July 25, 2025 • 70 mins
While the human species is inarguably successful (for now), hundreds of millions of people struggle under daily threats of starvation, physical danger, lack of shelter and disease. And, perhaps more troubling, the numbers indicate it's possible to feed and shelter virtually every single person on the planet -- or is it? Is there enough for everyone, and, if so, why isn't humanity transforming this potential into a reality? Join the guys as they explore the answers to this question -- along with its disturbing implications -- in tonight's Classic episode.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Fellow conspiracy realist, welcome back. We have a classic episode
for you from twenty twenty in the Trenches of COVID.
We put our heads together and we asked ourselves, is
there actually enough for everyone?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
I love this.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
It's a very philosophical question, it's hard, but also a
very practical question, and we talk about all of those
angles in this classic episode.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
I remember thinking about one specific guy. Do you remember
who it was? We talked about him on Infamous Inventors,
A long time ago, man named Norman Borlog.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, save the world wheat, that's right.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Well, and it made us all think about this thing
where humanity has been attempting to create more and more
and more food. Right, so everybody has that because that's
a necessity. To figure out ways to filter water and
purify water because we need that too. But what do
we mean when we say is there enough for everyone?
Is it just those two things? Or is it more? Oh,
(01:07):
it's more right?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Yeah, you know, as we recorded than in twenty twenty
and even now in twenty twenty five, it's no secret
that hundreds and hundreds of millions of people are struggling
under daily physical threats like starvation, danger, disease, lack of
sanitation and shelter, but also what about the philosophical points, right,
(01:31):
what about that which feeds the soul? Is there enough
for everyone? We're really proud of this one and we
can't wait to hear your thoughts.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Thanks Roleo.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies, history is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
A production of Iheartrading.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Our friend Noel is on adventures, but we'll be returning
in the future.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
They call me Ben.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
We are joined as always with our super producer Paul,
Mission Control decand most importantly, you are you. You are
here and that makes this stuff they don't want you
to know.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
This is a This is a wide ranging episode for
us today, isn't.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
It It is? But it brings in topics that we've
been covering over the past seven years, at least seven
or not I think almost seven and this year we
will become seven. But yeah, we've hit on a lot
of the topics that we're going to kind of pull
in here. So hopefully you've listened to many of the episodes. Uh,
(02:51):
if not, maybe go back, you know, check out, check
out some of the ones that you can kind of
infer that we're going to be talking about with this
topic as you've read in the title, and then come
back to this episode, because we are going to be
pulling in a lot of stuff and we're not gonna
have time to hit everything in complete detail.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And this, this wide ranging episode is also by its
nature collaborative, as we of course hope all of our
episodes are, because we need your help, we want your involvement.
As we often say you specifically, you are the most
important part of this show. Those are not empty words.
(03:29):
As a matter of fact, to prove that these are
not empty words, to put our money where our mouths
are or where your ears are as you listen to this,
you know, Matt, I checked on our Twitter at conspiracy
stuff on Twitter. I checked on our Twitter feed, and
I had no idea that we we have more people
(03:52):
befriending us on Twitter than I thought. Yeah, not a
big number. It's a big number in absolute terms, but
it was bigger than I thought it was.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
It's a for for us, it's a big number. Give
me say what it is exactly where we are. According
to the mobile version, we have twenty nine two hundred
to something followers. Holy smokes, Well, we don't consider you followers,
by the way. Yeah, that's right, that's an awful word.
You are a fellow conspiracy realist. You are a fellow listeners.
(04:24):
So we thought we would give some of you a
quick shout out at the top of the show. And
we hope that the people shout out are listening, but
we want to share what they said with you, especially
for those of us who are not on Twitter. So
unless everybody hates this, we're gonna make this.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
A regular thing. Here we go, We'll we'll just read
a few shout out to shootdah one Stuart Hopfer over
there on Twitter, who's responding to our recent coronavirus episode.
We do have an update coming. And Stuart, you said,
I listened to this episode and and there's something you
should have mentioned. Aside from wearing a mask to not
(05:03):
get sick or catching something, they have also been worn
for those who have not done their makeup, which really
which I thought was interesting. Yeah, so maybe you're in
a hurry and you feel like you should have as
they say, put on your face, but you didn't have time,
so you say, I'll just I'll slap on the mask.
I'm just running to the store. Yeah it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Huh, it really is. I never would have thought about that.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
And so here's here's another one.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Patrick Lee six six six' nine was responding to our
earlier tangent about RIDICULOUS dc. Villains, yes and he hipped
us to this Fantastic batman, villain ten eyed. Man patrick just,
said look him.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Up ten eyed. Man, yeah he's.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Got his thing is that his only superpower is that
he he wears a headband over where the rest of
us normals would have, eyes and his, eyes the ten
eight man's eyes are on the tips of his. Fingertips
what what they're on His, yeah not tips of his
(06:14):
fingertips is, redundant but they're on his.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Fingertips, oh so we're talking About Philip. Reardon, Okay i've
seen the costume that has eyes going down his.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Chest, yeah those are decorative. Though his real power in
the finger.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Tips oh, man this is really. Cool he's in the bat.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Verse, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah he's up there with The
JOKER i assume as the most powerful Of Batman's villains
and last one for. Today Last twitter shout out for
today is r In jen three to eleven, says have
you all heard of and watched the Documentary Active measures On?
(06:58):
Hulu my timfoil hat is on and conspiracies are are.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Afoot check it out if you get a.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Chance, folks let us know if you've Seen Active. MEASURES
i have. Not let us know if it's if it's
worth a while for your fellow, listeners and thanks to you,
Guys thanks to everyone who has befriended us On twitter
and joined the ranks of the conspiracy. Realist, again we
are at conspiracy. Stuff if you ever want to just
shoot off a quick tweet to us while you're while
(07:25):
you're hearing. Something this episode may may get a little
personal for. PEOPLE i know it's it's full, confession a
little bit personal for, Me. Matt as you pointed out,
earlier today's episode is a.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Geshtault you, know it's.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Cumulative it's going to trend a bit towards the philosophical
but we've based it on pretty hard in that time sobering.
Science as you, said in the, past we've explored specific
concrete examples of things like resource. Extraction that's where that's
where a eight actor or a corporation or state sponsor
(08:04):
corporation goes into usually a developing country and purposefully keeps
the people broke while taking things like their lithium or their,
cobalt or their sugar or their you, know their cocoa beam.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Production. Yeah and the more recent modern version of that
is exactly what you said up top. There the minerals
the things that are needed to produce, technologies.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Right the rare earth, elements, right the rare earth. Metals
so we've also looked at global health crises such as
the idea of a. Superbug. Right, yeah shout out to
you livestock, industry thanks for making antibiotics.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Useless and also shout out To seattle right, now who
recently had to close down schools because of THE covid.
Nineteen to get in front of. It and here where
we are In, Atlanta Fulton county is experience seeing the
beginnings of an.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Outbreak, yeah, YEAH i mean the outbreak is already, happening.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Yes but we're we're actually seeing, it, Right we're actually
seeing the numbers beginning to rise as they do in
a in a localized, area, right.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
Exactly it's starting to hit home and we're seeing actions being.
Taken we've also looked at unethical corporate or state behavior
tail as old as. Time i've looked at over. Population
is it? Alarmism are we being too are we being
to sedate in our response to the?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Threats we're certainly using too much.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Stuff we are certainly using too much.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Stuff that's.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Right, today we are combining all of these previous investigations
to answer a single damning, question and so a question
that people have racked their brains over for, millennium and
is this is there enough for? Everyone in other, words
and this planet support the current human? Population and we
(10:03):
don't mean just like keep them alive matrix, style but
we mean give them lives they consider worth. Living and
this is this is an enormous and profound. QUESTION i,
mean after, all for billions of, people this world is a,
brutal dangerous. Place life is, hard it is, painful it
is often. Terrifying and there's only one cold comfort for
(10:28):
a lot of people, suffering and that's that the folks
on the receiving end of the majority of life's terrors
often tend not to live.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
Long, wow that's not. Bleak that's not bleak at, all
but it is super. Bleak it is super. Bleak so
is there enough for? Everyone here are the, Facts? Matt
what do we mean when we say?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Everyone right? Now, well right, now as Of, Friday march,
sixth twenty, twenty at eleven twenty one a. M eastern,
time there are seven, billion seven hundred and sixty nine,
million sixty four, thousand seven hundred and forty four. People
(11:09):
it just, changes keeps, Changing.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
It keeps, changing and the clock keeps running. Up that's
so many people we Cannot science.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Proves that.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
It's very difficult for our brains to grock the concept
of one.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Billion, YEAH i can't grock one. Billion, No, NO i.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
CAN'T i have a tough time with that. Too and
this is this is a new, development right the number
of you're laughing BECAUSE i said.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Grock, yeah, yeah that's a, word right. Use i've never used,
it BUT i enjoy it very.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
MUCH i might be in the wrong timeline, again but
this is a relatively new. Development the number of quote
unquote modern human beings On earth has been pretty small
until very very very very.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Recently, yeah just ten thousand years. Ago think about. That
ten thousand years, ago there might have been no more
than a few million people wandering around on the, planet
and those populations are going to be pretty far. Spread
and the one billion mark wasn't passed until the eighteen,
hundreds very early in the eighteen. Hundreds the two billion
mark wasn't passed until the nineteen. Twenties so we have
(12:19):
just just exponentially exploded here and all of us walking
around just because of where we, live because of the
cultures in which we. Live we want a whole bunch of,
stuff just stuff that we. Use a lot of. Times
we throw it. Away sometimes we keep it around for
a couple of years until it breaks and throw it.
Away maybe we can recycle, it maybe we can reuse
(12:41):
it in a, way but generally it ends up in the.
Trash here's the. Thing we all have different ideas of
what that stuff should be, like we, said because of that.
Culture but we only need a few basic. Things we
only need a few basic, things right.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Right it's a conversation that a lot of parents in
the have had with their. CHILDREN a lot of us
have had this conversation with our own, parents wherein the
adult explains the difference between what you need and what you.
Want it's never a super fun conversation for the, kid
and it's probably not a super fun conversation for the.
(13:17):
Adult but it's, True, matt we only need a few basic.
Things let's look at. That here's a, question how much
food does one person, need not, want but. Need turns,
out people don't actually need a ton of calories to
survive every. Day according to THE Us department Of, health
(13:37):
adult males generally require somewhere between two thousand to three
thousand calories per, day so every twenty four hours to
maintain their, weight and adult females need around sixteen hundred
to twenty four. Hundred of, course those numbers are super,
loose and the concept of, gender you, know is somewhat.
(14:00):
Problematic but what we're saying is that's that's the, ballpark
somewhere between sixteen hundred to three, thousand not to gain
muscle mass and hulk, out and not to shed a
bunch of weight and get felt enough to wear you,
know your old bell bottoms or.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Something, Yeah and it's All the calorie is a measurement of, energy, right,
Right so it all depends on the output that you're
having as. Well how much energy you're. Using, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
Exactly if, you for, instance have a relatively sedentary, existence
you're going to be on the lower end of the caloric.
Scale and if you have a very physically active, existence
then you're going to need more fuel for the. Fire of,
course you, know our species is nothing if not. Durable
people can and do survive, long often harrowing periods deprived
(14:55):
of proper, nutrition and you, know you can bounce back from,
that but after a certain point you will also experience
lifelong medical consequences of. That, furthermore epigenetics proves that the
medical consequences of long periods of privation will carry on
after you. Die they'll carry on in your genetic code
(15:18):
and the way it expresses in your.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Offspring and there is also the concept here that occurs
in this country and many other places across the, world
where you are hitting or exceeding those calories that you,
need but the nutrition of those calories is not what you. Need,
Right you're not actually getting the things within the food
you're consuming to make a healthy. Body, yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Exactly now we've got that. Number so they're almost seven
point eight billion. People they need somewhere between sixteen hundred
and three thousand calories every twenty four hours just for
things to be status. Quo how much does the world?
Eat this is, interesting this is a related.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Question it's. Crazy.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yeah, globally every sixty, seconds we eat eleven point five
million pounds of. Food as that's, everybody that's our collective
tab at the buffet of the world.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
One, minute eleven point five.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Million so to put that in terms we, UNDERSTAND i
think you AND i were talking about this on a previous.
Episode how people in THE us will, do will make
up any kind of measurement to avoid using the metric. System, yes,
okay so it'll put that in terms we can. Understand
that's about twenty million big max every every sixty.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Seconds.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Wow so if you love Big, max that's that's the
metric for. You if you hate, them, well that'll just
make the rest of the bad news we're going to
get to even more.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Harrowing so here's the.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Catch while we actually eat that eleven point five million
pounds of food in one, minute we also waste two
four hundred and seventy two.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Tons, Dude i'm looking at the world's food clock right
now that has all of. This how much is, produced
consumed and wasted and it's a the food clock counts
up every second of those three. Metrics, yeah, It i'm,
LIKE i hate. It i'm. Terrified i'm Just i'm staring
at it while you're telling me these, Facts, ben and
(17:24):
my brain is exploding a little. Bit it's.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Crazy oh and just to get us into more of
an apples to apples, comparison they're eleven point five million.
Pounds that's like five one hundred and thirty three, tons
and that doesn't count the two, thousand four hundred and
seventy two tons that are just straight in the garbage.
Can so, logically then if we were more, efficient this
(17:51):
means that we could feed. Everyone we we could feed
everyone every.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Day we just. Don't there's no and there's other have
to get into there when they're talking about, Later, yes
about why why we currently can't or. Won't, yes but uh,
yeah livelet's continue why it's.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Not happening even though it's. Possible, Yeah so LET'S i
want to bracket to the side the problem with, water
with potable or drinkable, water it's a different. Case, unfortunately
it's one we're going to have to tackle in an
episode all its own because spoiler. Alert while the news
about food does have a happy, ending the news about
(18:32):
water doesn't yet. Doesn't, really more than two billion people
of the seven point eight billion people here On earth
lack clean drinking water at, home available on. Demand meaning
of the seven point eight, billion more than two billion
don't have a faucet they can go to in their
(18:52):
house that just turns on and gives them water that
won't kill. THEM a major un room from back in
twenty eighteen In june shows that the world is way off.
Track The United nations had a goal which was to
bring safe water and sanitation to everyone on the planet
by twenty. Thirty we're not going to make that. Happen
(19:15):
it's the pigeon of potable water has flown the coop
by twenty. Fifty in, fact half of the world's population
just might not have safe.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Water and here's the, well, currently here's the. Deal they're
only really two ways to change these, numbers and that
is to reduce the number of people that need to
have clean drinking, water or is to somehow revolutionize the purification,
technology or get some of this is the third, option
(19:49):
get some kind of, angel, billionaire trillionaire investor or group
of investors to just put the money in to make
it happen.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
Right right to get at some of that billionaire blessing
for purification, technology or if we want to get really space,
age we could look into somehow getting non terrestrial sources of,
water right to farm a comet or.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Something, YEAH i know. TOTALLY i just trying to imagine
the cost difference between farming the water from a, COMET i,
know just cleaning some, water making a plant in places
where there there aren't those.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Plants, yeah it's it's the equivalent of let's go out
and buy water and someone, say, no we have water at,
home just clean.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
It.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
Right so we, ALSO i like the you brought up
money because we want to we need to just touch on.
That the average. Income so we have all the we
have these billions of, people what what.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Does the average person take?
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Home this is a tricky question and there's no way
to really contextualize it and do just this to the
reality on the, ground because we have to remember there
are vast amounts of income. Inequality but if we total
up all of the available, information then we find the
(21:12):
average global household income is something like nine, thousand seven
hundred seventy three dollars per, year so a little under
ten grand per household per.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
YEAR a lot of.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
People listening in The west already make more than that
on their, own and a lot of people do. Not and,
then of course we have to remember that number factors
in people Like Jeff bezos Of, amazon so that guy
is busting the curve for.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Everyone and then a lot of almost or very close to, zero.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Right, RIGHT a ton of, that, Yes and those results
come from Some gallop research between two thousand and six
and twenty twelve and one hundred and thirty one. Populations
here's how here's how screwed up that metric. Is income
in the top ten wealthiest populations in the world are
more than fifty times that of those in the ten poorous,
(22:09):
populations and all of the ten poorest populations are currently
located In Sub Saharan. Africa so we hit, money we hit,
water we hit, food and now we have to confront the, big,
big the big elephantine grim reaper in the, room which is.
Mortality and we'll do that after a word from our.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Sponsor all, right so we have all of these, people
we have all of these. Needs by the, way we
also need love and that's really all you need be The. Beatles,
yeah but let's look at how we are exiting this this,
(22:58):
planet exiting this experience that we call. Life in twenty,
seventeen as of officially three years, ago fifty six million
people died that, year and the top three causes were cardiovascular.
Disease there were seventeen point six five million deaths due
(23:19):
to cardiovascular. Disease that represents thirty two point twenty six
percent of all the. Deaths and then cancers came in.
Second there were eight point nine three million deaths that
were caused by cancer or at least in some way
associated with, cancer and the sheriff deaths there is sixteen
point three two. Percent and then next up is respiratory
(23:41):
disease coming in at three point five four million, deaths
and that is six point four to eight percent of
all of the. Deaths so health issues, here major health
issues with our bodies and how they.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Function, yeah and we have to note those top three
causes of death Or bbrella. Terms cardiovascular disease encompasses several different.
Conditions not all cancers are created, equally of, course and
so on and so, On and equitable access to medical
care would vastly reduce these, numbers as would preventative measures
(24:17):
like tighter pollution controls and and and the. Like when
we look at shelter and, clothing we know that you,
know one man's one man's shack is another man's, castle
or however you, wanna you want to trot out that old.
Cliche there's clearly, Enough, uh there's clearly enough around given
(24:41):
that given that shelter can be built out of so many. Things,
yes there's clearly enough enough there to create housing for.
PEOPLE i, mean in a lot of developed countries even
there's still a huge homeless, problem and there are a
lot of empty, buildings but the homeless population is not
(25:02):
allowed to take shelter in there because of course concerns for.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Crime. Right, YEAH i was going to, say when you're
speaking about, shelter it can be defined really is anything
that's going to protect a person from the elements as
well as impending danger from some kind of outside. Force, Right.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
And we've had a high look at the, numbers, then,
right we've covered some of the. Basics these numbers are not,
perfect but we see some. Commonalities we see that outside of,
water outside of clean drinking, water which is a huge.
Necessity the trend seems to indicate that there is potential
(25:45):
for people not to go. Hungry there's potential for people
not to be, homeless, right maybe even collectively have a
better quality of. Life so with, that let's get to
the question is there enough for every? One here's where
it gets. Crazy the answer is actually. Yes and this
(26:10):
should not necessarily make anybody. Happy this should be troubling
that the answer is. Yes it should be very troubling because,
yeah because that answer is, yes then our next media question, is,
well what gives why isn't this. Happening let's look at.
Food so you've heard stuff about food, scarcity shout out
(26:30):
to people Like Norman borlog and The Green. Revolution the
fact of the matter is that right now the world
already produces enough to. Eat we actually produce a. Surplus
this world creates more than one point five times enough
food to feed literally. Everyone that's enough to feed ten billion,
(26:51):
people and ten billion people just for a bookmark is
where experts expect the population to peak around twenty, fifty
so that not that far. Away if you're listening to this,
podcast the odds are in your favor of being alive
when there are ten billion people around or when they're
(27:11):
ten who, knows we'll roll the.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
Dice we're never gonna make it that.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Far so there's a problem, though because that food will
only say just food in. General it's an umbrella. Term
and as we as we had discussed, earlier that term
encompasses a lot of, grain the staple of the global,
diet and the bulk of the grain produced by. Agribusiness
(27:38):
the bulk of industrially produced grain goes to feeding livestock
and can find feed, lots and goes to, biofuels rather
than going to the one billion starving or food insecure
people on the. Planet so, again it's not that we
(27:59):
can't feed every, one it's more that we can't feed
everyone the kind of food everyone wants and.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
Well and we also destroy a lot of those grains
that are created in order to control the price of said,
grains which, means like it if you could just decide
instead of destroying it or throwing it away or you,
know getting rid of it in that, way and you
(28:28):
just used it to feed people for no. Cost, well
when it's oh, god and again it's later WHEN i
say no, COST i just mean you're not actually selling
it or. Anything you're literally donating. It but in order
then to get that grains to the, places to the
needy people that would would want, it then it costs
a lot of, money.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
Right, Right and shout out to a previous recent episode
on farm. Subsidies it is true that a lot of
governments pay farmers to not grow, food even when you
know there are tons of. Concerns listen to that episode
for more. Information but think about it this. Way let's
take it to an individual. Level if you knew with
(29:12):
certitude that none of those one billion people would ever
need to starve, again but it meant that you and
everyone else you knew would have to change your. Diet
you could realistically maybe eat meat once a month or
once a year or never. Again would you be able
(29:33):
to make that trade? Off the problem there is that
if we're being, realistic we would we would not have
a way to know everyone else was playing by the.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Rules can you meagine the black meat? Market?
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Oh, man, Yeah i've seen there are things about that
and sci. Fi you, know when like when lab grown
protein or lab grown meat becomes the, normal then how
much will people pay for a real?
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Stake and then the concentric circle around the black meat
market and the red meat market become, troubling.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Right, Right for many of, us this already sounds like
a losing, proposition and it's hard to fault people for.
That it's something called the tragedy of the, commons which
we've mentioned before in this. Show the tragedy of the
commons essentially is. This it's the idea that there is
something a public resource that everybody. Uses like if we
(30:32):
didn't have, agribusiness and you just foraged from everybody in
the village foraged from the same field or, whatever and
stuff just grew, naturally but you had to take steps
to make sure that that food grew next.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Year but why would. You it's not.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Yours it's just a place you go to and grab, food,
right and then everybody grabs food and then it's, gone
and then you just you go through this, increasing increasing
crescendo of passing the, blame you know WHAT i, Mean,
LIKE i just ate WHAT i. Wanted it's the problem
is never, me it's all all these other. Schmucks so
(31:10):
it's understandable that this would look like an unnecessary cost
for us to put on. Ourselves why SHOULD i have
to punish myself to help a billion people THAT i
will never, meet, Right and why SHOULD i have to
punish myself or hold myself to standards THAT i cannot
prove other people are.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Meeting you.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Know so if we look at this, is by the,
way this is not taking in. Medicine we're just we're
putting that to side because the medical care stuff like
water is almost its own.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Episode, yeah and again bringing in, costs the time it
takes to train people and medications that would be affordable
to save.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Lives all, Right so next, question, then so we can
do this technically, potentially we're. Not so why? Not why
are we not giving every other human being what they
need to? Survive, essentially it's because doing, so even if
everybody wanted, to doing so would necessitate a massive transfer
(32:20):
of resources and wealth something on something that like on
the level that it, is never occurred in human. History
it boggles the. Mind and part of it is because
of we're talking about inequality up there with. Mortality that's
the other elephant in the. Room and when we talk about,
inequality we often tend to think in these, extremes you,
(32:44):
know because extremes are easy cognitive shortcuts we think of the,
billionaires for, example on one end of a scale and
the hopelessly deprived on the other end of the. Curve but,
honestly we have to give ourselves. Pontfective if you own
a device that allows you to listen to a, podcast for,
(33:05):
example then you are globally, speaking much more likely to
be one of those haves rather than one of those have.
NOTS a lot of people considered poor in a developed,
country for, instance may still have a better quality of
life overall than a relatively well off person in a
least developed.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Country you know WHAT i. Mean, Yeah, well then the question,
becomes what do we do about that again without having you,
know even if everybody's on board except for the trillionaires to the, billionaires,
like how do you get those, people those corporations to
decide that it's a better thing for everyone if we
(33:48):
raise all? Ships?
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Right that leads us to another. Question you, know what's the?
Solution can technology save? Us something we'll tackle after a
word from our sponsor.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And we're.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Back all, right here's one for the budding technocrats in the,
audience the people who are very forward to the.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Future right? There another, question after an ad, break can
technology save.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Us, yeah, yeah the answer is. Yes, maybe let's say
the answer is, yes but probably.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Not oh, Dear. Yeah, see for most.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Of human, history we just didn't have the organization necessary
to handle the logistics. Involved you might have people in
one part of the world who had a surplus of
grain because the weather was, favorable and people in a different,
region you, know maybe they were combating droughts or floods
and as a, result their harvest didn't come through and they.
(34:53):
Starved and let's say that the people with the surplus
of grain heard about this distant land that needed. Help
even if the people with that surplus wanted to feed
their fellow, humans even if they tried very, hard for
most of human, history they just wouldn't have the means
to get the food or medicine or resources to those
(35:15):
folks in time to make a. Difference, now for the
first time, ever that has. Changed we can ship almost
anything almost. Anywhere but.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
It costs, money and it costs money because of, fuel
because of the existing technology that can. Travel it costs
money because you have to have the logistics in place
to figure out what is going. Where and that's you,
know a bunch of people employed a lot of times
(35:51):
huge facilities and all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Happened all money is a representation of labor over, time,
right sore would have to to ship. Stuff we essentially
have to give, people uh these placeholders for time that
was spent, earlier, right and we do that in the
form of. Currency so we have to we have to
help these people justify their labor their, time, right and
(36:19):
that that is a, huge huge. Hurdle but if there
was some other, thing not saying that we have an,
answer And i'm not not even saying there should be
some other, thing but if if there was quote unquote no,
cost then we could literally feed every single hungry person
(36:40):
on the. Planet we're, Not, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
So what can we? Do can emerging technology and energy
improvements and a lot of these things that are out
there that are, happening we know are, coming it's just
when will they get? Here will those things move the
needle enough to help everyone's ship rise a little? Bit
because you, know there really is an interesting stuff out there.
Happening and one of the big things would be if
(37:03):
we could because it would change, everything if we could
get more efficient and larger amounts of power of, energy
because that would reduce the costs of things like. Shipping
they would reduce the cost of things like packaging and
all of these other things we would. Need so we
(37:24):
were just looking at a couple of different emerging technologies
and we won't spend too much time on. This twenty.
Nineteen according to a lot of the news that has
been coming out about energy, improvements twenty nineteen was a
year that wasn't too exciting about brand new. Developments but
(37:44):
there are some really cool stuff in there happening that's
more of a minor improvement that you can kind of
see the tail of, right you can see where it's.
Headed we found something called floating, solar which is really
interesting to me AND i hope you find it to
be fascinating. Too the idea is taking a solar array
that you've probably seen pictures of somewhere online that generally
(38:07):
it's in a desert or somewhere or a more arid
climate where you've just got solar panels in a huge,
circle or a different arrangement that's just out there aiming
at the sun at all, times trying to generate. Electricity,
well floating solar uses a body of water that isn't
usually used for a specific human. Purpose so imagine a
(38:29):
hydroelectric dam's, reservoir so like the water that's above a
hydroelectric dam that then that water flows down through the
dam system and generates electricity through. Turbines this floating solar
array would sit on top of that reservoir and it
would look kind of like the other solar rays you've seen.
Before it's just they're floating on the surface of the
water that isn't going to be used, anyway the surface.
(38:51):
Isn't then you can generate a bunch of power. There
and the cool thing about this is that because in this,
case at, least if it's really close in proximity to
a power generation plant already with that hydroelectric, dam it's
really easy to transfer the power generated on that floating
array to the grid, itself, which as we're going to
(39:14):
keep talking about, here that becomes one of the major
problems with new energy technologies out there that might give
us a bit of a step up when it comes
to helping. Everyone so another, one another technology that you
can think about is offshore wind. Farms so wind farms
(39:35):
that are relatively far out into the ocean or, offshore
and the wind out there can generate energy really. Effectively
the problem is if you're far enough, away it becomes
extremely difficult to get that power generated because it's so
far away from the grid to the. Grid so there
(39:56):
are new technologies coming out about the types of cables
and how those cables function to actually bring more power
to the global. Grid that seems like a cool. Thing
there's new nuclear technologies that are, emerging like we talked
about With Chris. Cogswell there's stuff in there about molten
salt reactors which seem to be a little bit safer
(40:18):
than the fission reactors that we you, know that are
so common right now on the. Planet but there's also
that concept of fusion that we talked at length With
chris about that really does seem to be. Happening, yeah that. Weird,
YEAH i was so skeptical when we were initially talking about,
It but since, then like smaller fusion reactors are a
(40:43):
real thing that seemed to be. Happening so that could
really change the game as far as being able to
get either to produce the food that is needed and
to clean the water efficiently and put power play plants
in places that we normally wouldn't even consider doing it
if you're a large. Corporation.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
Yeah and now all of the problem is all those
technologies that we've named have some.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
Major.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Drawbacks major drawbacks they, have you, know including stuff like
the overhead or the initial, costs safety or environmental, concerns
and then problems of.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
Scale, yeah oh, YEAH i mean none of. That none
of these things we're talking about are going to change
the game really in the way we're imagining. Here but
except for. Fusion fusion could they? COULD i think fusion.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Could, yeah, YEAH i would love for it to. BE
i would love for that to be the case for
any of those things we just named solar or hydro
electric or fusion to make it off of the drawing
boarder off of the to move from the column of
potential solutions to practical or implemented. Solutions we're not there.
(42:00):
Yet we're not there.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Yet and then how on earth do you bring the
cost down to something like fusion enough to make it extremely.
Helpful there's there's.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Another whenever we talk about technology and its possible role
in improving the lives of the of the people who
are members of this, species one big thing must be,
addressed and that is the concept of what is often
CALLED ai or artificial intelligence or you, know increasingly academics
prefer the term machine consciousness because they, say you, know
(42:31):
a consciousness is a. Consciousness how is a machines consciousness
any different theoretically from a meatheads? Consciousness you, know what
makes one artificial and? Whatnot, right it's the. Meat it's
the meat that's going to be that's going to be
our advertisement for premium organic brains in the in the
(42:52):
black meat.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
Market it's the.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
MEAT i wish you guys could see the expression mad
it WAS i nominate you as.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Spokesman OH i, accepted.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Right Uh so before we talk ABOUT, ai let me
pitch you a little bit on why why people are
excited about having a non human consciousness or collective handle
these logistical, problems these distribution, problems.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Which is really that's what a lot of this. Is.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Well, first no matter what our our lovely little primate
brains can make technology, wise outside OF, ai we may
not have the tools mentally to take advantage of. This our,
brains you, see are one of the most important pieces
(43:48):
of early human. Technology how we got where we. Are our,
brains make no, mistake are the are the reason for
all the good stuff the human species has, done they're
also the reason for all the bad stuff we've. Done
it's kind of Like promethean, fire.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Right so.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
The problem is that our, brains like any other computer have.
Have you, know they've got, code and they've got limits
to their. Capabilities our brains naturally bulk at the idea
of deliberately lowering our individual standards to help some abstract
collective thousands of other bring billions of other bring computers
(44:34):
that we will never, ever ever ever. Meet, sorry the
odds against you meeting all the people on the planet
right now are astronomical because so many are dying every
minute and so many more are being. Born you just
don't have time for it in your. Schedule and even
(44:55):
if you're lowering your individual standard of living to something that's,
survivable something is not that. Bad something it's not, terrible
but just isn't as awesome as you would, want you'll
you'll never really see the impact of that on the,
planet you, know not in your. Lifetime and our brains
(45:18):
already knew this way before we, did which brings us
to one of the chilling theories that that. IS i
don't know about, You, matt but it's sort of changed
the WAY i look at the. World it's something Called dunbar's.
Number oh, yes, yeah which we've mentioned. Before it's named
after A british anthropologist Named Robin. Dunbar long story. Short
(45:43):
dunbar is convinced through his research that there is a,
ratio a correlation between brain size in primates and the
amount of people given primate can consider other people or
other their, primates, living, thinking feeling beings with their own,
(46:03):
motivations their own. Goals that number for human, beings according To,
dunbar is one hundred and fifty people. Ballpark that means
then that once you get to like one hundred and
fifty two, people two of those aren't. People they're just
sort of. Functions they, happen you know WHAT i. Mean they're, bots,
(46:29):
yeah right, there they're, verbs their, mechanisms their processes that
you see, it you see moving around, you but you
don't think of them as.
Speaker 2 (46:39):
People i'm imagining it as a social media. Thing let's just,
say let's Use. Facebook you've got one hundred and Fifty facebook,
friends and you know all of, them, right you really
truly know all those, People and then that that number
starts to grow and grow and grow and grow and,
grow and now it's just kind of a picture of
(47:00):
a representation of a human in each of those.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
Profiles, yeah and you do that obnoxious thing people do
on social media where you don't really care at someone's,
birthday but you get a, notification so you pop A
hbd over, there Because god knows you don't have time
to write all to both of those words out.
Speaker 2 (47:18):
Right that's. Right so.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
The problem then is If dunbar's theory is, correct the
problem is less one of material goods or resource, availability
and it is more one of our inherent neurological, wiring
our hardwired inability to think that humanity as we understand it,
(47:46):
exists really exists past a certain threshold of about one
hundred and fifty.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
People but in your experiment, Here, ben we're talking about
allowing some extremely sophisticated computer system to side who's gonna
get fed when and with?
Speaker 1 (48:02):
What wait, WAIT i want TO i just want to
hit this. Though, okay from WHAT i was, saying If
dunbar's theory is, true then that means all other things, Aside,
yeah including the most popular ideology of this age or
the most popular, religion which would be, economy, money, currency
things like. That that means that we are the biggest
(48:27):
obstacle to our own. Success the. Problem the problem isn't
how much food is being. Grown the problem is, us
you know WHAT i? Mean and GUES i see where you're,
going where it gets a perfect. Setup do we then
eschew our individual and species wide. Responsibility do we build
(48:49):
a better brain and just trust it some kind of sky,
net some kind of technological god made of ones and
zeros that will tell us where the cantelope is supposed
to go every. Harvest for many, people that is a
troubling thing because then we're. Coast we're consigning our entire
(49:12):
species existence to be the the children of something else
that we've, created you know WHAT i. Mean and then
we have to also say we would blindly trust this,
thing and we would no matter no matter how what
kind of system we put in place to watch the
(49:34):
watchmen as it, were we would have we would have
very little. Recourse you, know once once you hop on that,
wagon once you hop on that, train there's not really
an easy way to get off because of the power
you would have to give that sort of. Mind, yeah
Well i'm on. Board you're on.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
Board, yeah let's call IT. Mana uh. Huh it'll be
THE mana system on The gaya grid and it'll it'll
just send all the food and water resources necessary to
the entire globe that needs, them no matter where they're
produced and at what. Time it'll calculate like when when
(50:14):
foods will spoil and how far they can actually. Travel,
oh it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (50:18):
Incredible mega algorithmic network. ASSIGNMENT i don't.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Know that's pretty.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Good, NO i mean it's good for a nineteen sixties short.
Speaker 2 (50:28):
Story but, yeah there may be an automation in there
or what's another really GOOD a and not an android? Assistant?
Speaker 1 (50:41):
No oh, yeah, yeah, yeah massive artificial neural.
Speaker 2 (50:47):
Algorithm that's pretty. GOOD i was just thinking more of
the symbolism of the manna from the. Gods it just,
falls you, know drops from the. Drones be clear about.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
THAT i am one hundred percent on. BOARD i think
manna is the way to go because we want something
that sounds non, threatening, Right but of, course you, know
you can see how people wouldn't trust that because for many,
people the existence of something like that would not be
a positive addition to their immediate. Lives, sure it would
(51:21):
probably mean that within five or six generations your descendants
would have would live in a world that was environmentally better, off,
Right and it means that, overall within several, generations people
in general would be. Okay but for, you, buddy as
soon as when the manna starts, falling that's gonna mean
(51:44):
that your quality of life takes a definite and observable,
hit and you're just gonna have to, trust, like, oh
there's something bigger than me and bigger than, mana and
it is this this, tremendous tremendously controversial fat called human human.
Speaker 2 (52:02):
Existence and you know what we'd end up doing if
we did actually get that system in, place we would
increase that world population. Clock it would go up well
a lot, Faster oh, yeah because that's would happen at
a much smaller rate if everybody had what they. Needed
and then overpopulation actually truly for real becomes a.
Speaker 1 (52:22):
Problem, yeah and all The malthusians are able to resurrect
their old. Beliefs and then, furthermore of, course you, know
we're ascribing benevolence to something like, this some kind of
creation like.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
This but the big.
Speaker 1 (52:37):
Question is if it's solving the Problem the most logical.
Way then the, easiest most efficient answer to making life
better for the existing population would be to reduce the
size of the existing, population and then the survivors would
(52:58):
not have to take a huge hit on their quality of,
life and the survivors would actually tend to have a
better quality of life depending on the size of the
population you left over if you were A.
Speaker 2 (53:12):
Mana, oh it's just you, know the old artificial intelligence
culling that we've been waiting.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
For m, hmm, yeah, RIGHT i checked the world clock every.
Speaker 2 (53:21):
Day, well that numbers a lot lower than it should. Be.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Yeah, yeah you, KNOW i have these these feverish moments
WHERE i, think one Day i'll check the world clock
And i'll find out that something terrible has happened because
it starts going.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
Down yeah. Wow but of COURSE i.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
Wouldn't really work because it's based on these estimates that
are based on studies that were connected years in the.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
Past have you SEEN i think we've talked about it.
Before you've seen that movie that was available On netflix
a little while ago Called Mother, Yes, YES i have, okay,
yeah OR I Am Mother. No what was it? Called
it was one about THEIR hi, system not the aronofsky, one.
Speaker 1 (54:03):
Right but it's the one about the one about the
machine consciousness that is raising a.
Speaker 2 (54:09):
Daughter, yes who is? Human? Yes oh, man you could
it's mana at.
Speaker 1 (54:15):
Work, there it is man at.
Speaker 2 (54:17):
Work it very much.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Is, well there we. Have it turns out there is
enough food and potential shelter for every single human being
living on this. Planet water is a different. Thing we
still see people dying from, starvation poor, diet, disease lack of,
shelter and more and more and. More why because there
(54:39):
are several. Problems, first the existing systems that we came
up with over thousands and thousands of, years they were
just not built to accommodate a population of this. Size
you know WHAT i, Mean like a it's kind of
like a like a lemonade stand is not meant to
(55:01):
be an industrial lemonade. Factory as a matter of, fact
most kids who start eliminade stand never think this should be.
Something this should be an operation WHERE i can, feed you,
know or give ten times the amount of people the
lemonade THAT i was making for maybe twenty people a.
Day that's just the. Facts now we can make better systems.
(55:22):
Maybe but, second related to this, problem.
Speaker 2 (55:25):
We have just now.
Speaker 1 (55:27):
Begun this is an exciting time to be. Alive we've
just now begun to create global supply systems capable of
addressing the labyrintine logistics needed to feed and house. Everyone
and that's not even counting how to cheap those people
from getting. Sick that's just making sure they have somewhere
to sleep and enough to. Eat and, third forget all
(55:49):
the fancy agricultural, improvements all the hypothetical stuff that we're
talking about. Today our brains themselves are old. Technology our
brains are arguably, obsolete and we still don't fully understand.
Them we literally do not have the physiological capacity to
understand the size of the human, population nor do we
(56:11):
have the ability to think of this population in terms of.
Individuals we have a limit hardwired to our empathy and.
Cognition so after about one hundred and fifty or so,
people you, mean everyone you, know cannot conceive of others as, actual,
feeling thinking human. Beings do you feel pity for a
(56:35):
maple tree growing somewhere In missouri and a specific?
Speaker 2 (56:40):
Coordinate? No why would.
Speaker 1 (56:42):
You you know the idea of a maple, tree but
you don't know that? One, yeah and, like, so how
is a human being by that maple tree any different
from the? Tree you know it's not a human, being do?
Speaker 2 (56:56):
You? YEAH i don't know about this stone bar.
Speaker 1 (56:59):
Guy now you think he's poisoning the well Bit.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
It feels like a very pessimistic view of our brains
and our capacity for. Empathy technically still a, THEORY i,
KNOW i THINK i think inside of us there is
more capacity for. It BUT i understand the.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
Concept, well, well, okay think about this, then in more
concrete terms and more microcosmic. Terms, happiness as we understand
it is kind of. Relative you might ask, yourself how
can a person making twelve dollars an hour be happier
than someone making fifty dollars an, hour for? Example, well first,
off happiness is not entirely based on. Finance we understand.
(57:40):
That but if we look at that, example we find
that if someone is making twelve dollars an, hour they'll
tend to be happier with their income so long as
they know all their colleagues are making, less all the
other people work with, them even if it's just a little.
Less if you make twelve dollars an hour and you
work somewhere where, you, oh for a, fact everybody else
(58:01):
makes eleven dollars and fifty cents an. Hour just that
fifty cents will tend to make you. Happier, however let's
go to our person making fifty bucks an. Hour they'll be,
irritated they'll be, po'ed they'll be unhappy if they make
fifty dollars an hour and they know their colleagues are
making just a little, more you, know it's like fifty
(58:23):
five dollars an, hour they'll be in sense there is
no justice in this bleak and, uncaring godless.
Speaker 2 (58:29):
Universe it feels very, relative BUT i guess it.
Speaker 1 (58:33):
Is that's kind of a point, Here and then they
and they will completely not they will tend to not
really identify with the person making twelve dollars an hour
in the office across. Town so it seems that a,
fine a refined appreciation of inequality then is inherent to
our our. Existence and probably back an hour just out
(58:54):
of the trees running around the savannah, days that was
very beneficial to our. Species so for some, reason we
humans tend to think of success less in terms of
having quote unquote, enough and more in terms of having
more than other, people or LIKE i am successful because
other people have less than, me or if we want
(59:15):
to do it a half full, WAY i am successful
because it could be. WORSE i am better off THAN
i could. Be and shifting away from this, concept make no,
mistake would be a fundamental. Change were we this is
the question bothers, me, man were we to overcome this,
hurdle would we still be human? Beings would we still
be the same species.
Speaker 2 (59:35):
If we were no longer jealous of each other's? Finances?
Speaker 1 (59:39):
Finances, yeah but you, know more or less nation into?
Speaker 2 (59:43):
That? Yeah? Interesting, YEAH i think so.
Speaker 1 (59:49):
If we were capable, of if we were capable of
describing success and happiness in just terms of how AM i?
Doing AM i? Okay DO i have? Enough instead of
how AM i? Doing AM i doing better than other?
PEOPLE i don't?
Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
Know, YEAH i don't. KNOW i think that exists in
a lot of people right, now especially people who don't have.
MUCH i believe. SO i think what we're talking about
here is really. Describing it's more describing the person that's
making fifty dollars an, hour who's already experienced that a
(01:00:33):
little bit of knowing what having a lot is to.
Me that's What i'm, Here BUT i don't know if that's.
Speaker 1 (01:00:40):
True that's interesting because we didn't talk about that. Yet
maybe it's a story for another. Day but studies also
show that people who have want to keep it in
the realm of, finance people who have lower incomes or
lower on the socioeconomic scale tend to contribute to. Charities
they tend to contribute a larger proportion of their income
(01:01:02):
than the quote unquote.
Speaker 2 (01:01:03):
Haves, yeah we did the whole episode on how wealth
makes you a bad, person WHICH i went.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Back and re listened to, it AND i was hoping
things would have.
Speaker 2 (01:01:12):
Changed they. HAVEN'T i think we nailed.
Speaker 1 (01:01:14):
It the conclusion of that one, spoiler which still holds
up and is worth listening, to is that our personal
opinions aside because science doesn't care about. Those multiple studies
prove that people tend to behave quote unquote worse the
(01:01:39):
higher they go up a certain financial.
Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
Scale, yeah and.
Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Again we're not saying that automatically makes you bad any
of that. Stuff we're just saying multiple studies prove tend
people tend to behave in a less cool.
Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Man there we. Go it's a good way to put.
It oh my, gosh. Okay SO i guess the question
now is like how like, Okay it's a personal, question
it's and it's aimed at. You how much would you
give up if you knew that by giving up something
(01:02:19):
of yours others would be better off and would be
safe and would survive and would have more. Happiness how
much would you be willing to give? Up and that's
a tough question to answer BECAUSE i think to you,
know every single person here thinks or knows rather that
(01:02:40):
they have responsibilities in their. Life they have you, know
maybe a, family maybe a friend, group or a community
that they are, supporting that they're doing their best to do,
that and then imagining giving up, more it's probably a
difficult thing to pose to somebody to think, about even
especially if, you especially.
Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
For, instance you have no way of proving that that
effort would be, reciprocated which is the case and just
fundamentally in the. Case and then, furthermore you, know we're
not talking about we're not talking about people giving up
stuff that was just given to. Them people have worked,
hard they have put in, blood, sweat tears and. Time you,
(01:03:21):
know now we're, saying, hey give it up for someone
you don't, know and then just trust, us Says, Mana
it'll all work, out or in the case Of, mana
it would just be a mandated. Thing but, yeah we
want to. Know is some sort of benevolent machine consciousness
our only? Hope can humans get the band back together
(01:03:44):
and put out a more successful album in this in
our long discography of? Existence, boy that was a terrible
pretty GOOD i don't, know man we're working, live but
let us. Know we want to hear from. You as
we said at the top of the, show you can
tell us your opinion on this On, Facebook, Instagram twitter
(01:04:05):
where conspiracy stuff On twitter we love to recommend Our
facebook community. Page here's where it gets. CRAZY i am
going to say again that there is a huge chasm
between what is possible and what is. Plausible so it
is possible to improve the lives of people on the,
(01:04:28):
planet of everyone on the, planet is it? PLAUSIBLE i
don't think. SO i don't think we're there.
Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
YET i think we will be, there but it's going
to take a global catastrophe.
Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
And then that'll get us to that kind of Star
trek yep post scarcity where there is a threat to
the species at large and there kind of is.
Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
One, guys it's called global climate.
Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Change oh but you WHAT i, Mean but you're talking
about something More hollywood. FRIENDLY i am Talking hollywood. Friendly
i'm talking.
Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
A little bit of. Bluebeam but it doesn't necessarily mean.
BLUEBEAN i just mean if there is enough of a
threat to the species at, LARGE i think preserving each
and every individual will become, paramount and then these kinds
of changes will.
Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
Occur, right because they'll have, to and the size of
the problem will be smaller. Too.
Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
Yeah so let it there's a global. PANDEMIC i, oh
maybe pandemic occurring right.
Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Now, yeah but again to our earlier, CONVERSATION i feel
like THE i feel like it's a battle of semantics with,
pandemic you know WHAT i. MEAN i know the official
definition is not going to change the way and infection
ravages a.
Speaker 2 (01:05:40):
Body maybe, MAYBE i don't, know how about the, numerous
very troubling outbreaks occurring across the.
Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Planet, yeah maybe that'll maybe that'll be what it. Takes
maybe that'll be the big kickstart we. Need, right it'll be,
zombies the zombies or, yeah, ALIENS i would, say or
a huge natural, disaster non terrestrial.
Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Disaster, Well, matt it.
Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
Happened we once again started talking about the end of the.
Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
World, yes and stuff is.
Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
Bleak, Well, hey here's a question that's probably on everybody's
mind as we reach the end of today's. Show what
how can they tell us their take on whether there's
enough for? Everyone, if LIKE i have an opinion about,
this for, instance BUT i hate using social? Media how
DO i get in contact with you?
Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
Guys, ah you can call. Us our number is one
eight three three STD. Wytk give us a, call tell
us what you think you might end up on an.
Episode but one way or, another we're going to hear
what you were, saying and that is either a good
thing or a bad thing for. You but we're excited
(01:06:54):
to hear your, opinions your, jokes your ideas for. Episodes
whatever you want to tell, us give us a. Call
you can call, in just like this person did last.
Speaker 5 (01:07:03):
Night hi, There this Is jade From, Spokane. WASHINGTON i
was just reflecting on your guys' recent episode about the.
Coronavirus AND i live In, spokane, obviously AND i live
about a quarter mile away from a hospital where they
(01:07:24):
have TAKEN i think, five maybe more patients that have
been infected with the coronavirus and are holding them at
that hospital because it's one of ten in THE. Us
but ever since that was, ANNOUNCED i have seen at
(01:07:46):
least two helicopters a day come in and, out and
it'll be at random times at. Night and, Yeah i'm
not so sure that those are legit.
Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
Helicopters not sure what you mean? There?
Speaker 1 (01:08:09):
Interesting? Interesting, yeah who's?
Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
Controlling like what is the company basically and what is their?
Speaker 1 (01:08:16):
Purpose, yeah it's thank you first off for calling in
with this on the ground. News we need primary. Sources
as we know our coronavirus, episode we went back and.
Forth we felt it was important to make this, episode
and we knew that because we were in the nascent
stages of the development of the, infection we would have
(01:08:39):
to come and do an. Update so we need your
help with, this especially if you have on the ground.
Experience the sad truth of the matter, here and the
dangerous truth of the, matter is that given the way
THE us is currently HANDLED covid, nineteen there are easily
(01:09:00):
thousands of undiagnosed cases, around you, know AND i WOULD
i would not be surprised at all if the official
messaging we're getting does not match the actual activities that
governments or states are taking to stave off the.
Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Infection, YES i, KNOW i. DO i agree with. That
it is one of those things that is still making me.
Nervous my newsfeed is just filled with updates about new
clusters of infections and it's given me. Nightmares but thank
you for calling in with information from a specific. Area
(01:09:43):
feel free to call back again with any kind of
update You in, PARTICULAR i Believe jade is what you,
said and anyone else please call, in leave a, message
and if you don't want to do, that please send
us a good old fashioned.
Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
Email we are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot.
Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
Com stuff they don't want you to know is a
(01:10:21):
production Of. iHeartRadio for more podcasts From, iHeartRadio visit The iHeartRadio,
App Apple, podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite.
Shows
Fellow conspiracy realist, welcome back. We have a classic episode
for you from twenty twenty in the Trenches of COVID.
We put our heads together and we asked ourselves, is
there actually enough for everyone?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
I love this.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
It's a very philosophical question, it's hard, but also a
very practical question, and we talk about all of those
angles in this classic episode.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
I remember thinking about one specific guy. Do you remember
who it was? We talked about him on Infamous Inventors,
A long time ago, man named Norman Borlog.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
Yeah, save the world wheat, that's right.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Well, and it made us all think about this thing
where humanity has been attempting to create more and more
and more food. Right, so everybody has that because that's
a necessity. To figure out ways to filter water and
purify water because we need that too. But what do
we mean when we say is there enough for everyone?
Is it just those two things? Or is it more? Oh,
(01:07):
it's more right?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Yeah, you know, as we recorded than in twenty twenty
and even now in twenty twenty five, it's no secret
that hundreds and hundreds of millions of people are struggling
under daily physical threats like starvation, danger, disease, lack of
sanitation and shelter, but also what about the philosophical points, right,
(01:31):
what about that which feeds the soul? Is there enough
for everyone? We're really proud of this one and we
can't wait to hear your thoughts.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Thanks Roleo.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies, history is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
A production of Iheartrading.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
Our friend Noel is on adventures, but we'll be returning
in the future.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
They call me Ben.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
We are joined as always with our super producer Paul,
Mission Control decand most importantly, you are you. You are
here and that makes this stuff they don't want you
to know.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
Matt.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
This is a This is a wide ranging episode for
us today, isn't.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
It It is? But it brings in topics that we've
been covering over the past seven years, at least seven
or not I think almost seven and this year we
will become seven. But yeah, we've hit on a lot
of the topics that we're going to kind of pull
in here. So hopefully you've listened to many of the episodes. Uh,
(02:51):
if not, maybe go back, you know, check out, check
out some of the ones that you can kind of
infer that we're going to be talking about with this
topic as you've read in the title, and then come
back to this episode, because we are going to be
pulling in a lot of stuff and we're not gonna
have time to hit everything in complete detail.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And this, this wide ranging episode is also by its
nature collaborative, as we of course hope all of our
episodes are, because we need your help, we want your involvement.
As we often say you specifically, you are the most
important part of this show. Those are not empty words.
(03:29):
As a matter of fact, to prove that these are
not empty words, to put our money where our mouths
are or where your ears are as you listen to this,
you know, Matt, I checked on our Twitter at conspiracy
stuff on Twitter. I checked on our Twitter feed, and
I had no idea that we we have more people
(03:52):
befriending us on Twitter than I thought. Yeah, not a
big number. It's a big number in absolute terms, but
it was bigger than I thought it was.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
It's a for for us, it's a big number. Give
me say what it is exactly where we are. According
to the mobile version, we have twenty nine two hundred
to something followers. Holy smokes, Well, we don't consider you followers,
by the way. Yeah, that's right, that's an awful word.
You are a fellow conspiracy realist. You are a fellow listeners.
(04:24):
So we thought we would give some of you a
quick shout out at the top of the show. And
we hope that the people shout out are listening, but
we want to share what they said with you, especially
for those of us who are not on Twitter. So
unless everybody hates this, we're gonna make this.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
A regular thing. Here we go, We'll we'll just read
a few shout out to shootdah one Stuart Hopfer over
there on Twitter, who's responding to our recent coronavirus episode.
We do have an update coming. And Stuart, you said,
I listened to this episode and and there's something you
should have mentioned. Aside from wearing a mask to not
(05:03):
get sick or catching something, they have also been worn
for those who have not done their makeup, which really
which I thought was interesting. Yeah, so maybe you're in
a hurry and you feel like you should have as
they say, put on your face, but you didn't have time,
so you say, I'll just I'll slap on the mask.
I'm just running to the store. Yeah it's interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Huh, it really is. I never would have thought about that.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
And so here's here's another one.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
Patrick Lee six six six' nine was responding to our
earlier tangent about RIDICULOUS dc. Villains, yes and he hipped
us to this Fantastic batman, villain ten eyed. Man patrick just,
said look him.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Up ten eyed. Man, yeah he's.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Got his thing is that his only superpower is that
he he wears a headband over where the rest of
us normals would have, eyes and his, eyes the ten
eight man's eyes are on the tips of his. Fingertips
what what they're on His, yeah not tips of his
(06:14):
fingertips is, redundant but they're on his.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Fingertips, oh so we're talking About Philip. Reardon, Okay i've
seen the costume that has eyes going down his.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Chest, yeah those are decorative. Though his real power in
the finger.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Tips oh, man this is really. Cool he's in the bat.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Verse, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah he's up there with The
JOKER i assume as the most powerful Of Batman's villains
and last one for. Today Last twitter shout out for
today is r In jen three to eleven, says have
you all heard of and watched the Documentary Active measures On?
(06:58):
Hulu my timfoil hat is on and conspiracies are are.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Afoot check it out if you get a.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Chance, folks let us know if you've Seen Active. MEASURES
i have. Not let us know if it's if it's
worth a while for your fellow, listeners and thanks to you,
Guys thanks to everyone who has befriended us On twitter
and joined the ranks of the conspiracy. Realist, again we
are at conspiracy. Stuff if you ever want to just
shoot off a quick tweet to us while you're while
(07:25):
you're hearing. Something this episode may may get a little
personal for. PEOPLE i know it's it's full, confession a
little bit personal for, Me. Matt as you pointed out,
earlier today's episode is a.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Geshtault you, know it's.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Cumulative it's going to trend a bit towards the philosophical
but we've based it on pretty hard in that time sobering.
Science as you, said in the, past we've explored specific
concrete examples of things like resource. Extraction that's where that's
where a eight actor or a corporation or state sponsor
(08:04):
corporation goes into usually a developing country and purposefully keeps
the people broke while taking things like their lithium or their,
cobalt or their sugar or their you, know their cocoa beam.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Production. Yeah and the more recent modern version of that
is exactly what you said up top. There the minerals
the things that are needed to produce, technologies.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Right the rare earth, elements, right the rare earth. Metals
so we've also looked at global health crises such as
the idea of a. Superbug. Right, yeah shout out to
you livestock, industry thanks for making antibiotics.
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Useless and also shout out To seattle right, now who
recently had to close down schools because of THE covid.
Nineteen to get in front of. It and here where
we are In, Atlanta Fulton county is experience seeing the
beginnings of an.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Outbreak, yeah, YEAH i mean the outbreak is already, happening.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Yes but we're we're actually seeing, it, Right we're actually
seeing the numbers beginning to rise as they do in
a in a localized, area, right.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
Exactly it's starting to hit home and we're seeing actions being.
Taken we've also looked at unethical corporate or state behavior
tail as old as. Time i've looked at over. Population
is it? Alarmism are we being too are we being
to sedate in our response to the?
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Threats we're certainly using too much.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Stuff we are certainly using too much.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Stuff that's.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Right, today we are combining all of these previous investigations
to answer a single damning, question and so a question
that people have racked their brains over for, millennium and
is this is there enough for? Everyone in other, words
and this planet support the current human? Population and we
(10:03):
don't mean just like keep them alive matrix, style but
we mean give them lives they consider worth. Living and
this is this is an enormous and profound. QUESTION i,
mean after, all for billions of, people this world is a,
brutal dangerous. Place life is, hard it is, painful it
is often. Terrifying and there's only one cold comfort for
(10:28):
a lot of people, suffering and that's that the folks
on the receiving end of the majority of life's terrors
often tend not to live.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
Long, wow that's not. Bleak that's not bleak at, all
but it is super. Bleak it is super. Bleak so
is there enough for? Everyone here are the, Facts? Matt
what do we mean when we say?
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Everyone right? Now, well right, now as Of, Friday march,
sixth twenty, twenty at eleven twenty one a. M eastern,
time there are seven, billion seven hundred and sixty nine,
million sixty four, thousand seven hundred and forty four. People
(11:09):
it just, changes keeps, Changing.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
It keeps, changing and the clock keeps running. Up that's
so many people we Cannot science.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Proves that.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
It's very difficult for our brains to grock the concept
of one.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
Billion, YEAH i can't grock one. Billion, No, NO i.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
CAN'T i have a tough time with that. Too and
this is this is a new, development right the number
of you're laughing BECAUSE i said.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Grock, yeah, yeah that's a, word right. Use i've never used,
it BUT i enjoy it very.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
MUCH i might be in the wrong timeline, again but
this is a relatively new. Development the number of quote
unquote modern human beings On earth has been pretty small
until very very very very.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
Recently, yeah just ten thousand years. Ago think about. That
ten thousand years, ago there might have been no more
than a few million people wandering around on the, planet
and those populations are going to be pretty far. Spread
and the one billion mark wasn't passed until the eighteen,
hundreds very early in the eighteen. Hundreds the two billion
mark wasn't passed until the nineteen. Twenties so we have
(12:19):
just just exponentially exploded here and all of us walking
around just because of where we, live because of the
cultures in which we. Live we want a whole bunch of,
stuff just stuff that we. Use a lot of. Times
we throw it. Away sometimes we keep it around for
a couple of years until it breaks and throw it.
Away maybe we can recycle, it maybe we can reuse
(12:41):
it in a, way but generally it ends up in the.
Trash here's the. Thing we all have different ideas of
what that stuff should be, like we, said because of that.
Culture but we only need a few basic. Things we
only need a few basic, things right.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Right it's a conversation that a lot of parents in
the have had with their. CHILDREN a lot of us
have had this conversation with our own, parents wherein the
adult explains the difference between what you need and what you.
Want it's never a super fun conversation for the, kid
and it's probably not a super fun conversation for the.
(13:17):
Adult but it's, True, matt we only need a few basic.
Things let's look at. That here's a, question how much
food does one person, need not, want but. Need turns,
out people don't actually need a ton of calories to
survive every. Day according to THE Us department Of, health
(13:37):
adult males generally require somewhere between two thousand to three
thousand calories per, day so every twenty four hours to
maintain their, weight and adult females need around sixteen hundred
to twenty four. Hundred of, course those numbers are super,
loose and the concept of, gender you, know is somewhat.
(14:00):
Problematic but what we're saying is that's that's the, ballpark
somewhere between sixteen hundred to three, thousand not to gain
muscle mass and hulk, out and not to shed a
bunch of weight and get felt enough to wear you,
know your old bell bottoms or.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Something, Yeah and it's All the calorie is a measurement of, energy, right,
Right so it all depends on the output that you're
having as. Well how much energy you're. Using, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
Exactly if, you for, instance have a relatively sedentary, existence
you're going to be on the lower end of the caloric.
Scale and if you have a very physically active, existence
then you're going to need more fuel for the. Fire of,
course you, know our species is nothing if not. Durable
people can and do survive, long often harrowing periods deprived
(14:55):
of proper, nutrition and you, know you can bounce back from,
that but after a certain point you will also experience
lifelong medical consequences of. That, furthermore epigenetics proves that the
medical consequences of long periods of privation will carry on
after you. Die they'll carry on in your genetic code
(15:18):
and the way it expresses in your.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Offspring and there is also the concept here that occurs
in this country and many other places across the, world
where you are hitting or exceeding those calories that you,
need but the nutrition of those calories is not what you. Need,
Right you're not actually getting the things within the food
you're consuming to make a healthy. Body, yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Exactly now we've got that. Number so they're almost seven
point eight billion. People they need somewhere between sixteen hundred
and three thousand calories every twenty four hours just for
things to be status. Quo how much does the world?
Eat this is, interesting this is a related.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
Question it's. Crazy.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yeah, globally every sixty, seconds we eat eleven point five
million pounds of. Food as that's, everybody that's our collective
tab at the buffet of the world.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
One, minute eleven point five.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
Million so to put that in terms we, UNDERSTAND i
think you AND i were talking about this on a previous.
Episode how people in THE us will, do will make
up any kind of measurement to avoid using the metric. System, yes,
okay so it'll put that in terms we can. Understand
that's about twenty million big max every every sixty.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Seconds.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Wow so if you love Big, max that's that's the
metric for. You if you hate, them, well that'll just
make the rest of the bad news we're going to
get to even more.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Harrowing so here's the.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Catch while we actually eat that eleven point five million
pounds of food in one, minute we also waste two
four hundred and seventy two.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
Tons, Dude i'm looking at the world's food clock right
now that has all of. This how much is, produced
consumed and wasted and it's a the food clock counts
up every second of those three. Metrics, yeah, It i'm,
LIKE i hate. It i'm. Terrified i'm Just i'm staring
at it while you're telling me these, Facts, ben and
(17:24):
my brain is exploding a little. Bit it's.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Crazy oh and just to get us into more of
an apples to apples, comparison they're eleven point five million.
Pounds that's like five one hundred and thirty three, tons
and that doesn't count the two, thousand four hundred and
seventy two tons that are just straight in the garbage.
Can so, logically then if we were more, efficient this
(17:51):
means that we could feed. Everyone we we could feed
everyone every.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
Day we just. Don't there's no and there's other have
to get into there when they're talking about, Later, yes
about why why we currently can't or. Won't, yes but uh,
yeah livelet's continue why it's.
Speaker 1 (18:09):
Not happening even though it's. Possible, Yeah so LET'S i
want to bracket to the side the problem with, water
with potable or drinkable, water it's a different. Case, unfortunately
it's one we're going to have to tackle in an
episode all its own because spoiler. Alert while the news
about food does have a happy, ending the news about
(18:32):
water doesn't yet. Doesn't, really more than two billion people
of the seven point eight billion people here On earth
lack clean drinking water at, home available on. Demand meaning
of the seven point eight, billion more than two billion
don't have a faucet they can go to in their
(18:52):
house that just turns on and gives them water that
won't kill. THEM a major un room from back in
twenty eighteen In june shows that the world is way off.
Track The United nations had a goal which was to
bring safe water and sanitation to everyone on the planet
by twenty. Thirty we're not going to make that. Happen
(19:15):
it's the pigeon of potable water has flown the coop
by twenty. Fifty in, fact half of the world's population
just might not have safe.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Water and here's the, well, currently here's the. Deal they're
only really two ways to change these, numbers and that
is to reduce the number of people that need to
have clean drinking, water or is to somehow revolutionize the purification,
technology or get some of this is the third, option
(19:49):
get some kind of, angel, billionaire trillionaire investor or group
of investors to just put the money in to make
it happen.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
Right right to get at some of that billionaire blessing
for purification, technology or if we want to get really space,
age we could look into somehow getting non terrestrial sources of,
water right to farm a comet or.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
Something, YEAH i know. TOTALLY i just trying to imagine
the cost difference between farming the water from a, COMET i,
know just cleaning some, water making a plant in places
where there there aren't those.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
Plants, yeah it's it's the equivalent of let's go out
and buy water and someone, say, no we have water at,
home just clean.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
It.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
Right so we, ALSO i like the you brought up
money because we want to we need to just touch on.
That the average. Income so we have all the we
have these billions of, people what what.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Does the average person take?
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Home this is a tricky question and there's no way
to really contextualize it and do just this to the
reality on the, ground because we have to remember there
are vast amounts of income. Inequality but if we total
up all of the available, information then we find the
(21:12):
average global household income is something like nine, thousand seven
hundred seventy three dollars per, year so a little under
ten grand per household per.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
YEAR a lot of.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
People listening in The west already make more than that
on their, own and a lot of people do. Not and,
then of course we have to remember that number factors
in people Like Jeff bezos Of, amazon so that guy
is busting the curve for.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Everyone and then a lot of almost or very close to, zero.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Right, RIGHT a ton of, that, Yes and those results
come from Some gallop research between two thousand and six
and twenty twelve and one hundred and thirty one. Populations
here's how here's how screwed up that metric. Is income
in the top ten wealthiest populations in the world are
more than fifty times that of those in the ten poorous,
(22:09):
populations and all of the ten poorest populations are currently
located In Sub Saharan. Africa so we hit, money we hit,
water we hit, food and now we have to confront the, big,
big the big elephantine grim reaper in the, room which is.
Mortality and we'll do that after a word from our.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Sponsor all, right so we have all of these, people
we have all of these. Needs by the, way we
also need love and that's really all you need be The. Beatles,
yeah but let's look at how we are exiting this this,
(22:58):
planet exiting this experience that we call. Life in twenty,
seventeen as of officially three years, ago fifty six million
people died that, year and the top three causes were cardiovascular.
Disease there were seventeen point six five million deaths due
(23:19):
to cardiovascular. Disease that represents thirty two point twenty six
percent of all the. Deaths and then cancers came in.
Second there were eight point nine three million deaths that
were caused by cancer or at least in some way
associated with, cancer and the sheriff deaths there is sixteen
point three two. Percent and then next up is respiratory
(23:41):
disease coming in at three point five four million, deaths
and that is six point four to eight percent of
all of the. Deaths so health issues, here major health
issues with our bodies and how they.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Function, yeah and we have to note those top three
causes of death Or bbrella. Terms cardiovascular disease encompasses several different.
Conditions not all cancers are created, equally of, course and
so on and so, On and equitable access to medical
care would vastly reduce these, numbers as would preventative measures
(24:17):
like tighter pollution controls and and and the. Like when
we look at shelter and, clothing we know that you,
know one man's one man's shack is another man's, castle
or however you, wanna you want to trot out that old.
Cliche there's clearly, Enough, uh there's clearly enough around given
(24:41):
that given that shelter can be built out of so many. Things,
yes there's clearly enough enough there to create housing for.
PEOPLE i, mean in a lot of developed countries even
there's still a huge homeless, problem and there are a
lot of empty, buildings but the homeless population is not
(25:02):
allowed to take shelter in there because of course concerns for.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Crime. Right, YEAH i was going to, say when you're
speaking about, shelter it can be defined really is anything
that's going to protect a person from the elements as
well as impending danger from some kind of outside. Force, Right.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
And we've had a high look at the, numbers, then,
right we've covered some of the. Basics these numbers are not,
perfect but we see some. Commonalities we see that outside of,
water outside of clean drinking, water which is a huge.
Necessity the trend seems to indicate that there is potential
(25:45):
for people not to go. Hungry there's potential for people
not to be, homeless, right maybe even collectively have a
better quality of. Life so with, that let's get to
the question is there enough for every? One here's where
it gets. Crazy the answer is actually. Yes and this
(26:10):
should not necessarily make anybody. Happy this should be troubling
that the answer is. Yes it should be very troubling because,
yeah because that answer is, yes then our next media question, is,
well what gives why isn't this. Happening let's look at.
Food so you've heard stuff about food, scarcity shout out
(26:30):
to people Like Norman borlog and The Green. Revolution the
fact of the matter is that right now the world
already produces enough to. Eat we actually produce a. Surplus
this world creates more than one point five times enough
food to feed literally. Everyone that's enough to feed ten billion,
(26:51):
people and ten billion people just for a bookmark is
where experts expect the population to peak around twenty, fifty
so that not that far. Away if you're listening to this,
podcast the odds are in your favor of being alive
when there are ten billion people around or when they're
(27:11):
ten who, knows we'll roll the.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
Dice we're never gonna make it that.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Far so there's a problem, though because that food will
only say just food in. General it's an umbrella. Term
and as we as we had discussed, earlier that term
encompasses a lot of, grain the staple of the global,
diet and the bulk of the grain produced by. Agribusiness
(27:38):
the bulk of industrially produced grain goes to feeding livestock
and can find feed, lots and goes to, biofuels rather
than going to the one billion starving or food insecure
people on the. Planet so, again it's not that we
(27:59):
can't feed every, one it's more that we can't feed
everyone the kind of food everyone wants and.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
Well and we also destroy a lot of those grains
that are created in order to control the price of said,
grains which, means like it if you could just decide
instead of destroying it or throwing it away or you,
know getting rid of it in that, way and you
(28:28):
just used it to feed people for no. Cost, well
when it's oh, god and again it's later WHEN i
say no, COST i just mean you're not actually selling
it or. Anything you're literally donating. It but in order
then to get that grains to the, places to the
needy people that would would want, it then it costs
a lot of, money.
Speaker 1 (28:48):
Right, Right and shout out to a previous recent episode
on farm. Subsidies it is true that a lot of
governments pay farmers to not grow, food even when you
know there are tons of. Concerns listen to that episode
for more. Information but think about it this. Way let's
take it to an individual. Level if you knew with
(29:12):
certitude that none of those one billion people would ever
need to starve, again but it meant that you and
everyone else you knew would have to change your. Diet
you could realistically maybe eat meat once a month or
once a year or never. Again would you be able
(29:33):
to make that trade? Off the problem there is that
if we're being, realistic we would we would not have
a way to know everyone else was playing by the.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Rules can you meagine the black meat? Market?
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Oh, man, Yeah i've seen there are things about that
and sci. Fi you, know when like when lab grown
protein or lab grown meat becomes the, normal then how
much will people pay for a real?
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Stake and then the concentric circle around the black meat
market and the red meat market become, troubling.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Right, Right for many of, us this already sounds like
a losing, proposition and it's hard to fault people for.
That it's something called the tragedy of the, commons which
we've mentioned before in this. Show the tragedy of the
commons essentially is. This it's the idea that there is
something a public resource that everybody. Uses like if we
(30:32):
didn't have, agribusiness and you just foraged from everybody in
the village foraged from the same field or, whatever and
stuff just grew, naturally but you had to take steps
to make sure that that food grew next.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Year but why would. You it's not.
Speaker 1 (30:49):
Yours it's just a place you go to and grab, food,
right and then everybody grabs food and then it's, gone
and then you just you go through this, increasing increasing
crescendo of passing the, blame you know WHAT i, Mean,
LIKE i just ate WHAT i. Wanted it's the problem
is never, me it's all all these other. Schmucks so
(31:10):
it's understandable that this would look like an unnecessary cost
for us to put on. Ourselves why SHOULD i have
to punish myself to help a billion people THAT i
will never, meet, Right and why SHOULD i have to
punish myself or hold myself to standards THAT i cannot
prove other people are.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Meeting you.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
Know so if we look at this, is by the,
way this is not taking in. Medicine we're just we're
putting that to side because the medical care stuff like
water is almost its own.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Episode, yeah and again bringing in, costs the time it
takes to train people and medications that would be affordable
to save.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Lives all, Right so next, question, then so we can
do this technically, potentially we're. Not so why? Not why
are we not giving every other human being what they
need to? Survive, essentially it's because doing, so even if
everybody wanted, to doing so would necessitate a massive transfer
(32:20):
of resources and wealth something on something that like on
the level that it, is never occurred in human. History
it boggles the. Mind and part of it is because
of we're talking about inequality up there with. Mortality that's
the other elephant in the. Room and when we talk about,
inequality we often tend to think in these, extremes you,
(32:44):
know because extremes are easy cognitive shortcuts we think of the,
billionaires for, example on one end of a scale and
the hopelessly deprived on the other end of the. Curve but,
honestly we have to give ourselves. Pontfective if you own
a device that allows you to listen to a, podcast for,
(33:05):
example then you are globally, speaking much more likely to
be one of those haves rather than one of those have.
NOTS a lot of people considered poor in a developed,
country for, instance may still have a better quality of
life overall than a relatively well off person in a
least developed.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Country you know WHAT i. Mean, Yeah, well then the question,
becomes what do we do about that again without having you,
know even if everybody's on board except for the trillionaires to the, billionaires,
like how do you get those, people those corporations to
decide that it's a better thing for everyone if we
(33:48):
raise all? Ships?
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Right that leads us to another. Question you, know what's the?
Solution can technology save? Us something we'll tackle after a
word from our sponsor.
Speaker 2 (34:08):
And we're.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
Back all, right here's one for the budding technocrats in the,
audience the people who are very forward to the.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Future right? There another, question after an ad, break can
technology save.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Us, yeah, yeah the answer is. Yes, maybe let's say
the answer is, yes but probably.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Not oh, Dear. Yeah, see for most.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Of human, history we just didn't have the organization necessary
to handle the logistics. Involved you might have people in
one part of the world who had a surplus of
grain because the weather was, favorable and people in a different,
region you, know maybe they were combating droughts or floods
and as a, result their harvest didn't come through and they.
(34:53):
Starved and let's say that the people with the surplus
of grain heard about this distant land that needed. Help
even if the people with that surplus wanted to feed
their fellow, humans even if they tried very, hard for
most of human, history they just wouldn't have the means
to get the food or medicine or resources to those
(35:15):
folks in time to make a. Difference, now for the
first time, ever that has. Changed we can ship almost
anything almost. Anywhere but.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
It costs, money and it costs money because of, fuel
because of the existing technology that can. Travel it costs
money because you have to have the logistics in place
to figure out what is going. Where and that's you,
know a bunch of people employed a lot of times
(35:51):
huge facilities and all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Happened all money is a representation of labor over, time,
right sore would have to to ship. Stuff we essentially
have to give, people uh these placeholders for time that
was spent, earlier, right and we do that in the
form of. Currency so we have to we have to
help these people justify their labor their, time, right and
(36:19):
that that is a, huge huge. Hurdle but if there
was some other, thing not saying that we have an,
answer And i'm not not even saying there should be
some other, thing but if if there was quote unquote no,
cost then we could literally feed every single hungry person
(36:40):
on the. Planet we're, Not, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
So what can we? Do can emerging technology and energy
improvements and a lot of these things that are out
there that are, happening we know are, coming it's just
when will they get? Here will those things move the
needle enough to help everyone's ship rise a little? Bit
because you, know there really is an interesting stuff out there.
Happening and one of the big things would be if
(37:03):
we could because it would change, everything if we could
get more efficient and larger amounts of power of, energy
because that would reduce the costs of things like. Shipping
they would reduce the cost of things like packaging and
all of these other things we would. Need so we
(37:24):
were just looking at a couple of different emerging technologies
and we won't spend too much time on. This twenty.
Nineteen according to a lot of the news that has
been coming out about energy, improvements twenty nineteen was a
year that wasn't too exciting about brand new. Developments but
(37:44):
there are some really cool stuff in there happening that's
more of a minor improvement that you can kind of
see the tail of, right you can see where it's.
Headed we found something called floating, solar which is really
interesting to me AND i hope you find it to
be fascinating. Too the idea is taking a solar array
that you've probably seen pictures of somewhere online that generally
(38:07):
it's in a desert or somewhere or a more arid
climate where you've just got solar panels in a huge,
circle or a different arrangement that's just out there aiming
at the sun at all, times trying to generate. Electricity,
well floating solar uses a body of water that isn't
usually used for a specific human. Purpose so imagine a
(38:29):
hydroelectric dam's, reservoir so like the water that's above a
hydroelectric dam that then that water flows down through the
dam system and generates electricity through. Turbines this floating solar
array would sit on top of that reservoir and it
would look kind of like the other solar rays you've seen.
Before it's just they're floating on the surface of the
water that isn't going to be used, anyway the surface.
(38:51):
Isn't then you can generate a bunch of power. There
and the cool thing about this is that because in this,
case at, least if it's really close in proximity to
a power generation plant already with that hydroelectric, dam it's
really easy to transfer the power generated on that floating
array to the grid, itself, which as we're going to
(39:14):
keep talking about, here that becomes one of the major
problems with new energy technologies out there that might give
us a bit of a step up when it comes
to helping. Everyone so another, one another technology that you
can think about is offshore wind. Farms so wind farms
(39:35):
that are relatively far out into the ocean or, offshore
and the wind out there can generate energy really. Effectively
the problem is if you're far enough, away it becomes
extremely difficult to get that power generated because it's so
far away from the grid to the. Grid so there
(39:56):
are new technologies coming out about the types of cables
and how those cables function to actually bring more power
to the global. Grid that seems like a cool. Thing
there's new nuclear technologies that are, emerging like we talked
about With Chris. Cogswell there's stuff in there about molten
salt reactors which seem to be a little bit safer
(40:18):
than the fission reactors that we you, know that are
so common right now on the. Planet but there's also
that concept of fusion that we talked at length With
chris about that really does seem to be. Happening, yeah that. Weird,
YEAH i was so skeptical when we were initially talking about,
It but since, then like smaller fusion reactors are a
(40:43):
real thing that seemed to be. Happening so that could
really change the game as far as being able to
get either to produce the food that is needed and
to clean the water efficiently and put power play plants
in places that we normally wouldn't even consider doing it
if you're a large. Corporation.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
Yeah and now all of the problem is all those
technologies that we've named have some.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
Major.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Drawbacks major drawbacks they, have you, know including stuff like
the overhead or the initial, costs safety or environmental, concerns
and then problems of.
Speaker 2 (41:24):
Scale, yeah oh, YEAH i mean none of. That none
of these things we're talking about are going to change
the game really in the way we're imagining. Here but
except for. Fusion fusion could they? COULD i think fusion.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Could, yeah, YEAH i would love for it to. BE
i would love for that to be the case for
any of those things we just named solar or hydro
electric or fusion to make it off of the drawing
boarder off of the to move from the column of
potential solutions to practical or implemented. Solutions we're not there.
(42:00):
Yet we're not there.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Yet and then how on earth do you bring the
cost down to something like fusion enough to make it extremely.
Helpful there's there's.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
Another whenever we talk about technology and its possible role
in improving the lives of the of the people who
are members of this, species one big thing must be,
addressed and that is the concept of what is often
CALLED ai or artificial intelligence or you, know increasingly academics
prefer the term machine consciousness because they, say you, know
(42:31):
a consciousness is a. Consciousness how is a machines consciousness
any different theoretically from a meatheads? Consciousness you, know what
makes one artificial and? Whatnot, right it's the. Meat it's
the meat that's going to be that's going to be
our advertisement for premium organic brains in the in the
(42:52):
black meat.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
Market it's the.
Speaker 1 (42:54):
MEAT i wish you guys could see the expression mad
it WAS i nominate you as.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Spokesman OH i, accepted.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Right Uh so before we talk ABOUT, ai let me
pitch you a little bit on why why people are
excited about having a non human consciousness or collective handle
these logistical, problems these distribution, problems.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Which is really that's what a lot of this. Is.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Well, first no matter what our our lovely little primate
brains can make technology, wise outside OF, ai we may
not have the tools mentally to take advantage of. This our,
brains you, see are one of the most important pieces
(43:48):
of early human. Technology how we got where we. Are our,
brains make no, mistake are the are the reason for
all the good stuff the human species has, done they're
also the reason for all the bad stuff we've. Done
it's kind of Like promethean, fire.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Right so.
Speaker 1 (44:10):
The problem is that our, brains like any other computer have.
Have you, know they've got, code and they've got limits
to their. Capabilities our brains naturally bulk at the idea
of deliberately lowering our individual standards to help some abstract
collective thousands of other bring billions of other bring computers
(44:34):
that we will never, ever ever ever. Meet, sorry the
odds against you meeting all the people on the planet
right now are astronomical because so many are dying every
minute and so many more are being. Born you just
don't have time for it in your. Schedule and even
(44:55):
if you're lowering your individual standard of living to something that's,
survivable something is not that. Bad something it's not, terrible
but just isn't as awesome as you would, want you'll
you'll never really see the impact of that on the,
planet you, know not in your. Lifetime and our brains
(45:18):
already knew this way before we, did which brings us
to one of the chilling theories that that. IS i
don't know about, You, matt but it's sort of changed
the WAY i look at the. World it's something Called dunbar's.
Number oh, yes, yeah which we've mentioned. Before it's named
after A british anthropologist Named Robin. Dunbar long story. Short
(45:43):
dunbar is convinced through his research that there is a,
ratio a correlation between brain size in primates and the
amount of people given primate can consider other people or
other their, primates, living, thinking feeling beings with their own,
(46:03):
motivations their own. Goals that number for human, beings according To,
dunbar is one hundred and fifty people. Ballpark that means
then that once you get to like one hundred and
fifty two, people two of those aren't. People they're just
sort of. Functions they, happen you know WHAT i. Mean they're, bots,
(46:29):
yeah right, there they're, verbs their, mechanisms their processes that
you see, it you see moving around, you but you
don't think of them as.
Speaker 2 (46:39):
People i'm imagining it as a social media. Thing let's just,
say let's Use. Facebook you've got one hundred and Fifty facebook,
friends and you know all of, them, right you really
truly know all those, People and then that that number
starts to grow and grow and grow and grow and,
grow and now it's just kind of a picture of
(47:00):
a representation of a human in each of those.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
Profiles, yeah and you do that obnoxious thing people do
on social media where you don't really care at someone's,
birthday but you get a, notification so you pop A
hbd over, there Because god knows you don't have time
to write all to both of those words out.
Speaker 2 (47:18):
Right that's. Right so.
Speaker 1 (47:22):
The problem then is If dunbar's theory is, correct the
problem is less one of material goods or resource, availability
and it is more one of our inherent neurological, wiring
our hardwired inability to think that humanity as we understand it,
(47:46):
exists really exists past a certain threshold of about one
hundred and fifty.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
People but in your experiment, Here, ben we're talking about
allowing some extremely sophisticated computer system to side who's gonna
get fed when and with?
Speaker 1 (48:02):
What wait, WAIT i want TO i just want to
hit this. Though, okay from WHAT i was, saying If
dunbar's theory is, true then that means all other things, Aside,
yeah including the most popular ideology of this age or
the most popular, religion which would be, economy, money, currency
things like. That that means that we are the biggest
(48:27):
obstacle to our own. Success the. Problem the problem isn't
how much food is being. Grown the problem is, us
you know WHAT i? Mean and GUES i see where you're,
going where it gets a perfect. Setup do we then
eschew our individual and species wide. Responsibility do we build
(48:49):
a better brain and just trust it some kind of sky,
net some kind of technological god made of ones and
zeros that will tell us where the cantelope is supposed
to go every. Harvest for many, people that is a
troubling thing because then we're. Coast we're consigning our entire
(49:12):
species existence to be the the children of something else
that we've, created you know WHAT i. Mean and then
we have to also say we would blindly trust this,
thing and we would no matter no matter how what
kind of system we put in place to watch the
(49:34):
watchmen as it, were we would have we would have
very little. Recourse you, know once once you hop on that,
wagon once you hop on that, train there's not really
an easy way to get off because of the power
you would have to give that sort of. Mind, yeah
Well i'm on. Board you're on.
Speaker 2 (49:53):
Board, yeah let's call IT. Mana uh. Huh it'll be
THE mana system on The gaya grid and it'll it'll
just send all the food and water resources necessary to
the entire globe that needs, them no matter where they're
produced and at what. Time it'll calculate like when when
(50:14):
foods will spoil and how far they can actually. Travel,
oh it's going to be.
Speaker 1 (50:18):
Incredible mega algorithmic network. ASSIGNMENT i don't.
Speaker 2 (50:23):
Know that's pretty.
Speaker 1 (50:24):
Good, NO i mean it's good for a nineteen sixties short.
Speaker 2 (50:28):
Story but, yeah there may be an automation in there
or what's another really GOOD a and not an android? Assistant?
Speaker 1 (50:41):
No oh, yeah, yeah, yeah massive artificial neural.
Speaker 2 (50:47):
Algorithm that's pretty. GOOD i was just thinking more of
the symbolism of the manna from the. Gods it just,
falls you, know drops from the. Drones be clear about.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
THAT i am one hundred percent on. BOARD i think
manna is the way to go because we want something
that sounds non, threatening, Right but of, course you, know
you can see how people wouldn't trust that because for many,
people the existence of something like that would not be
a positive addition to their immediate. Lives, sure it would
(51:21):
probably mean that within five or six generations your descendants
would have would live in a world that was environmentally better, off,
Right and it means that, overall within several, generations people
in general would be. Okay but for, you, buddy as
soon as when the manna starts, falling that's gonna mean
(51:44):
that your quality of life takes a definite and observable,
hit and you're just gonna have to, trust, like, oh
there's something bigger than me and bigger than, mana and
it is this this, tremendous tremendously controversial fat called human human.
Speaker 2 (52:02):
Existence and you know what we'd end up doing if
we did actually get that system in, place we would
increase that world population. Clock it would go up well
a lot, Faster oh, yeah because that's would happen at
a much smaller rate if everybody had what they. Needed
and then overpopulation actually truly for real becomes a.
Speaker 1 (52:22):
Problem, yeah and all The malthusians are able to resurrect
their old. Beliefs and then, furthermore of, course you, know
we're ascribing benevolence to something like, this some kind of
creation like.
Speaker 2 (52:36):
This but the big.
Speaker 1 (52:37):
Question is if it's solving the Problem the most logical.
Way then the, easiest most efficient answer to making life
better for the existing population would be to reduce the
size of the existing, population and then the survivors would
(52:58):
not have to take a huge hit on their quality of,
life and the survivors would actually tend to have a
better quality of life depending on the size of the
population you left over if you were A.
Speaker 2 (53:12):
Mana, oh it's just you, know the old artificial intelligence
culling that we've been waiting.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
For m, hmm, yeah, RIGHT i checked the world clock every.
Speaker 2 (53:21):
Day, well that numbers a lot lower than it should. Be.
Speaker 1 (53:26):
Yeah, yeah you, KNOW i have these these feverish moments
WHERE i, think one Day i'll check the world clock
And i'll find out that something terrible has happened because
it starts going.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
Down yeah. Wow but of COURSE i.
Speaker 1 (53:40):
Wouldn't really work because it's based on these estimates that
are based on studies that were connected years in the.
Speaker 2 (53:47):
Past have you SEEN i think we've talked about it.
Before you've seen that movie that was available On netflix
a little while ago Called Mother, Yes, YES i have, okay,
yeah OR I Am Mother. No what was it? Called
it was one about THEIR hi, system not the aronofsky, one.
Speaker 1 (54:03):
Right but it's the one about the one about the
machine consciousness that is raising a.
Speaker 2 (54:09):
Daughter, yes who is? Human? Yes oh, man you could
it's mana at.
Speaker 1 (54:15):
Work, there it is man at.
Speaker 2 (54:17):
Work it very much.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Is, well there we. Have it turns out there is
enough food and potential shelter for every single human being
living on this. Planet water is a different. Thing we
still see people dying from, starvation poor, diet, disease lack of,
shelter and more and more and. More why because there
(54:39):
are several. Problems, first the existing systems that we came
up with over thousands and thousands of, years they were
just not built to accommodate a population of this. Size
you know WHAT i, Mean like a it's kind of
like a like a lemonade stand is not meant to
(55:01):
be an industrial lemonade. Factory as a matter of, fact
most kids who start eliminade stand never think this should be.
Something this should be an operation WHERE i can, feed you,
know or give ten times the amount of people the
lemonade THAT i was making for maybe twenty people a.
Day that's just the. Facts now we can make better systems.
(55:22):
Maybe but, second related to this, problem.
Speaker 2 (55:25):
We have just now.
Speaker 1 (55:27):
Begun this is an exciting time to be. Alive we've
just now begun to create global supply systems capable of
addressing the labyrintine logistics needed to feed and house. Everyone
and that's not even counting how to cheap those people
from getting. Sick that's just making sure they have somewhere
to sleep and enough to. Eat and, third forget all
(55:49):
the fancy agricultural, improvements all the hypothetical stuff that we're
talking about. Today our brains themselves are old. Technology our
brains are arguably, obsolete and we still don't fully understand.
Them we literally do not have the physiological capacity to
understand the size of the human, population nor do we
(56:11):
have the ability to think of this population in terms of.
Individuals we have a limit hardwired to our empathy and.
Cognition so after about one hundred and fifty or so,
people you, mean everyone you, know cannot conceive of others as, actual,
feeling thinking human. Beings do you feel pity for a
(56:35):
maple tree growing somewhere In missouri and a specific?
Speaker 2 (56:40):
Coordinate? No why would.
Speaker 1 (56:42):
You you know the idea of a maple, tree but
you don't know that? One, yeah and, like, so how
is a human being by that maple tree any different
from the? Tree you know it's not a human, being do?
Speaker 2 (56:56):
You? YEAH i don't know about this stone bar.
Speaker 1 (56:59):
Guy now you think he's poisoning the well Bit.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
It feels like a very pessimistic view of our brains
and our capacity for. Empathy technically still a, THEORY i,
KNOW i THINK i think inside of us there is
more capacity for. It BUT i understand the.
Speaker 1 (57:18):
Concept, well, well, okay think about this, then in more
concrete terms and more microcosmic. Terms, happiness as we understand
it is kind of. Relative you might ask, yourself how
can a person making twelve dollars an hour be happier
than someone making fifty dollars an, hour for? Example, well first,
off happiness is not entirely based on. Finance we understand.
(57:40):
That but if we look at that, example we find
that if someone is making twelve dollars an, hour they'll
tend to be happier with their income so long as
they know all their colleagues are making, less all the
other people work with, them even if it's just a little.
Less if you make twelve dollars an hour and you
work somewhere where, you, oh for a, fact everybody else
(58:01):
makes eleven dollars and fifty cents an. Hour just that
fifty cents will tend to make you. Happier, however let's
go to our person making fifty bucks an. Hour they'll be,
irritated they'll be, po'ed they'll be unhappy if they make
fifty dollars an hour and they know their colleagues are
making just a little, more you, know it's like fifty
(58:23):
five dollars an, hour they'll be in sense there is
no justice in this bleak and, uncaring godless.
Speaker 2 (58:29):
Universe it feels very, relative BUT i guess it.
Speaker 1 (58:33):
Is that's kind of a point, Here and then they
and they will completely not they will tend to not
really identify with the person making twelve dollars an hour
in the office across. Town so it seems that a,
fine a refined appreciation of inequality then is inherent to
our our. Existence and probably back an hour just out
(58:54):
of the trees running around the savannah, days that was
very beneficial to our. Species so for some, reason we
humans tend to think of success less in terms of
having quote unquote, enough and more in terms of having
more than other, people or LIKE i am successful because
other people have less than, me or if we want
(59:15):
to do it a half full, WAY i am successful
because it could be. WORSE i am better off THAN
i could. Be and shifting away from this, concept make no,
mistake would be a fundamental. Change were we this is
the question bothers, me, man were we to overcome this,
hurdle would we still be human? Beings would we still
be the same species.
Speaker 2 (59:35):
If we were no longer jealous of each other's? Finances?
Speaker 1 (59:39):
Finances, yeah but you, know more or less nation into?
Speaker 2 (59:43):
That? Yeah? Interesting, YEAH i think so.
Speaker 1 (59:49):
If we were capable, of if we were capable of
describing success and happiness in just terms of how AM i?
Doing AM i? Okay DO i have? Enough instead of
how AM i? Doing AM i doing better than other?
PEOPLE i don't?
Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
Know, YEAH i don't. KNOW i think that exists in
a lot of people right, now especially people who don't have.
MUCH i believe. SO i think what we're talking about
here is really. Describing it's more describing the person that's
making fifty dollars an, hour who's already experienced that a
(01:00:33):
little bit of knowing what having a lot is to.
Me that's What i'm, Here BUT i don't know if that's.
Speaker 1 (01:00:40):
True that's interesting because we didn't talk about that. Yet
maybe it's a story for another. Day but studies also
show that people who have want to keep it in
the realm of, finance people who have lower incomes or
lower on the socioeconomic scale tend to contribute to. Charities
they tend to contribute a larger proportion of their income
(01:01:02):
than the quote unquote.
Speaker 2 (01:01:03):
Haves, yeah we did the whole episode on how wealth
makes you a bad, person WHICH i went.
Speaker 1 (01:01:09):
Back and re listened to, it AND i was hoping
things would have.
Speaker 2 (01:01:12):
Changed they. HAVEN'T i think we nailed.
Speaker 1 (01:01:14):
It the conclusion of that one, spoiler which still holds
up and is worth listening, to is that our personal
opinions aside because science doesn't care about. Those multiple studies
prove that people tend to behave quote unquote worse the
(01:01:39):
higher they go up a certain financial.
Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
Scale, yeah and.
Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Again we're not saying that automatically makes you bad any
of that. Stuff we're just saying multiple studies prove tend
people tend to behave in a less cool.
Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Man there we. Go it's a good way to put.
It oh my, gosh. Okay SO i guess the question
now is like how like, Okay it's a personal, question
it's and it's aimed at. You how much would you
give up if you knew that by giving up something
(01:02:19):
of yours others would be better off and would be
safe and would survive and would have more. Happiness how
much would you be willing to give? Up and that's
a tough question to answer BECAUSE i think to you,
know every single person here thinks or knows rather that
(01:02:40):
they have responsibilities in their. Life they have you, know
maybe a, family maybe a friend, group or a community
that they are, supporting that they're doing their best to do,
that and then imagining giving up, more it's probably a
difficult thing to pose to somebody to think, about even
especially if, you especially.
Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
For, instance you have no way of proving that that
effort would be, reciprocated which is the case and just
fundamentally in the. Case and then, furthermore you, know we're
not talking about we're not talking about people giving up
stuff that was just given to. Them people have worked,
hard they have put in, blood, sweat tears and. Time you,
(01:03:21):
know now we're, saying, hey give it up for someone
you don't, know and then just trust, us Says, Mana
it'll all work, out or in the case Of, mana
it would just be a mandated. Thing but, yeah we
want to. Know is some sort of benevolent machine consciousness
our only? Hope can humans get the band back together
(01:03:44):
and put out a more successful album in this in
our long discography of? Existence, boy that was a terrible
pretty GOOD i don't, know man we're working, live but
let us. Know we want to hear from. You as
we said at the top of the, show you can
tell us your opinion on this On, Facebook, Instagram twitter
(01:04:05):
where conspiracy stuff On twitter we love to recommend Our
facebook community. Page here's where it gets. CRAZY i am
going to say again that there is a huge chasm
between what is possible and what is. Plausible so it
is possible to improve the lives of people on the,
(01:04:28):
planet of everyone on the, planet is it? PLAUSIBLE i
don't think. SO i don't think we're there.
Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
YET i think we will be, there but it's going
to take a global catastrophe.
Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
And then that'll get us to that kind of Star
trek yep post scarcity where there is a threat to
the species at large and there kind of is.
Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
One, guys it's called global climate.
Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Change oh but you WHAT i, Mean but you're talking
about something More hollywood. FRIENDLY i am Talking hollywood. Friendly
i'm talking.
Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
A little bit of. Bluebeam but it doesn't necessarily mean.
BLUEBEAN i just mean if there is enough of a
threat to the species at, LARGE i think preserving each
and every individual will become, paramount and then these kinds
of changes will.
Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
Occur, right because they'll have, to and the size of
the problem will be smaller. Too.
Speaker 2 (01:05:19):
Yeah so let it there's a global. PANDEMIC i, oh
maybe pandemic occurring right.
Speaker 1 (01:05:26):
Now, yeah but again to our earlier, CONVERSATION i feel
like THE i feel like it's a battle of semantics with,
pandemic you know WHAT i. MEAN i know the official
definition is not going to change the way and infection
ravages a.
Speaker 2 (01:05:40):
Body maybe, MAYBE i don't, know how about the, numerous
very troubling outbreaks occurring across the.
Speaker 1 (01:05:49):
Planet, yeah maybe that'll maybe that'll be what it. Takes
maybe that'll be the big kickstart we. Need, right it'll be,
zombies the zombies or, yeah, ALIENS i would, say or
a huge natural, disaster non terrestrial.
Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Disaster, Well, matt it.
Speaker 1 (01:06:06):
Happened we once again started talking about the end of the.
Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
World, yes and stuff is.
Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
Bleak, Well, hey here's a question that's probably on everybody's
mind as we reach the end of today's. Show what
how can they tell us their take on whether there's
enough for? Everyone, if LIKE i have an opinion about,
this for, instance BUT i hate using social? Media how
DO i get in contact with you?
Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
Guys, ah you can call. Us our number is one
eight three three STD. Wytk give us a, call tell
us what you think you might end up on an.
Episode but one way or, another we're going to hear
what you were, saying and that is either a good
thing or a bad thing for. You but we're excited
(01:06:54):
to hear your, opinions your, jokes your ideas for. Episodes
whatever you want to tell, us give us a. Call
you can call, in just like this person did last.
Speaker 5 (01:07:03):
Night hi, There this Is jade From, Spokane. WASHINGTON i
was just reflecting on your guys' recent episode about the.
Coronavirus AND i live In, spokane, obviously AND i live
about a quarter mile away from a hospital where they
(01:07:24):
have TAKEN i think, five maybe more patients that have
been infected with the coronavirus and are holding them at
that hospital because it's one of ten in THE. Us
but ever since that was, ANNOUNCED i have seen at
(01:07:46):
least two helicopters a day come in and, out and
it'll be at random times at. Night and, Yeah i'm
not so sure that those are legit.
Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
Helicopters not sure what you mean? There?
Speaker 1 (01:08:09):
Interesting? Interesting, yeah who's?
Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
Controlling like what is the company basically and what is their?
Speaker 1 (01:08:16):
Purpose, yeah it's thank you first off for calling in
with this on the ground. News we need primary. Sources
as we know our coronavirus, episode we went back and.
Forth we felt it was important to make this, episode
and we knew that because we were in the nascent
stages of the development of the, infection we would have
(01:08:39):
to come and do an. Update so we need your
help with, this especially if you have on the ground.
Experience the sad truth of the matter, here and the
dangerous truth of the, matter is that given the way
THE us is currently HANDLED covid, nineteen there are easily
(01:09:00):
thousands of undiagnosed cases, around you, know AND i WOULD
i would not be surprised at all if the official
messaging we're getting does not match the actual activities that
governments or states are taking to stave off the.
Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Infection, YES i, KNOW i. DO i agree with. That
it is one of those things that is still making me.
Nervous my newsfeed is just filled with updates about new
clusters of infections and it's given me. Nightmares but thank
you for calling in with information from a specific. Area
(01:09:43):
feel free to call back again with any kind of
update You in, PARTICULAR i Believe jade is what you,
said and anyone else please call, in leave a, message
and if you don't want to do, that please send
us a good old fashioned.
Speaker 1 (01:09:56):
Email we are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot.
Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
Com stuff they don't want you to know is a
(01:10:21):
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