May 19, 2023 • 27 mins
As they continue highlighting the Amazonia Conservation Hub, Rick and Marco speak with Senior Wildlife Care Specialist Lindsey Shafer about Alba, a female Andean bear at the San Diego Zoo. Alba recently gave birth to twin Andean bear cubs—the first twins of their species born at the Zoo since 1993! Amazing Wildlife examines what it’s like for this special omnivore to care for these extraordinary bears, and what wildlife care specialists do when cubs—in this case, two of them—join the family.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hi, I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
What else y s world?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
I'm Marco Wentz.
Speaker 4 (00:08):
Welcome to Amazing Wildlife, where we explore unique stories of
wildlife from around the world and uncover fascinating animal facts.
This podcast is a production of iHeartRadio and San Diego
Zoo Wildlife Alliance, in international nonprofit conservation organization which oversees
the San Diego Zoo and Safari Park.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
You know, Rick, I've had so many guests and team
members who are really digging our podcast, and I got
a little more feedback about our last episode.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Oh cool. What's the feedback?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Well, at first they didn't really like the idea of
a snake episode. Oh I know, I know, But after
listening to it, they definitely had a newfound appreciation for
the Bushmaster.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Oh good, good.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
I was worried You're going to say somebody had a
hissy fit about it, and now our episode will be constricted.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
I don't even know how to respond to that.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Fair enough, Marco, I realize not everyone finds my animal
puns as hysterical as I do.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Please.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Okay, all right, Marco, fair enough, let's get back to business.
What conservation hubs are we focused on today?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
African forest, Oceans, Australian forest.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Well, earlier this year that San Diego Zoo's female Anddian bear, Alba,
gave birth to twin Andian bear cubs. So I was
thinking we could stick to the AMAZONI Hub for one
more episode.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Right on, Marco, I think we can bear with it
for one more episode.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
You just can't help yourself, can you.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Nope, It's just how my head works.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
But I'll try to keep a lid on the puns
fair enough, And yes, I would love to talk about
Indian bears and these cubs.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
What did you have in mind?
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Well, I mean, the fact that Alba, the mother Andyan bear,
had twins is pretty awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Theyt least you out is Mama Bear.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
She has been a mom before, but this is her
first set of twins.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
It is really exciting.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
And from what I understand, the last time we had
twin Andian bears born at the San Diego Zoo was
back in nineteen ninety three. So not only are these
two very important additions to the overall population of Andyan
bears and the future of the species as twins, they're
pretty unique.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Oh totally.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
And when we have birth like this at the San
Diego Zoo or the Safari Park. It's really easy to
get completely absorbed in the cuteness factor of the babies,
I know, especially these adorable cubs. But like you mentioned,
there is a bigger and more important goal here, and
that's securing a safe population for the future of the
species exactly.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
And I want to make sure our audience knows they
can learn all about our Indian bear conservation work by
listening to our Indian Bear episode from last season. It's
episode twenty four, season one. Now, in that episode, we
have a great conversation with doctor Russ van Horn. He
shares with us how the Indian bears are doing in
the wild and the work San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance
is currently doing with conservation partners.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Oh yeah, you know, I'm really glad you mentioned that, Rick,
because today I wanted to share with our audience what
it's like to care for these extraordinary bears and what
changes in their care when a cub or in this case,
two cubs join the familia.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Ooh, I like where you're going with this, Marco.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
I thought you might, Rick, and to help us learn
about this, I thought we should go directly to someone
with hands on experience.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Well, I can barely wage.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Sorry.
Speaker 5 (03:12):
I am Lindsay Schaeffer, and I am a senior wildlife
care specialist. I primarily work with our bear species, so
when I'm on the bear routine, I have the Anddian bears,
the grizzly bears, and the sloth bears. But I'm also
trained on some of the other routines, so i also
work the cats, the tigers, the leopards, and the hippos,
just to name a few.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Wow, Lindsay, that's a lot of really cool species you
work with. Can you give us a little insight to
what it's like to work with?
Speaker 6 (03:38):
The Indian bears are Andian bears.
Speaker 5 (03:40):
They're probably one of the smartest species of animals I've
ever worked, especially our female, miss Alba. You really watch
the wheels turn with her. She really likes to problem
solve work through all of the enrichment experiences that we
do with her.
Speaker 6 (03:56):
So every day it's.
Speaker 5 (03:57):
That challenge to come up with something new and something
fun to really get those wheels turning for her. So
that's probably why she's the most challenging.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
I'm so excited you brought up enrichment experiences lindsay, I
know what that means, and I know Marco does, but
for our audience, I want to give them a little
context and enrichment. Experience is a series of things the
animal gets to experience that can engage one, two, or
even all of the senses and also gives them the
opportunity to use their mind, natural adaptations, and body to
(04:25):
engage within the experience itself.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
For example, oh, one second, Rick, before you give that example. Okay, Lindsay,
With giving the audience that context, can you share with
us what kind of experiences you provide for the Anddian bears.
Speaker 5 (04:38):
We do a wide variety of different experiences for our bears.
Since the Indian bears in particular, they're big nesters and
they're big fruit eaters. A lot of our experiences that
we design around that are with different substrates or different
nesting material. A lot of them are also up high
in the climbing structures to really utilize those arboreal skills
(04:58):
that those bears have. And also with the fruit eating,
we do a lot of fruiting experiences, which is kind
of different cues that lead up to a big, smortgish
board of fruit that will appear in the habitat that
the bears can go and find sounds.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Like you put in a lot of work on your
side of it.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Friend, I'm sure does sound like a lot of time
and effort. Lindsay you said something about creating cues that
lead up to a big event or outcome.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
In the example, you gave a Shmorgish work of fruit,
which sounds delicious.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
Can you tell us more about that and why that's
part of their experience?
Speaker 5 (05:33):
So the experience is honestly, I think there're as much
enriching for us as they are for the bears. We're
constantly trying to come up with these cues that lead
to the end result.
Speaker 6 (05:41):
For instance, the fruit in the wild.
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Of course, there are different environmental cues that let an
animal know. We'll use the Andian bear for example that hey,
maybe a certain fruit is about to be ripe and
it's that fruit season.
Speaker 6 (05:53):
Here.
Speaker 5 (05:53):
We try to replicate those cues as much as we can.
So we'll start why blowing wind through through the habitat,
So we'll turn on the fans, and then we'll have
a certain scent that we then will kind of place
by the fans that will then blow in.
Speaker 6 (06:08):
That's just that new.
Speaker 5 (06:09):
Scent of Ooh, something smells a little different, kind of
replicating that Ooh, the bear in the wild might be
smelling that right fruit, That fruit might be coming soon,
So we try to replicate that here, and then once
we do the scent for a couple of days, then
the massive fruiting event will happen.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
It sounds like this gives the bears the opportunity to
experience anticipation, patience, and the curiosity of where is that
smell coming from?
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (06:36):
Correct, and problem solving.
Speaker 5 (06:38):
It's all about trying to solve where can I find
my next resource and take advantage of what's available. So
it's really fun here to try to replicate that as
much as we can.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
In all fairness, some people might look at this and
think that the bears wouldn't like these challenges. Why is
creating these experience is an important part of caring for
these intelligent bears.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
Yeah, so they naturally they want to solve problems. I mean,
just working with these bears, they've really me that they
love to be able to let their minds go and
be able to find their own food. I mean, if
we every single day had the same food presented the
same way the same time of day. I don't know
about you, but I would be bored out of my
mind by it. So it's really fun to be able
(07:16):
to explore that challenge that the bears really like to
have and really take advantage of that and let them
let them be bears.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Who knew having to outsmart a bear would be part
of a wildlife care specialist day. I know for my
time as a wildlife care specialist with birds, there is
a lot more to your day than what most people
would think. Lindsey, can you give us a snapshot of
what your average day is like taking care of the
Indian bears.
Speaker 5 (07:43):
Depending on the time of year, we might vary it
a little bit, but every day, you know, we come in,
we are first getting an evaluation of how the bears
were overnight, how their appetites are, or how their behavior is,
that sort of thing, and then we kind of roll
with those punches and kind of dictate our day based
on what the bears.
Speaker 6 (08:00):
Are telling us they need.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
But in generally, you know, it's a lot of cleaning,
a lot of cleaning, and then depending on what behaviors
we're working on, there's some training involved. There's the brainstorming
of the different enrichment activities that we're doing for the day,
multiple feedings, either habitat resets or tosses from the roof,
or to kind of take the wildlife care specialist out
(08:22):
of it, we even do automatic feeders that sort of thing.
So every day we're just trying to do something a
little bit different and kind of cater towards what the
bears are telling us they need.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Again, I gotta say that sounds like a lot of work.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
I know you said there are automatic feeders that can
help keep the bears guessing about how and when the
food will show up, But you also said something about
resetting a habitat.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
What does that mean.
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Yeah, So when if we reset a habitat, for instance,
I will call the bear inside, I will shut the
door so that way I'm safe to go out on habitat,
and I will skewer fruits.
Speaker 6 (08:54):
Different places on habitat.
Speaker 5 (08:56):
I will hide food, I will do smears of avocado,
just different things like that to really get them foraging around.
Versus if I just do like a toss from the
roof or a toss from the front, it's kind of
just like a scatter foraging opportunity.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Man.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
All this talk of avocados and fruit kind of making
me hungry. I was thinking the same thing, Marco Lindsay,
you've mentioned fruit for the Indian bears quite a bit.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Do they eat any meat at all?
Speaker 5 (09:24):
Only about five to seven percent of their diet is meat,
so a lot of their diet is fruits. A wild
bear eats a lot of plant materials, whether that be
bromeliads or cactus or even bamboos, some bamboos here.
Speaker 6 (09:38):
We feed them a little bit of meat.
Speaker 5 (09:39):
They get a ground chuck, but of course it's all
parts of the cow. They also get a few little
bone days and some fish. Our female especially really likes
her fish. But in general they do get a lot
more plant type materials versus like a grizzly bear that
most of their diet, depending on the time of year,
is more meat focused.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
It really is pretty interesting that the grizzly and Indian
bears are omnivores, but they're kind of different omnivores in
that Indian bears eat a lot more fruit and grizzly
bears are a little more meat focused.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah, yeah, totally, And it kind of sounds like their
habitat helps play a role in what they eat because
of what's available.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah, good point, Marco.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
And because of that, it sounds like the bears keep
you pretty busy, lendsy, which then.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Of course, does make me wonder. When you first started working.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
As a wildlife care specialist, did you imagine part of
your job would actually be trying to outsmart an Indian bear.
Speaker 5 (10:31):
I did not, and I don't think I'll ever be
able to outsmarter it. I tell you what, Miss Albush,
she really is one of the smartest bears I've ever met.
She actually, when she first came to us, she would
tear apart her climbing structures. She figured out how to
take a part in nuts and bolts. We actually had
to redo everything and put like elephant industrial bolts and
stuff to build her new climbing structures. So she has
(10:54):
always kept us on her toes, and I think we'll
always continue to.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
I love that, and I love the fact that there's
this understanding that Alba will always be curious about what
she can get into, and as a wildlife care specialist,
you not only accept the challenge, but you embrace it.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Yeah, it really is just part of the adventure of
Borkin with Wildlife and Lindsay, since you mentioned Daba, I
want to hear about her skills as a mom too.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Oh wait, wait, wait before we hear about Alba being
a mom.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
If it's okay, just hold on a second, can we
step back into the past just a little bit and
have you share with our audience what it's like leading
up to the birth of the cubs.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
We set up the breeding season. Basically, Alba, our female,
lives next door to Turbo, our male, and Alba especially
is amazing at communicating when she's ready to be with
our male.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
These bears are solitary.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
They usually only come together to breed or if it's
a mom with cubs, so otherwise these guys live separate lives.
But Alba, when breeding season comes about, which for her
typically is May Junish, is when she'll be an estress
and ready to breed. She will start giving us those
signs that she wants to be with Turbo will start
vocalizing to him. She makes almost like a cooing noise,
(12:03):
which is a very friendly, almost like a flirty vocalization
that she does. She'll start nest building next to him,
so she'll make the way our habitats are there's a
door in between them that has panels out of it
that the bears can see each other and smell each other,
So she'll start building nests right next to that, she'll
start vocalizing to him, and those are some of the
ways that we're like, all right, it's time they want
(12:25):
to be together.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Now. When Autba is giving you all those cues that
she's interested in being together with Turbo, what steps do
you take as a wildlife care specialist to make that
safely happen.
Speaker 5 (12:36):
Yeah, so as care specialists, we always take it slow.
These bears have been together before, but you never know.
Every years different. So every year we go through the
same steps of the visual introductions, first, the one door
away introductions, which still means there's a barrier in between,
but they can get very close to each other, basically
making sure they're giving us all the cues that they're
ready to be together. And then when that day finally
(12:58):
comes that there is no longer a door between, there's
always multiple staff members around, multiple deterrents, so that if
we have to get involved, we can. Thankfully, these two
have always been an amazing pair and do incredibly well
when introduced.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Lindsay, you had said earlier that these are a solitary
bear by nature, so I know after a little time together,
Alba and Turbo will naturally go their separate ways. But
once they do, how can we tell if allbus pregnant
or not.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
Ever since their first breeding cycle, we have trained Alba
for ultrasound, which basically means she comes. There's always a
bear between us and the bear, so we're still protected
contact with her, but she has been taught to come
right up to us, sit on a shelf or a
little seat, and there's a little window that an ultrasound
probe could fit through, and she sits, and she stays
(13:44):
with her avocado and peanut butter that we've smeared on
a target basically, and the vets then can perform ultrasound.
And that girl would probably sit there all day. If
peanut butter and avocado was involved. She could care less
who does that ultrasound. She's just happy to get the
peanut butter and the avocado.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
Cotto and peanut butter.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Wow, I can see why Allah doesn't mind sitting during
that ultrasound. A bear after my own heart, voluntarily participating
in an ultrasound while getting to snack onut some delicious yummies, right, I.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Mean, how much better would a visit to the doctor
be if there was a snack bar with your favorite
foods available?
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Hmmm, I think around something here, Buddy, I'm going to
have to suggest that on my next doctor's visit.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Oh.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
I look forward to hearing how that goes with your doctor.
But okay, okay, So lindsay we got a little off
topic here. Going back to the ultrasounds, I can only
imagine the anticipation everyone must feel hoping to see a
fetus or a heartbeat or something on the ultrasound screen.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
What is that like?
Speaker 5 (14:40):
It's honestly so exciting. I mean, we as wildlife care specialists,
we put a lot into our job, and to be
able to see all that hard work and all that
behavioral reading that we're constantly doing with these bears. When
we see that fetus for the first time, it's almost
like it pays off for us, Like, oh, look, all
of our hard work is shown right here.
Speaker 6 (14:59):
It's so much fun.
Speaker 5 (15:00):
And then this year, you know, the first go around
she only had one, which is completely normal, right, And
then this time around we saw one fetus and then
the next ultrasound showed the two, so it was really exciting.
It was almost like double the excitement.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Was there any disbelief.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Twins runs in her family, so her grandma has a
history of twins. Her mom, like her second or third pregnancy,
if I remember correctly, was also twins, So twins kind
of runs in her family. And an anddian bear It's
very common to have either one or two, and they
will even implant at different times. Those two different fetuses,
and both my coworker and I kind of had a
(15:37):
gut feeling that we would have two this time. Don't
ask why, but we kind of had a feeling. But
it was just as exciting to see that second fetus.
Speaker 4 (15:45):
Yeah, it's fair to note the wildlife care specialist intuition,
I think.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
I think so.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
You work around these animals so much, they become your
extended family.
Speaker 6 (15:53):
They really are.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
It's like knowing somebody in your family has something going
on without them saying word.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
Yeah. It's so true.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
Nothing beats intuition of a wildlife care specialist when it
comes to the wildlife that they take care of.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Now, I'm curious.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Lindsey having that gut feeling about twins then having it
confirmed with the ultrasound. Is there extra excitement or do
you keep your expectations in check because you never know
what's going to happen and is there anything different? And
you have to do knowing there are twins coming.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
When it comes to working with animals, something could always
go wrong. You always can prepare, you have that excitement,
but in the back of your head, you know, we've
been around the block. We know that things could go wrong.
You know she could potentially lose it, just like in
any animal or person pregnancy. But to say we do
anything different with our day, really know, if she's showing
she's extra hungry, we'll do a diet change to give
(16:43):
her some more food. If she's showing she's extra nesty
and wants to start making her big nest in her den,
we'll give her more bedding. So we just always take
our cues from what all be needs. But other than that,
we pretty much just kind of maintain status quo with
her care.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
I love that so much. Let Mama Bear show us
what she needs. After all, this is a big part
of taking care of wildlife, observing them and interpreting their
species specific behavior and then responding to those behavioral cues.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
That's so true, Marko.
Speaker 4 (17:14):
And part of understanding what you're observing comes from being
able to look back at past behavior too. And lindsay,
is it correct to assume that we could also anticipate
sort of when the cubs were going to arrive because
we could compare the ultrasound measurements of the babies with
the data from past pregnancies.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
That's what's so exciting about those ultrasounds. We have advanced
enough equipment that we were able to get measurements on
both fetuses, and we had done that for her first pregnancy,
so we kind of could roughly predict, Okay, the fetuses
are getting to excise, so we knew when we were
getting kind of around that mark that we would start
(17:52):
really preparing for potential birth. We knew there were two,
so they were probably going to be a little bit smaller,
so there was still kind of a guessing game. But Alba,
we learned from the first go around, and she did
the same thing this time. When she starts nesting the
whole day, like NonStop dragging bedding in her den, really
making her bed, that's our indication that she's impending. And
(18:15):
sure enough, the first time she did that, I think
she had agapito within a couple days. This time it
was literally within a day. She just nested all day
and then overnight had two very healthy babies.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Well, that sounds so exciting to come into work and
see that she has two healthy cubs. However, I can't
help but also think that as a wildlife care specialist,
you now have two more albeit small, but still two
more animals to look after.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
And I know with some of the bird species I
worked with in the past, usually the parents do all
the work of caring for and looking after the young.
Is that the same for the Andyan bears, Lindsay, or
did you have extra work to do now?
Speaker 5 (18:55):
Alba is one of the best moms we've ever seen.
Our job is easy, to be honest with you, She's
doing all the hard work.
Speaker 6 (19:01):
Really, all we do those first couple weeks.
Speaker 5 (19:03):
We have a video monitor setup that we can make
sure we see nursing and good movement from the cubs,
and we have a little baby monitor in our office
that we can also hear vocalizations, just to make sure
we're hearing nursing and that sort of thing. And then
we will offer her food in one of the bedrooms
that's next door to her den, and then really other
(19:24):
than that, Alba's just being one of the best moms
we've ever seen and takeing care of those cubs, and
that's pretty.
Speaker 6 (19:30):
Much all we do.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Nice.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
She makes our job easy when she's got cubs in
those dens. She really does.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
You mentioned she's taking care of those cubs in the
den for the first few weeks. At what point does
Alba bring them out of the den or is that
something the cubs initiate.
Speaker 5 (19:47):
She typically has initiated that usually when they're oh, maybe
about a month, month and a half, she has historically
carried them out to kind of check her space a
little bit. We leave her with habitat access twenty four
to seven. We let her make her good choices about
where she wants the cubs to be where she wants
to be. So historically and this go around, she took
(20:09):
the cubs out and kind of inspected everything, carrying both
of them in her arm at about a month, month
and a half and then they didn't really start initiating
going out until they were about three three and a
half months old, And now at four months it's just
mass chaoss.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
We'll get to that massk cass the second. But you
mentioned I think when people think about a large carnivore carrying.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Its baby, they visualize what they see the lions do
in the savannah.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
It's that's scruff carrying.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
But you mentioned she's carrying both her babies, yes, in
her arm. Is it like a football?
Speaker 5 (20:39):
It's exactly like a football carry And she would hold
them almost like rear end to face and then rear
end face like kind of opposite ways, and then she'd
kind of cradle them just like a football and kind
of three legged hop out and just kind of take
a look around, make sure everything looked okay, and then
take them right back in.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
She is such a good mom. How cool is it
that she figured out a way to carry both of
the cubs like that?
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Wicked smart?
Speaker 4 (21:07):
She really is amazing, and it sounds like she's making
it pretty easy for the wildlife care staff for the
first few months at least. But Lindsay, you mentioned and
I quote mass chaos around the four month mark.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Oh yeah, that's right. I want to ask more about
that too, Lindsay. With the enrichment experiences that Turbo and albaget.
Do the cubs interact with those two and if so,
what's that like.
Speaker 5 (21:28):
It's so fun watching them experience those little things for
the first time, like the first time they'll see a
palm wrap, or the first time they'll wrestle with a
little log. It's just so fun being able to introduce
all those little things to them and even watch all
the introduce things. So as the clubs have gotten older,
(21:49):
she'll start introducing different food items to them. For instance,
if she gets one of her half femur bones, one
thing she's historically done has always smashed it open to
get the marrow out. Now you kind of watch her
show them what she's doing so that eventually they'll pick
up that behavior and.
Speaker 6 (22:06):
Learn that on their own.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So it's a lot of fun being able to kind
of provide her with those things so that she's teaching
the cubs basically how to be a bear, and it's
not coming from us.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
As we're recording this, the cubs are about four months
old and will be about five months old when this
episode comes out. What behavior can guess visiting the San
Diego Zoo expect to see from the cubs as they
grow and develop and what are you hoping to see
as well?
Speaker 5 (22:33):
So right now, you know, we're continuing to watch their
mobility get better. They're still a little wildly on their feet,
so as the months progress, you'll see them get stronger.
So we'll continue to provide them with different climbing opportunities
and play opportunities that really help strengthen those muscles. We'll
also see them, you know, start to get away from
(22:55):
nursing as much and getting more on solid food. Right now,
well it's mostly still nursing, but they are sampling food.
The little female cubs, she seems to be really taking
a liking. We call it baby food, which is where
we chop up all this diet into little baby pieces. Basically,
she's really liking that, whereas the little male cub has
(23:16):
really been into the meat product, which is interesting to see.
So we'll see that progress. They're taking of different food
items and that sort of thing. This is a really
fun time because we usually experiment with all sorts of
different foods with cubs, hoping that maybe as adults they
will take to those food items. Veggies are historically a
very hard thing to get bears to eat, so we
(23:37):
always offer veggies to cubs in the hopes that maybe
as adult bears they will actually eat their veggies.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Not unlike most parents with kids.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
Correct, it's really the same thing across species, bear or human.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
That's hilarious.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
I love that. Gotta eat your veggies kids. Hey, Lindsey,
I want to switch gears there a little bit.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
One thing Rick and I have noticed over these last
week you interviews is that everyone is so passionate about
the species they work with. Have bears always been a
species of wildlife that you were interested in?
Speaker 5 (24:08):
Truthfully, I kind of accidentally started working with bears. I always,
truthfully wanted to work with marine mammals. I had my
heart set that that's what I wanted to work with,
was marine mammals. And then way back in college, I
got an internship with big and small cats and kind
of fell into that, and that was the route I
always thought I'd take. And then when I joined this team,
(24:29):
it was a nice mixture of bears and cats, but
I kind of got towards the bear side and have
stayed ever since. And it's been a challenge and a
joy ever since.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
It's funny how that works out.
Speaker 4 (24:41):
Sometimes our path will lead us to something wonderful and unexpected.
And I know for me and probably for you too, Marco,
working with wildlife is a work of passion. Our hearts
are so strongly tied to our work.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So, Lindsey, I'd like to ask you why do you
do this?
Speaker 6 (24:57):
You know I do this job.
Speaker 5 (24:58):
Watching all but b mom is what makes it all
worth It makes the dirt, makes the basically we always say,
the blood, sweat and tears that we put into this job.
The rewarding things like all but teaching her cubs how
to be bears.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
That's what makes it all worth it.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
And watching those cubs grow into the adults that we
know they're going to grow in.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
We look forward to MUCHIEI ms get asked.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yes, you're sharing that, Lindsay. It was amazing.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
It really is a treat for a listeners to be
able to hear from one of our very own wildlife
care specialists and to learn about the work and the
wildlife in their care.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yes, thank you, Lindsay. We really do appreciate your time.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
And speaking of time, I want to let our audience
know that this episode came out in May of twenty
twenty three, and if you come to the San Diego zoo.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
You should be able to see.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
Alba and her twin cubs throughout the year of twenty
twenty three. But keep in mind they grow up quickly,
so if you're here in the later part of the year, well,
they might look a little more like teenagers.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Than they would cubs.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Yeah, no doubt, And it's worth mentioning if you're listening
to this near the end of twenty twenty three or
the beginning of twenty twenty four, it is possible that
Alva has decided the kids are too big and she
would rather be solitary.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Again, she kicked them out right, I can't flavor.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
And in that case, Alva and the cubs, who would
be very close to adult size at that point, will
be taking turns in the outdoor habitat.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Oh and speaking of San Diego Zoo, Marco, that reminds me,
we have Nighttime Zoo coming up really soon.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Oh yeah, that's right. Ooh, that gives me an idea.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
Oh okay, what's that?
Speaker 2 (26:36):
How about an episode about nocturnal animals? Ooh?
Speaker 1 (26:40):
I like it? All right, everyone, you know what to do.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Be sure to subscribe and tune into our next episode,
in which Marco and I step into the night with
some nocturnal wildlife.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Marco Went and I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo's Tafari Park, go.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
To SDZWA dot org.
Speaker 4 (27:03):
Amazing Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio. Our supervising producer
is Nikiah Swinton and our sound designer and editor is
Sierra Spreen. For more shows from iHeartRadio, check out the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite shows.
Hi, I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
What else y s world?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
I'm Marco Wentz.
Speaker 4 (00:08):
Welcome to Amazing Wildlife, where we explore unique stories of
wildlife from around the world and uncover fascinating animal facts.
This podcast is a production of iHeartRadio and San Diego
Zoo Wildlife Alliance, in international nonprofit conservation organization which oversees
the San Diego Zoo and Safari Park.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
You know, Rick, I've had so many guests and team
members who are really digging our podcast, and I got
a little more feedback about our last episode.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Oh cool. What's the feedback?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Well, at first they didn't really like the idea of
a snake episode. Oh I know, I know, But after
listening to it, they definitely had a newfound appreciation for
the Bushmaster.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Oh good, good.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
I was worried You're going to say somebody had a
hissy fit about it, and now our episode will be constricted.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
I don't even know how to respond to that.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Fair enough, Marco, I realize not everyone finds my animal
puns as hysterical as I do.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Please.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Okay, all right, Marco, fair enough, let's get back to business.
What conservation hubs are we focused on today?
Speaker 1 (01:06):
African forest, Oceans, Australian forest.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Well, earlier this year that San Diego Zoo's female Anddian bear, Alba,
gave birth to twin Andian bear cubs. So I was
thinking we could stick to the AMAZONI Hub for one
more episode.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Right on, Marco, I think we can bear with it
for one more episode.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
You just can't help yourself, can you.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Nope, It's just how my head works.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
But I'll try to keep a lid on the puns
fair enough, And yes, I would love to talk about
Indian bears and these cubs.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
What did you have in mind?
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Well, I mean, the fact that Alba, the mother Andyan bear,
had twins is pretty awesome.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
Theyt least you out is Mama Bear.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
She has been a mom before, but this is her
first set of twins.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
It is really exciting.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
And from what I understand, the last time we had
twin Andian bears born at the San Diego Zoo was
back in nineteen ninety three. So not only are these
two very important additions to the overall population of Andyan
bears and the future of the species as twins, they're
pretty unique.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Oh totally.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
And when we have birth like this at the San
Diego Zoo or the Safari Park. It's really easy to
get completely absorbed in the cuteness factor of the babies,
I know, especially these adorable cubs. But like you mentioned,
there is a bigger and more important goal here, and
that's securing a safe population for the future of the
species exactly.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
And I want to make sure our audience knows they
can learn all about our Indian bear conservation work by
listening to our Indian Bear episode from last season. It's
episode twenty four, season one. Now, in that episode, we
have a great conversation with doctor Russ van Horn. He
shares with us how the Indian bears are doing in
the wild and the work San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance
is currently doing with conservation partners.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Oh yeah, you know, I'm really glad you mentioned that, Rick,
because today I wanted to share with our audience what
it's like to care for these extraordinary bears and what
changes in their care when a cub or in this case,
two cubs join the familia.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
Ooh, I like where you're going with this, Marco.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
I thought you might, Rick, and to help us learn
about this, I thought we should go directly to someone
with hands on experience.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Well, I can barely wage.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Sorry.
Speaker 5 (03:12):
I am Lindsay Schaeffer, and I am a senior wildlife
care specialist. I primarily work with our bear species, so
when I'm on the bear routine, I have the Anddian bears,
the grizzly bears, and the sloth bears. But I'm also
trained on some of the other routines, so i also
work the cats, the tigers, the leopards, and the hippos,
just to name a few.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Wow, Lindsay, that's a lot of really cool species you
work with. Can you give us a little insight to
what it's like to work with?
Speaker 6 (03:38):
The Indian bears are Andian bears.
Speaker 5 (03:40):
They're probably one of the smartest species of animals I've
ever worked, especially our female, miss Alba. You really watch
the wheels turn with her. She really likes to problem
solve work through all of the enrichment experiences that we
do with her.
Speaker 6 (03:56):
So every day it's.
Speaker 5 (03:57):
That challenge to come up with something new and something
fun to really get those wheels turning for her. So
that's probably why she's the most challenging.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
I'm so excited you brought up enrichment experiences lindsay, I
know what that means, and I know Marco does, but
for our audience, I want to give them a little
context and enrichment. Experience is a series of things the
animal gets to experience that can engage one, two, or
even all of the senses and also gives them the
opportunity to use their mind, natural adaptations, and body to
(04:25):
engage within the experience itself.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
For example, oh, one second, Rick, before you give that example. Okay, Lindsay,
With giving the audience that context, can you share with
us what kind of experiences you provide for the Anddian bears.
Speaker 5 (04:38):
We do a wide variety of different experiences for our bears.
Since the Indian bears in particular, they're big nesters and
they're big fruit eaters. A lot of our experiences that
we design around that are with different substrates or different
nesting material. A lot of them are also up high
in the climbing structures to really utilize those arboreal skills
(04:58):
that those bears have. And also with the fruit eating,
we do a lot of fruiting experiences, which is kind
of different cues that lead up to a big, smortgish
board of fruit that will appear in the habitat that
the bears can go and find sounds.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Like you put in a lot of work on your
side of it.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Friend, I'm sure does sound like a lot of time
and effort. Lindsay you said something about creating cues that
lead up to a big event or outcome.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
In the example, you gave a Shmorgish work of fruit,
which sounds delicious.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
Can you tell us more about that and why that's
part of their experience?
Speaker 5 (05:33):
So the experience is honestly, I think there're as much
enriching for us as they are for the bears. We're
constantly trying to come up with these cues that lead
to the end result.
Speaker 6 (05:41):
For instance, the fruit in the wild.
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Of course, there are different environmental cues that let an
animal know. We'll use the Andian bear for example that hey,
maybe a certain fruit is about to be ripe and
it's that fruit season.
Speaker 6 (05:53):
Here.
Speaker 5 (05:53):
We try to replicate those cues as much as we can.
So we'll start why blowing wind through through the habitat,
So we'll turn on the fans, and then we'll have
a certain scent that we then will kind of place
by the fans that will then blow in.
Speaker 6 (06:08):
That's just that new.
Speaker 5 (06:09):
Scent of Ooh, something smells a little different, kind of
replicating that Ooh, the bear in the wild might be
smelling that right fruit, That fruit might be coming soon,
So we try to replicate that here, and then once
we do the scent for a couple of days, then
the massive fruiting event will happen.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
It sounds like this gives the bears the opportunity to
experience anticipation, patience, and the curiosity of where is that
smell coming from?
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (06:36):
Correct, and problem solving.
Speaker 5 (06:38):
It's all about trying to solve where can I find
my next resource and take advantage of what's available. So
it's really fun here to try to replicate that as
much as we can.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
In all fairness, some people might look at this and
think that the bears wouldn't like these challenges. Why is
creating these experience is an important part of caring for
these intelligent bears.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
Yeah, so they naturally they want to solve problems. I mean,
just working with these bears, they've really me that they
love to be able to let their minds go and
be able to find their own food. I mean, if
we every single day had the same food presented the
same way the same time of day. I don't know
about you, but I would be bored out of my
mind by it. So it's really fun to be able
(07:16):
to explore that challenge that the bears really like to
have and really take advantage of that and let them
let them be bears.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Who knew having to outsmart a bear would be part
of a wildlife care specialist day. I know for my
time as a wildlife care specialist with birds, there is
a lot more to your day than what most people
would think. Lindsey, can you give us a snapshot of
what your average day is like taking care of the
Indian bears.
Speaker 5 (07:43):
Depending on the time of year, we might vary it
a little bit, but every day, you know, we come in,
we are first getting an evaluation of how the bears
were overnight, how their appetites are, or how their behavior is,
that sort of thing, and then we kind of roll
with those punches and kind of dictate our day based
on what the bears.
Speaker 6 (08:00):
Are telling us they need.
Speaker 5 (08:01):
But in generally, you know, it's a lot of cleaning,
a lot of cleaning, and then depending on what behaviors
we're working on, there's some training involved. There's the brainstorming
of the different enrichment activities that we're doing for the day,
multiple feedings, either habitat resets or tosses from the roof,
or to kind of take the wildlife care specialist out
(08:22):
of it, we even do automatic feeders that sort of thing.
So every day we're just trying to do something a
little bit different and kind of cater towards what the
bears are telling us they need.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Again, I gotta say that sounds like a lot of work.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
I know you said there are automatic feeders that can
help keep the bears guessing about how and when the
food will show up, But you also said something about
resetting a habitat.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
What does that mean.
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Yeah, So when if we reset a habitat, for instance,
I will call the bear inside, I will shut the
door so that way I'm safe to go out on habitat,
and I will skewer fruits.
Speaker 6 (08:54):
Different places on habitat.
Speaker 5 (08:56):
I will hide food, I will do smears of avocado,
just different things like that to really get them foraging around.
Versus if I just do like a toss from the
roof or a toss from the front, it's kind of
just like a scatter foraging opportunity.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Man.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
All this talk of avocados and fruit kind of making
me hungry. I was thinking the same thing, Marco Lindsay,
you've mentioned fruit for the Indian bears quite a bit.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Do they eat any meat at all?
Speaker 5 (09:24):
Only about five to seven percent of their diet is meat,
so a lot of their diet is fruits. A wild
bear eats a lot of plant materials, whether that be
bromeliads or cactus or even bamboos, some bamboos here.
Speaker 6 (09:38):
We feed them a little bit of meat.
Speaker 5 (09:39):
They get a ground chuck, but of course it's all
parts of the cow. They also get a few little
bone days and some fish. Our female especially really likes
her fish. But in general they do get a lot
more plant type materials versus like a grizzly bear that
most of their diet, depending on the time of year,
is more meat focused.
Speaker 4 (09:58):
It really is pretty interesting that the grizzly and Indian
bears are omnivores, but they're kind of different omnivores in
that Indian bears eat a lot more fruit and grizzly
bears are a little more meat focused.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah, yeah, totally, And it kind of sounds like their
habitat helps play a role in what they eat because
of what's available.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah, good point, Marco.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
And because of that, it sounds like the bears keep
you pretty busy, lendsy, which then.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
Of course, does make me wonder. When you first started working.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
As a wildlife care specialist, did you imagine part of
your job would actually be trying to outsmart an Indian bear.
Speaker 5 (10:31):
I did not, and I don't think I'll ever be
able to outsmarter it. I tell you what, Miss Albush,
she really is one of the smartest bears I've ever met.
She actually, when she first came to us, she would
tear apart her climbing structures. She figured out how to
take a part in nuts and bolts. We actually had
to redo everything and put like elephant industrial bolts and
stuff to build her new climbing structures. So she has
(10:54):
always kept us on her toes, and I think we'll
always continue to.
Speaker 4 (10:58):
I love that, and I love the fact that there's
this understanding that Alba will always be curious about what
she can get into, and as a wildlife care specialist,
you not only accept the challenge, but you embrace it.
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Yeah, it really is just part of the adventure of
Borkin with Wildlife and Lindsay, since you mentioned Daba, I
want to hear about her skills as a mom too.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Oh wait, wait, wait before we hear about Alba being
a mom.
Speaker 4 (11:19):
If it's okay, just hold on a second, can we
step back into the past just a little bit and
have you share with our audience what it's like leading
up to the birth of the cubs.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
We set up the breeding season. Basically, Alba, our female,
lives next door to Turbo, our male, and Alba especially
is amazing at communicating when she's ready to be with
our male.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
These bears are solitary.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
They usually only come together to breed or if it's
a mom with cubs, so otherwise these guys live separate lives.
But Alba, when breeding season comes about, which for her
typically is May Junish, is when she'll be an estress
and ready to breed. She will start giving us those
signs that she wants to be with Turbo will start
vocalizing to him. She makes almost like a cooing noise,
(12:03):
which is a very friendly, almost like a flirty vocalization
that she does. She'll start nest building next to him,
so she'll make the way our habitats are there's a
door in between them that has panels out of it
that the bears can see each other and smell each other,
So she'll start building nests right next to that, she'll
start vocalizing to him, and those are some of the
ways that we're like, all right, it's time they want
(12:25):
to be together.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Now. When Autba is giving you all those cues that
she's interested in being together with Turbo, what steps do
you take as a wildlife care specialist to make that
safely happen.
Speaker 5 (12:36):
Yeah, so as care specialists, we always take it slow.
These bears have been together before, but you never know.
Every years different. So every year we go through the
same steps of the visual introductions, first, the one door
away introductions, which still means there's a barrier in between,
but they can get very close to each other, basically
making sure they're giving us all the cues that they're
ready to be together. And then when that day finally
(12:58):
comes that there is no longer a door between, there's
always multiple staff members around, multiple deterrents, so that if
we have to get involved, we can. Thankfully, these two
have always been an amazing pair and do incredibly well
when introduced.
Speaker 4 (13:12):
Lindsay, you had said earlier that these are a solitary
bear by nature, so I know after a little time together,
Alba and Turbo will naturally go their separate ways. But
once they do, how can we tell if allbus pregnant
or not.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
Ever since their first breeding cycle, we have trained Alba
for ultrasound, which basically means she comes. There's always a
bear between us and the bear, so we're still protected
contact with her, but she has been taught to come
right up to us, sit on a shelf or a
little seat, and there's a little window that an ultrasound
probe could fit through, and she sits, and she stays
(13:44):
with her avocado and peanut butter that we've smeared on
a target basically, and the vets then can perform ultrasound.
And that girl would probably sit there all day. If
peanut butter and avocado was involved. She could care less
who does that ultrasound. She's just happy to get the
peanut butter and the avocado.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
Cotto and peanut butter.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
Wow, I can see why Allah doesn't mind sitting during
that ultrasound. A bear after my own heart, voluntarily participating
in an ultrasound while getting to snack onut some delicious yummies, right, I.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Mean, how much better would a visit to the doctor
be if there was a snack bar with your favorite
foods available?
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Hmmm, I think around something here, Buddy, I'm going to
have to suggest that on my next doctor's visit.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Oh.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
I look forward to hearing how that goes with your doctor.
But okay, okay, So lindsay we got a little off
topic here. Going back to the ultrasounds, I can only
imagine the anticipation everyone must feel hoping to see a
fetus or a heartbeat or something on the ultrasound screen.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
What is that like?
Speaker 5 (14:40):
It's honestly so exciting. I mean, we as wildlife care specialists,
we put a lot into our job, and to be
able to see all that hard work and all that
behavioral reading that we're constantly doing with these bears. When
we see that fetus for the first time, it's almost
like it pays off for us, Like, oh, look, all
of our hard work is shown right here.
Speaker 6 (14:59):
It's so much fun.
Speaker 5 (15:00):
And then this year, you know, the first go around
she only had one, which is completely normal, right, And
then this time around we saw one fetus and then
the next ultrasound showed the two, so it was really exciting.
It was almost like double the excitement.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Was there any disbelief.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Twins runs in her family, so her grandma has a
history of twins. Her mom, like her second or third pregnancy,
if I remember correctly, was also twins, So twins kind
of runs in her family. And an anddian bear It's
very common to have either one or two, and they
will even implant at different times. Those two different fetuses,
and both my coworker and I kind of had a
(15:37):
gut feeling that we would have two this time. Don't
ask why, but we kind of had a feeling. But
it was just as exciting to see that second fetus.
Speaker 4 (15:45):
Yeah, it's fair to note the wildlife care specialist intuition,
I think.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
I think so.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
You work around these animals so much, they become your
extended family.
Speaker 6 (15:53):
They really are.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
It's like knowing somebody in your family has something going
on without them saying word.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
Yeah. It's so true.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
Nothing beats intuition of a wildlife care specialist when it
comes to the wildlife that they take care of.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Now, I'm curious.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Lindsey having that gut feeling about twins then having it
confirmed with the ultrasound. Is there extra excitement or do
you keep your expectations in check because you never know
what's going to happen and is there anything different? And
you have to do knowing there are twins coming.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
When it comes to working with animals, something could always
go wrong. You always can prepare, you have that excitement,
but in the back of your head, you know, we've
been around the block. We know that things could go wrong.
You know she could potentially lose it, just like in
any animal or person pregnancy. But to say we do
anything different with our day, really know, if she's showing
she's extra hungry, we'll do a diet change to give
(16:43):
her some more food. If she's showing she's extra nesty
and wants to start making her big nest in her den,
we'll give her more bedding. So we just always take
our cues from what all be needs. But other than that,
we pretty much just kind of maintain status quo with
her care.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
I love that so much. Let Mama Bear show us
what she needs. After all, this is a big part
of taking care of wildlife, observing them and interpreting their
species specific behavior and then responding to those behavioral cues.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
That's so true, Marko.
Speaker 4 (17:14):
And part of understanding what you're observing comes from being
able to look back at past behavior too. And lindsay,
is it correct to assume that we could also anticipate
sort of when the cubs were going to arrive because
we could compare the ultrasound measurements of the babies with
the data from past pregnancies.
Speaker 5 (17:31):
That's what's so exciting about those ultrasounds. We have advanced
enough equipment that we were able to get measurements on
both fetuses, and we had done that for her first pregnancy,
so we kind of could roughly predict, Okay, the fetuses
are getting to excise, so we knew when we were
getting kind of around that mark that we would start
(17:52):
really preparing for potential birth. We knew there were two,
so they were probably going to be a little bit smaller,
so there was still kind of a guessing game. But Alba,
we learned from the first go around, and she did
the same thing this time. When she starts nesting the
whole day, like NonStop dragging bedding in her den, really
making her bed, that's our indication that she's impending. And
(18:15):
sure enough, the first time she did that, I think
she had agapito within a couple days. This time it
was literally within a day. She just nested all day
and then overnight had two very healthy babies.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
Well, that sounds so exciting to come into work and
see that she has two healthy cubs. However, I can't
help but also think that as a wildlife care specialist,
you now have two more albeit small, but still two
more animals to look after.
Speaker 3 (18:41):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
And I know with some of the bird species I
worked with in the past, usually the parents do all
the work of caring for and looking after the young.
Is that the same for the Andyan bears, Lindsay, or
did you have extra work to do now?
Speaker 5 (18:55):
Alba is one of the best moms we've ever seen.
Our job is easy, to be honest with you, She's
doing all the hard work.
Speaker 6 (19:01):
Really, all we do those first couple weeks.
Speaker 5 (19:03):
We have a video monitor setup that we can make
sure we see nursing and good movement from the cubs,
and we have a little baby monitor in our office
that we can also hear vocalizations, just to make sure
we're hearing nursing and that sort of thing. And then
we will offer her food in one of the bedrooms
that's next door to her den, and then really other
(19:24):
than that, Alba's just being one of the best moms
we've ever seen and takeing care of those cubs, and
that's pretty.
Speaker 6 (19:30):
Much all we do.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Nice.
Speaker 5 (19:32):
She makes our job easy when she's got cubs in
those dens. She really does.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
You mentioned she's taking care of those cubs in the
den for the first few weeks. At what point does
Alba bring them out of the den or is that
something the cubs initiate.
Speaker 5 (19:47):
She typically has initiated that usually when they're oh, maybe
about a month, month and a half, she has historically
carried them out to kind of check her space a
little bit. We leave her with habitat access twenty four
to seven. We let her make her good choices about
where she wants the cubs to be where she wants
to be. So historically and this go around, she took
(20:09):
the cubs out and kind of inspected everything, carrying both
of them in her arm at about a month, month
and a half and then they didn't really start initiating
going out until they were about three three and a
half months old, And now at four months it's just
mass chaoss.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
We'll get to that massk cass the second. But you
mentioned I think when people think about a large carnivore carrying.
Speaker 4 (20:30):
Its baby, they visualize what they see the lions do
in the savannah.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
It's that's scruff carrying.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
But you mentioned she's carrying both her babies, yes, in
her arm. Is it like a football?
Speaker 5 (20:39):
It's exactly like a football carry And she would hold
them almost like rear end to face and then rear
end face like kind of opposite ways, and then she'd
kind of cradle them just like a football and kind
of three legged hop out and just kind of take
a look around, make sure everything looked okay, and then
take them right back in.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
She is such a good mom. How cool is it
that she figured out a way to carry both of
the cubs like that?
Speaker 3 (21:06):
Wicked smart?
Speaker 4 (21:07):
She really is amazing, and it sounds like she's making
it pretty easy for the wildlife care staff for the
first few months at least. But Lindsay, you mentioned and
I quote mass chaos around the four month mark.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Oh yeah, that's right. I want to ask more about
that too, Lindsay. With the enrichment experiences that Turbo and albaget.
Do the cubs interact with those two and if so,
what's that like.
Speaker 5 (21:28):
It's so fun watching them experience those little things for
the first time, like the first time they'll see a
palm wrap, or the first time they'll wrestle with a
little log. It's just so fun being able to introduce
all those little things to them and even watch all
the introduce things. So as the clubs have gotten older,
(21:49):
she'll start introducing different food items to them. For instance,
if she gets one of her half femur bones, one
thing she's historically done has always smashed it open to
get the marrow out. Now you kind of watch her
show them what she's doing so that eventually they'll pick
up that behavior and.
Speaker 6 (22:06):
Learn that on their own.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So it's a lot of fun being able to kind
of provide her with those things so that she's teaching
the cubs basically how to be a bear, and it's
not coming from us.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
As we're recording this, the cubs are about four months
old and will be about five months old when this
episode comes out. What behavior can guess visiting the San
Diego Zoo expect to see from the cubs as they
grow and develop and what are you hoping to see
as well?
Speaker 5 (22:33):
So right now, you know, we're continuing to watch their
mobility get better. They're still a little wildly on their feet,
so as the months progress, you'll see them get stronger.
So we'll continue to provide them with different climbing opportunities
and play opportunities that really help strengthen those muscles. We'll
also see them, you know, start to get away from
(22:55):
nursing as much and getting more on solid food. Right now,
well it's mostly still nursing, but they are sampling food.
The little female cubs, she seems to be really taking
a liking. We call it baby food, which is where
we chop up all this diet into little baby pieces. Basically,
she's really liking that, whereas the little male cub has
(23:16):
really been into the meat product, which is interesting to see.
So we'll see that progress. They're taking of different food
items and that sort of thing. This is a really
fun time because we usually experiment with all sorts of
different foods with cubs, hoping that maybe as adults they
will take to those food items. Veggies are historically a
very hard thing to get bears to eat, so we
(23:37):
always offer veggies to cubs in the hopes that maybe
as adult bears they will actually eat their veggies.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Not unlike most parents with kids.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
Correct, it's really the same thing across species, bear or human.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
That's hilarious.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
I love that. Gotta eat your veggies kids. Hey, Lindsey,
I want to switch gears there a little bit.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
One thing Rick and I have noticed over these last
week you interviews is that everyone is so passionate about
the species they work with. Have bears always been a
species of wildlife that you were interested in?
Speaker 5 (24:08):
Truthfully, I kind of accidentally started working with bears. I always,
truthfully wanted to work with marine mammals. I had my
heart set that that's what I wanted to work with,
was marine mammals. And then way back in college, I
got an internship with big and small cats and kind
of fell into that, and that was the route I
always thought I'd take. And then when I joined this team,
(24:29):
it was a nice mixture of bears and cats, but
I kind of got towards the bear side and have
stayed ever since. And it's been a challenge and a
joy ever since.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
It's funny how that works out.
Speaker 4 (24:41):
Sometimes our path will lead us to something wonderful and unexpected.
And I know for me and probably for you too, Marco,
working with wildlife is a work of passion. Our hearts
are so strongly tied to our work.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So, Lindsey, I'd like to ask you why do you
do this?
Speaker 6 (24:57):
You know I do this job.
Speaker 5 (24:58):
Watching all but b mom is what makes it all
worth It makes the dirt, makes the basically we always say,
the blood, sweat and tears that we put into this job.
The rewarding things like all but teaching her cubs how
to be bears.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
That's what makes it all worth it.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
And watching those cubs grow into the adults that we
know they're going to grow in.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
We look forward to MUCHIEI ms get asked.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yes, you're sharing that, Lindsay. It was amazing.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
It really is a treat for a listeners to be
able to hear from one of our very own wildlife
care specialists and to learn about the work and the
wildlife in their care.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yes, thank you, Lindsay. We really do appreciate your time.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
And speaking of time, I want to let our audience
know that this episode came out in May of twenty
twenty three, and if you come to the San Diego zoo.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
You should be able to see.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
Alba and her twin cubs throughout the year of twenty
twenty three. But keep in mind they grow up quickly,
so if you're here in the later part of the year, well,
they might look a little more like teenagers.
Speaker 1 (25:59):
Than they would cubs.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Yeah, no doubt, And it's worth mentioning if you're listening
to this near the end of twenty twenty three or
the beginning of twenty twenty four, it is possible that
Alva has decided the kids are too big and she
would rather be solitary.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Again, she kicked them out right, I can't flavor.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
And in that case, Alva and the cubs, who would
be very close to adult size at that point, will
be taking turns in the outdoor habitat.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Oh and speaking of San Diego Zoo, Marco, that reminds me,
we have Nighttime Zoo coming up really soon.
Speaker 3 (26:31):
Oh yeah, that's right. Ooh, that gives me an idea.
Speaker 1 (26:35):
Oh okay, what's that?
Speaker 2 (26:36):
How about an episode about nocturnal animals? Ooh?
Speaker 1 (26:40):
I like it? All right, everyone, you know what to do.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
Be sure to subscribe and tune into our next episode,
in which Marco and I step into the night with
some nocturnal wildlife.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Marco Went and I'm Rick Schwartz.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
For more information about the San Diego Zoo and San
Diego Zoo's Tafari Park, go.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
To SDZWA dot org.
Speaker 4 (27:03):
Amazing Wildlife is a production of iHeartRadio. Our supervising producer
is Nikiah Swinton and our sound designer and editor is
Sierra Spreen. For more shows from iHeartRadio, check out the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your
favorite shows.
Hosts And Creators
Rick Schwartz
Marco Wendt
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