August 6, 2025 • 36 mins
This freshwater fish is one of the most-farmed fish on the planet (and happens to be excellent when cornmeal fried). Anney and Lauren dive into the history and biology of channel catfish.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
He alone. Welcome to save your predictive ByHeart.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Are you I'm any reason and I'm morn volga bam,
and today we have an episode for you about Channel catfish.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, oh you know we love these seafood.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Oh yes, oh they're so weird. Sea life is so
much weirder than landlife and I adore it. Oh yeah,
I'm also it's tasty, So it is it is.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Was there any particular reason this was on your mind?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Lord h Nope, I was. I was looking for some
kind of protein related episode, and I do love seafood episodes,
and I was thinking that we hadn't done fish in
a while, and then I was looking Basically, my my
method of finding a good seafood episode is to just
(00:58):
start googling, like what's in season, and then like cross
checking with sustainability guides because I kind of only want
to cover seafood on here that is that does have
like a sustainable option, so that I'm not like, there's
this really cool seafood, you shouldn't need it because that's depressing.
(01:20):
I mean, probably probably good to cover in terms of
just you know, talking about it, right, but but yeah,
so catfish came up.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Yeah, and I'm glad it did, because I kind of
haven't thought about catfish for a while, but now I
have a real craving because I do love a right
fried catfish. Yes, I used to get catfish, and like sew,
I've had a lot of catfish in my life. I
have to say, though I did not like catching catfish
(01:50):
as a kid. I believe it was a channel catfish.
It kind of checks all the boxes, but I can't
tell you for sure. Sure, but just as a kid
when I was young, they were the pretty big and
they have those whiskers they stab you and it like stings.
They were unwieldy to get off of the hook.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
And a couple of their fins, like up near their
head are very sharp and spiky.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
So yes, yeah, One time my grandfather had a shrimping
boat and one time we caught just just catfish.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
And I tell you it was a miserable experience everyone involved.
Like if it had been the different, if we had
been like commercial fishers or something, I'm sure that would
have been a great surprise. But instead it was like
just catfish tearing up the net. Oh wow, with their
whiskers and their fins and everybody getting kind of punctured,
and yeah, they're no joke.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I believe you entirely. Yeah, I do not have any
cat fishing experience in any sense of the word. Over
on that later, but I sure do like eating it.
I love it so much. I'm so glad to live
(03:12):
in Atlanta. Buy our new offices. There is a kind
of pon seafood Court and one of the shops will
do cornmeal fried fish to order on days when they
have it, and it is transcendental.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
It's it's beautiful. It's so simple, but it's like just delightful.
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Well, you can see our past seafood episodes. We have
done quite a few.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
I think cod is the one that really intersects with this,
but perhaps only due to like one parable Yeah, I
don't sure.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Yeah, I can see some similarities. Fried crawd, fried catfish. Yeah, sure, Okay,
I guess that brings us to our question channel catfish.
What are they?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Well, the channel catfish is a fresh water bottom dwelling,
temperate climate fish that's caught for its meat. They're kind
of mid sized and cylindrical, long and slender. Typically when
they're caught like about a foot long that's thirty centimeters
and weighing two to four pounds.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
That's like one to two kilos.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
The meat is taken off in filets from the sides
of the fish and will be ivory pink to maybe
gold and yellow in color. It's slightly translucent when it's raw,
and we'll cook up opaque. The flavor is earthy, like
lightly sweet in that savory way that seafood often is
only a very tiny bit fishy like, mostly like kind
(04:57):
of clean tasting, and the texture is like super flaky
and tender with like a little bit of chew to it.
It can be cooked in any way that you like
cooking fish, baked, roasted, sauteed, smoked. It's especially popular as
a fried fish, breaded often in corn meal, and deep fried,
and it is often served as the main protein of
a meal with some side dishes, or in a sandwich
(05:19):
or taco kind of situation. Maybe it is a super
satisfying protein, like it feels light, but it tastes filling,
if that makes sense. Eating it is like it's like
the feeling of stepping into a calm bit of river
bed or lake bed and squishing your toes into that
(05:43):
sandy earth just kind of cool and warming at the
same time.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah. Yeah, And I think that's one of the reasons
that is such a good fried fish. Yeah, is because
it's very It is very light and mild, and the
fried part is, you know, kind of fatty in your
face and crispy. And yeah, yes, it's like the contrast
of it and the flavor of the catfish usually still
(06:13):
stands up even though it is a bit of a
milder flavor.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Yeah. When when I was writing that description, I was
eating like an actually very spicy curry and my brain
was so confused.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
About what that. Yeah, it was like, hold.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
On, there's too much input here, but okay, uh. Taxonomical
name it Dolores punctatus.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
The North American catfish family has about seven genera and
at least forty five species, but channel catfish are by
far the most popular as food. They do not have scales,
but rather a sort of slick skin that's maybe olive
to grayish blue to black on their backs and then
silvery white on their bellies, a little bit of iridescence
(07:02):
in there. Younger ones may have some darker speckles or
spots along their backs. Their fins are soft raid, except
for those aforementioned pectoral and dorsal fins around their head,
which do have sharp spines. Watch out for those, and
you can tell them apart from related species by looking
at the anal fin like on the belly towards the tail,
(07:22):
which is long and rounded and has like twenty four
to twenty nine rays. I read that very specific number
in a bunch of places I don't make the biology facts.
And also their tail fin is deeply forked as opposed
to a lot of other catfish. They have four pair
(07:43):
of barbels around their mouth, which is kind of wide
like a big old goofy grin, and those barbels barbells,
I don't know. They look sort of like whiskers on
a cat, hence their name. Their genus name that that
Ictolorus is a mash of the Greek for fish and cat,
and the species name means spotted like like like like
(08:06):
little spots pink tatus.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Yeah, that was a fun fact.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Spotted cat. Yeah. Yeah. Those whiskers have a concentration of
taste buds on them, but the fish's whole body has
taste buds all over it, which which is mostly how
they find their food. Rather than using sight or smell,
(08:33):
which really helps them out in like cloudy water, which
they do. Yeah. Sure, they are opportunistic omnivores is the
scientific term. Basically, they'll eat anything algae, plants, insects, small
crustaceans like crawfish, smaller fish, birds if they can get them,
(08:56):
you know, oh yeah, yeah, oh my god, m pretty much.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
It is interesting. People have like their go to baits
that they use to catch catfish, and it cracked me
up hearing.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
A huge right ranges wildly Yeah, like people swear by
they're like chicken gizzards or only bread dough. Yeah yeah,
like what wild. Sure, they do prefer temperate water, like
(09:30):
right around the range that humans are generally comfortable at,
and they prefer clear streams with a decent current and
a sandy or gravel sort of bottom. But they are
really adaptable and they can and will hang out in
any range of conditions. When they're ready to spawn, a
male catfish will build a nest out from some kind
(09:50):
of like crevice or maybe a hollow log something like that,
like nice and secluded. You know, they'll just sort of
clean it out and then stick around to defend it.
And a female catfish will come along and be like, dude, awesome,
nest heck yeah, and lay her eggs there some like
three to four thousand eggs per pound of body weight.
(10:10):
Fish are great and the male will fertilize them and
then like tend to them, keeping them clean and safe.
He'll sort of fan them with his fins to wash
away waste and keep them, you know, like oxygenated with
fresh water. They'll hatch in just over a week with
a little yolk sac that feeds them until they're fully
developed and can swim out on their own after another
few days or so. They're usually harvested when they're about
(10:33):
two years old and weigh at least a pound, but
they can live over twenty years in the wild and
we'll kind of just keep growing. So it's not unheard
of to catch one that's in the like forty pound range,
around like eighteen kilos or so. In the wild and
in stocked ponds. They're popular for recreational fishing. They're pretty
(10:55):
easy to catch and clean from what I understand. Yeah,
they're right. They are not picky. They will go for
any kind of bait, and they are fairly easy to
keep on farms. The aquaculture for them is very well developed.
Most American farmed channel catfish is considered a best choice
seafood by the Monterey Bay Seafood Watch. So good job there.
(11:16):
But yeah, yeah, when you eat them, they're like a
nice mildfish. Some people do have a strong opinion about
that sort of earthy flavor. I find it like pleasantly
lightly mushroomy, kind of like that, like some people find
it muddy. I've heard that complaint before. Although in the
American South this can be a class thing. There's a
(11:37):
little bit of an attitude of like, oh, it's a
bottom feeder. Gross, But come on, man, fish eat whatever.
This like fish will eat anything. This is what fish do.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
It is and as we've said in many of our
past seafood episodes, if you want to research the biology
of fish, you might change your tombs. Now, Oh it's
a bottom feeder. There's a lot of strange things going on.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
So oh yeah, oh yeah, but hey, you know, I
can't can't tell you what to like. Of course, if
you if you don't like it, don't don't eat it.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah sure, but.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Anyway, it is so so, so, so so good, like
a little light egg dip and then that cornmeal dredge
you fried up crispy. If the filet is thin, it'll
curl up a little. This is sometimes the fish and
like a fish and gritz platter in the American South.
But it's nice. It's nice with delicate flavors or as
a base for strong ones, like a like a blackened preparation.
(12:31):
It can also be put in soups and stews, like
added sort of towards the end of cooking. Because it's
a fish, it cooks quickly. They are also kept as
an ornamental pond fish, especially the albino variety, which are
kind of peachy pink in color. Real cute, real cute,
real weird and thing that I didn't know. They are
(12:52):
used in scientific research as a test animal prior to
human testing in clinical trials, specifically when you're trying to
look at like immune responses, antibody formation, and chemical transference,
like for toxicology and pharmacology purposes, because apparently those systems
(13:15):
in channel catfish are fairly similar to those systems in humans.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
Huh very interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, okay, well what about the nutrition by itself? Channel
catfish is pretty good for you. By the time you
deep fry it. I can't really can't really tell you,
but I mean I can, and treats are nice as
the answer. But yeah, channel catfish is high end protein,
low in fats. What fats it does have are good fats.
(13:46):
It's got a bunch of micro nutrients in there, and
it is also one of the types of fish that
is lowest in contaminants like mercury. So if that's a
thing that you're concerned about, catfish all.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Day, catfish all day. Well, speaking of, we have some
numbers for you.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Oh we do, okay. So the largest channel catfish on
record weighed fifty eight pounds that's twenty six kilos. It
was caught in South Carolina in nineteen sixty four, and
believe me, people have been trying since then, so I'm
impressed that that is still the record holder. The longest
(14:21):
one ever caught was four feet eight inches. That's that's
one point four meters.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
Oh my goodness, that's really creeping up on me. You guys.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
I'm not sure whether that was the same specimens as
the heaviest one. The oldest one on record was forty
years old.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Yeah. Yeah. There are numerous catfish festivals around the US,
plus a convention for catfish every year in Louisville. Curious
about all of those if you've ever been to one.
I ran across so many that I like, I kind of.
I was like, Okay, this is There are other facts
(15:07):
I'm going to gather for this particular episode, but want
to hear the details. Another thing I didn't really understand.
I guess maybe I had like a slight concept of
this in my head, but I did not know that catfish.
Channel catfish specifically is one of the top thirty aquacultured
species in the world by weight, with over four hundred
(15:32):
and fifty thousand metric tons farmed in twenty nineteen alone.
Of that, China produced some three hundred thousand tons, and
the US produced some one hundred and fifty thousand, which,
if you're keeping track, adds up to about four hundred
and fifty thousand, which is the total. Other places do
(15:52):
farm it, but in relatively super tiny amounts. And yeah,
channel catfish consistently makes up between fifty to sixty percent
of all US fish and seafood farmed. Like farmed fish
and seafood by weight, Yeah, that is so much more
(16:13):
than I thought.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Me too, Me too.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
As of twenty twenty three, sales of farmed channel catfish
in the US were some four hundred and thirty seven
million dollars, which also makes it the single most valuable
farmed species in the country. And furthermore, this number is
a little bit older. It's from two thousand and nine,
but I don't think it's changed drastically since then. As
(16:42):
of two thousand and nine, at least ninety percent of
the channel catfish being farmed here in the US were
produced in the Mississippi River Valley region. So we produce
a lot of it, and we produce it in the South.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Yes, and people have written quite a lot about it.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Oh, yes, which is so cool. I love that as
a podcaster and like thanks, yeah, perfect, yes, And we
are going to get into that wonderful history as soon
as we get back from a quick break for a
word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes,
(17:30):
thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Okay. So, the channel catfish is indigenous to a large
swath of North America, from southern parts of Canada to
northeastern Mexico and east of the Rockies.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, east of the Rockies and west of the Appalachians.
Like just the whole center bit there, like Gulf of
Mexico up through Hudson Bay. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yes, And fossil records indicate that they species might go
back as far as twenty million years ago. They're old
much much later. The catfish was introduced to parts of
California and Texas and the drainages for the Atlantic and
Pacific oceans and eventually around the world, so they're pretty
(18:11):
well established. Which speaking of, there has been a lot
of documentation about the spread of channel catfish. We're going
to go over a few of them, a few of
these instances, but if you're really curious, there are charts
that show you where, when, and how this fish was introduced,
(18:31):
if the information is available, and then it also includes
if it was a purposeful introduction or an accidental introduction,
So that information does exist. But to sum up, yeah, yes,
to sum up, we're just going to go over a
few of the main things. Okay, So the history of
people eating channel catfish is difficult to track. According to
(18:54):
some sources, indigenous folks in North America were eating them
where they were available, though some researchers wondered at the
lack of evidence in the form of bones and sometimes
there's other fish bones present, but not channel catfish bones. However,
the consensus seems to be indigenous peoples with access to catfish,
particularly in the South, called channel catfish and then grilled, boiled, spoked,
(19:16):
or dried them for eating. The first known written description
of the channel catfish was composed by Samuel Ruffanesque in
eighteen eighteen. And this is where we get into some
of these introductions, as they call them. The United States
Fish Commission are the USFC determined that the channel catfish
(19:38):
was a valuable food and gaming fish in the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah, So in the eighteen seventies they started like really
collecting and stalking fish from the wild in other places,
and in eighteen ninety they figured out how to get
them to spawn in captivity rights.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
So in eighteen ninety two and ninety three they sent
thousands of channel catfish to over twenty states across the country,
where they went on to become an established species. In
many cases, they had previously been planted in the watershed
of the San Francisco Bay in eighteen seventy four. Some
of the historical records don't clearly specify the type of
(20:19):
catfish though, Yeah, that's always kind of a risk.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
Records indicate the channel catfish was introduced to Europe in
nineteen hundred as a game in food fish. Some reports
suggest that wild populations were later established in parts of Spain, Italy,
and Russia. As we've talked about it before, it could
be hard to know for sure with fish because they
move all about. They did what they want. Yeah, they
(20:45):
do what they want. By nineteen fifteen, these fish were
plentiful in the waters around the DC area. In the
nineteen forties, the channel catfish was introduced to the Columbia
and San Francisco Bay estuaries. They were introduced to Hawaii
and nineteen fifty eight, and then we get a lot
of research around catfish. The University of Auburn's Agricultural Experiment
(21:09):
Station in Alabama launched a warm water fish production program
in the nineteen thirties. As part of this program, they
looked into the production and nutrition of channel catfish. The
station released a lot of research about the market value
of growing these fish. Their research generated more interest in
the farming of catfish. Several other similar institutes and programs
(21:31):
opened in the following decades, and research continues to this day,
they're still looking into these things.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
It wasn't until the nineteen fifties that commercial production of
the catfish became viable in the US, in part due
to the research about how the fishpond. That was a
really big thing.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Beginning in the nineteen sixties, several technological innovations around aquaculture
and fish feed led to increased yield of channel catfish
and quicker processing. This led to relatively cheap cat fish
on grocery shelves across the country Over the years. New
regulations around best practices around aquaculture and introductions were also developed.
(22:09):
In some places like Mississippi and Missouri, over harvesting due
to commercial fishing led to size limits and other regulations.
And I know there have been some instances like in
New Zealand where they dat a study it was like, no,
this would actually be bad for our environment, so they
didn't introduce the channel catfish there. Since a large percentage
(22:30):
of US farm raised catfish originated in the American South,
catfish became a big part of Southern cuisine in some places,
a lot of places, partially due to people of African descent.
According to food writer and James Beard Award winner Adrian Miller.
When enslaved West Africans were forcibly relocated to America, they
brought their food traditions with them, including around smoked, fried, dried,
(22:54):
or salted fish, either as an accompaniment to a dish
to add flavor, or as a snack or as a
full meal. On top of that, they were familiar with
another species of catfish from West Africa, and the Channel
catfish was plentiful in many areas in the South. When caught,
the fish was often cooked quickly, making frying a preferred
(23:14):
method because a lot of the fish could be prepared
at once, and this led to a lasting communal tradition
amongst black communities of having fish fries on the weekends
and for fundraising. And this is still around today. A
lot of people do it.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Oh yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
And fish was and still is often a protein option
in Southern style meat in three plates catfish specifically. That
being said, people weren't eating them where they were available
long before the commercial industry took off. This is one
of those things where I kind of stogled to find
the actual eating of the catfish history. But I'm guessing
that's because in a lot of places. It was just everywhere.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Yeah, it was kind of beyond remark. People were just like, oh, yeah,
of course exactly.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
And typically the fish was coated in corn meal and
fried in oil, often in a cast iron skillet, but
it was also grilled, blackened, or put in stews. And
part of its popularity was due to the affordability, the availability,
but also an ease of preparation and adaptability because it
is a mildfish, it adapts well to a lot of things. Okay,
(24:18):
channel catfish or introduced to Japan in nineteen seventy one
and to China in the nineteen eighties. Wild populations in
nearby waters are thought to be the result of the
fish escaping aquaculture setups or illegal releases.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
In any case, global aquaculture production grew pretty steadily through
the sixties and seventies, right, and then yeah, really took
off in the eighties when the catfish were introduced to China.
Production kind of continued shooting up through the twenty oughts.
At least it's leveled out a little bit since then.
(24:53):
But yeah, like, if you look at a chart of this, it's.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Like boo boo, boo boo.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
Whoah, when when it's cat in China, it's very substantial. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Yes. Going back to the US, in nineteen ninety seven,
Missouri named the channel catfish as their official state fish,
and from what I understand, it is also the official
state fish of Nebraska, Kansas, Iowa, and Tennessee. Okay, I
love it.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
Yeah, that's great.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
For a long time, catfish was viewed as the poor
man's fish outside the South or even in the South,
in parts because yes, of their diet bottom feeders, but
also in part because of stereotypes around Southern foods. And
we've talked about these problematic stereotypes before. But as Southern
cuisine saw growing kind of buzzy popularity across the US
(25:46):
in more recent times, catfish grew in popularity too. However,
cheaper imported catfish or cheaper types of fish, along with
increasing costs for things like feed for American farm raised
catfish has in packed at the US catfish industry.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah, and unfortunately the Chinese aquaculture industry is not as
well regulated. So for channel catfish specifically, probably a lot
of other things, but for channel catfish specifically, sustainability experts,
do you recommend that you seek out American product.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Yes, and here comes are one of our fun entertainment facts.
I know what we'll call it. In twenty ten, a
documentary called Catfish gave rise to the term that describes
someone who has fabricated at least a part of their
identity online.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah yeah, so right. So if someone has uh, if
someone presents themselves as a different age or gender or
whatever it is in like in a way that is
meant to trick somebody. That is called catfishing. And this
term comes from a sort of parable from the fishing
(27:01):
industry that tells of live cod being transported in in
vats on ships long distance and by themselves. The cod
would arrive at their destination kind of kind of mushy
and tasteless. But people figured out that if you put
catfish in the tanks too, they'd nip at the cod
(27:24):
and like keep it moving around. So the metaphor is
that a catfish will keep you guessing, you know, keep
you on your toes, and thus keep things from getting
too dull, though it's usually used like disparagingly these days,
but the original parable is like, oh, yeah, you need
some catfish in your life, keep it interesting, keep yourself tasty.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Stabbed you get stabbed. Pull of those whiskers. I'll tell
you it's interesting enough.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
And the parable, interestingly, actually dates back to this early
nineteen hundred's essay written by a British Christian writer, one
Henry W. Nevinson, called appropriately the catfish. So yeah, that's
so interesting here we are, what century later? Yeah, talking
(28:16):
about online dating.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Yes, this guy his mine would be blown.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah yeah, yeah, because he was like he was like,
Christianity is the catfish that the europe needs to keep
itself sharp. That's what sessay was about. That is not
the way that we are using it today.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
No, it's not, No, it is not. Okay.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
The first catfish to have its genome sequenced was a
channel catfish that happened in twenty sixteen, and the researchers
named the fish that they took these genetic samples from.
They named her Coco after Coco Chanel because and I quote,
(29:00):
she was Channel number one.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Oh what's excellent? This is This is a bad perfume pun.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
And I love it.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
You know, scientists make those puns. They are ready, they're ready,
but they're so prepared, and you've gotta love it. Also,
Coco Schanell was a fascist. Just heck that person, heck
that whole person. Anyway, Yes, yes, Well here's another thing
I didn't know about. Noodling. Noodling for catfish was legalized
(29:34):
in Louisiana in twenty twenty two, making it the seventeenth
state to do so.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Okay, very briefly, noodling for catfish this is a type
of noodling is a type of fishing that uses no tools.
The fisher like gets in the water and uses their
fingers to attract a fish, getting it to bite onto
their hand, and then pulls the fish out of the water,
(30:01):
you know, manually, like literally manually. And this is controversial.
It's been illegal in some places. I think mostly because
it's kind of dangerous for the person and more potentially
disruptive of the environment than other fishing methods. But it's
(30:21):
also like a deep cultural practice in some places. I
didn't look too much into it, and I'm not familiar
with this culture. I would want to learn more before
I said much more about it. But yeah, noodling you can,
you can look it up or if you have experience,
please write in.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Please write in. And there are noodling festivals. Oh yeah,
oh yeah, So if you had experience with that, let
us know, yes, oh my gosh. And if you have
any catfish recipes memories? Yeah, how did you handle fishing?
Speaker 2 (30:59):
Yeah? If you yeah, how do you avoid those weird spines? Do?
Have you ever had a pet catfish of any kind?
If I want to hear all about your fish.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yes, absolutely, But I think that's what we have to
say about channel catfish for now.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
It is. We do already have some listener mail for you, though,
and we are going to get into that as soon
as we get back from one more quick break forward
from our sponsors. And we're back.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Thank you sponsors, Yes, thank you, And we're back with
catfish whiskers and everything.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Okay, so today we have two messages about tear Gone.
I love how many people people are writing it about tarragon.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Yeah, you never know what's gonna really hit with people.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
They're like, yeah, that one resonates.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
I gotta send in my memories about this gone. Yeah, okay.
Brian wrote, I'm a fan, but I don't use it
very often. I do like that liquoricey anise esque taste,
but no one else in my house really enjoys it.
There are a couple of recipes I've come across that
I enjoy, and I figured i'd pass them along. Plumb
(32:28):
tarragon popsicles and steak sauce if you're into tarragon, or
at least an a post to it. I think the
flavor is subtle enough to not be offensive to the haters,
but sort of enough for those who enjoy it to
appreciate it. But mileage will vary. And yes, Brian did
send these recipes. If you want to get them, just
email us and we'll pass them along. They're kind of
(32:49):
a bit longer than what we only read, but they
do sound really nice. Oh yeah, popsicle popsicles. Yeah, Oh
my gosh, especially right now what it is so hot,
so warm?
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So I hadn't thought about yeah, right right, I hadn't
thought about tarragon that much in sweet recipes. But yeah,
plum absolutely, Okay, all right, anyway, Joe wrote, French tarragon
isn't one of my favorite herbs, if I'm honest. The
anna's lickorage profile is one I have a hard time with,
but it does feature in one of my favorite memories.
(33:23):
During my master's year in England, one of my best
friends studied a broad in France for the fall semester.
Before he headed back to the US. We decided to
spend Christmas together in Paris. We stayed in a tiny
flat on the fifth floor of a building with no elevator,
so the climb was always a challenge. What good after
eating a hardy French dinner on Christmas Day? We stayed
in and cooked Christmas lunch in the tiny but well
(33:45):
equipped kitchen. The only thing missing was an oven. We
decided to go ahead with pan fried chicken breast and
mashed potatoes, which I noticed was mentioned in listener mail
of Great Minds and all that. Our chicken breast was
served with a white wine mustard sauce, and saw swopped
time for tarragon. The mashed potatoes had chopped tarragon folded
into them as well. The chicken recipe is below, as
(34:07):
well as a picture of our meal. We also had
a rubel of salad, cheese and bread, of course, and
a raspberry tart from the iconic French bakery, the name
of which I've not looked up how to pronounce stroher Stroller.
Sorry apologies anyway, truly a Christmas to remember. Said friend
(34:28):
also loves coming up with cocktails based on what he
has on hand. Last year, he came up with one
that has vodka, orange blossom water, honey, and orange sand pellegrino.
He never measures anything, but I'd assume it's a shot
glass of vodka, about an eighth of a tea spoon
of orange blossom water, and a teaspoon of honey mixed
together before adding ice and topping it off with the
orange sand pellegrino. Super refreshing and timely for summer. Oh
(34:53):
yeah right, ooh yes, yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I love this. I love when you have the friend
that's like, I'll make the cocktail.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
It's like, hold on, I got youa yeah, a nice
orange blossom water and terragon.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Yeah too.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
M Oh, that does sound like a really lovely Christmas
that does.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
That does, and this sounds like a great meal came
together wonderfully.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
Oh oh that cocktail though, I need to I really
need to get some get some orange blossom water cocktails
going because I've been on a kick. I've just been
just been like like a like a drop or two
and a glass of soda water.
Speaker 1 (35:42):
Oh yeah, adds so much, yeah, add so much. Well,
thank you to both of these listeners for writing in
and sending recipes. Yeah like we're happy to pass along.
You can emailos at Hello dot com.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
We're also on social media. You can find us on
Instagram and blue Sky at savor pod and we do
hope to hear from you. Savor is production of iHeartRadio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Thanks as always to our super producers Dylan Fagan and
Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope
(36:21):
that lots of We're good things are coming your way
He alone. Welcome to save your predictive ByHeart.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Are you I'm any reason and I'm morn volga bam,
and today we have an episode for you about Channel catfish.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Yes, oh you know we love these seafood.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Oh yes, oh they're so weird. Sea life is so
much weirder than landlife and I adore it. Oh yeah,
I'm also it's tasty, So it is it is.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Was there any particular reason this was on your mind?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Lord h Nope, I was. I was looking for some
kind of protein related episode, and I do love seafood episodes,
and I was thinking that we hadn't done fish in
a while, and then I was looking Basically, my my
method of finding a good seafood episode is to just
(00:58):
start googling, like what's in season, and then like cross
checking with sustainability guides because I kind of only want
to cover seafood on here that is that does have
like a sustainable option, so that I'm not like, there's
this really cool seafood, you shouldn't need it because that's depressing.
(01:20):
I mean, probably probably good to cover in terms of
just you know, talking about it, right, but but yeah,
so catfish came up.
Speaker 1 (01:30):
Yeah, and I'm glad it did, because I kind of
haven't thought about catfish for a while, but now I
have a real craving because I do love a right
fried catfish. Yes, I used to get catfish, and like sew,
I've had a lot of catfish in my life. I
have to say, though I did not like catching catfish
(01:50):
as a kid. I believe it was a channel catfish.
It kind of checks all the boxes, but I can't
tell you for sure. Sure, but just as a kid
when I was young, they were the pretty big and
they have those whiskers they stab you and it like stings.
They were unwieldy to get off of the hook.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
And a couple of their fins, like up near their
head are very sharp and spiky.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
So yes, yeah, One time my grandfather had a shrimping
boat and one time we caught just just catfish.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
And I tell you it was a miserable experience everyone involved.
Like if it had been the different, if we had
been like commercial fishers or something, I'm sure that would
have been a great surprise. But instead it was like
just catfish tearing up the net. Oh wow, with their
whiskers and their fins and everybody getting kind of punctured,
and yeah, they're no joke.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I believe you entirely. Yeah, I do not have any
cat fishing experience in any sense of the word. Over
on that later, but I sure do like eating it.
I love it so much. I'm so glad to live
(03:12):
in Atlanta. Buy our new offices. There is a kind
of pon seafood Court and one of the shops will
do cornmeal fried fish to order on days when they
have it, and it is transcendental.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
It's it's beautiful. It's so simple, but it's like just delightful.
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Well, you can see our past seafood episodes. We have
done quite a few.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
I think cod is the one that really intersects with this,
but perhaps only due to like one parable Yeah, I
don't sure.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Yeah, I can see some similarities. Fried crawd, fried catfish. Yeah, sure, Okay,
I guess that brings us to our question channel catfish.
What are they?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Well, the channel catfish is a fresh water bottom dwelling,
temperate climate fish that's caught for its meat. They're kind
of mid sized and cylindrical, long and slender. Typically when
they're caught like about a foot long that's thirty centimeters
and weighing two to four pounds.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
That's like one to two kilos.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
The meat is taken off in filets from the sides
of the fish and will be ivory pink to maybe
gold and yellow in color. It's slightly translucent when it's raw,
and we'll cook up opaque. The flavor is earthy, like
lightly sweet in that savory way that seafood often is
only a very tiny bit fishy like, mostly like kind
(04:57):
of clean tasting, and the texture is like super flaky
and tender with like a little bit of chew to it.
It can be cooked in any way that you like
cooking fish, baked, roasted, sauteed, smoked. It's especially popular as
a fried fish, breaded often in corn meal, and deep fried,
and it is often served as the main protein of
a meal with some side dishes, or in a sandwich
(05:19):
or taco kind of situation. Maybe it is a super
satisfying protein, like it feels light, but it tastes filling,
if that makes sense. Eating it is like it's like
the feeling of stepping into a calm bit of river
bed or lake bed and squishing your toes into that
(05:43):
sandy earth just kind of cool and warming at the
same time.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yeah. Yeah, And I think that's one of the reasons
that is such a good fried fish. Yeah, is because
it's very It is very light and mild, and the
fried part is, you know, kind of fatty in your
face and crispy. And yeah, yes, it's like the contrast
of it and the flavor of the catfish usually still
(06:13):
stands up even though it is a bit of a
milder flavor.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Yeah. When when I was writing that description, I was
eating like an actually very spicy curry and my brain
was so confused.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
About what that. Yeah, it was like, hold.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
On, there's too much input here, but okay, uh. Taxonomical
name it Dolores punctatus.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
The North American catfish family has about seven genera and
at least forty five species, but channel catfish are by
far the most popular as food. They do not have scales,
but rather a sort of slick skin that's maybe olive
to grayish blue to black on their backs and then
silvery white on their bellies, a little bit of iridescence
(07:02):
in there. Younger ones may have some darker speckles or
spots along their backs. Their fins are soft raid, except
for those aforementioned pectoral and dorsal fins around their head,
which do have sharp spines. Watch out for those, and
you can tell them apart from related species by looking
at the anal fin like on the belly towards the tail,
(07:22):
which is long and rounded and has like twenty four
to twenty nine rays. I read that very specific number
in a bunch of places I don't make the biology facts.
And also their tail fin is deeply forked as opposed
to a lot of other catfish. They have four pair
(07:43):
of barbels around their mouth, which is kind of wide
like a big old goofy grin, and those barbels barbells,
I don't know. They look sort of like whiskers on
a cat, hence their name. Their genus name that that
Ictolorus is a mash of the Greek for fish and cat,
and the species name means spotted like like like like
(08:06):
little spots pink tatus.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
Yeah, that was a fun fact.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Spotted cat. Yeah. Yeah. Those whiskers have a concentration of
taste buds on them, but the fish's whole body has
taste buds all over it, which which is mostly how
they find their food. Rather than using sight or smell,
(08:33):
which really helps them out in like cloudy water, which
they do. Yeah. Sure, they are opportunistic omnivores is the
scientific term. Basically, they'll eat anything algae, plants, insects, small
crustaceans like crawfish, smaller fish, birds if they can get them,
(08:56):
you know, oh yeah, yeah, oh my god, m pretty much.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
It is interesting. People have like their go to baits
that they use to catch catfish, and it cracked me
up hearing.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
A huge right ranges wildly Yeah, like people swear by
they're like chicken gizzards or only bread dough. Yeah yeah,
like what wild. Sure, they do prefer temperate water, like
(09:30):
right around the range that humans are generally comfortable at,
and they prefer clear streams with a decent current and
a sandy or gravel sort of bottom. But they are
really adaptable and they can and will hang out in
any range of conditions. When they're ready to spawn, a
male catfish will build a nest out from some kind
(09:50):
of like crevice or maybe a hollow log something like that,
like nice and secluded. You know, they'll just sort of
clean it out and then stick around to defend it.
And a female catfish will come along and be like, dude, awesome,
nest heck yeah, and lay her eggs there some like
three to four thousand eggs per pound of body weight.
(10:10):
Fish are great and the male will fertilize them and
then like tend to them, keeping them clean and safe.
He'll sort of fan them with his fins to wash
away waste and keep them, you know, like oxygenated with
fresh water. They'll hatch in just over a week with
a little yolk sac that feeds them until they're fully
developed and can swim out on their own after another
few days or so. They're usually harvested when they're about
(10:33):
two years old and weigh at least a pound, but
they can live over twenty years in the wild and
we'll kind of just keep growing. So it's not unheard
of to catch one that's in the like forty pound range,
around like eighteen kilos or so. In the wild and
in stocked ponds. They're popular for recreational fishing. They're pretty
(10:55):
easy to catch and clean from what I understand. Yeah,
they're right. They are not picky. They will go for
any kind of bait, and they are fairly easy to
keep on farms. The aquaculture for them is very well developed.
Most American farmed channel catfish is considered a best choice
seafood by the Monterey Bay Seafood Watch. So good job there.
(11:16):
But yeah, yeah, when you eat them, they're like a
nice mildfish. Some people do have a strong opinion about
that sort of earthy flavor. I find it like pleasantly
lightly mushroomy, kind of like that, like some people find
it muddy. I've heard that complaint before. Although in the
American South this can be a class thing. There's a
(11:37):
little bit of an attitude of like, oh, it's a
bottom feeder. Gross, But come on, man, fish eat whatever.
This like fish will eat anything. This is what fish do.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
It is and as we've said in many of our
past seafood episodes, if you want to research the biology
of fish, you might change your tombs. Now, Oh it's
a bottom feeder. There's a lot of strange things going on.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
So oh yeah, oh yeah, but hey, you know, I
can't can't tell you what to like. Of course, if
you if you don't like it, don't don't eat it.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah sure, but.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Anyway, it is so so, so, so so good, like
a little light egg dip and then that cornmeal dredge
you fried up crispy. If the filet is thin, it'll
curl up a little. This is sometimes the fish and
like a fish and gritz platter in the American South.
But it's nice. It's nice with delicate flavors or as
a base for strong ones, like a like a blackened preparation.
(12:31):
It can also be put in soups and stews, like
added sort of towards the end of cooking. Because it's
a fish, it cooks quickly. They are also kept as
an ornamental pond fish, especially the albino variety, which are
kind of peachy pink in color. Real cute, real cute,
real weird and thing that I didn't know. They are
(12:52):
used in scientific research as a test animal prior to
human testing in clinical trials, specifically when you're trying to
look at like immune responses, antibody formation, and chemical transference,
like for toxicology and pharmacology purposes, because apparently those systems
(13:15):
in channel catfish are fairly similar to those systems in humans.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
Huh very interesting.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
Yeah, okay, well what about the nutrition by itself? Channel
catfish is pretty good for you. By the time you
deep fry it. I can't really can't really tell you,
but I mean I can, and treats are nice as
the answer. But yeah, channel catfish is high end protein,
low in fats. What fats it does have are good fats.
(13:46):
It's got a bunch of micro nutrients in there, and
it is also one of the types of fish that
is lowest in contaminants like mercury. So if that's a
thing that you're concerned about, catfish all.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Day, catfish all day. Well, speaking of, we have some
numbers for you.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Oh we do, okay. So the largest channel catfish on
record weighed fifty eight pounds that's twenty six kilos. It
was caught in South Carolina in nineteen sixty four, and
believe me, people have been trying since then, so I'm
impressed that that is still the record holder. The longest
(14:21):
one ever caught was four feet eight inches. That's that's
one point four meters.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
Oh my goodness, that's really creeping up on me. You guys.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
I'm not sure whether that was the same specimens as
the heaviest one. The oldest one on record was forty
years old.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
Yeah. Yeah. There are numerous catfish festivals around the US,
plus a convention for catfish every year in Louisville. Curious
about all of those if you've ever been to one.
I ran across so many that I like, I kind of.
I was like, Okay, this is There are other facts
(15:07):
I'm going to gather for this particular episode, but want
to hear the details. Another thing I didn't really understand.
I guess maybe I had like a slight concept of
this in my head, but I did not know that catfish.
Channel catfish specifically is one of the top thirty aquacultured
species in the world by weight, with over four hundred
(15:32):
and fifty thousand metric tons farmed in twenty nineteen alone.
Of that, China produced some three hundred thousand tons, and
the US produced some one hundred and fifty thousand, which,
if you're keeping track, adds up to about four hundred
and fifty thousand, which is the total. Other places do
(15:52):
farm it, but in relatively super tiny amounts. And yeah,
channel catfish consistently makes up between fifty to sixty percent
of all US fish and seafood farmed. Like farmed fish
and seafood by weight, Yeah, that is so much more
(16:13):
than I thought.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Me too, Me too.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
As of twenty twenty three, sales of farmed channel catfish
in the US were some four hundred and thirty seven
million dollars, which also makes it the single most valuable
farmed species in the country. And furthermore, this number is
a little bit older. It's from two thousand and nine,
but I don't think it's changed drastically since then. As
(16:42):
of two thousand and nine, at least ninety percent of
the channel catfish being farmed here in the US were
produced in the Mississippi River Valley region. So we produce
a lot of it, and we produce it in the South.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Yes, and people have written quite a lot about it.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Oh, yes, which is so cool. I love that as
a podcaster and like thanks, yeah, perfect, yes, And we
are going to get into that wonderful history as soon
as we get back from a quick break for a
word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes,
(17:30):
thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
Okay. So, the channel catfish is indigenous to a large
swath of North America, from southern parts of Canada to
northeastern Mexico and east of the Rockies.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, east of the Rockies and west of the Appalachians.
Like just the whole center bit there, like Gulf of
Mexico up through Hudson Bay. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yes, And fossil records indicate that they species might go
back as far as twenty million years ago. They're old
much much later. The catfish was introduced to parts of
California and Texas and the drainages for the Atlantic and
Pacific oceans and eventually around the world, so they're pretty
(18:11):
well established. Which speaking of, there has been a lot
of documentation about the spread of channel catfish. We're going
to go over a few of them, a few of
these instances, but if you're really curious, there are charts
that show you where, when, and how this fish was introduced,
(18:31):
if the information is available, and then it also includes
if it was a purposeful introduction or an accidental introduction,
So that information does exist. But to sum up, yeah, yes,
to sum up, we're just going to go over a
few of the main things. Okay, So the history of
people eating channel catfish is difficult to track. According to
(18:54):
some sources, indigenous folks in North America were eating them
where they were available, though some researchers wondered at the
lack of evidence in the form of bones and sometimes
there's other fish bones present, but not channel catfish bones. However,
the consensus seems to be indigenous peoples with access to catfish,
particularly in the South, called channel catfish and then grilled, boiled, spoked,
(19:16):
or dried them for eating. The first known written description
of the channel catfish was composed by Samuel Ruffanesque in
eighteen eighteen. And this is where we get into some
of these introductions, as they call them. The United States
Fish Commission are the USFC determined that the channel catfish
(19:38):
was a valuable food and gaming fish in the eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah, So in the eighteen seventies they started like really
collecting and stalking fish from the wild in other places,
and in eighteen ninety they figured out how to get
them to spawn in captivity rights.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
So in eighteen ninety two and ninety three they sent
thousands of channel catfish to over twenty states across the country,
where they went on to become an established species. In
many cases, they had previously been planted in the watershed
of the San Francisco Bay in eighteen seventy four. Some
of the historical records don't clearly specify the type of
(20:19):
catfish though, Yeah, that's always kind of a risk.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
Records indicate the channel catfish was introduced to Europe in
nineteen hundred as a game in food fish. Some reports
suggest that wild populations were later established in parts of Spain, Italy,
and Russia. As we've talked about it before, it could
be hard to know for sure with fish because they
move all about. They did what they want. Yeah, they
(20:45):
do what they want. By nineteen fifteen, these fish were
plentiful in the waters around the DC area. In the
nineteen forties, the channel catfish was introduced to the Columbia
and San Francisco Bay estuaries. They were introduced to Hawaii
and nineteen fifty eight, and then we get a lot
of research around catfish. The University of Auburn's Agricultural Experiment
(21:09):
Station in Alabama launched a warm water fish production program
in the nineteen thirties. As part of this program, they
looked into the production and nutrition of channel catfish. The
station released a lot of research about the market value
of growing these fish. Their research generated more interest in
the farming of catfish. Several other similar institutes and programs
(21:31):
opened in the following decades, and research continues to this day,
they're still looking into these things.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
It wasn't until the nineteen fifties that commercial production of
the catfish became viable in the US, in part due
to the research about how the fishpond. That was a
really big thing.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Beginning in the nineteen sixties, several technological innovations around aquaculture
and fish feed led to increased yield of channel catfish
and quicker processing. This led to relatively cheap cat fish
on grocery shelves across the country Over the years. New
regulations around best practices around aquaculture and introductions were also developed.
(22:09):
In some places like Mississippi and Missouri, over harvesting due
to commercial fishing led to size limits and other regulations.
And I know there have been some instances like in
New Zealand where they dat a study it was like, no,
this would actually be bad for our environment, so they
didn't introduce the channel catfish there. Since a large percentage
(22:30):
of US farm raised catfish originated in the American South,
catfish became a big part of Southern cuisine in some places,
a lot of places, partially due to people of African descent.
According to food writer and James Beard Award winner Adrian Miller.
When enslaved West Africans were forcibly relocated to America, they
brought their food traditions with them, including around smoked, fried, dried,
(22:54):
or salted fish, either as an accompaniment to a dish
to add flavor, or as a snack or as a
full meal. On top of that, they were familiar with
another species of catfish from West Africa, and the Channel
catfish was plentiful in many areas in the South. When caught,
the fish was often cooked quickly, making frying a preferred
(23:14):
method because a lot of the fish could be prepared
at once, and this led to a lasting communal tradition
amongst black communities of having fish fries on the weekends
and for fundraising. And this is still around today. A
lot of people do it.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Oh yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:28):
And fish was and still is often a protein option
in Southern style meat in three plates catfish specifically. That
being said, people weren't eating them where they were available
long before the commercial industry took off. This is one
of those things where I kind of stogled to find
the actual eating of the catfish history. But I'm guessing
that's because in a lot of places. It was just everywhere.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
Yeah, it was kind of beyond remark. People were just like, oh, yeah,
of course exactly.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
And typically the fish was coated in corn meal and
fried in oil, often in a cast iron skillet, but
it was also grilled, blackened, or put in stews. And
part of its popularity was due to the affordability, the availability,
but also an ease of preparation and adaptability because it
is a mildfish, it adapts well to a lot of things. Okay,
(24:18):
channel catfish or introduced to Japan in nineteen seventy one
and to China in the nineteen eighties. Wild populations in
nearby waters are thought to be the result of the
fish escaping aquaculture setups or illegal releases.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
In any case, global aquaculture production grew pretty steadily through
the sixties and seventies, right, and then yeah, really took
off in the eighties when the catfish were introduced to China.
Production kind of continued shooting up through the twenty oughts.
At least it's leveled out a little bit since then.
(24:53):
But yeah, like, if you look at a chart of this, it's.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Like boo boo, boo boo.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
Whoah, when when it's cat in China, it's very substantial. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Yes. Going back to the US, in nineteen ninety seven,
Missouri named the channel catfish as their official state fish,
and from what I understand, it is also the official
state fish of Nebraska, Kansas, Iowa, and Tennessee. Okay, I
love it.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
Yeah, that's great.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
For a long time, catfish was viewed as the poor
man's fish outside the South or even in the South,
in parts because yes, of their diet bottom feeders, but
also in part because of stereotypes around Southern foods. And
we've talked about these problematic stereotypes before. But as Southern
cuisine saw growing kind of buzzy popularity across the US
(25:46):
in more recent times, catfish grew in popularity too. However,
cheaper imported catfish or cheaper types of fish, along with
increasing costs for things like feed for American farm raised
catfish has in packed at the US catfish industry.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah, and unfortunately the Chinese aquaculture industry is not as
well regulated. So for channel catfish specifically, probably a lot
of other things, but for channel catfish specifically, sustainability experts,
do you recommend that you seek out American product.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Yes, and here comes are one of our fun entertainment facts.
I know what we'll call it. In twenty ten, a
documentary called Catfish gave rise to the term that describes
someone who has fabricated at least a part of their
identity online.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah yeah, so right. So if someone has uh, if
someone presents themselves as a different age or gender or
whatever it is in like in a way that is
meant to trick somebody. That is called catfishing. And this
term comes from a sort of parable from the fishing
(27:01):
industry that tells of live cod being transported in in
vats on ships long distance and by themselves. The cod
would arrive at their destination kind of kind of mushy
and tasteless. But people figured out that if you put
catfish in the tanks too, they'd nip at the cod
(27:24):
and like keep it moving around. So the metaphor is
that a catfish will keep you guessing, you know, keep
you on your toes, and thus keep things from getting
too dull, though it's usually used like disparagingly these days,
but the original parable is like, oh, yeah, you need
some catfish in your life, keep it interesting, keep yourself tasty.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Stabbed you get stabbed. Pull of those whiskers. I'll tell
you it's interesting enough.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
And the parable, interestingly, actually dates back to this early
nineteen hundred's essay written by a British Christian writer, one
Henry W. Nevinson, called appropriately the catfish. So yeah, that's
so interesting here we are, what century later? Yeah, talking
(28:16):
about online dating.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
Yes, this guy his mine would be blown.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah yeah, yeah, because he was like he was like,
Christianity is the catfish that the europe needs to keep
itself sharp. That's what sessay was about. That is not
the way that we are using it today.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
No, it's not, No, it is not. Okay.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
The first catfish to have its genome sequenced was a
channel catfish that happened in twenty sixteen, and the researchers
named the fish that they took these genetic samples from.
They named her Coco after Coco Chanel because and I quote,
(29:00):
she was Channel number one.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Oh what's excellent? This is This is a bad perfume pun.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
And I love it.
Speaker 1 (29:11):
You know, scientists make those puns. They are ready, they're ready,
but they're so prepared, and you've gotta love it. Also,
Coco Schanell was a fascist. Just heck that person, heck
that whole person. Anyway, Yes, yes, Well here's another thing
I didn't know about. Noodling. Noodling for catfish was legalized
(29:34):
in Louisiana in twenty twenty two, making it the seventeenth
state to do so.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Okay, very briefly, noodling for catfish this is a type
of noodling is a type of fishing that uses no tools.
The fisher like gets in the water and uses their
fingers to attract a fish, getting it to bite onto
their hand, and then pulls the fish out of the water,
(30:01):
you know, manually, like literally manually. And this is controversial.
It's been illegal in some places. I think mostly because
it's kind of dangerous for the person and more potentially
disruptive of the environment than other fishing methods. But it's
(30:21):
also like a deep cultural practice in some places. I
didn't look too much into it, and I'm not familiar
with this culture. I would want to learn more before
I said much more about it. But yeah, noodling you can,
you can look it up or if you have experience,
please write in.
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Please write in. And there are noodling festivals. Oh yeah,
oh yeah, So if you had experience with that, let
us know, yes, oh my gosh. And if you have
any catfish recipes memories? Yeah, how did you handle fishing?
Speaker 2 (30:59):
Yeah? If you yeah, how do you avoid those weird spines? Do?
Have you ever had a pet catfish of any kind?
If I want to hear all about your fish.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
Yes, absolutely, But I think that's what we have to
say about channel catfish for now.
Speaker 2 (31:19):
It is. We do already have some listener mail for you, though,
and we are going to get into that as soon
as we get back from one more quick break forward
from our sponsors. And we're back.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
Thank you sponsors, Yes, thank you, And we're back with
catfish whiskers and everything.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Okay, so today we have two messages about tear Gone.
I love how many people people are writing it about tarragon.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Yeah, you never know what's gonna really hit with people.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
They're like, yeah, that one resonates.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
I gotta send in my memories about this gone. Yeah, okay.
Brian wrote, I'm a fan, but I don't use it
very often. I do like that liquoricey anise esque taste,
but no one else in my house really enjoys it.
There are a couple of recipes I've come across that
I enjoy, and I figured i'd pass them along. Plumb
(32:28):
tarragon popsicles and steak sauce if you're into tarragon, or
at least an a post to it. I think the
flavor is subtle enough to not be offensive to the haters,
but sort of enough for those who enjoy it to
appreciate it. But mileage will vary. And yes, Brian did
send these recipes. If you want to get them, just
email us and we'll pass them along. They're kind of
(32:49):
a bit longer than what we only read, but they
do sound really nice. Oh yeah, popsicle popsicles. Yeah, Oh
my gosh, especially right now what it is so hot,
so warm?
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So I hadn't thought about yeah, right right, I hadn't
thought about tarragon that much in sweet recipes. But yeah,
plum absolutely, Okay, all right, anyway, Joe wrote, French tarragon
isn't one of my favorite herbs, if I'm honest. The
anna's lickorage profile is one I have a hard time with,
but it does feature in one of my favorite memories.
(33:23):
During my master's year in England, one of my best
friends studied a broad in France for the fall semester.
Before he headed back to the US. We decided to
spend Christmas together in Paris. We stayed in a tiny
flat on the fifth floor of a building with no elevator,
so the climb was always a challenge. What good after
eating a hardy French dinner on Christmas Day? We stayed
in and cooked Christmas lunch in the tiny but well
(33:45):
equipped kitchen. The only thing missing was an oven. We
decided to go ahead with pan fried chicken breast and
mashed potatoes, which I noticed was mentioned in listener mail
of Great Minds and all that. Our chicken breast was
served with a white wine mustard sauce, and saw swopped
time for tarragon. The mashed potatoes had chopped tarragon folded
into them as well. The chicken recipe is below, as
(34:07):
well as a picture of our meal. We also had
a rubel of salad, cheese and bread, of course, and
a raspberry tart from the iconic French bakery, the name
of which I've not looked up how to pronounce stroher Stroller.
Sorry apologies anyway, truly a Christmas to remember. Said friend
(34:28):
also loves coming up with cocktails based on what he
has on hand. Last year, he came up with one
that has vodka, orange blossom water, honey, and orange sand pellegrino.
He never measures anything, but I'd assume it's a shot
glass of vodka, about an eighth of a tea spoon
of orange blossom water, and a teaspoon of honey mixed
together before adding ice and topping it off with the
orange sand pellegrino. Super refreshing and timely for summer. Oh
(34:53):
yeah right, ooh yes, yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I love this. I love when you have the friend
that's like, I'll make the cocktail.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
It's like, hold on, I got youa yeah, a nice
orange blossom water and terragon.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Yeah too.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
M Oh, that does sound like a really lovely Christmas
that does.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
That does, and this sounds like a great meal came
together wonderfully.
Speaker 2 (35:24):
Oh oh that cocktail though, I need to I really
need to get some get some orange blossom water cocktails
going because I've been on a kick. I've just been
just been like like a like a drop or two
and a glass of soda water.
Speaker 1 (35:42):
Oh yeah, adds so much, yeah, add so much. Well,
thank you to both of these listeners for writing in
and sending recipes. Yeah like we're happy to pass along.
You can emailos at Hello dot com.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
We're also on social media. You can find us on
Instagram and blue Sky at savor pod and we do
hope to hear from you. Savor is production of iHeartRadio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Thanks as always to our super producers Dylan Fagan and
Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope
(36:21):
that lots of We're good things are coming your way
Savor News
Hosts And Creators
Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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