September 26, 2025 • 32 mins
Who are the teens debugging in the bathroom? This week in tech news, there’s a Gen Z-led revolution in Nepal and Discord made it possible. Early 2000s hustle culture is so back in Silicon Valley — at least for teen tech founders. Then, there’s a new AI-generated political satire show airing on Russian state TV. And Albania gets an AI-avatar to seek out corruption. Finally, on Chat and Me, how ChatGPT is helping one user through a new diagnosis.
Also, we want to hear from you: If you’ve used a chatbot in a surprising or delightful (or deranged) way, send us a 1–2 minute voice note at techstuffpodcast@gmail.com.
Additional Reading:
- Nepal Currently Being Run Via Discord After Gen Z Uprising
- AI Startup Founders Tout a Winning Formula—No Booze, No Sleep, No Fun
- The Trump Admin Is Suing Amazon for Tricking People Into Prime Subscriptions. Here’s How That Might Affect You
- Albania’s AI-generated chatbot, called Diella, was named to the country’s cabinet
- Russian State TV Launches AI-Generated News Satire Show
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
From Kaleidoscope and iHeart podcasts. This is tech stuff.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I'm as Voloscian and I'm Carera Price.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Today we'll get into the headlines this week, including Nepal's
failed social media band turned government takeover, and a look
at the newest generation of tech founders. Then on chatting me.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Chasubt has become kind of like a partner that makes
managing health and lifestyle simple.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
All of that On the Week in Tech. It's Friday,
September twenty sixth.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Hello, Cara Hias.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Nice to see you. It's been a couple of weeks
where we've been remote, you've abandoned me. It's good to
be back with you in person.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Dirty gritty New York City.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
Speaking of dirty grit in New York City, how often
you go to Brian Park?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Why not to go inside Brian Park? But I take
the subway to Brian Park once a week on Thursday's
Goo Therapy. But this week and you're trying not to
go anywhere because this un week has completely unga, snarled
traffic and the.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
Dirtiest word in the New york Er Dictionary unga.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Why do you ask, though, because.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Brian Park is not where the Center of Fashion is
in Manhattan. It is where I found my most beloved
new toy. Her name is Belonce.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Belonce.
Speaker 4 (01:33):
She's actually not she doesn't belong to me, but she
is the robot lawnmower of Brian Park.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Well, she's got a good name.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
I wish I came up with the name Belonce.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
I did not.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
I read about it in the Washington Post and then
I actually went to the park to check it out.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
You did some reporting.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
She's gorgeous. How in the flesh she's gorgeous?
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Is there anything significant about Belonce other than her fabulous name?
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Nothing is insignificant about Belonce. She's a four thousand dollars rumba, essentially,
and she's run via an app which tells her when
and where to mow. So you tell her where to go,
she does her thing, and then very cutely, she rolls
herself back to her charger after a few hours. And
I think it goes without saying that all of these
electric robot lawnmowers are much in quotes greener than their
(02:18):
gas guzzling human controlled counterparts.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
My mother also has a semi autonomous robot lawnmower at
her house. I'm not sure if that's because of her
concern for gas guzzling. But it is interesting how these
kind of almost sci fi type robots have become so
normalized that people think you're crazy for going to look
at one in action. I am curious though. Obviously in
the previously owned garden, you know, a Belonce going about
(02:42):
her business is racally safe. But I can imagine the
cut in trust of New York City, you know, vandalism, theft.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
All dirt, the grimy crime of New York City. Actually,
that Belonce wouldn't be safe.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yeah, I was worried about her.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, she is safe.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
You want to know why there's a ton of security
in brime. She's also not the first she has peers.
There were several others tested, including l lawn James got.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Who comes up with this? Mum? If you're listening, Karen,
do you have any suggestions for what the garden lawnmower
could be rechristened?
Speaker 4 (03:15):
Okay, so I have actually five because one of our
genius producers asked an AI chatbot for a few more
lawn pun names.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Here we go. My favorite, Trimothy Shallome.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
Mozart, Yeah, fine, eh, post Malone, ye ye grass, light Year,
and fine, another great one a lawn musk.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
That's my favorite. MS. Okay, we got it.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
So that is my lighthearted contribution for today. If you
are in New York City, go check out belonce. She'll
be waiting for you. I have to switch gears a
little bit for my next story. How familiar are you
with Discord.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
I've had about Discord for many years. I've never actually
used it a gamer. I'm not a gamer. I know
it's kind of like a live platform for simultaneous discussion,
and unfortunately, my life is so sad that the closest
analogy I can think of is the work productivity tool Slack.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Slack is a game for you.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Unfortunately, you're like, oh, you mean Slack's Ega Genesis. Well,
the reason I ask you, and I think you'll be
interested in this. Discord recently played a very big role
in a revolution.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
I actually I actually heard about this a little bit
intil some headlines. This is in Nepal, that's right.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
So in the course of a week, the country banned
social media, erupted in gen z led protest, ousted, their
prime minister, solicited recommendations for an interim replacement on chat GBT,
and then elected an interim leader on discord.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Talk about tech stuff.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
It really is a tech stuff story.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, I don't know that much about Nepal. I know
it's in the Himalayas. I know it's where Mount Everest is. Yes,
it borders China and India. But why did this happen there? Like,
what's the background?
Speaker 4 (05:06):
So actually Nepal was traditionally a monarchy, right, but a
democratic government was founded less than twenty years ago. Nepal
is the second poorest country in South Asia, the first
being Afghanistan. And a few weeks ago there was a
massive TikTok trend among youth and Nepal called hashtag Nepo kids.
(05:27):
So social media users were posting videos showing the wealthy
lifestyles of the children of Nepal's leaders. So think images
of politicians' kids posing in front of Christmas trees made
out of Louis Vuitton and Cardier boxes. These images were
being juxtaposed with images of the day to day struggles
of regular people in Nepal. So there are images of
(05:48):
malnourished children, floods, decimated housing, and overall poverty.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Yeah, that's quite a stark juxtaposition. And I can't imagine
government ministers felt too good about their children being juxtaposed
with children suffering malnourishment and poverty. No, and it.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
Actually it led to the government banning twenty six social
media platforms, including TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook, purportedly in the
name of battling fake news, hate speech, and online fraud,
which obviously people are not buying.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, I wouldn't buy that either. When did the band
come into effect?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
On my birthday?
Speaker 1 (06:21):
September fourth, hap your birthday?
Speaker 4 (06:22):
The following Monday, Thousands of young people took to the streets.
So some government buildings were burned down, including the Prime
Minister's office, and according to Reuter's there was a violent
crackdown and about seventy two people were actually killed in
the protest and subsequent fires.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah, this sounds like, I mean, eerily familiar in terms
of the Arab Spring of fifteen years ago. What happened
next in Nepal?
Speaker 4 (06:45):
So the social media ban was reversed almost immediately after
protests began, and on Tuesday, September ninth, the Prime minister
resigned and fled the country. Then the military pretty much
took over and put a curfew in place. And so
you know, what do people do when they're force to
stay inside, They go back on life, That's right, they
go online. So over one hundred thousand people, including a
(07:08):
number of organizing groups, spent several days on Discord working
to come up with an interim leader who the military
would actually cooperate with and accept. There were discussions taking
place on Discord, filled with you know, everything you'd expect
on discord, memes, insults, and there were some genuinely earnest
you know, suggestions and polls.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
Young activists argued over the future leadership of the country,
and some even turned to chat GPT for help. You know,
one group asked chat to identify potential candidates for the
interim leadership position, and so when they were provided a
list of qualified candidates, they went back to chat gpt
and asked it to debate the strengths and weaknesses of
each candidate.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Well and chat gate good advice, it seemed to you know.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
Chat gpt actually provided many qualified candidates, including one woman
who had been selected by a dominant gen Z collective
to lead negotiations with the military. This was Sushila Karki.
She's seventy three years old. She's not, you know, a
young discord user herself. She's a former Chief Justice and
well known anti corruption crusader, and according to the Sri
Lankan Guardian, Chatchept advised the quote, she seems likely to
(08:16):
command trust across different groups and could help oversee reforms
and the path to fare elections.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
And so far, so good.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
You know, after some chaos, the discord community decided to
have her be the new interim leader of Nepal. And
she's actually putting together a cabinet right now and will
hold elections for a new prime minister in about six months.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
This is an amazing story. This is uncanny online, offline
metaverse discord chatchpt, real life protests, new leaders. I mean,
what's so interesting to me about this story is just
how borderless it is. For example, the mascot of this
revolution is the pirate flag from the Japanese anime series
One Piece. Have you watched One Piece?
Speaker 2 (08:57):
I know about it, I'm aware of it.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
So CNN describes it as quote the swashbuckling story, and
I always loved the swashbuckling story. To the swashbuckling story
of the charming pirate captain Monkey d Loofy and his
misfit straw hat crew. CNN continues to one piece fans.
The flag symbolizes Lufi's quest to chase his dreams, liberate
oppressed people, and fight the autocratic world government. That flag,
(09:23):
from a Japanese anime series has now been seen flying
not just in Nepal, but also in Indonesia and the Philippines,
countries that are both recently had their own gen Z
uprisings over government corruptions. I was in an uber this
morning in gridlock traffic in Midtown, so got chatting. My
driver was from Nepal, Lucky, and so I asked him,
(09:45):
you know, what do you think about this story? He said, Look,
this isn't really a story about Nepal. This is much
bigger than Nepal. This is about a group of people,
young people who refuse to be bound by the political conventions,
the political institutions, or the political establishment of their country
and instead insisted on having their voice and on a
new political reality. And his point was this is really borderers.
(10:09):
And he even said it could happen here. I don't
know if it really could happen here, but the optimism
which he brought in the excitement reminded me of the
early days of the Arab Spring, which obviously followed by
what people talk about as the Arab Winter. But it'll
be interesting to see what happens next.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
Yeah, you know, for year, social media companies talked about
how their platforms could democratize the Internet and bring people together.
And in the US, as we know, they've mostly proven
to be divisive and polarizing, you know, que the recent
discussion about the rhetoric and online communities that motivated Tyler
Robinson who is now in custody for killing Charlie Kirk.
But in Nepal they were able to have a transparent
(10:45):
exercise in direct democracy, of course, with the help of
Discord and unbelievably generative AI.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
And this brings me to our next stories. So while
gen Z and Nepal is interested in using AI and
discord a topple government and bring more direct experience of democracy,
gen Z in America is focused on getting rich.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Who isn't true?
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Who isn't So basically, there was a great story in
the Wall Street Journal that I read. I mean, the
headline was AI startup founders taut a winning formula, no booze,
no sleep, no fun. And what the story is really
about is how back in the early two thousands there
was this like hustle culture there was. It was celebrated
(11:30):
in the movie The Social Network. You know, it was
this time of college dropouts and the consumer internet was
being born. People were living in dormitories and you know,
doing business with each other and kind of sacrificing that
the normal pleasures of youth to build these companies that
became Facebook and Google or whatever else and became you know,
multi multi billionaires. In the intervening time, Silicon Valley kind
of settled into a normal you know, corporate America. People
(11:54):
had great benefits, they're normal working hours, they made great money,
et cetera, et cetera, and that seemed to be kind
of the new norm. And you saw this like generation
of people who were you know, not all about hustle culture,
about you know, have a balance in their private lives.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Exact life balance, a balance.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Now there are new fortunes to be made, and there
are new threats to the stable assumptions of what it
was to be you know, a knowledge worker in your
early twenties. And so with a vengeance, this hustle culture
seems to have returned.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
So what does that look like exactly?
Speaker 4 (12:28):
You know, are founders sleeping under their deaths, working all
the time, have no social I mean, that's that's what
I think of when I think about sort of early Facebook.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Yeah, exactly that, but that someone that are even younger
than they were. So The General profiled an eighteen year
old from Kazakhstan named Arlan. He dropped out of school
in his junior year of high school after creating an
AI tool that led him getting a summer research job
at Stanford. After that, he was accepted to why Combinator,
which is this very famous startup incubator that helped develop
(12:56):
companies like door Dash and Airbnb. He said that being
steps to why Combinator been his dream since he was ten.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Years old, which was eight years ago.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Exactly. Jeez, that really puts his perspective to From there,
Arlan received a million dollars in funding and moved from
Kazakhstan to San Francisco again. According to the Journal, he
always carries his laptop with him and works quote while
out walking, during dinners, at the laundromat and on the.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
Toy because we're moving fast and breaking things, because we
have add.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
Well, yeah, I mean, obviously the phone in the toilet
is a particularly bad habit, but I think Arlan is
like debugging software, I think, rather than texting. The journal
reported that even after dinner with other founders, Arlan will
go to meetings with potential clients until one am. He said, quote,
I'm trying to be in the sprint mode always. I
(13:54):
never tried to divide working on startup and my social life.
And Arline even convinced his father brother to move to
the US where they're working on their own AI startups. Again,
he's eighteen years old.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
What does he mean when he says he never tried
to divide his startup in a social life.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Yeah, I mean, so you know, it's not like he
never socializes with other people. Like the startup founders obviously
understand that having a network is a key part of succeeding.
They don't waste their time and they don't socialize for fun.
But apparently one of the things which is in vogue
as a way of socializing is something you know quite
a lot about, which is book clubs.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
I didn't realize that you run a book club I do.
What do you think motivates your members? To be part
of the book club. It's called Bellatris.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yes, thank you.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
Check it out on Instagram and on the websitewwwl tris
dot com. I think when we started at what motivated
people was this idea that we were increasingly on our
phones all the time. Like in the early twentieth century,
when paperbacks really started to hit the market, people were
worried that people would be.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Reading too much.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Much. Now, I think a lot of people have said
to me, you know, I'm devoted to reading in the
way that I'm devoted to exercise, in the sense of
it's bringing my mind offline in a way that not
much else is.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
And I think one of the interesting things in Silicon
Value there's this thing going on where there's interest in
Roman history and military history and all this this kind
of idea that to be a successful founder, Yes, there's
a lot of hustle, but also kind of living in
the world of grand ideas and intellectual frameworks and stuff
is also important.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
One of the things that's surprising about this article, and
you're describing in it, is like I was under the
impression that gen Z was like quiet, quitting and taking
time for themselves.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah, I think that comes back to what I was
saying at the beginning, which is there's probably like there
may be a bifurcation between like elder gen Z and
younger gen Z. I mean, life was economically before the
air evolution, like the corporate job market was much more
secure than is now, and also like new fortunes were
(16:03):
not being made, like the tech companies were so dominant.
There's all that focus on how you needed anti trust
regulation otherwise no new companies would emerge. And then jen
Ai came along and it just shattered the landscape. And
so now you have these extraordinary you know, dreamers like
our Land moving from Kazakhstan to try and make it
in the valley. It's something that's always happened, I think,
(16:24):
But this you know, return of hustle culture with a
vengeance is really interesting. There was a bit in a
story that really made me think, which is that a
bunch of the young founders refer to this concept of
nine ninety six. Do you not? Nine ninety six is?
Speaker 4 (16:37):
I do? But please describe it because I want people to.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Know, well, nine ninety six is actually a concept that
emerged in China, and this was basically a kind of
work as hard as you can nine am to nine pm,
six days a week, so every day you one day
off and otherwise you work twelve hours a day. And
this was kind of like a little bit of a
boogey man of like people look at China and think,
oh my god, this is a whole generation of young
people who are killing them by working too hard in
(17:01):
the tech sector, and you know, actually suicides, and there's
a lot of horrible kind of ansidiary reporting around this
nine ninety six culture. But it's now evidently like a
meme not so dissimilar to the Pirate flag, been absorbed
by a certain sector of youth population of Silicon Valley
as something to aspire to. And I just find that
really really interesting.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
It is very strange because we came of age in
a time where burnout culture was such a buzzword. This
is literally touting burnout culture as the way to live
and as the way to make money, which is interesting.
I mean, if you think of prior generations of immigrant populations,
like burnout was a way to build wealth in this country.
If you came to this country and if your relatives
(17:42):
were meant to come to this country, it wasn't like
if you owned a dry cleaner, for example, you.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
It nine ninety six was there was another work.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Life balance at the dry cleaner. And I think what's
interesting is it's the type of businesses that people are
building that has changed. But there has always been a
mentality in this country of like, we come to America
to make wealth.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
See I think you're right to your point. AI is
exactly that. Like it's a chimera, like it's a dream,
it's anything you want it to be. And so it's
literally a moment where like for a certain group of
people it feels like anything's possible, although of course the
reality is most of them will be very burnt out
and not have very valuable businesses at the end of it.
Speaker 4 (18:17):
You know, your pal Jeff Hinton, who was a tech
stuff guest and the so called godfather of AI, recently
gave an interview to The Financial Times where he said, quote,
AI will make a few people much richer and most
people poorer. So I think we kind of are aware
of this on a macro level, but it's interesting to
see it play out in the Petri dish of Silicon Valley.
You know how hard these kids are willing to fight
(18:40):
for a slice of the AI PI while like all
of these entry level jobs are being slashed.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
After the break, some more headlines. The FDC is taking
Amazon to trial, Albania has an AI minister of corruption,
and Russia has an AI generated television show. Then on
Chat to me Chat helps one tech stuff listener navigate
a scary diagnosis. Stay with us. We're back, and in
(19:13):
honor of you, m week, We've got a couple more
global headlines for you. But first, Kara, are you an
Amazon Prime member?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
I am?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Do you remember when you signed up? Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
God, years ago, years ago?
Speaker 1 (19:25):
Probably the free delivery gotcha easily.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Yeah, me too, just hauling it prime.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, it's like I want to be the prime USDA.
H yeah, so that's a good thing. Prime. However, the
Federal Trade Commission is taking Amazon to trial this week
overclaims they tricked millions of people into signing up for Prime.
I did it with my eyes open, but apparently millions
of others did not. And the laws it was actually
first filed, interestingly during the Biden administration back in twenty
(19:52):
twenty three, but the trial just started on Monday.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Why does the FDC think that people were tricked?
Speaker 1 (19:58):
Well, you want to hear from the comp I do.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
I'm not going to read it.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
The complaint filed by the FTC says, quote Amazon used manipulative, coercive,
or deceptive user interface designs known as dark patterns to
treat consumers into enrolling and automatically renewing prime subscriptions. Cancline
subscription was made intentionally more difficult than signing up for one,
(20:24):
and the complaint calls the cancelation process quote labyrinthine is
how you say labyrinth thine, labyrinthine.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
I think it's labyrinthine, labyrinthine.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Get this. Internally at Amazon, the cancelation process was called quote,
an unspoken cancer, and it was referred to as the
Iliad flow, as in the Greek epic poem about a
hero's journey through the protracted Trojan war.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
I love these nerds, That's why, I mean, just internally
what they call things.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
But what does the Iliad flow entail?
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Well, it kind of entails what you'd do, imagine, which
is being extremely hard to get from A to B.
And they knew, and they knew, and they were making
a joke about it. But specifically, the complaint says that
in order to go through the process of unsubscribing. On
the site, customers had to navigate through four pages, six clicks,
and fifteen various options. And there are also a ton
(21:19):
of sort of chances along the way to unknowingly stop canceling,
warnings about losing benefits, promotional offers, all intended to distract
you or convince you not to cancel. Whereas guess how
many clicks it takes to sign up for Prime?
Speaker 4 (21:35):
Not a lot.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
I'm actually surprised it wasn't just one, but absolutely Since
the court filing, Amazon has actually already changed the process.
There's now a well labeled and easy to understand cancelation page.
But the outcome of the trial is still worth keeping
an eye on because it could impact the future of
canceling subscriptions for all kinds of companies. And it is
unbelievably hard and annoying to cancel subscriptions. The worst subscription
(22:01):
cancelation I ever had was the Times Literary supplement We
had to Call, We Have.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
To Call, which is run by Abacus.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
If I'm not mistaken, it's actually I've watched my mom
almost being brought to tears by cancelation.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
It's evil. Some of the cancelation.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Tactes are evil, dark patterns.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
It feels malicious, high listeners.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
This is oz. I wanted to let you know that
the day after we recorded the episode, there was actually
an outcome to the trial. Amazon settled with the FTC
for two point five billion dollars. By settling, they admitted
no wrongdoing. But we'll keep an eye out on what
this outcome means for subscription cancelation overall. But now back
(22:45):
to our episode and our next short headline. How much
do you know about Albanian politics?
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Literally nothing, which is embarrassing, but nothing.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Not that embrassing. I've actually been to our not too
long ago. It's really quite a fascinating country that's had
a meteoric rise post communism. It's in this very strategic
location between East and West, and so you know, the
US and Europeans are quite supportive. But there's also terrible
problems with organized crime. And actually a lot of the
drug trafficking through the port of Rotterdam from South America
(23:22):
is controlled by Albanian organized crime. And recently Albania became
the first country in the world to appoint an AI
generated government minister.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
How does that work?
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Good question? I'll start with her name, Della, which means
sun in Albania. That's Della has actually been around since January.
She started life as an AI assistant designed to help
people navigate online government services.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
So she's actually worked her.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
This is this is a real uh yeah, brags to
Rich's journey for Della. She has reached promoted to cabinet
minister in charge of public procurement. Essentially, she'll be analyzing
government contracts for corruption. Would you like to meet her?
Speaker 2 (24:10):
But I'm dying to meet her. Also, this feels ripe
for corruption.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Well we'll get We'll get to that in a minute,
but first, here's d'ella.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
The samoanchuitor Anti coustets I Kim Kalandur.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
So this is an AI generated person that I'm looking at.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
This is an AI generated person wearing traditional Albanian dress
against the backdrop of the Albanian flag and the EU.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Flag its state sponsor TV.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
She's talking in Albanian, but luckily there are subtitles. She says,
some have labeled me unconstitutional because I'm not a human being.
That hurt me, not for myself, but for the nine
hundred and seventy two thousand interactions I had with citizens
whom I served as part of E Albania ABBE. This
is well, that's the beginning of her career when she
(25:02):
was bootstrapping, Yeah, exactly. She emphasized that as an AI
she has no ambitions or personal interests, which makes her
perfectly suited to the job of making sure government contracts
impartial and corruption free. The Prime Minister of Albania, Eddie Ramer,
said Diella would help make Albania quote a country where
public tenders are one hundred percent free of corruption, one
(25:27):
hundred percent free of corruption. I methinks the Prime Minister
does protest too much, and some citizens of Albania are
also quite dubious. One Facebook user quote in The Guardian said,
in Albania, even Diella will be corrupted.
Speaker 4 (25:44):
I mean talk about AI hallucination, AI corruption, I think
is the next frontier. You know, it's funny that you
bring this up, because my next headline is also about
state sponsored AI. I read this article in four or
four media about a news satire show which recently premiered
on Russian state TV, and it's apparently all AI generated.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
So what does state funded political AI slop entail?
Speaker 4 (26:09):
So, according to ads for the show. They've got a
neural network deciding the content and topics for each episode,
and then that same neural network uses AI to generate video.
So it's been creating content like, you know, amazing stuff
like President Trump singing songs, French President Emmanuel Macron wearing
(26:29):
hair curlers and a pink robe. An ad for the
show claims, quote the editorial team's opinion may not coincide
with the AIS, though usually it does.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Do you think that's it has to be?
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Poll It Stacker, which is the name of the show,
is not just news but a tough breakdown of political
madness from a digital host who notices what others overlook.
Russia's Ministry of Defense actually owns the TV channel where
it airs.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
I'm curious about this this show though, I mean it
like obvious that it's made by AI. How does the
AI show up in the show?
Speaker 4 (27:04):
Well, there's a data scientist named Kalev Letaru from Georgetown.
He's the one who found the show originally, and he says,
at times, if you don't know it was AI, you
might never guess that it looks a lot like other
Russian propaganda. And he says further, if they are using
AI to the degree that they say they are, even
if it's just to pick topics. They mastered that formula
(27:25):
in a way that others have not. You know, there
are parts that are unmistakable AI, like deep fake interviews
with world leaders. In one of those interviews, Trump says
he'll end the Russia Ukraine war by building a casino
in Moscow with golden toilets. But the AI seems to
have Trump's pattern of speech down pretty well. To quote
him in one of these videos, all the Russian oligarchs,
(27:46):
they would all be inside, all their money would be inside.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Problem solved.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
They would just play poker and forget about the whole war.
A very bad deal for them, very distracting.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
It's funny, you know, big fears when when gerative AI
really took off, that we would all be tricked and
transfixed by deep fakes of world leaders and you know,
political events would be dictated by fake media. Instead, what
seems to have happened is that deep fakes have kind
of evolved the medium of the meme. Like instead of
(28:21):
a meme, now you kind of create a deep fake
scenario of the thing you're trying to make fun of
and it's funny that, you know, Trump is talking about
building a casino in Moscow in this Russian satire AI show,
because on Trump's own AI satire social media channels, he's
making content about turning Gaza into a riviera. So there's
(28:44):
a funny like you know, doubleness here where it's odd
that the primary expression of deep fake content right now
is political satire. And now it's time for our final
(29:08):
segment of the day, Chat and Me. Today's submission is
from Jeremy, who is an early adopter of Chat GPT,
a self described chat evangelist, and of course a tech
stuff listener.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
I like anyone who's a self described tex stuff listener.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
I like anyone who text stuff listener, not self described
thank you.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
So, while Jeremy uses Chat for all sorts of tasks,
there's one in particular that he thinks is of note.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
One of the biggest ways it helps me. It's like
health tracking both me and my dog. Actually, what I
do is I log my Apple Watch stats after hikes, workouts,
and then I upload that information into chat GBT and
it just breaks those numbers down in a way that
actually makes sense to me. So I can kind of
see my progress over time.
Speaker 4 (29:55):
There is a plot twist coming. Jeremy doesn't just track
his workouts. He also tracks his food with the help
of chat GPT, and he actually is a really powerful incentive.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
I was recently diagnosed with pre diabetes, so I'm trying
to kind of be a little more careful what I eat.
Instead of just guessing what I eat and the nutritional
value of information, I basically just log my daily foods.
Whatever I eat, I take a picture of what I eat,
and I just uploaded the chat GPT and it kind
of just breaks all their down. You know, the calorie corp, sugar,
(30:28):
protein are there.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
You know, I can imagine if you're dealing with a
diagnosis like pre diabetes, not only do you have to
come to terms with this new health reality emotionally, you
also very practically have to build a new routine that
takes into account all kinds of new health priorities. You know, obviously,
the doctors can give you strict guidelines about what to
(30:49):
do in order to make sure your blood sugar levels
don't spike in terms of proteins and fats and carbohydrates.
But actually what Jeremy's doing is translating that into real life,
seeing what chatchpt says about it and how that may
track with the guidelines he's trying to follow. We've talked
a lot about medicine and AI, and the classic is
(31:11):
always like, can the AI outdiagnose a doctor, which in
many cases it seems like it can, but the majority
of medicine is not really diagnosis. It's actually preventative health
and patient compliance with doctor's recommendations and stuff. And so
this is actually the first I really heard of not
(31:31):
using AI so much just to diagnose an illness, but
actually to turn it into a tool to help manage
your condition. And I think it's pretty cool.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
Yeah, it's a little bit like your medical concierge that
leaves the doctor's office with you exactly.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
That.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Don't forget. We want to hear from you, our listeners,
so please send your chat stories to our inbox tech
Stuff podcast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
That's it for this week for Tech Stuff.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
I'm Kara Price and I'm os Voloshin. This episode was
produced by Eliza Dennis Tyler Hill and Melissa Slaughter. It
was executive produced by me Kara Price and Kate Osborne
for Kaleidoscope and Katrina Norvel for iHeart Podcasts. The Engineer
is Beheit. Fraser and Jack Insley mixed this episode. Kyle
Murdoch wrote out theme song.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
Join us next Wednesday for Textuff the Story for a
look at a beloved American industry that is benefiting and
being destroyed by AI Hollywood.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Please rate and review the show wherever you listen to podcasts,
and reach out to us at tech Stuff podcast at
gmail dot com. We love hearing from you.
From Kaleidoscope and iHeart podcasts. This is tech stuff.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
I'm as Voloscian and I'm Carera Price.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Today we'll get into the headlines this week, including Nepal's
failed social media band turned government takeover, and a look
at the newest generation of tech founders. Then on chatting me.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Chasubt has become kind of like a partner that makes
managing health and lifestyle simple.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
All of that On the Week in Tech. It's Friday,
September twenty sixth.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Hello, Cara Hias.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
Nice to see you. It's been a couple of weeks
where we've been remote, you've abandoned me. It's good to
be back with you in person.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Dirty gritty New York City.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
Speaking of dirty grit in New York City, how often
you go to Brian Park?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Why not to go inside Brian Park? But I take
the subway to Brian Park once a week on Thursday's
Goo Therapy. But this week and you're trying not to
go anywhere because this un week has completely unga, snarled
traffic and the.
Speaker 4 (01:16):
Dirtiest word in the New york Er Dictionary unga.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Why do you ask, though, because.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Brian Park is not where the Center of Fashion is
in Manhattan. It is where I found my most beloved
new toy. Her name is Belonce.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Belonce.
Speaker 4 (01:33):
She's actually not she doesn't belong to me, but she
is the robot lawnmower of Brian Park.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
Well, she's got a good name.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
I wish I came up with the name Belonce.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
I did not.
Speaker 4 (01:42):
I read about it in the Washington Post and then
I actually went to the park to check it out.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
You did some reporting.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
She's gorgeous. How in the flesh she's gorgeous?
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Is there anything significant about Belonce other than her fabulous name?
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Nothing is insignificant about Belonce. She's a four thousand dollars rumba, essentially,
and she's run via an app which tells her when
and where to mow. So you tell her where to go,
she does her thing, and then very cutely, she rolls
herself back to her charger after a few hours. And
I think it goes without saying that all of these
electric robot lawnmowers are much in quotes greener than their
(02:18):
gas guzzling human controlled counterparts.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
My mother also has a semi autonomous robot lawnmower at
her house. I'm not sure if that's because of her
concern for gas guzzling. But it is interesting how these
kind of almost sci fi type robots have become so
normalized that people think you're crazy for going to look
at one in action. I am curious though. Obviously in
the previously owned garden, you know, a Belonce going about
(02:42):
her business is racally safe. But I can imagine the
cut in trust of New York City, you know, vandalism, theft.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
All dirt, the grimy crime of New York City. Actually,
that Belonce wouldn't be safe.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yeah, I was worried about her.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Well, she is safe.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
You want to know why there's a ton of security
in brime. She's also not the first she has peers.
There were several others tested, including l lawn James got.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Who comes up with this? Mum? If you're listening, Karen,
do you have any suggestions for what the garden lawnmower
could be rechristened?
Speaker 4 (03:15):
Okay, so I have actually five because one of our
genius producers asked an AI chatbot for a few more
lawn pun names.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Here we go. My favorite, Trimothy Shallome.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
Mozart, Yeah, fine, eh, post Malone, ye ye grass, light Year,
and fine, another great one a lawn musk.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
That's my favorite. MS. Okay, we got it.
Speaker 4 (03:44):
So that is my lighthearted contribution for today. If you
are in New York City, go check out belonce. She'll
be waiting for you. I have to switch gears a
little bit for my next story. How familiar are you
with Discord.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
I've had about Discord for many years. I've never actually
used it a gamer. I'm not a gamer. I know
it's kind of like a live platform for simultaneous discussion,
and unfortunately, my life is so sad that the closest
analogy I can think of is the work productivity tool Slack.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Slack is a game for you.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Unfortunately, you're like, oh, you mean Slack's Ega Genesis. Well,
the reason I ask you, and I think you'll be
interested in this. Discord recently played a very big role
in a revolution.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
I actually I actually heard about this a little bit
intil some headlines. This is in Nepal, that's right.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
So in the course of a week, the country banned
social media, erupted in gen z led protest, ousted, their
prime minister, solicited recommendations for an interim replacement on chat GBT,
and then elected an interim leader on discord.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Talk about tech stuff.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
It really is a tech stuff story.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Yeah, I don't know that much about Nepal. I know
it's in the Himalayas. I know it's where Mount Everest is. Yes,
it borders China and India. But why did this happen there? Like,
what's the background?
Speaker 4 (05:06):
So actually Nepal was traditionally a monarchy, right, but a
democratic government was founded less than twenty years ago. Nepal
is the second poorest country in South Asia, the first
being Afghanistan. And a few weeks ago there was a
massive TikTok trend among youth and Nepal called hashtag Nepo kids.
(05:27):
So social media users were posting videos showing the wealthy
lifestyles of the children of Nepal's leaders. So think images
of politicians' kids posing in front of Christmas trees made
out of Louis Vuitton and Cardier boxes. These images were
being juxtaposed with images of the day to day struggles
of regular people in Nepal. So there are images of
(05:48):
malnourished children, floods, decimated housing, and overall poverty.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
Yeah, that's quite a stark juxtaposition. And I can't imagine
government ministers felt too good about their children being juxtaposed
with children suffering malnourishment and poverty. No, and it.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
Actually it led to the government banning twenty six social
media platforms, including TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook, purportedly in the
name of battling fake news, hate speech, and online fraud,
which obviously people are not buying.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, I wouldn't buy that either. When did the band
come into effect?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
On my birthday?
Speaker 1 (06:21):
September fourth, hap your birthday?
Speaker 4 (06:22):
The following Monday, Thousands of young people took to the streets.
So some government buildings were burned down, including the Prime
Minister's office, and according to Reuter's there was a violent
crackdown and about seventy two people were actually killed in
the protest and subsequent fires.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Yeah, this sounds like, I mean, eerily familiar in terms
of the Arab Spring of fifteen years ago. What happened
next in Nepal?
Speaker 4 (06:45):
So the social media ban was reversed almost immediately after
protests began, and on Tuesday, September ninth, the Prime minister
resigned and fled the country. Then the military pretty much
took over and put a curfew in place. And so
you know, what do people do when they're force to
stay inside, They go back on life, That's right, they
go online. So over one hundred thousand people, including a
(07:08):
number of organizing groups, spent several days on Discord working
to come up with an interim leader who the military
would actually cooperate with and accept. There were discussions taking
place on Discord, filled with you know, everything you'd expect
on discord, memes, insults, and there were some genuinely earnest
you know, suggestions and polls.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Right.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
Young activists argued over the future leadership of the country,
and some even turned to chat GPT for help. You know,
one group asked chat to identify potential candidates for the
interim leadership position, and so when they were provided a
list of qualified candidates, they went back to chat gpt
and asked it to debate the strengths and weaknesses of
each candidate.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Well and chat gate good advice, it seemed to you know.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
Chat gpt actually provided many qualified candidates, including one woman
who had been selected by a dominant gen Z collective
to lead negotiations with the military. This was Sushila Karki.
She's seventy three years old. She's not, you know, a
young discord user herself. She's a former Chief Justice and
well known anti corruption crusader, and according to the Sri
Lankan Guardian, Chatchept advised the quote, she seems likely to
(08:16):
command trust across different groups and could help oversee reforms
and the path to fare elections.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
And so far, so good.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
You know, after some chaos, the discord community decided to
have her be the new interim leader of Nepal. And
she's actually putting together a cabinet right now and will
hold elections for a new prime minister in about six months.
Speaker 1 (08:35):
This is an amazing story. This is uncanny online, offline
metaverse discord chatchpt, real life protests, new leaders. I mean,
what's so interesting to me about this story is just
how borderless it is. For example, the mascot of this
revolution is the pirate flag from the Japanese anime series
One Piece. Have you watched One Piece?
Speaker 2 (08:57):
I know about it, I'm aware of it.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
So CNN describes it as quote the swashbuckling story, and
I always loved the swashbuckling story. To the swashbuckling story
of the charming pirate captain Monkey d Loofy and his
misfit straw hat crew. CNN continues to one piece fans.
The flag symbolizes Lufi's quest to chase his dreams, liberate
oppressed people, and fight the autocratic world government. That flag,
(09:23):
from a Japanese anime series has now been seen flying
not just in Nepal, but also in Indonesia and the Philippines,
countries that are both recently had their own gen Z
uprisings over government corruptions. I was in an uber this
morning in gridlock traffic in Midtown, so got chatting. My
driver was from Nepal, Lucky, and so I asked him,
(09:45):
you know, what do you think about this story? He said, Look,
this isn't really a story about Nepal. This is much
bigger than Nepal. This is about a group of people,
young people who refuse to be bound by the political conventions,
the political institutions, or the political establishment of their country
and instead insisted on having their voice and on a
new political reality. And his point was this is really borderers.
(10:09):
And he even said it could happen here. I don't
know if it really could happen here, but the optimism
which he brought in the excitement reminded me of the
early days of the Arab Spring, which obviously followed by
what people talk about as the Arab Winter. But it'll
be interesting to see what happens next.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
Yeah, you know, for year, social media companies talked about
how their platforms could democratize the Internet and bring people together.
And in the US, as we know, they've mostly proven
to be divisive and polarizing, you know, que the recent
discussion about the rhetoric and online communities that motivated Tyler
Robinson who is now in custody for killing Charlie Kirk.
But in Nepal they were able to have a transparent
(10:45):
exercise in direct democracy, of course, with the help of
Discord and unbelievably generative AI.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
And this brings me to our next stories. So while
gen Z and Nepal is interested in using AI and
discord a topple government and bring more direct experience of democracy,
gen Z in America is focused on getting rich.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Who isn't true?
Speaker 1 (11:09):
Who isn't So basically, there was a great story in
the Wall Street Journal that I read. I mean, the
headline was AI startup founders taut a winning formula, no booze,
no sleep, no fun. And what the story is really
about is how back in the early two thousands there
was this like hustle culture there was. It was celebrated
(11:30):
in the movie The Social Network. You know, it was
this time of college dropouts and the consumer internet was
being born. People were living in dormitories and you know,
doing business with each other and kind of sacrificing that
the normal pleasures of youth to build these companies that
became Facebook and Google or whatever else and became you know,
multi multi billionaires. In the intervening time, Silicon Valley kind
of settled into a normal you know, corporate America. People
(11:54):
had great benefits, they're normal working hours, they made great money,
et cetera, et cetera, and that seemed to be kind
of the new norm. And you saw this like generation
of people who were you know, not all about hustle culture,
about you know, have a balance in their private lives.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Exact life balance, a balance.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Now there are new fortunes to be made, and there
are new threats to the stable assumptions of what it
was to be you know, a knowledge worker in your
early twenties. And so with a vengeance, this hustle culture
seems to have returned.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
So what does that look like exactly?
Speaker 4 (12:28):
You know, are founders sleeping under their deaths, working all
the time, have no social I mean, that's that's what
I think of when I think about sort of early Facebook.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Yeah, exactly that, but that someone that are even younger
than they were. So The General profiled an eighteen year
old from Kazakhstan named Arlan. He dropped out of school
in his junior year of high school after creating an
AI tool that led him getting a summer research job
at Stanford. After that, he was accepted to why Combinator,
which is this very famous startup incubator that helped develop
(12:56):
companies like door Dash and Airbnb. He said that being
steps to why Combinator been his dream since he was ten.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Years old, which was eight years ago.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Exactly. Jeez, that really puts his perspective to From there,
Arlan received a million dollars in funding and moved from
Kazakhstan to San Francisco again. According to the Journal, he
always carries his laptop with him and works quote while
out walking, during dinners, at the laundromat and on the.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
Toy because we're moving fast and breaking things, because we
have add.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
Well, yeah, I mean, obviously the phone in the toilet
is a particularly bad habit, but I think Arlan is
like debugging software, I think, rather than texting. The journal
reported that even after dinner with other founders, Arlan will
go to meetings with potential clients until one am. He said, quote,
I'm trying to be in the sprint mode always. I
(13:54):
never tried to divide working on startup and my social life.
And Arline even convinced his father brother to move to
the US where they're working on their own AI startups. Again,
he's eighteen years old.
Speaker 4 (14:07):
What does he mean when he says he never tried
to divide his startup in a social life.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Yeah, I mean, so you know, it's not like he
never socializes with other people. Like the startup founders obviously
understand that having a network is a key part of succeeding.
They don't waste their time and they don't socialize for fun.
But apparently one of the things which is in vogue
as a way of socializing is something you know quite
a lot about, which is book clubs.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
I didn't realize that you run a book club I do.
What do you think motivates your members? To be part
of the book club. It's called Bellatris.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yes, thank you.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
Check it out on Instagram and on the websitewwwl tris
dot com. I think when we started at what motivated
people was this idea that we were increasingly on our
phones all the time. Like in the early twentieth century,
when paperbacks really started to hit the market, people were
worried that people would be.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Reading too much.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Much. Now, I think a lot of people have said
to me, you know, I'm devoted to reading in the
way that I'm devoted to exercise, in the sense of
it's bringing my mind offline in a way that not
much else is.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
And I think one of the interesting things in Silicon
Value there's this thing going on where there's interest in
Roman history and military history and all this this kind
of idea that to be a successful founder, Yes, there's
a lot of hustle, but also kind of living in
the world of grand ideas and intellectual frameworks and stuff
is also important.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
One of the things that's surprising about this article, and
you're describing in it, is like I was under the
impression that gen Z was like quiet, quitting and taking
time for themselves.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah, I think that comes back to what I was
saying at the beginning, which is there's probably like there
may be a bifurcation between like elder gen Z and
younger gen Z. I mean, life was economically before the
air evolution, like the corporate job market was much more
secure than is now, and also like new fortunes were
(16:03):
not being made, like the tech companies were so dominant.
There's all that focus on how you needed anti trust
regulation otherwise no new companies would emerge. And then jen
Ai came along and it just shattered the landscape. And
so now you have these extraordinary you know, dreamers like
our Land moving from Kazakhstan to try and make it
in the valley. It's something that's always happened, I think,
(16:24):
But this you know, return of hustle culture with a
vengeance is really interesting. There was a bit in a
story that really made me think, which is that a
bunch of the young founders refer to this concept of
nine ninety six. Do you not? Nine ninety six is?
Speaker 4 (16:37):
I do? But please describe it because I want people to.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Know, well, nine ninety six is actually a concept that
emerged in China, and this was basically a kind of
work as hard as you can nine am to nine pm,
six days a week, so every day you one day
off and otherwise you work twelve hours a day. And
this was kind of like a little bit of a
boogey man of like people look at China and think,
oh my god, this is a whole generation of young
people who are killing them by working too hard in
(17:01):
the tech sector, and you know, actually suicides, and there's
a lot of horrible kind of ansidiary reporting around this
nine ninety six culture. But it's now evidently like a
meme not so dissimilar to the Pirate flag, been absorbed
by a certain sector of youth population of Silicon Valley
as something to aspire to. And I just find that
really really interesting.
Speaker 4 (17:20):
It is very strange because we came of age in
a time where burnout culture was such a buzzword. This
is literally touting burnout culture as the way to live
and as the way to make money, which is interesting.
I mean, if you think of prior generations of immigrant populations,
like burnout was a way to build wealth in this country.
If you came to this country and if your relatives
(17:42):
were meant to come to this country, it wasn't like
if you owned a dry cleaner, for example, you.
Speaker 1 (17:46):
It nine ninety six was there was another work.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Life balance at the dry cleaner. And I think what's
interesting is it's the type of businesses that people are
building that has changed. But there has always been a
mentality in this country of like, we come to America
to make wealth.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
See I think you're right to your point. AI is
exactly that. Like it's a chimera, like it's a dream,
it's anything you want it to be. And so it's
literally a moment where like for a certain group of
people it feels like anything's possible, although of course the
reality is most of them will be very burnt out
and not have very valuable businesses at the end of it.
Speaker 4 (18:17):
You know, your pal Jeff Hinton, who was a tech
stuff guest and the so called godfather of AI, recently
gave an interview to The Financial Times where he said, quote,
AI will make a few people much richer and most
people poorer. So I think we kind of are aware
of this on a macro level, but it's interesting to
see it play out in the Petri dish of Silicon Valley.
You know how hard these kids are willing to fight
(18:40):
for a slice of the AI PI while like all
of these entry level jobs are being slashed.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
After the break, some more headlines. The FDC is taking
Amazon to trial, Albania has an AI minister of corruption,
and Russia has an AI generated television show. Then on
Chat to me Chat helps one tech stuff listener navigate
a scary diagnosis. Stay with us. We're back, and in
(19:13):
honor of you, m week, We've got a couple more
global headlines for you. But first, Kara, are you an
Amazon Prime member?
Speaker 2 (19:20):
I am?
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Do you remember when you signed up? Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:23):
God, years ago, years ago?
Speaker 1 (19:25):
Probably the free delivery gotcha easily.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Yeah, me too, just hauling it prime.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
Yeah, it's like I want to be the prime USDA.
H yeah, so that's a good thing. Prime. However, the
Federal Trade Commission is taking Amazon to trial this week
overclaims they tricked millions of people into signing up for Prime.
I did it with my eyes open, but apparently millions
of others did not. And the laws it was actually
first filed, interestingly during the Biden administration back in twenty
(19:52):
twenty three, but the trial just started on Monday.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Why does the FDC think that people were tricked?
Speaker 1 (19:58):
Well, you want to hear from the comp I do.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
I'm not going to read it.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
The complaint filed by the FTC says, quote Amazon used manipulative, coercive,
or deceptive user interface designs known as dark patterns to
treat consumers into enrolling and automatically renewing prime subscriptions. Cancline
subscription was made intentionally more difficult than signing up for one,
(20:24):
and the complaint calls the cancelation process quote labyrinthine is
how you say labyrinth thine, labyrinthine.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
I think it's labyrinthine, labyrinthine.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Get this. Internally at Amazon, the cancelation process was called quote,
an unspoken cancer, and it was referred to as the
Iliad flow, as in the Greek epic poem about a
hero's journey through the protracted Trojan war.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
I love these nerds, That's why, I mean, just internally
what they call things.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
But what does the Iliad flow entail?
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Well, it kind of entails what you'd do, imagine, which
is being extremely hard to get from A to B.
And they knew, and they knew, and they were making
a joke about it. But specifically, the complaint says that
in order to go through the process of unsubscribing. On
the site, customers had to navigate through four pages, six clicks,
and fifteen various options. And there are also a ton
(21:19):
of sort of chances along the way to unknowingly stop canceling,
warnings about losing benefits, promotional offers, all intended to distract
you or convince you not to cancel. Whereas guess how
many clicks it takes to sign up for Prime?
Speaker 4 (21:35):
Not a lot.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
I'm actually surprised it wasn't just one, but absolutely Since
the court filing, Amazon has actually already changed the process.
There's now a well labeled and easy to understand cancelation page.
But the outcome of the trial is still worth keeping
an eye on because it could impact the future of
canceling subscriptions for all kinds of companies. And it is
unbelievably hard and annoying to cancel subscriptions. The worst subscription
(22:01):
cancelation I ever had was the Times Literary supplement We
had to Call, We Have.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
To Call, which is run by Abacus.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
If I'm not mistaken, it's actually I've watched my mom
almost being brought to tears by cancelation.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
It's evil. Some of the cancelation.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Tactes are evil, dark patterns.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
It feels malicious, high listeners.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
This is oz. I wanted to let you know that
the day after we recorded the episode, there was actually
an outcome to the trial. Amazon settled with the FTC
for two point five billion dollars. By settling, they admitted
no wrongdoing. But we'll keep an eye out on what
this outcome means for subscription cancelation overall. But now back
(22:45):
to our episode and our next short headline. How much
do you know about Albanian politics?
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Literally nothing, which is embarrassing, but nothing.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
Not that embrassing. I've actually been to our not too
long ago. It's really quite a fascinating country that's had
a meteoric rise post communism. It's in this very strategic
location between East and West, and so you know, the
US and Europeans are quite supportive. But there's also terrible
problems with organized crime. And actually a lot of the
drug trafficking through the port of Rotterdam from South America
(23:22):
is controlled by Albanian organized crime. And recently Albania became
the first country in the world to appoint an AI
generated government minister.
Speaker 2 (23:33):
How does that work?
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Good question? I'll start with her name, Della, which means
sun in Albania. That's Della has actually been around since January.
She started life as an AI assistant designed to help
people navigate online government services.
Speaker 2 (23:50):
So she's actually worked her.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
This is this is a real uh yeah, brags to
Rich's journey for Della. She has reached promoted to cabinet
minister in charge of public procurement. Essentially, she'll be analyzing
government contracts for corruption. Would you like to meet her?
Speaker 2 (24:10):
But I'm dying to meet her. Also, this feels ripe
for corruption.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Well we'll get We'll get to that in a minute,
but first, here's d'ella.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
The samoanchuitor Anti coustets I Kim Kalandur.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
So this is an AI generated person that I'm looking at.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
This is an AI generated person wearing traditional Albanian dress
against the backdrop of the Albanian flag and the EU.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Flag its state sponsor TV.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
She's talking in Albanian, but luckily there are subtitles. She says,
some have labeled me unconstitutional because I'm not a human being.
That hurt me, not for myself, but for the nine
hundred and seventy two thousand interactions I had with citizens
whom I served as part of E Albania ABBE. This
is well, that's the beginning of her career when she
(25:02):
was bootstrapping, Yeah, exactly. She emphasized that as an AI
she has no ambitions or personal interests, which makes her
perfectly suited to the job of making sure government contracts
impartial and corruption free. The Prime Minister of Albania, Eddie Ramer,
said Diella would help make Albania quote a country where
public tenders are one hundred percent free of corruption, one
(25:27):
hundred percent free of corruption. I methinks the Prime Minister
does protest too much, and some citizens of Albania are
also quite dubious. One Facebook user quote in The Guardian said,
in Albania, even Diella will be corrupted.
Speaker 4 (25:44):
I mean talk about AI hallucination, AI corruption, I think
is the next frontier. You know, it's funny that you
bring this up, because my next headline is also about
state sponsored AI. I read this article in four or
four media about a news satire show which recently premiered
on Russian state TV, and it's apparently all AI generated.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
So what does state funded political AI slop entail?
Speaker 4 (26:09):
So, according to ads for the show. They've got a
neural network deciding the content and topics for each episode,
and then that same neural network uses AI to generate video.
So it's been creating content like, you know, amazing stuff
like President Trump singing songs, French President Emmanuel Macron wearing
(26:29):
hair curlers and a pink robe. An ad for the
show claims, quote the editorial team's opinion may not coincide
with the AIS, though usually it does.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Do you think that's it has to be?
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Poll It Stacker, which is the name of the show,
is not just news but a tough breakdown of political
madness from a digital host who notices what others overlook.
Russia's Ministry of Defense actually owns the TV channel where
it airs.
Speaker 1 (26:57):
I'm curious about this this show though, I mean it
like obvious that it's made by AI. How does the
AI show up in the show?
Speaker 4 (27:04):
Well, there's a data scientist named Kalev Letaru from Georgetown.
He's the one who found the show originally, and he says,
at times, if you don't know it was AI, you
might never guess that it looks a lot like other
Russian propaganda. And he says further, if they are using
AI to the degree that they say they are, even
if it's just to pick topics. They mastered that formula
(27:25):
in a way that others have not. You know, there
are parts that are unmistakable AI, like deep fake interviews
with world leaders. In one of those interviews, Trump says
he'll end the Russia Ukraine war by building a casino
in Moscow with golden toilets. But the AI seems to
have Trump's pattern of speech down pretty well. To quote
him in one of these videos, all the Russian oligarchs,
(27:46):
they would all be inside, all their money would be inside.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Problem solved.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
They would just play poker and forget about the whole war.
A very bad deal for them, very distracting.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
It's funny, you know, big fears when when gerative AI
really took off, that we would all be tricked and
transfixed by deep fakes of world leaders and you know,
political events would be dictated by fake media. Instead, what
seems to have happened is that deep fakes have kind
of evolved the medium of the meme. Like instead of
(28:21):
a meme, now you kind of create a deep fake
scenario of the thing you're trying to make fun of
and it's funny that, you know, Trump is talking about
building a casino in Moscow in this Russian satire AI show,
because on Trump's own AI satire social media channels, he's
making content about turning Gaza into a riviera. So there's
(28:44):
a funny like you know, doubleness here where it's odd
that the primary expression of deep fake content right now
is political satire. And now it's time for our final
(29:08):
segment of the day, Chat and Me. Today's submission is
from Jeremy, who is an early adopter of Chat GPT,
a self described chat evangelist, and of course a tech
stuff listener.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
I like anyone who's a self described tex stuff listener.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
I like anyone who text stuff listener, not self described
thank you.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
So, while Jeremy uses Chat for all sorts of tasks,
there's one in particular that he thinks is of note.
Speaker 3 (29:33):
One of the biggest ways it helps me. It's like
health tracking both me and my dog. Actually, what I
do is I log my Apple Watch stats after hikes, workouts,
and then I upload that information into chat GBT and
it just breaks those numbers down in a way that
actually makes sense to me. So I can kind of
see my progress over time.
Speaker 4 (29:55):
There is a plot twist coming. Jeremy doesn't just track
his workouts. He also tracks his food with the help
of chat GPT, and he actually is a really powerful incentive.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
I was recently diagnosed with pre diabetes, so I'm trying
to kind of be a little more careful what I eat.
Instead of just guessing what I eat and the nutritional
value of information, I basically just log my daily foods.
Whatever I eat, I take a picture of what I eat,
and I just uploaded the chat GPT and it kind
of just breaks all their down. You know, the calorie corp, sugar,
(30:28):
protein are there.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
You know, I can imagine if you're dealing with a
diagnosis like pre diabetes, not only do you have to
come to terms with this new health reality emotionally, you
also very practically have to build a new routine that
takes into account all kinds of new health priorities. You know, obviously,
the doctors can give you strict guidelines about what to
(30:49):
do in order to make sure your blood sugar levels
don't spike in terms of proteins and fats and carbohydrates.
But actually what Jeremy's doing is translating that into real life,
seeing what chatchpt says about it and how that may
track with the guidelines he's trying to follow. We've talked
a lot about medicine and AI, and the classic is
(31:11):
always like, can the AI outdiagnose a doctor, which in
many cases it seems like it can, but the majority
of medicine is not really diagnosis. It's actually preventative health
and patient compliance with doctor's recommendations and stuff. And so
this is actually the first I really heard of not
(31:31):
using AI so much just to diagnose an illness, but
actually to turn it into a tool to help manage
your condition. And I think it's pretty cool.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
Yeah, it's a little bit like your medical concierge that
leaves the doctor's office with you exactly.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
That.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Don't forget. We want to hear from you, our listeners,
so please send your chat stories to our inbox tech
Stuff podcast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
That's it for this week for Tech Stuff.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
I'm Kara Price and I'm os Voloshin. This episode was
produced by Eliza Dennis Tyler Hill and Melissa Slaughter. It
was executive produced by me Kara Price and Kate Osborne
for Kaleidoscope and Katrina Norvel for iHeart Podcasts. The Engineer
is Beheit. Fraser and Jack Insley mixed this episode. Kyle
Murdoch wrote out theme song.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
Join us next Wednesday for Textuff the Story for a
look at a beloved American industry that is benefiting and
being destroyed by AI Hollywood.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Please rate and review the show wherever you listen to podcasts,
and reach out to us at tech Stuff podcast at
gmail dot com. We love hearing from you.
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Oz Woloshyn
Karah Preiss
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