January 2, 2026 • 59 mins
Officially formed in 1999, Nunavut is the newest and most northerly territory of Canada. This sparsely-populated region is home unique wildlife, ancient culture and, it seems, a mystery. Join Ben, Matt and Noel as they unravel the strange story of a bizarre, unexplained sound emerging from the seafloor -- it's allegedly terrified migratory animals, baffled local hunters, and inspired the Canadian government to launch an official investigation (which led to more questions than answers).
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Okay, felly conspiracy realist.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Here we are at the end door of the beginning
of a year and our classic episode this evening takes
us to the most northern part of Canada that you
can get to now, something that wasn't even a thing
until nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
That's right, none of it.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
And this really fits in with some conversations we've been
having recently about mysterious sounds things that have come up
in our Strange news segments, the idea of the windsor hum.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
This one is the nineve ping. Not a hum, but
a ping.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Oh.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Yes, it's been around for quite a long time. Remember
in twenty sixteen were we had heard about this, but
I don't think we covered it until twenty twenty because
there were I believe there were some new pieces of
information that came out about it.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, yeah, that's correct. This was an unexplained sound emerging
from deep beneath the waves, terrifying migratory animals, baffling local
hunters who know that land very well, and everybody got
so confused, perplexed, and frightened by this that the Canadian
government launched an official investigation.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Here's what they found.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of Iheartradiu.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Hello, welcome back to the show.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
My name is Matt, my name is Nola.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
They call me Ben. We are joined as always with
our super producer, all Michig Control decads. Most importantly, you
are you. You are here, and that makes this stuff
they don't want you to know. Today's episode starts off
with something that's understandably a problem for many people. Strange noises.
(02:10):
We don't mean smacking, snoring, the squeak of styrophoam or
all those other demons of misophonia.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Don't know how about heavy breathing, guys.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
People accuse me online of heavy breathing a lot, and
it's really made me self conscious to the point where
I lean away from the microphone really hard.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
So thanks a lot, Internet.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
So we're talking about something much less annoying, and we're
talking about something much more mysterious, or so some would
have us believe. Longtime listeners, fellow conspiracy realist, you've been
with us as we explored the story of the windsor hum,
which by the way, will be solved in this episode
as well as the story of the infamous Bloop. But
(02:50):
this mysterious noise occurs in the far North, in an
isolated part of the world, home to more animals than
people the local population and is apparently being haunted by
a bizarre well. Some would describe it as a hum,
some would describe it as a beep. Today it's best
known as the Nunavut ping. Here are the facts.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
So first off, let's do a little geography.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Nunavut is in Canada, right, but where it's north really north,
about as far north as you can possibly go. The
area encompasses most of the Canadian Arctic Archipelago, and this
is Polar Bear Country.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Nunavut is the.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Largest and northernmost territory of Canada and the fifth largest
administrative division in the entire world. In fact, Nunavut alone
represents about twenty one percent of the entire area of Canada,
which is interesting considering how few people actually live there.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
It's really strange to look at on something like Google
Earth or in another digital based globe just to see
essentially that ring, the Arctic ring around the North Pole.
There it's you're right up at the top. And this
whole area we're talking about here, Nunavut, it's a little
over two million kilometers in total area. That's around eight
(04:14):
hundred thousand square miles a little more than that, and
according to the latest numbers, it has a total population
of around thirty six thousand people.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yeah, this one, this one gave gave me a weird
rabbit hole, Matt. The population's thirty five, nine hundred and
forty four as of the twenty sixteen census, and that
number still seems to hold about the same in twenty nineteen.
So I was looking for an easy comparison. You know,
(04:44):
what's maybe a more well known city or town that
has a comparable population. So I started looking at cities
in the US that have a population maybe around there.
I couldn't find any. So I started looking at smaller
and smaller and smaller places, and I stumbled on the
closest comparison I can find, which is Goose Creek City,
(05:07):
South Carolina, with a population of thirty five thousand, nine
hundred and thirty eight. So, residents of Goose Creek City,
shout out to.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
You, yeah, shut shout out to Mount Pleasant and Bulls
Bay as well, which are right right down the street
from you.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Do you get there? Do you know about a creek city?
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Yeah, dude, I'm all about some Goose Creek just from here.
You can you got to get to ninety five, but
head on up that way and then you can head
head east right over to Goose Creek.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Mint.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
I'm just looking at a.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Map, Okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I would have loved the idea of Matt having like
long lost family in Goose Creek that he's just now
like discovering on the air in real time.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yes, as Nols said, please tell us your Goose Creek
City stories. Unlike the residents of Goose Creek City, the
residents of this territory are overwhelmingly Inuit, about eighty five
percent of the population.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
This territory is.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Also incredibly new. It was officially created in nineteen ninety nine.
Before that, it was part of the pre existing Northwest Territories. Now,
if you want to go and counter the great outdoors
in this part of the world, you're going to need
to prepare. This is not an especially welcoming environment. It's
(06:31):
mostly composed of rocky, treeless tundra that's locked in permafrost.
The Arctic, as we know, is experiencing climate change, specifically
warming of the climate at a faster rate than a
lot of other parts of the world, and this also
affects Nunavut. Changes there include higher temperatures which melts the permafrost,
(06:53):
which reduces the ice, and the sea which causes the
glaciers to diminish and retreat and diminishes the ice shelves
tale as old as time. We all know this pattern,
but it's also home to a mystery. And that's our
question today. Have you heard of the Nunavut ping?
Speaker 4 (07:11):
And just another thing to point out here is just
how difficult it is to get to Nunavut from a
lot of other places or nearly anywhere else in the world,
considering where it is on the Earth, and how cold
it is, how much ice you're dealing with in the
lack of standard transportation or a very little standard transportation.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
I actually when I was looking up researching for this episode,
I came across a YouTuber by the name of Olivia Young, who,
along with her husband at the time of the video,
which is in twenty eighteen, it just moved to ecollow it,
which is the capital city of Nunavut.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
And she made two very helpful videos, one of which
was ten reasons you should move to a Call of
It and ten reasons you should not move to a
call It.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Not that she was trying to force anybody one way
or the other, but the reasons you should things like
we're talking about the gorgeous natural scenery, the hunting, the
camping opportunities, and just kind of the adventure of it.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
All the reasons you shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Apparently, cost of living is one of the highest in
all of Canada there largely because it is so remote.
There aren't very many chain things, so there's kind of
a monopoly on you know, goods and services on this
very remote, hard to get to place. And she was saying,
I guess they're talking about Canadian bucks. But it was
like around eighteen hundred dollars for a flight, like a
three hour flight from Call of It to I believe
(08:34):
Manitoba believes with theirs.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
I can't quite remember where they would go home to
hang with.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
Their folks, but apparently very very prohibitively expensive to fly
out of there, and not many flights go there, so
it's kind of a monopoly there too. Also commented on
the Internet being particularly slow, but then you pointed out
that they seem to have fixed that.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Yeah, yeah, And this is something this kind of inaccessibility
is something that's very familiar to people who live in
areas of the world like this, but perhaps sounds strange
to people not acquainted with these environments. You know, there's
a reason, for instance, that department stores in Alaska tend
(09:15):
to do a little bit better than department stores in
the rest of the contiguous United States. That's because some
places just don't deliver. You know, you can't order something
online if it means that someone from Amazon or something
has to fly out on a small Cessna plane to
get you, you know, your dunk a Ruse or whatever
(09:36):
you're ordering. I imagine it's dunk a Ruse.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
It's gotta be.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Yeah, just speaking to that. Shout out to the whoever
is working at and running the Hall Beach Airport that's
out there and nearby. It's one of the only ones
that I was able to find or that was big
enough to actually land, like you said, as Cessna or something.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, and apparently there's no specialty medical faci there. Doctors
actually come in on a weekly basis that the woman
I was talking about who had the YouTube video was
pregnant at the time and was talking about how to
see a specialist. She had to wait until that individual
was actually making the rounds, which would require flying in
on a little plane like you're talking about. And also
(10:17):
one of the reasons she said if you don't want
to move here is if you don't like online shopping,
because that's sort of mainly where you're going to find
most of your options because there's really no chain department
stores or malls or walmarts or anything like that to
speak of.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So, as you can tell from that very high level look,
life here is very different than life in many other
parts of the world. Nunavut is home to a stunning
and rich history of indigenous culture, tradition, and practices, right
including hunting, which plays a big role in today's show.
(10:53):
This area is also home to a mystery. It's one
that a lot of people outside of the region have
not heard of. Have you heard of the Nunavut ping.
Here's where it gets crazy, because you see, this area
of the world is home to more than breathtaking natural
(11:13):
beauty and astonishing ancient culture. It's also home to something
that is most often I should say allegedly home to
something that is most often called a ping like ping like.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
That sound of submarine makes right.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Maybe, well, it's it's interesting. It's been described a bunch
of different ways. Actually, sometimes it is that ping like
we just gave an example of. Sometimes it's more of
a m Sometimes it's a sound that you can't hear
unless you're recording. Sometimes it's a beep, more of a
bit like the ones that we make on this show
(11:50):
when we need to record something again that you go.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Behind the scenes. That's behind the scenes, Matt. That doesn't
make it to the final at a thank you, Mission Control.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Where's Michael Winslow when you need him?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
I wish you had him as a guest right now.
He could do all of these sounds perfectly for us.
But I think you did a great job, Matt.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Well.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Thanks. So what you need to know is that there's
a specific area within this larger area that we've been
describing to you. It's called the Fury and Heckless Strait
of Nunavut. It's about one hundred and twenty kilometers or
seventy four miles from the small town of Igloic.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yeah, and you were we were talking earlier off here, Matt,
you said that this is this is kind of the
closest point of human civilization that we can relate to this.
It's the Fury and Heckless Strait is sort of northwest
of this town.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Correct, correct. Yeah, and it's it's large, it's very open.
Many times, or in the past, I guess more frequently
in the past there would be ice floating in this area,
and not so much anymore, as you stated earlier, Ben, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
So this ping was first we could say, solidly confirmed
by a sailboat that was traveling through the strait back
in the summer of twenty sixteen. And the reason we
can say it was solidly confirmed is because the crew
of the boat and passengers on the boat were able
to register the sound with onboard sonar equipment. They weren't
(13:25):
looking for anything, they just had the sonar equipment for
the boat. Rumors had existed before this official confirmation. And
note to your earlier point, Matt, this is not the
same thing as recording the sound. They registered it, they
proved that it existed, but they didn't have an audio
file they could play for other people. The strait itself
(13:49):
is a word of the day. I don't know about
you all, but this I learned this word for the
first time. The strait is what is called a paulina.
It's an area of open water that's surrounded by and
this is a cozy, cozy, perfect home for tons of
sea mammals. The sound itself, the ping or the hum or,
(14:10):
the can be heard throughout the summer. That's a big deal. Yeah,
there we go. That's a big deal because summer is
one of the major hunting seasons in this region, because
there is a typically historically there's a large number of
sea mammals that pass through this area, and so since
(14:31):
ancient days, when people are living there, they would harvest
these animals and use components of these animals throughout the
rest of the year for a multitude of things.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
And if I'm not mistaken, you can find narwhals in
this region. The mythical yet perfectly real narwhal.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Yeah, God, guys, there a Arctic circle types the narwhal.
You know, they haven't quite yet franchised to the Caribbean,
but hey, the world's a changing place. Who knows, Maybe
we'll see a tropical Narwal. Draw us a picture of
what that looks like. Send it in conspiracy at iHeartRadio
dot com.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Probably just wearing a la and has like a tropical
drink of some kind. Narmals don't really have hands, though
it has.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
It has like pineapples and stuff speared on the on
the whole, which is actually a great example left tooth
of the Narwal. Quite so weird it is, but the
ping is even weirder than an arwall, I would say,
because the sound can be heard throughout the summer. Multiple
people allegedly report it. Notice we had to drop the
(15:33):
allegedly on there. You'll find out why in a minute.
The booters who are aboard that private vessel passing through
the area, they said that they heard the sound. They
registered it on Sonart. They didn't have an audio recording,
but they went to a local radio show in Igloick
afterwards and they described their experience hearing the sound. And
(15:54):
when they described it, multiple people called into the radio
station to say, Hey, I've heard this too.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
What gives just.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
A quick thing to think about here. This incident occurred
in twenty sixteen, so you know, we can't know for sure,
but I assume that somebody on that private boat that
was traveling through the Strait had some kind of cellular
device that had recording capabilities on it, And it does
make me wonder why if they were hearing something as
(16:25):
strange as this sounds, they wouldn't begin rolling, similar to
if there's a UFO sighting or something, you'd want to
at least attempt to capture it.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
It's a good point, Matt, but I think maybe we
take for granted sometimes how quick we are to pull
out stuff like that and record interesting sounds or videos.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Some people just don't think about it.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
I think it's like second nature to us, I think,
since we're sort of tech eat nerd types.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
But I don't know. It could go either way. It
is a little weird.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
But I also know people that just never really occurs
to them, unless it's like snapping a picture to like
pull up the voice memo recorder. It is almost like
too many players of menu for some people on a phone.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I want to go back to what you said, Matt,
and I want to respond to you by saying ding
ding ding, or should I say ping ping ping, because
this is going to be important later in the story, right,
And I think your point holds know that it is
not normal or it's not you know, ubiquitous for everybody
to instantly take out a phone. As a matter of fact,
many of us listening along today when we have seen
(17:25):
something anomalous, perhaps in the sky or in the distance,
you know, it can be real pain to try to
get to your camera on your phone or your audio
recorder in time unless you've made it a habit and
normalized it. So with your point, Matt, I would say
one thing that alters, or I would say one thing
that influences the points we're making here, is that these
(17:49):
people were on a boat. They likely already had recording
equipment or communications equipment of some sort running, and we
don't without knowing how long their window of time was
hearing the ping, we don't know how much time they
had to respond. But it is interesting there was not
a recorded sound there. This acoustic anomaly. There's an important
(18:12):
part about it. It wasn't just affecting humans and hunters.
Locals had noticed that animals appear to hear this sound
as well, and they responded to it by turning tail
or turning fin or turning flipper and skiedaddling whatever this
sound was it seemed to frighten them. At least according
(18:34):
to initial reports, there were hardly any sea mammals in
the area during the summer of twenty fifteen, and that
became an issue of major concern to the local government.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Yeah, especially since when we're talking about tourism and even
like just locals, hunting is huge. So if your animals
are constantly getting spooked away by this sound, that's not
going to go over well with the locals or with
tourists and the govern who are maybe thinking, oh, this
is a bumber. This is going to like make it
less attractive for people to come here. And you see
(19:06):
these these natural phenomenon are and perhaps you know, shoot them.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
Yes, And to that end, we have a statement from
a legislative assemblyman from the area named George Kualute. He said,
quote that passage is a migratory route for bowhead whales
and also bearded seals and ringed seals. There would be
so many in that particular area this summer there was none.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Which is amazing because usually these kind of declines step
down incrementally over time, right and over seasons. It's anomalous
for an entire migratory population to change to disappear and
change route. So locals and visitors, humans and animals alike
(19:56):
all seemed to know that something was happening, but no
one knew what, unless, of course we asked the animals,
which no one really did. This means then the lack
of certitude, speculation thrives, and theories abound. What are we
talking about. We'll tell you afterword from our sponsor and
(20:24):
we have returned. We hope that everyone had an excellent
commercial break. Maybe a few many adventures, we don't know
tell us about them. But we had a discussion of
our own during the break, and Matt, you brought up
an important point that we need to hit before we
dive into these theories dive in.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
Sorry guys, Oh we're really getting started in that realm ben.
So just jumping back to that initial report that kind
of broke this story back in twenty sixteen of the
private boat and the people on board that went through
and heard this ping with their sonar equipment, they they
(21:04):
at least stated they were able to discern that the
sound appeared to be originating from the seafloor from below them,
way down at the bottom. And just keep that in
mind as we're continuing down through these theories about what
this sound could possibly be, and we have.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
A we have a couple of broad categories of theories
with with very i would say, differing levels of plausibility. Right,
So we start maybe if you guys, if you guys
are into this, we can start with the very mundane
one and the reason why it's very mundane, and then
(21:49):
we can move progressively to some more conspiratorial stuff. The
first theory centers on an outfit called the baffin Land
Iron Minds Corporation. They had earlier conducted sonar surveys on
a nearby Endlet steams by Endlet. This theory that a
(22:10):
corporation in the mining industry could be responsible for this
sound does have some sand, but not because of the
mining corporation itself. Here, it's increasingly plausible because of recent
revelations about the Windsor Hum, which we explored in previous episode.
(22:31):
Rarely get to say this, this one has been proven.
We can put this one to bed. Probably in that
previous episode on the Windswor Hum, we examined this mysterious
sound on the Canadian US border. Since about twenty eleven,
people in Windsor Ontario and the area were reporting a weird,
(22:51):
weird hum. Nobody knew what it was. Some people were
saying secret government plans, usos UFOs, extra dimensional stuff, all
the exciting stuff, all the hits, all the jazz. But
just a few days before we recorded this episode, the
announcement the news came on July twenty seventh. We're recording
(23:11):
this On July twenty ninth, one of our theories from
windsor hum was proven correct. The US Steel facility on
Zug Island went into idle mode as the company scaled
back operations across its Great Lakes facilities. And according to
a guy named Colin Novak, who we may have cited
in that episode, he's the lead researcher for the Canadian
(23:34):
study into the hum. According to him, as soon as
that Zug Island facility went quiet, the hum vanished. So
no aliens, or at least maybe the aliens were working
at the factory. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Yeah, it's crazy to you know, we're talking today about
a ping and we're referring to this one, and it
is kind of known in popular culture I guess as
a hum, but I mean residents were describing it as
like almost a sub you know, sub base kind of
rumble that would actually like vibrate pictures off the wall
and make some people sick, you know. I mean, there's
a whole episode about it. But that plant that we're
(24:09):
talking about, I think they determined that it was caused
by like a process of like venting pressure from some
of the equipment that that was very very very loud
and actually carried uh all the way to the residence
of windsor pretty cool.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
Wow, that's that's weird that we can come and say
that to you today. It felt like a mystery that
was going to be around for a while, but now
it's gone. You guys doing the world.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Our success rate is if you look at if you
define success as in solving these things, our success rate
is pretty abysmal. But but this alone, this kind of
theory does not solve the case of the nunavutping because
there are some problems with this explanation.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Yes, that's Corre, the Baffin Iron Mines Corporation. So they
ended up speaking with Canadian media and essentially they said, yes,
they do have a mine on the Mary River, which
is southwest of Pond Inlet. Another inlet in the area.
They had not been conducting any surveys of the sonar
type in the area where the ping had been observed,
(25:20):
and they didn't they didn't even have any equipment in
the water, especially at the bottom of the sea there
or of the strait, I guess. So it does feel
as though, at least if they are telling the truth,
that that this may not be the explanation. And if
you don't want to just trust the company's words, you
(25:42):
can look to the local politicians who have also verified
that there weren't any official permits that were issued for
this company for construction or for other kinds of work
like blasting hydrography, which is a fun term as well,
and there was no there was no official permits for
work that would explain those sounds originating from that company.
(26:05):
But again, you're trusting politicians then, right, So.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Yeah, but still in either case, back to the conspiracy
drawing board on this one. There's another theory that was
pretty popular in the local population that reminded me in
a way of allegation. Well, it's an allegation of eco
terrorism kind of and it reminds me of like Captain
(26:31):
Planet kind of fights. So what if the ping is
coming not from a mining corporation but from those nefarious
ne'er do wells over at Greenpeace. Oh, I know, right,
So what if? What if green Peace is the culprit
here for people who believe this The motivation of this
(26:52):
organization is to use the ping or some kind of
sonar device to scare wildlife away from the huntunting grounds
during this peak hunting season. This theory does not come
from thin air. It's not likely that someone just made
it up to troll people. Green Peace and the local
population have had ten six changes in the past, and
(27:15):
that was largely due to green Peace as historical opposition
to seal hunting in the nineteen seventies and nineteen eighties,
so decades ago. But there's still probably some bad blood,
or at the very least some distrust.
Speaker 4 (27:29):
So the big question here is would an environmental group
like green Peace purposefully disrupt what's going on with the
natural behaviors of a large group of animals in some
roundabout way to save them. It's definitely one of those
things that feels like, Okay, I guess in a Doctor
Evil style green Peace maneuver, but it definitely it definitely
(27:53):
feels off to me like that wouldn't be It wouldn't
be a good idea because you changed the patterns of
those animals, where they live, where they hunt, where they feed,
You're going to cause some disastrous effects. Probably, yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
It First, to your point, it feels circuitous there I say,
Rube Goldberg esque. And secondly, it seems like a textbook
example of a situation where someone is choosing the lesser evil.
It feels like it would be anomalous for Greenpeace to
take that kind of course of action. That doesn't mean
it's not true, It just it seems weird and it
(28:30):
seems out a character. Green Peace denies this accusation the
same way that the mining corporation denied the accusation. In fact,
a spokesperson for Greenpeace, one Farah Khan, said quote, not
only would we not do anything to harm marine life,
but we very much respect the right of Inuit to
hunt and would definitely not want to impact that in
(28:52):
any way. This is important because it means not only
does green Peace not want to mess with the animals,
they're also say they don't want to mess with Inuit
hunting traditions. So their argument render if true, renders the
whole conspiratorial concept moot, because they're saying, first, we didn't
(29:15):
do that, and second, if there was something we could
do to disrupt this hunting season, we wouldn't do it
anyway because we think it's an important cultural practice. So
they're basically saying, you know, it's not our battle, not
our hill to die on. Additionally, to your point, Matt,
if you don't believe greenpeace anymore than you believe mining corporations,
(29:37):
we can note that government officials note no one has
seen a craft of any sort capable of carrying and
dropping sonar going through the area, or putting anything into
the water that you know would function as is so
in our device capable of creating this sound, etc. And
that all means boom, back to the conspiracy drawing board
(29:59):
we go. And this brings us to a third theory,
which I would say is I don't want to call
it fun, but it's fascinating, and I think we might
differ on our opinions of the plausibility here, guys, because
I I'm a little more pro conspiracy on this theory.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
In particular.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Wait, wait, Ben, are you talking about submarines.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Not just the sandwiches?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
Matt, We did an.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Episode not long ago on submarines, older submarines, and the
tech that was available, you know, back during the Cold
War days, was so advanced you can only imagine that
there might be something lurking out there in the waters
that nobody can detect.
Speaker 3 (30:47):
Yeah, in that same episode, we talked about how there's
no question that sonar really jacks with marine animals, especially whales.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
And dolphins me and so many of them use their.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Own form of sonar to communicate, and this absolutely can
throw a real wrench in that system. And I mean,
the whole point of many of these submarines is to
swim under the radar. So if there were more advanced
versions of these things, we probably wouldn't know about it,
whether domestic or foreign. So to your point, Matt, who's
(31:20):
to say that some newer version of this technology doesn't
exist that either sounds different or acts a little different,
but still clearly, you know, disrupts marine life. But the
Canadian military has ruled out the presence of both domestic
and foreign subs in the area, at least that's what
they're saying in their official statements of the public. But
(31:41):
who knows how.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Accurate that might be.
Speaker 4 (31:45):
I would just say, remember where we are in the world.
Right We're at the northern top of Canada, and I
would say just across the Arctic Ocean. It is a
pretty vast distance from that area to Russia. But if
you're thinking about it with a Cold War mindset, which
(32:06):
I'm not going to say is gone from governments on
either side of that original conflict. It's evolved, certainly, But
if you're thinking about it in that way, then there
might be a strategic reason to be floating around in
the waters there.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
I'm gonna save it.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
I'm gonna save it.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
I'm gonna save it. Well, we'll get back to this,
but I completely agree with you, Matt, completely agree spoiler alert.
But let's say, just for the sake of maritime argument,
we say, okay, maybe that's not one hundred percent it.
We'll head back halfheartedly with caveats to the conspiracy drawing board.
As DJ Collin would say, another one. You see, there
(32:53):
is a fourth theory, conspiracy realist. It proposes that the
sounds were being emitted by essentially a science project in
the Arctic, funded not by Canada but by the United States,
specifically by the Office of Naval Research in the US,
this is called the Canada Basin Acoustic Propagation Experiment or
(33:18):
what would you can pay that?
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Do you think DJ Collin has anything to do with this?
Do you think this is why he hasn't released any
new material in so long, He's just been working on this.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
I'm gonna ask. I'm gonna ask if DJ Collin has
released his own.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Material another one, another sickburn against.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
He's been great to us, He's a good friend of
the show. Actually, I love hearing the contracts. It's a
guilty pleasure.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
I wish you always you always know, you always know
it's him. Yes, it reminds me of those like those
mix or the you know when you buy a beat
on the internet and you don't pay the full price,
you need to get the sample. Occasionally in the background
it'll be like like six sounds twenty ninety and then
(34:11):
you know when you buy it, that goes away. It's
like an audio watermark. That's what DJ Khala does. He's
like a human audio watermark.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Well, yeah, and he certainly experiments with sounds right.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
Oh, well, after I was getting at maybe this is
his This is his new material, Canapey, which also a
delightful French savory dish.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
A cannopey. I think it's kind of like a crape.
I'm sure it is irrelevant.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
I have no idea I've heard I've heard the term though.
But but this, this project, called the Canada Based Acoustic
Propagation Experiment or canna PAY, it's really interesting, uses low
frequency sounds to try and figure out the ongoing changes
that are occurring in that general area with regards to
(35:02):
sea ice and how the how those changes. So if
you're as you're having less or more ice in an area,
how does that affect acoustics? So that sounds really interesting,
and they're thinking that this project could produce some data
for use in tracking submarines way up there in the
(35:23):
Arctic or just far north in general, like we're talking about,
uh oh, are submarines making a comeback already?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Another one?
Speaker 1 (35:33):
It's the dust. But we have an expert, that's right.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
We have an expert by the name of Peter either
Worchester or Worcester guess, depending on which part of the
country you come from or if you're English. But he
is a member of the Script's Institution of Oceanography at
the University of California, And he said that the sound
being generated by CANape, which by the way, is a
(35:56):
small amuse boosh that you might see on a tray
carried by a waiter at a party with little little
things on it, like a little smoked salmon perhaps, But
it's also this thing. But the sound emitted by Canna
Pay the sounds rather are very low and too far
away to be heard in the fury and heckless strait. Okay,
so this he's ruling this out for for the for
(36:19):
the ping.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
Now what does make sense? The project is focused on
low frequency sounds, right, and we're talking about a very
high pitched for high frequency sound.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
So yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
And one of the issues too, which Worster brings up,
is the problem of time, right, and and and distance.
So this experiment uh the sound to be responsible for
the nunavu ping, these experiments would have to travel very well,
(36:51):
a pretty long way, and it would still have to
be distinct from the ambience background noise, right, that's gonna occur.
So Worster outlines, you know how quickly this would dissipate
in the background noise, and instead he proposes another culprit,
a returning culprit that some of us may recognize from
(37:13):
our earlier episode on the bloop and he says it
could be Arctic ice, that could be the kaiser, so's
a here, and he notes that much of the acoustic
noise in the Arctic is caused by ice rubbing together
and cracking, sliding against itself, and moving. And favorite fact
about today's episode is that this is a known phantom
(37:35):
sound dating back to the days of early Arctic explorers. Well,
let me copy at that early European Arctic explorers. They
knew about these sounds. They were so common that Arctic
explorers in that age called these noises the devil's symphony.
How cool is that? And the descriptions ranged it kind
(37:59):
of had the same some of the same sounds we
hear the nunavuok ping being described as They would say
there was a buzz maybe kind of a really low hum,
and then they also said wheezing and loud bangs there.
I don't think there's a nunavu wheeze yet, but that
would really creep me out. Can you imagine beat out
in the far North and then you just hear this
(38:20):
sort of.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
That sounds is pretty cool. Actually like some kind of
experimental music. What if you were listening to the Devil's
Symphony while smoking the Devil's lettuce.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Bad combination, probably so or maybe great, who knows, but yeah,
that been that right there is the best fact of
this whole thing. And you right now can go on
YouTube and other places and hear sounds of ice in
both the Arctic and Antarctic, and just the incredible range
(38:55):
of tones and frequencies that you can get out of
ice interact with itself and other chunks of ice.
Speaker 3 (39:02):
I can only imagine. I mean, you know, cracks. The
ice is like a man. I mean, think of like
the ocean, how far it extends. I mean, so many
of these bodies of ice are just take up just
as much, not just as much, but.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Are very very you know, wide ranging.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
And for cracks to be spreading, you know, all at
the same time slowly and kind of these slow creaking
crack sounds like that really does sound pretty haunting just
to consider, especially if they were making like sympathetic tones
and causing.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
These kind of weird vibration sounds.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
And as reports of this ping grew or appeared to grow,
the Canadian government, including the members of the legislature that
we mentioned earlier eventually decided to investigate and to escalate
this to get the military involved, which I think just
I think is another interesting argument for the sub theory.
(39:59):
But what are we talking. We'll tell you after a
word from our sponsor, and we're.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Back and the government has become involved. Oh Canadian government,
what did you do? Well? In November of twenty sixteen,
they conducted several searches of the area using sound equipment. Essentially,
the military went through there and they were unable to
(40:31):
determine what was causing whatever these quote acoustic anomalies were.
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Yeah, I believe they flew over the ocean with multi
sensor you know, scans essentially trying to find the origin,
but they couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (40:47):
Yeah, they did, but it was a it was a
large jet or a plane.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
Right.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
I'm confused about that too, Matt, Like that makes so
much noise in and of itself, Like, not not that
we're acoustic specialists or anything, but a little weird. I
think they do it with a boat with the motors
turned off or something, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Like, it does seem as though if you are getting
your initial reports from you know, a boat or a
ship traveling through that straight You would also in kind
send some kind of vessel through there with equipment sonar, acoustic,
or otherwise, just to test to see if you could
(41:24):
repeat it, rather than sending a plane over. But maybe
that's just to my ears.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
ROV's a magnetometer. We do have to we do have
to keep in mind, however, that the relative inaccessibility of
this area and the size plays a role. Knowing something
or thinking something originates from the seafloor doesn't get you
out of that needle in a haystack situation. It just
(41:50):
points you to like a rough area of the hay
you know what. It just moves the haystack to the
sea floor. That's all it does.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
It's a great point.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
And in twenty seventeen they decided to well, they did
find something in their search, which doesn't particularly surprising. They
found two pods of whales and six walruses, so they
didn't come up completely empty handed.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
But in twenty seventeen, oh wait, wait, one point though
about the walruses. What I love about the way this
is presented when you read about it is that it's
a total of six walruses. So I love that there.
It sounds like they're consistently discovering a walrus and it
keeps them going. So maybe my crazy conspiracy about this
(42:32):
is a seventh walrus. They just turned around too soon.
Speaker 3 (42:36):
I couldn't agree with you or Ben, but you know,
they didn't let this dampen their.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Spirits too much.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
In twenty seventeen, the Army had plans to send two
acoustic specialists to Eglulik to learn more about the ping
and just kind of like pull the locals, ask around,
like see who had heard it, what they thought it
sounded like. Seems like a smart move, So they ended
up sending one instead, a guy named Doug Brown no relation.
(43:04):
Brown was at Aglouick for a total of nine days
in January of that year, twenty seventeen. And here's some
things that he accomplished while he was there.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Well, the first thing that he didn't accomplish was recording
anything as far as audio goes of the strait or
the water or any pings whatsoever. Again, the according to them,
and according to the work that Doug Brown was commissioned
to do, the militariat attempted to record those sounds, and
(43:36):
they were unable to do so, so they sent him
there with a very different mission. He was instead interviewing
residents and locals as well as officials, and attempting to
just get as much information as he could about what
they had heard.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
You don't think sending an acoustic specialist without like a
field recorder sort of like sending a photographer without a camera.
Speaker 1 (43:59):
That's a little weird.
Speaker 4 (44:01):
That's precisely what it sounds like to me.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Yeah, and it's true.
Speaker 3 (44:04):
I mean, I don't know if he brought that stuff
or what, or just decided to leave it in his bag.
But in that nine day span he was there, he
didn't make a single recording. Instead, he just talked to
folks to try to get their perspective. Doesn't seem like
it would necessarily take an acoustic specialist to do that,
but who far be it for me to question the
judgment of the Canadian government. He did play sound examples
(44:29):
for the locals. It does it sound like this, here's
a sonar ping ping.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
You wasn't quite like that.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
It was a little more of a pew, you know.
That's that's maybe the response. But who knows, because he
I wonder if he recorded the interviews.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
That's a good question. And he asked.
Speaker 3 (44:45):
If anybody knew who had heard the sound, and they
said no, that nobody in their community or organization had
heard any of the pinging sounds.
Speaker 2 (44:56):
He also noted that the people he spoke with in
the community were much less concerned about what the media
called the mystery of the ping Instead, they were intensely
concerned about the lack of migration of the narwhale and
the walrus and other marine animals up to the Fury
and Heckless Strait. He was, you know, he did his
(45:20):
best to say, here's maybe a reason why, and he
wanted to answer their question and they're you know, address
their concern So he told them that the lack of
animals may be due to the environmental issues that have
been occurring and escalating in the North over the past
few years. And he said, you know, these issues may
(45:41):
have led to the animals just not migrating as far
as they once did. So the animals are still around, right,
They're just not at the same historical range. And then
in a he got a lot of help from rangers
who were based in the town and speak the local dialect,
because not every especially older members of the community don't
(46:06):
just speak that dialect. And so he went to that
local radio station and he had one of the rangers
put out a message translated from English to this language
and said, hey, you know, we want to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
Have you heard this ping?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Have you experienced it? Do you have a recording? Let
us know? And nobody answered. For one reason or another,
nobody answered, but I want to go back here. They're
interesting things about Doug Brown's investigation. He says, there's no
viable reason to put sonar in the area, so he
(46:47):
rejects the sonar claim. He says, the current is too strong,
there's too much ambient and background noise. Even if you
wanted to do it, you wouldn't get workable results, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (47:00):
I mean, you know, we've seen plenty of examples of
the media maybe rolling with the story before confirming all
the details because it sounded cool. There's, you know, a
way to kind of sex up something that maybe there
isn't confirmed evidence for. It's not to say they're making
things up out of whole cloth, but we've definitely seen
this in our research time and time again. So could
(47:20):
the ping possibly have just been a rumor that got
out of hand. I mean, it seems to me that
the biggest report that we've heard of in this case
is those folks on the boat from the top of
the show that didn't record it on their cell phone.
And I don't even think we had names, So it
certainly sounds like that's possible. And then it could have
potentially been kind of, let's say, escalated based on something
(47:47):
that we all know well, the idea of fear, the
idea of being concerned about self preservation and something that's
out of your control to maybe explain it away or
to at the very least, you know, a sign something
to blame, and that would be the changes in migratory routes,
this notion that these sea creatures, sea mammals that were
(48:10):
so commonly seen in that particular area were gone this year.
But we also know that there's other things that can
lead to changes in migratory routes.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
Right, Yeah, I want to go back to second interesting
point about Doug Brown's investigation. I think speaks to what
you're talking about. There's an interview you can read with
Vice and they do excellent work, especially through Motherboard, where
Brown says, you know, he doubles down.
Speaker 1 (48:38):
He says, I.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Never spoke to a single person who said that they
had any faith in the reality of this ping, much
less said they had heard it themselves. And in fact,
when he spoke with members of the Legislative Assembly, he
asked them, you know, the day one question you would
ask in this situation, he said, why does it seem
(49:01):
like so many papers initially reported hearing this noise, and
the legislative members said that was a quote misunderstanding of
the media. No one in the community, as far as
this assembly person knew, had actually heard the ping. And
this is odd because it wasn't just one paper reporting
these eyewitnesses accounts. With this, the Army thus considered the
(49:26):
case closed, and now it leaves us with several possibilities.
One is the idea that you brought up second ago, Nol,
the change of migratory patterns. That's something people can't really
fight immediately, right. That stuff has to change over time.
It's like a train. It takes a while to get
started and it takes a while to stop. But as
(49:48):
we were talking about earlier before the break, Matt, let's
go back to the possible submarines cover up idea. So
when Doug Brown, after he was sent to the area,
the government considered the case close and they pretty much
shut down this story, any further investigation, any official comment.
They were basically saying they want none of it.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
I've never accused.
Speaker 2 (50:14):
I'm I was, you know, fellow listeners, I was writing,
I was writing to the gang off air, and I
was like, I refuse to apologize for this terrible pun.
I'm sneaking in and no, I feel lighter.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
I feel like you're certainly not alone.
Speaker 3 (50:29):
I mean, I'm looking at the YouTube comments on the
video that I was talking about about reasons you should
move to none of it, and the first comment say
is how much of that province is inhabitable?
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Answer? None of it?
Speaker 4 (50:41):
Oh sick burns all day.
Speaker 3 (50:45):
And then and then and then everyone and then everyone
proceeded to school this guy. It's not a province, you moron,
It's territory. So you're a big dumb, dumb head and
your pun was bad.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
And there's there's no solid proof of any cover up
at this point, Like there's no declassified documentation, there's no
deathbed confession, no former intelligence officer or anything. But there
is solid proof to your earlier point Matt, that the
melting ice of the Arctic Circle has made the region
a geopolitical hot spot. Think about it. There are billions
(51:20):
of dollars to be made in future Arctic shipping routes.
There are also potentially billions of dollars to be made
in extracting resources from this area. It is therefore, at
least this is kind of my opinion. It's not a fact,
it's speculation, but it is one hundred percent plausible that
foreign powers, including the US, Russia, heck, throw China in
(51:42):
the pile. As long as we're adding up scary superpowers,
they could be snooping around. And to your point about
hidden technology, Noal, it's possible they could be doing it
largely undetected. The motivations are there.
Speaker 4 (51:56):
If not, the means, hey don't discount the Canadian Secret
Submarine Group whatever it is called. There's I don't even
know if it exists, but there's gotta be one, right,
There's got to be some kind of secret Canadian super
cold submarines.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
They're so cool, but I just I couldn't. I couldn't
be in one for a long time. I don't know
about you, guys, I think I would I don't think
I would deal with it.
Speaker 1 (52:25):
Well, yeah, do you have any kind of claustrophobia?
Speaker 5 (52:29):
Ben?
Speaker 2 (52:30):
No?
Speaker 3 (52:31):
No, I mean I I guess I've never really been
in a situation where where it would be that bad.
But I do have dreams sometimes where I'm like packed
into like a pipe or something, you know, and it's
not pleasant. The idea of being buried in a coffin
really freaks me out. So that's sort of how it
seems like it would be only for a very very
long time.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
It takes us space. I mean, it's a rare set
of skills. You know, people who are submarriners are dedicated
and focused.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
You'd have to be.
Speaker 3 (52:57):
And I didn't mean to imply that you'd be on
a submarine for a longer time than you'd be buried
in a coffin.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
That's a weird thing to say. I apologize.
Speaker 4 (53:05):
It's totally fine. I mean, you can imagine just the
horrors of submarine flatulence and.
Speaker 3 (53:13):
Just I mean, we talked about this last subs came up.
Just the overall smelliness of it all. It's definitely a thing.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
Yep, it is, And everybody listening to this currently on
a submarine give us your favorite or your weirdest sub
smells stories. You can contact us directly anytime of day
or night. There's one last note for this. We've laid
out the broad categories the possibilities here. But whatever the
(53:47):
ping is, whether or not it actually exists, there is
one thing for sure. We do not need some mysterious
noise to explain the increasing decline in animal populations.
Speaker 1 (53:58):
We have the culprit for that.
Speaker 2 (54:00):
It's us, it's human civilization. We will kill these animals
out soon enough. And then this is not to be preachy.
These are these are just facts. This is the process.
These animals are specially adapted for a specific environment, and
that environment will will likely cease to exist. So if
(54:23):
you if you feel bad about that, go check out
polar bears. While you can be careful, they will kill you.
They are dangerous, dangerous things. But but you know, I mean,
we're it's it's ridiculous to ignore the fact, the objective
truth of the matter, and this is a show that
(54:43):
deals in facts, is that this this, this question about
the ping may well be moot. The animals are disappearing,
That's that's just true.
Speaker 3 (54:53):
Well, and you know, not only are the animals disappearing.
The ice is disappearing, and that's the product of climate change.
And when the climate changes, the animals they find other
places that are more suitable to their climate needs. So
I do certainly think that that does seem to be
the most plausible explanation here, because unlike the winds are
(55:16):
hum the none of it ping has not been solved
and remains something of a mystery.
Speaker 4 (55:23):
You're right, at least a mystery for now until we
discover that sub terrestrial submarine base at the bottom of
that street, which we will find in twenty twenty six.
It'll take a while, but we'll get there. I'm joking,
of course. But you know, there is one thing here
(55:46):
that we didn't really discuss.
Speaker 1 (55:48):
Yes, what if the.
Speaker 4 (55:51):
Sound wasn't mechanical in nature, or a vehicle or an
experimental piece of machinery. What if it was biological?
Speaker 2 (56:01):
What are you saying, Matt, Are you saying some sort
of unknown organism could be responsible? It could be scaring
off the other known animals. Careful, my friends, we teeter
on the precipice of cryptozoology.
Speaker 6 (56:16):
Oh dare we You mean like a locknested monster kind
of situation, Like a giant Arctic sea monster maybe.
Speaker 4 (56:27):
But you'll have to wait until next episode to hear
about it.
Speaker 3 (56:32):
That you are a mischievous devil and I love it.
Speaker 2 (56:36):
Yes, yeah, a sea monster. Oh gosh, guys, the gates
of possibility are flung wide open. The horizon of creepy
stuff rushes forward from the future to meet us.
Speaker 3 (56:49):
You guys know, the only thing I'm scared of more
than like birds is giant underwater monsters.
Speaker 4 (56:56):
Really, Ah, yeah, I think.
Speaker 1 (56:58):
I talked about it a while back on an episode.
Speaker 3 (57:00):
I always have dreams that I'm like in this vast
sea and there's a giant presence beneath me, and I
sense it. And that's not that I'm worried about getting eaten.
It's just the very existence and presence and being in
the proximity of such a thing as very Oh it
makes my blood run cold.
Speaker 2 (57:17):
So what do you think, folks? You know, in the
past episodes, we've seen mysterious noises traced to industry, like
the windsor hum or, natural causes like shifting earth or ice.
That would be that's the most widely accepted explanation.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
For the bloop.
Speaker 2 (57:33):
But do you think there's something else?
Speaker 1 (57:35):
Here.
Speaker 2 (57:35):
Do you think there's a mystery afoot? Do you think
there's a sea creature? Do you think there's a mundane explanation?
Do you think there's some kind of difference between what's
actually happening and the official narrative? Have you yourself heard
this ping? If so, we want to hear from you.
Speaker 4 (57:51):
Yes, please find us on social media where we are
Conspiracy Stuff on Twitter and Facebook. You can find us
on Instagram at conspirac Stuff Show. If you don't want
to do those things you don't like social media, you
can give us a call. Our number is one eight
three three std WYTK. Leave a message. You may find
(58:13):
yourself on one of our new listener Mail episodes, or
you may inspire us to make an episode such as
this one. You can say whatever you want. You will
not be censored. Just let us know if you want
to be on the air or not.
Speaker 1 (58:25):
And if that's not your thing.
Speaker 3 (58:26):
You can find us on other forms of social media
where we are Conspiracy Stuff or Conspiracy Stuff Show. If
you'd like to be a member of our Facebook group,
here's where it gets crazy. You just go right on there,
search for it'll come right up and just name one
of the three of us or super producer Paul, Mission
controlled decant or superroducer Alexis nickname TBD Jackson. We'll bring
(58:48):
in some in email, some suggestions. I don't think we
should air them here. You can do that, and we
tend to hang out in that group from time to
time and respond to memes and posts and questions and
it's a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (59:01):
So check that out.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
And if none of that's quite bags who are figurative
conspiratorial badgers.
Speaker 1 (59:07):
But you're thinking I have.
Speaker 2 (59:09):
A story, you guys need to hear more importantly, have
a story my fellow listeners need to hear. Then you
can always contact us any old time of day, any
old time of the year at our good old fashioned
email address where.
Speaker 4 (59:22):
We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff they don't
(59:44):
want you to know is a production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Okay, felly conspiracy realist.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Here we are at the end door of the beginning
of a year and our classic episode this evening takes
us to the most northern part of Canada that you
can get to now, something that wasn't even a thing
until nineteen ninety nine.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
That's right, none of it.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
And this really fits in with some conversations we've been
having recently about mysterious sounds things that have come up
in our Strange news segments, the idea of the windsor hum.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
This one is the nineve ping. Not a hum, but
a ping.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Oh.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Yes, it's been around for quite a long time. Remember
in twenty sixteen were we had heard about this, but
I don't think we covered it until twenty twenty because
there were I believe there were some new pieces of
information that came out about it.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, yeah, that's correct. This was an unexplained sound emerging
from deep beneath the waves, terrifying migratory animals, baffling local
hunters who know that land very well, and everybody got
so confused, perplexed, and frightened by this that the Canadian
government launched an official investigation.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Here's what they found.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of Iheartradiu.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Hello, welcome back to the show.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
My name is Matt, my name is Nola.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
They call me Ben. We are joined as always with
our super producer, all Michig Control decads. Most importantly, you
are you. You are here, and that makes this stuff
they don't want you to know. Today's episode starts off
with something that's understandably a problem for many people. Strange noises.
(02:10):
We don't mean smacking, snoring, the squeak of styrophoam or
all those other demons of misophonia.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Don't know how about heavy breathing, guys.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
People accuse me online of heavy breathing a lot, and
it's really made me self conscious to the point where
I lean away from the microphone really hard.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
So thanks a lot, Internet.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
So we're talking about something much less annoying, and we're
talking about something much more mysterious, or so some would
have us believe. Longtime listeners, fellow conspiracy realist, you've been
with us as we explored the story of the windsor hum,
which by the way, will be solved in this episode
as well as the story of the infamous Bloop. But
(02:50):
this mysterious noise occurs in the far North, in an
isolated part of the world, home to more animals than
people the local population and is apparently being haunted by
a bizarre well. Some would describe it as a hum,
some would describe it as a beep. Today it's best
known as the Nunavut ping. Here are the facts.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
So first off, let's do a little geography.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Nunavut is in Canada, right, but where it's north really north,
about as far north as you can possibly go. The
area encompasses most of the Canadian Arctic Archipelago, and this
is Polar Bear Country.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Nunavut is the.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Largest and northernmost territory of Canada and the fifth largest
administrative division in the entire world. In fact, Nunavut alone
represents about twenty one percent of the entire area of Canada,
which is interesting considering how few people actually live there.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
It's really strange to look at on something like Google
Earth or in another digital based globe just to see
essentially that ring, the Arctic ring around the North Pole.
There it's you're right up at the top. And this
whole area we're talking about here, Nunavut, it's a little
over two million kilometers in total area. That's around eight
(04:14):
hundred thousand square miles a little more than that, and
according to the latest numbers, it has a total population
of around thirty six thousand people.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Yeah, this one, this one gave gave me a weird
rabbit hole, Matt. The population's thirty five, nine hundred and
forty four as of the twenty sixteen census, and that
number still seems to hold about the same in twenty nineteen.
So I was looking for an easy comparison. You know,
(04:44):
what's maybe a more well known city or town that
has a comparable population. So I started looking at cities
in the US that have a population maybe around there.
I couldn't find any. So I started looking at smaller
and smaller and smaller places, and I stumbled on the
closest comparison I can find, which is Goose Creek City,
(05:07):
South Carolina, with a population of thirty five thousand, nine
hundred and thirty eight. So, residents of Goose Creek City,
shout out to.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
You, yeah, shut shout out to Mount Pleasant and Bulls
Bay as well, which are right right down the street
from you.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Do you get there? Do you know about a creek city?
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Yeah, dude, I'm all about some Goose Creek just from here.
You can you got to get to ninety five, but
head on up that way and then you can head
head east right over to Goose Creek.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Mint.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
I'm just looking at a.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
Map, Okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I would have loved the idea of Matt having like
long lost family in Goose Creek that he's just now
like discovering on the air in real time.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yes, as Nols said, please tell us your Goose Creek
City stories. Unlike the residents of Goose Creek City, the
residents of this territory are overwhelmingly Inuit, about eighty five
percent of the population.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
This territory is.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
Also incredibly new. It was officially created in nineteen ninety nine.
Before that, it was part of the pre existing Northwest Territories. Now,
if you want to go and counter the great outdoors
in this part of the world, you're going to need
to prepare. This is not an especially welcoming environment. It's
(06:31):
mostly composed of rocky, treeless tundra that's locked in permafrost.
The Arctic, as we know, is experiencing climate change, specifically
warming of the climate at a faster rate than a
lot of other parts of the world, and this also
affects Nunavut. Changes there include higher temperatures which melts the permafrost,
(06:53):
which reduces the ice, and the sea which causes the
glaciers to diminish and retreat and diminishes the ice shelves
tale as old as time. We all know this pattern,
but it's also home to a mystery. And that's our
question today. Have you heard of the Nunavut ping?
Speaker 4 (07:11):
And just another thing to point out here is just
how difficult it is to get to Nunavut from a
lot of other places or nearly anywhere else in the world,
considering where it is on the Earth, and how cold
it is, how much ice you're dealing with in the
lack of standard transportation or a very little standard transportation.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
I actually when I was looking up researching for this episode,
I came across a YouTuber by the name of Olivia Young, who,
along with her husband at the time of the video,
which is in twenty eighteen, it just moved to ecollow it,
which is the capital city of Nunavut.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
And she made two very helpful videos, one of which
was ten reasons you should move to a Call of
It and ten reasons you should not move to a
call It.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Not that she was trying to force anybody one way
or the other, but the reasons you should things like
we're talking about the gorgeous natural scenery, the hunting, the
camping opportunities, and just kind of the adventure of it.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
All the reasons you shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
Apparently, cost of living is one of the highest in
all of Canada there largely because it is so remote.
There aren't very many chain things, so there's kind of
a monopoly on you know, goods and services on this
very remote, hard to get to place. And she was saying,
I guess they're talking about Canadian bucks. But it was
like around eighteen hundred dollars for a flight, like a
three hour flight from Call of It to I believe
(08:34):
Manitoba believes with theirs.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
I can't quite remember where they would go home to
hang with.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
Their folks, but apparently very very prohibitively expensive to fly
out of there, and not many flights go there, so
it's kind of a monopoly there too. Also commented on
the Internet being particularly slow, but then you pointed out
that they seem to have fixed that.
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Yeah, yeah, And this is something this kind of inaccessibility
is something that's very familiar to people who live in
areas of the world like this, but perhaps sounds strange
to people not acquainted with these environments. You know, there's
a reason, for instance, that department stores in Alaska tend
(09:15):
to do a little bit better than department stores in
the rest of the contiguous United States. That's because some
places just don't deliver. You know, you can't order something
online if it means that someone from Amazon or something
has to fly out on a small Cessna plane to
get you, you know, your dunk a Ruse or whatever
(09:36):
you're ordering. I imagine it's dunk a Ruse.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
It's gotta be.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Yeah, just speaking to that. Shout out to the whoever
is working at and running the Hall Beach Airport that's
out there and nearby. It's one of the only ones
that I was able to find or that was big
enough to actually land, like you said, as Cessna or something.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Well, and apparently there's no specialty medical faci there. Doctors
actually come in on a weekly basis that the woman
I was talking about who had the YouTube video was
pregnant at the time and was talking about how to
see a specialist. She had to wait until that individual
was actually making the rounds, which would require flying in
on a little plane like you're talking about. And also
(10:17):
one of the reasons she said if you don't want
to move here is if you don't like online shopping,
because that's sort of mainly where you're going to find
most of your options because there's really no chain department
stores or malls or walmarts or anything like that to
speak of.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
So, as you can tell from that very high level look,
life here is very different than life in many other
parts of the world. Nunavut is home to a stunning
and rich history of indigenous culture, tradition, and practices, right
including hunting, which plays a big role in today's show.
(10:53):
This area is also home to a mystery. It's one
that a lot of people outside of the region have
not heard of. Have you heard of the Nunavut ping.
Here's where it gets crazy, because you see, this area
of the world is home to more than breathtaking natural
(11:13):
beauty and astonishing ancient culture. It's also home to something
that is most often I should say allegedly home to
something that is most often called a ping like ping like.
Speaker 1 (11:26):
That sound of submarine makes right.
Speaker 4 (11:29):
Maybe, well, it's it's interesting. It's been described a bunch
of different ways. Actually, sometimes it is that ping like
we just gave an example of. Sometimes it's more of
a m Sometimes it's a sound that you can't hear
unless you're recording. Sometimes it's a beep, more of a
bit like the ones that we make on this show
(11:50):
when we need to record something again that you go.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Behind the scenes. That's behind the scenes, Matt. That doesn't
make it to the final at a thank you, Mission Control.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Where's Michael Winslow when you need him?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
I wish you had him as a guest right now.
He could do all of these sounds perfectly for us.
But I think you did a great job, Matt.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Well.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Thanks. So what you need to know is that there's
a specific area within this larger area that we've been
describing to you. It's called the Fury and Heckless Strait
of Nunavut. It's about one hundred and twenty kilometers or
seventy four miles from the small town of Igloic.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
Yeah, and you were we were talking earlier off here, Matt,
you said that this is this is kind of the
closest point of human civilization that we can relate to this.
It's the Fury and Heckless Strait is sort of northwest
of this town.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Correct, correct. Yeah, and it's it's large, it's very open.
Many times, or in the past, I guess more frequently
in the past there would be ice floating in this area,
and not so much anymore, as you stated earlier, Ben, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
So this ping was first we could say, solidly confirmed
by a sailboat that was traveling through the strait back
in the summer of twenty sixteen. And the reason we
can say it was solidly confirmed is because the crew
of the boat and passengers on the boat were able
to register the sound with onboard sonar equipment. They weren't
(13:25):
looking for anything, they just had the sonar equipment for
the boat. Rumors had existed before this official confirmation. And
note to your earlier point, Matt, this is not the
same thing as recording the sound. They registered it, they
proved that it existed, but they didn't have an audio
file they could play for other people. The strait itself
(13:49):
is a word of the day. I don't know about
you all, but this I learned this word for the
first time. The strait is what is called a paulina.
It's an area of open water that's surrounded by and
this is a cozy, cozy, perfect home for tons of
sea mammals. The sound itself, the ping or the hum or,
(14:10):
the can be heard throughout the summer. That's a big deal. Yeah,
there we go. That's a big deal because summer is
one of the major hunting seasons in this region, because
there is a typically historically there's a large number of
sea mammals that pass through this area, and so since
(14:31):
ancient days, when people are living there, they would harvest
these animals and use components of these animals throughout the
rest of the year for a multitude of things.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
And if I'm not mistaken, you can find narwhals in
this region. The mythical yet perfectly real narwhal.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
Yeah, God, guys, there a Arctic circle types the narwhal.
You know, they haven't quite yet franchised to the Caribbean,
but hey, the world's a changing place. Who knows, Maybe
we'll see a tropical Narwal. Draw us a picture of
what that looks like. Send it in conspiracy at iHeartRadio
dot com.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
Probably just wearing a la and has like a tropical
drink of some kind. Narmals don't really have hands, though
it has.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
It has like pineapples and stuff speared on the on
the whole, which is actually a great example left tooth
of the Narwal. Quite so weird it is, but the
ping is even weirder than an arwall, I would say,
because the sound can be heard throughout the summer. Multiple
people allegedly report it. Notice we had to drop the
(15:33):
allegedly on there. You'll find out why in a minute.
The booters who are aboard that private vessel passing through
the area, they said that they heard the sound. They
registered it on Sonart. They didn't have an audio recording,
but they went to a local radio show in Igloick
afterwards and they described their experience hearing the sound. And
(15:54):
when they described it, multiple people called into the radio
station to say, Hey, I've heard this too.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
What gives just.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
A quick thing to think about here. This incident occurred
in twenty sixteen, so you know, we can't know for sure,
but I assume that somebody on that private boat that
was traveling through the Strait had some kind of cellular
device that had recording capabilities on it, And it does
make me wonder why if they were hearing something as
(16:25):
strange as this sounds, they wouldn't begin rolling, similar to
if there's a UFO sighting or something, you'd want to
at least attempt to capture it.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
It's a good point, Matt, but I think maybe we
take for granted sometimes how quick we are to pull
out stuff like that and record interesting sounds or videos.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Some people just don't think about it.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
I think it's like second nature to us, I think,
since we're sort of tech eat nerd types.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
But I don't know. It could go either way. It
is a little weird.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
But I also know people that just never really occurs
to them, unless it's like snapping a picture to like
pull up the voice memo recorder. It is almost like
too many players of menu for some people on a phone.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
I want to go back to what you said, Matt,
and I want to respond to you by saying ding
ding ding, or should I say ping ping ping, because
this is going to be important later in the story, right,
And I think your point holds know that it is
not normal or it's not you know, ubiquitous for everybody
to instantly take out a phone. As a matter of fact,
many of us listening along today when we have seen
(17:25):
something anomalous, perhaps in the sky or in the distance,
you know, it can be real pain to try to
get to your camera on your phone or your audio
recorder in time unless you've made it a habit and
normalized it. So with your point, Matt, I would say
one thing that alters, or I would say one thing
that influences the points we're making here, is that these
(17:49):
people were on a boat. They likely already had recording
equipment or communications equipment of some sort running, and we
don't without knowing how long their window of time was
hearing the ping, we don't know how much time they
had to respond. But it is interesting there was not
a recorded sound there. This acoustic anomaly. There's an important
(18:12):
part about it. It wasn't just affecting humans and hunters.
Locals had noticed that animals appear to hear this sound
as well, and they responded to it by turning tail
or turning fin or turning flipper and skiedaddling whatever this
sound was it seemed to frighten them. At least according
(18:34):
to initial reports, there were hardly any sea mammals in
the area during the summer of twenty fifteen, and that
became an issue of major concern to the local government.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
Yeah, especially since when we're talking about tourism and even
like just locals, hunting is huge. So if your animals
are constantly getting spooked away by this sound, that's not
going to go over well with the locals or with
tourists and the govern who are maybe thinking, oh, this
is a bumber. This is going to like make it
less attractive for people to come here. And you see
(19:06):
these these natural phenomenon are and perhaps you know, shoot them.
Speaker 4 (19:11):
Yes, And to that end, we have a statement from
a legislative assemblyman from the area named George Kualute. He said,
quote that passage is a migratory route for bowhead whales
and also bearded seals and ringed seals. There would be
so many in that particular area this summer there was none.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Which is amazing because usually these kind of declines step
down incrementally over time, right and over seasons. It's anomalous
for an entire migratory population to change to disappear and
change route. So locals and visitors, humans and animals alike
(19:56):
all seemed to know that something was happening, but no
one knew what, unless, of course we asked the animals,
which no one really did. This means then the lack
of certitude, speculation thrives, and theories abound. What are we
talking about. We'll tell you afterword from our sponsor and
(20:24):
we have returned. We hope that everyone had an excellent
commercial break. Maybe a few many adventures, we don't know
tell us about them. But we had a discussion of
our own during the break, and Matt, you brought up
an important point that we need to hit before we
dive into these theories dive in.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
Sorry guys, Oh we're really getting started in that realm ben.
So just jumping back to that initial report that kind
of broke this story back in twenty sixteen of the
private boat and the people on board that went through
and heard this ping with their sonar equipment, they they
(21:04):
at least stated they were able to discern that the
sound appeared to be originating from the seafloor from below them,
way down at the bottom. And just keep that in
mind as we're continuing down through these theories about what
this sound could possibly be, and we have.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
A we have a couple of broad categories of theories
with with very i would say, differing levels of plausibility. Right,
So we start maybe if you guys, if you guys
are into this, we can start with the very mundane
one and the reason why it's very mundane, and then
(21:49):
we can move progressively to some more conspiratorial stuff. The
first theory centers on an outfit called the baffin Land
Iron Minds Corporation. They had earlier conducted sonar surveys on
a nearby Endlet steams by Endlet. This theory that a
(22:10):
corporation in the mining industry could be responsible for this
sound does have some sand, but not because of the
mining corporation itself. Here, it's increasingly plausible because of recent
revelations about the Windsor Hum, which we explored in previous episode.
(22:31):
Rarely get to say this, this one has been proven.
We can put this one to bed. Probably in that
previous episode on the Windswor Hum, we examined this mysterious
sound on the Canadian US border. Since about twenty eleven,
people in Windsor Ontario and the area were reporting a weird,
(22:51):
weird hum. Nobody knew what it was. Some people were
saying secret government plans, usos UFOs, extra dimensional stuff, all
the exciting stuff, all the hits, all the jazz. But
just a few days before we recorded this episode, the
announcement the news came on July twenty seventh. We're recording
(23:11):
this On July twenty ninth, one of our theories from
windsor hum was proven correct. The US Steel facility on
Zug Island went into idle mode as the company scaled
back operations across its Great Lakes facilities. And according to
a guy named Colin Novak, who we may have cited
in that episode, he's the lead researcher for the Canadian
(23:34):
study into the hum. According to him, as soon as
that Zug Island facility went quiet, the hum vanished. So
no aliens, or at least maybe the aliens were working
at the factory. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Yeah, it's crazy to you know, we're talking today about
a ping and we're referring to this one, and it
is kind of known in popular culture I guess as
a hum, but I mean residents were describing it as
like almost a sub you know, sub base kind of
rumble that would actually like vibrate pictures off the wall
and make some people sick, you know. I mean, there's
a whole episode about it. But that plant that we're
(24:09):
talking about, I think they determined that it was caused
by like a process of like venting pressure from some
of the equipment that that was very very very loud
and actually carried uh all the way to the residence
of windsor pretty cool.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
Wow, that's that's weird that we can come and say
that to you today. It felt like a mystery that
was going to be around for a while, but now
it's gone. You guys doing the world.
Speaker 2 (24:39):
Our success rate is if you look at if you
define success as in solving these things, our success rate
is pretty abysmal. But but this alone, this kind of
theory does not solve the case of the nunavutping because
there are some problems with this explanation.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Yes, that's Corre, the Baffin Iron Mines Corporation. So they
ended up speaking with Canadian media and essentially they said, yes,
they do have a mine on the Mary River, which
is southwest of Pond Inlet. Another inlet in the area.
They had not been conducting any surveys of the sonar
type in the area where the ping had been observed,
(25:20):
and they didn't they didn't even have any equipment in
the water, especially at the bottom of the sea there
or of the strait, I guess. So it does feel
as though, at least if they are telling the truth,
that that this may not be the explanation. And if
you don't want to just trust the company's words, you
(25:42):
can look to the local politicians who have also verified
that there weren't any official permits that were issued for
this company for construction or for other kinds of work
like blasting hydrography, which is a fun term as well,
and there was no there was no official permits for
work that would explain those sounds originating from that company.
(26:05):
But again, you're trusting politicians then, right, So.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Yeah, but still in either case, back to the conspiracy
drawing board on this one. There's another theory that was
pretty popular in the local population that reminded me in
a way of allegation. Well, it's an allegation of eco
terrorism kind of and it reminds me of like Captain
(26:31):
Planet kind of fights. So what if the ping is
coming not from a mining corporation but from those nefarious
ne'er do wells over at Greenpeace. Oh, I know, right,
So what if? What if green Peace is the culprit
here for people who believe this The motivation of this
(26:52):
organization is to use the ping or some kind of
sonar device to scare wildlife away from the huntunting grounds
during this peak hunting season. This theory does not come
from thin air. It's not likely that someone just made
it up to troll people. Green Peace and the local
population have had ten six changes in the past, and
(27:15):
that was largely due to green Peace as historical opposition
to seal hunting in the nineteen seventies and nineteen eighties,
so decades ago. But there's still probably some bad blood,
or at the very least some distrust.
Speaker 4 (27:29):
So the big question here is would an environmental group
like green Peace purposefully disrupt what's going on with the
natural behaviors of a large group of animals in some
roundabout way to save them. It's definitely one of those
things that feels like, Okay, I guess in a Doctor
Evil style green Peace maneuver, but it definitely it definitely
(27:53):
feels off to me like that wouldn't be It wouldn't
be a good idea because you changed the patterns of
those animals, where they live, where they hunt, where they feed,
You're going to cause some disastrous effects. Probably, yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:07):
It First, to your point, it feels circuitous there I say,
Rube Goldberg esque. And secondly, it seems like a textbook
example of a situation where someone is choosing the lesser evil.
It feels like it would be anomalous for Greenpeace to
take that kind of course of action. That doesn't mean
it's not true, It just it seems weird and it
(28:30):
seems out a character. Green Peace denies this accusation the
same way that the mining corporation denied the accusation. In fact,
a spokesperson for Greenpeace, one Farah Khan, said quote, not
only would we not do anything to harm marine life,
but we very much respect the right of Inuit to
hunt and would definitely not want to impact that in
(28:52):
any way. This is important because it means not only
does green Peace not want to mess with the animals,
they're also say they don't want to mess with Inuit
hunting traditions. So their argument render if true, renders the
whole conspiratorial concept moot, because they're saying, first, we didn't
(29:15):
do that, and second, if there was something we could
do to disrupt this hunting season, we wouldn't do it
anyway because we think it's an important cultural practice. So
they're basically saying, you know, it's not our battle, not
our hill to die on. Additionally, to your point, Matt,
if you don't believe greenpeace anymore than you believe mining corporations,
(29:37):
we can note that government officials note no one has
seen a craft of any sort capable of carrying and
dropping sonar going through the area, or putting anything into
the water that you know would function as is so
in our device capable of creating this sound, etc. And
that all means boom, back to the conspiracy drawing board
(29:59):
we go. And this brings us to a third theory,
which I would say is I don't want to call
it fun, but it's fascinating, and I think we might
differ on our opinions of the plausibility here, guys, because
I I'm a little more pro conspiracy on this theory.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
In particular.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
Wait, wait, Ben, are you talking about submarines.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
Not just the sandwiches?
Speaker 1 (30:28):
Matt, We did an.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Episode not long ago on submarines, older submarines, and the
tech that was available, you know, back during the Cold
War days, was so advanced you can only imagine that
there might be something lurking out there in the waters
that nobody can detect.
Speaker 3 (30:47):
Yeah, in that same episode, we talked about how there's
no question that sonar really jacks with marine animals, especially whales.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
And dolphins me and so many of them use their.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Own form of sonar to communicate, and this absolutely can
throw a real wrench in that system. And I mean,
the whole point of many of these submarines is to
swim under the radar. So if there were more advanced
versions of these things, we probably wouldn't know about it,
whether domestic or foreign. So to your point, Matt, who's
(31:20):
to say that some newer version of this technology doesn't
exist that either sounds different or acts a little different,
but still clearly, you know, disrupts marine life. But the
Canadian military has ruled out the presence of both domestic
and foreign subs in the area, at least that's what
they're saying in their official statements of the public. But
(31:41):
who knows how.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Accurate that might be.
Speaker 4 (31:45):
I would just say, remember where we are in the world.
Right We're at the northern top of Canada, and I
would say just across the Arctic Ocean. It is a
pretty vast distance from that area to Russia. But if
you're thinking about it with a Cold War mindset, which
(32:06):
I'm not going to say is gone from governments on
either side of that original conflict. It's evolved, certainly, But
if you're thinking about it in that way, then there
might be a strategic reason to be floating around in
the waters there.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
I'm gonna save it.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
I'm gonna save it.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
I'm gonna save it. Well, we'll get back to this,
but I completely agree with you, Matt, completely agree spoiler alert.
But let's say, just for the sake of maritime argument,
we say, okay, maybe that's not one hundred percent it.
We'll head back halfheartedly with caveats to the conspiracy drawing board.
As DJ Collin would say, another one. You see, there
(32:53):
is a fourth theory, conspiracy realist. It proposes that the
sounds were being emitted by essentially a science project in
the Arctic, funded not by Canada but by the United States,
specifically by the Office of Naval Research in the US,
this is called the Canada Basin Acoustic Propagation Experiment or
(33:18):
what would you can pay that?
Speaker 3 (33:21):
Do you think DJ Collin has anything to do with this?
Do you think this is why he hasn't released any
new material in so long, He's just been working on this.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
I'm gonna ask. I'm gonna ask if DJ Collin has
released his own.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Material another one, another sickburn against.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
He's been great to us, He's a good friend of
the show. Actually, I love hearing the contracts. It's a
guilty pleasure.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
I wish you always you always know, you always know
it's him. Yes, it reminds me of those like those
mix or the you know when you buy a beat
on the internet and you don't pay the full price,
you need to get the sample. Occasionally in the background
it'll be like like six sounds twenty ninety and then
(34:11):
you know when you buy it, that goes away. It's
like an audio watermark. That's what DJ Khala does. He's
like a human audio watermark.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Well, yeah, and he certainly experiments with sounds right.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
Oh, well, after I was getting at maybe this is
his This is his new material, Canapey, which also a
delightful French savory dish.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
A cannopey. I think it's kind of like a crape.
I'm sure it is irrelevant.
Speaker 4 (34:42):
I have no idea I've heard I've heard the term though.
But but this, this project, called the Canada Based Acoustic
Propagation Experiment or canna PAY, it's really interesting, uses low
frequency sounds to try and figure out the ongoing changes
that are occurring in that general area with regards to
(35:02):
sea ice and how the how those changes. So if
you're as you're having less or more ice in an area,
how does that affect acoustics? So that sounds really interesting,
and they're thinking that this project could produce some data
for use in tracking submarines way up there in the
(35:23):
Arctic or just far north in general, like we're talking about,
uh oh, are submarines making a comeback already?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
Another one?
Speaker 1 (35:33):
It's the dust. But we have an expert, that's right.
Speaker 3 (35:36):
We have an expert by the name of Peter either
Worchester or Worcester guess, depending on which part of the
country you come from or if you're English. But he
is a member of the Script's Institution of Oceanography at
the University of California, And he said that the sound
being generated by CANape, which by the way, is a
(35:56):
small amuse boosh that you might see on a tray
carried by a waiter at a party with little little
things on it, like a little smoked salmon perhaps, But
it's also this thing. But the sound emitted by Canna
Pay the sounds rather are very low and too far
away to be heard in the fury and heckless strait. Okay,
so this he's ruling this out for for the for
(36:19):
the ping.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
Now what does make sense? The project is focused on
low frequency sounds, right, and we're talking about a very
high pitched for high frequency sound.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
So yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
And one of the issues too, which Worster brings up,
is the problem of time, right, and and and distance.
So this experiment uh the sound to be responsible for
the nunavu ping, these experiments would have to travel very well,
(36:51):
a pretty long way, and it would still have to
be distinct from the ambience background noise, right, that's gonna occur.
So Worster outlines, you know how quickly this would dissipate
in the background noise, and instead he proposes another culprit,
a returning culprit that some of us may recognize from
(37:13):
our earlier episode on the bloop and he says it
could be Arctic ice, that could be the kaiser, so's
a here, and he notes that much of the acoustic
noise in the Arctic is caused by ice rubbing together
and cracking, sliding against itself, and moving. And favorite fact
about today's episode is that this is a known phantom
(37:35):
sound dating back to the days of early Arctic explorers. Well,
let me copy at that early European Arctic explorers. They
knew about these sounds. They were so common that Arctic
explorers in that age called these noises the devil's symphony.
How cool is that? And the descriptions ranged it kind
(37:59):
of had the same some of the same sounds we
hear the nunavuok ping being described as They would say
there was a buzz maybe kind of a really low hum,
and then they also said wheezing and loud bangs there.
I don't think there's a nunavu wheeze yet, but that
would really creep me out. Can you imagine beat out
in the far North and then you just hear this
(38:20):
sort of.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
That sounds is pretty cool. Actually like some kind of
experimental music. What if you were listening to the Devil's
Symphony while smoking the Devil's lettuce.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Bad combination, probably so or maybe great, who knows, but yeah,
that been that right there is the best fact of
this whole thing. And you right now can go on
YouTube and other places and hear sounds of ice in
both the Arctic and Antarctic, and just the incredible range
(38:55):
of tones and frequencies that you can get out of
ice interact with itself and other chunks of ice.
Speaker 3 (39:02):
I can only imagine. I mean, you know, cracks. The
ice is like a man. I mean, think of like
the ocean, how far it extends. I mean, so many
of these bodies of ice are just take up just
as much, not just as much, but.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Are very very you know, wide ranging.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
And for cracks to be spreading, you know, all at
the same time slowly and kind of these slow creaking
crack sounds like that really does sound pretty haunting just
to consider, especially if they were making like sympathetic tones
and causing.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
These kind of weird vibration sounds.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
And as reports of this ping grew or appeared to grow,
the Canadian government, including the members of the legislature that
we mentioned earlier eventually decided to investigate and to escalate
this to get the military involved, which I think just
I think is another interesting argument for the sub theory.
(39:59):
But what are we talking. We'll tell you after a
word from our sponsor, and we're.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Back and the government has become involved. Oh Canadian government,
what did you do? Well? In November of twenty sixteen,
they conducted several searches of the area using sound equipment. Essentially,
the military went through there and they were unable to
(40:31):
determine what was causing whatever these quote acoustic anomalies were.
Speaker 3 (40:37):
Yeah, I believe they flew over the ocean with multi
sensor you know, scans essentially trying to find the origin,
but they couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (40:47):
Yeah, they did, but it was a it was a
large jet or a plane.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
Right.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
I'm confused about that too, Matt, Like that makes so
much noise in and of itself, Like, not not that
we're acoustic specialists or anything, but a little weird. I
think they do it with a boat with the motors
turned off or something, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (41:03):
Like, it does seem as though if you are getting
your initial reports from you know, a boat or a
ship traveling through that straight You would also in kind
send some kind of vessel through there with equipment sonar, acoustic,
or otherwise, just to test to see if you could
(41:24):
repeat it, rather than sending a plane over. But maybe
that's just to my ears.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
ROV's a magnetometer. We do have to we do have
to keep in mind, however, that the relative inaccessibility of
this area and the size plays a role. Knowing something
or thinking something originates from the seafloor doesn't get you
out of that needle in a haystack situation. It just
(41:50):
points you to like a rough area of the hay
you know what. It just moves the haystack to the
sea floor. That's all it does.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
It's a great point.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
And in twenty seventeen they decided to well, they did
find something in their search, which doesn't particularly surprising. They
found two pods of whales and six walruses, so they
didn't come up completely empty handed.
Speaker 2 (42:12):
But in twenty seventeen, oh wait, wait, one point though
about the walruses. What I love about the way this
is presented when you read about it is that it's
a total of six walruses. So I love that there.
It sounds like they're consistently discovering a walrus and it
keeps them going. So maybe my crazy conspiracy about this
(42:32):
is a seventh walrus. They just turned around too soon.
Speaker 3 (42:36):
I couldn't agree with you or Ben, but you know,
they didn't let this dampen their.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Spirits too much.
Speaker 3 (42:42):
In twenty seventeen, the Army had plans to send two
acoustic specialists to Eglulik to learn more about the ping
and just kind of like pull the locals, ask around,
like see who had heard it, what they thought it
sounded like. Seems like a smart move, So they ended
up sending one instead, a guy named Doug Brown no relation.
(43:04):
Brown was at Aglouick for a total of nine days
in January of that year, twenty seventeen. And here's some
things that he accomplished while he was there.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Well, the first thing that he didn't accomplish was recording
anything as far as audio goes of the strait or
the water or any pings whatsoever. Again, the according to them,
and according to the work that Doug Brown was commissioned
to do, the militariat attempted to record those sounds, and
(43:36):
they were unable to do so, so they sent him
there with a very different mission. He was instead interviewing
residents and locals as well as officials, and attempting to
just get as much information as he could about what
they had heard.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
You don't think sending an acoustic specialist without like a
field recorder sort of like sending a photographer without a camera.
Speaker 1 (43:59):
That's a little weird.
Speaker 4 (44:01):
That's precisely what it sounds like to me.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Yeah, and it's true.
Speaker 3 (44:04):
I mean, I don't know if he brought that stuff
or what, or just decided to leave it in his bag.
But in that nine day span he was there, he
didn't make a single recording. Instead, he just talked to
folks to try to get their perspective. Doesn't seem like
it would necessarily take an acoustic specialist to do that,
but who far be it for me to question the
judgment of the Canadian government. He did play sound examples
(44:29):
for the locals. It does it sound like this, here's
a sonar ping ping.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
You wasn't quite like that.
Speaker 3 (44:35):
It was a little more of a pew, you know.
That's that's maybe the response. But who knows, because he
I wonder if he recorded the interviews.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
That's a good question. And he asked.
Speaker 3 (44:45):
If anybody knew who had heard the sound, and they
said no, that nobody in their community or organization had
heard any of the pinging sounds.
Speaker 2 (44:56):
He also noted that the people he spoke with in
the community were much less concerned about what the media
called the mystery of the ping Instead, they were intensely
concerned about the lack of migration of the narwhale and
the walrus and other marine animals up to the Fury
and Heckless Strait. He was, you know, he did his
(45:20):
best to say, here's maybe a reason why, and he
wanted to answer their question and they're you know, address
their concern So he told them that the lack of
animals may be due to the environmental issues that have
been occurring and escalating in the North over the past
few years. And he said, you know, these issues may
(45:41):
have led to the animals just not migrating as far
as they once did. So the animals are still around, right,
They're just not at the same historical range. And then
in a he got a lot of help from rangers
who were based in the town and speak the local dialect,
because not every especially older members of the community don't
(46:06):
just speak that dialect. And so he went to that
local radio station and he had one of the rangers
put out a message translated from English to this language
and said, hey, you know, we want to hear from you.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
Have you heard this ping?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Have you experienced it? Do you have a recording? Let
us know? And nobody answered. For one reason or another,
nobody answered, but I want to go back here. They're
interesting things about Doug Brown's investigation. He says, there's no
viable reason to put sonar in the area, so he
(46:47):
rejects the sonar claim. He says, the current is too strong,
there's too much ambient and background noise. Even if you
wanted to do it, you wouldn't get workable results, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (47:00):
I mean, you know, we've seen plenty of examples of
the media maybe rolling with the story before confirming all
the details because it sounded cool. There's, you know, a
way to kind of sex up something that maybe there
isn't confirmed evidence for. It's not to say they're making
things up out of whole cloth, but we've definitely seen
this in our research time and time again. So could
(47:20):
the ping possibly have just been a rumor that got
out of hand. I mean, it seems to me that
the biggest report that we've heard of in this case
is those folks on the boat from the top of
the show that didn't record it on their cell phone.
And I don't even think we had names, So it
certainly sounds like that's possible. And then it could have
potentially been kind of, let's say, escalated based on something
(47:47):
that we all know well, the idea of fear, the
idea of being concerned about self preservation and something that's
out of your control to maybe explain it away or
to at the very least, you know, a sign something
to blame, and that would be the changes in migratory routes,
this notion that these sea creatures, sea mammals that were
(48:10):
so commonly seen in that particular area were gone this year.
But we also know that there's other things that can
lead to changes in migratory routes.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
Right, Yeah, I want to go back to second interesting
point about Doug Brown's investigation. I think speaks to what
you're talking about. There's an interview you can read with
Vice and they do excellent work, especially through Motherboard, where
Brown says, you know, he doubles down.
Speaker 1 (48:38):
He says, I.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
Never spoke to a single person who said that they
had any faith in the reality of this ping, much
less said they had heard it themselves. And in fact,
when he spoke with members of the Legislative Assembly, he
asked them, you know, the day one question you would
ask in this situation, he said, why does it seem
(49:01):
like so many papers initially reported hearing this noise, and
the legislative members said that was a quote misunderstanding of
the media. No one in the community, as far as
this assembly person knew, had actually heard the ping. And
this is odd because it wasn't just one paper reporting
these eyewitnesses accounts. With this, the Army thus considered the
(49:26):
case closed, and now it leaves us with several possibilities.
One is the idea that you brought up second ago, Nol,
the change of migratory patterns. That's something people can't really
fight immediately, right. That stuff has to change over time.
It's like a train. It takes a while to get
started and it takes a while to stop. But as
(49:48):
we were talking about earlier before the break, Matt, let's
go back to the possible submarines cover up idea. So
when Doug Brown, after he was sent to the area,
the government considered the case close and they pretty much
shut down this story, any further investigation, any official comment.
They were basically saying they want none of it.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
I've never accused.
Speaker 2 (50:14):
I'm I was, you know, fellow listeners, I was writing,
I was writing to the gang off air, and I
was like, I refuse to apologize for this terrible pun.
I'm sneaking in and no, I feel lighter.
Speaker 1 (50:26):
I feel like you're certainly not alone.
Speaker 3 (50:29):
I mean, I'm looking at the YouTube comments on the
video that I was talking about about reasons you should
move to none of it, and the first comment say
is how much of that province is inhabitable?
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Answer? None of it?
Speaker 4 (50:41):
Oh sick burns all day.
Speaker 3 (50:45):
And then and then and then everyone and then everyone
proceeded to school this guy. It's not a province, you moron,
It's territory. So you're a big dumb, dumb head and
your pun was bad.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
And there's there's no solid proof of any cover up
at this point, Like there's no declassified documentation, there's no
deathbed confession, no former intelligence officer or anything. But there
is solid proof to your earlier point Matt, that the
melting ice of the Arctic Circle has made the region
a geopolitical hot spot. Think about it. There are billions
(51:20):
of dollars to be made in future Arctic shipping routes.
There are also potentially billions of dollars to be made
in extracting resources from this area. It is therefore, at
least this is kind of my opinion. It's not a fact,
it's speculation, but it is one hundred percent plausible that
foreign powers, including the US, Russia, heck, throw China in
(51:42):
the pile. As long as we're adding up scary superpowers,
they could be snooping around. And to your point about
hidden technology, Noal, it's possible they could be doing it
largely undetected. The motivations are there.
Speaker 4 (51:56):
If not, the means, hey don't discount the Canadian Secret
Submarine Group whatever it is called. There's I don't even
know if it exists, but there's gotta be one, right,
There's got to be some kind of secret Canadian super
cold submarines.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
They're so cool, but I just I couldn't. I couldn't
be in one for a long time. I don't know
about you, guys, I think I would I don't think
I would deal with it.
Speaker 1 (52:25):
Well, yeah, do you have any kind of claustrophobia?
Speaker 5 (52:29):
Ben?
Speaker 2 (52:30):
No?
Speaker 3 (52:31):
No, I mean I I guess I've never really been
in a situation where where it would be that bad.
But I do have dreams sometimes where I'm like packed
into like a pipe or something, you know, and it's
not pleasant. The idea of being buried in a coffin
really freaks me out. So that's sort of how it
seems like it would be only for a very very
long time.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
It takes us space. I mean, it's a rare set
of skills. You know, people who are submarriners are dedicated
and focused.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
You'd have to be.
Speaker 3 (52:57):
And I didn't mean to imply that you'd be on
a submarine for a longer time than you'd be buried
in a coffin.
Speaker 1 (53:02):
That's a weird thing to say. I apologize.
Speaker 4 (53:05):
It's totally fine. I mean, you can imagine just the
horrors of submarine flatulence and.
Speaker 3 (53:13):
Just I mean, we talked about this last subs came up.
Just the overall smelliness of it all. It's definitely a thing.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
Yep, it is, And everybody listening to this currently on
a submarine give us your favorite or your weirdest sub
smells stories. You can contact us directly anytime of day
or night. There's one last note for this. We've laid
out the broad categories the possibilities here. But whatever the
(53:47):
ping is, whether or not it actually exists, there is
one thing for sure. We do not need some mysterious
noise to explain the increasing decline in animal populations.
Speaker 1 (53:58):
We have the culprit for that.
Speaker 2 (54:00):
It's us, it's human civilization. We will kill these animals
out soon enough. And then this is not to be preachy.
These are these are just facts. This is the process.
These animals are specially adapted for a specific environment, and
that environment will will likely cease to exist. So if
(54:23):
you if you feel bad about that, go check out
polar bears. While you can be careful, they will kill you.
They are dangerous, dangerous things. But but you know, I mean,
we're it's it's ridiculous to ignore the fact, the objective
truth of the matter, and this is a show that
(54:43):
deals in facts, is that this this, this question about
the ping may well be moot. The animals are disappearing,
That's that's just true.
Speaker 3 (54:53):
Well, and you know, not only are the animals disappearing.
The ice is disappearing, and that's the product of climate change.
And when the climate changes, the animals they find other
places that are more suitable to their climate needs. So
I do certainly think that that does seem to be
the most plausible explanation here, because unlike the winds are
(55:16):
hum the none of it ping has not been solved
and remains something of a mystery.
Speaker 4 (55:23):
You're right, at least a mystery for now until we
discover that sub terrestrial submarine base at the bottom of
that street, which we will find in twenty twenty six.
It'll take a while, but we'll get there. I'm joking,
of course. But you know, there is one thing here
(55:46):
that we didn't really discuss.
Speaker 1 (55:48):
Yes, what if the.
Speaker 4 (55:51):
Sound wasn't mechanical in nature, or a vehicle or an
experimental piece of machinery. What if it was biological?
Speaker 2 (56:01):
What are you saying, Matt, Are you saying some sort
of unknown organism could be responsible? It could be scaring
off the other known animals. Careful, my friends, we teeter
on the precipice of cryptozoology.
Speaker 6 (56:16):
Oh dare we You mean like a locknested monster kind
of situation, Like a giant Arctic sea monster maybe.
Speaker 4 (56:27):
But you'll have to wait until next episode to hear
about it.
Speaker 3 (56:32):
That you are a mischievous devil and I love it.
Speaker 2 (56:36):
Yes, yeah, a sea monster. Oh gosh, guys, the gates
of possibility are flung wide open. The horizon of creepy
stuff rushes forward from the future to meet us.
Speaker 3 (56:49):
You guys know, the only thing I'm scared of more
than like birds is giant underwater monsters.
Speaker 4 (56:56):
Really, Ah, yeah, I think.
Speaker 1 (56:58):
I talked about it a while back on an episode.
Speaker 3 (57:00):
I always have dreams that I'm like in this vast
sea and there's a giant presence beneath me, and I
sense it. And that's not that I'm worried about getting eaten.
It's just the very existence and presence and being in
the proximity of such a thing as very Oh it
makes my blood run cold.
Speaker 2 (57:17):
So what do you think, folks? You know, in the
past episodes, we've seen mysterious noises traced to industry, like
the windsor hum or, natural causes like shifting earth or ice.
That would be that's the most widely accepted explanation.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
For the bloop.
Speaker 2 (57:33):
But do you think there's something else?
Speaker 1 (57:35):
Here.
Speaker 2 (57:35):
Do you think there's a mystery afoot? Do you think
there's a sea creature? Do you think there's a mundane explanation?
Do you think there's some kind of difference between what's
actually happening and the official narrative? Have you yourself heard
this ping? If so, we want to hear from you.
Speaker 4 (57:51):
Yes, please find us on social media where we are
Conspiracy Stuff on Twitter and Facebook. You can find us
on Instagram at conspirac Stuff Show. If you don't want
to do those things you don't like social media, you
can give us a call. Our number is one eight
three three std WYTK. Leave a message. You may find
(58:13):
yourself on one of our new listener Mail episodes, or
you may inspire us to make an episode such as
this one. You can say whatever you want. You will
not be censored. Just let us know if you want
to be on the air or not.
Speaker 1 (58:25):
And if that's not your thing.
Speaker 3 (58:26):
You can find us on other forms of social media
where we are Conspiracy Stuff or Conspiracy Stuff Show. If
you'd like to be a member of our Facebook group,
here's where it gets crazy. You just go right on there,
search for it'll come right up and just name one
of the three of us or super producer Paul, Mission
controlled decant or superroducer Alexis nickname TBD Jackson. We'll bring
(58:48):
in some in email, some suggestions. I don't think we
should air them here. You can do that, and we
tend to hang out in that group from time to
time and respond to memes and posts and questions and
it's a lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (59:01):
So check that out.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
And if none of that's quite bags who are figurative
conspiratorial badgers.
Speaker 1 (59:07):
But you're thinking I have.
Speaker 2 (59:09):
A story, you guys need to hear more importantly, have
a story my fellow listeners need to hear. Then you
can always contact us any old time of day, any
old time of the year at our good old fashioned
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Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
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Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Burden
The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.