November 16, 2018 • 19 mins
This vegetarian protein is made from wheat (and it's pronounced say-TAHN, but we couldn't resist the joke). Anney and Lauren dig into the debated history and gooey, chewy science of seitan.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello, and welcome to Savor. I'm any Rees and I'm
Lauren vocal bamb and today we're talking about satan. Yes, satan,
not satan, not satan. No, different, things, very different. Probably
not vegetarian, that second one. I don't think so, but
you never know, you never know. No, we're talking about satan,
(00:29):
which is flavored wheat gluten, sometimes called gluten, wheat gluten,
wheat protein, or wheat meat. It's in your toe freaky slices. Yes, yes,
but really though, what is it? Okay? Satan is a
protein product created using wheat gluten. Gluten is the primary
protein and wheat. It's a stretchy and sort of linky,
(00:51):
and the texture of satan is well, it's a it's
a lot like meat, maybe more so than other meat alternatives.
It has a sort of fibrous chew that reminds me
a lot of chicken, or at least like a chicken nugget,
actual chicken. And you make satan by a first coaxing
the gluten out of wheat flour, and then by encouraging
(01:13):
that gluten to lock up just right to give you
that nice chewy texture. To get the gluten out, you
make a sort of dough of flour and water and
then soak and need it with more water, like a
lot more water. Gluten is not water soluble, so it
will stay put in your sort of dough, but the
starches that make up the rest of wheat flour are
totally water soluble, so they will eventually wash out. You're
(01:36):
then left with gluten and okay. Gluten is made up
of two types of protein molecules, glutenens and gladin's, plus
a smattering of a few other compounds like sistine, which
is an amino acid, and all right under normal circumstances.
Gluten is a sort of gel like suspension of this
stuff and maybe some molecules of water. But but when
(01:57):
you mess with it, both physically mix or needing the
gluten and also chemically changing its pH by adding stuff
like vinegar or baking soda, those Cystein's will make the
gluten and molecules link up, the gliddens are smaller, and
we'll get trapped in these like cross linked matrices of
(02:17):
luten molecules like a Okay, imagine imagine you have a
few strands of giant Christmas lights like like like the
bulbs are like the size of like normal lamp bulbs. Okay,
and these strands are just super tangled up as they do.
And for some reason you and all your wisdom decided
(02:39):
to store a bunch of bitty little like pinky sized
globe ornaments in the same box as these strands of
Christmas lights. And so when you take this mass of
tangled lights out of the box, all of these little
ornaments come with it, trapped in the little like pockets
made up by the twisted chords. Did my mom put
you up to this? It's a lot of work taking
(03:00):
down the decorations at the end of the year. Mom, No,
no shame, no shame. Okay, okay? Does this imagine that
you can eat it? Oh? Does that make it better?
Then I don't have to untangle him? Yeah? Okay, yeah, yeah.
Well that's satan cool, guilt free. You can also make
it at home. It is notoriously difficult to get the
(03:23):
texture right, but yes, you can totally work your own
gluten out of flower or buy wheat gluten often called
vital wheat gluten in stores and use it to make
your own satan. You can also use vital wheat gluten
to up your homemade bread game. I'm always looking to
up my homemade bread game. If we're talking about flavor,
I actually don't have too much experience with satan. Satan yes,
(03:48):
the form of horror movies, but satan, no, not really.
I do remember having a hardy, meaty texture and that
had absorbed flavor really well. It can mimic some of
the flavors and properties of meat so well that it
makes some vegetarians or vegans suspicious that there might actually
be meat in whatever vegetarian vegan dish they've ordered that
(04:08):
has satan in it. Yeah, by itself, wheat gluten is
pretty bland, but satan is usually made with flavor additives
to make it taste meaty. Um. Common recipes recommend savory
things like nutritional yeast, tomari and worse to share sauce.
And for talking about nutrition, satan has a good amount
of protein. One ounce comes in around one protein. Um.
(04:30):
It's low fat, low car but obviously not gluten free.
If celiacs are, gluten intolerance is something that you deal with. Yeah,
and this this package of really high protein with really
low fat and low carb is something that some people
find very desirable and numbers wise inve Some research put
(04:50):
the meat alternatives industry in the US, of which Satan
is a part of, at five thirty three million dollars.
So it's making some money. Yeah, it's thinking some money.
And if we look back at the history, it features
a cameo from someone I was not expecting that we
haven't talked about in a while in this show. But
(05:11):
you're gonna have to wait to find out who it
is until after this quick break for a word from
our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you.
For centuries Chinese and Japanese vegetarian Buddhist monks have eaten satan,
(05:34):
or not exactly satan, but who romanized either h U
or Fu. But yeah, who is not exactly what we
think of when we think of satan today. But it's
also a product made from wheat gluten that has been
processed to form chewy protein e products. It's usually a
little less fibrous than satan, more like the texture of
(05:54):
seafood than chicken, or sort of spongy or like a
sort of springy cake. Yeah, there isn't too much when
it comes to history recorded history when it comes to satan.
But I do know that some people like ignore this
whole thing and say that this isn't satan when they're
talking about the history of satan depends, you know, mytories
(06:16):
of history. Yeah, yeah, Um, it's been a Southeast Asian
diet staple since sixth century CE. In Japan, for instance,
where for centuries up until the nineteenth century, eating four
legged animals was forbidden. This resulted from the arrival of
Buddhism circa sixth century CE, compounding existing Shinto beliefs against
killing or eating animals. Because of that, Japan and also India,
(06:39):
which had a similar story, Um, the idea of mock
meat wasn't really a thing for a good while because
there wasn't really a reference point. Yeah, there were pockets
of cultures that eight meat anyway in Japan, but it
was not widespread. Like new emperors had a long standing
tradition of as soon as they rose to power, re
up ing that edict against eating mammals. Right, the same
(07:05):
wasn't true in China, not for the common person at
any rate. Buddhist monks on the mainland and in Korea
wouldn't eat animals either. Poet Yuan May included a recipe
for a satan textured to be similar to goose in
the book Recipes from the Sway Garden. Journey to the West,
a book out of the Ming Dynasty, comes with several
wheat gluten mentions. One involves a demon trying to trick
(07:28):
a monk into eating human flesh and brains that resembled
wheat gluten. Tricky demon that sounds like it could be
a future fantasy food. Journey to the West is full
of It's the legend that we got so many other
stories out of, like a dragon ball z and Sayuki
and all of these weird problems. Yeah, yeah, re visit
(07:52):
that for sure. Yeah, or you know, whatever precursor to
Satan you're you want to talk about did feature pretty
widely in Chinese. Al Right. There's a poem from the
eleventh century CE book dream Pool Essays that said steel
is to iron as gluten is to flower. It's only
after thoroughly washing the dough that gluten is revealed. Wow.
(08:13):
I kind of want to go think about that for
aboute but I suppose we should continue in Vegetarian Restaurant
Number one opened in New York thanks to the New
York City Vegetarian Society. Vegetarian restaurant number one. I love
how on the nose. That is, we have a restaurant
similar to that in Atlanta. It was similarly named, but
(08:35):
the opening night menu included fruit and graham bread. Yes,
that graham graham, but that's not the kimmu I'm talking about.
Although related, George Osawa came up with the term satan
in nineteen sixty one. He was also the founder of
the macrobiotic diet. And indeed, satsan wasn't that common in
(08:57):
cookbooks until the nineteen seventies. That were it anyway, And
like I said earlier, all of that early history we're
we've been talking about. Some folks dispute it, saying that
satan got its start with the macrobiotic diet in the
nineteen sixties. I think satan is based very heavily on
who like, to the point where you can really call it.
(09:18):
I mean that you can you can count the history
of Yeah, it was sort of like a progression. Yeah, absolutely,
it's just just an offshoot. Yeah, I agree. When Mormon
settlers were making their way to Utah in the nineteenth century,
they needed an inexpensive protein source and satan was their answer.
Oh and also you know who was a huge part
(09:40):
of this movement, One John Harvey Kellogg. Kellogg That Kellogg
as part of his whole health sanitarium thing that we've
talked about in a few episodes, he was looking for
a successful meat alternative for the vegetarians in his fock.
He and his brother Will Kith, through some weird circumstance,
came upon the conclusion that dry wheat flaked super well,
(10:04):
and you add milk whila toasted wheat flakes. Now Kellogg
and his brother Will Keith had a huge blowout when
it came to the profitability of the cereal, eventually leading
to Will spinning out the Kellogg we all Know that
company and John Harvey Kellogg starting the Battle Creek Food Company.
(10:25):
This company's product line was primarily mock meats, the most
popular of which was known as Protos. It was a
combination of soy, peanuts and wheat gluten, sort of the
first commercial approximation of Setne. Some Seventh Day Avent his
fans of Kellog got the idea for mock meats more
closely resembling hot dogs and hamburgers and adding more seasoning
(10:47):
for flavor, including one Dr George Harding a relative of
Aard g. Harding. Yeah, we're gonna what guys of surprising
people in this episode. From this came the Worthington Foods
Company and their two can imitation meat products in if
you're wondering, because we were meatless wieners still available these
days to be looking for a throwback, and soy loin steaks. Oh,
(11:12):
that legitimately made me laugh. It was a good it's
a good pun. Uh. And we talked about these meatless
weeners and our hot dogs episode. These were maybe the
first veggie dogs on the market. Eventually, Worthington's got bought
out by Miles Laboratories, and from this came a brand
you've probably heard of, morning Star Farms. Yep, that one.
(11:32):
They were the first that we're really able to commercialize
the mock meats market in the US, like the Chick
with a K Patty. That was them. Morning Star went
through several companies before once again falling under Kellogg's ownership.
Satan's success largely depended on the public at large accepting vegetarianism,
which for a while was a tough sell in the
(11:55):
United States, especially for Middle America in the nineteen twenties.
One of America's first chain restaurants. It was called Child's,
attempted to transition to a full vegetarian menu at an
affordable price at the behest of owner and vegetarian William Childs.
Folks didn't go for it, though, sales plummeted and Childs
(12:15):
was removed from his leadership position. Even progressive New York
City was iffy on the idea of vegetarianism during World
War Two. Enter Cranks in nineteen sixty one and all
vegetarian restaurant that went on to attract famous fans like
Linda McCartney and Princess Diana and uh I wanted to
(12:37):
put in here at the end that these days, Satan
is pretty widely available in supermarkets. But if you're looking
to expand from Satan into Who territory, the fresh stuff
that's mixed with glutinous rice in Japanese called nummafu is
is hard to find in the West, but you can
probably find cooked and dried who called yaki who or
Yaki boo in whatever Asian import market is in your area.
(13:02):
I'll have to keep an eye out for that. This
episode has inspired me to try try some more. Yeah
me too, I'm sort of I'm craving it right now.
I've definitely had like clear broth Japanese soup that has
these little it almost looks like a like a little
spongey cracker And that's definitely this this like yucky who
like dried m and yeah, and I'm just like, oh,
(13:24):
it's nice. It soaks up, it soaks up the broth.
That's a nice little texture difference in the soup. Yeah,
I got a craving. I've said it before and I'll
say to you in the Tempe episode to date is
the one that has changed my diet the most because
I eat Tempe all the time. Now really, oh wow,
that's so cool. Yeah. Oh, now I want to know.
I want to pick your brain for recipes and stuff.
(13:46):
Oh my goodness, how do you like cooking it? I
like a good simple stir fry with soy sauce. Yea
in a little sesame oil. Yeah, sesame oil makes all
the difference. Yeah. But now I'm I'm hoping maybe I'll
have a similar revelation in about Satan. But in the meantime,
it is time for listener mail. That was kod that
(14:08):
was on point. There's hand gestures coordinated, but it wasn't coordinated,
but it ended up working out. We're taking this straight
to Broadway. It would be really off Broadway. But actually
before we get to the listener mail, we have one
more quick break for you for a word from our sponsor.
(14:33):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and
we are back with a letter from Jarrett. He wrote,
I heard you were looking for food poetry. While not
a poet myself, I wondered if you had heard of
the poem addressed to a haggis by Scotland's most celebrated poet,
Robert Burns as a Scottish American. We celebrate Burns's birthday
(14:55):
each year on January five, and traditionally there is always
a hag us as part of the dinner. There are
all sorts of virtuals and whatnot, and the evening is
generally spent with friends and family reading some of Burns's poetry. However,
during the opening sequence of the feast, Burns Night or
her Burns Feast is what the event is traditionally called,
and is celebrated as a national holiday in Scotland. The
(15:16):
presentation of the haggis before dinner is accompanied by a
miniature parade from the kitchen to the dining area, during
which a variety of tunes is played by a bagpiper.
All Linksign is another poem written by Burns and then
later set to the music We All Know and Love,
and the recitation of the poem addressed to a haggis.
It's a lot of fun, and since some of Burns's
(15:36):
poetry can get a bit body, there's plenty of laughter.
I've included a link to the poem below for your pleasure.
It's written in the Scott's dialect of English, but this
one includes a translation. If you haven't yet done an
episode about haggis, perhaps you'd like to consider it. As
of today, you can't get real haggis in the US
because of the laws regarding consumption of sheep awful, So
(15:57):
perhaps it would be fun to research. I think so. Yeah,
this sounds lovely, and this sounds like the best kind
of party, A parade, a bagpiper, poetry readings, pasting. Yeah,
it's very good. I've never had real haggis, but I'm
I'm into the idea. I had it once and I
liked it. Yeah, yeah, it was you had to get
(16:19):
over at least I did because I was pretty young
at the time and relatively young, and I had to
get over all of the the context. You know, in
the US, we make a lot of jokes about it. Yeah,
but it's just it's really just sausage stuff. Yeah, it
was good. It's good, I believe you. But yeah, if
we should post the poem somewhere, it is pretty it's
(16:42):
pretty excellent. We'll have to do. We'll just have to
do an episode on Haggess and do a dramatic reading.
Oh yes, so in Brian wrote, can you imagine mayonnaise
on Hawaiian pizza? No? I wouldn't want to either, but nevertheless,
I was witnessed to such a usage by a shipmate
some years ago. I was working aboard a traditional wooden
(17:04):
hulled schooner where several crew lived in a rather dank
foxel that smelled of wetwood, sea salt, rope people, and
the more pleasant to me at least, odor of Danish
pine tar. I've never been seasick, but the smells of
that boat, plus the site of our bosun slathering mayonnaise
atop her slice of steaming hot Hawaiian pizza, seeing it
melting into the ham and pineapple was enough to make
(17:26):
me just a tad green. Don't get me wrong, I
like Mayo, but this is not an acceptable use for
such a condiment, even one so versatile as Mayo. I
am from Connecticut and still lived there, but work on
a tugboat down south, where the Cajun crew has converted
this Connecticut Yankee two dukes, having been raised in the North.
I had never heard of dukes Helman's and its abysmal
(17:48):
approximation called miracle whip, where all I knew. But as
soon as I tried dukes on a cucumber sand which
I was elated to find that it was less sweet
and pleasantly tangy. Turns out these Southerners were about their
preference for dukes, unlike their preferred treatment of lobsters by
boiling them with crawfish seasoning or crab boil black. I
(18:10):
love it. Opinions are so great. Yeah, yeah, man, savor
neither endorses nor nor do not. We should get cards
that say that. Yeah. I didn't include it, but at
the beginning of this letter, Brian wrote, don't show this
to Annie. It'll make her feel terrible or something. And
(18:31):
he's right. I got a little queasy here in that description. Yeah,
that's an intense condiment usage. Yeah, I've never witnessed such
a thing, and I have no desire to. I don't
approve of warm applications of Mayo. Okay, I think it's
I think it's basically a cold sandwich only condiment. Okay, Yeah,
(18:52):
that's Laurence food opinion. Yeah, I can. I can see
an aoli. You gotta go case by case, but generally yeah, yeah, yeah,
you've really got to step up the spices somehow if
you're going to apply a mayo product to a warm
sandwich or et cetera. Yeah, that's all I'm saying. I'm sticking.
I'm sticking with that. We should really have a book
(19:15):
of your food rules. I like it. I love this
this kind of stuff. Keep chat, keep tracking that. Thanks
to both of them for writing in. If you'd like
to write to as you can, Our email is Hello
at saber pod dot com. We're also on social media.
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram all
(19:36):
at saber Pod. We do hope to hear from you.
Thank you so much to super producer Dylan Fagan, thank
you to you for listening, and we hope that lots
more good thanks are coming your way.
Hello, and welcome to Savor. I'm any Rees and I'm
Lauren vocal bamb and today we're talking about satan. Yes, satan,
not satan, not satan. No, different, things, very different. Probably
not vegetarian, that second one. I don't think so, but
you never know, you never know. No, we're talking about satan,
(00:29):
which is flavored wheat gluten, sometimes called gluten, wheat gluten,
wheat protein, or wheat meat. It's in your toe freaky slices. Yes, yes,
but really though, what is it? Okay? Satan is a
protein product created using wheat gluten. Gluten is the primary
protein and wheat. It's a stretchy and sort of linky,
(00:51):
and the texture of satan is well, it's a it's
a lot like meat, maybe more so than other meat alternatives.
It has a sort of fibrous chew that reminds me
a lot of chicken, or at least like a chicken nugget,
actual chicken. And you make satan by a first coaxing
the gluten out of wheat flour, and then by encouraging
(01:13):
that gluten to lock up just right to give you
that nice chewy texture. To get the gluten out, you
make a sort of dough of flour and water and
then soak and need it with more water, like a
lot more water. Gluten is not water soluble, so it
will stay put in your sort of dough, but the
starches that make up the rest of wheat flour are
totally water soluble, so they will eventually wash out. You're
(01:36):
then left with gluten and okay. Gluten is made up
of two types of protein molecules, glutenens and gladin's, plus
a smattering of a few other compounds like sistine, which
is an amino acid, and all right under normal circumstances.
Gluten is a sort of gel like suspension of this
stuff and maybe some molecules of water. But but when
(01:57):
you mess with it, both physically mix or needing the
gluten and also chemically changing its pH by adding stuff
like vinegar or baking soda, those Cystein's will make the
gluten and molecules link up, the gliddens are smaller, and
we'll get trapped in these like cross linked matrices of
(02:17):
luten molecules like a Okay, imagine imagine you have a
few strands of giant Christmas lights like like like the
bulbs are like the size of like normal lamp bulbs. Okay,
and these strands are just super tangled up as they do.
And for some reason you and all your wisdom decided
(02:39):
to store a bunch of bitty little like pinky sized
globe ornaments in the same box as these strands of
Christmas lights. And so when you take this mass of
tangled lights out of the box, all of these little
ornaments come with it, trapped in the little like pockets
made up by the twisted chords. Did my mom put
you up to this? It's a lot of work taking
(03:00):
down the decorations at the end of the year. Mom, No,
no shame, no shame. Okay, okay? Does this imagine that
you can eat it? Oh? Does that make it better?
Then I don't have to untangle him? Yeah? Okay, yeah, yeah.
Well that's satan cool, guilt free. You can also make
it at home. It is notoriously difficult to get the
(03:23):
texture right, but yes, you can totally work your own
gluten out of flower or buy wheat gluten often called
vital wheat gluten in stores and use it to make
your own satan. You can also use vital wheat gluten
to up your homemade bread game. I'm always looking to
up my homemade bread game. If we're talking about flavor,
I actually don't have too much experience with satan. Satan yes,
(03:48):
the form of horror movies, but satan, no, not really.
I do remember having a hardy, meaty texture and that
had absorbed flavor really well. It can mimic some of
the flavors and properties of meat so well that it
makes some vegetarians or vegans suspicious that there might actually
be meat in whatever vegetarian vegan dish they've ordered that
(04:08):
has satan in it. Yeah, by itself, wheat gluten is
pretty bland, but satan is usually made with flavor additives
to make it taste meaty. Um. Common recipes recommend savory
things like nutritional yeast, tomari and worse to share sauce.
And for talking about nutrition, satan has a good amount
of protein. One ounce comes in around one protein. Um.
(04:30):
It's low fat, low car but obviously not gluten free.
If celiacs are, gluten intolerance is something that you deal with. Yeah,
and this this package of really high protein with really
low fat and low carb is something that some people
find very desirable and numbers wise inve Some research put
(04:50):
the meat alternatives industry in the US, of which Satan
is a part of, at five thirty three million dollars.
So it's making some money. Yeah, it's thinking some money.
And if we look back at the history, it features
a cameo from someone I was not expecting that we
haven't talked about in a while in this show. But
(05:11):
you're gonna have to wait to find out who it
is until after this quick break for a word from
our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you.
For centuries Chinese and Japanese vegetarian Buddhist monks have eaten satan,
(05:34):
or not exactly satan, but who romanized either h U
or Fu. But yeah, who is not exactly what we
think of when we think of satan today. But it's
also a product made from wheat gluten that has been
processed to form chewy protein e products. It's usually a
little less fibrous than satan, more like the texture of
(05:54):
seafood than chicken, or sort of spongy or like a
sort of springy cake. Yeah, there isn't too much when
it comes to history recorded history when it comes to satan.
But I do know that some people like ignore this
whole thing and say that this isn't satan when they're
talking about the history of satan depends, you know, mytories
(06:16):
of history. Yeah, yeah, Um, it's been a Southeast Asian
diet staple since sixth century CE. In Japan, for instance,
where for centuries up until the nineteenth century, eating four
legged animals was forbidden. This resulted from the arrival of
Buddhism circa sixth century CE, compounding existing Shinto beliefs against
killing or eating animals. Because of that, Japan and also India,
(06:39):
which had a similar story, Um, the idea of mock
meat wasn't really a thing for a good while because
there wasn't really a reference point. Yeah, there were pockets
of cultures that eight meat anyway in Japan, but it
was not widespread. Like new emperors had a long standing
tradition of as soon as they rose to power, re
up ing that edict against eating mammals. Right, the same
(07:05):
wasn't true in China, not for the common person at
any rate. Buddhist monks on the mainland and in Korea
wouldn't eat animals either. Poet Yuan May included a recipe
for a satan textured to be similar to goose in
the book Recipes from the Sway Garden. Journey to the West,
a book out of the Ming Dynasty, comes with several
wheat gluten mentions. One involves a demon trying to trick
(07:28):
a monk into eating human flesh and brains that resembled
wheat gluten. Tricky demon that sounds like it could be
a future fantasy food. Journey to the West is full
of It's the legend that we got so many other
stories out of, like a dragon ball z and Sayuki
and all of these weird problems. Yeah, yeah, re visit
(07:52):
that for sure. Yeah, or you know, whatever precursor to
Satan you're you want to talk about did feature pretty
widely in Chinese. Al Right. There's a poem from the
eleventh century CE book dream Pool Essays that said steel
is to iron as gluten is to flower. It's only
after thoroughly washing the dough that gluten is revealed. Wow.
(08:13):
I kind of want to go think about that for
aboute but I suppose we should continue in Vegetarian Restaurant
Number one opened in New York thanks to the New
York City Vegetarian Society. Vegetarian restaurant number one. I love
how on the nose. That is, we have a restaurant
similar to that in Atlanta. It was similarly named, but
(08:35):
the opening night menu included fruit and graham bread. Yes,
that graham graham, but that's not the kimmu I'm talking about.
Although related, George Osawa came up with the term satan
in nineteen sixty one. He was also the founder of
the macrobiotic diet. And indeed, satsan wasn't that common in
(08:57):
cookbooks until the nineteen seventies. That were it anyway, And
like I said earlier, all of that early history we're
we've been talking about. Some folks dispute it, saying that
satan got its start with the macrobiotic diet in the
nineteen sixties. I think satan is based very heavily on
who like, to the point where you can really call it.
(09:18):
I mean that you can you can count the history
of Yeah, it was sort of like a progression. Yeah, absolutely,
it's just just an offshoot. Yeah, I agree. When Mormon
settlers were making their way to Utah in the nineteenth century,
they needed an inexpensive protein source and satan was their answer.
Oh and also you know who was a huge part
(09:40):
of this movement, One John Harvey Kellogg. Kellogg That Kellogg
as part of his whole health sanitarium thing that we've
talked about in a few episodes, he was looking for
a successful meat alternative for the vegetarians in his fock.
He and his brother Will Kith, through some weird circumstance,
came upon the conclusion that dry wheat flaked super well,
(10:04):
and you add milk whila toasted wheat flakes. Now Kellogg
and his brother Will Keith had a huge blowout when
it came to the profitability of the cereal, eventually leading
to Will spinning out the Kellogg we all Know that
company and John Harvey Kellogg starting the Battle Creek Food Company.
(10:25):
This company's product line was primarily mock meats, the most
popular of which was known as Protos. It was a
combination of soy, peanuts and wheat gluten, sort of the
first commercial approximation of Setne. Some Seventh Day Avent his
fans of Kellog got the idea for mock meats more
closely resembling hot dogs and hamburgers and adding more seasoning
(10:47):
for flavor, including one Dr George Harding a relative of
Aard g. Harding. Yeah, we're gonna what guys of surprising
people in this episode. From this came the Worthington Foods
Company and their two can imitation meat products in if
you're wondering, because we were meatless wieners still available these
days to be looking for a throwback, and soy loin steaks. Oh,
(11:12):
that legitimately made me laugh. It was a good it's
a good pun. Uh. And we talked about these meatless
weeners and our hot dogs episode. These were maybe the
first veggie dogs on the market. Eventually, Worthington's got bought
out by Miles Laboratories, and from this came a brand
you've probably heard of, morning Star Farms. Yep, that one.
(11:32):
They were the first that we're really able to commercialize
the mock meats market in the US, like the Chick
with a K Patty. That was them. Morning Star went
through several companies before once again falling under Kellogg's ownership.
Satan's success largely depended on the public at large accepting vegetarianism,
which for a while was a tough sell in the
(11:55):
United States, especially for Middle America in the nineteen twenties.
One of America's first chain restaurants. It was called Child's,
attempted to transition to a full vegetarian menu at an
affordable price at the behest of owner and vegetarian William Childs.
Folks didn't go for it, though, sales plummeted and Childs
(12:15):
was removed from his leadership position. Even progressive New York
City was iffy on the idea of vegetarianism during World
War Two. Enter Cranks in nineteen sixty one and all
vegetarian restaurant that went on to attract famous fans like
Linda McCartney and Princess Diana and uh I wanted to
(12:37):
put in here at the end that these days, Satan
is pretty widely available in supermarkets. But if you're looking
to expand from Satan into Who territory, the fresh stuff
that's mixed with glutinous rice in Japanese called nummafu is
is hard to find in the West, but you can
probably find cooked and dried who called yaki who or
Yaki boo in whatever Asian import market is in your area.
(13:02):
I'll have to keep an eye out for that. This
episode has inspired me to try try some more. Yeah
me too, I'm sort of I'm craving it right now.
I've definitely had like clear broth Japanese soup that has
these little it almost looks like a like a little
spongey cracker And that's definitely this this like yucky who
like dried m and yeah, and I'm just like, oh,
(13:24):
it's nice. It soaks up, it soaks up the broth.
That's a nice little texture difference in the soup. Yeah,
I got a craving. I've said it before and I'll
say to you in the Tempe episode to date is
the one that has changed my diet the most because
I eat Tempe all the time. Now really, oh wow,
that's so cool. Yeah. Oh, now I want to know.
I want to pick your brain for recipes and stuff.
(13:46):
Oh my goodness, how do you like cooking it? I
like a good simple stir fry with soy sauce. Yea
in a little sesame oil. Yeah, sesame oil makes all
the difference. Yeah. But now I'm I'm hoping maybe I'll
have a similar revelation in about Satan. But in the meantime,
it is time for listener mail. That was kod that
(14:08):
was on point. There's hand gestures coordinated, but it wasn't coordinated,
but it ended up working out. We're taking this straight
to Broadway. It would be really off Broadway. But actually
before we get to the listener mail, we have one
more quick break for you for a word from our sponsor.
(14:33):
And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and
we are back with a letter from Jarrett. He wrote,
I heard you were looking for food poetry. While not
a poet myself, I wondered if you had heard of
the poem addressed to a haggis by Scotland's most celebrated poet,
Robert Burns as a Scottish American. We celebrate Burns's birthday
(14:55):
each year on January five, and traditionally there is always
a hag us as part of the dinner. There are
all sorts of virtuals and whatnot, and the evening is
generally spent with friends and family reading some of Burns's poetry. However,
during the opening sequence of the feast, Burns Night or
her Burns Feast is what the event is traditionally called,
and is celebrated as a national holiday in Scotland. The
(15:16):
presentation of the haggis before dinner is accompanied by a
miniature parade from the kitchen to the dining area, during
which a variety of tunes is played by a bagpiper.
All Linksign is another poem written by Burns and then
later set to the music We All Know and Love,
and the recitation of the poem addressed to a haggis.
It's a lot of fun, and since some of Burns's
(15:36):
poetry can get a bit body, there's plenty of laughter.
I've included a link to the poem below for your pleasure.
It's written in the Scott's dialect of English, but this
one includes a translation. If you haven't yet done an
episode about haggis, perhaps you'd like to consider it. As
of today, you can't get real haggis in the US
because of the laws regarding consumption of sheep awful, So
(15:57):
perhaps it would be fun to research. I think so. Yeah,
this sounds lovely, and this sounds like the best kind
of party, A parade, a bagpiper, poetry readings, pasting. Yeah,
it's very good. I've never had real haggis, but I'm
I'm into the idea. I had it once and I
liked it. Yeah, yeah, it was you had to get
(16:19):
over at least I did because I was pretty young
at the time and relatively young, and I had to
get over all of the the context. You know, in
the US, we make a lot of jokes about it. Yeah,
but it's just it's really just sausage stuff. Yeah, it
was good. It's good, I believe you. But yeah, if
we should post the poem somewhere, it is pretty it's
(16:42):
pretty excellent. We'll have to do. We'll just have to
do an episode on Haggess and do a dramatic reading.
Oh yes, so in Brian wrote, can you imagine mayonnaise
on Hawaiian pizza? No? I wouldn't want to either, but nevertheless,
I was witnessed to such a usage by a shipmate
some years ago. I was working aboard a traditional wooden
(17:04):
hulled schooner where several crew lived in a rather dank
foxel that smelled of wetwood, sea salt, rope people, and
the more pleasant to me at least, odor of Danish
pine tar. I've never been seasick, but the smells of
that boat, plus the site of our bosun slathering mayonnaise
atop her slice of steaming hot Hawaiian pizza, seeing it
melting into the ham and pineapple was enough to make
(17:26):
me just a tad green. Don't get me wrong, I
like Mayo, but this is not an acceptable use for
such a condiment, even one so versatile as Mayo. I
am from Connecticut and still lived there, but work on
a tugboat down south, where the Cajun crew has converted
this Connecticut Yankee two dukes, having been raised in the North.
I had never heard of dukes Helman's and its abysmal
(17:48):
approximation called miracle whip, where all I knew. But as
soon as I tried dukes on a cucumber sand which
I was elated to find that it was less sweet
and pleasantly tangy. Turns out these Southerners were about their
preference for dukes, unlike their preferred treatment of lobsters by
boiling them with crawfish seasoning or crab boil black. I
(18:10):
love it. Opinions are so great. Yeah, yeah, man, savor
neither endorses nor nor do not. We should get cards
that say that. Yeah. I didn't include it, but at
the beginning of this letter, Brian wrote, don't show this
to Annie. It'll make her feel terrible or something. And
(18:31):
he's right. I got a little queasy here in that description. Yeah,
that's an intense condiment usage. Yeah, I've never witnessed such
a thing, and I have no desire to. I don't
approve of warm applications of Mayo. Okay, I think it's
I think it's basically a cold sandwich only condiment. Okay, Yeah,
(18:52):
that's Laurence food opinion. Yeah, I can. I can see
an aoli. You gotta go case by case, but generally yeah, yeah, yeah,
you've really got to step up the spices somehow if
you're going to apply a mayo product to a warm
sandwich or et cetera. Yeah, that's all I'm saying. I'm sticking.
I'm sticking with that. We should really have a book
(19:15):
of your food rules. I like it. I love this
this kind of stuff. Keep chat, keep tracking that. Thanks
to both of them for writing in. If you'd like
to write to as you can, Our email is Hello
at saber pod dot com. We're also on social media.
You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram all
(19:36):
at saber Pod. We do hope to hear from you.
Thank you so much to super producer Dylan Fagan, thank
you to you for listening, and we hope that lots
more good thanks are coming your way.
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Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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