September 2, 2023 • 25 mins
As we begin re-entering society, women are reporting low self-esteem around job performance and self-image. Anney and Samantha dig into the science of why that is, and how to deal with it in this classic episode.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Anny and Samantha and welcome to Steff.
I never told you production of iHeartRadio and today I
wanted to bring back on that is a little dated
but also kind of unfortunately relevant. It's one we did
(00:26):
when it was like the pandemic was lifting and we
were going out and it was about confidence after the pandemic,
and in the wake of my surprise party Gonna Rye
and now Dragon Con, I feel that this is something
(00:48):
I'm wrestling with. I feel like what's holding me back
now is my lack of confidence with myself and with
my body. Whereas I used to when I would go
to Dragon Con, put on a costume and I would
feel more confident than I'd ever felt like it was
like I was stepping into someone else and so I
(01:08):
don't have to worry about all of my problems, which
is not necessarily healthy, but that was how it felt
because people used to kind of be confused. They would say, like,
how can you wear this costume and you're so shy
when you're whatever, whatever, whatever, And I would say, well,
I actually felt more confident when I'm pretending to be
something else. But as you know, I've also been asked
(01:34):
to be on a Star Wars panel, and I'm highly concerned.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
It'd be great. I was so goodor we talked about
this too where.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Because fandom, and in a lot of ways, especially Star
Wars fandom, is very gatekeepy and very like no, I'm right, but.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Also what is canon anymore? I don't know. I'm just worried.
I hate that I have to be like, but I'm
not a big enough fan. When I am a big enough.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
You are.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
I really, I really really am, And it's for like obscure.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Star Wars facts and it's family feud style. My biggest
hope is that there's nothing negative in it. I don't
want to be like, what's the most hated character? I
don't want that I want. I just don't like that
part of it. It's not my thing. Even though I
have my opinions about it, I just don't.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
It's not my thing. I don't want to do that
as someone else.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
But yeah, I just It's something I'm still grappling with,
even years later, about going in public and feeling that
kind of performance of being in public a way that
I like, I've always felt it, but I think I've
just been used to it before the pandemic and now
I'm not used to it anymore.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
This is your second Dragon Con panel. I know you
want me, but they's your life.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
I'm late. I love it.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
I'm excited to see it because I don't like it.
Like when you're talking about not being prepared, I would never,
but I'm excited to watch you.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
I well, you'll have to cheer me on when I
will fail everything that.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
Oh I'm so nervous.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
She's full of lies, yeall, she doesn't felt things.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
I'm like the weakest link though, I will say that
in this team, I am definitely uh doubtful. But I'm
gonna try to have fun. I my friends are there,
and that's you know what. I have supportive friends and.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
That's what matters.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
We're gonna yell for you.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, even if I get it wrong. If they're like,
oh no, what's your favorite droids? That isn't these droids?
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And I'm like that one, but I feel like they won't.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
It has to be obscure. I've been studying. I'm embarrassed
to say.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
I'm so embarrassed. Are you gonna have it on your hands? Oh? No,
I know my cheating days are behind me.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
Do you want me to hold up scoreboards.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I put that answer. I got you, I got you,
I got it. I wark this out.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
On the floor.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Okay, three taps. What does it mean?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
You can tell everyone?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Okay, got it? Well we're kind of assisted. No, we won't,
but we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I'll report back. Oh gosh, I'll report back.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
But in the meantime, please enjoy this classic episode. Hey,
this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephfman Never
Told You production of iHeart Radio.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
All right, Annie, I have a question for you. Okay,
what is something that you did before the pandemic that
we probably will not do now?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yes? Now is in right now? Or now is in
moving forward? Moving forward? Moving forward?
Speaker 1 (05:28):
I probably I know we've talked about this some and
we're very fortunate and that this is an option. I
probably won't go into the office as much as I
did because I used to be a like pretty much
every day of the week, even if it wasn't necessary,
I went in to the office, and outside of that,
I'm curious to see if this changes.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
But right now, I don't think I'm going to.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Have as many back to back plans, as many days
of the week where It used to be like I'd
be like, you're going to this museum from this time
to this time, and then you're gonna go here from
this time to this time, and every day was like that.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
I don't think that's gonna be the case anymore.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
Right, Yeah, I think for me, some things will be.
And I didn't do it too much beforehand, but like
food bars and I would go to the Whole Foods
and they have that food bar. I would go to town
on that sound bar because I love they have chicken
fry tofu, probably one of my favorite things.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Ever.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
As now, like I don't know if I'll ever do
this again, because it wasn't great to begin with. I mean,
the little sneeze guards that seem like a great idea,
but people purposely go underneath that to get to things,
and I'm like, no, no, no, And the one excepted
was Whole Foods. And now I'm like, I don't I
don't think I'll be doing that anymore. The automatic hugs, oh,
(06:49):
that will be less likely, as well as sharing drinks
with strangers. And I say this and like, if I
got to know you, maybe the first one I got
to know you, but about an hour and a half later,
I'm like, oh, you want to try this?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Right?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I didn't think much of it, but now I'm like, oh.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Yeah, no, yeah, no, right.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
And the reason I was thinking about all of these things,
of course, there are other things that we're going to
do that I'm we're not doing right now, Like right now,
I won't dine indoors. Eventually, well, I absolutely, but the
preference is that I will be eating on the patio
at all times. And I'm very excited about that because
you know, in Georgia we only have like a month
(07:25):
of where that is actually not too hot, not too old,
not too poliny, right, that we can do that, But
just the overall idea of going out and being a
part of society again has me really really anxious. And
I know we talked about this before, and it made
me think about how our confidence or lack thereof, how
it's changed since after the pandemic. And again I don't
(07:48):
know about anybody else, And yeah, like I said, I've
talked about this before, but as we're preparing to meet
up with people and mingle with people, I'm started to
have a lot of second thoughts on whether or not
I even want to go out. In the first place,
and whether I have the emotional motivation or strength to
actually do it. And of course this has everything to
do with not just being a part of society again
(08:11):
and just interacting with people and just socializing, but also
my confidence in my job and then what we're doing.
It has really waned. I feel like during the pandemic,
which is hilarious because we've upped our amount of episodes
that we do on a constant basis. I'm finally getting
to the point of this like year three, yo, I
(08:31):
can't remember right, year three of me finally you know,
me kind of getting adjusted to this new job. But
I'm still having a lot of anxiety. Of course, it
didn't help that I clicked onto some reviews the other
day and it was not pretty. I know, everybody got
onto me, including Holly stuff you missed in history class,
(08:52):
and Caroline from Unladylike and Tracy of missing history class.
They're all like, stop doing that, And I didn't mean to.
I was actually trying to do it for and I
just ended up clicking on it, and of course a
word caught my eye, so I was like, let me,
let me see what this is.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Oh my gosh, son of.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
It was a huge mistake. But I'm not the only one,
so I feel a little bit better about this and
a little sad about this. And according to one research
I Think Tank, they found over seventy nine percent of
women struggling with self esteem or self love issues and
it ranged from different reasons such as financial reasons. And yeah,
we talked about this before, especially when it comes to
Black women and Latino women. They've been hardest when it
(09:31):
comes to the job prices during the pandemic. And that
same study found over seventy percent felt financially insecure and
seventy one percent have had their financial plans being completely
affected due to the pandemic.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
And it is not all because of finance, but also
due to not surprisingly the state of the world, things
like politics, the pandemic, and for some feeling like they
haven't moved forward in their lives, whether it's personal or professional.
(10:08):
And according it to one statistic, the lowest ranking and
self esteem or self love is in South Korea, Saudi Arabia,
and surprisingly France, while Denmark, Australia, and the United States
rake the highest, which could be more about who was
asked more than anything else. Always good to question those
kinds of studies, and again it's such a shock. It
has shown that people who are frequent users of social
(10:28):
media are more likely to have lower self esteem. But
it's also worth noting that many of the same people
have said they get more emotional support they need. And
there have been many different reports talking about the overall
effect of social media, especially in teenagers when it comes
to them using these platforms, and.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
That's not adding the overall pressures of the dreaded zoom meetings.
According to a study done by Washington University in Saint Louis,
they didn't find a decrease in self esteem, which I
thought was surprising because every time I open it up
dialogue inside they said quote counter to expectations, Daily video
chatting hours was unassociated with appearance satisfaction, which aligns with
(11:08):
some work that suggests the specific social media activities, rather
than the total spent using it, predicts body dissatisfaction. And
the research continues. Furthermore, daily video chatting hours was not
associated with self objectification or video chatting appearance comparisons, though
self objectifications moderated the relationship between total video chatting hours
(11:30):
and both satisfaction measures, so Essentially, what they are saying
is they expected that to be a problem. They're saying
that they felt that their self esteem was hit all
these things, but they really didn't care. It didn't really change.
It just kind of was like, huh, okay, it happens,
moving on and again. Like I said, hey, I don't
know about you, but I'm definitely not one of those
who feel fine with all the zoom and Skype and
(11:53):
any of these things, because when I pop up the video,
it shows me how I look at that day. I'm like, oh, yeah,
I haven't looked in the mirror today. But the one
thing I do love is that I can actually just
turn off the camera. So being at a meeting without
being at a meeting has been really nice. And which,
by the way, the study does point out that many
of those who participate in these types of surveys did
(12:14):
highlight that they really like the edit feature or they
could turn it off, and that's part of the reason.
They're like, yeah, I can change it if I want to.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
Yeah, yeah, I remember the first time for I don't know,
the first time I zoom and I was just messing
around with They'll like edit my appearance feature.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
It's like, whoa, this is why I'm not savvy enough,
and I'm just like, just turn it off, just turn
it off.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Well, I mean it does reach a certain point. I
mean you gotta have a light touch unless you want
people to know like, oh yeah, she's got that edit
my apparents function creak to the top.
Speaker 3 (12:50):
And I'm guessing I didn't look into this that the
purchasing has increased four things like the ring light, which
a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
Of people have now I have noticed that I have.
I've noticed that, and I actually have one in here.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
I did not purchase it specifically for Zoom, but I
did move it from where it was into here because
I was like, well, if I'm gonna be on camera, all.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
I get the ring light out.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
However, it's facing my wall more than my face, So no,
not great.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
But anyway, issues.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Of body image have been a prevailing theme throughout the
pandemic as well.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
And honestly, yeah, I've been uh stocking up a lot
on ponchos and this is part of my now normal
clothes closet because you know, I'm preparing for the vaxed
guirl woman summer and yeah, new fashion is cover up
as much as I can with as much material, but
that doesn't make me too hot. In ponchos, they give
you the options of not having too long with sleeves.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
I should get out my Luke Skywalker poncho. You haven't
seen me in it yet, Samantha, heaven't. It was super cute.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
I love how people always see it so ugly. I'm like, oh,
I think it looks so cute.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Yeah, that's actually I haven't had the chance to tell
you this because it kind of just happens, Tomantha. But
the other night, a friend of mine, a really good
friend of mine, texted me at like nine pm and said,
do you want to come hang out at a bar
that's near me? I'm here and I was like, what
is this last minute plan? And he was like, I know,
I'm bringing them back. And I felt too gross and
(14:18):
ugly to go outside.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
And I couldn't say that because then he'd be like
come on and being ridiculous.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
But that's what that was my immediate like I can't
be seen like this. Yeah, And I know a lot
of friends women, particularly in my group, that have said
similar things.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
One scientific journal found that stress and anxiety has increased
due to people's ideas around body image. There is this
defeatist attitude about what they should and should not have
accomplished while in quarantine. And again we see social media
and a lot of fat phobic content that feed into
this narrative that that's been a big conversation throughout this
whole thing.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
Right, And according to the National Eating Disorders Association, quote,
people with negative body image have a greater likelihood of
developing eating this order. They're also more likely to suffer
from the feelings of depression, isolation, low self esteem, and
obsession with weight. And that's again to say that this
is this horror level of it's not actually what your
body looks like, but it's how you're thinking on it
(15:13):
and what is making you think on it, and a yeah,
and part of that is this whole narrative that we've
been talking about throughout our episodes. And I know a
lot of women in general are talking about the fact
that there's this feeling a failure because we didn't We
had all this time, and why didn't you do this?
And you could have done this while you're there, and
because we didn't or may not have done it, we
(15:35):
feel like we haven't met those expectations as well as
that it becomes a moment of obsession to it's like,
why didn't I do this? And this is my fault
that I did this and all these things. And I
think we would definitely want to add negative body image
can affect anyone, So it doesn't matter what you look
like at all. Again, just through preface that this is
not about what you actually look like. It's what you
(15:57):
actually think in process and what's being fed to you.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Right, And as we talked about earlier, financial issues have
made many women insecure due to the pandemic, but so
as the overall level of job skill, which can lead
to burnout. According to CNBC and Survey Monkey Women at
Work survey that was conducted February through March of this year.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Twenty twenty one, just in case you're listening to this in.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
The future, at least fifty three percent of women said
they were suffering from burnout due to their jobs, and
many experts report it's the usual level of bias and
lack of fairness that many women have been dealing with
for years, added to the pandemic that is causing this
increase of burnout.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
And yeah, this isn't even talking about the unequal responsibility
laid on women in the household, which one report estimated
at least twenty additional hours of extual work was added
because of that household responsibility. Yeah, any how many hours
do you think a week you average for this job?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I will say it heavily depends on the week, but
it can go up to a fifty or six. See
And in fact, I have a friend who uses an
app where almost like you're clocking and clocking out because
we don't traditionally do that with our job, but just
to keep tracks, so I know how many hours I
am putting in some weeks it's much less, for sure,
but because of the way our jobs are structured, and
now you're doing that at home, and those lines are
(17:17):
blurred between like home life and office life, and depending
on your state of mind, you might.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Be working, you might be working really early in.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
The morning or at off hours, so you're not thinking
of it in that way, and so it's really difficult
to get a clear idea of how much it is.
Especially I don't know if you've experienced this, but I
feel like the hours just bleed together and somehow, like
I don't know if it's the pandemic are stressed. I
feel like things are taking me much longer than they
(17:47):
used to take me, and I can't really say what
that is. I know, maybe it's not even true, but
it feels like I used to be able to get
all my work done in pretty standard work time hours
and now it's like working weekends is an out of
the that's pretty regular.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
Right, And I think that's part of the problem that
we are not addressing enough, especially when we talk about
working from home, especially when we talk about salary jobs
and why it can be problematic because when you start
dwindling down how many hours you truly work, you're like, oh,
I'm getting paid five dollars an hour, that's right, that's
not worth it, and as in fact what you're talking about,
why it takes you longer. One of the workplace experts,
(18:24):
Jennifer Moss, actually stated that yes, burnout, which you may
not even realize you have, often leads to brain fog, fatigue,
and chronic stress, and has made even small tasks like
folding laundry or unloading a dishwasher really exhausting, which means
it takes you longer and it seems really hard when
it's like I've done this for so many years. Why
(18:47):
is this a problem now? And especially again when we
can't differentiate our regular hours versus work hours. And you're
better at getting on top of things than I am,
but you're not better at stopping. Yeah, you don't limit
yourself and that is problematic for you. Me, I'll give
up some times, but it bleeds into my hour stretch
(19:10):
over a twelve hour work day. But I and it
may be eight hours, but it may take me three
hours to do one of the tests that should have
taken me thirty minutes, like I actually measured, like this
should take me this long.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
It take me this long? What did I just do?
Speaker 3 (19:23):
And part of that, especially when I this kind of
job to me is so different because research seems so
like college like that I can't quite grasp professional versus research,
which is again very different from me from what I
used to do, which I would go in and have
conference calls and you know, different things like that. That
was obviously like a different level of professional bits where
(19:44):
I would do a documentation of interviews. When I would
do investigations, it was different. This researching things, it seems
like it's almost against school like which meant I would
wait till the last minute, but do it, hammit within
six hours. So my ideal discipline has gone out the
window and I have regressed to really bad college habits
for this job. So it's really weird. But on top
(20:06):
of that, again, my confidence, I feel like is shocked
because this is something that this kind of job allows
for a lot of people to critique it. Outside of
just your boss and ourselves, you have so many people
who have so many opinions that it makes me so
shell shocked that I feel like I can't do my
job properly and I don't have the confidence to say
(20:26):
that I have.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
So it's a whole different thing, which again brings back
the whole like burnout stress where I get I quit. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
Well, and there's a lot we could unpack there, and
I'm sure we will in a future episode of Just
when we have the conversation of you know, being feminist
enough or am I like is my voice worth hearing?
Speaker 4 (20:47):
And then you get the critiques, and then you get
in your head and then you doubt everything about yourself
and what you're doing, and then you have a pandemic
and you're like, I know, I could do better, but
I'm so stressed rightly, like just all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
And I will say for me all so for the
long work hours.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
This is something I thought about when I was going
on a mental experiment of like what would happen if
I got fired today? And I was just thinking that
I do rely on work a lot to as a
stress Like as stressful as it is, it also distracts
me from other politics or it gives me something to do,
(21:23):
so I use it in that way also.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
So that's another aspect of this whole thing.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
And yeah, as we get back to whatever normal is,
and many would argue there is no real getting back
to what we assumed to be normal before the pandemic,
it is important to measure how you see yourself as
in taking care to not fall under the pressures and
lies of unrealistic expectations. We do have some advice on
how to care for yourself as we ease back into
(22:01):
society and as many of us have discussed, did the
pressures of returning how to deal with those the pressures
returning to putting the job first in a capitalistic society.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
So here's one letting things go prioritize what you need
and the best way for you to be productive. So
most times you can't do it all. That's unrealistic, unhealthy
to think that you have to and that's something that
you can do and we have to prioritize in order
to be able to be productive. So that includes saying
no when you don't have the time to do it,
(22:34):
or just if you don't want to. So if they're
asking you to volunteer, don't say yes if you don't
want to, if you don't enjoy it. Why learn compassionate detachment,
which is defined as the quote manner in which we
relate to others when we allow them to deal with
their own problems and therefore they're free to choose to
become responsible for their own issues. Also, you could say
(22:55):
it as you can observe, but not absorb, taking on
those responsibilities. And here's a few ways to do that.
One retreat. Remove yourself from that situation if it's not
a situation you want to be a part of, or
if it's not giving you good vibes, Put down that phone,
walk away from that conversation, go with hide in the
closet if you need to. Hiding's great. I love doing that. Restore,
(23:16):
whether it's going in a quiet space like we talked about,
taking some deep breaths, maybe showering to wash off that
negativity literally, or even a much needed fifteen minute power nap.
Who knows we evaluate? Is this person someone who is
there for you as much as you are there for them.
You need to really consider what this friendship is. Is
it toxic? Even this work relationship? Is it uplifting and
(23:38):
same as any situation. Listen to your body, listen to
your instincts.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Which is sometimes easier said than done. And I'm actually
really working on that. Taking time for yourself, so that
could be things like going outside, turning off your phone.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
I just lost my phone, so I'm kind of dealing
with this right now.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
She's been now twice, she's envaccinated and lost her phone
on the second time, not the first time. That's true.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Give yourself breaks throughout the day, even if you are
working from home, step away from your workspace and stay connected.
Find your people. Stay connected with them, whether it's just
a quick text exchange or chat. Restore yourself with the
people who know you and love you for who you are.
Ponchos and all and Yes, Samantha even though you're Pancho
(24:28):
scared the crap out of me that one time because
it was hanging on a closet wall. You're still a
great friend of mine.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
It was my uh wearable comforter. That is a giant poncho.
But it's the size of a tent. Yeah, because it's
also very very thick. It looks like a person.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Just staring at you. Is true, That's what I thought,
and it scared me.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
But to be fair, I am easily scared too.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Well.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Listeners, please let us know if you have any tips
or trick or thoughts. We love hearing them all. You
can email us at Stuff Media, Momstuff at iHeartMedia dot com.
You can find us on Instagram at Stephane Never Told
You or on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as
always to our super producer Christina, Thank you, and thanks
to you for listening. Stefan Never Told You is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the
(25:18):
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite shows.
Hey, this is Anny and Samantha and welcome to Steff.
I never told you production of iHeartRadio and today I
wanted to bring back on that is a little dated
but also kind of unfortunately relevant. It's one we did
(00:26):
when it was like the pandemic was lifting and we
were going out and it was about confidence after the pandemic,
and in the wake of my surprise party Gonna Rye
and now Dragon Con, I feel that this is something
(00:48):
I'm wrestling with. I feel like what's holding me back
now is my lack of confidence with myself and with
my body. Whereas I used to when I would go
to Dragon Con, put on a costume and I would
feel more confident than I'd ever felt like it was
like I was stepping into someone else and so I
(01:08):
don't have to worry about all of my problems, which
is not necessarily healthy, but that was how it felt
because people used to kind of be confused. They would say, like,
how can you wear this costume and you're so shy
when you're whatever, whatever, whatever, And I would say, well,
I actually felt more confident when I'm pretending to be
something else. But as you know, I've also been asked
(01:34):
to be on a Star Wars panel, and I'm highly concerned.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
It'd be great. I was so goodor we talked about
this too where.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Because fandom, and in a lot of ways, especially Star
Wars fandom, is very gatekeepy and very like no, I'm right, but.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Also what is canon anymore? I don't know. I'm just worried.
I hate that I have to be like, but I'm
not a big enough fan. When I am a big enough.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
You are.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
I really, I really really am, And it's for like obscure.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Star Wars facts and it's family feud style. My biggest
hope is that there's nothing negative in it. I don't
want to be like, what's the most hated character? I
don't want that I want. I just don't like that
part of it. It's not my thing. Even though I
have my opinions about it, I just don't.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
It's not my thing. I don't want to do that
as someone else.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
But yeah, I just It's something I'm still grappling with,
even years later, about going in public and feeling that
kind of performance of being in public a way that
I like, I've always felt it, but I think I've
just been used to it before the pandemic and now
I'm not used to it anymore.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
This is your second Dragon Con panel. I know you
want me, but they's your life.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
I'm late. I love it.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
I'm excited to see it because I don't like it.
Like when you're talking about not being prepared, I would never,
but I'm excited to watch you.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
I well, you'll have to cheer me on when I
will fail everything that.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
Oh I'm so nervous.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
She's full of lies, yeall, she doesn't felt things.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
I'm like the weakest link though, I will say that
in this team, I am definitely uh doubtful. But I'm
gonna try to have fun. I my friends are there,
and that's you know what. I have supportive friends and.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
That's what matters.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
We're gonna yell for you.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, even if I get it wrong. If they're like,
oh no, what's your favorite droids? That isn't these droids?
Speaker 2 (03:56):
And I'm like that one, but I feel like they won't.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
It has to be obscure. I've been studying. I'm embarrassed
to say.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
I'm so embarrassed. Are you gonna have it on your hands? Oh? No,
I know my cheating days are behind me.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
Do you want me to hold up scoreboards.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
I put that answer. I got you, I got you,
I got it. I wark this out.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
On the floor.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Okay, three taps. What does it mean?
Speaker 3 (04:34):
You can tell everyone?
Speaker 1 (04:37):
Okay, got it? Well we're kind of assisted. No, we won't,
but we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
I'll report back. Oh gosh, I'll report back.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
But in the meantime, please enjoy this classic episode. Hey,
this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stephfman Never
Told You production of iHeart Radio.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
All right, Annie, I have a question for you. Okay,
what is something that you did before the pandemic that
we probably will not do now?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Yes? Now is in right now? Or now is in
moving forward? Moving forward? Moving forward?
Speaker 1 (05:28):
I probably I know we've talked about this some and
we're very fortunate and that this is an option. I
probably won't go into the office as much as I
did because I used to be a like pretty much
every day of the week, even if it wasn't necessary,
I went in to the office, and outside of that,
I'm curious to see if this changes.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
But right now, I don't think I'm going to.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Have as many back to back plans, as many days
of the week where It used to be like I'd
be like, you're going to this museum from this time
to this time, and then you're gonna go here from
this time to this time, and every day was like that.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
I don't think that's gonna be the case anymore.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
Right, Yeah, I think for me, some things will be.
And I didn't do it too much beforehand, but like
food bars and I would go to the Whole Foods
and they have that food bar. I would go to town
on that sound bar because I love they have chicken
fry tofu, probably one of my favorite things.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Ever.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
As now, like I don't know if I'll ever do
this again, because it wasn't great to begin with. I mean,
the little sneeze guards that seem like a great idea,
but people purposely go underneath that to get to things,
and I'm like, no, no, no, And the one excepted
was Whole Foods. And now I'm like, I don't I
don't think I'll be doing that anymore. The automatic hugs, oh,
(06:49):
that will be less likely, as well as sharing drinks
with strangers. And I say this and like, if I
got to know you, maybe the first one I got
to know you, but about an hour and a half later,
I'm like, oh, you want to try this?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Right?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I didn't think much of it, but now I'm like, oh.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Yeah, no, yeah, no, right.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
And the reason I was thinking about all of these things,
of course, there are other things that we're going to
do that I'm we're not doing right now, Like right now,
I won't dine indoors. Eventually, well, I absolutely, but the
preference is that I will be eating on the patio
at all times. And I'm very excited about that because
you know, in Georgia we only have like a month
(07:25):
of where that is actually not too hot, not too old,
not too poliny, right, that we can do that, But
just the overall idea of going out and being a
part of society again has me really really anxious. And
I know we talked about this before, and it made
me think about how our confidence or lack thereof, how
it's changed since after the pandemic. And again I don't
(07:48):
know about anybody else, And yeah, like I said, I've
talked about this before, but as we're preparing to meet
up with people and mingle with people, I'm started to
have a lot of second thoughts on whether or not
I even want to go out. In the first place,
and whether I have the emotional motivation or strength to
actually do it. And of course this has everything to
do with not just being a part of society again
(08:11):
and just interacting with people and just socializing, but also
my confidence in my job and then what we're doing.
It has really waned. I feel like during the pandemic,
which is hilarious because we've upped our amount of episodes
that we do on a constant basis. I'm finally getting
to the point of this like year three, yo, I
(08:31):
can't remember right, year three of me finally you know,
me kind of getting adjusted to this new job. But
I'm still having a lot of anxiety. Of course, it
didn't help that I clicked onto some reviews the other
day and it was not pretty. I know, everybody got
onto me, including Holly stuff you missed in history class,
(08:52):
and Caroline from Unladylike and Tracy of missing history class.
They're all like, stop doing that, And I didn't mean to.
I was actually trying to do it for and I
just ended up clicking on it, and of course a
word caught my eye, so I was like, let me,
let me see what this is.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
Oh my gosh, son of.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
It was a huge mistake. But I'm not the only one,
so I feel a little bit better about this and
a little sad about this. And according to one research
I Think Tank, they found over seventy nine percent of
women struggling with self esteem or self love issues and
it ranged from different reasons such as financial reasons. And yeah,
we talked about this before, especially when it comes to
Black women and Latino women. They've been hardest when it
(09:31):
comes to the job prices during the pandemic. And that
same study found over seventy percent felt financially insecure and
seventy one percent have had their financial plans being completely
affected due to the pandemic.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
And it is not all because of finance, but also
due to not surprisingly the state of the world, things
like politics, the pandemic, and for some feeling like they
haven't moved forward in their lives, whether it's personal or professional.
(10:08):
And according it to one statistic, the lowest ranking and
self esteem or self love is in South Korea, Saudi Arabia,
and surprisingly France, while Denmark, Australia, and the United States
rake the highest, which could be more about who was
asked more than anything else. Always good to question those
kinds of studies, and again it's such a shock. It
has shown that people who are frequent users of social
(10:28):
media are more likely to have lower self esteem. But
it's also worth noting that many of the same people
have said they get more emotional support they need. And
there have been many different reports talking about the overall
effect of social media, especially in teenagers when it comes
to them using these platforms, and.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
That's not adding the overall pressures of the dreaded zoom meetings.
According to a study done by Washington University in Saint Louis,
they didn't find a decrease in self esteem, which I
thought was surprising because every time I open it up
dialogue inside they said quote counter to expectations, Daily video
chatting hours was unassociated with appearance satisfaction, which aligns with
(11:08):
some work that suggests the specific social media activities, rather
than the total spent using it, predicts body dissatisfaction. And
the research continues. Furthermore, daily video chatting hours was not
associated with self objectification or video chatting appearance comparisons, though
self objectifications moderated the relationship between total video chatting hours
(11:30):
and both satisfaction measures, so Essentially, what they are saying
is they expected that to be a problem. They're saying
that they felt that their self esteem was hit all
these things, but they really didn't care. It didn't really change.
It just kind of was like, huh, okay, it happens,
moving on and again. Like I said, hey, I don't
know about you, but I'm definitely not one of those
who feel fine with all the zoom and Skype and
(11:53):
any of these things, because when I pop up the video,
it shows me how I look at that day. I'm like, oh, yeah,
I haven't looked in the mirror today. But the one
thing I do love is that I can actually just
turn off the camera. So being at a meeting without
being at a meeting has been really nice. And which,
by the way, the study does point out that many
of those who participate in these types of surveys did
(12:14):
highlight that they really like the edit feature or they
could turn it off, and that's part of the reason.
They're like, yeah, I can change it if I want to.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
Yeah, yeah, I remember the first time for I don't know,
the first time I zoom and I was just messing
around with They'll like edit my appearance feature.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
It's like, whoa, this is why I'm not savvy enough,
and I'm just like, just turn it off, just turn
it off.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Well, I mean it does reach a certain point. I
mean you gotta have a light touch unless you want
people to know like, oh yeah, she's got that edit
my apparents function creak to the top.
Speaker 3 (12:50):
And I'm guessing I didn't look into this that the
purchasing has increased four things like the ring light, which
a lot.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
Of people have now I have noticed that I have.
I've noticed that, and I actually have one in here.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
I did not purchase it specifically for Zoom, but I
did move it from where it was into here because
I was like, well, if I'm gonna be on camera, all.
Speaker 2 (13:13):
I get the ring light out.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
However, it's facing my wall more than my face, So no,
not great.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
But anyway, issues.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Of body image have been a prevailing theme throughout the
pandemic as well.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
And honestly, yeah, I've been uh stocking up a lot
on ponchos and this is part of my now normal
clothes closet because you know, I'm preparing for the vaxed
guirl woman summer and yeah, new fashion is cover up
as much as I can with as much material, but
that doesn't make me too hot. In ponchos, they give
you the options of not having too long with sleeves.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
I should get out my Luke Skywalker poncho. You haven't
seen me in it yet, Samantha, heaven't. It was super cute.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
I love how people always see it so ugly. I'm like, oh,
I think it looks so cute.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Yeah, that's actually I haven't had the chance to tell
you this because it kind of just happens, Tomantha. But
the other night, a friend of mine, a really good
friend of mine, texted me at like nine pm and said,
do you want to come hang out at a bar
that's near me? I'm here and I was like, what
is this last minute plan? And he was like, I know,
I'm bringing them back. And I felt too gross and
(14:18):
ugly to go outside.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
And I couldn't say that because then he'd be like
come on and being ridiculous.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
But that's what that was my immediate like I can't
be seen like this. Yeah, And I know a lot
of friends women, particularly in my group, that have said
similar things.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
One scientific journal found that stress and anxiety has increased
due to people's ideas around body image. There is this
defeatist attitude about what they should and should not have
accomplished while in quarantine. And again we see social media
and a lot of fat phobic content that feed into
this narrative that that's been a big conversation throughout this
whole thing.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
Right, And according to the National Eating Disorders Association, quote,
people with negative body image have a greater likelihood of
developing eating this order. They're also more likely to suffer
from the feelings of depression, isolation, low self esteem, and
obsession with weight. And that's again to say that this
is this horror level of it's not actually what your
body looks like, but it's how you're thinking on it
(15:13):
and what is making you think on it, and a yeah,
and part of that is this whole narrative that we've
been talking about throughout our episodes. And I know a
lot of women in general are talking about the fact
that there's this feeling a failure because we didn't We
had all this time, and why didn't you do this?
And you could have done this while you're there, and
because we didn't or may not have done it, we
(15:35):
feel like we haven't met those expectations as well as
that it becomes a moment of obsession to it's like,
why didn't I do this? And this is my fault
that I did this and all these things. And I
think we would definitely want to add negative body image
can affect anyone, So it doesn't matter what you look
like at all. Again, just through preface that this is
not about what you actually look like. It's what you
(15:57):
actually think in process and what's being fed to you.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
Right, And as we talked about earlier, financial issues have
made many women insecure due to the pandemic, but so
as the overall level of job skill, which can lead
to burnout. According to CNBC and Survey Monkey Women at
Work survey that was conducted February through March of this year.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Twenty twenty one, just in case you're listening to this in.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
The future, at least fifty three percent of women said
they were suffering from burnout due to their jobs, and
many experts report it's the usual level of bias and
lack of fairness that many women have been dealing with
for years, added to the pandemic that is causing this
increase of burnout.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
And yeah, this isn't even talking about the unequal responsibility
laid on women in the household, which one report estimated
at least twenty additional hours of extual work was added
because of that household responsibility. Yeah, any how many hours
do you think a week you average for this job?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I will say it heavily depends on the week, but
it can go up to a fifty or six. See
And in fact, I have a friend who uses an
app where almost like you're clocking and clocking out because
we don't traditionally do that with our job, but just
to keep tracks, so I know how many hours I
am putting in some weeks it's much less, for sure,
but because of the way our jobs are structured, and
now you're doing that at home, and those lines are
(17:17):
blurred between like home life and office life, and depending
on your state of mind, you might.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Be working, you might be working really early in.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
The morning or at off hours, so you're not thinking
of it in that way, and so it's really difficult
to get a clear idea of how much it is.
Especially I don't know if you've experienced this, but I
feel like the hours just bleed together and somehow, like
I don't know if it's the pandemic are stressed. I
feel like things are taking me much longer than they
(17:47):
used to take me, and I can't really say what
that is. I know, maybe it's not even true, but
it feels like I used to be able to get
all my work done in pretty standard work time hours
and now it's like working weekends is an out of
the that's pretty regular.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
Right, And I think that's part of the problem that
we are not addressing enough, especially when we talk about
working from home, especially when we talk about salary jobs
and why it can be problematic because when you start
dwindling down how many hours you truly work, you're like, oh,
I'm getting paid five dollars an hour, that's right, that's
not worth it, and as in fact what you're talking about,
why it takes you longer. One of the workplace experts,
(18:24):
Jennifer Moss, actually stated that yes, burnout, which you may
not even realize you have, often leads to brain fog, fatigue,
and chronic stress, and has made even small tasks like
folding laundry or unloading a dishwasher really exhausting, which means
it takes you longer and it seems really hard when
it's like I've done this for so many years. Why
(18:47):
is this a problem now? And especially again when we
can't differentiate our regular hours versus work hours. And you're
better at getting on top of things than I am,
but you're not better at stopping. Yeah, you don't limit
yourself and that is problematic for you. Me, I'll give
up some times, but it bleeds into my hour stretch
(19:10):
over a twelve hour work day. But I and it
may be eight hours, but it may take me three
hours to do one of the tests that should have
taken me thirty minutes, like I actually measured, like this
should take me this long.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
It take me this long? What did I just do?
Speaker 3 (19:23):
And part of that, especially when I this kind of
job to me is so different because research seems so
like college like that I can't quite grasp professional versus research,
which is again very different from me from what I
used to do, which I would go in and have
conference calls and you know, different things like that. That
was obviously like a different level of professional bits where
(19:44):
I would do a documentation of interviews. When I would
do investigations, it was different. This researching things, it seems
like it's almost against school like which meant I would
wait till the last minute, but do it, hammit within
six hours. So my ideal discipline has gone out the
window and I have regressed to really bad college habits
for this job. So it's really weird. But on top
(20:06):
of that, again, my confidence, I feel like is shocked
because this is something that this kind of job allows
for a lot of people to critique it. Outside of
just your boss and ourselves, you have so many people
who have so many opinions that it makes me so
shell shocked that I feel like I can't do my
job properly and I don't have the confidence to say
(20:26):
that I have.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
So it's a whole different thing, which again brings back
the whole like burnout stress where I get I quit. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
Well, and there's a lot we could unpack there, and
I'm sure we will in a future episode of Just
when we have the conversation of you know, being feminist
enough or am I like is my voice worth hearing?
Speaker 4 (20:47):
And then you get the critiques, and then you get
in your head and then you doubt everything about yourself
and what you're doing, and then you have a pandemic
and you're like, I know, I could do better, but
I'm so stressed rightly, like just all this stuff.
Speaker 2 (20:58):
And I will say for me all so for the
long work hours.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
This is something I thought about when I was going
on a mental experiment of like what would happen if
I got fired today? And I was just thinking that
I do rely on work a lot to as a
stress Like as stressful as it is, it also distracts
me from other politics or it gives me something to do,
(21:23):
so I use it in that way also.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
So that's another aspect of this whole thing.
Speaker 1 (21:40):
And yeah, as we get back to whatever normal is,
and many would argue there is no real getting back
to what we assumed to be normal before the pandemic,
it is important to measure how you see yourself as
in taking care to not fall under the pressures and
lies of unrealistic expectations. We do have some advice on
how to care for yourself as we ease back into
(22:01):
society and as many of us have discussed, did the
pressures of returning how to deal with those the pressures
returning to putting the job first in a capitalistic society.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
So here's one letting things go prioritize what you need
and the best way for you to be productive. So
most times you can't do it all. That's unrealistic, unhealthy
to think that you have to and that's something that
you can do and we have to prioritize in order
to be able to be productive. So that includes saying
no when you don't have the time to do it,
(22:34):
or just if you don't want to. So if they're
asking you to volunteer, don't say yes if you don't
want to, if you don't enjoy it. Why learn compassionate detachment,
which is defined as the quote manner in which we
relate to others when we allow them to deal with
their own problems and therefore they're free to choose to
become responsible for their own issues. Also, you could say
(22:55):
it as you can observe, but not absorb, taking on
those responsibilities. And here's a few ways to do that.
One retreat. Remove yourself from that situation if it's not
a situation you want to be a part of, or
if it's not giving you good vibes, Put down that phone,
walk away from that conversation, go with hide in the
closet if you need to. Hiding's great. I love doing that. Restore,
(23:16):
whether it's going in a quiet space like we talked about,
taking some deep breaths, maybe showering to wash off that
negativity literally, or even a much needed fifteen minute power nap.
Who knows we evaluate? Is this person someone who is
there for you as much as you are there for them.
You need to really consider what this friendship is. Is
it toxic? Even this work relationship? Is it uplifting and
(23:38):
same as any situation. Listen to your body, listen to
your instincts.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Which is sometimes easier said than done. And I'm actually
really working on that. Taking time for yourself, so that
could be things like going outside, turning off your phone.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
I just lost my phone, so I'm kind of dealing
with this right now.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
She's been now twice, she's envaccinated and lost her phone
on the second time, not the first time. That's true.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
Give yourself breaks throughout the day, even if you are
working from home, step away from your workspace and stay connected.
Find your people. Stay connected with them, whether it's just
a quick text exchange or chat. Restore yourself with the
people who know you and love you for who you are.
Ponchos and all and Yes, Samantha even though you're Pancho
(24:28):
scared the crap out of me that one time because
it was hanging on a closet wall. You're still a
great friend of mine.
Speaker 3 (24:36):
It was my uh wearable comforter. That is a giant poncho.
But it's the size of a tent. Yeah, because it's
also very very thick. It looks like a person.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Just staring at you. Is true, That's what I thought,
and it scared me.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
But to be fair, I am easily scared too.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Well.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
Listeners, please let us know if you have any tips
or trick or thoughts. We love hearing them all. You
can email us at Stuff Media, Momstuff at iHeartMedia dot com.
You can find us on Instagram at Stephane Never Told
You or on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast. Thanks as
always to our super producer Christina, Thank you, and thanks
to you for listening. Stefan Never Told You is a
production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the
(25:18):
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite shows.
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