February 18, 2022 • 32 mins
This long, skinny loaf of bread is deceptively simple and deeply loved. Anney and Lauren tear into the history and science behind the baguette.
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren vog Obam, and today
we have an episode for you about baguettes. Yes, it's
a lot, Oh my goodness, it is. It's quite the
topic to tackle it. It's it's a little intimidating because
it is again one of those things that people have
very strong opinions about. Yes, oh gosh, uh that I
(00:35):
had forgotten that I had given myself this assignment um,
and then had this moment of panic when I started
doing the reading, because I was like, oh no, what
did I do? Baggett. Panic is very very real, very
very real. Uh. And I'm going to start out saying
something kind of controversial. I'm Baggett neutral. Oh fine, oh wow,
(00:59):
I go right, I know. And we just had a
like heated discussion about Star Wars. That feels. No. I've
had I've had some lovely, lovely bag ads and some
out of this world BoNT me. I love a good
um and even like just a simple cheese played or
butter situation, but in general, I just don't seek them out. Um.
(01:21):
It's kind of a it's it's less to do with
the taste and more like the mess that gets made
a lot of time with the bag and it is
a crumbly crust, and so you're gonna you're gonna get
some crumbs all over the clothes, whole thing. I do
have a friend that loves them, and it's one of
(01:42):
my favorite things about hers that she always brings them
to cheese night and she's given but without out fail Lauren,
she leaves most of it with me. Um. So then
I freeze it, and then the next time we have
cheese night, she scolds me and throws it away and
has a whole a new one, and so the cycle,
the cycle of baggett continues. But it's one of her
(02:04):
biggest she hates. She thinks I'm like a cheap skate
or something, and that we are very friendly, loving way
that I will never throw anything out I have. I
have no joke. Three afro bats in there, she will
be goodness, oh my goodness. I well, I mean, okay,
(02:24):
you could de freeze them, to defrost them de freeze goodness? Um,
I mean you could consume them in between? Sure? Could
I'm confused as to why you don't. I mean, I
always have various bread products in my freezer and I
(02:45):
eat them with perhaps disturbing frequency. Um, I really, I
really go through them. Mm hmm. But goodness, I I
I love a Baggett. I mean, I you know, it's
It's one of the things that makes me feel the
most like adult and fancy is when I'm putting together
(03:07):
some kind of um snacking situation and uh and I
find a bakery that has a basket of these big,
lovely loaves um, and I'm like, oh, yeah, am I
going to eat a whole loaf of bread today? Yes
i am. I'm so happy for you when you get
(03:30):
to have that moment I have stand it's it's lovely. Yeah,
so exciting. Yeah, it has a it's got an emotional
component to it, I think. Um. And when I was
in France, I did see baggetts ever everywhere. One of
the first pictures I took I did the most stereotypical
(03:50):
touristing a baggett and I got some cheese, I got
some wine, and I had a picnic in from the
Eiffel Tower and I took a picture. Yeah, it was very,
very nice. It was pretty common breakfast lunch item, maybe
half with some mustard and cut meats like really simple
often sure yeah, yeah, and it was it was pretty nice.
I remember getting all like on the train and you
(04:11):
could just never it would you didn't have to worry.
There would be a bag at somewhere that you could take.
That's wonderful goodness. Yeah, I other right, Other than putting
together like snack plate kind of situations at home, I
guess my other and all the bond me every bond me,
(04:31):
every day, all the time, bond me. Um. But but
other than that, gosh, um. When the one time that
I got over to England for a week or so, um,
I was staying in Reading and there was this little
sandwich shop around the corner um that had this this
very like Seinfeld like soup Nazi kind of vibe. It
was like a very particular way of ordering and like
(04:55):
it was and they baked all their bread in the
house and it was very simple sandwiches, and I think
I just got one that was like like smoked salmon
and cream cheese and like a little bit of herb
mm hm. That was it. But the back at it
was incredible and and the salmon was incredible, and I
(05:18):
was just bowled over by like everything, you know, it
was like I transported. It was. It was also like
my first time out of the country really, and so
I was just like like bright eyed about everything on
the planet, which was very much not the vibe. I
think I really upset a number of Englishmen by just
(05:38):
smiling at them on the street. Apparently that's not what
you do. I'll screw them, Lauren, and I guess that's
an important thing to know. We are going to talk
about that later. Um, there are plenty of not so
great baggots that are kind of muddy the water, like
(06:00):
I think you know the ones my friend brings. And
there's no shade to that either necessarily. Uh, aren't you
know the best quality of baggett? Yes, there's a part
of what people are passionate about is how this product
is made. Oh, yes, they are, so, I guess we
(06:22):
should get to our question. I guess, so, yeah, yeah,
here we go. Baggetts. What are they? Well, Um, a
baggett is a type of yeast raised bread, traditionally baked
fairly quickly in long, skinny loaves without any added fat.
(06:43):
You're you're just using flower water, salt, and yeast to
create this. Um, this simple but kind of elegant loaf
that has a that has a relatively thick, crisp crust
surrounding this light, but chewy crumb. It's a really beautiful
contrast of textures when you get it right. But it's
(07:03):
so straightforward that you're like really highlighting the flavors of
the yeast and everything that's happening to the flower during
the baking. They're like a they're like if modernist minimalism
was a bread, I wasn't expecting that one, Okay, I
(07:24):
like that all right? Yeah yeah. Um. Finished baguettes are
usually um two to three inches wide, that's around five
d eight centimeters and about twenty four to twenty eight
inches long, like sixty to seventy centimes. They're abouts somewhere
in there. Um. They are yeah, excellent on their own, um,
(07:46):
sliced or perhaps torn into more manageable pieces so you're
not just gnawing on like a two ft long bread loaf. Um.
But they're also often cut lengthwise and spread with simple
stuff like like butter or right made to sandwiches with
anything from yeah, like a like a little bit of
sliced meat and a spread of some kind of condiment
to multi layered amalgamations of proteins and spreads and garnishes.
(08:12):
Either either is good. Yes, baguettes are meant to be
eaten very fresh, like really as soon as they're cool
from the oven um as the crust will start going
soft and stale after that, um, which I think is
from moisture escaping from the inside of the loaf um.
(08:33):
And then the whole loaf will after that pretty quickly
dry out because it doesn't have um any ingredients to
hold moisture in. And as usual with a product that
is so um so simple in heavy scare quotes, um,
some really precise and complex science goes into making them correctly. Um. Okay,
(08:56):
So let's let's do a really quick rundown of what
goes into making yeast breads. Yeah, okay, very basically, Uh,
if you're starting with dry yeast, which are friendly microbes
that have been put into a kind of stasis, uh,
you might need to activate the yeast or or wake
those microbes up with warm water. You then mix and
(09:19):
need your ingredients into an elastic kind of dough and
let it proof, which means that you're letting that yeast
go to work. Eating sugars in the flour and pooping
carbon dioxide and flavor yeast. Um, the carbon dioxide will
cause the dough to rise. Um. You then deflate the
(09:42):
dough a little bit, punch it down and shape it
into your loaf. Then let it prove a second time,
during which it will attain more or less its final shape. Um. Finally,
you score the top of the loaf, which means that
you you create cuts meant to let steam escape in
a controlled manner during the baking, so that the surface
doesn't bubble or crack or poof up unevenly. Yeah. Um.
(10:06):
Then yeah, you bake it until the elastic structures in
the dough firm up and the crust dries out, and
the Miyard reaction, in which sugars and proteins together are
affected by heat. The Myyard reaction causes the crust to
brown and gain flavor. All right, those are the basics. Um.
In terms of baguetts, your your ratio of ingredients, well,
(10:32):
I mean in terms of any bread, but in certainly
with baggetts. Um, your your ratio of ingredients and your
types of ingredients are really gonna matter. Um. Like, you
typically want a higher protein, harder type of wheat flour
that will create really stable gluten structures during baking and
thus helped create that that firm crust and that chewy crumb.
(10:56):
The amount of kneading that you do with the dough
also matters here. Um. The humidity in your kitchen and
your oven matter. Like. Remember you were dealing with for
ingredients here, water is one of them. Um. So like
the first couple of minutes the baggetts are baking, they're
usually steamed um. And this this keeps the crust elastic
(11:17):
as the moisture in the loaf begins to turn into
steam um and and expands, letting the loaf appropriately rise. UM.
But you don't want to steam them the whole time
because that wouldn't allow a crisp to occur on the crust.
It would make the crust kind of rubbery. Now you
want no. No. Of course, all of this is assuming
(11:37):
a like baking by hand process in a small kitchen environment. UM.
Baguettes are made industrially, and in those industrial applications, UM,
other ingredients might be added to help mimic the flavor
and the texture of handmade that get We're both just
(12:03):
nodding at each other very seriously, which I think is
really playing on an audio so it captures our nervousness
around this very serious topic. Oh goodness. Um uh. Scientifically speaking, UM,
(12:27):
I wasn't sure if I should put this note here
in the timeline, but I chose to put it here. Um.
The bag at might be actually an ideal texture for
a flavorful bread eating experience. Um. And this is according
to or like. This is in line with some some
research that was published in the Journal of Agricultural and
(12:48):
Food Chemistry in which found that the crust sort of
sort of helps lock in some of these um aroma
and flavor molecules. And because you have to chew a
proper baguette like kind of a lot um, you wind
(13:09):
up releasing more of those molecules into your nose and
mouth as you eat. Then you might with um softer
types of bread. Mm hmm. I love this food research. Yes, yes,
I love it so so wonderful. Well, what about the nutrition? Uh?
(13:34):
Could be worse? Could be worse? Uh low low and
fat and sugar hiding carbs. UM. Usually a decent amount
of protein in there from the flower baguettes will help
fill you up, but to keep you going pair with
a little bit of fat for sure, a little bit
more protein probably. You know, eat a vegetable, always eat
a vegetable. M We have a few numbers for you,
(13:57):
a couple. Yeah. Baker in France sell about six million
bagats a day a day, however, with the introduction of
industrial made baguets around the nineteen fifties, the number of
French bakeries has dropped by thirty thousand. Europe One reported
recently that one thousand, two hundred small French bakeries close
(14:18):
a day. Oh my goodness, yeah yeah um. According to
the Observatoire Dupins are the bread observatories, something else that
delighted me to discover it exists. The French people as
a whole consume about three twenty bagats every second that
comes out. I know. That comes out to be half
a bag at per person per day and about ten
(14:41):
billion every year. So delicious. It's a lot of baguets,
and obviously it is important to France. These are very
French specific numbers, even though they do. Bag gets obviously
exist and are important in other places, but French, the French, yes, um,
(15:02):
and and in fact, one one more number for you, Um,
there's a world record the longest baggett ever. It comes
from Italy. I know so much controversy and scandal already,
right right. Um. It was achieved in nineteen and it
(15:26):
measured a hundred and thirty two point six two meters
in length. That is about four hundred and thirty five
ft one inch. No, my brain does not accept this factor. Yeah, yeah,
I don't. I honestly don't know what that means. Like,
that's that's quite long. It's bonkers. Bonkers is the scientific
(15:52):
term for it. Yes, it is, I believe so. Uh well,
we've got quite a long is read on this one
for you as well. We do, um, and we're going
to get into that as soon as we get back
from a quick break for a word from our sponsors,
(16:16):
and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. Oh goodness.
So bread. This is not an episode about the history
of bread. No, no, please, No, it's been around a
good long while. I can tell you that, um, and
we have mentioned it in you know, kind of very
briefly in passing in several episodes about how it has
(16:38):
evolved from ingredients that were that created something pretty hard
and dense to something fluffier and yeastier um with all
kinds of ingredients and methods in the mix to make it.
And bread has always been important to French culture, and
in several instances it was even a signifier of status.
At the same time, bread was a staple to the impoverished,
(17:01):
sustaining them even through lean times, and any interruption in
that it was not well received. No um. In fact,
riots over bread and greens and the suspected hoarding and
price gouging of them helped lead to the French Revolution. Yeah.
Um uh. Part of all of this is that what's
now Central France happens to be a really great region
(17:24):
for growing wheat, and so wheat products like bread really
became a staple in surrounding areas. Yes, and I went
down a rabbit hole of French bread laws over the centuries,
and I can't not today, not today, not today, bread laws.
No all right, goodness be uh no spoilers, But if
(17:51):
you haven't seen the screen movie, I really enjoyed it.
And there's a line where somebody, somebody says to the killer,
not today, and the killer says yesterday. And I can't
stop thinking about that every time I hear that line anymore. Anyway,
the baggett as a murder weapon. Oh okay, all right, okay.
(18:16):
The baggett specifically does have mysterious origins and many a
legends surrounding it, but many agree I was probably invented
as an item of convenience during the Napoleonic era, perhaps
the innovation of French bakers who wanted a product soldiers
could carry in their pockets um or, as some stories go,
down their pants. We're on that in a second backpack
(18:40):
space was a precious commodity, so they just stick the
long bread loafs down their trousers. But okay, some sources
attribute this idea to Napoleon himself and not the bakers.
In eight one record suggest a Napoleonic soldier in Italy said,
what can you expect from so stupid a nation that
eats its bread in a stick? I know? However, many
(19:05):
other people rightfully point out that this whole thing probably
isn't true, because can you imagine doing soldier stuff with
a hard lot of bread any pants? Like? I A no?
Um or, I mean I can, but it's pretty comical. Uh,
and the crumbs would be everywhere and so itchy. I know. Um,
(19:28):
but I can see how it would be like easily
attached to the outside of your backpack or whatever you're carrying.
So right, that makes much more sense to me. I mean,
and there's even like a little bit of like potential
for physical comedy, like if you're if you're like turning
around quickly and like you slap your friend in the
(19:49):
face with you immediately went to slapstick comedy. In the
poleonic Arab Bagguette story, yep, I'm where. Yeah, we were
just talking about Star Wars. There's a lot that's true,
there's out My mind is just racing with all these things.
I got screened, I got Star Wars, I got baggets.
(20:11):
That's a lot going on up here, you know. So
where's the Star Wars Lightsaber parody with buggets? I'm sure
it exists already. So another much passed around but almost
certainly untrue story claims that baggetts were created in response
to fights that broke out when laborers started working on
(20:31):
the Paris Metro and officials. Yeah, so in this story,
officials requested a bread that could be torn, not cut,
so that they could forbid knives on the work side.
All right, right, well again, Baggett says a weapon. And
(20:53):
here's another story. In the nine twenties and Austrian officer
introduced the steam of an in France along with Pan
a Vinois and the croissant. Don't at me, I'm just
saying uh. And some do say Pan Benois is the
ancestor of the bag at Uh. The steam oven allowed
for lighter area loaves. Yeah. Yeah, as as discussed before,
(21:18):
the steaming really helps out. Um. I will say that
techniques for steaming breads during at least part of their
baking process go back to like at least ancient Greece. However, um,
the the modern steam injection oven was developed like over
the first few decades of the nineteen hundreds. Um. And
(21:41):
and the techniques and technologies for working with this we're
being developed by multiple peoples around Europe working with breads.
So yeah, that gesture of like backing away, yep, yep,
I've got my hands up. I didn't write, I wasn't there.
(22:03):
I cannot argue I don't have we don't have our
Savor time machine up and running yet, not yet. I
don't have a loaf in this race. So also in
French law was past that prohibited bakers from working between
ten pm and four a m. Yeah. Because of this,
(22:25):
the more traditional, larger loaf baked in time for breakfast
kind of went out the window. So the thinner, longer
Baggett was a solution to that. Again, like every story
Lauren and I are mentioning has a lot more to it,
and we could go into all that stuff. But otherwise yeah, yeah, streamlining, um,
and I will say that that baggett uh cooking like
(22:47):
twenty thirty minutes tops, So I mean the process for
for creating the loaves beforehand takes a little bit of time.
But but yeah, like if you're just trying to get
loaves of bread out the door in the morning, then
it's a relatively quick baking process. So there's there's a
little bit there's a little bit of scientific weight in
there somewhere away. Yes, yes. And also some people think
(23:10):
that this might have been in part due to the
size of French bread loaves getting out of hand. That
was time. Yes, Some written observations from French and American
visitors from the nineteenth century indicate that they were shocked
by how large these loaves could be. Here are a
few example quotes that I loved loaves of bread six
ft long that look like crowbars. Another one, the long
(23:34):
sticks of bread a yard or two in length, made
an odd impression on me. It is funny to see
the street boys but laboring each other with the long
sticks of bread they are taking home. And the loaves
of bread here are rolls three or four ft long,
and frequently one of these is laid across or rather along,
for it is oftentimes longer than the table is wide
(23:56):
the table for you to hack at. Wow. I know
these kinds of descriptions go go on until at least
nineteen o three, when an American wrote, the bread now
called French is in very long loaves of one thickness
from end to end. At some Paris restaurants that baker's
leave loaves daily that are from one to two yards long.
(24:18):
That's it's a lot of bread. Yeah, mm hmmm uh.
Using the word bag get to refer to this type
of bread of what we think of as the baggett
today seem so first started in the nineteen twenties. Also,
historians use the baggett to trace the footprint of the
French empire um all around the world, including the fact
(24:42):
that it is integral to the Vietnamese dish at the Botany,
as we've discussed in that episode. You can go listen
to that one from information. Wherever the French wint bag
gets went with them, whether or not they stuck was
based on available ingredients and tastes in that area. That's
a whole different story. Morocco, Algeria and Tunisi are other
examples of war bagets are eaten in large quantities where
(25:03):
the French had this presence. As mentioned at the top
of the beginning, in the nineteen fifties, the quality of
the baguette at large suffered when bakers were striving to
find ways to make baggetts more quickly, including turning to frozen,
pre made dough and using molds instead of free form baking.
These baggetts were pale and often instantly stale when cooled,
(25:24):
but they became the standard at French bakeries by the
nineteen nineties. All of this, let's have France passing the
Bread Decree in nine which dictated that the traditional baggett
must be handmade, sold in the same place it's baked,
and only contain water, yeast, salt and wheat flour. These days.
Traditional baggett's account for about half of baggett cells and
(25:46):
big French cities the bread decree the bed degree. It
sounds so intense. Speaking of intense, since nineteen, the city
of Paris has hosted an annual lagren Pre Day the
Baguettes each April, inviting a jury of fourteen experts um
and some lucky volunteers. Actually, it might be more mixed
(26:08):
than that. Some lucky volunteers and some experts um yes
to determine the best baggett in the city. Two hundred
bakers enter and they enter two of their best baguettes.
To proceed to the judging, they have to meet very
specific parameters. About half of them are disqualified at this
first step. I know. The baggetts are judged in five
(26:29):
areas baking, appearance, smell, taste and crumb. What a gig?
What a gig? I did Like one of the judges
was like, it's so much baggett tweet. Yeah. The winner
gets to supply the President of France with their bread.
(26:51):
French President Emmanuel Maccran pushed for the baggett to be
named in UNESCO Intangible Cultural Heritage status, saying, quote, the
bag at is the endy of the whole world. Yeah,
and then in the French Baker's Association petitioned the un
to add the baggett to their list of cultural heritage products.
(27:12):
So a lot of love and pride around the bag in.
Yeah uh yeah, I've got such a craving now I
got three half eaten frozen baggets right over here. Lord,
no goodness, I'm going to have to go to a
(27:33):
local bakery. What what a terrible thing, What a horrible
thing to have happened. Yeah, yeah, well, yeah, it's a
tough life, it is, aren't being a podcaster food podcaster? Indeed?
Well that's what we have to say about the baget
for now. It is. Um. We do have some listener
(27:55):
mail for you, though, and we're going to get into
that as soon as we get back from one more
quick break for a word from our sponsors. They were
back the key sponsoring. Yes, thank you, and we're back
with Okay. So I just remembered I once went to
(28:21):
a Halloween party and there was a group of people
just as the three of Usketeers, and they had baggetts
and they were just going around getting in Yeah, so
I have seen something like that it turns out well,
that is delightful. I am glad that you witnessed that,
(28:41):
and that you have remembered it and shared with us.
I'm glad glad for all of those things as well.
Jane wrote, I just finished listening to your toothpick episode
and had to send you pictures of this family heirloom
toothpick match just spent, sir. It's a cast iron contraption
(29:04):
consisting of a base with a hinged woodpecker mounted on it.
The woodpecker has a sharp spike on the end of
the beak that is supposed to spear the toothpick when
you push its head down into the toothpick reservoir in
the base. Thing is, it's really crap at the job.
Round toothpicks scoot out of the way of the spear,
(29:24):
and flat ones split. Maybe when it was new, toothpicks
were more substantial. I don't know. I've never tried it
with matches anyway. Even though it's too frustrating to use
as intended, I'm fond of it. And it makes a
good paperweight. That's so cool. Oh yeah, and right, and
we didn't even mention dispensers for toothpicks in that episode,
(29:47):
because they are frequently the most frustrating little things. They are.
They are so I as I mentioned in that episode,
I have for dungeons and Dragons. I bought some and
that's like a you know, up to date modern tooth
pick dispenser. I would imagine. I still can hardly get
it to work. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, you're You're sitting
(30:08):
there for like six minutes, like trying to shake a
single toothpick out of this thing. It seems like it
shouldn't be so complicated physically speaking, but they've become like
a non Newtonian fluid in there, and they all lock
up in strange ways, and like, I don't know, it's
a conspiracy. Uh, but Jane did send us pictures of
(30:29):
this device, this heirloom, and it looks really really cool,
and I just love the idea that it was supposed
to spear like spear the tooth already like splintering it
as you take it out. Um. Valerie wrote, Oh my goodness,
(30:52):
Annie wished for a Star Wars cake colored with spinach.
I made one years ago for my son's birthday. Uh
sent a picture. The only colorings are spinach and cocoa powder.
Related to that, here's homemade pasta that I made in
an electric pasta machine, colored only with beats. It's gluten
free too. It gets paler when it's cooked, but still
looks pink um. Also, here's homemade penny that I made
(31:15):
in the pasta machine. The green ones were cooked with
period kale fun. I love this. I love that. I
was like mentioned in passing, well, I've got to use
this finished frosting thing for a Star Wars cake obviously yeah,
and then immediately, oh, yes, I got you. You beautiful
(31:36):
humans answered the call and we're like, this is what
it looks like, Yes you are, and it did look amazing.
It was like a lightsabor situation, so wonderful. That's add
that to our weird Star Wars savor thing we're going
to do, yes, And also the pastas look delicious and
(31:58):
the beat one was shaped like hearts talk. Yes. So
thank you to both of those listens for writing. If
you'd like to write to as you can, Our email
is hello at savor pod dot com. We're also on
social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and
Instagram at savor pod. And we do hope to hear
from you savor is production of I Heart Radio. For
(32:18):
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the
I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers
Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,
and we hope that lots more good things are coming
your way.
Hello, and welcome to Savor production of I Heart Radio.
I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren vog Obam, and today
we have an episode for you about baguettes. Yes, it's
a lot, Oh my goodness, it is. It's quite the
topic to tackle it. It's it's a little intimidating because
it is again one of those things that people have
very strong opinions about. Yes, oh gosh, uh that I
(00:35):
had forgotten that I had given myself this assignment um,
and then had this moment of panic when I started
doing the reading, because I was like, oh no, what
did I do? Baggett. Panic is very very real, very
very real. Uh. And I'm going to start out saying
something kind of controversial. I'm Baggett neutral. Oh fine, oh wow,
(00:59):
I go right, I know. And we just had a
like heated discussion about Star Wars. That feels. No. I've
had I've had some lovely, lovely bag ads and some
out of this world BoNT me. I love a good
um and even like just a simple cheese played or
butter situation, but in general, I just don't seek them out. Um.
(01:21):
It's kind of a it's it's less to do with
the taste and more like the mess that gets made
a lot of time with the bag and it is
a crumbly crust, and so you're gonna you're gonna get
some crumbs all over the clothes, whole thing. I do
have a friend that loves them, and it's one of
(01:42):
my favorite things about hers that she always brings them
to cheese night and she's given but without out fail Lauren,
she leaves most of it with me. Um. So then
I freeze it, and then the next time we have
cheese night, she scolds me and throws it away and
has a whole a new one, and so the cycle,
the cycle of baggett continues. But it's one of her
(02:04):
biggest she hates. She thinks I'm like a cheap skate
or something, and that we are very friendly, loving way
that I will never throw anything out I have. I
have no joke. Three afro bats in there, she will
be goodness, oh my goodness. I well, I mean, okay,
(02:24):
you could de freeze them, to defrost them de freeze goodness? Um,
I mean you could consume them in between? Sure? Could
I'm confused as to why you don't. I mean, I
always have various bread products in my freezer and I
(02:45):
eat them with perhaps disturbing frequency. Um, I really, I
really go through them. Mm hmm. But goodness, I I
I love a Baggett. I mean, I you know, it's
It's one of the things that makes me feel the
most like adult and fancy is when I'm putting together
(03:07):
some kind of um snacking situation and uh and I
find a bakery that has a basket of these big,
lovely loaves um, and I'm like, oh, yeah, am I
going to eat a whole loaf of bread today? Yes
i am. I'm so happy for you when you get
(03:30):
to have that moment I have stand it's it's lovely. Yeah,
so exciting. Yeah, it has a it's got an emotional
component to it, I think. Um. And when I was
in France, I did see baggetts ever everywhere. One of
the first pictures I took I did the most stereotypical
(03:50):
touristing a baggett and I got some cheese, I got
some wine, and I had a picnic in from the
Eiffel Tower and I took a picture. Yeah, it was very,
very nice. It was pretty common breakfast lunch item, maybe
half with some mustard and cut meats like really simple
often sure yeah, yeah, and it was it was pretty nice.
I remember getting all like on the train and you
(04:11):
could just never it would you didn't have to worry.
There would be a bag at somewhere that you could take.
That's wonderful goodness. Yeah, I other right, Other than putting
together like snack plate kind of situations at home, I
guess my other and all the bond me every bond me,
(04:31):
every day, all the time, bond me. Um. But but
other than that, gosh, um. When the one time that
I got over to England for a week or so, um,
I was staying in Reading and there was this little
sandwich shop around the corner um that had this this
very like Seinfeld like soup Nazi kind of vibe. It
was like a very particular way of ordering and like
(04:55):
it was and they baked all their bread in the
house and it was very simple sandwiches, and I think
I just got one that was like like smoked salmon
and cream cheese and like a little bit of herb
mm hm. That was it. But the back at it
was incredible and and the salmon was incredible, and I
(05:18):
was just bowled over by like everything, you know, it
was like I transported. It was. It was also like
my first time out of the country really, and so
I was just like like bright eyed about everything on
the planet, which was very much not the vibe. I
think I really upset a number of Englishmen by just
(05:38):
smiling at them on the street. Apparently that's not what
you do. I'll screw them, Lauren, and I guess that's
an important thing to know. We are going to talk
about that later. Um, there are plenty of not so
great baggots that are kind of muddy the water, like
(06:00):
I think you know the ones my friend brings. And
there's no shade to that either necessarily. Uh, aren't you
know the best quality of baggett? Yes, there's a part
of what people are passionate about is how this product
is made. Oh, yes, they are, so, I guess we
(06:22):
should get to our question. I guess, so, yeah, yeah,
here we go. Baggetts. What are they? Well, Um, a
baggett is a type of yeast raised bread, traditionally baked
fairly quickly in long, skinny loaves without any added fat.
(06:43):
You're you're just using flower water, salt, and yeast to
create this. Um, this simple but kind of elegant loaf
that has a that has a relatively thick, crisp crust
surrounding this light, but chewy crumb. It's a really beautiful
contrast of textures when you get it right. But it's
(07:03):
so straightforward that you're like really highlighting the flavors of
the yeast and everything that's happening to the flower during
the baking. They're like a they're like if modernist minimalism
was a bread, I wasn't expecting that one, Okay, I
(07:24):
like that all right? Yeah yeah. Um. Finished baguettes are
usually um two to three inches wide, that's around five
d eight centimeters and about twenty four to twenty eight
inches long, like sixty to seventy centimes. They're abouts somewhere
in there. Um. They are yeah, excellent on their own, um,
(07:46):
sliced or perhaps torn into more manageable pieces so you're
not just gnawing on like a two ft long bread loaf. Um.
But they're also often cut lengthwise and spread with simple
stuff like like butter or right made to sandwiches with
anything from yeah, like a like a little bit of
sliced meat and a spread of some kind of condiment
to multi layered amalgamations of proteins and spreads and garnishes.
(08:12):
Either either is good. Yes, baguettes are meant to be
eaten very fresh, like really as soon as they're cool
from the oven um as the crust will start going
soft and stale after that, um, which I think is
from moisture escaping from the inside of the loaf um.
(08:33):
And then the whole loaf will after that pretty quickly
dry out because it doesn't have um any ingredients to
hold moisture in. And as usual with a product that
is so um so simple in heavy scare quotes, um,
some really precise and complex science goes into making them correctly. Um. Okay,
(08:56):
So let's let's do a really quick rundown of what
goes into making yeast breads. Yeah, okay, very basically, Uh,
if you're starting with dry yeast, which are friendly microbes
that have been put into a kind of stasis, uh,
you might need to activate the yeast or or wake
those microbes up with warm water. You then mix and
(09:19):
need your ingredients into an elastic kind of dough and
let it proof, which means that you're letting that yeast
go to work. Eating sugars in the flour and pooping
carbon dioxide and flavor yeast. Um, the carbon dioxide will
cause the dough to rise. Um. You then deflate the
(09:42):
dough a little bit, punch it down and shape it
into your loaf. Then let it prove a second time,
during which it will attain more or less its final shape. Um. Finally,
you score the top of the loaf, which means that
you you create cuts meant to let steam escape in
a controlled manner during the baking, so that the surface
doesn't bubble or crack or poof up unevenly. Yeah. Um.
(10:06):
Then yeah, you bake it until the elastic structures in
the dough firm up and the crust dries out, and
the Miyard reaction, in which sugars and proteins together are
affected by heat. The Myyard reaction causes the crust to
brown and gain flavor. All right, those are the basics. Um.
In terms of baguetts, your your ratio of ingredients, well,
(10:32):
I mean in terms of any bread, but in certainly
with baggetts. Um, your your ratio of ingredients and your
types of ingredients are really gonna matter. Um. Like, you
typically want a higher protein, harder type of wheat flour
that will create really stable gluten structures during baking and
thus helped create that that firm crust and that chewy crumb.
(10:56):
The amount of kneading that you do with the dough
also matters here. Um. The humidity in your kitchen and
your oven matter. Like. Remember you were dealing with for
ingredients here, water is one of them. Um. So like
the first couple of minutes the baggetts are baking, they're
usually steamed um. And this this keeps the crust elastic
(11:17):
as the moisture in the loaf begins to turn into
steam um and and expands, letting the loaf appropriately rise. UM.
But you don't want to steam them the whole time
because that wouldn't allow a crisp to occur on the crust.
It would make the crust kind of rubbery. Now you
want no. No. Of course, all of this is assuming
(11:37):
a like baking by hand process in a small kitchen environment. UM.
Baguettes are made industrially, and in those industrial applications, UM,
other ingredients might be added to help mimic the flavor
and the texture of handmade that get We're both just
(12:03):
nodding at each other very seriously, which I think is
really playing on an audio so it captures our nervousness
around this very serious topic. Oh goodness. Um uh. Scientifically speaking, UM,
(12:27):
I wasn't sure if I should put this note here
in the timeline, but I chose to put it here. Um.
The bag at might be actually an ideal texture for
a flavorful bread eating experience. Um. And this is according
to or like. This is in line with some some
research that was published in the Journal of Agricultural and
(12:48):
Food Chemistry in which found that the crust sort of
sort of helps lock in some of these um aroma
and flavor molecules. And because you have to chew a
proper baguette like kind of a lot um, you wind
(13:09):
up releasing more of those molecules into your nose and
mouth as you eat. Then you might with um softer
types of bread. Mm hmm. I love this food research. Yes, yes,
I love it so so wonderful. Well, what about the nutrition? Uh?
(13:34):
Could be worse? Could be worse? Uh low low and
fat and sugar hiding carbs. UM. Usually a decent amount
of protein in there from the flower baguettes will help
fill you up, but to keep you going pair with
a little bit of fat for sure, a little bit
more protein probably. You know, eat a vegetable, always eat
a vegetable. M We have a few numbers for you,
(13:57):
a couple. Yeah. Baker in France sell about six million
bagats a day a day, however, with the introduction of
industrial made baguets around the nineteen fifties, the number of
French bakeries has dropped by thirty thousand. Europe One reported
recently that one thousand, two hundred small French bakeries close
(14:18):
a day. Oh my goodness, yeah yeah um. According to
the Observatoire Dupins are the bread observatories, something else that
delighted me to discover it exists. The French people as
a whole consume about three twenty bagats every second that
comes out. I know. That comes out to be half
a bag at per person per day and about ten
(14:41):
billion every year. So delicious. It's a lot of baguets,
and obviously it is important to France. These are very
French specific numbers, even though they do. Bag gets obviously
exist and are important in other places, but French, the French, yes, um,
(15:02):
and and in fact, one one more number for you, Um,
there's a world record the longest baggett ever. It comes
from Italy. I know so much controversy and scandal already,
right right. Um. It was achieved in nineteen and it
(15:26):
measured a hundred and thirty two point six two meters
in length. That is about four hundred and thirty five
ft one inch. No, my brain does not accept this factor. Yeah, yeah,
I don't. I honestly don't know what that means. Like,
that's that's quite long. It's bonkers. Bonkers is the scientific
(15:52):
term for it. Yes, it is, I believe so. Uh well,
we've got quite a long is read on this one
for you as well. We do, um, and we're going
to get into that as soon as we get back
from a quick break for a word from our sponsors,
(16:16):
and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. Oh goodness.
So bread. This is not an episode about the history
of bread. No, no, please, No, it's been around a
good long while. I can tell you that, um, and
we have mentioned it in you know, kind of very
briefly in passing in several episodes about how it has
(16:38):
evolved from ingredients that were that created something pretty hard
and dense to something fluffier and yeastier um with all
kinds of ingredients and methods in the mix to make it.
And bread has always been important to French culture, and
in several instances it was even a signifier of status.
At the same time, bread was a staple to the impoverished,
(17:01):
sustaining them even through lean times, and any interruption in
that it was not well received. No um. In fact,
riots over bread and greens and the suspected hoarding and
price gouging of them helped lead to the French Revolution. Yeah.
Um uh. Part of all of this is that what's
now Central France happens to be a really great region
(17:24):
for growing wheat, and so wheat products like bread really
became a staple in surrounding areas. Yes, and I went
down a rabbit hole of French bread laws over the centuries,
and I can't not today, not today, not today, bread laws.
No all right, goodness be uh no spoilers, But if
(17:51):
you haven't seen the screen movie, I really enjoyed it.
And there's a line where somebody, somebody says to the killer,
not today, and the killer says yesterday. And I can't
stop thinking about that every time I hear that line anymore. Anyway,
the baggett as a murder weapon. Oh okay, all right, okay.
(18:16):
The baggett specifically does have mysterious origins and many a
legends surrounding it, but many agree I was probably invented
as an item of convenience during the Napoleonic era, perhaps
the innovation of French bakers who wanted a product soldiers
could carry in their pockets um or, as some stories go,
down their pants. We're on that in a second backpack
(18:40):
space was a precious commodity, so they just stick the
long bread loafs down their trousers. But okay, some sources
attribute this idea to Napoleon himself and not the bakers.
In eight one record suggest a Napoleonic soldier in Italy said,
what can you expect from so stupid a nation that
eats its bread in a stick? I know? However, many
(19:05):
other people rightfully point out that this whole thing probably
isn't true, because can you imagine doing soldier stuff with
a hard lot of bread any pants? Like? I A no?
Um or, I mean I can, but it's pretty comical. Uh,
and the crumbs would be everywhere and so itchy. I know. Um,
(19:28):
but I can see how it would be like easily
attached to the outside of your backpack or whatever you're carrying.
So right, that makes much more sense to me. I mean,
and there's even like a little bit of like potential
for physical comedy, like if you're if you're like turning
around quickly and like you slap your friend in the
(19:49):
face with you immediately went to slapstick comedy. In the
poleonic Arab Bagguette story, yep, I'm where. Yeah, we were
just talking about Star Wars. There's a lot that's true,
there's out My mind is just racing with all these things.
I got screened, I got Star Wars, I got baggets.
(20:11):
That's a lot going on up here, you know. So
where's the Star Wars Lightsaber parody with buggets? I'm sure
it exists already. So another much passed around but almost
certainly untrue story claims that baggetts were created in response
to fights that broke out when laborers started working on
(20:31):
the Paris Metro and officials. Yeah, so in this story,
officials requested a bread that could be torn, not cut,
so that they could forbid knives on the work side.
All right, right, well again, Baggett says a weapon. And
(20:53):
here's another story. In the nine twenties and Austrian officer
introduced the steam of an in France along with Pan
a Vinois and the croissant. Don't at me, I'm just
saying uh. And some do say Pan Benois is the
ancestor of the bag at Uh. The steam oven allowed
for lighter area loaves. Yeah. Yeah, as as discussed before,
(21:18):
the steaming really helps out. Um. I will say that
techniques for steaming breads during at least part of their
baking process go back to like at least ancient Greece. However, um,
the the modern steam injection oven was developed like over
the first few decades of the nineteen hundreds. Um. And
(21:41):
and the techniques and technologies for working with this we're
being developed by multiple peoples around Europe working with breads.
So yeah, that gesture of like backing away, yep, yep,
I've got my hands up. I didn't write, I wasn't there.
(22:03):
I cannot argue I don't have we don't have our
Savor time machine up and running yet, not yet. I
don't have a loaf in this race. So also in
French law was past that prohibited bakers from working between
ten pm and four a m. Yeah. Because of this,
(22:25):
the more traditional, larger loaf baked in time for breakfast
kind of went out the window. So the thinner, longer
Baggett was a solution to that. Again, like every story
Lauren and I are mentioning has a lot more to it,
and we could go into all that stuff. But otherwise yeah, yeah, streamlining, um,
and I will say that that baggett uh cooking like
(22:47):
twenty thirty minutes tops, So I mean the process for
for creating the loaves beforehand takes a little bit of time.
But but yeah, like if you're just trying to get
loaves of bread out the door in the morning, then
it's a relatively quick baking process. So there's there's a
little bit there's a little bit of scientific weight in
there somewhere away. Yes, yes. And also some people think
(23:10):
that this might have been in part due to the
size of French bread loaves getting out of hand. That
was time. Yes, Some written observations from French and American
visitors from the nineteenth century indicate that they were shocked
by how large these loaves could be. Here are a
few example quotes that I loved loaves of bread six
ft long that look like crowbars. Another one, the long
(23:34):
sticks of bread a yard or two in length, made
an odd impression on me. It is funny to see
the street boys but laboring each other with the long
sticks of bread they are taking home. And the loaves
of bread here are rolls three or four ft long,
and frequently one of these is laid across or rather along,
for it is oftentimes longer than the table is wide
(23:56):
the table for you to hack at. Wow. I know
these kinds of descriptions go go on until at least
nineteen o three, when an American wrote, the bread now
called French is in very long loaves of one thickness
from end to end. At some Paris restaurants that baker's
leave loaves daily that are from one to two yards long.
(24:18):
That's it's a lot of bread. Yeah, mm hmmm uh.
Using the word bag get to refer to this type
of bread of what we think of as the baggett
today seem so first started in the nineteen twenties. Also,
historians use the baggett to trace the footprint of the
French empire um all around the world, including the fact
(24:42):
that it is integral to the Vietnamese dish at the Botany,
as we've discussed in that episode. You can go listen
to that one from information. Wherever the French wint bag
gets went with them, whether or not they stuck was
based on available ingredients and tastes in that area. That's
a whole different story. Morocco, Algeria and Tunisi are other
examples of war bagets are eaten in large quantities where
(25:03):
the French had this presence. As mentioned at the top
of the beginning, in the nineteen fifties, the quality of
the baguette at large suffered when bakers were striving to
find ways to make baggetts more quickly, including turning to frozen,
pre made dough and using molds instead of free form baking.
These baggetts were pale and often instantly stale when cooled,
(25:24):
but they became the standard at French bakeries by the
nineteen nineties. All of this, let's have France passing the
Bread Decree in nine which dictated that the traditional baggett
must be handmade, sold in the same place it's baked,
and only contain water, yeast, salt and wheat flour. These days.
Traditional baggett's account for about half of baggett cells and
(25:46):
big French cities the bread decree the bed degree. It
sounds so intense. Speaking of intense, since nineteen, the city
of Paris has hosted an annual lagren Pre Day the
Baguettes each April, inviting a jury of fourteen experts um
and some lucky volunteers. Actually, it might be more mixed
(26:08):
than that. Some lucky volunteers and some experts um yes
to determine the best baggett in the city. Two hundred
bakers enter and they enter two of their best baguettes.
To proceed to the judging, they have to meet very
specific parameters. About half of them are disqualified at this
first step. I know. The baggetts are judged in five
(26:29):
areas baking, appearance, smell, taste and crumb. What a gig?
What a gig? I did Like one of the judges
was like, it's so much baggett tweet. Yeah. The winner
gets to supply the President of France with their bread.
(26:51):
French President Emmanuel Maccran pushed for the baggett to be
named in UNESCO Intangible Cultural Heritage status, saying, quote, the
bag at is the endy of the whole world. Yeah,
and then in the French Baker's Association petitioned the un
to add the baggett to their list of cultural heritage products.
(27:12):
So a lot of love and pride around the bag in.
Yeah uh yeah, I've got such a craving now I
got three half eaten frozen baggets right over here. Lord,
no goodness, I'm going to have to go to a
(27:33):
local bakery. What what a terrible thing, What a horrible
thing to have happened. Yeah, yeah, well, yeah, it's a
tough life, it is, aren't being a podcaster food podcaster? Indeed?
Well that's what we have to say about the baget
for now. It is. Um. We do have some listener
(27:55):
mail for you, though, and we're going to get into
that as soon as we get back from one more
quick break for a word from our sponsors. They were
back the key sponsoring. Yes, thank you, and we're back
with Okay. So I just remembered I once went to
(28:21):
a Halloween party and there was a group of people
just as the three of Usketeers, and they had baggetts
and they were just going around getting in Yeah, so
I have seen something like that it turns out well,
that is delightful. I am glad that you witnessed that,
(28:41):
and that you have remembered it and shared with us.
I'm glad glad for all of those things as well.
Jane wrote, I just finished listening to your toothpick episode
and had to send you pictures of this family heirloom
toothpick match just spent, sir. It's a cast iron contraption
(29:04):
consisting of a base with a hinged woodpecker mounted on it.
The woodpecker has a sharp spike on the end of
the beak that is supposed to spear the toothpick when
you push its head down into the toothpick reservoir in
the base. Thing is, it's really crap at the job.
Round toothpicks scoot out of the way of the spear,
(29:24):
and flat ones split. Maybe when it was new, toothpicks
were more substantial. I don't know. I've never tried it
with matches anyway. Even though it's too frustrating to use
as intended, I'm fond of it. And it makes a
good paperweight. That's so cool. Oh yeah, and right, and
we didn't even mention dispensers for toothpicks in that episode,
(29:47):
because they are frequently the most frustrating little things. They are.
They are so I as I mentioned in that episode,
I have for dungeons and Dragons. I bought some and
that's like a you know, up to date modern tooth
pick dispenser. I would imagine. I still can hardly get
it to work. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, you're You're sitting
(30:08):
there for like six minutes, like trying to shake a
single toothpick out of this thing. It seems like it
shouldn't be so complicated physically speaking, but they've become like
a non Newtonian fluid in there, and they all lock
up in strange ways, and like, I don't know, it's
a conspiracy. Uh, but Jane did send us pictures of
(30:29):
this device, this heirloom, and it looks really really cool,
and I just love the idea that it was supposed
to spear like spear the tooth already like splintering it
as you take it out. Um. Valerie wrote, Oh my goodness,
(30:52):
Annie wished for a Star Wars cake colored with spinach.
I made one years ago for my son's birthday. Uh
sent a picture. The only colorings are spinach and cocoa powder.
Related to that, here's homemade pasta that I made in
an electric pasta machine, colored only with beats. It's gluten
free too. It gets paler when it's cooked, but still
looks pink um. Also, here's homemade penny that I made
(31:15):
in the pasta machine. The green ones were cooked with
period kale fun. I love this. I love that. I
was like mentioned in passing, well, I've got to use
this finished frosting thing for a Star Wars cake obviously yeah,
and then immediately, oh, yes, I got you. You beautiful
(31:36):
humans answered the call and we're like, this is what
it looks like, Yes you are, and it did look amazing.
It was like a lightsabor situation, so wonderful. That's add
that to our weird Star Wars savor thing we're going
to do, yes, And also the pastas look delicious and
(31:58):
the beat one was shaped like hearts talk. Yes. So
thank you to both of those listens for writing. If
you'd like to write to as you can, Our email
is hello at savor pod dot com. We're also on
social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and
Instagram at savor pod. And we do hope to hear
from you savor is production of I Heart Radio. For
(32:18):
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the
I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers
Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening,
and we hope that lots more good things are coming
your way.
Savor News
Hosts And Creators
Anney Reese
Lauren Vogelbaum
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