June 14, 2021 • 15 mins
Anney shares her journey of realizing she was queer.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha, and welcome to stuff
I've never told you production I R Radio. Samantha. Did
you keep a diary or journal at all? I did.
We don't talked about this before. I kept a diary
(00:28):
for a very long time. I did more poems, so
I have a lot of poetry books more so than diaries.
I do have. And i'd laugh because but it was
beautifully written. When I was really religious and doing all
of the traveling in the mission work. And I say
mission work, I lived for a year at Children's Home
(00:48):
in Oklahoma, working with them and living on campus with them,
and I got to beat a lot of sweet people,
including a lot of people from the indigenous community because
they were near try Out that way, so I got
to meet a lot of amazing people. But I would
keep journals of that, and I also sent out newsletters
to people, which is super weird, and I got a
(01:11):
lot of responses about how it was an amazing writer.
So put that out there. I don't think I am,
but I think they love the flowery words that I
would meash with Bible verses, so I definitely did a
lot of that. I tried to do the single line
one line of day thing that did not work out
(01:32):
because you just gave up, because yeah, I lost it
during the pandemic, so I haven't taken it outside the house.
I just don't know where it is in my house.
That's I can relate to that. Yeah, what about you? Yes,
I did keep a diary. As you know, it is
a very popular story among my friend group. I had
a um bad run of pets, so I had a
(01:55):
lot of tragic pet deaths when I was growing up.
So every entry I could and laugh now, but every
entry would start with like, well Fluffy's gone. Didn't you
call him Katie? Just naming what they were. Yeah, well
one of my rabbit Fluffy, And then I had four Katie's,
and then I thought pair keeps, and I thought the
name Katie was cursed, so I named one Rebecca. But
(02:18):
Rebecca also died very quickly. I have to know, did
you name these after you to friends? And where they
worried after the fact. I don't recall naming them after
my friends, but it is popular that I did because
I thought I thought Katie was the coolest, and I thought, yeah,
so possibly, and Rebecca was a good friend of mine too,
so maybe unfortunately, and I believe I've shared this story
(02:43):
on the show before. I destroyed everything I wrote, whether
that was like books that I wrote or stories I
wrote from pretty much any time during my primary education,
so kindergarten to high school. I got rid of all
of them. And it makes me very sad because I
do think there would be some wonderfully embarrassing things that
I could uncover, but also just I think that it
(03:08):
could be telling to look back on some of the
entries and be like, Oh, you didn't know you were
struggling with this or just this like piece of who
I was that I hadn't accepted yet or didn't realize
what quite what was going on or what I was
wrestling with because I did keep I was pretty regular
(03:29):
in an updating my journal, our diary, whichever oh it was.
It had a unicorn on the front, had key. It
was cool mine too. I didn't have a unicorn, but
it definitely had the keys all that. I also did
a friends only file thing that also we'll see. The
thing is I still have the key and it's so flimsy,
(03:51):
like it would have been so easy to get into
that diary if somebody wanted to I'm just gonna click
paper clip. I think you could have literally just pride it.
But I thought it was really cool key around my neck.
It felt me, it did, it did, so I I
wanted to ask this, and before we get into the
(04:13):
episode of very quick trigger warning, a brief mention of
sexual trauma and eating disorders. Very brief, but just in case.
I wanted to talk about this because I have been
discussing my experience being queer and kind of claiming that
identity and the journey I've gone through with it, and
all the questions and looking back um and subscribing meaning
(04:35):
to things where I didn't understand at the time what
was going on, but now that I look back, like,
oh yeah, okay, you just didn't realize that you identified
in this way. And I'm gonna go ahead and say
to you, if you're like me and you connect so
hard with fictional characters, or you were like I, I
prefer this or this or this. This is a very
anti Statuck episode. So if you don't me, you can
(05:00):
click away. If you prefer Samantha that everybody wants to hear,
keep going, yes, okay, thank you. Well, several of you
have sent me messages asking all about this journey and
if I could ask me if I would share it
with you, and I'm always happy to share, and I
thought that I would just say it on podcast since
(05:23):
it is Pride months. This is the kind of edited
message I sent to our dear listener and friend Jamie,
who asked me about about my journey, was so supportive
and also open in her own So this is a
message that I sent to her, and I thought I
would just share it with everybody. So it feels like
(05:48):
reading a diary entry though it's a little weird, but
bear with me. I can't remember a time ever wanting
to have sex, and I never once had sex that
I want it to have. In high school, I pretended
I did want to have sex to fit in. I
thought that eventually it would kick in. That maybe I
was just like a late bloomer, as they say. I
(06:10):
also thought maybe I was just approved because I was
very religious at a time. I want too, so I
thought maybe I had just soaked up these messages and
I didn't realize it. And even though I think of
myself as a very liberal person, I had been raised
in a pretty conservative environment. Maybe I just absorbed all
that this was all complicated by the fact that there
(06:32):
were all these rumors that I was a slut flying around,
so people assumed I wanted to have a lot of
sex and that I had had a lot of sex,
and that was in part. I don't want to say
my fault, but I again, I would make these sexual
jokes because I wanted to fit in, and I was
kind of overcompensating because I really didn't want to have sex,
(06:53):
so I went over the top implying that I did.
I did the same thing, yeah, except I'm not ace,
But yes, I did the same thing as a kid.
I was trying to be cool. So I was a kid.
I knew all about sex, which was funny because I
didn't know anything about sex. Yeah, I had to look
up what sex was in an encyclopedia, and trust me,
that is not how you want to learn what it is.
(07:15):
I don't know. I asked my mom what a blowjob was,
and that was really uncomfortable. Oh I'm sure it was.
And yes, sometimes I did, and I still do, feel
an intense attraction to people, very rarely physical attraction. Usually
if that happens, it happens after the emotional attraction. But
not sexual, and like, sometimes I do like kissing and cuddling,
(07:40):
but I'm too afraid to do it because I feel
like it's going to escalate. And like I said in
a recent happy hour, I'm afraid I won't stand up
for myself or say I don't want this because I'm
so used to pleasing other people, but also doubting what
I my own self and knowing what I actually do want,
I will question and that too, like maybe you do
(08:02):
want this, I'm like, I don't think so, and then
that just becomes this loop that is not helpful. When
I got to college, I tried really hard to convince
myself I wanted to have sex or that I just
had to get over it and have sex with people
until I liked it. And this is when I started
dating men and women. But I always felt safer with
women because of my past with sexual abuse and trauma.
(08:23):
I thought maybe one day something would click, which sounds
so silly now that I've been doing years of therapy,
that one day it would just be fine. I did
a lot of things I didn't want to do because
of this, and that makes me really sad to agree
that that's one of the things that stakes with me.
I also was date raped in college, so I had
a new like I had a new trauma on top
of all this old trauma. So I thought, maybe that's
(08:46):
why I didn't want to have sex. And yeah, my
trauma goes back to like some of my first memories.
So I was like that, it has just been with
me this whole time, so how can I know for sure?
And I also realized that the eating disorder I had
messages with sex drive, so I thought it could be that.
But basically all of these doubts and questions. Then I
started as an intern on this very show back in
(09:07):
I had just graduated college, and we did an episode
on being ace and being a romantic and I remember thinking, huh,
that's the first I've heard about this other than sort
of yeah, joking misrepresentation of it, Like I have more
than one memory of being laughed at or hearing someone
else get laughed at when they would talk about it.
And I told my then boyfriend about it, and he
(09:29):
said it made him sad because he thought people who
identified that way were clearly damaged. And we broke up
soon after that. Okay, yeah, and I kept thinking about it,
but I was really torn about the intersection yeah, of
this sexual trauma and eating disorders and being a somewhere
that left me Also at the time, that was when
there was all this like I don't know if science
(09:53):
is the right word, but people were like, you know,
maybe we can just boost women's sex drive, as if
women just in general don't have a high enough sex drive,
instead of maybe asking other questions. And because my dad
was dying at that time, I wanted he wanted to
have grandkids. I wanted that for him. At the time
of my stablings, I was the one that had the
(10:13):
best shot. And because our society does tell us that
success equal stable relationship and or kids, and your value
as a woman is desirability, I tried so hard, so
hard to make relationship work, and I felt incredibly guilty
that I never wanted sex. And I reached the point
I really couldn't even have sex without having a massive
panic attack, Like it almost never happened because it would
(10:36):
like come time and I would freak out. And when
my last boyfriend and I broke up, he said, like,
I can feel myself beginning to resent you. And one
of the things about that is I was resenting myself too.
Because I knew. I knew that that was a piece
that was missing, and that I was We didn't communicate
(10:56):
about it openly, and that was on both of us.
But I was just internalizing all of this stuff and
thinking of how how he sees me and avoiding the
topic at all costs, which isn't healthy. And yeah, we
we thought, both of us thought that eventually i'd get
there again, that it might just go away, that maybe
(11:16):
I would want to have sex one day, And yeah,
now I've come to realize that that was not the case,
and that I shouldn't have tried to force it. I
don't really blame either of us because we were younger
and I didn't know. I do think we both could
have communicated way better, but I don't. That's just where
we were in that time. But yes, sex is not
(11:39):
something I want to really think about, even though I
do sometimes wish it was, and sometimes I still want
other aspects of a physical relationship. Mostly I just want
a companion that I can kiss and cuddle and occasionally
feel up. But my trust issues are so severe it's
gonna take a long time before I reached that point.
If I ever ever reached that point, I like to
(12:00):
believe being in a healthy relationship as an asexual person exists,
And I will put in here Jamie, who I was
corresponding with with this, she is a good example of that.
She has found that and I know that it does exist.
So this is also a couple of years old when
I wrote this, so it's interesting to see how I've
changed even from this. But yeah, I've felt like something's
(12:21):
wrong with me my entire life, and I've done so
much that I wished I had him to fit in.
So knowing that there are others out there like me,
it's hugely validating. And to this day it blows my
mind that I was willing to get married and have
kids with someone I wasn't in love with to please
my dad. And even to this day, I'm both scared
(12:42):
bi sexual attraction and feel like I need it to
prove my worth and that sends me in a very
dark cycle. And at this the time I was writing this,
I had recently had a friend of my family's say
she was married to someone who didn't want to have
sex and how sad that made her, and how that
something had to be wrong with him and that's why
they broke up. And that cultural association between love and
(13:02):
sex has been one that I have been struggling with.
I've been talking about on this very show, just because
that's how it's commonly depicted, and that's that makes me
feel like a failure, like I owe someone something or
else I'm just a tease or it's not love, and
I know that's not true. I know it's not true. Um,
And you can't have healthy relationships without sex, and even
romantic relationships without sex. It's just been it's a lot
(13:26):
of stuff I have to unlearn, right, and you're not
the only one. Just even without identifying as aces, it's
still a complication in trying to understand the implications of
sex and what that means, and it's it has become
such as a holdover, especially for young girls and just
(13:49):
people in general who feel vulnerable when it comes to
what that means, and oftentimes the misconceptions that usually benefit
men and harm one in general. Um. And then again,
our value is still undermined by what someone else's attraction
to them. It's just such a gross aspect in general,
(14:11):
and it has led into a whole societal failing. Yeah,
but we're not gonna get into all that, but yeah,
I'm not. I'm very proud of who you are and
I think you have done a phenomenal job of being
an example for others and the honesty that comes out
is just as much of working progress for everyone else
who are trying to learn anything about themselves in general.
(14:31):
And it's been beautiful. Well, I am proud of who
you are to submit the yeah, yeah, and I, like
I said at that happy hour, we did something. I'm
still learning and I still have questions and I you
listeners have just been so helpful for all of this.
(14:52):
And when I hear from someone who's like, oh you've
You've helped me, hearing your story helped me, that is
that's what this is all about. UH is so amazing
and I'm so happy that we can connect on that way,
um and find community in that way. So that being said,
thank you so much for listening to my story. We
always really appreciate hearing from you. If you would like
(15:15):
to contact as, you can our email Stuff Media mom
Stuff at ihart media dot com. You can find us
on Instagram and Stuff I've Never Told You or on
Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to a
super producer Christina We're always proud of YouTube. Yes yes,
and thanks to you for listening stuff I've never told you.
Protection of I heart Radio. For more podcast from I
heart Radio is the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha, and welcome to stuff
I've never told you production I R Radio. Samantha. Did
you keep a diary or journal at all? I did.
We don't talked about this before. I kept a diary
(00:28):
for a very long time. I did more poems, so
I have a lot of poetry books more so than diaries.
I do have. And i'd laugh because but it was
beautifully written. When I was really religious and doing all
of the traveling in the mission work. And I say
mission work, I lived for a year at Children's Home
(00:48):
in Oklahoma, working with them and living on campus with them,
and I got to beat a lot of sweet people,
including a lot of people from the indigenous community because
they were near try Out that way, so I got
to meet a lot of amazing people. But I would
keep journals of that, and I also sent out newsletters
to people, which is super weird, and I got a
(01:11):
lot of responses about how it was an amazing writer.
So put that out there. I don't think I am,
but I think they love the flowery words that I
would meash with Bible verses, so I definitely did a
lot of that. I tried to do the single line
one line of day thing that did not work out
(01:32):
because you just gave up, because yeah, I lost it
during the pandemic, so I haven't taken it outside the house.
I just don't know where it is in my house.
That's I can relate to that. Yeah, what about you? Yes,
I did keep a diary. As you know, it is
a very popular story among my friend group. I had
a um bad run of pets, so I had a
(01:55):
lot of tragic pet deaths when I was growing up.
So every entry I could and laugh now, but every
entry would start with like, well Fluffy's gone. Didn't you
call him Katie? Just naming what they were. Yeah, well
one of my rabbit Fluffy, And then I had four Katie's,
and then I thought pair keeps, and I thought the
name Katie was cursed, so I named one Rebecca. But
(02:18):
Rebecca also died very quickly. I have to know, did
you name these after you to friends? And where they
worried after the fact. I don't recall naming them after
my friends, but it is popular that I did because
I thought I thought Katie was the coolest, and I thought, yeah,
so possibly, and Rebecca was a good friend of mine too,
so maybe unfortunately, and I believe I've shared this story
(02:43):
on the show before. I destroyed everything I wrote, whether
that was like books that I wrote or stories I
wrote from pretty much any time during my primary education,
so kindergarten to high school. I got rid of all
of them. And it makes me very sad because I
do think there would be some wonderfully embarrassing things that
I could uncover, but also just I think that it
(03:08):
could be telling to look back on some of the
entries and be like, Oh, you didn't know you were
struggling with this or just this like piece of who
I was that I hadn't accepted yet or didn't realize
what quite what was going on or what I was
wrestling with because I did keep I was pretty regular
(03:29):
in an updating my journal, our diary, whichever oh it was.
It had a unicorn on the front, had key. It
was cool mine too. I didn't have a unicorn, but
it definitely had the keys all that. I also did
a friends only file thing that also we'll see. The
thing is I still have the key and it's so flimsy,
(03:51):
like it would have been so easy to get into
that diary if somebody wanted to I'm just gonna click
paper clip. I think you could have literally just pride it.
But I thought it was really cool key around my neck.
It felt me, it did, it did, so I I
wanted to ask this, and before we get into the
(04:13):
episode of very quick trigger warning, a brief mention of
sexual trauma and eating disorders. Very brief, but just in case.
I wanted to talk about this because I have been
discussing my experience being queer and kind of claiming that
identity and the journey I've gone through with it, and
all the questions and looking back um and subscribing meaning
(04:35):
to things where I didn't understand at the time what
was going on, but now that I look back, like,
oh yeah, okay, you just didn't realize that you identified
in this way. And I'm gonna go ahead and say
to you, if you're like me and you connect so
hard with fictional characters, or you were like I, I
prefer this or this or this. This is a very
anti Statuck episode. So if you don't me, you can
(05:00):
click away. If you prefer Samantha that everybody wants to hear,
keep going, yes, okay, thank you. Well, several of you
have sent me messages asking all about this journey and
if I could ask me if I would share it
with you, and I'm always happy to share, and I
thought that I would just say it on podcast since
(05:23):
it is Pride months. This is the kind of edited
message I sent to our dear listener and friend Jamie,
who asked me about about my journey, was so supportive
and also open in her own So this is a
message that I sent to her, and I thought I
would just share it with everybody. So it feels like
(05:48):
reading a diary entry though it's a little weird, but
bear with me. I can't remember a time ever wanting
to have sex, and I never once had sex that
I want it to have. In high school, I pretended
I did want to have sex to fit in. I
thought that eventually it would kick in. That maybe I
was just like a late bloomer, as they say. I
(06:10):
also thought maybe I was just approved because I was
very religious at a time. I want too, so I
thought maybe I had just soaked up these messages and
I didn't realize it. And even though I think of
myself as a very liberal person, I had been raised
in a pretty conservative environment. Maybe I just absorbed all
that this was all complicated by the fact that there
(06:32):
were all these rumors that I was a slut flying around,
so people assumed I wanted to have a lot of
sex and that I had had a lot of sex,
and that was in part. I don't want to say
my fault, but I again, I would make these sexual
jokes because I wanted to fit in, and I was
kind of overcompensating because I really didn't want to have sex,
(06:53):
so I went over the top implying that I did.
I did the same thing, yeah, except I'm not ace,
But yes, I did the same thing as a kid.
I was trying to be cool. So I was a kid.
I knew all about sex, which was funny because I
didn't know anything about sex. Yeah, I had to look
up what sex was in an encyclopedia, and trust me,
that is not how you want to learn what it is.
(07:15):
I don't know. I asked my mom what a blowjob was,
and that was really uncomfortable. Oh I'm sure it was.
And yes, sometimes I did, and I still do, feel
an intense attraction to people, very rarely physical attraction. Usually
if that happens, it happens after the emotional attraction. But
not sexual, and like, sometimes I do like kissing and cuddling,
(07:40):
but I'm too afraid to do it because I feel
like it's going to escalate. And like I said in
a recent happy hour, I'm afraid I won't stand up
for myself or say I don't want this because I'm
so used to pleasing other people, but also doubting what
I my own self and knowing what I actually do want,
I will question and that too, like maybe you do
(08:02):
want this, I'm like, I don't think so, and then
that just becomes this loop that is not helpful. When
I got to college, I tried really hard to convince
myself I wanted to have sex or that I just
had to get over it and have sex with people
until I liked it. And this is when I started
dating men and women. But I always felt safer with
women because of my past with sexual abuse and trauma.
(08:23):
I thought maybe one day something would click, which sounds
so silly now that I've been doing years of therapy,
that one day it would just be fine. I did
a lot of things I didn't want to do because
of this, and that makes me really sad to agree
that that's one of the things that stakes with me.
I also was date raped in college, so I had
a new like I had a new trauma on top
of all this old trauma. So I thought, maybe that's
(08:46):
why I didn't want to have sex. And yeah, my
trauma goes back to like some of my first memories.
So I was like that, it has just been with
me this whole time, so how can I know for sure?
And I also realized that the eating disorder I had
messages with sex drive, so I thought it could be that.
But basically all of these doubts and questions. Then I
started as an intern on this very show back in
(09:07):
I had just graduated college, and we did an episode
on being ace and being a romantic and I remember thinking, huh,
that's the first I've heard about this other than sort
of yeah, joking misrepresentation of it, Like I have more
than one memory of being laughed at or hearing someone
else get laughed at when they would talk about it.
And I told my then boyfriend about it, and he
(09:29):
said it made him sad because he thought people who
identified that way were clearly damaged. And we broke up
soon after that. Okay, yeah, and I kept thinking about it,
but I was really torn about the intersection yeah, of
this sexual trauma and eating disorders and being a somewhere
that left me Also at the time, that was when
there was all this like I don't know if science
(09:53):
is the right word, but people were like, you know,
maybe we can just boost women's sex drive, as if
women just in general don't have a high enough sex drive,
instead of maybe asking other questions. And because my dad
was dying at that time, I wanted he wanted to
have grandkids. I wanted that for him. At the time
of my stablings, I was the one that had the
(10:13):
best shot. And because our society does tell us that
success equal stable relationship and or kids, and your value
as a woman is desirability, I tried so hard, so
hard to make relationship work, and I felt incredibly guilty
that I never wanted sex. And I reached the point
I really couldn't even have sex without having a massive
panic attack, Like it almost never happened because it would
(10:36):
like come time and I would freak out. And when
my last boyfriend and I broke up, he said, like,
I can feel myself beginning to resent you. And one
of the things about that is I was resenting myself too.
Because I knew. I knew that that was a piece
that was missing, and that I was We didn't communicate
(10:56):
about it openly, and that was on both of us.
But I was just internalizing all of this stuff and
thinking of how how he sees me and avoiding the
topic at all costs, which isn't healthy. And yeah, we
we thought, both of us thought that eventually i'd get
there again, that it might just go away, that maybe
(11:16):
I would want to have sex one day, And yeah,
now I've come to realize that that was not the case,
and that I shouldn't have tried to force it. I
don't really blame either of us because we were younger
and I didn't know. I do think we both could
have communicated way better, but I don't. That's just where
we were in that time. But yes, sex is not
(11:39):
something I want to really think about, even though I
do sometimes wish it was, and sometimes I still want
other aspects of a physical relationship. Mostly I just want
a companion that I can kiss and cuddle and occasionally
feel up. But my trust issues are so severe it's
gonna take a long time before I reached that point.
If I ever ever reached that point, I like to
(12:00):
believe being in a healthy relationship as an asexual person exists,
And I will put in here Jamie, who I was
corresponding with with this, she is a good example of that.
She has found that and I know that it does exist.
So this is also a couple of years old when
I wrote this, so it's interesting to see how I've
changed even from this. But yeah, I've felt like something's
(12:21):
wrong with me my entire life, and I've done so
much that I wished I had him to fit in.
So knowing that there are others out there like me,
it's hugely validating. And to this day it blows my
mind that I was willing to get married and have
kids with someone I wasn't in love with to please
my dad. And even to this day, I'm both scared
(12:42):
bi sexual attraction and feel like I need it to
prove my worth and that sends me in a very
dark cycle. And at this the time I was writing this,
I had recently had a friend of my family's say
she was married to someone who didn't want to have
sex and how sad that made her, and how that
something had to be wrong with him and that's why
they broke up. And that cultural association between love and
(13:02):
sex has been one that I have been struggling with.
I've been talking about on this very show, just because
that's how it's commonly depicted, and that's that makes me
feel like a failure, like I owe someone something or
else I'm just a tease or it's not love, and
I know that's not true. I know it's not true. Um,
And you can't have healthy relationships without sex, and even
romantic relationships without sex. It's just been it's a lot
(13:26):
of stuff I have to unlearn, right, and you're not
the only one. Just even without identifying as aces, it's
still a complication in trying to understand the implications of
sex and what that means, and it's it has become
such as a holdover, especially for young girls and just
(13:49):
people in general who feel vulnerable when it comes to
what that means, and oftentimes the misconceptions that usually benefit
men and harm one in general. Um. And then again,
our value is still undermined by what someone else's attraction
to them. It's just such a gross aspect in general,
(14:11):
and it has led into a whole societal failing. Yeah,
but we're not gonna get into all that, but yeah,
I'm not. I'm very proud of who you are and
I think you have done a phenomenal job of being
an example for others and the honesty that comes out
is just as much of working progress for everyone else
who are trying to learn anything about themselves in general.
(14:31):
And it's been beautiful. Well, I am proud of who
you are to submit the yeah, yeah, and I, like
I said at that happy hour, we did something. I'm
still learning and I still have questions and I you
listeners have just been so helpful for all of this.
(14:52):
And when I hear from someone who's like, oh you've
You've helped me, hearing your story helped me, that is
that's what this is all about. UH is so amazing
and I'm so happy that we can connect on that way,
um and find community in that way. So that being said,
thank you so much for listening to my story. We
always really appreciate hearing from you. If you would like
(15:15):
to contact as, you can our email Stuff Media mom
Stuff at ihart media dot com. You can find us
on Instagram and Stuff I've Never Told You or on
Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as always to a
super producer Christina We're always proud of YouTube. Yes yes,
and thanks to you for listening stuff I've never told you.
Protection of I heart Radio. For more podcast from I
heart Radio is the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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Anney Reese
Samantha McVey
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