January 19, 2019 • 28 mins
Do men complain more about being sick? Do women have stronger immune systems? Who takes the most sick days? All this and more in this classic episode.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie, and you're listening to stuff I've
never told you. Well, it's blue season, or I guess
it is. Because everyone in the office is sick or
(00:28):
just got over being sick, or it looks like they
might have about to be getting sick. It's kind of stunning.
And I'm really fortunate to have a healthy immune system
and i haven't gotten sick in many years. But I'm
starting to get a little nervous, a little paranoid, taking
extra precautions. I do not want whatever is going around.
This classic episode takes a look at the man flu,
(00:51):
along with other differences between men and women exhibiting illness.
And I remember when it came out. Men in my
life came up to me and they sore up and
down that the man flew was real. So stay well,
everybody and enjoy this classic episode. Welcome to Stuff Mom
Never told you from how Stuff Works dot Com. Hello,
(01:19):
and welcome to the podcast. I'm Caroline and I'm Kristen. Kristen.
Every winter, and I don't mean to sound mean to
my dad, Hi Dad, but every winter my dad gets
some sickness, some regular run of the mill like sniffles,
kind of aches and pains and he acts as if
the end is near, I know, And then he goes
(01:40):
to his doctor, and his doctors like, go home, you're fine.
He's some super right, have an orange, get over it.
But apparently he's not the only one. Apparently this is
a theme with his gender. Yeah. I did not know
that the term man flew existed before we start researching
this podcast. Um, but apparently it's pretty common in the UK,
(02:05):
and it is an expression that's a tongue in cheek
term used to describe how men may tend to inflate
their symptoms of what is probably just a common cold
into a life threatening illness and they want to be
weighted on hand and foot as they get better, right,
(02:27):
And I I mean I've seen this before. I I
used to live with dudes, so I've seen where. You know,
guys can tend to be all weak and whiney, especially
if they have a girlfriend or someone available or a
mom to to wait on them and bring them soup
and such. Yeah, if they have a way to take
advantage of it. Now, I'm not gonna lie h. Sometimes,
like if there's someone around me and I'm sick and
(02:50):
I and I know that things can be done for me.
I may or may not take advantage of that. But
but man flu is supposedly this uh, this thing that
that guys do and uh. Dr Charles Risin, who is
a clinical director of the Mind and Body Program at
Emory University School of Medicine here in Atlanta, Georgia, says
(03:13):
that it might be because um men become more emotionally
vulnerable when they are physically sick. Yeah, they actually it's
possible that they actually experienced the physical symptoms of a
cold or the flu worse than women do. Whereas we
might be more emotionally vulnerable and be willing to talk
(03:34):
about our problem, men maybe are more vulnerable when they
are ill and then they feel like, Okay, this is
my time to be vulnerable, because it's it's easier to
be vulnerable when you're sick and you feel all achy
and sniff ley and whatever than it is if you're like,
if your feelings are hurt because you're like, no, I'm
a man, I'm just gonna tough it out, dude. Uh.
(03:57):
And the thing is, there is scientific evidence to back
up at least the gender differences in um immune systems,
and specifically that women might have stronger. That's right, fellas
stronger immune systems than men. Right, it's all thanks to
(04:17):
our double X chromosomes. Yeah, chromosomes coming in handy. This
is uh some research that came out of Ghent University
in Belgium this past fall, and they looked at the
role of micro RNA's encoded on the X chromosome, of
which women have to UM and they think that the
(04:40):
micro RNAs have something to do with our superior immunity.
Is speaking of women and gender differences, It's already been
shown in some studies that we tend to live longer
UM and now with this evidence that we have stronger
immune systems, I just think it's interesting because we just
(05:01):
seem to be winning the context of of of living
I don't know anyway, or better equipped to fight sepsis,
infection and trauma. And this is not just in female humans.
This is also in other female mammalian species, right, and
it has to do with genes silencing. Um. Since but uh,
(05:23):
the the X chromosome is tied to immunity and with
gene silencing. If if part of our X chromosome gets
silenced to make it kind of simplistic, Um, we've still
got this other one hanging out, whereas men have an
X and a Y and so if they're uh, if
their genes tied in with immunity gets silence, then they're
(05:43):
just and they're like, oh, I got nothing. And the
reason why genes play such an important role in sickness,
disease and conversely immunity is because genes produce the proteins
in our bodies which are then responsible for things like
our looks um our development, um, how we function both
(06:04):
good and bad. So when it comes to diseases, if
you have a faulty gene, that might lead to some
faulty proteins which might lead to then faulty protein related activity,
leaving you sickly and faulty and faulty. Um yeah, Cambridge.
A study out of Cambridge in um said that the
(06:26):
man flew is not a myth and then it has
a lot to do with um with different gender differences
in immunity and Dr Oliver Rustuff said in many cases,
males tend to be more prone to get infected or
less able to clear infection, and he cites the interference
between male hormones and immunity as well as risk taking
behavior that goes back to our caveman ancestors. So speaking
(06:50):
of risky behavior, this is the perfect time to talk
about hormones because the male tendency toward risk aavior is
linked back to testosterone. Okay, And in two thousand nine
there was a study out of McGill University Health Center
that claimed that estrogen in the female body could also
(07:15):
provide um some inflammatory response against bacterial pathogens because it
blocks the reduction of an enzyme called cast paced twelve,
which blocks the inflammatory process UM. So, not only might
the micro RNA in our X chromosome help us out
(07:36):
in terms of living longer and fighting trauma and infection,
but then estrogen comes along gives us a little bit
more of a boose. Whereas testosterone is putting men physically
in danger all the time, right, estrogen stimulates the immune
responses uh, and testosterone is an immunosuppressant. Like you said,
so from the get go, right out of the gate,
(07:58):
you're just men, You're just more sickly. Sorry. Now, another
component of that Cambridge research that you brought up, Caroline,
is that males tend to uh. Their priority tends to
be in making sure that they can reproduce, whereas females
tend to make sure that they are physically healthier and
(08:23):
stronger to nurture. So instead of um resting up and
getting themselves back into health, men might put themselves at
a higher risk for reinfection by just going out and
trying to keep mate must mate, must mate. Well, but
it's interesting because yes, I can see how that is
(08:45):
absolutely true and it makes sense. But on the other hand,
doesn't it seem to contradict the whole idea of the
man flew of like men lying around on the couch
for weeks getting better and whining, where women are like
I've got to drag myself to work. Well, I mean
this is going bad down when I'm sick. Uh. Well, yes,
that's a good point. But it also you know, I mean,
(09:07):
that's that's condensing things down to these very um evolutionary,
animalistic based instincts. It doesn't mean that, you know, by extension,
if a guy is running a temperature, he will put
on put on his his sassy jeans and hit the
hit the club to try and find a honey, his
(09:29):
pajome gene, whereas we just go put our snuggie on. Yes,
I have a I have a Santa Snuggie. Um. But
this Dr Rastaff from Cambridge UH talked about the genetics
behind all of this, and he said that the benefit
of rapid recovery in males decreases owing to constant reinfections.
So they're they're going out there and like mate mate mate,
(09:51):
mate mate, um, and so they're they're getting reinfected. They're
not giving their bodies time to heal um. And over time,
this is actually selected for lower resistance in males because
think about it, If the guys who are getting sick
are still going out there and reproducing, then all these
babies are selected for having lower immune systems or or
(10:13):
being more prone to reinfection. UM. So this this yeah,
like he says. Rustaf says, this ultimately leads to males
with higher susceptibility or exposure than females and developing lower
immuno competence. But not everybody is on board, of course,
with this idea of of a major gender difference in
(10:35):
immune system responses. Don J. Diamond, who is the director
of a translational vaccine research and a professor of virology
at City Hope in California, is a total skeptic. He says, uh, well,
riddle me this. Why has there never been a gender
specific vaccine? Boys and girls will get like if you
(10:59):
take a in a girl and to get their technis shot,
they're going to get the same dosage, right exactly. He
said that there has never been a vaccine released for
human use that has used a different dose for male
and female. But then he goes on to give give
women some some more props. I really liked this episode
because it's one rare time when it's like, yeah, we
(11:20):
were just across the board, sorry, fellas, we are um uh,
stronger animals in this sense. He says that women are
better at being sick because we have an innately higher
pain tolerance, allowing us to you guessed it, have babies, right,
We're pushing out babies all the time, so we can
(11:41):
deal with it. Although I mean, I whimper at a
paper cut, so I'm not sure how much that applies
to me, but yeah, he says that women seem to
tough out the flu better. Maybe maybe you're whimpering it
a paper cut implies that you have higher levels of testosterone.
(12:04):
Another interesting place where men and women differ as far
as immune systems involves post traumatic stress disorder UM. Men
show no immune response in regard to PTSD, but women
have a strong one UM, and people with PTSD have
been shown to have higher rates of cardiovascular disease and arthritis,
(12:24):
which your disease is associated with chronic inflammation. And this
has to do with UM cell signaling pathways. So basically,
to try to boil it down and not confuse myself
or the listeners. UM. Because women have this stronger immune
system and stronger immune system response, UM, we tend to
(12:48):
UM have more inflammation because of this response. So in
two of the three pathways referenced in this the study
bead inflammation, two of the three pathways associated with inflammation,
there was evidence of signaling for inflammation. But in the
third pathway, men had increased signaling which led to less inflammation,
(13:11):
and women had decreased signaling which could lead to more inflammation.
And that's hard to break down. But basically, UM, when
women have PTSD and stress and anxiety and all this stuff,
our immune system is not helping with inflammation, right. And
here's where UM, the scales begin to tip in terms
(13:34):
of women's stronger or maybe finer tuned immune systems because
since since they might be a little a little more
sensitive for lack of a better word, it can also
lead to immune hyper immunity hyperactivity UM. And that's one
reason why, UM this, these gender differences among the chronic
(13:58):
diseases associated with pt STE might affect more women, and
also why autoimmune diseases such as celiac disease, inflammatory balel disease,
multiple sclerosis, psoriasis, but algo and so forth affect women
far more frequently than men because autoimmune diseases happen when
(14:21):
your immune system actually starts attacking healthy cells. There are
no foreign invaders. Your body just kind of goes into,
uh into overdrive, and as a result, autoimmune diseases target
women of the time. So in exchange for you know,
men perhaps having some rougher or at least wimpier days
(14:46):
in bed every winter, we get we get sariss. Not
to not to laugh at having suriss, but but that's
the that's called a give and take, my friends, right,
And I mean a lot of people have autoimmune disorders
in this country. They affect twenty three point five million Americans,
but most of that number are a women and especially
(15:09):
minority women are the most affected by autoimmune diseases UM
and compounding problems even more, a lot of these are
are difficult to diagnose right until it's almost too late
to do anything about it, and UM and doctors might
what it was. According to a two thousand one survey
from the Autoimmune Diseases Association, over patients with autoimmune diseases
(15:35):
were simply labeled chronic complainers, right, which is just like
when we talked about in our anxiety podcast, women who
go in with symptoms like shortness of breath, not sleeping well,
chest pressure pain, are the doctors are like, here's a
prescription for anxiety or antidepressant medication, whereas men might be
(15:55):
taken more seriously and get a full work up. It's
it's kind of a similar alar effect here. And these
immune system differences also come up with how our bodies
respond to alcohol. Right. Alcohol, as many of you know,
acts as an immune immuno suppressant, but it suppresses everyone's
(16:17):
immune system, men and women. But the thing is it
affects women more. UM. Alcohol consumption women will initially cause
a spike in estrogen production and then a major drop
off in estrogen production. And these fluctuations affect the production
of cytokinds and those are immune cells, and in men
(16:42):
it causes a decrease in testosterone. So so if there
is so, if testosterone then is an immuno suppressant and
that level is going down. Well, but alcohol is an
immuno suppressant also, so so it's just it's all like
all the holes are getting plugged. So the moral of
that story is drinking is not good for you. Right. Well,
(17:03):
now that the study about alcohol in the immune system
did point out that, um, you know people who drink
like one glass of red wine. We've heard people say
this that like, if you have one glass of red
wine a day, it's not going to kill you, and
that wine has red wine has um antioxidants. There we go. Um,
but it's when you're drinking the whole bottle that it's like, oh, well,
(17:24):
now you're gonna get sick. Maybe we get so sick
um in the wintertime then not so much because of
the cold weather, but because of all the holiday parties
that are happening, we're drinking more. Very well, maybe we
need to kiss people more, which leads me to my
next point. So perhaps mistletoe is the vaccine of the
holiday season, because I do have a segue here, people.
(17:50):
Two thousand nine study found that kissing might be an
important part of building our immune systems. Now, before we
go any further, if you have a cold right out,
this does not mean you need to start making out
with somebody now. You should have taken care of this
before you got the cold, right because because you can't
pass along many germs, including oral herpes, right through through
(18:13):
open mouth kissing, So be selective in your time of kissing.
We wait, but we got to explain the relationship between immunity.
We can't. You mean, we can't just leave it at that, Okay,
grab the nearest person. Well, the studies showed that the
longer you kiss a person, your partner or whoever, and
(18:33):
in six months is the ideal. This is where a
woman kissing, This is really focused on women kissing women
kissing whoever, that the more likely she is to be
immune to the cytomegalovirus, which almost sounds like a dinosaur
because I don't I don't know. It's like an evil.
It has spikes, that virus like a transformer, right, But
(18:55):
it makes her more likely to be immune to the
site of megalovirus if she gets pregnant. And and that virus,
that particular virus is is pretty um harmless if you
just happen to get it now. But I can actually
really do a lot of damage to a fetus. So
I imagine anything called a megalovirus terrible habitsovirus. UM. But yeah,
(19:18):
and and this is not scientists don't think that this
is why kissing originated. UM. It had more to this
is so gross. It had more to do with They
think that we um regurgitated food for our kids like birds.
What's so gross about that, Caroline? Oh, I'm sorry. Oh
that's right. That's how you eat your lunch. I forgot.
It's just food, just food. But anyway, when that happened,
(19:41):
it also passed along germs and spit and whatever else.
And uh so that's how the the offspring would be
more immune too, you know, sickness and whatnot. But this
study also, or the article talking about this UM study
also urged re D's to um not kiss your pets.
(20:03):
Oh god, this is gross. Well I don't understand why
people let pets lick them on the face. Anyway, we'll see.
I was thinking, like anything that licks it's but what
if I kiss my cat's head, Well, that's fine, O
your cat's tongue. Your cat's tongue can't reach it's that kissing.
I I just want to, like, you know, given your
little no no they mean like do not let And
(20:24):
I know I have seen people do list and I
think it's disgusting. Um yeah, just send me angry mail.
Go ahead. But if you let your pet lick you
on the mouth, I mean I think just think about
where your pets tongue has been. It's possible that you
could get several gross sicknesses and worms and whatever if
(20:45):
you let your pet French kiss you. I wish people
can see the look on your face right now, because
it is a sheer horror, pain pain. So yeah, so
don't don't kiss your dog, but you can. You can
kiss people right, kiss people, ideally one person for a
significant length of time to build us months, right to
(21:06):
build up immunity to that person stuff that he's carrying around.
Maybe that should be the new benchmark for for when
you call someone your your boyfriend, like once once you're
immune to each other's jump. I'm protected against cytomegalovirus, so
we can we can take things to the next level now.
But yeah, they were saying. They were saying that basically,
if you are with someone that you might want to
(21:27):
have babies with, you should be kissing them for at
least six months before you decide to get pregnant to
be immune to the cytomegalovirus romantic. Yeah, so enough about kissing.
We gotta we gotta answer our original question because we
have established that, yes, there are gender differences in immune systems.
It seems like our X chromosome are additional X chromosome
(21:51):
and our estrogen might protect us as and us by us,
I mean women a little better for the long haul,
although it can cause our immune systems to go into
overdrive and lead to a bunch of autoimmune disorders, which
is a downer. But original question is about man flu,
this whole thing of do you know do men? Are
(22:13):
men getting sicker more often or at least more loudly
during the winter, What do you think? Well, I don't know.
I mean, I I complain a lot when I'm sick,
so I'm really I'm not one to talk. After all
that snack I talked earlier, I really can't talk. Maybe
you get you get you get a little man flu. Look, Kristen,
(22:35):
that's the second time you've insinuated that. I I'm sorry
about this. Well, whether or not man flu is or
is not real, And guys listening right now, I want
to hear from you, and I really hope that uh,
you have not taken offense I genuinely, or any girlfriends
or mothers who have taken care of men, yeah, or
boyfriends taking care of whatever guys. Um. So this is
(22:57):
from Medical News Today, a study from Bennington Healthcare Society
in the UK. They found that women tend to phone
in sick to work more often, whether or not man
flu is real. Over the entirety of our careers, women
will phone in sick eighty nine times. Men will do
(23:21):
it only a hundred and forty times. But listen to this.
The average adult only takes three and a half sick
days per year. We are some tough cookies. Well, but
don't you think those numbers, I mean to to kind
of go off on a side thing anyway, don't you
think that those numbers could reflect that like mothers, yes,
take time off for their children. Yeah, I think that
absolutely could account for the difference. Um. And even though
(23:43):
we are calling in a little bit more often um
and blaming it on stomach bugs, dizziness, and viruses. Most often, women,
no matter what, feel a lot guiltier making that call
or sending that email, and we will try to work anyway,
whereas men like feel guilty like half as often. Well,
(24:05):
good for them, good for everyone, go home, even though
everybody go home. Don't pass your your sickness. Who cares?
Who has the better immune system? You're coffin at work? Yeah,
either drink some water and get rid of that tickle
in your throat orme. Yeah. Well, I mean now that
we've talked about how man Flew gives men the opportunity
to be more vulnerable, and that women power through and
(24:27):
and and yet take more sick days. Maybe we take
more sick days because we're feeling so guilty when we
are sick that it's only exacerbating our symptoms. We become
more anxious, and then we get an autoimmune disorder. I
feel like a lot of pet theories have come up
in my brain during this podcast. We don't kiss your pets.
That yes, the more or the stories that I want
to leave you with, don't kiss your pets and the
(24:48):
mouth yeah on the mouth, um, and yeah, let us
know your thoughts on I want to hear other people's
pet theories about this whole man flew thing and men,
I'm talking to you too, what do you what do
you think? Mom? Stuff at how stuff works dot com
is the email address. And I have a funny story
(25:10):
to share right now. Uh. And this is from Derek
and he was writing to share a story about our
Slasher Halloween podcast. He starts out, I was surprised to
hear no mention of nightmare on Elm Street two. In
(25:30):
this film, Mark Patton plays a role of a screaming
typical female slasher lead, yet is seemingly a total homosexual.
Shower scenes dreams of gay bars, along with explicit thoughts
of young boys. Jim Teacher have dubbed this movie by
Cracked dot com the most unintentional gay horror movie of
all time. I've been married to my husband for about
(25:53):
two years and we spent our belated honeymoon in Puerto
Viar to Mexico. Among the little shops downtown, we Glee
fill in love with a little craft store. The owner
of the store was incredibly kind to us, gave us
a whole itinerary and list of favorite places to check up,
check out. And it wasn't until the final day of
the trip, when we were visiting the shop owner that
I recognized an action figure of Mark Patton from Nightmare
(26:17):
on Elm Street Too sitting on the shelf. The resemblance
between this little toy and the store's owner was so
uncanny I couldn't help but comment, Lo and behold the
shop owner was Mark Patton, himself, the ultimate gay horror
movie star, tucked away in the beautiful hills of Puerto Vallarta. Interesting.
So that's a fun story, Mark Patton. Yeah, tourist destination.
(26:38):
I'll have to check out Nightmare on Elm Street too.
I'm going to say that I will, but I probably won't.
I don't watch any horror movies. So thanks to Derek
and Mikey for that story. This is an email from
Brielle about our spy episode. She said, I really enjoyed
your latest podcast on Lady Spies, but I was surprised
that the recent Angelina jolie By film Salt never came up.
(27:00):
This role, which was originally written for Brad Pitt, was
so interesting because it didn't fit the stereotypical women woman's
spy trope. Although I didn't find the role that revolutionary.
I can easily imagine the movie with a male lead.
I thought, I actually thought it was written for uh
Tom Cruise, But and I didn't. I don't. I didn't
like that movie I never saw. I also didn't like
(27:21):
want it. Angelina Deelie, please make something better. Thank you Bale.
Maybe she's listening right now, Angelina. Send us your thoughts
mom Stuff at house stuff Works dot com. You can
always find us over at Facebook and follow us on
Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast, and you can head over
to the blog during the week It's stuff Mom Never
(27:41):
told You at how Stuff Works dot com. Be sure
to check out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future.
Join how Stuffwork staff as we explore the most promising
and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. The House Stuffworks iPhone app
has a Ride a Mood. It today on iTunes
Hey, this is Annie, and you're listening to stuff I've
never told you. Well, it's blue season, or I guess
it is. Because everyone in the office is sick or
(00:28):
just got over being sick, or it looks like they
might have about to be getting sick. It's kind of stunning.
And I'm really fortunate to have a healthy immune system
and i haven't gotten sick in many years. But I'm
starting to get a little nervous, a little paranoid, taking
extra precautions. I do not want whatever is going around.
This classic episode takes a look at the man flu,
(00:51):
along with other differences between men and women exhibiting illness.
And I remember when it came out. Men in my
life came up to me and they sore up and
down that the man flew was real. So stay well,
everybody and enjoy this classic episode. Welcome to Stuff Mom
Never told you from how Stuff Works dot Com. Hello,
(01:19):
and welcome to the podcast. I'm Caroline and I'm Kristen. Kristen.
Every winter, and I don't mean to sound mean to
my dad, Hi Dad, but every winter my dad gets
some sickness, some regular run of the mill like sniffles,
kind of aches and pains and he acts as if
the end is near, I know, And then he goes
(01:40):
to his doctor, and his doctors like, go home, you're fine.
He's some super right, have an orange, get over it.
But apparently he's not the only one. Apparently this is
a theme with his gender. Yeah. I did not know
that the term man flew existed before we start researching
this podcast. Um, but apparently it's pretty common in the UK,
(02:05):
and it is an expression that's a tongue in cheek
term used to describe how men may tend to inflate
their symptoms of what is probably just a common cold
into a life threatening illness and they want to be
weighted on hand and foot as they get better, right,
(02:27):
And I I mean I've seen this before. I I
used to live with dudes, so I've seen where. You know,
guys can tend to be all weak and whiney, especially
if they have a girlfriend or someone available or a
mom to to wait on them and bring them soup
and such. Yeah, if they have a way to take
advantage of it. Now, I'm not gonna lie h. Sometimes,
like if there's someone around me and I'm sick and
(02:50):
I and I know that things can be done for me.
I may or may not take advantage of that. But
but man flu is supposedly this uh, this thing that
that guys do and uh. Dr Charles Risin, who is
a clinical director of the Mind and Body Program at
Emory University School of Medicine here in Atlanta, Georgia, says
(03:13):
that it might be because um men become more emotionally
vulnerable when they are physically sick. Yeah, they actually it's
possible that they actually experienced the physical symptoms of a
cold or the flu worse than women do. Whereas we
might be more emotionally vulnerable and be willing to talk
(03:34):
about our problem, men maybe are more vulnerable when they
are ill and then they feel like, Okay, this is
my time to be vulnerable, because it's it's easier to
be vulnerable when you're sick and you feel all achy
and sniff ley and whatever than it is if you're like,
if your feelings are hurt because you're like, no, I'm
a man, I'm just gonna tough it out, dude. Uh.
(03:57):
And the thing is, there is scientific evidence to back
up at least the gender differences in um immune systems,
and specifically that women might have stronger. That's right, fellas
stronger immune systems than men. Right, it's all thanks to
(04:17):
our double X chromosomes. Yeah, chromosomes coming in handy. This
is uh some research that came out of Ghent University
in Belgium this past fall, and they looked at the
role of micro RNA's encoded on the X chromosome, of
which women have to UM and they think that the
(04:40):
micro RNAs have something to do with our superior immunity.
Is speaking of women and gender differences, It's already been
shown in some studies that we tend to live longer
UM and now with this evidence that we have stronger
immune systems, I just think it's interesting because we just
(05:01):
seem to be winning the context of of of living
I don't know anyway, or better equipped to fight sepsis,
infection and trauma. And this is not just in female humans.
This is also in other female mammalian species, right, and
it has to do with genes silencing. Um. Since but uh,
(05:23):
the the X chromosome is tied to immunity and with
gene silencing. If if part of our X chromosome gets
silenced to make it kind of simplistic, Um, we've still
got this other one hanging out, whereas men have an
X and a Y and so if they're uh, if
their genes tied in with immunity gets silence, then they're
(05:43):
just and they're like, oh, I got nothing. And the
reason why genes play such an important role in sickness,
disease and conversely immunity is because genes produce the proteins
in our bodies which are then responsible for things like
our looks um our development, um, how we function both
(06:04):
good and bad. So when it comes to diseases, if
you have a faulty gene, that might lead to some
faulty proteins which might lead to then faulty protein related activity,
leaving you sickly and faulty and faulty. Um yeah, Cambridge.
A study out of Cambridge in um said that the
(06:26):
man flew is not a myth and then it has
a lot to do with um with different gender differences
in immunity and Dr Oliver Rustuff said in many cases,
males tend to be more prone to get infected or
less able to clear infection, and he cites the interference
between male hormones and immunity as well as risk taking
behavior that goes back to our caveman ancestors. So speaking
(06:50):
of risky behavior, this is the perfect time to talk
about hormones because the male tendency toward risk aavior is
linked back to testosterone. Okay, And in two thousand nine
there was a study out of McGill University Health Center
that claimed that estrogen in the female body could also
(07:15):
provide um some inflammatory response against bacterial pathogens because it
blocks the reduction of an enzyme called cast paced twelve,
which blocks the inflammatory process UM. So, not only might
the micro RNA in our X chromosome help us out
(07:36):
in terms of living longer and fighting trauma and infection,
but then estrogen comes along gives us a little bit
more of a boose. Whereas testosterone is putting men physically
in danger all the time, right, estrogen stimulates the immune
responses uh, and testosterone is an immunosuppressant. Like you said,
so from the get go, right out of the gate,
(07:58):
you're just men, You're just more sickly. Sorry. Now, another
component of that Cambridge research that you brought up, Caroline,
is that males tend to uh. Their priority tends to
be in making sure that they can reproduce, whereas females
tend to make sure that they are physically healthier and
(08:23):
stronger to nurture. So instead of um resting up and
getting themselves back into health, men might put themselves at
a higher risk for reinfection by just going out and
trying to keep mate must mate, must mate. Well, but
it's interesting because yes, I can see how that is
(08:45):
absolutely true and it makes sense. But on the other hand,
doesn't it seem to contradict the whole idea of the
man flew of like men lying around on the couch
for weeks getting better and whining, where women are like
I've got to drag myself to work. Well, I mean
this is going bad down when I'm sick. Uh. Well, yes,
that's a good point. But it also you know, I mean,
(09:07):
that's that's condensing things down to these very um evolutionary,
animalistic based instincts. It doesn't mean that, you know, by extension,
if a guy is running a temperature, he will put
on put on his his sassy jeans and hit the
hit the club to try and find a honey, his
(09:29):
pajome gene, whereas we just go put our snuggie on. Yes,
I have a I have a Santa Snuggie. Um. But
this Dr Rastaff from Cambridge UH talked about the genetics
behind all of this, and he said that the benefit
of rapid recovery in males decreases owing to constant reinfections.
So they're they're going out there and like mate mate mate,
(09:51):
mate mate, um, and so they're they're getting reinfected. They're
not giving their bodies time to heal um. And over time,
this is actually selected for lower resistance in males because
think about it, If the guys who are getting sick
are still going out there and reproducing, then all these
babies are selected for having lower immune systems or or
(10:13):
being more prone to reinfection. UM. So this this yeah,
like he says. Rustaf says, this ultimately leads to males
with higher susceptibility or exposure than females and developing lower
immuno competence. But not everybody is on board, of course,
with this idea of of a major gender difference in
(10:35):
immune system responses. Don J. Diamond, who is the director
of a translational vaccine research and a professor of virology
at City Hope in California, is a total skeptic. He says, uh, well,
riddle me this. Why has there never been a gender
specific vaccine? Boys and girls will get like if you
(10:59):
take a in a girl and to get their technis shot,
they're going to get the same dosage, right exactly. He
said that there has never been a vaccine released for
human use that has used a different dose for male
and female. But then he goes on to give give
women some some more props. I really liked this episode
because it's one rare time when it's like, yeah, we
(11:20):
were just across the board, sorry, fellas, we are um uh,
stronger animals in this sense. He says that women are
better at being sick because we have an innately higher
pain tolerance, allowing us to you guessed it, have babies, right,
We're pushing out babies all the time, so we can
(11:41):
deal with it. Although I mean, I whimper at a
paper cut, so I'm not sure how much that applies
to me, but yeah, he says that women seem to
tough out the flu better. Maybe maybe you're whimpering it
a paper cut implies that you have higher levels of testosterone.
(12:04):
Another interesting place where men and women differ as far
as immune systems involves post traumatic stress disorder UM. Men
show no immune response in regard to PTSD, but women
have a strong one UM, and people with PTSD have
been shown to have higher rates of cardiovascular disease and arthritis,
(12:24):
which your disease is associated with chronic inflammation. And this
has to do with UM cell signaling pathways. So basically,
to try to boil it down and not confuse myself
or the listeners. UM. Because women have this stronger immune
system and stronger immune system response, UM, we tend to
(12:48):
UM have more inflammation because of this response. So in
two of the three pathways referenced in this the study
bead inflammation, two of the three pathways associated with inflammation,
there was evidence of signaling for inflammation. But in the
third pathway, men had increased signaling which led to less inflammation,
(13:11):
and women had decreased signaling which could lead to more inflammation.
And that's hard to break down. But basically, UM, when
women have PTSD and stress and anxiety and all this stuff,
our immune system is not helping with inflammation, right. And
here's where UM, the scales begin to tip in terms
(13:34):
of women's stronger or maybe finer tuned immune systems because
since since they might be a little a little more
sensitive for lack of a better word, it can also
lead to immune hyper immunity hyperactivity UM. And that's one
reason why, UM this, these gender differences among the chronic
(13:58):
diseases associated with pt STE might affect more women, and
also why autoimmune diseases such as celiac disease, inflammatory balel disease,
multiple sclerosis, psoriasis, but algo and so forth affect women
far more frequently than men because autoimmune diseases happen when
(14:21):
your immune system actually starts attacking healthy cells. There are
no foreign invaders. Your body just kind of goes into,
uh into overdrive, and as a result, autoimmune diseases target
women of the time. So in exchange for you know,
men perhaps having some rougher or at least wimpier days
(14:46):
in bed every winter, we get we get sariss. Not
to not to laugh at having suriss, but but that's
the that's called a give and take, my friends, right,
And I mean a lot of people have autoimmune disorders
in this country. They affect twenty three point five million Americans,
but most of that number are a women and especially
(15:09):
minority women are the most affected by autoimmune diseases UM
and compounding problems even more, a lot of these are
are difficult to diagnose right until it's almost too late
to do anything about it, and UM and doctors might
what it was. According to a two thousand one survey
from the Autoimmune Diseases Association, over patients with autoimmune diseases
(15:35):
were simply labeled chronic complainers, right, which is just like
when we talked about in our anxiety podcast, women who
go in with symptoms like shortness of breath, not sleeping well,
chest pressure pain, are the doctors are like, here's a
prescription for anxiety or antidepressant medication, whereas men might be
(15:55):
taken more seriously and get a full work up. It's
it's kind of a similar alar effect here. And these
immune system differences also come up with how our bodies
respond to alcohol. Right. Alcohol, as many of you know,
acts as an immune immuno suppressant, but it suppresses everyone's
(16:17):
immune system, men and women. But the thing is it
affects women more. UM. Alcohol consumption women will initially cause
a spike in estrogen production and then a major drop
off in estrogen production. And these fluctuations affect the production
of cytokinds and those are immune cells, and in men
(16:42):
it causes a decrease in testosterone. So so if there
is so, if testosterone then is an immuno suppressant and
that level is going down. Well, but alcohol is an
immuno suppressant also, so so it's just it's all like
all the holes are getting plugged. So the moral of
that story is drinking is not good for you. Right. Well,
(17:03):
now that the study about alcohol in the immune system
did point out that, um, you know people who drink
like one glass of red wine. We've heard people say
this that like, if you have one glass of red
wine a day, it's not going to kill you, and
that wine has red wine has um antioxidants. There we go. Um,
but it's when you're drinking the whole bottle that it's like, oh, well,
(17:24):
now you're gonna get sick. Maybe we get so sick
um in the wintertime then not so much because of
the cold weather, but because of all the holiday parties
that are happening, we're drinking more. Very well, maybe we
need to kiss people more, which leads me to my
next point. So perhaps mistletoe is the vaccine of the
holiday season, because I do have a segue here, people.
(17:50):
Two thousand nine study found that kissing might be an
important part of building our immune systems. Now, before we
go any further, if you have a cold right out,
this does not mean you need to start making out
with somebody now. You should have taken care of this
before you got the cold, right because because you can't
pass along many germs, including oral herpes, right through through
(18:13):
open mouth kissing, So be selective in your time of kissing.
We wait, but we got to explain the relationship between immunity.
We can't. You mean, we can't just leave it at that, Okay,
grab the nearest person. Well, the studies showed that the
longer you kiss a person, your partner or whoever, and
(18:33):
in six months is the ideal. This is where a
woman kissing, This is really focused on women kissing women
kissing whoever, that the more likely she is to be
immune to the cytomegalovirus, which almost sounds like a dinosaur
because I don't I don't know. It's like an evil.
It has spikes, that virus like a transformer, right, But
(18:55):
it makes her more likely to be immune to the
site of megalovirus if she gets pregnant. And and that virus,
that particular virus is is pretty um harmless if you
just happen to get it now. But I can actually
really do a lot of damage to a fetus. So
I imagine anything called a megalovirus terrible habitsovirus. UM. But yeah,
(19:18):
and and this is not scientists don't think that this
is why kissing originated. UM. It had more to this
is so gross. It had more to do with They
think that we um regurgitated food for our kids like birds.
What's so gross about that, Caroline? Oh, I'm sorry. Oh
that's right. That's how you eat your lunch. I forgot.
It's just food, just food. But anyway, when that happened,
(19:41):
it also passed along germs and spit and whatever else.
And uh so that's how the the offspring would be
more immune too, you know, sickness and whatnot. But this
study also, or the article talking about this UM study
also urged re D's to um not kiss your pets.
(20:03):
Oh god, this is gross. Well I don't understand why
people let pets lick them on the face. Anyway, we'll see.
I was thinking, like anything that licks it's but what
if I kiss my cat's head, Well, that's fine, O
your cat's tongue. Your cat's tongue can't reach it's that kissing.
I I just want to, like, you know, given your
little no no they mean like do not let And
(20:24):
I know I have seen people do list and I
think it's disgusting. Um yeah, just send me angry mail.
Go ahead. But if you let your pet lick you
on the mouth, I mean I think just think about
where your pets tongue has been. It's possible that you
could get several gross sicknesses and worms and whatever if
(20:45):
you let your pet French kiss you. I wish people
can see the look on your face right now, because
it is a sheer horror, pain pain. So yeah, so
don't don't kiss your dog, but you can. You can
kiss people right, kiss people, ideally one person for a
significant length of time to build us months, right to
(21:06):
build up immunity to that person stuff that he's carrying around.
Maybe that should be the new benchmark for for when
you call someone your your boyfriend, like once once you're
immune to each other's jump. I'm protected against cytomegalovirus, so
we can we can take things to the next level now.
But yeah, they were saying. They were saying that basically,
if you are with someone that you might want to
(21:27):
have babies with, you should be kissing them for at
least six months before you decide to get pregnant to
be immune to the cytomegalovirus romantic. Yeah, so enough about kissing.
We gotta we gotta answer our original question because we
have established that, yes, there are gender differences in immune systems.
It seems like our X chromosome are additional X chromosome
(21:51):
and our estrogen might protect us as and us by us,
I mean women a little better for the long haul,
although it can cause our immune systems to go into
overdrive and lead to a bunch of autoimmune disorders, which
is a downer. But original question is about man flu,
this whole thing of do you know do men? Are
(22:13):
men getting sicker more often or at least more loudly
during the winter, What do you think? Well, I don't know.
I mean, I I complain a lot when I'm sick,
so I'm really I'm not one to talk. After all
that snack I talked earlier, I really can't talk. Maybe
you get you get you get a little man flu. Look, Kristen,
(22:35):
that's the second time you've insinuated that. I I'm sorry
about this. Well, whether or not man flu is or
is not real, And guys listening right now, I want
to hear from you, and I really hope that uh,
you have not taken offense I genuinely, or any girlfriends
or mothers who have taken care of men, yeah, or
boyfriends taking care of whatever guys. Um. So this is
(22:57):
from Medical News Today, a study from Bennington Healthcare Society
in the UK. They found that women tend to phone
in sick to work more often, whether or not man
flu is real. Over the entirety of our careers, women
will phone in sick eighty nine times. Men will do
(23:21):
it only a hundred and forty times. But listen to this.
The average adult only takes three and a half sick
days per year. We are some tough cookies. Well, but
don't you think those numbers, I mean to to kind
of go off on a side thing anyway, don't you
think that those numbers could reflect that like mothers, yes,
take time off for their children. Yeah, I think that
absolutely could account for the difference. Um. And even though
(23:43):
we are calling in a little bit more often um
and blaming it on stomach bugs, dizziness, and viruses. Most often, women,
no matter what, feel a lot guiltier making that call
or sending that email, and we will try to work anyway,
whereas men like feel guilty like half as often. Well,
(24:05):
good for them, good for everyone, go home, even though
everybody go home. Don't pass your your sickness. Who cares?
Who has the better immune system? You're coffin at work? Yeah,
either drink some water and get rid of that tickle
in your throat orme. Yeah. Well, I mean now that
we've talked about how man Flew gives men the opportunity
to be more vulnerable, and that women power through and
(24:27):
and and yet take more sick days. Maybe we take
more sick days because we're feeling so guilty when we
are sick that it's only exacerbating our symptoms. We become
more anxious, and then we get an autoimmune disorder. I
feel like a lot of pet theories have come up
in my brain during this podcast. We don't kiss your pets.
That yes, the more or the stories that I want
to leave you with, don't kiss your pets and the
(24:48):
mouth yeah on the mouth, um, and yeah, let us
know your thoughts on I want to hear other people's
pet theories about this whole man flew thing and men,
I'm talking to you too, what do you what do
you think? Mom? Stuff at how stuff works dot com
is the email address. And I have a funny story
(25:10):
to share right now. Uh. And this is from Derek
and he was writing to share a story about our
Slasher Halloween podcast. He starts out, I was surprised to
hear no mention of nightmare on Elm Street two. In
(25:30):
this film, Mark Patton plays a role of a screaming
typical female slasher lead, yet is seemingly a total homosexual.
Shower scenes dreams of gay bars, along with explicit thoughts
of young boys. Jim Teacher have dubbed this movie by
Cracked dot com the most unintentional gay horror movie of
all time. I've been married to my husband for about
(25:53):
two years and we spent our belated honeymoon in Puerto
Viar to Mexico. Among the little shops downtown, we Glee
fill in love with a little craft store. The owner
of the store was incredibly kind to us, gave us
a whole itinerary and list of favorite places to check up,
check out. And it wasn't until the final day of
the trip, when we were visiting the shop owner that
I recognized an action figure of Mark Patton from Nightmare
(26:17):
on Elm Street Too sitting on the shelf. The resemblance
between this little toy and the store's owner was so
uncanny I couldn't help but comment, Lo and behold the
shop owner was Mark Patton, himself, the ultimate gay horror
movie star, tucked away in the beautiful hills of Puerto Vallarta. Interesting.
So that's a fun story, Mark Patton. Yeah, tourist destination.
(26:38):
I'll have to check out Nightmare on Elm Street too.
I'm going to say that I will, but I probably won't.
I don't watch any horror movies. So thanks to Derek
and Mikey for that story. This is an email from
Brielle about our spy episode. She said, I really enjoyed
your latest podcast on Lady Spies, but I was surprised
that the recent Angelina jolie By film Salt never came up.
(27:00):
This role, which was originally written for Brad Pitt, was
so interesting because it didn't fit the stereotypical women woman's
spy trope. Although I didn't find the role that revolutionary.
I can easily imagine the movie with a male lead.
I thought, I actually thought it was written for uh
Tom Cruise, But and I didn't. I don't. I didn't
like that movie I never saw. I also didn't like
(27:21):
want it. Angelina Deelie, please make something better. Thank you Bale.
Maybe she's listening right now, Angelina. Send us your thoughts
mom Stuff at house stuff Works dot com. You can
always find us over at Facebook and follow us on
Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast, and you can head over
to the blog during the week It's stuff Mom Never
(27:41):
told You at how Stuff Works dot com. Be sure
to check out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future.
Join how Stuffwork staff as we explore the most promising
and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. The House Stuffworks iPhone app
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