Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
I was sentenced to eight years. I did five years.
I did five fits.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
It's hard time.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
You know what. I wouldn't trade one second of it
because of where I am now. I wouldn't trade one
second net one.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome to an army of normal folks. I'm Bill Courtney.
I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband, I'm a father,
I'm an entrepreneur, and I've been a football coach in
inner city Memphis. And that last part it somehow led
to an oscar for the film about our team. It's
called Undefeated. Guys, I believe our country's problems will never
(00:47):
be solved by a bunch of fancy people and nice
suits using big words that nobody ever uses on CNN
and Fox, but rather by an army of normal folks.
That's us, just you and me to citing. Hey, you
know what, maybe I can help. That's what Buddy Osborne,
the voice you just heard, has done. Buddy is the
(01:07):
founder of The Rock Ministries, which was birth out of
time in prison, his redemption story in Christ and being
a Golden Gloves boxing champion and guys, he is hilarious.
The Rock started by serving inner city boys with boxing
and the gospel and has grown to serving over eleven
(01:30):
thousand kids through sports, arts, music, mentoring, Bible studies, and
just about anything else you can imagine or that Buddy
can come up with. And all of this is taking
place amidst the largest open air drug market in the
world and some of the most dangerous blocks in the
United States. I cannot wait for you to meet our
(01:54):
new friend, Buddy. Right after these brief messages from our
general sponsors, Buddy Osbourne from Kensington, Pennsylvania. Welcome to Memphis.
(02:22):
Listen to be here, bro A. When'd you fly out
to Philly Philly? Yeah? Yeah, they got a direct flight.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Uh no, I had. I went to Atlanta and Delta
them yeah, Deltia Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yeah yeah. Well, welcome to Memphis, Buddy. You've got a
really great story, and I cannot wait for our listeners
to hear about what you're doing now, which is Rock Ministries,
which you founded. But the path that got you there
is pretty pretty extraordinary. And when people hear Kensington, Penncil,
(03:00):
I don't think many know what we're talking about, although
we're talking about right outside of Philly, but Germane to
your story. Really, I don't even think you'd be where
you are today if it wasn't for the way you
grew up. Kind of kind of start us off by
telling us about Kensington, about you know, how you grew
up and where you came from.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Well, Kensington is a Philadelphia, right, Kensington yet, but Philadelphia
is a city of neighborhoods built and you know, so
you have Kensington, Port, Richmond, Fishtown. So whenever you come
in contact with somebody, you'll say where you're from. And
once they tell you where, you know, you'll know what
type of guy.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Believe it, So nobody says I'm from Philly. They say
I'm from Fishtown or I'm from Kensingy.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Well you can say you're from Philly, but we're at yeah. Yeah.
So whenever somebody tells me where they're from, okay, you know,
I'll know exactly what what caliber they are.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
So when you say, do you say Kensington or do
you Kensey or what do you say?
Speaker 1 (03:59):
He said, Well, well, there's a thing called the slang
called Kenzo's like if you're a Kenzo, Yeah you're a Kenzo.
Yeah that's funny, But no, I'm from I'm from I
was born and raising Kensington.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
You know that's if you say, I'm from Kensington. What
is somebody from Philly here when they hear that?
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Well, you know, when I was growing up, I didn't
never want people to know I was from Kensington, you know, yeah,
because it just was from me. For me at that time,
you know, I had a full head of hair, blat,
it was dark. I was fit as a fiddle, you know.
I just you know, you know, you're out in about
and I got that at age where I want. I
was wanted to meet the girls and this and that.
(04:38):
So South Philly was a lot of Italians, you know,
and so for some reason, I just I equated with them,
you know, and I would I would stop, I would
dress like them and all, you know. So it was
so real. Good friend of mine, right, he would have
a tattoo Kensington, and I said, I don't nobody were.
But now but now I'm so honored and so proud
(05:01):
and so amazed, and I'm that I that I came back.
I left when I was twenty six, came back at
forty five to start the rock and which we'll get into.
But Kensington is a is a you know, it's it
was the manufacturing community of the country at one time.
I mean really, oh yeah, with hats and sweaters and
blankets and textiles, textile mills. Yeah yeah, textile exactly. And uh,
(05:27):
every corner you had, you had a factory. Everyone worked.
Uh the employment was one hundred percent. It was amazing.
I mean, you know, like I remember as a kid,
just you know, just it was amazing, amazing. The seventies,
you know, we were we were starting to fade and
and and that's when really drugs really start to make
(05:47):
its way in into Kensington. A lot of the people
that were you know, you know, working class, you know,
all jobs, everybody's working. The factories is shutting down one
by one and then and they were just they just
abandoned the factories. And then ultimately and time, as time
went on, then poverty came in and and you know,
(06:09):
just and the family structure changed, you know.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
Between family structure. How did you go up? What's your
family structure?
Speaker 1 (06:17):
Yeah? I have eleven brothers and sisters. Yeah, it's gotta
be yeah yeah yeah, race Catholic, race Catholic. Yeah yeah,
but I had, you know, like my dad, yeah, Irish German. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
you know, so, I mean my mom, I the truth
of the matter is my father had you know, a
(06:37):
couple of different women, you know, and so I got
you know, so he he. But my mother raised nine
of us and two of us my dad. My dad
kind of right race on his own, you know, two
of my other my brothers and sisters. Yeah, so I yeah,
family of eleven. But my mom, like I said, had
we had two sets of twins. The oldest and the
(06:58):
youngest are twins. So just really you know, grew up
in an Irish Catholic family, which is you know, I
guess she.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Would say, and uh, couldn't have been much money.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
No, No, my mother, well, my mother she she she
rented a house all the time. And then, as I recall,
I think it was like in nineteen seventy one, she
purchased her first house for eleven thousand dollars in Kensington
because she was she was from Kensington and my father
is from Kensington, you know, and that was the first
house she she ever owned, you know, wow. Yeah, so
(07:31):
three bedroom you know, nine eleven or nine nine yeah,
nine Yeah, kenn we were bunk beds man. I was
a bunk bed kid.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
I had to be stack yeah, So yeah, I mean
it was it was really it was really, but I'll
tell you it was when I look back, when a
mom did the best she could, you know what I mean, brother,
And uh yeah, she was you know, you know, I'll
tell you interesting to worry with mom. Yeah, I mean
she she We moved her out of Kensington when she
(08:05):
was fifty. We moved her down to the shore, New
Jersey and single home, you know, because Atlantic City was
starting to come up like big time, all the casinos
and so my mom was was a leader, like she
was a worker. She just had this way about her.
Not college educated, but very bright, very smart. You know,
(08:25):
back in the day, the twelfth grade education was like
more than a college education today. The folks back in
the World War two, gays, man, they were smart, right,
I mean diligent. So so mom, we moved her down
there and she was she wound up work in the
Trump's Trump Plaza and she was sweeping the floors and
she would make more money in the bathroom because she
(08:46):
would find the coin. The coin's been like, you know,
and then and so I remember one time she found
like a two thousand dollars chip back in like the
like in the in the late seven of these early
early wow you know, for a working person. So I
say this for this reason, my mom wound up working
(09:08):
her way up the ladder and she became the genuine manager.
And she would she worked for Trump's wife. She would
receive when Trump would come in on a helicopter. My
mother would be up there with I think it's Ivanka,
his first wife. Yeah. So, and she would she loved
she loved my mom. My mom loved her, you know.
(09:30):
So she dealt behind the house, she ran the environmental
She had two hundred and fifty employees.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
Kid, oh no, no.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
And Trump gave her a couple awards, you know. But
she was hard worker, man, you know, just a good,
good woman. You know. She she had her hands full
of me though, I guess. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
So you grow up in this house of nine kids, yes,
or this family with eleven and what was growing up
in Kensington like for you in those days? What'd you do?
Speaker 1 (10:00):
What were you? Yeah? Man, you have some great questions. Well,
you know, look at you know, when you don't have
a dad, a father figure, you know, you know, it's tough,
it's it's it can be hard because as a as
a young boy, you know, like in hindsight, I mean
I'm sixty five now and I can look back and say, man,
you know and you know it's how important a father
(10:22):
is in the life of a child, you know so
and I think you know that too.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Well.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Yeah, so, I mean I was a I had gotten
uh this rare form of ostium. The lightness of my
right what of my that's big words, lightess it was
my answer. Yeah. Yeah, it was a form of bone
(10:51):
of bone cancer like. And what happened when they were
going to amputate my my right leg from my knee down.
As a young boy, how were you I was only
about seven, oh gosh seven yeah, yeah, so so so
I spent like I spent almost two years in the hospital,
believe it or not, back in the day because well,
because what happened. The pain was umbarrabed umbarable was so
(11:15):
bad because you know when you get bone like, when
you get a problem with a bone. I mean it's
just so I was itching, itching, itching, so long stories.
I had five operations, and finally a guy from Japan,
a doctor from Japan, as I recall, he uh he
basically you know, did some did dead America? I mean,
(11:36):
I don't know. He shelled it all out and so
I had one foot at ten and another and eight
from from a cast. Always being always in isolation. You
had to wear a mask and gown. But you know,
it's interesting. I remember being in the hospital, in the
hospital and I'm looking through the like the window, and
I see this this guy with a with a jacket on.
(11:59):
It had his name on the back, Joe Frasier, right,
and I see him talking to a kid there.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Right.
Speaker 1 (12:05):
I didn't know who he was at the time, but
but it was, you know, he was he won the
gold medal, you know, Joe Fraser who everybody was Joe Frasier, right.
So it was his nephew, which his brother has a brother, Tommy.
It was his nephew. I didn't know that until later
in life because yeah, yep, yep, you're right.
Speaker 2 (12:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
So anyway, he so Marvis want up becoming a real
good friend of mine, you know, so so Joe. So
his nephew wound up coming into my room and me
and him would fight each other. And one day I
get he hits, I get hit and I and I
had a wheelchair and I want to close my wheelchair
closed up on me. But it's what they.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Were.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
They were visiting. He was visiting his nephew, Tommy's son.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
No kid, he was.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
He had something going on too. I don't know what
it was, but but him, him and I wound up
in the same room and we had a big fight him.
You know, we would fight and I got you know,
we used to hit the back of it. We used
to hit the you know, the bedrail like it and said,
oh look I watch this little that I know that
I would become a boxer one day, you know. So yeah,
I mean, Kensington was it was a It was a
(13:14):
it was a It was a city of neighborhoods. It
was solid and a lot of Irish Catholics at the time,
and you know, neighbors looked out for one another.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
I read one time you said, when you were growing up,
you became one or three things. A cop, a pre
storre convict. Yeah. Really kind of the mentality back then.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Well, you know, listen again, it lends to the question
about not having a father. So what happens is when
you're a young boy, you're going to latch onto something
of a of a of a male figure, and some
sometimes at most times, it could be the wrong male figure.
And working with thousands of kids over the years. I'm
(13:58):
a testimony to that because to see it in my
own life. Yeah, I mean I U, I latched on
to I got in bobed at a young age, you know,
with some interesting men, you know, interesting guys.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
And yeah, I remember reading that you said by thirteen
you were want to be gangster? Wow, what does that
look like in nineteen that would have been nineteen seventy.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Yeah, it was like, well, probably I was nineteen seventy.
I was, I was ten years old, I was eleven
years old. We all had like black cashmere jackets we
had we had we had eleven year old. Yeah, we
had lead. We had lead we got we would get
lead and we would bang it, bang it down flat
and we would make it. We put black tape. We
(14:45):
would put that in our in our in our pocket
like it was a leadstick, like you know, like we
were we thought we were with a bomb.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
Like it was up.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
What's up? Man? I mean we we really thought we
were real for real. Yeah, yeah, so so we we
were remember of the Bridge Gang. You start this gang
called the Bridge Gang, and yeah, it was pretty intense.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
And now a few messages from our gener sponsors. But
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Speaker 1 (15:54):
So, yeah, you know, we got involved in Simph and
glue tiewall. It was big back in the day. Went
through a phase of that, and then and then I
remember Heroin actually coming in, you know, and I remember
it around seventy three, seventy four, I believe it was.
It was it was before that, but I remember a
guy standing on a corner I know his name, and
(16:17):
he's wrapping his arm to looking and then he drills
a needle on his arm. And there was five kids
that were watching us, and all of them became addicts.
You know. I lived by this mottol it more is
caught than taught, you know. And my brother was one
of them, and he yeah, my brother was one of them.
(16:38):
And three of them have you know, died from complications
of drugs and my brother was one of them. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
So do you think this reality of the way you
grew up was a combination of no father, tough neighborhood,
and then all the jobs leaving as a result of
the textile industry falling apart. I mean, was that kind
of the perfect storm?
Speaker 1 (17:00):
I am?
Speaker 2 (17:00):
I hearing that right?
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Well, you know what? You probably you are right. I
mean I never really thought of it that way. I
just think I was a young kid who was waywort
and became way wart. In fact, I was a at
ten years old. My mom took me to a psychiatrist.
And I'll never forget as long as I live, I
go to the psychiatrist. I was. I was a diagnosis
(17:24):
being a nonconformist at a young age. My mom I
shared a rough time with me. Yeah, that was a diagnose. Yeah,
so what do you hear this? This ding was? I
go zre off? Right? So I go into this this thing, right.
I walk in the door, and I don't see anybody.
The receptions left me and I sat there, and then
then she said, okay, you can go in. I walk
(17:44):
in this door liquid. All of a sudden, the guy's
behind the desk. He pops up out of the desk boom,
and he hits me with a with a with a
rubber band brang.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
You kidding, I said, But I was.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
I grab we had a rubber band.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
It was amazing. So he wound up.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Becoming the psychiatrist to the stars in Vegas, believe or not. Yeah, no,
no funny story. But yeah, so at so at ten,
but at thirteen, that's when I got involved in boxing.
My father actually took me to the place, you know.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
Was it We got to get this kid an outlet.
Let's take them to the gym. Yes, I went to
the gym, and we go back to a seconds. So
you had this cancer. Obviously they didn't amprotect your leg
because I'm looking at it. Because the Japanese guy did something,
Yeah he did. I'm sure that's a whole story too.
So do you think that also led to part of
(18:46):
where you were headed being cooped up at a hospital
for two years.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Well, here's the thing. I I what happened was I
wanted to play sports, but I was always was insecure,
you know, I mean, I want to play football, and man,
I got my chance. I was on one hundred and
twenty pounds, right, you know, And so I went with
three of three of you know, three of my friends.
We went and we go in and you know, get
(19:11):
everything on. I remember, I felt so like, man, I
got that im on, I got my uniform, my cleats,
well guess what. I put my hip pads on as
my my shoulder pads, I said, and everybody busted on me.
I was like, so another time, So another time, we
were playing under the lights and we were playing the
(19:32):
Leprechauns in Jersey and it was and we're poor kids
from Kensington, like we don't We're just crazy, you know.
So we get in there and Mooney was our coach
and he, you know, he said, I was boring, get
in there, linebacker. So I'm in the middle lineberg. I'm
in here, I said to Pierceder, whatever, what are you know?
Cause it wasn't. It didn't come to me Bill, you know,
it didn't come to me. Like I'm like, I'm watching
(19:55):
the guy. And these guys were like under the lights,
they had the cleanest uniform. They were im amazing. Man,
I go, I grabbed that guy. Bam, I dump him
and I'm getting down the whistle bluw. I didn't care.
I'm like guilt down. It was a fake fake he
didn't have the ball. So so it just goes on
and on and on. I you know, I tried soccer
(20:15):
and baseball. I hit a home run that ran all
the bases, but it was foul. You know, that's a
true story. But when I got intovolved in boxing.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
I realized that that was that was found a home.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
Yeah, I did. I found something that would become you know,
you know, it was quite a career that I had.
I represented.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
You know, you show up, I assume a Golden Gloves
gym or something.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
No, I go, well, it was a gym, it was.
It was not It wasn't a Golden Gloves gym. It
was just a gym at the time. And it was
in the neighborhood. It was in Kensington and you walked
up these steps. I mean, it's it's been in a
couple two or three movies. It was in Creed and
really yeah, yeah, it's been nice. Yeah yeah, the place
(21:01):
was in yeah. Uh so, I mean yeah, I mean
it was. It was quite a quite an experience. So, yeah,
I show up at this gym. I'm one hundred and
twenty six pounds and the guy that I that I
went with, he was about five years older than me,
maybe four years older. He was a buck sixty and
they all took a lik in him. Irish kid. Man
(21:22):
could he fight? He was a puncher, didn't have any
any any science behind what he did. But man, when
you when you he threw that shot, like, oh, what
was she at? You know?
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Was it one of those when it hit different?
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Yeah? Yeah, yeah, it was a haymaker. He could punch.
And but I stuck in there and I hung in
there and uh and I ultimately picked up a trainer,
and at sixteen, I was number one in the city.
At nineteen, I was number one in the state. At twenty,
I was a top ten in the country. And what wait, middleweight?
Yeah I was. I was sixty five one sixty five.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
Yeah, middleweight. It's an interesting way. I boxed a little yeah,
coming up, But what did you what did you weigh?
Was you won? Seventy five one seventy five?
Speaker 1 (22:05):
Yeah, that's late, that's considered late heavyweight.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Yeah, which I was not good. Listen hear me when
I tell you I didn't. I was nothing. Okay. I
was really really good at getting punched. I could get
punched well, and I could stand up while I was punched.
But that was it. But middleweight middleweight to me, is
(22:30):
that weight that you've got to be able to throw
hard punches, but you're still small enough that you move quickly.
I think middle age.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
Yeah you you hit that right, Yeah, because they're typically,
you know, very good punchers and quick with their hands.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a tough division.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
It's a tough, tough division. So here you are. You're
top in the state at sixteen at middleway.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
Yeah, I was. I was a number one in the
city at the time, and I didn't I had won
the Golden Gloves just yet. I actually had. I did
win the Junior Olympics and and but I didn't win
the Golden Gloves yet. I won the Golden Gloves at
seventeen eighteen and then nineteen I wanted.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
And that's unbelievable. I mean, yeah, people listing who don't
know anything about boxing, which is probably most that really don't.
I mean, when you're there, you're on a track to
be on national team possibly Olympics, and you know, I mean,
that's those are the best of the best. Tough kid,
(23:37):
it was so your you found your home at that
time in your life.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
I mean, well, I found I found the sport that
I could that I could excel at because I couldn't
do it. For whatever reason, I could not do it.
And I'll share something with you when I got a
chance to play softball when I was about twenty six.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
But that's we'll get to that.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
Yeah, But so so.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
I gotta believe coming from Kensington, coming from where we
are and now is the state guy in Golden Gloves,
nobody really screwed with you anymore, did they?
Speaker 1 (24:17):
Yeah? And I know you're right. Well, here's the thing.
What I've what I've come to find out in my
life and growing up, is that tough guys really don't
have to you know, they don't have to defend themselves,
you know, and how tough they are, they're gentlemen, you know.
I mean, it's guys that are insecure, you know that
that somehow, some way always seemed like they had to
(24:38):
prove themselves. So because as I got better, the better
I got with my hands, the more I realized that
I could beat all the guys that I feared or
I was, you know, afraid of, but I never I
never had to do that. And we just come to
a respect, you know, like you know what I mean.
And in the city, you know, believe it or not.
People know when you're tough, like the older I get
(25:02):
the tough riot.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
I was people fifty six years old, and I still
remember the guys in high school that you just did
not screw.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay, there you go.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Well, okay, there you got fifty six that they walked
through this door right now, still wouldn't screw them.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Yeah yeah, yeah. Well there's there's a code of of honor,
you know amongst tough, tough guys. Tough guys don't have
to they don't have to defend themselves, you know, but
when it comes their way, you rise to the occasion.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
So now you're the state champ. Where does it go
from there?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
Okay, so I go let me see, let me see state.
So I win, I win the state championship, golden gloves,
I win the City of Philadelphia, I win the region,
and then I win the state and then I go
represent you know, I represent Pennsylvania in the Nationals. And
I flew down to uh Louisiana and my first fight,
(25:58):
I handled a guy, you know, done. Second fight, I
got a guy from Chicago, and he came in with
more medals and on his hat and his robe and
he was. He was an Olympian and all and first
round bang down on you know, second I mean first
round again, boom down. They put him down twice. Second round,
(26:19):
put him down twice. I lost the fight.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
You're kidding.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
No, I'm not kidding. I lost the fight. So so
you know, I made it to the quarterfinals there and then.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
But it was all good.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
I mean it was you know, it is what it is.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
I mean.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Then I made the I made the USA boxing team,
you know, which that was fun.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
That's crazy. Where'd you where'd you had over them?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
Yeah? I did well. I fought the uh let's see,
I fought I went to my first one time. I
went to Sweden. I fought the Swedish kid. You know.
In fact, I was out to dinner two weeks ago
on a Sunday with a couple of people. His wife
is born in Sweden. She's still goes over. I said,
I for Sweden, he said. When I says he was
(27:03):
an Olympian, it was in nineteen eighty one and ten
thousand people in the arena, the USA team. We went
in the bus. They were rocking the bus. We get
in there and man, I'm a tall kid. Bah bah,
I mean it was on right and the winner from
the United States of America, Buddy Osborn. Oh man, it
(27:26):
was amazing, everybody whistleing. I'm like, this is great. Well
here I find out whistle on is like a bood.
So I go. So I go back in the dressing room.
Fifteen minutes later, no joke, I get changed. My teammate
comes in and says, they want you outside. So what
(27:47):
they did they reversed the decision and they gave it
to that guy.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Are you kidding?
Speaker 1 (27:51):
No, But here's what happened. I saw it in the
paper with my hands raised and with my trunks on,
his head down, and then another picture it has my
head down in his hands raised, you know. So, but
what happened? So I told him his son was there.
I said, I would love to get that picture and
(28:12):
that write up. He goes on and he finds he
finds the article. There's no picture and the guy's name,
and it gives a little article about many years later. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
the guy's name. He was, he was in the nineteen
eighty Olympics. The guy.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
So then I went into uh. I went from there
and I went to Denmark and I go out and
it's American referee, and I go down right, and then
he gets up again. If you knock a guy down
three times in the one round, he's done, it's all right.
But goes down again. Go back to the corner. Now
(28:51):
I remember what happened to me with the internationals second round.
Bang down again, boom down again. He is right. I
was so frustrated. Now he's fighting a little dirty. So
I look, I see the referee. I get here right,
and I get him right. I bite him. I bid him,
I bit his ear.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
I didn't bite at all. You weren't, So you know
what that happened in Memphis.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Oh the talk.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
Was here was here? Wasn't really about that?
Speaker 1 (29:23):
Well then I met at home.
Speaker 2 (29:24):
Well guess what I did it before, Tyson. But I
didn't bite all. But you know what happened.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
And then because I was frustrated, I didn't want to
lose this fight. I won the fight, by the way.
So we're sitting at a press conference, no joke. So
I'm here, he's here, and then then the other the
other guys there and each of our teammates. So I said,
what happened to your what happened here? And this is
no joke. He says, you bit me, you dirty boss.
Like the way he said, it was like the whole
(29:52):
place went nuts. And then I went and then I
went to Norway, and then and then I the guy
out stretched him and the in the first round and
it was great, you.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
Know, stretched them.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Yeah, yeah, it was so I really had a really
I had an amazing career. But at the age of
twenty two, I was I had ninety fights.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Good, that's a lot of fights. Yeah, and I just
you're lucky you were punch drunk at twenty two.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Well, I mean that's a lot of fights. Yeah, but
it's it is.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
It is. But there's kids now that have two hundred fights.
But you know, but it was, it was. It was
a great experience for me. You know, it was so
so amazing.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
We'll be right back. So now here you are. You're
twenty two, twenty three, You've had this great experience and
you find yourself back in Kensington. Yeah, yes, yes, So
what do you do? Wow? Huh, tough guy.
Speaker 1 (30:58):
Well, I'll tell you what. I left Kensington at nineteen
and I went into a training camp I lived. I
don't know whether you remember a guy Hawridersell, you remember
how who So here I am. I'm in a training camp. Yeah,
you have a voice like him. Yeah. So I remember
I lived in a like in Kensington. There's no trees,
(31:20):
you know. So I go to this place in this
training camp. This is my new trainer and the guy
who drove me. They his name is Marky. They called
us to Kensington Connection because he was a one bad dude.
He was a couple of years younger than me. Man
could he fight. He had a liver shot that would
he would knock a heavyweights out with his liver shot.
(31:41):
He just knew how to get it. He was like,
and you can't recover from that, you know. So so
he said, listen, I'm going because I had stopped boxing
at the Kensington gym. He says, I've been going up
with this other gym. So you come on, I go up,
he says, listen. The trainer there, he's different. Well okay,
(32:01):
because he has everybody fight the same way. So I go.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
I go up.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Sure enough, he gets me and he has me like
this with my hand like that.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
It was just so awkward for me.
Speaker 1 (32:14):
I'm like, because I had like fifty fights at the time,
Like I had more fights than all of them there.
I said, okay, I'll do it, you know, and then
sure enough I wound up staying there. And he really
became like a mentor to me, you know. And he
was a he was a powerful labor leader and you know,
and and that's that Lin that goes into something you
(32:35):
know that we'll talk about. But he was a well
known man, you know, and just politically connected and just
you know, just a you know, and a soldier. So
this long story short, he developed he developed a really
good boxing team. And it's interesting, it's it's he I
remember his There was a picture it says boys in
(32:58):
sports stay out of court.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
It's you know, boys in born state out of course.
Speaker 1 (33:04):
Yes, but if you looked at that now, out of
all of the guys that were in that picture, everyone
is probably about three hundred and thirty years of incarceration
with all of them.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
Wow. Yeah, tough kids, tough area.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
So you're back, you've been overseas, you've done your box
and you've got your ninety fives. You're back in Kensington.
What's next for Buddy.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Well? I One of the things that in Kensington is
the trade is there's a trade called as a roofer
you know, and I always wanted to be a roofer man.
So I was sixteen years old at the time.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Seven money.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
It was great man, It was a great and it
was there was a status to it. You know. See
when I was a young kid, when guys went to prison,
it was a badge of honor.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
You know.
Speaker 1 (33:58):
I know it's a warp mentality to think about. But
when you're a way work kid and you're.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Lookay something, brother, you know, it is so interesting. Now
say here we go on a divergent conversation, but it
is so interesting to me. Howdy fit sixty five, sixty
five years old and you're talking about boxing and growing
up tough. And we've heard about as a thirteen year
(34:25):
old watching heroin or drugs being used on a street corner.
And now you talk about when you're growing up, you know,
going to going to prison as a badge of honor.
And this is seventies eighties and you're a white Irish
Catholic guy, all right. And then we look at so
(34:46):
many of the lost areas in communities today and in
the inner city, and they're largely black with doing some
of the same stuff. And there is this thing inside
the inner city and gangs today that is about street red, yes,
(35:08):
which is doing time and all of that. And it
screams to me that this is not a racial thing.
It's a socioeconomic thing. And I just think it's very
interesting that your life growing up mirrors many young strapping
kids life today growing up that I've coached and worked with.
(35:31):
They're no different, not any different at all. And it
doesn't have anything to do with race. It doesn't have
anything to do with any of that. It just has
to do with socioeconomics and the zip code at the
time of your birth. Often, what do you think about that?
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Well, I think you got some good points there, you know,
I think for me, for me, you know, you have
to really find out what is the truth in your life.
I mean as a young kid, and you know what
I mean, And I I knew in my own life
built to answer that question. I'm going to get back
to that that there was something missing, there was a
(36:12):
void in my life. So I was grabbing hold of
things that were just making me feel good and making
me feel relevant, and but I had no I had
no uh, I had no solid foundation, you know, like
there's a there's a there's a in scripture. It talks
about you know, and I use this with a lot
(36:33):
of kids that come in from the streets. You know,
I'll say, what's the first thing you do when you
build a house? I'll ask him that first, the first
thing I'll do. I'll say, hey, hey, have you ever thought?
They said, because I mean, fine, ever lost?
Speaker 2 (36:46):
I says, is that right?
Speaker 1 (36:47):
How you hold your hands?
Speaker 2 (36:48):
And I'll put you say okay, I would.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Put you to sleep, but listen, but I let them
shoot the movie, let them do, let them do the thing. Coach,
you know what I mean. I'll say, all right, so
let me ask you a question. When you build a house.
What's the first thing you do? Wow? You know, we
go get the lumber, or we go get the materials.
I said, okay, get the architecture plans. All right, And
(37:24):
they name all these things and then all of a sudden,
I'm they found this, I said, perfect. So if you
build you if you build your house on the sand
and the wind, the rain, as it says in scripture,
comes what house would say? It say, if you build
on the sand, or you're build on the rock. And
obviously they say the rock. I said, well, listen, that's
like your life now. Look, So what I'll do is
(37:45):
I'll stand up and I'll square off. I'll say push me,
and they'll go I said, no, push me. To push me,
I'll fall back and then I'll turn around. I'll put
my legs under me, shoulder with apart, hands high, chined down,
push me, bro go ahead. They can't even move me.
I said, you see that's sand and this is this
is rock.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
Now let's do it.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
And then before you know it, they start listening to
the conversation. They respond to things. Get your hand up,
get your left hand up, start using your job, you know.
So so you know it's it's it's it's it's just
bait that I use to bring in kids to to
check their heart because of that void that I lived
(38:27):
with and grew up with. You know, boxing was one thing,
but it progressed and seemed the propensity, propensity for violence
for me continued outside of boxing, you know. And so
as I was twenty two, I retired, I stopped boxing,
went back into Kensington, and then I worked my way
up into being a roofer and uh making a good living.
(38:49):
So I was at a crossroad I was in. I
was an apprentice at the time and it's a.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Four year apprenticeshipproach union job up there.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Yoh yeah yeah yeah yeah. So so what happened was.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
Which means a good wage, yes, way to make it with.
Speaker 1 (39:05):
Yeah yeah, yes, yes yes. So so I take this responsibility.
I graduate from from apprenticeship school and I'm a second
hand to the foreman. So I had an opportunity to
be a shop steward or to be a foreman. And
I waited, said I'm would be a shop steward because
I like the union. I liked the whole thing. So
(39:26):
at the age of twenty five, I was I was
hired as a union organizer. So I leave, I go
to my I go to a job. It's a Friday,
and they called me to the hall union hall. I'm dirty,
I smell like pitch and the guy says, you know, buddy,
you know, we want to put you on as an organizer.
I had got wind of it. I said, wow, that's unbelievable.
(39:50):
I go, I pick out a brand new car. I
come in. That's a Friday. I come into the union
hall on a Monday morning. I got gap bedeen pants on,
I got beautiful shoes, hair is combed, back shirt, smelling good,
got my brand new car. I'm ready and and sure enough,
you know, I love what I did. I love what
(40:11):
I did. Now was it right?
Speaker 2 (40:13):
Let's talk about what a union organizer does, didn't he? Listen? Man,
you got to remember this is the Southeast. Unions are
not big down here on the northeast of the Midwest,
not at all. We're we're we're you know, our history
is not manufacturing. Our history is farming. Our history is yeah,
(40:37):
you know, there's certainly manufacturing down here, but as a result,
it's just not as big of a union presence in
the Southeast for the blue collar middle class. So I'm
just asking an organizer, does that mean you're out there
representing the union trying to get other roofers to join
the union, are you?
Speaker 1 (41:00):
So here's what, here's what the way the way it went.
You got to remember the roofers Union were feared. They
were feared.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
Were they feared?
Speaker 1 (41:09):
Well, they were feared because it was it was a
bunch of men that were either incarcerated. It meant a
long time.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
That's tough.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
They were really tough, violent, violent and uh so and
and you always bank robbers, you know, really oh yeah,
you know you name it, they were. They were in it,
and and and there. That was a trade that that
for some reason they were allowed to come in. Now,
I don't know whether you ever know anything about the
(41:38):
mob or anything like that in the cities of Philadelphia. Well,
in the eighties there was a mob war and twenty
eight men were killed in that war. The second person
it was, and the second person was killed was my boss.
He was assassinated in front of his wife, shot six
times in the head.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Roofing boss. Yeah, the union, the union boss. The union
got the union and the mob were so closely tied together.
Speaker 1 (42:03):
No, here's what happened, was my my boss was sixty
years old. The union boss. He was a founder of
Local thirty roof Vish Union. His name was John McCullough.
He was He was a World War two hero, just
a strapping guy's crew haircut, just like you knew he was.
He was around one of the nicest guys you'd ever meet.
But oh yeah, there's no doubt about that that he was.
(42:25):
He was tough, There's no doubt about that. So Atlantic
City was popped up, so there was a lot of
a lot of building going on there, and and uh
and the mob was was was. You could look this up.
This is a matter of public record. The mob was
in there pretty good. They wanted to get in there
and and and build, you know. And and there was
a guy named Mickey Scarfo who who was who was
(42:48):
actually became the Mob of Philadelphia, you know. And but
he was he was put on the shelf, so to speak.
He was sent to Atlantic City because of he had
he was starting some trouble. And but but he hated
McCullough apparently, you know, he had a hatred and he
had a fear of him because but because you know,
(43:10):
he was fear fearful, I believe is from what you
read and hear. And remember that John was he was
John had all of Atlantic City like he was strong there.
He was. He was a presence in the Labor movie.
He was going to get all the roof ark well,
of course we would absolutely get all. But there was
more than that. He was just a he he was
union all. I mean, everybody just looked at him as
(43:32):
the savior in a sense, you know. And so anyway
he was.
Speaker 2 (43:35):
Shot and killed and did you say in front of
his wife?
Speaker 1 (43:39):
Yeah, it was a December sixteenth, nineteen eighty and he
the guy named William Moran, came in with points set
as a knock on the door and says, I have
more more? Can I go out? He's talking on the
phone or another guy I know. And then when he
came in, he pulled out a gun and shot him
six times in front of his wife. Yeah. Wow. And
(44:00):
they wound up, they wound up getting them, and they
got him, and they got the two people that were
behind it. And that's that's another story. But what happened
was I'm grafted into this. This was nineteen eighty so
nineteen eighty five, five years later, I'm now hired as
(44:21):
an organizer, you know. And it was probably the most
fascinating time in my life because I'm an eighth grade dropout,
you know, I'm an inner city kid. I'm a boxer.
I got I.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
Now I'm a roof for thirty Yeah yeah, I mean yeah,
you've got the credibility.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
Oh yeah, street. Oh, there's no question about it. There's
no question about it.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
And that concludes part one of my conversation with Buddy Osborne.
And listen, you don't want to miss part two. It's
just more Buddy be and Buddy it's available to listen
to right now. Together, guys, we can change this country,
but it starts with you. I'll see in Part two.