March 16, 2011 • 27 mins
Lambert Simnel was born into a humble position, but over the course of his life he became both a pretender to the throne and an imposter. Tune in to learn how this young man was used as a pawn in this story of classic royal intrigue.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class from how
Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast.
I'm Sarah Dowdy and I'm Deblina choker Boarding. And in
case you haven't noticed, we like themes and it's not
(00:20):
going to be an exclamation themed episode. But we also
like royal pretenders. They seem to come up a lot
um especially we like them when they're not just pretending
to claim a throne but actually pretending to be someone else.
A double pretend, yeah, double pretend, impostors as well as pretenders.
And today we're gonna be talking about a ten year
(00:42):
old boy named Lambert Snell. And because he was a
pretender and an impostor, an impostor two times over, you
probably haven't ever heard of him before. Yeah, but the
interesting thing about him is that for a brief time,
he had like this cooked up claim that threatened the
security of the tutor line major line in English is
(01:04):
just getting going at this but just getting going at
this point. And his defeat marked the true end of
the War of the Roses. Yeah, it's not all over
on boss Worth Field like you might think. Um, but
because it's also almost Patrick's day, we've picked a subject
that has a little bit of Irish influence on it too. Obviously,
the story ends well for the Tutors, not for the Irish,
(01:27):
but it's still interesting to learn a little bit about
um this history between the two countries and find out
why Ireland's chancellor would throw his weight behind a claimant
who was obviously a fraud. It's it's going to be
a curious question to answer. I think it definitely will.
But first let's take a little look at the War
of the Roses. Now, we get requests all the time
(01:50):
to talk about the War of the Roses, and this
is not going to be that episode. So don't get
too excited if you're one of those fans, but we
are going to refresh your memory just a little bit
about what happened. So the wars took place between the
Houses of York and Lancaster in the fourteen hundreds, and
what happened was a York claimant eventually came out on top,
Edward the Fourth. Yeah, and I mean there were a
(02:12):
few bumps in the road even once Edward the Fourth
was was the guy who who won. In the end,
he had to execute his own brother, supposedly in a
vat of wine. That's the old Shakespeare story apparently. Yeah, indeed, um,
that was George, Duke of Clarence, and that's an important
name to remember. We're not going to toss it. There
(02:34):
are a lot of names here and we're gonna only
mention the ones that are important. But that's one to
to remember, um. But aside from having to execute his
own brother, Edward the fourth was a really popular king.
He was a very good fighter. He was never defeated
on the field, so it seemed like things were going
pretty well for for his line. Plus he had two sons.
(02:55):
Unfortunately for the House of York. Edward up and died
before where those two sons came of age and the
rest of it you probably know from Shakespeare. Edward the fourth,
older brother comes in at this point Richard, the Duke
of Gloucester, and he locks the boys in the Tower
of London. So if you've ever visited the Tower of
London or you're from England, you might have heard the
story as well. At this point, Richard declares himself King
(03:18):
Richard the Third, and the boys disappear. That's another one
of your like most requested suggestions. What happened to the
the princes in the Tower. Yeah, it's one of those
things that I think really makes the Tower of London
an exciting site to see, even though it's kind of
a really touristy site. It's it's fascinating for those scary
stories you hear. But that was in fourteen eighty three
(03:39):
and is one of history's great mysteries. Yeah. And not
too long after that, though, Richard the Third was defeated
in the Battle of bosworth Field by this new guy,
this kind of random guy. I mean, that's not a
very historical way to put it, but essentially what he was,
Henry Tudor, Henry Tudor victorious makes him self Henry the seventh.
(04:01):
And it's a really big deal because it's not just
the end of the Wars of the Roses in that
York Lancaster battle that had been going on for so long.
It also ends the Plantagenet House, which Katie and I
did an episode ages ago on Eleanor of Aquitaine, so
we know that those that family has been around and
in power for a very long time. Definitely, and Henry's
(04:26):
own claim, though was pretty tenuous at that point. According
to British heritage. In five there were actually twenty nine
living people who were more qualified than he to to
take the throw. You had better claims, right, But he's
a pretty shrewd guy, and so he tries to solidify
his claim by marrying a York girl, the daughter of
Edward the fourth, the sister of the Princes of the Tower. Yeah,
(04:48):
and um, you know that that probably helps get a
certain amount of support, but there's still plenty of people
who don't want him to be king, especially loyal Yorkists.
And that's where our story stand in fourteen eighties six,
when we have this pretender come in. And the interesting
thing about ten year old Lambert from Nell is that
(05:09):
he's so much of a pawn in his own story
that we can't really start talking about it without talking
about some other people first. It kind of reminded me
of like boy bands or something like, you know, you
get the contact first, and then you you cast the part,
then you cast the parts. Yeah. So, um, we'll give
you a little background on this particular Minuto scenario that's
(05:31):
happening here. The Viscount Level, who is a crony of
Richard and a Yorkist. He's the first to stage a
major uprising against Henry the seventh just some months after
his coronation. When this fails, though, he ends up going
to Oxford and continues to scheme and look for a way.
So he's one person that's involved in this. The other
one is John della Pole. He meets John de la Pole,
(05:53):
who is Earl of Lincoln, and John de la Pole
is actually a real claimant to the throw and he
was the nephew of Richard the third and Edward the
fourth and is likely even Richard's air. Yeah, he's one
of their sister's son, so definitely, uh, I mean it
has a better claim than Henry tudor Um. But he
seems like he would be the head of this rebellion,
(06:14):
somebody who's so closely related to the former king Um.
But surprisingly he does not take up the pretender business
for himself. It is a very dangerous job, especially if
you are the figurehead of the rebellion. So Lincoln and
Level conspire with this Oxford priest named Richard simmons Um
(06:34):
kind of not the one you heard of? You heard of?
Exercise guy. I feel like we should start a list
of people who are more famous today. May make random
appearances in history, always a little bit awkward. Anyways, they
conspire with this Oxford priest who presents one of his
students as none other but Richard Duke of York. Richard
(06:57):
Duke of York is one of the little town were boys,
so surprise, surprise, it seems he's alive and in the
form of this Oxford student. Alive and well, of course
it's really Lambert from Nell, who just happens to be
a handsome enough boy, the son of an Oxford tradesman. Um.
He said to look kind of like the younger Tower Prince,
(07:21):
but I mean, who knows how many people would really
even know what those two boys looked like. He just
he has the bearing of a prince and the manners,
and he's been trained to play the part. So by
late fourteen six, these two conspirators, Lincoln and Level, they're
sure that their boy will not quote step out of character.
(07:42):
As Karen Kenyon wrote, They've also gotten some funding from
Lincoln's aunt, who is Margaret of Burgundy, and she's really
eager to see the York's return to power, even if
they do it through the rise of this pretender boy,
Lambert Simnel. Yeah, I mean, she would I'm sure rather
see one of her family members on the threat own.
But that's something to keep in mind with this whole
(08:03):
random pretender business too, that if the rebellion was successful,
I'm pretty sure that somebody who was actually from the
York family would end up on the throne and poor
little Lambert would be disappeared. Yeah. Who knows what they
told him at the time, but it probably wouldn't have
turned out so well for him in the end. Yeah.
(08:24):
But anyways, this is also where Ireland becomes important. We
were not going to neglect this country because this is
kind of our St. Patrick's Day episode. So the conspirators
decide that Ireland will be the york Is base for
the plot, and that's where they head off to. And
we have to ask why Ireland. Why would Ireland be
(08:46):
the head for for this rebellion? Um There was a
lot of York support in Ireland, surprisingly strong support, especially
from so called home rule Anglo Irish lords, and it
was partly because members of the York family had served
as lieutenants in Ireland for thirty years and had been
pretty popular at least with some people while they were there,
(09:09):
and one of them was even lieutenant when the Parliament
at Dreda declared Ireland independent. So they had they had
fond memories of the York family. They felt like they
had been treated well enough, and the tutors were an
unknown quantity at this point. Yeah, and another thing to
note is that they were especially a big fans of
that wine drowned Duke of Clarence who we mentioned earlier.
(09:31):
He was born in Dublin and considered quote countryman and
protector of the land. So this brings us to kind
of the next stage, and our pretender conspiracy and Irish
support actually increases at this point because Lambert Simnels suddenly
ceases being the Prince in the Tower, his first faux identity,
and becomes the twelve year old Edward Plantagenet, Earl of Warwick,
(09:55):
the deceased Duke of Clarence, son and nephew of Edward
the fourth and Richard the Third. So, I mean, this
part makes it pretty unbelievable. I would say, not only
is this random boy from Oxford pretending to be one prince,
now he's pretending to be an earl who is actually
still alive. I'm just thinking about this poor little ten
(10:16):
year old boy, and how confused he has to I
know he and I mean apparently he would. He would
amuse people by recounting stories of his father's court. And
you can just imagine all his handlers saying like, no,
don't tell those stories anymore. It's like the wrong background.
You need to change the whole thing. Flip the switch. Yes,
I mean it would be disturbing, I'm sure, um, But
(10:38):
the this whole switchero I mean there is a reason
behind it, and it comes out of false news in
early four seven that the Earl of Warwick had been
imprisoned in the tower and killed, which wouldn't be that
surprising anyways. He is probably one of the Yorks with
the strongest claim to the throne at this point. So
Lincoln and Level essentially take a gamble and they decide
(11:00):
that if Warwick really has been killed, and if Henry
the seventh is called upon to produce him and he can't,
he'll be exposed as a murderer or people will think
that Simnel is the real deal. And you know, maybe
even if Henry the Seventh can produce Warwick, people will
be so confused about what's going on they might not
(11:22):
know who's who, And that's exactly what happens. Henry the
Seventh gets legitimately concerned and he takes Warwick out of
wherever he's keeping him, sort of parades him around London.
He even takes the poor kid to church with him,
you know, finally like showing him. Yeah, And it's too
late though, because by that point people are confused. They're
(11:43):
not sure which of these boys is the real thing,
and everyone's everyone's just mixed up. That's what happens when
pretenders are also imposters. So true. So meanwhile, the Irish
are only continuing to build up the young Simnels, so
they're kind of playing on this whole confusion, most notably
the Lord Deputy of Ireland, Gerald Fitzgerald, Earl of Kildare,
(12:06):
and his brother Thomas Fitzgerald, Chancellor of Ireland. They're working
on this and building up this story a bit. So
with such strong Irish support, Killed Dare sets up a
coronation and I mean, you probably didn't expect it to
get quite this far, but it happens. Simnel is crowned
at Dublin's christ Church Cathedral and he's accepted as king
(12:28):
everywhere in Ireland. But Waterford. And that's a note too.
He's accepted as King of England and Ireland, not King
of England and Lord of Ireland as as he would
traditionally have been. Um. But it's kind of sad too,
and it reminds us again that he's just this little boy.
He's so tiny that he has to wear a crown
(12:49):
off the statue of the Virgin and afterwards the mayor
carries him through Dublin on his shoulders to a big
feast at Dublin Castle. He's probably the king all he
must have been really good at pretending and it's all
paying off. Yeah, he might be having a good time
at this point, but it makes you wonder did people
really buy into these switcheroos and shady claims that we're
(13:13):
going on, especially the Irish, did they really buy into
everything that was going on? I mean you just said it.
Everybody in Ireland except for the people in Waterford pretty
much accepted him, so yeah, they were the holdouts. Um,
so let's take a look at it. Well, most historians
think no, that the Irish didn't really buy into it.
It's simply suited the purposes of the Irish Yorkists to
(13:34):
play such a major role in this promising uprising. Yeah,
you have this boy king, and if he's successful and
you helped put him on the throne, well then hopefully
you get treated a little better than than you might
under the current ruler. Yeah. There is one historian, though,
at least Jeremy Potter, who differs with us. He says,
(13:54):
kill dare respected Lincoln and Level's word, and since they
swore the boy was the son of the Juke of Clarence,
he might have actually really believe them. Yeah. So, I mean,
you know, I guess I can see either way, But
at least for the majority of people, I can't imagine
that they would seriously believe this claim. You'd have to,
you'd have to pay lip service to it, you know,
(14:15):
you'd have to. You'd have to go out and really
say you did believe it was the boy and he
should be king. But I don't know, I think it
seemed pretty obvious he was a puppet. Yeah, it seems
like a stretch. Who knows. Maybe it was a little
bit of a mixture. Some did, some didn't, But you know, regardless,
Ireland does come out in support of the boy. It
throws its lot in with the boy and the rebel
(14:38):
makeup that sails for the Lancashire coast is. Um. It
seems pretty impressive initially at least. Yeah, two thousand German
mercenaries under the command of Swiss Captain Martin Schwartz, paid
for by Margaret, Duchess of Burgundy. Of course, it is
the money behind the money bags. And there were up
to five thousand Irish but mostly rebel. Yeah, just guys
(14:59):
who have joined up for various reasons. Um. They're joined
in England by more rebels and a few Scottish mercenaries.
But this is where the first cracks start to show.
Lincoln was definitely assuming that more people in England would
would join up, would come to to support the York
cause against the Tutors. But it seemed like the English
(15:22):
were pretty leer at this whole plan. And according to
a really great article in military history by Stephen Jarvis,
Lord Baconstead of the march into Yorkshire, quote, their snowball
did not gather as it went, And he also said
that um Englishmen didn't quote care to have a king
brought into them upon the shoulders of Irish and Dutch.
(15:44):
So that might have been a pretty big oversight on
Lincoln and Level's part. But the King wasn't really doing
so well with support either at that point. He was
trying to rally people and the rebels actually got five
days to hunker down before the Royalist supporters got there
to challenge them in the first place. His main allies,
the king's main allies at this point are Henry Percy,
Earl of Northumberland and Henry Lord Clifford, but he's later
(16:07):
joined by George Talbot, Earl of Shrewsbury, George Lord Strange,
and John Cheney in Nottingham. So these captains they add
a lot of men, so things start to look up
gradually for him. They add about six thousand men and
just in time since the rebels have come through Sherwood Forest. Yeah.
So the battle finally goes down on June six, and
(16:29):
it's just outside the village of Stoke on Trent, Thus
the Battle of Stokefield, that's what it's called. It's nine
thousand rebels versus fifteen thousand Royalists and the mercenary. Schwartz
knows that it's not looking very good for them. You know,
they really didn't get the English support they needed to
to to truly fight, and he says to Lincoln, quote Sarah,
(16:52):
now I see well that you have deceived yourself and
also me, but that notwithstanding all such promise as I
made and to my lady the Dutch, I shall perform.
So the quote beggarly and naked Irish are a reserve.
We call them rabble earlier, but just guys who are
not really very skilled fighters. Certainly it's not an army. Yeah,
(17:13):
they're not an army. They're not well equipped soldiers. They
make up the reserve. The Germans lead a charge, and
they do this because they don't have archers, and Schwartz
knows that the English do, and if they end up
on this prolonged fight, the rebels will will surely lose.
And it it This tactic does work. For a minute,
(17:33):
this this charge, it's scary. They are all these German
guys with twenty ft pikes, and some of the English,
especially those who are not quite as battle trained, start
to flee and break up. But the English regroup, they
get it together again, and their weapons are superior, especially
when it comes to hand to hand combat. The twenty pikes,
(17:53):
I mean, that's great charging down the hill, but maybe
a little awkward when you're fighting in the thick of things.
The Irish try to retreat over the ridge because they
really don't have good weaponry at all, and the battle,
according to Stephen Jarvis, becomes quote butchery pretty quickly. Yeah,
four thousand Irish were killed trying to cross the Trent,
which is still called the Red Gutter. Some mercenaries they
(18:16):
die fighting, pretty much all of them, right then. I mean,
they're they're trained guys, and they know it's what they
gotta do. Honorable thing. Lincoln and the irishman Thomas Fitzgerald
are killed in battle. But Level's body has never found
and this part I find really fascinating. He could he
have escaped across the Trent. You know, no one knows
(18:37):
what happened to him, but it's likely that he probably drowned.
But here's the catch. Later in the eighteenth century, there
was a secret chamber found in Level's ancestral home, and
there was a skeleton inside that secret chamber, seated at
a table. Yeah, not just lying down at a table.
That's really weird. And I mean, obviously we don't know
(18:58):
if that is Level himself, but definitely a strange note
to mention. So with the end of the battle, it's
the end of the Wars of the Roses, and the
Yorkist leaders are buried with green willows staves driven through
their hearts. Really kind of a grizzly thing to do.
Henry the Seventh loses three thousand men, but none of
(19:20):
them are nobles or gentlemen. Um, I mean, poor other guys.
But I guess that's of note for him that he's
not losing his his captains in case he's got to
keep fighting later. And then a few days after this,
he's in Lincoln and he publicly executes the surviving rebels
to really make a point. You know, I'm the king now,
(19:41):
don't try any of this. But remarkably, some of our
main characters from this podcast are not in that group
of executed rebels. Some of the main players actually. Yeah,
Earl of Kildare, for example, he ends up spending a
spell in the tower, but is eventually pardoned. He even
gets back his whole as Lord Deputy and is essentially
(20:02):
the power broker between the Gaelic and Anglo Irish lords. Yeah,
we're going to talk a little bit more about him
in a minute. The Priest Richard Simmons is sentenced to
life in prison. He's probably safe because he is a priest,
and even a little Lambertsnell gets a job. I guess
Henry the Seventh just realizes he's not a threat on
(20:23):
his own. He was a puppet. He's just a little boy.
He's put to work in the royal kitchen, which Debilina
was saying that it sounded like a better job than
being a royal pretender in the first place. Yeah, totally.
I mean, as you pointed out in earlier in the podcast,
if he had, if it worked, if their scheme had worked,
(20:43):
he probably would have been disposed of pretty soon. So
I think being a being a chef, a royal chef,
sounds a lot better than that. He even gets a promotion.
He does. He gets promoted to royal falconer, and he
lives to age fifty, which is a remarkable age considering
he is a no own tutor trader, I mean fifty.
That's amazing that that he's allowed to live and that
(21:07):
he he doesn't get into any more trouble, lives a long,
happy life. Good for good for Lambert. Yeah, a little
Lambert is kind of the winner in this story, Ireland
is unfortunately not, and that's because Ireland's participation in the
rebellion left a really bad taste in Henry's mouth, especially
when just a few years later, the here's yet another
(21:29):
prince in the tower, poser pretender, who pops up Perkin Warbeck,
who's in Cork, and again he's championed by these Yorkists
in Ireland. And while this attempt or this rebellion doesn't
really come to battle like the other one did, it
really opposed a more serious threat than than Lambert's rebellion,
(21:51):
partly because Warbick's friends included people like James the fourth
of Scotland and the French King and the Habsburgs. He
had some real weight behind him. So after that Henry
the Seventh gets rid of killed are got a job back,
but ends up losing his job again. And he puts
an Englishman in the de facto position of power in Ireland,
and that is Sir Edward Pointings. While it has post
(22:14):
Pointing strips Ireland of all their independence, and he summons
an Irish Parliament at Dreda, making it past legislation that
all future decisions would need approval from English Privy Council. Yeah,
so a pretty bad deal for Ireland. It was called
Pointing Flaw and it wasn't repealed until seventeen eighty two.
It meant, of course that the Irish Parliament was no
(22:36):
longer independent. And of course, you know, I mean probably
most of you have have covered a little bit of
the Tutor Tutor Irish relations and we're not going to
get into all of that. But the English Reformation only
stirred up the violence, and Henry the fourth of course
abolished the monasteries and established the Church of Ireland. And
(22:57):
there were three Irish rebellions under Elizabeth the first. I
was actually originally thinking of doing a podcast on one
of those, but I couldn't pick between between the three,
and I thought it might be even a more tragic St.
Patrick's Day subject than than this one. This one, at
least this little Lambert Lambert, I guess could be the
(23:17):
uplifting part for this. Yeah, But I mean, ultimately, I
think this is a really interesting story because it's most
famous for wrapping up one era, the War the Roses,
and it it's the end of the York cause because
of course Henry the seventh once he starts having sons.
He's pretty much in trench. You know that the people
(23:39):
stopped really thinking so much about having yet another war
and a new king and and starting all over again. Um.
But while it was wrapping up that time period, it
it really started another one in Ireland. And I thought
that Dale Hope for the American Historical Review put it
really nicely. He wrote, quote, the issue at Stoke transcended
(24:01):
the fate of Lancaster and York? Was it not really
a question of the relation of Ireland to England? So
I mean, I think that's an interesting way to look
at it. Yeah, definitely sums up the significance of this moment,
so to speak, and opens up a whole other can
of worms that we can explore in future podcast too.
(24:22):
It does well. I guess that about wraps it up
for young Lambert Mill, but it does bring us to
listener mail. So this email is from Hannah and I
really like the subject line too. I'm going to go
ahead and read it. Y'all are mind readers all right? Um?
(24:42):
She wrote to us, I'm a high school senior and
a devoted listener to Steph you missed in history class,
which is coming handy. A number of times by filling
me in on stuff I actually did miss in history class.
In fact, for the past several months, almost every time
I have a test on something, a podcast has come
out on a related helpful subject. This has been especially
(25:03):
useful for ap art history. We learned about Rococo Art,
and what did I see on iTunes? A series about
the Bourbons who started Rococo Art. Now we're about to
take a unit test that includes the Baroque period, and
suddenly you send me a podcast about Caravaggio. I don't
know what this strange connection is, but I appreciate you
helping me out in class, and it would be really
(25:23):
great if we could keep up our awesome mind link
because I think it is significantly improving my grades. Hint.
Next unit is about Impressionism post Impressionism. So wow. I
have to say. I did totally almost do a podcast
or suggest a podcast on Dega when we were thinking
of New Orleans related stories, since he spent some time
(25:46):
in New Orleans. So maybe maybe we are my graders.
In fact, I hope it's not too late for you,
Hannah Um, but yeah, it's it's always great to hear
that we are helping somebody improve their grades. I mean,
come on, who doesn't like to hear something like that? Definitely? Now,
if only we could apply the mind reading to other
areas of our lives, Yeah, that would be helpful. It
(26:08):
would be So if you have any podcast subjects that
you think would help boost your grades, and unfortunately they're
probably gonna have to interest us to going to cover them, um,
still send them our way. We're at history podcast at
how stuff works dot com. You can also find us
on Facebook and you can find us on Twitter at
(26:28):
Misston History. And yeah, I guess I just want to
wish everyone a happy St. Patrick's Day. Have a great
time celebrating however however you do. And um, we also
have blogs at how stuff works dot com. And I
know last year Molly from stuff Mom Never Told You
wrote a post on how to catch a lepre con.
(26:48):
So that's really I'm sure the tips are still valid. Yeah,
if you can find it on the blogs, I know
it's still there. And uh do that by going over
to our home page at www dot how stuff works
dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics.
Is it how stuff works dot com. To learn more
(27:10):
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Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class from how
Stuff Works dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast.
I'm Sarah Dowdy and I'm Deblina choker Boarding. And in
case you haven't noticed, we like themes and it's not
(00:20):
going to be an exclamation themed episode. But we also
like royal pretenders. They seem to come up a lot
um especially we like them when they're not just pretending
to claim a throne but actually pretending to be someone else.
A double pretend, yeah, double pretend, impostors as well as pretenders.
And today we're gonna be talking about a ten year
(00:42):
old boy named Lambert Snell. And because he was a
pretender and an impostor, an impostor two times over, you
probably haven't ever heard of him before. Yeah, but the
interesting thing about him is that for a brief time,
he had like this cooked up claim that threatened the
security of the tutor line major line in English is
(01:04):
just getting going at this but just getting going at
this point. And his defeat marked the true end of
the War of the Roses. Yeah, it's not all over
on boss Worth Field like you might think. Um, but
because it's also almost Patrick's day, we've picked a subject
that has a little bit of Irish influence on it too. Obviously,
the story ends well for the Tutors, not for the Irish,
(01:27):
but it's still interesting to learn a little bit about
um this history between the two countries and find out
why Ireland's chancellor would throw his weight behind a claimant
who was obviously a fraud. It's it's going to be
a curious question to answer. I think it definitely will.
But first let's take a little look at the War
of the Roses. Now, we get requests all the time
(01:50):
to talk about the War of the Roses, and this
is not going to be that episode. So don't get
too excited if you're one of those fans, but we
are going to refresh your memory just a little bit
about what happened. So the wars took place between the
Houses of York and Lancaster in the fourteen hundreds, and
what happened was a York claimant eventually came out on top,
Edward the Fourth. Yeah, and I mean there were a
(02:12):
few bumps in the road even once Edward the Fourth
was was the guy who who won. In the end,
he had to execute his own brother, supposedly in a
vat of wine. That's the old Shakespeare story apparently. Yeah, indeed, um,
that was George, Duke of Clarence, and that's an important
name to remember. We're not going to toss it. There
(02:34):
are a lot of names here and we're gonna only
mention the ones that are important. But that's one to
to remember, um. But aside from having to execute his
own brother, Edward the fourth was a really popular king.
He was a very good fighter. He was never defeated
on the field, so it seemed like things were going
pretty well for for his line. Plus he had two sons.
(02:55):
Unfortunately for the House of York. Edward up and died
before where those two sons came of age and the
rest of it you probably know from Shakespeare. Edward the fourth,
older brother comes in at this point Richard, the Duke
of Gloucester, and he locks the boys in the Tower
of London. So if you've ever visited the Tower of
London or you're from England, you might have heard the
story as well. At this point, Richard declares himself King
(03:18):
Richard the Third, and the boys disappear. That's another one
of your like most requested suggestions. What happened to the
the princes in the Tower. Yeah, it's one of those
things that I think really makes the Tower of London
an exciting site to see, even though it's kind of
a really touristy site. It's it's fascinating for those scary
stories you hear. But that was in fourteen eighty three
(03:39):
and is one of history's great mysteries. Yeah. And not
too long after that, though, Richard the Third was defeated
in the Battle of bosworth Field by this new guy,
this kind of random guy. I mean, that's not a
very historical way to put it, but essentially what he was,
Henry Tudor, Henry Tudor victorious makes him self Henry the seventh.
(04:01):
And it's a really big deal because it's not just
the end of the Wars of the Roses in that
York Lancaster battle that had been going on for so long.
It also ends the Plantagenet House, which Katie and I
did an episode ages ago on Eleanor of Aquitaine, so
we know that those that family has been around and
in power for a very long time. Definitely, and Henry's
(04:26):
own claim, though was pretty tenuous at that point. According
to British heritage. In five there were actually twenty nine
living people who were more qualified than he to to
take the throw. You had better claims, right, But he's
a pretty shrewd guy, and so he tries to solidify
his claim by marrying a York girl, the daughter of
Edward the fourth, the sister of the Princes of the Tower. Yeah,
(04:48):
and um, you know that that probably helps get a
certain amount of support, but there's still plenty of people
who don't want him to be king, especially loyal Yorkists.
And that's where our story stand in fourteen eighties six,
when we have this pretender come in. And the interesting
thing about ten year old Lambert from Nell is that
(05:09):
he's so much of a pawn in his own story
that we can't really start talking about it without talking
about some other people first. It kind of reminded me
of like boy bands or something like, you know, you
get the contact first, and then you you cast the part,
then you cast the parts. Yeah. So, um, we'll give
you a little background on this particular Minuto scenario that's
(05:31):
happening here. The Viscount Level, who is a crony of
Richard and a Yorkist. He's the first to stage a
major uprising against Henry the seventh just some months after
his coronation. When this fails, though, he ends up going
to Oxford and continues to scheme and look for a way.
So he's one person that's involved in this. The other
one is John della Pole. He meets John de la Pole,
(05:53):
who is Earl of Lincoln, and John de la Pole
is actually a real claimant to the throw and he
was the nephew of Richard the third and Edward the
fourth and is likely even Richard's air. Yeah, he's one
of their sister's son, so definitely, uh, I mean it
has a better claim than Henry tudor Um. But he
seems like he would be the head of this rebellion,
(06:14):
somebody who's so closely related to the former king Um.
But surprisingly he does not take up the pretender business
for himself. It is a very dangerous job, especially if
you are the figurehead of the rebellion. So Lincoln and
Level conspire with this Oxford priest named Richard simmons Um
(06:34):
kind of not the one you heard of? You heard of?
Exercise guy. I feel like we should start a list
of people who are more famous today. May make random
appearances in history, always a little bit awkward. Anyways, they
conspire with this Oxford priest who presents one of his
students as none other but Richard Duke of York. Richard
(06:57):
Duke of York is one of the little town were boys,
so surprise, surprise, it seems he's alive and in the
form of this Oxford student. Alive and well, of course
it's really Lambert from Nell, who just happens to be
a handsome enough boy, the son of an Oxford tradesman. Um.
He said to look kind of like the younger Tower Prince,
(07:21):
but I mean, who knows how many people would really
even know what those two boys looked like. He just
he has the bearing of a prince and the manners,
and he's been trained to play the part. So by
late fourteen six, these two conspirators, Lincoln and Level, they're
sure that their boy will not quote step out of character.
(07:42):
As Karen Kenyon wrote, They've also gotten some funding from
Lincoln's aunt, who is Margaret of Burgundy, and she's really
eager to see the York's return to power, even if
they do it through the rise of this pretender boy,
Lambert Simnel. Yeah, I mean, she would I'm sure rather
see one of her family members on the threat own.
But that's something to keep in mind with this whole
(08:03):
random pretender business too, that if the rebellion was successful,
I'm pretty sure that somebody who was actually from the
York family would end up on the throne and poor
little Lambert would be disappeared. Yeah. Who knows what they
told him at the time, but it probably wouldn't have
turned out so well for him in the end. Yeah.
(08:24):
But anyways, this is also where Ireland becomes important. We
were not going to neglect this country because this is
kind of our St. Patrick's Day episode. So the conspirators
decide that Ireland will be the york Is base for
the plot, and that's where they head off to. And
we have to ask why Ireland. Why would Ireland be
(08:46):
the head for for this rebellion? Um There was a
lot of York support in Ireland, surprisingly strong support, especially
from so called home rule Anglo Irish lords, and it
was partly because members of the York family had served
as lieutenants in Ireland for thirty years and had been
pretty popular at least with some people while they were there,
(09:09):
and one of them was even lieutenant when the Parliament
at Dreda declared Ireland independent. So they had they had
fond memories of the York family. They felt like they
had been treated well enough, and the tutors were an
unknown quantity at this point. Yeah, and another thing to
note is that they were especially a big fans of
that wine drowned Duke of Clarence who we mentioned earlier.
(09:31):
He was born in Dublin and considered quote countryman and
protector of the land. So this brings us to kind
of the next stage, and our pretender conspiracy and Irish
support actually increases at this point because Lambert Simnels suddenly
ceases being the Prince in the Tower, his first faux identity,
and becomes the twelve year old Edward Plantagenet, Earl of Warwick,
(09:55):
the deceased Duke of Clarence, son and nephew of Edward
the fourth and Richard the Third. So, I mean, this
part makes it pretty unbelievable. I would say, not only
is this random boy from Oxford pretending to be one prince,
now he's pretending to be an earl who is actually
still alive. I'm just thinking about this poor little ten
(10:16):
year old boy, and how confused he has to I
know he and I mean apparently he would. He would
amuse people by recounting stories of his father's court. And
you can just imagine all his handlers saying like, no,
don't tell those stories anymore. It's like the wrong background.
You need to change the whole thing. Flip the switch. Yes,
I mean it would be disturbing, I'm sure, um, But
(10:38):
the this whole switchero I mean there is a reason
behind it, and it comes out of false news in
early four seven that the Earl of Warwick had been
imprisoned in the tower and killed, which wouldn't be that
surprising anyways. He is probably one of the Yorks with
the strongest claim to the throne at this point. So
Lincoln and Level essentially take a gamble and they decide
(11:00):
that if Warwick really has been killed, and if Henry
the seventh is called upon to produce him and he can't,
he'll be exposed as a murderer or people will think
that Simnel is the real deal. And you know, maybe
even if Henry the Seventh can produce Warwick, people will
be so confused about what's going on they might not
(11:22):
know who's who, And that's exactly what happens. Henry the
Seventh gets legitimately concerned and he takes Warwick out of
wherever he's keeping him, sort of parades him around London.
He even takes the poor kid to church with him,
you know, finally like showing him. Yeah, And it's too
late though, because by that point people are confused. They're
(11:43):
not sure which of these boys is the real thing,
and everyone's everyone's just mixed up. That's what happens when
pretenders are also imposters. So true. So meanwhile, the Irish
are only continuing to build up the young Simnels, so
they're kind of playing on this whole confusion, most notably
the Lord Deputy of Ireland, Gerald Fitzgerald, Earl of Kildare,
(12:06):
and his brother Thomas Fitzgerald, Chancellor of Ireland. They're working
on this and building up this story a bit. So
with such strong Irish support, Killed Dare sets up a
coronation and I mean, you probably didn't expect it to
get quite this far, but it happens. Simnel is crowned
at Dublin's christ Church Cathedral and he's accepted as king
(12:28):
everywhere in Ireland. But Waterford. And that's a note too.
He's accepted as King of England and Ireland, not King
of England and Lord of Ireland as as he would
traditionally have been. Um. But it's kind of sad too,
and it reminds us again that he's just this little boy.
He's so tiny that he has to wear a crown
(12:49):
off the statue of the Virgin and afterwards the mayor
carries him through Dublin on his shoulders to a big
feast at Dublin Castle. He's probably the king all he
must have been really good at pretending and it's all
paying off. Yeah, he might be having a good time
at this point, but it makes you wonder did people
really buy into these switcheroos and shady claims that we're
(13:13):
going on, especially the Irish, did they really buy into
everything that was going on? I mean you just said it.
Everybody in Ireland except for the people in Waterford pretty
much accepted him, so yeah, they were the holdouts. Um,
so let's take a look at it. Well, most historians
think no, that the Irish didn't really buy into it.
It's simply suited the purposes of the Irish Yorkists to
(13:34):
play such a major role in this promising uprising. Yeah,
you have this boy king, and if he's successful and
you helped put him on the throne, well then hopefully
you get treated a little better than than you might
under the current ruler. Yeah. There is one historian, though,
at least Jeremy Potter, who differs with us. He says,
(13:54):
kill dare respected Lincoln and Level's word, and since they
swore the boy was the son of the Juke of Clarence,
he might have actually really believe them. Yeah. So, I mean,
you know, I guess I can see either way, But
at least for the majority of people, I can't imagine
that they would seriously believe this claim. You'd have to,
you'd have to pay lip service to it, you know,
(14:15):
you'd have to. You'd have to go out and really
say you did believe it was the boy and he
should be king. But I don't know, I think it
seemed pretty obvious he was a puppet. Yeah, it seems
like a stretch. Who knows. Maybe it was a little
bit of a mixture. Some did, some didn't, But you know, regardless,
Ireland does come out in support of the boy. It
throws its lot in with the boy and the rebel
(14:38):
makeup that sails for the Lancashire coast is. Um. It
seems pretty impressive initially at least. Yeah, two thousand German
mercenaries under the command of Swiss Captain Martin Schwartz, paid
for by Margaret, Duchess of Burgundy. Of course, it is
the money behind the money bags. And there were up
to five thousand Irish but mostly rebel. Yeah, just guys
(14:59):
who have joined up for various reasons. Um. They're joined
in England by more rebels and a few Scottish mercenaries.
But this is where the first cracks start to show.
Lincoln was definitely assuming that more people in England would
would join up, would come to to support the York
cause against the Tutors. But it seemed like the English
(15:22):
were pretty leer at this whole plan. And according to
a really great article in military history by Stephen Jarvis,
Lord Baconstead of the march into Yorkshire, quote, their snowball
did not gather as it went, And he also said
that um Englishmen didn't quote care to have a king
brought into them upon the shoulders of Irish and Dutch.
(15:44):
So that might have been a pretty big oversight on
Lincoln and Level's part. But the King wasn't really doing
so well with support either at that point. He was
trying to rally people and the rebels actually got five
days to hunker down before the Royalist supporters got there
to challenge them in the first place. His main allies,
the king's main allies at this point are Henry Percy,
Earl of Northumberland and Henry Lord Clifford, but he's later
(16:07):
joined by George Talbot, Earl of Shrewsbury, George Lord Strange,
and John Cheney in Nottingham. So these captains they add
a lot of men, so things start to look up
gradually for him. They add about six thousand men and
just in time since the rebels have come through Sherwood Forest. Yeah.
So the battle finally goes down on June six, and
(16:29):
it's just outside the village of Stoke on Trent, Thus
the Battle of Stokefield, that's what it's called. It's nine
thousand rebels versus fifteen thousand Royalists and the mercenary. Schwartz
knows that it's not looking very good for them. You know,
they really didn't get the English support they needed to
to to truly fight, and he says to Lincoln, quote Sarah,
(16:52):
now I see well that you have deceived yourself and
also me, but that notwithstanding all such promise as I
made and to my lady the Dutch, I shall perform.
So the quote beggarly and naked Irish are a reserve.
We call them rabble earlier, but just guys who are
not really very skilled fighters. Certainly it's not an army. Yeah,
(17:13):
they're not an army. They're not well equipped soldiers. They
make up the reserve. The Germans lead a charge, and
they do this because they don't have archers, and Schwartz
knows that the English do, and if they end up
on this prolonged fight, the rebels will will surely lose.
And it it This tactic does work. For a minute,
(17:33):
this this charge, it's scary. They are all these German
guys with twenty ft pikes, and some of the English,
especially those who are not quite as battle trained, start
to flee and break up. But the English regroup, they
get it together again, and their weapons are superior, especially
when it comes to hand to hand combat. The twenty pikes,
(17:53):
I mean, that's great charging down the hill, but maybe
a little awkward when you're fighting in the thick of things.
The Irish try to retreat over the ridge because they
really don't have good weaponry at all, and the battle,
according to Stephen Jarvis, becomes quote butchery pretty quickly. Yeah,
four thousand Irish were killed trying to cross the Trent,
which is still called the Red Gutter. Some mercenaries they
(18:16):
die fighting, pretty much all of them, right then. I mean,
they're they're trained guys, and they know it's what they
gotta do. Honorable thing. Lincoln and the irishman Thomas Fitzgerald
are killed in battle. But Level's body has never found
and this part I find really fascinating. He could he
have escaped across the Trent. You know, no one knows
(18:37):
what happened to him, but it's likely that he probably drowned.
But here's the catch. Later in the eighteenth century, there
was a secret chamber found in Level's ancestral home, and
there was a skeleton inside that secret chamber, seated at
a table. Yeah, not just lying down at a table.
That's really weird. And I mean, obviously we don't know
(18:58):
if that is Level himself, but definitely a strange note
to mention. So with the end of the battle, it's
the end of the Wars of the Roses, and the
Yorkist leaders are buried with green willows staves driven through
their hearts. Really kind of a grizzly thing to do.
Henry the Seventh loses three thousand men, but none of
(19:20):
them are nobles or gentlemen. Um, I mean, poor other guys.
But I guess that's of note for him that he's
not losing his his captains in case he's got to
keep fighting later. And then a few days after this,
he's in Lincoln and he publicly executes the surviving rebels
to really make a point. You know, I'm the king now,
(19:41):
don't try any of this. But remarkably, some of our
main characters from this podcast are not in that group
of executed rebels. Some of the main players actually. Yeah,
Earl of Kildare, for example, he ends up spending a
spell in the tower, but is eventually pardoned. He even
gets back his whole as Lord Deputy and is essentially
(20:02):
the power broker between the Gaelic and Anglo Irish lords. Yeah,
we're going to talk a little bit more about him
in a minute. The Priest Richard Simmons is sentenced to
life in prison. He's probably safe because he is a priest,
and even a little Lambertsnell gets a job. I guess
Henry the Seventh just realizes he's not a threat on
(20:23):
his own. He was a puppet. He's just a little boy.
He's put to work in the royal kitchen, which Debilina
was saying that it sounded like a better job than
being a royal pretender in the first place. Yeah, totally.
I mean, as you pointed out in earlier in the podcast,
if he had, if it worked, if their scheme had worked,
(20:43):
he probably would have been disposed of pretty soon. So
I think being a being a chef, a royal chef,
sounds a lot better than that. He even gets a promotion.
He does. He gets promoted to royal falconer, and he
lives to age fifty, which is a remarkable age considering
he is a no own tutor trader, I mean fifty.
That's amazing that that he's allowed to live and that
(21:07):
he he doesn't get into any more trouble, lives a long,
happy life. Good for good for Lambert. Yeah, a little
Lambert is kind of the winner in this story, Ireland
is unfortunately not, and that's because Ireland's participation in the
rebellion left a really bad taste in Henry's mouth, especially
when just a few years later, the here's yet another
(21:29):
prince in the tower, poser pretender, who pops up Perkin Warbeck,
who's in Cork, and again he's championed by these Yorkists
in Ireland. And while this attempt or this rebellion doesn't
really come to battle like the other one did, it
really opposed a more serious threat than than Lambert's rebellion,
(21:51):
partly because Warbick's friends included people like James the fourth
of Scotland and the French King and the Habsburgs. He
had some real weight behind him. So after that Henry
the Seventh gets rid of killed are got a job back,
but ends up losing his job again. And he puts
an Englishman in the de facto position of power in Ireland,
and that is Sir Edward Pointings. While it has post
(22:14):
Pointing strips Ireland of all their independence, and he summons
an Irish Parliament at Dreda, making it past legislation that
all future decisions would need approval from English Privy Council. Yeah,
so a pretty bad deal for Ireland. It was called
Pointing Flaw and it wasn't repealed until seventeen eighty two.
It meant, of course that the Irish Parliament was no
(22:36):
longer independent. And of course, you know, I mean probably
most of you have have covered a little bit of
the Tutor Tutor Irish relations and we're not going to
get into all of that. But the English Reformation only
stirred up the violence, and Henry the fourth of course
abolished the monasteries and established the Church of Ireland. And
(22:57):
there were three Irish rebellions under Elizabeth the first. I
was actually originally thinking of doing a podcast on one
of those, but I couldn't pick between between the three,
and I thought it might be even a more tragic St.
Patrick's Day subject than than this one. This one, at
least this little Lambert Lambert, I guess could be the
(23:17):
uplifting part for this. Yeah, But I mean, ultimately, I
think this is a really interesting story because it's most
famous for wrapping up one era, the War the Roses,
and it it's the end of the York cause because
of course Henry the seventh once he starts having sons.
He's pretty much in trench. You know that the people
(23:39):
stopped really thinking so much about having yet another war
and a new king and and starting all over again. Um.
But while it was wrapping up that time period, it
it really started another one in Ireland. And I thought
that Dale Hope for the American Historical Review put it
really nicely. He wrote, quote, the issue at Stoke transcended
(24:01):
the fate of Lancaster and York? Was it not really
a question of the relation of Ireland to England? So
I mean, I think that's an interesting way to look
at it. Yeah, definitely sums up the significance of this moment,
so to speak, and opens up a whole other can
of worms that we can explore in future podcast too.
(24:22):
It does well. I guess that about wraps it up
for young Lambert Mill, but it does bring us to
listener mail. So this email is from Hannah and I
really like the subject line too. I'm going to go
ahead and read it. Y'all are mind readers all right? Um?
(24:42):
She wrote to us, I'm a high school senior and
a devoted listener to Steph you missed in history class,
which is coming handy. A number of times by filling
me in on stuff I actually did miss in history class.
In fact, for the past several months, almost every time
I have a test on something, a podcast has come
out on a related helpful subject. This has been especially
(25:03):
useful for ap art history. We learned about Rococo Art,
and what did I see on iTunes? A series about
the Bourbons who started Rococo Art. Now we're about to
take a unit test that includes the Baroque period, and
suddenly you send me a podcast about Caravaggio. I don't
know what this strange connection is, but I appreciate you
helping me out in class, and it would be really
(25:23):
great if we could keep up our awesome mind link
because I think it is significantly improving my grades. Hint.
Next unit is about Impressionism post Impressionism. So wow. I
have to say. I did totally almost do a podcast
or suggest a podcast on Dega when we were thinking
of New Orleans related stories, since he spent some time
(25:46):
in New Orleans. So maybe maybe we are my graders.
In fact, I hope it's not too late for you,
Hannah Um, but yeah, it's it's always great to hear
that we are helping somebody improve their grades. I mean,
come on, who doesn't like to hear something like that? Definitely? Now,
if only we could apply the mind reading to other
areas of our lives, Yeah, that would be helpful. It
(26:08):
would be So if you have any podcast subjects that
you think would help boost your grades, and unfortunately they're
probably gonna have to interest us to going to cover them, um,
still send them our way. We're at history podcast at
how stuff works dot com. You can also find us
on Facebook and you can find us on Twitter at
(26:28):
Misston History. And yeah, I guess I just want to
wish everyone a happy St. Patrick's Day. Have a great
time celebrating however however you do. And um, we also
have blogs at how stuff works dot com. And I
know last year Molly from stuff Mom Never Told You
wrote a post on how to catch a lepre con.
(26:48):
So that's really I'm sure the tips are still valid. Yeah,
if you can find it on the blogs, I know
it's still there. And uh do that by going over
to our home page at www dot how stuff works
dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics.
Is it how stuff works dot com. To learn more
(27:10):
about the podcast, click on the podcast icon in the
upper right corner of our homepage. The How Stuff Works
iPhone app has a rise. Download it today on iTunes
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