August 10, 2021 • 22 mins
Ben listens to voicemails and answers listener questions.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely
those of the authors and participants and do not necessarily
represent those of iHeart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees.
This series contains discussions of violence and sexual violence. Listener
discretion is advised. Hey, it's been here. Today's a bonus
(00:21):
episode before we return to the regular series. So we've
been getting some interesting voicemails and questions and there's some
stuff we want to investigate and follow up on, and
doing this episode gives us a little more time to
do that. So anyway, let's get to it. Hey, then,
my name is Clarissa. I have been listening to your
(00:42):
podcast for the last few days, and it's kind of
crazy to me because I listened to a lot of
true crime podcasts and this one especially hit home because
it's where I live. Um. I live in Burnham, Illinois,
which is right between Chicago and Northwest Indiana. I'm right
(01:04):
between Hammond and Chicago technically, um and randomly, I also
lived in Texas Houston, So I feel super related to
this story and I just wanted to know what information
you're looking for. So if you have any uh, leaves
or anything that I could possibly help look into. Since
(01:26):
I live in the area, I would love to be
able to help get any information that I can. Hey, Clarissa,
thanks for the offer, and we'll definitely keep that in mind.
But probably the thing that would help the most of
this point is just spreading word about the podcast and
just kind of awareness about how you know, Darren Vaughan
might be linked to these other cold cases. I'm still
(01:49):
very interested in talking to people who knew on at
various stages of his life to try to verify some
of his stories. And I'm also interested in talking to
China or people that knew her um about how it
was that she knew that Tira Beatty was dead in
an abandoned building, what was going on there? And Clarissa
also stay tuned because in an upcoming episode, we are
(02:12):
going to discuss a cluster of murders in Chicago and
explore whether or not Von might have been connected to it. Uh.
Speaking of Chicago, here's another voicemail. This is Pam Zeckman,
former CBS reporter who did the story with Tom Hargrove
(02:32):
on the possible serial killer in the Chicago area. I
just wanted to tell you that I listened to your
podcasts and you did a terrific job with it, and
I know you have a lot more coming out, and
I wanted to just tell you that I thought I
was very impressed. Thanks bye. I was really excited to
(02:53):
get that voicemail. I wonder if if Hargrove shared the
podcast with her for context she was actually involved opped
in them rage Tavern staying that I mentioned in episode
one where the journalists made the fake bar to expose
city corruption. Um and Harger have actually mentioned her to me.
Um in one of his interviews that he was thrilled
to work with her about that cluster of serial murders
(03:16):
in Chicago. So the next message comes from Twitter, so
we'll have a text to speech algorithm read that one.
What's up, man, love listening to your pods. I'm from
Northwest Indiana. Back in the summer oft I met my
uncle at eighteen Street Brewery in Gary. My uncle works
(03:36):
in downtown Chicago and rides the train to work, and
there is a train stopped right by the brewery in Gary.
So it had to be around five o'clock or so.
There were probably ten to twenty people total at the brewery.
It was a Friday night, normally a pretty mixed race crowd.
This guy is sitting at the bar stuck out though.
(03:56):
A couple of months pass and van S mugshot pops
up on the low cool news. Uncle and I immediately
text each other and say, wasn't that the guy we've
seen at the brewery? He had one to two beers
while we were there. He was chatting with the bartender
and people at the bar. He left before us. Not
a groundbreaking story for you, but maybe you can reach
(04:18):
out to the brewery and see if he was a
regular or something. Good luck and keep crushing it. So
I contacted that brewery. They were saying it was a
small operation back in so probably the owner is the
one to speak to you. So I've tried to get
in contact with him and I'll let you guys know
if anything comes from it. Also, a computer pronouncing Vaughan's
(04:41):
last name is Van reminded me that that's a question
I've gotten a couple of times now. So his name
is Darren Vaughan, but a lot of the early news
reports pronounced it as Van, so I thought that was
his name until months into the project, and a lot
of people I interviewed. Also, I thought his name was
pronounced van and, but from the interrogation tapes, you know
(05:02):
it's clearly Vaughan and and a lot of people close
to the case, um, you know know that it's Vaughn.
But but even then, sometimes if I was interviewing them
early on, I might have said Van and they started
saying Van Hi. Then this is how they tuned him
from Birmingham, Alabama. I've been listening to Algorithm every week
(05:23):
on my directory work, So thanks for the great interial
question for you for the upcoming human A. Are you
finding it challenging to navigate the language around sex works
for the series, especially since Vawn himself uses such dehumanizing
language when it comes from the victims. Thanks in advance
for answering my question. I've gotten comments from a couple
(05:43):
of listeners about my use of the word prostitute on
the podcast, basically telling me that there's a lot of
stigma associated with that word, um, and that many prostitutes
prefer to be called sex workers. I'm going to try
to be better about using the term sex worker verse
as prostitute, but there are some places where I think
is still appropriate to use the term you know, for example,
(06:06):
if we're talking about statistics, like you know, what's the
percentage of the victims of serial killers who are prostitutes,
and you know what's the percentage of victims who are
sex workers? Those numbers will be different, and I think
we need to be you know, very specific sometimes, right,
because sex workers is this bigger, more all encompassing term
(06:28):
that includes people like strippers or people involved in pornography,
and you know, those people's risks, for example, being victimized
in crime, are going to be different than people who
are engaging in prostitution. And in fact, you know, even
within prostitution there's different levels. Street prostitution is a lot
(06:51):
higher risk than being in your own room the way
Africa was is actually one of the least risky ways
of doing prostitution. But you know, nothing is ever completely
risk free. There are also sex workers who do self
identify as prostitutes. For example, here's a voicemail from Maxine Dugan. Hey, Hi,
(07:14):
it's Maxcine Dugan UM callings from San Francisco, California. I'm
with the Erotic Service Providers Union UM. The Erotic Service
Providers Union is by and for those who labor erotically
to gain you know, their agency through solidarity organizing for occupational,
social and economic rights UM and I myself work as
(07:38):
a prostitute of thirty plus years, so I find that
your show is phenomenal in that the woman who was
looking for Africa, her friend is able to tell the
police that she knows the phone number of the guys
who saw Africa laugh, and she gives it to the
police and they're able to get him into custody. That
(07:58):
woman's faced inn array of felony charges for facilitating prostitution,
you know, which has been recriminalized in recent years as
sex trafficking, when really she's just a part of Africa's
you know security. You know. I'm glad she was able
to do the right thing and tell the police the
crucial information to end this particular serial killer's reign of terror.
(08:20):
She deserves a metal. Marvin and Tara's story reminds me
of Sarah Derrid's story, who goes missing in the Lower
East Side of Vancouver, BC in the late ninete Sarah's
customer tries to report her missing to the police, but
the police had some arbitrary rule that had to be
a relative to report the missing person, so the customer
(08:44):
context Sarah's sister, Maggie, and Maggie was able to report um,
but given Sarah's status as a street based drug using
prostitute you know, which are all criminalized activities, the police
don't find her until they find her DNA on the
property of a now convicted serial killer, Robert Pickton. The
(09:04):
podcast also reminds me of the Green River Killer victims,
whose boyfriends were often labeled as TIMPs when they tried
to report the missing to the police, so the Seattle
Police Department dismissed them because the missing people's status as
street based prostitutes, and the police also responded with conducting
(09:25):
stam operations for certain known prostitution areas you know, which
only had the effect of forcing those workers until less
populated and not will at areas where they became easier
targets for the Green River Killer. I really appreciate that
that feedback, Maccine, and thanks for listening. I hope that
regardless of how anyone feels about sex work and it's legality,
(09:48):
I hope that we can at least all agree that,
you know, we need to find some ways to make
it as safe as possible. Sex workers need to be
able to go to police to report crimes, and when
they do report crimes, they need to be taken seriously. Similarly,
when a sex worker disappears, police need to to take
that seriously as well, and and treat it the way
(10:08):
they would treat any other missing person case. We need
to demand that from the police, and we need to
hold the police accountable. So our next voicemail comes from Lima, Ohio,
(10:32):
which is the city in western Ohio where vond moved
as a teenager and went to high school. I'm currently
listening to your episode where mentioned bomb was dan Lima
and graduated in nine. I live outside of Lima. Lima
is a really freaking rous town. Um, I don't go
(10:55):
to Lima for anything. I know he would have been
a juvenile, but I just wondered if he checked any
and soul murders at that time that might have fit
m oh. I also wondered, um, did he ever come
back to Lina to visit his mother. It's a great podcast,
(11:15):
thank you. So in the interrogations, Vaughan didn't confess to
any murders in Lima. He does mention that during that
time he was arrested um. He says he was arrested
as a juvenile on a cun running charge. I was
going on probation in line as a juven I remember,
I all were you there because there was shiploaded guns.
I think we was we're shiving like two or three
(11:36):
hundred guns of money. I don't know what they gave,
but I know they dropped the gun charge because I
was the kids. Because they wanted to adults. I think
you a tl but he wanted to a dealt so
you think you dealt with a t F. I didn't
deal with him. I think they deal with other part
of the case. They just want to get the kids
out of the way. I got you because they wanted
the help. They wanted the people that was actually moving
(11:58):
in crazy and achievement. Right. What was the name of
the game that was doing old game? They hacked They
didn't have games. Then. We just had a bunch of
trades in his white boys. When I hooked up with
they wanted on some of my classmates, bigger brothers and
uncles and stuff like that, right, because they've been eyeballing
them for a while. I don't know if ant F
(12:19):
gun was they one of them, but I know it
was a whole, big old mess a valley. Was it
in the favorite No, they kept pretty quiet. They rated
on two or three houses. We had guns all over
the place. I remember that, and I was like, Hey,
told him mom, he's a kid. We don't even want him.
We got the delts. I know they wanted our guy
(12:39):
because our guy had the nations to other guy. You
know what I'm saying. Yeah, they're trying to move up
because I'm one of my best friends. I never speak
to you again, said you brought that trader to us. Really, dude,
that broke into it, Like I told you, droking to
his stepfather. I've had all the guns, um, he told
He told him everybody. Essentially, there's a kid he was
(13:02):
friends with. His dad owned a ton of guns, and
they stole those guns and sold them, and then the
kid's mom found out, and you know, the the kid
ended up getting them all in trouble. That's the only
crime he mentions from that time period. But at the
same time, just because he didn't confess any murders doesn't
mean they didn't happen, especially because he wanted the death penalty. Um.
(13:24):
And he said he didn't want to involve other jurisdictions,
so he was only going to confess to murders in Indiana.
So Von would have been in Lima from around seven
to and according to Hargrove's data set, there is one
unsolved strangulation from this time period. It's a thirty five
year old black woman who was strangled in it's anonymized data,
(13:47):
so you don't have a name, you don't have a month.
That makes it hard to find articles about it. But
I did find the Ohio Attorney General's office lists of
unsolved homicides, and I tried to look it up on
there and it didn't show up, you know, So I'm
not exactly sure what that means. It might mean it
was originally entered into the database is unsolved, but it's
been solved um sometime later, and that's why it's not
(14:09):
on this cold case database that the higher Attorney General keeps.
Or it might be that that jurisdiction which isn't actually Lima,
but it is Fort Shawnee, um, you know. So it
could be something where the Trinee General asked Evere to
submit their cold cases. They didn't submit it. Um. So
(14:31):
if anyone knows anything about the strangulation of a woman
in Fort Shawnee. Um. In, if someone else wants to
take up this lou thing and tell me what they find,
I'd really appreciate that, alright. So the next message comes
from Facebook. It's a message from someone who came across
the podcast. They're talking about Vaughan and they say he
(14:54):
was a door fiend who used to hang out. I
don't know what that means. Door fiend, drug fiend. Um.
He was a door fiend who used to hang out
in a crack house off Broadway and forty three. Whenever
he got high, he tapped into satan. He had a routine.
He appeared disoriented so that a crack would leave with him.
After he flashed some money and hit the dope, they leave.
(15:16):
They were never missed. I told Gary at a recorded
council meeting about sanitation that they had a serial killer.
He lived off a fifty second. He had been killing women.
His partner is a serial killer too. UM. So this
person wanted to remain anonymous. I've actually gotten back in
touch with her. UM heard her story. It is pretty wild,
(15:38):
so look forward to that in one of these upcoming episodes.
She encountered Vaughan during this period when he was committing
a bunch of these crimes. And some of it seems
to also verify UM information I've gotten from other sources.
So yeah, alright, here's here's when I've gotten a couple
of times I've gotten a couple of people will ask
(16:00):
about my accent. I also know the way I talk
can sound different when I'm in the interviews versus when
I'm narrating. It is harder than you might think to
sound natural and keep your voice consistent across the thirty
minute episode. And as for the accent, I grew up
outside DC in northern Virginia. I did live for a
(16:20):
couple of years in Mexico when I was a kid,
you know, around the time I was first learning how
to speak, So some of my speech patterned might come
from that experience as well. Some people have been asking
for more nuts and bolts information about the algorithm and
how it works. Uh, if you go back to episode two,
I think you can get a fuller explanation there. But
(16:41):
I think it's maybe just people thinking that the algorithm
is more complicated than it is. Um. The first thing
it does is it groups together murders based on geography,
the victim's gender, and the method of killing. There're been
a couple of different versions of the algorithm. I think
the original one also factored in the victim's age. UM.
Now it's simpler and it just focuses on geography, gender,
(17:04):
method of killing. You know, they they've compiled over seven
hundred thousand homicides mainly from FBI data UM and you
can then kind of divide those up into a hundred
thousand different groups, right, and so in each one of
these groups, it will be the same place, all the
victims will be the same gender, killed in the same way.
(17:26):
Now you have these a hundred thousand different groups, and
you can rank those by the percentage of murders that
were solved, and you can see which clusters have extremely
low solution rates, right, so where they haven't made an
arrest or or they at least didn't make an arrest
at the time that they had entered it into the
(17:47):
FBI's Supplemental homicide reports UM, and you can look for
clusters that have extremely low solution rates, and you can
look at that kind of across the entire time period
that they have data for, or you can do this
lighting window analysis where you look for a specific time
period where that area had, you know, an extremely low
(18:09):
solution rate for that particular type of murder. Right. And
one of the explanations for why they might have that
low solution rate is because there's a serial killer who
is active, who is getting away with multiple crimes and
making that type of crime harder to solve. So Hargrove
believes that these clusters that have very low solution rates,
(18:30):
those are more likely to contain victims of serial killers.
And that's in part because that's what you see with
the Green River killer, and a lot of the other
clusters that he looked at early on um seemed to
also match that pattern. Um. But this stuff isn't an
exact science, right, So just because one of these clusters
(18:50):
has a low solution rate doesn't mean that that area
necessarily had a serial killer, or that even if they
did have a serial killer active in that area during
that time period, it doesn't mean that the killer was
responsible for all of the murders in that cluster. Right. So, UM, imagine,
you know, Vaughan is killing all these people, right, but
(19:13):
it's still very possible that someone else could strangle someone.
UM in Lake County during that same time period, right,
and that murder also doesn't get solved, and the algorithm
has no way of separating them, right. So it's not
this magic bullet that only identifies murders by serial killers,
but but it can kind of flag that they're an
(19:35):
unusual number of you know, this certain kind of murder
that haven't been solved, and you know, I think it's
it's at least telling you that something is going on there. Right, So,
even if it's not a serial killer, why aren't these
murders being solved? And maybe someone should look into them?
And we're doing a deep dive right now into this
cluster and Gary, but I imagine that you would find,
(19:57):
you know, incredibly interesting stories, which I for one of
these clusters you looked into. I've also had some listeners
who are hoping that this would be less of a
deep dive into Vaughan and you know, this one specific
(20:20):
case and more more of a deep dive into the
algorithm and how it and other technology could be used
to find serial killers in different cities across the country.
So I picked this case in particular because I think
it's very illustrative of the algorithm's potential. But I am
very interested in exploring clusters and other cities, um, you know,
(20:42):
especially kind of ongoing clusters where you know there might
be someone out there and an active right now, because
you know that's that's a place that we could really
potentially do some good. And I hope on future seasons
of the show we can do just that. You know.
An if you're enjoying the show and you're interested in
(21:03):
there being more seasons of Algorithm that explore other cities,
you know, please tell a friend about the show and
leave a review on Apple Podcasts. I know I'm always
asking you guys to do that stuff, and you know
it can feel like a drop in the bucket, but
when it comes to these companies making a decision about
whether or not to make another season of the show,
h that kind of stuff is really important. Um. And
(21:26):
also I'm looking for suggestions of cities that you think
should be investigated. So if you have any ideas, you know,
if you think there's something weird going on where you live,
or you've heard crazy stories about cities that might have
active serial killers right now, please let me know and
we can see what the algorithm says and look into it.
(21:46):
I really do appreciate all of you who listened and
left voicemails or reached out on Twitter. UM, if you
haven't yet, please do. I'm sure we'll have another episode
like this soon. So you can leave a voicemail at
eight five zero one zo nine. That's five zero one nine. UM.
(22:06):
You can message me on Twitter at b N underscore
KU E B R I c H. That's been underscore Keybrick.
So we'll be back very soon with some episodes that
are looking into some of the cold cases that the
Algorithm identified and looking into Vaughan's possible connection to those murders.
(22:27):
This episode was written and produced by me ben Key Brick.
Algorithm is executive produced by Alex Williams, Donald Albright, and
Matt Frederick. Production assistance in mixing by Eric Quintana. The
music is by Makeup and Vanity Set in Blue Dot Sessions.
Thanks to Christina Dana, Miranda Hawkins, Jamie Albright, Rema l
(22:49):
k Ali, Trevor Young, and Josh Thane for their help
and notes.
The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely
those of the authors and participants and do not necessarily
represent those of iHeart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees.
This series contains discussions of violence and sexual violence. Listener
discretion is advised. Hey, it's been here. Today's a bonus
(00:21):
episode before we return to the regular series. So we've
been getting some interesting voicemails and questions and there's some
stuff we want to investigate and follow up on, and
doing this episode gives us a little more time to
do that. So anyway, let's get to it. Hey, then,
my name is Clarissa. I have been listening to your
(00:42):
podcast for the last few days, and it's kind of
crazy to me because I listened to a lot of
true crime podcasts and this one especially hit home because
it's where I live. Um. I live in Burnham, Illinois,
which is right between Chicago and Northwest Indiana. I'm right
(01:04):
between Hammond and Chicago technically, um and randomly, I also
lived in Texas Houston, So I feel super related to
this story and I just wanted to know what information
you're looking for. So if you have any uh, leaves
or anything that I could possibly help look into. Since
(01:26):
I live in the area, I would love to be
able to help get any information that I can. Hey, Clarissa,
thanks for the offer, and we'll definitely keep that in mind.
But probably the thing that would help the most of
this point is just spreading word about the podcast and
just kind of awareness about how you know, Darren Vaughan
might be linked to these other cold cases. I'm still
(01:49):
very interested in talking to people who knew on at
various stages of his life to try to verify some
of his stories. And I'm also interested in talking to
China or people that knew her um about how it
was that she knew that Tira Beatty was dead in
an abandoned building, what was going on there? And Clarissa
also stay tuned because in an upcoming episode, we are
(02:12):
going to discuss a cluster of murders in Chicago and
explore whether or not Von might have been connected to it. Uh.
Speaking of Chicago, here's another voicemail. This is Pam Zeckman,
former CBS reporter who did the story with Tom Hargrove
(02:32):
on the possible serial killer in the Chicago area. I
just wanted to tell you that I listened to your
podcasts and you did a terrific job with it, and
I know you have a lot more coming out, and
I wanted to just tell you that I thought I
was very impressed. Thanks bye. I was really excited to
(02:53):
get that voicemail. I wonder if if Hargrove shared the
podcast with her for context she was actually involved opped
in them rage Tavern staying that I mentioned in episode
one where the journalists made the fake bar to expose
city corruption. Um and Harger have actually mentioned her to me.
Um in one of his interviews that he was thrilled
to work with her about that cluster of serial murders
(03:16):
in Chicago. So the next message comes from Twitter, so
we'll have a text to speech algorithm read that one.
What's up, man, love listening to your pods. I'm from
Northwest Indiana. Back in the summer oft I met my
uncle at eighteen Street Brewery in Gary. My uncle works
(03:36):
in downtown Chicago and rides the train to work, and
there is a train stopped right by the brewery in Gary.
So it had to be around five o'clock or so.
There were probably ten to twenty people total at the brewery.
It was a Friday night, normally a pretty mixed race crowd.
This guy is sitting at the bar stuck out though.
(03:56):
A couple of months pass and van S mugshot pops
up on the low cool news. Uncle and I immediately
text each other and say, wasn't that the guy we've
seen at the brewery? He had one to two beers
while we were there. He was chatting with the bartender
and people at the bar. He left before us. Not
a groundbreaking story for you, but maybe you can reach
(04:18):
out to the brewery and see if he was a
regular or something. Good luck and keep crushing it. So
I contacted that brewery. They were saying it was a
small operation back in so probably the owner is the
one to speak to you. So I've tried to get
in contact with him and I'll let you guys know
if anything comes from it. Also, a computer pronouncing Vaughan's
(04:41):
last name is Van reminded me that that's a question
I've gotten a couple of times now. So his name
is Darren Vaughan, but a lot of the early news
reports pronounced it as Van, so I thought that was
his name until months into the project, and a lot
of people I interviewed. Also, I thought his name was
pronounced van and, but from the interrogation tapes, you know
(05:02):
it's clearly Vaughan and and a lot of people close
to the case, um, you know know that it's Vaughn.
But but even then, sometimes if I was interviewing them
early on, I might have said Van and they started
saying Van Hi. Then this is how they tuned him
from Birmingham, Alabama. I've been listening to Algorithm every week
(05:23):
on my directory work, So thanks for the great interial
question for you for the upcoming human A. Are you
finding it challenging to navigate the language around sex works
for the series, especially since Vawn himself uses such dehumanizing
language when it comes from the victims. Thanks in advance
for answering my question. I've gotten comments from a couple
(05:43):
of listeners about my use of the word prostitute on
the podcast, basically telling me that there's a lot of
stigma associated with that word, um, and that many prostitutes
prefer to be called sex workers. I'm going to try
to be better about using the term sex worker verse
as prostitute, but there are some places where I think
is still appropriate to use the term you know, for example,
(06:06):
if we're talking about statistics, like you know, what's the
percentage of the victims of serial killers who are prostitutes,
and you know what's the percentage of victims who are
sex workers? Those numbers will be different, and I think
we need to be you know, very specific sometimes, right,
because sex workers is this bigger, more all encompassing term
(06:28):
that includes people like strippers or people involved in pornography,
and you know, those people's risks, for example, being victimized
in crime, are going to be different than people who
are engaging in prostitution. And in fact, you know, even
within prostitution there's different levels. Street prostitution is a lot
(06:51):
higher risk than being in your own room the way
Africa was is actually one of the least risky ways
of doing prostitution. But you know, nothing is ever completely
risk free. There are also sex workers who do self
identify as prostitutes. For example, here's a voicemail from Maxine Dugan. Hey, Hi,
(07:14):
it's Maxcine Dugan UM callings from San Francisco, California. I'm
with the Erotic Service Providers Union UM. The Erotic Service
Providers Union is by and for those who labor erotically
to gain you know, their agency through solidarity organizing for occupational,
social and economic rights UM and I myself work as
(07:38):
a prostitute of thirty plus years, so I find that
your show is phenomenal in that the woman who was
looking for Africa, her friend is able to tell the
police that she knows the phone number of the guys
who saw Africa laugh, and she gives it to the
police and they're able to get him into custody. That
(07:58):
woman's faced inn array of felony charges for facilitating prostitution,
you know, which has been recriminalized in recent years as
sex trafficking, when really she's just a part of Africa's
you know security. You know. I'm glad she was able
to do the right thing and tell the police the
crucial information to end this particular serial killer's reign of terror.
(08:20):
She deserves a metal. Marvin and Tara's story reminds me
of Sarah Derrid's story, who goes missing in the Lower
East Side of Vancouver, BC in the late ninete Sarah's
customer tries to report her missing to the police, but
the police had some arbitrary rule that had to be
a relative to report the missing person, so the customer
(08:44):
context Sarah's sister, Maggie, and Maggie was able to report um,
but given Sarah's status as a street based drug using
prostitute you know, which are all criminalized activities, the police
don't find her until they find her DNA on the
property of a now convicted serial killer, Robert Pickton. The
(09:04):
podcast also reminds me of the Green River Killer victims,
whose boyfriends were often labeled as TIMPs when they tried
to report the missing to the police, so the Seattle
Police Department dismissed them because the missing people's status as
street based prostitutes, and the police also responded with conducting
(09:25):
stam operations for certain known prostitution areas you know, which
only had the effect of forcing those workers until less
populated and not will at areas where they became easier
targets for the Green River Killer. I really appreciate that
that feedback, Maccine, and thanks for listening. I hope that
regardless of how anyone feels about sex work and it's legality,
(09:48):
I hope that we can at least all agree that,
you know, we need to find some ways to make
it as safe as possible. Sex workers need to be
able to go to police to report crimes, and when
they do report crimes, they need to be taken seriously. Similarly,
when a sex worker disappears, police need to to take
that seriously as well, and and treat it the way
(10:08):
they would treat any other missing person case. We need
to demand that from the police, and we need to
hold the police accountable. So our next voicemail comes from Lima, Ohio,
(10:32):
which is the city in western Ohio where vond moved
as a teenager and went to high school. I'm currently
listening to your episode where mentioned bomb was dan Lima
and graduated in nine. I live outside of Lima. Lima
is a really freaking rous town. Um, I don't go
(10:55):
to Lima for anything. I know he would have been
a juvenile, but I just wondered if he checked any
and soul murders at that time that might have fit
m oh. I also wondered, um, did he ever come
back to Lina to visit his mother. It's a great podcast,
(11:15):
thank you. So in the interrogations, Vaughan didn't confess to
any murders in Lima. He does mention that during that
time he was arrested um. He says he was arrested
as a juvenile on a cun running charge. I was
going on probation in line as a juven I remember,
I all were you there because there was shiploaded guns.
I think we was we're shiving like two or three
(11:36):
hundred guns of money. I don't know what they gave,
but I know they dropped the gun charge because I
was the kids. Because they wanted to adults. I think
you a tl but he wanted to a dealt so
you think you dealt with a t F. I didn't
deal with him. I think they deal with other part
of the case. They just want to get the kids
out of the way. I got you because they wanted
the help. They wanted the people that was actually moving
(11:58):
in crazy and achievement. Right. What was the name of
the game that was doing old game? They hacked They
didn't have games. Then. We just had a bunch of
trades in his white boys. When I hooked up with
they wanted on some of my classmates, bigger brothers and
uncles and stuff like that, right, because they've been eyeballing
them for a while. I don't know if ant F
(12:19):
gun was they one of them, but I know it
was a whole, big old mess a valley. Was it
in the favorite No, they kept pretty quiet. They rated
on two or three houses. We had guns all over
the place. I remember that, and I was like, Hey,
told him mom, he's a kid. We don't even want him.
We got the delts. I know they wanted our guy
(12:39):
because our guy had the nations to other guy. You
know what I'm saying. Yeah, they're trying to move up
because I'm one of my best friends. I never speak
to you again, said you brought that trader to us. Really, dude,
that broke into it, Like I told you, droking to
his stepfather. I've had all the guns, um, he told
He told him everybody. Essentially, there's a kid he was
(13:02):
friends with. His dad owned a ton of guns, and
they stole those guns and sold them, and then the
kid's mom found out, and you know, the the kid
ended up getting them all in trouble. That's the only
crime he mentions from that time period. But at the
same time, just because he didn't confess any murders doesn't
mean they didn't happen, especially because he wanted the death penalty. Um.
(13:24):
And he said he didn't want to involve other jurisdictions,
so he was only going to confess to murders in Indiana.
So Von would have been in Lima from around seven
to and according to Hargrove's data set, there is one
unsolved strangulation from this time period. It's a thirty five
year old black woman who was strangled in it's anonymized data,
(13:47):
so you don't have a name, you don't have a month.
That makes it hard to find articles about it. But
I did find the Ohio Attorney General's office lists of
unsolved homicides, and I tried to look it up on
there and it didn't show up, you know, So I'm
not exactly sure what that means. It might mean it
was originally entered into the database is unsolved, but it's
been solved um sometime later, and that's why it's not
(14:09):
on this cold case database that the higher Attorney General keeps.
Or it might be that that jurisdiction which isn't actually Lima,
but it is Fort Shawnee, um, you know. So it
could be something where the Trinee General asked Evere to
submit their cold cases. They didn't submit it. Um. So
(14:31):
if anyone knows anything about the strangulation of a woman
in Fort Shawnee. Um. In, if someone else wants to
take up this lou thing and tell me what they find,
I'd really appreciate that, alright. So the next message comes
from Facebook. It's a message from someone who came across
the podcast. They're talking about Vaughan and they say he
(14:54):
was a door fiend who used to hang out. I
don't know what that means. Door fiend, drug fiend. Um.
He was a door fiend who used to hang out
in a crack house off Broadway and forty three. Whenever
he got high, he tapped into satan. He had a routine.
He appeared disoriented so that a crack would leave with him.
After he flashed some money and hit the dope, they leave.
(15:16):
They were never missed. I told Gary at a recorded
council meeting about sanitation that they had a serial killer.
He lived off a fifty second. He had been killing women.
His partner is a serial killer too. UM. So this
person wanted to remain anonymous. I've actually gotten back in
touch with her. UM heard her story. It is pretty wild,
(15:38):
so look forward to that in one of these upcoming episodes.
She encountered Vaughan during this period when he was committing
a bunch of these crimes. And some of it seems
to also verify UM information I've gotten from other sources.
So yeah, alright, here's here's when I've gotten a couple
of times I've gotten a couple of people will ask
(16:00):
about my accent. I also know the way I talk
can sound different when I'm in the interviews versus when
I'm narrating. It is harder than you might think to
sound natural and keep your voice consistent across the thirty
minute episode. And as for the accent, I grew up
outside DC in northern Virginia. I did live for a
(16:20):
couple of years in Mexico when I was a kid,
you know, around the time I was first learning how
to speak, So some of my speech patterned might come
from that experience as well. Some people have been asking
for more nuts and bolts information about the algorithm and
how it works. Uh, if you go back to episode two,
I think you can get a fuller explanation there. But
(16:41):
I think it's maybe just people thinking that the algorithm
is more complicated than it is. Um. The first thing
it does is it groups together murders based on geography,
the victim's gender, and the method of killing. There're been
a couple of different versions of the algorithm. I think
the original one also factored in the victim's age. UM.
Now it's simpler and it just focuses on geography, gender,
(17:04):
method of killing. You know, they they've compiled over seven
hundred thousand homicides mainly from FBI data UM and you
can then kind of divide those up into a hundred
thousand different groups, right, and so in each one of
these groups, it will be the same place, all the
victims will be the same gender, killed in the same way.
(17:26):
Now you have these a hundred thousand different groups, and
you can rank those by the percentage of murders that
were solved, and you can see which clusters have extremely
low solution rates, right, so where they haven't made an
arrest or or they at least didn't make an arrest
at the time that they had entered it into the
(17:47):
FBI's Supplemental homicide reports UM, and you can look for
clusters that have extremely low solution rates, and you can
look at that kind of across the entire time period
that they have data for, or you can do this
lighting window analysis where you look for a specific time
period where that area had, you know, an extremely low
(18:09):
solution rate for that particular type of murder. Right. And
one of the explanations for why they might have that
low solution rate is because there's a serial killer who
is active, who is getting away with multiple crimes and
making that type of crime harder to solve. So Hargrove
believes that these clusters that have very low solution rates,
(18:30):
those are more likely to contain victims of serial killers.
And that's in part because that's what you see with
the Green River killer, and a lot of the other
clusters that he looked at early on um seemed to
also match that pattern. Um. But this stuff isn't an
exact science, right, So just because one of these clusters
(18:50):
has a low solution rate doesn't mean that that area
necessarily had a serial killer, or that even if they
did have a serial killer active in that area during
that time period, it doesn't mean that the killer was
responsible for all of the murders in that cluster. Right. So, UM, imagine,
you know, Vaughan is killing all these people, right, but
(19:13):
it's still very possible that someone else could strangle someone.
UM in Lake County during that same time period, right,
and that murder also doesn't get solved, and the algorithm
has no way of separating them, right. So it's not
this magic bullet that only identifies murders by serial killers,
but but it can kind of flag that they're an
(19:35):
unusual number of you know, this certain kind of murder
that haven't been solved, and you know, I think it's
it's at least telling you that something is going on there. Right, So,
even if it's not a serial killer, why aren't these
murders being solved? And maybe someone should look into them?
And we're doing a deep dive right now into this
cluster and Gary, but I imagine that you would find,
(19:57):
you know, incredibly interesting stories, which I for one of
these clusters you looked into. I've also had some listeners
who are hoping that this would be less of a
deep dive into Vaughan and you know, this one specific
(20:20):
case and more more of a deep dive into the
algorithm and how it and other technology could be used
to find serial killers in different cities across the country.
So I picked this case in particular because I think
it's very illustrative of the algorithm's potential. But I am
very interested in exploring clusters and other cities, um, you know,
(20:42):
especially kind of ongoing clusters where you know there might
be someone out there and an active right now, because
you know that's that's a place that we could really
potentially do some good. And I hope on future seasons
of the show we can do just that. You know.
An if you're enjoying the show and you're interested in
(21:03):
there being more seasons of Algorithm that explore other cities,
you know, please tell a friend about the show and
leave a review on Apple Podcasts. I know I'm always
asking you guys to do that stuff, and you know
it can feel like a drop in the bucket, but
when it comes to these companies making a decision about
whether or not to make another season of the show,
h that kind of stuff is really important. Um. And
(21:26):
also I'm looking for suggestions of cities that you think
should be investigated. So if you have any ideas, you know,
if you think there's something weird going on where you live,
or you've heard crazy stories about cities that might have
active serial killers right now, please let me know and
we can see what the algorithm says and look into it.
(21:46):
I really do appreciate all of you who listened and
left voicemails or reached out on Twitter. UM, if you
haven't yet, please do. I'm sure we'll have another episode
like this soon. So you can leave a voicemail at
eight five zero one zo nine. That's five zero one nine. UM.
(22:06):
You can message me on Twitter at b N underscore
KU E B R I c H. That's been underscore Keybrick.
So we'll be back very soon with some episodes that
are looking into some of the cold cases that the
Algorithm identified and looking into Vaughan's possible connection to those murders.
(22:27):
This episode was written and produced by me ben Key Brick.
Algorithm is executive produced by Alex Williams, Donald Albright, and
Matt Frederick. Production assistance in mixing by Eric Quintana. The
music is by Makeup and Vanity Set in Blue Dot Sessions.
Thanks to Christina Dana, Miranda Hawkins, Jamie Albright, Rema l
(22:49):
k Ali, Trevor Young, and Josh Thane for their help
and notes.
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