December 10, 2025 • 54 mins
Located in the eastern Pacific ocean, thousands of miles from other civilizations, Rapa Nui is home to an enduring mystery: hundreds of giant, stone sculptures called maoi. For centuries, outsiders had no idea how these were built, when, why or -- most importantly -- what happened to make the construction stop. In tonight's episode, Ben, Matt and Noel dive deep into hidden history and the latest research... and just may, finally, find the answers.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Nolan.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
They call be Bed. We're joined as always with our
super producer Dylan. That's Tennessee pal Fagan. Most importantly, you
argue you are here. That makes this the stuff they
don't want you to know. Thank you for joining us tonight, folks.
We had a bit of a rough ride with a
previous episode on Chicago's Ripper Crew, so we're thinking of
(00:51):
this one as a bit of a palate cleanser.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Man, I'm both bummed and not bummed that I missed
that one.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Yeah, and welcome back. You know I've been using new
street name for you, Copenhagen Brown. I appreciate.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
I hope people don't think that I'm like doing dips
all the time. You know, the Copenhagen isn't that like
a chew, like a chewing tobacco brand.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Oh, I think it is.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
It might be. Yeah, not the demographic, but cool. I
don't think they're no no, no, I love it.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
I'm here for it, and people can think whatever they want.
And I had a really lovely time. And Copenhagen despite
Radio had canceling their show that I was there for
because speaking of conspiracy theories, now, Tommy Yorick had apparently
a real bad throat infection and my show got rescheduled
and I'm not going back. But I had a great time,
lovely Christmas market. It's a great time of year to
(01:37):
be in that part of the world.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Simply having a wonderful Christmas time. I didn't say that.
That's Paul McCartney. Yeah, Paul McCartney is simply having a
wonderful Christmas time at all times.
Speaker 4 (01:53):
Wonderful Christmas time at all times.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
The phrase is fine, Just please don't say it in
that way, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
There's a great conspiracy about our conspiracy theory about this
that I enjoy, which is the narrative that that song
is entirely a bunch of people having pagan celebrations and
line to the authorities. So the authorities show up and
then they say, oh, oh, we're simply having a wonderful
(02:23):
Christmas time.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So look look at all of the point.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
An alternate conspiracy is that it in and of itself
is a syop and the most brilliant one ever perpetrated
on the American people whoa mind control stuff. Guys, Hey,
have y'all ever considered the coconut? I mean, it's a
it's a it's a legitimate question. You can do a
lot with a coca. I'm sorry, we're talking about something
(02:48):
today that's got me very malana coated.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Ah.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Yes, this is our a bit of a bit of
a palate cleanser. It's one of those, Uh, it's one
of those explorations or episodes that we looked back upon
and said, to wait, have we really never covered this?
It's kind of a Bermuda Triangle moment for us. We're
diving into something. It's a little bit of hidden history,
a little bit of travel, and I would say an
(03:12):
enduring obsession for all of us in our younger, wilder years.
This is the story of the mysterious sculptures of Rapannui,
often called Easter Island.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Yeah, you know it because of the statues, So we're
kind of focused a little bit on those today, right.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
You may also know it as as an UNESCO World
heritage site, I believe, and is it also one of
the wonders of the modern world.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
It definitely should be. Yeah, it definitely should be.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
What a snub?
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Well, we also know that the idea of what makes
what dotha wonder make is pretty arbitrary throughout history.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
I thought I wondered that myself.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Yeah, we've got a whole series of that on Ridiculous History.
Check it out for now with us, folks. Imagine we're
in a boat, the waves are rising, and we see
there in the distance, a little piece of land in
the middle of nowhere. What's that on the horizon? Why?
It looks like a giant person with a very big head. Okay,
(04:18):
we'll be back. Here are the facts, all right. We're
going to use the phrases Easter Island and Rapa Nui interchangeably,
because most of the outside world uses the term Easter Island,
but the original inhabitants call it Rapa Nui.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
That's right. And I mentioned the Alana bit because I
believe the fictional island that that film takes place on
is called Maltan Nui and seems to be It's definitely
a reference to the Polynesian heritage and culture of this
part of the world.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah, that's cool man, Yeah, because I believe Rapa nui
means great rapa. It's also been called Tepito te henw
we're not native speakers here. That translates in English to
navel of the world. But the name you probably know
it best by folks statistically is Easter Island. And that
doesn't come from the people who live there. That comes
(05:17):
from the first Europeans that we know made it over
to the island. They were Dutch. They reached it in
seventeen twenty two, and they reached it on Easter Day. So,
in an entirely not self absorbed way, they named the
whole island after the day they reached it. They did
not ask the locals. It's like showing up to someone
(05:40):
else's town on a Tuesday and saying, oh, this is
Tuesday toon.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Hell yeah, European conquista horse slash Explorers. Well is that
funny too?
Speaker 4 (05:51):
The way things like that just stick. Like we did
an episode of Ridiculous History about the origins of the
ice cream Sunday and that had everything to do with
the fact that it originally was like a special that
came out on a Sunday.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Yeah, for weird religious reasons exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
So, guys, the original inhabitants. Yes, I found a couple
stories that said that there had only been human inhabitants
on the island for about nine hundred years. I guess
before that, or I guess at this point nine hundred
years ago. But did you guys find that there was
a later date than that.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, we'll get into that in depth here. And I'm
glad you're bringing that up because there's still This is
a slight spoiler, but one of the big reveals of
this episode is going to be all the mysteries we
bring up continue and there's new, amazing research that keeps
reframing the conversation or the exploration, and we could posit
(06:49):
that part of the reason this research is still ongoing.
Part of the reason these various mysteries we're exploring still
continue here in twenty twenty five record on Friday, December fifth,
is because Rapa Nui is so far away from everything else,
and it is tiny. If you pull up your favorite
(07:11):
Big Brother Internet map of choice, you'll see this thing
is only sixty three square miles in size. It's in
the eastern part of the Pacific Ocean, and it is
so gosh darn far away from everything. When the Dutch
first got there, they said, okay, these native inhabitants live
(07:33):
a life similar to that of other folks we know
of in other parts of Polynesia, with a big difference.
This place is riddled with statues, monolithic sculptures, ruins. The
Europeans occasionally speculated of a once great civilization that must
have fallen in antiquity, and of course, you know, being
(07:57):
Europeans of their day, they said, oh, this must mean
that some ancient group of proto European people got here first,
because who else would build this same stuff they said
about the Sphinx and the Pyramids. Bit of an anglocentric view, right,
Oh yeah, for sure. And post European arrival, this goes
(08:21):
back to this harkens back to our episode on uncontacted
peoples and tribes. After the Europeans figured out this thing existed,
stuff went pretty tough for the local people. New diseases arrived.
Later in the eighteen sixties, Peruvian forces would launch straight
up slave raids, and that's also contributed to a massive
(08:45):
migration drain. Locals were saying, okay, I got to get
out of here. I know everything else is far away,
but I'm going to try to go to Tahiti. And
as a result, you know, when the Dutch got there,
there were an estimated two thousand to three thousand pe
people on Rapanui. But by eighteen seventy seven, because of
all these factors, there were only one hundred and eleven
(09:09):
native people Jesus alive.
Speaker 4 (09:13):
One hundred and eleven souls. That's that's not very many.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
That's a rate of attrition.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yeah, well, I mean it is improving, I believe.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, and now, okay,
so fast forward. It's eighteen eighty eight. Chile conkers the
island annex. Is it similar to what the US would
later do with Hawaii in the fifties at nineteen fifties
and this, this situation continues today. Easter Island Rapanui is
(09:42):
a dependency of Chile, but it may as well be
on a different planet. It's actually do you guys remember
the Pitcairn Islands. We've never been, but I.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
Don't know about them.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
No, oh man, that's its own stuff. They don't want
you to know. It's a very it's an island of
partially Tahitian descent and partially Mutineer descent from back in
the day. And it had an intergenerational continuing sex scandal.
(10:14):
And it's technically part of England for some reason. But anyway,
that place is also isolated in the middle of nowhere.
At Rapanui's so far away that it is closer to
Pitcairn Island than it is to Chile. It's like twelve
hundred miles from Pitcairn, but it's two thousand something miles
away from Chile. It's tough to get to.
Speaker 4 (10:37):
It's interesting too that the indigenous folks there were not
granted citizenship of Chile until nearly a century later, in
nineteen sixty six.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Has the population increased.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
I think that's again I believe, I believe it's doing.
They're on the ups.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
If you look at the I guess a map from
above of this island, you can just see that there
aren't a ton of great places to live on the
I mean there's some, there's some really nice areas, it's
just a lot of it is volcanic rock. And you
know that huge crater that's there from a volcanic crater
(11:14):
that we're going to talk about later with the quarrying
and everything, but it's when I was trying to imagine
around three thousand people on that island at one time.
That felt like a lot to me.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
Yeah, yeah, it definitely was. And now, as far as
we can tell, at least from the twenty seventeen census,
Rapa Nui has a popul population of a little less
than eight thousand people something like seven seven hundred and
fifty now, and that's only possible because of international.
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Trade, that's right, And as we mentioned before European contact,
it was only around three thousand before that precipitous drop,
so you know, doing comparatively well, yeah, which will go
into our ideas of the concepts we have to explore
limited resources and population control. I mean, this is still,
(12:06):
again by any measure, one of the most remote inhabited
islands on the world. We talked about it a little
bit off air. As we remember, I had.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
The misfortune and lack of foresight to get so close
to visiting Rapanui back in twenty nineteen at the dawn
of the world locking down for the pandemic. So instead
of actually making it over there, you can only fly
out from Chile at certain times of the year. Guys,
(12:38):
I ended up racing back to the Santiago airport to
try to make it out of the country before they
shut down their borders. It was dicey, and.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
You'd never made it, and you're still there right now today.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
And I never made it and I'm still there right
there today.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
But that's interesting. It was just going to be a
flight from where you were in Chile to to the island.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Yeah, so a flight out of Santiago is usually going
to be how most modern outsiders arrive to Easter Island.
And it can again, it can only happen specific times
a year. That's when they offer it.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
But I'm sorry. Last question, is there I imagine there's
a lot of tourism on the island, So is there
a pretty good infrastructure as a visitor when you go
there to stay in a place for a while.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Now there is a much more robust infrastructure because people
do travel there despite it being despite it being so
cartoonishly remote. If you get over there, you're going to
go for several reasons. Right There are a lot of
(13:46):
people who go there for scientific research. There are a
lot of folks who go there for personal curiosity, even
to the degree of people who may have ancestry from there, right,
but they are now part of the diasporas, so they
have returned to learn more about their ancestry. And then
of course quiet part out loud. A ton of people
(14:08):
are there to see the statues in person, the moai.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Because they're mysterious. It's all heck, why why these? Why this?
Why did you face it this way?
Speaker 3 (14:19):
Well? They look like that?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Whose face is that?
Speaker 2 (14:21):
When? How did they get there?
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Right?
Speaker 2 (14:23):
That was at least for a long time. I remember
when when we're growing up with those those book series.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Right and everything, Mysteries of the Unknown, shot timelife.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Yeah, how do they get to where they are on
the island? And like and again why they are.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
Because they're structurally I mean massive and the way tons
they're ten to twenty feet tall. Some of them are
even bigger than that. And there's a lot of them.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
Yeah, yeah, hundreds, hundreds that we know of, and several
of them also are still standing or have been re
erected on equally mysterious huge stone platforms called ahoo So
for centuries, ever since the first Europeans stumbled across the place,
they and everyone who came after them were mystified by
(15:10):
these gigantic stone statues, by these moi, and so people
have always obsessed about this stuff. Who built them, how
did they build them? When did they build them? To
some of the questions you were raising their matt and also,
perhaps most importantly, why did they build them? And why
did they stop?
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Yeah? Think about how much effort it would take to
make one of those things, right, that's the concept. And
then these people chose to make that many. There's got
to be some serious significance to these things.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
And so tonight we're tackling the mystery. Join us. We'll
be back after a word from our sponsors. Here's where
it gets crazy, all right, to answer these questions, to
tackle them and unravel some of this mystery, or carve
(16:04):
out the stone of this mystery. Maybe we start by
learning a little bit more about the maui themselves. I
feel like it is an assumption, but I feel like
pretty much all of us who are tuning in tonight
are familiar with the iconic pictures of the Easter Island statues.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
Right, very large foreheads, very large sloping noses.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah, yes, stoic expression. They differ in size and location
They're usually going to be the ones that were moved
from their quarry site, which we'll get to. They're usually
going to be along the coast. They're going to be
facing in towards the interior pretty often, and their rocking
stoic expression. About three eighths of the entire statue. Is
(16:51):
this enormous, elongated, somewhat rectangular head.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Yeah, and as you were saying, they're mostly facing in,
but there are some that are facing out right, which
leads to that mystery. It seems like they would all
be facing the direction of the important thing that they symbolize,
whatever this would be. This is imagining we're one of
these European explorers, especially that stumbles upon these, right, Why
(17:19):
would you even have a choice of facing it some
different direction?
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Yeah, exactly what is the significance of that placement? You know?
In the visages of these sculptures, this is interesting. We
see a great hommonality. Not just the fact that although
they vary in size and weight, they also very emplacement
and so on, but the fact that they all have
(17:44):
such similar expression also shows us a connection to other
Polynesian cultures. You got the minimalist style. The heads are
probably so big because there's this common Polynesian belief that
the head is a center of sanctity. So you're kind
of prioritizing that in the in the construction. Whomever we're
(18:07):
building these things in memory of, it's meant to make
them look good and say, hey, these were impressive people.
At least that's our assumption this squatting. They have arms
resting different positions, but they don't have legs.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Never legs, not all out.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Legs are too far.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Maybe legs didn't the see a thing though, maybe they
had legs. That was one of the early mysteries about
the thing, like is this statue because many of them
were in the earth, right, so you.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Buried about up to what looks like the shoulders.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yes, So there was this imagining that, oh, if we
excavate this thing, we're gonna get a full humanoid statue. Right,
That was and that was a long time ago. We've
found out that, Yeah, it is almost like there's there's
detail on many of them that goes down past those shoulders,
past this area, but not much.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Right right, Yeah, nailed it. I mean. Current research argues
that most, if not all, of these were created sometime
between twelve hundred and fifty or twelve hundred CE and
fifteen hundred CE. So this means they had been standing
and in some cases they had fallen or been knocked
over for centuries before there was any meaningful contact with
(19:27):
the outside world. That goes back to someone who teased
to have been in the beginning here. For a long time,
people would look at these statues and say, okay, we
can guess they were made and you know, insert this
time period, but how did the people who carved them?
How did these sculptors get to the island in the
first place, right, because they had to come from somewhere.
(19:49):
It's just too far away from other sites of natural
human evolutions. So for a long long time, researchers said, okay,
the people that we call the Rapanui, or the original
native inhabitants of this island, they got there around eight
hundred CE. But if you fast forward in two thousand
(20:11):
and seven, you'll see studies that make a pretty good
case they didn't get there in eight hundred CE, but
much later in twelve hundred which is again exactly when
we believe the construction of the original statues began.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Isn't that interesting? It what do you guys think is
more plausible a group of humans arrives on a remote
island like that and immediately begins building, you know, some
statues of significance, or the concept of building the statues
is grown after several hundred years of a civilization being there.
Speaker 4 (20:51):
I think it's that one, Matt that seems most likely.
I'd have to have I don't know, some shared experience
and to kind of have time to semboled that much lore.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
I guess around it, well, Kat, I would argue actually
for the twelve hundred arrival date, just from the studies
and the oral history that we're going to talk about
a little bit, which is kind of a mixture of genealogy, lineage,
historical record and then myth making and propaganda. For sure,
(21:23):
But it feels to me like if you look at
or not to me, but based on the studies that
we were reading for this, it feels like the statues
have so much in common with other similar Polynesian practices
that they probably landed there and got cracking.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Okay, yeah, oh that's a good point.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
I guess, yes, they would have already had a lot
of those beliefs in place, for sure.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
I think I agree with you, Ben from the studies.
The interesting thing that's arising there is we're about to
talk about it in the construction of these things. We're
going to It was thought for long time that this
was one big herculean effort that everybody got together to do, right,
But as we're the more we're learning, we're learning that, oh, well,
(22:09):
maybe these statues were actually constructed by much smaller groups
for their own individual group's purposes, which makes me just
personally move a little bit away from that concept that
they all arrived together and then this was the thing
that you do. But maybe I'm my thinking is a
little wrong there. I'm just not sure yet.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Yeah, let's get to this because these are great questions.
We're okay, let's say we're random explorers or we are
shipwrecked and we somehow end up on Rapanui. When we
look at these things, they're weighing fourteen tons on average,
but the tallest weighs eighty plus tons, The heaviest weighs
in at eighty six tons, a real bruiser, and you
(22:55):
would have to say, how did these things get here?
Especially if you're on the coast. Sixty three miles square
is not a big deal in the size of the
world overall. But if you're a human and you're standing
on the coast, you're going to just see a stunning
statue or series of statues, and you're gonna have no
(23:16):
idea where they came from. It looks like they kind
of sprouted out of the rock in some cases, or
sprouted out of the ground. And this is where we
get to the immensely impressive details of construction. It reminds
me a lot of the other stuff we see in archaeology,
(23:36):
something called experimental archaeology, like that famous clip of the
guy who's trying to build stone hinge by himself for
demonstrating the methods you could use with simple technology to
create this stuff, and.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
He was really effective at it or VI recall I
remember those videos, and it often, at least in the
construction here we're talking about ballards right by yards. I
don't know how to say it correctly, or where it
even stems from. The posts in the ground staggered in
(24:09):
certain ways so that you could actually end up rolling
a statue down like from a large let's say quarried hill.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Yeah, and these statues, by the way, are all carved
from pretty much the same thing, a substance called volcanic
tough tuff tough stone.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Hey, I only know a boy that from Minecraft.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
My favorite way to spell tough two is in any context,
it's not the same as obsidian or other kinds of
volcanic rock. This is made from solidified volcanic ash, right.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Yeah, you nailed it. Upwards of ninety five percent of
all known sculptures, please clock how we said known sculptures
comes from quarry zones at a volcanic crater called Rano Rabraku,
and this place is still home to a lot of
what we call incomplete MOI today. Like if you go
(25:07):
to the quarry, you'll see instances where it looks like
someone started carving out a new statue and then stopped
somewhere in the process, kind of like walking through a
car factory and seeing a car that is partially completed.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
You can see mapped images, like if you're looking in
the satellite imagery of this place, and you can kind
of maybe feel like you're making out statues hanging out
as we talked about, that still exists in that quarry
and that's pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Yeah, you know, and oral traditions, which often get ignored
by the way. Historically they suggest that the maui were
carved either by this distinguished class of artisans right or
by members of each individual clan, because the Rapanui at
this time they were not They all lived in the
(25:56):
same place right on the same sixty three square miles,
but they had individual factions, communities, people's clans, lineages, and
so we know that the quarry appears to be even
per the oral history that again people were ignored. The
quarry was subdivided into different territories. For each clan they
(26:18):
had their turf of carving areas. So after a statue
gets completed, the locals, this is the narrative, they would
painfully move it all the way from the quarry, which
is in like the southwest to the coast to a
ceremonial site, and then sometimes they would adorn it with
a red stone cylinder called a I can't remember the
(26:41):
pronunciation p ukao pucau. Maybe it looks for all the
world like a cute red hat. If you've seen the pictures,
it looks like a red hat with a brim around it.
A lot of those ended up a lay off over time,
(27:02):
as we'll see. Care for the care for the now,
I declined precipitously. Later research would show I think it
was you Nola mentioned obsidian. Later research would show that
these things looked way different when they were originally constructed.
They probably in the carvings for the eye sockets, there
(27:22):
was probably other material like obsidian and like a.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
White little adornments, kind of like a little detail work.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Yeah, it looked like they had actual eyes that were
staring at so.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Oh, okay, that would have been cool to see.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Like a snowman and the coal.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
I don't know, Yeah, that's right, very similar, right, And
so everybody said the doll's eyes. Sorry, like Kirsten Dunn said,
it's just yeah, we don't have to relitergate that one.
But I said what I said. So, this was obviously
(28:03):
a time intensive pursuit. You had to have huge amounts
of skill, patience, and people thought huge amounts of collaboration.
So naturally, one of the first questions everybody asked, from
the Dutch all the way to the modern day is
why would you go to all this trouble in the
first place? What would motivate you towards such an historical flex.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Well, we will explore that and much more. Right after
a quick break to hear, we're from our sponsor and
we're back. So let's start in right away on some
of these answers. The first answer to the question why
would you do this, why would you bother going to
all this trouble to build some giant heads is ancestry. Ben,
(28:49):
you pointed out one word, ancestry. Many mai are thought
to be representations and commemorations of the debt monuments to
past and present try leaders. These were, you know, incredible
flexes like you put it, Ben, status symbols thinking of
think of like, you know, a mausoleum, you know, marking
(29:12):
the burial spot of a great general or something like that.
You know, we we still do stuff like that to
this day, honoring the dead and various ostentatious forms, you know,
depending on their stature when.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
They were alive.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Yeah, yeah, this was very It was very socially valuable too,
aside from the spiritual aspects of it. But you say
that it reminds me of an earlier conversation I can't
remember which show or whether it was on air, about
the problematic aspect of a living person getting a statue
(29:45):
of themselves. It feels a lot, doesn't it feel a little.
Speaker 4 (29:50):
Lot been really quickly. We don't have any evidence, however,
that these were burial sites, though this would have been
more just like an honoring of these individuals, not necessarily
that their remains were there.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Yeah, that's a great point. We don't have a ton
of evidence saying that this would be you know, like
how a pyramid would have a VIP of that society
interred within or something. We don't have evidence of that.
But we do have sub kind of evidence that these
statues were placed purposely for some reason. The largest the
(30:27):
larger the statue was, the more manna according to Bradstreet Foundation,
or the more you know the juice, the more acclaim
you had as being the person who commissioned it. So
some of these statues were made for leaders of communities
or tribes while they were alive, which again it's just
(30:49):
it feels weird to have a statue of yourself while
you're alive. If it's someone else's idea, I guess that's
fine because it's them giving you a gift and you
don't want to be a jerk about it. But if
it's if it's your idea, it's it's a little weird.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Which is more self aggrandizing a statue or a giant arch?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Hmmm? For a good question, I would say it depends
on the size of the statue. Okay, maybe that's.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Part of it. Maybe an arch sized statue would be
worse than a statue sized arch.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Yeah, because you're getting a little as a mandias when
you put your face on it. Right, and check out
our earlier strange News conversation about why why this country,
the United States, had to make a specific law that
said no living people on the money. Mm hmmm, because
it became so it all goes down to one really
(31:47):
really sneaky ballsy guy at the Treasury. I forgot about
that story. It's me, I'm on the money, look exactly,
which has to you know, in some social situations. I
guess that is impressive, but so okay. Ancestry is one
answer to that question why build these statues in the
(32:10):
first place? But the second question becomes why build so
very many? And that leads us to our second answer. Competition. Man,
these guys got mad when the people the next neighborhood
over built a statue that was bigger.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, it goes back to that early early concept that oh,
look these people's constructed statues together as one thing, right,
all of these peoples living on this island must be
the same and of this one culture, and all did
them together. And then going back to the competition aspect,
it makes total sense now and and or with that
(32:49):
new framing, right, with just a little bit of time.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
Yeah, now it's a matter of keeping up with the Joneses.
It's an arms race of op and importance. It's kind
of like I was reading about this in Macau and
a lot of the casinos, there's this weird thing that
happens where people get VIP tables at casinos or clubs,
(33:16):
and to show off their wealth, they start ordering expensive
champagne for whatever seems like the next richest table or
the next biggest table of rich people, and then those
folks respawed by ordering more bottles of champagne for the
other table. Now, spoiler, folks, Those bottles of champagne get announced,
(33:37):
but they never actually get delivered. It is entirely just
to say, look at me and the money I have.
And the folks do get charged for the champagne, they
just never actually get to drink it.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Oh snap, the guys on my MoMA told me just
had a great conversation with someone about that very thing
in the conspiracy of the bottle service, of slowly draining
the wealth with bottle service, and it's insane.
Speaker 4 (34:03):
The markup on alcohol already is insane, and bottle service
just makes it like ten x it's oh my gosh,
it's bonkers.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Well, and the social pressure to do it right right,
combined with just who is actually getting bottle service and
a table, like who is actually getting a VIP table?
Wait a second, it's not the like extremely wealthy people
doing that.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
No, it's the up and comers with the Jones pressure, yes, sir, yeah,
or who need to be visible, right, Like let's say
I have an album that just came out, or let's
say I'm trying to popularize this. Uh, this happens especially
in Atlanta too. By the way, I'm trying to popularize
this single that I once played at the club, and
(34:46):
now here I am in person at the club. It's
me Swift City, which is an old Rapnu mas.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Well, you're paying for the real estate too, you're playing,
You're paying for the spot and being seen and all
of the accoutre moment goes along with it, and that,
you know, presentation of wealth and opulence.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
So what we're saying is this is a very human
constant folks around the world. And there were doubtlessly some
groups at some point on Rapanui who maybe over prioritized
building these statues, you know, maybe could have spent a
(35:22):
little more time fishing, maybe already sort of predicted some
agricultural issues ahead. But will be gosh darned if those
people a few miles distant have a better, bigger statue
than us.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
It's like somebody at the edge of a huge fire
just saying, remember.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
Me, witness me, witness me. Fury Road was so good.
But I mean, look, we're I hope we're making it
clear folks that we all agree this might seem silly
to some folks in the modern day, but it was
a huge deal in the communities at the time. And
(36:03):
before we look down our collective noses at this or
other practices, we got to remember every society from ancient
to modern evenings has all sorts of practices and status
symbols that seem bizarre or strange to outsiders. And I
want to thank you specifically, Matt, because bottles and my
mom had told me, because bottle service is a perfect
(36:27):
example of how silly this kind of thing can become.
You know, we're using the past tense too, here's why
the island is no longer making these unique, amazing sculptures.
In fact, at some point, until quite recently, the overall
narrative was that for some reason, the locals abruptly stopped
(36:49):
making the statues all together, abandoned the incomplete ones that
had just been a few weeks previous, so very important.
The civilization collapse, that's the argument. But what led to it,
What happened? You know, it's the eighteen hundreds. Of course
by this point, right we said seven twenty two, the
(37:10):
Dutch make it over there. By the eighteen hundreds. Some sources,
overwhelmingly European, are saying the rapanui of the modern day,
you guys, they're a remnant of a greater civilization that
was lost to the waves. Who ever heard of Atlantis dog?
Because they called each other dog? I guess, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:29):
I mean it's not quite as you know, extreme as that.
It's sort of more maybe not obvious, but historically consistent,
just you know, resource extraction. That's really what it amounts.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
To right. Yeah, yeah, they said, look, there are hundreds
of moai out there. They're possibly in the ruins of
full cities that fell beneath the waves. That hypothesis got
debunked because what you just said, Noel, is much more
likely to be the case.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
It's way better than having to publicly come out and say, hey,
sorry for the diseases and all of the slavery stuff.
Maybe instead Atlantis.
Speaker 3 (38:12):
Yeah, I'll be okay. Yeah, the plague is not good
pr for us, so maybe, yeah, a little bit of plague,
but probably Atlantis, though probably I think probably mainly Atlantis.
What we found is that you have to remember Rapanui
is not a big place. If you go to the
Smithsonian as recently as two thousand and seven, when some
(38:34):
of those other studies we mentioned published, they point out
that the local people depended upon giant palms that grew
on the island. However, like any other civilization, they wanted
to march toward progress. They also had a growing population.
They had people to feed, so they started hutting down
the trees. We call it the forestation now. But they
(38:56):
were making room for agriculture, or they were burning for fire,
or they were making tools and instruments, like we were
saying earlier, to transport statues across the island. And then
when you don't have trees, erosion steps in right, and
erosion starts whittling away at the soil, and then eventually
(39:19):
the people have to begin burning grass. So this led
to a perilous situation. The palms are disappearing, people are
beginning to starve. Warfare is breaking out amid these various clans,
and this is war not driven by necessarily deep seated enmity.
(39:40):
It's driven by the fact that if these people eat,
then there is less food than for you. You know,
it's a terrible situation to be in. And so by
the time the Dutch get there, the forest is pretty
much gone. The land is virtually barren.
Speaker 2 (39:56):
Yeah, that's what we're talking about up at the top
of this episode. When you look at the Eye island itself,
you imagine where would all these people live. And even
right now we're saying there's eight thousand people that occupy
the land. It's astonishing and it's only possible for the
things that been mentioned there, getting things to that island
and trading.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Yeah, unfortunately, and of those we should mention of those
almost eight thousand people there on the island, not all
of them are descendants of the original inhabitants. Right. There
are people in Behalf, I believe, Yeah, yeah, yeah, they
live there. There are people who are not rapanui who
(40:35):
live there full time. Right. Not as extreme as what
happened in Hawaii, but I would say a similar process.
So the real villain here is not some act of
the paranormal or vast hidden Atlantean Lemurian conspiracy. Said. It
seems to be what Jared Diamond, the author of Guns,
(40:56):
Germs and Steel, would later describe as eco side, which
is a phrase I wasn't familiar with.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
Yeah, nor I that's a much better term than I
had said, resource extraction.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
This isn't exactly right.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
Certainly some of that, like you said, been making tools
and you know, burning trees for energy and things like that.
But this was just essentially them not quite understanding how
delicate the balance of their ecosystem was, and so ultimately
they killed it.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Wait, was competition amongst different groups there on the island
what led to the problems? Are we saying competition could
be bad at times?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Right, Yeah, especially when coupled with resource consumption. Under very
harsh constraints, you know what I mean, because it's not
as if. Look, it was such an epic journey to
get there in the first place, what is considered the
easternmost Polynesian island. You were in a locked room essentially
(41:58):
with the technology at the time. Right, even though Polynesian
cultures pretty much by any measure, for thousands of years
they were the world leaders in navigation using the stars
at sea. Uh, even with the oral history, you would
know things were a long long way away, So you
(42:18):
don't really have anywhere to go.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
It's tough to mcgruber yourself out of some ecoside.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
Right exactly. Yes, and do check out. I was going
to make up a mcgruver episode. We did, but we
have it yet. We'll get there. We'll get there. We'll
call Will fort Nae.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
Did you guys see the Epstein Files.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
One? Yes, it's a series, a series of sketches from
one of the most recent Saturday Night Lives and to
say anything Saturday Night Lives whatever, to say anything else
ruin your enjoyment. But do check it out. I'm going
to look forward to Yeah, text this other group chat.
(42:56):
I'm sure it is a compilation.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
Mcgroover's definitely not in them.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
Definitely not, definitely not. We're asking too many questions, so well,
was it toss me that paper clip? Let's focus and
what's important. So we wanted to close this one out
with something we've been kind of teasing. This is our
big reveal. Research into the story of Rapanui continues just
(43:20):
last month. In fact, new investigations indicate that humanity still
has a lot to learn about the rise and fall
of this statue building era, as well as about the
moi themselves. And this brings us to a professor of
anthropology at Binghampton University, Carl Philip LiPo LPO.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
Matt, you were talking about this one off micah Bit
and how fascinated you were by these new was it
three D models that give you a real look like
behind the curtain of all this stuff?
Speaker 3 (43:48):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (43:48):
Yes, this is Carl Philip LiPo, Professor of Anthropology at
Binghamton University and the State University of New York. This
is It's incredible. It's a thousand Molai statues and the
quarry itself and large parts of the island that are
(44:09):
in a high resolution three D model. And when you
pull the thing up and you look at it, which
we highly recommend you do. I don't know if there's
a super easy way to get to it, guys, because
it's not like the best url. I found it on
fizzorg phys dot org. I'll just give you that link
so you can look for it. First of its kind
(44:29):
three D model that's you explore Easter Island statues up close,
and then there's a link in there you can click
on and you can find this thing, which is just
first of all, you're hit with the volcanic crater right
when you look when you open up this three D model,
and then you're looking at the sides of that crater
that have these these thirty I think thirty sites that
(44:53):
are all separate that are well, they're at least separated
out into individual sites. And without this three D model,
it looks like it's one contiguous thing. Wouldn't you say?
Speaker 3 (45:05):
Yeah? Yeah, And please folks, always support your local academics.
Go to the name of the actual study is Megalithic
Statue Production on rap Anui and you should be able
to find it on plos. You should be able to
read it in full. It's worth your time and like
Matt was, saying it fundamentally redefines some what we understand
(45:29):
about this process, because they also how cool is this?
They used drones to collect all these images that they compile,
and they also use something that I just learned about.
It's one of my new favorite words, a process called
structure for motion photo grammetry. Photo grammetry. It sounds like
(45:51):
a weird class you would take at the Harry Potter School. Heck, yeah,
I'm a photogrammatrist. And that's where they make that three
D model. They overlap the two D images, and this
is where they find our big reveal that labor was
not some kind of pyramid scheme, no bad jokes left behind.
(46:15):
Instead of a top down hierarchical approach where one king
is ordering construction, it appears that there was this group.
There was an abundance of self organized smaller family groups,
clans or tribes, and everybody had their turf in the quarry.
(46:35):
They were competing with each other. And also it took
way fewer people to move, to complete and to move
the statues than we assumed. It wasn't the entire island
going one two three bush. It was like six people
going one two three bush.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
Yeah, it's like because of the use of those ballard
things that I didn't understand what these were at all.
You can use that word to describe a lot of
different things. One of them are the little stubby metal
posts that you've seen on a wharf or something like
if you're going to attach a boat to something, those
(47:14):
are considered ballards. Also in traffic, they've got those same things,
like the concrete ones often or metal ones that you'll see.
They just look a little posts. But if you imagine
a bunch of those things and then rolling once you're
in that quarry and you finally got this huge twenty
ton statue and you can roll it down the hill
(47:36):
with enough people, which is just I still don't understand it.
I can visualize it, but then and I guess I
go back to that same guy you were describing, Ben,
the dude who showed how you can turn a huge,
huge piece of stone around if you just elevate it
in the right way and then build the correct wooden
structures around it.
Speaker 3 (47:56):
Leverage right, it's a hell of a drug. We Yeah,
this this is fascinating because it reminds us of one
of the most amazing parts of human civilization when people
apply themselves to something. They are capable of such remarkable,
extraordinary things without sounding too much like an old curmudgeon,
(48:21):
but just a little bit like an old curmudgeon. These
folks didn't have ubiquitous social media information pulling their focus
and attention away. Their brains weren't suffering from the same
degeneration that occurs when you constantly look at short term content,
which I that's not my opinion, that's a study from earlier.
Speaker 4 (48:44):
And we also, I think, experience that first.
Speaker 3 (48:47):
It's very real.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
It makes one want to lay supine in a quarry
like a statue.
Speaker 3 (48:55):
Sure, and some of those statues were not. They weren't
suddenly abandoned because of a catastrophe. No one was like, oh,
the last palm tree's done, We're not gonna work anymore.
A lot of times, because of the material science of
volcanic tough you would be part way through carving something
out and you would run into lumps of much harder rock,
(49:16):
which is much more difficult to carve or carve around.
Or current science speculates some of these were just rock
carvings that weren't meant to be moved. It's almost like
some of them were practice carvings. If you think about
it's say, okay, well, before we do the actual statue,
let me make sure I get this news right.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
Or maybe you know Bob passed away just before he
could finish his statue, and he was our only specialist
in our group. Well, crap, I guess we're done there.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
Yeah, I guess we're gotta make friends with someone else.
And they're like, ah, but I hate those guys in
the next valley.
Speaker 2 (49:56):
I really don't like Bob's work either. We're going to
start a different one.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
His work derivative. It looked too much like the other statues.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
Can you imagine some of that?
Speaker 3 (50:06):
Like kind of definitely, especially because they're in competition, not cooperation.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
So that Petty always right.
Speaker 3 (50:16):
So Lipo's team also, this is another thing that is
studying they came away with in the research. He's calling
into question that official accepted story of deforestation, resource loss,
and massive collapse. He says that if you look at
this with the information, the data that they have uncovered,
the unfinished Moi at Rono Raurku aren't evidence of a
(50:40):
sudden catastrophe. He says, they're normal quarry operations, so as
life gradually got worse. This kind of the prioritization of
this historical flex started to decline because people were increasingly
concerned about stuff like staying alive and eating food, hopefully
(51:00):
at least once in a twenty four hour period. This
leads us to that question again, we're returning to it.
What actually happened. We still don't know, but we be
modern civilization are closer than ever before, and Guys, I
would posit that the biggest potential for further breakthrough on
the horizon here includes leveraging new technology like in the
(51:24):
professor's work as well as in this is something I
think the public's ignoring, as well as returning to those
oral histories anew and using current technology to fit these
narratives to see how they compare to the forensic evidence
(51:44):
that has been gathered and discovered. And I think we'll find,
as we often do with oral history, there's a lot
of astonishing truth there. It's a little bit of myth,
but there's a lot of accurate information in there.
Speaker 2 (51:57):
I think you're absolutely right, Ben, I do think we
have to keep our minds open for learning something extra
right as we as technologies advanced, as some new thing
is discovered there on the island. That explains things. We
just got to keep our minds open the way a
lot of the folks did, who were still exploring this idea,
(52:19):
you know, up until these past few years.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
Absolutely, and perhaps that's where we leave it. We can't
wait to hear from you folks. We hope you're having
a great end of the year. Also, calendars are made up.
Check out our episode on that and we want to
hear from you. So find us on the lines, call
us on the phone, send us an email, et etc.
Speaker 4 (52:41):
Oh please do you can find us at the handle
Conspiracy Stuff where we exist on Facebook with our Facebook
group here's where it gets crazy. On AXVKA, Twitter and
on YouTube we had video content for We're perusing enjoyment
on Instagram and TikTok. However, we're Conspiracy Stuff Show.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
We have a phone number. It is one eight three
three st d WYTK. Turn those letters into numbers, then
give that number a call. When you call in, it's
a voicemail system. Give yourself a cool nickname and let
us know if we can use your name and message
on the air. If you are going to make a
MOI statue, what would it look like let us know.
(53:19):
If you want to send us an email, you can
do that too.
Speaker 3 (53:21):
We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
we receive. Be well aware, yet's out afraid. Sometimes the
void writes back, so join us, O put my sunglasses
on here out in the dark. Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Stuff they don't want you to Know is a production
of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the ihet
art radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is
riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or
learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A
production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,
my name is Nolan.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
They call be Bed. We're joined as always with our
super producer Dylan. That's Tennessee pal Fagan. Most importantly, you
argue you are here. That makes this the stuff they
don't want you to know. Thank you for joining us tonight, folks.
We had a bit of a rough ride with a
previous episode on Chicago's Ripper Crew, so we're thinking of
(00:51):
this one as a bit of a palate cleanser.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Man, I'm both bummed and not bummed that I missed
that one.
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Yeah, and welcome back. You know I've been using new
street name for you, Copenhagen Brown. I appreciate.
Speaker 4 (01:02):
I hope people don't think that I'm like doing dips
all the time. You know, the Copenhagen isn't that like
a chew, like a chewing tobacco brand.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Oh, I think it is.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
It might be. Yeah, not the demographic, but cool. I
don't think they're no no, no, I love it.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
I'm here for it, and people can think whatever they want.
And I had a really lovely time. And Copenhagen despite
Radio had canceling their show that I was there for
because speaking of conspiracy theories, now, Tommy Yorick had apparently
a real bad throat infection and my show got rescheduled
and I'm not going back. But I had a great time,
lovely Christmas market. It's a great time of year to
(01:37):
be in that part of the world.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
Simply having a wonderful Christmas time. I didn't say that.
That's Paul McCartney. Yeah, Paul McCartney is simply having a
wonderful Christmas time at all times.
Speaker 4 (01:53):
Wonderful Christmas time at all times.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
The phrase is fine, Just please don't say it in
that way, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
There's a great conspiracy about our conspiracy theory about this
that I enjoy, which is the narrative that that song
is entirely a bunch of people having pagan celebrations and
line to the authorities. So the authorities show up and
then they say, oh, oh, we're simply having a wonderful
(02:23):
Christmas time.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So look look at all of the point.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
An alternate conspiracy is that it in and of itself
is a syop and the most brilliant one ever perpetrated
on the American people whoa mind control stuff. Guys, Hey,
have y'all ever considered the coconut? I mean, it's a
it's a it's a legitimate question. You can do a
lot with a coca. I'm sorry, we're talking about something
(02:48):
today that's got me very malana coated.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Ah.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Yes, this is our a bit of a bit of
a palate cleanser. It's one of those, Uh, it's one
of those explorations or episodes that we looked back upon
and said, to wait, have we really never covered this?
It's kind of a Bermuda Triangle moment for us. We're
diving into something. It's a little bit of hidden history,
a little bit of travel, and I would say an
(03:12):
enduring obsession for all of us in our younger, wilder years.
This is the story of the mysterious sculptures of Rapannui,
often called Easter Island.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Yeah, you know it because of the statues, So we're
kind of focused a little bit on those today, right.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
You may also know it as as an UNESCO World
heritage site, I believe, and is it also one of
the wonders of the modern world.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
It definitely should be. Yeah, it definitely should be.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
What a snub?
Speaker 3 (03:44):
Well, we also know that the idea of what makes
what dotha wonder make is pretty arbitrary throughout history.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
I thought I wondered that myself.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Yeah, we've got a whole series of that on Ridiculous History.
Check it out for now with us, folks. Imagine we're
in a boat, the waves are rising, and we see
there in the distance, a little piece of land in
the middle of nowhere. What's that on the horizon? Why?
It looks like a giant person with a very big head. Okay,
(04:18):
we'll be back. Here are the facts, all right. We're
going to use the phrases Easter Island and Rapa Nui interchangeably,
because most of the outside world uses the term Easter Island,
but the original inhabitants call it Rapa Nui.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
That's right. And I mentioned the Alana bit because I
believe the fictional island that that film takes place on
is called Maltan Nui and seems to be It's definitely
a reference to the Polynesian heritage and culture of this
part of the world.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah, that's cool man, Yeah, because I believe Rapa nui
means great rapa. It's also been called Tepito te henw
we're not native speakers here. That translates in English to
navel of the world. But the name you probably know
it best by folks statistically is Easter Island. And that
doesn't come from the people who live there. That comes
(05:17):
from the first Europeans that we know made it over
to the island. They were Dutch. They reached it in
seventeen twenty two, and they reached it on Easter Day. So,
in an entirely not self absorbed way, they named the
whole island after the day they reached it. They did
not ask the locals. It's like showing up to someone
(05:40):
else's town on a Tuesday and saying, oh, this is
Tuesday toon.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Hell yeah, European conquista horse slash Explorers. Well is that
funny too?
Speaker 4 (05:51):
The way things like that just stick. Like we did
an episode of Ridiculous History about the origins of the
ice cream Sunday and that had everything to do with
the fact that it originally was like a special that
came out on a Sunday.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Yeah, for weird religious reasons exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
So, guys, the original inhabitants. Yes, I found a couple
stories that said that there had only been human inhabitants
on the island for about nine hundred years. I guess
before that, or I guess at this point nine hundred
years ago. But did you guys find that there was
a later date than that.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, we'll get into that in depth here. And I'm
glad you're bringing that up because there's still This is
a slight spoiler, but one of the big reveals of
this episode is going to be all the mysteries we
bring up continue and there's new, amazing research that keeps
reframing the conversation or the exploration, and we could posit
(06:49):
that part of the reason this research is still ongoing.
Part of the reason these various mysteries we're exploring still
continue here in twenty twenty five record on Friday, December fifth,
is because Rapa Nui is so far away from everything else,
and it is tiny. If you pull up your favorite
(07:11):
Big Brother Internet map of choice, you'll see this thing
is only sixty three square miles in size. It's in
the eastern part of the Pacific Ocean, and it is
so gosh darn far away from everything. When the Dutch
first got there, they said, okay, these native inhabitants live
(07:33):
a life similar to that of other folks we know
of in other parts of Polynesia, with a big difference.
This place is riddled with statues, monolithic sculptures, ruins. The
Europeans occasionally speculated of a once great civilization that must
have fallen in antiquity, and of course, you know, being
(07:57):
Europeans of their day, they said, oh, this must mean
that some ancient group of proto European people got here first,
because who else would build this same stuff they said
about the Sphinx and the Pyramids. Bit of an anglocentric view, right,
Oh yeah, for sure. And post European arrival, this goes
(08:21):
back to this harkens back to our episode on uncontacted
peoples and tribes. After the Europeans figured out this thing existed,
stuff went pretty tough for the local people. New diseases arrived.
Later in the eighteen sixties, Peruvian forces would launch straight
up slave raids, and that's also contributed to a massive
(08:45):
migration drain. Locals were saying, okay, I got to get
out of here. I know everything else is far away,
but I'm going to try to go to Tahiti. And
as a result, you know, when the Dutch got there,
there were an estimated two thousand to three thousand pe
people on Rapanui. But by eighteen seventy seven, because of
all these factors, there were only one hundred and eleven
(09:09):
native people Jesus alive.
Speaker 4 (09:13):
One hundred and eleven souls. That's that's not very many.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
That's a rate of attrition.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yeah, well, I mean it is improving, I believe.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, and now, okay,
so fast forward. It's eighteen eighty eight. Chile conkers the
island annex. Is it similar to what the US would
later do with Hawaii in the fifties at nineteen fifties
and this, this situation continues today. Easter Island Rapanui is
(09:42):
a dependency of Chile, but it may as well be
on a different planet. It's actually do you guys remember
the Pitcairn Islands. We've never been, but I.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
Don't know about them.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
No, oh man, that's its own stuff. They don't want
you to know. It's a very it's an island of
partially Tahitian descent and partially Mutineer descent from back in
the day. And it had an intergenerational continuing sex scandal.
(10:14):
And it's technically part of England for some reason. But anyway,
that place is also isolated in the middle of nowhere.
At Rapanui's so far away that it is closer to
Pitcairn Island than it is to Chile. It's like twelve
hundred miles from Pitcairn, but it's two thousand something miles
away from Chile. It's tough to get to.
Speaker 4 (10:37):
It's interesting too that the indigenous folks there were not
granted citizenship of Chile until nearly a century later, in
nineteen sixty six.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Has the population increased.
Speaker 4 (10:48):
I think that's again I believe, I believe it's doing.
They're on the ups.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
If you look at the I guess a map from
above of this island, you can just see that there
aren't a ton of great places to live on the
I mean there's some, there's some really nice areas, it's
just a lot of it is volcanic rock. And you
know that huge crater that's there from a volcanic crater
(11:14):
that we're going to talk about later with the quarrying
and everything, but it's when I was trying to imagine
around three thousand people on that island at one time.
That felt like a lot to me.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
Yeah, yeah, it definitely was. And now, as far as
we can tell, at least from the twenty seventeen census,
Rapa Nui has a popul population of a little less
than eight thousand people something like seven seven hundred and
fifty now, and that's only possible because of international.
Speaker 4 (11:44):
Trade, that's right, And as we mentioned before European contact,
it was only around three thousand before that precipitous drop,
so you know, doing comparatively well, yeah, which will go
into our ideas of the concepts we have to explore
limited resources and population control. I mean, this is still,
(12:06):
again by any measure, one of the most remote inhabited
islands on the world. We talked about it a little
bit off air. As we remember, I had.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
The misfortune and lack of foresight to get so close
to visiting Rapanui back in twenty nineteen at the dawn
of the world locking down for the pandemic. So instead
of actually making it over there, you can only fly
out from Chile at certain times of the year. Guys,
(12:38):
I ended up racing back to the Santiago airport to
try to make it out of the country before they
shut down their borders. It was dicey, and.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
You'd never made it, and you're still there right now today.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
And I never made it and I'm still there right
there today.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
But that's interesting. It was just going to be a
flight from where you were in Chile to to the island.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Yeah, so a flight out of Santiago is usually going
to be how most modern outsiders arrive to Easter Island.
And it can again, it can only happen specific times
a year. That's when they offer it.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
But I'm sorry. Last question, is there I imagine there's
a lot of tourism on the island, So is there
a pretty good infrastructure as a visitor when you go
there to stay in a place for a while.
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Now there is a much more robust infrastructure because people
do travel there despite it being despite it being so
cartoonishly remote. If you get over there, you're going to
go for several reasons. Right There are a lot of
(13:46):
people who go there for scientific research. There are a
lot of folks who go there for personal curiosity, even
to the degree of people who may have ancestry from there, right,
but they are now part of the diasporas, so they
have returned to learn more about their ancestry. And then
of course quiet part out loud. A ton of people
(14:08):
are there to see the statues in person, the moai.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
Because they're mysterious. It's all heck, why why these? Why this?
Why did you face it this way?
Speaker 3 (14:19):
Well? They look like that?
Speaker 4 (14:20):
Whose face is that?
Speaker 2 (14:21):
When? How did they get there?
Speaker 3 (14:23):
Right?
Speaker 2 (14:23):
That was at least for a long time. I remember
when when we're growing up with those those book series.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Right and everything, Mysteries of the Unknown, shot timelife.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
Yeah, how do they get to where they are on
the island? And like and again why they are.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
Because they're structurally I mean massive and the way tons
they're ten to twenty feet tall. Some of them are
even bigger than that. And there's a lot of them.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
Yeah, yeah, hundreds, hundreds that we know of, and several
of them also are still standing or have been re
erected on equally mysterious huge stone platforms called ahoo So
for centuries, ever since the first Europeans stumbled across the place,
they and everyone who came after them were mystified by
(15:10):
these gigantic stone statues, by these moi, and so people
have always obsessed about this stuff. Who built them, how
did they build them? When did they build them? To
some of the questions you were raising their matt and also,
perhaps most importantly, why did they build them? And why
did they stop?
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Yeah? Think about how much effort it would take to
make one of those things, right, that's the concept. And
then these people chose to make that many. There's got
to be some serious significance to these things.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
And so tonight we're tackling the mystery. Join us. We'll
be back after a word from our sponsors. Here's where
it gets crazy, all right, to answer these questions, to
tackle them and unravel some of this mystery, or carve
(16:04):
out the stone of this mystery. Maybe we start by
learning a little bit more about the maui themselves. I
feel like it is an assumption, but I feel like
pretty much all of us who are tuning in tonight
are familiar with the iconic pictures of the Easter Island statues.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
Right, very large foreheads, very large sloping noses.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah, yes, stoic expression. They differ in size and location
They're usually going to be the ones that were moved
from their quarry site, which we'll get to. They're usually
going to be along the coast. They're going to be
facing in towards the interior pretty often, and their rocking
stoic expression. About three eighths of the entire statue. Is
(16:51):
this enormous, elongated, somewhat rectangular head.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Yeah, and as you were saying, they're mostly facing in,
but there are some that are facing out right, which
leads to that mystery. It seems like they would all
be facing the direction of the important thing that they symbolize,
whatever this would be. This is imagining we're one of
these European explorers, especially that stumbles upon these, right, Why
(17:19):
would you even have a choice of facing it some
different direction?
Speaker 3 (17:23):
Yeah, exactly what is the significance of that placement? You know?
In the visages of these sculptures, this is interesting. We
see a great hommonality. Not just the fact that although
they vary in size and weight, they also very emplacement
and so on, but the fact that they all have
(17:44):
such similar expression also shows us a connection to other
Polynesian cultures. You got the minimalist style. The heads are
probably so big because there's this common Polynesian belief that
the head is a center of sanctity. So you're kind
of prioritizing that in the in the construction. Whomever we're
(18:07):
building these things in memory of, it's meant to make
them look good and say, hey, these were impressive people.
At least that's our assumption this squatting. They have arms
resting different positions, but they don't have legs.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Never legs, not all out.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Legs are too far.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Maybe legs didn't the see a thing though, maybe they
had legs. That was one of the early mysteries about
the thing, like is this statue because many of them
were in the earth, right, so you.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Buried about up to what looks like the shoulders.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yes, So there was this imagining that, oh, if we
excavate this thing, we're gonna get a full humanoid statue. Right,
That was and that was a long time ago. We've
found out that, Yeah, it is almost like there's there's
detail on many of them that goes down past those shoulders,
past this area, but not much.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
Right right, Yeah, nailed it. I mean. Current research argues
that most, if not all, of these were created sometime
between twelve hundred and fifty or twelve hundred CE and
fifteen hundred CE. So this means they had been standing
and in some cases they had fallen or been knocked
over for centuries before there was any meaningful contact with
(19:27):
the outside world. That goes back to someone who teased
to have been in the beginning here. For a long time,
people would look at these statues and say, okay, we
can guess they were made and you know, insert this
time period, but how did the people who carved them?
How did these sculptors get to the island in the
first place, right, because they had to come from somewhere.
(19:49):
It's just too far away from other sites of natural
human evolutions. So for a long long time, researchers said, okay,
the people that we call the Rapanui, or the original
native inhabitants of this island, they got there around eight
hundred CE. But if you fast forward in two thousand
(20:11):
and seven, you'll see studies that make a pretty good
case they didn't get there in eight hundred CE, but
much later in twelve hundred which is again exactly when
we believe the construction of the original statues began.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Isn't that interesting? It what do you guys think is
more plausible a group of humans arrives on a remote
island like that and immediately begins building, you know, some
statues of significance, or the concept of building the statues
is grown after several hundred years of a civilization being there.
Speaker 4 (20:51):
I think it's that one, Matt that seems most likely.
I'd have to have I don't know, some shared experience
and to kind of have time to semboled that much lore.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
I guess around it, well, Kat, I would argue actually
for the twelve hundred arrival date, just from the studies
and the oral history that we're going to talk about
a little bit, which is kind of a mixture of genealogy, lineage,
historical record and then myth making and propaganda. For sure,
(21:23):
But it feels to me like if you look at
or not to me, but based on the studies that
we were reading for this, it feels like the statues
have so much in common with other similar Polynesian practices
that they probably landed there and got cracking.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Okay, yeah, oh that's a good point.
Speaker 4 (21:43):
I guess, yes, they would have already had a lot
of those beliefs in place, for sure.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
I think I agree with you, Ben from the studies.
The interesting thing that's arising there is we're about to
talk about it in the construction of these things. We're
going to It was thought for long time that this
was one big herculean effort that everybody got together to do, right,
But as we're the more we're learning, we're learning that, oh, well,
(22:09):
maybe these statues were actually constructed by much smaller groups
for their own individual group's purposes, which makes me just
personally move a little bit away from that concept that
they all arrived together and then this was the thing
that you do. But maybe I'm my thinking is a
little wrong there. I'm just not sure yet.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Yeah, let's get to this because these are great questions.
We're okay, let's say we're random explorers or we are
shipwrecked and we somehow end up on Rapanui. When we
look at these things, they're weighing fourteen tons on average,
but the tallest weighs eighty plus tons, The heaviest weighs
in at eighty six tons, a real bruiser, and you
(22:55):
would have to say, how did these things get here?
Especially if you're on the coast. Sixty three miles square
is not a big deal in the size of the
world overall. But if you're a human and you're standing
on the coast, you're going to just see a stunning
statue or series of statues, and you're gonna have no
(23:16):
idea where they came from. It looks like they kind
of sprouted out of the rock in some cases, or
sprouted out of the ground. And this is where we
get to the immensely impressive details of construction. It reminds
me a lot of the other stuff we see in archaeology,
(23:36):
something called experimental archaeology, like that famous clip of the
guy who's trying to build stone hinge by himself for
demonstrating the methods you could use with simple technology to
create this stuff, and.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
He was really effective at it or VI recall I
remember those videos, and it often, at least in the
construction here we're talking about ballards right by yards. I
don't know how to say it correctly, or where it
even stems from. The posts in the ground staggered in
(24:09):
certain ways so that you could actually end up rolling
a statue down like from a large let's say quarried hill.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Yeah, and these statues, by the way, are all carved
from pretty much the same thing, a substance called volcanic
tough tuff tough stone.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Hey, I only know a boy that from Minecraft.
Speaker 4 (24:32):
My favorite way to spell tough two is in any context,
it's not the same as obsidian or other kinds of
volcanic rock. This is made from solidified volcanic ash, right.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Yeah, you nailed it. Upwards of ninety five percent of
all known sculptures, please clock how we said known sculptures
comes from quarry zones at a volcanic crater called Rano Rabraku,
and this place is still home to a lot of
what we call incomplete MOI today. Like if you go
(25:07):
to the quarry, you'll see instances where it looks like
someone started carving out a new statue and then stopped
somewhere in the process, kind of like walking through a
car factory and seeing a car that is partially completed.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
You can see mapped images, like if you're looking in
the satellite imagery of this place, and you can kind
of maybe feel like you're making out statues hanging out
as we talked about, that still exists in that quarry
and that's pretty cool.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Yeah, you know, and oral traditions, which often get ignored
by the way. Historically they suggest that the maui were
carved either by this distinguished class of artisans right or
by members of each individual clan, because the Rapanui at
this time they were not They all lived in the
(25:56):
same place right on the same sixty three square miles,
but they had individual factions, communities, people's clans, lineages, and
so we know that the quarry appears to be even
per the oral history that again people were ignored. The
quarry was subdivided into different territories. For each clan they
(26:18):
had their turf of carving areas. So after a statue
gets completed, the locals, this is the narrative, they would
painfully move it all the way from the quarry, which
is in like the southwest to the coast to a
ceremonial site, and then sometimes they would adorn it with
a red stone cylinder called a I can't remember the
(26:41):
pronunciation p ukao pucau. Maybe it looks for all the
world like a cute red hat. If you've seen the pictures,
it looks like a red hat with a brim around it.
A lot of those ended up a lay off over time,
(27:02):
as we'll see. Care for the care for the now,
I declined precipitously. Later research would show I think it
was you Nola mentioned obsidian. Later research would show that
these things looked way different when they were originally constructed.
They probably in the carvings for the eye sockets, there
(27:22):
was probably other material like obsidian and like a.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
White little adornments, kind of like a little detail work.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Yeah, it looked like they had actual eyes that were
staring at so.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Oh, okay, that would have been cool to see.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
Like a snowman and the coal.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
I don't know, Yeah, that's right, very similar, right, And
so everybody said the doll's eyes. Sorry, like Kirsten Dunn said,
it's just yeah, we don't have to relitergate that one.
But I said what I said. So, this was obviously
(28:03):
a time intensive pursuit. You had to have huge amounts
of skill, patience, and people thought huge amounts of collaboration.
So naturally, one of the first questions everybody asked, from
the Dutch all the way to the modern day is
why would you go to all this trouble in the
first place? What would motivate you towards such an historical flex.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Well, we will explore that and much more. Right after
a quick break to hear, we're from our sponsor and
we're back. So let's start in right away on some
of these answers. The first answer to the question why
would you do this, why would you bother going to
all this trouble to build some giant heads is ancestry. Ben,
(28:49):
you pointed out one word, ancestry. Many mai are thought
to be representations and commemorations of the debt monuments to
past and present try leaders. These were, you know, incredible
flexes like you put it, Ben, status symbols thinking of
think of like, you know, a mausoleum, you know, marking
(29:12):
the burial spot of a great general or something like that.
You know, we we still do stuff like that to
this day, honoring the dead and various ostentatious forms, you know,
depending on their stature when.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
They were alive.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Yeah, yeah, this was very It was very socially valuable too,
aside from the spiritual aspects of it. But you say
that it reminds me of an earlier conversation I can't
remember which show or whether it was on air, about
the problematic aspect of a living person getting a statue
(29:45):
of themselves. It feels a lot, doesn't it feel a little.
Speaker 4 (29:50):
Lot been really quickly. We don't have any evidence, however,
that these were burial sites, though this would have been
more just like an honoring of these individuals, not necessarily
that their remains were there.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
Yeah, that's a great point. We don't have a ton
of evidence saying that this would be you know, like
how a pyramid would have a VIP of that society
interred within or something. We don't have evidence of that.
But we do have sub kind of evidence that these
statues were placed purposely for some reason. The largest the
(30:27):
larger the statue was, the more manna according to Bradstreet Foundation,
or the more you know the juice, the more acclaim
you had as being the person who commissioned it. So
some of these statues were made for leaders of communities
or tribes while they were alive, which again it's just
(30:49):
it feels weird to have a statue of yourself while
you're alive. If it's someone else's idea, I guess that's
fine because it's them giving you a gift and you
don't want to be a jerk about it. But if
it's if it's your idea, it's it's a little weird.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
Which is more self aggrandizing a statue or a giant arch?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Hmmm? For a good question, I would say it depends
on the size of the statue. Okay, maybe that's.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Part of it. Maybe an arch sized statue would be
worse than a statue sized arch.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
Yeah, because you're getting a little as a mandias when
you put your face on it. Right, and check out
our earlier strange News conversation about why why this country,
the United States, had to make a specific law that
said no living people on the money. Mm hmmm, because
it became so it all goes down to one really
(31:47):
really sneaky ballsy guy at the Treasury. I forgot about
that story. It's me, I'm on the money, look exactly,
which has to you know, in some social situations. I
guess that is impressive, but so okay. Ancestry is one
answer to that question why build these statues in the
(32:10):
first place? But the second question becomes why build so
very many? And that leads us to our second answer. Competition. Man,
these guys got mad when the people the next neighborhood
over built a statue that was bigger.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, it goes back to that early early concept that oh,
look these people's constructed statues together as one thing, right,
all of these peoples living on this island must be
the same and of this one culture, and all did
them together. And then going back to the competition aspect,
it makes total sense now and and or with that
(32:49):
new framing, right, with just a little bit of time.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
Yeah, now it's a matter of keeping up with the Joneses.
It's an arms race of op and importance. It's kind
of like I was reading about this in Macau and
a lot of the casinos, there's this weird thing that
happens where people get VIP tables at casinos or clubs,
(33:16):
and to show off their wealth, they start ordering expensive
champagne for whatever seems like the next richest table or
the next biggest table of rich people, and then those
folks respawed by ordering more bottles of champagne for the
other table. Now, spoiler, folks, Those bottles of champagne get announced,
(33:37):
but they never actually get delivered. It is entirely just
to say, look at me and the money I have.
And the folks do get charged for the champagne, they
just never actually get to drink it.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Oh snap, the guys on my MoMA told me just
had a great conversation with someone about that very thing
in the conspiracy of the bottle service, of slowly draining
the wealth with bottle service, and it's insane.
Speaker 4 (34:03):
The markup on alcohol already is insane, and bottle service
just makes it like ten x it's oh my gosh,
it's bonkers.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Well, and the social pressure to do it right right,
combined with just who is actually getting bottle service and
a table, like who is actually getting a VIP table?
Wait a second, it's not the like extremely wealthy people
doing that.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
No, it's the up and comers with the Jones pressure, yes, sir, yeah,
or who need to be visible, right, Like let's say
I have an album that just came out, or let's
say I'm trying to popularize this. Uh, this happens especially
in Atlanta too. By the way, I'm trying to popularize
this single that I once played at the club, and
(34:46):
now here I am in person at the club. It's
me Swift City, which is an old Rapnu mas.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Well, you're paying for the real estate too, you're playing,
You're paying for the spot and being seen and all
of the accoutre moment goes along with it, and that,
you know, presentation of wealth and opulence.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
So what we're saying is this is a very human
constant folks around the world. And there were doubtlessly some
groups at some point on Rapanui who maybe over prioritized
building these statues, you know, maybe could have spent a
(35:22):
little more time fishing, maybe already sort of predicted some
agricultural issues ahead. But will be gosh darned if those
people a few miles distant have a better, bigger statue
than us.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
It's like somebody at the edge of a huge fire
just saying, remember.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
Me, witness me, witness me. Fury Road was so good.
But I mean, look, we're I hope we're making it
clear folks that we all agree this might seem silly
to some folks in the modern day, but it was
a huge deal in the communities at the time. And
(36:03):
before we look down our collective noses at this or
other practices, we got to remember every society from ancient
to modern evenings has all sorts of practices and status
symbols that seem bizarre or strange to outsiders. And I
want to thank you specifically, Matt, because bottles and my
mom had told me, because bottle service is a perfect
(36:27):
example of how silly this kind of thing can become.
You know, we're using the past tense too, here's why
the island is no longer making these unique, amazing sculptures.
In fact, at some point, until quite recently, the overall
narrative was that for some reason, the locals abruptly stopped
(36:49):
making the statues all together, abandoned the incomplete ones that
had just been a few weeks previous, so very important.
The civilization collapse, that's the argument. But what led to it,
What happened? You know, it's the eighteen hundreds. Of course
by this point, right we said seven twenty two, the
(37:10):
Dutch make it over there. By the eighteen hundreds. Some sources,
overwhelmingly European, are saying the rapanui of the modern day,
you guys, they're a remnant of a greater civilization that
was lost to the waves. Who ever heard of Atlantis dog?
Because they called each other dog? I guess, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:29):
I mean it's not quite as you know, extreme as that.
It's sort of more maybe not obvious, but historically consistent,
just you know, resource extraction. That's really what it amounts.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
To right. Yeah, yeah, they said, look, there are hundreds
of moai out there. They're possibly in the ruins of
full cities that fell beneath the waves. That hypothesis got
debunked because what you just said, Noel, is much more
likely to be the case.
Speaker 2 (37:59):
It's way better than having to publicly come out and say, hey,
sorry for the diseases and all of the slavery stuff.
Maybe instead Atlantis.
Speaker 3 (38:12):
Yeah, I'll be okay. Yeah, the plague is not good
pr for us, so maybe, yeah, a little bit of plague,
but probably Atlantis, though probably I think probably mainly Atlantis.
What we found is that you have to remember Rapanui
is not a big place. If you go to the
Smithsonian as recently as two thousand and seven, when some
(38:34):
of those other studies we mentioned published, they point out
that the local people depended upon giant palms that grew
on the island. However, like any other civilization, they wanted
to march toward progress. They also had a growing population.
They had people to feed, so they started hutting down
the trees. We call it the forestation now. But they
(38:56):
were making room for agriculture, or they were burning for fire,
or they were making tools and instruments, like we were
saying earlier, to transport statues across the island. And then
when you don't have trees, erosion steps in right, and
erosion starts whittling away at the soil, and then eventually
(39:19):
the people have to begin burning grass. So this led
to a perilous situation. The palms are disappearing, people are
beginning to starve. Warfare is breaking out amid these various clans,
and this is war not driven by necessarily deep seated enmity.
(39:40):
It's driven by the fact that if these people eat,
then there is less food than for you. You know,
it's a terrible situation to be in. And so by
the time the Dutch get there, the forest is pretty
much gone. The land is virtually barren.
Speaker 2 (39:56):
Yeah, that's what we're talking about up at the top
of this episode. When you look at the Eye island itself,
you imagine where would all these people live. And even
right now we're saying there's eight thousand people that occupy
the land. It's astonishing and it's only possible for the
things that been mentioned there, getting things to that island
and trading.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
Yeah, unfortunately, and of those we should mention of those
almost eight thousand people there on the island, not all
of them are descendants of the original inhabitants. Right. There
are people in Behalf, I believe, Yeah, yeah, yeah, they
live there. There are people who are not rapanui who
(40:35):
live there full time. Right. Not as extreme as what
happened in Hawaii, but I would say a similar process.
So the real villain here is not some act of
the paranormal or vast hidden Atlantean Lemurian conspiracy. Said. It
seems to be what Jared Diamond, the author of Guns,
(40:56):
Germs and Steel, would later describe as eco side, which
is a phrase I wasn't familiar with.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
Yeah, nor I that's a much better term than I
had said, resource extraction.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
This isn't exactly right.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
Certainly some of that, like you said, been making tools
and you know, burning trees for energy and things like that.
But this was just essentially them not quite understanding how
delicate the balance of their ecosystem was, and so ultimately
they killed it.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
Wait, was competition amongst different groups there on the island
what led to the problems? Are we saying competition could
be bad at times?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Right, Yeah, especially when coupled with resource consumption. Under very
harsh constraints, you know what I mean, because it's not
as if. Look, it was such an epic journey to
get there in the first place, what is considered the
easternmost Polynesian island. You were in a locked room essentially
(41:58):
with the technology at the time. Right, even though Polynesian
cultures pretty much by any measure, for thousands of years
they were the world leaders in navigation using the stars
at sea. Uh, even with the oral history, you would
know things were a long long way away, So you
(42:18):
don't really have anywhere to go.
Speaker 2 (42:20):
It's tough to mcgruber yourself out of some ecoside.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
Right exactly. Yes, and do check out. I was going
to make up a mcgruver episode. We did, but we
have it yet. We'll get there. We'll get there. We'll
call Will fort Nae.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
Did you guys see the Epstein Files.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
One? Yes, it's a series, a series of sketches from
one of the most recent Saturday Night Lives and to
say anything Saturday Night Lives whatever, to say anything else
ruin your enjoyment. But do check it out. I'm going
to look forward to Yeah, text this other group chat.
(42:56):
I'm sure it is a compilation.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
Mcgroover's definitely not in them.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
Definitely not, definitely not. We're asking too many questions, so well,
was it toss me that paper clip? Let's focus and
what's important. So we wanted to close this one out
with something we've been kind of teasing. This is our
big reveal. Research into the story of Rapanui continues just
(43:20):
last month. In fact, new investigations indicate that humanity still
has a lot to learn about the rise and fall
of this statue building era, as well as about the
moi themselves. And this brings us to a professor of
anthropology at Binghampton University, Carl Philip LiPo LPO.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
Matt, you were talking about this one off micah Bit
and how fascinated you were by these new was it
three D models that give you a real look like
behind the curtain of all this stuff?
Speaker 3 (43:48):
Oh?
Speaker 2 (43:48):
Yes, this is Carl Philip LiPo, Professor of Anthropology at
Binghamton University and the State University of New York. This
is It's incredible. It's a thousand Molai statues and the
quarry itself and large parts of the island that are
(44:09):
in a high resolution three D model. And when you
pull the thing up and you look at it, which
we highly recommend you do. I don't know if there's
a super easy way to get to it, guys, because
it's not like the best url. I found it on
fizzorg phys dot org. I'll just give you that link
so you can look for it. First of its kind
(44:29):
three D model that's you explore Easter Island statues up close,
and then there's a link in there you can click
on and you can find this thing, which is just
first of all, you're hit with the volcanic crater right
when you look when you open up this three D model,
and then you're looking at the sides of that crater
that have these these thirty I think thirty sites that
(44:53):
are all separate that are well, they're at least separated
out into individual sites. And without this three D model,
it looks like it's one contiguous thing. Wouldn't you say?
Speaker 3 (45:05):
Yeah? Yeah, And please folks, always support your local academics.
Go to the name of the actual study is Megalithic
Statue Production on rap Anui and you should be able
to find it on plos. You should be able to
read it in full. It's worth your time and like
Matt was, saying it fundamentally redefines some what we understand
(45:29):
about this process, because they also how cool is this?
They used drones to collect all these images that they compile,
and they also use something that I just learned about.
It's one of my new favorite words, a process called
structure for motion photo grammetry. Photo grammetry. It sounds like
(45:51):
a weird class you would take at the Harry Potter School. Heck, yeah,
I'm a photogrammatrist. And that's where they make that three
D model. They overlap the two D images, and this
is where they find our big reveal that labor was
not some kind of pyramid scheme, no bad jokes left behind.
(46:15):
Instead of a top down hierarchical approach where one king
is ordering construction, it appears that there was this group.
There was an abundance of self organized smaller family groups,
clans or tribes, and everybody had their turf in the quarry.
(46:35):
They were competing with each other. And also it took
way fewer people to move, to complete and to move
the statues than we assumed. It wasn't the entire island
going one two three bush. It was like six people
going one two three bush.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
Yeah, it's like because of the use of those ballard
things that I didn't understand what these were at all.
You can use that word to describe a lot of
different things. One of them are the little stubby metal
posts that you've seen on a wharf or something like
if you're going to attach a boat to something, those
(47:14):
are considered ballards. Also in traffic, they've got those same things,
like the concrete ones often or metal ones that you'll see.
They just look a little posts. But if you imagine
a bunch of those things and then rolling once you're
in that quarry and you finally got this huge twenty
ton statue and you can roll it down the hill
(47:36):
with enough people, which is just I still don't understand it.
I can visualize it, but then and I guess I
go back to that same guy you were describing, Ben,
the dude who showed how you can turn a huge,
huge piece of stone around if you just elevate it
in the right way and then build the correct wooden
structures around it.
Speaker 3 (47:56):
Leverage right, it's a hell of a drug. We Yeah,
this this is fascinating because it reminds us of one
of the most amazing parts of human civilization when people
apply themselves to something. They are capable of such remarkable,
extraordinary things without sounding too much like an old curmudgeon,
(48:21):
but just a little bit like an old curmudgeon. These
folks didn't have ubiquitous social media information pulling their focus
and attention away. Their brains weren't suffering from the same
degeneration that occurs when you constantly look at short term content,
which I that's not my opinion, that's a study from earlier.
Speaker 4 (48:44):
And we also, I think, experience that first.
Speaker 3 (48:47):
It's very real.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
It makes one want to lay supine in a quarry
like a statue.
Speaker 3 (48:55):
Sure, and some of those statues were not. They weren't
suddenly abandoned because of a catastrophe. No one was like, oh,
the last palm tree's done, We're not gonna work anymore.
A lot of times, because of the material science of
volcanic tough you would be part way through carving something
out and you would run into lumps of much harder rock,
(49:16):
which is much more difficult to carve or carve around.
Or current science speculates some of these were just rock
carvings that weren't meant to be moved. It's almost like
some of them were practice carvings. If you think about
it's say, okay, well, before we do the actual statue,
let me make sure I get this news right.
Speaker 2 (49:38):
Or maybe you know Bob passed away just before he
could finish his statue, and he was our only specialist
in our group. Well, crap, I guess we're done there.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
Yeah, I guess we're gotta make friends with someone else.
And they're like, ah, but I hate those guys in
the next valley.
Speaker 2 (49:56):
I really don't like Bob's work either. We're going to
start a different one.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
His work derivative. It looked too much like the other statues.
Speaker 2 (50:04):
Can you imagine some of that?
Speaker 3 (50:06):
Like kind of definitely, especially because they're in competition, not cooperation.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
So that Petty always right.
Speaker 3 (50:16):
So Lipo's team also, this is another thing that is
studying they came away with in the research. He's calling
into question that official accepted story of deforestation, resource loss,
and massive collapse. He says that if you look at
this with the information, the data that they have uncovered,
the unfinished Moi at Rono Raurku aren't evidence of a
(50:40):
sudden catastrophe. He says, they're normal quarry operations, so as
life gradually got worse. This kind of the prioritization of
this historical flex started to decline because people were increasingly
concerned about stuff like staying alive and eating food, hopefully
(51:00):
at least once in a twenty four hour period. This
leads us to that question again, we're returning to it.
What actually happened. We still don't know, but we be
modern civilization are closer than ever before, and Guys, I
would posit that the biggest potential for further breakthrough on
the horizon here includes leveraging new technology like in the
(51:24):
professor's work as well as in this is something I
think the public's ignoring, as well as returning to those
oral histories anew and using current technology to fit these
narratives to see how they compare to the forensic evidence
(51:44):
that has been gathered and discovered. And I think we'll find,
as we often do with oral history, there's a lot
of astonishing truth there. It's a little bit of myth,
but there's a lot of accurate information in there.
Speaker 2 (51:57):
I think you're absolutely right, Ben, I do think we
have to keep our minds open for learning something extra
right as we as technologies advanced, as some new thing
is discovered there on the island. That explains things. We
just got to keep our minds open the way a
lot of the folks did, who were still exploring this idea,
(52:19):
you know, up until these past few years.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
Absolutely, and perhaps that's where we leave it. We can't
wait to hear from you folks. We hope you're having
a great end of the year. Also, calendars are made up.
Check out our episode on that and we want to
hear from you. So find us on the lines, call
us on the phone, send us an email, et etc.
Speaker 4 (52:41):
Oh please do you can find us at the handle
Conspiracy Stuff where we exist on Facebook with our Facebook
group here's where it gets crazy. On AXVKA, Twitter and
on YouTube we had video content for We're perusing enjoyment
on Instagram and TikTok. However, we're Conspiracy Stuff Show.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
We have a phone number. It is one eight three
three st d WYTK. Turn those letters into numbers, then
give that number a call. When you call in, it's
a voicemail system. Give yourself a cool nickname and let
us know if we can use your name and message
on the air. If you are going to make a
MOI statue, what would it look like let us know.
(53:19):
If you want to send us an email, you can
do that too.
Speaker 3 (53:21):
We are the entities that read every piece of correspondence
we receive. Be well aware, yet's out afraid. Sometimes the
void writes back, so join us, O put my sunglasses
on here out in the dark. Conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Stuff they don't want you to Know is a production
of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the ihet
art radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
Stuff They Don't Want You To Know News
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Matt Frederick
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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