June 11, 2025 • 31 mins
Is rereading old texts a sign of love addiction or just enthusiasm? Content creator Tefi Pessoa gets real about her experiences in intense relationships, the complex work of breaking toxic dating patterns, and how to prioritize self-love.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm usually like running from a man that's good for
me and chasing a man that's bad for me. I need,
what is the most unhinged thing that you have done?
Oh like for someone like that, it doesn't have to
be a boyfriend. Yeah, I mean, I guess like the
(00:20):
time I went through this guy's computer, he fell asleep,
and while he was asleep, I started going through his
Facebook messages. I was on WhatsApp, I was on Instagram.
I was top to bottom gonna figure something out. Oh yeah,
like high school. And I was like desperately trying to
find something to get him on, you know what I
mean to be like, Yeah, but I was the one
(00:41):
being suspicious, like he should have been going through my phone,
you know, And so that's what it was. No, I
found nothing, and then he woke up and caught me.
And he's so good and nice that he was like,
if you wanted to talk to me about anything, you
could have just looked.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Have just looked.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
I hope this doesn't go on, I mean whatever, Like,
oh my god, I'm like, that is my most vulnerable truth.
I wish I could say that was the only time
I've looked through an x's phone and I can think
of at least ten more unhinged things I've done to boyfriends, crushes,
(01:26):
and situationships in my past. That's why in this episode
we're talking about breaking these toxic patterns. I'm Hopewitderd and
welcome to Boysover, a space where we're learning and unlearning
all the myths were taught about love and relationships. Step
(01:55):
one to going boy sober is identifying what patterns I
need to break free from. For me, I love the
chase so much so that I'm often chasing new crushes
before I'm done with a current partner. Yes, that's terrible.
It is not something I'm proud of. So many times
(02:15):
I've been the toxic ex and I want to figure
out how to stop this behavior. So today I'm talking
to someone who's done just that. Teffi Posoa has gone
through a similar struggle. If you don't know her, she's
a content creator, a pop culture historian, and has even
been called the Internet's favorite big sister, and I totally agree.
(02:40):
I first became aware of Teffy when I saw one
of her videos on TikTok, and then I moved to
New York and randomly got a job as her manager's assistant.
I was suddenly on the sidelines while she was posting
about her life, and at that time she was engaged
and then quickly not engaged, which I always assumed must
(03:01):
have been hard to experience in the spotlight. I was
excited to talk to her about that and what she's
been through since she's been in relationships, she's been single,
and now she's focusing on herself to figure out what
she actually.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Wants to start things off.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
I wanted to play a little game that, if I'm
being honest, is probably more helpful for me than Tefie,
because again, I've done some pretty unhinged things in the
name of love or maybe just lust.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Tefie, welcome to voiceover. Yeah that's so crazy. How are you?
I'm good? How are you? Can you believe your life
like it's a beautiful thing? Yeah? Okay, this is our game.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So I'm gonna tell you something and you have to
decide if it's love addiction or just enthusiastic Okay, okay,
number one checking to see if your crush watched your
Instagram story.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
I don't think it's enthusiastic or love addiction. What do
you think that's just being thorough.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
It's just being self aware. Yeah, sorry, we're just seeing
what's up. I think it's just being excited. Yeah, okay,
excited enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Looking up your crush on Venmo after the first date,
that is love, addiction, that's addiction. Okay, making your crush
a playlist that better be enthusiast, that's enthusiasts.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
It has to be come on. That's like an art form.
You can't better give.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
You can't burn a CD, you can't make cassette tapes
for anybody. So like everybody else in generations probably gets
to have that, but.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Us, no, no, no, no, I agree, that's enthusiastic.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
That's enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Okay, what if a first date lasts eight hours?
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Man or woman? It's different, it's different. Tell me the difference.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
If you're with a man for eight hours, you're in
a basement, right, crazy.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I feel like with a girl, it's normal.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Right. With a girl, it's like you're probably having a
fantastic time.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Like with a man. I'm doing this, I'm like, is
it working? Is it working?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
You're like with girls, I'm like, should we just go
to the zoo after this?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Or let's all right? All right?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
So that one we're gonna say it depends. What about
posting an Instagram story with only your crush in mind?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah? No, I think once it gets into the territory
of like even the story checking, once it gets into
the territory of this could define your day. Oh that's one,
Like if somebody's not texting you and it's affecting your day,
day defining.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, day defining.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Right, Okay, My next one is what if you've only
got your crush on your close friends?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
No, baby, no, no way personal. You don't want your
best friend to see your good me. Sorry, it was
just it was it was a steamy picture.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Like a little hair you get in the mood. Yeah,
it was a one time thing. I don't do it anymore.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Okay, I got over that.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Okay, what about googling your crush? Yeah, that's love addiction,
love addiction. I mean, are you feeling that there might
be a crime?
Speaker 2 (06:15):
You know what I mean? You're like, oh something they said?
You know you know what?
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Actually, as I get older I'm turning thirty five in July,
maybe you do want to see because we are entering
the divorce era where you're meeting people who are getting divorced,
especially if it's like a single dad. I can understand
a woman being like, well what happened?
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Yeah, you know, I can understand. I'm gonna say enthusiastic.
I'm gonna say enthusiastic. Yeah. What about rereading old texts?
I think that's a little love addictie. I've never done that.
You haven't. I've never done that.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
I've never done that, even when I like going through
a breakup and stuff. I'm the kind of person that
I will delete the thread because I know that I
will do so. Maybe to me, that is love addictie,
And that's why I delete it, because I know I'm
going to get it.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
In there, and I don't need access to it. I
don't need to see their name. I don't need to
see the thread.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
I don't want to remember what you said when you
liked me.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
No, no, no, you know what I do have it
on is my computer. Okay, so I delete it from
my phone, but then I look on my computer A
little part of you.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I dance, I dance the dance. I walked alive.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
Yea, yeah, right, last one canceling your weekend plans because.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Nope, that's the same as only out in their neighborhood
on a Friday if they haven't texted you no, no, no, no,
I yes, I.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Did it the other day. Girl, free yourself. Also, like
I have.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
I used to do that all the time, and what
killed me is like I'd be like, oh, are you
in the West Village tonight or like midnight, They're like, no,
I'm in Park Slope.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Oh well, as a matter of fact, I'll be there
in thirty minutes. It never works out. Can't cancel the plans. Okay,
so let's get into a little let's go.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Let's talk a little bit about your experience with some
pretty intense relationships.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Oh my life, all I know is intensity. All I
know is intensity.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Before we go on, I have to ask you to
define specifically if you could love it love addiction.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
I think love addiction in a nutshell is being obsessed
with finding a savior on your terms. But at the
end of the day, I think we all want to
be saved on our terms. It's something that I tell
myself a lot too when I feel maybe being swept
away or romanticizing somebody. You know, this is just a
(08:32):
person totally, and I have to It's such a weird thing.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
To say, but like I literally have.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
To be like, this is someone's son, daughter, child, whatever,
And then I can feel that other part of me
being like, but if they're going to work, why are
they texting on the subway? And I'm like, this is
just a person, you know what I mean? Yeah, somehow
I know too. If this person did obsess over me,
oh the way that I wanted, I.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Would say, get the fuck away from it.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
In the next Literally, I think a healthy relationship. I've
only had tastes of that in my life. Healthy relationships,
healthy relationships, secure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wasn't ready for
it when like.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Growing up, do you remember like sort of the first
brush with like romance with the guy, Like the first
time you felt sort of like male attention and what
it meant to you.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I was my first boyfriend from fourteen to twenty three.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
No. Oh, he wasn't just with me girl, but no,
it was very off and on. It was very toxic
the teens. At twenty three is uh so.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
I loved him desperately and he was okay about me.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
But I have but I remember that brush of like
insanity like real Stevie Nick said it once. The only
time I've been really truly in love. Was my first
love because it was new and you didn't know, and
I fully fully trusted this person, you fully fully, all in,
all in, and I think that I'm so grateful for
(09:56):
that experience too. It taught me so much somethings I
did not have to learn.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Some things I did not have to learn.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I didn't have to learn, you know, Like that's a
big reason also why I have never in my life
after that relationship checked a X situationship fling or relationship
social media. Never you're kidding, I never have and I
don't block them or anything.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
I never have creeped, not once. Really inspiring because why how?
Because it broke my heart.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I think when you're a teenager too, like your brain
is absorbing and changing all the time, and everything was
happening on Facebook. You could really see what everybody was doing.
I will never forget like that bone chilling betrayal and
like realizing what was happening, and like, I think it's
(10:44):
not because I.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Have this like extreme willpower.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
Show me a brownie, you know, literally wait, but I
know that one it doesn't feel good and two it's
not true. Like whatever story I'm gonna tell myself is
not true, and I'm gonna be crazy about it regardless,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
I don't need to feed that fire. It's already in me.
I've already got it. I've already got it burning.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
And my mom was like, I remember, she was like,
dating is so crazy for your generation. This is when
I was a teenager. Like one of the times that
I was like stopping crying. She's like, yeah, when I
was dating in the eighties in New York, if a
guy liked you, by the time you got home, there
was a message on your answering machine, which is so cute.
And she's like, so cute, and then if you broke up,
you were literally never saw them again.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
I long for a time like that because so I
gave it to myself. I'm not like you in that
way where I go searching. I was texting my sister
about it yesterday and she was like, stop making yourself sad,
Like give yourself a narrative, totally, like stop doing this
to yourself, like stop checking, stop looking, stop but I fixate.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah, but you fixate, and then what happens is you
tell yourself a story of what's really happening, what's going on,
and then you create this narrative and your body's begging
for you to be wrong. So you reach out, like
one step of alcohol and it's oh, it's done, and
it's like you can feel like you're inner child being like, wait,
it's true, we're not lovable or something. So you reach
out and it just creates either you've broken no contact,
(12:07):
so now you're in this thing that you know it's
going to end, and you're in this shame circle. I
know that shame circle too, Like when you're talking to
somebody you shouldn't be talking to. If your friends were
to find out, they'd kill you. Like if you were
in a situation where you cannot stop your own narrative,
you have to tell someone.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
You have to you have to pull people in, and
you have to be like, I'm really being my own
worst enemy right now, I.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Am being so mean, totally so mean to me.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
One of my best friends is always like, stop being
so mean to my friend.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
And literally don't talk about my friend that way.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Exactly when I first discovered you on TikTok, you were engaged.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I wasn't good. Is that You're next immediate relationship not
only walked me through I was with. I was with
somebody from fourteen to twenty three, and then I moved
to New York.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Then I was here for forty eight hours, and I
fell in love with somebody else because eight I latched
onto the first man that batted his eyes at me out.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
I was with him for like.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Two years two hours you loved him.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Two years later I did, and I think I was
twenty two, where I just turned twenty three. Wow, So
I was like a new born, yeah, totally, and.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
I was new to the city. So I had somebody
to kind of like show me around. Right.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
It was never going to be serious for them, and
I needed it to be serious because I was so
scared to be alone.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
I'd never been alone. But we were not compatible.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
And then after that, I was dating around for like
two years and then I met my exit I later
was engaged to and we broke up. But it was
also a situation where we should not have been together.
Like we loved each other very much, but I think
unfortunately sometimes you meet people and you're like, in order
(14:04):
to become the person that I wanted to, you needed
to like break my heart that way. That was something
where I had to learn that I could not learn
these lessons for a person, and I think that's where
we were not compatible. I don't think I was in
a position where he had so much to learn about
himself and I didn't have the heart to put him
through it. When you're in a relationship, you want to
(14:25):
make life easier. So I found myself in a place
where I was an enabler for really bad behavior because
I'd be like, no.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
No, no, it's not his fault.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
Or even with like friends, you're like, well, she didn't
mean that. You know that her mom is really mean
to her, Like I was enabling and which is disguised
as understanding, and it was selfish empathy. And I remember
when we ended things, I remember thinking like, this is
the kindest thing I can do for you, And even then,
I'm still obsessed with this high horse. I was so
sick of being like the moral guidance person because I
(14:57):
think at the end of that too, I wanted to
be bad too.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Somebody has to like be the glue.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
And I just saw this pattern of my life continuing
where like this person was gonna keep getting like soft
blows because I was going to protect them from everything,
and then me trying to like myself because I hated myself.
I hated who I was in that relationship. I was
a nag, like I'm not someone who's like on your ass.
It was turning into mother and son, and I did
(15:24):
not like who I was.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
A mother sort of son dynamic in a relationship I
think is so common.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
It's so it happened so much, and it's been so
so sneaky.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Like resentment is a plant you water by accident. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
I really do want to know, like, if you could
put it into words, how.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
You were able to let it go, how you were
able to walk away.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Longestly, I found out that somebody was doing something there
weren't supposed to do, and I remember I felt tired,
I was a mad There was no yelling. It was
a sit down conversation. I called my mom before I
told her I'm leaving this person? Can you come? And
I had to tell my mom what happened because I
(16:05):
needed somebody to hold me accountable because I'm already in
this pattern.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
It's almost too easy to go back.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Well, I'm thinking about what a different reaction that is
because I'm thinking about myself and I always want to
be like I'm not speaking to you anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
I'm done.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I want to say this like big statement, but I
know what that statement means is just like that's a
toss and I want you to toss it back to me.
I want you to come back. I want you to chase.
I want you to say no, don't go.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
But when you feel that feeling of just like you
know your your body, I can't even tell you I'm done.
I'm so done.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Yeah, Like I can't even tell you I'm out the
door because I'm so I don't even care to hear what.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You have to say. I tell girls too all the time.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I mean, if you feel like you need to go
back and you need to learn that lesson again, each time,
it's going to be harder. Each time, it's going to
be worse. The people that are going to push and
push and push are going to make it worse and
worse and worse. I remember I said, I'm not your
fiance girlfriend anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Whatever, just put it aside. Yeah, as your friend, like
what's happening? What are you doing? Like why? Like why
like like we could really be happy? Yeah, you know whatever.
And I think a lot of people have that moment
where it's like, if you.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Could just stop being yourself And I think that's and
I think when I was looking at this person, being like,
why do you keep doing this? And it was one
thousandth time too, like I don't want people to think
that I'm just.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
Like and I stood up the first time. I said no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
I know if this person bid my spir to a
pulp and probably meet two to him in many ways,
I don't care to know at this point. Sure, but
everybody deserves to be with someone that wants the same
things totally. And it just got down to we love
each other so much, we have so much sulf for
each other. Yeah, we are not compatible, right, And I
think for the rest of my life I'd be wondering
(17:41):
if I settled. And that's when I felt a true
piece come over me. Yeah, And I think that night
was the first time in four years that I went
to sleep without word anybody was gonna cheat on me.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Holy go. I slept starfish so much relief. I slept
for like twelve hours.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Yeah, I was listening to you on another podcast and
I heard you say that you have been the villain
in so many people's story for sure, Why do you
use the word villain, and can you tell me about
one of those moments.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I think they needed me to be.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
I think that at the end of the day, we
know what really happened, and in order to heal from something,
instead of I'm going to give you an example, I'm
making this up. It's not that I left when they
cheat it it's that I abandoned them at their lowest.
And I'm like, if that's what you need to tell yourself,
(18:35):
you know what I mean? Like, there's always so many sides,
and I've realized that as I've gotten older, there are
three sides to a story.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
And I understand that now.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
And there is an inner monologue happening with people that
I'm not aware of. And if we're not communicating, if
we're not vulnerable, or if you're not in a place
where you can share these things with me, of course
I'm going to be the villain. I can't read your mind,
and I feel like, towards the end of a relationship,
it's like, in order for this to work, we need
like brutal intimacy and brutal honesty. And a lot of
(19:04):
times people will not meet you half way. And I'm
not some Buddha Barney. Either I can be selfish, I
can be a brat, I can be emotionally reactive. I'm
a human being. But I don't think anybody can say
TEFFI didn't.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Try her darnest. So it's tough.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
I feel like this is such a thing that we
do as women too, Like we can fix this and
I won't even make them meet me halfway, just ten percent,
and I can fix it.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Why do you think we want to fix it so bad?
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Because we don't want to be alone and we've or
oh my god, hope the idea after that going like
me and going through that breakup, being like me going
on a date and asking what's your favorite color? I
want to like pull my tongue out right. And you've
already met their families, you've done Christmas Is together, and
like you're in this. Being comfortable will keep you underwater,
(19:54):
you know, Like I truly look back and a pictures
of myself too, and I can see how miserable I
am in my eyes, and I had no idea. The
worst thing about being in a toxic relationship is the
possibility that it might end. That's the worst thing. You
don't tell anybody you don't talk about it because if
you talk about it, it might end right, and you'd
(20:14):
rather be sick then have to face yourself.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
I was reckoning with like kind of addiction to chaos,
and so for me, it sort of was like a
rock bottom moment where I was like, I have to
be alone, like I have to reckon with Yeah, you
have to yeah, with voiceover with whatever I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
That is a part of this equation, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
So was that the moment for you where you were like,
I need to step back completely and like take ownership
of like my patterns with love and everything. Or was
that like your rock bottom?
Speaker 2 (20:45):
No, I think with rock bottom.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
I think my rock bottom was like I try to
start dating, and I could feel me not being present
and I knew that dating was making me miss someone
who didn't treat me. Well, yeah, there's a warmth, and
there's an intimacy that comes with someone that's betrayed you
because they've seen you like sobbing crime, Like there's an
(21:07):
intimacy to like forgiveness, and I was missing that and
I could feel myself wanting to recreate toxic patterns so that.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Me and this new person could do that. I think.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Also, I was still very trusting, and I thought that
if I just started dating, I could like get over
it or something like the way I got over other
relationships did not work this time because I was engaged
in totally, so I was like, I don't really know
what the fuck I'm doing here, and I'm in my thirties,
(21:38):
like I should know how to date. But I felt
almost like declaude or something like I felt like I
was getting like my sea legs.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
And then at the same time, I was getting so
much attention for my career totally, so I had to
be kind of two people. And there's something that I
do all the time to check if I really am
happy in something. I go back to like twelve year
old me and I tell her about something romantic that's
happening in my life and they're like, but are we wait?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Are we so happy?
Speaker 3 (22:09):
And I owe it to her to say yes, because
if I start explaining why I'm not happy but I
can be, I can see her smile kind of drop
and she's like.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
This blows, this sucks.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
There's got to be more, and she's right, and it
kills me because then I get annoyed at a child.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
You're holding me accountable. You're twelve, So that's something that
really grounds me too.
Speaker 3 (22:34):
You know, how did you finally break the pattern? You
know when you have hyper focused food? Yeah, Like I
think my mom Mike's my mom. Mike's the best tune
a salad sandwich you have ever. Yeah, And I remember
I would eat it like every different lunch for the
year when I was living a front of me and
there was this one day I was like, this makes
me sick totally. I think I got to the point
(22:57):
where dating made me sick. Yeah, Like I was doing
this dance and I started to look like shit. I
started to feel like shit. And I remember like being
on one of these dating apps on day and being
like I just can't. And I think I was like, yeah,
single for two years straight.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
I want to know more about like you and Phoebe's
conversations and therapy. Hey Phoebe, shout out Pheb, we love you.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Phoebe.
Speaker 3 (23:37):
I was talking to her about my love life and
she said everybody in this society is a love addict
and I was like, what do you mean, And she's like,
because how the media portrays love like it's not normal
to meet somebody and then like look for their text
all day and think about your last names together, Like
that's not normal.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
Do you like the chase? Do you like the chase?
Despise the chase? I despise it. I despise you do it.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
I think that I find myself in situations where people
don't know who they are yet, or especially with men,
I feel like men are like developmentally emotionally, are of
course behind. I think are like all our moms told
us out like boys are always a little bit more mature, right, yeah.
But I think as women, we are told at a
young age, you're going to be a mother, You're going
(24:21):
to be a caretaker, right, You're going to be head
of this community. You better evolve emotionally. So there's a
lot of this pressure for us to evolve, and men
don't really have the same pressures for them to provide.
And I understand that maybe there comes a place where
I'm like, if you don't go to therapy or if
you don't work this out, I might outgrow you totally.
Even with friends sometimes and I'm like, I need you
(24:44):
to work this out because I don't want to outgrow
this friendship, right, you know, right? And it's not that
I chase avoidant people. It just gets to a place
where in order for us to continue growing together, yeah,
you're going to have to break through this wall or
really like face yourself right, And I know how scary
that is. The Thing about therapy is I think people
(25:04):
go to therapy and they're like, I just don't want
to feel like this anymore. And through therapy I've learned
when I feel like this, what do I do? And
we're women, right, So as we get older, there is
this kind of wait, am I gonna have kids?
Speaker 2 (25:21):
Wait?
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Am I gonna I can have kids at forty three?
Do I want to have kids at forty three? Like
these kind of things where you feel rushed, right, And
when these feelings come up for me instead of thinking
about it like is this love addiction? I go, wait, okay,
what am I feeling right now?
Speaker 2 (25:35):
What is this rush? Do I feel like I'm being
left behind?
Speaker 3 (25:38):
You know? What's the question I ask myself too with
Phoebe is like Phoebe, I don't know one couple I
want to be like, right, But for some reason I
feel like I meet somebody who and this is in
the past.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
I feel like I've this.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Past year, I've done a lot of internalized work, and
a lot of that is not reading comments anymore, or
like blocking a certain conversation, not being interested in some
conversations because as women, we are excitable and the Internet
is mainly women.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
How did sort of that feel?
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Did you feel that disconnect of like being online and
being public and sort of having this piece of your relationship?
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Were you sharing that honesty? Like now? Yeah? Like how
sort of.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
Transparent was your online persona and the reality of your relationship.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
I think that the hardest thing was that this person
was not well and there were certain issues and dependencies
that they had to work through without me.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
But there are just.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
Some things where online I didn't know how to speak
about it because I wanted to protect this person so much.
I have this thing about the internet too. I refuse
to talk about things while I'm still working it out
because I don't want that to I'm very malleable. I've
learned that about me. I don't want somebody else's story
to kind of bleed into my truth. So I always
(27:00):
talk about things that I've learned. So after that breakup,
I'll talk about like boundaries or patterns and stuff like that,
but I wasn't talking about it online because I don't
think it was fair to me. I needed to mourn
it and find stable ground. And I've moved on and
we both have. Are you all Do you stay connected?
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Absolutely not. I have no interest.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
I wish you well away from me totally, like I
don't think enjoy please. But I think even to this day,
I wake up and I'm like, I don't think he
did go to that party.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Like there's like there are still things literally, wait, that
doesn't make sense to three years later, you're.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Like pretty sure on that one day he did.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Lie.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Wait, hold on, we don't have a car, like you know,
so there's literally like that. And I also for the internet,
I think that when people post their breakup stories or
their relationship stories, I am so like, tell me girl,
tell me girl. But for me, I refuse used to
(28:00):
be known for my worst moment. And it was a
decision I made. If you would have told me, like
a year before that breakup, would you ever talk about it,
I'd be like fuck, yeah, fuck that motherfucker or something
if he does that to me whatever, and it happened.
I was like, what if one day I get to
interview Michelle von Robinson Obama, Oh, I love you so much,
and then my search is an ex's nan I'm so much.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
I respect everybody that goes online and talks about breakups.
That must be so scary, especially knowing that you're inviting
other narratives or people to come in and like argue
your truth. I think I was also so deeply hurt
that I could not imagine somebody coming in and maybe
telling me the truth.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Mm, I don't think I could handen What do you
think the truth would have been?
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Maybe this person was using you, taking advantage of you,
that this person saw you as somebody that could do
things for them, And I don't think I was ready
to have that truth. So I think the people that
go on and do that, like you're so much braver
than me.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Do you think there's sort of a connection between addiction
and like working on the internet.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Working on the internet is tough, yeah, because sometimes you're
like is this how I truly feel? Or is this
the woman I want to be?
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Am I hurt?
Speaker 1 (29:09):
Yet?
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Am I someone that like I want people to look
at and be like, she's got it all figured out?
Speaker 2 (29:14):
And I don't. But I recently figured out.
Speaker 3 (29:17):
You know, when I'm recording a video, I'm not looking
at people, I'm looking at myself. So a lot of
the times when people are like I had no idea
that she was so lonely, miserable, sad, I'm like a
lot of the videos, I think I'm talking to myself,
and I'm posting it just in case somebody in the collective.
If we're all connected, there has to be at least
one person out there who feels that way. This year,
(29:40):
my therapist and I were like, my goal is to
date someone who likes me, and that is so simple,
but it's not.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
And are you doing it? Yes?
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I am, Oh, and you date someone's dating you that
likes you. This is the thing we need to hold
on to date someone.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
I think you should just date someone who likes you.
And what's crazy? That's it?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Like, this is what it is to be like so simple,
But I do think we all run from it. Why
because maybe me personally don't like myself so much sometimes
so or.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
You're scared it's going to go away. We actually have
to make peace with that first, and then maybe I
can date something.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
I have survived everything that's ended. I'll be fine.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
I hope one day the solutions to fixing my toxic
patterns will be as clear to me as.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
They are to Tefi.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Talking with her really helped me see that there is
a path forward and we do not have to be
stuck circling the drain forever. I'm going to try to
talk about that to my own personal Phoebe, because you've
got to start somewhere. Boysover is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
(30:51):
I'm your host, Hope Ordered. Our executive producers are Christina
Everett and Julie Pinero. Our supervising producer is Emily Meronoff
engineering by Bahid Fraser and mixing and mastering.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
By Aboo Zafar.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
If you liked this episode, please tell a friend and
don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe to boy Sober
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get
your favorite shows
I'm usually like running from a man that's good for
me and chasing a man that's bad for me. I need,
what is the most unhinged thing that you have done?
Oh like for someone like that, it doesn't have to
be a boyfriend. Yeah, I mean, I guess like the
(00:20):
time I went through this guy's computer, he fell asleep,
and while he was asleep, I started going through his
Facebook messages. I was on WhatsApp, I was on Instagram.
I was top to bottom gonna figure something out. Oh yeah,
like high school. And I was like desperately trying to
find something to get him on, you know what I
mean to be like, Yeah, but I was the one
(00:41):
being suspicious, like he should have been going through my phone,
you know, And so that's what it was. No, I
found nothing, and then he woke up and caught me.
And he's so good and nice that he was like,
if you wanted to talk to me about anything, you
could have just looked.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Have just looked.
Speaker 1 (01:03):
I hope this doesn't go on, I mean whatever, Like,
oh my god, I'm like, that is my most vulnerable truth.
I wish I could say that was the only time
I've looked through an x's phone and I can think
of at least ten more unhinged things I've done to boyfriends, crushes,
(01:26):
and situationships in my past. That's why in this episode
we're talking about breaking these toxic patterns. I'm Hopewitderd and
welcome to Boysover, a space where we're learning and unlearning
all the myths were taught about love and relationships. Step
(01:55):
one to going boy sober is identifying what patterns I
need to break free from. For me, I love the
chase so much so that I'm often chasing new crushes
before I'm done with a current partner. Yes, that's terrible.
It is not something I'm proud of. So many times
(02:15):
I've been the toxic ex and I want to figure
out how to stop this behavior. So today I'm talking
to someone who's done just that. Teffi Posoa has gone
through a similar struggle. If you don't know her, she's
a content creator, a pop culture historian, and has even
been called the Internet's favorite big sister, and I totally agree.
(02:40):
I first became aware of Teffy when I saw one
of her videos on TikTok, and then I moved to
New York and randomly got a job as her manager's assistant.
I was suddenly on the sidelines while she was posting
about her life, and at that time she was engaged
and then quickly not engaged, which I always assumed must
(03:01):
have been hard to experience in the spotlight. I was
excited to talk to her about that and what she's
been through since she's been in relationships, she's been single,
and now she's focusing on herself to figure out what
she actually.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Wants to start things off.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
I wanted to play a little game that, if I'm
being honest, is probably more helpful for me than Tefie,
because again, I've done some pretty unhinged things in the
name of love or maybe just lust.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Tefie, welcome to voiceover. Yeah that's so crazy. How are you?
I'm good? How are you? Can you believe your life
like it's a beautiful thing? Yeah? Okay, this is our game.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So I'm gonna tell you something and you have to
decide if it's love addiction or just enthusiastic Okay, okay,
number one checking to see if your crush watched your
Instagram story.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
I don't think it's enthusiastic or love addiction. What do
you think that's just being thorough.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
It's just being self aware. Yeah, sorry, we're just seeing
what's up. I think it's just being excited. Yeah, okay,
excited enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Looking up your crush on Venmo after the first date,
that is love, addiction, that's addiction. Okay, making your crush
a playlist that better be enthusiast, that's enthusiasts.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
It has to be come on. That's like an art form.
You can't better give.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
You can't burn a CD, you can't make cassette tapes
for anybody. So like everybody else in generations probably gets
to have that, but.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Us, no, no, no, no, I agree, that's enthusiastic.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
That's enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Okay, what if a first date lasts eight hours?
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Man or woman? It's different, it's different. Tell me the difference.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
If you're with a man for eight hours, you're in
a basement, right, crazy.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
I feel like with a girl, it's normal.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Right. With a girl, it's like you're probably having a
fantastic time.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Like with a man. I'm doing this, I'm like, is
it working? Is it working?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
You're like with girls, I'm like, should we just go
to the zoo after this?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Or let's all right? All right?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
So that one we're gonna say it depends. What about
posting an Instagram story with only your crush in mind?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Yeah? No, I think once it gets into the territory
of like even the story checking, once it gets into
the territory of this could define your day. Oh that's one,
Like if somebody's not texting you and it's affecting your day,
day defining.
Speaker 2 (05:45):
Yeah, day defining.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Right, Okay, My next one is what if you've only
got your crush on your close friends?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
No, baby, no, no way personal. You don't want your
best friend to see your good me. Sorry, it was
just it was it was a steamy picture.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
Like a little hair you get in the mood. Yeah,
it was a one time thing. I don't do it anymore.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Okay, I got over that.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Okay, what about googling your crush? Yeah, that's love addiction,
love addiction. I mean, are you feeling that there might
be a crime?
Speaker 2 (06:15):
You know what I mean? You're like, oh something they said?
You know you know what?
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Actually, as I get older I'm turning thirty five in July,
maybe you do want to see because we are entering
the divorce era where you're meeting people who are getting divorced,
especially if it's like a single dad. I can understand
a woman being like, well what happened?
Speaker 2 (06:34):
Yeah, you know, I can understand. I'm gonna say enthusiastic.
I'm gonna say enthusiastic. Yeah. What about rereading old texts?
I think that's a little love addictie. I've never done that.
You haven't. I've never done that.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
I've never done that, even when I like going through
a breakup and stuff. I'm the kind of person that
I will delete the thread because I know that I
will do so. Maybe to me, that is love addictie,
And that's why I delete it, because I know I'm
going to get it.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
In there, and I don't need access to it. I
don't need to see their name. I don't need to
see the thread.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
I don't want to remember what you said when you
liked me.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
No, no, no, you know what I do have it
on is my computer. Okay, so I delete it from
my phone, but then I look on my computer A
little part of you.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I dance, I dance the dance. I walked alive.
Speaker 1 (07:17):
Yea, yeah, right, last one canceling your weekend plans because.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Nope, that's the same as only out in their neighborhood
on a Friday if they haven't texted you no, no, no, no,
I yes, I.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Did it the other day. Girl, free yourself. Also, like
I have.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
I used to do that all the time, and what
killed me is like I'd be like, oh, are you
in the West Village tonight or like midnight, They're like, no,
I'm in Park Slope.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
Oh well, as a matter of fact, I'll be there
in thirty minutes. It never works out. Can't cancel the plans. Okay,
so let's get into a little let's go.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Let's talk a little bit about your experience with some
pretty intense relationships.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
Oh my life, all I know is intensity. All I
know is intensity.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Before we go on, I have to ask you to
define specifically if you could love it love addiction.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
I think love addiction in a nutshell is being obsessed
with finding a savior on your terms. But at the
end of the day, I think we all want to
be saved on our terms. It's something that I tell
myself a lot too when I feel maybe being swept
away or romanticizing somebody. You know, this is just a
(08:32):
person totally, and I have to It's such a weird thing.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
To say, but like I literally have.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
To be like, this is someone's son, daughter, child, whatever,
And then I can feel that other part of me
being like, but if they're going to work, why are
they texting on the subway? And I'm like, this is
just a person, you know what I mean? Yeah, somehow
I know too. If this person did obsess over me,
oh the way that I wanted, I.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Would say, get the fuck away from it.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
In the next Literally, I think a healthy relationship. I've
only had tastes of that in my life. Healthy relationships,
healthy relationships, secure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I wasn't ready for
it when like.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
Growing up, do you remember like sort of the first
brush with like romance with the guy, Like the first
time you felt sort of like male attention and what
it meant to you.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
I was my first boyfriend from fourteen to twenty three.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
No. Oh, he wasn't just with me girl, but no,
it was very off and on. It was very toxic
the teens. At twenty three is uh so.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
I loved him desperately and he was okay about me.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
But I have but I remember that brush of like
insanity like real Stevie Nick said it once. The only
time I've been really truly in love. Was my first
love because it was new and you didn't know, and
I fully fully trusted this person, you fully fully, all in,
all in, and I think that I'm so grateful for
(09:56):
that experience too. It taught me so much somethings I
did not have to learn.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Some things I did not have to learn.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I didn't have to learn, you know, Like that's a
big reason also why I have never in my life
after that relationship checked a X situationship fling or relationship
social media. Never you're kidding, I never have and I
don't block them or anything.
Speaker 2 (10:17):
I never have creeped, not once. Really inspiring because why how?
Because it broke my heart.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
I think when you're a teenager too, like your brain
is absorbing and changing all the time, and everything was
happening on Facebook. You could really see what everybody was doing.
I will never forget like that bone chilling betrayal and
like realizing what was happening, and like, I think it's
(10:44):
not because I.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Have this like extreme willpower.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
Show me a brownie, you know, literally wait, but I
know that one it doesn't feel good and two it's
not true. Like whatever story I'm gonna tell myself is
not true, and I'm gonna be crazy about it regardless,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
I don't need to feed that fire. It's already in me.
I've already got it. I've already got it burning.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
And my mom was like, I remember, she was like,
dating is so crazy for your generation. This is when
I was a teenager. Like one of the times that
I was like stopping crying. She's like, yeah, when I
was dating in the eighties in New York, if a
guy liked you, by the time you got home, there
was a message on your answering machine, which is so cute.
And she's like, so cute, and then if you broke up,
you were literally never saw them again.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
I long for a time like that because so I
gave it to myself. I'm not like you in that
way where I go searching. I was texting my sister
about it yesterday and she was like, stop making yourself sad,
Like give yourself a narrative, totally, like stop doing this
to yourself, like stop checking, stop looking, stop but I fixate.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah, but you fixate, and then what happens is you
tell yourself a story of what's really happening, what's going on,
and then you create this narrative and your body's begging
for you to be wrong. So you reach out, like
one step of alcohol and it's oh, it's done, and
it's like you can feel like you're inner child being like, wait,
it's true, we're not lovable or something. So you reach
out and it just creates either you've broken no contact,
(12:07):
so now you're in this thing that you know it's
going to end, and you're in this shame circle. I
know that shame circle too, Like when you're talking to
somebody you shouldn't be talking to. If your friends were
to find out, they'd kill you. Like if you were
in a situation where you cannot stop your own narrative,
you have to tell someone.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
You have to you have to pull people in, and
you have to be like, I'm really being my own
worst enemy right now, I.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Am being so mean, totally so mean to me.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
One of my best friends is always like, stop being
so mean to my friend.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
And literally don't talk about my friend that way.
Speaker 1 (12:34):
Exactly when I first discovered you on TikTok, you were engaged.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
I wasn't good. Is that You're next immediate relationship not
only walked me through I was with. I was with
somebody from fourteen to twenty three, and then I moved
to New York.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Then I was here for forty eight hours, and I
fell in love with somebody else because eight I latched
onto the first man that batted his eyes at me out.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
I was with him for like.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Two years two hours you loved him.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
Two years later I did, and I think I was
twenty two, where I just turned twenty three. Wow, So
I was like a new born, yeah, totally, and.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
I was new to the city. So I had somebody
to kind of like show me around. Right.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
It was never going to be serious for them, and
I needed it to be serious because I was so
scared to be alone.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
I'd never been alone. But we were not compatible.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
And then after that, I was dating around for like
two years and then I met my exit I later
was engaged to and we broke up. But it was
also a situation where we should not have been together.
Like we loved each other very much, but I think
unfortunately sometimes you meet people and you're like, in order
(14:04):
to become the person that I wanted to, you needed
to like break my heart that way. That was something
where I had to learn that I could not learn
these lessons for a person, and I think that's where
we were not compatible. I don't think I was in
a position where he had so much to learn about
himself and I didn't have the heart to put him
through it. When you're in a relationship, you want to
(14:25):
make life easier. So I found myself in a place
where I was an enabler for really bad behavior because
I'd be like, no.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
No, no, it's not his fault.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
Or even with like friends, you're like, well, she didn't
mean that. You know that her mom is really mean
to her, Like I was enabling and which is disguised
as understanding, and it was selfish empathy. And I remember
when we ended things, I remember thinking like, this is
the kindest thing I can do for you, And even then,
I'm still obsessed with this high horse. I was so
sick of being like the moral guidance person because I
(14:57):
think at the end of that too, I wanted to
be bad too.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Somebody has to like be the glue.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
And I just saw this pattern of my life continuing
where like this person was gonna keep getting like soft
blows because I was going to protect them from everything,
and then me trying to like myself because I hated myself.
I hated who I was in that relationship. I was
a nag, like I'm not someone who's like on your ass.
It was turning into mother and son, and I did
(15:24):
not like who I was.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
A mother sort of son dynamic in a relationship I
think is so common.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
It's so it happened so much, and it's been so
so sneaky.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
Like resentment is a plant you water by accident. Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
I really do want to know, like, if you could
put it into words, how.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
You were able to let it go, how you were
able to walk away.
Speaker 3 (15:44):
Longestly, I found out that somebody was doing something there
weren't supposed to do, and I remember I felt tired,
I was a mad There was no yelling. It was
a sit down conversation. I called my mom before I
told her I'm leaving this person? Can you come? And
I had to tell my mom what happened because I
(16:05):
needed somebody to hold me accountable because I'm already in
this pattern.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
It's almost too easy to go back.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Well, I'm thinking about what a different reaction that is
because I'm thinking about myself and I always want to
be like I'm not speaking to you anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
I'm done.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I want to say this like big statement, but I
know what that statement means is just like that's a
toss and I want you to toss it back to me.
I want you to come back. I want you to chase.
I want you to say no, don't go.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
But when you feel that feeling of just like you
know your your body, I can't even tell you I'm done.
I'm so done.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Yeah, Like I can't even tell you I'm out the
door because I'm so I don't even care to hear what.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You have to say. I tell girls too all the time.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
I mean, if you feel like you need to go
back and you need to learn that lesson again, each time,
it's going to be harder. Each time, it's going to
be worse. The people that are going to push and
push and push are going to make it worse and
worse and worse. I remember I said, I'm not your
fiance girlfriend anymore.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Whatever, just put it aside. Yeah, as your friend, like
what's happening? What are you doing? Like why? Like why
like like we could really be happy? Yeah, you know whatever.
And I think a lot of people have that moment
where it's like, if you.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Could just stop being yourself And I think that's and
I think when I was looking at this person, being like,
why do you keep doing this? And it was one
thousandth time too, like I don't want people to think
that I'm just.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
Like and I stood up the first time. I said no, no, no, no.
Speaker 3 (17:21):
I know if this person bid my spir to a
pulp and probably meet two to him in many ways,
I don't care to know at this point. Sure, but
everybody deserves to be with someone that wants the same
things totally. And it just got down to we love
each other so much, we have so much sulf for
each other. Yeah, we are not compatible, right, And I
think for the rest of my life I'd be wondering
(17:41):
if I settled. And that's when I felt a true
piece come over me. Yeah, And I think that night
was the first time in four years that I went
to sleep without word anybody was gonna cheat on me.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Holy go. I slept starfish so much relief. I slept
for like twelve hours.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Yeah, I was listening to you on another podcast and
I heard you say that you have been the villain
in so many people's story for sure, Why do you
use the word villain, and can you tell me about
one of those moments.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
I think they needed me to be.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
I think that at the end of the day, we
know what really happened, and in order to heal from something,
instead of I'm going to give you an example, I'm
making this up. It's not that I left when they
cheat it it's that I abandoned them at their lowest.
And I'm like, if that's what you need to tell yourself,
(18:35):
you know what I mean? Like, there's always so many sides,
and I've realized that as I've gotten older, there are
three sides to a story.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
And I understand that now.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
And there is an inner monologue happening with people that
I'm not aware of. And if we're not communicating, if
we're not vulnerable, or if you're not in a place
where you can share these things with me, of course
I'm going to be the villain. I can't read your mind,
and I feel like, towards the end of a relationship,
it's like, in order for this to work, we need
like brutal intimacy and brutal honesty. And a lot of
(19:04):
times people will not meet you half way. And I'm
not some Buddha Barney. Either I can be selfish, I
can be a brat, I can be emotionally reactive. I'm
a human being. But I don't think anybody can say
TEFFI didn't.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Try her darnest. So it's tough.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
I feel like this is such a thing that we
do as women too, Like we can fix this and
I won't even make them meet me halfway, just ten percent,
and I can fix it.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Why do you think we want to fix it so bad?
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Because we don't want to be alone and we've or
oh my god, hope the idea after that going like
me and going through that breakup, being like me going
on a date and asking what's your favorite color? I
want to like pull my tongue out right. And you've
already met their families, you've done Christmas Is together, and
like you're in this. Being comfortable will keep you underwater,
(19:54):
you know, Like I truly look back and a pictures
of myself too, and I can see how miserable I
am in my eyes, and I had no idea. The
worst thing about being in a toxic relationship is the
possibility that it might end. That's the worst thing. You
don't tell anybody you don't talk about it because if
you talk about it, it might end right, and you'd
(20:14):
rather be sick then have to face yourself.
Speaker 1 (20:16):
I was reckoning with like kind of addiction to chaos,
and so for me, it sort of was like a
rock bottom moment where I was like, I have to
be alone, like I have to reckon with Yeah, you
have to yeah, with voiceover with whatever I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
That is a part of this equation, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
So was that the moment for you where you were like,
I need to step back completely and like take ownership
of like my patterns with love and everything. Or was
that like your rock bottom?
Speaker 2 (20:45):
No, I think with rock bottom.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
I think my rock bottom was like I try to
start dating, and I could feel me not being present
and I knew that dating was making me miss someone
who didn't treat me. Well, yeah, there's a warmth, and
there's an intimacy that comes with someone that's betrayed you
because they've seen you like sobbing crime, Like there's an
(21:07):
intimacy to like forgiveness, and I was missing that and
I could feel myself wanting to recreate toxic patterns so that.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Me and this new person could do that. I think.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Also, I was still very trusting, and I thought that
if I just started dating, I could like get over
it or something like the way I got over other
relationships did not work this time because I was engaged
in totally, so I was like, I don't really know
what the fuck I'm doing here, and I'm in my thirties,
(21:38):
like I should know how to date. But I felt
almost like declaude or something like I felt like I
was getting like my sea legs.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
And then at the same time, I was getting so
much attention for my career totally, so I had to
be kind of two people. And there's something that I
do all the time to check if I really am
happy in something. I go back to like twelve year
old me and I tell her about something romantic that's
happening in my life and they're like, but are we wait?
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Are we so happy?
Speaker 3 (22:09):
And I owe it to her to say yes, because
if I start explaining why I'm not happy but I
can be, I can see her smile kind of drop
and she's like.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
This blows, this sucks.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
There's got to be more, and she's right, and it
kills me because then I get annoyed at a child.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
You're holding me accountable. You're twelve, So that's something that
really grounds me too.
Speaker 3 (22:34):
You know, how did you finally break the pattern? You
know when you have hyper focused food? Yeah, Like I
think my mom Mike's my mom. Mike's the best tune
a salad sandwich you have ever. Yeah, And I remember
I would eat it like every different lunch for the
year when I was living a front of me and
there was this one day I was like, this makes
me sick totally. I think I got to the point
(22:57):
where dating made me sick. Yeah, Like I was doing
this dance and I started to look like shit. I
started to feel like shit. And I remember like being
on one of these dating apps on day and being
like I just can't. And I think I was like, yeah,
single for two years straight.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
I want to know more about like you and Phoebe's
conversations and therapy. Hey Phoebe, shout out Pheb, we love you.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Phoebe.
Speaker 3 (23:37):
I was talking to her about my love life and
she said everybody in this society is a love addict
and I was like, what do you mean, And she's like,
because how the media portrays love like it's not normal
to meet somebody and then like look for their text
all day and think about your last names together, Like
that's not normal.
Speaker 2 (23:54):
Do you like the chase? Do you like the chase?
Despise the chase? I despise it. I despise you do it.
Speaker 3 (24:00):
I think that I find myself in situations where people
don't know who they are yet, or especially with men,
I feel like men are like developmentally emotionally, are of
course behind. I think are like all our moms told
us out like boys are always a little bit more mature, right, yeah.
But I think as women, we are told at a
young age, you're going to be a mother, You're going
(24:21):
to be a caretaker, right, You're going to be head
of this community. You better evolve emotionally. So there's a
lot of this pressure for us to evolve, and men
don't really have the same pressures for them to provide.
And I understand that maybe there comes a place where
I'm like, if you don't go to therapy or if
you don't work this out, I might outgrow you totally.
Even with friends sometimes and I'm like, I need you
(24:44):
to work this out because I don't want to outgrow
this friendship, right, you know, right? And it's not that
I chase avoidant people. It just gets to a place
where in order for us to continue growing together, yeah,
you're going to have to break through this wall or
really like face yourself right, And I know how scary
that is. The Thing about therapy is I think people
(25:04):
go to therapy and they're like, I just don't want
to feel like this anymore. And through therapy I've learned
when I feel like this, what do I do? And
we're women, right, So as we get older, there is
this kind of wait, am I gonna have kids?
Speaker 2 (25:21):
Wait?
Speaker 3 (25:21):
Am I gonna I can have kids at forty three?
Do I want to have kids at forty three? Like
these kind of things where you feel rushed, right, And
when these feelings come up for me instead of thinking
about it like is this love addiction? I go, wait, okay,
what am I feeling right now?
Speaker 2 (25:35):
What is this rush? Do I feel like I'm being
left behind?
Speaker 3 (25:38):
You know? What's the question I ask myself too with
Phoebe is like Phoebe, I don't know one couple I
want to be like, right, But for some reason I
feel like I meet somebody who and this is in
the past.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
I feel like I've this.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Past year, I've done a lot of internalized work, and
a lot of that is not reading comments anymore, or
like blocking a certain conversation, not being interested in some
conversations because as women, we are excitable and the Internet
is mainly women.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
How did sort of that feel?
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Did you feel that disconnect of like being online and
being public and sort of having this piece of your relationship?
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Were you sharing that honesty? Like now? Yeah? Like how
sort of.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
Transparent was your online persona and the reality of your relationship.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
I think that the hardest thing was that this person
was not well and there were certain issues and dependencies
that they had to work through without me.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
But there are just.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
Some things where online I didn't know how to speak
about it because I wanted to protect this person so much.
I have this thing about the internet too. I refuse
to talk about things while I'm still working it out
because I don't want that to I'm very malleable. I've
learned that about me. I don't want somebody else's story
to kind of bleed into my truth. So I always
(27:00):
talk about things that I've learned. So after that breakup,
I'll talk about like boundaries or patterns and stuff like that,
but I wasn't talking about it online because I don't
think it was fair to me. I needed to mourn
it and find stable ground. And I've moved on and
we both have. Are you all Do you stay connected?
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Absolutely not. I have no interest.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
I wish you well away from me totally, like I
don't think enjoy please. But I think even to this day,
I wake up and I'm like, I don't think he
did go to that party.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Like there's like there are still things literally, wait, that
doesn't make sense to three years later, you're.
Speaker 2 (27:38):
Like pretty sure on that one day he did.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
Lie.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Wait, hold on, we don't have a car, like you know,
so there's literally like that. And I also for the internet,
I think that when people post their breakup stories or
their relationship stories, I am so like, tell me girl,
tell me girl. But for me, I refuse used to
(28:00):
be known for my worst moment. And it was a
decision I made. If you would have told me, like
a year before that breakup, would you ever talk about it,
I'd be like fuck, yeah, fuck that motherfucker or something
if he does that to me whatever, and it happened.
I was like, what if one day I get to
interview Michelle von Robinson Obama, Oh, I love you so much,
and then my search is an ex's nan I'm so much.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 3 (28:24):
I respect everybody that goes online and talks about breakups.
That must be so scary, especially knowing that you're inviting
other narratives or people to come in and like argue
your truth. I think I was also so deeply hurt
that I could not imagine somebody coming in and maybe
telling me the truth.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Mm, I don't think I could handen What do you
think the truth would have been?
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Maybe this person was using you, taking advantage of you,
that this person saw you as somebody that could do
things for them, And I don't think I was ready
to have that truth. So I think the people that
go on and do that, like you're so much braver
than me.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Do you think there's sort of a connection between addiction
and like working on the internet.
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Working on the internet is tough, yeah, because sometimes you're
like is this how I truly feel? Or is this
the woman I want to be?
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Am I hurt?
Speaker 1 (29:09):
Yet?
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Am I someone that like I want people to look
at and be like, she's got it all figured out?
Speaker 2 (29:14):
And I don't. But I recently figured out.
Speaker 3 (29:17):
You know, when I'm recording a video, I'm not looking
at people, I'm looking at myself. So a lot of
the times when people are like I had no idea
that she was so lonely, miserable, sad, I'm like a
lot of the videos, I think I'm talking to myself,
and I'm posting it just in case somebody in the collective.
If we're all connected, there has to be at least
one person out there who feels that way. This year,
(29:40):
my therapist and I were like, my goal is to
date someone who likes me, and that is so simple,
but it's not.
Speaker 2 (29:45):
And are you doing it? Yes?
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I am, Oh, and you date someone's dating you that
likes you. This is the thing we need to hold
on to date someone.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
I think you should just date someone who likes you.
And what's crazy? That's it?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Like, this is what it is to be like so simple,
But I do think we all run from it. Why
because maybe me personally don't like myself so much sometimes
so or.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
You're scared it's going to go away. We actually have
to make peace with that first, and then maybe I
can date something.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
I have survived everything that's ended. I'll be fine.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
I hope one day the solutions to fixing my toxic
patterns will be as clear to me as.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
They are to Tefi.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Talking with her really helped me see that there is
a path forward and we do not have to be
stuck circling the drain forever. I'm going to try to
talk about that to my own personal Phoebe, because you've
got to start somewhere. Boysover is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
(30:51):
I'm your host, Hope Ordered. Our executive producers are Christina
Everett and Julie Pinero. Our supervising producer is Emily Meronoff
engineering by Bahid Fraser and mixing and mastering.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
By Aboo Zafar.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
If you liked this episode, please tell a friend and
don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe to boy Sober
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, and wherever you get
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