4/30/25: Trump Bullies Bezos, GDP Shrinks, Trump MS13 Photoshop, US Jet Falls Into Sea & MORE!

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
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Speaker 3 (00:25):
We need your help to build the future of independent
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dot com.

Speaker 4 (00:33):
Good morning, and welcome to Counterpoints Sentily.

Speaker 5 (00:35):
How you doing.

Speaker 6 (00:35):
I'm good. We've got Tager on deck.

Speaker 7 (00:37):
Don't we Yes, We've got a great slate of guests today,
Slash co host, So we've got Sager who's going to
join us for about half of the show. After that,
we're going to be joined by one of the two
victims of the assault in Crown Heights last week. This
woman was a random bystander who was just checking out

(00:57):
the scene. Somebody started filming, so she put us kind
of scarf over her face and Instantly, this crowd of
pro Israel people is like, Oh, she must be anti
Israel because she's got a scarf on.

Speaker 4 (01:08):
Her face and.

Speaker 7 (01:11):
A harrowing scene emerge. This will be her first on
camera interview. Eric Adams has actually asked her to come
forward so that he can press charges against the people
who were involved with this. We have new video footage,
and we have her video footage which has not been
seen before, so you're going to see this mob kind
of from her perspective. We're also going to talk to
African journalist churn Oba. He's going to talk about the

(01:35):
what's going on in Africa post USAI D. He has
been a longtime critic of American interference in Africa and
USA I D. So he's gonna he'll talk about that
and a bunch of other things. GDP numbers came out
this morning, so we'll talk about that. Last night, Donald
Trump did an interview with Terry Moran, Wild, interview with Wild,

(01:58):
interview with Tam Moran, a rally, he met with Gretchen Whitmer.
I think the theme of today's show is the break
with reality in a way that we haven't really seen in.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
Our politics before. There's just some it's just getting weird.

Speaker 6 (02:11):
Didn't that happen in like twenty fifteen?

Speaker 4 (02:14):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (02:14):
Ish, Well, well, when you start to hear Donald Trump talking,
let's see if like these aren't even lies, these are
just like this guy.

Speaker 8 (02:22):
Okay, there are some particularly interesting moments actually in that context.

Speaker 6 (02:28):
Also the influencer briefings.

Speaker 8 (02:29):
We're going to do battle over the influencer briefings because
I'm out numbered on this.

Speaker 6 (02:32):
Ryan and Sager want to tear them apart.

Speaker 7 (02:35):
And you know what the White House is bringing in
social media influencers and hosting like parodies of press events.

Speaker 8 (02:42):
Yeah, some of them definitely deserve to be torn apart.
So we will get into all of that. Trump also
held a rally last night in addition to this interview
with Terry Moran. He's celebrating his first one hundred days
in the style Ryan, So we have soundbites from that
and the who the these you you want to give
us an update on.

Speaker 7 (02:59):
Going to do it, a wide update on the war
in Yemen. A one of our seventy million dollars fighter
jets fell off an aircraft carrier.

Speaker 4 (03:10):
We'll talk about that.

Speaker 7 (03:11):
B It appears that Scentcom is now taking targeting and
information from random ocent people. Sager is going to like
this one random ocent people on Twitter and just killing
innocent people because they're not double checking the work of
these amateurs from like Europe and Houston.

Speaker 4 (03:27):
And along the way.

Speaker 7 (03:28):
They bombed an African migrant detention center. So far, sixty
eight people have been killed in this strike. They said
it was some hooty base, it was actually actually a
detention center.

Speaker 4 (03:40):
A quick health update on the Grim family.

Speaker 7 (03:43):
We can bring Sager in here because Sager will appreciate this.
When there was the overhead cam a couple weeks ago,
I noticed I was going bald and a lot of
braking points.

Speaker 4 (03:54):
Viewers said, you got to get this hymns monoxidil thing.
I started doing it. Are you serious?

Speaker 3 (04:00):
I don't know, Ryan, you got to You got to
check your testosterol levels on that one.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
You should watch out.

Speaker 4 (04:06):
So that my tea levels are going to collapse.

Speaker 7 (04:08):
The other the other health update, my wife's pathology report
came back and no residual cancer.

Speaker 4 (04:14):
Answer free.

Speaker 7 (04:15):
There'll be some radiation and some other things, but uh,
real light at the end of.

Speaker 6 (04:20):
The tunnel and a big relief for yeah, all of you.

Speaker 7 (04:22):
Fuller head of hair, no cancer like. Things are looking up.

Speaker 6 (04:26):
Life couldn't be better for Ryan right now.

Speaker 3 (04:29):
I'm so glad to hear it. Ryan, And thank you
guys for having me. I appreciate it, Oh.

Speaker 4 (04:33):
Appreciate appreciate you being here.

Speaker 7 (04:34):
We're going to start by talking about, uh this the Amazon,
the up and down with Amazon. Oh so, so Amazon
begins the day with reporting and punch.

Speaker 4 (04:43):
Bowl that there's going there.

Speaker 7 (04:45):
They're going to start listing the extra price that you're
paying based on the tariffs. The end of the day
without that, and throughout the day. I think it's a
lesson in our contemporary politics. But let's roll this first side.

Speaker 4 (04:58):
So it was.

Speaker 9 (04:59):
Reported this morning Amazon will soon display a little number
next to the price of each product that shows how
much the Trump tariffs are adding to the cost of
each product. So isn't that a perfect crystal clear demonstration
that it's the American consumer and not China who is
going to have to pay for these policies.

Speaker 10 (05:19):
I will take this since I just got off the
phone with the President about Amazon's announcement. This is a
hostile and political act by Amazon. Why did Amazon do
this when the Biden administration height inflation to the highest level.

Speaker 6 (05:34):
In forty years.

Speaker 10 (05:35):
And I would also add that it's not a surprise because,
as Reuters recently wrote, Amazon has partnered with a Chinese
propaganda arm. So this is another reason why Americans should
buy American. It's another reason why we are on shoring
critical supply chains here at home to shore up our
own critical supply chain and boost our own manufacturing here.

Speaker 5 (05:58):
Zo is still a Trump supporter.

Speaker 10 (06:00):
Look, I will not speak to the President's relationships with
Jeff Bezos, but I will tell you that this is
certainly a hostile and political action by Amazon.

Speaker 7 (06:09):
All Right, So, this allegedly hostile act was first reported
by punch Bowl after that White House interaction. You've moved
now to A three very quickly. Here's Jeff Stein reporting
on an Amazon statement. Quote, the team that runs our
ultra low cost Amazon Hall store has considered listing import
charges on certain products. This was never a consideration for

(06:32):
the main Amazon site, and nothing has been implemented on
any Amazon properties. But wait, there's more. But wait, there
is more. Donald Trumps asked about this back and forth.
Let's roll Trump.

Speaker 11 (06:48):
Great. Jeff Bezos was very nice, he was terrific.

Speaker 5 (06:52):
He solved the.

Speaker 11 (06:53):
Problem very quickly, and he did the right thing, and
it's a good guy.

Speaker 8 (06:58):
So when from punch bowl to the briefing, to Jeff
Stine to Donald Trump himself, Sager, what did you make
of that play by play in the I think all
of that went from like eight am to one pm.

Speaker 7 (07:11):
With Amazon stock moving as a result the whole time.

Speaker 3 (07:14):
Yeah, I mean, I think my meta takeaway from all
of this is just how different and how frankly a
weak this is compared to the Chinese system. I want
to remind everyone whenever we were covering this stuff last
week on the Chinese version of Amazon, they are actually
advertising state subsidized discounts. They're calling them patriotic discounts, saying, hey,

(07:36):
Chinese people, if you are patriotic, stand up to the
United States, buy Chinese. Here's a discount from the state.
We must save our supply chains. Meanwhile, here we are
in our country where the price is going up no
matter what. Except the President and Bezos, you know, the
one of the richest men in the world and the
President of the United States are basically coming together to

(07:57):
make sure that the label is not there to say
that this is as a result of the tariffs. I
also want to say this as well. The White House
might be trying to do some sort of political layoup
in the future. They're going to say, look, Amazon prices
have not gone up all that much. That is just
categorically not true. The reason why is that while the

(08:18):
price may remain the same on Amazon, Amazon is currently
engaged in economic warfare against all of its suppliers.

Speaker 1 (08:27):
I was just reading yesterday.

Speaker 3 (08:29):
Amazon is demanding in the same way that Walmart, Target
and all the other large retailers are. They are saying
to their suppliers, you are eating the margin. We are
not touching one dollar of this. They have the power
of that because of the reliance of those platforms, of
those suppliers on their platform. This is the problem. So Amazon, Target,
and Walmart, they are all going to be generally fine. Yes,

(08:51):
there may be some little bit of increase in price,
but the real crime here is for the small business
let's say that relies on Amazon. Let's say they sixty
or seventy percent of volume. I don't know if you
guys saw this as a viral image going around of
somebody who bought something from Hong Kong where they paid
like two thousand dollars for the product, and their custom

(09:11):
duty charge is over the price of the good, right,
so twenty five hundred. So just imagine if you're one
of these smaller suppliers E commerce company. There's so many
of these companies out there. They're relying on Amazon almost entirely.
And Amazon is telling them no, no, no, no, you're eating that,
and so Costco, Walmart, Target, and Amazon, the big four
like major retailers, they have the power to tell those

(09:34):
suppliers to eat margin. And that's great for them, but
you know that can result both in a wipeout of
a lot of these suppliers, right because they can't have
any profitability, and then worse, it can even manifest in
empty shelves and less inventory. So we really are the
ones who are losing here. And I just want to
highlight the difference in these two state strategies, Like, on

(09:54):
the one hand, you have a state over in China,
which is not just really because they don't care about
Amazon in their own way, right because they control it. Instead,
they care about the suppliers that I just talked about.
Those are the backbone of the United States economy and
they're the exact people who are not being helped right
now by government policy. In fact, they're the ones with

(10:15):
who are freezing cash flow, have a lot of inventory uncertainty.
They're the ones who are not placing right They're the
ones not placing their orders in this dramatic freight drop
off from China. And so watching that, I actually in
a lot of ways, it's just like COVID, all the
big companies, the Fortune five hundred, they made off like bandits.

Speaker 1 (10:35):
You know, who are the people who went bankrupt? Small business?

Speaker 3 (10:37):
You have restaurants, you know, employees or five you know,
contractors and others.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Those are the people that really suffer in something like this.

Speaker 3 (10:45):
And so that's where I want to zoom out of
even just Trump and Amazon, and like this is about
meta high level strategy, and just watch at who's playing
the game and who's actually winning that game.

Speaker 7 (10:56):
And in the war with reality is this is a
serious skirmish because think about what the administration is objecting to.
If there are increases that are the direct result of
the importers having to pay this tariff, they're saying, you
cannot convey that reality to your consumers. We will not
allow it. Yet reality exists, and so we can put

(11:17):
up a five. So UPS announced that, despite having strong
profits for the first quarter, it's planning in the future
going forward to cut twenty thousand jobs. Part of this
is these are companies that are always looking to lay
off workers for any excuse they can find.

Speaker 4 (11:35):
But the excuse that they're.

Speaker 7 (11:36):
Finding here is that their main client, Amazon isn't shipping
as much stuff.

Speaker 4 (11:42):
And so while Amazon is.

Speaker 7 (11:44):
You're right going to be able to tell that its
suppliers we will not be accepting price increases. I've seen
some of those emails that have gone around. It's an
amazing thing to read we will not be accepting price increases.
How cool would that be to be able to walk
into a store and be like, yeah, I'm sorry, I'm
just I don't accept price increases, So just gonna I'm

(12:05):
just gonna pay what this used to cost.

Speaker 12 (12:07):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (12:08):
Despite that power, they're still shipping less stuff because they
don't have complete absolute control over everything, and as a result, uh,
there's less for UPS drivers to do. And so that's
just that's just one of the many kind of to
borrow a Reagan phrase, trickle down effects, that we're gonna
that we're that we're going to see from this, uh
the other uh you know reality uh interferences is best

(12:32):
at getting asked about you know, where they are with
China at this point.

Speaker 4 (12:36):
So let's let's roll the Treasury secretary.

Speaker 6 (12:38):
The Chinese continue to say that the US and are
not engaged in any consultation or negotiation on tariffs.

Speaker 13 (12:46):
You recently said you've talked to your counterpart, but.

Speaker 6 (12:48):
It's more about quote traditional things like financial stability. So
can you clarify is the administration talking to Beijing specifically
about tariffs or not.

Speaker 14 (12:58):
Well, we're not going to talk about who's talking to whom.
But I think that over time we will see that
the Chinese terraffts are unsustainable for China. I've seen some
very large numbers over the past few days to show
if these numbers stay on, Chinese could lose ten million
jobs very quickly, and even if there is a drop

(13:21):
in the tariffs that they could lose five million jobs.
So remember that we are the deficit country. They sell
almost five times more goods to us than we sell
to them, So the onus will be on them to take.

Speaker 5 (13:38):
Off these tariffs.

Speaker 14 (13:39):
They're unsustainable for them, and they are saying, you guys
are not talking about it, So is that true? They
have a different form of government, They're playing to a
different audience. So I'm not going to get into the
nitty gritty again of who's talking to whom. But as
I said, I believe or the Chinese, Uh, these terrorifts

(14:02):
are unsustainable very.

Speaker 8 (14:03):
Quickly two days ago that you didn't know if President
Trump had spoken to Sheeting King.

Speaker 11 (14:08):
Do you know?

Speaker 13 (14:09):
Now?

Speaker 14 (14:10):
Again, I would say, Caroline and I have a lot
of jobs around the White House running the switchboard in
one of them.

Speaker 1 (14:17):
Did you still have switchboards switching?

Speaker 6 (14:20):
That's actually a really good question.

Speaker 4 (14:21):
Did she come to the switchboard?

Speaker 8 (14:23):
I know?

Speaker 13 (14:23):
God does she?

Speaker 6 (14:24):
I know?

Speaker 4 (14:24):
I meant to ask, did he talk to she?

Speaker 6 (14:27):
Shoot?

Speaker 4 (14:28):
I saw him, and I forgot to ask.

Speaker 3 (14:30):
Yeah, Well let's interpret they're not talking. They're not talking
at any at any level. It's not happening. Go ahead
of one.

Speaker 6 (14:36):
Well no, that's exactly what I'm just gonna say. Framing
the whether they're.

Speaker 8 (14:39):
Even talking to China as the quote unquote nitty gritty
is completely wi. There's nothing nitty or gritty about that question.
It's really the question for the entire global economy right now.
And they don't have an answer to it, which is
why they are framing it as the nitty gritty.

Speaker 6 (14:55):
Anyone else went away, And before we go to Howard Lutnik.

Speaker 3 (14:59):
I mean, I just think broadly again, like, this is
why we've seen such wild market swings, is that the
administration just is addicted to floating these things which are
just not true. Like anybody with any expertise China launcher
the Chinese fact. But this the other You don't need
to speak Chinese. The Chinese Foreign Ministry puts out statements
in English. We've never talked, we're not talking. We have

(15:20):
nothing to discuss. Take the tariffs off and that's it.
By the way, it's not just China. And this is
actually what's concerning me the most. Remember in Japan, Japan
was held up as the first trade deal. They came
here first, the Japanese Prime Minister giving a speech in
the parliament. We are not going to concede to aggressive
US demands. In fact, the current position of the Japanese
Economic Ministry is you must take the tariffs off before

(15:44):
we're able to talk. Okay, that's the Japanese. Those are
the people who we are friends with. The administration is
not floating some trade deal with India. You know what's
really funny about that too, is it reveals how much
of this is bullshit, because Scott Bessen actually said, actually,
a trade deal with India is a lot easier because
they have lots of tariffs, but less non trade bearer

(16:07):
non tariff barriers, right, And so he's like, we can
actually come to some sort of negotiation. But the problem
is that the administration does not have any genuine definition
that they can even point to of a non tariff barrier.
They're basically like going back through their records and trying
to make stuff up. And it comes back to the
way that they talked with the Japanese. Remember, the Japanese

(16:29):
have a zero let me reiterate this, a zero percent
tariff on American cars. It is not because of tariffs.
There are a lot of non tariff barriers. We can
talk about that if you want. But then, you know,
whenever the Japanese came here and they're like, so what
do you want You guys said this is reciprocal tariffs,
and they're like, well, what are you offering? They're like,
I can't even do how am I supposed to do

(16:49):
business with you? So I mean, just what I wanted
to highlight is that Scott Bessett and Howard Latnik and
others are complete and Trump are just completely schizophrenic in
their messaging. And then I mean broadly, I know you
guys have been talking about this is it is going
to set in for people very soon. That freight drop
sixty percent that's showing up, okay sometime in June. Uh,

(17:10):
you know, it's it's very You know, my wife, you know,
obviously we're doing with all this baby stuff right now,
she's like, hey, should we order that infant car seat?
You know, and it's not about the tariffs. Are we
going to be able to get one six months from now?
What about diapers? You know, I'm going through researching where
the diapers that we're going to buy are made, just
to make sure, Hey, should I go in stockpile right now?

Speaker 4 (17:30):
You know?

Speaker 3 (17:30):
Ninety nine percent By the way of kids toys, Ryan,
as a parent, when do Kisney toys?

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Actually, Mary, I.

Speaker 7 (17:36):
Mean you can get the ones stuff in their mouth
like almost immediately, like the little kankeys and stuff like
pretty right.

Speaker 3 (17:42):
Yeah, guess what over ninety five percent of that is
made in China, right, you know, ninety five percent, So
you know, I hope my kid there's a luddite, you know,
just deal with the no toys, or maybe it's maybe
they're better off, right, Maybe I should, you know, go
back to hand whittling, and.

Speaker 7 (17:57):
Yeah they're reasonable. My reusable diaper are good. They've gotten
they've gotten a lot better. And they're probably made in
China too, so you better.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Yeah, you're right, Yeah, those are also made. Go ahead.

Speaker 8 (18:07):
Well, I was gonna say to Sager's point, We have
a clip of Howard Lutnik. This is Sager's point about
how the administration is addicted to floating things out into
the public and maybe it is just the sort of
online addling of the American mind where they love seeing
the market shoot up, so they say stuff like this
on CNBC. But Howard Lutnix apt for a long interview

(18:27):
on CMBC yesterday, and we have some clips of that
where he's talking. He's pushed on the question of these deals.
Let's take a listen to what he said.

Speaker 15 (18:35):
If we get a headline that we've signed some deal
with China and whatever, you know, the markets are going
to rip so or actually I.

Speaker 16 (18:41):
Should say, would you say that well, Treasury Secretary Vestent
is focused on China. That's his that's his portfolio. He's
got to get something done with China. And my portfolio
is the rest of the world's trade deals. So they
are coming portfolio. Oh, it's it's the greatest thing because
we have every country in the world, just like Donald
Trump has said, wants to do a deal with us.

(19:03):
Now here's the point. I have a deal done, done,
done done, but I need to wait for their prime
minister and their parliament to give its approval, which I
have country shortly.

Speaker 13 (19:14):
I'm not going to tell you what country.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
Let the president.

Speaker 15 (19:15):
It's just you and me here and have a couple
of million people.

Speaker 16 (19:18):
Hopefully I'll have the president decide so and then there
are a country after country where we're just working through
the details. But you have to remember they have prime ministers,
they have parliament, they have to work through their process.
But all of these are going to be coming, and
what they're going to be is they're going to be
incredibly smart. And key is where are you going to.

Speaker 13 (19:34):
Find the people to work here? Right, you're north of Phoenix.
Where are they're coming?

Speaker 16 (19:37):
Does you go to the community colleges and you train people.
So all the community colleges around here, Arizona State's on
a Grand canyon. All these community colleges here are training
people right now, technicians. And these are really good paying jobs.
You started seventies eighties, ninety thousand dollars. These are trade craft.
It's time to train people not to do the jobs

(20:00):
of the past, but to do the great jobs of
the future. You know, this is the new model where
you work in these kind of plants for the rest
of your life, and your kids work here, and your
grandkids work here. You know, we let the auto plants
go overseas right now. You should see an auto plant.
It's highly automated. But the people, the four five thousand
people who work there, they are trained to take care

(20:21):
of those robotic arms. They're trained to keep the air conditioning.

Speaker 12 (20:24):
You take it.

Speaker 8 (20:25):
So, who wants to take a guess at what Howard
Lutnex deal that he referenced there is, because I don't
think we.

Speaker 1 (20:32):
Know, No, we don't know.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
I mean, look, all the current reports are that it's India,
and you know, I've even talked about this. Look the Indians, Yeah,
they'll offer you some like fake tariffs and all these
other things. But this is also the inconsistency that drives
me crazy. India is one of the most protective developing
economies in the entire world. We're talking about Japan non
trade tariff barriers. That's a joke compared to what India does.

(20:58):
I mean, listen, don't ask me. Go and ask anybody
who's ever tried to go scot business over there. Yeah,
just talking about yesterday, any of these folks. It's true.
I mean, listen, I no hate. They're doing what they
need to do because they believe in the protective economy.
They don't want another country to be able to have
any say over its global affairs. I respect that, but
let's be serious here and not say that this is
not one of the most difficult markets in the entire

(21:20):
world for any US company to do business in.

Speaker 1 (21:23):
That is just obvious.

Speaker 3 (21:24):
And yet you know they're willing to take reciprocal tariffs
maybe there, but they're not willing to take it over
with Japan. The whole thing is just preposterous. And you
know the level of uncertainty that they've injected now you know,
into the small business supply chain, and honestly, even the
pain that they are already. Listen, the tariffs go off tomorrow,
it doesn't matter. That's still an entire what month, maybe

(21:45):
quarter of economic growth wiped out like that. And for
a small business, I mean, look it's only what seven
to ten percent, But I run a small business here
with Crystal. I mean, could we really go a quarter
with like no money? I don't really know business that
could do that, you know, or if you can, you know,
maybe you can make it work.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
But that's that's a lot of stress. That's that's a
heart attacks.

Speaker 3 (22:08):
That's you know, people getting fired, having to ask people
to take you know, okay, can I can I pay
in sixty days?

Speaker 1 (22:15):
You know that type of thing. You don't want to
be doing that to your vendor.

Speaker 3 (22:18):
That has all cascading effects all throughout the economy.

Speaker 7 (22:24):
If you think about the blood, sweat and tears that
has gone into so many of these businesses, when you
talk about the pain, like that's the part that has
really been been hitting me. And actually over at Dropside,
I think we've seen a plateauing, you know, even though
we're not like importing anything, but just just as people
I think, are you know, pinching their pennies more because
the consumer confidence has completely collapsed.

Speaker 4 (22:45):
It's so hard to build.

Speaker 7 (22:47):
A small or medium sized business, and people put their
entire lives into it, and then their lives depend on it,
and sometimes their own the rug just being ripped out
from under them is just brutal.

Speaker 6 (22:57):
Yeah, and sometimes small towns are revolving around these small businesses.

Speaker 8 (23:01):
And to Howard Lutin's suggestion that we are bringing all
these jah blah blah blah, this administration has no industrial
policy to train these workers to augment changes in the market,
to augment what might happen to small businesses.

Speaker 6 (23:16):
They actually have nothing.

Speaker 8 (23:17):
And so I think it's fairly audacious for Howard Lutink
to come out and talk about all of these things
that should happen that are going to happen, while the
administration really it's a soccer.

Speaker 6 (23:28):
Maybe I've missed something.

Speaker 8 (23:30):
Are they doing literally, are they putting any policy forward
that is helping workers and helping communities and helping the
economy broadly shift to meet the changes that they're inducing.

Speaker 3 (23:42):
Well, I mean, I've been off the grid last couple
of days dealing with all this stuff, but lesson anything
he's broken in the last four days.

Speaker 1 (23:48):
You know, you can enlighten me.

Speaker 3 (23:50):
I mean, the current position of the United States government
is that you will be charged a massive surcharge if
you do if you import anything of broad even if
you build it here in the United States, and thus
it is incumbent upon you to eat into your margin
to invest here in America. Okay, I mean, look, we

(24:12):
could talk numbers. Let's say ten for ten, as in
I would take ten percent of my margin, and you
give me a ten percent break on taxes. Everybody wins, right,
you know, I invest a little bit here. Kapax is
super expensive. Ask anybody who's ever built anything in the
physical world. And so I don't see I don't see

(24:33):
one single proposal. In fact, the only civil war that
I can see happening right now in Congress for Republicans
is whether or not to cut Medicare or Medicaid.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
That's that's a whole other discussion.

Speaker 3 (24:45):
But we're not even talking about tax breaks for people
who are small businesses, or write offs or anything if anything. Actually,
as I understand it, they want to take a lot
of that away. It's called for it's like forty five acts.
I think it is a manufacturing task credit, which was
built into the Inflation Reduction Act. They want to get

(25:05):
rid of that, okay, and that was one of the
only things that got you know, some of these companies
to actually build a fact Now listen, it's fine.

Speaker 5 (25:12):
You know.

Speaker 3 (25:12):
The objection from the Republicans is like, oh, that's all
this green energy bs fine, Expand it for everything, make
it for oil.

Speaker 1 (25:18):
I don't care, you don't do whatever.

Speaker 3 (25:20):
Just just make sure that it builds something here in America,
if anything you'd like, Yeah, you're right, it shouldn't be
totally restricted to renewables or whatever. Build it for everything,
you know, for the entire you know, made in America.
And then the green the green energy can get it.
Everybody can get it. Fine, if that's what we want
to do. But you don't even hear that, right because
it's this is why it's just all it's it's just
there's nothing to it beyond the service level.

Speaker 7 (25:43):
And on your Medicaid point, oh no, on your Medicaid
point real quickly, Bernie Moreno Ohio Republican new you know,
Freshman Center just came out and told the House forget
it with your Medicaid cuts, Like those are cuts you're.

Speaker 4 (25:53):
Calling them, not cuts.

Speaker 7 (25:54):
We see them as cuts, and we're not doing it.
So you know, the nose always win Congress, So even
that is struggling. I wanted to finish though with speaking
of reality.

Speaker 4 (26:05):
Usually we go.

Speaker 6 (26:06):
To which have you put Chinese propaganda in the road?

Speaker 12 (26:09):
Down?

Speaker 17 (26:09):
Usually we go down honestly this time right, so, but
usually when it comes when it comes to the US side,
you're you can disagree or agree with him, but it's
more likely to be based in reality.

Speaker 5 (26:21):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (26:21):
And the Chinese are the ones that are going to
give you just flagrant nonsense propaganda.

Speaker 13 (26:25):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (26:26):
In this case, this is what the Chinese are putting
out in English through their Ministry of Foreign Affairs website,
basically in response so trying to buck up the entire
world against us, but also in response to the claims
from the United States government that there are some deals,
you know, they're conversations happening there, getting down to the
nitty gritty. So this is a much longer video, but

(26:46):
just a little slice of it. Watch this and then
ask yourself, is this a video made by a country
that is engaged earnestly in negotiations with in a good
faith way with a partner at the moment.

Speaker 4 (26:59):
So let's let's roll this.

Speaker 7 (27:00):
From the Chinese Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Speaker 5 (27:03):
The US has.

Speaker 15 (27:04):
Stirred up a global tariff storm and deliberately targeted China,
playing a ninety day pause game with other nations, forcing
them to limitrade with China. This is just like the
deadly trap of the eye of the storm. Bowing to
a bully is like drinking poison to quench thirst. It
only deepens the crisis. The US once accused Japan of

(27:25):
dumping semiconductors and crushed companies like Toshiba. Later, it forced
Japan to sign the Plaza Accord, pushing the economy into
decades of anemic growth.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
The US also used long arm.

Speaker 15 (27:37):
Jurisdiction as a weapon, breaking up France's industrial giant Allstons,
robbing the country of a national champion. History has proven
compromise won't earn you mercy. Kneeling only invites more bullying.

Speaker 4 (27:53):
China won't kneel downright, Sager.

Speaker 7 (27:55):
So does that sound like a country that's taking Trump's
calls right now?

Speaker 3 (28:00):
Yeah, it's just not. I mean, and you're right, you know.
The other final irony here is about TikTok. Like I
didn't want to highlight that Donald Trump is trying to
save TikTok, and the Chinese are like great, and so
they are flooding TikTok with stuff like that and targeting
America's I mean, I warned this, what happened.

Speaker 1 (28:18):
We tried to ban it.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
You were the one who decided you were a king
and that you were just going to subvert you know,
US law and say that I'm not going to ban it.
It's like, you know what, I just feel like that
scene in The Joker, I'm like, you get what you deserve. Man.
You know, you have the entire population. You have the
entire population, which is getting China pilled. I personally really
like this guy, but we played him here on the

(28:41):
show and he was like, hey, America, here's how many
things made in my house from America? He goes, do
you have anything made in your house from China? I
love this dude. I watched all his videos because so.

Speaker 6 (28:54):
You only have a house because of America though.

Speaker 3 (28:57):
Yeah yeah, but you know he's he actually used to
live here, and so he understands us. And he'll just
constantly be hitting back and someone will be like, hey,
what about nineteen eighty nine, and he's like, this is
so he goes, you are so imbued with propaganda, and
then he'll list off like Kent State and all these
other and I was like, hey.

Speaker 1 (29:15):
Listen, I mean, the guy has a point, you know
what kind of saying.

Speaker 4 (29:20):
Well as Trump says, now you think we're not killers?

Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah, you think we're no what do you say? We
think you're so innocent? You think we're so innocent? And
there's something just refreshing. I think about watching that now Pervade,
because look, I mean I don't even think it should
be here, but Trump is actively as the person who
wants to save it and is now you know, paying
the price for the very thing that he that he

(29:45):
that he's now.

Speaker 1 (29:46):
Trying to do with respect to tariffs. It's just amazing.
You know.

Speaker 3 (29:49):
I wasn't able to join you guys for the one
hundred Day episode, and it's like it's crazy, you know,
to watch them in the same breath.

Speaker 1 (29:56):
This is the most successful one hundred days ever.

Speaker 3 (29:59):
You know, I have a great FDR one hundred day
book behind me, and I'm like, this is a joke compared.

Speaker 1 (30:04):
To I mean, what a joke.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
All we have seen is just I mean, Doge is
a massive listen We'll take their claim I like to
take people's claims and take the take the subjectivity out
of it, and just be like, Okay, you said you're
gonna cut two trillion, Now it's gonna be like fifteen
billion at best, right at best in terms of because
they said one fifty and of that actually one hundred
and thirty five is fake.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
So fifteen billion.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
Wow, congratulations, that's like maybe what less than a day
of the overall.

Speaker 6 (30:32):
I feel like I do that the budget?

Speaker 3 (30:34):
Yeah, okay, so thanks, Then what mass deportation? Nope, numbers
are exactly the same as Obama and okay, and does
Bush instead, you know, even ignited all of this. Basically,
you've had opened a massive credibility gap with the whole
enemy's aliens Act. Trump is out there actually claiming that
the MS thirteen things is real on a break a

(30:57):
guard see his knuckles like that. That's the level of
discourse which we've been subjected to. Signal Gate, the ceasefire
and Gaza you know, fell apart the ceasefire in Ukraine.

Speaker 1 (31:09):
Nothing there is currently happening.

Speaker 3 (31:11):
I mean, honestly, the only I would say there are
only two like a grades from my perspective, again in
terms of what they said they were going to do.
One is the Iran negotiations, which as you and I know,
very tenuous and that could blow up at any time.
And the border crossings they actually did accomplish that. Beyond that,
I mean, I don't know. I would probably give him
an f on every single one of the ways that

(31:32):
this has been implemented, again both by its success, it's implementation,
and then sinking your goodwill with the overall American public.

Speaker 1 (31:40):
Now it's Trump. Can he come back?

Speaker 14 (31:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (31:43):
You know, listen, you know you beat an idiot at
this point to count him out entirely.

Speaker 1 (31:47):
But I don't know. I don't really know where things go.

Speaker 7 (31:50):
From here, and Trump seems to not be Usually Trump's
genius is a tactile feel for where the American public is.
He seems to have completely lost it and he seems
to be in a bubble. And we'll talk about that
more in this next segment. We'll have ADP jobs where
we'll have GDP numbers, and we've got Trump's interview with
Terry Murran.

Speaker 4 (32:10):
Stick around for that.

Speaker 7 (32:14):
GDP and job numbers are out and neither are looking
very good. Let's put his first element up on the
screen economists that expected something around one point four percent
a year over year increase. Instead we got a zero
point three percent dropped, the first contraction of the economy
since the pandemic since the pandemic. ADP private payroll numbers

(32:36):
also came out. They rose at only sixty two thousand jobs.
Dow Jones and others had been expecting more like one
hundred and fifty thousand.

Speaker 4 (32:44):
Jobs added to the payrolls, So.

Speaker 7 (32:48):
Only sixty two is being received by the markets as
a huge problem now, Saga. The GDP is interesting in
the way that it factors in imports. Obviously, the D
stands for domestic, and so imports are kind of subtracted out.
What you saw in March was this massive surge in

(33:11):
purchasing of imports to get ready for Liberation Day because
Trump said Liberation Day is coming, so everybody batten down
the hatches. And so it's not supposed to count around
GDP because you know it counts and then it gets
subtracted back out. But money that you would spend on
imports is money that you just buy definition don't have

(33:31):
to spend on something else. You know, think about it
in terms of a household. If you if you need,
you know, to do some landscaping and you need to
buy a new refrigerator, and all of a sudden, you
got to buy the fridge, You're not going to do
the landscaping or whatever like So, so some domestic things
didn't get done because of the imports. So that did
play a role. But what do you make of the
first contraction? And this is March, so we're we're talking

(33:54):
about ending March thirty first, so these numbers do not count.

Speaker 6 (33:58):
April Liberation Day was actually April.

Speaker 7 (34:00):
April second, per second souse. They didn't want it to
be the April Fool's Day.

Speaker 6 (34:03):
That's right.

Speaker 3 (34:04):
I want people to not pay attention to the top
number and instead look at the trend. So the overall
trend is that yes, it was because of good imports,
but it was consumption slowed to just one point eight percent,
down from four percent at the end of twenty twenty four.
So that shows almost what is one hundred percent reduction
in consumption that happened in just a three month period.

(34:26):
That's devastating, you know, to a lot of businesses. And quote,
final sales to domestic purchasers came in at just two
point three percent, down from about three percent at the
age of twenty twenty four. Those two things are what matter,
I think, even more than the import craziness, because this
is from Heather Long. If you set aside the import craziness,
the economy slowed in the Trump early days, but it

(34:46):
didn't collapse. That said, the risk of recession is now
real with the hefty tariff. So for me, the decline
in consumption is the number one story. It fits with
the consumer Confidence index falling to twenty twenty two, and
it also just shows us you know, what a contraction
can look like, because if you have high impoort duties,
low consumption, mass layoffs or at least some sort of layoffs,

(35:09):
you have high uh you know, unemployed, higher unemployment, and
interest rates have to remain high because technically inflation will
still remain at least you know, baseline of kind of
where it is right now, You're gonna have the stagflation
type scenario, which is externally affected and I actually don't
even think it fits that neatly into a box. The

(35:29):
consumption figure screams volumes, because that is uncertainty. That's you,
that's me, that's Ryan Emily and all of us where
even subconsciously, right before we're about to make a purchase,
Do I really need this right now? Should I just
be putting this in the bank? Should I keep keep
doing this?

Speaker 6 (35:48):
Women?

Speaker 4 (35:49):
Oh? Oh really, you're just buying it?

Speaker 3 (35:51):
Yeah, I mean honestly, I noticed I didn't include my wife.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
Yeah, women be shopping women, all right?

Speaker 5 (35:57):
Yeah? Is uh?

Speaker 3 (35:59):
The point is that as that manifests across the economy,
you see the ups you know style stuff, you see
a few of the plants and these other things, layoffs
began to happen. Consumer retail is going to start to
get slowly dragged down. And that is when you see,
you know things I always think about gift shops, candle

(36:20):
shops in a nice tourist area.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
You're dead.

Speaker 3 (36:22):
If you see twenty percent, you know, reduction in overall
visitors and the people who are visiting have like have
you know, on a tighter budget, you're.

Speaker 4 (36:31):
Done in your inventory?

Speaker 3 (36:33):
Upstate New York, Yeah, You're inventory costs twice as much.
If you're in upstate New York or in Washington and
you're heavily reliant on Canadians, you're dead.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
Are you guys seeing this stuff?

Speaker 3 (36:43):
Out of Vegas about how Vegas is devastating right now,
absolutely devastated. They're like, their occupancy rate is apparently low.
I just thought Nate Silver, he was like, Oh, I'm
booking my rooms for the WSOP that's coming up, and
it's some of the lowest rates that I'd ever seen.

(37:03):
A lot of it is from international travel and also
just broad consumption.

Speaker 7 (37:07):
And the tourism point is a key one because the
biggest bright spot in the jobs report was in leisure
and hospitality.

Speaker 4 (37:16):
So that's March.

Speaker 7 (37:17):
We know for a fact that in April the biggest
bright spot turned very dark.

Speaker 4 (37:22):
It is getting quite ugly.

Speaker 7 (37:24):
And we can put up this chart, which I believe
is B two, which goes exactly to Sager's point. This
is a consumer confidence index. Obviously, sometimes there are material
reasons for the number going from straight downward towards the floor.
If you look at two thousand and seven, eight nine,
we know why it crashed back. Then we look at

(37:45):
twenty twenty, we know why it crashed. Then that's the pandemic.
This one is completely driven by decisions just made for
effectively very little reason by Donald Trumps decided to do
this thing, and as a result, you see this number
just spiking down to the floor. And when the consumer

(38:09):
economy makes up so much of our economic capacity and
you have people pulling back, that has a that has
a ripple effect that's going to be felt throughout the economy.

Speaker 6 (38:22):
Futures are sliding.

Speaker 8 (38:23):
Dow is down about three hundred and fifty points since
the news came out, and.

Speaker 7 (38:28):
I would think that who knows how the market's going
to handle it, But you would think that Trump's interview
last night as well would not inspire much confidence in
the markets.

Speaker 4 (38:36):
Let's let's play just this this one.

Speaker 7 (38:39):
Thought uh B three from Terry Moran and Donald Trump
last night.

Speaker 18 (38:43):
We basically have an embargo on China. Look to say,
something's gonna happen. No, okay, well, thing's going to happen.

Speaker 13 (38:49):
You know business. Now I want to ask you, I
do no business.

Speaker 18 (38:52):
And so one hundred and forty tariffs on China, and
that is that basically an embargo. They it'll raise prices
on everything from electronics to clothing to building houses.

Speaker 13 (39:03):
You don't know that.

Speaker 11 (39:04):
You don't know whether or not China's mathematics. China probably
will eat those tariffs. But at one hundred and forty five.
They basically can't do much business with the United States,
and they were making from US a trillion dollars a year.
They were ripping us off like nobody's ever ripped us off.
And by the way, we have other countries that were
just as bad. If you look at the European Union,
who is terrible what they've done to us. Every country,

(39:27):
almost every country in the world was ripping us off.

Speaker 13 (39:29):
But they're not doing that anymore.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
I want you to think that inspire any confidence.

Speaker 3 (39:34):
Well, yeah, you're right, Ryan, I mean it's one of
those where really what you're watching.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
I mean what Trump.

Speaker 3 (39:38):
Also says is he'll be like, oh, we're having all
these jobs come back, and they're telling me it's amazing.
It's like, there's not what that's not true. You literally
listen to the CEO Walmart Target. They're like, we told
them it would be devastating. That's what they said. It's
smpirical about I mean, you know, the other really gross
part about all this is how the auto manufacturers are
basically just shaking Trump down for exemptions when she announced

(40:01):
in Michigan, and it's like, okay, so what are we
doing here?

Speaker 4 (40:04):
Exactly?

Speaker 3 (40:04):
So we don't have exemptions, or actually we do. And
by the way, the tariffs are also going to apply
to Toyota if they build in America. So why would
Toyota continue to build in America? Can anyone riddle me
that one? If your toy if your Toyota, I just
like screw it. You know, I'm done. Why would I
even want to keep doing business here? It just it

(40:25):
does it's preposterous and it doesn't really make a whole
bunch of sense. And broadly that continues to shine through
in Trump's interview. I mean, look in a certain way,
like you get, you really get exactly what he should like.
What he is on the screen is exactly how he is.
I can testify to that, you know, on a personal level,
having met him a couple or interviewed him a couple

(40:46):
of times. And so anybody who's thinking like it's a
performance or whatever, it's like his life is a performance.
That's how he actually is in all of these meetings.
So we'll see the one.

Speaker 4 (40:55):
The one that scared me was when he said that
tourism is way up.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Yeah right, it's just us.

Speaker 7 (41:00):
Terry moransay, Yeah, I'm sorry, what No, it's not it's
way down. Like these are not differences of opinion here,
like either Las Vegas is a ghost town or it's not.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
Yeah, well in payroll, yeah, Brian, he should ask Steve
wick Coough, the.

Speaker 6 (41:17):
Developer, Well, tasty property in Vegas.

Speaker 3 (41:20):
That's true. Yeah, check the Trump numbers in Vegas. Actually, honestly,
someone should go and track where the room rates at
the Trump International in Vegas and see how they have
trended from November all the way until today. That'd be
a good like chatchypt task or something. I mean, look,
I could be wrong only because it is Trump and

(41:41):
there's a lot of maga boomers out there that will
pay a premium just to stay at a Trump property.
But you know, I wouldn't be surprised if they're not
completely insulated from any sort of economic downturn.

Speaker 6 (41:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (41:53):
So ADP their report showed private payroll growth slowed in
April to sixty two thousand. The Dow estimate for that
was one hundred twenty thousand, So another negative indicator. But
if you're worried about all of us, I have good news.
We can roll the final stot Chuck Schumer is on
the case.

Speaker 6 (42:09):
Let's play before of.

Speaker 13 (42:10):
All the crazy things the Republicans want to do. Now
they want a car tax.

Speaker 6 (42:14):
Hell no, hell no, to the contacts.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
I'm inspired. I'm personally inspired.

Speaker 6 (42:20):
I feel good.

Speaker 4 (42:22):
John, there is done. Let's move on to the influence influencers.

Speaker 8 (42:27):
Well, the White House started its influencer briefings this week.
I think we're two influencer briefings in there.

Speaker 6 (42:34):
There have been.

Speaker 8 (42:35):
There was one on Monday, one on Tuesday. We'll see
where they go going forward. Now, there are some moments
from these briefings that are going massively viral because they
are cringe inducing, painful, and nobody is wrong to cringe
at them.

Speaker 6 (42:52):
My very unpopular take is.

Speaker 8 (42:55):
That the moments that aren't going viral have actually not
been bad. So before I make my very unpopular argument
and do battle with Ryan and Sager, let's roll I don't.

Speaker 6 (43:08):
Even want to do it. Let's roll this cop see
one of the influence in briefing at the White House
with Caroline love It.

Speaker 19 (43:16):
Over the first one hundred days, the majority of policies
that we've seen from the Trump administration have been either
targeted at foreign affairs, such as bringing the American hostages
home or attempting to end the war between Ukraine and Russia,
or long term goals such as cover cutting government spending
with DOJE. What policies can we expect to see rolled
out over the next few months that Americans will directly
feel the effects of in order to secure the twenty

(43:37):
twenty six midterms for the Republican Party and keep his
approval rating historically high.

Speaker 20 (43:41):
This in the first hundred days is that the White
House is crawling with kids. You have a young, beautiful
baby boy. There are babies everywhere. There's so many young
folks on staff who have kids. But the last four
years under Joe Biden, parents are really stressed and ravage.
They had to take on two or three extra jobs.
Depression rates were up, suicide rates were up. Very high
profile young mother who seems to juggle and balance it

(44:03):
all beautifully. What advice do you have young parents out
there who are starting their careers, having kids, building families
and trying to find that balance so desperately.

Speaker 10 (44:10):
Yeah, well, it's a great question, and first to the
heart of your premise, It's true the president has empowered
not just me as a young mother in this role,
but there are so many new moms and dads on
our senior staff in the West Wing, but also across
the entire administration.

Speaker 8 (44:27):
Can't forget that there's one from the first briefing on
Monday that we're going to roll. We've got some more
information on this influencer. Let's go ahead and play see
two here.

Speaker 21 (44:39):
Thank you for having us here. I've noticed this is
kind of like a repeat of twenty sixteen. The Legacy
medy has gone back to not reporting anything on President Trump.
At the beginning, we had them reporting everything that he
was doing. Now they're kind of going back again to
not reporting everything that he is actually doing. I'm kind
of the nerd when it comes to reporting. I'm off

(45:00):
the headline newsgirl. I'm the nuts and bolts. I'm the
policy type nerd. So what direction do you advise kind
of me to go into like the White House files
that y'all send out every single day, because that's what
people are used to when they want to ask me
questions they want to know, kind of like the nuts
and bolts of earthing.

Speaker 6 (45:18):
Okay, guys, go ahead and react where.

Speaker 4 (45:20):
We want to start.

Speaker 3 (45:21):
That reminds me of Brian Stelter asking Jensaki, what can
we as the media do better? And that was ridiculed
then and it should be ridiculed now. And look, I
think brought Emily.

Speaker 1 (45:34):
This is the thing.

Speaker 3 (45:35):
I'm not objecting to everybody in the briefing room. I
am friends with a lot a lot of those people.
I mean, my man pomp was there sitting in the background.
But my point is not about that. It's actually a
philosophical thing where the White House is just here's my
main message to a lot of these influencers.

Speaker 1 (45:54):
You are being used. They think you're a fucking joke.

Speaker 3 (45:57):
I just wanted to be honest with you, because let's
let's talk about this. Who did Donald Trump choose to
give his one hundred day interviews to The Atlantic Time
magazine and Terry Moran at ABC News for an oval
office sit down. Yeah, they'll invite you to your city
little briefing so you can glaze them about babies or

(46:19):
whatever is going on. They don't respect you at all.
So even though Trump will sit there and be like, wow,
what a great question, Trump understands the optics are humiliating
to actually sit down with somebody like you, and the
White House does too. You're a pond, You're a joke,
You're somebody there just to take up space and to
piss off the media. Now, if you want to actually

(46:41):
do your job, you should ask them questions which are
critical and Ryan, I mean, I really think it's important
for you to be able to talk about this because
you were once in a similar position in the Huffingon Post.

Speaker 5 (46:53):
And what the.

Speaker 3 (46:53):
Huffington Post expertly did under Barack Obama is they challenged
Barack Obama from the left. And so the mission of
conservative media should not be to glaze the Trump administration.
It should be to challenge the Trump administration to say,
why haven't you done these things that you promised on
campaign traill? Why are you allowing this? Why are you

(47:13):
not doing You should find internal contradictions. And I'm telling
you this is the way that I operated in the
White House, and hey, what do I know. I only
got to interview the president four times in the Oval Office.
The reason why I did it is not because I
glazed them. In fact, I'll just reveal it public privately.
They would all say, yeah, we can't give this to you. Know,

(47:34):
whoever is a is a like is glazing us because
we would look stupid. They're like, when we bring you in,
you're actually going to ask them critical questions. They they
don't want the critical question, but they understand that that's.

Speaker 1 (47:46):
Part of the back and forth.

Speaker 3 (47:47):
So Ryan, I think you should really go off on
this a little bit because you had the experience.

Speaker 1 (47:51):
Oh sorry, Emily too.

Speaker 8 (47:53):
No, I just want to interject to say my entire
argument is what the point that you are making here
is that there actually were questions that didn't go viral
from some of these influencers people I don't even know
who were coming at it from the right, and actually
Sean Spicer, of all people, ask Caroline Levitt why Donald

(48:13):
Trump is sitting down with Jeffrey Goldberg and other people
in the corporate press, which I meant to post this,
but like I do a lot of like helping.

Speaker 7 (48:24):
I was watching that, I was like, is that Sean Spicer? Yes,
hell is he doing in there?

Speaker 8 (48:27):
But this is the thing, like I have I don't
know how many like young conservive journalists. I've said exactly
what you just said, Sager too.

Speaker 6 (48:34):
And I was meant to.

Speaker 8 (48:36):
Send that from Sean Spicer and be like, he under
he actually understands this. This is the only way that
you get respect is asking serious questions. So there were
questions about Trump's promise for national reciprocity for gun owners,
a great example of something that nobody in the mainstream
media would ask about, holding him to account for a
promise from the right that nobody in the corporate press
would ask about. Very legitimate question, newsy question, when would

(48:59):
the when will the wall be built? Another great question
that one didn't go viral. There was a question this
was from DC Dreno about the timeline on the Epstein files.
There was a question about reorganizations of the irs. There
were some genuinely decent questions that didn't go viral. Now
to everyone's point, I just want to say, I agree

(49:20):
that those viral moments speak to something really like rotten
in conservative media mega media. And I'm also very curious
to hear Ryan's thoughts on this, because he actually did
exactly what you said, Sager, which is the right way
to approach this job, not just for being more successful,
but also just doing your damn job and respecting your
viewers and your audience.

Speaker 7 (49:40):
So Ryan tell us, oh, yes, Sager has this exactly right.
That if you are a journalist with a perspective, whether
you know you guys on on the right me on
the left, it's actually easier to do your job when uh,
there's a center left. If you're a left wing journalist
and there's a center left president in power, attacking them

(50:01):
from the left is kind of a lot easier to
do real interesting work than it is when there's a
right wing president, because it's not interesting that like the
Huffet and Post thinks that Donald Trump is wrong about X, Y,
and Z, because they also think he's wrong about A, B, C, D, E,
f G.

Speaker 4 (50:20):
Everything. But when it comes to somebody that.

Speaker 7 (50:23):
You're a little bit closer with, you're able to earnestly say, hey,
you ran on breaking up the big banks, and now
we're hearing that Larry Summers is saying you can't break up.

Speaker 4 (50:36):
The big banks.

Speaker 7 (50:37):
You know, you ran on making sure that there is
a public option for people who can't afford insurance.

Speaker 4 (50:45):
We hear that you're.

Speaker 7 (50:47):
Talking a big farm about getting you know, making sure
that that's not even in the bill. And finding the
gap between what they ran on and what they're actually
doing is where is where the good good journalism is.
You drive that wedge in there, and you can do
it more effectively if you actually care.

Speaker 8 (51:03):
And it's your value, right, because you're filling blind spots.
The entire point of this, that's why I actually like
the National Reciprocity for gun owners question. Was I thought
such a good illustration, like this is your value in
the briefing room is that you are bringing a perspective
that is underrepresented in the media despite being represented more
evenly throughout the rest of the population. Trump voters care

(51:25):
about the promise he made on gun reciprocity, they care
about the border wall, but their questions aren't represented in
the briefing room. So it's not only a value add
for you to be tough on some of these questions
from the right, it also will be more successful. So like,
if you want to be successful, you're being stupid by
being a lapdog.

Speaker 3 (51:43):
Yes, yeah, And that's the thing they just don't understand.
And again Trump understands this. That's why he at the
end of the day, is not choosing any of these
people to sit down with. And you know, I just
don't know because I wonder also if it's an audience thing,
because there has been so much of a magapill taken

(52:04):
by a lot of people who are influencers online where
you know, because they've created a feedback loop through which
everything all they do is glaze Donald Trump all the time,
that they don't even have the space or the trust
with their audience to be able to challenge Trump and
so that they find it existentially dangerous. I mean, I
think it would be fascinating to watch any of these,

(52:26):
like former free speech warriors, go in there and ask
about the Palestine thing, right, because that would throw them
off their game too. They Here's the other thing too
that people need to understand. It's also about mindset. So
the mindset of White House pres sectery. When they walk
into a normal briefing room, it's war. It's literal warfare.
They're prepared, they're ready to do battle. But when she's
walking in there, let me guarantee you, she's not doing

(52:48):
the level of preparation that they are. Whenever they go
into the briefing room, that's when things get interesting. That's
when things are very interesting, when you can hear what
they actually think. I remember once in the first Trump administration,
there was this great reporter I think his name was
Olivier Knox, I forget who we worked for at the time,
and he was in a back and forth with Spicer
and he was just like, Hey, what does victory look

(53:11):
like in Afghanistan? Spicer was like stable and I was like, oh, interesting,
he don't even know. I was like, what a great question, right,
you know, because it was it was so fascinating because
he hadn't prepared for it at all and hit him
with something and he actually had to think on the spot.
It might be one of the few honest moments of
his entire career. That's actually one of the best things
that you could get. I mean, Ryan, you can talk

(53:32):
about this too. Didn't Obama call you guys out specifically
on like his first press conference in nine and He's like,
I could hear a cancer and the Huffingon post would say,
you know, I didn't do enough.

Speaker 7 (53:44):
It was even better, he said, He said, if I
were if the huffingon posts were covering Abraham Lincoln when
he did there and when he did the Emancipation Proclamation,
they would have highlighted the fact that it didn't apply
to a few counties and US Virginia and to other
counties under Confederate.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
By the way, that's actually fair. That is the Oberator
and those people said, just so we're aware.

Speaker 7 (54:08):
Mister yes, and we actually then wrote that article just
for him, uh, because all of the radical Republican papers
at the time said the same thing, why are you
so late on this? And why doesn't this cover everybody?
And that's the role of that press. So it's like,
yes and yeah. He would call us out. He would
call us out pretty regularly, and we ate it up.
And what my favorite part time was when the New

(54:29):
York Times editorialized against Larry Summers for FED chair. But
we had been just absolutely hammering him at the Huffington Post.

Speaker 6 (54:38):
You were very pro Larry Summers for FRED chair and uh, he.

Speaker 4 (54:41):
Did not get He did not get it.

Speaker 7 (54:42):
And in a private meeting with Democrats, Obama complained about us,
uh and Larry Summers and not the New York Times
because the New York Times at a total page wasn't
moving the needle.

Speaker 4 (54:51):
See.

Speaker 6 (54:52):
That's very interesting, right.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
That was what was crawl see and that's power and
then that look, I mean, that's to your point.

Speaker 7 (55:01):
These influencers think that they're going to get access by
asking these glazing questions when in fact, as you found
with Trump, it's being adversarial and building your own authority
that then forces them to answer your questions and otherwise
they're totally embarrassed. So it was the power that we
built that forced them. They didn't love us, hated us,

(55:23):
hated us more than they hated the Daily Caller, probably
because they're like, oh, yeah they call.

Speaker 4 (55:26):
Of course they're going to beat us up.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
But god post they don't listen. And you know, Emily,
like you said, I have been on the phone with
half of these people. They don't listen. They're taking their
advice from social media, and I just I think, not
only is it going to age poorly, Like remember all
of the stars of twenty seventeen in the briefing room
April Ryan, Jim Acosta. How did it work out? You know,

(55:50):
I mean these people are jokes. We remember it as
a joke. So yeah, they got rich, you know for
a year or for two Jim A. Costallary got fired
from CNN, humiliating, you know, as part of his brand.
Nobody looks back on his whole like fight resist, what
was the whole like grabbing the microphone away from the intern.
It's just like it literally is like mass psychosis, right

(56:14):
that that was even considered acceptable.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
I think that's how most of these mega media.

Speaker 3 (56:18):
People are going to look, they won't age and you know, look,
I mean, will they get away with it? Yeah, they
definitely will. I mean I've been watching to see the
reception they get on social media. I think it's insane.
I honestly, I don't really understand it.

Speaker 8 (56:33):
Well, that's the point that I wanted to make because
I think the distinction between influencers and journalism is quite
interesting as well, because to the point you were making
about whether this is audience capture, that's really interesting because
I think with some of these influencers, it's not even
audience capture.

Speaker 6 (56:49):
It's that they want this access.

Speaker 8 (56:51):
That's not about getting journalism right because they're not journalists,
so they're not trying to like break stories and move
the ball forward. What they want is more access for
social and that's a very different set of incentives. You know,
they want to be able to go with like Kai
Trump and Don Junior and like be behind the scenes
at all of these events.

Speaker 6 (57:09):
Because that's just sort of where their bread is buttered.
Right now.

Speaker 8 (57:13):
They can get maybe sponsorships with it, and it's a
it's a different I agree that it's a different set
of incentives than breaking news. And obviously those incentives have
crept into journalism itself too. But if you don't even
think of yourself as a journalist, it's true that you
have important, big audiences. So there's a there's theoretically a
case for these influencer briefings, but they're not going to

(57:34):
be the same as the White House press briefing. Nevertheless,
if you have serious questions, then you should ask the
serious questions because it will be better off. You will
actually be respected, Your audience will be interested in it
because they are following you in that they think you
are one of their like they're a fellow conservatives, so
they're probably have the same questions that you do about

(57:54):
when the border wall is supposed to be done despite
all of the promises. So, I mean, it's it's obviously, yes,
it's silly. I hope some of these good questions keep
getting asked even if they're not going viral, because this
really ties a bow on everything.

Speaker 6 (58:06):
We've just talked about. You don't go viral for asking
a good question about sometimes.

Speaker 3 (58:11):
You do, though you can actually sometimes you do. Yeah, right, right,
what the That's what these other people don't get. It's like,
if you want real fame or like success or any
of the stuff. You can get it by doing kind
of what you're trying to do. But it's just it's
harder whatever, it's much harder. It takes a level of
intellectualism and history and of knowledge, you know, to get there.

(58:31):
But you know, they've chosen their path, and I mean,
I think they just look like a joke and that
you know, four years from now, they're not going to
be able to even have a career.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
And from that point forward, like you got to.

Speaker 3 (58:43):
Ask existential questions because look, all the warning signs were there,
and they're just feeding into this mass hysteria at the moment.

Speaker 1 (58:50):
So we'll see, we'll see how it goes.

Speaker 7 (58:52):
Yeah, guys, so stop embarrassing yourself. So let's move on
now to Donald Trump's rally last night.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
By the way, guys, thank you, thank you very much
for you know, dealing with my absences. There's a couple
of just personal medical things going on. But everything is
fine for right now, and we are anxiously awaiting our baby.
The kid is already a pain in the ass and
he's not even or he or she has not even
been born yet, and so I'm sure that will manifest
in their personality going forward. But just in case, this

(59:18):
might be the very last time that you guys see
me before labor and you know, I'll take a few
weeks off and all of that.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
So just thank you very much for bearing with me.
I really appreciate you all, And back to Ryan and Emily.

Speaker 8 (59:33):
President Trump went to Michigan yesterday, had a little encounter
with Gretchen Whitmer. But he was doing a rally on
the occasion of his one hundredth day in office, and
the crowd was sort of a.

Speaker 6 (59:46):
Typical Trump rally crowd.

Speaker 8 (59:48):
But given what's happened over the course of the first
one hundred days, there was one particularly interesting moment.

Speaker 6 (59:53):
We have a couple that we're going to run. But
let's play this first clip.

Speaker 8 (59:57):
After Donald Trump showed video of the allegendbus thirteen members
heading to Al Salvador ending up at Seacott.

Speaker 6 (01:00:04):
This is what happened, and the worst.

Speaker 11 (01:00:07):
Of the worst are being sent to a no nonsense
prison in El Salvador.

Speaker 13 (01:00:12):
Why don't you watch watch this, watch this, take a look.

Speaker 6 (01:00:32):
So there were USA USA chants.

Speaker 8 (01:00:34):
Now Donald Trump also floated well, he first said that
he was going to serve two terms. Here's what's happened,
Here's what happened after that. Let's roll this club.

Speaker 11 (01:00:44):
It was so important to win because they used to
say the fake is to be a great president, you
have to serve two terms.

Speaker 13 (01:00:51):
So now we're going to serve two terms.

Speaker 11 (01:00:54):
Now they've taken that work of crush, right, right Oz?

Speaker 13 (01:01:01):
Trust that one off?

Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
Trust that one off.

Speaker 5 (01:01:04):
No, they say it all the time.

Speaker 11 (01:01:05):
When I was out, they say, well, then they.

Speaker 6 (01:01:09):
Go, is it a fever dream?

Speaker 8 (01:01:11):
When he says, right, doctor Oz, right, doctor Oz, what's happening?
But the crowd was chanting three if you couldn't hear that,
Then Trump said, thank you, we actually already served three.

Speaker 7 (01:01:22):
Then one more clip, This one is he was elected
in twenty twenty.

Speaker 4 (01:01:25):
Is that what he means?

Speaker 6 (01:01:25):
I think that's what he means. It's genuinely hard to say.

Speaker 5 (01:01:28):
This is.

Speaker 8 (01:01:30):
His part of his interview. So the rally is happening.
He's also sitting gun.

Speaker 6 (01:01:34):
For an interview with Terry Moran on ABC again to
mark the one hundredth day of the administration. Let's roll
this clip D three.

Speaker 13 (01:01:41):
But the court has warned you to facilitate that you're
not the one making this decision. We have lawyers.

Speaker 11 (01:01:47):
I don't want to do this, but the buck stops
eyes on now, No, no, no, I follow the law.

Speaker 13 (01:01:53):
You want me to follow the law.

Speaker 11 (01:01:54):
If I were the president that just wanted to do anything,
I'd probably keep them right where it says what the
law is.

Speaker 22 (01:02:00):
Listen.

Speaker 11 (01:02:01):
I was elected to take care of a problem that
was it was an unforced era that was made by
a very incompetent man, A man that turned out to
be incompetent that you always said was wonderful, great genius.

Speaker 13 (01:02:15):
Right, and now you find out all of.

Speaker 11 (01:02:17):
The media now they're saying, what a mistake they made.
A man who was grossly incompetent allowed us to have
open borders where millions of people float in. I campaigned
on that issue. I wouldn't say it was my number
one issue, but it was pretty clear I campaigned on
that issue. I've done an amazing job. I have closed borders.
He said you couldn't do it, and you wouldn't be
able to do it, it would never happen.

Speaker 13 (01:02:38):
Well, it happened, and it happened very quickly.

Speaker 11 (01:02:41):
Wait a minute, when we have criminals, murderers, criminals in
this country, we have to get him out, and we're
doing it, and you'll pick out one man. But even
the man that you picked out, he's got a key,
said he wasn't a member of a gang.

Speaker 13 (01:02:54):
And then they looked and on his knuckles.

Speaker 11 (01:02:57):
He had MS thres there it Wait a minute, he
had MS thirteen.

Speaker 13 (01:03:04):
We had some tattoos that are interpreted that way. But
let's move on. Wait a minute, I will tear it Terry, Terry,
he did not have the letter MS one. It says
MS one three. That was photoshop. So let me do
his photoshop. Terry, you can't have that.

Speaker 11 (01:03:17):
Hey, they're giving you the big break of a lifetime.
You know you're doing the interview. I picked you because frankly,
I never heard of you.

Speaker 13 (01:03:23):
But that's okay. I picked to you, Terry. But you're
not being very nice. He had MS thirteen texts will
agree to disagree. I want to rive on to something else, Terry.
Do you want me to show you the picture? I
saw the picture. Well the photoshop. Here we go. Here
we got photoshop, but go look at his hand he had.
He did have tattoos that can be interpreted that way.
I'm not an expert on them. I want to turn

(01:03:44):
to Ukraine, I.

Speaker 11 (01:03:45):
Want to get to No, he had MS as clear
as you can be, not interpreted. This is why people
no longer believe well the news because when photogl.

Speaker 13 (01:03:58):
In El Salvador, they aren't there. But let's just go
they aren't there when he's in there now right, No,
but they're in your picture.

Speaker 11 (01:04:06):
Terry Ukraine sir, he's got MS thirteen on his knuckles.

Speaker 13 (01:04:10):
All, okay, we'll take such a disservice. Will take a look.
What did you just say it? Yes, he does so.

Speaker 8 (01:04:18):
Donald Trump clearly believes that he deported someone with MS
thirteen tattooed on his knuckles, the letters MS and then
the numbers one three tattooed on his knuckles. That would
be Kilmore Abrego Garcia, who does have tattoos that experts,
some have said, resemble what gang members might have. But
to be very clear, Trump thinks it's said MS one

(01:04:41):
three on his knuckles. What actually happened is that the
White House put MS. They photoshop. They actually did, to
Terry Marrin's point, photoshop MS thirteen onto by picture of
kill More Abrego Garcia's knuckles to sort of demonstrate they
enhanced the picture of his knuckles so that the tattoos
were more clearly visible, and then MS thirteen on it.

(01:05:01):
And there was debate when the White House released that
photo as to whether they wanted people to believe it
was photoshopped or wanted people to believe.

Speaker 6 (01:05:11):
That MS thirteen actually had been tattooed on his knuckles.

Speaker 7 (01:05:15):
Donald Trump seems to have been maybe he was the
tartop of this hoax, seriously.

Speaker 8 (01:05:21):
Because there, I mean, there was this this actually somewhat
interesting debate when that happened last week about whether or
not people would actually believe the photoshop or that it
was very clearly indicating that they were just enhancing the picture.
I was actually in the camp that was like, oh,
this is so obviously photoshopped that what they're trying to
do is just make it a graphic that indicates the

(01:05:43):
tattoos or MS thirteen, not that this is like because
they were like extenciled letters, like you know, just it
didn't look real.

Speaker 6 (01:05:50):
But I guess if you're a sorry boomers, but I
guess if you're a social.

Speaker 4 (01:05:54):
Media boom without your focals.

Speaker 8 (01:05:56):
He was, he was duped by the photoshop and genuinely
believes that Kilmer abrego Garcia, all of this uproar. I mean,
that changes the story significantly that Donald Trump believes the
man has MS thirteen tattooed on him, because that's a
confirmation clear as day that he is MS thirteen. Meaning
the Democrats that are fighting to keep him, the media
that is fighting to keep him is coming from a very.

Speaker 7 (01:06:16):
Different place right from Trump's addult perspective. He literally thinks
that Abrego Garcia has has MS thirteen tattooed on his fingers.
And then he's like, god, what is wrong with these
democrats in the media right that are like fighting over
this guy.

Speaker 8 (01:06:33):
Publicans by the way, who were unhappy with the direction.

Speaker 4 (01:06:37):
Twenty fifth Amendment time, Like.

Speaker 7 (01:06:40):
Whoever is the marshal of the Supreme Court like from
this first term, who never showed up to arrest Trump?

Speaker 4 (01:06:47):
Like twenty fifth Amendment?

Speaker 8 (01:06:48):
Man?

Speaker 4 (01:06:49):
Like this is this man is utterly delusional?

Speaker 6 (01:06:52):
Am I wrong? That that picture was very obvious?

Speaker 7 (01:06:54):
It was obvious because I think if you can see it,
I think I think maybe his eyes aren't good enough.

Speaker 4 (01:06:59):
And Steven Miller just lied to him.

Speaker 7 (01:07:02):
I mean, and somebody's lying to him, like and we'll
talk about this that at the end of this clip
with his answer on tourism, he's he's watching television and
reading some things, so he has some like access to
outside information. But clearly his circle of advisors are either
afraid of him and or are just outright lying to

(01:07:25):
him to cynically manipulate him. Stephen Miller is the one
with the most access to him as deputy chief of staff,
who would have a vested interest in lying about whether
or not he has MS thirteen tattooed.

Speaker 4 (01:07:38):
On his hand. And also it doesn't. The whole thing
falls apart.

Speaker 7 (01:07:43):
He has a marijuana leaf and then a smile, and
then a smile like okay, well even in Spanish, you
know you can that's there's an MS there. Then there's
a cross, which is like okay, it's not a one,
that's a cross. And then and then there's a skull,
and that's where it's like, where do you have three
out of a skull? And people are like, well, you
can draw a three somewhere onto the skull.

Speaker 5 (01:08:03):
All right.

Speaker 7 (01:08:03):
Now you're just in fantasy land, like it's it's like,
you know, smok smoking weed makes me happy, love the
Lord till I die, Like that's a thing that's out
there like that actually makes a little bit of sense.

Speaker 6 (01:08:16):
Yeah, it makes a little bit of sense, but I'm
not MS thirteen. Also tattoos either.

Speaker 4 (01:08:20):
Also MS thirteen.

Speaker 7 (01:08:22):
If you've seen go google image MS thirteen tattoos, they
say MS thirteen on their face or on their back and.

Speaker 8 (01:08:29):
Like, yeah, they're usually in like old timy old script,
but it's clear.

Speaker 4 (01:08:33):
It's clear.

Speaker 7 (01:08:33):
But you'd be thrown out of the gang, Like, hey,
you're supposed to tattoo MS thirteen on yourself, Kilmart and
he's like, oh, yeah, I did this.

Speaker 4 (01:08:40):
It's really fancy. See how the M s And.

Speaker 7 (01:08:42):
Then this is sort of like a one and this
is a skully be like you're you're you're afraid to
announce your support, your your your membership in MS thirteen,
So you're out like like that, that's not how it
works anyway, that it matters, because none of this matters.

Speaker 4 (01:08:58):
This was photoshop. He's wrong.

Speaker 8 (01:09:00):
It was very obvious. It was like a USARAH font
with it didn't look like it was natural on the skin,
like a tattoo.

Speaker 4 (01:09:07):
It was he's wrong put.

Speaker 8 (01:09:08):
Onto the image in a way that is just mind
blowing that you would interpret that as someone's actual MS
thirteen tattoo. I'm not ready to rule out what's on
Timar Arbrego Garcia's knuckles as being potentially gang related, but
that's at this point, beside the point because Donald Trump
thinks that an obvious photoshop is really, he clearly thinks
that it's really.

Speaker 6 (01:09:28):
Did you get the sense that he was lying to
Terry Moran's face? I didn't. I think.

Speaker 7 (01:09:32):
He seemed to, and he seemed to be like really
frustrated at Terry Moran, for like, his ability to take
in information seems gone.

Speaker 4 (01:09:42):
And at the end he says, why won't you just
say to me?

Speaker 22 (01:09:46):
Yes?

Speaker 7 (01:09:47):
He has MS thirteen on his knuckles, which is clearly
that's what he wants his sick of fans around him
to say, just tell me yes.

Speaker 6 (01:09:55):
Let's skip ahead to D five.

Speaker 8 (01:09:58):
This is going to be the thought about tourism because
I think that is actually an interesting theme from some
of the clips that we played, so the MS thirteen
clip but also the two versus three terms clip.

Speaker 6 (01:10:07):
Let's roll. Tourism is way up D five.

Speaker 13 (01:10:10):
And Canadians, many of them, are really angry furious.

Speaker 18 (01:10:15):
About your talk about We're going to take over Canada
is going to become the fifty first state, and it
kind of is of a piece.

Speaker 13 (01:10:21):
A lot of travel is down into the United States
from around the world. We're doing it's like there's been
reputational team. He's doing great well.

Speaker 11 (01:10:30):
Prices it down, not the touristling's down. Energy's down. Tourism
is going to be way up. Wait do you see
the numbers. The tourism is way up now now, Canada
tourism is doing very well.

Speaker 13 (01:10:42):
We're doing very well. We're doing very well.

Speaker 11 (01:10:44):
Wait do you see the real numbers come out in
about in six months from now?

Speaker 13 (01:10:48):
Where do you see the numbers? But do you think
we're gonna ask you?

Speaker 8 (01:10:52):
So he's saying two things there, on the one hand
that numbers are fine now and the other that the
numbers will go up.

Speaker 4 (01:10:57):
Wait wait, wait you see the numbers.

Speaker 6 (01:10:59):
Well, this is.

Speaker 8 (01:11:00):
According to c NBC, foreign visitors to the US by
air fell nearly ten percent in March from the same
month a year earlier, and nearly thirteen percent from before
the pandemic to four point five four million people. That's
what the that's where this information that we have as
right now? Yeah, that's mark wait.

Speaker 4 (01:11:16):
To see April. Yeah, so well, according to Trump, wait
to see April like, who's lying to him? Like I don't.

Speaker 7 (01:11:24):
I don't like Trump's judgment in general, but I would
like his judgment to be acted upon reality, Like I
want him to have accurate information and then and then
I disagree with or agree with what he's doing. I'd
rather his advisors tell them, hey, man, tourism's way down.

(01:11:45):
Do we care or is this all part of the plan,
rather than this, Hey boss, everything's great.

Speaker 4 (01:11:51):
Tourism is up. Cheese on the phone.

Speaker 7 (01:11:57):
That MS thirteen is tattooed on his fingers, like you're
killing it, boss, So everybody loves you.

Speaker 6 (01:12:04):
CNBC also says, including land work crossings, okay.

Speaker 7 (01:12:06):
Yeah, and we're going to get the Fox News polster fired.
That's what Steve Miller said yesterday.

Speaker 6 (01:12:10):
Yeah, he said that.

Speaker 8 (01:12:11):
I actually think that there are probably some legitimate questions
about the accuracy of the.

Speaker 7 (01:12:15):
Fox News pul They're in line with everybody else's plot
right now.

Speaker 6 (01:12:18):
They are.

Speaker 8 (01:12:19):
Yeah, these if you look at all the polling aggregations, yes, so,
including land border crossing. CNBC says inbound visitors to the
US fell fourteen percent in March from last year. According
to the US Travel Association, So an industry that's down
trade group.

Speaker 6 (01:12:32):
Yeah, that's very obviously down.

Speaker 8 (01:12:33):
Now this clip, I want to say, Ryan, I think
that sounded to me possibly just like regular Trump talking
his way into success, like I hope, fluctuating between. They're
fine now, but they're going to be fine, Like it
just was. I felt like that was just Trump kind
of bullshitting. The MS thirteen one is the one that

(01:12:54):
really concerns me. Also, I don't know what he was
talking about when he said two terms and then he
said three terms. Yes, it's possibly twenty twenty, but he
said we already served three terms.

Speaker 6 (01:13:05):
So it's all.

Speaker 7 (01:13:08):
It's very it's a time traveler. I've never been on
the you have this very like traditional understanding of time. Yes,
whereas he moves about it freely, he's.

Speaker 8 (01:13:20):
Sort of a higher plane. But no, I've never been
on the bandwagon ever. Like up until this point of
people who thought that Trump had some type of like
medical mental aging condition, you know, that was something the
Biden team tried to push. There's obviously something going on
up there, whether or not it's aging. I've never been

(01:13:40):
on that bandwagon, to be honest. But the MS thirteen
one now that one has me really.

Speaker 4 (01:13:49):
Idiocy and capacity.

Speaker 7 (01:13:50):
Yeah, I could just be idiocylied to him.

Speaker 6 (01:13:53):
To your point, I guess it is possible that somebody
relied to him.

Speaker 8 (01:13:57):
Now, to put that in stark relief, take a look
at what Donald Trump said about negotiations with Vladimir Putin,
just for a reminder that the man who believes his
thirteen was tattooed on Kimora Bergo's Gerty's hands is negotiating
the end of a potential.

Speaker 6 (01:14:14):
Or of a war involving a nuclear power. So go
ahead and roll D four.

Speaker 11 (01:14:18):
He's willing to stop the fighting, don't you begin he
wants You think Vladimir Putin wants peace?

Speaker 13 (01:14:26):
I think he does. Yes, I think there is I
think people's a reigning missiles. I think he really his
dream was to take over the whole country. I think
because of me, he's not going to do that. Do
you trust him? I think? Do you trust him? I
don't trust you. I don't trust I don't trust a
lot of people. I don't trust you. Look at you.

Speaker 11 (01:14:45):
You come in all shooting for bear, You're so happy
to do the interview I am, and then you start
hitting me with fake questions he saw telling me that
a guy whose hand is covered with the tattoo doesn't
have the tattoo.

Speaker 13 (01:14:56):
You know, I mean you're being dishonest.

Speaker 8 (01:14:58):
No, I'm not.

Speaker 13 (01:14:59):
Lem is not so I trust. I don't trust a
lot of people, but I do think this.

Speaker 11 (01:15:04):
I think that he let's say, he respects me, and
I believe because of me, he's not going to take
over the whole, but his decision, his choice would be
to take over all of Ukraine.

Speaker 8 (01:15:17):
Okay, again, there's a charitable reading of this where he's
said this before. He's not going to talk and Wikoff
has said this, he's not going to talk trash about
Putin in a way that would hamper his ability just
to kind of virtue signal to American neo cons in
a way that would hamper the actual peace process.

Speaker 6 (01:15:38):
So on that part, I get not taking Terry Moran's bait.

Speaker 8 (01:15:43):
On the other hand, Ryan, he's still going back to
the MS thirteen tattoo.

Speaker 7 (01:15:49):
So he's like, yeah, I can't trust you because you
think that wasn't photoshop Yeah, or you think that was photoshopped.

Speaker 6 (01:15:57):
Wow, things are fine. We're a hundred days in. Everything
is preceding apace everyone's happy. Tourism is up.

Speaker 4 (01:16:05):
It feels like a lifetime good lord.

Speaker 8 (01:16:07):
Yeah, anything else on the Terry Moran Now, just twenty
fifth Amendment and look I was I was for it
with Biden, So you can't get me on.

Speaker 4 (01:16:18):
Can't get me on that hypocrisy. So important now, President Vance,
get ready, lace up Lisa.

Speaker 8 (01:16:25):
All right, let's move on to the Housies, Ryan, because
another quite an interesting l for the good old US
of A here.

Speaker 4 (01:16:37):
This week. And we can put this first element up
on the screen.

Speaker 7 (01:16:41):
An Fa eighteen fighter jet fell off the side of
a US aircraft carrier.

Speaker 4 (01:16:48):
And sunk to the bottom of the Red Sea.

Speaker 7 (01:16:51):
What we know from reporting out of the US from
the Navy is that or they claim this is what
they claim.

Speaker 4 (01:17:00):
We'll talk about this.

Speaker 7 (01:17:01):
They claim that the aircraft carrier was making a sharp
movement to avoid hoothy fire. Now we know from hooty
officials that they did indeed say that they launched a
drone and missile attack on the Truman carrier group. And
I spoke to somebody who served on an aircraft carrier

(01:17:21):
and he said, yeah, those things I think thirty thirty
knots like they get they get moving at a serious
clip and when they start to I don't know if
you can totally come about in an aircraft carrier, but
when those when they start to turn, they do bank
and you have to have everything kind of secured. According
to the Navy, they were hauling this thing out of

(01:17:44):
the hangar a hangar at the time when it started
to bank, because I guess they weren't planning on banking. Now,
these are super fast missiles, so it's kind of I'm
a little skeptical that even the fast aircraft carrier can
move fast enough to get it out of the way
of a missile.

Speaker 4 (01:18:04):
Who knows, what do I know?

Speaker 7 (01:18:06):
All we know is that this seventy dollar fighter jet
is now at the bottom of the Red Sea. So
we don't have health care, yeah, but we do have
now we raises sunken fighter jet. It raises a lot
of questions. Do we have fighter jet insurance? And were

(01:18:29):
we current on it?

Speaker 6 (01:18:30):
Yes, that is one of the questions that comes to mind.

Speaker 4 (01:18:33):
Was it paid off.

Speaker 6 (01:18:35):
From Progressive?

Speaker 4 (01:18:36):
What if we had just finished paying this thing off
when it rolled off.

Speaker 8 (01:18:40):
The side the all stick guys should start doing commercials.

Speaker 4 (01:18:45):
And you know how you know, that's how it goes.

Speaker 7 (01:18:46):
When you have a seventy million dollar fighter jet, the
second you make your last payment, it rolls off the
side of the aircraft carrier.

Speaker 6 (01:18:52):
Many such cases.

Speaker 4 (01:18:54):
Just for fun, let's put up E two here. This
is the War Powers resolution.

Speaker 7 (01:19:02):
It is not actually okay, constitutionally for this carrier group
to even be in these waters. According to the Constitution,
the Congress is vested with the power to declare war.
According to the War Powers Act, you cannot enter into hostilities.

Speaker 4 (01:19:26):
You can't do this. So beyond that, you can't do this,
I'm just saying you can't do this. So and what
they are entered into hostilities right now?

Speaker 7 (01:19:37):
They are in a place where they know they're going
to get shot at, and if they don't want to
get shot at, they're able to leave that area like
there's no reason they have to be there or Congress
has not authorized it. Now, maybe that implicates the insurance policy.
Insurance policy. You probably have to be current on your
alignment with your constitutional war powers, and so the insurance policies,

(01:19:59):
they're not paid. They're not paying for this FAA team.
When All State gets the bill, do.

Speaker 8 (01:20:04):
You say that this is they'll claim this under the
umbrella of an AOMF, like a twenty plus year old AOMF.

Speaker 4 (01:20:10):
I don't even know if they bother anymore.

Speaker 7 (01:20:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And our allies aren't there. So the
au m F authorizes us to fight al Qaeda wherever
we find them. The problem in Yemen is that our
allies are al Qaeda. Al Qaeda are fighting the houthies.
So that's not that's not going to fly either.

Speaker 6 (01:20:31):
Well you'd think, did you just say that's not going
to fly? Pretty good?

Speaker 7 (01:20:36):
I did not even I did not even do that
one on purpose, but wow, it really worked. Less amusing
but even more disturbing perhaps development out of Yemen.

Speaker 4 (01:20:49):
We can put this next element up on the screen.

Speaker 7 (01:20:53):
So there are as you know, as everybody knows, a
bunch of amateur ocent people out there who go around
around monking with Google Earth, posting things that they find
and declaring them to be interesting to the world. If
that's your hobby, fine, enjoy yourself, you know, social media,

(01:21:14):
go ahead. There are some people who have been going around,
uh looking at Google Earth images of Yemen and claiming
to have been able to spot hothy missile launch sites
or hoothy bases.

Speaker 4 (01:21:36):
Okay again, I guess.

Speaker 7 (01:21:38):
Like, if that's how you want to spend your time,
go ahead and do that. So a couple of accounts
posted the the exact coordinates of what they said was
a missile you know, some type of base slash missile
launch situation in.

Speaker 4 (01:21:52):
A quarry in Yemen. We can put this next element
up on the screen, and the US struck that precise
coordinate killed.

Speaker 7 (01:22:03):
The reports are and uh Shuey al malwassee who's our reporter?
And Sanas confirmed for us that this that this area
just outside of Sana was was struck. A significant number
of civilians were killed. The reporting is eight uh. And
so we know that this person posted this image, post

(01:22:27):
posted these coordinates and then the US struck these coordinates
and that there was nothing there.

Speaker 4 (01:22:31):
Like we all know this now.

Speaker 6 (01:22:34):
What was the time lapse between the couple of weeks?

Speaker 4 (01:22:37):
And so the question then is is this the strangest
coincidence ever?

Speaker 7 (01:22:44):
Or is sentcom pulling targets from random Twitter users? Weird're
striking them?

Speaker 8 (01:22:53):
Weirder possibility what if somebody at centcom has a burner
that they're floating coordinates out onto.

Speaker 7 (01:23:02):
I think this is a person that's in Holmn. They
know who this person is. It's like a woman who's
just interested in this stuff.

Speaker 12 (01:23:09):
Like.

Speaker 7 (01:23:10):
Also, they're wrong, like they blew it like this they
killed civilians like they didn't they didn't get this right.
So this person posted screenshots of donations that she made
to Doctors Without Borders and a Yemeny charitable group as sorry.

(01:23:32):
So to start, I have made two donations, one to
MSF Meslan Frontier and one the Yemen Data Project, totaling
five hundred euros, like as an apology basically for accidentally
getting some people killed. Now, I'm not even that angry
at this person because it's sentcom that should not be

(01:23:55):
grabbing information for this person.

Speaker 6 (01:23:58):
This is a really weird account. I'm going through it
right now. Yeah, lucky it han.

Speaker 4 (01:24:01):
It's very strange.

Speaker 6 (01:24:02):
It's very very weird.

Speaker 5 (01:24:03):
It's like.

Speaker 6 (01:24:05):
It's almost like a belling cat type.

Speaker 4 (01:24:09):
But it's just a random person ish but who knows.

Speaker 7 (01:24:13):
The response that mirrors the way I feel about it
was from somebody who said, we don't want your donations,
we don't need them. Just stop publishing false aerial photos.
You're publishing civilian areas as military zones and causing the
killing of our people. Even if we assume that they
are military zones, Why are you hostile to us? What
is your interest in this? And so that's actually the

(01:24:35):
question I have too, It's like, why are you doing this?
So I reached out to this account. They did not
hear back. I did not hear back. I also reached
out to Sentcom to ask if it's the case, and
there was another account as well that had posted the
same quarry. So I reached out to ask, is it
the case that you're pulling these from Twitter?

Speaker 6 (01:24:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (01:24:59):
It it certainly is the case. We know that at
least for some of their and we know this from.

Speaker 7 (01:25:05):
Sources around the Pentagon that they are pulling. We do
know for sure they're pulling some of their damage assessment
from Twitter, because that's that has circulated in the Pentagon.
Like after a strike, there'll be some social media account
like posts from that are not US you know, government

(01:25:26):
or US military accounts, just random people. Some of these
some of these are just strident, like anti houthy partisans
and they'll say this is what happened in the strike
and that and saidcom will.

Speaker 4 (01:25:39):
Use that in there now.

Speaker 7 (01:25:40):
So we do know that they are willing to use
what they euphemistically call open source intel and whatever.

Speaker 8 (01:25:48):
I mean, presumably whatever led this open source intel collector
who interestingly has ceasefire now.

Speaker 7 (01:25:57):
And I saw that, Yeah, fire aware in the bio,
the bio of where do they want.

Speaker 4 (01:26:04):
To seize fire?

Speaker 6 (01:26:04):
Yeah, it's very odd ym So presumably obviously whatever led
this account to that spot could potentially be leading sentcom
to that spot. I mean, it wouldn't necessarily have to
be a coincidence.

Speaker 4 (01:26:20):
Except it was the total blunder, Like it was right,
it was just a misreading.

Speaker 6 (01:26:25):
It's very very weird. It's an incredibly deeply strange story.
I'm glad that you asked the government about it, because.

Speaker 8 (01:26:33):
If they're pulling this stuff and it's wrong from Twitter accounts,
I mean, I guess it's one thing.

Speaker 6 (01:26:38):
If it's right, it's still very odd.

Speaker 8 (01:26:40):
If it's right, if they're actually getting it from Twitter
and not just sort of following the same breadcrumbs, but
a deeply deeply strange situation, and you can understand how
it's going to land with people in Yemen. I mean,
it's it looks to people in Yemen like complete casual destruction.

Speaker 7 (01:26:59):
Yes, and it's also completely ineffectual. I mean, it's it's
effective at killing innocent people, but when it comes to
actually degrading the capacity of the Houthis to fire at ships,
it's simply simply not effective.

Speaker 4 (01:27:14):
We just they just.

Speaker 7 (01:27:15):
Tilted an aircraft carrier and knocked a what do they
call it a hornet whatever, to the bottom of the
bottom of the Red Seas seventy million dollar seventy million
dollar plane. Meanwhile, the houthis in an interview with shoe Abe,
a top official there, was effectively responding to Trump and

(01:27:37):
Hegseeth who said that if the Hoothies stopped shooting at
American ships, we will stop shooting at them. This Hoothy
political leader on the record told drop Site News, we
will stop you stop attacking us, and then we will
stop attacking you. Done agreement. Our problem is with Israel,
and they're not even asking Israel to enter into a

(01:27:58):
ceasefire at this point. They launched this renewed siege of
shipping because Israel was blocking.

Speaker 4 (01:28:06):
AID into Gaza.

Speaker 7 (01:28:08):
So if Israel would just allow AID back in now
at this point, they want Israel to return to the
ceasefire terms that they had agreed to.

Speaker 4 (01:28:16):
But that's it. Their beef is with Israel, not with us,
and so they have accepted our offer.

Speaker 7 (01:28:23):
Yet here we are bombing innocent people, trying to degrade
their capacity, not doing it. And right now, it's just
kind of funny that this ship, I mean's sort of
funny that the ship fell off the aircraft carrier. Trump
could get somebody killed. Also, that could have been a
lot worse.

Speaker 8 (01:28:43):
I just found at Vlecki Han sited in West Points
a report from West Points Combating Terrorism Center.

Speaker 6 (01:28:51):
So interesting, a reliable the quote ever resourceful analyst at
Flecki Han.

Speaker 4 (01:28:57):
This is a west Point paper.

Speaker 7 (01:28:58):
Yeah, all right, well this is pretty confirmation that this
account is considered credible. What was it called, it's ever reliable,
ever reliable, ever reliable, well not ever resourceful, ever resourceful. Yes, okay,
they're resourceful. They're using Google Earth.

Speaker 8 (01:29:14):
This was in the case of it says the ever
resourceful analyst at Lucky Han's use of purchased commercial satellite imagery.
And this is from last year, so it's not like
an old paper or anything. And it's cited actually in
the footnotes of this report from West Point.

Speaker 7 (01:29:27):
So yeah, so okay, they so they are they do
actually think this person is credible that that ups the
likelihood that they relied on this person's Google Earth imagery
to launch this erroneous and deadly air strike close to
one hundred percent.

Speaker 8 (01:29:46):
So what this means is that the military is paying
attention to this particular open source account, right, so it
would make it that's much stronger.

Speaker 4 (01:29:54):
I mean, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 7 (01:29:57):
Separately and also relatedly, and we won't We were going
to put up some of this video, but we decided
we decided not to because even even blurring it it's
just too it's just too graphic. But the hooth He's
announced that one of the air strikes, and we don't

(01:30:18):
know where they got the coordinates for this one that
the US had said hit a Hoothy base actually hit
an African African migrant detention center, and so far the
death toll is at least sixty eight. Like, we struck
a detention center filled with people, and the images that

(01:30:39):
have come out of it of bodies mingled with the
rubble are just are gruesome and horrifying. So you can
go find them if you want to. We were going
to play it just so that you didn't have to
take our word for it, but I think you probably
trust us enough at this point that we can tell
you that it happened.

Speaker 4 (01:30:58):
We did that.

Speaker 6 (01:31:00):
I mean, the video is people, go pull it up.

Speaker 4 (01:31:04):
You can find it.

Speaker 6 (01:31:05):
Yeah, you can find it. Recommended viewing, unfortunately, in a
very very tragic way. Recommended viewing.

Speaker 7 (01:31:12):
So up next, protests and counter protests in Crown Heights
in Brooklyn on Thursday night led to what became was
becoming a national scandal, the way that a mob of
pro Israel protesters assaulted two different women. One of them
is going to do her first video interview and share

(01:31:34):
some of her own footage that she captured while this
mob was pursuing her, so stick around for that. So
on Thursday night, It'samar ben Gevie appeared at a synagogue
in Crown Heights, Brooklyn, where he was met by protesters
as well as pro Israel counter protesters. As you may

(01:31:57):
have heard, because it's become a national story by this point,
two women were chased and assaulted that evening. Eric Adams
has since come out and said that he wants to
press charges, but the women have not come forward publicly.
One of those women was just simply a neighborhood resident
and a bystander she's joining us today. She wants to

(01:32:20):
continue to remain anonymous, and she's also provided us for
the first time some video footage that she took from
her perspective. You've probably seen a lot of the footage
of the crowd kind of assaulting her and harassing her
as she's separated from the rest of this protest. But

(01:32:41):
you'll be able to see some of this shortly. But
let's bring in our Crown Heights resident. Welcome to Counterpoints.
Thank you so much for joining.

Speaker 5 (01:32:49):
Us, Thank you for having me, Thank you for interest
in that story.

Speaker 4 (01:32:53):
Yeah for sure. So first of all, can you tell us,
like how you wound up Thursday evening.

Speaker 7 (01:33:00):
At this protest? How did you How did you know
that there was a protest going on?

Speaker 5 (01:33:05):
Sure? Yeah, so you know, kind of later in the evening,
around ten ten thirty and a helicopter had been hovering
over my building for around thirty minutes. So I went
outside to see what was going on, and I encountered
the aftermath of a protest when I arrived at Kingston

(01:33:29):
Avenue in Eastern Parkway, right where the Chabat is.

Speaker 4 (01:33:34):
And so, yeah, so what happened next?

Speaker 5 (01:33:37):
Yeah, So I was standing on the sidewalk. There were
tons of people, hundreds of people in the street and
on the sidewalk pretty much only Orthodox Jewish people, mostly men,
and then there were some other neighbors like myself standing
on the sidewalk just watching, just watching the scene to see.

Speaker 8 (01:33:58):
What was going on. And I want to say, that's
an point because actually we had reported earlier that you
were a pro Palestine demonstrator, and that's not the case.
To be clear, you were just sort of a bystander
who was watching the chaos unfold in your neighborhood, right.

Speaker 5 (01:34:14):
That's right, and so.

Speaker 7 (01:34:18):
I understand that, Well, why did they mistake you for
somebody that needed to be assaulted?

Speaker 5 (01:34:25):
Yeah, So what happened, and it happened really quickly, was
that people near me began filming and I didn't want
to be on anyone's camera rule, so I pulled up
my scarf over my face. And I just want to
be clear that it was not a cathea. It wouldn't
matter if it was, but it wasn't, and that was

(01:34:46):
really that just escalated things. Almost immediately a woman began
screaming at me. She was already screaming at the police.
Then she started screaming at me for me that they
needed to get me out of there, and almost immediately
a group of like one hundred guys encircled me and
just started shouting like just vile insults at me. They

(01:35:13):
were saying, you're a waste of seeming or a failed abortion.
They were threatening to rape me, they telling me to
go back to Palestine. And I also just want to
say that I was standing right next to a long
line of police, and as this began to happen, I
moved closer to the police because I thought that that

(01:35:34):
would afford me some safety. And I was wrong, because
they did not do anything to intervene, and they really
just stared straight ahead with their eyes glazed over, as
if no crime, nothing was happening before their eyes.

Speaker 4 (01:35:49):
I want to play a little bit of the footage
here if we can roll that control room.

Speaker 19 (01:35:53):
See the fact that you guys, lets the fact.

Speaker 13 (01:35:57):
You guys want.

Speaker 23 (01:36:00):
You're again, I live here to be here, that you
want someone to bend you over and like the dorn
of the Jews in Palestine.

Speaker 8 (01:36:31):
Guys, and you can see in that video the police
standing there. You pay taxes to be protected by the police.
They're standing there in that video, And so how did
you end up getting out of the situation? Was anybody
other than the police trying to help?

Speaker 6 (01:36:49):
What happened? As you you tried to get away from
uh that harassment?

Speaker 5 (01:36:55):
Yeah, so asn't tried to leave the situation and to
get away. Another officer from somewhere else on the street
came over and he saw this mob following me, and
he tried to escort me home, and so we walked
in the direction of my home and this just this

(01:37:16):
mob of men followed and as they followed, they were
again saying go back to Palestine and in Hebrew, shouting
death to Arabs. They were kicking me in the back repeatedly.
They were throwing things at my head. They hurled the
trash can at me, They threw a traffic cone at me,

(01:37:40):
they were spitting It was just it was really scary,
and at a certain point.

Speaker 13 (01:37:46):
I realized that.

Speaker 5 (01:37:49):
I couldn't leave this mob to my home, that that
wouldn't be safe for me. And I turned on a
different street in a way from the direction of my home,
where they kind of cornered me and this one officer
against a building, which is where they were started like

(01:38:09):
throwing the trash can and the traffic cone at me,
and I really just I didn't know what to do
or where to go because they couldn't go home, and
the police weren't there to stop. I mean, they were there,
but they weren't stopping this, and it was really terrifying. Finally,

(01:38:30):
as we're like cornered against this building, a cop car
pulled up in the middle of the street, and I
just ran for my wife through this crowd of men
who were shouting get her, and jumped in the back
of the police car. Who and then those police drove
me into my house.

Speaker 7 (01:38:49):
So what were you thinking as you're kind of going
down the street and the mob is around you, Because
I'm reminded of this time where I got jumped by
three guys in an alley behind my apartment, and I
remember thinking, remember, don't go down. Don't go down, because if,
like I knew that, if I went down onto the ground,
then you know, then then you're dealing with feet rather
than just rather than just fists. And I was eventually

(01:39:11):
able to get away without actually going down onto the
onto the onto the floor of the alley. So I'm
wondering if there were any thoughts going through your mind
as you're like getting hit, kicked in the back and
like things are getting thrown at you of what you
needed to do to like get yourself out of this situation.

Speaker 5 (01:39:31):
Yeah. I mean, I will say I have a very
strong fight instinct and I was fighting very hard to
repress it in those moments because I knew that they
wanted me to respond.

Speaker 6 (01:39:46):
In that way.

Speaker 5 (01:39:47):
They wanted me to fight back so that they could
escalate things and have an excuse to hurt me further.
And it was and it was just like I really
had to have to rep us that the whole time
and instead put my mind to keeping myself safe. And
there wasn't a lot of conscious thought outside of don't

(01:40:10):
don't react physically and don't leave them to your home,
you know. Outside of that, it was just like a
lot it was a lot of terror. It was just
this feeling of terror that was that was there for me.

Speaker 6 (01:40:23):
And what response have you received since all of this happened.

Speaker 8 (01:40:27):
I know Eric Adams has sort of put out an
attempt to get in contact.

Speaker 6 (01:40:33):
Have the police followed up? What's what have you heard
in the last several days.

Speaker 5 (01:40:39):
Yeah, you know, I'm in such a tricky position here
because I want to call out all of the all
of the police in action and lies that they've been telling,
and at the same time, I really want them to
take action on my behalf and the people of New
York's behalf and think those two, those two desires of

(01:41:05):
mine are in conflict with each other. And so but
I'm going to say anyway, like the police didn't do anything.
Nobody tried to get in contact with me. They were
saying that they reached out to me, and I filed
the report and that was a lie. I eventually did
get in touch with a detective a couple of days ago,

(01:41:25):
and I was able to file a report. And yeah,
and I think that the police have just been spreading
a lot of misinformation about what happened. And that's really
frustrating for me.

Speaker 7 (01:41:40):
And so you did speak to a detective, would you
testify if they were able to find you, know, able
to identify these these men who did this?

Speaker 5 (01:41:50):
I would Yeah. Yeah, it was.

Speaker 7 (01:41:55):
It was interesting to see Eric Adams finally come out,
because there's a it took a way. It took a
significant amount of time for Adams to say anything publicly,
and it seems like there's this attitude that if somebody
is a kind of pro Palestine demonstrator, the kind of
rules don't apply.

Speaker 4 (01:42:12):
They can just get beaten up.

Speaker 7 (01:42:14):
And I wonder if them finally realizing that you actually
weren't you were just a person who lives in the neighborhood,
if that played some role. Did you get any indication
from the detective of how important kind of that his
bosses see this case and what it was that moved
them kind of to actually do something.

Speaker 5 (01:42:37):
Yeah, So I think I talked to the detective on
Monday afternoon and they seem to really be scrambling. He
had told me that they had only just gotten the
directive that they were going to be investigating this like
a couple hours prior. So this all happened on Thursday night,
where the police again watched it happen, and they didn't

(01:42:58):
take any action until this video went viral over the
weekend and the pressure and then there was pressure on
the mayor and the NYPD.

Speaker 7 (01:43:09):
And not that any of this matters because you were
just you were just there. But I'm curious, are you Jewish?
Are you Christian? And you atheist? Apathysts?

Speaker 4 (01:43:17):
Like what's what? What's and do you have a view
on the politics here.

Speaker 7 (01:43:22):
Like I said, it doesn't matter, nobody should beaten up
no matter what they think, any wherever they are on
the spectrum, and you were just there.

Speaker 4 (01:43:28):
But I'm also just curious.

Speaker 5 (01:43:31):
Yeah, No, I'm not religious at all, and I do
support the rights of Palestinians to live in a free
state of their own. And I think, like you know,
what happened to me, it really gave me a glimpse
into the daily reality of Palestinians under occupation. Just they're

(01:43:55):
subjected to violence, to humanization, abandonment, and and what happened
to me isn't isolated. It's part of a broader system
of violence, and that needs to be that needs to end.

Speaker 8 (01:44:08):
My last question is about the situation in Crown Heights,
and people are sort of familiar with the historical tensions
that have simmered over in Crown Heights, and what's very frightening.
One of the many things that's very frightening about your
experience and about the video is how is this anger
seems to be bubbling into something very very dangerous right now?

(01:44:31):
So I wanted to ask, I mean, this is kind
of a meta question, but there's a reason that you
want to speak out anonymously, and I imagine.

Speaker 6 (01:44:39):
That it has to do with your safety.

Speaker 8 (01:44:41):
So if you could speak to that and the situation
in Crown Heights, whether you see it as something that's
very dangerous right now, that would be much appreciated.

Speaker 5 (01:44:51):
Yeah. Sure, Yeah, I'm absolutely afraid for my own safety
in the neighborhood I lived in and have lived in
for almost a decade. I'm afraid of being recognized. And yes,
there's a long and fraught history of tensions involving this
community in Crown Heights. I would say, like two weeks ago,

(01:45:15):
members of the Orthodox Jewish community brutally beat an elderly
black man in a wheelchair and threw him to the sidewalk.
Earlier that night, you know, you mentioned it before, Like
that same mob that attacked me, They threw a brook
at a brick at a woman's face. They assaulted an
anti zion As Hasidic man that night, also throwing into
the ground and removing his religious head covering. And like

(01:45:40):
you know, I've lived here for a long time, I
know the history, Like the Orthodox Jewish community rings terror
on this neighborhood with impunity and I don't normally feel
that tensions walking through the street as a white woman,
but I am aware of it. I am aware that

(01:46:00):
they are afforded certain privileges that not everyone else in
the neighborhood is.

Speaker 7 (01:46:07):
As we saw Thursday, the event happened Thursday night in
full view of all the police, and nothing happened until
Monday until the you know, there's a spotlight put on it.
So thank thank you so much for you know, sharing
your your perspective, the videos and and your side of
this this terrifying event.

Speaker 6 (01:46:25):
Yeah, we really appreciate it.

Speaker 5 (01:46:27):
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 7 (01:46:31):
Joining us now is Turnobob, editor of the Africanist Press.

Speaker 4 (01:46:35):
And also we can put this element up on the screen.

Speaker 7 (01:46:37):
The author of the tremendous book The Ebola Outbreak in
West Africa, Corporate gangsters, multinationals and rogue Politicians.

Speaker 4 (01:46:44):
We spoke with Turno a year or two ago.

Speaker 7 (01:46:48):
About the Abola outbreak in West Africa, and we can
put a link to that interview that we did down
in the down in the show notes. Embarrassed say, I
hadn't read the full book by the time that we
had you on then, because we were moving fairly quickly.
But I've since read it. It's really a masterpiece. I
would recommend it to every It's it's also a fairly

(01:47:10):
short books. There was no excuse that I hadn't read
it yet. But it runs through the history of kind
of multinational, corporate and colonial involvement in medical research in Africa,
and then you know, leads up into Ebola and the
and the response. And I'll let you talk about it
a little bit because we want we're going to talk
about some other things in this in this segment, but

(01:47:32):
you know, you you basically demonstrate with authority that the
story that we're told about how the Ebola outbreak happened
is ludicrous as no evidentiary basis, and that the more
likely cause is the shoddy lab that was doing a
bola research in Sierra Leone and anything you want to

(01:47:55):
add about about that.

Speaker 22 (01:47:58):
Yes, it's been ten years now.

Speaker 12 (01:48:01):
Since I published that book, or since I wrote that book,
and it's interesting to see that the conversation that we
started ten years ago still is relevant today, especially when
we talk about COVID and the pandemic. It was five
years before COVID at the time when the outbreak happened.
The official narrative was that the outbreak started in Guinea,

(01:48:25):
and they identified Emily woman way two years old or
less than two year old child an eighteen year old
boy as the index case of the outbreak. They alleged
that the child had participated in the hunting and grillion
of a bat. So my book challenge is that what
we call the official narrative raising questions that would have

(01:48:45):
allowed people to look into the biodefense research operation that
was happening in eastern Syrallian dating back to two thousand
and four, ten years before the outbreak. But I think
ten years ago when the book came out, it was
very difficult to have that conversation because any attempt to
have a conversation that challenged the dominant narrative as we

(01:49:09):
called it then, was considered a conspiracy theory.

Speaker 22 (01:49:12):
So very few people were willing to have that kind
of conversation.

Speaker 12 (01:49:16):
So I travel around the world at the time, going
to Europe, across the United States, and in some African countries.

Speaker 22 (01:49:23):
To promote the book. You know, ten years down the line,
I think now we.

Speaker 12 (01:49:28):
Have some kind of a significant amount of people who
are perhaps willing to listen to that kind of you know,
the possibility that the outbreak that killed thousands of people
in West Africa and still has a lingering socio economic
impact and psychological impact on the population of West Africa.
Talking about people who lived in Strira, Lian, in Liberia

(01:49:53):
and Guinea, the epicenter of that epidemic, are still unaware
of the causes and origin of that. We've had so
much about COVID, which happened five years and afterwards. There
has been some kind of congressional discussion, some kind of
White House conversation around COVID, but no such conversation has

(01:50:14):
happened for the victims of the epidemic in West Africa.
And I had said in my book that what we
witnessed in West Africa in twenty fifteen was a prelude,
was address reheaursal to what the world will face with
this whole idea of pathrogens being part of warfare, bioterrorism
and all these kinds of things. So I'm happy that

(01:50:34):
we're still talking about this ten years later. I'm hoping
that this conversation will loom large, that the victims of
the bold outbreak would get justice. At least we'll be
able to understand how that outbreak that killed their family members,
their relatives, their friends and neighbors. We need the truth,
We need some kind of a disclosure of information around
what corporations we are doing, what universities and the research scientists,

(01:50:58):
because we're talking about the same institution, same individuals who
are involved with COVID where the ones who get involved
in West.

Speaker 4 (01:51:04):
Africa, and it's it's relevant.

Speaker 7 (01:51:06):
The conversation is relevant today, I think for a lot
of reasons, but one of them is that here here
in the West, the debate around what we call quote
unquote foreign aid is that the Democrats will say, you know,
kind of foreign aid is good and we should do
it because it's it's it's good and also it helps
the United States, you know, with our soft power, and
people love us because we do it. The Republicans will

(01:51:27):
say foreign aid is good because you know, it's charity
and it helps people, but it's not our business, like
we we don't need to do it. They need to
take care of themselves. But there's really no debate over
whether or not. You know, it's it's fundamentally a good thing.
So that's why I wanted to have have you on
today because obviously, you know, somebody who is getting you know,

(01:51:49):
access to HIV HIV treatment like they need that treatment
as a as a particular individual. But taking it from
a micro case to to a macro case, let's talk
about what the what the fallout has been in the
regions where you cover to both you know, the the

(01:52:09):
pulling back of U S A I D, but also
UH what has happened in the wake of some of
these some of the the quote unquote aid or investment
UH projects that have that have rolled out through d
f C or MCC. Will talk about those separately. First,
what was your reaction when you saw the you know,
the cuts to the U S A I D. And

(01:52:30):
from from your understanding, what what have been you know,
how how is Africa responding?

Speaker 13 (01:52:36):
Well?

Speaker 22 (01:52:37):
I think the problem here.

Speaker 12 (01:52:41):
We entered into a problem because when these real conversations
that affect people's lives. We're talking about women and men,
you know, children who have suffered from dictators, from bad government,
from corruption in Africa. And when we we have this
kind of conversation, risk is that when it becomes partisan,
we lose the importance of scrutinizing international relations. To what

(01:53:07):
extent has international relations affected the lives of ordinary people.

Speaker 22 (01:53:14):
In the case of Syralan, we've been raising these issues.

Speaker 12 (01:53:16):
We've said clearly that we are not against what you
might call for indirect investment or genuine solidarity and support
that applics people. But what we've witnessed in the last
sixty years is a kind of relations that has undermined
the real development. Not only that that has imposed huge debts,
non transparent debts and contracts that have affected lives. You know,

(01:53:40):
we raise in the last five years, for example, the
US International Development Finance Corporation in Sralian acquired you know,
huge contracts in infrastructure projects, telecommunication projects, and these are
amounts of money ranging to four hundred and twelve million
in one case for an electricity project that was never constructed.

(01:54:05):
And the processes through which that you know, these contracts
were awarded. We also did not comply with even US
laws regarding foreign direct investment in in Africa or point
other places we raise these questions, nobody listened.

Speaker 5 (01:54:21):
You know.

Speaker 12 (01:54:22):
The same thing with the Millennium Challenge Corporation that claimed
that they've signed a compact agreement with Relion to support
the energy sectorance volume with one undred and eighty million dollars,
and even as we speak today, more than ninety percent
of the Saliny and population do not have access to electricity,
They do not have access to safe and pure drinking water.
The healthcare system is broken. So when you talk about

(01:54:46):
us AID, DFC and MCC giving money or loans of
credit or charity to countries like Relion, the citizens would
be wandering where this money is going, because there's no
evidence of that on the ground. So I would say
that rationally speaking, if we remove the partisan aspect of

(01:55:07):
this conversation, we have to look at the real impact
of these so called development assistance or loans or credit
or charity, whatever you might want to call it. But
it hasn't translated into real development. It hasn't changed the
living conditions of the people of many of these countries.
So it's one case, but there you can find this
in any African country. This is why many African citizens

(01:55:30):
do not you know, are not really affected by these
The politicians, the corporations, the companies who have been benefiting
from the advance that have been complaining and unfortunately we
do not have an opportunity of speaking to the people
who are directly impacted by these developments. When these conversations
are being you know held, they are always we always

(01:55:51):
listen to opinion leaders or representatives of these corporations who
tend to complain about the withdrawal of so called aid
and charity that has not really benefited the millions of
people across Africa and in other places on whose names
and conditions these supposed charitable programs have been done. So
we have to in order to get at this conversation,

(01:56:14):
we have to have this conversation outside of the Democrats
or the Republicans or whatever party. When issues of development
and human rights and peace have been discussed and we talked,
we bring these partisant issues into the conversation, we risk
losing the reality and the impacts that these situations tend

(01:56:34):
to have on the real lives of people. I have
been one individual that has reported on corruption and human
right violations in West Africa for more than twenty years
and one of the issues we've encountered every time we
raised this is raised these questions to US officials. For example,
in the last administration, we help countless meetings with the

(01:56:56):
State Department representatives of diplomats who were in charge of
West Africa. They ignore these questions. They ignore the fact that,
for example, have been in exile for more than five
six years, have been her ass transnationally by for just
raising these issues of corruption, that moneys that have been
awarded to corrupt through gyms in West Africa, affecting human

(01:57:20):
rights defenders, affecting journalists, affecting independent media, our ability to
hold leaders accountable. Every time we raise corruption issues. In fact,
the that's when the governments received more money. In fact,
you have a situation where politicians in West Africa would
tell us that the more you write about corruption, the
more we get money from Western countries, including the United States.

Speaker 22 (01:57:39):
So this was a very problematic situation. It's not just
the US.

Speaker 12 (01:57:43):
You also look at organizations like the IMF, the World
Bank who've been imposing debts, non transparent debts on these country.
So we have millions of hundreds of millions and billions
of dollars in debts and so called aid that has
not changed the conditions Inure. It's more than sixty five
years now. So youon just celebrated what the gos sixty

(01:58:04):
four years independence and when you look at the country,
the indices of povertier and the development are very stuck.

Speaker 22 (01:58:11):
You know, you don't need to go too far.

Speaker 12 (01:58:13):
You just need to have someone on the street and
ask them how do you feel about what your government
is doing. They will tell you the government is corrupt,
the government is not responsive to their needs, and.

Speaker 8 (01:58:22):
Lots of I was going to say, Turner, let's talk
more about that, because a lot of people here in
the United States. When USAID, for example, was on the
sort of cutting table in the early days of Trump's
second administration, the media portrayed this as the sky was
falling in the United States. This was, you know, taking

(01:58:42):
a racking ball to lowercase deed democracy in human rights.
And there are you know, obviously cases where people's livelihoods
and health and safety were affected by it, no question
about it. But your experience suggests that this relic of
the Cold War era that was meant to be a
bulwark against the Soviet influence around the world is always

(01:59:05):
the aid is always coming with strings attached. That you know,
the question of democracy is not the pure question at
hand when aid money is distributed or when yeah, well,
I mean even when when aid money is distributed and
NGOs non governmental organizations are bolstered by that aid money
and when when they are chosen. Uh, there's there's always

(01:59:25):
a strategy that is very particular and not just about
lowercase D democracy.

Speaker 6 (01:59:31):
Your experience speaks to that.

Speaker 8 (01:59:33):
So can you tell our listeners and viewers a little
bit about the reality behind the curtain of USA I,
D and foreign aid.

Speaker 12 (01:59:43):
Well, I think what what you call development as systems
of foreign aid did in the case of Stalin. We
take the last four or five years of the the
current government in power, is that it emboldened them. It
emboldened them to you know, ignore to violate human rights,
to suppress citizens, including journalists, independent journalists like myself, with

(02:00:07):
impunity because they believe that they were backed by an
administration that kept giving them money. When we raise the
issues of corruption regarding the non transparent acquisition of contracts
by corporations and companies funded by the DFC, the State
Department went ahead and signed a funded an eighty million agreement,
a compact agreement MCC agreement with this Ilan government. This

(02:00:30):
was less than a year ago, and this was for
an electricity project that they've been talking about for fifteen years.

Speaker 22 (02:00:36):
And we've counted more than almost a billion.

Speaker 12 (02:00:38):
Dollars in debts or loan or credit, whatever you might
call it, that for the construction of a power plant
that has never been built. And even as we speak,
more than ninety percent of the population of Sweet Town,
the capital of Syralon, do not have electricity. And we
have it on the records that the MCC and the
DFC has given Syrallon four hundred and eighty million in

(02:01:02):
one case FO hundred and twelve million. We're talking about
more than eight hundred million dollars of US tax payers moneys,
you know, given to a government for the construction and
provision of literacy supply that.

Speaker 22 (02:01:12):
Has never been provided. The service is not available.

Speaker 12 (02:01:16):
So if you talk about it withdraw out of funding,
in that case, people are not even going to be
bot at because the money that was announced was not
has not done anything on the ground. So the people
who would be offended or who be affected by that
situation will be the politicians and the corporations and the
companies and the contractors who we are benefiting from these
rogue relationships and investment agreements that we are non transparent,

(02:01:40):
that even violated US laws because you cannot on the books,
you cannot spend US tax payers money in the country
that doesn't respect human right, that doesn't respect the freedom
of his own citizens. So the governmental stralium felt emboldened
by these corporate relationships financial inducements to disregard accountability questions.

(02:02:03):
And it's not just Relion. You can find this across
many of the other countries in Africa. And if you
look at the people who have been complaining, they are
not regular African citizens, right.

Speaker 4 (02:02:14):
And your workers and right, that's what I ask you about.

Speaker 7 (02:02:16):
So the aid gets sent by let's say, USA, I,
d MC, c DFC and some of these international development
finance corporations or institutions, so that it gets sent out.
In your experience, and you've done so much corruption reporting
in your experience, how much of that money gets kind
of stolen by African elites, the early on elites, and
how much of it gets stolen by Western elites who

(02:02:40):
so it never even arrives for it to be stolen
by the elites in Africa.

Speaker 22 (02:02:44):
Yeah, that is the question.

Speaker 12 (02:02:45):
In fact, three years ago we've developed what we call
it the African experce and Illicit Financial Fluids Project. Why
you know, when we look at the corruption on the ground,
the amount of money, whether as from the IMF and
the World Bank that has been given and we don't
see the development. We decided to look at the transnational
dimension of this corrupt arrangement because when you talk about corruption,

(02:03:06):
in most cases, it tends to be localized, being seen
as these government's given money and the African politicians and
African bureau class advance that are still in these money.
And what we've come to realize is that much of
that money, even the African politicians themselves are just pawns
in this whole arrangement where these moneys have been shipped
into offshore accounts and tax heavens and all of that.

Speaker 22 (02:03:30):
So we've been mapping and developing a database of these.

Speaker 12 (02:03:33):
Movement of transnational fonts and how African governments themselves are
just part of an auxiliary of points in this whole
international cricketer in enterprise that has developed, you know, for
at least in.

Speaker 22 (02:03:50):
The last.

Speaker 12 (02:03:52):
Sixty years or sixty five years, So we're looking at
Africa from ninety seventy five to present. So it's difficult
to even assign a percentage in this case, and we've
been that's the troubling question. How much agency can we
are signed through the African politicians themselves who are roped
into these international corruption enterprise and this deals with sovereignty issues,

(02:04:16):
it deals with elections and democratization. We are leaders who
do not play along these lines fall out of favor
with governments and they are easily kicked out of power.
And those who agree to be used to participate in
this international process are aided and are bettered in rigging
elections and consult and the consolidate dictatorships. We saw that

(02:04:39):
in elections in Srilon in June twenty twenty three, where
people voted against the government and elections. People went to
vote and elections the results are still absent. If the
US election monitors themselves said the elections we are non transparent,
but the DFC and MCC continued giving money or signing

(02:05:00):
finance agreements with the salutant government.

Speaker 22 (02:05:03):
So this speaks to the.

Speaker 12 (02:05:06):
Question is something that is that is new that people
need to look into, inviting journalists now increasingly to you know,
to reverse the scale and begin to look at transnationally,
not just on the local African context.

Speaker 22 (02:05:21):
How much money has been stolen.

Speaker 12 (02:05:23):
You take the case of Ibula, much of the funds
that went to roll back in Bula and West Africa
was taken back by international organizations. Some of that is
in my book the non source agreement that it's difficult
to even compute them now.

Speaker 7 (02:05:38):
Now, maybe that's something that we can work on together
and real quickly. Last question for you. I don't know
that Emily has anything else. My sense of how this
plays out on the ground, and here's for your take
on this is that the corruption that this produces ends
up kind of crushing democracy in at least to two

(02:05:58):
different major ways.

Speaker 5 (02:06:00):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (02:06:00):
One is the one that you've talked about, that the
governments that are in power don't feel any obligation to
respond to the will of the public and make reforms
and improve their lives because they know that they have
the backing of these US institutions whether they do it
or not, so why bother with it? But then secondly,

(02:06:22):
by by infecting the system with so much corruption, it
reduces the amount of engagement I would think that regular
people have with their government, because you can have a
social democratic reformer who says he's going to do X
y Z when he gets into office, but the regular
person just thinks he's just as corrupt as anybody else.

(02:06:44):
And so when he gets in, he's going he's it's
just a different flavor of stealing from me. And so
when what that does is it breaks that bond between
the people and the government and makes and makes democracy
just a just a bunch of elections. And then if
the elections don't go the right way, they just changed
They just change accounting like they did in twenty twenty three.

Speaker 4 (02:07:06):
And we had you on to talk about that at
the time.

Speaker 7 (02:07:08):
So is anything is that sense that I have roughly
accurate and like, how would you characterize it?

Speaker 22 (02:07:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 12 (02:07:16):
Absolutely, It just empowers citizens because when you go to
vote and you find out that your vote doesn't count
and your voice doesn't count, it silences people.

Speaker 22 (02:07:27):
It makes mockery of democracy.

Speaker 12 (02:07:29):
It turns neo liberal democracy into a facade where people
do not believe in the electoral process. And this is
dangerous because it opens up ideas people begin to think
about how to actualize their own citizenship, their right to
have a say in government. The key to governance is trust.
There has to be a fundamental trust between citizens and

(02:07:50):
those they elect, where supposedly elected leaders cannot be held
accountable and they cannot be punished when they violate the
social contract between them and electorate.

Speaker 22 (02:08:03):
It is a major problem.

Speaker 12 (02:08:04):
And in the case of Africa, it's not just robbing
African countries of their own sovereignity, their inability to have
a say on the global stage, but also it empowers
regular citizens, especially when countries like the United States back
autopractical leaders in Africa who steal money, who steal votes,

(02:08:26):
and also steal the lives of their own people. You know,
people feel this empowered, they lose faith in government, they
lose trust in their own leaders, and once that happens,
it opens the way for conflict of all kinds. And
this is why you have this instability on top of
the other development and the horrible conditions of poverty. There's
no stability in Africa because people are constantly thinking about

(02:08:48):
how to get rid of this burden that they've been
dealing with for the last sixty five years or more
since so called independence, the transition from direct colonialism to
what we have today. We're in the generous African politicians
from our own communities get elected into offices and they
do not serve the interest of their own people, and
they do not even listen to the interest of their
own people.

Speaker 22 (02:09:08):
That do not care.

Speaker 12 (02:09:09):
They serve the interests of foreign, foreign corporations and those
are the people their account that they are worried about.
They're worried about whether they will be on the good
books of the United States. Right now, many of the
African leaders are worried. They're constantly thinking about hiring lobbies
to be on the good books of the current administration.
Especially in the case of Australian the government that enjoyed

(02:09:29):
treatmendous goodwill from the Biden Harrison administration. Now they're constantly
thinking about how to recalibrate their entire program to be
on the good books of the current new administration in Washington,
because they need that to be able to undertake these
you know, to continue on the road to dictatorship and authoritarianism.
So the United States need to retink it's own relations

(02:09:52):
with these countries. And this is not a partician conversation.
It is way beyond republican or democrat. It deals with
real people's lives. It deals with independence and selfdetermination and
the lives of women and children who have been suffering
for many, many years, who have no other opportunities. All
they want is just peace, to be let alone. To

(02:10:12):
be able to work, free to leave, you know, to
have the minimum standards of existence, electricity, good roads, healthcare.
These are basic human needs and we should be able
to look at this problem beyond outside of these boxes.
Now we've placed ourselves dispartisan boxes. I think that is
the issue. That's the message. Nobody in Africa is against

(02:10:33):
foreign relations. What we are against is that foreign direct
investment or foreign relations should not be conducted at the
expense of the lives and liberty of African citizens. In
the case of Australian we're saying that any such engagement
should have at its call the protection of the lives
and liberty of all salunions, including those of us who
want to hold leaders accountable to the minimum standards of

(02:10:55):
good governance and accountability. They should not be for anyone,
the godless of your party, ideology or persuasion. You should
be able to support this kind of a human demand.
It's a demand for freedom and liberty which everybody around
the world, you know as bis.

Speaker 7 (02:11:14):
Yes, sounds sounds reasonable to Met Chernoba, journalist at the
Africanist Press.

Speaker 4 (02:11:19):
Editor.

Speaker 7 (02:11:20):
I'm an author of the great book The Ebola Outbreak.
Thank you so much for joining us very much, appreciate it.

Speaker 22 (02:11:26):
Thank you for having me.

Speaker 4 (02:11:27):
All Right, that's it for us today. You in here tomorrow.

Speaker 6 (02:11:30):
I don't know, we don't know. Actually Sager doesn't know
what his schedule is.

Speaker 4 (02:11:34):
That's true.

Speaker 6 (02:11:35):
Nobody knows anything.

Speaker 4 (02:11:36):
So just you have to you have to tune in
to find out. Will definitely be here Friday.

Speaker 8 (02:11:40):
It has been fun like having three people, then that
one Friday we had four people. We're just mixing everything up,
having a blast over here. First one hundred days. You
never know what you're going to get from Breaking Points.

Speaker 5 (02:11:51):
That's right.

Speaker 7 (02:11:52):
Except the latest is half the Friday show is for
premium subscribers, so go ahead and join. We're going to
need your help with these with these brutal headwinds thanks
to the trade war, So Breakingpoints dot Com pull the
trigger become a premium subscriber.

Speaker 6 (02:12:07):
That's right. And you know now that we're we're on Fridays.

Speaker 8 (02:12:10):
One of the things we do on those shows is
kind of catch up on some of the big picture
things from the week, and because the trends of the
last week are sort of clear by the Friday news cycle.

Speaker 6 (02:12:19):
So I love doing those.

Speaker 4 (02:12:20):
Yeah, you don't want to miss that.

Speaker 6 (02:12:21):
Yeah, and you know we'll save some of the best
for the second half.

Speaker 7 (02:12:25):
Of course, exactly exactly, yeah, tune in phoning it in
the first half. The premium subs get the good stuff.

Speaker 6 (02:12:30):
Breaking Points dot Com.

Speaker 8 (02:12:31):
And we don't know who will be back here tomorrow
because Sager is awaiting his baby, but we will certainly
have someone here for you.

Speaker 6 (02:12:39):
Make sure to tune in for that. We'll see you
back here soon.

Speaker 4 (02:12:41):
I see you later.

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