Doug is joined by San Diego State Women’s Assistant - and big brother - Gregg Gottlieb to discuss the Mountain West overtaking the Pac-12 on the men’s side, the impact of Caitlin Clark’s popularity across men and women, the biggest differences which rules the Men’s game should adopt from the Women’s games.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
On Monday, March eleventh. You can pre register for the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hey, what up?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is All Ball Special
conversation today. My brother Greg, he's assistant coach with the
women at San Diego State. Course. If you follow me,
if you follow his career, you know twenty six years
he's spent on the men's side. Started Cal Poly's say Luisibispo,
to Sack State, to San Diego State the first year
(00:42):
that Steve Fisher was there, all the way through eight years.
They won the league, got to the NCAA tournament to
Cal Berkeley. From cal he went to Oregon State. They
went to the first tournament first time, and like twenty
five years he's at Oregon State and then switched the
women's side at Grand Canyon for three years with Molly
Miller and now he's at San Diego Stay where they're
(01:04):
having spite injuries a pretty surprisingly successful season and they're
creeping up on twenty wins. So I want to get
to a couple of topics with him before I do that,
just kind of react to some of the stories of
what's going on, and there's a This is always an
interesting time of year because and I felt some of
(01:24):
the backlash from this for the last five years maybe
in my career, which is I always tried to play
it straight, not because I'm like holier than now, but
because I just thought that had the best longevity, and
I thought that's the way in which I really want
people in the media that well they they cover college football,
(01:47):
like I don't want guys just because they cover a
league to kiss up to that league, or just because
he played for a coach, doesn't you kiss up for
the coach. Or just because that school's your rival, doesn't
mean you talk shit about that that school. So I've
always trying to play it straight. And I think it's
fascinating this time of the year where we all have
our conference affiliations. If you're a broadcaster now, I was
(02:09):
always kind of a floateright and I've never had like
one true tie. We'll tell you that. For Compass Media,
they do the Big Ten tournament, we do Big twelve games,
and then all the different jobs I perform. It gets
me ready for the postseason. But I find it to
be fascinating how what we pick up on and you know,
social media is such a powerful, powerful force. And I'll
(02:31):
give you an example. There's a Seaton Hall discussion to
be had out there now. Seaton Hall at the time
of this recording, I believe, is in third place in
the Big East. They do have wins over Marquette and
Yukon at home, and they had a nice little winning
streak before they got blown out by Creighton. I'm willing
(02:51):
to believe that Seaton Hall has improved as a team.
They weren't fully healthy when they were losing to you know,
in the midst of a losing street. But the point
is that it's very I find it to be kind
of par for the course that the ones shouting from
the mountaintops about Seton Hall are either East Coast guys,
(03:14):
New York based guys, or they cover the Big East,
whereas the rest of us are sitting there going like like,
look that their their top is really good. But they
didn't beat anybody of any substance in the non conference,
they have one which I actually think would be a
quality win over Missouri, and you're like, Missouri stinks. I know,
but the idea is when you're playing an SEC team too,
(03:36):
that that financially they're invested in being good. But the
bigger issue is, like, it wasn't like you scheduled to
avoid teams when you played Iowa and USC of Missouri
and these are normally traditionally NCAA tournament worthy programs and
they just weren't this year. And I don't believe you know,
you scheduled Missouri or USC thinking they were gonna suck,
(03:57):
but they have. That's said, like, look, I tweeted out
on Sunday that hey, it's nice still win streak, but
they're beating the bottom of the league. You know, let
me know what happens when they play the top of
the league, which is what they have here. You got
Creton on the road blown out. Now they got Yukon
up coming on Saturday. I don't think that'll end well.
Then they return home for Villanova, who have viscerated them,
and I think you gotta beat Villanova, And then I
(04:20):
think you got like a DePaul game. Okay, you're gonna
win that. Then when the game in the Big East Tournament,
you're probably safe. But you're operating this idea. Well, we
beat the top two teams the league, get home. Congrats.
Lots of teams have they really have. You got to
establish a level consistency and you got to be able
to show you can win on the road. And I
(04:42):
don't know how the committee evaluates November and December this year.
I don't because teams are not the same. But we've
always been taught it's your entire body of work. And
I think Seena Hall is going to challenge that. Well,
let's get to my conversation. Here's my brother Greg, course
sistant women's basketball coach at San Diego State. Okay, so
(05:03):
here just a question I have for you. You spent
like half your basketball life of the Mountain West, like
half it in the PAC twelve. And again, like, I
don't think that it's been this way for a long time.
There's been a couple of years where it's sort of
this year not less a better league in the PAC twelve.
How does that happen your opinion?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Yeah, I think I think you look at I look around,
first of all, the Mountain West has always had a
real commitment to basketball. I mean there are more there
are more schools in cities that really support the program.
That's why they've always had big arenas and the better
attendance than the Pac twelve.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
But I think you're looking around.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
And you're seeing a lot of schools that have a
much stronger commitment to basketball and an understanding. I think
of the nil landscape in a they were able to
capture that faster, you know. And then I think, all
so you look and I think there's some schools that
understand their identity way better and have stuck to who
(06:06):
they are in terms of how they become successful. You know,
a program like New Mexico, we know, I mean they
have tremendous tradition and commitment to basketball like that. And
you know, someone like like Richard Pertino, I think he
figured it out pretty quickly, like what do they need
and how are they going to get guys? They're kind
(06:26):
of guys to be successful, you know. But you know,
Colorado State even, I mean they're really good. Utah State's
really good. Boise I think they've established a level of consistency,
you know, I'm not even mentioning San Diego State. And
I think the craziest part about it, if you think
about it, because there's five or six teams, right are
you going to go to the tournament? And I didn't
(06:47):
mention UNLB, which usually would be the one that has
the strongest commitment.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Well, I think that's how they got d Dan Thomas.
But they don't have a you know, it's a hard lead, right.
It's interesting, like the NIL thing, like I've heard Utah
State is like in the forty grand in terms of
overall NIL. You know, from whatever their collective is. Now,
you know, guys can make stuff on their own santy.
The state they lost, you know, they're one of their
(07:13):
best players to Arizona because of you know, like it
became a bidding war and they're just like, hey, we're
not We're not there. So I agree with you. But
there's like you look at the University of Washington and
I don't know what the actual number is, but there's
a gigantic financial commitment for them in the NIL space
in comparison to so many teams terms of dollars and
(07:35):
cents wise in the Mountain West that are not nearly
at that level. And yet again, University of Washington this
year very average team in a very average at best
by twelve, Like, how does that happen?
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Yeah, I mean I think that's a great example because
I think you look at Washington State, they're more in
the Mount West molde of you know. You know, Mike
Coptons had a lot of success his first two years,
but really most of the kids he inherited from Lorenzo
Romar and then you know, he did a really good
job of recruiting kids that were highly regarded. But I
(08:09):
don't know that he ever truly has found his identity
in terms of how to put together the group that
he can be successful with. And I think you look
right right over there at Washington State, and I mean
they probably have the least amount of not just nil,
but the commitment to, you know, on.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
A lot of things budget wise for basketball.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And I think Kyle's he's figured out whatever he had
to do to get the kind of guys that he
can win with. And again, I think you're looking around,
you know, and I think within the PAC twelve, I
think there's you know, sometimes when people with the nil
people lose their identity too, they start figuring, all right,
should we take now all of a sudden, we're going
(08:49):
to be everybody's in the portal? Or are we taking?
You know, who are we taking? Where are we getting guys?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Now?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Forget about recruiting freshmen, you know. So I think you're
seeing again some of the programs that have established a
level of consistency, they kind of.
Speaker 4 (09:04):
Already have their.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Mold and identity of who they're getting, you know, what,
what the kids look like, where they're where they're coming from.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
And they haven't really truly gotten off that path.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Maybe they've added one or two kids in the portal,
but they're still recruiting high school kids. They still are
retaining guys, you know, and they and their style of
play probably hasn't changed that much as well. So you know,
that's where I see the biggest change, you know. I mean,
I think even someone like Oregon.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
I think Oregon.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Struggled because they've probably been heavy in the NIL and
maybe they don't have as many guys that really are
the kind of guys that Dana likes to coach.
Speaker 4 (09:45):
They're just really talented.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Yeah, there's lots to talk about Dana possibly retiring and
just because he's he made a lot of money. It's
not from Morgan what a lot of games been new
Final four or have done with it, you know, and
the constantly put in together a new team is just
it's it can be hard on guys who like you know,
(10:07):
it's always better when you have some consistency from last
year call on.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
Well, I think it's more than more than that.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
There's there's definitely that that's a huge piece, like you said,
but it's also just getting the kind of guys that
respond to the way you coach, you know, and having
you know, you want to have that group. You might
you might get that from a guy or too who's
a transfer, you know, but it's it's harder, you know
with some of these guys where you know they don't
even realize they're not very coachable, you know, they just
want to just give me the ball, let me go
(10:33):
do my things, so to speak, and you know, or
or really are they truly competitive? You know? The biggest
problem in the in the days of taking so many
transfers is you know, you can you can definitely watch
synergy clips and see how talented kids are and if
they can score and all that, but you really aren't
going to get an idea of what it's like to
coach them, not just in practice, but in games. Are
(10:55):
they truly competitive? What kind of teammate are they? You know,
how well do they think you? And I don't know
that you're going to get that, you know when you're
you know, asking their previous coaching staff either, So you
really got to do a good job.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
How do you do that? Well?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
I think the big the biggest thing. It's kind of
like that, you know what the NBA has done with scouting.
I mean you uh, you know if I would go
Historically at San Diego State, you know, we never took kids,
uh transfers that we didn't already recruit, you know, so
we had a really good feel for these guys ahead
of time. We knew them from high school. We knew them,
we knew their AAU coaches, we knew all the people.
(11:31):
We had seen them play multiple times as young kids
going on up, had them on campus even a lot
of times. So you know, there wasn't that foreign where
you're just watching a kid in on their video and
then making a decision based on a one or two
week courtship, you know, makes sense?
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Makes sense? What about uh just quick snapshot in the
women's game. Like, guys, this is the first time I
can ever remember dudes like legit sitting down and watching
and being into the women's game in Kaitlyn Clark when
(12:14):
you're coaching women's basketball. How much of that you know
in terms of I mean, she comes down, she's like Steph, dude,
she's pulling. And I know Sabrina was like that a
little bit too, But maybe it was because it's an
organ and didn't have the power of the big ten days,
because she didn't go to the national championship game. It
just didn't feel like it was as much of a
thing as the Caitlin Clark thing is in your world? Now,
(12:39):
how much of a thing? How impactful is she?
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Oh, I mean, she's definitely obviously impactful. I think it's
really more or less about my world. I just think
in general, like you just said, the fact that you
have everybody that's very aware and watching, there's a lot
of eyes, you know, But I think she's not the
only one. I mean, and I'll you you go to
out West and you look at I think it's interesting
because you talked about we were just talking about the
(13:05):
PAC twelve for men's basketball, where the PAC twelve. For
the women's basketball's got I think six teams that are
ranked in the top twenty. I mean there's a and
record crowds at some of these games. So I do
think there's the interest in women's sports overall has grown,
and I think the respect for the women as athletes
has grown. And I think some of it starts too
(13:27):
with how much the you know, the men's basketball. You
look at some of the NBA players and you know,
you see them coming to the w NBA games or
to even to the college games, people like Steph Curry
having you know, the three point.
Speaker 4 (13:41):
Contest, you know, with Sabrina.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
I think that all those things are showing that, you
know that if pro athletes respect those female athletes, why
wouldn't the average guys sitting at home?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
You know?
Speaker 3 (13:54):
And I think, honestly, sometimes you know, men's basketball in
general is a little bit watered down, hasn't been the
same product that it was as well in terms of
team basketball.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
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Speaker 1 (14:16):
On Monday, March eleventh. You can pre register for the
Fox Sports Radio Bracket Challenge at Foxsports Radio dot com.
Don't miss your chance to win the ultimate college sports
trip for you and a friend a Graduate Hotels. Fox
Sports Radios Bracket Challenge is brought to you by graduate
hotels where college fans stay. Let's go through. Let's go through.
The rules are different, okay, sir? Fourth quarter to ten minutes, right,
(14:39):
five fouls each quarter for the bonus. Right, it's the
double bonus or it's always double bonus.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Now it's uh, it's a good even question. But I
think it's just automatically two free throws. My mind's blanking
on that one.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Good. I'm apprecire, which is that I don't know the
word is. I don't know. You need to google, you
die jogle on the old iPad, whatever you do it.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
But but the point is, and then.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
What's the what's the last minute? What's the what's the
rule on the vent?
Speaker 4 (15:09):
Timeout? Advance in the last minute?
Speaker 3 (15:11):
As long as you just like the NBA, if you
call a timeout without moving or on a made basket
or on a rebound without uh, you know, either taking
a dribble or passing, you can time out advance. So
it totally changes the game because in the last minute
of the game, a ten point lead is not a
guaranteed secure if you know, and so it also changes
(15:31):
when you use your timeouts. So there's a lot of
strategy involved there as well as the end of game.
So we were just talking. You know, you just look
last night two games in the Mountain West. Uh, there
was game deciding plays. Right Justin lost to Utah State.
Guy hit a three with one point three seconds to go.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Why didn't they fall?
Speaker 3 (15:51):
Well, I'll tell you that, you know, I don't know
that for sure. But one of the problems Justin has
is he's down. He's down to six scholarship players. He
started five guards. So it's very possible that he said,
you know what, if I fiul right now, they might
be able to easily win the game on an offensive
rebound because we got a bunch of sixty three guards.
I don't have anybody who's gonna block out there and
come over the top of us, you know. So there's
(16:13):
a lot of other strategy that could go into that
on the upside downside. But the point is, they hit
a shot with one point three seconds, Well, if you
have a time out in timeout advance one point three seconds.
That's enough time to get a shot on a sideline
out of bounds.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
When you when you when you advance, when you advance
under a minute, but like fifty seconds ago, does it
cut the shot clock? Because like a diva, if you advance,
it cuts to the shot talk to fourteen. Do you
know that role?
Speaker 4 (16:42):
Either you know that part? That part I don't know.
I don't even know.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I haven't even paid attention to that, but that but
it's really doesn't even matter because you're you're you're usually
doing it because they're either you're either doing it on
the when you're down to try and score you know,
quicker and shave time off the clock, so you're shot
clocks on an issue, or you're doing it because you
don't want to go the leak to the floor and
you know, uh, like they're going to press you so
(17:10):
you get the ball inbounds and then you know they're
going to value you. Know, So those are the reasons
why you're going to do it, But it also means
you've got to there's a whole other level of uh,
you know, coaching and strategy that goes into all those things.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Gets yet the Mounts.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Yeah, you know, And it's funny because in the in
the Florida Atlantic San Diego State game in the in
the semi finals, you know, Florida Atlantic called the time
out and there their last offensive possession of the game,
and UH allowed not only Dutch to put in his
defensive lineup. But I remember sitting next to somebody and
(17:50):
I said, you know, women's basketball, they have so many
more sideline out of bounds. You know they're gonna they're
much more efficient at getting the ball inbounds or running
their action, whereas in men's basketball, you don't have that
many sideline out of balance, and they might have struggle
to get it in. And sure enough, if you recall,
they had to call a time out another time out
to get the ball in and barely got it in.
(18:12):
So you know, those are those are real things. And
I think again, you watch in the NBA, they do
it all the time. And I think one of the
other things it does is it allows more close games,
which you know, people, that's why they did the elam
ending in the tv T. I mean, people want to
see closer games. They want to see things that you know,
(18:32):
come down to the wire game winning shots and when
he plays, and there's definitely more strategy. So I think,
you know, it's crazy that really college men's basketball is
the only one that's still playing halves.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
No one else.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
There's no other game that where they're doing that. And
I think it has more to do with media timeouts
and how many you get at it a math on
that maybe they get one extra timeout in there, but
you know.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
You could still figure out a way to do it.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
So you get with the twelve, the sixteen, the twelve,
the eight, the four, So you get four timeouts, right.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
And I think I think you get one. I'm not
talking about that, I'm talking about the first I think
time out what is the media as well or something,
But in in in women's in women's basketball, it's it's
you get one at the at the five minute mark,
and then obviously the quarter is going to be a
(19:30):
time out as well, and then you get the first
one in the second half is automatically a media that
you call, someone calls, so you do get that. But
I think that again, strategy as far as the game
goes and all the other stuff, it totally changes, because
like you talked about, whether you're in the bonus or
not and it resets. And because I you know, I
(19:55):
think you know, you see in some games early in
the second half or something and the team gets in
foul trouble Earli they're in the bonus in seven fouls,
and you know it's that becomes a long game for
a team that's in the bonus. Whereas you get you
do get the ability to reset. Now, the other side
of it is if you can get a couple of
(20:16):
quick fouls and you can get in the bonus fast
in a quarter. So but I think it makes a
huge difference in the way the games played, especially at
the end. And it's crazy that everybody's in denial over
why they that they shouldn't do it. You know again,
I'm looking right now just last night with Jared Lucas
(20:38):
in a half.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Court shot for Nevada. It was a hell of a shot.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
But I mean in a normal game that you time
out advance right there and you're running a set play
from half court, you've got plenty of time. And same
thing even for you know, probably both those ending game
that that shot that you tuss eight needed, they're running
a side line out of balance to get a shot,
not running a full court play that ends up in
(21:03):
a hail Mary.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
I don't know. I like the I like the fever rules.
The best to be honest with you, and you know
that one is it's it's quarters. You can't call live
ball timeouts. You also, when you're gonna call a timeout,
like you turn, you just do it to the table,
(21:25):
which I love because getting these guys attention and oh yeah,
by the way, it's like it's kind of an impossible
ask to get somebody's attention during the game anyway, right
when they're actually doing their job. But I like the
you asked the table for it. I like the fourteen
second I like twenty four second shot clock honestly, which
I'm that's that's not something that previous to the last
(21:47):
five six years I would have said. I like the
twenty four second shot clock. I like the fourteen second
reset on the offensive rebound. They have the advance. I
think at any time you could advance, but if you do,
you get you know, fourteen on the clock, and then
their deal is you get I think three timeouts a half,
(22:09):
but only two under the last two minutes, so you
just don't get like time out of time out. Now
that The problem with actually the Fever game is it
moves too fast, believe it or not, Like it really
goes too fast because now they don't have they don't
always have the built in media timeouts. I just think
you do the fever rules the timeouts at the five,
(22:30):
you know, and I'm just surprised that they can't make
it work. I'm guessing it's that extra timeout that you
get because that's super valuable real estate. But there's got
to be a way to work around that, you know,
extend halftime. I don't know, throwing an extra timeout and
each half its gonna be that hard.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Well, you'd make one of your time out one time
out each half a media or something automatically either, which
is the first one that people call, you know, that
kind of thing.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
But I mean there's ways around it.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
I mean, I just think people get stuck in not
seeing it if you haven't done it, you know. So,
I mean, I think I think it'd be would be
interesting to see how people manage that. But it definitely
changes the strategy of the game and how it's being played,
and not just that, but obviously how you prepare, you know.
(23:23):
Uh So, I mean I watched so many game winning plays,
and in the NBA as well as in women's basketball,
where that you know, there's there's you got to you.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
Got to have all kinds of timeouts.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
I thought actually a couple of weeks ago, Oregon State
beat U c l A. Organ State women beat U
c l A. And they had one point one and
they had two timeouts left, and they called it. They
ran a sideline out of bounds and and they didn't
like what they got, and they called another time out,
(23:58):
and it was I mean, again, those things, Yeah, maybe
maybe you're able to do that regardless in a huddle,
but I think because someone like Scott Rook or women's
basketball coach has the experience or an NBA coach has
the experience of having done it so much that they know, hey,
we got another time out, so if you don't like it,
just call another call one and we'll set up a
(24:20):
second play. So they didn't like what they got, and
they set up a second play and ended up hitting
the game winning three. You know, and those are two
ranked teams, and that was a big win for Oregon State.
But again, those are I mean, those things come with
experience of having been in those situations so many times,
you know, at least as the coach, and then preparing
(24:42):
your team for that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
Sideline out of bounds philosophy, what's your do you have
any like hard and fast? We can't do anything without this.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
Well, the first thing is you've got to make sure
you think about all the other things. But you got
to figu out who's going to pass. You know, the
person taking the ball out of bounds might be the
most important person again.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Right right, most important most important person person thinking the
ball bounds. Second most important person is who's gonna catch it?
Speaker 3 (25:12):
Yeah, dependent you know, and I think then you then
you where about everything else?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
So do you are you like a I want a bigger,
bigger person taking the ball of the bounds? Well, my
best passer, even if they're a point guard and they're small,
Like what's the philosophy?
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (25:27):
Again, all those things you got to you want to
prepare ahead of time too, to know, all right, at
the end of the game, do they put someone on
the ball, do they have them off or then man
the zone? You know, all the different things that you know,
and what are you going to do if there's two seconds?
What if you do if there's four seconds? What if
you know you have to have a you know, do
we need a two? Do we need a three? There's
a lot of different things that go into that too.
(25:48):
So that's what I'm saying, You're going to have to
have a handful of plays. You're gonna have to make
sure your team understands, you know, what we're trying to accomplish,
how much time we have, you know, all those different
things really go into effect. But I think it starts.
You've got to figure out who's going to take it out,
you know, and because you can't and it's no different
(26:10):
if the ball's baseline baseline out of bounce. But again,
and you know, on the sideline is because you're calling
a timeout on purpose, So you're going to put that
person in there strategically, So you definitely have to have
someone who's going to be there in that situation. And
then obviously, you know what happens if you know, you
work on all these things, and what happens if a
key guys out because he fouled out now now now
(26:32):
it changes everything too, obviously, right, So and then same thing,
do you if you're if you're if it's a two
point game, are you trying to force people to value
you know, are you're going for three? What are you
trying to get accomplished in those things? So and you know, uh,
sometimes that happens. You got you know, you got to
work on situations. But I think sometimes too, you you know,
(26:53):
as the season goes on, you're going to be in
those situations. But I think again, because of the ability
to time out advance, you're going to be in those
situations so much more, not just because you can do it,
but because everyone will. Because you know, you can catch
up with people if you're if you're down you know, seven, eight,
nine points, you could still come back. You know, you
(27:13):
could you know, run a sideline out of bounds, hit
a three foul immediately, you know, call another time out.
And also you know you can you can make up
a lot of ground in a lot less time. So
which is the other reason why I think that I
love the elam ending thing. I mean, they're never going
to do that in college basketball, but I think it's
fun to see how that stuff can work too, because
(27:35):
you got to win on a game winning shot.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
Yeah, I just I mean, I just value time and score.
I mean that's part of what separates what separates basketball
from from anything else. And then just score and score.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
You know, well you just have you have to do
it and have done it before. But I think you're right.
But from the you're also never out of it. So
if you're in a game, uh, and you're down fifteen
or whatever, you know you could still come back because
if you get stops and you got to win a shot.
Speaker 4 (28:07):
So it changes the game.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Like you said, time and score, you can't just hold
the ball, but now now you got to get a shot.
You know, you got to score to win two. So
you know that makes them just changes the way the
game's played.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
You know, no question, you're talking to the guy who
authored the greatest comeback in the history of tvt right
down twenty six to New Mexico right to Team Enchantment.
And they had never seen a diamond press, but they impressed.
They didn't prepare for a diamond press. But the one
thing about the elm ending is it's a lot like
pickup ball, right where you know the target score number.
(28:40):
It's like, oh, we need is we need a six?
Like dude two threes? Right, instead of just thinking like
man three, two's into the game, you know, or you're
it's it's three to it, so he just heed taking three.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yeah, So that's that's that's again, that's just the figuring
out the strategy. I mean, we're all in that thing
where you know, same thing. I mean, if you're if
you're down three with thirty seconds to go and you
have if you have the ball, even if you didn't
have any timeouts, if you're down three with thirty seconds
to go, I mean, in all likelihood, I mean, if
you'd ask ninety percent of coaches, I'm not going for three.
(29:12):
I'm trying to get to the basket and I'm gonna
try and extend the game when they don't want to foul,
and I'm gonna try and get a layup. I'm gonna
try and get something going to the rim, and then
i'm gonna, you know, set my press up or whatever.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
I'm going to try and foul and.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Then we're gonna we're gonna keep going.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
We're going to play that.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Way, you know. Now some people say, well, if we're
on the road, this, that and the other. But i
mean it's all time and score dictated like to your.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Point, right, right yep, So yep, yep.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Regardless, I just think there's those are all things that
can make the game more fun than people watching. You know, obviously,
you know how many people turn off the game when
there's if it's you know, a twenty point lead. You know,
now in the NBA, how many times you turn off
the game there's a twenty point lead in the you know,
the beginning of the fourth quarter, and then you're saying, wait,
(30:00):
what happened?
Speaker 4 (30:01):
They won?
Speaker 3 (30:03):
You know, so it happens, I mean won, that's more time.
There's a little more time in the NBA. But you know,
twenty point leading the NBA is not secure, so it's
totally true.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
But again, that's also a twelve you know, twelve minute,
twelve minute quarter and twenty four second shot. So you know,
there's a there's a certain kind of there's a certain
math to it. Okay, so you're back in the Mountain West. Okay,
give me, is there a place like when I go
to Albuquerque, I always go to I think it's called
(30:37):
Satellite Coffee and they have a Mexican latte which is
freaking good. It's called like cinnamon in it, a little spicy.
Give me, give me a place that you hit back
up now being back in the Mountain West. You're like, man,
I have been here forever. When you get theady like
this is still here, that's a great question.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
But honest, I mean you're talking you're not talking about
a lot of I mean you'd say Vegas. We haven't
been to Vegas yet. You know, Fort Collins is that
there's a really nice hotel that we stayed at in
Fort Collins that I don't think it existed when I
was there, and it's right downtown, so you get a
wave different feel for Fort Collins. That was really pretty cool.
(31:19):
I think that was really pretty cool. But you know,
we didn't have a spot New Mexico actually, and I
can't remember the name, but there was a I was
out here a couple of weeks ago recruiting and I
kind of fell into this coffee shop that's that's really
good and I can't remember the name. It's not the
place you're talking about, but it's one of those places
where they got a really good, you know, a handful
(31:41):
of like foreign coffees and they do a drip cup
and it was really a cool, really cool vibe, good
spot and I would totally go back. So that place
was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Way you're there, now you're not going back because you
don't know where it is.
Speaker 4 (32:00):
I just don't.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I don't have time and I don't have a car,
so you know, I'm not gonna have the bus take me.
But yeah, but no, uh uh, you know. And then
there's some teams that weren't in the Mountain West. I
mean Nevada, San Jose State and Fresno weren't even in
the Mountain West when I was in the league. Many
moons Ago, nor both Boise, so I had Actually that's
(32:22):
the first time I played at Boise was this year.
Cool Boise is another cool spot. Yeah, and they got
and actually they had a pretty good crowd for our game.
I was impressed. So really, that's I just named four
teams that weren't even in the Mountain West. And obviously
ut Wuyu aren't in the league anymore. The best part
about Laramie, Wyoming they got a nice hotel. Now they
didn't used to have that. You know, you stay in
(32:44):
that motel.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
That arena's cool, by the way. I love what they
did to that place.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
Yeah, it's a nice arena. I think it's kind of
weird how they that one little angle there's with the seats.
It's a little a little odd, but great fans, great crowd,
you know, and you have to kind of go there
at least to experience it regardless, you know. So and
obviously the pit is historic and so that that's always cool.
(33:13):
You know, we're gonna we're gonna go there today for
shoot around and you know we got to do the
roll the ball up the up the ramp, see who
can get to the top. Yeah, I mean that that's
pretty much a given standard issue, right Okay.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Yeah, it's just like Wyoming where they have the altitude
on the court and then right before you walk out,
you know, be hazardous to your health.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
That's great, I mean play the mind game, yeah, totally, totally,
you know, I mean there's so there's a there's a
lot of cool spots.
Speaker 4 (33:42):
I think the best part is just seeing.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
You know, definitely the there's a you really appreciate the
level of interest in basketball, you know, in the Mountain West.
I think all you gotta do is just see the arenas,
even in the or and they all have practice facilities
and you know that are really nice.
Speaker 4 (34:01):
And so there's definitely been a commitment.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Same thing, you know, Utah State that was the first
time we played it, I played at Utah State was
this year they weren't in the league either, and obviously
they have.
Speaker 4 (34:13):
Great commitment there as well. So I mean, there's a
there's a lot of cool spots justate.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
It's interesting because it's so they have that the s
the center is really nice. The arena is perfect, like
really nice. But like, dude, you got to redo those seats,
the seventies seats, and it's a big thing for them
to like, well, it's kind of always our thing, like
just take out the seats, put in blue seats. It'll
be amazing.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Yeah, you're probably right, except for when the you know,
when they got to sell out. No one knows what
the color of the seats are anyway, so you know,
I mean I always say the best arenas are the
packed ones.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
You know.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
There's plenty of games that I played in when there's no.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
There's there's a lot of fans dressed as seats in
some of these other games, you know. So, and I
think that's really one of the other advantages the Mountain
West has is they don't lose a lot of home games.
I mean, you look around on the men's side, you
got how many teams have twenty wins right now? Twenty plus,
you know, and you look at the PAC twelve and
you go, how many teams have twenty wins? It's crazy.
(35:09):
How many teams in PAC twelve have fifteen wins right
now or less?
Speaker 4 (35:12):
You know.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
But also I was not even close in attendance wise,
So I mean it's not an advantage. You know, you
used to be. Stanford just be a really hard place
to go and play in terms of crowd wise. I mean,
no one goes to the Stanford games right now, you know,
I mean nobody. And you know, no one goes to
the cow games. They just started finally getting some good crowds.
(35:35):
They've had a couple of them, but not really, not
all of them. But you know, and I'm just giving
you a couple of examples, but those are places where,
like you know, it should be hard to play. But
I mean, if you go in the Mount West, I mean,
they're they're drawn like crazy, and really I mean, and
you know, obviously can talk about all of them, but
still in the Mount West, the best place to play
(35:57):
is still you know, San Diego st facts. So it's
hard to be hard to beat, all.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Right, man. Thanks to my boy Greg. He'll join us
here throughout March as we get ready for the NCAA tournament.
Give us the thoughts on what it's really like to
prepare for these conference tournament championships. We're gonna start pumping
more and more of these all balls out because this
is that time of year. So hope you enjoyed it.
Remember to download rate Review, subscribe to it. You can
(36:27):
also check out The Doug Gottlieb Show, which is daily
three to five Eastern, or you can get it in
podcast form as well. Just type in Doug gottlie wherever
we got these pod this pod and you can get
more good ones. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is All Ball
On Monday, March eleventh. You can pre register for the
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hey, what up?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is All Ball Special
conversation today. My brother Greg, he's assistant coach with the
women at San Diego State. Course. If you follow me,
if you follow his career, you know twenty six years
he's spent on the men's side. Started Cal Poly's say Luisibispo,
to Sack State, to San Diego State the first year
(00:42):
that Steve Fisher was there, all the way through eight years.
They won the league, got to the NCAA tournament to
Cal Berkeley. From cal he went to Oregon State. They
went to the first tournament first time, and like twenty
five years he's at Oregon State and then switched the
women's side at Grand Canyon for three years with Molly
Miller and now he's at San Diego Stay where they're
(01:04):
having spite injuries a pretty surprisingly successful season and they're
creeping up on twenty wins. So I want to get
to a couple of topics with him before I do that,
just kind of react to some of the stories of
what's going on, and there's a This is always an
interesting time of year because and I felt some of
(01:24):
the backlash from this for the last five years maybe
in my career, which is I always tried to play
it straight, not because I'm like holier than now, but
because I just thought that had the best longevity, and
I thought that's the way in which I really want
people in the media that well they they cover college football,
(01:47):
like I don't want guys just because they cover a
league to kiss up to that league, or just because
he played for a coach, doesn't you kiss up for
the coach. Or just because that school's your rival, doesn't
mean you talk shit about that that school. So I've
always trying to play it straight. And I think it's
fascinating this time of the year where we all have
our conference affiliations. If you're a broadcaster now, I was
(02:09):
always kind of a floateright and I've never had like
one true tie. We'll tell you that. For Compass Media,
they do the Big Ten tournament, we do Big twelve games,
and then all the different jobs I perform. It gets
me ready for the postseason. But I find it to
be fascinating how what we pick up on and you know,
social media is such a powerful, powerful force. And I'll
(02:31):
give you an example. There's a Seaton Hall discussion to
be had out there now. Seaton Hall at the time
of this recording, I believe, is in third place in
the Big East. They do have wins over Marquette and
Yukon at home, and they had a nice little winning
streak before they got blown out by Creighton. I'm willing
(02:51):
to believe that Seaton Hall has improved as a team.
They weren't fully healthy when they were losing to you know,
in the midst of a losing street. But the point
is that it's very I find it to be kind
of par for the course that the ones shouting from
the mountaintops about Seton Hall are either East Coast guys,
(03:14):
New York based guys, or they cover the Big East,
whereas the rest of us are sitting there going like like,
look that their their top is really good. But they
didn't beat anybody of any substance in the non conference,
they have one which I actually think would be a
quality win over Missouri, and you're like, Missouri stinks. I know,
but the idea is when you're playing an SEC team too,
(03:36):
that that financially they're invested in being good. But the
bigger issue is, like, it wasn't like you scheduled to
avoid teams when you played Iowa and USC of Missouri
and these are normally traditionally NCAA tournament worthy programs and
they just weren't this year. And I don't believe you know,
you scheduled Missouri or USC thinking they were gonna suck,
(03:57):
but they have. That's said, like, look, I tweeted out
on Sunday that hey, it's nice still win streak, but
they're beating the bottom of the league. You know, let
me know what happens when they play the top of
the league, which is what they have here. You got
Creton on the road blown out. Now they got Yukon
up coming on Saturday. I don't think that'll end well.
Then they return home for Villanova, who have viscerated them,
and I think you gotta beat Villanova, And then I
(04:20):
think you got like a DePaul game. Okay, you're gonna
win that. Then when the game in the Big East Tournament,
you're probably safe. But you're operating this idea. Well, we
beat the top two teams the league, get home. Congrats.
Lots of teams have they really have. You got to
establish a level consistency and you got to be able
to show you can win on the road. And I
(04:42):
don't know how the committee evaluates November and December this year.
I don't because teams are not the same. But we've
always been taught it's your entire body of work. And
I think Seena Hall is going to challenge that. Well,
let's get to my conversation. Here's my brother Greg, course
sistant women's basketball coach at San Diego State. Okay, so
(05:03):
here just a question I have for you. You spent
like half your basketball life of the Mountain West, like
half it in the PAC twelve. And again, like, I
don't think that it's been this way for a long time.
There's been a couple of years where it's sort of
this year not less a better league in the PAC twelve.
How does that happen your opinion?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Yeah, I think I think you look at I look around,
first of all, the Mountain West has always had a
real commitment to basketball. I mean there are more there
are more schools in cities that really support the program.
That's why they've always had big arenas and the better
attendance than the Pac twelve.
Speaker 4 (05:44):
But I think you're looking around.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
And you're seeing a lot of schools that have a
much stronger commitment to basketball and an understanding. I think
of the nil landscape in a they were able to
capture that faster, you know. And then I think, all
so you look and I think there's some schools that
understand their identity way better and have stuck to who
(06:06):
they are in terms of how they become successful. You know,
a program like New Mexico, we know, I mean they
have tremendous tradition and commitment to basketball like that. And
you know, someone like like Richard Pertino, I think he
figured it out pretty quickly, like what do they need
and how are they going to get guys? They're kind
(06:26):
of guys to be successful, you know. But you know,
Colorado State even, I mean they're really good. Utah State's
really good. Boise I think they've established a level of consistency,
you know, I'm not even mentioning San Diego State. And
I think the craziest part about it, if you think
about it, because there's five or six teams, right are
you going to go to the tournament? And I didn't
(06:47):
mention UNLB, which usually would be the one that has
the strongest commitment.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Well, I think that's how they got d Dan Thomas.
But they don't have a you know, it's a hard lead, right.
It's interesting, like the NIL thing, like I've heard Utah
State is like in the forty grand in terms of
overall NIL. You know, from whatever their collective is. Now,
you know, guys can make stuff on their own santy.
The state they lost, you know, they're one of their
(07:13):
best players to Arizona because of you know, like it
became a bidding war and they're just like, hey, we're
not We're not there. So I agree with you. But
there's like you look at the University of Washington and
I don't know what the actual number is, but there's
a gigantic financial commitment for them in the NIL space
in comparison to so many teams terms of dollars and
(07:35):
cents wise in the Mountain West that are not nearly
at that level. And yet again, University of Washington this
year very average team in a very average at best
by twelve, Like, how does that happen?
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Yeah, I mean I think that's a great example because
I think you look at Washington State, they're more in
the Mount West molde of you know. You know, Mike
Coptons had a lot of success his first two years,
but really most of the kids he inherited from Lorenzo
Romar and then you know, he did a really good
job of recruiting kids that were highly regarded. But I
(08:09):
don't know that he ever truly has found his identity
in terms of how to put together the group that
he can be successful with. And I think you look
right right over there at Washington State, and I mean
they probably have the least amount of not just nil,
but the commitment to, you know, on.
Speaker 4 (08:26):
A lot of things budget wise for basketball.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
And I think Kyle's he's figured out whatever he had
to do to get the kind of guys that he
can win with. And again, I think you're looking around,
you know, and I think within the PAC twelve, I
think there's you know, sometimes when people with the nil
people lose their identity too, they start figuring, all right,
should we take now all of a sudden, we're going
(08:49):
to be everybody's in the portal? Or are we taking?
You know, who are we taking? Where are we getting guys?
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Now?
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Forget about recruiting freshmen, you know. So I think you're
seeing again some of the programs that have established a
level of consistency, they kind of.
Speaker 4 (09:04):
Already have their.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Mold and identity of who they're getting, you know, what,
what the kids look like, where they're where they're coming from.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
And they haven't really truly gotten off that path.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Maybe they've added one or two kids in the portal,
but they're still recruiting high school kids. They still are
retaining guys, you know, and they and their style of
play probably hasn't changed that much as well. So you know,
that's where I see the biggest change, you know. I mean,
I think even someone like Oregon.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
I think Oregon.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Struggled because they've probably been heavy in the NIL and
maybe they don't have as many guys that really are
the kind of guys that Dana likes to coach.
Speaker 4 (09:45):
They're just really talented.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Yeah, there's lots to talk about Dana possibly retiring and
just because he's he made a lot of money. It's
not from Morgan what a lot of games been new
Final four or have done with it, you know, and
the constantly put in together a new team is just
it's it can be hard on guys who like you know,
(10:07):
it's always better when you have some consistency from last
year call on.
Speaker 4 (10:11):
Well, I think it's more than more than that.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
There's there's definitely that that's a huge piece, like you said,
but it's also just getting the kind of guys that
respond to the way you coach, you know, and having
you know, you want to have that group. You might
you might get that from a guy or too who's
a transfer, you know, but it's it's harder, you know
with some of these guys where you know they don't
even realize they're not very coachable, you know, they just
want to just give me the ball, let me go
(10:33):
do my things, so to speak, and you know, or
or really are they truly competitive? You know? The biggest
problem in the in the days of taking so many
transfers is you know, you can you can definitely watch
synergy clips and see how talented kids are and if
they can score and all that, but you really aren't
going to get an idea of what it's like to
coach them, not just in practice, but in games. Are
(10:55):
they truly competitive? What kind of teammate are they? You know,
how well do they think you? And I don't know
that you're going to get that, you know when you're
you know, asking their previous coaching staff either, So you
really got to do a good job.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
How do you do that? Well?
Speaker 3 (11:10):
I think the big the biggest thing. It's kind of
like that, you know what the NBA has done with scouting.
I mean you uh, you know if I would go
Historically at San Diego State, you know, we never took kids,
uh transfers that we didn't already recruit, you know, so
we had a really good feel for these guys ahead
of time. We knew them from high school. We knew them,
we knew their AAU coaches, we knew all the people.
(11:31):
We had seen them play multiple times as young kids
going on up, had them on campus even a lot
of times. So you know, there wasn't that foreign where
you're just watching a kid in on their video and
then making a decision based on a one or two
week courtship, you know, makes sense?
Speaker 1 (11:52):
Makes sense? What about uh just quick snapshot in the
women's game. Like, guys, this is the first time I
can ever remember dudes like legit sitting down and watching
and being into the women's game in Kaitlyn Clark when
(12:14):
you're coaching women's basketball. How much of that you know
in terms of I mean, she comes down, she's like Steph, dude,
she's pulling. And I know Sabrina was like that a
little bit too, But maybe it was because it's an
organ and didn't have the power of the big ten days,
because she didn't go to the national championship game. It
just didn't feel like it was as much of a
thing as the Caitlin Clark thing is in your world? Now,
(12:39):
how much of a thing? How impactful is she?
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Oh, I mean, she's definitely obviously impactful. I think it's
really more or less about my world. I just think
in general, like you just said, the fact that you
have everybody that's very aware and watching, there's a lot
of eyes, you know, But I think she's not the
only one. I mean, and I'll you you go to
out West and you look at I think it's interesting
because you talked about we were just talking about the
(13:05):
PAC twelve for men's basketball, where the PAC twelve. For
the women's basketball's got I think six teams that are
ranked in the top twenty. I mean there's a and
record crowds at some of these games. So I do
think there's the interest in women's sports overall has grown,
and I think the respect for the women as athletes
has grown. And I think some of it starts too
(13:27):
with how much the you know, the men's basketball. You
look at some of the NBA players and you know,
you see them coming to the w NBA games or
to even to the college games, people like Steph Curry
having you know, the three point.
Speaker 4 (13:41):
Contest, you know, with Sabrina.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
I think that all those things are showing that, you
know that if pro athletes respect those female athletes, why
wouldn't the average guys sitting at home?
Speaker 1 (13:54):
You know?
Speaker 3 (13:54):
And I think, honestly, sometimes you know, men's basketball in
general is a little bit watered down, hasn't been the
same product that it was as well in terms of
team basketball.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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Speaker 1 (14:16):
On Monday, March eleventh. You can pre register for the
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The rules are different, okay, sir? Fourth quarter to ten minutes, right,
(14:39):
five fouls each quarter for the bonus. Right, it's the
double bonus or it's always double bonus.
Speaker 3 (14:46):
Now it's uh, it's a good even question. But I
think it's just automatically two free throws. My mind's blanking
on that one.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Good. I'm apprecire, which is that I don't know the
word is. I don't know. You need to google, you
die jogle on the old iPad, whatever you do it.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
But but the point is, and then.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
What's the what's the last minute? What's the what's the
rule on the vent?
Speaker 4 (15:09):
Timeout? Advance in the last minute?
Speaker 3 (15:11):
As long as you just like the NBA, if you
call a timeout without moving or on a made basket
or on a rebound without uh, you know, either taking
a dribble or passing, you can time out advance. So
it totally changes the game because in the last minute
of the game, a ten point lead is not a
guaranteed secure if you know, and so it also changes
(15:31):
when you use your timeouts. So there's a lot of
strategy involved there as well as the end of game.
So we were just talking. You know, you just look
last night two games in the Mountain West. Uh, there
was game deciding plays. Right Justin lost to Utah State.
Guy hit a three with one point three seconds to go.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Why didn't they fall?
Speaker 3 (15:51):
Well, I'll tell you that, you know, I don't know
that for sure. But one of the problems Justin has
is he's down. He's down to six scholarship players. He
started five guards. So it's very possible that he said,
you know what, if I fiul right now, they might
be able to easily win the game on an offensive
rebound because we got a bunch of sixty three guards.
I don't have anybody who's gonna block out there and
come over the top of us, you know. So there's
(16:13):
a lot of other strategy that could go into that
on the upside downside. But the point is, they hit
a shot with one point three seconds, Well, if you
have a time out in timeout advance one point three seconds.
That's enough time to get a shot on a sideline
out of bounds.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
When you when you when you advance, when you advance
under a minute, but like fifty seconds ago, does it
cut the shot clock? Because like a diva, if you advance,
it cuts to the shot talk to fourteen. Do you
know that role?
Speaker 4 (16:42):
Either you know that part? That part I don't know.
I don't even know.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I haven't even paid attention to that, but that but
it's really doesn't even matter because you're you're you're usually
doing it because they're either you're either doing it on
the when you're down to try and score you know,
quicker and shave time off the clock, so you're shot
clocks on an issue, or you're doing it because you
don't want to go the leak to the floor and
you know, uh, like they're going to press you so
(17:10):
you get the ball inbounds and then you know they're
going to value you. Know, So those are the reasons
why you're going to do it, But it also means
you've got to there's a whole other level of uh,
you know, coaching and strategy that goes into all those things.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Gets yet the Mounts.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
Yeah, you know, And it's funny because in the in
the Florida Atlantic San Diego State game in the in
the semi finals, you know, Florida Atlantic called the time
out and there their last offensive possession of the game,
and UH allowed not only Dutch to put in his
defensive lineup. But I remember sitting next to somebody and
(17:50):
I said, you know, women's basketball, they have so many
more sideline out of bounds. You know they're gonna they're
much more efficient at getting the ball inbounds or running
their action, whereas in men's basketball, you don't have that
many sideline out of balance, and they might have struggle
to get it in. And sure enough, if you recall,
they had to call a time out another time out
to get the ball in and barely got it in.
(18:12):
So you know, those are those are real things. And
I think again, you watch in the NBA, they do
it all the time. And I think one of the
other things it does is it allows more close games,
which you know, people, that's why they did the elam
ending in the tv T. I mean, people want to
see closer games. They want to see things that you know,
(18:32):
come down to the wire game winning shots and when
he plays, and there's definitely more strategy. So I think,
you know, it's crazy that really college men's basketball is
the only one that's still playing halves.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
No one else.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
There's no other game that where they're doing that. And
I think it has more to do with media timeouts
and how many you get at it a math on
that maybe they get one extra timeout in there, but
you know.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
You could still figure out a way to do it.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
So you get with the twelve, the sixteen, the twelve,
the eight, the four, So you get four timeouts, right.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
And I think I think you get one. I'm not
talking about that, I'm talking about the first I think
time out what is the media as well or something,
But in in in women's in women's basketball, it's it's
you get one at the at the five minute mark,
and then obviously the quarter is going to be a
(19:30):
time out as well, and then you get the first
one in the second half is automatically a media that
you call, someone calls, so you do get that. But
I think that again, strategy as far as the game
goes and all the other stuff, it totally changes, because
like you talked about, whether you're in the bonus or
not and it resets. And because I you know, I
(19:55):
think you know, you see in some games early in
the second half or something and the team gets in
foul trouble Earli they're in the bonus in seven fouls,
and you know it's that becomes a long game for
a team that's in the bonus. Whereas you get you
do get the ability to reset. Now, the other side
of it is if you can get a couple of
(20:16):
quick fouls and you can get in the bonus fast
in a quarter. So but I think it makes a
huge difference in the way the games played, especially at
the end. And it's crazy that everybody's in denial over
why they that they shouldn't do it. You know again,
I'm looking right now just last night with Jared Lucas
(20:38):
in a half.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Court shot for Nevada. It was a hell of a shot.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
But I mean in a normal game that you time
out advance right there and you're running a set play
from half court, you've got plenty of time. And same
thing even for you know, probably both those ending game
that that shot that you tuss eight needed, they're running
a side line out of balance to get a shot,
not running a full court play that ends up in
(21:03):
a hail Mary.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
I don't know. I like the I like the fever rules.
The best to be honest with you, and you know
that one is it's it's quarters. You can't call live
ball timeouts. You also, when you're gonna call a timeout,
like you turn, you just do it to the table,
(21:25):
which I love because getting these guys attention and oh yeah,
by the way, it's like it's kind of an impossible
ask to get somebody's attention during the game anyway, right
when they're actually doing their job. But I like the
you asked the table for it. I like the fourteen
second I like twenty four second shot clock honestly, which
I'm that's that's not something that previous to the last
(21:47):
five six years I would have said. I like the
twenty four second shot clock. I like the fourteen second
reset on the offensive rebound. They have the advance. I
think at any time you could advance, but if you do,
you get you know, fourteen on the clock, and then
their deal is you get I think three timeouts a half,
(22:09):
but only two under the last two minutes, so you
just don't get like time out of time out. Now
that The problem with actually the Fever game is it
moves too fast, believe it or not, Like it really
goes too fast because now they don't have they don't
always have the built in media timeouts. I just think
you do the fever rules the timeouts at the five,
(22:30):
you know, and I'm just surprised that they can't make
it work. I'm guessing it's that extra timeout that you
get because that's super valuable real estate. But there's got
to be a way to work around that, you know,
extend halftime. I don't know, throwing an extra timeout and
each half its gonna be that hard.
Speaker 3 (22:51):
Well, you'd make one of your time out one time
out each half a media or something automatically either, which
is the first one that people call, you know, that
kind of thing.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
But I mean there's ways around it.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
I mean, I just think people get stuck in not
seeing it if you haven't done it, you know. So,
I mean, I think I think it'd be would be
interesting to see how people manage that. But it definitely
changes the strategy of the game and how it's being played,
and not just that, but obviously how you prepare, you know.
(23:23):
Uh So, I mean I watched so many game winning plays,
and in the NBA as well as in women's basketball,
where that you know, there's there's you got to you.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
Got to have all kinds of timeouts.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
I thought actually a couple of weeks ago, Oregon State
beat U c l A. Organ State women beat U
c l A. And they had one point one and
they had two timeouts left, and they called it. They
ran a sideline out of bounds and and they didn't
like what they got, and they called another time out,
(23:58):
and it was I mean, again, those things, Yeah, maybe
maybe you're able to do that regardless in a huddle,
but I think because someone like Scott Rook or women's
basketball coach has the experience or an NBA coach has
the experience of having done it so much that they know, hey,
we got another time out, so if you don't like it,
just call another call one and we'll set up a
(24:20):
second play. So they didn't like what they got, and
they set up a second play and ended up hitting
the game winning three. You know, and those are two
ranked teams, and that was a big win for Oregon State.
But again, those are I mean, those things come with
experience of having been in those situations so many times,
you know, at least as the coach, and then preparing
(24:42):
your team for that kind of stuff.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
Sideline out of bounds philosophy, what's your do you have
any like hard and fast? We can't do anything without this.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
Well, the first thing is you've got to make sure
you think about all the other things. But you got
to figu out who's going to pass. You know, the
person taking the ball out of bounds might be the
most important person again.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
Right right, most important most important person person thinking the
ball bounds. Second most important person is who's gonna catch it?
Speaker 3 (25:12):
Yeah, dependent you know, and I think then you then
you where about everything else?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
So do you are you like a I want a bigger,
bigger person taking the ball of the bounds? Well, my
best passer, even if they're a point guard and they're small,
Like what's the philosophy?
Speaker 4 (25:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (25:27):
Again, all those things you got to you want to
prepare ahead of time too, to know, all right, at
the end of the game, do they put someone on
the ball, do they have them off or then man
the zone? You know, all the different things that you know,
and what are you going to do if there's two seconds?
What if you do if there's four seconds? What if
you know you have to have a you know, do
we need a two? Do we need a three? There's
a lot of different things that go into that too.
(25:48):
So that's what I'm saying, You're going to have to
have a handful of plays. You're gonna have to make
sure your team understands, you know, what we're trying to accomplish,
how much time we have, you know, all those different
things really go into effect. But I think it starts.
You've got to figure out who's going to take it out,
you know, and because you can't and it's no different
(26:10):
if the ball's baseline baseline out of bounce. But again,
and you know, on the sideline is because you're calling
a timeout on purpose, So you're going to put that
person in there strategically, So you definitely have to have
someone who's going to be there in that situation. And
then obviously, you know what happens if you know, you
work on all these things, and what happens if a
key guys out because he fouled out now now now
(26:32):
it changes everything too, obviously, right, So and then same thing,
do you if you're if you're if it's a two
point game, are you trying to force people to value
you know, are you're going for three? What are you
trying to get accomplished in those things? So and you know, uh,
sometimes that happens. You got you know, you got to
work on situations. But I think sometimes too, you you know,
(26:53):
as the season goes on, you're going to be in
those situations. But I think again, because of the ability
to time out advance, you're going to be in those
situations so much more, not just because you can do it,
but because everyone will. Because you know, you can catch
up with people if you're if you're down you know, seven, eight,
nine points, you could still come back. You know, you
(27:13):
could you know, run a sideline out of bounds, hit
a three foul immediately, you know, call another time out.
And also you know you can you can make up
a lot of ground in a lot less time. So
which is the other reason why I think that I
love the elam ending thing. I mean, they're never going
to do that in college basketball, but I think it's
fun to see how that stuff can work too, because
(27:35):
you got to win on a game winning shot.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
Yeah, I just I mean, I just value time and score.
I mean that's part of what separates what separates basketball
from from anything else. And then just score and score.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
You know, well you just have you have to do
it and have done it before. But I think you're right.
But from the you're also never out of it. So
if you're in a game, uh, and you're down fifteen
or whatever, you know you could still come back because
if you get stops and you got to win a shot.
Speaker 4 (28:07):
So it changes the game.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
Like you said, time and score, you can't just hold
the ball, but now now you got to get a shot.
You know, you got to score to win two. So
you know that makes them just changes the way the
game's played.
Speaker 1 (28:20):
You know, no question, you're talking to the guy who
authored the greatest comeback in the history of tvt right
down twenty six to New Mexico right to Team Enchantment.
And they had never seen a diamond press, but they impressed.
They didn't prepare for a diamond press. But the one
thing about the elm ending is it's a lot like
pickup ball, right where you know the target score number.
(28:40):
It's like, oh, we need is we need a six?
Like dude two threes? Right, instead of just thinking like
man three, two's into the game, you know, or you're
it's it's three to it, so he just heed taking three.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yeah, So that's that's that's again, that's just the figuring
out the strategy. I mean, we're all in that thing
where you know, same thing. I mean, if you're if
you're down three with thirty seconds to go and you
have if you have the ball, even if you didn't
have any timeouts, if you're down three with thirty seconds
to go, I mean, in all likelihood, I mean, if
you'd ask ninety percent of coaches, I'm not going for three.
(29:12):
I'm trying to get to the basket and I'm gonna
try and extend the game when they don't want to foul,
and I'm gonna try and get a layup. I'm gonna
try and get something going to the rim, and then
i'm gonna, you know, set my press up or whatever.
Speaker 4 (29:23):
I'm going to try and foul and.
Speaker 3 (29:25):
Then we're gonna we're gonna keep going.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
We're going to play that.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
Way, you know. Now some people say, well, if we're
on the road, this, that and the other. But i
mean it's all time and score dictated like to your.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Point, right, right yep, So yep, yep.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
Regardless, I just think there's those are all things that
can make the game more fun than people watching. You know, obviously,
you know how many people turn off the game when
there's if it's you know, a twenty point lead. You know,
now in the NBA, how many times you turn off
the game there's a twenty point lead in the you know,
the beginning of the fourth quarter, and then you're saying, wait,
(30:00):
what happened?
Speaker 4 (30:01):
They won?
Speaker 3 (30:03):
You know, so it happens, I mean won, that's more time.
There's a little more time in the NBA. But you know,
twenty point leading the NBA is not secure, so it's
totally true.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
But again, that's also a twelve you know, twelve minute,
twelve minute quarter and twenty four second shot. So you know,
there's a there's a certain kind of there's a certain
math to it. Okay, so you're back in the Mountain West. Okay,
give me, is there a place like when I go
to Albuquerque, I always go to I think it's called
(30:37):
Satellite Coffee and they have a Mexican latte which is
freaking good. It's called like cinnamon in it, a little spicy.
Give me, give me a place that you hit back
up now being back in the Mountain West. You're like, man,
I have been here forever. When you get theady like
this is still here, that's a great question.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
But honest, I mean you're talking you're not talking about
a lot of I mean you'd say Vegas. We haven't
been to Vegas yet. You know, Fort Collins is that
there's a really nice hotel that we stayed at in
Fort Collins that I don't think it existed when I
was there, and it's right downtown, so you get a
wave different feel for Fort Collins. That was really pretty cool.
(31:19):
I think that was really pretty cool. But you know,
we didn't have a spot New Mexico actually, and I
can't remember the name, but there was a I was
out here a couple of weeks ago recruiting and I
kind of fell into this coffee shop that's that's really
good and I can't remember the name. It's not the
place you're talking about, but it's one of those places
where they got a really good, you know, a handful
(31:41):
of like foreign coffees and they do a drip cup
and it was really a cool, really cool vibe, good
spot and I would totally go back. So that place
was pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Way you're there, now you're not going back because you
don't know where it is.
Speaker 4 (32:00):
I just don't.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
I don't have time and I don't have a car,
so you know, I'm not gonna have the bus take me.
But yeah, but no, uh uh, you know. And then
there's some teams that weren't in the Mountain West. I
mean Nevada, San Jose State and Fresno weren't even in
the Mountain West when I was in the league. Many
moons Ago, nor both Boise, so I had Actually that's
(32:22):
the first time I played at Boise was this year.
Cool Boise is another cool spot. Yeah, and they got
and actually they had a pretty good crowd for our game.
I was impressed. So really, that's I just named four
teams that weren't even in the Mountain West. And obviously
ut Wuyu aren't in the league anymore. The best part
about Laramie, Wyoming they got a nice hotel. Now they
didn't used to have that. You know, you stay in
(32:44):
that motel.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
That arena's cool, by the way. I love what they
did to that place.
Speaker 3 (32:49):
Yeah, it's a nice arena. I think it's kind of
weird how they that one little angle there's with the seats.
It's a little a little odd, but great fans, great crowd,
you know, and you have to kind of go there
at least to experience it regardless, you know. So and
obviously the pit is historic and so that that's always cool.
(33:13):
You know, we're gonna we're gonna go there today for
shoot around and you know we got to do the
roll the ball up the up the ramp, see who
can get to the top. Yeah, I mean that that's
pretty much a given standard issue, right Okay.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Yeah, it's just like Wyoming where they have the altitude
on the court and then right before you walk out,
you know, be hazardous to your health.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
That's great, I mean play the mind game, yeah, totally, totally,
you know, I mean there's so there's a there's a
lot of cool spots.
Speaker 4 (33:42):
I think the best part is just seeing.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
You know, definitely the there's a you really appreciate the
level of interest in basketball, you know, in the Mountain West.
I think all you gotta do is just see the arenas,
even in the or and they all have practice facilities
and you know that are really nice.
Speaker 4 (34:01):
And so there's definitely been a commitment.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Same thing, you know, Utah State that was the first
time we played it, I played at Utah State was
this year they weren't in the league either, and obviously
they have.
Speaker 4 (34:13):
Great commitment there as well. So I mean, there's a
there's a lot of cool spots justate.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
It's interesting because it's so they have that the s
the center is really nice. The arena is perfect, like
really nice. But like, dude, you got to redo those seats,
the seventies seats, and it's a big thing for them
to like, well, it's kind of always our thing, like
just take out the seats, put in blue seats. It'll
be amazing.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
You know.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Yeah, you're probably right, except for when the you know,
when they got to sell out. No one knows what
the color of the seats are anyway, so you know,
I mean I always say the best arenas are the
packed ones.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
You know.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
There's plenty of games that I played in when there's no.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
There's there's a lot of fans dressed as seats in
some of these other games, you know. So, and I
think that's really one of the other advantages the Mountain
West has is they don't lose a lot of home games.
I mean, you look around on the men's side, you
got how many teams have twenty wins right now? Twenty plus,
you know, and you look at the PAC twelve and
you go, how many teams have twenty wins? It's crazy.
(35:09):
How many teams in PAC twelve have fifteen wins right
now or less?
Speaker 4 (35:12):
You know.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
But also I was not even close in attendance wise,
So I mean it's not an advantage. You know, you
used to be. Stanford just be a really hard place
to go and play in terms of crowd wise. I mean,
no one goes to the Stanford games right now, you know,
I mean nobody. And you know, no one goes to
the cow games. They just started finally getting some good crowds.
(35:35):
They've had a couple of them, but not really, not
all of them. But you know, and I'm just giving
you a couple of examples, but those are places where,
like you know, it should be hard to play. But
I mean, if you go in the Mount West, I mean,
they're they're drawn like crazy, and really I mean, and
you know, obviously can talk about all of them, but
still in the Mount West, the best place to play
(35:57):
is still you know, San Diego st facts. So it's
hard to be hard to beat, all.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
Right, man. Thanks to my boy Greg. He'll join us
here throughout March as we get ready for the NCAA tournament.
Give us the thoughts on what it's really like to
prepare for these conference tournament championships. We're gonna start pumping
more and more of these all balls out because this
is that time of year. So hope you enjoyed it.
Remember to download rate Review, subscribe to it. You can
(36:27):
also check out The Doug Gottlieb Show, which is daily
three to five Eastern, or you can get it in
podcast form as well. Just type in Doug gottlie wherever
we got these pod this pod and you can get
more good ones. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is All Ball
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