ATS REWIND: Ricky Williams | ALL THE SMOKE

With the start of the NFL season just weeks away, we flash back to a 4/20 conversation with former NFL running back Ricky Williams to discuss his NFL career. 

Williams opens up about the use of painkillers in the NFL, the infamous 1999 Saints trade for him, cannabis in sports, post-retirement life and much more.

NEW ATS EPISODES RETURN on SEPTEMBER 5th!

**Originally aired April 20th, 2022**

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
H m hmmm mm hmm. Welcome back all the smoke

(00:27):
for twenty edition.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yes, sir Jack, what's the good full of these burgers?
I just had shut out the burn and that big
old blunt I had after that, So.

Speaker 3 (00:41):
It's four twenty brother with me, just bad with me?

Speaker 1 (00:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
Man, we got a very special guest today, a pioneer
in the cannabis space but also amazing athlete.

Speaker 3 (00:52):
Welcome to the show, Ricky Williams.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
What up man? Well?

Speaker 4 (00:55):
Brother, yeah good, thanks for being here. And we rolled
them up some of this bond bonds. This leaves bonbons,
so we'll enjoying this seven leaves bomb bond on this
special four to twenty episode. Man, what is the present
day looking like for Ricky Williams?

Speaker 1 (01:08):
These days?

Speaker 5 (01:09):
I mean a lot of this, okay, A lot of
smoking and a lot of talking. So I have a
couple of businesses, so I wake up and handle like
business stuff, and then the afternoons, my side hustle is
I do professional astrology readings.

Speaker 1 (01:22):
So really we'll talk to people like three people a day.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
So you read cards.

Speaker 5 (01:27):
I read cards, but more I read astrology charts. So
people give me their birth information and then I look
at where the stars and the planets where when they
were born and just try to give them some insight.

Speaker 4 (01:36):
How long does that take because I want to do
that shit after the episode? Yeah, I mean, no, that's dope.
We got what got you into that?

Speaker 5 (01:45):
So back in two thousand and four, when I retired
from football, I just started traveling around the world and
I met this lady and she started talking to me
about shit, and it's just like I lost it, just
blew my mind and gave me some direction, and so
I say, like, whatever that is, I need to like
get some of that.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
Tap into it. Yeah, that's dope.

Speaker 4 (02:02):
With the NFL Draft around the corner, are you still
locked into football all you pay attention at all?

Speaker 3 (02:06):
Or you kind of removed yourself from that now.

Speaker 5 (02:08):
If it's on, I can't help but be all the way,
all the way in it, So, but I don't watch
it that much.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
It's funny.

Speaker 5 (02:15):
I was watching the Super Bowl with my wife and
we got married after I finished football, and so she
never really seen me watch sports, and so the game
was on and I just was so locked in.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
She's like, who are you?

Speaker 4 (02:30):
Yeah, yeah, do you do you miss it at all? Obviously?
You know we're going to get into how decorated your
career was. You chose to step away obviously a little
sooner than than you could have, but miss it at all, obviously,
you say when you when you watch you still locked
in thoughts on just the sport as a whole.

Speaker 5 (02:48):
You know what I miss and what I loved about
it was it was one place I could go every
day and I could just like put it all on
the table and just everything and it wasn't too much.
And I missed that where everyone is aligned with the
same goal and.

Speaker 1 (03:02):
No excuses, just get to work and get it done.
I missed that.

Speaker 2 (03:05):
Talked about talk to us about your upbringing the San
Diego what was that like?

Speaker 5 (03:10):
So I guess, like a lot of people that grew
up in time, I grew up, my parents split up,
and really my mom was more like a dad anyway,
and so I just had like a mom that was just.

Speaker 3 (03:22):
About it, super mom.

Speaker 5 (03:23):
Yeah like that, And so it just taught me how
to be tough and and above everything. She just taught
me that life ain't gonna be fair, don't expect it
to be, to make the most of every situation.

Speaker 2 (03:34):
My mom's mom similarly the same way Like, So, having
a strong mother like that at a young age, did
you have to.

Speaker 5 (03:43):
Change the decision making Nope, Nope, because my mom's My
mom's thing was she wasn't like, don't do stuff. She
was like, if you do something, like be smart enough
to get away with it, and if you're not, like,
take your lumps to learn. And so it just was
really an attitude that that allowed me just to go
for it.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
Right.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
It's been said that even at an early age, you
had a profound outlook on life has been an adventure.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
Talk about that.

Speaker 5 (04:06):
That's just from church. I think, yeah, you know, just
going to church, and I was one of those kids.
I just was always locked in until whatever the preacher
was saying, whether he was living it or people were.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
Living in I just will take it up. I was
locked in.

Speaker 5 (04:18):
And so, like I said, my first role model, just
because I was exposed to him every week, was was
Jesus and the idea like he really didn't care what
people thought. He just was willing to go for it.
So I picked that up and I tried to live
that out of my life.

Speaker 3 (04:32):
It's not a bad role model to have.

Speaker 5 (04:34):
Yeah, church started to become an issue when I got
like fifteen and they started to talk about that way
till you get married.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
I was like, wait a minute, I don't know when
did sports of martial laws come into play?

Speaker 1 (04:48):
Early early?

Speaker 5 (04:49):
I remember in kindergarten we had this teacher and she
was really big at the fitness and so she would
make us run two laps around the field.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
And I remember the first day I was like, man,
I don't.

Speaker 5 (04:57):
Feel like But then after two days, I just got curious,
like what if I was the first one like to finish?

Speaker 1 (05:03):
What I would feel like? And I just took off
and I never stopped.

Speaker 5 (05:06):
Now got that feeling that I realized I could do
something or something I was could be the best at
and I just I just leaned into.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
That's a feeling.

Speaker 4 (05:16):
Patrick Henry High School in San Diego. We got another
San Diego guy behind the camera. What school did you
go to? Big fella? The Saints Saint Augustine. Football and
baseball were the two sports in high school you chose
to run with. Tell me what you loved about each
of them.

Speaker 5 (05:34):
Okay, what I loved? So baseball was my first love
growing up in San Diego. Watching Tony Gwen, I thought
I was gonna be like the next Tony Gwy and
my my stepdad was.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
He was Pandomanian and he just loved baseball.

Speaker 5 (05:47):
So it just was like he taught me how to
play baseball, and it just was that thing. Because my
mom told me when I was seven, she said, you
are going to college and I am not paying for it.
So I knew I had to had to do something,
but I thought it would be baseball. Kept playing in
football came along. I started playing when I was eighth grade.
I just was so much better.

Speaker 3 (06:05):
It just always a running back.

Speaker 1 (06:07):
I love playing defense too. Offense always, yeah, I love
to hit.

Speaker 4 (06:11):
I could see you, big strong, thick ass out there
popping people exactly. Yep, you end up taking a scholarship
to Texas. What other colleges were in play at the time.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
I pretty much.

Speaker 5 (06:21):
Could have gone to any college. I took my recruiting
trips to Berkeley.

Speaker 4 (06:25):
It seems like you would have fit into Berkeley. It
wasn't your thing, you know.

Speaker 5 (06:28):
So I decided when I was a kid, I wanted
to be a professional baseball player, but I decided I
wanted to be a college football player. So my whole
thing about was a college football experience. So I went
to I took a trip to SC. Close to going
to SC, took a trip to Texas, Notre Dame, and
at the end of the day Texas just you know,
I was looking for that that the program where they

(06:49):
were almost on top and they just needed a couple
of missing pieces and I could be that missing piece.

Speaker 1 (06:53):
Yeah, I'm looking for it. But I knew I had
to start as a freshman.

Speaker 5 (06:57):
I knew if I was on the bench, like if
I had a red shirt out, I wouldn't make it.

Speaker 1 (07:01):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (07:01):
I got to go in and flight. Yeah, straight up.

Speaker 4 (07:03):
I had to feel that San Diego has a rich
history of Heisman Trophy winners. When you were able to
bring that home, what did that mean for you?

Speaker 1 (07:10):
It's interesting we have four we actually have four Heisman
Trophy winners.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
So you run back Reggie Bush, Marcus Allen.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
And Rashon Saloon.

Speaker 3 (07:17):
Rashon Salon, Yeah, he went he was a husky, right, he.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Was a buffalo. He's a buffalo.

Speaker 4 (07:22):
Okay, yeah, okay, Colorado, yeah, okay, Yeah, Well what did
that mean? Obviously, such a rich, rich history of great
running back from that area, and you were able to
continue to carry on that tradition.

Speaker 5 (07:31):
No, Like it might sound cheesy, but it was one
of those things where I just I reflected back on
all the people that helped me get to that place,
and just reflected on my upbringing and how when I
was a kid, I had dreams and realized like all
the people that had to show up to help me
achieve those and I was just one of those moments
where I accomplished something and I knew I had to
do the work, but just realizing how many other people

(07:53):
it took the hell handle, yeah, and feeling like hoping
that all the people, you know, because I was a
knucklehead some time when I was a kid, a lot
of people had to like let me slide and forgive
me and give me second chances, and just thinking of,
you know, all those people hopefully at that moment where
they saw me receiving the trophy that they felt like
they were part of it.

Speaker 3 (08:10):
Right, that's special.

Speaker 4 (08:13):
Ninety five to ninety seven, you played minor league baseball
with the Phillies.

Speaker 3 (08:17):
What was that like?

Speaker 1 (08:19):
It was horrible?

Speaker 5 (08:20):
It was horrible, but it helped me grow up though, Okay,
it helped me grow up.

Speaker 3 (08:25):
So this is what you're I was out of high school.

Speaker 5 (08:28):
So I left even like three days before I graduated
from from high school.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
I got on a got on a plane and flew.

Speaker 5 (08:34):
To Martinsville, Virginia, which is this tiny little town in Virginia.
In Virginia, and I was eighteen. I was like in
the South, staying with this dude named Bobby and punkin
in this house.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
It was it just was culture shock, and I was
I was just homesick. It just was.

Speaker 5 (08:51):
It was hard, but it was it helped me grow up,
right because like minor league baseball, you made eight fifty
eight to fifty a month, and it's like you're even
with others.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
A grind.

Speaker 3 (09:03):
What was the baseball? How was the baseball part? I struggled.

Speaker 4 (09:06):
I struggled, do you think mentally because it was such
an adjustment mentally that you struggled obviously on the on
the actual sports side of it.

Speaker 1 (09:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (09:14):
If I'm being real, like you know, I'm kind of
a sensitive person and so if I don't feel like
comfortable in my surroundings that I like, I don't act right.
But if I feel comfortable, I can handle anything.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
If I okay.

Speaker 5 (09:25):
And so it just took me a while to figure out,
like what that sweet spot is for me.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
Baseball. I get it was rough, but I grew up
because I would.

Speaker 5 (09:33):
Go I went from minor league baseball straight to my
freshman year playing football, and then I would go back
to baseball and then back to football. So I would
go from you know, everybody like being the best, to
you know, just being a dude on the bus swinging
the bat.

Speaker 1 (09:46):
So it kept me, It kept me home.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Let me ask a question. Were you cool when the
basketball players when you were Texas? I was Who were
you cool with?

Speaker 5 (09:54):
I was cool with when I was in school with
Chris Klack?

Speaker 1 (09:57):
Chris Clack. I played against him in state championship my
junior year. Yeah, Rich clag Yeah. They went to Austin
Edison Yeah yeah, sure, yeah sure.

Speaker 5 (10:07):
Also Reggie you know Reggie FREEMANGI yeah he was.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
He was a senior when I when I got there.
Did you know bj Tyler? I did? I sure did. Yeah,
so we're from the same hometown. Put off the text, Okay,
yeah for sure.

Speaker 3 (10:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (10:21):
We had a James Brown, a quarterback with some portar Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (10:26):
Despite being a high first round projected picking none of
the eight you tried to decide to go back to
school for your senior year.

Speaker 3 (10:32):
What made that jump in a time?

Speaker 4 (10:34):
Actually you were a little early, but everyone is so
eager to jump now you actually decided to go back
and finish.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
Like I said, when I was a kid, my goal
wasn't even really to go to the NFL. It was
to be a college football player.

Speaker 5 (10:44):
But I'm not gonna lie. After I had my junior
I led the nation in Russian and scored. I was
thinking that going to the next level. And then I
was sitting in our media guy's office and he had
one of those almanacs on his desk, and so I
started flipping through it, and I flipped through to the
record for all time.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Leading rusher in college football history.

Speaker 5 (11:02):
And I looked and I saw, like, damn, if I
have a similar year and I had last year, I
could be like most ever. And I flipped a couple
of pages to touchdowns and the same thing. I was like,
I got it. Then I went to all purpose yards,
did the math. I was like, Okay, if I come back,
I knew it was a risk.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
If I come back.

Speaker 5 (11:19):
And have the same kind of year, you know, I
could break all these records with their reach.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
Yeah, And I couldn't. I couldn't. So what was it like?

Speaker 4 (11:28):
Obviously the college experience of self, but then knowing what
was on the line, really studying it and knowing what's
on the line your senior year. What was that senior
year like with all the attention you received, you.

Speaker 5 (11:38):
Know, for real, it's when I started smoking. That's when
it all started. Because I came back everything on the line.
I was focused, and within the first couple of weeks
I had, I had a bad game against Kansas State
and I found out that my girl for like two years,
was like messing with the quarterback on the team.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
On your team, on the other team on my dude
handed me the ball.

Speaker 5 (12:02):
So so I was sick, and you know, I was
trying to be like the better person, to not make
a big deal and like mess up the whole season.
But at the same time I was. I remember I
was sitting there at home after the game. I was
just like, why the fuck did I come back for
this ship? Like, you know, my mind started early in
the season. Early in the season, my mind started going
to like I should have gone, I should have I
should have left, and my homeboy, like he's a smoker

(12:23):
and he's like, dude, you just need to chill.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
He slid his ball over.

Speaker 5 (12:29):
I hit it, and it was I had smoked a
little bit, but it was the first time where I
where I noticed that It took my mind off of
obsessing about the bullshit and I started thinking like about
next the next game and and no lie back to
back three hundred yard.

Speaker 4 (12:42):
Rush after after that the first time seeing and I
loved that. Obviously we're going to get into it. You
were really a pioneer in this space as far as
just going to be.

Speaker 1 (12:52):
Out forward with it.

Speaker 4 (12:53):
But to see where medicating is in sports today and
kind of knowing after that first ball hit that shit
really changed your life.

Speaker 3 (13:02):
Yeah easy to say.

Speaker 4 (13:05):
I mean throughout your career knowing you needed that. How
how do you look at today's current policy for current athletes.

Speaker 5 (13:14):
I think it's it's changing, thank goodness. But you just
said I needed it. And so when I got into
the league, Yeah, that's the right word.

Speaker 1 (13:23):
I'll tell you why.

Speaker 5 (13:24):
So I got in the league, and and when I
first got the league, I wasn't really smoking that much.
I smoke every once in a while with the guys,
but we're only being tested one time a year and
it was in training campra when I was with the Saints,
and so I never had an issue. And then I
was my third year, I kept getting hurt, and so
I started smoking a little bit more when I was hurt.
And then I got traded to Miami, and then I
started smoking a lot, and and nobody told me that

(13:47):
in Miami they drug test in the off season. So
I came to work one day and they were like,
you know, and then they got they put me in
the program. And when they put you in the program,
they test you nine times a month and you got
to talk.

Speaker 1 (13:58):
To like a therapist for two years. Yeah. Same, same, Yeah.
So they put me in.

Speaker 5 (14:01):
They put me in the program, and at first I
was like, I mean, I don't need to smoke, It's cool,
you know. Then after about like three weeks, I was
like damn. I was like, I can't do this shit
if I taking care of myself, right, So I started
to find a way to like smoke and still pass
the drug test. So what I think to me, especially football,
but I really all sports, if we're you know, what

(14:22):
we do to our bodies. I think leagues need to
give us all reasonable means to take care of ourselves.
And that's besides the conversation of how much better this is.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
The pharmaceuticals right question.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
I completely understand that nineteen ninety nine draft, the infamous trade,
the same trade every single pick they have, I mean,
the mascot, the concession stand.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
They trade everybody for the boy. Talk about that. I mean,
I was, I was.

Speaker 5 (14:49):
I was honored, But at the same time, I wanted
to be the number of the number one pick. So
I'm kind of salty, But I mean there's still they're
still they're still telling.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
The story now, so that that's that's the positive side
of it. They gave up headsets, coolers, they gave up
all those picks and the first pick for the next year.
I wouldn't have done it.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
I would have done it.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
I wouldn't have done it.

Speaker 5 (15:22):
I mean, if if he had coming to me and
he said I'm thinking about making.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
This trade, I would have said, don't do it. You
don't do it. Yeah, don't do it.

Speaker 4 (15:32):
Knowing all that, and everyone else knowing all that, your
team knowing all that, How hard did that?

Speaker 3 (15:35):
Did Did that make it tough?

Speaker 4 (15:37):
Coming into training camp and and and kind of your
first taste of the pros or was it smooth.

Speaker 5 (15:42):
It made it tough in the sense that there was
just all this like extra like extra stuff on top
of Yeah, that was like it's not necessary to me.
What I what I loved about the game was like practice,
when you go on practice or when the game starts,
everything is focused.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
When I hated about all the other stuff that happens
out of it.

Speaker 5 (16:00):
Yeah, to me, it's like if I'm doing my job
on the field, like what does it matter, right.

Speaker 1 (16:05):
That's to do?

Speaker 4 (16:06):
Yeah, especially when I'm not really I'm chilling. I'm not
out there fucking going crazy and doing all this other shit.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
I'm in my house medicating exactly, staying.

Speaker 4 (16:17):
Out the way. No limit sports. How did that happen?
So we're trying to get Pete too. I texted this
moil was like, Yo, we have Rick on the show Man.
We need you to come through too. But you talk
to us about what that experience was like.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
By a whole pounds some master p Yeah, I'm a Romeo,
little Romeo.

Speaker 5 (16:31):
Yeah, it was a lesson. You know, for me, I
thought I was an opportunity to do something different. And
when I when I came into the league and all
the agents, you know, typical agents coming at me, it
just felt like slimy and this dude Terry Rito like Pete,
like the runner for a No Limit Sports, Like he
became like an uncle to me and we just can't

(16:52):
real tight, like I could tell him anything and just
he just really helped me navigate that process. So when
the relationship fell through with my with my agent and
I was looking for finding a new agent, I was like,
since I have this kind of familiar relationship and I
feel like these people, it just makes sense to I
didn't realize everyone having like an opinion about it.

Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know.

Speaker 5 (17:10):
I thought it was an opportunity to say, like, we
keep looking to these kinds of people to take care
of us when there's other types of people out there.
And he was just starting No lim in Sports, and
I thought landed me like this could be an opportunity
to change something.

Speaker 4 (17:24):
Help grow his company too. So how was your experience
with it? Like you said, it was a learning It
was wonderful.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
You know.

Speaker 5 (17:30):
I was fortunate because all of this happened before the draft,
and so you know PB from New Orleans, it was on.
It was on, and I felt in a sense when
I first got to New Orleans, I did feel like
a familial kind of sense because they were just down
in bound rouge and they were deep. So I felt
like I was part of the No Limit family. I
had my chain and everything.

Speaker 1 (17:51):
Hey, they were a movement, they were a whole movement.

Speaker 5 (17:55):
And then when it came down to the actual contract negotiation,
I took control and I and this was on me.
I told my agent what I what I wanted, and
again for me, I saw it as an opportunity to explain.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
Statement for all the people that don't know what was
So what I.

Speaker 5 (18:10):
Said is my agent came back to me and basically
had three different deals. What I told him going in
is I said, you know, I said, I want to
be paid for for my performance. I said, because I'm
the only draft pick that there's a certain like rookie
pool of the max amount of money that they can give.
I said, just give me that like max amount that
they can give me for what I've done in the past.
But moving forward, I want my performance performance bace. And

(18:35):
my agent said, well, you could get hurt and all
that stuff.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
I said, I don't.

Speaker 5 (18:38):
I said, I don't care, and he said, look, he said, look,
I'm going to go and negotiate three contracts, one that
what you want, one of what I think more most
guaranteed money, and then we'll do something in the middle.
And he tried to convince me to take that one
in the middle, but I said no. I said, I
want the one that only pays me if I kill it.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
But that makes sense because that's what the youngsters y'all
need to pay attention. Because the agent works for you,
you don't work for him. So that's how it's supposed
to be anyway.

Speaker 4 (19:01):
But then unfortunately got hurt though, right I got hurt though,
talk to us about that process.

Speaker 5 (19:04):
My whole career from pop owner all the way to
I didn't miss never missed a game, so I wasn't
even thinking about it.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
Registered But what if I get hurt.

Speaker 5 (19:13):
So first preseason game, first preseason game, and get a
high ankle spray, and I'm gonna I consider myself one
of those those guys just plays through. And so I
missed a couple of games in the preseason. I was
just barely ready for the first game, wrapped up that
ain't going out. Reinjured it the first first quarter. Okay,
so came out, but I got got myself right for

(19:33):
the next game. I get wrapped up. Last play of
the game, quarterback throws me the bomb running down the field.
Dislocate my elbow. So I got the ankles. Just starting
to get better. Now I got the dislocated elbow. Then God,
we had a bye week, so I rehabbed. I was
ready for that next week. Ankle braised the elbow braids
and I and I toughed it out for like five

(19:53):
weeks until I finally got healthy. Then I started having
one hundred yard games, and then I got a turf
toe and I missed four games.

Speaker 4 (19:59):
People don't understand how bad turf toe is. I had
to have surgery on my turf toe. Man, that ship
is no joke. Yeah, but all this you played through.
So what you feel like? Obviously, cannabis played a huge
part in obviously the mental but then also the recovery
part in that.

Speaker 5 (20:15):
No, the truth though, if I if I think if
I was smoking more earlier in my career, I think
I I think I could have avoided a lot of
because when I started smoking, I didn't get hurt anymore.

Speaker 1 (20:25):
No recovery.

Speaker 5 (20:26):
Yeah, it's the recovery, but I think even more so
it's just getting your mind right, because most of the time.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
People get hurt.

Speaker 5 (20:32):
It's like you're you're not You're not not dialed in right,
You're not down in.

Speaker 4 (20:36):
What or were you So I was someone who smoked
day of the game. Were you someone similar or night before?
How did you intake?

Speaker 1 (20:43):
I mean I was like I was after. I was
always after. Okay, that's what he was because two things.

Speaker 5 (20:49):
One I wasn't smoking enough to have my tolerance at
that level where I felt comfortable. And two I just
think the stigma it didn't even occur to me. I
don't know if you guys have had this moment, but
I had this moment. I was I was in Jamaica,
visiting where where Bob was born, his birthplace, and I
was with his younger brother, and his brother was saying
Bob used to go to that rock.

Speaker 1 (21:07):
Up there and read the smoke and read the Bible.
And I was like, you can smoke and read the Bible.

Speaker 5 (21:14):
I had that moment like where something that's supposed to
be good for you is something that's supposed to be
bad for you.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
How they could come together And I just was like, damn,
so I.

Speaker 5 (21:22):
Got my Bible, got my split foot up there smoked,
and I like, that's when I had that moment.

Speaker 1 (21:29):
That's what I at that point twenty seven is right before.

Speaker 5 (21:32):
It was like a week before I retired, and so like,
you know, I think, yeah, I think smoking. I had
a day at practice when I was playing. I played
a year in Canada and I broke my ankle and
uh and messed up my arm. So I wasn't I
was in rehab and the guys and I was just
coming back though, and the guys were driving to practice
and they were passing the blunt around and I was

(21:53):
just like, I'm not playing, So I was like, I'll
smoke before practice. I had the most amazing like practice ever.
I didn't feel my my pain. I felt like I
was a kid again out there just bawling, right, So
I got it, but.

Speaker 1 (22:04):
It was it was yeah, damn.

Speaker 4 (22:07):
So yeah, I was someone who because like I said,
I think you said it perfectly, like it locks it.
It calms the outside noise and you lock in on
with your what your job is supposed to be. Yeah,
and that's you know, the ultimate focus.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
Mike Dicka. Yes, ESPN magazine cover. Yeah, how did that
come about? Damn?

Speaker 5 (22:21):
Levatard worked for ESPN at the time. Uh, he's writing
for ESPN the magazine, and we become close and he
reached out and he said, they want to do a
piece for the cover of you and Dicka, and so
they We went back and forth for like two months,
throw a different ideas around about the picture, and then
one day Dan called and he said, like, what about
you got you in a wedding dress and Dica in
a in a tux, like you guys are getting married.

(22:44):
And I was on my phone in the car and
I laughed and I said that'd be funny.

Speaker 1 (22:48):
I was like, yeah.

Speaker 5 (22:49):
But then when I got there that day, I was like,
I was like, and then when it came out and.

Speaker 1 (22:57):
The media had it, then it really wasn't funny.

Speaker 4 (23:00):
Yeah, hey, that was today boy, he said. At first
I laughed, but then I got there, it wasn't funny.

Speaker 5 (23:08):
I had to put the dress on him and realize
what was what was going on?

Speaker 1 (23:11):
What was happening? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (23:13):
Yeah, God damn.

Speaker 1 (23:14):
Obviously.

Speaker 4 (23:16):
You know you spoke of someone who was never injured
until you got to the Pros. When you in the
Pros and you get injured, the first thing they want
to do is pump you full of all kinds of
different bulloids and and shit that is masking one problem
causing long term effects on the other side. Talk to
us about that proces because I know you've been very
vocal with the recovery of it, but just also the
whole overall process.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (23:36):
Well, I remember one day I was I was sitting
in the in the training room before practice, and I
was watching each of the guys come in for practice
to get the tourd off shot, and I started doing
the math like I was like, if someone plays eight
ten years and they have to do this every day
for practice, Like what is this doing?

Speaker 1 (23:52):
What is it? What is this doing to our bodies?

Speaker 4 (23:54):
And real quick, I don't want to cut you off.
Please remember your thought. Tour do all is so strong
that when I was with the Clipper going into the playoffs,
I got hit by Dwight Howard and had a minor
tear in my shoulder so in my shooting arm, so
during the whole round, like during the week, I couldn't
barely lift my arm.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
I'm doing rehab to lift my arm.

Speaker 4 (24:14):
I'll take the toward all shot too outs before the
game and I'm totally fine.

Speaker 1 (24:17):
Totally fine, Like unbelievable.

Speaker 5 (24:20):
You go to practice without toward all, you feel like
you're eighty five years old.

Speaker 4 (24:23):
You can't imagine doing it in practice. I had in
the game, I like Superman. That's the same. That's the
year we beat San Antonio in the first round and
the last play I blocked Kawhi that was my hurt
shoulder that the day before I couldn't even lift.

Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yeah, yeah, so it's real. So I understood why.

Speaker 5 (24:36):
But I was doing the math and I said, I
gotta find like some other way to take care of
my liver too, And I just started smoking more and
then finding like how to take care of myself. Like
I spent a little bit more time stretching, and also
was when I smoked in stretched.

Speaker 1 (24:47):
I was really getting in there and really.

Speaker 4 (24:50):
Like, yeah, you have a focus, a different focus. How
many years did you play eleven? At what point in
your career did you kind of say I'm leaving this
person described medicine from the league behind and solely smoking
cannabis or was it always a balance of both?

Speaker 1 (25:07):
It was.

Speaker 5 (25:09):
It was a balance up until that moment I just
told you about. But after that, I mean I might
have taken something like I had to be in a
lot of pain before I would take something. So and
I was probably six or seven years in in but
I started taking care of myself and I didn't spend
any time in the training room, and the trainer just
left me alone because they were like, whatever you're doing.

Speaker 4 (25:30):
And I think a running back you get hit the
most exactly whether you're blocking or running.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
That's a beautiful thing.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
Damn.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
See.

Speaker 5 (25:37):
I think in the long term, like, if these sports
teams start to support players using cannabis, it's going to
save them a lot of a lot of money.

Speaker 1 (25:45):
Point blank. That's no.

Speaker 3 (25:47):
What do you think about.

Speaker 4 (25:51):
High profile athletes now not necessarily coming out in hey
I'm out here smoking, but knowing that they do use it,
and there's kind of a perception now that they're starting
to realize it's like, Okay, the best players are actually
using this too.

Speaker 3 (26:03):
What is your thought about that.

Speaker 5 (26:05):
I mean, personally, I think that the players should be
out there saying, yeah, I agree, I use this because
you know, what I found is so many people come
up to me and they've said, you know, I was
like had an attitude about this and I was against
it until like your story and I saw you and
because of that, I tried it and it helped me, right,

(26:25):
And so I think players coming out and being honest
is just going to really help a lot of people
get access to us that for whatever reason in their
mind or whatever, they don't have access to it.

Speaker 2 (26:34):
And stop worrying about what people think. And I think
that's the biggest part. Like even me, I stopped smoking
because I'm Muslim, but then again, I know I need it,
but I but I know I'm one of the most
righteous people alive, you know what I mean. It's just
got to get to the point where you do what's
best for you and not where about what people say.
And I think that's why a lot of players don't
come out and talk about it.

Speaker 1 (26:52):
But I think a lot of it is misinformation.

Speaker 5 (26:54):
And what I've realized is when we were young and
so we hear people say like the war on drug
war on drugs. Now that I'm older and I've gone
back and like just studied a little bit, it really
was a war. Like literally, like are this mighty government
militarized against against cannabis?

Speaker 1 (27:13):
Militarized anything about?

Speaker 5 (27:15):
Like in any war, there's always a lot of casualties,
and it takes a long time to heal. But if
we go like pre drug war, and we really understand
the history of this planet, it was used by righteous
people to help them achieve more righteousness, Like that's what
it was for. And and I think too, we're remembering that,

(27:35):
but we're doing it the hard way because we're like,
at least for me, I became a better person when
I started.

Speaker 2 (27:41):
My wife told me that please hurry up back smoke.
She used to text me.

Speaker 4 (27:45):
She was texting him, git him back to smoke, please,
because he's not the same person.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
It's needed, it's needed.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
You traded to Miami in two thousand and two and
led the league in Russian for for your first year.
You almost had eight hundred carries for those first two years,
both of the seasons, your top twenty for most carries
by running back in the season.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
That's a lot of way.

Speaker 2 (28:08):
And tell on your body in the NFL carrying that
many times, and we know how you run. I just
told the people that's gonna get the prepops that were
running over shit. Yeah, what's your mind sign? What's your
mind frame?

Speaker 5 (28:21):
The first year when I led the league in rushing,
I averaged four point seven yards of carry.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
So and that was great.

Speaker 5 (28:28):
And next year I averaged three point eight yards to
carry more carries a lot less yards.

Speaker 1 (28:34):
That was not so. But they stack in the lineup.

Speaker 5 (28:36):
They stacked, you know, it was it was there stacking
the line.

Speaker 1 (28:39):
But also, like.

Speaker 5 (28:42):
I see, like in any sport, when you have a
player that not necessarily the best player, but the player
that everyone is like thinking everything's built around.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
Other team knows if we stop him, we're gonna win. Right.

Speaker 5 (28:52):
You need the other guys on the team to realize
that and step up their game to meet that kind
of force. And I think the first year, the success
kind of surprised everyone, and I think that second year,
and you know, when you after you win and you go.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
Back, you can't take it easy. Everybody's coming for you.

Speaker 5 (29:06):
So you got to like take your game to the
next level to be able to meet that challenge. And
I felt like as a as a team, everybody did.

Speaker 1 (29:13):
We did it.

Speaker 5 (29:14):
And so I was taking the toll because everybody was
like tea it off on my ask.

Speaker 1 (29:21):
Oh man, let's go again.

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your position. You're coming off leading the league. How does
that take a toll on you? Because I mean, that's
a lot of the mental health that athletes are talking about.
You just saw Kyrie yesterday kind of go in on
fans Like, what kind of toll did that take on you?

Speaker 1 (31:38):
Well?

Speaker 5 (31:38):
I think it takes a toll the fact that just
in general, as a professional athlete, that people like they
forget that we're human.

Speaker 4 (31:46):
Being deal they think because we make money that they
can that we don't have feelings.

Speaker 5 (31:50):
Yeah, but on a deeper level, like to me, it's like,
you're the one paying money to watch us, you know
what I'm saying, So there's probably something that we're doing
that you could learn from, and so instead of like
throwing shit out of it's like trying to learn from us,
because whatever we're doing, you're like, yeah, you rather spend
time with us than your family.

Speaker 2 (32:13):
At some point I had to figure out that it's
people that are just fans of the sport. But then
you got people that wish they could be you, you
know what I mean, And that's where we get the
confusion at You got people that really that really wish
they had like playing basketballs, people that really had hoop dreams,
that really wanted to be in the NBA, that play
a man whoever did all that some fun? Everybody that

(32:34):
played basketball that made to the NBA. But then you
got your fans that really love a team. I think
the fact that they sitting together in the stadium, it's
hard to separate the good fans and.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
The bad fans.

Speaker 3 (32:43):
Yeah, I agree.

Speaker 2 (32:44):
Is it a coincidence that you just started falling drug
tests around the time?

Speaker 5 (32:48):
Well, I think the other question, is it a coincidence
that I started leading the league and rushing, because so,
like when I first got to Miami, that's when I
really started smoking. I remember I come home after after
working out and smoke and I would like start to
like visualize myself like killing it, just killing.

Speaker 1 (33:05):
So I just had this. I just had this.

Speaker 5 (33:07):
By the time the season came, I just had this
knowing that. It's like I was ready. I was ready,
And so I think that had a lot to.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
Do with the tree. Yeah, yeah, I love that. I mean,
we can we can speak to that.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Yeah. I gotta be high every doing everything.

Speaker 2 (33:23):
I agree, there's no way, though, I can do nothing
without it. You're preaching to the choir, yes, or would you?
I mean, it's like I can't, I can't. I'm sorry, Yeah,
I can't.

Speaker 4 (33:33):
Two thousand and four, you decided to retire. What uh
you were over everything? Where were you at mentally with that?
And what made you come to that and to smoke my.

Speaker 1 (33:43):
Tree in peace? Yeah? You know it's interesting.

Speaker 5 (33:46):
I feel like sometimes in life, like the universe is
trying to tell us something and sometimes we don't want
to hear it, and it's got to like tell us
really loudly. And So two thousand and two, I let
the NFL and rush. In two thousand and three, I
got my tour up. So coming into the next season,
you know, I went to the two thousand and four
I went to the Dolphins and I and I said, like,
if you're going to give me the ball, like and

(34:08):
expect me to do everything, like, you need to like
take care of me, make sure that. Cause I started
to like think about the future and think like if
I keep doing this, I'm not going to last very long,
and like what am I going to have to show
for it?

Speaker 1 (34:19):
So I said, like, if.

Speaker 5 (34:20):
You're going to do this, I'm good with it, but
help me feel good about doing right. And their response,
but they went today they came back with the business response,
and for me, like a business decision, right is my
business decision is? This is my only body, and I
have to find a way to take care of it.
I need to feel good. That's my business. I understand

(34:40):
you got your business if you've got salary cap and
all that other stuff. Just the way they came back
to me, I was like, Okay, they don't really they
don't really appreciate they're taking me for granted.

Speaker 1 (34:48):
And so already I was like okay.

Speaker 5 (34:50):
And then after having that year and thinking, you know,
I spent all my life trying to be the best
football player I can be, and I realized that it
has there's a lot more that goes into me being
a good football player. And by being a good football player,
I've seen I've been kind of like a like a
not a good person at some of these and it
started to bother me. So I started to think about,
like what am I doing with my life? And what

(35:11):
I felt was I need to like travel and see
the world and do some shit because my heart's not
in this right now. And then with the contract and
then all this other stuff started happening, so I just
was like, I hear the message, it's time for me
to go, So so I bounced.

Speaker 1 (35:27):
It was just one of those things.

Speaker 5 (35:28):
Where you know, but I think, like, again, my dream
as a kid was to make it as a college
football player and then to have some kind of platform
where I could like tell people like what I think.
And I got to the NFL and people were just like,
shut up, shut up, we don't want to hear. And yeah,
we don't want to hear what you have to say,
just go run. And then I, you know, I got

(35:49):
to the point where I was like, I need to
have I need to say something. But then I realized,
because I've been chasing football my whole life, I don't
really have anything to say. So I left and I
started traveling and just having more experiences of meeting different people,
and went back to school, started studying things I was
really passionate about.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
So I learned. So I now I feel like I
have actually something to say.

Speaker 4 (36:09):
What was it like because obviously back then, when you
were doing it, the cannabis was the ultimate no. So
the media content starts to paint a picture of a
bad person when again, you've explained to all the reasons
why leading up to this. But how hard was that
having to deal with that on a daily basis?

Speaker 1 (36:28):
You know, I was fortunate a couple of things. You know.

Speaker 5 (36:31):
One, back in two thousand and four, nobody, like we
weren't educated about cannabis the way we are now, Like
outside of California and Oregon, nobody was talking about medicinal marijuana,
and so I didn't have the language. And so when
it first hit the news that failing a drug test
was connected to my retirement, I had a friend of
mine who was leaving the country, so I was like, yeah,

(36:52):
let's go.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
So I didn't have to really deal with any of
it because I was traveling around the world.

Speaker 5 (36:59):
And the funny thing, as I was traveling around the world,
I kept meeting people who like smoked, and so.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
Where I like, I wasn't. I wasn't trying to run
away from it.

Speaker 5 (37:08):
But I thought it was interesting that as I was
like out and about, people didn't even know who I was.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
And I kept running.

Speaker 5 (37:13):
Into it, and I kept running it into it in
ways where people were talking about it, in ways that
I had never heard people talk about cannabis. And so well,
I ended up back in northern California studying ariveda with
Indian medicine, and I was looking through a book and
I came across a book and it had a whole
chapter on cannabis, and again, at that time, no one
was talking about medicinal marijuana. And so I started to realize,

(37:36):
there's a lot more to this, to this thing than
than what we've been told. And because I surrounded myself
with those kinds of people, when I finally did have
to deal with the media, I felt more supported. And
so Mike Wallace from Sixty Minutes came to northern California
where I was studying, ariveda and it was like that
interviewer we found, we found Ricky and one of the
questions he asked straight up, he said, if the NFL

(37:59):
drug tested you right now, how would you pass the test?
And I remember, you know, looking at him, and everything
in my head was saying lie, lie, Lie lie, and
something I just said, like I just said no, I
would fail. And it was like it was this moment
where I was being real while here was this this
was two thousand and four. I was being like honest
and I was being real and I knew I wasn't

(38:21):
supposed to, but it felt like really liberating because I
wasn't in the NFL.

Speaker 1 (38:25):
It felt like.

Speaker 5 (38:26):
Liberating to be able to like to tell my truth
and not back down for it, you know, and like
that to me, that was a special moment in my
life where I kind of said I'm on this side.

Speaker 1 (38:37):
I made a statement.

Speaker 4 (38:38):
So after that, I mean, that was kind of obviously
a groundbreaking type of situation. What was with the feedback
on that? Because I always say like you were just
ahead of your time, Like if you came out and
did that, now you would be leading athletes in this space.
I mean, you're obviously one of the top people. But
to do it back in that time in two thousand
and four, once you kind of came out and told
your truth, it was almost a weightlifted on your off

(38:59):
your show.

Speaker 3 (39:00):
There's what was the what was it met with?

Speaker 5 (39:02):
So, you know, funny like personally it was it was
the coolest thing in the world because you know, I'd
be on the airport, I'd be hanging around. I remember
I was in Sacramento at the airport and I was
kind of lived up there at the time, and some
guy like it was that same feeling of when somebody
recognizes me, but he was like, hey.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
I got I got something in my car.

Speaker 5 (39:21):
You would have come and people would just come up
to me and just give me weed. Like, so it
was amazing, like the like the one on one dealing
with people. I felt like I was more real to
people and there was something up for us to connect
on on a deeper level.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
And you know, the NFL.

Speaker 5 (39:36):
I came back to the NFL, partially because the Dolphins
sued me for eight million dollars, but also the NFL
kept asking me to come back.

Speaker 1 (39:43):
Who won they wanted they wanted? Yeah, yeah, So I
came back and and it was weird.

Speaker 5 (39:50):
I was still in the NFL drug program, but it
was like nobody just nobody ever talked about it. And
one time, one time, somebody, uh, one of the people
in the media, we had like a b week and
we had a couple of days off, and he said,
do you ever think about smoking weed?

Speaker 1 (40:04):
And I was just being honest. I was like, I
think about that shit all the time.

Speaker 5 (40:10):
And then it kind of came up and it was
like a you know, coach told me, like, you know,
don't be a distraction. But other than that, everyone pretended
like pretend like it didn't happen. Yeah, that's crazy.

Speaker 4 (40:21):
What did you really find out about yourself once you
stepped away from football?

Speaker 5 (40:26):
I think I found out that I was just a
more spiritual person than I than I thought.

Speaker 4 (40:32):
And that's what leads you into all the astrology stuff exactly.

Speaker 5 (40:36):
Just I'm like that, I'm just really curious. I just
want to want to learn exactly. That's all I got.
All I think about.

Speaker 4 (40:43):
Where else did you get to travel? You said you
travel the world where some of the favorite places you
pit stopped at.

Speaker 1 (40:50):
I love Thailand. I love Thailand.

Speaker 3 (40:52):
It's beautiful out there.

Speaker 5 (40:54):
Yeah, Australia was Australia was cool because it's different, but
everybody speaks English, so it was different enough, but it
still felt familiar enough in.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
Your in your travels. Who had the best grass? Good question?

Speaker 5 (41:11):
I mean obviously Amsterdam, Amsterdam, but Hawaii surprisingly.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
Yeah they got we were there. Yeah, we were there Hawaii.

Speaker 5 (41:21):
I was just now the whole nother like I don't
know if it was that batch or if it's across
the board.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
But I had it like that, so fire out there.

Speaker 4 (41:27):
Yeah, it was funny because we used to go to
Amsterdam and the off season, me and some guys that
are still playing. But they said they get a majority
of their way from California, Northern California in.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
Particular, you bounced back in the league in two thousand
and five, right, but you're still dealing with the NFL
drug policy.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
Back and forth, back and forth. What was that like?
It was stressful. I know it's stressful. You just want
to smoke them chill.

Speaker 4 (41:51):
Well, you said, you said at one point you learned
how to be tested, and still was this during that
time because I went.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
Through different phases.

Speaker 5 (41:59):
Like the first the first time I got into the program,
I found this drink okay, and.

Speaker 1 (42:04):
Ours was called liquid. We used to use something.

Speaker 5 (42:07):
Extra extra clear or something okay, and you gotta like,
you gotta drink it, and then you wait fifteen minutes,
drink about the water. Fifteen minutes, drink about the water,
and then your piece.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
Cleant.

Speaker 4 (42:19):
You gotta window, you gotta keep paying, Yes, you gotta
keep peeing. Yeah, we're giving away our secretuse. We've never
talked about this the first time.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
This is the first time.

Speaker 3 (42:26):
Our ship used to be liquid.

Speaker 5 (42:28):
That's what got me though, is at the time that
I got popped the second time is like I went out,
we lost to the Eagles and we got knocked out
of the playoffs, and I.

Speaker 1 (42:35):
Just was like, went too hard that night.

Speaker 5 (42:37):
So he would come at six o'clock in the morning,
So I wake up at five.

Speaker 1 (42:41):
The process and I fell back asleep. You didn't get that.

Speaker 5 (42:44):
I didn't get the piss off and I just barely failed.

Speaker 4 (42:48):
You got to get at least three to four p's
out before you're clear.

Speaker 1 (42:51):
Yeah, so that was we got so speaking to your ship.

Speaker 4 (42:53):
So when I was I was in the program with
the Clippers and got traded to Memphis, and uh, the
p man was coming once a week, so I would
be clean all week he would come, know him by name.
He would actually I did know his name forgot the ship.
But I'd be clean all week, and then the day
he tests me, I'll smoke the entire day and then

(43:14):
try to get clean the whole entire week, and I'll
be able to take.

Speaker 5 (43:16):
My That was my second That was my second way.
The second time when I came back.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
It was only once a week, and yeah.

Speaker 5 (43:21):
And then I got to the point where I realized
I could take three hits and pass the tests the
next day.

Speaker 4 (43:25):
Oh, three hits and past the next day. So you
would just want to take a drink, drink a bunch
of water.

Speaker 5 (43:30):
Just because I was as an athlete, we're cyclist so much.
The cannabis when it comes out, it's because it's stored.
But if you don't smoke enough to store it, it isn't.

Speaker 3 (43:39):
Yeah you was Michael does and before Michael does.

Speaker 1 (43:42):
But because I was in the program and Michael does worked.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
You know, when you're doing like three hits as much
exactly get you where you need to be exactly.

Speaker 2 (43:50):
I didn't have that power you all the way in
I'm going to go to sleep.

Speaker 1 (43:55):
That's how I was.

Speaker 4 (43:57):
I had some shipip shipped up from Cali and every
once a week, I get to smoke once a week,
so I'd burn it down like two three joints. I'd
probably pass out in my chair. It was on the
regular wake up and just I had to get it
in me. We've never talked about that because I never
wanted to bust no one out. But since they don't
test for it no more. Because everyone used to say
what do you used to take? And we used to
have to tell it but it was liquid from G

(44:18):
and C or when they didn't have liquid. I would
just say, yo, what's I would go to I'd be
real with to do it, like I got to pass
the P test. Would you recommend what's the hardest cleanser
you have, and they would give it to you. But
you would feel like shit though, because you had to
take that drink that I just used to take a bunch.
I used to have my trainers. I used to drop
some of my trainers from Bread to give me a
heads up, like, because they got to a point where
we're doing four randoms during the season, we didn't know

(44:39):
where it was coming.

Speaker 3 (44:40):
Four randoms.

Speaker 4 (44:42):
This is not even in the program though, this is
just regular wow, four random tests. So I would always,
you know, I get some of my trainers from Bread,
like just give me a heads up the morning they come.
So sometimes I do that whole process and be bloated
like a motherfucker and I didn't even get tested.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
I was pissed.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
But at one point we knew that you can go
on a drug ram and still smoke. So we told
them and Early Live we was like, man, I'm pissing dirty.
Put them in the program and you can stand up.
I stayed in the program. Damn. The three seasons under company.
It wasn't no penalties that that they wouldn't They wouldn't
help you. As long as you in the program, you
just got to pee a certain amount of times and
something you could up. But it was really I stayed

(45:19):
in that motherfucker for three years.

Speaker 5 (45:20):
If you're in the program and you get popped, that's
like four game suspensions, It's like, and it keeps getting worse.

Speaker 4 (45:25):
It probably weren't some penalties, but Jack probably just when
I first got in the league, it was one drug test.
Like them, it was a preseason They got the whole
team too, Yes, so we could. We had We had
weed in the car as soon as we got there
out of practice that day.

Speaker 3 (45:37):
That's how it used to be.

Speaker 2 (45:38):
How did the turbulent relationship with the NFL and pack
your image?

Speaker 1 (45:41):
Though I know that kind of pissed you off, honestly,
at the end of the day, it actually helped. It
actually helped.

Speaker 5 (45:48):
I mean I had to come back and like finish
my career and like earn that kind of respect and
carry myself for certain way. But at the end of
the day, it turns into like a redemption story and
it allowed me now to tell a positive.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
Exactly right, I was right the whole time. Yeah, basically,
straight up?

Speaker 1 (46:07):
What was it like? Real quick?

Speaker 4 (46:08):
I want to know because my brother played with the
Argonauts and went running great Cup. What was that experience like,
because that was the one thing he was a receiver,
and he said they used to just that the treatment
was low grade.

Speaker 3 (46:18):
Just it was tough to really make.

Speaker 5 (46:20):
It if you come from even like college and the
States to something and.

Speaker 1 (46:24):
Then you go to that.

Speaker 5 (46:26):
I mean, but like our our facility were trailers, right,
you know, trailers we did. Like our our team meeting
room was just a trailer.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
But but I.

Speaker 5 (46:36):
Will say, like if you if you really are about
the game, you know, then it like can bring you
back to it. And for me it did, Like because
if there are only certain there's only a certain number
of American players that can be on the team. So
most of the American guys like stayed in the same area.
So it was kind of like college and after after
practice we just go play. It was Toronto, yeah, and

(46:57):
it was Toronto and it was Toronto, right, yeah, so
it was I had a wonderful experience.

Speaker 1 (47:01):
Did you.

Speaker 4 (47:02):
My brother said he loved it, but he's just like
as far as like the amenities and trying to keep
your body on top of it, it's tough.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
It's even like the gear, you know, trying to get gloves.

Speaker 4 (47:12):
It was tough, Like, god damn it, I used to
have to give this shit away and I can't even
getting us exactly when you initially stepped away from the game.
Was there you said you started traveling right away?

Speaker 1 (47:23):
Was there ever?

Speaker 4 (47:24):
Kind of like a gnull because I kind of feel
like when people step away from something they've been accustomed
to their whole life, there's kind of a little did
you ever hit the rut or you just kept mine?

Speaker 5 (47:31):
I just saw I was going so hardcore just to
like because it was something that was building up.

Speaker 1 (47:36):
It wasn't like I was.

Speaker 5 (47:37):
It was something that was building up, and I just
knew I needed to like sow my royal old so
see see the world. So I was on it and
that way I went on and I got to this
point where I was like, this is great, but for
my life to really take off, I need to go
back to the league and clear my name, not that,
and so it kind of it led me back. But
I came back and the biggest difference was before I

(47:58):
was kind of in this no man's land of like
what do I have to do to like keep this?
And when I came back, it was more like what
can my career, what can.

Speaker 1 (48:06):
The NFL do do for me? And so I was
just more intentional.

Speaker 3 (48:11):
Did you get what you were looking for?

Speaker 5 (48:12):
I got exactly where I cleared my name. I was
able to walk away and with the platform intact that
I now have access to.

Speaker 4 (48:19):
So you recently launched Heisman, what are your hopes and
envisions in this cannabis space? With that, I mean really
a lot of this of just conversation, these conversations, you know,
because like I'm hardcore, and I'm saying like, because most
people they say, you know, don't talk about using cannabis,
but then they don't have all their reasons, you know,
I'm heard or this or that, And I'm saying like,

(48:41):
more like this kind of conversation where people are talking about,
like did you take your medicine today?

Speaker 5 (48:46):
You know where it is people feel comfortable saying I
need this. I need because people say like I need
this for a lot of reasons. But when you're saying something,
I need this because this makes me a better person,
I think, you know.

Speaker 1 (49:01):
Change exactly. That's the biggest statement you can make.

Speaker 4 (49:04):
Yeah, I think, yeah, I mean I just think hearing
the why you know this is why they've never heard
athletes say why. It was always just a stigma. You're this,
you're that, you're, you're, you're you know, you're not focused.
But when you actually hear the reasons why, you can't
argue with it.

Speaker 5 (49:17):
The crazy part, though, is like, is this is what
I noticed? Is I believe that too, So I thought
I was doing something wrong. So I took a step
back and I said, like, really, what is going on?
And I was like, and it might sound crazy, but
at that time, at least from my body's perspective, this
was better for me than football anything.

Speaker 3 (49:34):
Like, yeah, talk to them real shit.

Speaker 4 (49:36):
I mean my I started smoking at fourteen, and I
didn't really know. Obviously I didn't need it for the
paint at that time, but I had just had a
tough upbringing. And I remember the first thing you said
is it just calmed everything on the outside. And I
knew when I smoked it would take me there. So
fast forward. You know, I'm forty two now, I've been smoking,
you know, for more than half my life. But we
can always, we can explain until we're blue in the face.

(49:58):
But I think the real breakthrough was when they were
started having medical research behind this. So now we're saying.
What we're saying is backed up by actual information, and
I think obviously that's why it's moving the needle now.
But it's we've been saying this, we just didn't have,
like you said, the terminology, I guess is what they needed.

Speaker 5 (50:15):
And I think it's more more people that are successful
in life come out and tell their story. I think
that's going to drive even more. It's going to change
the research questions.

Speaker 4 (50:23):
Yeah, I agree, So speak to exactly. I mean, you
have it pretty narrow focused on different, you know, aspects
of the cannabis space. So speak to us about your
brand and the names of each and why you decided
to go this route.

Speaker 5 (50:35):
Yeah, so like overall, you know, creating a brand. When
I got into the cannabis space, like I saw it's
like what people were calling a brand is you just
create some like fancy packaging and then you convince people that.

Speaker 1 (50:46):
Yours is better than the next. And that's a brand.

Speaker 5 (50:49):
And to me, I think I get it, and they're
people doing a great job. But for me, if I'm
going to do a brand, it's got to be like
be part of it, has to be part of me
that that I'm putting out there, and so I was
saying earlier about I had this experience of how cannabis
actually helped me be a better football player and a
better person, and so helping people make these connections. And
one of the ways simple ways we did that is

(51:10):
through are the naming convention of our flower and instead
of the more conventional sativa indica hybrid, we call the
more sativa leaning strains pregame the hybrid's halftime, and then the
indica is postgame, right, so.

Speaker 4 (51:24):
It's you're a heavy indicas postgame pre game, Yeah, you
pre game it post game exactly.

Speaker 5 (51:31):
And then and then we've been we've been having fun
with the different like strainings, really trying to connect the
genetics with our favorite athletes.

Speaker 3 (51:39):
Oh that's dopeyh Yeah, I definitely want to check that out.

Speaker 1 (51:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (51:42):
Traditionally someone who was kind of private, but you you
really started to open up more with two docs on
a TV game show working on a biopic.

Speaker 1 (51:51):
Who you want to play you? I feel like there's
going to be some unknown person that.

Speaker 4 (51:56):
If there was, if there was a famous person, though
they're the famous person to play you.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
But see, it's tough because we have to go to
that age, that age.

Speaker 5 (52:03):
Range, and I like, I don't really know that many
actors in that age range.

Speaker 3 (52:08):
So you're gonna put someone on the map.

Speaker 1 (52:10):
I'm gonna put somebody on somebody's gonna just blow us
away and there. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (52:14):
Are you obviously more comfortable in the public eye now
and and and just kind of freely out here kind
of being yourself or is it still kind of you
just still kind of hold back a little bit.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
Yeah, I'm I'm out there now. I like got to
the point where I really fuck it. Yeah, it's me. Yeah,
take it, take it, leave it.

Speaker 5 (52:34):
At a certain point in life, like you realize that
young people need guidance and if we're trying to pretend
to be something else, that's that's not a good that's
not a good example.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
That's and that's a shitty way to live. I tell you,
be you the best you can be. Is you so
hard of being somebody else? Every hardest thing to do?
Just be yourself. Everyone else has already And and the
people that supposed to be in your life and that's
supposed to support you and love you, they gonna be
there regardless of who you are.

Speaker 1 (52:58):
Just be yourself.

Speaker 5 (52:59):
I had that same away and when I left, everybody
thought I was crazy, But my experience was this is
the happiest I ever been. And so I was like,
people in my life that can that are happy that
I'm happy?

Speaker 1 (53:08):
Those are my people. People that have a problem with that.

Speaker 4 (53:11):
Yeah, writing's on the wall. Yeah, well man, we appreciate
your time. We're gonna come down to Quick Hitters band.
First thing across your mind, let us know who are
some of the people in the cannabis space.

Speaker 3 (53:23):
Uh you look up to.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
H right now. The first person that comes to mind
is Chris Ball.

Speaker 3 (53:30):
Okay, Ball Family Farms.

Speaker 1 (53:31):
Yeah, that's there.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
That's as folks.

Speaker 5 (53:33):
Yeah, I mean just like heart and just like what
he's what the opportunity has and what he's doing with it.
You know, he talks about cultivating the culture. And I
think sometimes when I when I think about the industry,
it's like it makes me sad sometimes because it's becomes
just about like starting to become just about the money.
And what I love about what Chris is doing, it's
really about the plant.

Speaker 4 (53:55):
We did a collabor with him, shut out the Ball
family and that flower right, Yeah, something Now he's got
some shit over there.

Speaker 1 (54:01):
Yeah, what's the longest time you spent meditating.

Speaker 5 (54:04):
Like in one city for four hours probably, wow, But
that's not a lot, Like, that's not that's I got.

Speaker 1 (54:10):
I got probably close to thirty minutes.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
But you fall asleep, nah, But you know when I pray,
you know, after I pray.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Yeah, yeah, this was like time was up in the
MLA is like just up there to meditate. That was
that's a long time.

Speaker 4 (54:25):
So when you say that's when you say it's not
a long time. What is a long time to someone
who is actually in the space and really well to me.

Speaker 5 (54:32):
People like, honestly, a good meditation is five minutes. Okay,
it's just about centering yourself and then because if someone
needs to go out in the day, five minutes you're centered.
But if you know, I was on retreat, I was
like out for a couple of months, and I was
trying to like go deeper into myself, and so it's
like you sit for five minutes and things like settle

(54:52):
down to a certain level. But as you sit there,
like more stuff comes to the surface, you know, and
then if you can sit there, then that settles and
then just the more time it just gives you ability
to just go.

Speaker 4 (55:03):
So what do you I'm someone that's kind of wanted
to get what are you actually focusing on?

Speaker 1 (55:07):
Why you try?

Speaker 4 (55:08):
So if you say a five power five minute meditation,
so your things are coming to your mind, what do
you do to kind So.

Speaker 5 (55:15):
The simplest technique, and really what meditation is about is
it doesn't really matter what the point of focus is.
So when people when we're playing our sport or we're
doing our thing and we're in a zone, that's a
meditation because meditation just means the nature of our mind.
It just goes in all these different directions all the time,
and meditation is just bringing the bringing it about.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
It doesn't even matter what the point is.

Speaker 5 (55:34):
Some people use a mantrass, some people use their heart
or their their head, but it's just having it could
be a thought and idea a person. It's just having
one thing that you can bring the mind back to.
I mean this is why sports, I think, especially at
our level, it's so beneficial because it forces you to
learn to meditate. Right, your mind wants to go, but
you got a job to do. So the mind is

(55:55):
trained to be focused on one So for us, like
we know how to meditate, you.

Speaker 1 (56:01):
Know, we just got to do something that has.

Speaker 5 (56:03):
Our attention and the mind foot will focus. But that's
all meditation is just training the mind when it goes here,
to bring it back here. And then once it like
it gets trained and stops wandering, it can sit in
one place and then it becomes more profound.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
You notice more things.

Speaker 3 (56:20):
Are there any other things.

Speaker 4 (56:23):
Psilocybin, mushrooms, anything in that psychedelic realm, so to.

Speaker 3 (56:27):
Speak, that you feel that can help people.

Speaker 5 (56:29):
I think all of the psychedelics because and I consider
cannabis is a psychedelic. It's just mild, something you can
do more on a daily basis. I think a lot
of the other psychedelics they're more like when you got
to flush your system out, you know.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
But I think that cannabis is more like the daily maintenance.

Speaker 5 (56:46):
And even the worst psychedelic it means soul revealing, right,
revealing ourselves to ourselves or another word that uses entheagen
is the god within.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
So I think all of these.

Speaker 5 (56:56):
Substances it's the same thing as meditation. It's just getting
your mind off the bullshit and just focusing on something
that's like more real.

Speaker 1 (57:03):
Five dinner guests dead or alive, so definitely Bob, Yes, sir,
definitely pop m hm.

Speaker 5 (57:13):
And then I'm like Jesus Mohammad and uh, roomy, who's
that he's?

Speaker 3 (57:20):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (57:21):
He was a mystic poet pop talk about him? Yeah yeah, ok, yeah, okay,
here's a poet? Is a room m to me? Something
like that? Yeah? Yeah.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
What artists do you currently have on rotation? And what
genre music you best? The best describes your running style?
Two questions.

Speaker 5 (57:37):
So the what I'm listening to right now is on repeat,
I just have It's Damian Marley. I listened to all
of Marley's a lot, but right now.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
I've just been on Damien for for a minute. Jam rock.
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
And your running style, what kind of music is that?

Speaker 1 (57:52):
A good one? I think? Uh?

Speaker 5 (57:55):
Like I came up in nineties West Coast hip hop.
It's like smooth and then it hits it.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
Yeah exactly, we all know that. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (58:10):
What's the first thing you do when you wake up
and the last thing you do before.

Speaker 1 (58:13):
You go to sleep? The first thing I do when
I wake up is I roll up, and then I pray,
and then you smoke.

Speaker 3 (58:21):
After you pray, I smoke after that.

Speaker 5 (58:23):
I noticed I noticed this morning I rolled up. I
rolled up first, and then I went upstairs. Some mornings
I pray first, but this morning I rolled up, then
I pray, then I smoke, and then I read, meditate,
and before I go to bed, I'm always reading.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
I read and smoke until I fall asleep. See.

Speaker 2 (58:40):
I pray, meditate, smoke every morning. Yeah, if you could
see one person on our show, who would it be?
But before you answer that, you have to help us
get your answer on the show. All right, Janeico, Oh
that's dope. And she smokes heavy too. Yeah yeah, actually yes,
do you know her?

Speaker 1 (58:59):
I don't.

Speaker 4 (59:02):
And we're gonna put a college big y'all both, we
need both of y'all.

Speaker 3 (59:06):
Both y'all big shop. There's real for both, y'all.

Speaker 4 (59:09):
Well, man, that's a wrap, Ricky Man, we appreciate your time.
I'm glad we got a chance to talk to you.

Speaker 1 (59:14):
Man.

Speaker 4 (59:14):
I've been a big fan of yours for a long time.
Obviously I'm a huge football fan. But again that you
were before your time in the cannabis space, and uh,
you know, we're someone like myself and my brother Al Harrington.
We really kind of took that Jackson and really kind
of continue to push the narrative man, but I feel
like it really started with you.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
Man. I appreciate what you guys.

Speaker 3 (59:32):
Yeah, we need it, definitely.

Speaker 1 (59:34):
I'm a text boy, so I'm a different type of fan. Man.

Speaker 4 (59:37):
That's a rap with our man, Ricky Williams. See y'all
next week.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
Peace,