Elon’s Barely Working Brain, End Workplace Drug Testing 05.22.23

In episode 1487, Jack and Miles are joined by author and host of Crime Writers On... and ...These Are Their Stories, Rebecca Lavoie, to discuss… True Crime And America Waking Up To The Fact That Cops Are Bad at Their Jobs, Elon Is A Human Sh*tpost, Workplace Drug Testing Needs To F*ck Right Off and more!

1. Workplace Drug Testing Needs To F*ck Right Off
2. Record number of U.S. workers test positive for cannabis, study shows
3. Companies are Getting Rid of Drug Tests Because They Can’t Find Enough Workers
4. The Bizarre History Of Workplace Drug Testing
5. REAGAN AIDES SPLIT ON DRUG TESTS
6. PRIVACY IN AMERICA: WORKPLACE DRUG TESTING
7. The thriving, legally questionable market for synthetic urine

LISTEN: Feeling Normal by Calibre

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello the Internet, and welcome to season two eighty eight,
Episode one of Deadly Say Guys. It's a production of iHeartRadio.
This is a podcast where we take a deep dive
into America's share consciousness. And it is Monday, May twenty second,
twenty twenty three. Where did the days go?

Speaker 2 (00:19):
I know, I know, I wish I knew what day
it was, but I don't. You said May twenty second,
May twenty second, just to confirm that. Okay, okay, just
it's hard for me to keep up with other days.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
Mayah, Where am I? What's the day again? What's the
day again? I'm sorry I didn't have to think.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Well, hold on, hold on, I have to scroll because
normally when we do it on Fridays and I go
to the tomorrow hyperlink, it's Saturday, and I have to
actually navigate to the twenty second.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
Here we go.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
It's May twenty second. You know what that means. It's
International Being You Day. National Solitaire Day. Shout out to
all the people on Windows like or kids in schools
on the computer library who love to play Solitaire like me.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
World Aloma Day. That's still a thing. Yeah, tall, turn
on the computer.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Yeah okay, oh, man, it's one of the great pastimes.
And then picking the designs like on the back of
the cards. I like those, see shelf myself. It's also
National Vanilla Pudding Day, so shout out to Rondasantish, National
Bio Musical Instrument Day and National Maritime Day.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
Was it vanilla pudding that he was finger blasting?

Speaker 2 (01:21):
I know it was some kind of cup plastic cup
pudding that he was using his fingers digital.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
He called it a digital spoon.

Speaker 2 (01:28):
I believe just to be a fancy but it's actually
a digital spoon. You mean, digit says in your fingers. Yes, yes,
Victor's telling us his chocolate.

Speaker 1 (01:38):
Okay, that's how I pictured it. Something about me and
Ron DeSantis were always locked locked in together, kind of
on the same page.

Speaker 3 (01:48):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:48):
My name is Jack O'Brien aka My Jack. Hosts the
t d Z. Your Jack supports the ge O p
My Jack drops the Daily double four Free. Your Jack
released on daily Wire for a fee. My Jack thighs
bigger than a bridge. Your jacks look like a little kids.
Jack plumper is larger than the chargers the whole team.

(02:10):
Your jacks they looking up scene. Jack's thighs are like supersized.
Your jacks look like two fris oh man. This courtesy
of Esbah Yeah, who said I could have kept going,
but we all get it. He got thick af thighs. Brother,
mm hm, I appreciate it. This is another rap song

(02:34):
that I was not familiar with, Mike Yeah by Mickey Appall. Yeah,
it's it's all, it's all, It's all just stupid. It's
all stupid. Miles Well, speaking of Miles, I'm thrilled to
be joined as always by my co host, mister Miles
Grad Miles Grand aka he.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
On the Floorida Tour would put in on his hand,
be in a fucking disgrace with trans writes into can okay,
that's about rock saying to shout out to.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
Race Act on the discord.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
We'll hit us with that wonderful tribe called Quest Award
Tour mash up where we reference Rond Loick. We got
it all, we got it all talented talented listeners. You
know that one really got me on a tour. Well, Miles,
we are thrilled to be joined by an author and
podcast host ye know from her shows Crime Writers on

(03:25):
the Netflix show You Can't make this up And these
are their Stories the Law and Order podcast, which I
believe I guessed it.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
On many years ago. Please welcome to this show, Rebecca Levoy.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
Where's my rap song? Come on?

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Where? What's your favorite?

Speaker 2 (03:45):
I would say, what's your favorite karaoke song?

Speaker 4 (03:47):
Oh? God, Kevin and I do love shack together. It's
oh something.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
If you see a fated sign at the side of
the road that says sixteen miles.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
To the.

Speaker 4 (03:58):
S, Yeah, that kind of me.

Speaker 2 (04:02):
I love.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
That's my favorite voice to do. Yeah, I gotta say
his his uh level of difficulty much lower than yours,
letting them.

Speaker 5 (04:11):
Off easy, send it like that, and I am singing.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
That high note I.

Speaker 4 (04:22):
Choose, like which girl I want to be?

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Man, you're like doing costume changes, switching between the two.

Speaker 4 (04:28):
Rip my ponytail around.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
She's like one of those singers, is one of the
one of the great voices. Just the pipes.

Speaker 4 (04:36):
Yeah, really, I'm just you pulling.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
You're pulling that off. My My hat's off to you.

Speaker 4 (04:43):
No, there's like a drunken component of Carrio. You know.
He doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
Yeah, people don't care.

Speaker 4 (04:49):
I mean they do, but they don't.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
Right. Where are you coming to us from?

Speaker 4 (04:52):
I live in New Hampshire if you can believe Hampshire. Yeah,
live for or.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Die, that's right.

Speaker 2 (04:58):
There a few times I hockey like a competitive hockey,
So I go to New Hampshire in the New England
area a lot. So the old man on the mountain
before it all it started crumbling.

Speaker 4 (05:08):
Oh ri ip old man.

Speaker 5 (05:10):
Yeah, yeah, you hear what happened up here in the
news around the old man in the mountain on the
anniversary the state legislator who compared it to nine to eleven.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
His face falling off was compared to nine to eleven. Yes,
it wasn't.

Speaker 2 (05:23):
Vandalism, right, it's like just natural erosion.

Speaker 4 (05:25):
No, it was a natural erosion.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
It was mother terrorism.

Speaker 5 (05:29):
Although my son Henry Nepo Baby podcaster put out a
version of his show today called who Did five three,
which is about that state legislator.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
Sounds very You've a reased episode of crime writers on
you were talking about his the impression he does of
you that cracked.

Speaker 4 (05:51):
Me up, which one is that it's.

Speaker 1 (05:53):
Like, uh, you know Bone Valley?

Speaker 4 (05:58):
Have you ever heard of Bone Valley?

Speaker 1 (06:02):
Which is a crime podcast, which.

Speaker 5 (06:03):
Is all I went around saying for like three months,
fucking work people listen to the damn show and now
it's winning awards, so it obviously worked. Whatever you got
the word val I'll own it. It's not a porno podcast,
even though it sounds like one. Actually pretty good.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah, Bone Valley really could be about the San Fernando
Valley's porn.

Speaker 4 (06:24):
It could.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
All right, Okay, well, Rebecca, we're going to get to
know you a little bit better in a moment. First,
we're going to tell our listeners a couple of the
things we're talking about. First of all, we're gonna pick
your brain about just true crime, the state of true crime,
what our obsession with true crime means. We will talk
about the amazing human ship post Elon Musk, because he's

(06:46):
just out here ship posting in reality. And we'll probably
talk about workplace drug testing, which I didn't realize was
invented by the Reagans. That wasn't a thing before and
in most other countries that are like, guess, not a
thing period. That's weird.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
I was so I was so nervous when you piss
tested me, when you first wanted me to like attention
to work with you on the pod.

Speaker 1 (07:08):
I didn't know that it was just like a I
was kink of mine. Well, and I'm also just glad.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
That like you were chilled, you clearly didn't say anything
the fact that's putting lemonade in the cup. Yeah, all right, cool,
looks good. Well, I think, uh, we're good.

Speaker 1 (07:22):
We're good here.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
Yeah, just take it to the lab really quick. And
you you turned your back and then you burked. I
think gross. All good, all that plenty more.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
But first, Rebecca, we like to ask our guests, what
is something from your search history that's revealing about who
you are?

Speaker 5 (07:39):
I have my search history right now. Why does my
dog eat grassed when he feels sick?

Speaker 1 (07:46):
Classic?

Speaker 4 (07:47):
I also have what does disavow mean?

Speaker 5 (07:52):
Which is it like one of those things where like
you're writing something or doing something and you're like, sure,
you one hundred percent know what a word means, but
then when you use it.

Speaker 4 (07:58):
You're like, am I using that right? And my fucking
stupid exactly exactly?

Speaker 5 (08:04):
Yeah, So I have Those were my two most recent
search terms, and they obviously go together very well.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
And was this just a casual text message where you
were using the word disavow?

Speaker 4 (08:15):
No?

Speaker 5 (08:15):
No, I actually did an event on Wednesday night with
uh I work on the my day job.

Speaker 4 (08:20):
I work in Hampshire Public Radio.

Speaker 5 (08:22):
We did bear Brook and we had an event and
I was hosting it and like I was talking about
somebody disavowing their role like in a wrongful conviction. But
I was like writing the script and I was like disavow.
I don't know, so I was, you know, I wasn't
gonna be free was I don't know it was. I
don't want to be stupid, so looked it up. Yeah,
it was right, it was right.

Speaker 4 (08:40):
I knew it was right.

Speaker 1 (08:42):
But you know, why wait?

Speaker 2 (08:44):
Why do I know dogs eat they eat the grass
to like help them vomit.

Speaker 5 (08:48):
Right, yes, but I have a dog that he gets
sick so often. He's a like wheat and terrier, very
sensitive stomach situation. And you know, so we're at the
point now Whe're like he just wants to go out
and need grass. Don't take him out them. And at
one point when he was he was young, we had
just mowed the lawn and he ate all the grass
on the moje lawn and they made a giant ball
in his stomach and he had to have surgery to

(09:09):
get it. Oh no, so I actually, but he's twelve
now and it's never occurred to me to like look
up why. I was just like, he's going to be dead,
and I, well then have looked it up. But no,
it's just because like they don't really know. Either it
makes them want to throw up or it sues their stomach,
but apparently it's not that bad for him unless they
eat right after you mow your lawn, which don't.

Speaker 2 (09:30):
You that, Yeah, don't just don't leave it all out
there for all you neat grass buffet, don't do that.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
Turns out I was right about disavow because I was like, uh,
maybe I've had it wrong exactly. It's responsibility or support.

Speaker 4 (09:44):
For right right.

Speaker 5 (09:46):
It's not like non plus, which literally everybody uses the
everybody yeah, to.

Speaker 1 (09:50):
The point that I think we can just all start
using no. No.

Speaker 5 (09:55):
I think actually I think the dictionary people actually just
allowed that. And that actually pisses me off because yeah, yeah, yeah,
I'm snob about stuff like that usually, except that, like
that's one where it's like, come on, get your shit together,
nonplust people, get your shit together.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
I don't like it, so I'll say I was nonplussed.

Speaker 4 (10:13):
Yes, yes, right, you cannot you cannot take any more.
You're non plussed out of your mind.

Speaker 1 (10:19):
So the yeah, the dictionary Oxford Dictionary has surprised and
confused so much that they're unsure how to react. As
the number one meaning and then number two of a
person not disconcerted, unperturbed. And this is informal North Americans.
They're just like, we gotta, we just gotta, like, let
the North Americans fuck this up.

Speaker 4 (10:41):
It's the dummy definition.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
Yeah, what is something that you think is overrated besides sandwiches? Yes? Wow?

Speaker 4 (10:52):
Quitting Twitter and indignation overrated?

Speaker 1 (10:56):
Yeah?

Speaker 5 (10:57):
Yeah you know why? Yeah, because no one noticed? Is
when you stop doing something, no one, no one notices. Yeah,
And like every social media platform sucks in its own
special way. Every I mean Elon obviously Extra sucks, which
I guess we're going to be talking about, but like
no one notices when you stop doing something. I've seen

(11:17):
a specific news organization that I may or may not
have a loose affiliation with, you know, quit in a.

Speaker 4 (11:22):
Very public way.

Speaker 5 (11:23):
My my news outlet did too, and I you know
didn't make us quit, you know, or the reporters of
that news organization quit. But I'm like, what an opportunity
you had when you're actually being talked about to do
something else with this besides just stop doing anything, right
and now, like you're not doing anything with it, Like
you could have raised money, you could have like top
people with journalism is but like when you're not doing anything,

(11:45):
nobody notices you're not doing anything. So I just think
that there's like taking your toy. Remember it happened with
Reddit like a bunch of years ago, Like what happened
with that? Nothing like nothing, So I don't know. I
just I just think that there's some like a little
bit of just like virtue signaling nothing burgeress in quitting
Twitter and indignation right now. I mean maybe someday it

(12:07):
will be important, but to me it's a little bit overrated.

Speaker 4 (12:10):
I'm sorry if either one of you did that. And
I just like, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (12:13):
It's like twelve to thirteen times a day about I'm
quitting Twitter. Yeah, each post is like that's it you've
done at this time, musk. But yeah, I guess the
fact that I've been doing that for three months now, probably.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
I'll never quit because I never thought I would have
this many followers and I like to look at the number.
Why would I do that now? At the top of
my game.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
I'm true, and may I say to the followers, you guys,
stop quitting because it's making our numbers go down. What
fuck that makes us sad? You're burning me?

Speaker 2 (12:50):
You burned me listeners who quit Twitter?

Speaker 1 (12:52):
My number went down, Like Jack.

Speaker 5 (12:54):
I was looking at your following number. You're like about
twice as many as me. Like I could fill like
a small college football stadium, you could feel like a
big college football stadium. Like you couldn't like show up
somewhere and like forty five thousand people would show up,
right right, that's true.

Speaker 1 (13:11):
Yeah, they're all very loyal too.

Speaker 5 (13:13):
And they're all real people.

Speaker 1 (13:17):
The bonds of mine. Yeah, them robots and they're all
they're all real. Yeah, they love me like family members.
I have a forty five thousand person family.

Speaker 5 (13:28):
They're not going to hang out flags in front of
their house after they graduate. You.

Speaker 2 (13:33):
It's weird how I can get twelve thousand of them
to say the exact same thing to me at the
same time. Yeah, what's there? That's how that's all on
the same page.

Speaker 1 (13:41):
They are. Wait, and then sandwiches are overrated? You just
kind of skip past that.

Speaker 4 (13:46):
Yeah, I sandwiches to bear the lead.

Speaker 1 (13:49):
Yeah, all sandwiches.

Speaker 5 (13:51):
Sandwiches, well, not real cheese, obviously.

Speaker 1 (13:55):
I like, obvious, obviously not one of the three most
popular sandwiches.

Speaker 5 (14:00):
The world's greatest hangover food is obviously not overrated. Okay, okay,
but yeah, I don't get I just I've never understood
like the obsession with sandwiches. I know people love sandwiches
for me personally, sure, No, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (14:15):
It's like the mania, like sandwich mania that's overrated or I.

Speaker 5 (14:19):
Just I just I don't understand, like when people are like, oh,
we're going to bring in lunch for this meeting, bringing
in sandwiches, and everyone's like yeah, and I'm like yeah,
right right, pizza, yeah, sandwiches. No, Like it's just the
stuff in the middle is a good part, and like
I have to get through the ship on the outside
to get to.

Speaker 4 (14:35):
Stuff in the middle.

Speaker 2 (14:36):
You're almost like Trump with pizza, You're like, nah, not,
the bread is just the top part.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
Scrape it off.

Speaker 4 (14:44):
Thank you, Thank you for that very complimentary comparison.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
I get that, look, I get the sort of singular
focus though it's just sort of like no, no, no,
that's filler. You want the meats and the cheeses right there.

Speaker 5 (14:57):
That's the fucking I'm just not a huge, huge bread person.
I mean, I'm not like anti carbs. I fucking love carbs,
but I'm not like when people who's.

Speaker 4 (15:05):
Like, I love bread, right, and then people are.

Speaker 5 (15:07):
Always like, you'll love it if you have the bread
I make, And then I'm like, no, one fucking won't,
Like I don't really, It's like, it's just it's just bread.
It's just like it's not a special. It's just my opinion.
It's my opinion. Not everybody agrees.

Speaker 4 (15:21):
It's okay.

Speaker 5 (15:21):
I have had I have had great bread. Get me,
don't get me wrong. There is bread it's better than
other bread.

Speaker 4 (15:26):
I believe that.

Speaker 1 (15:27):
Have you tried the they there's this thing that I
have out here in La called sliced bread where they yeah, yeah,
it's not just one big hunk. It's really the greatest thing.

Speaker 4 (15:40):
It doesn't come out of a stone oven. It's not artisanal.

Speaker 1 (15:43):
Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 2 (15:46):
Wonder that's it? That's good stuff. Have you tried to
wonder the stuff?

Speaker 1 (15:51):
Slice bread gets so much credit from people all the time.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
Have you seen like those clips when like Americans are
amazed at like the bread slicers in Europe when you
go to a store and like, oh, there's like I've
just seen a genre of video, like Americans whose minds
are blown buying like a loaf of bread at a
European grocery store that like you can then take to
a machine that just like slices it fresh.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
Yeah. I was just gonna say coffee. Yeah you know, yeah,
you just loaded in.

Speaker 2 (16:17):
I might be in Germany or something like that, and
it just like cleanly just slices it up, so you
have like good like your loaf is actually as fresh
as possible or whatever, and.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
Wow, it just slices it right here. And I'm like,
and I watched it.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
I'm like, come on, man, act like you're I'm like,
it's just slices, right.

Speaker 5 (16:32):
The chill forgot Yeah yeah, act like you've been here.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
That shit does make it Like grinding your coffee beans
right before you brew the coffee really does make a difference.
I'm sure, Like, now now I want the I want
a unsliced wonderbread loaf.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
Something that even thank you, I'll take it home just
yeah with your friend and I have just doing the
most uneven slices.

Speaker 5 (17:01):
You ever tried to cut wonderbread or like with a knife,
you can't do it.

Speaker 1 (17:04):
It's just like but yeah, yeah, like a non Newtonian substances.
Neither air is it's neither gas nor solid nor liquid. Yes, yeah,
the knife does know what to do with it. What
is something that you think is underrated?

Speaker 4 (17:20):
Oh it's easy HGTV underage. So here's the thing, Like,
how many people watch Succession?

Speaker 1 (17:28):
Really?

Speaker 5 (17:28):
I watched Succession, don't get me wrong, but like a
couple million people watch it when it's on, and then
a couple of million people watch it later. Right, that's it.
Forty four million people watch HGTV.

Speaker 4 (17:40):
I'm not kidding.

Speaker 5 (17:41):
Like, this is a show called Rock the Block. That's
like they're one of their like big competition like prestige shows.
Fourteen million people fucking watch that show. And there's no
like think pieces about that shit.

Speaker 4 (17:54):
None. Everybody watches HGTV.

Speaker 5 (17:58):
Everybody has seen flip Flock, everybody has seen House Hunters,
everybody has seen love It or list it, and you
talk about it, you can talk about it with anyone,
and everyone is conversant in HGTV and there's no fucking
thing pieces about it. And it makes me crazy, it's
the best.

Speaker 4 (18:18):
I think it's the best. Oh yeah.

Speaker 5 (18:19):
So it's basically like it's kind of an all stars
type show where they bring on hosts of other shows
and they have four very expensive houses, and over a
period of six weeks they have them compete room by
room to like do your best kitchen, do your best
living room, do your best whatever, and then at the end,
one of the team's wins, and then they name the

(18:40):
block after that team. It's just it's a very like
low stakes thing where it's just like really fun media.
Oh yeah, yeah, basically it's basically aspirational, but it's just
just like you know, but I'll tell you it's it's
it's one of the best edited because HGTV's editing is
really frustrating, but it's one of the best edited shows
that they make, which was makes a good sense.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
Right right right. I was just also reading like kind
of I think piece about HGTV. But it's impact on
American homes and the like just monotone aesthetic that exists
now in like homes because everyone has everyone's watching the
same fucking way of flipping house that like like that
we've come to known that like weird gray Property Brothers

(19:24):
or like that great like but specifically how that floor
has taken over the United States thanks to like HGTV
type shows.

Speaker 4 (19:31):
And I was like, yeah, that's theres awful. It really
is that, like that like light gray vinyl thing and.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
Look, no shade.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
If that's the floor you got, just if you love it.

Speaker 4 (19:41):
Love it, if you love it, but you're not gonna
love it, and.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
Like I would, it would.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
And it's true though that you say, like it's I've
noticed even like when I've babysat like my young nieces
or nephews, I could put House.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
Hunters on and they fuck with it.

Speaker 2 (19:56):
Yeah, even like little kids are like like they're just
like watching. I'm like, is this interesting to you? They're
like they're like introduce They're all different rooms. Yeah, like
different rooms in another country.

Speaker 5 (20:07):
I'm like, okay, cool, Yeah, international, super fun, international, super fun.
It's like, did you want to live in the house
that your boyfriend wants, which is twelve thousand dollars over budget?
Do you want to live in the house that is
exactly in budget but horribly disappointing, or do you want
to live in the hovel by the beach that you
have to piss outside.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
Which one do you want?

Speaker 1 (20:26):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (20:27):
Always the spectrum so wacky, yeah, yeah, yeah. And it
also helps for people who like if you're like, man,
I got to get out of the US watch House
Hunters and you're like, that's the rent over there, right,
like the fuck, yeah, I'm going to live in Lisbon.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
There you go.

Speaker 2 (20:41):
All right, let's take a quick break and we'll be
right back. And we're back.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
We're back, And Rebecca, you you spend a lot of
time talking about writing about true crime as a genre,
which is and it's in the news now NPR is
debunking like the wave of fentanyl poisonings we were seeing
from police.

Speaker 4 (21:16):
Did you scare quotes around fentanyl poisoning?

Speaker 1 (21:19):
Yes, yes, always really assume implied scare quotes around police
and fentanyl.

Speaker 4 (21:25):
Poisoning around police and just about anything.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
Right exactly. So that's kind of what I wanted to
just get your Like I've talked about this before on
the show, but it does feel like the thing that
is different about true crime just narratively, Like obviously the
big differences that like between I grew up on crime
shows and you know what like Law and Order or

(21:48):
you know, movie crime movies where the police were at
least competent, where there was a competent police officer who
was like pushing back against the corruption and you know, inefficiencies,
and then like true crime, the main myth that it
seems to be debunking as a genre is that the

(22:11):
police are ever competent and ever like there's so rarely
like that the default seems to be. And then the
police fucked this up, Like there were all these people
who should have been interviewed, like all these things that
your response as a rational human being would be like, oh, well,

(22:34):
you'd't want to talk to that person or you'd want
to follow that line of reasoning, and the police just
get it wrong, like time after time after time, which
I think adds to the stakes of true crime because
it kind of opens people up to a reality where
like the police aren't actually there to keep us safe,

(22:54):
and so the world is much more dangerous in that respect,
or at least it's like much less you know, yeah,
I guess more dangerous and less safe than like there's
not this default that we've always been told there is
with like you just call the police and they'll they'll
handle it, and they'll make it right, Like, do you
think of that as kind of a constant in true

(23:17):
crime or like at least a narrative difference that you
see repeatedly happening.

Speaker 4 (23:23):
Well, it's certainly a narrative difference to white people. It's
not a narrative difference to people of color who've never
trusted the cops very rightly because they know that they've
been getting it wrong forever and ever and ever.

Speaker 5 (23:33):
But yeah, So the couple things going on. One is
obviously police corruption. Police misconduct has obviously been sort of
unveiled more in the last few years, and journalism is
starting to finally catch up by not just taking the
police at their word when they get a statement from
the cops.

Speaker 4 (23:50):
They don't just print it or they don't just say
police say X. They do.

Speaker 5 (23:54):
Still, don't get me wrong, it happens a lot on
TV news, It happens a lot in like quick turn stories,
but it doesn't happened times.

Speaker 4 (24:01):
It doesn't happen all the time. It's happening.

Speaker 5 (24:03):
It's happening there there is now journalism that questions it.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen. But the other thing
that is now sort of being unveiled is aside from
misconduct and all that stuff, is that police are trained
to win and close cases and not get to the truth.
And it's that training and it's that system that leads

(24:26):
to mistakes and misconduct. And you know, I have a
very clear point of view on this that like some
people don't agree with. It's like people think, like, you
know what, he's not a bad guy. He woke up
and he wouldn't wake up this morning thinking I'm gonna
get the wrong guy and put the wrong guy in prison.
This is just the way he was trained in the
way the system works. The bottom line is if you
are systemically put in the wrong guy in prison, even

(24:48):
if you're like a good uncle, you are actually a
bad guy.

Speaker 4 (24:51):
I mean, that's just like the way that it works.

Speaker 5 (24:53):
But you know, you are trained in the retechnique, You're
gonna use the retechnique and you're gonna put the wrong
people in prison. That's the way that it is. And
it does bring me a lot of satisfaction as somebody
who I don't really write anymore, but I used to
write true crime books that were literally the narrative of
like the police did the investigation and got it right
and put the person away. But that was like two

(25:14):
thousand and seven, two thousand and eight. Gives me a
tremendous amount of satisfaction to disavow the kind of true
crime shit that I used to write, because it's not real.
It's just not I mean, there are earnest good investigations,
but there are also a shit ton of very very
bad investigations that are completely predicated on closure and getting

(25:37):
the win.

Speaker 4 (25:38):
And that's what all of that is about.

Speaker 1 (25:40):
And does the world of policing seem to be every
instance where the police are criticized, the police response seems
to be belligerents? Like, are there examples where police forces
are actually being like, okay, the read technique And if
you could explain what the red technique is that it
would be helpful, I think to Yeah.

Speaker 4 (26:00):
The retechnique is an interrogation technique that has been scientifically
shown to elicit false confessions again and again and again.
And interestingly, the retechnique was invented by this guy named
John Reid the time that he used it, where it
was actually that the first time he used it that
it became the model for the technique he would then develop.

(26:22):
That case ended up being a false confession case.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
It works so good, you can't.

Speaker 5 (26:28):
Make this shit up. You can't make this shit up.
So that technique is actually now like a training course.
It's called like the read course, and police departments use
it all over the country and they say that they've
developed it, they've tweaked it over time. Police officers are
supposed to use it in the way that they say
and that they've they've you know, softened the techniques over time.
But basically what it is is they put the it

(26:51):
specifically and really is effective on vulnerable people, on young people,
on people with you know, mental illness, on people with
intellectual delay. Think about Brandon Dacy for making a murderer
for instance. Basically, what they do is they put people
in a position where they believe they are helping the police.
They lie to them, they give them bad information, they
say you're on video doing X y Z, and they

(27:13):
basically put you in a position where you believe if
you say something, you're going to be in a better situation.

Speaker 3 (27:18):
You know.

Speaker 5 (27:18):
And they also do a thing where they don't they
don't record the first twelve hours of your interrogation. They
only record the final hour where they've finally sort of
broken you.

Speaker 4 (27:29):
And then they have this thing on tape and they go, look,
he confessed on tape. What are you talking about?

Speaker 1 (27:32):
He did it?

Speaker 4 (27:33):
Who would ever confess on tape? But they didn't do it.
That's the Rea technique.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
Even though for twelve hours I said, you're never going
to be able to see wrestling again or go home
unless you say this.

Speaker 5 (27:41):
Exactly or for twelve hours they say, come on, we
all you know, it's like, if you just tell us this,
you're helping us and you're going to maybe we'll even
be able to get you a deal because that we'll.

Speaker 4 (27:52):
Figure something out.

Speaker 5 (27:52):
You know, you'll be able to have dinner, You'll be
able to go home and sleep in your own bed tonight.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
You know.

Speaker 4 (27:57):
It's like that's that's what That's what it's all about.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
And are are are you seeing any like it? I
think people are maybe getting more exposure to shit like this,
and like I guess on one of our sister podcasts,
Behind the Bastard's about this guy, David Grossman, the director
of the Killology Research Group that is like goes around
and gives these speeches to police about how they should

(28:22):
like feel comfortable killing people who make them scared. Essentially,
Like there's all these just shockingly morally bankrupt training practices
and just general practices in how police go about doing
their jobs.

Speaker 5 (28:38):
Like it, Yeah, do you guys see Killing County on Netflix?
This documentary Killing County. Colin Kaepernick's film company made it.
It's about the county where he's from. And there's a
shocking piece of footage and they're not shocking, that's surprising,
but shocking. I think it's the sheriff is talking to
the department and he's been basically in a training saying

(29:02):
that it is better for the department to kill someone
than wound them because if you kill them, they can't
sue you, essentially what he says.

Speaker 4 (29:11):
Or if it's on.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Hulu, right it's about Bakersfield.

Speaker 5 (29:14):
Yes, I think, oh, you're right, Yeah, Okay, shocking. It's
like it's like and that's like if that is you
know that he's not the only cop in the world who,
right is walking around this way right.

Speaker 2 (29:27):
Right to think about the payouts too, And I'm like, yoh,
pay that claim if you wound someone or.

Speaker 5 (29:33):
Or just arrest them or whatever. It's like, you know,
it's just cheaper and quicker and cleaner.

Speaker 4 (29:38):
So yeah, but I.

Speaker 1 (29:40):
Mean we we've seen some political successes with like I mean,
locally in LA there were some local elections where people
voted against increasing the police budget. You know that Jacksonville
just had kind of a not a like anti police
or police reformists, can it? But somebody who is they

(30:01):
were trying to paint as like a Black Lives Matter,
anti police supporter, and people voted for her. Anyways, I'm
just like wondering, is all the true crime that people
are watching? Do you think changing anything? Or are the
police just going to like kind of hunker down and
you know, respond with belligerents like we've seen them do

(30:22):
time after a time.

Speaker 5 (30:23):
I think it's going to take a generation, to be
completely honest with you, I think it's going to be
like like the kids of consumers, because it's like there's
a wave of like you know, and I don't want
to be gross about it, but like there's a there
are millions of like middle class Midwestern women who now

(30:43):
know what Brady violations are, who never who never thought
about it before because they listened to like cereal and
undisclosed and like it dark and shit right, So so
like their kids might be like hearing a little bit
of their outrage, and like some of their kids are
going to grow up and become lawyers or whatever. So
I think it's going to be gen generational. I'll tell
you the elected officials thing is tough. These election cycles

(31:06):
are short. The thing that has made a huge difference
in cities and communities and states is conviction integrity units.
Like Philadelphia has a conviction in tygrena with this guy
Larry Krasner. What happens when there's a conviction integrity unit
and shit starts getting overturned, people start getting out of prison,
then there's a lot of political pressure to start looking

(31:27):
at the system that put people there because it's embarrassing
and the cities have to start writing big checks. So
getting conviction integrity units set up, not only does it
actually get people out of prison, which is the result
you want, but also it creates like a bubble of
pressure that you can't ignore because it's just there. So

(31:48):
I think that's one of the most effective changes that
I've seen happen politically, more so than electing somebody. Also,
like in La you had that sheriff who pretended he
was a reformist and then ended up being like a bad.

Speaker 4 (31:59):
Guy right in.

Speaker 5 (32:01):
Yeah, so you know, just election cycles are quick. People
say what they're going to say and then they can't
actually do anything when they're elected. But yeah, I think conviction,
integrity and is I think that's where it's at, right.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
I also wonder if we're going to see it, like
I see it bleed over into like how crime and
punishment are portrayed in TV and film in general, like
just this kind of new, newer realization. Like I think
when when I was a kid, the like standard thing
that writers had to contend with is like a constant
question of like why wouldn't they just call the cops

(32:31):
like that, you know, like that that would solve everything.
And now obviously like that isn't is no longer the case,
I'd imagine, But I just I wonder if we'll see
less and less movies that are where it's just like, yeah,
so it's a it's a cop, and so we can
assume they're kind of cool and trying to solve crimes.

Speaker 5 (32:54):
Yeah No, I don't think so. I mean, if you're
watching the New Law and Order, there's like a lot
of they're handling it very poorly, by the way, the
new Law and Order, they're very much like the very beginning.
When I first came back, it was like, man, we
just you know, things are changing, man. And then in
episode two it was like, we got to stand up
for our brothers.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
They're under attack.

Speaker 5 (33:11):
Yeah, like wild, Yeah, they went from fucking red haired
freak with the protest. I mean they constantly talk about
it on the show, but then they just behave exactly
as abominably as it was on the show.

Speaker 4 (33:25):
It's pretty wild.

Speaker 2 (33:26):
Yeah, it seems like a lot of places are like
they All they did was just kind of go into hibernation,
like in the fall of twenty twenty, when a lot
of people like, you know what, like live PD might
be a mistake of a show, folks or sorry. And
then it's like right back before we started. It's like,
just wait a fucking a couple of seconds, right, We'll
come back, Brooklyn nine nine will be back.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
Yeah, yeah, all right, Well, let's talk about Elon real quick.
Oh my god, did a CNBC interview at the end
of last week, and you know what we've seen from
his Twitter persona appears to have transferred over to his
actual human body persona because yeah, yeah, he's just full,

(34:06):
full blown.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
He's just a human four chan shit post basically, and
he really let his freak flag fly in that interview.
And by freak flag, I mean swastika's because man, a
lot of the interview made ways like around this is
like incessant need to defend the like verified Nazi shooter
from Alan, Texas. You know, the guy with like the

(34:29):
all the Nazi tattoos and the talk of loving Nazis
and how he'd rather be a Nazi than act black.
When he posted that meme, like he let everybody know
very clearly, you know where he stood on things, what
his perspective was. Anyway, Elon, he goes off about how
despite all of the evidence and even the shooter's own words,
it's not right to call this like a white supremacist act.

Speaker 1 (34:50):
So let me let me just play this.

Speaker 2 (34:51):
He's he's gonna start off by talking about why he's
like dubious and you can just watch his like brain
start melting.

Speaker 3 (35:00):
And the evidence for that was some obscure Russian website
that no one's ever heard of that had no followers,
and the company that found this is Belling Cat, And
do you know what bella Cat does. Ops.

Speaker 6 (35:18):
I couldn't really even follow exactly what it was you
were trying to express there, So that's part why I
was curious.

Speaker 3 (35:24):
But I'm saying that I thought that the ascribing a
two whites premacy was bullshit. Okay, and and uh and
and and and that the information for that came from
an obscure Russian website and was somehow magically found by Bellancat,
which is a company that does.

Speaker 2 (35:40):
Okay, so enough about that.

Speaker 4 (35:44):
Who is the reporter going right? Was he just a
reflexively bad thing to say?

Speaker 2 (35:50):
Yeah, I even though he did kind of follow up,
he's like, look, I only say that because I don't
know what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
He did, like, I don't know what you're trying to
see right now, but yeah, change your reflex.

Speaker 4 (36:00):
Do the barbar like huh, right to change the reflex, dude,
change it.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
It's better to just be like a Honestly, it'll force
the person to really have to explain ah or say nothing, right,
not that. But yeah, again, so he's saying belling Cat,
which does you know real investigative journalism, they're saying they
do psyops.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
And it's bullshit.

Speaker 2 (36:26):
It's bullshit that they're trying to say that this is
a white supremacist.

Speaker 5 (36:29):
What is his horse in this race? Aside from being
a white supremacist himself, What is it? What is his
horse in this particular?

Speaker 2 (36:36):
I think probably did not give too much momentum to
the not even narrative to the reality of increasing like
extremist violence and the like that these people exist and
they are they're acting out their ideologies in real physical
space violently, because I think I don't know if he's
trying to thread this needle he's like saying, like, I
don't know if he's like it was a white supremacist

(36:58):
reason why he shot those people. It might just be
that he was like a white supremacist and shop It's
like really not clear. But he's definitely trying to like
cape for like white supremacy in this very bizarre way
that's not even really clear to even the interviewer, who was.

Speaker 4 (37:13):
Like, okay, right, you know your interviewer is like right.

Speaker 2 (37:17):
Right, right, right, right right, because you know Hitler was
correct about what he said, right right, right right and everything.

Speaker 5 (37:24):
Oh my god, that's gonna be the clip you're going
to share on social media.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
No, absolutely not so again it's a very frustrating interview
because he is truly just like lost in the sauce
his face when he was like trying to even explain
like the logic path of like this Russian account and
belling cats, It's like he was trying to like do
like a thread on at thread unrolled, like please dude,

(37:50):
please unroll this Twitter thread in my brain so I
can go find like the precise clapback reply that I
need in here. And it's a shame that this didn't
get like a ton of coverage. I mean, you got
some coverage, but like talking about the man that owns
fucking Twitter is out here showing you how vile his
fucking beliefs are, like in real and like in such
a even a way, like I don't know why I'm mad.

(38:10):
I'm like, it's he's not even doing it elegantly. It's
just like it's just like the raw stupidity of it.
It just like makes it even more and more frustrating
to see. And again it haves to be like right rightops.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Yeah, the I mean, how did they not have support
for the claim that like they knew he was going
to try to debunk rather than just being you know, yeah, yeah,
I mean like, I don't even know what you're saying.

Speaker 5 (38:38):
Well, now, SA just unroll this a little bit because
I just don't understand. So was was he even being
asked about this? Because this spread on Twitter?

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Like?

Speaker 4 (38:46):
Why is this even something he's talking about?

Speaker 2 (38:49):
He's been like he because he himself has been retweeting
other accounts that are.

Speaker 4 (38:53):
Catching God God.

Speaker 5 (38:56):
So he's now like he's now like pot committed to
this like situation where he has to defend He like
why are.

Speaker 2 (39:02):
You Yeah, he's like, why are you using your platform
to like I think, why are these even people? And
then he's like, well, he's like, well, where did their
evidence come from that they were white supremacists?

Speaker 1 (39:09):
The guy has a say off company swastika tattoos on
his arm. Yeah, literally, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
They he may have had his tattoo, artists may have
had Glackhomas was trying to make a plus sign.

Speaker 1 (39:19):
I don't know. We just don't help.

Speaker 2 (39:22):
But like the fact that that the bolts the bolts
his other tattoo or SS bolts, Yes.

Speaker 4 (39:28):
No, those are Celtic runes.

Speaker 2 (39:30):
You know, yeah, exactly. No, he's a he's a Journeyman
Electrician and the ib E w's a high voltage logo,
Like what the fuck up again? And I think the
reason why this guy was caught off on CNBC is
because they were on Stonks TV, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
They weren't on MSNBC.

Speaker 2 (39:49):
He wasn't talking like Ben Collins or something like someone
who's like knows, like it's very well versed in all this,
you know.

Speaker 5 (39:55):
But Ben Collins is a great example of why I
think it is overrated to leave twittered indignation. Like he's
a great example of why.

Speaker 4 (40:05):
No, he's there and if he left, like, no one
would ever see a ship, right.

Speaker 2 (40:10):
He's always there, just dunk on people and exactly always
like like help people who are not like terminally online
like some of us understand like what is actually being
spoken about?

Speaker 1 (40:21):
So anyway, again, this interview.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
Was basically on cn CNBC, so they're like Then he
eventually gets to the money part, which is another really
interesting moment in this interview. He said, the big question
is like for people who love Stonks like Tesla and stuff,
He's like, what the fuck's going on with like Tesla
shares and like the way you're running Twitter because the
businesses are interconnected, whether you like it or not. And

(40:43):
He's like, and if you keep turning Twitter into like
an ad repelling website equivalent of like Christall knocked, Like
what are you going to how are you going to
keep people's money moving? Like what do you say to
these people who are actually worried about the ship that
you post and its effect on the financials of everything?

Speaker 1 (41:00):
This answer is fucking even.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
I'm just gonna play the whole thing because it's this
is a very like this man's brain.

Speaker 4 (41:09):
I I don't even know I'm salad servant.

Speaker 6 (41:12):
Yeah, god no, I don't want to at all, but
I'm what I'm trying even came up though in the
annual meeting. I mean, you know, do your tweets hurt
the company? Are there Tesla owners just saying I don't
agree with his political position because and I know it
because he shares so much of it, or their advertisers
on Twitter that Linda Yakarna will come and say you
gotta stop, man, or you know, I can't get these

(41:33):
ads because of some of the things you tweet.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
Pause paws buzz. He's just looking off into the middle distance, booting.
Does you find the right.

Speaker 2 (41:47):
Mean, you know, I'm reminded of uh uh.

Speaker 3 (41:52):
Bone Valley seeing the Princess Bride, great movie where he
confronts the person who killed his father. Okay, he says,
offer me money.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
Literally, it's not what he says.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
I don't care. See, you just don't care. Offer me money.

Speaker 6 (42:24):
You want to share what you have to say.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
I'll say what I want to say, and if if
if the consequence of that is losing money.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
So be it.

Speaker 5 (42:32):
Has he ever seen that fucking movie? That's literally not
he says, my name is in Eniggo Montor. I mean
like literally everybody knows that.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Offer me money off. It's like, I don't understand. He's
basically replying in like gift form. Gift form, Yeah, you
know what I mean. It's like, what do you say
about that princess Brian dot gif? It took him a
while to find it. He was my god, the he
racked his brain for the dumbest response. I mean, truly

(43:04):
does he have like an.

Speaker 1 (43:06):
Early kind of trial version of neuralink going like looked
up to Twitter and like that's just how badly it works,
And he.

Speaker 2 (43:13):
Was just going through seen seconds to respond. That was
a thirteen second fucking pause he took to say, I'm
reminded of a scene from Princess Bride.

Speaker 1 (43:23):
What offer me money? Offer me power? I mean that
couldn't have been the answer that thes were looking for.

Speaker 5 (43:31):
How fucking Austin would have been because I'm reminded of
a scene from Princess Bride where in rodents of unusual side.

Speaker 2 (43:44):
I mean, it's I think it's also just too these people,
especially billionaires, right, they're never in environments where people press
them or ask follow up questions, so when they are,
it's like a disorienting experience for them. The beginning of
the first clip where I talked to, where he's talking
about billing running, bailing, cat running, syops, when he's like
when the the journalists asking very basic questions of his

(44:05):
like like twitter retweets, he's also like, almost, I'll just
play this other section because it truly shows like he
is not used to being held to account for fucking anything.

Speaker 4 (44:14):
I can't get enough of this.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
Keep going there, and Alan Texas, you say something like
it might be.

Speaker 6 (44:22):
A bad psyop. I'm not quite sure what she meant.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
But.

Speaker 3 (44:28):
Oh, in that particular case, uh, there was a somehow
that that's not not not that the that people were killed,
but the it was I think incorrectly.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
Like super killed.

Speaker 2 (44:49):
He he his his body language like you know, I'm
not I'm no body language expert, although I do testify
at trials as an expert.

Speaker 4 (44:58):
Very scientifically proved and to be like legit.

Speaker 2 (45:01):
But it's just interesting how he he like goes he's
starting like this, and then he just really does get
small and he's like, oh, right, this.

Speaker 1 (45:08):
Thing I did a side, Well it's what I didn't.
He like tilts his head to the side like a
dog that like you just spoke a full sentence to
and the dog doesn't like understand what you're saying. And
then another pause, another pause, and then oh.

Speaker 5 (45:28):
That So when you were first talking about this psych
was coming on the show, I didn't know what we
were gonna be talking about, and I just.

Speaker 4 (45:34):
Quickly googled Elon musk C NBC. All of the.

Speaker 5 (45:38):
Top headlines I see are Elon must tells the NBC
he's now up to six hours of sleep a night.
That was the takeaway from this contract.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
What because the mains true media worships and the foreheads
just want them to be Tony Stark real real Tony Stark.
That's what they are there too, you know, play a
role and a role that the mainstream media isn't interested
in is like massive billionaire thought leader who is also

(46:10):
a Nazi. Like they erased that part of Henry Ford's
story for many years, right, you know.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
And also like that's not a good ad for his
mental elasticity for someone who supposedly is such a brilliant
I'm like, this guy took thirteen seconds to say this
reminds me of the Princess Bride.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
I don't know, and.

Speaker 4 (46:28):
Then and then didn't get the right line that everybody knows.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
Offer me the thing I don't care.

Speaker 4 (46:37):
I want in Nego Montoya.

Speaker 2 (46:40):
Yeah, I think there was this character a Negro Toyota and.

Speaker 1 (46:46):
What he said? What anyway, So Emerald boy is back
at it.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
But yeah, shout out to everybody who was focused on
the six hours of sleep park.

Speaker 1 (46:56):
Oh my god, he needs more apparently, because he's there's
a lot of a lot of years spinning without any
anything coming out. All right, let's take a quick break
and we'll be right back. And we're back. And it

(47:24):
was recently announced that the percentage of American workers testing
positive for marijuana is at the highest level ever recorded. Yeah,
which let them know. But like, so are all those
people being fired for that? Like that's what like this
The story implied that it was just like informational drug testing,
but right, why the fuck are people still drug testing

(47:47):
their employees? Yeah, it's kind of my question.

Speaker 2 (47:51):
Well, yeah, isn't.

Speaker 5 (47:52):
It like insurance or it's like some sort of like
situation where like some where places have like an umbrella
policy or have them working heavy equipment or something.

Speaker 4 (48:02):
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (48:03):
My work My workplace has like a thing in our
handbook that evokes like potential. You're not supposed to be,
you know, imbibing on the job. It's not a question
anybody has ever asked anybody ever workplace, So I don't know.

Speaker 1 (48:22):
Yeah, I mean it's in other countries there are like
I could understand. It's like we you can't be intoxicated
while operating heavy machinery, obviously, Like that's and that is
how drug testing is used in other countries that use it.
But the way that the US uses it where it's
just like we just want to check out your lifestyle

(48:44):
and what you're doing when you're not on work hours
is really like it's not a long term thing and
it's not practiced in other countries, so like that's the
that's the thing I always assumed. Yeah, there was like
some international corporation re for like with insurance or something
like that, but the US is the only place that

(49:04):
really has this. It was invented by the Reagans as
part of like their war on drugs. Shit, like it's
a it's a recent innovation that is not helpful, is
not effective, and.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Yeah, it's one of the latest tools of white supremacy.
Yeahs finally you know, being done away with because yeah,
like it's always like, oh, you smoke weed in this
part of the neighborhood and you want to work at
this grocery store, right, you know, it's like what the
fuck is this? And yeah, all it does is like
either dissuades people from wanting to apply for a job,
which I'm sure is one factor of it, or you know,

(49:40):
you can really kind of prolong the employing someone by
being like, oh, I don't know about your drug tests
and shit like that.

Speaker 1 (49:46):
I mean that it is on the decline, drug testing
and it's definitely like way less popular than it was
fairly recently, but it's still happening in thousands of workplaces.
And the reason and it's on the decline has nothing
to do with the fact that it's invasive and unnecessary
and you know, arguably unconstitutional, but because of the labor

(50:09):
shortage caused by the pandemic. And so yeah, it plays
like Amazon dropped drug testing in twenty twenty one and
like acknowledged that it is inherently racist, but we're like,
and we're dropping it, but not because of the racism.
We're dropping it because of changing state laws. Wait, oh,
you know it's racist though.

Speaker 5 (50:29):
Yea, yeah, yeah, yeah, And then we always did and
we always because by the way, you know, the War
on drugs.

Speaker 4 (50:34):
Was not Reagan's, it was Nixon's.

Speaker 5 (50:37):
And John Erlickman gave the interview, you're saying that, like
we did it to disrupt black communities, Like that's.

Speaker 4 (50:42):
Why we did it.

Speaker 5 (50:42):
We knew with drugs, we knew that pot wasn't bad.
We were lying, that's why we did it. And Carter
tried to pull it back, and then the Reagans went
like double down with it, Like that's what. So it's
always like you know, pull back, push, pull back, push.
What's happened now with drugs, which is interesting. It's not
just the legalization of pot. It's the opioids crisis, which
is now like inspired this like wave of empathy for

(51:06):
substance use disorder, which it now has a new name
and now is meant to now it's a health crisis
because the perceived victims are white people, right even though
like like the fastest growing demographic of deaths right now
is like black people, but it's perceived to be a
white problem, which is why it like inspired all of

(51:26):
these like actual legislative things and like money and.

Speaker 4 (51:30):
Resources and stuff.

Speaker 5 (51:31):
So it is really interesting to see like how it
snaps back and forth and back and forth and back
and forth. I would not be surprised with all this
marijuana legalization and stuff, like I think it's great, But
I wouldn't be surprised if in like four, eight, twelve
years there was another huge snapback. I just wouldn't because
that's just how I mean, like what's happening now with abortion,
Like what's happened. I mean, it's just it's just in

(51:52):
gay rights, Like it's just it seems to be like
we're on these ebbs and flows, and every time you
get an EBB. It's worse than the previous EBB when
it comes to being progressive or regressive.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
Right, yeah, yeah, there's so when Reagan announced it, he
instituted it with like the one point one million federal
employees that he had control over, and then he did
a publicity stunt. He was like so horny for drug
testing workers. He was like, fuck it, I'll do a
drug TESTO. And but like the reality of the drug

(52:26):
test was that if anybody in his administration, or if
he or Nancy had tested positive, it would have been
totally kept totally secret and confidential, and instead of being fired,
they'd simply be offered counseling, so with discretion. Yeah. Interesting,
but yeah, by nineteen ninety five, more than three quarters

(52:47):
of employers had adopted workplace drug testing. That's crazy, right,
typically only done in Europe for safety concerns, and in Canada,
workplace drug testing is considered a human rights violation, which
makes sense because, like, for instance, a DC police department
admitted it used urine samples collected for drug tests to
screen female employees for pregnancy without their knowledge or consent.

Speaker 4 (53:11):
So sorry, I'm not going again.

Speaker 5 (53:14):
Not shocked, not surprised, just like bold over from the
moment a little bit. Yeah, and then what did they
do if they found out? Did they just not tell
them and just not hire them? That was that was
the thing.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
I think that's.

Speaker 2 (53:24):
Imagine or could you imagine? Then they like they're like, also, girl,
you're pregnant. Sorry, we cannot offer you employment with this
police department. Congratulations, are preggers my eggers?

Speaker 1 (53:38):
Okay, so figure it out. Congratulations girl, you're not getting
the job, but congratulations on what you know what I mean?
You know what I mean? Wink wink wink. Yeah. Anyways,
because of human error, because of the ability to like
buy things that can help hide. Like there's all all
these products Golden Flask, you're a novelty kit. It says

(54:03):
it's a fetish novel. You're a novelty kit, but of
course it's actually just for people to buy. And if
you're fetish's employment, you're into working for corporation that doesn't
respect your human rights. I think that's so hot. Help
you toil for me? Yeah, there's the Wizonator but yeah,
so there's just all these products to Yeah, it makes sense.

(54:26):
Who does it?

Speaker 2 (54:26):
It's it's non I remember like even in I remember
high school, right, we graduated high school, one of my
best friends applied for a job at Costco and he
fucking almost fainted at the job interview because they made
him pissed test wow and like, but the thing was
he knew he failed, Like he was like, right every
day he's like, but he's like I went in confident.
I was like, yeah, okay, give it to me, and

(54:48):
he's like, but they hired me anyway, And I was like, oh, interesting, it's.

Speaker 5 (54:52):
Probably a polygraph where it was like if they flinched
about taking it, they wouldn't hire.

Speaker 2 (54:57):
I actually need to, oh, get my mom from the
airport right now?

Speaker 1 (55:05):
Okay, can you run away in a bottle of golden
flat falls out of your.

Speaker 4 (55:13):
Do you have a condition where I can't? You're a
note unless I'm at home?

Speaker 2 (55:17):
Yeah, home field advantage. You know it happens.

Speaker 1 (55:20):
We've all been there.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
But yeah, do away with the fucking drug tests please,
Like it's yes.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
Yeah, come on, Well, Rebecca, such a pleasure having you
on the daily Geist. Where can people find you? Follow you?

Speaker 5 (55:31):
Oh my god, this was ridiculously fun. Well, you can
listen to crime writers on and anything else I do
but you can follow me on social media, including Twitter,
because I have not left in a huff at reb Levoi.

Speaker 4 (55:41):
That's where I am everywhere.

Speaker 1 (55:43):
Yeah, and is there a work of media you've been enjoyed?

Speaker 5 (55:47):
Yeah, well, I'm sure you guys have talked about Jury
Duty on the show with someone else, right, so Retrey background. Well,
by the way, this weekend was the return of Selling
Sunset on Netflix. Haven't watched, Yeah, but it's back actually
coming out as we're taping this show. Yeah, but there's
something coming out of Netflix that this week that people

(56:08):
should check out that I've seen a preview of. It's
called Victim Suspect on Netflix. And we're just since we're
talking about criminal justice stuff, and if you want to
get real pissed off, it's about It's great. It's there's
a reporter Ray de Leone who works at the Center
for Investigative Reporting, and she did this long investigation about
women who get arrested after they report being raped and

(56:29):
the cops accuse them of falsely reporting being raped and
then they get arrested.

Speaker 4 (56:33):
It's super good.

Speaker 5 (56:34):
It's it'll make you really angry, but it's it's really
really good and I recommend it. Was as it's sun
Dance and now it's coming out of Netflix. It's really good.
But also watch Selling Sunset.

Speaker 2 (56:43):
Because I mean, what's kind of what's going on with Rishelle?

Speaker 4 (56:45):
You know high art, I mean Krishelle.

Speaker 1 (56:47):
I mean, I see what's happening here in real life?

Speaker 4 (56:49):
I know, I miss Maya. I miss Maya a lot.

Speaker 1 (56:52):
Oh yeah, Maya was number one.

Speaker 4 (56:55):
In my Power rankings, number one.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
But you know yeah, also a true crime podcast. If
you look at the deals that they're getting away with, yep,
I mean some of these places are a steal. All right.

Speaker 5 (57:09):
We'll have to see what happens with the Christine Less
Selling Sunset.

Speaker 4 (57:13):
We'll see if it's so good. I think it'll be
fine exactly.

Speaker 1 (57:16):
Miles, Where can people find you? What is the work
media you've been enjoying?

Speaker 2 (57:20):
Oh, you can find me on Twitter, Instagram, other app
based websites At Miles of Gray. You can find Jack
and on our basketball podcast, Miles and Jack John Matt
Bosty's where we talk about you know, the NBA the
postseason right now, my Lakers were I don't know what
happened in Game three, so it could really be or
it could be, but hey, we'll have to find out

(57:42):
next episode. And you can also find me talking about
ninety day Fiance, my favorite reality trash fire show on
my other podcast.

Speaker 1 (57:49):
For twenty day Fiance. So you know what time it is.
Let's see, do I like a tweet? Nope, I don't.
I haven't.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
I haven't actually gone on Twitter, although I do see
see Casey just hand is just trending, so I can
only Oh, there's a Politico deep dive on her, can't
we Yeah?

Speaker 1 (58:06):
Oh wait here, let me.

Speaker 5 (58:07):
Let me see the sanctimonious you mean, come on, you
don't have to have the name right exactly.

Speaker 2 (58:13):
Oh, here's what Okay, Now, apparently there's like this whole
Politico deep dives is talking about how she's the one
controlling everything.

Speaker 4 (58:22):
Okay, even the pudding.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Yeah, come on, your big slot pig go putting was
a sigh op to get us to identify with them.
They're like everybody eats pudding with their fingers right right
like and then he blew it by being like, that's
not true, sugar man. Come on, I don't need that.
I don't need pudding, all right? Uh tweet, I've been

(58:46):
enjoying Adam serious at row tweeting, tweeted me, I'm having
hearing issues. Doctor, can you describe the symptoms?

Speaker 3 (58:55):
Me?

Speaker 1 (58:56):
It's a TV show about a family from Springfield. I'm
really good. And then Zach Dunn tweeted a picture of
a I guess it's the HBO Max ad maybe and
it says join your favorite plumbers on an epic quest.
Renter owned the Super Mario Brothers movie at Home with Exfinity,

(59:19):
so it's an Exfinity at And he said, Hey, Bud,
I'm only gonna say this once, so listen close. You
have no fucking idea who my favorite plumbers are. Assume
you know anything. You don't know me, all right. You
can find me on Twitter at Jack Underscore Obrian. You

(59:39):
can find us on Twitter at Daily Zeitgeist. We're at
the Daily Zeitgeist on Instagram. We have a Facebook fanpage
and a website, Daily zeitgeist dot com, where we post
our episodes and our footnote where we link off to
the information that we talked about in today's episode, as
well as a song that we think you might enjoy. Miles,
what's the song that you think people might enjoy?

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
Here's a song you might enjoy. Uh, this is an
artist from Belfax named Caliber and the track is called
Feeling Normal and it kind of reminds me of like
Tom Yorky dance music like idio Tech by Radiohead. Like
if you like that, you're I think you'll probably like
this because it's got, like, you know, kind of interesting
industrially deep with a haunting, spooky falsetto over it. So

(01:00:22):
check out Feeling Normal by Caliber. Oh and also if
you really like idio Tech, I just heard a college
acapella version of it by the Virginia still Whoetts from
the University of Virginia, an all female identifying acappella group.

Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
That's another one.

Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
If you want to hear the spooky version idio Tech,
try that one off your size.

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
Spooky radio Head covers really like, it's just a matter
of time until you hear that cover, and it'll be
it'll be in the trailer for Super Mario Brothers too,
right right, like.

Speaker 4 (01:01:00):
The Social Network version about you and Musk.

Speaker 2 (01:01:03):
Will have that Yeah, God, yeah, truly idiotech all right.

Speaker 3 (01:01:07):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
The Daily's Eye Guys is a production of iHeart Radio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visits the iHeartRadio abb Apple
podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. That's
gonna do it for us this morning, back this afternoon
to tell you what is trending, and we'll talk to
y'all then. Bye bye bye