November 1, 2024 • 55 mins
Today's special guest is Yannick Gill, a human rights attorney based in Washington, D.C. Yannick’s work focuses on the intersection of migration, race, democracy, and law, He joins today's podcast to discuss contrasts in immigration policy between Kamala Harris and Donald Trump
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
This is the Black Information Network Daily Podcast, and I'm
your host, ramses Ja. And sometimes the amount of stories
that make their way to us means that we simply
can't cover everything that comes our way. But from time
to time, a story just stays with me, and Bill
compelled to share it with you and give you my thoughts.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
And now one more thing.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Yannick Gill is a human rights lawyer based in Washington,
d c. Yanick worked in Congress with two progressive members
of the House of Representatives. He is an accomplished human
rights advocate defending marginalized people across the United States and abroad.
And he is our guest today. This is the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast, and I am your host, ramses.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Ja, and I am q Ward.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
All Right, so, Janick Gil, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Man.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
We've been looking forward to having a conversation with you.
How are you doing today.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
I'm doing well. The pleasure is Mike you. I'm really
excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Hi, y'all, I'm doing great. So we talked a little
bit about your background, but obviously it's a lot more
extensive than that. What we do on the show, of course,
is that when we have a guest such as yourself.
We invite you to tell us a little bit more
about yourself, just so our listeners are a little bit
more familiar with who we're having a conversation with. So
you can start with where you were born, where you
(01:19):
grew up, where you went to school, all those things,
and then of course what led you to the conversation
we're about to have today.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yeah, absolutely so, I think you hit all the major points.
But I'm a Florida man, proud of it, NHBCU grat,
graduate of Howard University School of Law, and I think
most importantly when it comes to these conversations, I'm a
black man. I think there's so much happening, particularly if
we're talking about twenty twenty four, with conversations around who
(01:49):
we are, how we view things. And my identity doesn't
stop when I put on the suit, does not stop
when I enter into a workplace. And so although I
have worked on issues of democracy, human rights, migration policy
all across the United States and the world, I kind
of start that analysis and those thoughts from my background.
(02:12):
When I walk into the room. We don't see my degree,
but you definitely see my skin, and that is part
of what I bring to any conversation to include this campaign.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
I'd be remiss if I didn't thank you for carrying
your blackness into every room with you. As you can imagine,
that is also something that we don't have a choice
in the matter of, and we don't pretend that, you know,
no matter how many radio stations or how many you know,
interviews that we get to do, that it's something that
(02:44):
we cannot take off or cover up with our suit
or our degrees or our awards. So I just want to,
you know, thank you for stepping into rooms the way
that you do. On that note, racial justice is an obvious.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Big deal and factor in this upcoming election.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
With you, given your education and experience, we just want
you to share your thoughts on the contrast between the
competing administrations for our vote, between the Harris administration and
the administration of our former president.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Go through a few things and educate.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Us on how life could be very different given the
two potential candidates.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
And you don't contrast I think is the word of today,
just because it almost feels laughable that we're in a
situation where we actually have to compare point for point.
So first I'll use those degrees you talked about and
discuss policy, but that we just need to, I think,
have a call in moment amongst ourselves and really understand
what we're talking about. The policy is easy. The first
(03:50):
thing that comes to my mind is the criminal justice
reform component. There's a strong narrative around Vice President Harris
being a cop, but let's not be confused when it
comes to criminal justice matters. Former President Donald Trump has
shown how he sees us. Can go back to the
(04:12):
central part five, we can go down to his criminal convictions,
we can go down to multiple, multiple multiple comments on
record with how he sees us as thugs and how
he sees us as as people in need of some
sort of handout. And the contrast is clear with the
(04:36):
excitement around the opportunity agenda for black men. I think
I'm going to point to some of those policy issues,
whether it be police accountability, whether it be access to
the criminal justice system that goes beyond simply listening to
the police. When we are placed into precarious situations caused
(04:59):
by over policing, the comparisons are stark. Access to the
voting booth is something that our forefathers have been fighting
about and we see it in different states across our
country where they're trying to limit who has access to voting.
This is something that Vice President Harris has not only
spoken to, but has said that she will continue to
(05:19):
advocate for. We can also talk about access to capital
for small benchess ventures. The list goes on. I can
talk about healthcare, I can talk about access cryptocurrency. The
beauty of blackness is that we're not monolithic. And the
different policies uesed that I'll bring up will make certain
people's ears perk up and other people close their eyes.
(05:41):
But don't be fooled if we google, just go on
the simple website and google whatever issue is most important
to your day to day, to your family, to your community.
Vice President Heiris has shown that she has plans that
will directly impact us in ways that the former president
has shown that he simply does not care.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
Yeah, there's.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
There's a lot that's being said about Project twenty twenty five,
of course, and how problematic that is for America in
general and in particular specific terms, how problematic that would
be for those of us who have historically been marginalized
in this country. And even though Trump has tried to
(06:26):
distance himself from that agenda. His Agenda forty seven does
not speak to what his administration plans to do to
earn the trust and the respect of the black community
in the way that Kamala Harris's does. And again we're
(06:47):
not trying to be biased here. It's just that Kamala
Harris again has a very specific agenda for black people
and black men in this country, whereas Trump's Agenda forty seven,
the one thing that he has said that he is behind,
does not. So I want to make sure that that's
stated here too.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
And then.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
You know, I don't want to give him a free
pass on that, you know, distancing himself from Project twenty
twenty five, because we know full well the authors of
Project twenty twenty five are people that work very closely
with him, and you know, his name is mentioned in
the document hundreds of times, so it's it's specifically for
his administration. But you know, my assumption here is that
(07:29):
he had to come up with something to pivot because
Project twenty twenty five was not polling well, and so
that's where Agenda forty seven comes from. But in our
estimation around here is the thrust of his agenda is
in Project twenty twenty five. Now, you mentioned that you
(07:50):
know there were people that have different issues that are
important to them and that is why they would or
would not vote, or they would vote for one candidate
or the other. And I understand that on our shows
that Q and I do, we.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Speak to.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
A number of different groups. You mentioned that black people
are not a monolith. We speak to allies of black
and brown people, of course, and everyone in between. But
one element that we cannot overlook just because of the
nature of the type of program that we create is
sort of like the activist element. And this element can
(08:32):
and historically has taken issue with Kamala Harris's relationship to police.
These folks who have been out in the streets protesting
police systems and systemic injustice at the hands of the
carceral system to marginalized communities. Now, we've had conversations on
this show almost well, I'll say, bringing what's the word,
(09:00):
I want to say, bringing insight, clarity, perspective to her
history as a prosecutor. We would like for you to
do the same. Could you speak to people who might
have reservations about voting, essentially or a police officer the
top cop when they historically have felt like police have
(09:20):
done harm to black and brown communities.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
You know, this is an issue that in full transparency,
I'm grappling with. I say activists before lawyer, I say
advocate for lawyer. And as I said, at the end
of the day, I close my eyes as a black man,
and the idea of advocating or someone who has such
(09:46):
intimate ties to policing was something that I really had
to grapple with for some time. But I'm going to
go back to the word of the day, which is contrast. Again.
When we're looking at the big decision that we all
have to make in the next two weeks, we have
a choice between someone who has unapologetically targeted people that
(10:10):
look like me and you. We have a contrast between
someone who has advocated for the return of stop and
risk of unabashed qualified immunity. We have someone that has
highlighted and quite frankly benefited from some of the ugliest
parts of policing in the United States, which, let's be clear,
(10:35):
in a Harris administration, there's a lot of work to
do to improve policing. The George for Justice and Police
Act has not been passed and it's something that would
only begin to get us moving in the right direction.
But when I'm considering and thinking through the relationship of
(10:59):
Vice President Hair with the police, I'm thinking about someone
that has shown that she's willing to come to the
table and actually have a conversation about these issues. I'm
talking with someone that has shown that from her first
initial run for president, that she has moved to the
left on a lot of these issues, to include policing.
(11:22):
I'm looking at someone that cares about our community in
ways that go beyond far. They go beyond just placating
us with fancy words. There comes a point that is
coming quickly where we have to think through what issues
(11:44):
are going to bring us out and which issues are
going to stop us. And it's cliche, but in this election,
we really have to consider that for every person that
is not sitting down because of her views on policing, immigration,
nasal security, there's someone who's jumping out of their seat
and bringing all their friends to vote for Donald Trump,
(12:05):
regardless of what he called us, who he assaulted, which
laws he's broken. We tend to be often very cerebral
with our choices in ways that the other side is
not and I don't think that we have this luxury
this election. The conversations need to be had and will
be had, hopefully next year with an administration that'll actually
(12:28):
invite us to the table. You know.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
One of the things that keeps me up at night,
and that's something that I borrowed from Ambassador Susan Rice,
is exactly what you just said. It's like we collectively
look for reasons to disqualify a candidate, and the other
side has determined there is no such thing. They're going
(12:53):
to vote for their guy no matter what.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Even the way that.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
They campaign seems to have nothing to do with policy,
more just popularity. What things will get the most clicks,
what things will rile his base up the most, And
even support from other conservative candidates that have throughout their
entire political history, really demolished him as a person, as
(13:17):
a human and claimed him to be unfit, have now
gone the way of, well, he's the most popular, so
let me just align myself with him in this way
that he seems to be impenetrable or bulletproof with regard
to his behavior, his rhetoric. He brags about things that
(13:39):
we would bristle at. You know, he brags about getting
rid of Roby Wade, and most recently on television, you know,
very you know broad chestedly bragged about his desire to
get rid of the Department of Education.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Again.
Speaker 4 (13:59):
I want us to make the contrast clear. He's saying,
no Department of Education, no funding to you know, schools
or states that teach children about the real history of
this country. Our current Vice president, I'm sure, has some
very different ideas with regards to education.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
And I think the commentary it's easy to get stuck
on it. Right. Oh god, I can't believe he said that.
Why would he say something like that? But we really
have to think about again, the real world implications of it.
I talked about first Gen, this first gen that saying
it plain without things like pilgrant, I wasn't going to school,
My family did not have it, and these government policies
(14:47):
changed my life. Who's in charge of that Department of
Education cutting away those things? It sounds like a headline
until you really think about the real world implications that
it has on our communities. Again, getting rid of ro
V Wade again, it just sounds like a headline until
you're seeing people in some of these states die because
(15:08):
they don't have access to basic health care that we
all thought was a given decades and decades ago. I
think it's really really important to remember that this language
isn't just language. All these things have real applications. You know,
before we can go back to reconstruction, we were taking
(15:31):
our women. That led to over policing of black men
before oh, immigrants had taken our jobs. That led to
direct attacks on the immigranted community. Stops by police asking
them to check papers as though we're in a Nazi
era country. We're now in a place where he's casually joking, oh,
(15:51):
Haitians are eating our pets. What is happening to that community?
We don't have to ask death threats, bomb threats to
communities where there are large populations of Asian immigrants. This
is more than just words, and we really have to
think through is a tax deduction is a quote unquote
(16:15):
popular cool hip president, something that you're willing to ignore,
someone that you're willing to celebrate when we have seen
how his words his actions are quickly supplemented by policy. Again,
we can talk for hours about all the things that
(16:38):
happened that seemed like a lifetime ago. The Muslim ban
Roe v Wade policing, or we could just take there
we go if Herbert don't get me started on the
education part. But it will only get worse. He had
to consider before a re election campaign. This time he
does it, it's going to be worse this.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
So you know that that brings me the thought because
he's not the president right now, and yet his words
have enough power to bring great harm to huge populations
(17:22):
in this country. You know, you mentioned the Haitian immigrants
who are here legally working bolstering the economy, and because
he decided to lean into something that was not even true,
not just the Haitians, but the entirety of that community
has suffered as a result of it. And because this
(17:42):
is a nation of three hundred and I don't know,
fifty million people give or take, it's really easy for
that town to have their you know, fifteen minutes, you know,
worth the headlines, and then the rest of the country
just kind of moved on beyond it, and people forget
(18:03):
again that the scale of this man's words ramps up
when he indeed he is the president of the United
States again. So I think your point is well made,
and I think that that has something to do with
the population here. There's something particularly about the MAGA group,
(18:23):
in my estimation, that is kind of flipped on its head.
And of course you can, you know, share your thoughts
on this, but my belief has always been that historically,
the people elect a person to represent their interests. They
(18:44):
elect a person who will do the things that represent them.
And I think that this is flipped on its head
because I believe that the people are now representing Donald
Trump and they like it's It's almost like it brings
(19:05):
out the worst in people because it's not Donald Trump
who's actually on the ground in Colorado affecting the immigrants.
It's not Donald Trump who's on the on the ground
in the day to day with you know, people at work,
people you know at the dinner table, people you know,
out in the streets, people waving their Trump flags. And
(19:26):
you know, I saw a video a bunch of Trump
trucks in Texas trying to run a bus off of
the road not too long ago. Those are his people,
and they are now representing Donald Trump rather than the
other way around. And I don't know if that speaks
to you mentioned you know, education, I don't know if
that speaks to an uneducated or lesser educated electorate than
(19:56):
we prefer. But you know, just kind of speak to
your experience on kind of covering those headlines and maybe
what you make of whether or not the people are
taking on Donald Trump's traits or if I'm just crazy
and I'm just seeing things.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Well, you're definitely not seeing things otherwise, We've all been
having the same visions for the last I think it's
really scary. Frank I shared with you. I'm a proud
Florida man. I grew up in West Palm Beach, Florida,
which is the last blue part where things get really
really red and stay to Florida. I say that to
say I've been rubbing shoulders with people across the partisan
(20:35):
lines my entire life, and I think what has been
jarring seeing a Trump's presence in the political sector is
seeing Christian, suburban proud families supporting someone committing sexual assault,
supporting someone who proudly cheated on his wife off a
(21:00):
porn star. Yes, these I'll keep it with that sort
of issue because it speaks to just how out of
character Trump's presence has has made people become. They're no
longer thinking which candidate most aligns with my values, Which
candidate most benefits my family. What they're really considering is
(21:26):
which candidate aligns with my party affiliation. That's the start
and end of the analysis. They fall directly in line
and will repeat whatever it is that he's saying. And
to your point, you see it with the representatives. Again,
there was a bipartisan immigration bill, and speaking candidately, all
it wasn't my favorite bill. There was a lot more
(21:46):
that we could have done for the immigrant community than
what was in that bill, but it was the metaphorical
step in the right direction. But even that bipartisan bill, Trump,
who was not the president, as you noted, able to
shut that down. Let's be clear, he's not the president,
but he's definitely still in charge of the party. And
(22:06):
until the American people wake up and recognize a lot
of the distress that's been going on about the chaos
that's happening in DC that he is behind, we'll continue
to put it aside and talk about whether or not
Tom has always identified as black foolish, or we could
actually have policy discussions and think why is it that
(22:29):
this person would represent us on an international scale? And
again havn't done work on this, not just in the US,
but abroad. While Trump was at the Helm, it was
much harder to do work to benefit the lives of
people because they would point a finger back at me
and say, what's happening in your country? I don't want
that for another four year.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
You know him, that just the possibility of him once
again being in that office. It's scary beyond just living
here because I hear people saying, you know, if he wins,
we'll just pick up and move somewhere else. Well, I
don't know where in the world would be safe with
him at the helm of the largest, most well funded
and powerful military in the world, and having decided anybody
(23:13):
that disagrees with him is an enemy who he will
point his weapons at. Is a really, really scary prospect.
So I couldn't imagine you being in a position to
have to try to work and negotiate, you know, while
he was the person who everybody thought was in charge.
Last night, Rams and I had a conversation with a
really powerful group of black men here in Phoenix, Arizona,
(23:37):
and one of the gentlemen who could have been our
father stood up in that conversation and talked about the
lack of power that the black vote has and feeling
like his vote didn't matter. And when we see how
hard the other side is trying to make it for
us to vote, and how clumsily they or for our
(24:00):
attention in our vote, selling sneakers and gold watches and
parading rappers on stage, washed up rappers. I think it's
very very clear that not only do our votes matter,
but that our votes have power in kind of finalizing
a lot of these decisions and winning a lot of
these races. Talk about your experience or your your vantage
(24:23):
point on what we've seen in kind of overtly trying
to block us from exercising that right to vote and
having access to the ballot box.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Yo, we don't have to dig that deep. Think about Georgia.
The bill got a lot of attention when it passed,
and then we kind of forgot that it happened. But
they made it illegal to pass out water to people
standing in line to vote. I lived in Atlanta, Georgia
for a chapter before moving to DC, and I thought
(24:57):
it was normal to be required to stand in line
for between four and six hours. Now, I was working
in a law firm at the time, so saying hey, all,
I'm going to vote, everyone said, oh me too. We
actually car pulled over and we all stood aligned together.
But if you have a phenomenal job, you could be
a manager at Marshalls, you could be a school teacher,
(25:21):
you can work in television. All jobs don't have that
flexibility to sacrifice between four and eight hours to cast
a vote. You might have family commitments, you might physically
be incapable of standing in a line that long. All
of those barriers that they have now codified in certain
states across our country make it harder to vote. You're
(25:45):
completely right. Why would legislatures in all fifty states be
attempting to make it that much harder to vote? If
our vote doesn't matter. Why would they be banning books?
If what's reading in those books did it matter? Why
would they be destroying the Department of Education if going
to college and advancing your degrees didn't matter. You can follow,
(26:10):
you can follow the actions and the policies happening on
the other side and know what they deem important. And
let's be clear, our vote still matters. Of course it matters,
which is why seg washed up rapping even feels generous
when they had Ambarros rapping about Trump. It is truly
the definition of pandering. So the idea of how they
(26:33):
treat us, how they look at us, to be met
with an apathy saying that our vote doesn't matter is
dangerous and it speaks to the forgetfulness that people tend
to have around all the things that happened during the
Trump administration, but more importantly, just the things that happened
(26:57):
to our grandparents, to our parents. We have an opportunity
to change things, and we cannot get bobbed down on
the nuances and intricacies of some of this policy. Like
I said, I can talk about the immigration bill, I
can talk about policing. There's a lot that the administration
will have to do to get us all on one accord.
(27:20):
But Kamo Harris has shown that she's willing to do
that work. Like I said, who's going to actually invite
the black community, the brown community, marginalized people in a
significant way versus sending us ugly goal shoes to purchase
some things with what three hundred dollars? Laugh?
Speaker 2 (27:43):
The watch is one hundred thousand, see.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
Hundred.
Speaker 4 (27:48):
Oh yeah, there's an eight hundred dollars watch and a
one hundred thousand dollars watch. Those are the only two options.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Awesome, that's how he sees the community there. It is.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
If my voice matter, people wouldn't be trying so hard
to silence me, and if my vote didn't matter, they
wouldn't work so hard to take it away. So you
know why I'm voting this November because I know they
don't want me to.
Speaker 6 (28:11):
Your voice is powerful, your voice matters. Don't let your
voice be silenced. To register, confirm your voting status, or
get information about voting in your area, visit vote dot gov.
That's vote dot gov. A message from the Perception Institute
and the Black Information Network.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
You mentioned a couple of things in this conversation. I
think it's really important for our listeners to get inside
of your mind. You have a perspective a lot of
people don't have. I'm personally excited to, you know, hear
your thoughts or hear your explanation.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
Here.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
You mentioned that Donald Trump effectively tanked the bipartisan border deal,
which is why we have a quote on quote border
crisis right now. He did that so that he would
have something to campaign on, something to point at the
(29:10):
current administration. And say, see how they're failing you. I
will step in and I will fix this problem. So
it's effectively a problem he prevented from being fixed so
that he could say, look, they have this problem that
I can solve, right, And from his side, you know,
(29:30):
I'm sure he was thinking that that would work because
his first administration succeeded by campaigning on build that wall.
So he's you know, reverted to the textbook fear mongering,
that the immigrants are coming in and they are going
to take your jobs, and they're going to eat your animals,
and they're criminals, and they are bringing drugs and all
(29:52):
this sort of stuff. Right, They're going to come and
rape all your kids, all the just the worst things
that he can say about this unknown la element that
people in Utah and you know, Wisconsin and Maine and
you know, places like that can be afraid of, even
though it could not impact them, it's just enough to
(30:14):
cause them to be afraid. The thing is people, it's
hard to get people to be afraid of something they
know very well. It's a lot easier to get people
to be afraid of something they don't know. And most
of the country does not live in Arizona, like a
border state like this. You know, we got basically Texas,
(30:35):
New Mexico, and California, and we're the ones who can
we live with immigration, you know, like the immigration that
they're trying to use to stir up this fear around
the country. So this is where I want to kind
of get in your head, and I want to take
our listeners into your head. Being someone who has worked
(30:57):
with immigrants in the immigrant population, explain to us what
immigration does for this country positively, like why we have
immigration in the first place, why it's necessary, and help
(31:20):
dissolve some of the mystery around quote unquote immigration so
that it cannot be weaponized against us the way that
it is being weaponized against us by Donald Trump. So
let's let's bring some humanity and some logic to why
we have immigrants coming into this country in the first place.
Speaker 3 (31:40):
You know, Uh, that's such a beautiful question because I
sometimes forget I haven't grown up in Florida, living in
DC now connicence to New York. Not everyone is going
to break read with an immigrant once a week, if
(32:00):
at all, before the age of eighteen. And it's something
that a lot of us can take for granted, the
first thing I'm going to say is that there are
dozens of countries that with which people immigrate from to
the United States, and each immigrants experience is going to
be different. As I said, I'm the child of black
(32:20):
immigrants from Ghana. Their experience was completely different than someone
that came from Finland, someone that came from Haities, someone
that came from Mexico. So to speak to the immigrant
experience and any sort of sound bite is an impossibility.
But what I will say is that the monolithic analysis
(32:44):
of what immigrants are doing is foolish. There are several
different economies across our country that survive because of immigration.
There are people who call the loves of their lives
their why their husbands love only because of immigration. We
(33:07):
call it expats, but Americans continue to travel to other
countries because of access to immigration. To simply state that
immigrants are dangerous, that immigrants are coming and stealing jobs,
(33:28):
it's all based in ignorant talk. To any small business
owner and almost any state across the country, they have
interacted with the immigrant community in some way, shape or form.
Most immigrants, and there's data to support this. Come to
this country simply to work, and factually, and there's data
to prove this, they commit crimes at margins, huge margins,
(33:56):
less than Americans. Think about it. If you know that
you're able to provide education to your children, to get
a great paying job, to feel safe and see a
future growing, many of the things that the United States
is able to provide to the immigrant community, why risk
(34:18):
that for petty theft? Why risk that for some of
the major fensanol distribution. Again, it's fear mongering, and because
we are living in a time where the former president
can accuse the community of eating cats and dogs and
everyone nods and smiles, immigrants will always be that scapegoat.
(34:43):
You may have seen, y'all. There was an interview just
this week where a Fox anchor push back on that line.
He said, hey, there's no way it has been disproven.
Asian starts saw that. The President then turned around and said,
but what about the geese. This is the tide that
we live in. I can continue to talk about some
(35:05):
of the problems with the idea of the American dream.
I acknowledge my bias as someone who's advocated for the
rights of asylum and the importance to have diverse communities
the data that proves it and that shows it, or
we could just take a step back and think at
our country's beautiful history. We are a nation of immigrants.
(35:28):
We've all heard the adage that the only true Americans
are the native Americans who are here, and I think
starting with that foundation and understanding that all of us
Black Americans included, were brought here in different situations, on
different circumstances, we'd recognize that it is simply a scapegoat
(35:50):
to blame the economy, to blame crime, to blame any
of this nonsense on the immigrant community. It's unfortunate reality
that we are at a point where the humanity of
immigrants are being questioned, but disappoint in question because they
(36:10):
continue to be at the crosshairs of policies from the
Trump administration. And while things aren't perfect with the deeds,
As I said, who is going to invite us to
the table to have substantive policy changing conversation? In contrast
(36:30):
with sinking a bill that would have allowed for more judges,
that would have provided technology to better assess immigration cases. No,
instead the voting for someone that said we need a
wall on a mote. This is not game of Thrones
does not make any sense that this is our comparison.
Immigration policy is very complicated, but a love for your
(36:53):
fellow man is not. And that's what we really have
to keep at the floor when we're talking about immigration policy.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
You know, sometimes I fear that the former president has
made himself such a cartoonishly ridiculous person that some people
who should take him very seriously consider him like this
benign clown, or they explain away and kind of sayingwash
everything he says that's sort of non threatening their ability
(37:25):
to other us and and drive wedges between large groups
of the population that have so much in common. Right,
we can take groups of poor people and say, yeah,
you're all poor, but they're black. You know, take groups
of immigrants, Yeah you're all immigrants, but they're black immigrants.
(37:45):
They're Haitian, they're Cuban, they're from you know what he
referred to as s whole countries from all over the world.
Being able to draw this divide, you know, some people ask,
you know, again referring to this conversation night, how are
there black people that show up to support this man?
And if you take some of those black people and
(38:06):
make them feel like they are better and more like you,
and those that are poorer or immigrants are less like
you and more likely to hurt you or your children
or commit crimes, and all these fear mongering lies that
they tell. I'd like to know who on that side
would be able to point to Ramses and I be
(38:27):
able to point to you and say, well, he's not Haitian,
he's he's not Cuban, he's he's not African, He's and
I'm leaving that blank because you have Afro Latina, you
have African, you have West Indian, you have all of
these different variations of people who if you're just looking
at their skin and most of their features could be kinfolk.
(38:51):
Tell us more about that type of rhetoric where I
think people think they're excluded. Right, you see people who
look and some speak similar to the very targeted group
of Haitian immigrants now, and I think they feel they
would be excluded from those attacks and from that policy
of these mass deportations that he talks about. Speak to
(39:14):
how scary that should be, and I don't I hate
to try to use the same tactics, so maybe not scary,
but point to more what that could look like for
all of us, because I don't think every Haitian walks
around with the flag that says hey I'm.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
Haitian, deport me.
Speaker 4 (39:29):
I think our brothers and sisters from the Haitian community
could use our support because they are far more like
us than different.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
And I could not have said a better myself. It's
really one of those issues that I again forget is
even an issue. If I were to say, y'all, well,
my cousins, no one would bad twice until maybe you
started to ask certain questions about curry or ROTI about curry.
(39:56):
But one of the most brilliant things I heard at
my first week Howard was look around the root. Although
it seems is that we're all the same, because we are.
Our differences show up when you're invited to Grandma's house
for breakfast and you kind of see and hear the smells,
the music, the outfits. Perhaps, but that requires actually getting
(40:21):
to know that individual. We are all coming from the
same place. When whether you go to an anthropological level
and we're talking about the first humans or we're talking
to the black people specifically, at which point the slave
ship dropped us off, Let's be clear the policies that
are being implemented. Look into target the immigrant community will
(40:45):
impact anyone that is perceived to be an immigrant, and
that changes not just from state to state, but from
city to city. I have never been thought to be
Absha until I moved to these see in the same
way that if I'm in Detroit, I might be Somali,
in the same way that I'm going to New York.
(41:05):
You know, I speak my little Spanish, I can suddenly
be Dominican. But at the end of the days, because
we're all black, these policies that seek to target certain
parts of the community will inevitably impact us all. One
of the most dangerous but effective strategies that we have
seen implemented are those that seek to divide and conquer.
(41:31):
And it works, and it's worked for whether it be
through slaver votes or with the recent conversations riados. Let's
be glad. I'll support reparations until I get to certain
conversations or certain places where they say, oh, well, that
has nothing to do with you. Your parents were born in
(41:51):
South America. That's taking away one more voice to advance
policies that would just at large benefit our communities. And
I think this idea of saying that these issues won't
impact me and mine directly. I won't say that it's scary,
(42:13):
but I will say that it's short sighted and missing formed.
You know, whether it's a situation of access to capital.
You know, everyone loved to talk about how Trump he
gave those checks. You know, everyone got the checks. But
if you are attacking different protections that have always protected
our community, whether it be housing discrimination, whether it be
(42:36):
access to higher ed, whether it be access to capital,
loans or small businesses, if you're removing any sort of
any of those protections because he wrote you a check,
where are you spending that check? We really have to
get beyond the immediacy of all of these issues. We
really have to be able to see ourselves in our
(42:57):
brothers and our sisters, because for whom the bell tolls
today could be for you tomorrow. These issues will impact
generations of people to come, and we've seen that he
won't stop. Rows should be a scared example to us.
All again, Black women are dying in Texas and in
(43:19):
Georgia from preventable surgeries because of laws he has proudly supported.
And I think you're right this idea that he is
just a cloud is working and we got to wake up.
His words are very dangerous and we can't wait until
they knocking at our door making things dangerous for us
(43:40):
that subtly care.
Speaker 1 (43:44):
There's a couple of things that I want to or
one thing in particular that I want to touch on
before I ask the second thing, and feel free to
jump in. But you know, Donald Trump didn't write anybody
a check. Yes, yeah, that for folks. That because that
that is to be fair. That is something that people
(44:06):
sincerely believe. And uh, you know, in case you're only
getting this episode and you haven't got the rest of them,
you know, I apologize, but I have to say this
every time I happened MIC and an audience, because you know,
in our estimation, Q and myself, we feel the stakes
are so high that it's worth you hearing this twice
if me and someone else gets to hear it once.
So I will say that it was Congress that approved.
Speaker 3 (44:32):
The Democratic Congress.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Democratic Congress that approved those checks. Donald Trump stood in
the way of you getting those checks until he could
get his name on the check, and he bypassed Congress.
I believe it was Ambassador Rice that explain that to
us more fully but bypassed Congress and went to the
head of the Treasury to insist that the checks not
be sent out unless they had his name on it, right, right,
(44:58):
So the check came with a signature and I believe
maybe some other information that suggested that Donald Trump was
the person behind it. And for people that feel like
Donald Trump went to his own bank account and pulled
out money and gave it to the American people, you're
playing right into his hands. You're falling for the trick
that he wanted you to fall for. He's a showman
and you're, you know, you're dancing to his tune. Donald
(45:21):
Trump did not send you that money, nor would he
ever send you that money. The money was already earmarked
for you, and he wanted to take credit for it.
So that's the person for those of you who feel
like you want to vote for him over the twelve
hundred dollars that Congress approved for you, that's the person
that you're really voting for. Nobody. He didn't send you
that money. You have to say that next thing. I
(45:42):
want to say this, and I know that we're going
along on time, but I would appreciate your insight because
you are a person who is more familiar with the
average American with the legal framework of this country. You
mentioned to us that we don't need to look much
(46:03):
further than Roe v. Wade, And you know, on this
show we've discussed Roe v. Wade many times, and so
our assumption is that our listeners are familiar with that
that Supreme Court has stood in the way or repealed
so many things that people who prefer more progressive agenda
(46:32):
want to see happen. A lot of people got some
form of student loan relief. I was not one of them.
So you know, there's there's a lot of like really
scary things with respect to that Supreme Court. And we
don't necessarily need to talk about Donald Trump or his
decidedly conservative agenda whichever you think that he is going
(46:55):
to enact when he becomes president, be at Project twenty
twenty five or his Agenda forty seven. It's Project twenty
twenty five. But what I want to do is to
sort of ask you, you know, for those of us
that look at this situation and realize or feel rather
that it's very bleak. Even if there is a Harris
(47:16):
administration on the horizon, for US as a country, the
Supreme Court.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
Is there.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
As a lawyer, as someone who's familiar with the legal
framework of this country, what if anything can be done
about the Supreme Court in terms of pushing through a
progressive agenda for this country.
Speaker 3 (47:43):
Well, I'm so happy that you ended that question with
the word progressive, because as a progressive myself and with
many progressive in Congress, there has been a conversation around
expanding the court for years. At this point, we have
to start taking these policies seriously. We have to start
to consider ways to inhibit Scotus the Supreme Court from
(48:10):
determining what are fundamental, sometimes constitutionally guaranteed rights will look
like in the future. This country was supposed to have
checks and balances, and we have allowed for President Trump
to stack the Court with far right, politically motivated justices.
(48:38):
Unless we do something to radically change the way that looks,
whether it be court expansion or Supreme Court terms, this
will continue to be an issue. And it goes far
beyond Roe v. Wade. This has to do with the EPA.
This has to loan forgiveness that I too wish I
(48:59):
could say. This has to do with immigrant rights, like
we have to discussed It has to do with qualified
immunity and how policing is done in this country. Our
courts are meant to be a check on Congress, meant
to be a check on the president, and they have
been terribly, terribly politicized in a way that without that
(49:23):
same progressive thought process, without changing things from the way
they've always been done, we will continue to be at
the mercy of justices that have shown time and tim
and tom again that they will not answer to us
and that they don't necessarily care about us. Something has
(49:45):
to change. I think we have to change the way
that judges are operating, particularly our justices in this country,
otherwise we're going to continue to run into these same
same issues, if not worse issues.
Speaker 4 (50:03):
It's very refreshing to have this conversation with you. You know,
I had to pay all of my student loans back,
and I still hope they forgive even more for those
who haven't gotten that relief yet. The idea that some
people are upset that because they had to pay their
loans back, that they should stand in the way of
other people to get in there is forgiven is crazy
(50:24):
to me.
Speaker 3 (50:25):
But good Christian ideology, Oh yeah, absolutely, what would Jesus do.
Speaker 4 (50:33):
Thank you for shining a very pragmatic light on some
of these issues that, like I said, I think the
clown of a former president that we had has made
a lot of these issues seem very cartoonishly frivolous, and
people just kind of ignore the extreme things that he says. So,
(50:53):
you know, thank you from for lending your point of
view and your perspective on things that you have a
greater understanding than the two of us. For our listeners,
what's next for you? I know this election is mission
critical for everyone, but there's work to be done beyond that.
So what's next on your itinerary? And how can people
(51:18):
keep up with you and follow you and all those
great things?
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Yeah? Absolutely, I revel and the opportunity to have more
conversations like this because I think, to your point, we
often limit these conversations to the Ivory Tower. And I
always tell people, and I'm not smarter than you. I've
just created a life where I'm able to get paid
to read. But if someone else had a paycheck tied
(51:43):
every time they read the news and kind of kept
up with some of these policies, they could figure it
out too. This stuff isn't complicated. But if the only
time that you are hearing about it is for forty
five minutes right after you put the kids away and
you're feeding yourself some cold leftovers, not going to be
able to get into those intricacies and how it directly
(52:04):
impacts you, what they're saying about people across the sea
and people in a different city. That being said, over
the next two weeks, my primary goal is to make
sure that Vice President Kamala Harris is in office. That
volunteering my time knocking on doors, calling my cousins in
them to make sure that they are registered, and showing
(52:26):
up and taking a few long friends. That is really
what my foreseeable future looks like. You know, we can
have this conversation a week after the election and I
might have a more excited at each other. But for me,
it's just incredibly important to combat this information, to share
the good word and make sure that people understand how
(52:48):
this election is not something high and lofty in policy
and legal conversations, but how directly impact but the next
four years of their life and a minimum look like.
My name is Yanna gilt Y A N N I
C K G I L L and while you know,
not the easiest to pronounce, it makes Google very easy,
(53:10):
a simple Google search, and the Sianna gil with most
of everything all.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
You probably didn't mean it this way, but Rams and
I both just heard you say we could talk about
this again in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
I'm gonna take that as a promise. I'm not sure
if that's what you meant, but you said.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
Your mouth, Guys is now I'm holding you all accountable.
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Okay, there it is, all right.
Speaker 1 (53:32):
Well, in the short run, we got to say thank you. Obviously,
this conversation was a long time coming. And uh, it's
it's you and and people like you that give us
and our listeners the insight that we need to really
make heads or tails of things day to day. Your
expertise on immigration, just the fact that you're a lawyer
with the perspective of a black man goes a long way,
(53:54):
because you know, we're having conversations about blackness, we're having
conversations about the law, we're having conversations about immigration, and
so someone with your unique perspective and experience in the
political arena, it's an honor and it's a joy, and
it's exceptionally educational to have a little bit of your
time and the promise that we will have more of
(54:17):
your time in the future. So on, behalf of myself
and Q all of us here at the Black Information Network,
and it's an excipher. We want to say thank you,
not only for your time, but for your commitment to
making sure that we are all more educated and more engaged.
You're the sort of person that we simply can't thank enough.
(54:37):
Once again, Today's guest is Yannik Gill, a human rights
lawyer and accomplished human rights advocate defending marginalized people across
the United States and abroad.
Speaker 3 (54:46):
Thank you, sir, now pleasureless mind, Thank you all.
Speaker 1 (54:50):
This has been a production of the Black Information Network.
Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson. Have some thoughts
you'd like to share, use the red microphone talkback feature
on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there, be sure to
hit subscribe and download all of our episodes. I am
your host Ramsey's Jaw on all social media.
Speaker 2 (55:06):
I am q Ward on all socials as well.
Speaker 1 (55:09):
Join us tomorrow as we share our news with our
voice from our perspective right here on the Black Information
Network Daily Podcast. This has been a production of the
Black Information Network. Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson.
Have some thoughts you'd like to share, use the red
microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio APPUM. While you're there,
be sure to hit subscribe and download all of our episodes.
(55:30):
I'm your host, ramses Jaw on all social media. Join
us tomorrow as we share our news with our voice
from our perspective right here on the Black Information Network
Daily Podcast
This is the Black Information Network Daily Podcast, and I'm
your host, ramses Ja. And sometimes the amount of stories
that make their way to us means that we simply
can't cover everything that comes our way. But from time
to time, a story just stays with me, and Bill
compelled to share it with you and give you my thoughts.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
And now one more thing.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Yannick Gill is a human rights lawyer based in Washington,
d c. Yanick worked in Congress with two progressive members
of the House of Representatives. He is an accomplished human
rights advocate defending marginalized people across the United States and abroad.
And he is our guest today. This is the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast, and I am your host, ramses.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Ja, and I am q Ward.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
All Right, so, Janick Gil, welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Man.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
We've been looking forward to having a conversation with you.
How are you doing today.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
I'm doing well. The pleasure is Mike you. I'm really
excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Hi, y'all, I'm doing great. So we talked a little
bit about your background, but obviously it's a lot more
extensive than that. What we do on the show, of course,
is that when we have a guest such as yourself.
We invite you to tell us a little bit more
about yourself, just so our listeners are a little bit
more familiar with who we're having a conversation with. So
you can start with where you were born, where you
(01:19):
grew up, where you went to school, all those things,
and then of course what led you to the conversation
we're about to have today.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yeah, absolutely so, I think you hit all the major points.
But I'm a Florida man, proud of it, NHBCU grat,
graduate of Howard University School of Law, and I think
most importantly when it comes to these conversations, I'm a
black man. I think there's so much happening, particularly if
we're talking about twenty twenty four, with conversations around who
(01:49):
we are, how we view things. And my identity doesn't
stop when I put on the suit, does not stop
when I enter into a workplace. And so although I
have worked on issues of democracy, human rights, migration policy
all across the United States and the world, I kind
of start that analysis and those thoughts from my background.
(02:12):
When I walk into the room. We don't see my degree,
but you definitely see my skin, and that is part
of what I bring to any conversation to include this campaign.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
I'd be remiss if I didn't thank you for carrying
your blackness into every room with you. As you can imagine,
that is also something that we don't have a choice
in the matter of, and we don't pretend that, you know,
no matter how many radio stations or how many you know,
interviews that we get to do, that it's something that
(02:44):
we cannot take off or cover up with our suit
or our degrees or our awards. So I just want to,
you know, thank you for stepping into rooms the way
that you do. On that note, racial justice is an obvious.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
Big deal and factor in this upcoming election.
Speaker 4 (03:03):
With you, given your education and experience, we just want
you to share your thoughts on the contrast between the
competing administrations for our vote, between the Harris administration and
the administration of our former president.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
Go through a few things and educate.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Us on how life could be very different given the
two potential candidates.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
And you don't contrast I think is the word of today,
just because it almost feels laughable that we're in a
situation where we actually have to compare point for point.
So first I'll use those degrees you talked about and
discuss policy, but that we just need to, I think,
have a call in moment amongst ourselves and really understand
what we're talking about. The policy is easy. The first
(03:50):
thing that comes to my mind is the criminal justice
reform component. There's a strong narrative around Vice President Harris
being a cop, but let's not be confused when it
comes to criminal justice matters. Former President Donald Trump has
shown how he sees us. Can go back to the
(04:12):
central part five, we can go down to his criminal convictions,
we can go down to multiple, multiple multiple comments on
record with how he sees us as thugs and how
he sees us as as people in need of some
sort of handout. And the contrast is clear with the
(04:36):
excitement around the opportunity agenda for black men. I think
I'm going to point to some of those policy issues,
whether it be police accountability, whether it be access to
the criminal justice system that goes beyond simply listening to
the police. When we are placed into precarious situations caused
(04:59):
by over policing, the comparisons are stark. Access to the
voting booth is something that our forefathers have been fighting
about and we see it in different states across our
country where they're trying to limit who has access to voting.
This is something that Vice President Harris has not only
spoken to, but has said that she will continue to
(05:19):
advocate for. We can also talk about access to capital
for small benchess ventures. The list goes on. I can
talk about healthcare, I can talk about access cryptocurrency. The
beauty of blackness is that we're not monolithic. And the
different policies uesed that I'll bring up will make certain
people's ears perk up and other people close their eyes.
(05:41):
But don't be fooled if we google, just go on
the simple website and google whatever issue is most important
to your day to day, to your family, to your community.
Vice President Heiris has shown that she has plans that
will directly impact us in ways that the former president
has shown that he simply does not care.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
Yeah, there's.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
There's a lot that's being said about Project twenty twenty five,
of course, and how problematic that is for America in
general and in particular specific terms, how problematic that would
be for those of us who have historically been marginalized
in this country. And even though Trump has tried to
(06:26):
distance himself from that agenda. His Agenda forty seven does
not speak to what his administration plans to do to
earn the trust and the respect of the black community
in the way that Kamala Harris's does. And again we're
(06:47):
not trying to be biased here. It's just that Kamala
Harris again has a very specific agenda for black people
and black men in this country, whereas Trump's Agenda forty seven,
the one thing that he has said that he is behind,
does not. So I want to make sure that that's
stated here too.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
And then.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
You know, I don't want to give him a free
pass on that, you know, distancing himself from Project twenty
twenty five, because we know full well the authors of
Project twenty twenty five are people that work very closely
with him, and you know, his name is mentioned in
the document hundreds of times, so it's it's specifically for
his administration. But you know, my assumption here is that
(07:29):
he had to come up with something to pivot because
Project twenty twenty five was not polling well, and so
that's where Agenda forty seven comes from. But in our
estimation around here is the thrust of his agenda is
in Project twenty twenty five. Now, you mentioned that you
(07:50):
know there were people that have different issues that are
important to them and that is why they would or
would not vote, or they would vote for one candidate
or the other. And I understand that on our shows
that Q and I do, we.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Speak to.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
A number of different groups. You mentioned that black people
are not a monolith. We speak to allies of black
and brown people, of course, and everyone in between. But
one element that we cannot overlook just because of the
nature of the type of program that we create is
sort of like the activist element. And this element can
(08:32):
and historically has taken issue with Kamala Harris's relationship to police.
These folks who have been out in the streets protesting
police systems and systemic injustice at the hands of the
carceral system to marginalized communities. Now, we've had conversations on
this show almost well, I'll say, bringing what's the word,
(09:00):
I want to say, bringing insight, clarity, perspective to her
history as a prosecutor. We would like for you to
do the same. Could you speak to people who might
have reservations about voting, essentially or a police officer the
top cop when they historically have felt like police have
(09:20):
done harm to black and brown communities.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
You know, this is an issue that in full transparency,
I'm grappling with. I say activists before lawyer, I say
advocate for lawyer. And as I said, at the end
of the day, I close my eyes as a black man,
and the idea of advocating or someone who has such
(09:46):
intimate ties to policing was something that I really had
to grapple with for some time. But I'm going to
go back to the word of the day, which is contrast. Again.
When we're looking at the big decision that we all
have to make in the next two weeks, we have
a choice between someone who has unapologetically targeted people that
(10:10):
look like me and you. We have a contrast between
someone who has advocated for the return of stop and
risk of unabashed qualified immunity. We have someone that has
highlighted and quite frankly benefited from some of the ugliest
parts of policing in the United States, which, let's be clear,
(10:35):
in a Harris administration, there's a lot of work to
do to improve policing. The George for Justice and Police
Act has not been passed and it's something that would
only begin to get us moving in the right direction.
But when I'm considering and thinking through the relationship of
(10:59):
Vice President Hair with the police, I'm thinking about someone
that has shown that she's willing to come to the
table and actually have a conversation about these issues. I'm
talking with someone that has shown that from her first
initial run for president, that she has moved to the
left on a lot of these issues, to include policing.
(11:22):
I'm looking at someone that cares about our community in
ways that go beyond far. They go beyond just placating
us with fancy words. There comes a point that is
coming quickly where we have to think through what issues
(11:44):
are going to bring us out and which issues are
going to stop us. And it's cliche, but in this election,
we really have to consider that for every person that
is not sitting down because of her views on policing, immigration,
nasal security, there's someone who's jumping out of their seat
and bringing all their friends to vote for Donald Trump,
(12:05):
regardless of what he called us, who he assaulted, which
laws he's broken. We tend to be often very cerebral
with our choices in ways that the other side is
not and I don't think that we have this luxury
this election. The conversations need to be had and will
be had, hopefully next year with an administration that'll actually
(12:28):
invite us to the table. You know.
Speaker 4 (12:31):
One of the things that keeps me up at night,
and that's something that I borrowed from Ambassador Susan Rice,
is exactly what you just said. It's like we collectively
look for reasons to disqualify a candidate, and the other
side has determined there is no such thing. They're going
(12:53):
to vote for their guy no matter what.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Even the way that.
Speaker 4 (12:57):
They campaign seems to have nothing to do with policy,
more just popularity. What things will get the most clicks,
what things will rile his base up the most, And
even support from other conservative candidates that have throughout their
entire political history, really demolished him as a person, as
(13:17):
a human and claimed him to be unfit, have now
gone the way of, well, he's the most popular, so
let me just align myself with him in this way
that he seems to be impenetrable or bulletproof with regard
to his behavior, his rhetoric. He brags about things that
(13:39):
we would bristle at. You know, he brags about getting
rid of Roby Wade, and most recently on television, you know,
very you know broad chestedly bragged about his desire to
get rid of the Department of Education.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Again.
Speaker 4 (13:59):
I want us to make the contrast clear. He's saying,
no Department of Education, no funding to you know, schools
or states that teach children about the real history of
this country. Our current Vice president, I'm sure, has some
very different ideas with regards to education.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
And I think the commentary it's easy to get stuck
on it. Right. Oh god, I can't believe he said that.
Why would he say something like that? But we really
have to think about again, the real world implications of it.
I talked about first Gen, this first gen that saying
it plain without things like pilgrant, I wasn't going to school,
My family did not have it, and these government policies
(14:47):
changed my life. Who's in charge of that Department of
Education cutting away those things? It sounds like a headline
until you really think about the real world implications that
it has on our communities. Again, getting rid of ro
V Wade again, it just sounds like a headline until
you're seeing people in some of these states die because
(15:08):
they don't have access to basic health care that we
all thought was a given decades and decades ago. I
think it's really really important to remember that this language
isn't just language. All these things have real applications. You know,
before we can go back to reconstruction, we were taking
(15:31):
our women. That led to over policing of black men
before oh, immigrants had taken our jobs. That led to
direct attacks on the immigranted community. Stops by police asking
them to check papers as though we're in a Nazi
era country. We're now in a place where he's casually joking, oh,
(15:51):
Haitians are eating our pets. What is happening to that community?
We don't have to ask death threats, bomb threats to
communities where there are large populations of Asian immigrants. This
is more than just words, and we really have to
think through is a tax deduction is a quote unquote
(16:15):
popular cool hip president, something that you're willing to ignore,
someone that you're willing to celebrate when we have seen
how his words his actions are quickly supplemented by policy. Again,
we can talk for hours about all the things that
(16:38):
happened that seemed like a lifetime ago. The Muslim ban
Roe v Wade policing, or we could just take there
we go if Herbert don't get me started on the
education part. But it will only get worse. He had
to consider before a re election campaign. This time he
does it, it's going to be worse this.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
So you know that that brings me the thought because
he's not the president right now, and yet his words
have enough power to bring great harm to huge populations
(17:22):
in this country. You know, you mentioned the Haitian immigrants
who are here legally working bolstering the economy, and because
he decided to lean into something that was not even true,
not just the Haitians, but the entirety of that community
has suffered as a result of it. And because this
(17:42):
is a nation of three hundred and I don't know,
fifty million people give or take, it's really easy for
that town to have their you know, fifteen minutes, you know,
worth the headlines, and then the rest of the country
just kind of moved on beyond it, and people forget
(18:03):
again that the scale of this man's words ramps up
when he indeed he is the president of the United
States again. So I think your point is well made,
and I think that that has something to do with
the population here. There's something particularly about the MAGA group,
(18:23):
in my estimation, that is kind of flipped on its head.
And of course you can, you know, share your thoughts
on this, but my belief has always been that historically,
the people elect a person to represent their interests. They
(18:44):
elect a person who will do the things that represent them.
And I think that this is flipped on its head
because I believe that the people are now representing Donald
Trump and they like it's It's almost like it brings
(19:05):
out the worst in people because it's not Donald Trump
who's actually on the ground in Colorado affecting the immigrants.
It's not Donald Trump who's on the on the ground
in the day to day with you know, people at work,
people you know at the dinner table, people you know,
out in the streets, people waving their Trump flags. And
(19:26):
you know, I saw a video a bunch of Trump
trucks in Texas trying to run a bus off of
the road not too long ago. Those are his people,
and they are now representing Donald Trump rather than the
other way around. And I don't know if that speaks
to you mentioned you know, education, I don't know if
that speaks to an uneducated or lesser educated electorate than
(19:56):
we prefer. But you know, just kind of speak to
your experience on kind of covering those headlines and maybe
what you make of whether or not the people are
taking on Donald Trump's traits or if I'm just crazy
and I'm just seeing things.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Well, you're definitely not seeing things otherwise, We've all been
having the same visions for the last I think it's
really scary. Frank I shared with you. I'm a proud
Florida man. I grew up in West Palm Beach, Florida,
which is the last blue part where things get really
really red and stay to Florida. I say that to
say I've been rubbing shoulders with people across the partisan
(20:35):
lines my entire life, and I think what has been
jarring seeing a Trump's presence in the political sector is
seeing Christian, suburban proud families supporting someone committing sexual assault,
supporting someone who proudly cheated on his wife off a
(21:00):
porn star. Yes, these I'll keep it with that sort
of issue because it speaks to just how out of
character Trump's presence has has made people become. They're no
longer thinking which candidate most aligns with my values, Which
candidate most benefits my family. What they're really considering is
(21:26):
which candidate aligns with my party affiliation. That's the start
and end of the analysis. They fall directly in line
and will repeat whatever it is that he's saying. And
to your point, you see it with the representatives. Again,
there was a bipartisan immigration bill, and speaking candidately, all
it wasn't my favorite bill. There was a lot more
(21:46):
that we could have done for the immigrant community than
what was in that bill, but it was the metaphorical
step in the right direction. But even that bipartisan bill, Trump,
who was not the president, as you noted, able to
shut that down. Let's be clear, he's not the president,
but he's definitely still in charge of the party. And
(22:06):
until the American people wake up and recognize a lot
of the distress that's been going on about the chaos
that's happening in DC that he is behind, we'll continue
to put it aside and talk about whether or not
Tom has always identified as black foolish, or we could
actually have policy discussions and think why is it that
(22:29):
this person would represent us on an international scale? And
again havn't done work on this, not just in the US,
but abroad. While Trump was at the Helm, it was
much harder to do work to benefit the lives of
people because they would point a finger back at me
and say, what's happening in your country? I don't want
that for another four year.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
You know him, that just the possibility of him once
again being in that office. It's scary beyond just living
here because I hear people saying, you know, if he wins,
we'll just pick up and move somewhere else. Well, I
don't know where in the world would be safe with
him at the helm of the largest, most well funded
and powerful military in the world, and having decided anybody
(23:13):
that disagrees with him is an enemy who he will
point his weapons at. Is a really, really scary prospect.
So I couldn't imagine you being in a position to
have to try to work and negotiate, you know, while
he was the person who everybody thought was in charge.
Last night, Rams and I had a conversation with a
really powerful group of black men here in Phoenix, Arizona,
(23:37):
and one of the gentlemen who could have been our
father stood up in that conversation and talked about the
lack of power that the black vote has and feeling
like his vote didn't matter. And when we see how
hard the other side is trying to make it for
us to vote, and how clumsily they or for our
(24:00):
attention in our vote, selling sneakers and gold watches and
parading rappers on stage, washed up rappers. I think it's
very very clear that not only do our votes matter,
but that our votes have power in kind of finalizing
a lot of these decisions and winning a lot of
these races. Talk about your experience or your your vantage
(24:23):
point on what we've seen in kind of overtly trying
to block us from exercising that right to vote and
having access to the ballot box.
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Yo, we don't have to dig that deep. Think about Georgia.
The bill got a lot of attention when it passed,
and then we kind of forgot that it happened. But
they made it illegal to pass out water to people
standing in line to vote. I lived in Atlanta, Georgia
for a chapter before moving to DC, and I thought
(24:57):
it was normal to be required to stand in line
for between four and six hours. Now, I was working
in a law firm at the time, so saying hey, all,
I'm going to vote, everyone said, oh me too. We
actually car pulled over and we all stood aligned together.
But if you have a phenomenal job, you could be
a manager at Marshalls, you could be a school teacher,
(25:21):
you can work in television. All jobs don't have that
flexibility to sacrifice between four and eight hours to cast
a vote. You might have family commitments, you might physically
be incapable of standing in a line that long. All
of those barriers that they have now codified in certain
states across our country make it harder to vote. You're
(25:45):
completely right. Why would legislatures in all fifty states be
attempting to make it that much harder to vote? If
our vote doesn't matter. Why would they be banning books?
If what's reading in those books did it matter? Why
would they be destroying the Department of Education if going
to college and advancing your degrees didn't matter. You can follow,
(26:10):
you can follow the actions and the policies happening on
the other side and know what they deem important. And
let's be clear, our vote still matters. Of course it matters,
which is why seg washed up rapping even feels generous
when they had Ambarros rapping about Trump. It is truly
the definition of pandering. So the idea of how they
(26:33):
treat us, how they look at us, to be met
with an apathy saying that our vote doesn't matter is
dangerous and it speaks to the forgetfulness that people tend
to have around all the things that happened during the
Trump administration, but more importantly, just the things that happened
(26:57):
to our grandparents, to our parents. We have an opportunity
to change things, and we cannot get bobbed down on
the nuances and intricacies of some of this policy. Like
I said, I can talk about the immigration bill, I
can talk about policing. There's a lot that the administration
will have to do to get us all on one accord.
(27:20):
But Kamo Harris has shown that she's willing to do
that work. Like I said, who's going to actually invite
the black community, the brown community, marginalized people in a
significant way versus sending us ugly goal shoes to purchase
some things with what three hundred dollars? Laugh?
Speaker 2 (27:43):
The watch is one hundred thousand, see.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
Hundred.
Speaker 4 (27:48):
Oh yeah, there's an eight hundred dollars watch and a
one hundred thousand dollars watch. Those are the only two options.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
Awesome, that's how he sees the community there. It is.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
If my voice matter, people wouldn't be trying so hard
to silence me, and if my vote didn't matter, they
wouldn't work so hard to take it away. So you
know why I'm voting this November because I know they
don't want me to.
Speaker 6 (28:11):
Your voice is powerful, your voice matters. Don't let your
voice be silenced. To register, confirm your voting status, or
get information about voting in your area, visit vote dot gov.
That's vote dot gov. A message from the Perception Institute
and the Black Information Network.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
You mentioned a couple of things in this conversation. I
think it's really important for our listeners to get inside
of your mind. You have a perspective a lot of
people don't have. I'm personally excited to, you know, hear
your thoughts or hear your explanation.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
Here.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
You mentioned that Donald Trump effectively tanked the bipartisan border deal,
which is why we have a quote on quote border
crisis right now. He did that so that he would
have something to campaign on, something to point at the
(29:10):
current administration. And say, see how they're failing you. I
will step in and I will fix this problem. So
it's effectively a problem he prevented from being fixed so
that he could say, look, they have this problem that
I can solve, right, And from his side, you know,
(29:30):
I'm sure he was thinking that that would work because
his first administration succeeded by campaigning on build that wall.
So he's you know, reverted to the textbook fear mongering,
that the immigrants are coming in and they are going
to take your jobs, and they're going to eat your animals,
and they're criminals, and they are bringing drugs and all
(29:52):
this sort of stuff. Right, They're going to come and
rape all your kids, all the just the worst things
that he can say about this unknown la element that
people in Utah and you know, Wisconsin and Maine and
you know, places like that can be afraid of, even
though it could not impact them, it's just enough to
(30:14):
cause them to be afraid. The thing is people, it's
hard to get people to be afraid of something they
know very well. It's a lot easier to get people
to be afraid of something they don't know. And most
of the country does not live in Arizona, like a
border state like this. You know, we got basically Texas,
(30:35):
New Mexico, and California, and we're the ones who can
we live with immigration, you know, like the immigration that
they're trying to use to stir up this fear around
the country. So this is where I want to kind
of get in your head, and I want to take
our listeners into your head. Being someone who has worked
(30:57):
with immigrants in the immigrant population, explain to us what
immigration does for this country positively, like why we have
immigration in the first place, why it's necessary, and help
(31:20):
dissolve some of the mystery around quote unquote immigration so
that it cannot be weaponized against us the way that
it is being weaponized against us by Donald Trump. So
let's let's bring some humanity and some logic to why
we have immigrants coming into this country in the first place.
Speaker 3 (31:40):
You know, Uh, that's such a beautiful question because I
sometimes forget I haven't grown up in Florida, living in
DC now connicence to New York. Not everyone is going
to break read with an immigrant once a week, if
(32:00):
at all, before the age of eighteen. And it's something
that a lot of us can take for granted, the
first thing I'm going to say is that there are
dozens of countries that with which people immigrate from to
the United States, and each immigrants experience is going to
be different. As I said, I'm the child of black
(32:20):
immigrants from Ghana. Their experience was completely different than someone
that came from Finland, someone that came from Haities, someone
that came from Mexico. So to speak to the immigrant
experience and any sort of sound bite is an impossibility.
But what I will say is that the monolithic analysis
(32:44):
of what immigrants are doing is foolish. There are several
different economies across our country that survive because of immigration.
There are people who call the loves of their lives
their why their husbands love only because of immigration. We
(33:07):
call it expats, but Americans continue to travel to other
countries because of access to immigration. To simply state that
immigrants are dangerous, that immigrants are coming and stealing jobs,
(33:28):
it's all based in ignorant talk. To any small business
owner and almost any state across the country, they have
interacted with the immigrant community in some way, shape or form.
Most immigrants, and there's data to support this. Come to
this country simply to work, and factually, and there's data
to prove this, they commit crimes at margins, huge margins,
(33:56):
less than Americans. Think about it. If you know that
you're able to provide education to your children, to get
a great paying job, to feel safe and see a
future growing, many of the things that the United States
is able to provide to the immigrant community, why risk
(34:18):
that for petty theft? Why risk that for some of
the major fensanol distribution. Again, it's fear mongering, and because
we are living in a time where the former president
can accuse the community of eating cats and dogs and
everyone nods and smiles, immigrants will always be that scapegoat.
(34:43):
You may have seen, y'all. There was an interview just
this week where a Fox anchor push back on that line.
He said, hey, there's no way it has been disproven.
Asian starts saw that. The President then turned around and said,
but what about the geese. This is the tide that
we live in. I can continue to talk about some
(35:05):
of the problems with the idea of the American dream.
I acknowledge my bias as someone who's advocated for the
rights of asylum and the importance to have diverse communities
the data that proves it and that shows it, or
we could just take a step back and think at
our country's beautiful history. We are a nation of immigrants.
(35:28):
We've all heard the adage that the only true Americans
are the native Americans who are here, and I think
starting with that foundation and understanding that all of us
Black Americans included, were brought here in different situations, on
different circumstances, we'd recognize that it is simply a scapegoat
(35:50):
to blame the economy, to blame crime, to blame any
of this nonsense on the immigrant community. It's unfortunate reality
that we are at a point where the humanity of
immigrants are being questioned, but disappoint in question because they
(36:10):
continue to be at the crosshairs of policies from the
Trump administration. And while things aren't perfect with the deeds,
As I said, who is going to invite us to
the table to have substantive policy changing conversation? In contrast
(36:30):
with sinking a bill that would have allowed for more judges,
that would have provided technology to better assess immigration cases. No,
instead the voting for someone that said we need a
wall on a mote. This is not game of Thrones
does not make any sense that this is our comparison.
Immigration policy is very complicated, but a love for your
(36:53):
fellow man is not. And that's what we really have
to keep at the floor when we're talking about immigration policy.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
You know, sometimes I fear that the former president has
made himself such a cartoonishly ridiculous person that some people
who should take him very seriously consider him like this
benign clown, or they explain away and kind of sayingwash
everything he says that's sort of non threatening their ability
(37:25):
to other us and and drive wedges between large groups
of the population that have so much in common. Right,
we can take groups of poor people and say, yeah,
you're all poor, but they're black. You know, take groups
of immigrants, Yeah you're all immigrants, but they're black immigrants.
(37:45):
They're Haitian, they're Cuban, they're from you know what he
referred to as s whole countries from all over the world.
Being able to draw this divide, you know, some people ask,
you know, again referring to this conversation night, how are
there black people that show up to support this man?
And if you take some of those black people and
(38:06):
make them feel like they are better and more like you,
and those that are poorer or immigrants are less like
you and more likely to hurt you or your children
or commit crimes, and all these fear mongering lies that
they tell. I'd like to know who on that side
would be able to point to Ramses and I be
(38:27):
able to point to you and say, well, he's not Haitian,
he's he's not Cuban, he's he's not African, He's and
I'm leaving that blank because you have Afro Latina, you
have African, you have West Indian, you have all of
these different variations of people who if you're just looking
at their skin and most of their features could be kinfolk.
(38:51):
Tell us more about that type of rhetoric where I
think people think they're excluded. Right, you see people who
look and some speak similar to the very targeted group
of Haitian immigrants now, and I think they feel they
would be excluded from those attacks and from that policy
of these mass deportations that he talks about. Speak to
(39:14):
how scary that should be, and I don't I hate
to try to use the same tactics, so maybe not scary,
but point to more what that could look like for
all of us, because I don't think every Haitian walks
around with the flag that says hey I'm.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
Haitian, deport me.
Speaker 4 (39:29):
I think our brothers and sisters from the Haitian community
could use our support because they are far more like
us than different.
Speaker 3 (39:36):
And I could not have said a better myself. It's
really one of those issues that I again forget is
even an issue. If I were to say, y'all, well,
my cousins, no one would bad twice until maybe you
started to ask certain questions about curry or ROTI about curry.
(39:56):
But one of the most brilliant things I heard at
my first week Howard was look around the root. Although
it seems is that we're all the same, because we are.
Our differences show up when you're invited to Grandma's house
for breakfast and you kind of see and hear the smells,
the music, the outfits. Perhaps, but that requires actually getting
(40:21):
to know that individual. We are all coming from the
same place. When whether you go to an anthropological level
and we're talking about the first humans or we're talking
to the black people specifically, at which point the slave
ship dropped us off, Let's be clear the policies that
are being implemented. Look into target the immigrant community will
(40:45):
impact anyone that is perceived to be an immigrant, and
that changes not just from state to state, but from
city to city. I have never been thought to be
Absha until I moved to these see in the same
way that if I'm in Detroit, I might be Somali,
in the same way that I'm going to New York.
(41:05):
You know, I speak my little Spanish, I can suddenly
be Dominican. But at the end of the days, because
we're all black, these policies that seek to target certain
parts of the community will inevitably impact us all. One
of the most dangerous but effective strategies that we have
seen implemented are those that seek to divide and conquer.
(41:31):
And it works, and it's worked for whether it be
through slaver votes or with the recent conversations riados. Let's
be glad. I'll support reparations until I get to certain
conversations or certain places where they say, oh, well, that
has nothing to do with you. Your parents were born in
(41:51):
South America. That's taking away one more voice to advance
policies that would just at large benefit our communities. And
I think this idea of saying that these issues won't
impact me and mine directly. I won't say that it's scary,
(42:13):
but I will say that it's short sighted and missing formed.
You know, whether it's a situation of access to capital.
You know, everyone loved to talk about how Trump he
gave those checks. You know, everyone got the checks. But
if you are attacking different protections that have always protected
our community, whether it be housing discrimination, whether it be
(42:36):
access to higher ed, whether it be access to capital,
loans or small businesses, if you're removing any sort of
any of those protections because he wrote you a check,
where are you spending that check? We really have to
get beyond the immediacy of all of these issues. We
really have to be able to see ourselves in our
(42:57):
brothers and our sisters, because for whom the bell tolls
today could be for you tomorrow. These issues will impact
generations of people to come, and we've seen that he
won't stop. Rows should be a scared example to us.
All again, Black women are dying in Texas and in
(43:19):
Georgia from preventable surgeries because of laws he has proudly supported.
And I think you're right this idea that he is
just a cloud is working and we got to wake up.
His words are very dangerous and we can't wait until
they knocking at our door making things dangerous for us
(43:40):
that subtly care.
Speaker 1 (43:44):
There's a couple of things that I want to or
one thing in particular that I want to touch on
before I ask the second thing, and feel free to
jump in. But you know, Donald Trump didn't write anybody
a check. Yes, yeah, that for folks. That because that
that is to be fair. That is something that people
(44:06):
sincerely believe. And uh, you know, in case you're only
getting this episode and you haven't got the rest of them,
you know, I apologize, but I have to say this
every time I happened MIC and an audience, because you know,
in our estimation, Q and myself, we feel the stakes
are so high that it's worth you hearing this twice
if me and someone else gets to hear it once.
So I will say that it was Congress that approved.
Speaker 3 (44:32):
The Democratic Congress.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Democratic Congress that approved those checks. Donald Trump stood in
the way of you getting those checks until he could
get his name on the check, and he bypassed Congress.
I believe it was Ambassador Rice that explain that to
us more fully but bypassed Congress and went to the
head of the Treasury to insist that the checks not
be sent out unless they had his name on it, right, right,
(44:58):
So the check came with a signature and I believe
maybe some other information that suggested that Donald Trump was
the person behind it. And for people that feel like
Donald Trump went to his own bank account and pulled
out money and gave it to the American people, you're
playing right into his hands. You're falling for the trick
that he wanted you to fall for. He's a showman
and you're, you know, you're dancing to his tune. Donald
(45:21):
Trump did not send you that money, nor would he
ever send you that money. The money was already earmarked
for you, and he wanted to take credit for it.
So that's the person for those of you who feel
like you want to vote for him over the twelve
hundred dollars that Congress approved for you, that's the person
that you're really voting for. Nobody. He didn't send you
that money. You have to say that next thing. I
(45:42):
want to say this, and I know that we're going
along on time, but I would appreciate your insight because
you are a person who is more familiar with the
average American with the legal framework of this country. You
mentioned to us that we don't need to look much
(46:03):
further than Roe v. Wade, And you know, on this
show we've discussed Roe v. Wade many times, and so
our assumption is that our listeners are familiar with that
that Supreme Court has stood in the way or repealed
so many things that people who prefer more progressive agenda
(46:32):
want to see happen. A lot of people got some
form of student loan relief. I was not one of them.
So you know, there's there's a lot of like really
scary things with respect to that Supreme Court. And we
don't necessarily need to talk about Donald Trump or his
decidedly conservative agenda whichever you think that he is going
(46:55):
to enact when he becomes president, be at Project twenty
twenty five or his Agenda forty seven. It's Project twenty
twenty five. But what I want to do is to
sort of ask you, you know, for those of us
that look at this situation and realize or feel rather
that it's very bleak. Even if there is a Harris
(47:16):
administration on the horizon, for US as a country, the
Supreme Court.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
Is there.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
As a lawyer, as someone who's familiar with the legal
framework of this country, what if anything can be done
about the Supreme Court in terms of pushing through a
progressive agenda for this country.
Speaker 3 (47:43):
Well, I'm so happy that you ended that question with
the word progressive, because as a progressive myself and with
many progressive in Congress, there has been a conversation around
expanding the court for years. At this point, we have
to start taking these policies seriously. We have to start
to consider ways to inhibit Scotus the Supreme Court from
(48:10):
determining what are fundamental, sometimes constitutionally guaranteed rights will look
like in the future. This country was supposed to have
checks and balances, and we have allowed for President Trump
to stack the Court with far right, politically motivated justices.
(48:38):
Unless we do something to radically change the way that looks,
whether it be court expansion or Supreme Court terms, this
will continue to be an issue. And it goes far
beyond Roe v. Wade. This has to do with the EPA.
This has to loan forgiveness that I too wish I
(48:59):
could say. This has to do with immigrant rights, like
we have to discussed It has to do with qualified
immunity and how policing is done in this country. Our
courts are meant to be a check on Congress, meant
to be a check on the president, and they have
been terribly, terribly politicized in a way that without that
(49:23):
same progressive thought process, without changing things from the way
they've always been done, we will continue to be at
the mercy of justices that have shown time and tim
and tom again that they will not answer to us
and that they don't necessarily care about us. Something has
(49:45):
to change. I think we have to change the way
that judges are operating, particularly our justices in this country,
otherwise we're going to continue to run into these same
same issues, if not worse issues.
Speaker 4 (50:03):
It's very refreshing to have this conversation with you. You know,
I had to pay all of my student loans back,
and I still hope they forgive even more for those
who haven't gotten that relief yet. The idea that some
people are upset that because they had to pay their
loans back, that they should stand in the way of
other people to get in there is forgiven is crazy
(50:24):
to me.
Speaker 3 (50:25):
But good Christian ideology, Oh yeah, absolutely, what would Jesus do.
Speaker 4 (50:33):
Thank you for shining a very pragmatic light on some
of these issues that, like I said, I think the
clown of a former president that we had has made
a lot of these issues seem very cartoonishly frivolous, and
people just kind of ignore the extreme things that he says. So,
(50:53):
you know, thank you from for lending your point of
view and your perspective on things that you have a
greater understanding than the two of us. For our listeners,
what's next for you? I know this election is mission
critical for everyone, but there's work to be done beyond that.
So what's next on your itinerary? And how can people
(51:18):
keep up with you and follow you and all those
great things?
Speaker 3 (51:21):
Yeah? Absolutely, I revel and the opportunity to have more
conversations like this because I think, to your point, we
often limit these conversations to the Ivory Tower. And I
always tell people, and I'm not smarter than you. I've
just created a life where I'm able to get paid
to read. But if someone else had a paycheck tied
(51:43):
every time they read the news and kind of kept
up with some of these policies, they could figure it
out too. This stuff isn't complicated. But if the only
time that you are hearing about it is for forty
five minutes right after you put the kids away and
you're feeding yourself some cold leftovers, not going to be
able to get into those intricacies and how it directly
(52:04):
impacts you, what they're saying about people across the sea
and people in a different city. That being said, over
the next two weeks, my primary goal is to make
sure that Vice President Kamala Harris is in office. That
volunteering my time knocking on doors, calling my cousins in
them to make sure that they are registered, and showing
(52:26):
up and taking a few long friends. That is really
what my foreseeable future looks like. You know, we can
have this conversation a week after the election and I
might have a more excited at each other. But for me,
it's just incredibly important to combat this information, to share
the good word and make sure that people understand how
(52:48):
this election is not something high and lofty in policy
and legal conversations, but how directly impact but the next
four years of their life and a minimum look like.
My name is Yanna gilt Y A N N I
C K G I L L and while you know,
not the easiest to pronounce, it makes Google very easy,
(53:10):
a simple Google search, and the Sianna gil with most
of everything all.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
You probably didn't mean it this way, but Rams and
I both just heard you say we could talk about
this again in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
I'm gonna take that as a promise. I'm not sure
if that's what you meant, but you said.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
Your mouth, Guys is now I'm holding you all accountable.
Speaker 2 (53:30):
Okay, there it is, all right.
Speaker 1 (53:32):
Well, in the short run, we got to say thank you. Obviously,
this conversation was a long time coming. And uh, it's
it's you and and people like you that give us
and our listeners the insight that we need to really
make heads or tails of things day to day. Your
expertise on immigration, just the fact that you're a lawyer
with the perspective of a black man goes a long way,
(53:54):
because you know, we're having conversations about blackness, we're having
conversations about the law, we're having conversations about immigration, and
so someone with your unique perspective and experience in the
political arena, it's an honor and it's a joy, and
it's exceptionally educational to have a little bit of your
time and the promise that we will have more of
(54:17):
your time in the future. So on, behalf of myself
and Q all of us here at the Black Information Network,
and it's an excipher. We want to say thank you,
not only for your time, but for your commitment to
making sure that we are all more educated and more engaged.
You're the sort of person that we simply can't thank enough.
(54:37):
Once again, Today's guest is Yannik Gill, a human rights
lawyer and accomplished human rights advocate defending marginalized people across
the United States and abroad.
Speaker 3 (54:46):
Thank you, sir, now pleasureless mind, Thank you all.
Speaker 1 (54:50):
This has been a production of the Black Information Network.
Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson. Have some thoughts
you'd like to share, use the red microphone talkback feature
on the iHeartRadio app. While you're there, be sure to
hit subscribe and download all of our episodes. I am
your host Ramsey's Jaw on all social media.
Speaker 2 (55:06):
I am q Ward on all socials as well.
Speaker 1 (55:09):
Join us tomorrow as we share our news with our
voice from our perspective right here on the Black Information
Network Daily Podcast. This has been a production of the
Black Information Network. Today's show is produced by Chris Thompson.
Have some thoughts you'd like to share, use the red
microphone talkback feature on the iHeartRadio APPUM. While you're there,
be sure to hit subscribe and download all of our episodes.
(55:30):
I'm your host, ramses Jaw on all social media. Join
us tomorrow as we share our news with our voice
from our perspective right here on the Black Information Network
Daily Podcast
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