Lady Bird with Charla Lauriston

Jamie "Woman Hawk" Loftus and Caitlin "Girl Owl" Durante invite special guest Charla Lauriston to chat about Lady Bird!

(This episode contains spoilers)

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On the dol Cast. The questions asked if movies have
women and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism the patriarchy? Zef and best
start changing it with the Bedel Cast. Hi, welcome to
the Bechtel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus. My name
is Caitlin Durante. Oh my god, this is our podcast.

(00:22):
You're listening to it. Here we are. This is the
Bechtel Cast. We talked about the representation, the portrayal, the
treatment of women in movies, one movie at a time.
I'm drinking uh seven eleven juice. Yeah, I'm because you
think we need sweat. I'm kind of disappointed that you're
not drinking Mark's hard lemonade today, but I'm fully today.

(00:42):
After they followed us on Twitter and everything, you wouldn't believe,
they still have yet to send us any of their product.
But we'll get there. I don't know. I'm still I
I got into an online feud with the geeks who drank,
and I'm still really battling with that, and I think
that they're they're afraid of me, and then I sort
of just you know, it can't be feuding. Right now,

(01:05):
I understand feud. A show al for Molina was nominated
for a Golden Glove and snubbed. There we go, there's
the mention, Oh, so we so we look at movies
through the lens of how they treat women, using the
Bechdel test as a yard stick as a start for
the combo. Bechdel test for us is there has to

(01:26):
be a conversation between two female identifying characters in the
movie with names talking about something other than a man
for more than two lines of dialogue. Yeah, it doesn't
seem like it would be that hard for any movie
to pass. And yet, and yet so many simply do not.
Yes today today, I mean, I feel like no one

(01:46):
will be shocked to know. I say, we blow the
reveal that that lady Ladybirds done done. I'm so excited
to talk about it. Yeah, before we get into that,
they'll let us introduce guest. She's a hilarious comedian. She
runs a show called Velvet Charlotte Lordston being here, dected

(02:08):
to be here. Thanks for having me cool, Thanks for
bringing up this movie. Of course, this movie so you
saw in theaters and I'm guessing screens. Sorry, I mean
it only came out a couple of months ago. So
why did you pick this movie? Well, I also I
literally like when I saw the previous for it, I
reached out to my reps and asked for a script.

(02:30):
So I read the script before I ever saw the
movie because I was just so excited about Greta Gerwig
writing a film and like it's getting any kind of buzz,
Like I just get really excited when I see women
doing things that are like close to my age. It
just feels like I could do it. And it just
seemed like such a cool movie. I hadn't seen stuff
like I'm interested in writing a mother daughter kind of movie,

(02:51):
and I just wanted to see how she wrote out
that relationship. And it was like, really, you know, worthwhile
to read the script acy the movie. That's awesome, that's amazing.
I don't want to see. Yeah. Hey, speaking of scripts,
I do have a master's degree in screenwriting that I
hate to bring it up, you know, I just but
you know I've written a script before. No big deal.

(03:14):
That's good to know. I didn't know that about you. Yeah,
I'm so glad I know that now. Well, congratulations on
still having a master's to thank you take it away
from you after all that money. Yeah, imagine if they did,
like you don't use it in four years, are like, sorry,
you got to take it now. Unfortunately it's got like
an expiration date. Dude, he still owes two hundred thou dollars. Well,

(03:37):
I feel like I'm using it every day, every day
that we record an episode. I'm using that Master's baby. Yeah,
this is a this is a coping mechanism. This is
totally screenwriter adjacent for sure. Like some people totally never
even thank you for helping me validate my choices. We've
all made lovely We've all made choices, you know what
I mean? Like I make choices all the time. Some

(03:58):
of them were good. Some of them we're not saying whatever, hey,
kind of like what happens in today's movie. Quit people
making choices. Some of them are some of them are okay, masterful.
I learned about transitions in writing classes. Again, I don't

(04:20):
like to bring it up. So I saw Ladybird in
the theater. I liked a lot the first time. I
would say that I didn't like it quite as much
the second time. Some of it's I had the opposite experience. Yeah,
I know, I would say, because I read it first.
I liked the script better than I liked the movie
interesting just a little bit only because of the casting choices.
I was surprised by some of them. But yeah, I

(04:43):
was surprised by the boyfriend, her first boyfriend. That's that
casting choice, especially because he just looked so much more
like a baby than she does. And I like, it
was glaring to me, like, just get someone older. We
all know they're older playing younger, so it's like, so
that was weird. And I thought the brother casting was
and the girlfriend I thought those were both kind of

(05:06):
weird casting choices. So I ever seen either of those
actors before, thank me, neither. So this is I think
we are to understand autobiographical of Gwig's life. Does she
have like I wonder if she has like an adopted
sibling or not? I look it up neither. Maybe, Well,

(05:27):
well that's from doing for my understanding that autobiographical portion
is that she lived in a small town and wanted
to go to school in New York. So everyone who's
ever everybody has had the sixth right, so it's so relatable.
Every time the mother and the daughter are on screen

(05:48):
in this movie. I'm crying. I like fully allowed myself
to be manipulated. Oh my god. There are some lines
in there that really get a tear out. The scene
where they're shopping at the Good Wealthy when she asked
her do you like me? The yeah, because they were
shopping at that time too. Yeah, yeah, anytime they're in
a startic we wouldn't be shopping but having them deep

(06:10):
fast conversations. Oh my god, the one. But I'm thinking
of the part where they they're having a fight when
they're like looking at close on the rack and then
she pulls up one dress and then immediately they're not fighting. Yeah,
it's like, it's so good. Yeah, I'm gonna I thought
the movie did such a great job of showing how

(06:31):
you can forgive your kid for who they are at
that age, if that makes sense, you know, because you
can tell her mother loved her and knows that she'll
grow up and knows that she'll be more responsible. She
just wants more for her, but doesn't like her at
this age because she's so annoying. I guess I'm reading
a little bit about Greta Gerwig the early life section

(06:52):
of her Wikipedia that a scholar but This does actually
seem like a pretty close adaptation of what her life was,
where her mom was an O B G y N nurse,
her dad worked for a credit union. She has a
younger brother. They don't say if he is adopted, but
and then she went to an all girls Catholic school

(07:12):
in Sacramento. And she describes herself as a quote an
intense child, which also attracts with ladybirds. So so, speaking
of that, I'll kind of give a recap of the
story Caitlin's famous riga. We focus on Christine McPherson, who
has given herself the name Lady Bird and she wants

(07:34):
everyone to call her that. She is a senior in
high school in Sacramento at an all girls Catholic high school.
She does not especially like Sacramento, or at least she
doesn't think that she does, and she is gearing up
to be applying for colleges because she doesn't like Sacramento
in California in general. She doesn't want to go to
any of like the U C. State schools around. She

(07:54):
wants to go to New York. She wants to go
on the East Coast, so kind of that's on her mind.
She has a difficult relationship with her mother, Marian, played
by Laurie Metcalfe. Her mother is a bit overbearing, She's
pretty judgmental. They get in a lot of arguments. Her dad,
on the other hand, is like total beta male, like
sweetest guy ever. And she has a best friend named

(08:19):
Julie who throughout the sister I didn't know that until
earlier today. Yeah, I did not. Now that I know that,
I can totally see it right. Like she was she
was my favorite or one of one of my favorite
performances in the movie. I really loved her. I loved her.
I can't wait to see her more stuff. Same, she's awesome.

(08:39):
Yeah so um. Over the course of the movie, their
friendship has sort of an arc where they're very close.
But then Ladybird meets this other girl in her class
named Jenna. Is it. She comes from a wealthier family
and she's more popular, So Ladybirds like I want to
be also like hello sexual, she's and they well made

(09:00):
and like a sexpot in a way. That is because
this movie takes place in O two, right, Yeah, it's
very like an O two sexpot kind of vibe where
I like, in a way I can't even describe. It
was just like it's almost like a Britney Spears. Yeah,
like approachable but like like having way more sex and
it's comfortable age. Maybe get a parent as soon as

(09:23):
you see her? Yeah, like the is there a scene
where she's chewing bubble gum Like it's like on the lips,
titties are out, Like she's just but she looks so young, right, Yeah, yeah,
I think that she actually is. That is kind of
a weird casting thing in this movie where it seems
like the high school's mostly populated by kids that age,
and then Sarsha Rounan is like, yeah, exactly, oh is she? Yeah?

(09:46):
Is that how you say her name? Yeah? I learned
from I had to watch the Goldic Clubs and just
be like, how do they what are they gonna say?
There's so many vowels. Yeah, I'll trying to remember that. Sa. Meanwhile,
Timothy Shardonnay is it And but I'm getting ahead of Timothy.
Charlottagne a friend charlottagne um little Howard's in. So her

(10:12):
friendship with Jenna sort of displaces Julie a little bit,
but then they drama club. She's good, but she's not
so many drama Club Trauma Flashbacks got just like the
sincerity of a high school drama club, and like watching that,
you're just like, oh my god. Yeah, and then and
then it's so bad. It's so bad. It was well done.

(10:34):
How bad they made it yeah, and how they can't
tell how bad it is great portrayal of drama club.
Like yeah, like when they cut to the scene and
it's like they're they're like writhing around and primary colors right,
and they think it's the most future like this is
like six ship right here, like this is the best

(10:55):
stuff you've alrea done in all ads and it's awful,
like unwatchable. There's like a shot of the parents and
they're just like these are kids, so we're like we
have to summach god. I would shut. There's got to
be like video evidence of my high school drama club somewhere,
but I would I would die. I was never in
drama club. I did um mock trial and I was

(11:17):
on the soccer team. That was my extra curriculums. I
was on mock trial and the tennis team. Tennis. I
would I would like to play. I will, let's doll
you about it. I've been playing tennis anyway, Jamie complete
tennis with us Okay, Suttle YouTube. I played Division three
in college so terribly. Yeah A yeah, I'm not good

(11:39):
at tennis. He's kidding. I'm not. I'm just fairly Okay,
that's all you have to be your D three in college? Oh?
Is D three the division where you should show up? Yeah?
I like to say it to intimidate people that don't
know what I'm talking about. But it's really impressive. Yeah
it does great. I was I was, I was blue. Yeah. Anyway,

(12:01):
So Ladybird, uh so she has these different friendships. Ladybird
gets involved with this boy named Danny, who she meets
through the theater production that they dood flashbacks. Yeah, he
turns out to be gay, but I think we're supposed
to believe that she might have her first kiss with him,
or she says it's her first kiss. Okay. Then she

(12:22):
gets involved with Timothy Charlemagne and who is like, who
really is so good in this movie where you just
hate great performance, horrible character, hate that guy. And then
meanwhile she's you know, having conflicts with her mother. She's
applied to New York schools behind her mother's back. All

(12:44):
these things kind of come to a head around graduation
when she gets wait listed it I think n y U,
and her mother finds out about it, and she's all
upset because the family is also lower middle class. They
don't father was laid off, so they're having troubles that
Her mom, I think is a nurse in a psychiatric

(13:04):
hospital and she's working double shifts to pay for basically
the whole family. And then Ladybird also has a brother, Miguel,
and his girlfriend, Shelley, who also lives with the family.
I wish I saw we saw those characters more. But
Shelly especially seems like she has like one moment, but

(13:24):
it's only sort of to be like labir'd be nice
to your mom, and that's sort of all you get,
which is weird because it sounds like there was like
a lot there where it sounds like she was kicked
out of her house for having Yeah, but they give
her a kind of a decent storyline later, you know,
because Shelly tells Ladybird how cool her mom was, because
you know, when her actual mom kicked her out, her

(13:45):
mom took her in very easily. And also Shelley's other
storyline is wanting Ladybird to like her. Yeah, oh yes,
because there's that scene over they're eating eggs and then
Shelly's like, your sister doesn't like me, and Migul was like,
yeah she does, and everyone's like fighting and yelling. It's cute. Yeah,
so yeah, and then the story ends with her getting

(14:06):
into the school in New York. Moving there, she drops Ladybird.
Oh yeah, she starts dropping by Christine. Her mother and
she have not really reconciled by the time she leaves,
but her mom has written her all these notes and
basically she like calls and leaves a phone message being
like Mom, I love you, and and then that's kind

(14:26):
of the end of the movie. And then she goes, yeah,
which will stop very quickly after we started going to college.
It's just a matter of time. But you know that
description like that, the movie has so many great scenes
and so many great moments and so many great lines
like that you totally relate to from going to high

(14:48):
school and starting to experience all these things and like,
I'm from Taunton, Massachusetts. Way that's crazy, that's crazy, but
totally you want to get out of there. You yeah,
like you love and respect the town and the people
that are there and you know everyone, and it's like
it's very much familiar. But you know, I related to

(15:10):
the movie so much in that sense that I was like,
oh my god, I get I gotta get out of here. Yeah. Right,
the same experience for me. I grew up in a
small town in rural Pennsylvania, graduated only a year after
Ladybird's character did, so I was in high school right
at the same time, you know, justin Timberlake's Crimeer River
was all the rage for me to so good. Also

(15:33):
had a bit of a tumultuous relationship with my mother
at the time. My mom LORI shout out to Lorie. Uh,
she's chilled out considerably since then, but I'm sure you
were perfects and she wanted to hang out with you.
So that's what she did because she never let me
leave the house. She didn't let me do anything. We

(15:55):
were fighting about that all the time, Like we just
argued a lot. When I was a teen, I dealt
with my mom's over protectiveness in a different way, Like
my parents didn't let me go to problem, Like my
mom was super like my mom is super religious and overprotective,
which I totally get, you know, what I mean. But
I was like so super calm about it. I was
really I was just like, all right, well, I'll just

(16:17):
live at college and then I'll move away. I was
too impatient because it's like, there's no point I'm not, like,
I'm not rebellious towards my parents. I don't see any
use in that. I think the world is already so hard,
Like why would I give my my parents even more problems?
And also like there's logic to her being overprotective. It

(16:38):
just of course is oppressive to be so locked down
all the time. But she tot n I I did
go to ton Nill. Yeah, I don't know. Are literally
the towns there right next to each other neighbors? Love
your mom, great mom. I don't love the tot of mall. Really,

(16:58):
that was always my face. You'd to go there. My
mom would bring me a totton mall is like a
special treat. And she was like, I'd got to Claire's,
have at with like the red tag items at Claire's. God,
there's nothing worse, nothing else to do, and there's no
mall worse than the Brockton Mall. Agree only because I

(17:22):
go get all of my we've there so we've taught
there's that makes sense. Yeah, but in Brockton there's like
lots of we've that's where all the black people live.
It's great, it's yeah, I love fracton someone right. Well,
I didn't even have a mall in my hometown, so
well you were like in the woods space Yeah, yeah,

(17:42):
for sure. So this movie I think has a great
depiction of a relationship between a high school young woman
and her mother. Um, we've talked before on the podcast
about movies set in high school often don't feel like
any They don't look like any high school you've ever seen,

(18:03):
they don't feel like any high school you went to.
Like they just feel like a Hollywood version of what
high school is, and they don't ever totally feel real.
But to me, seeing this young woman just like that
felt real. Her high school experience, her relationship with her
mother is such a more in depth relationship than we
often see explored in a movie, like a mainstream Hollywood

(18:25):
movie like this. That alone made me. Especially the first
time I really enjoyed this movie, I was like, Wow,
this feels so honest. Seeing at the second time, I
was like, I don't think I like Ladybird as a
character very much. That was what I struggled with the
first time. But then the second time when I saw
I was like, oh, but I think that that means
that the movie is doing a good job. Yes, that's

(18:46):
the thing, because the characterization is so well done, and
I think we're supposed to come, at least for me,
coming away from this, I was like, Oh, you know,
I don't really like this character, but I think she's
she's frustrating, she's immature, but she's that we're all terrible
at that age. And I think we're supposed to come

(19:07):
away from this like thinking, Yes, she has potential to
learn and grow, and that's what her mom wanted for her,
to be the best version of herself. Yeah, just to
kind of come into her own. You know, this is
a coming of age story if you will. Uh. Yeah,
I think we're supposed to just like take away, Wow,
look how honest day portrayal this relationship and these relationships

(19:28):
were in this movie. So that was my main takeaway
from it. I loved it. My main takeaway from it
was the mom Laurie Metcalt character, because we I just
feel like moms are so underappreciated in culture and society.
And when I turned thirty, something happened in my brain

(19:49):
when two things became very important to me, my skin
and my mom. What happened, But like I immediately like
I don't know what it is about, like growing older
and I don't have kids, but it just made me
understand my mom in ways that I've just never understood
her before. And I like love watching Ladybird come to

(20:10):
understand her mom towards the end of the movie, you know,
like like that's what it was, like so great about
that it would have been like that's what I think
was the redeeming quality of her character because you don't
like her and you're not supposed to like her, but
at least by the end, she becomes like this very apologetic,
very grateful like kid who finally realizes like the emotional

(20:32):
labor of her like being her mom. Like that that's
what it was. It's like this heavy lifting to like
love you got there there towards the end. It is
like I had times like that with I mean, like
we all see us in our mom's in this movie,
but like the scene at the sink where Laura cass

(20:53):
washing dishes and it's being very you know I'm not
talking to you, and Ladybird is flipping the funk out
Like I had so many moments of that with my
mom where I would say something stupid or like lash
out in some weird hormonal way at her, and then
she would just shut down and then I would be like,
I don't I don't remember the exact line of dialogue,
but it really like hit me the second time, especially

(21:15):
when when she was like, you don't have to you know,
like we just talked to me, just talked to me,
just talked. I was like, Fuck, I did that with
my mom like every other day. Uh. Gregor growingg did
such an amazing job of like finding these so specific
moments that somehow like resonate on this huge level, like
anytime they're at a store. And then oh, there's one

(21:37):
of the things that I loved both viewings is when
they go to look at the nice houses right after
she too beautiful. Um yeah yeah. And then my thing
with the with the movie. The first time I remember
I saw it in theaters with my friend who grew
up in Sacramento at that exact time, and so her
gripes were all like sacramental related, and I didn't know

(21:59):
what they were. But the things that I was like
bummed out about the first time was I genuinely was
mad at Ladybird for bailing on Julie. Yeah, but that
means that it's just like, you know, the movie got
a serious reaction out of me because I was like, what,
like Julie didn't get like a good apology. That sucks.
But again, that's just like a thought I had about

(22:21):
the and then and then I did wish that that
the relationship between Ladybird and then Danny, Danny right when
he comes out of it. I wish that that, like
you get a great moment and we and we see
that their friends down the line. But I just I
wish that that was like explored a little bit more. Same. Yeah.
And also it's like again it's so you can't watch
this movie and not make it personal. But like I

(22:44):
I had, I had a gay high school boyfriend that
you know. There. I was like, there's there's so many
like weird, cool moments you could go back to, but
movies I would have taken a little bit less Timothy
Shallow may Uh and just swapped out He's I mean,
and that character is great. I like, it was so
well written in terms of just like what a fuck

(23:05):
he's got he's got Howard's in like that you know
exactly who he is and and you even find out
he's like, oh my dad has cancer and he's still
the worst, which really speaks to how annoying he is.
But like, yeah, my main grand of the movie. The
first time, I was like, I wish we got more Danny.
I thought that that was like a cool relationship we
didn't see. Yeah, Lady Bird does kind of redeem herself

(23:28):
with her mom at the end, like you were saying, Charlotte,
But I feel like I wanted more of a redemption
with both Danny and her best friend Julie, because she
does go back at the end, like right before prom,
and we don't see her actually apologize verbally. Maybe she
doesn't need to. Maybe their friendship is on such a

(23:49):
level where she doesn't. Just her showing up and hanging
out with her is enough. I don't know. Maybe I'm
like kind of working through this in real time. I
do like that they reconciled. I don't know, I just
wish that because the first time I saw the movie,
I was like, she's funny, she's spunky, she's bold, she's
like really outspoken, and I liked that about her. And
then the second time around, when I was like paying

(24:10):
more close attention, I was like, oh, she's kind of
mean to her friend, and she's she is, but it
made me, I know, I don't know, it just made
me annoyed with her. And then she like makes that
racist comment to her brother where she's basically implying that
he only got into UC Berkeley because of like affirmative action,
and he's just like, you're the worst, and and I

(24:32):
was just like, oh, she's a little piece of ship.
But again, we all are at that time, so and
that's I mean, I thought it was accurate. It is,
it is, it is, And I think that's partially why
she's so frustrating, because she is. And you know what
I love the most is at the end of the
movie when she's at that party and um, the guy

(24:53):
asked her where she's from and she says and he
doesn't really hear her, and she changes her answer to
San Francisco, and I love that that she's still lying,
like even because that's a theme throughout the movie that
she lies about the house that she lives in, and
like yeah. Yeah, she's a terrible person, which her friend

(25:14):
Julie after she learns her lesson Justice for Julie. Yeah,
justice for Julie. But like, I love that at the
end she's still lying because it's this great reminder that
change is slow and that you know, maybe at the
end of the four years she'll be a different person.
But her first party at college, she's still that. She's

(25:34):
still Ladybird, She's still Christine. She's still not comfortable in
this new role of she's not older, she's just in
a different place, you know, which was really cool and
it's cool to see her kind of figure that out
in time because she I mean, and that is part
of what I found frustrating about the character. And again
it's like the more we talk about it, it's like
it's not that doesn't mean that it's not I mean,

(25:54):
that means it's really good because and I recognize this
like behavior in you know, like girls they new in
high school of like they'll try out a club and
then if they're not immediately the center. Like that was
like Ladybird wanted attention, and when she didn't get like
a role she thought was sufficient for her, she was like, oh,
funk off by and then moved on to the next thing,

(26:15):
which is Jenna, and then moved on to the next
Like she's just all, you know, just like a very
teenage selfishness. And it's weird, I mean, because she also
she is insecure in some way, like she is a
very confident character, but there are some ways that yeah,
Like this was something I remember feeling myself to, Like
she was so confident but also very adamant about her

(26:39):
own like mediocrity and was not really delusional in any
way about Like she's like, yeah, my grades aren't good enough,
but I'm going to figure it out, right, Yeah, like
that we know of yet. That's such a great line.
And and you know, like when her mom was like, oh,
do you still like drama, She's like, no, I don't
think I'm good at it. Like Ladybird won to find

(27:00):
the easiest way to do everything. Yeah, yes, which you know,
which is a lot of us is understandable. Yeah that's hard. Yeah.
So these are just very well written characters that we
usually don't see on screen because especially female characters are
such one dimensional, underdeveloped people who don't feel like real

(27:20):
people that it is refreshing to see such dynamic characters
in this movie. Yes, I agree, I love I want
to talk about Julie. I think she's my favorite character.
We need to talk about. We need to talk about
Julie new movies starting to listen. So one of the
things I want to say about her is that I

(27:42):
really like that we get representation on screen of a
young woman who is fat. We almost never see fat
women in movies. Even of the female characters that we've
talked about on this podcast who we love and we
think are such like badass female characters, they're almost always
like these unrealistically thin women. Hollywood is very guilty of

(28:04):
portraying this like unrealistic standard of beauty that like no
one can achieve and having their like badass, strong female
protagonists and female characters still be very by Western standards,
very beautiful and very thin. So I just really liked
that we see a very lovable, good character, smart like

(28:27):
she gets cast in the lead of the play even
though she does not have that stand out of an
audition like that was where I was like, she had
a weird and lady bird. I thought had a pretty
good audition, so too, it was extra as hell, but
that same yeah, but just the fact that we see
that representation I think is really great because we haven't

(28:49):
talked that much about like kind of the body positivity
movement on this podcast. Yeah, and I mean I feel
like we don't talk about it a lot because we
so rarely see other body types in any movie we can,
which is also worth mentioning that we hardly ever see that. Yeah,
and kind of being to that point, I thought that
the way that that was, I mean, that was in
no way a focal point even of Julie's character really,

(29:12):
but they're the few times that like Julie, like she
says a few times like oh I feel so fat right,
Like there's like a little comments and Ladybird never quite
knows how to deal with it and respond and she'll
be like me too, or like something like connected with
with those moments too, of like when your friend expresses
an insecurity and then you're like, oh, I don't know

(29:32):
what to do with this. I'm just gonna say I
feel the same way, even though, like, yeah, like because
I've seen very early on they're looking through a magazine
at the store where McGill works at, and um, they
see like an ad of this like probably photoshopped model. Yeah,
even today, all that ship is being photoshopped. Julie says,
you know, why can't I look like that? I think

(29:55):
Ladybird doesn't really respond or like, doesn't say anything that important.
But then Ladybird reflects that same sentiment much later on
in the movie when she's shopping for her prom dress
and she comes out and there's address it's a little
too tight, and you know, she's saying, like, why don't
I look like the women in the magazines? Which is
a bit on the dose, you know, But yeah, I

(30:15):
do like those little moments where, you know, Julie, like
you said, it expresses an insecurity, which, you know, again
just a totally realistic thing for women of all ages
to be insecure about. So I just, yeah, I just
really liked that representation and that that was addressed in
the movie. I would like to see more movies feature
just a strong female lead that doesn't have that quote

(30:38):
unquote ideal body shape. I'd like to see representation across
the board of just you know, other shapes and sizes.
Doesn't seem like we're quite there yet in Hollywood. I
don't think so, but I it's on the horizon. I
can already. I can feel it in my bones. It's coming.
You know, when you see I really do. Like when
you see more women directors, you see more women screenwriters,

(31:00):
you see women really getting the means of production, like
you know, like you have a Shonda Rhymes that exists,
you have an Operah that exists, Oprah has a network,
Like I don't see how in the next ten to
twenty years, based on the way those women look, you know,
and what they've already done, like that that work isn't
pushed more. And like women like us who want to

(31:21):
see ourselves represented on screen, even aniss ray with hard
natural hair, like that's mind boggling to me, Like you
don't see a lead with natural hair like ten years
ago ever, you know, Like now it's everywhere. Now It's
like I don't even know how to take care of
my natural hair. Now, I'm like, oh my god, now
it's a trending to figure it out. But it's like seriously,

(31:42):
like I really I think it's I think it's only
going to get better. Really, yeah, I hope. So I
think it writes me happy. I feel uplifted. You guys
don't agree. You don't think it's going to get better.
I think so often we get caught in the mire
of like where you're usually covering movies that are a
little bit older, and it's so easy to just get
bogged down with like Jesus Christ, we're given James Franco

(32:03):
Golden Gloves. Okay, you know, Like, but it does seem
like there is a system that is, if not being
pushed all the way out, is at least being pushed
to the side, which is I think the most promising
thing is that system is seeing how financially like it's
it can't last long like that that system find like

(32:23):
like people aren't supporting movies that only have this or that,
Like I think a movie like Black Panther, which I
personally have been excited to see so ready, but the
fact that that or or even like Ladybird, let's just
usually the movie we're talking about, a movie like Ladybird
that is financially successful, you know, like from the time
when Bride'smaids was financially successful. Everything's about money in this industry.

(32:46):
So it's just once they see that they're this structure
that's built on these oppressive kind of ideas because only
a handful of people are only so many people get
to make these decisions when their bottom line isn't being
because they can't find it, they can't finance. But people
aren't putting people putting money anymore because they know they
don't have to see something like that. They have to

(33:08):
change or they die, which is fine. Some of them
will go away, and some of them will wise up
and like make movies with women and people of color
and like put people or like even better, I hate
having to like shove my way into like the person
of powers, you know position. I'd rather just create my
own thing and then you die naturally. You know. Competition

(33:30):
is great in that way, you know, like when you're
making something people want to see, Like I don't have
to push my way to the table. I can make
my own table and make my own film and make
my own you know. And I think it's I think
it's amazing. I think it's gonna be dope. And it
was like all these different platforms, things are so much
more accessible than they used to be with the studio
system and all that. It sucks that for like the

(33:51):
Hollywood studio system, the motivator for them is money and
not showcasing marginalized voices like it's good, that's capitalist socialist
Caitlin overright, So go get your plow, get a libertarian,
libertarians own plows. That's just like a fun thing. I

(34:14):
enjoyed pushing in the world. Um yeah, and when movies
like Ladybird, I want to see how beyond its budget
it it made. But like this movie did so well,
and I was I was surprised that. And I think
there's just like a cultural shift of a couple of
years ago. Do I think my brother, my little brother
would go out of his way to see Ladybird? No, like,

(34:35):
but he did, and he's seen it twice. I mean
that has to do with the movie Past two. But
but like it is cool that there is like a
culture shift happening where you don't necessarily see Lady Bird
and you're like, oh, it's the girl movie. We're not
going to go, but like, yeah, where it's like my yeah,
my dad and my brother's old Ladybird and they just

(34:56):
and I think unless they were like play me, I
think I just thought they saw a movie, which is
which they did. But I think ten years ago they
would have been like, oh, yeah, we saw I can't
believe I had to go see the girl movie. You know,
do you know what that makes me think of When
you say they saw a quote unquote girl movie and
they are just talking about it like a normal movie.

(35:16):
It makes me think of the me Too movement or
just the sexual harassment culture in Hollywood that everyone's been
talking about. About, how like dudes are just like, well,
how are we supposed to talk to women? They're a person.
Imagine talking to another guy, but that you might you know,
and like ask like would you touch another guy if
you didn't ask that person or didn't know if it

(35:37):
was okay? You know, like the sexual attraction part is
you know, one piece. But then also they're also a person.
That's what I would like to say people that are confused.
It's well, it's been shoved down everybody's throat in media
and just culture in general that actually women aren't really people,

(35:58):
their objects. So all these men who like don't know
how to talk to women are like don't know how
to treat them. It's because they've been spoon fed these
ideas that like women are objects and that they're not
real people and they don't have autonomy. So yeah, they're
just like jiggling boobs sometimes they have a name. Sometimes
they don't even Like you guys were talking about when

(36:19):
you go back and watch old movies, It's true. When
I go back and watch old movies, I'm like, holy
sh and like even like recent past, like something that
this movie didn't really address that that I mean, I
just think that there wasn't time. But like I would
be so interested, like what were the movies Ladybird and
Julie were like seeing in two thousand two, because it

(36:41):
had to have been a fucking nightmare, Like, because that's
kind of I feel like the early two thousands was
weirdly especially bad in the ways that women are projecting.
I'm kind of I think plugging in my time at
working in the Playboy archives as a litmus test for that.
But like the early two thousand was especially pushing, like

(37:02):
a insane body type on the world. Um that's less
realistic than almost any other era I can think of.
So I kind of wish I knew, Like I'm like, oh,
because they don't talk about movies. Music is discussed and
the soundtrack is like awesome. I like. Also, to date,

(37:25):
Lady Bird has practically quadrupled it's budget ten million budget.
It's made thirty nine point one million. That's amazing. Yeah.
I mean that's nowhere near what a blockbuster gets, which
is upsetting, but people are buying tickets to go saying
it's a good exciting. Another thing I wanted to talk

(37:45):
about is I love how like sex positive that household is. Yes,
Oh my god, Yeah, it's really cool to see. We
almost never seen that. And I loved how when she
asked her mom when it's a good time to have sex? Yeah? Mom?
What she says, she has a little She's like sex, yeah, yeah,
and she says truthfully no because she hadn't had sex

(38:08):
yet at that point. And then her mom says, I
say college. And then she's like, and make sure you
use protection like we talked about, which was implying that
they've already had the sex talk, like if you're going
to do it, just like you know, use protection, make
sure you're ready, all that stuff. There's that conversation which
I really loved. I really liked. I think it's earlier
on in the movie. But um, ladybirds, mom and dad

(38:29):
are like in the bathroom and my mom says, like,
do you think Miguel and Shelley have sex on the
pull up cad. He was like, oh yeah, and they
laughed about it like I love it so like, because
I don't know how religious the family is, I think
that because Ladybird goes to an all Catholic high school.
Maybe I'm assuming that because they addressed that to you,

(38:49):
that they said that Miguel saw someone stabbed in public school,
and so god, I remember that argument against like public school.
I just like, someone got stabbed once, and it's like so,
I guess my point was I assumed that the family
was at least religious enough to send their kid to
a religious school, but maybe not. Either way. The fact

(39:11):
that they that it was like a pretty sex positive household, Um,
did either of you grow up in like households like that,
very religious households? No, like sex positive, not at all
sex negative. My mom was actually for as liberal as
she is. My mom is, or at least was at
the time, not so progressive about sex. Now. I talked

(39:34):
to her all the time about raw dog and dudes. No,
not really, I call your mother speaking. I call my mom.
You know what, maybe I'm going to regret the sentence
of it. I call my mom like basically anytime I
have a new sex partner of Like, Mom, can I
send you pit because like a dream world, I can

(39:58):
never I'm married and I can't. Really my mom is
so like if you go home with your husband, does
she make you sleep in separate bedrooms? We sleep in
the same bedroom. But like it's like I don't even it,
just doesn't want to hear it. Like she doesn't believe
in like birth control, like for married couples, Like she
thinks like she's that, like she thinks we should be

(40:19):
having kids already. Whish. I'm just like, oh my god,
my mom. My mom was so sex positive to the
point where I like she kind of like fucked me
up in the reverse way where there were multiple times
in high school I lost my virginity. I mean, I
talk about all the fucking time I do, I do,

(40:40):
I do, I do a whole fucking chow. But but
but all I had to say my mom approached me
several times before I lost my virginia and she was like, Oh,
you haven't lost your virginia? Are you sick? Like are
you Yeah? She was like, are you not doing it right?
Like why? Because she loved my mom love all of

(41:00):
my high school boyfriends to the point of like, are
you hitting on them? And she was like you should, yeah,
go for it, you know. And she but she was
also great with like she brought me to the doctor.
Anytime I would start dating someone, she would bring me
to a doctor to kind of just you know, remind
me that I could have sex. But she was I
don't know. I think my mom was like, Jamie, why

(41:20):
aren't you like, oh wild little slat. I was like,
I actually like reading to read. Okay, at the time,
I wasn't a reading slut, but now I'm a reading slut.
I'm not great. Uh yeah, So I feel I feel

(41:41):
lucky to have grown up in a household like that.
And then my dad, I think, sort of like Ladybird's dad,
uh was not. I mean, it would have been weird
if he was just like, you haven't sex, what's going on?
But he was like tolerant and cool and nice about it.
And as was her mom, which I think is really
the what Lady Bird and her mom do fight about,

(42:01):
and then what they don't fight about, I think is
really telling of both of their characters as well, because
you've seen a million times in movies, and then also
our real lives of being really scared to approach your
mom about sex stuff, and you know, and fear of
her judging you and being called a slut and things
like that. But the fact that no judgment has passed
in their conversation about sex, and the fact that they

(42:23):
don't fight about it, whereas they fight about all kinds
of other stuff. But the fact that no shame is
attached to Ladybird potentially having sex, I thought was really
awesome to see. I wonder if that's California. Yeah, because
you know, like you being from rural Pennsylvania, like there's
no way sex negative, Like I'm from a hate I'm Haitian,

(42:45):
I was born in Haiti, Like I'm from a very
immigrant background. Like that's very common for you know, parents
in those kinds of backgrounds to not be sex positive.
So but the people that I meet from California, particularly
San Francisco, of course, But like I'm imagining even play
is like Sacramento. I'm wondering if it is a little
bit more open and a little bit more there's more

(43:06):
education and people are more laid back about young people
having sex, not even like laid back, because there's no
reason to be bananas about it, just more understanding. I
guess accepting people because I thought that same California thing
when we see how chill the nuns are. I was like, oh,
these are some California nus. They're unborgettable. You did not

(43:32):
just oh my god, man, I man shout out to
the nuns having fun calendar Nuns. You ever have the
nuns having fun calendar? Everyone? Oh dude, yeah. For my
aunt is like really into the duns having fun calendar.
I thought that was making a joke. No check no,
check it out, like if you it's one of the

(43:52):
better Google image searches. You can be nuns having fun.
They're doing all sorts of stuff. They're they're at the beach,
they're they're they're climbing a I have a very specific
image of a bunch of nuns in a tree. Just
smile and you're like, great, this is they're having fun. Anyways,
the nuns are very chill in this movie, yes, which
I thought was a fun choice of the things that

(44:14):
you would assume in like a coming of age movie
would provide the most resistance. Kind of don't in this
movie where I you know, when it opened at a
religious school, I'm like, oh, there's going to be some
religion struggle in this, but that's not really where the
movie chooses to go um, which I thought was like
cool and smart. Yeah, the non representation in cinema is like,

(44:39):
you know these well, my nun representation as sisters, that's
all I've ever seen. And I'm just like, nuns are
always portrayed awesome and like their lives are awesome, And
I almost wonder if it's because they don't have to
men don't have to be attracted to them, so they
don't have to be represent it as anything but fun

(45:01):
and cool and care for you because they love one man.
And uh. Doubt my favorite movie of all time. It's
one of my favorites. I've seen Doubts so many. I
don't know why. It speaks to ye dark. It's very dark.
I watched it a couple of times a year. It
is in your head. It's it's an actor's film. I

(45:23):
love it. It's all five everyone across the board. Beautiful work.
It is beautiful acting in that film. Doubt passes the
Bechdel test easy, easy, because it's like Amy Adams and
Meryl Street design the word doubt back and forth. Doubt.
I got doubt. But don't doubt they have doubt in
men they have Well, yeah, I mean the job will

(45:46):
that passing the Bechtel test. We're going to talk about doubt.
We'll do the episode that's going to be a five
hour barn burner of a beck song cast episode. Is
because I feel like I talked about doubting every Yeah,
that's true. Dot is become our new Titanic almost although yeah,
we really talk about Titanic a lot. It's good taste.

(46:08):
As you can tell that it does. It's because she
talks to her mom. Titanic fair is way better than
you would think on almost every really trying to think
of what conversations has she have had that word about
her husband? Well, and then also at the beginning, it's
like the old lady and her granddaughter granddaughter talk. Kathy

(46:29):
Bates talks to other women there. So I mean, it's
not not the best, but it does weigh better than
you think. Back to Ladybird though, I couldn't help but
notice how many people you see crying in this movie,
and how several of them are men, Because you see
Danny crying, you see that priest crying, who's like directing

(46:49):
the school musical God, that was what a beautiful tragic character. Yeah,
I wish you maybe found out a little well. So
you see a scene where he's making to Ladybird's mom
in the psychiatric hospital, and you don't know exactly what's
going on, except you can kind of assume that he
is probably still grieving from the death of his son

(47:10):
and depressed. And I felt so like whenever she's like,
do you have a support system and he's like, what
do you mean, Like, do you have anyone you can
talk to when you feel this way? And he said no,
not really, I was like, Oh, my heart is breaking
for this man. And again it's just like the writing
of this movie is so good. Is we barely see
that character and he still we still have such a
strong emotional response to it. And it's really funny line too,

(47:33):
after after the drama show and then he's like they
didn't understand. It reminded me in my high school theater
director to mental health is addressed again whenever Ladybird goes
into Julie's house before they go to prom, and Julie
is just crying and she's like, what's happening? Why are
you crying? And she's like I'm just crying and she's

(47:54):
like what, and she's like, some people just aren't built happy.
And I was like, and I think that they dress
it with the father character too, Oh yeah, yeah, because
he's on antidepressant. He's an antidepressant, and then Lady Ver,
his mom is sensitive to it until sometimes she'll just
use it as sort of like an argument chip of
like your father is depressed, and stop, so stop being

(48:15):
such a fucking bummer, Like yeah, but I thought that
that was interesting too, of like, yeah, I guess we
do see like men dealing with I actually missed the
Julie being depressed part because she wasn't going to go
to prom, so I thought she was crying about that
and just didn't want to admit that. I wasn't sure
what that moment. That's what I thought that moment was interesting.
I interpreted it because of her I think that that's

(48:37):
easy to assume. But then when she says, you know,
some people just aren't built happy, I just I thought
she was maybe just having sort of a depressive episode,
and but I don't know, Yeah, maybe you're right. And
they got a prown together, yeah, and then they and
they do have a really nice time, and if she
had been depressed, I hope A Ladybird helped kind of
alleviate that for at least a little while. Did you

(48:58):
did you see the picture that was sort of like
circulated around of Greta growing directing that scene. I think so, yeah,
she were she wore a prom dress to direct that.
It's like, it's so nice. I wonder if she's like
super like weird girl. Well, granted Garwig is, because I personally,

(49:18):
I mean her most. I would say Frances Hall was
her big thing. And I cannot stand Frances Hall. I
didn't get it. Yeah, I'm like, who was this? What's
going on? Who was that movie before? And and I
couldn't stand her character and it I was like, what
is she doing? She's the whole dancing in the street

(49:38):
vibe to France. F Oh, I didn't. I think I
only watched the first twenty five minutes of it and
then we never went back to it. And that that
was really my only experience of Greta Gerwick prior to
knowing that she had made this movie. Like I knew
who she was, Like she's randomly in the JACKIEO biopic
for some reason, like so like I knew she was,

(49:58):
but I was like, oh, the Francis Holly, I don't
want to see this. But it turns out that she
is better than friends, like it was just it was
exciting and now I'm fully teamed credit. Actually, I think
she's brilliant. I would love to meet her one day.
I hope she is weird. I always she's got it
if you want to come on the podcast to Velvet. Sorry,

(50:20):
sorry about friends, I said about Francis, HA, when you
put out your art, that's what happens. Yeah. Yeah, I'm
sure there's people you can't imagine. There's many, but I'm
sure there's people out there who don't even like the
Bechdel cast. So they talked about doubt too much main

(50:41):
criticism and also it's very impressive given the sheer number
of characters we see in this movie, of how every
character has their moment pretty much. There wasn't like there
wasn't the symptom of too many characters and then we
just lose some, although I do wish we'd see more.
N You guys love this character. I loved I'm in Vivlin.

(51:04):
I do definitely hate Timothy chardon Ay. I like him
as an actor. I hate his character, but even he
gets a moment too of like he has a little
bit of depth, and you know, he's like he's a
piece of ship and as shitty the Ladybird, but Ladybird's
kind of shitty, and and he has a sick dad,
and it's like, you know, I don't know. The scene

(51:27):
where she loses her virginity to him and then she
thinks that he has also lost his virginity to her,
and she's like, wow, we took each other's flowers and
he's like, nah, I've had sex with maybe six other people.
I don't know. It's like shut up quipping so cool,
and then that and she's like, how could you not
even know if it's six people? I've definitely like said

(51:48):
that when I was like younger to be like how
do you not know the exact number and order? What's
wrong with you? But that really upsets her because she says,
like I thought we were like sharing the experien It's
like this my whole experience or my perception. This is
completely wrong. And then the scene right after that, her
mom picks her up and she on the verge of tears,
and her mom's like, what's wrong, and then she just

(52:10):
kind of sinks into her mom's embrace, and it's like,
you see this really tender moment between these two characters
who you're usually seeing fighting, but I like the balance
of them fighting but then also having like warm, tender
moments like that is just like, really, I don't know
it just it's my robot heart that usually doesn't respond
emotionally to things unless it's padding to inter Paddington two,

(52:36):
I really felt something there and I didn't do has
a perfect score and written to too is the best movie.
I haven't padding to everyone who can't see it. Kaitlin
just gave me a look. I've never known you to
have such a strong and you have strong opinions on

(52:56):
a lot of things, but nothing is stronger than padding to.
It's it's a live action except the bear Paddington. Paddington
Bear is c g I. The first movie is terrific.
The second movie is even better. It's it's so good

(53:16):
it is hard to believe, especially because the movies are
not marketed well because it's their children and family movies.
So I won't get into it. Just know that Paddington
two is the best movie of this century. So that's all. Yeah,
what's the story? Like, quick, quick, like, what is it about?
Paddington is a bear who lives in Peru. He gets
displaced by an earthquake. He has to move to London.

(53:37):
This is Paddington one. He's looking for a family to
take him in. And then this family finds him. The
father is like, oh, a bear. No, and mom is like, no,
we have to help this bear. It's an allegory for
immigration and racism and it's so good. And then they
take him in and they try to help him find
this explorer and they won't spoil it. And then Paddington two,

(53:58):
he's in the family. Now he gets wrongfully accused of
a crime. Hugh Grant gives the performance of a lifetime. Wow,
this is an epic movie. Yes, it's great. Yeah, yeah,
so check out Paddington and Paddington Too, hand Ladybirds and
The Shape of Water with My new boyfriend fishes. But

(54:19):
the movie is pretty good. It's a good love story.
But you go for the hot fish. The fish is hot,
so yeah. I mean, there's no there's truly no shortage
of good movies right now. Don't see the post. Don't
see that, really, skip the post. Oh no, but that
screenwriter is like a first time writer and she's so cool,
and I think that's I think that Steven Spielberg kind

(54:43):
of biffs it up by yeah, just by with a
bunch of just like the the story is not the problem.
It's just like the way it's shot. It's so oscar
baby in the way it looks, and you know, I
haven't heard it's just you know, one of the reasons
why I haven't gone to see it is because no
one is talking about it, Like I haven't heard any
would be like, you gotta go see the posts because
you don't. Tania amazing, no way, so good. Yeah, check

(55:08):
out our Eitania Patreon episode coming out. Um. One last
thing I wanted to say about Ladybird is that it's
a very white movie. You do see two people of
color characters, and Miguel and Shelly. The fact that those
characters are sort of to me, they felt sidelined. It
was kind of crazy that, you know, this is a
movie about Ladybird and her home life and her like

(55:33):
year leading up to leaving her family. The fact that
those are the two characters that we see the like
least of screen time wise, and they feel the least developed,
Like I don't know, I just feel, like I mentioned
this before, I just wish we had seen more of
those characters. I mean, I do think they were sidelined
and I don't think they were cast really great. They
didn't have like really great like even when they were

(55:55):
on camera, they didn't really shine to me. So I thought,
I am ad that maybe that was part of the problem,
like you don't really want to put them in more
because they're not really owning the scenes that they're in. So,
I mean, I thought for such a white movie to like,
I I didn't feel like it was that bad. Like
I really felt like, because it is it's a movie

(56:17):
about a white girl and her mother and their relationship.
I don't think it was about these characters. And I
think the way that they handled the race, the different
races is great because they didn't put them in scenes
and then make jokes about their race or you know,
or like the punchline isn't their race, you know? Or like,
And then the one time it does come up, Lady
Bird's immediately told the fun and they don't ignore it either.

(56:41):
They totally call out that they're different races. But it's
not like they don't make fun of it. They don't.
It's like it's it's well handled for this film. You know,
I don't know what the demographics of Sacramento that was
part of this, Like this is a very white movie,
but it's a period piece in a very specific place,
and maybe that's what it would have looked like. I'm
not totally sure, though. I was looking like you know

(57:04):
too that as at West Game all. Does anyone have
anything else you want to say about labor? I think
you just see Ladybird and it's a great movie. You
guys haven't seen it. It's it's like if you want
good storytelling, great acting by Laurie Metcalfe, and it's like
sweet and fun and easy to watch and like you

(57:24):
might cry at the end, maybe yeah. I had like
five different moments of you know, like a two second
cry where you're like yeah and then it's over. I
had a bunch of those. My cry was when they're
dropping Ladybird off at the airport and her mother refuses
to go out and say goodbye to her or even
look at her, and then she drives around the block
and you know, runs into the dad's arms crying. She's

(57:45):
gonna like, yeah, I thought that was beautiful. Yeah, it
really was. Yeah. So, as we alluded to earlier, this
movie for sure passes the Bechdel test. Ladybird's talking to
her mom, she's talking to Julie, she's talking to Jenna,
she talks to Shelley, talks to the cool nuns, nuns,
all kinds of characters, talks to her. She talks to
her guidance counselor wasn't her guidance counselor a black woman? Yes, yes,

(58:09):
I don't know if we ever it's very quick scene. Yeah,
I don't know if we ever learned her name. So
I don't know if I seen technically passes got it.
But that was a fun scene of like Lady Bears like,
I'm not sure if I have the grades to get
into a good school, and she like, last you do not,
so you know. Yeah. So they're often talking about school

(58:31):
or Sacramento or applying to colleges and all kinds of
stuff that are not about boys. It's amazing, but they
also do talk about boys, which is high school. Yeah.
There's also a sweet moment in the pool with Jenna
when Ladybird asked her what she wants to do in
Jenna's as she wants to be a mom, and I
was like, wow, I didn't see coming. That was sweet.
There's oh. I guess we didn't really have time to
talk about the Jenna character, but I thought that she

(58:53):
was another small character who is serviced pretty well by
this movie. I agree, where when we first see her,
it's like almost draw the conclusion of how the character
will be treated, which is like, oh, she's going to
be you know, villainized or whatever, and she is a
little bit and you know, and you see in the
way high school girls sometimes are, like, you see what
Jenna is going for, but then you do see those

(59:15):
like human moments, and I agree. And she's actually the
one who's hurt at the end of the movie because
Ladybird lies to her about where she and she says
something like, I don't even I can't even begin to
understand why someone would lie about that. So you could
see that Jenna was genuinely in it for the friendship
and they weren't friends anymore because of Ladybird's being a

(59:35):
stupid liar. R so I heard such she is. But
Gretta does an excellent job at like putting layers into
these characters for sure. I also liked that scene between
Ladybird and Julie where Julie's like, Jenna is a moron.
She's like, no, she's an ap calculu. She's like she's

(59:56):
a moron in a deeper sense. I also loved the
portrayal of a happy marriage that was financially unstable, you know,
like I was like the stressors of life, and yet
they managed to keep their marriage happy, which I like
and that much, and speaking to like the beta when

(01:00:17):
we've called them Beta Daddy at this point. But but
seeing a man in a marriage and is in the
beta role and is you know, quote unquote emasculated in
a sense when he can't find a job and he
is depressed. But I think when we see characters like that,
especially male characters, a lot um, it's like we're supposed
to believe, like and it's killing him. She wants to

(01:00:38):
be the alpha so bad, but this character doesn't. And
it's totally seems very much like Lori's. I mean, I
don't remember the name of her character, Marian. He's very
much Marian's emotional support and you can tell that she
respects him very much for that which I loved to
see a lot of troops that you see over and

(01:01:00):
over again in mainstream Hollywood movies are totally subverted in
this movie and it's just like really awesome to see.
With that, let us rate the movie on our nipple
scale zero to five nipples. We rate based on its
portrayal of women. I'm gonna give five nipples, I agree to. Yeah,
I give it five nipples. Yeah, five nipples never happened.

(01:01:23):
The characterization is really great, and yeah, I love a
flawed female protagonist. We don't get to see flawed female
protagonists enough, and there are a number of movies out
right now with very flawed female protagonists that even though
they're lying and doing you know, stuff that's fucked up,
the writing is there and you can see yourself in it.

(01:01:44):
Like watching this movie as a personal experience and I look, well, Charlotte,
thank you so much for being here. Thank you for
having me. Guys, I had so much fun talking about
this movie. Where can people find you online? Do you
have anything you'd like to plug? Yes? You can find
me on Twitter at I'm Charlotte Face, and then also

(01:02:04):
on Instagram I'm Charlotte face and I run a show
called Velvet where first Friday of every month at Copper
Still in Koreatown at eight thirty. It's a free show.
It's always great lineups and it's always a fun time.
And I host Special. It's going to be Thursday, February
fift at eight pm at Lyric Hyperion. Kate Berland is

(01:02:25):
on the show. Yeah, and it's it's called special because
we're doing long sets. You're like seeing material that they
would do if they had a special. Awesome. If you
love long sets of stand up com ny, check that out.
You can follow the Bacte Cast on all the social media.
You can go to well, you should rate and review

(01:02:47):
us on iTunes, and you should subscribe to our Patreon
ITTI like five dollars a month and you get to
bonus episodes every month of the Battle Cast. This month
you get Ionia and the Disaster Artists Wow Bio February. Also,
you should come to our live show. Oh yeah, what's up?
Los Angeles, California? Ever heard of it? Yeah? If you

(01:03:09):
live there or near there, we have a live show
on February twelve at eight thirty at the Nerdest show
Room at melt On Comic I'm so excited. We're doing
the Notebook Baby with past guests from our Butch casting
the Sundance episode. Caitlyn Gill will be there, will be there.
She's awesome, she's so funny. It's gonna be a great

(01:03:31):
live show. Come on down. Tickets are ten dollars and
we're going to have our brand new merch for sale there,
so merch Alert, gonna save on shipping. Yeah, get those stickers,
get some buttons, air save. Will be there. I want
to meet Yeah, and you can meet us to our
you know, your favorite celebrities, Caitlin and Jamie will be

(01:03:52):
there for you to meet and talk to. Our backup
dancers will be there. You've never heard our backup dancers before,
but they're always here. They're always dancing quietly. Yeah, So
come on dostat. Tickets are on sale. You can go
to bechdel cast dot com slash live and get your

(01:04:13):
tickets and we'll see you there. You see you there.
Thanks for listening, Thanks for being here, Charlotte. Have a
great time everyone, and goodbye by