August 22, 2023 • 65 mins
In episode 1535, Jack and Miles are joined by filmmaker, director, TV Writer, and host of Celebrity Book Club, Chelsea Devantez, to discuss… The Evolution of Movie Sex Scenes, Pop Culture Horniness and more!
- EVERYONE IS BEAUTIFUL AND NO ONE IS HORNY
- Sontag on fascist art (from 1975)
- Marvel Movies: This Esteemed Director Says They’re Not Sexy Enough
- What is the Physical Culture Movement?
- BODYBUILDING AND NATION-BUILDING
- Gen Z's Distaste for Sex Scenes Sparks Hollywood Censorship Debate
LISTEN: Domingas by Jorge Ben Jor
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello the Internet, and welcome to season three oh one,
Episode one of DALY'SAI Guys Day production of iHeartRadio. This
is a podcast where we take a deep to dive
into america shared consciousness. And it is Tuesday, August twenty second,
twenty twenty three. You've been waiting for us to get
to this day, so the week can tell you that.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
It is, of course, National Pecan tort Day. There's so
many days for peacans.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Man, the con farmers have gotten to the National Day
industrial Complex.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
We'll go alright while you're you know, enjoying all those
sweet sweets. Don't forget. It's also National Tooth Fairy Day.
Shout out the Tooth Fairy Union. National Surgical on College
this day, Fuck cancer, shout out to the surgeons, though
that'd be trying to battle it. National Boo Day, International
Day of commemorating the Victims of Acts of Woya, my god,
it's so long acts of violence based off religion or belief.
(00:50):
That's a tall one. And what's one more? Just to
make it super fun? The last one is National Being
Angel Day.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Just being Angel? Yeah, hey, every day nation will be
an Angel Day for you, sweethearts. Thanks, hey, my name
is Jack O'Brien aka don't go Chase and Zaz love Balls.
Just stay on the picket line until that asshole pays you.
I know that you're gonna have to compete with AI y'all,
(01:21):
but I think that strokes are so bad. That is
Curtzy a Fighter of the Night Man underscore AAA on
the discord, and I'm thrilled to be joined as always
by my co host mister Miles.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Grad Miles Gray AKA, and I've fable ten thousand miles
and I'll trivele ten thousand more to be the world's
most renowned auctioneer. I will tribal ten thousand miles or more.
Shout out to no clue when I catch up on
the discord for combining you know the the Proclaimers track
(01:56):
with that State Center is Holden Moore. Food basically wrote
his entire Wikipedia article and had to shout out the
fact that he's traveled seventy five thousand miles doing auction
Oh yeah, that's right, yeah, while also trying to cover
for Donald Trump.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
It counts every mile that he travels. I respect that.
Actually that you just never get over it, like, look
how far we're going.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I mean, if you really want to stunt, like, you know,
we could, we could pull the passports out, young man.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
You know, businessmen do love to do that shit too.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Be like, oh yeah, the.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Status dude.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
The fucking airport any fucking like airport bar, You'll see
two dicks in suits being like, yeah, like, you know,
I just got I just got my million miler shot
as so you know I'm back status dude. Yeah, taking
my family down a Tobali next week. So yeah, got
to get the tripped miles.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah. Thrilled to be joined in our third seat by
a brilliantly talented filmmaker writer. She was one of the
head writers for the Problem with John Stewart and wrote
on Girls five, Have a Blessed, This Mess, The Opposition
with Klepper, among many others. She wrote, directed, and starred
in the acclaimed short film Basic Hosts the podcast Celebrity
book Club. It's Chelsea Davanta.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Oh Hi, intro like shouting my name into a cave,
you know, seeing what echoes.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Back to a cave full of the entire Internet. So
that's right, the whole damn Internet is here to welcome you.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
On the I'm feeling very blessed to be back here
and continue some very important discussions.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yes always yeah, So this is this is our Tuesday
episode where we kind of take a look at one
specific topic that we think kind of undergirds the whole zeitgeist.
That's important to understanding the zeitgeist.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
Undergirds are what I use instead of spanks, so very.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
They were the free date spanks. That's right, what's my underds?
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean, so we wanted to have
you on. You had one of our favorite observations in
the history of the show when you you basically said
that you knew Trump was going to win the twenty
sixteen election based off of watching The Bachelor, and then
you explained why and it made perfect sense and looking
(04:22):
at pop culture tea leaves and like reading what it acted,
like what is actually being said about what's happening to
people on the inside, what has gone on with our
shared dreams is one of my favorite subjects. You are
really good at it. We love to do it on
the Zeitgeist, and so we wanted to have you on
to do just that, and we'll get into what specifically
(04:47):
we're talking or actually we can do that now, I
mean we throughout stan culture being the new religion. We've
talked about that before, but this one subject keeps popping
up on social media. Popped up over the weekend after
we had selected this subject, and that is kind of
like the desexualization of pop culture. Movie sex scenes in
(05:10):
particular seem to be like a particular thing that is
that people are objecting to lately and are like, why
do these exist? When I watch an eighties movie? Why
does dan Aykroyd get a blood job from a ghost?
For instance? And that one's actually a really good question.
(05:30):
But anyways, there's all sorts of things we've talked about before.
The idea that like desexualized beautiful bodies is like actually
a feature of fascist art, and so we've puzzled over
whether that's what we're seeing here. But there's lots of
As this has become more and more of a mainstream
(05:50):
thing that we're seeing on social media, there's lots of explanations,
and we thought you were the best person to have
to have on the show to talk about this.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
I'm I'm thrilled to be here to talk about like
very hot sexy bodies not having sex. No, but I
was so fascinated you guys chose this because it's also
something I've been thinking about a lot. Also just as
like a side topic and where I'm coming from. I was,
you know, the writers are on strike right now, but
before we were on strike, I was pitching a show
(06:22):
and one of the demographics it was going out to
it was gonna be like part for millennials, part for
gen Z. Sort of this basically like late twenties early
thirties audience that people seem to think millennials and gen Z.
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Are just like so so so different.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So when you're pitching for like that late twenties early thirties,
executives start referencing studies like the ones we're going to
talk about, like gen Z actually isn't having in sex anymore,
so like like can one of these characters just like
not have a partner of any kind and they just
sort of like live in a hole and they stare
at a wall because that's what we assume gen Z
is doing. And it was so frustrating because every time
(07:02):
I looked around, be it from people in my.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Real life, the youth of the real life.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
TikTok, social media, really anything, I just kept feeling like
that is not true at all, even in gen Z
reality shows, like they are getting engaged, they are getting married,
they're talking about dating kind of like the same way.
You've always had this feeling of like, you know, I
want to be having good sex, but I'm not.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I don't know if that's something particular.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
To be in my friends, but like I remember in
my early twenties it was like, yeah, we would like
to be having sex, but no one's having sex, like
sex in the city. Like that just feels like the
twenties thing, unless, of course, you know, I'm sure some
people were. But anyways, all to say that, like I
really think about these studies that are being referenced, like
gen Z is like this, and dah da da is
like this, And all I keep thinking about is like
(07:50):
who's doing these studies?
Speaker 4 (07:52):
And maybe gen Z is just not participating.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Yeah, you know what, we're actually not going to answer
the polls about like what we've been fucking lately. We're
just not because I just don't think they're correct. But
I would love to hear what you guys think.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
It's like the political polls that are like, man, these
elderly people certainly over index. They seem like they're doing great,
and it's like, well, how did you conduct this? Calling
land lines exactly exactly?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
It's like, oh, I guess we didn't predict the election
correctly off of the hundred landlines. And then the I mean,
how weird do you have to be to pick up
the phone these days? Who is answering the phone? We're
trusting them with our polling data. The people who answer
an unknown number, I don't trust them.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
We actually asked a bunch of gen Z people's grandparents
about their sexual behavior, and this is what they told me.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
This is what they told us. Yeah, I just I
think so anyways, I do.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
But what I do think is a really interesting discussion
with this fascism thing is. And the thing that I've
been feeling is that I'll say, as a millennial to
the gen Z's is perhaps lacking new one discourse nuance,
which I don't know how. I mean, how close do
you think lack of nuance and understanding nuance is to
(09:09):
turning fascist?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Right?
Speaker 4 (09:11):
You know?
Speaker 3 (09:12):
On the nuance to fascist spectrum. I do think we're
somewhat close, But I don't think it's fascism. I think
it's nuanced.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's probably true. We have talked
before speaking of David Zaslove that he's a real gen
zer because when he saw flea bag, he paused it
and told everyone that we're if we're either going to
turn this trash off for the sex scenes or we're
just gonna watch it, and nobody's allowed to look at
(09:37):
me while we watch it, don't. So he was very
scandalized by a second.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
I'm sure he didn't want people to look at him
as he was just coming egregiously flee back.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Eyes off. Yeah, hands free, watch hands free, hands up,
hands up, still laughing, how how well.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I think that's also another good point though, of like,
people like Zaslov and them are at the top of
of our TV pop culture right now.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
So it is plugged in, I.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Can just finish listen.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
Yes, that's exactly what I was going to say. God,
he wants to look cool so bad.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
I saw him wearing three popped collared shirts the other day.
Three So that's a jacket. That's a shirt, and then
there was another shirt underneath three and all of them
popped collars, and then the little pockets on the jacket popped.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
I said, come on, my dog.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
But anyways, all to say that, like, normally, I think
we look at pop culture and it can really reflect
what you were saying, reflect back on to like culture culture.
But right now I'm feeling that actually only reality TV
and social media can accurately do that, because people like
Zaslov have been making television decisions for a good five
years and they're not accurately reflecting culture anymore.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Interesting. All right, well we are. That's what we're going
to be talking about in the second and third act.
First we were there first. That's something from your We
need to get to know you better. Oh my god,
I get to know you. We do like to ask
our guests, what's something from your search history that's revealing
about who you are? Sir?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
You know what?
Speaker 4 (11:10):
I'll do it live? Do you know what I mean? Yeah,
I'll go in live.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Oh well, we're gonna get to it. But Chloe Bailey,
patiently responding to swarm sex scene backlash, I was an
article I'd read a while ago, but cue it up
for our conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Got it, got it? Got it?
Speaker 1 (11:31):
What is something you think is overrated?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
Okay, here we go. Stay with me on this.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
So I was getting very nostalgic for magazines US weeklies,
people holding it in your hands, someone basically curating your
feed for you and telling you this is what people
are paying attention to. So my husband got me a
subscription to US Weekly and I was like, yes, back
in the saddle, here we go. And I know it's like, okay,
print media is dying, blah blah.
Speaker 5 (11:58):
Blah, but wow, oh my god, has this magazine taken
such a turn to the point where even if we
don't rate US Weekly highly anymore, whatever it is is
still too high. Like in the magazine they are now
printing celebrities own Instagram photos.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Wow, okay, so.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Yes, paper Instagram, but like sometimes like out of date.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
So it's like, over the course of six months, Selena
Gomez posted a photo with a fish, and then someone
else did, and now there's just a page in US
Weekly being like, look, sometimes celebrities fish and it's like
I already saw that on Instagram and you just like
put it through your printer, Like what's happening.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Do we not pay paparazzis anymore? Do they not have
the money for that?
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Like?
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Are we not curating like thoughts throughout the fish photos?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
It's just And then I started going through all of
it and like the just they're just like us, that's
it's just they're just printing Instagram.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
Still, I couldn't believe.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
I remember it used to be like the paparazzi things
like you go to sprouts, you know whatever.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Now they're like, oh, look Chrissy Cheekan dances in her
living room. It's like, yeah, because she's holding the camera herself,
what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Oh wow?
Speaker 3 (13:13):
As soon as I just couldn't believe it was still
a magazine, and then they're like atoning for their crimes,
Like do you guys remember when two celebrities would be
caught wearing the same dress and they'd be like who
wore it better? And they it'd be like one percent
for me and a Suvari.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Like you know, everyone thinks you look like shit.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
You look like shit in this dress.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
And so now they're sort of like they've learned like, oh,
we're not you know, we're not supposed to like pen
women against each other.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
And so now they just put a little thing that
says twining.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Oh but.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Boo boo, tell me a story, do something interesting, Like
I get that. I like, yeah, like, don't put them
against each other, but like that was it twiny? They
just they just past photos of them and is going
twinning and then the silent part is better?
Speaker 2 (14:04):
Yeah, you know which twin do you prefer?
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (14:07):
And the comedians used to make fun of fashion in
the back, like the back page, just to be sad
pathetic comedians like myself being like tent dress, I'd go
camping in that, you know, something like that. And now
it's people being like, mules are very in, pink is in?
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Color? Is a color that's in this season?
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Bright green? Are you missing out on the Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:31):
I wonder like, do we think this happened because budget
cuts at US Weekly or because there's only one magazine
now and so they like don't have to compete with anybody,
so they're just like I don't fucking care. Let's pretend
green is a new thing.
Speaker 6 (14:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I you know, I was thinking about it and I
was like, Okay, are they just sort of getting like
is this a thing where most of Americans aren't on
social media? So this magazine is like still helping people,
but like no, like six out of six.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Ten Americans are on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
And I think the four that aren't don't subscribe to
us weekly.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Yeah, Like the people I know who aren't on social media,
they damn sure don't give a fuck about celebrity culture.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Eve.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah, they're like on their own shit. They're like, I know,
I'm I operate on a completely different system than.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Other people, exactly.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
And this is where it's like, oh, print media is
going out of business. Well it's like I think they've
been told time of death is in four years, and
they're just trying to like in their lives early. Like
I don't know, I like it's as if they're like,
no one's like that.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, like I'm not gonna bust my ass as the
factory burns down. I'm gonna fucking just kick it and
just you know, just like we get singed in the corner.
Yeah exactly. We used to every week. I mean we
used to buy all the tabloids shout out bloyd Watch
where we would buy like every tabloid like National Inquirer, Globe,
all that shit, and then all the gossip mags like
People in Touch. And I'm curious now to see, like
(15:54):
I wonder how much the pandemic has changed that coverage,
because even then it was still doing like who wore
it better? Yeah, and other things and just being like
they're just like us. But it was like the old
you know, the paparazzi shots out in Malibu or somebody
wearing big glasses with the Starbucks trained the cup or whatever.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Yeah, she kind of looks sad. I bet she's divorced.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
The best was like, oh dude, this girl paradise. Yeah,
it was a subtext of every photograph, wasn't there. One
was like Brad Pitt touched rape Jennifer Aniston's stomach. They're
fucking pregnant. Yeah, exactly one miles. That was an entire
that was in every magazine for ten and a half years.
Speaker 4 (16:35):
For real, every day she's pregnant.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
She's pregnant. Why would you touch your stomach right after
eating if she wasn't.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I hadn't seen each other for fifteen years, and they're
like shocking new photos suggest that they're back together.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
It's like Angelina Jolie says, he's pretty abusive on a plane.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Jennifer Aniston pregnant with twins.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah, yeah, cut to Jennifer Aniston missed me with that gossip.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
But US Weekly was purchased by American Media, Inc. Which
is the owner of National Inquoir and all that, like
the actual bloids.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, I mean, then it should get juicier.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
I just don't.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
I have to say, Like I listen, I subscribed to
some GUS newsletters and they're so funny. They're so fun
the ones that include pictures fucking ty. If you printed
that out, I would buy it for three ninety nine.
I just like it's as if like they brought in,
they brought in a bunch of granddads to run this
weekly and they're like, I think my wife said there
was uh recipes.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
They almost definitely did, because like what that was one
thing that we noticed about National Inquiry and like the
actual supermarket tabloids was that they seemed to be made
by and for people who were in their eighties, Like truly,
it was just all about like this elderly celebrity might
be dying last days for Dolly like that that was
(18:00):
Every other issue was about how Dolly Parton was dying.
But for the most part it was just old old
people news.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:08):
Yeah, and I guess that's really just the demographic. It's
them and me with a subscription.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
Right, I'll read what is what's something you think is underrated?
Speaker 3 (18:17):
Okay, I'm doing a little like you know, mine go
together like they match.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Reddit, Now again you'll be like, yes, Reddit's really popular, Chelse,
Like what are you talking about? But again, I feel
like a bunch of communians myself included, have always used
Reddit as a punchline as like oh the like the trolls,
the sub humans, you know what I mean, Like who cares?
Speaker 4 (18:42):
What's like happening on Reddit?
Speaker 3 (18:44):
And I have some Google search terms up for my
podcast and I did this Carolyn Callaway Natalie Beach episode
and somehow, you know, one of.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
My Google alerts brought me to a Reddit thread.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Before clicking it, I thought like you're not supposed to
do this, Chelsea, Like this is not Whatever happens from
here is like not gonna go well. And when I
got there, I was like, holy shit, this is some
good discourse. This is some really smart, high level discourse.
And I think there's been a shift. Granted I have
not been real checked in to Reddit, but like on
(19:17):
TikTok comments and Instagram comments and Twitter, they all kind
of like derail the discourse and it always goes into
like your up, You're ugly that and should die like
somehow that always gets there, like within the first fe minutes.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Reddit is for the people.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Who are like we we we want seven hundred characters,
we have something to say, we need a real forum.
And I just I found some really elevated topics in there,
and I was like, I cannot believe I haven't been
living here.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
The whole time.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's yeah, it's definitely all about like what subreddits you
go on, Definitely what the energy is of people, because yeah,
some places are just total toxic meltdowns constantly. Like it's
funny even how like sports teams will have different subreddits.
We're like some people are like, nah, that other subreddit
is for like the fucking wishy washy day dreamers who
don't actually know ball. We know shit on this subreddit,
(20:08):
and like you'll even see like people with the same
interest like no, you guys over there, serious shit over here,
or like if you want a shit post, do that there.
But yeah, there really is.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
But really it's like they're yeah, creating internal guidelines, they're
kicking people out to the of the threads. I saw
this thing where it's like, yeah, we don't like I
saw this battle of like, don't call this girl pick me.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Don't use pick me energy. It's a sexist term. But
I was in a thread for people to shit talk
other probably women.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
I was in the thread where you're like, isn't this
woman so fucking stupid? And someone was like, you are
misusing pick me right right? That is toxic, And I
was like.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Where am I hello, professor?
Speaker 4 (20:51):
Yeah, I just really yeah, I really liked it.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Yeah. I think that's a really good point. I think
that's a really good underrated because Reddit does, like it
is still used as shorthand and for like dumb internet
like trolls and in cells, and like that's definitely not
exclusively the case or even like largely the case. I
feel like there's usually like if you want to find
a way to like use the Internet that doesn't make
(21:15):
it feel like it's completely broken and your every page
that you go to is taken over by ads. Just
like put a Reddit filter on all your searches. Just
do like whatever you're looking for and then Reddit, and
you're going to have a better time on the Internet.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah. See, how like on Google when people have like
questions about like day to day things, the like when
it auto fills reddit will be like one of them.
They're like how to change car battery Reddit, you know,
then like YouTube because like it's really interesting. I mean,
I'm I'm on Reddit a lot. I you know, obviously
like you go like the shit I'm interested in. I
(21:53):
go I check those subreddits out and it's fantastic. There's
other ones I just like to watch, Like there's one
about economics where like a bunch of economists choke. It's
like you'll never get consensus with like with two economists
in the same room, and then like they just like laugh,
like all high minded economy economic shit, and I'm like,
what the fuck. I'm like this is kind of interesting.
But yeah, there's it's there's truly something for everybody there.
(22:15):
Like I was on a subreddit where people just be
like I just found this thing? What is this? And
then people come in they're like, oh, I've been a
plumber for thirty years. This tools actually used to like
stop a drain or blah blah blah blah blah. People
like whoa.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Yes it was a plunger.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yeah, it's like this like goes down a drain and
like inflates. It's like when there is and when there
isn't a stop for it. It's like some very specific
plumbing tool. But it just looks like a lightsaber. So
people are like, I.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Don't know what I just found this ship encrusted lightsaber.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
But yeah, I totally agree.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I think the mob mentality of Reddit is very It
has a higher IQ and EQ than TikTok mob mentality.
I think if you went on TikTok, you're like, yo
with this plunger, people.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
Like you idiot, ye know what this is? And you'd
go on Reddit and they'd be like, we don't talk
like that in this one.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah, well yeah why. There's like some people on subredd
it's called like no dumb questions, like where people go
and there's not like people are like I'm sorry, what
is Selena Gomez? And like a kidney thing I keep
reading about. Please okay, this.
Speaker 4 (23:18):
Sounds like I should go there because I've.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Got answers for that one.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Oh yeah, there's another one. Yeah, out of the loop.
You'd probably like because that's another one where people come
in with like pop culture questions and they're like, I'm sorry,
who is D four four VB? The artist?
Speaker 4 (23:32):
I love this?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Yeah, I feel I feel sad for myself that I
missed out on Reddit for so many years because I
just assumed it was like you know what I mean,
it's a lazy punchline of like these losers. It's like, hmmm,
they're pretty smart. They want to type out paragraphs like
that takes.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Yeah, it's pretty smart.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Just don't venture anywhere where like you may be the
topic of conversation.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
That's subreddit specific. To Miles's point, not great place to
find out about Donald Trump if you're just reading from
a Donald Trump reddit sub reddit. Not a great place
to see crimes solved in real time, but then in
absolutely nowhere is good at crowdsourcing crime solutions.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Good point, But listen, specific genre of books, that's where
I'm at. Get to the book places, influencer snark threads,
you know.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
There there's like foam wah, which is like a Dumois
kind of I don't know, have you seen foam wak?
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, but you know what, I am so so out
on Dumoi and foam wa because it's like they have
made every single person into a paparazzi.
Speaker 4 (24:38):
And I don't trust half.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Of these paparazzis, you know, I mean, like every time
they're like, hey, guess what you know Toby Maguire is
suing his wife a non please, It's like that could
be that honestly, could be my grandma.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Right.
Speaker 4 (24:52):
Have you read Las Weekly ten years ago and is
like guess what I heard?
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Like it's like, yo, we have to I want to
read the juice and know it's real, and now it's
not because it's just some girl being like SoC Crystalia
without his mask in a coffee.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Shop, right right right boo. Also, yeah, Victor in the
chap brings up going a shower or you know about
shower oranges. No please, this were motherfuckers. They go into
a hot shower and just just just cave man, bite
into an orange.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Not necessarily, it's just they're just saying that you should
eat an orange and in a shower because of the
accommodation of hot shower and cold orange.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Like it was caping for shower oranges right now.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
It was very sexy and yours was very like just
because the posts I read on shower oranges, I'm more
in like, I'm more interested by the ones where people
like guys, I did it.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
I just I just let my animal instincts overcome me,
I just bugged it out with this orange and the
shower and it was beautiful, and they see people like,
would tangerines work?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
I mean, one of the things I like about the
concept of shower oranges is that you can just peel
it and drop it wherever you want, because you know,
shower peels are pretty much waterproof.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
But then you're leaving them there, okay, but then yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It was just the joy of dropping it up later.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, yeah, I think, yeah, I think it appeals to
like really messy people because it seems like the appeal
is all messy.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
All right.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
I mean, look, I'm not I'm not some you know,
very put together person like that, but I guess it
doesn't appeal to me, Like, yeah, get all gross, but
the water just watches it away. You know, the thing
you hate about the way you want to eat in
real life, which let the food get all over you,
Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Maybe, all right, so everybody just wants to just bite
into a watermelon from the outside in, stick your head
through it, and then just like throw the rind everywhere. Right, No, yeah,
that's just all right, moving on pool watermelons. I'm just saying,
all right, let's take a quick break, and when we
(26:55):
come back, we will talk about the de sexualization of
pop culture. Is it a thing? What does it mean?
We'll be right back and we're back. So just a
(27:16):
couple things to kick us off. More and more we're
seeing like these reactions go viral. There was one over
the weekend where a woman describes the movie Oppenheimer and
like that her and her husband wanted to see Oppenheimer,
but they had heard there was a sex scene. You know.
They she looks to be in her I'd say like
(27:36):
late twenties, early thirties, and it's it's just a it's wild.
The way she's talking about the sex scene as if
it's like a thing we can all agree is like
traumatic and not something that like anybody wants to watch,
and like they talk about like how they got through it.
They did their research, they like looked when it was
(27:58):
going to happen, and then they like close their eyes
during it. And this comes. I don't know what her
deal is, what her husband's deal is, if like, you know,
this is part of a long running social media presence
where people know like that they have some past trauma
as a couple or something like that. So I don't
(28:19):
want to dive too much in and be like, what
a weirdo. She also has like a Jesus fish on
her wrist, like tattooed on her wrist, so it could
just be like religious stuff, but like this does seem
to be. I think the reason it's getting so much
traction is people are seeing this as a take more
(28:39):
and more where people are like, finally someone says it
like sex scenes are weird. They make me feel gross.
I don't want to see them, And it came out
a lot with Oppenheimer in particular. But Chelsea, I just
want to open the floor to you on this subject
of like a step from horniness as media consumers.
Speaker 3 (29:05):
Well, first I have to say I haven't been totally
drawn to see Appenheimer, but after that video, now I
really want to go, Like I found myself being like
I have to know what this sex scene is, so
I don't, you know, I don't know where that puts
me perspective, But now I want to see the movie.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
Have you guys seen it? Is it a graphic sex scene?
I'd have to know.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
It's not graphic.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
It's actually like really so if you only have missionary sex, yeah,
it's straight, like the woman's yeah okay, but that was the.
Speaker 4 (29:35):
Most risk thing, and it's it's like nudity, yeah, there's like.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
Yeah, there's there's some nudity. But I actually think like
it feels very strange. Like Christopher Nolan has traditionally been
described as like being somewhat of a sexless filmmaker, Like
he made a movie about people's like going inside people's
dreams and no one, no one sucks at all, Like nobody,
like sex doesn't even inside these people's dreams. Sex doesn't
(30:02):
really exist inside most of his movies, I would say,
other than like the Joker character is kind of the
most fuckingest character that like he has and like any
of his movies in the sense that like he is
like this kind of creep but like at least there
is a sexual energy with the Joker. But anyways, this
(30:24):
seemed like he was responding to that and being like, oh, yeah,
I can't do a sex scene and it just feels
it is a weird sex scene. The first one is
really like it feels almost like self parody to me.
I don't know if I went in with a if
I went in being like I'm going to hate this
Christopher Nolan sex scene. But I think he's trying to
(30:48):
fight against the idea that his movies are dead sexually
and he failed.
Speaker 4 (30:51):
It sounds like he failed.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
I think he did.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
But I also I think he's popular, at least partially
because his movies take place in a sexless universe, and
I think people want that from their movies, like the
blockbuster movies.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Well, it's yeah, there's so many one after that description,
no two after that description. I want to see it
even more. I just have to know, I have to know.
It's the only thing that has brought me to this movie.
But yeah, there's so many threads to connect on this,
but kind of the The number one thought that comes
to my mind is something I talked about with my
one of my best friends, Ashley, who's also a television writer,
(31:26):
which is that prior to this moment in culture, sex
scenes have somewhat always They've always been bad story wise,
so there's never there's almost I'm gonna say Deadpool is
maybe the one exception where like a sex scene actually
had to be there to move the story forward. But
(31:48):
usually sex scenes are like a brief intermission where like,
you know what I mean, because the moment they've gotten
to like kissing. We know, Okay, so we're there story wise,
So if you're gonna show the full sex, like you
just kind of sitting it, and so then it really
is to be a very It's just exists to be
a sexy sex scene, which was way more needed in
previous generations where like that was the only time you
(32:10):
were going to see a sexy, sexy sex scene, right.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yeah, I was wearing the trench coat and times Square. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
I was thinking that like some examples of sex scenes
that needed to exist and that I think should inspire
people to like think more creatively about sex scenes. Is
like Parasite has a really interesting sex scene. Not an
American film, but it like shows this like really wealthy
couple like kind of having this weird sexual encounter on
(32:38):
the couch where they're like fantasizing that they are like
part of this lower class that they looked down on
and suppress. And like I thought that was like a
good that's a good one.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Yeah, that's another going when we were like, oh, there's
like meaning and.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Purpose for yes, But I feel like, yeah, sort of
traditionally and for the most part, sex scenes exist simply
to be sexy and they don't move anything forward, and
almost all of them have been written and directed by
you know, white cis men for a hundred years and so,
which and which I'm bringing up to say, like, I
(33:16):
think if our previous canon of sex scenes like had
had any sort of other like sexual lens on them,
that could turn a different portion of people on.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
I wonder if we'd be having this conversation.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
But because of that, people are sort of looking at
this as like, oh, like you can go back and
look at what was I just watching. It was a
it was it was a movie where you're like, oh,
it has a lot of sex scenes and you rewatch
them and you're like, oh, all of them rape scenes.
Speaker 4 (33:43):
Like and you just don't It was a it was
a movie.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
That had let me look hold on it was Sharon
Sharon Stone basics.
Speaker 4 (33:53):
I think it was basic instinct.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
And I'm just like blinded by the most famous part
of that movie and too, but I think it is
basic instinct. But there are other sex scenes in that
movie and they're just all rapes and and but they
but they're films like sex scenes, and so I think
this sort of like pushback to stuff like that is
is built on one hundred years of only one version
(34:15):
of sex being shown on screen.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Yeah, I think like just the other thing as we
were like thinking about the Nolan and like, is he
popular because he's like a particular like sex doesn't exist
in his cinematic universe, and like his sex scene in
Appenheimer seems like it was directed by somebody who's never
had sex. Like I was also thinking about Tom Cruise, who,
(34:39):
like the whole kind of argument against him has always
been this guy has like no sexual charisma, Like he
just like you can't really picture him having sex. Really,
he's like kind of this beautiful creature who doesn't have
any like you can't really picture him. And like the
other sex scene that made me id identify other than
(35:00):
the Appenheimer one, the one that like made me identify
with all the people who are like please stop was
the fucking Top Gun two sex scene where it's like
uh huh, yeah, it's just so weird, Like all of
a sudden, the movie starts to feel like it's an
ad for a retirement home. Like not that they're like
that old, but like the vibe of it is just
like this, like it like feels like a like Viagra commercial,
(35:24):
like totally because yes, it's just like dead and remote
and like takes place in heaven or something. It's really weird.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
And the the you know, the first hop Gun, the
most sexual scene in that movie is a abs at
the beach playing volleyball and they crush it, you know
what I mean. Like, and then in the second movie
they did it again and I don't know if you noticed,
but they had to shoot Tom Cruise like profile and
silhouette shirtless like it was a very like long lens. Yeah,
technically shirtless on the beach, but we're really going to
(35:50):
focus on on miles, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Jeans are super high for no reason that this is
just how people wear their jeans now.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, but they crushed it in that beach scene too,
and where it's like no one is I don't feel
like Yeah, I feel like on the most part, it's
like we can take sexy abs at the beach, but
like actual sexual intercourse, like I don't even know, like
don't film it. It does feel like very uncomfortable, which yeah,
I have to say that when you brought up this
(36:21):
topic because personally, I feel like this is when it
goes into gen Z. I'm sort of out on all
the like gen Z is not having sex. It's like
they were in a pandemic during the years when you
learn how to put your mouth on someone else's face,
so you know what I mean, So like where there's
gonna be a lag and like I you know, I'm
not believing all of these the so called data of
(36:42):
like they don't believe in sexy or I don't think
that's it. But what I do think is true is
that there's been a lot of sexual education, but not
that second step into the nuance of sexual education. So
like things feel very cut and dry, to the point
that in the television show Swarm, which Chloe Bailey was in,
I don't know if you guys saw that, but it
(37:02):
has a very very graphic sex scene in the pilot,
and a bunch of people online truly believed they were
having sex. So they wrote into the television show accounts
and on TikTok to be like why did they make
Chloe Bailey have sex and seem to have no understanding of.
Speaker 4 (37:24):
The art of television.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
Yeah, pantomime, Yes, like pantomime set you guys, it's not happening.
There's like you know, protect sheer protection cups over their parts.
But that's where I'm like, this is a nuanced understanding
mental alacrity, how to look in the real world issue
and less of like what is like we don't like
(37:46):
sex anymore issue, because.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
There's like a few ways to look because I think
of like erotic thrillers, right, And it was like the eighties,
we were you know, the conservatives. Conservatism of the eighties
sort of like helped build up the pressure for like
in the mid eighties for these films to start propping up,
like you know, coming up and people like, oh, actually
fuck with this something by night. The nineties were so
horny and dumb, We're like these are our greatest movies.
(38:13):
And I think like there's an uptake for like a
few reasons after, Like it's just kind of as we
were talking about this and just like researching the topic
and everything is like one really interesting thing is you
point out is like a lot of those erotic thrillers
have like sex can be dangerous, but also these women
are crazy and will kill you. Yeah, And I think
part of that is like the AIDS epidemic was already
(38:34):
making people question the quote unquote dangers of sex or
how sex could lead to like your eventual death right.
And then there's also like this sort of evolution of
sexual agency where like again to your point about these
like male writers and directors, like it almost feels like
for them, they're getting out their anxieties over like an
(38:55):
evolving new form of sexual politics coming out, and like
what does that mean for dudes? Like are they just
gonna fucking kill us?
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (39:03):
And also what sexually turns them on?
Speaker 2 (39:06):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
It's like it's like one dude's fantasy, Like she says no,
but she means yes.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
I said one dude. I meant hundreds of millions of dudes,
but who made all the art? But it's like had
had there been like to take this to the to
the porn conversation, like like it is so hard to
find porn that that that I personally like, I know
this is TMI, but it's more of like a female
thing like and I'm talking about like I don't like
(39:33):
when the house is dirty.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
And I'm not talking about like I like it clean.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
It's just like if there's like a super dirty mattress,
it's just so distracting. It's like like or like put
a sheet on it, you guys, like what is it?
And it's just like the actual ambiance and the actual atmosphere,
and it's like stuff like that isn't thought through. And
I feel like if our history of sex on TV
and film had included other people perspectives of point of
(39:59):
views of what turn them on.
Speaker 4 (40:01):
Yeah, yeah, there wouldn't be such a backlash right now.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
I don't mind a backlash against sex scenes that aren't
doing anything interesting or like see yeah, like like the
Oppenheimer's sex scene, like the or uh not Mission Top
Gun two sex scene, Like I'm fine with people lashing
back against that because it's not doing anything. I just
don't want people to not feel like they can express
(40:25):
that part of the human experience because like there's something
bad about inherently bad about sex scenes as opposed to
like there being something that is inherently bad about how
sex scenes and sexual like energy was expressed in film
up to this point.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
That's really well said.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Yeah there's I mean like there's other dimensions too, like
when you look at it, like I'm also like, where
does capitalism factor into this too? Because you know, like
there was an analysis of like from just like around
two thousand, like post nine, like right after nine to
eleven to like two thousand and six, like all these films,
and like seeing that sex or nudity like was not
like a like a revenue booster for films at all,
(41:05):
Like it really did nothing, Like it didn't move the
needle at all. And then you think about like, you know,
I guess eyes wide shut. It's just like our sort
of lasser prestige eerotic thriller. And that's two thousand and
there are a couple you know, trickling out after that,
but then you have like Lord of the Rings and
Harry Potter come out, and then the studios are setting like,
(41:25):
oh man, these like broad fucking movies, like we can
just start like these are just money printing things, and
like maybe we just need to go all in on
this shit too. So I know there's like a dimension
of that. But then I also think of like the
taboo element too, which is like to your point, even Chelsea,
of like you know, in the eighties and nineties, like
this was like a date night thing where like you
go like, I don't know, like there's some sexy shit
(41:46):
going on up there, and we don't have to feel
bad because there's no online porn where we can just
kind of like blow the doors open on everything we desire.
So it fills that sort of need. But then there's
also like the taboo where like I remember, as like
a ten year old middle schooler, you would talk about
these movies, not even because they were worked, like it's
like a good movie. You'd be like, did you see it?
(42:07):
Did your parents let you minute and.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Thirty seconds in on the VHS exactly?
Speaker 2 (42:12):
And become a man? Yeah, you will. You will know
what it looks like if you go to that scene,
like what? And so I feel like for my generation too,
like we were like somewhat educating ourselves in this really
bizarre way with these films. But then also I think we,
like the nineties were so hyper sexual, Like I feel
like it also burned us out to the point where
(42:34):
now you're looking for something a little more nuanced rather
than like, well, when's the part where they're going to
show a topless woman in the movie?
Speaker 3 (42:41):
Totally, And also I think it's sort of that thing
we're talking about, which is like it's just a call
for better art. And also I think there is a
call for better porn, like consensual porn porn being but like,
I think there's just a call for like being better
because we did get educated and now with the Internet,
this generation is like the most educated. I mean, I
was just thinking about how Harvey Weinstein, you know, maker
(43:04):
of many many Mirramax films made Free to Callow, which
was this you know, supposed supposed to be Prestige filmed
with Sama Hayek, And there's this famous story where he's like,
you need to do a full frontal naked lesbian scene
in the Free to Collo movie or I'm not gonna
make it, And Salma thinks to herself, like, I really
(43:26):
think the story about this woman is important, So I
guess I'm gonna do this sort of softcore porn scene
that makes absolutely no fucking sense again because people like
Harvey Weinstein were in charge, and I feel like it's
more of a pushback to that or even going to
swarm where they think, like, you know, this sex scene
is kind of really glorifying the male character, and Chloe
Bailey's character isn't. It's a very like male sex scene again,
(43:50):
and they're sort of like, what about her consent?
Speaker 4 (43:52):
Why does she have to be used like this.
Speaker 3 (43:54):
Granted I don't think they're understanding it's fake, but that
sort of nuance of like this is so silly, But
it's like they've been taught about consent and me too
an assault and being better, but also not how to
still be sexy or how to still like go forward
with it, And so it probably does feel like a
very like just don't do that type of situation.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Or that it could be a statement. I actually haven't
seen swarm, but like swarm, but like it could be
a statement about like, you know, every film character is
not meant to be a model of virtue, right Like,
sometimes you're showing bad people doing bad things or like
and the like that. I feel like that becomes a
(44:35):
problem when you're not allowed to do that without being
seen as like approving of the behavior that you're depicting
in the movie.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Right that.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
Yeah, and I feel like I've seen that a lot too,
which kind of goes again to like the nuance and
art and how like that has sort of that conversation
I feel like has gotten so stilted in places like TikTok,
whereas in other forums it's still alive.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
Right, let's take a quick break, real quick and we'll
come back and keep talking about this.
Speaker 2 (45:02):
We'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
And we're back, and Miles, I think you're about to taskol.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Oh just yeah. I mean, like you know, the other
thing is like we're just kind of the evolution. I
just think of like where I got my sexy imagery
as someone born in the eighties, like through you know,
like coming of age and then like late nineties aughts
and things like that, and it feels like at a
certain point, like it would be like, oh, a Van
Damn movie is gonna have movies in it, Like that
(45:37):
was a shorthand in my mind, like you you were
like conditioned to know like certain directors, actors, whatever, like
there would be that sort of thing and then you
But but then like a lot of the sex or
sexual content just really kind of shifted to like our
popular culture, like it didn't have to live in these
sort of movies like basic Oh what about basic instinct
(45:57):
kind of thing. It's like it's in my music video,
it's in the advertisements, it's on cable TV at night.
So it's almost like I don't know if it's like
also again, this sort of diversification of where that sort
of content lived to the points that it literally omni sexual,
like everywhere was sex. So that also feels like another
(46:19):
point where I guess the appeal of it only getting
it directly from film begins to wane a bit.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
Yeah, and also like if you're like, Okay, check out
this van dam sexy scene, or I can go to
my OnlyFans of a real person who is alive who's
doing my niche fetish and will look into the eyes
of the camera.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
And say my name right, yeah, what you know what
I mean? So when you go back to a VANDAM movie,
you're like boring Seid, move it along, like.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Yeah, I was just thinking of remember when Seth MacFarlane
did that Oscar song called boobs. Yeah the movies you
can see boobs in And that was twenty thirteen and the.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
Response was like yawn like on like yeah, that's all.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
You're in it for, and it's like shitty to treat
women that way, and it's like I'm still I'm still
here for a song, like I still need to get
to a place where like Seth McFarland can sing a
song about full frontal dick and he's got thirty movies
to reference, Like I think I've got one, you.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Know, were there, Harvey Kaitel, Yeah, yeah, you go. I
mean so I do still think it's interesting. So like
the miles you were talking about, like they made it
did an analysis in the early two thousands and found
that like nudity was not something that drove money making,
and I think rather than just that being always true,
(47:43):
I think that's probably an indicator of like changing tastes
in like filmgoers. And like the whole thesis that I
have about movies is like, yes, they're like commercial ventures,
but they people pay money to go see them because
they are getting to see something that is happening that
they can't really access inside them up on the screen, right,
(48:05):
And so like that's why I think it's interesting that
like early two thousands, like as the country was becoming
like explicitly fascist in the War on Terror, and you
know that that was a time when suddenly people were like, yeah, yeah,
we don't we don't want to see this shit. And
I agree, like it definitely has to do with like
that there became there like suddenly there were better places
(48:27):
to get that. But I also I don't know, like
there it does feel like they're one of these articles
from I think slash Film was saying that it it's
there's been like sort of an internalization of the PG
thirteen rating when it comes to like our movies, where
that's just kind of what people expect from movies. And
(48:53):
I do think that there's like I think that happened
because corporations came through and like overtook everything, you know,
Like the big example that this blood Knife article uses,
the Bloo Knife article that we'll link off to on
the footnotes is called Everyone's Beautiful and Nobody's horny or
something to that effect, and it's about like superhero movies
(49:15):
where everybody you know is just trained within just like
an inch of like perfection, just like and that does
that goes forward the superhero, it also goes for like
the FBI agent and the background character, and you know,
like that that's just how everybody is supposed to look perfect.
(49:36):
But then our favorite filmmakers, this guy whose movies take
place in a world where like dreams don't have sex
in them, And I think that there is something to
the idea that like so fascist art, like when you
look at like what was popular in Nazi Germany, like
the films of Lenny reech install with like the these
(50:00):
documentaries where they would like glorify the human body and
particularly the male body and like its strength and muscles,
but like completely it was all about power dynamics, right,
it was nothing about sex, and in fact, like sex
was like to be completely removed from the equation. And
(50:21):
I feel like there is like we obviously those movies
also had like Hitler and it was like and all
of the sexual energy is to be like sublimated to
your religious fealty to the furor and like that.
Speaker 4 (50:36):
Horny for Hitler only, horny for Hitler only.
Speaker 1 (50:39):
And now it feels like it is done to sublimate
to like the broader just kind of ideals of capitalism,
and like the the fact that there's like an internal
understanding of like, yeah, why would they put like iron
Man fucking in this movie? Like it wouldn't make as
much money. And I root for this movie because like
(50:59):
that that's my team is Marvel and so like, and
Marvel is winning against DC, and so I don't know,
I think it's interesting. I don't think it is like
I don't think it's a telltale symptom that like America
is headed towards some sort of fascism with like a
central fascist leader. But I do think it says something
(51:22):
interesting about our relationship to this all consuming, like capitalistic
ideal where it's like, yeah, no, we just take the
sex out of everything, because like that is not actually
making money for the thing that we want to see
make money. And we're all on board with that, not
just David Zaslov, Like we're all on board with that
(51:43):
because it doesn't like I can just get my sexual
content elsewhere.
Speaker 4 (51:47):
I'm going to say, I'm gonna push back on it.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
Yeah, having written in late night comedy for I can't now,
I'm trying to do the math. I don't know, but
I feel like the like, are we turning fascist think
pieces like make the Rounds every three years, you know
what I mean?
Speaker 4 (52:04):
And it's like are we are?
Speaker 2 (52:05):
We?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
Are we to the point where like it's not even
gonna matter because the term fascist now means something different
to everyone. It's lost all meaning, Like we're never gonna know,
you know what I mean, It's gonna be here and.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
No one will have any understanding on it.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
But taking this back to where we started the Bachelor,
I will bring us into my main basis for this
argument which is that the Bachelor is dying a slow death.
It's definitely slow, but it's just every season it's dying.
Speaker 4 (52:37):
It's dining time.
Speaker 3 (52:38):
And this last year we got reality shows about dating,
like Love Is Blind, like The Ultimatum, Queer Love, which
is Milf Manner one if the.
Speaker 4 (52:47):
Best shows I've ever watched, would you say.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
Miles, I said Manner, Milf Manner.
Speaker 4 (52:52):
I did watch every episode, Yes I did.
Speaker 3 (52:55):
And that's actually a great one to reference because in
the Ultimate Queer Love, they've got cameras on and you,
I mean, you're watching porn for a second, and you're
watching porn if someone you've intimately gotten to know like
all their relationship issues, and that show was wildly popular,
and on TikTok, the discourse about queer love stories and
(53:18):
like there was an entire storyline of like, you fingered
the woman I'm in love with and where's your fingers go?
When did they start? And how did it happen? Is
that considered sex? And then there's a conversation of like, everyone,
you know what I mean? Is that penetrative sex or
not to be count that as sex? What is the
consent needed for finger sex versus other sex yous and
you're like and TikTok is like going nuts and loving
this conversation. And everyone is loving that show. And I
(53:40):
think it's because it was it was showing sex in
the way that we understand and want to see it now,
which is like real authentic. It's not through this like
very singular patriarchal lens.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
Even on like Love Islands, they live in bikinis.
Speaker 3 (53:55):
They live in bikinis, and they switch partners every other
day for fifty episodes every season, and it's crushing it,
Like Love is Blind, you know, they talk about are
they I mean sex are they not? Meanwhile, the Bachelor,
which is a very sterile show, which would fit this
sort of like fascist thing where it's like overnight sweets,
like the door closes and like who knows is dying
a death.
Speaker 4 (54:16):
In popularity and so interesting.
Speaker 3 (54:19):
If we look to reality TV, I would say we
are still very much here for sex, but we're no
longer here for it in the ways that are harmful. Yeah,
like it's it doesn't feel good. And then if sex
scene is to like make you feel sexy, you don't
want to feel bad while you're watching it.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Yeahh So maybe my ultimate Plya is like that movies
do something interesting with their sex scenes because that's what
people want. And it's not that people are necessarily fascist, yo,
that they just want something interesting and not like the
traditional eighties movie sexy.
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Yeah, to Chelsea's point, like again, I was raised on
the Buck Wild movie sex scenes, you know what I mean.
And then you know, the internet kind of was like
I was like, Okay, I think I know what I
like and to the point to nuance, like now I'm like,
how come they not kissing in this porno. I'm like, nah, nah,
I'm off this, Like y'all need to be making out
as shit, like I need to, like I want to
(55:14):
see y'all be passionate, right or y'all Like in Bridgerton,
I just started watching the second see there's like one
moment where this one character she just says she said,
mister Bridgerton, and they just have like a look at
each other, and I was like, oh shit, like and
then they say shit, except like there was just a
very tense moment and the release was just saying it
(55:34):
and they shared a look and I was even like, damn,
that was all right, Like yeah.
Speaker 3 (55:38):
We're like you're just like doing it well, you know,
like that was hot and I didn't need to just
see you coldly simulate motions.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
Right right exactly, like making the back of the beast
with two backs, as it were. And I think, yeah,
we're I think because we've moved on from just being like,
will they show sex? They do yes, And then once
everyone now this is I do want to say this
is a direct attack on me, because that is a
direct quote from something I said earlier before we started rowling.
(56:07):
So I didn't do the fist pump though, Like I
didn't do the double fist pump, yes, but like yeah
that now we're so like, you know, it's like when you, like,
you're you get introduced to a new cuisine. In the beginning,
anything will do, and then as you formulate tastes, you're like, no, actually,
I'm like, it's not just about having you know, steak
or whatever or whatever. You know, you just you begin
(56:28):
to actually understand what it is that is appealing to you.
And I think, yeah, I think it's like it's just
sort of simultaneous cultural evolution along with the amount of
things we've been exposed to that kind of puts us
in this different place and I think.
Speaker 3 (56:41):
It's the problem with art meeting capitalism right now, especially
as like we're in the writer strike and the whole
like you go woke, you Go broke movement, which is
that like people come in and try and quantify it
and do the data and the statistics and what's selling
when what's not selling and actually this is in and
that is in blah blah.
Speaker 4 (56:58):
But like the thesis is good, we would love a
good movie.
Speaker 3 (57:04):
We would love a good movie, and the moment we
get a good movie, they go, oh, do that again,
do that again? Or like, you know, network television was dead,
then Abbot Elementary comes up, right, it was it was good.
Speaker 4 (57:14):
Right, everyone goes.
Speaker 5 (57:16):
Workplace comedies, right, workplace comedies, and you're like, oh, okay,
so that's nuts.
Speaker 4 (57:22):
That was not the only thing that made that show good,
you know. And I just.
Speaker 3 (57:25):
Feel like people want really great art and every time
it shows up, they're gonna love it, and every time
it's shitty, they're gonna hate it. And then people are
gonna drain it down into headline pieces of what could
sell more or less, and they're gonna miss the point,
which is that if it's good, it sells, and if
it's bad.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
It does not right.
Speaker 1 (57:41):
Yeah, that's right. Well, Chelsea, such a pleasure having you.
Speaker 2 (57:45):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (57:46):
I knew I would learn a lot. I did learn
a lot.
Speaker 3 (57:48):
Were you guys horny the whole episode? I just need
to know, like, you know, was it a horny episode
for you guys?
Speaker 1 (57:54):
I was quaking? I mean you could then see that
I was quaking.
Speaker 2 (57:57):
Yeah, yeah, I feel that for Justin, he's gonna have
to cut out.
Speaker 1 (58:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (58:00):
I was an edgelord the whole time, So.
Speaker 2 (58:04):
Shout out the goon everybody gooning out there. Yeah, it
was all I was all Sax music in the background, playing.
Speaker 1 (58:12):
Where can People Find You? Follow You? All that good stuff.
Speaker 4 (58:15):
Oh my gosh, please come listen to my podcast.
Speaker 3 (58:17):
It's called Celebrity book Club with Chelsea Devantes, but it's
so much more you guys. We discuss female celebrity memoirs.
We also do some pop culture stuff. I inspired by
you guys. I did an entire Bachelor episode talking about
politics and where we're at now, and someone pointed out
to me that in our Republican years is when we
had our worst bachelors too.
Speaker 4 (58:37):
It's you know, the method. Still I am.
Speaker 3 (58:41):
I am our data scientists on elections and so anyway,
come listen there. And I'm on Instagram at Chelsea Devantes
and I do like I post things from books and
stuff and have conversations over there.
Speaker 1 (58:52):
Yeah. Is it? Wait, so that the thesis is that
when the Bachelor is bad, we elect Republicans.
Speaker 4 (58:59):
No, no, it's when we have Republicans in office. Is
also cultural times.
Speaker 3 (59:06):
Where we are enjoying shittier bachelors who break the rules
and are only out for themselves and are selfish peace shit,
but they're so entertaining, So.
Speaker 4 (59:14):
Like Pete's the pilots, you know.
Speaker 3 (59:16):
Like if you just look at our Trump bachelor's, they're
the worst of all time and they're very selfish dudes.
Speaker 1 (59:22):
Oh interesting, So maybe that's due to casting on the
part of the producers of the Bachelor.
Speaker 3 (59:28):
Well yeah, and I think thinking of like like where
we're at, Like Ari, You guys remember Ari as a bachelor.
They brought him back and he like does the old
switcher roo at the end. You guys are nodding, but
you have no idea what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (59:39):
Before I remember because Anna no, Anna would regularly play
because what's Ari's last name? It's like Louis. It's like
a food Oh is that.
Speaker 4 (59:48):
One ari gray hair? Race car drivers?
Speaker 2 (59:51):
Oh yeah yeah they race car driver guy? Yees yeah
yeah yeah, yes, I'm savvy. I'm savvy.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (59:56):
Colton, who was like in the closet, did an entire
season as a fully gay man choosing one woman.
Speaker 4 (01:00:02):
He then stalks her.
Speaker 3 (01:00:03):
She has to take out her string order on him,
and then he's like, I've been gay the whole time,
Like wow, this is where we were at in the
Trump years.
Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
Right, hey, do we get our first black bachelor and
the Trump lay hear it too?
Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
Right? Yes we did.
Speaker 3 (01:00:18):
And that's also when we got our racial Reckoning season
where they brought in one black guy to host the
reunion and then guess what he left never has never
been heard from again. They brought him in for the
Racial Reckoning then sent him away.
Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Anyways, what was I saying? Follow me on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Actually get more takes like that? Is there a work
of media you've been enjoying?
Speaker 4 (01:00:41):
Oh my gosh so much?
Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
You know what, let's just give a shout out to
milf manor it is not what you think.
Speaker 4 (01:00:47):
It is it is because it starts and.
Speaker 3 (01:00:50):
They're like, you're gonna be dating young men, and they're like,
that's tight. And then the gate opens and it's all
of their sons. Okay, so it's all of their sons.
And then they're like, and you're gonna share room with
your son, but you're gonna date the other sons of
these other ladies here, and you're like, this is maniacal.
And by the end of the episode, they've all like
they're all just kind of like teaching their sons about
(01:01:11):
like how to put a condom on a banana.
Speaker 1 (01:01:14):
Oh wow.
Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
It's also one of the worst made reality shows I've
ever seen, Like there's no host. It feels like it
feels like Lord of the Flies, with like weird, incestuous
prompts that they have to do.
Speaker 4 (01:01:26):
Yes, they send them a text message like read this lab.
Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
They're like, all right, I guess we're gonna go to
commercial break now, and then we come back.
Speaker 4 (01:01:32):
We're gonna put on Blindfeldt's We're gonna fiel up our sons.
We're trying and choose which one is my son.
Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
Oh, this is definitely him.
Speaker 3 (01:01:39):
Oh, this is my son, this is my boy.
Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
There's some moments where I'm like, they've destroyed my mind.
Completely like in ways that I did not I did
not expect, and I think I'm know because of the
depravity or whoever was behind anyway, it's out there.
Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
This this episode has been the greatest add for trash
reality television.
Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
Maybe ever.
Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
I'm about I guess we should ask the question like
if Germany had access to trash television, like is the
whole Third Reich avoided?
Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
Maybe well, we'll trash television save us or bring us
our next president.
Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
That's right, Miles, where can people find you as their
working media? You've been enjoying at Miles of Gray where
they got at symbols.
Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
Find Jack and Iron a basketball podcast Miles and Jack
got Mad Boosties. If you like trash realities, guess what
check Sophia Alexander out on four to twenty Day Fiance
where we talk about ninety day Fiance, which is also
pretty garbage. And then if you like some true crimes,
you can still catch me on The Good Thief talking
about the Greek robin Hood and all that. I don't
(01:02:45):
have a piece of media, but I've been watching the
newest season of How To with John Wilson, and there
was a couple of moments where I've been like wow, wow, wow,
wow wow. Anyway, it's it's always an interesting show, so
maybe check that out.
Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
A tweet I've been enjoying is actually Ben Rosen at
Ben Underscore. Roseen tweeted John Wilson narrating the Zapruder film,
so you decide to go for a drive, but not
everyone thinks that's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
Wow, dude, the delivery on that.
Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
And Pat Tobin retweeted an image so that I don't
know who made this, but I think about it a lot,
and it's a side by side the sky and scenic locations.
It's just a blue sky the sky at grocery stores
and it's like this gorgeous, dramatic cloud sunset which just
resident like totally rang true to me. I've seen some
of the greatest skies of my life doing the most boring,
(01:03:46):
like mundane shit in my life and then you like
go on vacation to someplace and it's just blue skys.
So anyway, fuck blue skies, is what I'm saying. Wow,
the shout out to grocery stores. You can find me
on Twitter, Jack Underscore Obrian you can find us on
Twitter at daily zeitgeist 're at the Daily Zeichgeist on Instagram.
We have a Facebook fan page and a website, Daily
(01:04:07):
Zeitgeist dot com, where we post our episodes and our
footnote or link off to the information that we talked
about in today's episode, as well as a song that
we think you might enjoy. Miles Lit's song do you
think people might just.
Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
You know, something nice get us into the week? This
is George Ben j O R G E D E N.
And this track is called Dominga's It's so dope. George
Ben is one of my favorite Brazilian artists. I'll never
I'll keep saying that every time someone asks me that.
And his singing's fantastic, Like the beginning has like a
really dope you know, like I feel like if I
(01:04:41):
was sampling, i'd sample that first maybe twenty seconds. But anyway,
Dominga's by George Benn.
Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
All right, we will link off to that in the footnotes.
The Daily zeit Geist is the production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from My Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
That's gonna do it for us this morning, back this
afternoon to tell you what is trending, and we will
talk to y'all that fight.
Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
Jay Horny
Hello the Internet, and welcome to season three oh one,
Episode one of DALY'SAI Guys Day production of iHeartRadio. This
is a podcast where we take a deep to dive
into america shared consciousness. And it is Tuesday, August twenty second,
twenty twenty three. You've been waiting for us to get
to this day, so the week can tell you that.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
It is, of course, National Pecan tort Day. There's so
many days for peacans.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Man, the con farmers have gotten to the National Day
industrial Complex.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
We'll go alright while you're you know, enjoying all those
sweet sweets. Don't forget. It's also National Tooth Fairy Day.
Shout out the Tooth Fairy Union. National Surgical on College
this day, Fuck cancer, shout out to the surgeons, though
that'd be trying to battle it. National Boo Day, International
Day of commemorating the Victims of Acts of Woya, my god,
it's so long acts of violence based off religion or belief.
(00:50):
That's a tall one. And what's one more? Just to
make it super fun? The last one is National Being
Angel Day.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Just being Angel? Yeah, hey, every day nation will be
an Angel Day for you, sweethearts. Thanks, hey, my name
is Jack O'Brien aka don't go Chase and Zaz love Balls.
Just stay on the picket line until that asshole pays you.
I know that you're gonna have to compete with AI y'all,
(01:21):
but I think that strokes are so bad. That is
Curtzy a Fighter of the Night Man underscore AAA on
the discord, and I'm thrilled to be joined as always
by my co host mister Miles.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Grad Miles Gray AKA, and I've fable ten thousand miles
and I'll trivele ten thousand more to be the world's
most renowned auctioneer. I will tribal ten thousand miles or more.
Shout out to no clue when I catch up on
the discord for combining you know the the Proclaimers track
(01:56):
with that State Center is Holden Moore. Food basically wrote
his entire Wikipedia article and had to shout out the
fact that he's traveled seventy five thousand miles doing auction
Oh yeah, that's right, yeah, while also trying to cover
for Donald Trump.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
It counts every mile that he travels. I respect that.
Actually that you just never get over it, like, look
how far we're going.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I mean, if you really want to stunt, like, you know,
we could, we could pull the passports out, young man.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
You know, businessmen do love to do that shit too.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Be like, oh yeah, the.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Status dude.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
The fucking airport any fucking like airport bar, You'll see
two dicks in suits being like, yeah, like, you know,
I just got I just got my million miler shot
as so you know I'm back status dude. Yeah, taking
my family down a Tobali next week. So yeah, got
to get the tripped miles.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah. Thrilled to be joined in our third seat by
a brilliantly talented filmmaker writer. She was one of the
head writers for the Problem with John Stewart and wrote
on Girls five, Have a Blessed, This Mess, The Opposition
with Klepper, among many others. She wrote, directed, and starred
in the acclaimed short film Basic Hosts the podcast Celebrity
book Club. It's Chelsea Davanta.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Oh Hi, intro like shouting my name into a cave,
you know, seeing what echoes.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Back to a cave full of the entire Internet. So
that's right, the whole damn Internet is here to welcome you.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
On the I'm feeling very blessed to be back here
and continue some very important discussions.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Yes always yeah, So this is this is our Tuesday
episode where we kind of take a look at one
specific topic that we think kind of undergirds the whole zeitgeist.
That's important to understanding the zeitgeist.
Speaker 3 (03:50):
Undergirds are what I use instead of spanks, so very.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
They were the free date spanks. That's right, what's my underds?
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean, so we wanted to have
you on. You had one of our favorite observations in
the history of the show when you you basically said
that you knew Trump was going to win the twenty
sixteen election based off of watching The Bachelor, and then
you explained why and it made perfect sense and looking
(04:22):
at pop culture tea leaves and like reading what it acted,
like what is actually being said about what's happening to
people on the inside, what has gone on with our
shared dreams is one of my favorite subjects. You are
really good at it. We love to do it on
the Zeitgeist, and so we wanted to have you on
to do just that, and we'll get into what specifically
(04:47):
we're talking or actually we can do that now, I
mean we throughout stan culture being the new religion. We've
talked about that before, but this one subject keeps popping
up on social media. Popped up over the weekend after
we had selected this subject, and that is kind of
like the desexualization of pop culture. Movie sex scenes in
(05:10):
particular seem to be like a particular thing that is
that people are objecting to lately and are like, why
do these exist? When I watch an eighties movie? Why
does dan Aykroyd get a blood job from a ghost?
For instance? And that one's actually a really good question.
(05:30):
But anyways, there's all sorts of things we've talked about before.
The idea that like desexualized beautiful bodies is like actually
a feature of fascist art, and so we've puzzled over
whether that's what we're seeing here. But there's lots of
As this has become more and more of a mainstream
(05:50):
thing that we're seeing on social media, there's lots of explanations,
and we thought you were the best person to have
to have on the show to talk about this.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
I'm I'm thrilled to be here to talk about like
very hot sexy bodies not having sex. No, but I
was so fascinated you guys chose this because it's also
something I've been thinking about a lot. Also just as
like a side topic and where I'm coming from. I was,
you know, the writers are on strike right now, but
before we were on strike, I was pitching a show
(06:22):
and one of the demographics it was going out to
it was gonna be like part for millennials, part for
gen Z. Sort of this basically like late twenties early
thirties audience that people seem to think millennials and gen Z.
Speaker 4 (06:36):
Are just like so so so different.
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So when you're pitching for like that late twenties early thirties,
executives start referencing studies like the ones we're going to
talk about, like gen Z actually isn't having in sex anymore,
so like like can one of these characters just like
not have a partner of any kind and they just
sort of like live in a hole and they stare
at a wall because that's what we assume gen Z
is doing. And it was so frustrating because every time
(07:02):
I looked around, be it from people in my.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Real life, the youth of the real life.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
TikTok, social media, really anything, I just kept feeling like
that is not true at all, even in gen Z
reality shows, like they are getting engaged, they are getting married,
they're talking about dating kind of like the same way.
You've always had this feeling of like, you know, I
want to be having good sex, but I'm not.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I don't know if that's something particular.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
To be in my friends, but like I remember in
my early twenties it was like, yeah, we would like
to be having sex, but no one's having sex, like
sex in the city. Like that just feels like the
twenties thing, unless, of course, you know, I'm sure some
people were. But anyways, all to say that, like I
really think about these studies that are being referenced, like
gen Z is like this, and dah da da is
like this, And all I keep thinking about is like
(07:50):
who's doing these studies?
Speaker 4 (07:52):
And maybe gen Z is just not participating.
Speaker 3 (07:55):
Yeah, you know what, we're actually not going to answer
the polls about like what we've been fucking lately. We're
just not because I just don't think they're correct. But
I would love to hear what you guys think.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
It's like the political polls that are like, man, these
elderly people certainly over index. They seem like they're doing great,
and it's like, well, how did you conduct this? Calling
land lines exactly exactly?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
It's like, oh, I guess we didn't predict the election
correctly off of the hundred landlines. And then the I mean,
how weird do you have to be to pick up
the phone these days? Who is answering the phone? We're
trusting them with our polling data. The people who answer
an unknown number, I don't trust them.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
We actually asked a bunch of gen Z people's grandparents
about their sexual behavior, and this is what they told me.
Speaker 4 (08:41):
This is what they told us. Yeah, I just I
think so anyways, I do.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
But what I do think is a really interesting discussion
with this fascism thing is. And the thing that I've
been feeling is that I'll say, as a millennial to
the gen Z's is perhaps lacking new one discourse nuance,
which I don't know how. I mean, how close do
you think lack of nuance and understanding nuance is to
(09:09):
turning fascist?
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Right?
Speaker 4 (09:11):
You know?
Speaker 3 (09:12):
On the nuance to fascist spectrum. I do think we're
somewhat close, But I don't think it's fascism. I think
it's nuanced.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's probably true. We have talked
before speaking of David Zaslove that he's a real gen
zer because when he saw flea bag, he paused it
and told everyone that we're if we're either going to
turn this trash off for the sex scenes or we're
just gonna watch it, and nobody's allowed to look at
(09:37):
me while we watch it, don't. So he was very
scandalized by a second.
Speaker 3 (09:41):
I'm sure he didn't want people to look at him
as he was just coming egregiously flee back.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Eyes off. Yeah, hands free, watch hands free, hands up,
hands up, still laughing, how how well.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I think that's also another good point though, of like,
people like Zaslov and them are at the top of
of our TV pop culture right now.
Speaker 1 (10:03):
So it is plugged in, I.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Can just finish listen.
Speaker 4 (10:07):
Yes, that's exactly what I was going to say. God,
he wants to look cool so bad.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
I saw him wearing three popped collared shirts the other day.
Three So that's a jacket. That's a shirt, and then
there was another shirt underneath three and all of them
popped collars, and then the little pockets on the jacket popped.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
I said, come on, my dog.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
But anyways, all to say that, like, normally, I think
we look at pop culture and it can really reflect
what you were saying, reflect back on to like culture culture.
But right now I'm feeling that actually only reality TV
and social media can accurately do that, because people like
Zaslov have been making television decisions for a good five
years and they're not accurately reflecting culture anymore.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
Interesting. All right, well we are. That's what we're going
to be talking about in the second and third act.
First we were there first. That's something from your We
need to get to know you better. Oh my god,
I get to know you. We do like to ask
our guests, what's something from your search history that's revealing
about who you are? Sir?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
You know what?
Speaker 4 (11:10):
I'll do it live? Do you know what I mean? Yeah,
I'll go in live.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Oh well, we're gonna get to it. But Chloe Bailey,
patiently responding to swarm sex scene backlash, I was an
article I'd read a while ago, but cue it up
for our conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Got it, got it? Got it?
Speaker 1 (11:31):
What is something you think is overrated?
Speaker 4 (11:33):
Okay, here we go. Stay with me on this.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
So I was getting very nostalgic for magazines US weeklies,
people holding it in your hands, someone basically curating your
feed for you and telling you this is what people
are paying attention to. So my husband got me a
subscription to US Weekly and I was like, yes, back
in the saddle, here we go. And I know it's like, okay,
print media is dying, blah blah.
Speaker 5 (11:58):
Blah, but wow, oh my god, has this magazine taken
such a turn to the point where even if we
don't rate US Weekly highly anymore, whatever it is is
still too high. Like in the magazine they are now
printing celebrities own Instagram photos.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Wow, okay, so.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Yes, paper Instagram, but like sometimes like out of date.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
So it's like, over the course of six months, Selena
Gomez posted a photo with a fish, and then someone
else did, and now there's just a page in US
Weekly being like, look, sometimes celebrities fish and it's like
I already saw that on Instagram and you just like
put it through your printer, Like what's happening.
Speaker 4 (12:45):
Do we not pay paparazzis anymore? Do they not have
the money for that?
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Like?
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Are we not curating like thoughts throughout the fish photos?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
It's just And then I started going through all of
it and like the just they're just like us, that's
it's just they're just printing Instagram.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
Still, I couldn't believe.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
I remember it used to be like the paparazzi things
like you go to sprouts, you know whatever.
Speaker 3 (13:05):
Now they're like, oh, look Chrissy Cheekan dances in her
living room. It's like, yeah, because she's holding the camera herself,
what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Oh wow?
Speaker 3 (13:13):
As soon as I just couldn't believe it was still
a magazine, and then they're like atoning for their crimes,
Like do you guys remember when two celebrities would be
caught wearing the same dress and they'd be like who
wore it better? And they it'd be like one percent
for me and a Suvari.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Like you know, everyone thinks you look like shit.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
You look like shit in this dress.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
And so now they're sort of like they've learned like, oh,
we're not you know, we're not supposed to like pen
women against each other.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
And so now they just put a little thing that
says twining.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Oh but.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Boo boo, tell me a story, do something interesting, Like
I get that. I like, yeah, like, don't put them
against each other, but like that was it twiny? They
just they just past photos of them and is going
twinning and then the silent part is better?
Speaker 2 (14:04):
Yeah, you know which twin do you prefer?
Speaker 4 (14:07):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (14:07):
And the comedians used to make fun of fashion in
the back, like the back page, just to be sad
pathetic comedians like myself being like tent dress, I'd go
camping in that, you know, something like that. And now
it's people being like, mules are very in, pink is in?
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Color? Is a color that's in this season?
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Bright green? Are you missing out on the Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:31):
I wonder like, do we think this happened because budget
cuts at US Weekly or because there's only one magazine
now and so they like don't have to compete with anybody,
so they're just like I don't fucking care. Let's pretend
green is a new thing.
Speaker 6 (14:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:48):
I you know, I was thinking about it and I
was like, Okay, are they just sort of getting like
is this a thing where most of Americans aren't on
social media? So this magazine is like still helping people,
but like no, like six out of six.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Ten Americans are on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
And I think the four that aren't don't subscribe to
us weekly.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
Yeah, Like the people I know who aren't on social media,
they damn sure don't give a fuck about celebrity culture.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Eve.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
Yeah, they're like on their own shit. They're like, I know,
I'm I operate on a completely different system than.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Other people, exactly.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
And this is where it's like, oh, print media is
going out of business. Well it's like I think they've
been told time of death is in four years, and
they're just trying to like in their lives early. Like
I don't know, I like it's as if they're like,
no one's like that.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah, like I'm not gonna bust my ass as the
factory burns down. I'm gonna fucking just kick it and
just you know, just like we get singed in the corner.
Yeah exactly. We used to every week. I mean we
used to buy all the tabloids shout out bloyd Watch
where we would buy like every tabloid like National Inquirer, Globe,
all that shit, and then all the gossip mags like
People in Touch. And I'm curious now to see, like
(15:54):
I wonder how much the pandemic has changed that coverage,
because even then it was still doing like who wore
it better? Yeah, and other things and just being like
they're just like us. But it was like the old
you know, the paparazzi shots out in Malibu or somebody
wearing big glasses with the Starbucks trained the cup or whatever.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Yeah, she kind of looks sad. I bet she's divorced.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
The best was like, oh dude, this girl paradise. Yeah,
it was a subtext of every photograph, wasn't there. One
was like Brad Pitt touched rape Jennifer Aniston's stomach. They're
fucking pregnant. Yeah, exactly one miles. That was an entire
that was in every magazine for ten and a half years.
Speaker 4 (16:35):
For real, every day she's pregnant.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
She's pregnant. Why would you touch your stomach right after
eating if she wasn't.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I hadn't seen each other for fifteen years, and they're
like shocking new photos suggest that they're back together.
Speaker 3 (16:48):
It's like Angelina Jolie says, he's pretty abusive on a plane.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Jennifer Aniston pregnant with twins.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Yeah, yeah, cut to Jennifer Aniston missed me with that gossip.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
But US Weekly was purchased by American Media, Inc. Which
is the owner of National Inquoir and all that, like
the actual bloids.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, I mean, then it should get juicier.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
I just don't.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
I have to say, Like I listen, I subscribed to
some GUS newsletters and they're so funny. They're so fun
the ones that include pictures fucking ty. If you printed
that out, I would buy it for three ninety nine.
I just like it's as if like they brought in,
they brought in a bunch of granddads to run this
weekly and they're like, I think my wife said there
was uh recipes.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
They almost definitely did, because like what that was one
thing that we noticed about National Inquiry and like the
actual supermarket tabloids was that they seemed to be made
by and for people who were in their eighties, Like truly,
it was just all about like this elderly celebrity might
be dying last days for Dolly like that that was
(18:00):
Every other issue was about how Dolly Parton was dying.
But for the most part it was just old old
people news.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:08):
Yeah, and I guess that's really just the demographic. It's
them and me with a subscription.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
Right, I'll read what is what's something you think is underrated?
Speaker 3 (18:17):
Okay, I'm doing a little like you know, mine go
together like they match.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Reddit, Now again you'll be like, yes, Reddit's really popular, Chelse,
Like what are you talking about? But again, I feel
like a bunch of communians myself included, have always used
Reddit as a punchline as like oh the like the trolls,
the sub humans, you know what I mean, Like who cares?
Speaker 4 (18:42):
What's like happening on Reddit?
Speaker 3 (18:44):
And I have some Google search terms up for my
podcast and I did this Carolyn Callaway Natalie Beach episode
and somehow, you know, one of.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
My Google alerts brought me to a Reddit thread.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Before clicking it, I thought like you're not supposed to
do this, Chelsea, Like this is not Whatever happens from
here is like not gonna go well. And when I
got there, I was like, holy shit, this is some
good discourse. This is some really smart, high level discourse.
And I think there's been a shift. Granted I have
not been real checked in to Reddit, but like on
(19:17):
TikTok comments and Instagram comments and Twitter, they all kind
of like derail the discourse and it always goes into
like your up, You're ugly that and should die like
somehow that always gets there, like within the first fe minutes.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Reddit is for the people.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Who are like we we we want seven hundred characters,
we have something to say, we need a real forum.
And I just I found some really elevated topics in there,
and I was like, I cannot believe I haven't been
living here.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
The whole time.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
It's yeah, it's definitely all about like what subreddits you
go on, Definitely what the energy is of people, because yeah,
some places are just total toxic meltdowns constantly. Like it's
funny even how like sports teams will have different subreddits.
We're like some people are like, nah, that other subreddit
is for like the fucking wishy washy day dreamers who
don't actually know ball. We know shit on this subreddit,
(20:08):
and like you'll even see like people with the same
interest like no, you guys over there, serious shit over here,
or like if you want a shit post, do that there.
But yeah, there really is.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
But really it's like they're yeah, creating internal guidelines, they're
kicking people out to the of the threads. I saw
this thing where it's like, yeah, we don't like I
saw this battle of like, don't call this girl pick me.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
Don't use pick me energy. It's a sexist term. But
I was in a thread for people to shit talk
other probably women.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
I was in the thread where you're like, isn't this
woman so fucking stupid? And someone was like, you are
misusing pick me right right? That is toxic, And I
was like.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Where am I hello, professor?
Speaker 4 (20:51):
Yeah, I just really yeah, I really liked it.
Speaker 1 (20:53):
Yeah. I think that's a really good point. I think
that's a really good underrated because Reddit does, like it
is still used as shorthand and for like dumb internet
like trolls and in cells, and like that's definitely not
exclusively the case or even like largely the case. I
feel like there's usually like if you want to find
a way to like use the Internet that doesn't make
(21:15):
it feel like it's completely broken and your every page
that you go to is taken over by ads. Just
like put a Reddit filter on all your searches. Just
do like whatever you're looking for and then Reddit, and
you're going to have a better time on the Internet.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah. See, how like on Google when people have like
questions about like day to day things, the like when
it auto fills reddit will be like one of them.
They're like how to change car battery Reddit, you know,
then like YouTube because like it's really interesting. I mean,
I'm I'm on Reddit a lot. I you know, obviously
like you go like the shit I'm interested in. I
(21:53):
go I check those subreddits out and it's fantastic. There's
other ones I just like to watch, Like there's one
about economics where like a bunch of economists choke. It's
like you'll never get consensus with like with two economists
in the same room, and then like they just like laugh,
like all high minded economy economic shit, and I'm like,
what the fuck. I'm like this is kind of interesting.
But yeah, there's it's there's truly something for everybody there.
(22:15):
Like I was on a subreddit where people just be
like I just found this thing? What is this? And
then people come in they're like, oh, I've been a
plumber for thirty years. This tools actually used to like
stop a drain or blah blah blah blah blah. People
like whoa.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Yes it was a plunger.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Yeah, it's like this like goes down a drain and
like inflates. It's like when there is and when there
isn't a stop for it. It's like some very specific
plumbing tool. But it just looks like a lightsaber. So
people are like, I.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
Don't know what I just found this ship encrusted lightsaber.
Speaker 4 (22:46):
But yeah, I totally agree.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I think the mob mentality of Reddit is very It
has a higher IQ and EQ than TikTok mob mentality.
I think if you went on TikTok, you're like, yo
with this plunger, people.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
Like you idiot, ye know what this is? And you'd
go on Reddit and they'd be like, we don't talk
like that in this one.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah, well yeah why. There's like some people on subredd
it's called like no dumb questions, like where people go
and there's not like people are like I'm sorry, what
is Selena Gomez? And like a kidney thing I keep
reading about. Please okay, this.
Speaker 4 (23:18):
Sounds like I should go there because I've.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
Got answers for that one.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
Oh yeah, there's another one. Yeah, out of the loop.
You'd probably like because that's another one where people come
in with like pop culture questions and they're like, I'm sorry,
who is D four four VB? The artist?
Speaker 4 (23:32):
I love this?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Yeah, I feel I feel sad for myself that I
missed out on Reddit for so many years because I
just assumed it was like you know what I mean,
it's a lazy punchline of like these losers. It's like, hmmm,
they're pretty smart. They want to type out paragraphs like
that takes.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Yeah, it's pretty smart.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Just don't venture anywhere where like you may be the
topic of conversation.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
That's subreddit specific. To Miles's point, not great place to
find out about Donald Trump if you're just reading from
a Donald Trump reddit sub reddit. Not a great place
to see crimes solved in real time, but then in
absolutely nowhere is good at crowdsourcing crime solutions.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
Good point, But listen, specific genre of books, that's where
I'm at. Get to the book places, influencer snark threads,
you know.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
There there's like foam wah, which is like a Dumois
kind of I don't know, have you seen foam wak?
Speaker 3 (24:28):
Yeah, but you know what, I am so so out
on Dumoi and foam wa because it's like they have
made every single person into a paparazzi.
Speaker 4 (24:38):
And I don't trust half.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Of these paparazzis, you know, I mean, like every time
they're like, hey, guess what you know Toby Maguire is
suing his wife a non please, It's like that could
be that honestly, could be my grandma.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Right.
Speaker 4 (24:52):
Have you read Las Weekly ten years ago and is
like guess what I heard?
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Like it's like, yo, we have to I want to
read the juice and know it's real, and now it's
not because it's just some girl being like SoC Crystalia
without his mask in a coffee.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Shop, right right right boo. Also, yeah, Victor in the
chap brings up going a shower or you know about
shower oranges. No please, this were motherfuckers. They go into
a hot shower and just just just cave man, bite
into an orange.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Not necessarily, it's just they're just saying that you should
eat an orange and in a shower because of the
accommodation of hot shower and cold orange.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Like it was caping for shower oranges right now.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
It was very sexy and yours was very like just
because the posts I read on shower oranges, I'm more
in like, I'm more interested by the ones where people
like guys, I did it.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
I just I just let my animal instincts overcome me,
I just bugged it out with this orange and the
shower and it was beautiful, and they see people like,
would tangerines work?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
I mean, one of the things I like about the
concept of shower oranges is that you can just peel
it and drop it wherever you want, because you know,
shower peels are pretty much waterproof.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
But then you're leaving them there, okay, but then yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It was just the joy of dropping it up later.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Yeah, yeah, I think, yeah, I think it appeals to
like really messy people because it seems like the appeal
is all messy.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
All right.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
I mean, look, I'm not I'm not some you know,
very put together person like that, but I guess it
doesn't appeal to me, Like, yeah, get all gross, but
the water just watches it away. You know, the thing
you hate about the way you want to eat in
real life, which let the food get all over you,
Like I don't.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Maybe, all right, so everybody just wants to just bite
into a watermelon from the outside in, stick your head
through it, and then just like throw the rind everywhere. Right, No, yeah,
that's just all right, moving on pool watermelons. I'm just saying,
all right, let's take a quick break, and when we
(26:55):
come back, we will talk about the de sexualization of
pop culture. Is it a thing? What does it mean?
We'll be right back and we're back. So just a
(27:16):
couple things to kick us off. More and more we're
seeing like these reactions go viral. There was one over
the weekend where a woman describes the movie Oppenheimer and
like that her and her husband wanted to see Oppenheimer,
but they had heard there was a sex scene. You know.
They she looks to be in her I'd say like
(27:36):
late twenties, early thirties, and it's it's just a it's wild.
The way she's talking about the sex scene as if
it's like a thing we can all agree is like
traumatic and not something that like anybody wants to watch,
and like they talk about like how they got through it.
They did their research, they like looked when it was
(27:58):
going to happen, and then they like close their eyes
during it. And this comes. I don't know what her
deal is, what her husband's deal is, if like, you know,
this is part of a long running social media presence
where people know like that they have some past trauma
as a couple or something like that. So I don't
(28:19):
want to dive too much in and be like, what
a weirdo. She also has like a Jesus fish on
her wrist, like tattooed on her wrist, so it could
just be like religious stuff, but like this does seem
to be. I think the reason it's getting so much
traction is people are seeing this as a take more
(28:39):
and more where people are like, finally someone says it
like sex scenes are weird. They make me feel gross.
I don't want to see them, And it came out
a lot with Oppenheimer in particular. But Chelsea, I just
want to open the floor to you on this subject
of like a step from horniness as media consumers.
Speaker 3 (29:05):
Well, first I have to say I haven't been totally
drawn to see Appenheimer, but after that video, now I
really want to go, Like I found myself being like
I have to know what this sex scene is, so
I don't, you know, I don't know where that puts
me perspective, But now I want to see the movie.
Speaker 4 (29:20):
Have you guys seen it? Is it a graphic sex scene?
I'd have to know.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
It's not graphic.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
It's actually like really so if you only have missionary sex, yeah,
it's straight, like the woman's yeah okay, but that was the.
Speaker 4 (29:35):
Most risk thing, and it's it's like nudity, yeah, there's like.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
Yeah, there's there's some nudity. But I actually think like
it feels very strange. Like Christopher Nolan has traditionally been
described as like being somewhat of a sexless filmmaker, Like
he made a movie about people's like going inside people's
dreams and no one, no one sucks at all, Like nobody,
like sex doesn't even inside these people's dreams. Sex doesn't
(30:02):
really exist inside most of his movies, I would say,
other than like the Joker character is kind of the
most fuckingest character that like he has and like any
of his movies in the sense that like he is
like this kind of creep but like at least there
is a sexual energy with the Joker. But anyways, this
(30:24):
seemed like he was responding to that and being like, oh, yeah,
I can't do a sex scene and it just feels
it is a weird sex scene. The first one is
really like it feels almost like self parody to me.
I don't know if I went in with a if
I went in being like I'm going to hate this
Christopher Nolan sex scene. But I think he's trying to
(30:48):
fight against the idea that his movies are dead sexually
and he failed.
Speaker 4 (30:51):
It sounds like he failed.
Speaker 2 (30:53):
I think he did.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
But I also I think he's popular, at least partially
because his movies take place in a sexless universe, and
I think people want that from their movies, like the
blockbuster movies.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Well, it's yeah, there's so many one after that description,
no two after that description. I want to see it
even more. I just have to know, I have to know.
It's the only thing that has brought me to this movie.
But yeah, there's so many threads to connect on this,
but kind of the The number one thought that comes
to my mind is something I talked about with my
one of my best friends, Ashley, who's also a television writer,
(31:26):
which is that prior to this moment in culture, sex
scenes have somewhat always They've always been bad story wise,
so there's never there's almost I'm gonna say Deadpool is
maybe the one exception where like a sex scene actually
had to be there to move the story forward. But
(31:48):
usually sex scenes are like a brief intermission where like,
you know what I mean, because the moment they've gotten
to like kissing. We know, Okay, so we're there story wise,
So if you're gonna show the full sex, like you
just kind of sitting it, and so then it really
is to be a very It's just exists to be
a sexy sex scene, which was way more needed in
previous generations where like that was the only time you
(32:10):
were going to see a sexy, sexy sex scene, right.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yeah, I was wearing the trench coat and times Square. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
I was thinking that like some examples of sex scenes
that needed to exist and that I think should inspire
people to like think more creatively about sex scenes. Is
like Parasite has a really interesting sex scene. Not an
American film, but it like shows this like really wealthy
couple like kind of having this weird sexual encounter on
(32:38):
the couch where they're like fantasizing that they are like
part of this lower class that they looked down on
and suppress. And like I thought that was like a
good that's a good one.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Yeah, that's another going when we were like, oh, there's
like meaning and.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Purpose for yes, But I feel like, yeah, sort of
traditionally and for the most part, sex scenes exist simply
to be sexy and they don't move anything forward, and
almost all of them have been written and directed by
you know, white cis men for a hundred years and so,
which and which I'm bringing up to say, like, I
(33:16):
think if our previous canon of sex scenes like had
had any sort of other like sexual lens on them,
that could turn a different portion of people on.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
I wonder if we'd be having this conversation.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
But because of that, people are sort of looking at
this as like, oh, like you can go back and
look at what was I just watching. It was a
it was it was a movie where you're like, oh,
it has a lot of sex scenes and you rewatch
them and you're like, oh, all of them rape scenes.
Speaker 4 (33:43):
Like and you just don't It was a it was
a movie.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
That had let me look hold on it was Sharon
Sharon Stone basics.
Speaker 4 (33:53):
I think it was basic instinct.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
And I'm just like blinded by the most famous part
of that movie and too, but I think it is
basic instinct. But there are other sex scenes in that
movie and they're just all rapes and and but they
but they're films like sex scenes, and so I think
this sort of like pushback to stuff like that is
is built on one hundred years of only one version
(34:15):
of sex being shown on screen.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Yeah, I think like just the other thing as we
were like thinking about the Nolan and like, is he
popular because he's like a particular like sex doesn't exist
in his cinematic universe, and like his sex scene in
Appenheimer seems like it was directed by somebody who's never
had sex. Like I was also thinking about Tom Cruise, who,
(34:39):
like the whole kind of argument against him has always
been this guy has like no sexual charisma, Like he
just like you can't really picture him having sex. Really,
he's like kind of this beautiful creature who doesn't have
any like you can't really picture him. And like the
other sex scene that made me id identify other than
(35:00):
the Appenheimer one, the one that like made me identify
with all the people who are like please stop was
the fucking Top Gun two sex scene where it's like
uh huh, yeah, it's just so weird, Like all of
a sudden, the movie starts to feel like it's an
ad for a retirement home. Like not that they're like
that old, but like the vibe of it is just
like this, like it like feels like a like Viagra commercial,
(35:24):
like totally because yes, it's just like dead and remote
and like takes place in heaven or something. It's really weird.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
And the the you know, the first hop Gun, the
most sexual scene in that movie is a abs at
the beach playing volleyball and they crush it, you know
what I mean. Like, and then in the second movie
they did it again and I don't know if you noticed,
but they had to shoot Tom Cruise like profile and
silhouette shirtless like it was a very like long lens. Yeah,
technically shirtless on the beach, but we're really going to
(35:50):
focus on on miles, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Jeans are super high for no reason that this is
just how people wear their jeans now.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, but they crushed it in that beach scene too,
and where it's like no one is I don't feel
like Yeah, I feel like on the most part, it's
like we can take sexy abs at the beach, but
like actual sexual intercourse, like I don't even know, like
don't film it. It does feel like very uncomfortable, which yeah,
I have to say that when you brought up this
(36:21):
topic because personally, I feel like this is when it
goes into gen Z. I'm sort of out on all
the like gen Z is not having sex. It's like
they were in a pandemic during the years when you
learn how to put your mouth on someone else's face,
so you know what I mean, So like where there's
gonna be a lag and like I you know, I'm
not believing all of these the so called data of
(36:42):
like they don't believe in sexy or I don't think
that's it. But what I do think is true is
that there's been a lot of sexual education, but not
that second step into the nuance of sexual education. So
like things feel very cut and dry, to the point
that in the television show Swarm, which Chloe Bailey was in,
I don't know if you guys saw that, but it
(37:02):
has a very very graphic sex scene in the pilot,
and a bunch of people online truly believed they were
having sex. So they wrote into the television show accounts
and on TikTok to be like why did they make
Chloe Bailey have sex and seem to have no understanding of.
Speaker 4 (37:24):
The art of television.
Speaker 3 (37:25):
Yeah, pantomime, Yes, like pantomime set you guys, it's not happening.
There's like you know, protect sheer protection cups over their parts.
But that's where I'm like, this is a nuanced understanding
mental alacrity, how to look in the real world issue
and less of like what is like we don't like
(37:46):
sex anymore issue, because.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
There's like a few ways to look because I think
of like erotic thrillers, right, And it was like the eighties,
we were you know, the conservatives. Conservatism of the eighties
sort of like helped build up the pressure for like
in the mid eighties for these films to start propping up,
like you know, coming up and people like, oh, actually
fuck with this something by night. The nineties were so
horny and dumb, We're like these are our greatest movies.
(38:13):
And I think like there's an uptake for like a
few reasons after, Like it's just kind of as we
were talking about this and just like researching the topic
and everything is like one really interesting thing is you
point out is like a lot of those erotic thrillers
have like sex can be dangerous, but also these women
are crazy and will kill you. Yeah, And I think
part of that is like the AIDS epidemic was already
(38:34):
making people question the quote unquote dangers of sex or
how sex could lead to like your eventual death right.
And then there's also like this sort of evolution of
sexual agency where like again to your point about these
like male writers and directors, like it almost feels like
for them, they're getting out their anxieties over like an
(38:55):
evolving new form of sexual politics coming out, and like
what does that mean for dudes? Like are they just
gonna fucking kill us?
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (39:03):
And also what sexually turns them on?
Speaker 2 (39:06):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
It's like it's like one dude's fantasy, Like she says no,
but she means yes.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
I said one dude. I meant hundreds of millions of dudes,
but who made all the art? But it's like had
had there been like to take this to the to
the porn conversation, like like it is so hard to
find porn that that that I personally like, I know
this is TMI, but it's more of like a female
thing like and I'm talking about like I don't like
(39:33):
when the house is dirty.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
And I'm not talking about like I like it clean.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
It's just like if there's like a super dirty mattress,
it's just so distracting. It's like like or like put
a sheet on it, you guys, like what is it?
And it's just like the actual ambiance and the actual atmosphere,
and it's like stuff like that isn't thought through. And
I feel like if our history of sex on TV
and film had included other people perspectives of point of
(39:59):
views of what turn them on.
Speaker 4 (40:01):
Yeah, yeah, there wouldn't be such a backlash right now.
Speaker 1 (40:04):
I don't mind a backlash against sex scenes that aren't
doing anything interesting or like see yeah, like like the
Oppenheimer's sex scene, like the or uh not Mission Top
Gun two sex scene, Like I'm fine with people lashing
back against that because it's not doing anything. I just
don't want people to not feel like they can express
(40:25):
that part of the human experience because like there's something
bad about inherently bad about sex scenes as opposed to
like there being something that is inherently bad about how
sex scenes and sexual like energy was expressed in film
up to this point.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
That's really well said.
Speaker 2 (40:42):
Yeah there's I mean like there's other dimensions too, like
when you look at it, like I'm also like, where
does capitalism factor into this too? Because you know, like
there was an analysis of like from just like around
two thousand, like post nine, like right after nine to
eleven to like two thousand and six, like all these films,
and like seeing that sex or nudity like was not
like a like a revenue booster for films at all,
(41:05):
Like it really did nothing, Like it didn't move the
needle at all. And then you think about like, you know,
I guess eyes wide shut. It's just like our sort
of lasser prestige eerotic thriller. And that's two thousand and
there are a couple you know, trickling out after that,
but then you have like Lord of the Rings and
Harry Potter come out, and then the studios are setting like,
(41:25):
oh man, these like broad fucking movies, like we can
just start like these are just money printing things, and
like maybe we just need to go all in on
this shit too. So I know there's like a dimension
of that. But then I also think of like the
taboo element too, which is like to your point, even Chelsea,
of like you know, in the eighties and nineties, like
this was like a date night thing where like you
go like, I don't know, like there's some sexy shit
(41:46):
going on up there, and we don't have to feel
bad because there's no online porn where we can just
kind of like blow the doors open on everything we desire.
So it fills that sort of need. But then there's
also like the taboo where like I remember, as like
a ten year old middle schooler, you would talk about
these movies, not even because they were worked, like it's
like a good movie. You'd be like, did you see it?
(42:07):
Did your parents let you minute and.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
Thirty seconds in on the VHS exactly?
Speaker 2 (42:12):
And become a man? Yeah, you will. You will know
what it looks like if you go to that scene,
like what? And so I feel like for my generation too,
like we were like somewhat educating ourselves in this really
bizarre way with these films. But then also I think we,
like the nineties were so hyper sexual, Like I feel
like it also burned us out to the point where
(42:34):
now you're looking for something a little more nuanced rather
than like, well, when's the part where they're going to
show a topless woman in the movie?
Speaker 3 (42:41):
Totally, And also I think it's sort of that thing
we're talking about, which is like it's just a call
for better art. And also I think there is a
call for better porn, like consensual porn porn being but like,
I think there's just a call for like being better
because we did get educated and now with the Internet,
this generation is like the most educated. I mean, I
was just thinking about how Harvey Weinstein, you know, maker
(43:04):
of many many Mirramax films made Free to Callow, which
was this you know, supposed supposed to be Prestige filmed
with Sama Hayek, And there's this famous story where he's like,
you need to do a full frontal naked lesbian scene
in the Free to Collo movie or I'm not gonna
make it, And Salma thinks to herself, like, I really
(43:26):
think the story about this woman is important, So I
guess I'm gonna do this sort of softcore porn scene
that makes absolutely no fucking sense again because people like
Harvey Weinstein were in charge, and I feel like it's
more of a pushback to that or even going to
swarm where they think, like, you know, this sex scene
is kind of really glorifying the male character, and Chloe
Bailey's character isn't. It's a very like male sex scene again,
(43:50):
and they're sort of like, what about her consent?
Speaker 4 (43:52):
Why does she have to be used like this.
Speaker 3 (43:54):
Granted I don't think they're understanding it's fake, but that
sort of nuance of like this is so silly, But
it's like they've been taught about consent and me too
an assault and being better, but also not how to
still be sexy or how to still like go forward
with it, And so it probably does feel like a
very like just don't do that type of situation.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Or that it could be a statement. I actually haven't
seen swarm, but like swarm, but like it could be
a statement about like, you know, every film character is
not meant to be a model of virtue, right Like,
sometimes you're showing bad people doing bad things or like
and the like that. I feel like that becomes a
(44:35):
problem when you're not allowed to do that without being
seen as like approving of the behavior that you're depicting
in the movie.
Speaker 2 (44:43):
Right that.
Speaker 3 (44:43):
Yeah, and I feel like I've seen that a lot too,
which kind of goes again to like the nuance and
art and how like that has sort of that conversation
I feel like has gotten so stilted in places like TikTok,
whereas in other forums it's still alive.
Speaker 1 (44:58):
Right, let's take a quick break, real quick and we'll
come back and keep talking about this.
Speaker 2 (45:02):
We'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
And we're back, and Miles, I think you're about to taskol.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
Oh just yeah. I mean, like you know, the other
thing is like we're just kind of the evolution. I
just think of like where I got my sexy imagery
as someone born in the eighties, like through you know,
like coming of age and then like late nineties aughts
and things like that, and it feels like at a
certain point, like it would be like, oh, a Van
Damn movie is gonna have movies in it, Like that
(45:37):
was a shorthand in my mind, like you you were
like conditioned to know like certain directors, actors, whatever, like
there would be that sort of thing and then you
But but then like a lot of the sex or
sexual content just really kind of shifted to like our
popular culture, like it didn't have to live in these
sort of movies like basic Oh what about basic instinct
(45:57):
kind of thing. It's like it's in my music video,
it's in the advertisements, it's on cable TV at night.
So it's almost like I don't know if it's like
also again, this sort of diversification of where that sort
of content lived to the points that it literally omni sexual,
like everywhere was sex. So that also feels like another
(46:19):
point where I guess the appeal of it only getting
it directly from film begins to wane a bit.
Speaker 3 (46:25):
Yeah, and also like if you're like, Okay, check out
this van dam sexy scene, or I can go to
my OnlyFans of a real person who is alive who's
doing my niche fetish and will look into the eyes
of the camera.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
And say my name right, yeah, what you know what
I mean? So when you go back to a VANDAM movie,
you're like boring Seid, move it along, like.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Yeah, I was just thinking of remember when Seth MacFarlane
did that Oscar song called boobs. Yeah the movies you
can see boobs in And that was twenty thirteen and the.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
Response was like yawn like on like yeah, that's all.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
You're in it for, and it's like shitty to treat
women that way, and it's like I'm still I'm still
here for a song, like I still need to get
to a place where like Seth McFarland can sing a
song about full frontal dick and he's got thirty movies
to reference, Like I think I've got one, you.
Speaker 1 (47:19):
Know, were there, Harvey Kaitel, Yeah, yeah, you go. I
mean so I do still think it's interesting. So like
the miles you were talking about, like they made it
did an analysis in the early two thousands and found
that like nudity was not something that drove money making,
and I think rather than just that being always true,
(47:43):
I think that's probably an indicator of like changing tastes
in like filmgoers. And like the whole thesis that I
have about movies is like, yes, they're like commercial ventures,
but they people pay money to go see them because
they are getting to see something that is happening that
they can't really access inside them up on the screen, right,
(48:05):
And so like that's why I think it's interesting that
like early two thousands, like as the country was becoming
like explicitly fascist in the War on Terror, and you
know that that was a time when suddenly people were like, yeah, yeah,
we don't we don't want to see this shit. And
I agree, like it definitely has to do with like
that there became there like suddenly there were better places
(48:27):
to get that. But I also I don't know, like
there it does feel like they're one of these articles
from I think slash Film was saying that it it's
there's been like sort of an internalization of the PG
thirteen rating when it comes to like our movies, where
that's just kind of what people expect from movies. And
(48:53):
I do think that there's like I think that happened
because corporations came through and like overtook everything, you know,
Like the big example that this blood Knife article uses,
the Bloo Knife article that we'll link off to on
the footnotes is called Everyone's Beautiful and Nobody's horny or
something to that effect, and it's about like superhero movies
(49:15):
where everybody you know is just trained within just like
an inch of like perfection, just like and that does
that goes forward the superhero, it also goes for like
the FBI agent and the background character, and you know,
like that that's just how everybody is supposed to look perfect.
(49:36):
But then our favorite filmmakers, this guy whose movies take
place in a world where like dreams don't have sex
in them, And I think that there is something to
the idea that like so fascist art, like when you
look at like what was popular in Nazi Germany, like
the films of Lenny reech install with like the these
(50:00):
documentaries where they would like glorify the human body and
particularly the male body and like its strength and muscles,
but like completely it was all about power dynamics, right,
it was nothing about sex, and in fact, like sex
was like to be completely removed from the equation. And
(50:21):
I feel like there is like we obviously those movies
also had like Hitler and it was like and all
of the sexual energy is to be like sublimated to
your religious fealty to the furor and like that.
Speaker 4 (50:36):
Horny for Hitler only, horny for Hitler only.
Speaker 1 (50:39):
And now it feels like it is done to sublimate
to like the broader just kind of ideals of capitalism,
and like the the fact that there's like an internal
understanding of like, yeah, why would they put like iron
Man fucking in this movie? Like it wouldn't make as
much money. And I root for this movie because like
(50:59):
that that's my team is Marvel and so like, and
Marvel is winning against DC, and so I don't know,
I think it's interesting. I don't think it is like
I don't think it's a telltale symptom that like America
is headed towards some sort of fascism with like a
central fascist leader. But I do think it says something
(51:22):
interesting about our relationship to this all consuming, like capitalistic
ideal where it's like, yeah, no, we just take the
sex out of everything, because like that is not actually
making money for the thing that we want to see
make money. And we're all on board with that, not
just David Zaslov, Like we're all on board with that
(51:43):
because it doesn't like I can just get my sexual
content elsewhere.
Speaker 4 (51:47):
I'm going to say, I'm gonna push back on it.
Speaker 3 (51:49):
Yeah, having written in late night comedy for I can't now,
I'm trying to do the math. I don't know, but
I feel like the like, are we turning fascist think
pieces like make the Rounds every three years, you know
what I mean?
Speaker 4 (52:04):
And it's like are we are?
Speaker 2 (52:05):
We?
Speaker 3 (52:06):
Are we to the point where like it's not even
gonna matter because the term fascist now means something different
to everyone. It's lost all meaning, Like we're never gonna know,
you know what I mean, It's gonna be here and.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
No one will have any understanding on it.
Speaker 3 (52:19):
But taking this back to where we started the Bachelor,
I will bring us into my main basis for this
argument which is that the Bachelor is dying a slow death.
It's definitely slow, but it's just every season it's dying.
Speaker 4 (52:37):
It's dining time.
Speaker 3 (52:38):
And this last year we got reality shows about dating,
like Love Is Blind, like The Ultimatum, Queer Love, which
is Milf Manner one if the.
Speaker 4 (52:47):
Best shows I've ever watched, would you say.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
Miles, I said Manner, Milf Manner.
Speaker 4 (52:52):
I did watch every episode, Yes I did.
Speaker 3 (52:55):
And that's actually a great one to reference because in
the Ultimate Queer Love, they've got cameras on and you,
I mean, you're watching porn for a second, and you're
watching porn if someone you've intimately gotten to know like
all their relationship issues, and that show was wildly popular,
and on TikTok, the discourse about queer love stories and
(53:18):
like there was an entire storyline of like, you fingered
the woman I'm in love with and where's your fingers go?
When did they start? And how did it happen? Is
that considered sex? And then there's a conversation of like, everyone,
you know what I mean? Is that penetrative sex or
not to be count that as sex? What is the
consent needed for finger sex versus other sex yous and
you're like and TikTok is like going nuts and loving
this conversation. And everyone is loving that show. And I
(53:40):
think it's because it was it was showing sex in
the way that we understand and want to see it now,
which is like real authentic. It's not through this like
very singular patriarchal lens.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
Even on like Love Islands, they live in bikinis.
Speaker 3 (53:55):
They live in bikinis, and they switch partners every other
day for fifty episodes every season, and it's crushing it,
Like Love is Blind, you know, they talk about are
they I mean sex are they not? Meanwhile, the Bachelor,
which is a very sterile show, which would fit this
sort of like fascist thing where it's like overnight sweets,
like the door closes and like who knows is dying
a death.
Speaker 4 (54:16):
In popularity and so interesting.
Speaker 3 (54:19):
If we look to reality TV, I would say we
are still very much here for sex, but we're no
longer here for it in the ways that are harmful. Yeah,
like it's it doesn't feel good. And then if sex
scene is to like make you feel sexy, you don't
want to feel bad while you're watching it.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Yeahh So maybe my ultimate Plya is like that movies
do something interesting with their sex scenes because that's what
people want. And it's not that people are necessarily fascist, yo,
that they just want something interesting and not like the
traditional eighties movie sexy.
Speaker 2 (54:52):
Yeah, to Chelsea's point, like again, I was raised on
the Buck Wild movie sex scenes, you know what I mean.
And then you know, the internet kind of was like
I was like, Okay, I think I know what I
like and to the point to nuance, like now I'm like,
how come they not kissing in this porno. I'm like, nah, nah,
I'm off this, Like y'all need to be making out
as shit, like I need to, like I want to
(55:14):
see y'all be passionate, right or y'all Like in Bridgerton,
I just started watching the second see there's like one
moment where this one character she just says she said,
mister Bridgerton, and they just have like a look at
each other, and I was like, oh shit, like and
then they say shit, except like there was just a
very tense moment and the release was just saying it
(55:34):
and they shared a look and I was even like, damn,
that was all right, Like yeah.
Speaker 3 (55:38):
We're like you're just like doing it well, you know,
like that was hot and I didn't need to just
see you coldly simulate motions.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
Right right exactly, like making the back of the beast
with two backs, as it were. And I think, yeah,
we're I think because we've moved on from just being like,
will they show sex? They do yes, And then once
everyone now this is I do want to say this
is a direct attack on me, because that is a
direct quote from something I said earlier before we started rowling.
(56:07):
So I didn't do the fist pump though, Like I
didn't do the double fist pump, yes, but like yeah
that now we're so like, you know, it's like when you, like,
you're you get introduced to a new cuisine. In the beginning,
anything will do, and then as you formulate tastes, you're like, no, actually,
I'm like, it's not just about having you know, steak
or whatever or whatever. You know, you just you begin
(56:28):
to actually understand what it is that is appealing to you.
And I think, yeah, I think it's like it's just
sort of simultaneous cultural evolution along with the amount of
things we've been exposed to that kind of puts us
in this different place and I think.
Speaker 3 (56:41):
It's the problem with art meeting capitalism right now, especially
as like we're in the writer strike and the whole
like you go woke, you Go broke movement, which is
that like people come in and try and quantify it
and do the data and the statistics and what's selling
when what's not selling and actually this is in and
that is in blah blah.
Speaker 4 (56:58):
But like the thesis is good, we would love a
good movie.
Speaker 3 (57:04):
We would love a good movie, and the moment we
get a good movie, they go, oh, do that again,
do that again? Or like, you know, network television was dead,
then Abbot Elementary comes up, right, it was it was good.
Speaker 4 (57:14):
Right, everyone goes.
Speaker 5 (57:16):
Workplace comedies, right, workplace comedies, and you're like, oh, okay,
so that's nuts.
Speaker 4 (57:22):
That was not the only thing that made that show good,
you know. And I just.
Speaker 3 (57:25):
Feel like people want really great art and every time
it shows up, they're gonna love it, and every time
it's shitty, they're gonna hate it. And then people are
gonna drain it down into headline pieces of what could
sell more or less, and they're gonna miss the point,
which is that if it's good, it sells, and if
it's bad.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
It does not right.
Speaker 1 (57:41):
Yeah, that's right. Well, Chelsea, such a pleasure having you.
Speaker 2 (57:45):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (57:46):
I knew I would learn a lot. I did learn
a lot.
Speaker 3 (57:48):
Were you guys horny the whole episode? I just need
to know, like, you know, was it a horny episode
for you guys?
Speaker 1 (57:54):
I was quaking? I mean you could then see that
I was quaking.
Speaker 2 (57:57):
Yeah, yeah, I feel that for Justin, he's gonna have
to cut out.
Speaker 1 (58:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (58:00):
I was an edgelord the whole time, So.
Speaker 2 (58:04):
Shout out the goon everybody gooning out there. Yeah, it
was all I was all Sax music in the background, playing.
Speaker 1 (58:12):
Where can People Find You? Follow You? All that good stuff.
Speaker 4 (58:15):
Oh my gosh, please come listen to my podcast.
Speaker 3 (58:17):
It's called Celebrity book Club with Chelsea Devantes, but it's
so much more you guys. We discuss female celebrity memoirs.
We also do some pop culture stuff. I inspired by
you guys. I did an entire Bachelor episode talking about
politics and where we're at now, and someone pointed out
to me that in our Republican years is when we
had our worst bachelors too.
Speaker 4 (58:37):
It's you know, the method. Still I am.
Speaker 3 (58:41):
I am our data scientists on elections and so anyway,
come listen there. And I'm on Instagram at Chelsea Devantes
and I do like I post things from books and
stuff and have conversations over there.
Speaker 1 (58:52):
Yeah. Is it? Wait, so that the thesis is that
when the Bachelor is bad, we elect Republicans.
Speaker 4 (58:59):
No, no, it's when we have Republicans in office. Is
also cultural times.
Speaker 3 (59:06):
Where we are enjoying shittier bachelors who break the rules
and are only out for themselves and are selfish peace shit,
but they're so entertaining, So.
Speaker 4 (59:14):
Like Pete's the pilots, you know.
Speaker 3 (59:16):
Like if you just look at our Trump bachelor's, they're
the worst of all time and they're very selfish dudes.
Speaker 1 (59:22):
Oh interesting, So maybe that's due to casting on the
part of the producers of the Bachelor.
Speaker 3 (59:28):
Well yeah, and I think thinking of like like where
we're at, Like Ari, You guys remember Ari as a bachelor.
They brought him back and he like does the old
switcher roo at the end. You guys are nodding, but
you have no idea what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (59:39):
Before I remember because Anna no, Anna would regularly play
because what's Ari's last name? It's like Louis. It's like
a food Oh is that.
Speaker 4 (59:48):
One ari gray hair? Race car drivers?
Speaker 2 (59:51):
Oh yeah yeah they race car driver guy? Yees yeah
yeah yeah, yes, I'm savvy. I'm savvy.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (59:56):
Colton, who was like in the closet, did an entire
season as a fully gay man choosing one woman.
Speaker 4 (01:00:02):
He then stalks her.
Speaker 3 (01:00:03):
She has to take out her string order on him,
and then he's like, I've been gay the whole time,
Like wow, this is where we were at in the
Trump years.
Speaker 2 (01:00:12):
Right, hey, do we get our first black bachelor and
the Trump lay hear it too?
Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
Right? Yes we did.
Speaker 3 (01:00:18):
And that's also when we got our racial Reckoning season
where they brought in one black guy to host the
reunion and then guess what he left never has never
been heard from again. They brought him in for the
Racial Reckoning then sent him away.
Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Anyways, what was I saying? Follow me on Instagram.
Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
Actually get more takes like that? Is there a work
of media you've been enjoying?
Speaker 4 (01:00:41):
Oh my gosh so much?
Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
You know what, let's just give a shout out to
milf manor it is not what you think.
Speaker 4 (01:00:47):
It is it is because it starts and.
Speaker 3 (01:00:50):
They're like, you're gonna be dating young men, and they're like,
that's tight. And then the gate opens and it's all
of their sons. Okay, so it's all of their sons.
And then they're like, and you're gonna share room with
your son, but you're gonna date the other sons of
these other ladies here, and you're like, this is maniacal.
And by the end of the episode, they've all like
they're all just kind of like teaching their sons about
(01:01:11):
like how to put a condom on a banana.
Speaker 1 (01:01:14):
Oh wow.
Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
It's also one of the worst made reality shows I've
ever seen, Like there's no host. It feels like it
feels like Lord of the Flies, with like weird, incestuous
prompts that they have to do.
Speaker 4 (01:01:26):
Yes, they send them a text message like read this lab.
Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
They're like, all right, I guess we're gonna go to
commercial break now, and then we come back.
Speaker 4 (01:01:32):
We're gonna put on Blindfeldt's We're gonna fiel up our sons.
We're trying and choose which one is my son.
Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
Oh, this is definitely him.
Speaker 3 (01:01:39):
Oh, this is my son, this is my boy.
Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
There's some moments where I'm like, they've destroyed my mind.
Completely like in ways that I did not I did
not expect, and I think I'm know because of the
depravity or whoever was behind anyway, it's out there.
Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
This this episode has been the greatest add for trash
reality television.
Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
Maybe ever.
Speaker 1 (01:02:02):
I'm about I guess we should ask the question like
if Germany had access to trash television, like is the
whole Third Reich avoided?
Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
Maybe well, we'll trash television save us or bring us
our next president.
Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
That's right, Miles, where can people find you as their
working media? You've been enjoying at Miles of Gray where
they got at symbols.
Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
Find Jack and Iron a basketball podcast Miles and Jack
got Mad Boosties. If you like trash realities, guess what
check Sophia Alexander out on four to twenty Day Fiance
where we talk about ninety day Fiance, which is also
pretty garbage. And then if you like some true crimes,
you can still catch me on The Good Thief talking
about the Greek robin Hood and all that. I don't
(01:02:45):
have a piece of media, but I've been watching the
newest season of How To with John Wilson, and there
was a couple of moments where I've been like wow, wow, wow,
wow wow. Anyway, it's it's always an interesting show, so
maybe check that out.
Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
A tweet I've been enjoying is actually Ben Rosen at
Ben Underscore. Roseen tweeted John Wilson narrating the Zapruder film,
so you decide to go for a drive, but not
everyone thinks that's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
Wow, dude, the delivery on that.
Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
And Pat Tobin retweeted an image so that I don't
know who made this, but I think about it a lot,
and it's a side by side the sky and scenic locations.
It's just a blue sky the sky at grocery stores
and it's like this gorgeous, dramatic cloud sunset which just
resident like totally rang true to me. I've seen some
of the greatest skies of my life doing the most boring,
(01:03:46):
like mundane shit in my life and then you like
go on vacation to someplace and it's just blue skys.
So anyway, fuck blue skies, is what I'm saying. Wow,
the shout out to grocery stores. You can find me
on Twitter, Jack Underscore Obrian you can find us on
Twitter at daily zeitgeist 're at the Daily Zeichgeist on Instagram.
We have a Facebook fan page and a website, Daily
(01:04:07):
Zeitgeist dot com, where we post our episodes and our
footnote or link off to the information that we talked
about in today's episode, as well as a song that
we think you might enjoy. Miles Lit's song do you
think people might just.
Speaker 2 (01:04:19):
You know, something nice get us into the week? This
is George Ben j O R G E D E N.
And this track is called Dominga's It's so dope. George
Ben is one of my favorite Brazilian artists. I'll never
I'll keep saying that every time someone asks me that.
And his singing's fantastic, Like the beginning has like a
really dope you know, like I feel like if I
(01:04:41):
was sampling, i'd sample that first maybe twenty seconds. But anyway,
Dominga's by George Benn.
Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
All right, we will link off to that in the footnotes.
The Daily zeit Geist is the production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from My Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
That's gonna do it for us this morning, back this
afternoon to tell you what is trending, and we will
talk to y'all that fight.
Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
Jay Horny
The Daily Zeitgeist News
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Miles Gray
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