July 1, 2016 • 50 mins
Public wifi can be an enormously convenient thing -- it helps people dodge data charges in coffee shops, airports and other places around the globe. But how safe is it? Tune in to learn more.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know. Hello,
welcome back to the show. My name is Max, my
(00:22):
name is No. They often call me Ben. You are you?
This is stuff they don't want you to know. And
let's start with a question for those of you tuning in,
how are you listening to this show? And I don't
just necessarily mean like a boom box, which would be cool.
I don't know if our shows are on cassette yet
or are you downloading it? Have you streamed it? And
(00:44):
if so, where are you streaming it from. If you're
like most people, you have concerns about your data plan
on your phone, and you probably want to use WiFi.
Holy Grail, I certainly do. If I'm going to listen
to a podcast, I download it through WiFi and then
throwing on my phone so I can have it for
later because I've trust issues, you know. Speaking of trust issues,
(01:06):
A T and T totally bamboozled me out of my
unlimited data plan to lower my bill a little bit
because I felt like it was a little too high
and they're like, well, you know, if you give up
your limited data because you're clearly not using it, we
can give you this amount of data and you know
you'll be good as gold. Well, it turns out that
I exceeded just so every single month, even with Pop. Yeah,
(01:28):
so WiFi is huge because these phone companies are tightening
down data, so it's a lot more restrictive these days.
They have these plans, these tiered plans, where you are
paying for every little bit of data that you use,
much more so than in the past. So the obvious
choices to find WiFi anywhere and everywhere that you possibly can.
(01:49):
So a lot of people would ask what is WiFi?
It's one of those things that the average human being
just sort of accepts as existing. You know, a lot
of people own cars but have no idea how they work.
A lot of people own phones, have no idea how
they work. WiFi is something that people just sort of accept.
(02:09):
You're in an airport, boom, free WiFi. That's great. Your
You could be at a restaurant at a dentist office.
There's a pizza place next to our office that I
go to just because they have free WiFi. But what
is this stuff. WiFi is the name of any wireless
networking technology that uses radio waves to send out high
(02:30):
speed network and internet connections. And it's it's such a
cool little term, almost like podcast and have a coined
little buzz term. And there is a organization, as it
turns out, that owns the rights to this trademark called
the WiFi Alliance. In a burst of creativity, Yes, uh,
WiFi is a registered trademark and it's in This alliance
(02:53):
specifically defines WiFi as a wireless local area network w
LAND products that are based on the Institute of Electrical
and Electronics Engineers or I literally I Strickland by the way,
I hope be so glad to hear that. Um. Their
standards are at two dot eleven. The greatest thing about
(03:15):
WiFi is that you no longer have to plug in
a giant ethernet cable to get access to that beautiful,
sweet sweet Internet with all the things that you love,
all the the podcasts and videos and everything you do
on their Uh that's the best part about it. So
it uses radio frequencies to transfer all the information of packets,
all the packets of information rather from your computer to
(03:37):
the access point to the Internet essentially through all the
chain of servers that it goes through to get to
its end point, and then right back through all that
stuff through the access point to your computer. Just a
lovely little handshaking connection. Yeah, this RF current hits and
antenna creating an electromagnetic field that's able to propagate through space.
(04:00):
That's so cool. That's so science fiction e E E you know,
uh right right it is. It's the magic that we
just sort of accept And a lot of a lot
of current society in the West is built on the
premise of just accepting things because they are. That way,
we drive these death machines ad plus miles an hour
(04:22):
and just accept that. Everyone will pretend those yellow lines
in the middle are doing something much smarter people than
I figured out how to use radio waves so that
I can go on Reddit dot com. Uh, and I
just accepted we stand on the shoulders of giants, and
every great invention you know is only uh is only
(04:43):
capable of being discovered or created because of prior inventions.
I guess we're getting a little spacey already, you know. Uh.
Space is the place, my friend, Space is the place
you're you're killing it with the slogans lately there is
a lot more space than stuff. Yes. Yeah, we received
a great is it a YouTube comment or an email
where where someone pointed out on our live show recording
(05:05):
that we released that the table. Yeah, I hit the
tables and banging on and they're like, you do realize
that there's a lot more empty space in that table
than atoms, And I was like absolutely wow. So to
propagate through this mostly empty space, your WiFi connection uses
an electromagnetic field radio frequencies, and the primary job of
(05:29):
an access point is to broadcast this wireless signal that
your computer can detect. And just like a radio, just
like searching for radio station you can tune into to
connect to an access point. To join a wireless network,
these computers or these devices have to be equipped with
wireless network adapters. Pretty simple, right, Yeah. And and the
(05:50):
great thing about it is it's not just your computer
that connects to it. It's anyone who can see the
network and has an adapter. Right, So who is anyone
within your lifetime listeners? Depending on how young or old
you are when you were born, you have probably seen
(06:11):
a precipitous rise in the amount of people hopping online
around of the world population has some sort of Internet connection.
It's got to the point where it's almost considered like
a human right, I mean they're trying. There are all
these efforts to bring Internet access to more rural areas
(06:32):
and you know, third world countries and things. I mean,
it's become this thing that we expect. Yeah, in less
than one percent of the globe had some kind of connection.
So in slightly less than two decades, we've gone from
one percent to nearly half of the world's population. Are
you guys part of the one percent with a like
(06:55):
an old, old old modem, Yes, definitely, I think got me.
I think my parents may have had a O L.
We're you guys. Yeah, we had a o L and
we had compy served remember that. And I had a
friend who had Prodigy. Remember Prodigy. Not I am the
fire Starter, but the I am the Internet service productive
(07:16):
the same same people. Actually, seriously, No, that was a
good sigh. Yeah, that's a that's a good site gig.
And if the band's Prodigy had been part of the
Internet service Prodigy, they may have met with more long
term success for a while. Because the number of Internet
(07:37):
users has increased tenfold from two thirteen. So what do
we mean when we say, well, we mean that in
two thousand five we reached the first time in history
that a billion people could get on the internet. Two
thousand ten it was two billion, and then it was
three billion. And there's some really cool infographics you can grab.
(08:00):
Internet Live Stats is a pretty cool one if you
want to visit that, not while you're driving, if you're
driving as you listen to this, when you get a chance,
check out Internet live Stats. It will give you the
running tally of how many people have access to the Internet.
And the number just keeps it going and going and going,
and it's a live ticker. It's pretty great. Right now,
it's at three point four oh one billion, thousand three
(08:26):
nine and counting, yes and counter and we'll come back
right Well, so what we should do is come back
at the end of the episode and see how many
new listeners, how many new Internet users have joined us. So,
like we were saying at the top of the show,
beyond just expecting to have Internet access, which we do
part of our job, we definitely need it. Um, we
(08:48):
have come to a place where we expect that in
many public places, public settings, there's going to be free
and efficient wireless internet. Like what what kind of places? Well, sure,
I mean like cafes for example, you know Starbucks. It
is part and parcel of the Starbucks model to go there,
get your seven dollar prapolatte, and you know, enjoy some
(09:12):
Internet surfing, whether it's on your smartphone or your laptop
or you're doing work. A lot of people who work
remotely like to go to coffee shops. You are literally
using this businesses internet access for your business free of charge,
and it gets you there, and it's that's become kind
of like a added benefit of like, you know, going
to certain stores like Target for example, they have free
(09:34):
WiFi and they also have a little cafe there. Beyond that,
you've got airports, which Matt and I were talking before
the show. We've been doing a bit of traveling lately,
and we're starting to realize that airports have kind of
wised up a little bit. You're a bit of a
captive audience at the airport, and you know, you don't
really have a choice as to whether you hang out
in that terminal or not. So they don't always have
free internet. L a x Will, for instance, they have
(09:57):
a model where a user will it one hour free
and then need to pay for additional time. I hope
you didn't get delayed. In case anyone's interested and want
to know which airports do have free wife WiFi, there
is a site called air fair watchdog dot com that
has a WiFi access chart. Yeah, so that you don't
(10:18):
you don't get stuck out out there. But you know what,
we don't always have to be connected. I'm just gonna say,
you can bring a book hotels. Though hotel hotels want
you to have a pleasant stay. They want everything to
be just. So you're paying out the nose for a
hotel room, you're gonna get decent internet access as part
of your stay, unless you're in Alberton, Georgia. Uh recently.
(10:41):
I mean, I mean the access was there. It was there.
It was just snail's pace. It was like dial up speed.
But that's neither here nor there. Well, I was gonna say,
just a quick story, just a quick story. We had
ami fi uh one of these little access points to
use wireless uh data like through Verizon or another service
(11:02):
like this, and that was what ten times faster easily
to make fair, those little boxes do kind of kick um.
But then we've got like other places like museums, aquariums, hospitals, libraries.
More and more we're having outdoor access that's even provided
by cities. So let's do a hypothetical situation. Let's say Matt,
(11:25):
you're going to be our main character, and Nolan I
are going to tell the story of what happened to you. Uh,
let's say, you know, let's let's begin it this way.
One day, one afternoon, a traveler named Matt Frederick arrives
at the Colorado Airport and he just sits down in
(11:50):
one of the terminals you mentioned earlier. No, do you
remember specifically what he was doing. Oh? Sure, he had
a little time to kill and he wanted to maybe
catch up on his social media, looking at his stock tickers,
maybe check his his bank account and foe make sure
that his cash flow is good for the sweet trip
that he was about to go on. And he got
his frap his frapolatte in hand, laptop in lap like
(12:15):
you do, and up opens it up. Bam, pay dirt.
You know what's interesting here for our traveler is that
he notices there are several free WiFi points. Two of
them say free public WiFi. One of them says, just
(12:37):
airport WiFi looks good. Let's click on this one, And
that's how they get his bank account information, That's how
they get his log in for Twitter, for Facebook, for
let's see what else you want my trade trade yeah,
(12:58):
farmers only yeah, and you know whatever else. And it's
because there's this illusion of safety, and it's the same
illusion of safety that we find when people are driving
at high speeds on the highway right in traffic. The
convenience of WiFi, just like the convenience of driving on
an interstate, often leads us to mistakenly believe that it's
(13:19):
got to be safe. Everybody else is doing it right.
There are certain rules you have to follow, and everyone's
following them. That's because we live in a society that
teaches us if something if you're in a public place
and there are multiple people doing something, then you are
somehow safe. But that is also the exact reason a
hacker would choose a terminal at the Denver airport to
(13:42):
set up something that just says airport WiFi or free WiFi.
I haven't checked the charpnel, but it's quite possible that
all three of those points are just separate hackers. Yeah,
it's a perfect hunting ground. And then and they're like,
we need Matt Frederick's Twitter. Yeah, yeah, I think of
the change we could affect. Yeah, I wish I had
(14:05):
a Twitter, so that would make sense. Yeah, I'm gonna
start one for this you start one for this episode.
So you know, we had talked at the top of
the show about Mr Robot, who's working with us on
this episode. And one thing that is really cool. You
guys were hipped to Mr Robot before I was. But
in the very first episode is a mild spoiler alert.
(14:29):
We see an example of WiFi gone wrong. If you
have not watched the first episode of Mr Robot Season one,
the pilot episode, go and check it out before you
listen to this. Uh, if you've seen it, then here
we go. Oh wait wait, if you haven't seen it,
go ahead, we'll wait. Okay, you're back. So, at some
(14:50):
point in the past, the main character that we identify
with in Mr Robot, Elliott. He notices that there's this
free WiFi at this place called Ron's Coffee that seems
to be a large chain of coffee shops that exist
in his world, his immediate vicinity, and this WiFi is great.
Oh man, it is so good. It's fast. In fact,
(15:12):
let's hear a little clip. Yeah something I like coming
here because your WiFi was fast. I mean, you're one
of the few spots that has a fiber connection with
gigabit speed. It's good, so good. It scratched that part
of my mind, part that doesn't allow good to exist
without condition. So I started intercepting all the traffic on
(15:35):
your network. That's when I noticed something strange. That's when
I decided to hack you. I know, you run a
website called Plato's Boys. You're using tor networking to keep
the servers anonymous. You made it really hard for anyone
to see it, but I saw it. The Onion routing protocol.
(15:56):
It's not as anonymous as you think it is. Whoever's
in control all the exit notes is also in control
of the traffic, which makes me the one in control.
And you see Elliott discovers that the owner hosts a
massive horn site, the worst kind, from his server in
the cafe, and he thinks that he's hiding this because
(16:20):
he's using something that we've talked about before tour the
Onion router, the Onion routing protocol like you said, Ben,
something we discussed before. Uh, it's got some weird ties
and I think we'll get into it a little later
on exactly how it functions. Um. But it's supposedly or
it's meant to anonymize traffic Internet traffic. Yes, but a
(16:43):
little known fact about tour for a lot of people
who assume that it is safe. When we did our
stuff on the Silk Road, you know, we learned that
tour was originally created by the US government. Yes, and
there there are a set of servers amongst the Onion
router that are the endpoint for the the the last
(17:04):
server in the chain, the exit nodes. They're they are
referred to as exit nodes, and we have seen historically
in two thousand seven and two thousand eleven a couple
other times, we've seen that if you choose and you're
operating one of these exit nodes, you can spy on
any and all traffic that goes through that server. It's
(17:26):
a it's a code between the volunteer operators that run
these things that say, hey, this is all anonymous, We're
not going to spy on these people. In the end,
it's about trust, whether or not you trust I'm saying
this correctly, the volunteers who run this stuff. So Elliott,
in a very deadpan, monotonous way, explains to Ron of
(17:52):
Ron's coffee how he hacked the WiFi and took control
of these exit nodes, meaning he could watch all the
traffic because he wondered why this WiFi connection in particular
was so extraordinarily fast, and he found out why. And
as he is telling this guy's stuff, he tells him
(18:15):
there's a strange there's like a dark humor to it
when he tells him, you know, usually I do this online,
but I'm working on my people's skills, so I wanted
to come tell you in person. And yeah, he says,
I wanted to do this one A f K right, yes,
and uh and what does a f K stays the
same as I R L I R in real life
or away from keyboard. AFK was a great thing to
(18:36):
use back in the day. I did not know that one. Yeah, well,
for mm RPGs, that was a huge thing, like like
we're just saying let b RB. Well, um, now, so
this character that's obviously like an example of a white
hat hacker where he is using his skills and you know,
hacking this WiFi network to shut down somebody doing something
(18:57):
terrible and using this technology too horrible abusive ends. What
we're talking about for this episode largely is these black
hat hackers who just want to steal your stuff or
just affect chaos in some way or another. Some people
just want to see the world burn. But what I
want to know is how vulnerable are we at the airport?
(19:19):
How vulnerable is Matt at the Denver terminal? Could this
happen in real life? And we'll get right into my
vulnerabilities right after this word from our sponsor Here's where
(19:45):
it gets crazy. The answer is absolutely yes, this could
happen in real life. Absolutely yes, we are as vulnerable
as we allow ourselves to be. Yeah. The same things
as we said that make free WiFi so can venient,
also make it potentially and in many cases likely dangerous.
(20:06):
Most the most specific thing is that no authentication is needed.
Your computer just says, hey, can I ride this ride
this crazy internet train with you? And the access point says, oh, yeah,
hop on. There's room for everyone. Yes, and everyone includes
people who are interested in taking your stuff, your personal information,
(20:29):
any other kind of info that you're sending across that signal,
compromising photographs for instance, little texts or chat messages. You're
having anything like that. Yes, so there are dangers for
our hypothetical traveler who happens to be named Matt Frederick.
He let's see, we outlined a couple of places he
(20:49):
went to, so they have access to his personal information.
But it doesn't stop there. They can also install a
thing that will follow him like a shadow, and it
will see what he does when the hackers not around,
even logs, key strokes. I mean, they're any number of little,
you know, wormy type things that can be installed remotely
(21:11):
on someone's machine that can capture all kinds of input.
It can hijack the camera. I mean, it's sort of
all all bets are off, and depending on the security,
the network itself can be subverted. Yeah, so that the
airport WiFi one that is the actual connection that the
(21:32):
Colorado Airport is set up, could then be malicious or dangerous.
If I was gonna be that hacker, I would name mine.
This is the real airport WiFi. Yeah, yeah, I would
name mine super okay, fun time, free beer, What what
could go wrong? But with emphasis on free beer? Okay,
(21:53):
So There's there's another issue that happens that this reminds
me of, and that's a t M skin me. Oh,
you know, because it works in a similar way. If
someone is skimming an a t M, what they're doing
is installing a very small piece of hardware, usually something
that looks legit, that still allows you to interface with
(22:16):
the bank or even at a gas station, and it
allows you to buy gas, to access your banking information,
pull cash out, make a deposit, etcetera. But it sets
a middleman between it so that it's also capturing your information.
And they leave these things on and they come back
and then scoop it out, and you don't know until
you become a victim of identity theft. These attacks are
(22:41):
more common than you might think because the price of
the technology is, as you know, is going down. The
software is available to anyone who wants to find it,
and there are more and more people who have these
skill sets. So what what type of threats are we
talking about? What? What? Who is out there trying to
(23:07):
take over Matt Frederick's life at the Denver Airport. Well,
I have identified a couple of my potential assailants here
and I've given them, Uh, maybe some names that aren't official,
but I'm going to call them some things. The first
one would be sniffers just looking around, Oh what is that?
What's what's that over there? Reminds me of just kind
(23:28):
of a dog that's going around the airport, just trying
to see what everything is, giving a little sniff. Is
this worth my time? Over here? Is that? Some? Is that?
Some old pizza? And maybe some banking information? Um. These
these people will use some kind of application or a
program that they would just run from their computer that
then connects up to the access point and they're going
(23:51):
to capture, you know, as much of the traffic as
they want. You can. You can break it down sometimes
depending on the application, or you can just gather everything.
And it is very disturbing if you just do a
cursory search on the internet like hacking, WiFi hacking tools,
and the number that shows up. There's lists and lists
(24:13):
of you know, there was like a list of twenty
of the best WiFi hacking tools and they're simple to use.
They'll they'll break the security on the WiFi and just
let you run amok. Uh. And then there are other types,
right like gatherers might be after you, and these people
are almost like bounty hunters, so they'll take steps to
(24:36):
track your activity for a third party. This is something
we talked about earlier in an episode with our buddy Jonathan. Yes,
targeted advertising. Yeah, so it can be done in several ways,
having a email address or phone number required, access as server,
requiring a share on social media, or a similar action
(24:59):
where you're required to log into another site before using
the service, or and this is always a red flag
to me, requiring you to download something to access the WiFi.
And of course cookies, which we've talked about before and
are not as cool in the internet world as they
are in real life. Sweet sweet cookies. Is that a
(25:19):
cookie monster? What's the other kind? So this is delicious
sounding too, it's called they're called honeypots. Um. So word
to the wise, never, never, not ever, never, don't just
don't do this thing wherein you connect to an unfamiliar,
unlocked WiFi hotspot like Ben's not even super okay, Yeah,
(25:43):
that's that's that's red flaggy if you ask me, this
is just it's you. It is a complete and utter
crap shoot. You're gambling with your privacy, your personal information
because while not every unlocked access point is malicious, every
functioning malitia. Just access point is unlocked. It's a trap.
(26:05):
There are a couple of other things here that we
we should walk through real quick. So we're talking before
about data interception right easily captured by eavesdroppers even within
a few hundred feet, and their reach extends further if
they have directional antennas. Then of course d O S
right denial of service. Everyone shares the same unlicensed frequencies,
(26:26):
making competition inevitable in populated areas. That's why sometimes if
you're at an airport and super crowded, you're going to
have worse Internet access. Crap service, crap service. They're clogging
up the tubes with all their wifis the internet tubes
because that's how the Internet runs in tubes. You really
(26:49):
sold me on that one, and then rogue access points.
So that's when a business network is penetrated by an unknown,
unauthorized access point, and that's on the business. That's something
that a lot of corporations and such are very concerned about.
For example, our internet here at the office is so
(27:11):
tightly locked down that we sometimes have trouble doing certain things.
Connecting to certain services. Um even doing like a one
to one connection with another with an outside party, whether
it's like a you know, Skype type connection or like
a more direct video chat connection. If we're trying to
do like a really high end um high quality video
(27:34):
stream where we're connecting one piece of hardware to another
piece of hardware, there are certain um things about our
firewall and you know lack of open ports that completely
prevent us from doing that. And it's because of this
exact reason. So to even get on our wireless here
at the office, which is different from plugging in and
being you know, jacked into the network through a land um,
(27:56):
we have to have these specific files on our computer
that have various credentials that we don't actually enter, their
called certificates, and they have to be authenticated every time
you log into our WiFi here. So there is we
do have a public WiFi that people who are visiting
can access, but it has a lease on it where
you can only sort of like if you go to
(28:16):
Starbucks and it tells you that you get you to
password and it will expire. Your session will expire in
two hours and you have to get a new password.
Same with this, but Yeah, the corporations are particularly concerned
about this stuff and they act accordingly, right, and they're
also misconfigured access points, their endpoint attacks, their evil twin
ap s, fraudulent access points that can advertise the same
(28:40):
network name as a legit hotspot or business land and
cause uh other WiFi clients to connect with them. So
one of the strange things about this is that it's
easier and easier for people who want to do this
sort of stuff to do it. You can find tools
that will do a lot of the head be lifting
(29:00):
for you, like Carmetta disploit and UH these things like
listen to nearby clients, discover s s I d s
they're willing to connect to, and automatically start advertising those
and once they connect, then d n S and d
h c P are used to route the client traffic
through the evil twin where a local web mail file
(29:21):
server executes those men in the middle attacks that we're
talking about. And there are different ways to well, there
are different ways to lessen the likelihood of this stuff working.
And companies, in particular, as you said, Noel, spend a
lot of scratch on this Lota Moola butter cheese what's
(29:42):
another word for money? Deno Dennero spent a lot of
Robert DeNiro scrilla, so much of Matt money. Uh? And
what what we have nol Nichols. I feel like you
think I need Yeah, I think you do. I don't know.
I mean, you know what the pound is, tanking? You
(30:04):
can just take over that. Yeah, well, we're gonna put
a pin on it and send your suggestions to us. Uh.
We do want to establish also that we are not
ourselves hackers, white hat nor black hat. And a lot
of people for those of you listening who are familiar
with this, let's say you work in network security or something,
(30:25):
or let's say you are a white hat or a
black hat. Uh what what you're probably irritated by will
be the so called script kitties who just borrow, borrow
code and and use it themselves without making it. Like
you said, man, I mean, there's an insane amount of
(30:45):
resources out there for people that just want to dabble
in this stuff. But it was you. I'm sorry, Matt.
You're just saying that you found just like you know,
ready made little apps, a little ex executable files for
probably Windows and Maclynx Lenox that you can just download
and you know, give it a try, and it's it's
total fair weather novice hacking, and it you know, like
(31:07):
you said, people that really devote a lot of time
and effort to this, I'm sure doing some hard eye
rolls thinking about those folks just kind of like hopping
in and dipping their toes. And again not saying that
we support doing this stuff, but there are, as we
talked about with the Mr Robot examples, interesting uses of
this technology and of these you know, of exploiting these vulnerabilities.
(31:30):
But the point of this show, I think, is to
give people information they need to protect themselves from malicious intent, right.
And this is one of those things where we'll have
a lot of people say we'll just use common sense.
But common sense itself, and I think anybody can attest
to this. Common sense itself is a rather uncommon trait,
(31:51):
especially when people feel that they're already again in a
safe place, public place, a bunch of people. Crime doesn't
happened like that. Crime happens in dark alleys, right, Crime
happens to other people. Crime happens to other people, right.
So let's face facts, most of us will continue to
use public WiFi, either for its convenience or out of necessity, What,
(32:15):
if anything, can we do to protect ourselves? The best
way to stay safe while you're using a public WiFi network,
it's one rule. Don't do anything on there that you
wouldn't be comfortable doing with the pope standing directly behind
you and watching your screen. Hello, my son? What what
(32:37):
the yeah? I can explain this doesn't look holy. Well,
this is a subreddit. It's called it's called funny. Yeah.
Do you see that that's a kangaroo just like a person?
Pless you pretty cool guy? Yeah? That was that was
all right? To be fair, we have a very accepting pope,
(32:58):
right picture, perhaps a slightly you know, more judgmental post
or a pope with a pad and paper just writing.
Nothing worse than a pope with a pad. Pope with
a pad, which was originally the name of our podcast.
I'm kidding, but yeah, that's that's a great point. I
assume that everything is public. I would add that just
(33:20):
for the record, Uh, the best way to avoid that
kind of stuff is to not use it at all,
But you'll want to, and sometimes you'll have to. If
you do confirm the exact name of the access point
at any given location and be very very very aware
similar names that are they're not quite the same. Usually
(33:42):
those are the most dangerous, right, Yeah, and then you
know you can also use if you're on a laptop,
you can also use browser tools to prevent unwanted cookies,
other tracking techniques, and there's some stuff that's a little
more advanced but worth your time to do as well. Yeah.
Big one that's offered now is HTTPS, which is just
(34:02):
the hypertext transfer protocol that you know, and this is
pretty great. There's an extra layer of security when you
use HTTPS. There are some browsers like Chrome that have
options that will say always use HDT in other words,
as the prefix to the U r L you're visiting.
You can't type that in, but but if you do that,
then the protocol is more secure. Uses transport layer security.
(34:26):
The previous iteration of this was secure sockets layer. And
doing this just adds an extra layer of authentication with
your communication. Wow, some of these words strung together like this,
it's it's pretty fun. Extra communication authentication, authentication of your
communication across the nation, regardless of mobile device or PC,
(34:50):
MAC persuasion. Yes, But the great thing about using a
browser that says HTTPS always on. Is that when you're
not on a secure site like that, it lets you
know and you can get the heck out of there
if you want to. So then there's another thing that
you've heard about, probably, which is VPN, a virtual private network.
(35:12):
What is a VPN. Well, a VPN, virtual private network,
can be used in several different ways, and UM, like Matt,
I do not purport to be an expert in all things,
all the minutia of of these various internet tools. But
what I can't tell you is that the VPN essentially
reroutes your signal through a third party more or less,
(35:35):
so instead of being a direct connection between you, the
wireless network you're connecting to, and the Internet being provided,
you are sent out and then back in through this
third party tool, which is the virtual private network. Using that,
you can do several things. For example, if you were
(35:56):
using a VPN at home, you might do it to
get around UM certain region restrictions for content. For example,
so like if you want to watch a clip on
the BBC that is only meant for people in the
United Kingdom, you could conceivably use a VPN to make
(36:16):
it look like you are in the United Kingdom and
then you can access that content, it will not be
restricted to you. You can also use it to anonymize
your browsing. So if, for example, if you're God forbid
downloading torrents or illegal pirated content. Um. You know, we
all know that Internet service providers get reports of that
(36:37):
stuff and they can pay you for it, and they
can send you a letter a cease and desist. You know,
they they will serve you that letter that HBO or
whoever sends to them. By using one of these VPNs,
in this way, you can disguise your IP address somewhat exactly.
And none o thing's perfect, but a VPN in a
public WiFi setting essentially acts as an additional layer of
(37:00):
encryption for your for your data. The thing is, though,
like many things, there are free versions and there are
pay versions. More often than not, the free versions are
really just proxies. They don't actually offer the full layer
of security that a proper VPN offers. They just reroute
(37:21):
your your your traffic traffic exactly, and they log everything
that you do, all of your browsing habits, and they
sell it off to third parties. That's how these free
sites support you know, the work that they're doing. A
pay VPN will encrypt your stuff, and they claim you
never know that they don't store your information, that it
(37:44):
is destroyed, that no one has access to it. So
those are definitely things to consider it. If you're traveling
a lot, there's a lot of places you can do
some research on. In fact, Gizmoto has a great article
called VPNs What they do, how they work, and why
you're dumb for not using one. Um I recommend that
highly for which ones to go with, and a little
more in depth explanation of what VPNs are careful. How
(38:07):
I say this because I don't want to let the
let the badger out of the bag just yet. But
another thing that I think we should always emphasize about
VPNs is that it's not just for you know, pornography
or getting the latest Star Wars film right without having
(38:30):
a pay to see in the theater. In parts of
the world where access to information is restricted, such as
the use of social media in some places because it's
associated with protests or it's associated with coup's, VPNs are
crucial for people to be able to communicate with the
world at large or to visit sites that have been banned.
(38:53):
That is a really good point, something that hadn't even
really considered. But sure, like in China, I mean, where
you don't get access us to certain sites that give
you unbiased, let's say, or at least biased in a
different direction versions of the news. I mean, that is
pretty important to being a you know, fully informed member
(39:14):
of the global community. And it's it's it's almost a
form of protest to be able to say, hey, we
reject this restriction and we're able to use this technology
to equip ourselves with the information we need. Yeah, I
think that's I think that's a good point because often
this will be painted as one of those what you
(39:36):
need VPN for? Huh, will you do it? Will you
do it? Will you do it? If you're not doing
something wrong, regular connection, let me just see what you're doing.
Come on, let me just see it. Why are you
ashamed of what you are looking at? My son? No, look,
because it's a kind but the VPN, VPN show me
your history, my son, I can't come on, man. So
(40:00):
and uh, then there's another aspect here that we we
talked about briefly, which is the tour right the onion router. Uh,
there are issues here that Elliott stated in our example
from Mr Robot right, Volunteer operators maintain most of these
tour network's final set of servers right the exit notes.
(40:21):
And this excludes the course servers run by law enforcement. Sure, sure,
because they are used. There are other private tour servers
that can be set up, um, but the vast majority
of ones, if you're just a user and connecting up,
you're going through one of these, uh, one of these
that has volunteers and operators who are just you're just
(40:42):
trusting that they're going to keep it anonymous, right, right,
And as we said, it's easy to see the traffic
flowing through these servers if you control an exit node.
So one of the questions that you might have listening
to this will be the following the question that we
get asked often, who exactly are they in this situation
(41:06):
we're talking about compromising public WiFi. There's more than one they, uh,
there are many of them, and often one thing that
one thing that I dislike is that often this will
be painted as oh, here is an individual who has
(41:28):
low morals or just likes to mess with people because
they're statistic or their board or they had a bad childhood.
But the thing is it's not necessarily an individual. Yes,
there are many individuals doing that, some of who may
be listening to this show. And if so, I hope
to stay on your good side, Hank the hacker, We
mean you no ill will Yeah, big fans actually. And
(41:50):
then the thing that doesn't get talked about as often
but should be talked about more is that they're organized
rings of people doing this. And I don't just mean
private orizations. State sponsored hacking like this is real, it
is continual. Make no mistake if the country you live
in has an active interest in surveillance and hacking, and
(42:16):
it doesn't matter which country it is, and the US
is no better than the other countries that you might
hear about doing state sponsored hacking. One example would be
UH hackers using hotel internet to steal nuclear secrets. There's
a great article in Gizmoto from two thousand fourteen, so
this is old stuff. There was an elite team of
(42:39):
possibly state sponsored hackers that were infiltrating WiFi networks, although
that they wouldn't have that much luck in Alberton. They
were infiltrating WiFi networks, probably to steal nuclear secrets and
the security researchers who discovered this called the cyber spies
Dark Hotel, and their efforts to track down a scroup
(43:01):
we're tenacious. But the further they went, the more disturbing
stuff they discovered. These people were insanely talented. They're some
of the members were traced back to South Korea, but
at the time of writing, they still weren't, at least
publicly sure what these people were doing and why. And
(43:25):
this was ben Do you remember the Winter Olympics so stuff, Yeah,
tell me about it. Well, it sounds very similar to
to what you're talking about, where there were reports coming
out of American media that if you're using the WiFi
in restaurants around Sochi while you're at the Olympics, there's
a very high chance that you're going to get hacked.
(43:49):
There's a lot of fear about that stuff. So there's
also you know, this group Dark Hotel is still active
as of March of They also have a goth band
on the side. They have a goth band on the side. Oh,
it's kind of like Prodigy all over again. Wait, wait,
is this real? It could be excited, it could be
(44:11):
Maybe maybe you should ask them what kind of music
they like. Okay, those of you who don't know Matt
and haven't maybe seen him, he is so goth right now.
Guyliner for Days. Uh yeah, So Dark Hotel is still active.
They were reported exploiting a Chinese telecom. I'm not condoning
these actions, but the three of us feel that it
(44:33):
is important to be aware of the situation that you're
in when you're in an airport, and also to be
aware that governments are doing this. Don't let the don't
let the Sunday News or whatever fool you into thinking
it's just a couple of missing thropes in every airport. Now,
I would imagine the government is doing things like this
(44:54):
anyway and anywhere they can, well, especially in airports. I mean,
you're you're gonna want to have a lockdown on every
packet that goes to and from within an airport from
the user. And airport's great because it has instant distance
baked in yep, so uh, you know which terminal you're
at and probably where you're sitting right and then you're gone,
(45:18):
so it's not like there's someone in the cafe with
you anymore. So we hope that you have enjoyed this episode,
and we would like to hear from you if you
have any war stories about free WiFi, or you have
any tips or tricks that you think your fellow listeners
should hear. And to prove that we have ears, what
(45:39):
listen and eyes, let's see, we'd like to jump into
a little thing we like to call shut ut Corner.
Our first shout out goes to Paula. She and her
thirteen year old nephew. You guys are going to space
camp in July. Another another person of writing in to
(46:00):
let us know they're they're excited to go to space Camp.
She's so happy about it. She's been dancing a jig
for several days. She said, Well, Paula, we're dancing a
little jig for you right now. Nola's but I am
nodding my head rhythmically. Space camp is cool. I'm sorry,
We'll take you, I promise. Do you want to go
so much? Okay, Well, while we're getting our stuff together
(46:23):
for space Camp, let's hear from Chase from Alabama. Chase says,
uh it doesn't believe in the Illuminati per se, but
wants us to further explore the connections between separate groups
we've covered in the past, the builder, Berg's skull and Bones,
Trilateral Commission, Central Banks, etcetera, all of which are real
and all of which have been accused of doing some
(46:45):
shady things. So to take a page from the book
of Beyonce and perhaps some up Chase's position. Y'all haters
corny talking that Illuminati mess, but I think it warrants
further exploration, So we're gonna do that thing. Yep. Finally
we have one from Dan who wants us to take
a look at the French alchemist and author Fulconelli, who
allegedly attempted to warn a French physicist about the potential
(47:09):
dangers of weaponized nuclear fission in nineteen thirty seven, and
he claimed that it had been used on humanity before.
And this is one interesting customer. Yeah, that's right. He
even goes into the great work and trying to find
that place that all alchemists search for, where you can
(47:29):
it's a point, some point where you can access all
of space and time at once, all that has ever
existed and will never exist traveling without moving time is
a flat circle. He allegedly found this and was able
to truly access it at least you know according to
articles written about him. If you haven't listened to our
(47:51):
episode on alchemy, we had a guest, dear friend of
Ben's and now the show, Mr Damian Patrick Williams. We
had a fantastic versation about um the nature of alchemy,
and then there's a nice companion episode we did on
the same day about technology and its relationship with the occult.
As are some of my favorite episodes. I really recommend
(48:11):
going back into the archives and checking those out. And
this concludes our Gosh but wait, as Billy Mays was
wont to say Durina's glory days, there is more. This
is usually the part of the show where we talked
about our Facebook and Twitter and ask you to check
it out because you'll see suth that doesn't make it
(48:34):
onto the air for one reason or another. You'll also
see us actively taking suggestions were conspiracy stuff at those
We're also on Instagram now that's right, and we are
conspiracy stuff show there, and you guys, we haven't done
this before, but we would really appreciate it. Wherever you
listen to the podcast, be at iTunes, Stitcher, We're now
(48:55):
on Spotify, We're on Google Play, tons of places you
can get it. Leave us a review. I mean that
really helps the algorithm. It helps more people find out
about the show, and you know, it makes us feel
good in our hearts a need that every time we
get a review, our boss goes up to this thing
he painted on the wall. You know how they're like
(49:16):
fundraisers for schools and stuff where they'll have you know,
like a thermometer with the levels of money. Well, ours
is the level of likelihood of us being fired. And
if it gets to the top, and we've been very
close to the top for a while, then boom, we're
out here. So every like and every review ticks us
down just a little bit further away from being fired. Because,
(49:36):
as Ben Is said in the past, the biggest investment
that you make and the show is with your time.
So we would really really appreciate if you would take
just a little more of your time and say how
you feel about the show. All right, we said we
were gonna do it. The active Internet users in the
world right now total comes to three billion and one million,
(50:00):
one d and twenty one thousand, five hundred and forty
and counting. And you out there who are part of
this massive number Please do us a solid Send us
your thoughts, send us your episode recommendations. We are conspiracy
at house stop works dot com.
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn the stuff they don't want you to know. Hello,
welcome back to the show. My name is Max, my
(00:22):
name is No. They often call me Ben. You are you?
This is stuff they don't want you to know. And
let's start with a question for those of you tuning in,
how are you listening to this show? And I don't
just necessarily mean like a boom box, which would be cool.
I don't know if our shows are on cassette yet
or are you downloading it? Have you streamed it? And
(00:44):
if so, where are you streaming it from. If you're
like most people, you have concerns about your data plan
on your phone, and you probably want to use WiFi.
Holy Grail, I certainly do. If I'm going to listen
to a podcast, I download it through WiFi and then
throwing on my phone so I can have it for
later because I've trust issues, you know. Speaking of trust issues,
(01:06):
A T and T totally bamboozled me out of my
unlimited data plan to lower my bill a little bit
because I felt like it was a little too high
and they're like, well, you know, if you give up
your limited data because you're clearly not using it, we
can give you this amount of data and you know
you'll be good as gold. Well, it turns out that
I exceeded just so every single month, even with Pop. Yeah,
(01:28):
so WiFi is huge because these phone companies are tightening
down data, so it's a lot more restrictive these days.
They have these plans, these tiered plans, where you are
paying for every little bit of data that you use,
much more so than in the past. So the obvious
choices to find WiFi anywhere and everywhere that you possibly can.
(01:49):
So a lot of people would ask what is WiFi?
It's one of those things that the average human being
just sort of accepts as existing. You know, a lot
of people own cars but have no idea how they work.
A lot of people own phones, have no idea how
they work. WiFi is something that people just sort of accept.
(02:09):
You're in an airport, boom, free WiFi. That's great. Your
You could be at a restaurant at a dentist office.
There's a pizza place next to our office that I
go to just because they have free WiFi. But what
is this stuff. WiFi is the name of any wireless
networking technology that uses radio waves to send out high
(02:30):
speed network and internet connections. And it's it's such a
cool little term, almost like podcast and have a coined
little buzz term. And there is a organization, as it
turns out, that owns the rights to this trademark called
the WiFi Alliance. In a burst of creativity, Yes, uh,
WiFi is a registered trademark and it's in This alliance
(02:53):
specifically defines WiFi as a wireless local area network w
LAND products that are based on the Institute of Electrical
and Electronics Engineers or I literally I Strickland by the way,
I hope be so glad to hear that. Um. Their
standards are at two dot eleven. The greatest thing about
(03:15):
WiFi is that you no longer have to plug in
a giant ethernet cable to get access to that beautiful,
sweet sweet Internet with all the things that you love,
all the the podcasts and videos and everything you do
on their Uh that's the best part about it. So
it uses radio frequencies to transfer all the information of packets,
all the packets of information rather from your computer to
(03:37):
the access point to the Internet essentially through all the
chain of servers that it goes through to get to
its end point, and then right back through all that
stuff through the access point to your computer. Just a
lovely little handshaking connection. Yeah, this RF current hits and
antenna creating an electromagnetic field that's able to propagate through space.
(04:00):
That's so cool. That's so science fiction e E E you know,
uh right right it is. It's the magic that we
just sort of accept And a lot of a lot
of current society in the West is built on the
premise of just accepting things because they are. That way,
we drive these death machines ad plus miles an hour
(04:22):
and just accept that. Everyone will pretend those yellow lines
in the middle are doing something much smarter people than
I figured out how to use radio waves so that
I can go on Reddit dot com. Uh, and I
just accepted we stand on the shoulders of giants, and
every great invention you know is only uh is only
(04:43):
capable of being discovered or created because of prior inventions.
I guess we're getting a little spacey already, you know. Uh.
Space is the place, my friend, Space is the place
you're you're killing it with the slogans lately there is
a lot more space than stuff. Yes. Yeah, we received
a great is it a YouTube comment or an email
where where someone pointed out on our live show recording
(05:05):
that we released that the table. Yeah, I hit the
tables and banging on and they're like, you do realize
that there's a lot more empty space in that table
than atoms, And I was like absolutely wow. So to
propagate through this mostly empty space, your WiFi connection uses
an electromagnetic field radio frequencies, and the primary job of
(05:29):
an access point is to broadcast this wireless signal that
your computer can detect. And just like a radio, just
like searching for radio station you can tune into to
connect to an access point. To join a wireless network,
these computers or these devices have to be equipped with
wireless network adapters. Pretty simple, right, Yeah. And and the
(05:50):
great thing about it is it's not just your computer
that connects to it. It's anyone who can see the
network and has an adapter. Right, So who is anyone
within your lifetime listeners? Depending on how young or old
you are when you were born, you have probably seen
(06:11):
a precipitous rise in the amount of people hopping online
around of the world population has some sort of Internet connection.
It's got to the point where it's almost considered like
a human right, I mean they're trying. There are all
these efforts to bring Internet access to more rural areas
(06:32):
and you know, third world countries and things. I mean,
it's become this thing that we expect. Yeah, in less
than one percent of the globe had some kind of connection.
So in slightly less than two decades, we've gone from
one percent to nearly half of the world's population. Are
you guys part of the one percent with a like
(06:55):
an old, old old modem, Yes, definitely, I think got me.
I think my parents may have had a O L.
We're you guys. Yeah, we had a o L and
we had compy served remember that. And I had a
friend who had Prodigy. Remember Prodigy. Not I am the
fire Starter, but the I am the Internet service productive
(07:16):
the same same people. Actually, seriously, No, that was a
good sigh. Yeah, that's a that's a good site gig.
And if the band's Prodigy had been part of the
Internet service Prodigy, they may have met with more long
term success for a while. Because the number of Internet
(07:37):
users has increased tenfold from two thirteen. So what do
we mean when we say, well, we mean that in
two thousand five we reached the first time in history
that a billion people could get on the internet. Two
thousand ten it was two billion, and then it was
three billion. And there's some really cool infographics you can grab.
(08:00):
Internet Live Stats is a pretty cool one if you
want to visit that, not while you're driving, if you're
driving as you listen to this, when you get a chance,
check out Internet live Stats. It will give you the
running tally of how many people have access to the Internet.
And the number just keeps it going and going and going,
and it's a live ticker. It's pretty great. Right now,
it's at three point four oh one billion, thousand three
(08:26):
nine and counting, yes and counter and we'll come back
right Well, so what we should do is come back
at the end of the episode and see how many
new listeners, how many new Internet users have joined us. So,
like we were saying at the top of the show,
beyond just expecting to have Internet access, which we do
part of our job, we definitely need it. Um, we
(08:48):
have come to a place where we expect that in
many public places, public settings, there's going to be free
and efficient wireless internet. Like what what kind of places? Well, sure,
I mean like cafes for example, you know Starbucks. It
is part and parcel of the Starbucks model to go there,
get your seven dollar prapolatte, and you know, enjoy some
(09:12):
Internet surfing, whether it's on your smartphone or your laptop
or you're doing work. A lot of people who work
remotely like to go to coffee shops. You are literally
using this businesses internet access for your business free of charge,
and it gets you there, and it's that's become kind
of like a added benefit of like, you know, going
to certain stores like Target for example, they have free
(09:34):
WiFi and they also have a little cafe there. Beyond that,
you've got airports, which Matt and I were talking before
the show. We've been doing a bit of traveling lately,
and we're starting to realize that airports have kind of
wised up a little bit. You're a bit of a
captive audience at the airport, and you know, you don't
really have a choice as to whether you hang out
in that terminal or not. So they don't always have
free internet. L a x Will, for instance, they have
(09:57):
a model where a user will it one hour free
and then need to pay for additional time. I hope
you didn't get delayed. In case anyone's interested and want
to know which airports do have free wife WiFi, there
is a site called air fair watchdog dot com that
has a WiFi access chart. Yeah, so that you don't
(10:18):
you don't get stuck out out there. But you know what,
we don't always have to be connected. I'm just gonna say,
you can bring a book hotels. Though hotel hotels want
you to have a pleasant stay. They want everything to
be just. So you're paying out the nose for a
hotel room, you're gonna get decent internet access as part
of your stay, unless you're in Alberton, Georgia. Uh recently.
(10:41):
I mean, I mean the access was there. It was there.
It was just snail's pace. It was like dial up speed.
But that's neither here nor there. Well, I was gonna say,
just a quick story, just a quick story. We had
ami fi uh one of these little access points to
use wireless uh data like through Verizon or another service
(11:02):
like this, and that was what ten times faster easily
to make fair, those little boxes do kind of kick um.
But then we've got like other places like museums, aquariums, hospitals, libraries.
More and more we're having outdoor access that's even provided
by cities. So let's do a hypothetical situation. Let's say Matt,
(11:25):
you're going to be our main character, and Nolan I
are going to tell the story of what happened to you. Uh,
let's say, you know, let's let's begin it this way.
One day, one afternoon, a traveler named Matt Frederick arrives
at the Colorado Airport and he just sits down in
(11:50):
one of the terminals you mentioned earlier. No, do you
remember specifically what he was doing. Oh? Sure, he had
a little time to kill and he wanted to maybe
catch up on his social media, looking at his stock tickers,
maybe check his his bank account and foe make sure
that his cash flow is good for the sweet trip
that he was about to go on. And he got
his frap his frapolatte in hand, laptop in lap like
(12:15):
you do, and up opens it up. Bam, pay dirt.
You know what's interesting here for our traveler is that
he notices there are several free WiFi points. Two of
them say free public WiFi. One of them says, just
(12:37):
airport WiFi looks good. Let's click on this one, And
that's how they get his bank account information, That's how
they get his log in for Twitter, for Facebook, for
let's see what else you want my trade trade yeah,
(12:58):
farmers only yeah, and you know whatever else. And it's
because there's this illusion of safety, and it's the same
illusion of safety that we find when people are driving
at high speeds on the highway right in traffic. The
convenience of WiFi, just like the convenience of driving on
an interstate, often leads us to mistakenly believe that it's
(13:19):
got to be safe. Everybody else is doing it right.
There are certain rules you have to follow, and everyone's
following them. That's because we live in a society that
teaches us if something if you're in a public place
and there are multiple people doing something, then you are
somehow safe. But that is also the exact reason a
hacker would choose a terminal at the Denver airport to
(13:42):
set up something that just says airport WiFi or free WiFi.
I haven't checked the charpnel, but it's quite possible that
all three of those points are just separate hackers. Yeah,
it's a perfect hunting ground. And then and they're like,
we need Matt Frederick's Twitter. Yeah, yeah, I think of
the change we could affect. Yeah, I wish I had
(14:05):
a Twitter, so that would make sense. Yeah, I'm gonna
start one for this you start one for this episode.
So you know, we had talked at the top of
the show about Mr Robot, who's working with us on
this episode. And one thing that is really cool. You
guys were hipped to Mr Robot before I was. But
in the very first episode is a mild spoiler alert.
(14:29):
We see an example of WiFi gone wrong. If you
have not watched the first episode of Mr Robot Season one,
the pilot episode, go and check it out before you
listen to this. Uh, if you've seen it, then here
we go. Oh wait wait, if you haven't seen it,
go ahead, we'll wait. Okay, you're back. So, at some
(14:50):
point in the past, the main character that we identify
with in Mr Robot, Elliott. He notices that there's this
free WiFi at this place called Ron's Coffee that seems
to be a large chain of coffee shops that exist
in his world, his immediate vicinity, and this WiFi is great.
Oh man, it is so good. It's fast. In fact,
(15:12):
let's hear a little clip. Yeah something I like coming
here because your WiFi was fast. I mean, you're one
of the few spots that has a fiber connection with
gigabit speed. It's good, so good. It scratched that part
of my mind, part that doesn't allow good to exist
without condition. So I started intercepting all the traffic on
(15:35):
your network. That's when I noticed something strange. That's when
I decided to hack you. I know, you run a
website called Plato's Boys. You're using tor networking to keep
the servers anonymous. You made it really hard for anyone
to see it, but I saw it. The Onion routing protocol.
(15:56):
It's not as anonymous as you think it is. Whoever's
in control all the exit notes is also in control
of the traffic, which makes me the one in control.
And you see Elliott discovers that the owner hosts a
massive horn site, the worst kind, from his server in
the cafe, and he thinks that he's hiding this because
(16:20):
he's using something that we've talked about before tour the
Onion router, the Onion routing protocol like you said, Ben,
something we discussed before. Uh, it's got some weird ties
and I think we'll get into it a little later
on exactly how it functions. Um. But it's supposedly or
it's meant to anonymize traffic Internet traffic. Yes, but a
(16:43):
little known fact about tour for a lot of people
who assume that it is safe. When we did our
stuff on the Silk Road, you know, we learned that
tour was originally created by the US government. Yes, and
there there are a set of servers amongst the Onion
router that are the endpoint for the the the last
(17:04):
server in the chain, the exit nodes. They're they are
referred to as exit nodes, and we have seen historically
in two thousand seven and two thousand eleven a couple
other times, we've seen that if you choose and you're
operating one of these exit nodes, you can spy on
any and all traffic that goes through that server. It's
(17:26):
a it's a code between the volunteer operators that run
these things that say, hey, this is all anonymous, We're
not going to spy on these people. In the end,
it's about trust, whether or not you trust I'm saying
this correctly, the volunteers who run this stuff. So Elliott,
in a very deadpan, monotonous way, explains to Ron of
(17:52):
Ron's coffee how he hacked the WiFi and took control
of these exit nodes, meaning he could watch all the
traffic because he wondered why this WiFi connection in particular
was so extraordinarily fast, and he found out why. And
as he is telling this guy's stuff, he tells him
(18:15):
there's a strange there's like a dark humor to it
when he tells him, you know, usually I do this online,
but I'm working on my people's skills, so I wanted
to come tell you in person. And yeah, he says,
I wanted to do this one A f K right, yes,
and uh and what does a f K stays the
same as I R L I R in real life
or away from keyboard. AFK was a great thing to
(18:36):
use back in the day. I did not know that one. Yeah, well,
for mm RPGs, that was a huge thing, like like
we're just saying let b RB. Well, um, now, so
this character that's obviously like an example of a white
hat hacker where he is using his skills and you know,
hacking this WiFi network to shut down somebody doing something
(18:57):
terrible and using this technology too horrible abusive ends. What
we're talking about for this episode largely is these black
hat hackers who just want to steal your stuff or
just affect chaos in some way or another. Some people
just want to see the world burn. But what I
want to know is how vulnerable are we at the airport?
(19:19):
How vulnerable is Matt at the Denver terminal? Could this
happen in real life? And we'll get right into my
vulnerabilities right after this word from our sponsor Here's where
(19:45):
it gets crazy. The answer is absolutely yes, this could
happen in real life. Absolutely yes, we are as vulnerable
as we allow ourselves to be. Yeah. The same things
as we said that make free WiFi so can venient,
also make it potentially and in many cases likely dangerous.
(20:06):
Most the most specific thing is that no authentication is needed.
Your computer just says, hey, can I ride this ride
this crazy internet train with you? And the access point says, oh, yeah,
hop on. There's room for everyone. Yes, and everyone includes
people who are interested in taking your stuff, your personal information,
(20:29):
any other kind of info that you're sending across that signal,
compromising photographs for instance, little texts or chat messages. You're
having anything like that. Yes, so there are dangers for
our hypothetical traveler who happens to be named Matt Frederick.
He let's see, we outlined a couple of places he
(20:49):
went to, so they have access to his personal information.
But it doesn't stop there. They can also install a
thing that will follow him like a shadow, and it
will see what he does when the hackers not around,
even logs, key strokes. I mean, they're any number of little,
you know, wormy type things that can be installed remotely
(21:11):
on someone's machine that can capture all kinds of input.
It can hijack the camera. I mean, it's sort of
all all bets are off, and depending on the security,
the network itself can be subverted. Yeah, so that the
airport WiFi one that is the actual connection that the
(21:32):
Colorado Airport is set up, could then be malicious or dangerous.
If I was gonna be that hacker, I would name mine.
This is the real airport WiFi. Yeah, yeah, I would
name mine super okay, fun time, free beer, What what
could go wrong? But with emphasis on free beer? Okay,
(21:53):
So There's there's another issue that happens that this reminds
me of, and that's a t M skin me. Oh,
you know, because it works in a similar way. If
someone is skimming an a t M, what they're doing
is installing a very small piece of hardware, usually something
that looks legit, that still allows you to interface with
(22:16):
the bank or even at a gas station, and it
allows you to buy gas, to access your banking information,
pull cash out, make a deposit, etcetera. But it sets
a middleman between it so that it's also capturing your information.
And they leave these things on and they come back
and then scoop it out, and you don't know until
you become a victim of identity theft. These attacks are
(22:41):
more common than you might think because the price of
the technology is, as you know, is going down. The
software is available to anyone who wants to find it,
and there are more and more people who have these
skill sets. So what what type of threats are we
talking about? What? What? Who is out there trying to
(23:07):
take over Matt Frederick's life at the Denver Airport. Well,
I have identified a couple of my potential assailants here
and I've given them, Uh, maybe some names that aren't official,
but I'm going to call them some things. The first
one would be sniffers just looking around, Oh what is that?
What's what's that over there? Reminds me of just kind
(23:28):
of a dog that's going around the airport, just trying
to see what everything is, giving a little sniff. Is
this worth my time? Over here? Is that? Some? Is that?
Some old pizza? And maybe some banking information? Um. These
these people will use some kind of application or a
program that they would just run from their computer that
then connects up to the access point and they're going
(23:51):
to capture, you know, as much of the traffic as
they want. You can. You can break it down sometimes
depending on the application, or you can just gather everything.
And it is very disturbing if you just do a
cursory search on the internet like hacking, WiFi hacking tools,
and the number that shows up. There's lists and lists
(24:13):
of you know, there was like a list of twenty
of the best WiFi hacking tools and they're simple to use.
They'll they'll break the security on the WiFi and just
let you run amok. Uh. And then there are other types,
right like gatherers might be after you, and these people
are almost like bounty hunters, so they'll take steps to
(24:36):
track your activity for a third party. This is something
we talked about earlier in an episode with our buddy Jonathan. Yes,
targeted advertising. Yeah, so it can be done in several ways,
having a email address or phone number required, access as server,
requiring a share on social media, or a similar action
(24:59):
where you're required to log into another site before using
the service, or and this is always a red flag
to me, requiring you to download something to access the WiFi.
And of course cookies, which we've talked about before and
are not as cool in the internet world as they
are in real life. Sweet sweet cookies. Is that a
(25:19):
cookie monster? What's the other kind? So this is delicious
sounding too, it's called they're called honeypots. Um. So word
to the wise, never, never, not ever, never, don't just
don't do this thing wherein you connect to an unfamiliar,
unlocked WiFi hotspot like Ben's not even super okay, Yeah,
(25:43):
that's that's that's red flaggy if you ask me, this
is just it's you. It is a complete and utter
crap shoot. You're gambling with your privacy, your personal information
because while not every unlocked access point is malicious, every
functioning malitia. Just access point is unlocked. It's a trap.
(26:05):
There are a couple of other things here that we
we should walk through real quick. So we're talking before
about data interception right easily captured by eavesdroppers even within
a few hundred feet, and their reach extends further if
they have directional antennas. Then of course d O S
right denial of service. Everyone shares the same unlicensed frequencies,
(26:26):
making competition inevitable in populated areas. That's why sometimes if
you're at an airport and super crowded, you're going to
have worse Internet access. Crap service, crap service. They're clogging
up the tubes with all their wifis the internet tubes
because that's how the Internet runs in tubes. You really
(26:49):
sold me on that one, and then rogue access points.
So that's when a business network is penetrated by an unknown,
unauthorized access point, and that's on the business. That's something
that a lot of corporations and such are very concerned about.
For example, our internet here at the office is so
(27:11):
tightly locked down that we sometimes have trouble doing certain things.
Connecting to certain services. Um even doing like a one
to one connection with another with an outside party, whether
it's like a you know, Skype type connection or like
a more direct video chat connection. If we're trying to
do like a really high end um high quality video
(27:34):
stream where we're connecting one piece of hardware to another
piece of hardware, there are certain um things about our
firewall and you know lack of open ports that completely
prevent us from doing that. And it's because of this
exact reason. So to even get on our wireless here
at the office, which is different from plugging in and
being you know, jacked into the network through a land um,
(27:56):
we have to have these specific files on our computer
that have various credentials that we don't actually enter, their
called certificates, and they have to be authenticated every time
you log into our WiFi here. So there is we
do have a public WiFi that people who are visiting
can access, but it has a lease on it where
you can only sort of like if you go to
(28:16):
Starbucks and it tells you that you get you to
password and it will expire. Your session will expire in
two hours and you have to get a new password.
Same with this, but Yeah, the corporations are particularly concerned
about this stuff and they act accordingly, right, and they're
also misconfigured access points, their endpoint attacks, their evil twin
ap s, fraudulent access points that can advertise the same
(28:40):
network name as a legit hotspot or business land and
cause uh other WiFi clients to connect with them. So
one of the strange things about this is that it's
easier and easier for people who want to do this
sort of stuff to do it. You can find tools
that will do a lot of the head be lifting
(29:00):
for you, like Carmetta disploit and UH these things like
listen to nearby clients, discover s s I d s
they're willing to connect to, and automatically start advertising those
and once they connect, then d n S and d
h c P are used to route the client traffic
through the evil twin where a local web mail file
(29:21):
server executes those men in the middle attacks that we're
talking about. And there are different ways to well, there
are different ways to lessen the likelihood of this stuff working.
And companies, in particular, as you said, Noel, spend a
lot of scratch on this Lota Moola butter cheese what's
(29:42):
another word for money? Deno Dennero spent a lot of
Robert DeNiro scrilla, so much of Matt money. Uh? And
what what we have nol Nichols. I feel like you
think I need Yeah, I think you do. I don't know.
I mean, you know what the pound is, tanking? You
(30:04):
can just take over that. Yeah, well, we're gonna put
a pin on it and send your suggestions to us. Uh.
We do want to establish also that we are not
ourselves hackers, white hat nor black hat. And a lot
of people for those of you listening who are familiar
with this, let's say you work in network security or something,
(30:25):
or let's say you are a white hat or a
black hat. Uh what what you're probably irritated by will
be the so called script kitties who just borrow, borrow
code and and use it themselves without making it. Like
you said, man, I mean, there's an insane amount of
(30:45):
resources out there for people that just want to dabble
in this stuff. But it was you. I'm sorry, Matt.
You're just saying that you found just like you know,
ready made little apps, a little ex executable files for
probably Windows and Maclynx Lenox that you can just download
and you know, give it a try, and it's it's
total fair weather novice hacking, and it you know, like
(31:07):
you said, people that really devote a lot of time
and effort to this, I'm sure doing some hard eye
rolls thinking about those folks just kind of like hopping
in and dipping their toes. And again not saying that
we support doing this stuff, but there are, as we
talked about with the Mr Robot examples, interesting uses of
this technology and of these you know, of exploiting these vulnerabilities.
(31:30):
But the point of this show, I think, is to
give people information they need to protect themselves from malicious intent, right.
And this is one of those things where we'll have
a lot of people say we'll just use common sense.
But common sense itself, and I think anybody can attest
to this. Common sense itself is a rather uncommon trait,
(31:51):
especially when people feel that they're already again in a
safe place, public place, a bunch of people. Crime doesn't
happened like that. Crime happens in dark alleys, right, Crime
happens to other people. Crime happens to other people, right.
So let's face facts, most of us will continue to
use public WiFi, either for its convenience or out of necessity, What,
(32:15):
if anything, can we do to protect ourselves? The best
way to stay safe while you're using a public WiFi network,
it's one rule. Don't do anything on there that you
wouldn't be comfortable doing with the pope standing directly behind
you and watching your screen. Hello, my son? What what
(32:37):
the yeah? I can explain this doesn't look holy. Well,
this is a subreddit. It's called it's called funny. Yeah.
Do you see that that's a kangaroo just like a person?
Pless you pretty cool guy? Yeah? That was that was
all right? To be fair, we have a very accepting pope,
(32:58):
right picture, perhaps a slightly you know, more judgmental post
or a pope with a pad and paper just writing.
Nothing worse than a pope with a pad. Pope with
a pad, which was originally the name of our podcast.
I'm kidding, but yeah, that's that's a great point. I
assume that everything is public. I would add that just
(33:20):
for the record, Uh, the best way to avoid that
kind of stuff is to not use it at all,
But you'll want to, and sometimes you'll have to. If
you do confirm the exact name of the access point
at any given location and be very very very aware
similar names that are they're not quite the same. Usually
(33:42):
those are the most dangerous, right, Yeah, and then you
know you can also use if you're on a laptop,
you can also use browser tools to prevent unwanted cookies,
other tracking techniques, and there's some stuff that's a little
more advanced but worth your time to do as well. Yeah.
Big one that's offered now is HTTPS, which is just
(34:02):
the hypertext transfer protocol that you know, and this is
pretty great. There's an extra layer of security when you
use HTTPS. There are some browsers like Chrome that have
options that will say always use HDT in other words,
as the prefix to the U r L you're visiting.
You can't type that in, but but if you do that,
then the protocol is more secure. Uses transport layer security.
(34:26):
The previous iteration of this was secure sockets layer. And
doing this just adds an extra layer of authentication with
your communication. Wow, some of these words strung together like this,
it's it's pretty fun. Extra communication authentication, authentication of your
communication across the nation, regardless of mobile device or PC,
(34:50):
MAC persuasion. Yes, But the great thing about using a
browser that says HTTPS always on. Is that when you're
not on a secure site like that, it lets you
know and you can get the heck out of there
if you want to. So then there's another thing that
you've heard about, probably, which is VPN, a virtual private network.
(35:12):
What is a VPN. Well, a VPN, virtual private network,
can be used in several different ways, and UM, like Matt,
I do not purport to be an expert in all things,
all the minutia of of these various internet tools. But
what I can't tell you is that the VPN essentially
reroutes your signal through a third party more or less,
(35:35):
so instead of being a direct connection between you, the
wireless network you're connecting to, and the Internet being provided,
you are sent out and then back in through this
third party tool, which is the virtual private network. Using that,
you can do several things. For example, if you were
(35:56):
using a VPN at home, you might do it to
get around UM certain region restrictions for content. For example,
so like if you want to watch a clip on
the BBC that is only meant for people in the
United Kingdom, you could conceivably use a VPN to make
(36:16):
it look like you are in the United Kingdom and
then you can access that content, it will not be
restricted to you. You can also use it to anonymize
your browsing. So if, for example, if you're God forbid
downloading torrents or illegal pirated content. Um. You know, we
all know that Internet service providers get reports of that
(36:37):
stuff and they can pay you for it, and they
can send you a letter a cease and desist. You know,
they they will serve you that letter that HBO or
whoever sends to them. By using one of these VPNs,
in this way, you can disguise your IP address somewhat exactly.
And none o thing's perfect, but a VPN in a
public WiFi setting essentially acts as an additional layer of
(37:00):
encryption for your for your data. The thing is, though,
like many things, there are free versions and there are
pay versions. More often than not, the free versions are
really just proxies. They don't actually offer the full layer
of security that a proper VPN offers. They just reroute
(37:21):
your your your traffic traffic exactly, and they log everything
that you do, all of your browsing habits, and they
sell it off to third parties. That's how these free
sites support you know, the work that they're doing. A
pay VPN will encrypt your stuff, and they claim you
never know that they don't store your information, that it
(37:44):
is destroyed, that no one has access to it. So
those are definitely things to consider it. If you're traveling
a lot, there's a lot of places you can do
some research on. In fact, Gizmoto has a great article
called VPNs What they do, how they work, and why
you're dumb for not using one. Um I recommend that
highly for which ones to go with, and a little
more in depth explanation of what VPNs are careful. How
(38:07):
I say this because I don't want to let the
let the badger out of the bag just yet. But
another thing that I think we should always emphasize about
VPNs is that it's not just for you know, pornography
or getting the latest Star Wars film right without having
(38:30):
a pay to see in the theater. In parts of
the world where access to information is restricted, such as
the use of social media in some places because it's
associated with protests or it's associated with coup's, VPNs are
crucial for people to be able to communicate with the
world at large or to visit sites that have been banned.
(38:53):
That is a really good point, something that hadn't even
really considered. But sure, like in China, I mean, where
you don't get access us to certain sites that give
you unbiased, let's say, or at least biased in a
different direction versions of the news. I mean, that is
pretty important to being a you know, fully informed member
(39:14):
of the global community. And it's it's it's almost a
form of protest to be able to say, hey, we
reject this restriction and we're able to use this technology
to equip ourselves with the information we need. Yeah, I
think that's I think that's a good point because often
this will be painted as one of those what you
(39:36):
need VPN for? Huh, will you do it? Will you
do it? Will you do it? If you're not doing
something wrong, regular connection, let me just see what you're doing.
Come on, let me just see it. Why are you
ashamed of what you are looking at? My son? No, look,
because it's a kind but the VPN, VPN show me
your history, my son, I can't come on, man. So
(40:00):
and uh, then there's another aspect here that we we
talked about briefly, which is the tour right the onion router. Uh,
there are issues here that Elliott stated in our example
from Mr Robot right, Volunteer operators maintain most of these
tour network's final set of servers right the exit notes.
(40:21):
And this excludes the course servers run by law enforcement. Sure, sure,
because they are used. There are other private tour servers
that can be set up, um, but the vast majority
of ones, if you're just a user and connecting up,
you're going through one of these, uh, one of these
that has volunteers and operators who are just you're just
(40:42):
trusting that they're going to keep it anonymous, right, right,
And as we said, it's easy to see the traffic
flowing through these servers if you control an exit node.
So one of the questions that you might have listening
to this will be the following the question that we
get asked often, who exactly are they in this situation
(41:06):
we're talking about compromising public WiFi. There's more than one they, uh,
there are many of them, and often one thing that
one thing that I dislike is that often this will
be painted as oh, here is an individual who has
(41:28):
low morals or just likes to mess with people because
they're statistic or their board or they had a bad childhood.
But the thing is it's not necessarily an individual. Yes,
there are many individuals doing that, some of who may
be listening to this show. And if so, I hope
to stay on your good side, Hank the hacker, We
mean you no ill will Yeah, big fans actually. And
(41:50):
then the thing that doesn't get talked about as often
but should be talked about more is that they're organized
rings of people doing this. And I don't just mean
private orizations. State sponsored hacking like this is real, it
is continual. Make no mistake if the country you live
in has an active interest in surveillance and hacking, and
(42:16):
it doesn't matter which country it is, and the US
is no better than the other countries that you might
hear about doing state sponsored hacking. One example would be
UH hackers using hotel internet to steal nuclear secrets. There's
a great article in Gizmoto from two thousand fourteen, so
this is old stuff. There was an elite team of
(42:39):
possibly state sponsored hackers that were infiltrating WiFi networks, although
that they wouldn't have that much luck in Alberton. They
were infiltrating WiFi networks, probably to steal nuclear secrets and
the security researchers who discovered this called the cyber spies
Dark Hotel, and their efforts to track down a scroup
(43:01):
we're tenacious. But the further they went, the more disturbing
stuff they discovered. These people were insanely talented. They're some
of the members were traced back to South Korea, but
at the time of writing, they still weren't, at least
publicly sure what these people were doing and why. And
(43:25):
this was ben Do you remember the Winter Olympics so stuff, Yeah,
tell me about it. Well, it sounds very similar to
to what you're talking about, where there were reports coming
out of American media that if you're using the WiFi
in restaurants around Sochi while you're at the Olympics, there's
a very high chance that you're going to get hacked.
(43:49):
There's a lot of fear about that stuff. So there's
also you know, this group Dark Hotel is still active
as of March of They also have a goth band
on the side. They have a goth band on the side. Oh,
it's kind of like Prodigy all over again. Wait, wait,
is this real? It could be excited, it could be
(44:11):
Maybe maybe you should ask them what kind of music
they like. Okay, those of you who don't know Matt
and haven't maybe seen him, he is so goth right now.
Guyliner for Days. Uh yeah, So Dark Hotel is still active.
They were reported exploiting a Chinese telecom. I'm not condoning
these actions, but the three of us feel that it
(44:33):
is important to be aware of the situation that you're
in when you're in an airport, and also to be
aware that governments are doing this. Don't let the don't
let the Sunday News or whatever fool you into thinking
it's just a couple of missing thropes in every airport. Now,
I would imagine the government is doing things like this
(44:54):
anyway and anywhere they can, well, especially in airports. I mean,
you're you're gonna want to have a lockdown on every
packet that goes to and from within an airport from
the user. And airport's great because it has instant distance
baked in yep, so uh, you know which terminal you're
at and probably where you're sitting right and then you're gone,
(45:18):
so it's not like there's someone in the cafe with
you anymore. So we hope that you have enjoyed this episode,
and we would like to hear from you if you
have any war stories about free WiFi, or you have
any tips or tricks that you think your fellow listeners
should hear. And to prove that we have ears, what
(45:39):
listen and eyes, let's see, we'd like to jump into
a little thing we like to call shut ut Corner.
Our first shout out goes to Paula. She and her
thirteen year old nephew. You guys are going to space
camp in July. Another another person of writing in to
(46:00):
let us know they're they're excited to go to space Camp.
She's so happy about it. She's been dancing a jig
for several days. She said, Well, Paula, we're dancing a
little jig for you right now. Nola's but I am
nodding my head rhythmically. Space camp is cool. I'm sorry,
We'll take you, I promise. Do you want to go
so much? Okay, Well, while we're getting our stuff together
(46:23):
for space Camp, let's hear from Chase from Alabama. Chase says,
uh it doesn't believe in the Illuminati per se, but
wants us to further explore the connections between separate groups
we've covered in the past, the builder, Berg's skull and Bones,
Trilateral Commission, Central Banks, etcetera, all of which are real
and all of which have been accused of doing some
(46:45):
shady things. So to take a page from the book
of Beyonce and perhaps some up Chase's position. Y'all haters
corny talking that Illuminati mess, but I think it warrants
further exploration, So we're gonna do that thing. Yep. Finally
we have one from Dan who wants us to take
a look at the French alchemist and author Fulconelli, who
allegedly attempted to warn a French physicist about the potential
(47:09):
dangers of weaponized nuclear fission in nineteen thirty seven, and
he claimed that it had been used on humanity before.
And this is one interesting customer. Yeah, that's right. He
even goes into the great work and trying to find
that place that all alchemists search for, where you can
(47:29):
it's a point, some point where you can access all
of space and time at once, all that has ever
existed and will never exist traveling without moving time is
a flat circle. He allegedly found this and was able
to truly access it at least you know according to
articles written about him. If you haven't listened to our
(47:51):
episode on alchemy, we had a guest, dear friend of
Ben's and now the show, Mr Damian Patrick Williams. We
had a fantastic versation about um the nature of alchemy,
and then there's a nice companion episode we did on
the same day about technology and its relationship with the occult.
As are some of my favorite episodes. I really recommend
(48:11):
going back into the archives and checking those out. And
this concludes our Gosh but wait, as Billy Mays was
wont to say Durina's glory days, there is more. This
is usually the part of the show where we talked
about our Facebook and Twitter and ask you to check
it out because you'll see suth that doesn't make it
(48:34):
onto the air for one reason or another. You'll also
see us actively taking suggestions were conspiracy stuff at those
We're also on Instagram now that's right, and we are
conspiracy stuff show there, and you guys, we haven't done
this before, but we would really appreciate it. Wherever you
listen to the podcast, be at iTunes, Stitcher, We're now
(48:55):
on Spotify, We're on Google Play, tons of places you
can get it. Leave us a review. I mean that
really helps the algorithm. It helps more people find out
about the show, and you know, it makes us feel
good in our hearts a need that every time we
get a review, our boss goes up to this thing
he painted on the wall. You know how they're like
(49:16):
fundraisers for schools and stuff where they'll have you know,
like a thermometer with the levels of money. Well, ours
is the level of likelihood of us being fired. And
if it gets to the top, and we've been very
close to the top for a while, then boom, we're
out here. So every like and every review ticks us
down just a little bit further away from being fired. Because,
(49:36):
as Ben Is said in the past, the biggest investment
that you make and the show is with your time.
So we would really really appreciate if you would take
just a little more of your time and say how
you feel about the show. All right, we said we
were gonna do it. The active Internet users in the
world right now total comes to three billion and one million,
(50:00):
one d and twenty one thousand, five hundred and forty
and counting. And you out there who are part of
this massive number Please do us a solid Send us
your thoughts, send us your episode recommendations. We are conspiracy
at house stop works dot com.
Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
Hosts And Creators
Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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