Ryan and Emily discuss Bill Burr unleashes on Bill Maher, Canadian nurse speaks on horrors in Gaza, Biden sends another billion to Israel, and Ryan tracks AIPAC's hidden spending in US elections.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here,
and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of
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Speaker 2 (00:08):
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Coverage that is possible.
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If you like what we're all about, it just means
the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that,
let's get to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:25):
Let's move on to Bill Burr who was on Club
Random with Bill Maher and they obviously why not, got
into a conversation about the pro Palestinian demonstrations on campuses
around the country. Lest you think we weren't watching Aaron
Rodgers on Joe Rogan or on Tucker Carlson's show yesterday,
(00:47):
he did weigh in on the Cuba policy of Alan
Dulles inaccurately. By the way, this was a historic first,
I think the first former Green Bay Packers quarterback to
go after Alan Dulles.
Speaker 5 (00:57):
Triumph for him.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
So the podcast universe is thriving and Bill Burr is
is a part of that wonderful ecosystem and Bill Maher
this went pretty viral.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
I think got kind of owned by Bill Burr. Here,
let's take a watch.
Speaker 6 (01:15):
You don't realize that college campus is erupted with the
kids demonstrating for hamas they are in with the terrorists
they were for the Palestinians. Well, it's sort of the
same cause.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Why are you.
Speaker 6 (01:33):
I'm on the side of the kids. Yeah, that's easy
to say. You know, no one wants to see kids dead. Uh,
this is a war. Is very brave of you to
say this is a this is a ward. No, I'm
the one who's actually brave on this.
Speaker 7 (01:45):
It's at yourself on the bed. Easy to say I'm
for the kids. Who's not for the kids? It comes
down to real hard nosed decisions like a country. I'm
talking like your general country got attacked. Israel got attacked.
Speaker 8 (01:58):
I'm not saying that they didn't have a right to
go back. I'm just sitting there going like, how do
I look at the.
Speaker 6 (02:02):
Well, the only country in the world that they get
attacked and then as soon as they counterattack, it's like, well,
we got to stop this ship.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Now, don't attack them.
Speaker 6 (02:09):
Is a very simple solution to all this problem in
the Middle East.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Stop attacking Israel. Hey, you stop attacking Israel, which I do.
Speaker 6 (02:16):
I actually think that's fantastic anyway, all right, we don't
need to get that.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Let let's go to Russia and the Ukraine. How do
you solve that one?
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Bill?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Let me hear your hard.
Speaker 8 (02:26):
Knows decision about that. Well, let me ask you a question,
how is war still legal? All the shit that's been
canceled legal? Why is that still fucking legal?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Would you like a real answer to that?
Speaker 6 (02:36):
Because for something to be illegal, you have to have
the capacity to enforce it, and you can't enforce against
war or else you have to go to war with
the country that's going to war, and we don't want
to go to war with Russia over Ukraine. What would
be the sense of making it illegal that's really going
to stop putin? No, to stop people from going to war,
(02:58):
you have to also put down and talk it out.
Speaker 8 (03:01):
Why can't putent do a podcast with the head guy
like you just solve the Middle East on a podcast.
Why can't they solve what they're doing on a podcast?
Makes why this is not yours? Makes makes some hard
nice just not your thing?
Speaker 5 (03:14):
It's what you need?
Speaker 3 (03:16):
It is it isn't.
Speaker 8 (03:17):
You're like that guy that has a fantasy football team
and thinks he's a fucking GM. No, that's exactly what
it is, Like, why am I fucking listening to you?
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Like like you've done something? What have you done in Washington? Nothing?
That is a great point, Bill Martin, this thing that's
your thing, just getting high like mouthing off.
Speaker 4 (03:38):
I was just saying, yes, which is really your thing.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
But it would be like me saying that I'm some
expert on this. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
I mean you you regularly have covered that, You've been there,
You've interviewed people.
Speaker 5 (03:51):
It qualifies.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
But I feel like Bill mahert here really has celebrity
syndrome where he doesn't realize how poorly he's coming across
when he's sort of like in this very patronizing way
like verbally patting Bill Burr on the head and saying,
this is I got this, don't worry about it.
Speaker 5 (04:10):
My thing.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Your opinion counts as less because I'm.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
A talk show host.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
There was an interesting window into his mind in Bill
Maher's mind for a moment there where Bill Burr says,
I'm with the kids. Bill Maher had just said the
kids are supporting Hamas or whatever, and they're protesting. He
was Bill Burr was referring to the college kids. Yeah,
because Biller had just said the kids, right, Bill Maher's mind,
(04:38):
in his mind, he thinks he's saying that I'm with
the kids who are being slaughtered by Israel.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
That's what I Yeah, that's how I interpreted to.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Bill Maher's mind went to the kids being slaughtered and
then said I'm the courageous one because I'm okay with
the kids being slaughtered because I understand in a hard
headed world that there is no other choice than slaughtering
all these kids. Was fascinating, and it was really high. Well, yeah, clearly,
but that's a window into like I mean, he's high
most of the time, So that's that. It's like a
(05:10):
philosophical question about which Bill maher mind exists. And I
would say, if you're high more than half the time,
then it's the it's the high one.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
I also found that interesting because he was they were
in a conversation directly about the kids on college campuses.
They had both used the word kids in relation to
the kids on college campuses, and as soon as Bill
Burr said that, Bill mahert like the switch flipped and
he jumped on Bill Burr from oh you you say
you're with the Palestinian children. But Bill Burr then going
(05:41):
back and just driving the knife further with that last
comment about what have you done in Washington?
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Yeah, why am I listening to you? It is a
very good question, Like why on earth? I mean, because
it's funny, I guess to watch these two people hopefully,
but yeah, like him pretending like he has him saying
like this is my thing and it's not yours. Get
out of here.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
I actually think one of the great one of the
great benefits of the podcast ecosystem, especially in comedy, has
been the ascension of like the everyman take on politics.
That's like amplified more than it had been.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
In the way Aaron Rodgers and Joe Rogan yesterday.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
Great Tucker Carlson, but Aaron Rodgers is like a great
everyman example. And he even kind of talked about that one.
But it's I mean, like again, part of the problem
with media is the excessive gatekeeping. It doesn't mean that
you know, comedians spatting off about politics or you know,
celebrities spouting off about politics. It doesn't mean that it's
(06:41):
always right, but sometimes those casual conversations are actually pretty
interesting because you get Bill Maher then to like almost
literally like you could see he wanted to lean over.
I think he did even lean over and like touch him,
like pat him on the head and be like it's okay, Bill,
don't worry.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
I got this and so. And nobody's actually in their
heart against gatekeeping. They just want to let different people
through the gate. Like I want to let Bill burthrough
and tell Bill Maher, sorry, your card's been deactivated. You
can't come through this gate.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
So yeah, I say, I'll let Aaron Rodgers to the
gate if he wants to talk about Alan Dlles.
Speaker 5 (07:15):
There you go, I'm on through.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
Let's do it. We'll have that conversation. But anyway, it's
occasionally very fun.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
It is all right.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
Well, we're moving on now to an incredible interview that
you set up. I am excited to talk to Monica Johnston.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
Yeah, stick around. Monica is a Canadian nurse who now
lives in Oregon. She's in a hospital in Conunis called
the European Hospital right now. She was supposed to leave
on Monday, but because Israel has basically locked the doors,
nobody's getting in and out. She and her mission are
still trapped there. She's going to tell us what it's
like in the European Hospital. Stick around for that. We
(07:54):
are joined now from the European Hospital in conmunist Gaza
by Monica Johnston Johnson from Canada currently lives in Oregon,
but is in Conunis at the moment. Monica, thank you
so much for joining us. We really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Thank you for having me so.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
We reported earlier this week about the situation for you
and the others who are on the medical mission to
Conunis is Israel. By taking over the Rafa border and
closing it completely, no supplies have been able to get
in and out, but also no people have been able
to get in and out. I understand your mission was
supposed to leave this week has not been able to.
Yesterday when we spoke, you said the un was going
(08:35):
to do a trial run where they were going to
send staff members on that run and if they were
able to survive the trip from the hospital to Rafa
not be killed by the IDF, that then the next
day medical staff would be able to start leaving. What
is the circumstances with that plan.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, that's exactly right, how you said that.
Speaker 9 (09:03):
So the UN did make their trial run on Monday,
and we were supposed to start trial runs with our
teams yesterday. We got notified that the UN's convoy was successful,
but then ours would not be able to take place yesterday.
So as of now we still have not heard when
(09:23):
we will start those trial runs.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
And you would also told me that they were going
to do about two at a time, which is nowhere
near the entire team, but that you guys were insisting
that you know, to be allowed in. So can you
describe why that is? And how do these how do
these missions work like? And why is it so important
that new humanitarian aid workers be able to come in
to replace you?
Speaker 9 (09:47):
Absolutely, I really don't understand the reasoning. I know there's
multiple mission teams here, so splitting it up to allow
for a few members from each team I think I'm
not sure if it's the IDF for who's limiting the
amount of people in each convoy.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
But and then the prioritization.
Speaker 9 (10:10):
So when we did get word that our convoy was
going to be leaving on when Sorry, it's.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Hard to keep track of the days here. This is
why we need.
Speaker 9 (10:19):
Relief on Tuesday that none of our team members were
selected for that convoy based on some kind of priorities
that the WHO.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Has which we're not privy to. So the reason we
do need that relief is because you know, we're exhausted,
but we can't just leave and abandon the people here.
Speaker 9 (10:43):
Many units are working with only nursing students. Many units
are run by interns and residents, so we need the
support of humanitarian workers to help keep things afloat well.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
And speaking of the you know, actually kind of shifting
from the flow of people to the flow of supplies.
As Ryan mentioned earlier, can you tell us a little
bit about difficulties in getting what you need for medical
treatment to you guys, so that you can do your
jobs and help people be safe and recover from instances
in which you know they were not kept safe.
Speaker 9 (11:17):
Absolutely, So think of a hospital in America, they get
daily shipments of supplies.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Here, we brought in.
Speaker 9 (11:27):
Our team brought in three hundred suitcases for a two
week period. We went through almost all of those supplies
in one week, so you know, we're already coming to
depleted situation. We I guess incorrectly expected certain things like
hand soap, and sanitizer, paper towels to be here, so
we didn't prioritize those items in our three hundred bags
(11:49):
and we get here to find no units have so
no units have hand sanitizer. So some basic things that
help save wise help vent infections, and that's what we're seeing,
just a rampant infection rate and people are dying from this.
So we're running out of antibiotics, We're running out of
(12:09):
wound care supplies, pain medicine, medication that supports vital organs,
We're running out of all of those things. So it's
so desperately needed to reopen the borders.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
And so I noticed in a video that you had
sent to us earlier that you had something, I don't
know the exact term for it, as kind of a
stent in your arm. I if it's too personal to ask,
but can you talk a little bit about what the
situation is like for you and the other medical professionals
that you're with, Like, what's what's going on there that
dehydration or what what are you facing.
Speaker 9 (12:41):
Any of us have just been hit with gastroentritis, so
whether it was something we ate or you know, we
had some water that wasn't purified.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
For the most part, we're drinking bottled water.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
But now we're a little nervous about that supply, so
we've been starting to ration that a little bit more
so rationing that leads to the hydration. It's warm here.
I'm not used to this climate. I'm doing twenty dressing
changes in four hours.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
You know, it's hard, strenuous work.
Speaker 9 (13:10):
So me and my roommate personally, we had gastrotritis, so
you know, we're dehydrated from that.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
We both had ibs for two days.
Speaker 9 (13:22):
I received three and a half liters of fluid and
continued to.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Work as much as I could through that because you know, you're.
Speaker 9 (13:29):
Here and the idea of being in bed sick it
was devastating. I'm here to help and I'm sick and
I can't help, and it just wasn't acceptable.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
And what kind of wounds and illnesses are you guys saying, like,
what's a rough breakdown? Just from your perspective having treated
so many people now.
Speaker 9 (13:51):
So lots of tragic amputations, so explosions and they lose
limbs at the site and then extensive blast injuries with
shrapnel that ends up causing a wound to need to
be amputated later on. So we have those extensive blast
(14:12):
injuries and then burns on top of that, lots of
head injuries with that.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
So if you.
Speaker 9 (14:18):
Imagine a blast and getting thrown out one of my patients,
she's an eleven year.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Old, Oh, this is going to be tough.
Speaker 9 (14:26):
She lost bad and she was found two houses over
from their home, and her and her brother were brought
to our hospital and her brother died in the emergency room.
So she suffered a cut to her head down to
her skull, fractured pelvis, a fractured leg, and extensive blast
(14:52):
injuries to the back side of her legs where it's
going to take months to heal if she doesn't get
infected here and multiple graphs if she doesn't get infected.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
So you know, this is this is what we're seeing
the magnitude.
Speaker 9 (15:09):
I work at a Level one trauma burned center, and
I have not seen this magnitude at this frequency. At
one point, we were getting you know, five, six of
these at a time, and you know, a level one
Trump will.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Struggle with that, let alone a place that has no.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Resources and correct me if I'm wrong. To recover from
injuries like that you generally need more calories, more nutrition
than average. Can you talk a little bit about what
people are, what people have access to, and what the
effect of that is on their recovery?
Speaker 9 (15:48):
Very simply what they have access to is nothing, you know,
or near nothing. We're talking about maybe one can of
ensure for an entire day for one of these wound page.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
That no one can survive.
Speaker 9 (16:04):
On that, let alone someone who has an extensive injury.
Our patients back in America, you know, they fight with
us and say I can eat, I can eat, you know,
and two days later we're putting a feeding tube in
them because you can.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
You just physically can't consume that amount of calories.
Speaker 9 (16:19):
So it's leading to infections, graph losses if we ever
get to that point, further amputations, just so many complications
because of that.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
And somebody from your mission sent us video and control
room if you can put up this vo they send
us this video of the scene from a from a
safe house that some of the medical staff were using.
That's the trip from the safe house to the hospital.
They were then told don't go back to the safe
(16:51):
house anymore. It's not safe, it's too close. We think
the idef might strike it even if they're deconflicting and
give them the coordinates. So I'm curious, did you spend
any time in a safe house and are you hearing shelling?
What's the situation like as we speak with regards to violence.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
So our team in particular has only been at the
hospital staying at the hospital. A couple team members have
ventured out to visit surrounding areas and they just speak
of the devastation kind of like what you have shown
from inside the hospital, which is considered a green zone.
(17:33):
We are hearing shelling all the time on stant whirl
of the drones.
Speaker 9 (17:39):
This morning at six point thirty am was the largest
last that I have ever heard, and it felt like
it was in the next building over.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
It woke me out of a dead.
Speaker 9 (17:52):
Sleep and my heart nearly jumped out of my chest
and I just sat there and I kept waiting.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
I kept waiting for another one, and there were, but
fortunately not for us this time.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
I assume that some of the medical staff who were
Palestinian there were in some of the other hospitals that
have been, you know, raided by the IDEF. What have
have they given you any advice on how to handle
doing this work in this in this war zone, and
what have they told you about their experience in other hospitals.
Speaker 9 (18:29):
So some of the other hospitals, you know, it's just infrastructure.
I think at this point, seven eight months out, the
infrastructure has just gone. So some of the other hospitals
were run a little bit more smoothly.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
This one there's been just so much chaos.
Speaker 9 (18:45):
But I think it's you know, you think of all
the people who have displaced here and have been continually displaced.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
So I heard.
Speaker 9 (18:55):
I'm not sure if this is accurate, but at one
point there was thirteen thousand people occupying our hospital corridors
on this campus here, and you know, when we came,
you had just a small path to walk through the
entire hospital, and there were walls and walls of curtains
(19:16):
and tarts housing off families, little living quarters. So yeah,
other hospitals, I don't think quite they had their own
problems from what I hear, and obviously when they were invaded,
absolutely had issues, but I don't think they had this
mass displacement. To hear, that just is leading to even
(19:37):
more chaos.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
As you're thinking about the possibility of leaving, Like how
do you balance the different factors. On the one hand,
you've got the Palestinians who were in the hospital saying,
you know, if Westerners leave, were all going to be killed.
On the other hand, you need people to replace you
otherwise the thing completely collapses. But then on the third
(20:00):
and you guys are rationing water and running out of supplies.
I assume some are in facing significant health risks. How
are people kind of thinking through the series of terrible
options in front of you?
Speaker 9 (20:13):
Now, this team has been so so amazing.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
I cannot speak to the magnitude of how wonderful this
team is.
Speaker 9 (20:23):
Everybody cares so much about the Palestinian people here. We're
very adamant about the fact that we can't just leave
without replacement.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
But that does mean replacement of not only personnel, but supplies.
We you know, we've kind of learned from the Palestinians
here like to give.
Speaker 9 (20:45):
Like you see them and they have nothing, and they're
constantly inviting you for tea and what little food they
have they're giving and giving. So as a volunteer here,
it's hard not to want to do the same thing
for these people, and the thought of leaving them and
abandoning them is just it's not on our minds.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
You had mentioned by the way that a child had
opened what he thought was a can of tuna and
had one of them had an arm blown off. Is
that a cluster bomb that looks like a can of tuna? What?
What are people finding like in the street there?
Speaker 9 (21:24):
I am I'm not quite certain about that, but I
was called to the OAR to help and I was
told his story. You know, people are hungry, they find
stuff they want to eat, so.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
You know.
Speaker 9 (21:39):
There's potential that these things are getting placed in people's
houses when the IOF is you know, reading homes and
stuff and then affecting people like children are finding them
and when you're hungry.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
You can't blame them, right.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Wow, that's dark.
Speaker 5 (22:02):
Can't blame them?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
That is that is dark? And any any final thoughts
like what what what is what is the understaffing doing?
What's it like working in a hospital that is this understaffed?
And any final thoughts people should know about what the
situation is right now.
Speaker 9 (22:19):
So, yeah, the understaff we've we've gone into the ICU
two mornings now and found patients in a state of
rigor mortis. So that's meaning that they have been dead
for some time. All their IV lines were still running,
they were still hooked up to all the machines and
it showed a flatline on the monitor.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
But there's just no staff to respond. You walk into the.
Speaker 9 (22:44):
ICU and there's alarms twenty four to seven on every
single patient. So, you know, I asked a nurse about
this because I wanted to understand, like, are you exhausted?
Speaker 1 (22:56):
What is it?
Speaker 9 (22:57):
And I eventually got out from or that. When the
patient comes in, they know who's going to live and
who's not. And you know, you only have so many resources,
which includes you know, personal strength and resources, and to
put that emotion and strength into somebody that you know
(23:18):
is not going to make it is too much for
them after such a long period.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Of doing this, So you know, people are dying.
Speaker 9 (23:26):
People are dying, and things aren't getting caught. Just a
lot of extra unneeded death.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I think, Yeah, what portion do you think of people
who are dying? There would not die if they were
in your trauma, if in your facility back in Oregon.
Speaker 9 (23:47):
I mean, I don't I don't know about specific numbers,
but I mean, eighty ninety percent of these injuries are survivable.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Right, just with basic with the with basic supplies and
attention and calories exactly.
Speaker 9 (24:05):
But and that's the hardest thing to sit back and
not have any control over.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
I know it needs to be done, but I have
nothing to do it with.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
What's the prospect for you before we let you go?
What's when? When? When do you expect that you, you
and your team will be able to get out and
get swapped in with a new mission.
Speaker 9 (24:27):
You know, we have our next team sitting in Egypt waiting.
I personally have just kind of settled in.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
I don't know.
Speaker 9 (24:38):
You know, we're promised daily that tomorrow we'll get a
convoy out.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
I can't think about that, you know.
Speaker 9 (24:45):
I'm just taking care of the people here and taking
care of my team.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
And myself right now.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Well, if and when you do get on that convoy,
we we all desperately hope that the IDF does not
fire on it. I hope that the attention that is
finally being paid to this at least helps a little bit.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
Well, Nurse Johnson, thank you so much for everything you're doing.
Deeply appreciate it, Appreciate your time. All right. That was
Nurse Monica Johnston, who's volunteering at the European hospital and
stranded there by Israel siege. Meanwhile, here in the United States,
if you can put up this next element, the Wall
(25:31):
Street Journal broke the news that President Joe Biden is
moving forward with another billion dollars in new weapons for
the very military that is besieging American medical staff in
Gaza at the moment, to be spent mostly on tank shells, mortars,
and other offensive weapons, not just for Gaza presumably, but
(25:56):
also for the saber rattling that Israel is doing worth
with Lebanon. So this comes after, you know, Biden and
the White House made big news by saying that they
were stopping a shipment of three thousand, five hundred bombs
in retaliation basically for Netanyahu rebuffing every American public attempt,
(26:20):
I say public attempt rather than private attempt to stop
them from launching this rafa invasion that is killing all
of the people that that nurse Johnson just described to us. Afterwards,
Young Kirby said, look, Israel's getting all the weapons that
it needs. I don't understand what everybody's so upset about,
because we stopped these this one shipment of three thousand,
(26:42):
five hundred bombs. There are other reports that Israel was saying, look,
we already have all the weapons we need to invade Rafa.
Now doesn't mean it's not a symbolic shift perhaps, but
that doesn't help the people who are going to be
on the receiving end of these tank shells. I don't think.
Speaker 4 (26:58):
And so Acxios has this morning as well that Yahoo
has been ranting that Israel quote isn't a vassal state
of the United States, which.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I meant this point.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
It's so he says.
Speaker 4 (27:15):
According to one of his aids, he said, we are
not a vassal state of the United States. According to
three people of his remarks, including with knowledge of his remarks,
including one of his aids, this was in on a
rant in a meeting with his security cabinet. So obviously
the relationship has actually put it here is quote strained
at the moment, and Biden is trying to deal with
(27:36):
that in different ways that I have that are amounting
to this is nothing new but a completely inconsistent hodgepodge
policy towards this war that makes absolutely no sense.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
And this is what I don't get. Okay, you're not
a vassal state. Fine, then arm yourself.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
Well, they arm yourself in don't repeatedly say over and
over again that we could not fight this war without
the Americans. And so if you can't fight a war
that is existential, And I agree, I think this is
I think Israel faces existential threats from people around it,
And we may disagree in that, but I think that's true.
But you know Netanyahu, his security cabinet that said the
(28:20):
stakes of this war are existential, and we can't do
it without the Americans.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
Well, I mean, I think also destiny. Actually a good
point that he made in that debate that we had
was it's no longer existential that they are an industrial economy,
like they're powerful enough on their own.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
That American supports not existential.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
That in general, like Lebanon's not going to overrun them.
Hamas with whatever ten thousand fighters it's got left, is
not going to overrun them. Jordan's certainly isn't in any
mood to go to war with Egypt is not invading
Saudi Arabia, and the UAE just want to do business
like their place is secure. In that sense, It's not
(29:02):
like nineteen seventy three where you have Arab states who
are actually like will willing to like launch a military
invasion that that's over, Like that's done even without I
think American military support anymore. And a mass just doesn't
have the potential. And the Palestinian authority is a subcon
contractor of the Israeli government, So I've been many subcontracts,
(29:26):
subcontractors who have kind of taken over government. So that's
that's unlikely. Yeah, but yeah, tactical vehicles, mortar shells, tank shells,
all of the weapons that they're using to just annihilate RAFA,
and that we're going to send a billion a billion
dollars more, nice round number.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
Well, it's the same thing with the Biden Do you
care about what are defined internationally as war crimes or not?
I mean they care about it when it's putin, they
don't care about it. It's just obviously everyone knows at
this point that it's bullshit. But it's a Biden administration
that continues to enforce these like bullshit ideas about how
(30:08):
the war is being prosecuted and what international law is
supposed to look like when it's convenient and again not
new in American politics, not new in world politics, but
to maintain that posture and to have it, you know,
informing armshipments and very specific policy details in such an
uneven and inconsistent way just politically even for Biden a
(30:32):
disaster let alone, you know what it's actually doing in
the war.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
Yeah, and the American Medical Mission is an interesting proxy
on this. Hn Kaudrey and I over at the Intercept
broke this news on Monday that was that this was happening,
and it's it's an interesting proxy. Not in the sense
that American lives are inherently worth more than Palestinian lives.
They aren't. And I spoke previously with Nurse Johnson and
(30:57):
she was saying the same thing that she can tell
just that politically that everybody just acknowledges that American lives
are more valuable than Palestinian lives, including the Palestinians. That
the Palestinians will say, we really hope that if you leave,
that other Westerners come in and replace you, because otherwise
we're all going to be slaughtered like we need like
(31:20):
those are that's those are actual human shields, like Americans
shielding other civilians because the thinking is that the IDF
is not willing to kill in mass American citizens but
that thinking is even being challenged, like the UN convoy
was fired on Monday, killing a foreign driver of that vehicle.
(31:42):
Now they're having intense difficulties. So we broke this on Monday,
Washington Post, and we see others have since followed up
in the reporting. Yeah, so it's it's a global story
at this point. People know that there are these American
citizens and Canadian citizens trapped in this hospital. If netnya
who cared, he could do he could easily resolve this situation.
(32:06):
They control this area. Okay, seven minute drive from that
hospital to Rafa, they control the border crossing Monica could
be out within the next hour. If Netnah who cared
and net Yah who knows that they're trapped there, they
don't have the supplies they need, that the American citizens
and Canadian citizens are themselves facing serious health complications, and
(32:31):
instead she's woken up by the biggest shelling that she's
ever heard since being there at six thirty this morning.
He knows they're there, and they're shelling right nearby. Anyway,
they're being told to stay away from windows, and it
really does upend this assumption that your American passport or
your Canadian passport gives you any protection even as we're
(32:56):
sending them another billion dollars in weapons, and.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
You know, just as we're because you have been an interesting,
more interesting reporting to talk about. But as we're wrapping
this up, there are how many American hostages about five
American hostages that are still remaining and barely even talk
about that. But you know, speaking of on that point,
a producer, Max sent a tweet from Dennis Ross yesterday
(33:21):
where he says, one thing is clear, the fact that
the idea of has to go back into Jibalia and
other places in zuman units.
Speaker 5 (33:28):
Actually, speaking of what we were just talking about with Nurse.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
Johnston is a reminder that no plan existed for what
would replace Hamas. Yes, Hamas is weakened, but without an
alternative to it, it will fill the vacuum. And Israel
needs an answer. So from the interest of the United States,
the American hostages that are still being held, American aid
workers that you reported on shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Held hostage being how should more American hostages in that
hospital than being held by Hamas.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Now And just from the pure perspective of again the
interests of actual Americans over there, But how has Biden
handled this situation. How does the Biden administration advanced American
interests in this situation?
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Pretty damning.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Yeah, as Biden said, if you harm an American, we'll respond. Yeah,
terms and conditions apply, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 10 (34:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
All right, Ray, you have some more reporting on a
PAK in the United States in the campaign atmosphere as
recreding into November.
Speaker 5 (34:27):
What have you got?
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Yeah, well, I'm all worked up about this. Let's talk
about APAX influence in the third Congressional District out in Oregon.
About two weeks ago, two candidates in an Oregon congressional
race held a rare joint press conference where they leveled
a charge against a third candidate. Take a listen to
the local news coverage.
Speaker 11 (34:44):
Moving on, we wanted to bring you an update now
to a story we told you about last night, the
heated three way race for the third congressional district in
Oregon that's Earl Blumenauer's seat in Congress. Last week, two
of the candidates, Shushila Jayapaul and Eddie Morales, held her
a press conference accusing the candidate, Maxine Dexter, of taking
dark money washed through a super pac called three fourteen Action.
(35:07):
They claimed without any evidence that three fourteen Action could
be a front for far right donors looking to take
them out of the race.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
The candidate getting all that dark Bunny support is Maxine Dexter,
a state representative and local doctor. At a debate, she
was pressed by her opponent Eddie Morales to name the
source of the funding. Take a listen.
Speaker 12 (35:26):
I want to spend the last second of mine asking Maxine, MAXI,
will you look at the camera until Auction three, one, five,
three or four Action to disclose their donors before May twentieth?
Speaker 5 (35:37):
Do you yes? I observedly answer the question.
Speaker 10 (35:40):
It is absolutely They are legally obligated to.
Speaker 5 (35:44):
Disclose there before the day before the election.
Speaker 10 (35:47):
Eddie, you understand as well as I do.
Speaker 12 (35:49):
This is the public forum. You can tell them and
this is.
Speaker 10 (35:51):
It is a public forum. And I believe in discussion
and deliberation.
Speaker 11 (35:55):
Enom funding.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
You absolutely not.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
I've not taken Okay, I have to there, but I
need to let Nextine have a final word here.
Speaker 10 (36:02):
I will just say that this entire thing is frankly absurd.
I have put my values on record. I have four
years of voting records on progressive values. I have stood
firm with people who have supported me, and against people
who have supported me. I took an oath of office,
and I've taken an oath as a physician to keep
(36:24):
people at the center and do no harm. My integrity
is frankly being questioned here, which is absolutely offensive.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
All right, Well, we don't want to offend anybody, and
of course anybody accused of anything without evidence ought to
have a chance to defend themselves. So let's take a
closer look. And to be fair to accusers, it did
look off random. State representatives don't generally find themselves on
the winning end of millions of dollars of super pac
spending for no reason. And Soshilajyapaul the candidate in the middle.
(36:55):
There is the older sister of Promilagia Paul, one of
apacs most concerted adversaries on Capitol Hill and the powerful
chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. APAC had been unsuccessfully
recruiting a challenger to Primilagiapoul in her Seattle district. Now,
looking for clues as to who might be funding the
dark money operation, you could turn to the news outlet
(37:17):
Jewish Insider, which does a great job covering congressional primaries
through an Israel Palestine prism. In early December, Jewish Insider
flagged Sushila Jyapaul's candidacy as alarming to Israel advocates, elevating
the potential candidacy of Dexter as a strong opponent. So
after a few days of reporting, I confirmed it was
(37:38):
indeed APAC, and I found two sources who had knowledge
of how specifically APAK had begun playing in the race
without disclosing its role. It was routing money indeed through
the Pro Science quote unquote Pro Science superPAC called three
fourteen Action Fund. So I published that story on May
tenth at the Intercept. Now here's our friends at the
local TV station again. Three Fourteen's response.
Speaker 11 (38:01):
Jaiapaul and Morales are demanding that Dexter tell three fourteen
Action to reveal the donors. Now they say they think
they could be related to pro Israel group APAK, and
some recent reporting from the news outlet The Intercept supports
that claim. We reached out to three fourteen Action Group
yesterday and they did respond to us. We asked if
(38:22):
MAGA Republicans are among their donors. They didn't outright say no,
but they did say that they've spent tens of millions
of dollars backing other Democrats to defeat mega Republicans in
other states. They also said there's no evidence to support
a claim that APAK is among their donors, and that
they disclose their donors every reporting cycle and follow the
(38:43):
letter of the law. So again not outright denying that
APAC is involved, just there's no evidence there yet.
Speaker 3 (38:49):
So the Portland Mercury did some strong follow up reporting
on the race midweek, but Maxine Dexter continued to profess
ignorance even in the face of that reporting. But then
undeniable pieces of evidence began to emerge. While the Superpacks
aren't required to disclose their donors until the day before
the election, the candidate herself has to disclose regularly down
(39:12):
the campaign stretch, so she had to produce what's called
a forty eight hour report after a May seventh fundraiser.
Now at that fundraiser, of the nearly eighty donors who
gave that day, nearly ninety percent are also donors to
a pack. In other words, it was an Apack fundraiser,
which you can find out just by searching the names
of those donors on the site there. The next day,
(39:35):
Dexter disclosed having raised nearly six hundred thousand dollars in
the month of April, after raising just about three hundred
thousand dollars during her entire campaign before that. Doubling or
tripling your fundraising in the last few weeks of the
race is not typical. That is not normal. And inside
that six hundred thousand dollars were scores of additional Apack donors.
(39:58):
Of the ones we checked, we gave up after while
because it was it was pointless. It was very obvious
what was going on. But Okay, maybe it's a huge
coincidence that Apack donors are giving to her campaign, but
it's not a packed donors who are behind the super
Pac spending. How do we know Apak actually organized all this? Well.
I called one of the donors on the list and
got through to her. This is Jney Dallisman. At first
(40:21):
she said she didn't remember giving to Dexter at all.
When I told her the three thy three hundred dollars
donation of hers was in the FEC records, it clicked
for her. She said, quote, I give all of my
contributions through a pack whenever I am asked to give
to their endorsed candidates. I give so Dexter is an
endorsed candidate, even though that's not public. If that wasn't
(40:43):
enough to put the pieces together, a staffer at three
fourteen Action Fund, angry that a pack ostensibly dedicated to
electing candidates with a science background was having its mission
distorted to support pro Israel candidates, reached out to me
to share inside information. They told me directly about the
nature of the APACK driven operation. It was a pack.
(41:06):
Three fourteen took to Twitter to respond to my article,
but did so four minutes before I even published it,
and they accidentally denied the wrong thing they wrote here.
Ryan Graham from The Intercept is once again making up
stories out of thin air. His latest accusation that three
fourteen Action is a front group, or that three fourteen
will be spending against Representative Corey Bush as a complete fabrication.
(41:28):
But I had not, in fact reported that three fourteen
Action was expanding its campaign to target Bush directly. I
reported that three fourteen, with the heat on them, was
planning to set up a shell pack they could funnel
APAC money through, and so Emily, I think what's going
on here. So if you're trying, here's the question people
would ask, like, if you try to put together this
(41:49):
plan that you're that voters are not going to find
out that it's a PAC money until May twentieth, and
the election is May twenty first, and Oregon is mail balloting,
so everybody basically will voted by that's late enough. Why
would you schedule a May seventh fundraiser when you know
you're going to have to disclose those donors forty eight
hours later? And from what I've heard from people involved
(42:10):
in this is that they thought they would get away
with it, that nobody would notice that it's Oregon, it's
a small race, it's a small race. Who cares not
even an incumbent. It's an incumbent sister, but it's not
an incumbent.
Speaker 5 (42:22):
Presumably has nothing to do with foreign policy.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
Yeah, it's like the race is about homelessness, basically, Like
that's the big issue that they're that they're running their
ads on. The APAC funded ads are hitting Giapaul because
she was on the County Commission, and the County Commission
did a legitimately terrible job when it comes to a homelessness.
So actually that's like, that's a clean hit. It's just
(42:46):
let's not pretend that APAC cares like that's not their mission.
Their mission is not to eradicate homelessness in Portland.
Speaker 5 (42:53):
Why does APAC care about this?
Speaker 3 (42:54):
Seriously, from everything I've been able to gather, a Giapaul
is no a It supports an immediate ceasefire and is generally,
you know, sympathetic with the pill Palst and cause and
critical of apacad. She doesn't want a PAC money, et cetera.
But it's it's it's to get at Pramila Giapaul, I
(43:14):
see because Pramila that makes more sense. So the Squad
are their most outspoken kind of opponents that are elevated
in the press. But Giapaul has more power in the
caucus itself, ninety to one hundred members of Progressive Caucus.
She shares that caucus. She has a direct line to
the White House's She can make things happen in ways
(43:37):
that members of the Squad can't. They and according to
my reporting, they very much tried to recruit an opponent
to her. They ran polling in Seattle trying to find
ways that that she would be soft. They would have
been willing to spend I'm sure million, many millions of dollars.
They're spending twenty plus million to take out Jamal Bowman.
They could spend millions to take out Giapoul, but they
(43:59):
couldn't find a challenger. They have, she got one challenger
at the very last minute. But the person seems like
a bit of a crank, like running in like four
different races. Is the very outspoken pro is real person
in that But it's I don't think that's an APAC recruit.
And so if you can't go after Giapaul directly in Seattle, hey,
here's her sister who I should have played audio of her.
(44:21):
You saw she looks just like her. She also sounds
just like her. You're like, there's no way that's a
different person.
Speaker 4 (44:26):
It's got to be the same person. Once agains are wrong.
Speaker 3 (44:30):
Right, sources are wrong. So but I think the reason
that they held the APEC fundraiser on the seventh is
that they knew they'd have to disclose, but they didn't
think anybody care by that point, right, and then okay,
maybe somebody flags it in the by May ninth. At
that point it takes a week to report it out. Now,
it's towards now it's basically election day, and because you
(44:54):
need the reporting early enough that the candidates can then
get it out to voters not all watching counterpoints and
reading the intercept, but they should be. But believe or not,
they're not, so you have to so there has to
be the local news has to pick it up, which
is which is now starting to happen. Uh. The sheer
amount of money being spent probably is enough to overwhelm
(45:17):
and elect Dexter.
Speaker 5 (45:18):
It's a crazy amount.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
I mean, it might blow back now that it's now
that it's out and the local press is finally starting
to cover it in a in a better way. You
saw that one because they that that news outlet had
done some dismissive reporting in the past, saying like, oh
this is there's nothing to this, but now they're But
now when they got three fourteen's response, they're like, hmm.
Speaker 5 (45:37):
Maybe Ryan Groom sources.
Speaker 3 (45:39):
Are right, Maybe are right, this is this is actually
not a denial, because that's the funny thing. Just disclose
your donor Yeah, of course. And I think three fourteen
went so aggressive in its public response because they didn't
know that I had an internal source of theirs, and
so just a note for the organizations, like wait until
(45:59):
the article comes out, or call me like I emailed them,
like gave my number, call me then you can find
out what I've got and then you can shape your
response instead. I've never seen a more desperate and guilty
looking response.
Speaker 4 (46:12):
I like how they responded to the wrong thing too. Yeah,
it's just great all around.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Right.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
And the other reason they wouldn't endorse directly through three
fourteen action with Bush is that Bush's opponent is Guy
Wesley Bell, who's a prosecutor. He's not a scientist, like
they're supposed to only endorse scientists and doctors, So they'd
have to set up a different pack. There's one in
Portland called Americans for Responsive Government No No Voters for
(46:39):
Responsive Government. That they registered it on April first, because
if you registered it on March thirty first, then they
would have to disclose by the end of the month.
April first means they don't have to disclose until May twentieth. Now,
let's give APEC credit where it's due. They beat the
Capitol police officer, Harry Dunn. They did in Maryland's third
(47:01):
district last night for some reason, and people still to
this day do not know why they decided to spend
millions of dollars backing local state legislator Sarah Elfreth. Harry
Dunn had never really said anything critical of Israel. Why
they decided to make a January sixth Capitol police officer,
(47:24):
the guy that they spent millions of target is actually
unknown at this point. They also try to beat this Democrat,
Dave min in a primary in California, who also had
not said anything. Both of them non white, and there's
some suspicion that like, if you are non white, APAC
(47:45):
believes APAK is suspicious of your politics when it comes
to Palestinians until otherwise, until proven otherwise. They've done a
trip there and you know, done your I would be
nice if they would tell us. They don't they they
don't tell us. But the most fun news out of Maryland,
as we talked about at the top of the show,
(48:06):
is that David Trone, Yeah it was a good one,
lost to Angela also Brooks. David Trone is the owner
of Total Wine, which great store. Terrible person. He's famously
spent like something like fourteen million dollars trying to win
Jamie Raskin's seat.
Speaker 5 (48:26):
I thought it was more than that.
Speaker 3 (48:27):
It might have been he, but this is a primary,
a House primary. Not only did he lose to Raskin,
he lost to Chris Matthews's wife, who got finished second,
who was a famous local news anchor in her own
right in DC. He finished third, not only spending the
most money to lose a House primary in history, didn't
(48:48):
even finish the second. So then he switched and he
moved out to western Maryland and John Delaney left office,
so he was able to buy his way into that seat.
Tried to spend sixty plus million dollars to win the
Senate seat. Everybody thought it was his to win, but
Angela also Brooks beat him. She won with basically basically
(49:09):
Baltimore City PG and Charles County in Maryland, but she
also take a little Kent County prerogative. She's currently tied,
so I'm from king went to Kent County High School.
Kent County is a small county over on the very rural,
small county over on the eastern Shore. I haven't checked
the very latest. When I checked this morning, she was
tied seven two to seven twenty two in the in
(49:34):
Kent County with Trone, So I don't even have to
ask my mom. I'm sure she was also Brooks.
Speaker 4 (49:41):
Yeah, so they're now fifty four to forty one point nine,
So fifty four to forty two roughly overall, and then
in Kent.
Speaker 5 (49:52):
It's forty eight forty eight right now.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
Do they have the vote totals? It was flairity.
Speaker 4 (49:57):
We've see about fifteen hundred total votes right now. Okay, yeah,
so it's dead. He high ballgame in Kent County.
Speaker 5 (50:04):
As a wise woman once said.
Speaker 3 (50:05):
There's no Total Wine in Kent County.
Speaker 5 (50:07):
Money can't buy you class.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
Money can't buy you class. It's true, It's it's awesome.
It's great to see Trone beaten.
Speaker 5 (50:14):
It's always good to see money.
Speaker 3 (50:16):
Yes, not win the day the stole, like the Stoller's
anti monopoly crowd went after Trone and a super pack
basically launched a campaign hitting him on anti trust stuff.
Speaker 5 (50:29):
Because anti trust super.
Speaker 3 (50:30):
Pack, Yeah, because Total Wine is engaged in all sorts
of anti trust violations allegedly and is in the process
of getting prosecuted basically, and so and Trone politically is
like an anti anti trust. He's a pro trust. He's
for trusts because he is a he is a trust owner,
(50:53):
he owns a trust and so allegedly, basically, what the
Total Wine does is it suppressed, is it it punishes
supple and it gets better, It gets better deals on
booze than the mom and pops do. And it was
allegedly enforcing that in a pretty kind of ruthless way.
And what's amazing is during this campaign, David Trone's company
(51:17):
sued the Biden administration in relation to this fight that
they're having. So a Democratic senator running for a Democratic
Senate seat sued the Democratic president over anti trust policy
while he was running for Senate. Democratic voters said no,
(51:39):
so good for them.
Speaker 4 (51:40):
I was going to say that this segment was peak Portland,
but it has now become peak Ryan Grimm because what
started as a deep investigation into the various meddling of
a pac turned into a rant about the pro trust
organization structurally of Total Wine.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
I'm not sure how we got there, but you.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
Didn't see it coming. That was a Shamalan style.
Speaker 3 (52:06):
But here it's all about big money.
Speaker 5 (52:08):
All about big money. Yeah, that's the overhanging.
Speaker 3 (52:12):
And so the election is May twenty first in Portland
we'll see, like if they lose this despite spending millions
of dollars against Jaya Paul, that would be a huge
blow to them because that would leave them with just
Harry Dunn so far as the person they beat. They
and the January sixth protesters are the only ones that
(52:34):
have beaten Harry done and nobody else.
Speaker 4 (52:37):
Well, best of luck to Apak going forward. And that
does it for us on today's Wednesday edition of Counterpoints.
But of course we now do a wonderful Friday show
and that will be this week conversation with betto Work.
I imagine they'll be some debate back and forth. We
haven't taped it yet, but a conversation with Betoo Work
on the border, and that's really exciting.
Speaker 5 (52:58):
I really appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Setting that up right, Yeah, love Betto. I uh first
interviewed Beto when he was a El Paso City councilman
because he was pushing a pot legalization initiative referendum in
like not a reference, just a little resolution in like
two thousand and nine. I interviewed him for that and
(53:21):
I interviewed the sitting congressman at the time, and the
congressman said, if this passes the El Paso City Council,
like federal funding is going to be at risk. Beto
took that as a threat that how dare you threaten
federal funds over my pot resolution? And Beto ran against
him for Congress after reading that and beat him in
(53:42):
the primary. He was a border patrol guard, so he
beat a border patrol guard to get the Congress.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
You guys are just jen X.
Speaker 4 (53:49):
Yeah, brothers, we are yea brothers and the brothers in
the plant.
Speaker 3 (53:54):
Yeah exactly.
Speaker 4 (53:56):
You got a clubhouse because this is a treehouse. You
just like smoke weed and skateboard and listen to Nirvana.
Speaker 3 (54:03):
Yeah, we're not going to sell out man, but really
looking forward. Yeah all right, So come back Thursday night
Friday for Counterpoints Friday with Beto o'rourk. Otherwise Crystal Sograby
here tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (54:18):
And stay tuned of course to your inbox for just
updates on the greater Breaking Points universe going forward.
Speaker 5 (54:24):
And we'll see you next week. Ryan will see you
early next week.
Speaker 3 (54:26):
That's right, I'll be there Tuesday. Also, you get a
lot of me next week. All right, see you guys later.
Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here,
and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of
ways we can up our game for this critical election.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade
the studio ad staff give you, guys, the best independent.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
Coverage that is possible.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
If you like what we're all about, it just means
the absolute world to have your support. But enough with that,
let's get to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:25):
Let's move on to Bill Burr who was on Club
Random with Bill Maher and they obviously why not, got
into a conversation about the pro Palestinian demonstrations on campuses
around the country. Lest you think we weren't watching Aaron
Rodgers on Joe Rogan or on Tucker Carlson's show yesterday,
(00:47):
he did weigh in on the Cuba policy of Alan
Dulles inaccurately. By the way, this was a historic first,
I think the first former Green Bay Packers quarterback to
go after Alan Dulles.
Speaker 5 (00:57):
Triumph for him.
Speaker 4 (00:59):
So the podcast universe is thriving and Bill Burr is
is a part of that wonderful ecosystem and Bill Maher
this went pretty viral.
Speaker 5 (01:10):
I think got kind of owned by Bill Burr. Here,
let's take a watch.
Speaker 6 (01:15):
You don't realize that college campus is erupted with the
kids demonstrating for hamas they are in with the terrorists
they were for the Palestinians. Well, it's sort of the
same cause.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Why are you.
Speaker 6 (01:33):
I'm on the side of the kids. Yeah, that's easy
to say. You know, no one wants to see kids dead. Uh,
this is a war. Is very brave of you to
say this is a this is a ward. No, I'm
the one who's actually brave on this.
Speaker 7 (01:45):
It's at yourself on the bed. Easy to say I'm
for the kids. Who's not for the kids? It comes
down to real hard nosed decisions like a country. I'm
talking like your general country got attacked. Israel got attacked.
Speaker 8 (01:58):
I'm not saying that they didn't have a right to
go back. I'm just sitting there going like, how do
I look at the.
Speaker 6 (02:02):
Well, the only country in the world that they get
attacked and then as soon as they counterattack, it's like, well,
we got to stop this ship.
Speaker 3 (02:08):
Now, don't attack them.
Speaker 6 (02:09):
Is a very simple solution to all this problem in
the Middle East.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Stop attacking Israel. Hey, you stop attacking Israel, which I do.
Speaker 6 (02:16):
I actually think that's fantastic anyway, all right, we don't
need to get that.
Speaker 3 (02:20):
Let let's go to Russia and the Ukraine. How do
you solve that one?
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Bill?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Let me hear your hard.
Speaker 8 (02:26):
Knows decision about that. Well, let me ask you a question,
how is war still legal? All the shit that's been
canceled legal? Why is that still fucking legal?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Would you like a real answer to that?
Speaker 6 (02:36):
Because for something to be illegal, you have to have
the capacity to enforce it, and you can't enforce against
war or else you have to go to war with
the country that's going to war, and we don't want
to go to war with Russia over Ukraine. What would
be the sense of making it illegal that's really going
to stop putin? No, to stop people from going to war,
(02:58):
you have to also put down and talk it out.
Speaker 8 (03:01):
Why can't putent do a podcast with the head guy
like you just solve the Middle East on a podcast.
Why can't they solve what they're doing on a podcast?
Makes why this is not yours? Makes makes some hard
nice just not your thing?
Speaker 5 (03:14):
It's what you need?
Speaker 3 (03:16):
It is it isn't.
Speaker 8 (03:17):
You're like that guy that has a fantasy football team
and thinks he's a fucking GM. No, that's exactly what
it is, Like, why am I fucking listening to you?
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Like like you've done something? What have you done in Washington? Nothing?
That is a great point, Bill Martin, this thing that's
your thing, just getting high like mouthing off.
Speaker 4 (03:38):
I was just saying, yes, which is really your thing.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
But it would be like me saying that I'm some
expert on this. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
I mean you you regularly have covered that, You've been there,
You've interviewed people.
Speaker 5 (03:51):
It qualifies.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
But I feel like Bill mahert here really has celebrity
syndrome where he doesn't realize how poorly he's coming across
when he's sort of like in this very patronizing way
like verbally patting Bill Burr on the head and saying,
this is I got this, don't worry about it.
Speaker 5 (04:10):
My thing.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Your opinion counts as less because I'm.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
A talk show host.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
There was an interesting window into his mind in Bill
Maher's mind for a moment there where Bill Burr says,
I'm with the kids. Bill Maher had just said the
kids are supporting Hamas or whatever, and they're protesting. He
was Bill Burr was referring to the college kids. Yeah,
because Biller had just said the kids, right, Bill Maher's mind,
(04:38):
in his mind, he thinks he's saying that I'm with
the kids who are being slaughtered by Israel.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
That's what I Yeah, that's how I interpreted to.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Bill Maher's mind went to the kids being slaughtered and
then said I'm the courageous one because I'm okay with
the kids being slaughtered because I understand in a hard
headed world that there is no other choice than slaughtering
all these kids. Was fascinating, and it was really high. Well, yeah, clearly,
but that's a window into like I mean, he's high
most of the time, So that's that. It's like a
(05:10):
philosophical question about which Bill maher mind exists. And I
would say, if you're high more than half the time,
then it's the it's the high one.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
I also found that interesting because he was they were
in a conversation directly about the kids on college campuses.
They had both used the word kids in relation to
the kids on college campuses, and as soon as Bill
Burr said that, Bill mahert like the switch flipped and
he jumped on Bill Burr from oh you you say
you're with the Palestinian children. But Bill Burr then going
(05:41):
back and just driving the knife further with that last
comment about what have you done in Washington?
Speaker 3 (05:49):
Yeah, why am I listening to you? It is a
very good question, Like why on earth? I mean, because
it's funny, I guess to watch these two people hopefully,
but yeah, like him pretending like he has him saying
like this is my thing and it's not yours. Get
out of here.
Speaker 4 (06:03):
I actually think one of the great one of the
great benefits of the podcast ecosystem, especially in comedy, has
been the ascension of like the everyman take on politics.
That's like amplified more than it had been.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
In the way Aaron Rodgers and Joe Rogan yesterday.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
Great Tucker Carlson, but Aaron Rodgers is like a great
everyman example. And he even kind of talked about that one.
But it's I mean, like again, part of the problem
with media is the excessive gatekeeping. It doesn't mean that
you know, comedians spatting off about politics or you know,
celebrities spouting off about politics. It doesn't mean that it's
(06:41):
always right, but sometimes those casual conversations are actually pretty
interesting because you get Bill Maher then to like almost
literally like you could see he wanted to lean over.
I think he did even lean over and like touch him,
like pat him on the head and be like it's okay, Bill,
don't worry.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
I got this and so. And nobody's actually in their
heart against gatekeeping. They just want to let different people
through the gate. Like I want to let Bill burthrough
and tell Bill Maher, sorry, your card's been deactivated. You
can't come through this gate.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
So yeah, I say, I'll let Aaron Rodgers to the
gate if he wants to talk about Alan Dlles.
Speaker 5 (07:15):
There you go, I'm on through.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
Let's do it. We'll have that conversation. But anyway, it's
occasionally very fun.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
It is all right.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
Well, we're moving on now to an incredible interview that
you set up. I am excited to talk to Monica Johnston.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
Yeah, stick around. Monica is a Canadian nurse who now
lives in Oregon. She's in a hospital in Conunis called
the European Hospital right now. She was supposed to leave
on Monday, but because Israel has basically locked the doors,
nobody's getting in and out. She and her mission are
still trapped there. She's going to tell us what it's
like in the European Hospital. Stick around for that. We
(07:54):
are joined now from the European Hospital in conmunist Gaza
by Monica Johnston Johnson from Canada currently lives in Oregon,
but is in Conunis at the moment. Monica, thank you
so much for joining us. We really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Thank you for having me so.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
We reported earlier this week about the situation for you
and the others who are on the medical mission to
Conunis is Israel. By taking over the Rafa border and
closing it completely, no supplies have been able to get
in and out, but also no people have been able
to get in and out. I understand your mission was
supposed to leave this week has not been able to.
Yesterday when we spoke, you said the un was going
(08:35):
to do a trial run where they were going to
send staff members on that run and if they were
able to survive the trip from the hospital to Rafa
not be killed by the IDF, that then the next
day medical staff would be able to start leaving. What
is the circumstances with that plan.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, that's exactly right, how you said that.
Speaker 9 (09:03):
So the UN did make their trial run on Monday,
and we were supposed to start trial runs with our
teams yesterday. We got notified that the UN's convoy was successful,
but then ours would not be able to take place yesterday.
So as of now we still have not heard when
(09:23):
we will start those trial runs.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
And you would also told me that they were going
to do about two at a time, which is nowhere
near the entire team, but that you guys were insisting
that you know, to be allowed in. So can you
describe why that is? And how do these how do
these missions work like? And why is it so important
that new humanitarian aid workers be able to come in
to replace you?
Speaker 9 (09:47):
Absolutely, I really don't understand the reasoning. I know there's
multiple mission teams here, so splitting it up to allow
for a few members from each team I think I'm
not sure if it's the IDF for who's limiting the
amount of people in each convoy.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
But and then the prioritization.
Speaker 9 (10:10):
So when we did get word that our convoy was
going to be leaving on when Sorry, it's.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Hard to keep track of the days here. This is
why we need.
Speaker 9 (10:19):
Relief on Tuesday that none of our team members were
selected for that convoy based on some kind of priorities
that the WHO.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Has which we're not privy to. So the reason we
do need that relief is because you know, we're exhausted,
but we can't just leave and abandon the people here.
Speaker 9 (10:43):
Many units are working with only nursing students. Many units
are run by interns and residents, so we need the
support of humanitarian workers to help keep things afloat well.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
And speaking of the you know, actually kind of shifting
from the flow of people to the flow of supplies.
As Ryan mentioned earlier, can you tell us a little
bit about difficulties in getting what you need for medical
treatment to you guys, so that you can do your
jobs and help people be safe and recover from instances
in which you know they were not kept safe.
Speaker 9 (11:17):
Absolutely, So think of a hospital in America, they get
daily shipments of supplies.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
Here, we brought in.
Speaker 9 (11:27):
Our team brought in three hundred suitcases for a two
week period. We went through almost all of those supplies
in one week, so you know, we're already coming to
depleted situation. We I guess incorrectly expected certain things like
hand soap, and sanitizer, paper towels to be here, so
we didn't prioritize those items in our three hundred bags
(11:49):
and we get here to find no units have so
no units have hand sanitizer. So some basic things that
help save wise help vent infections, and that's what we're seeing,
just a rampant infection rate and people are dying from this.
So we're running out of antibiotics, We're running out of
(12:09):
wound care supplies, pain medicine, medication that supports vital organs,
We're running out of all of those things. So it's
so desperately needed to reopen the borders.
Speaker 3 (12:21):
And so I noticed in a video that you had
sent to us earlier that you had something, I don't
know the exact term for it, as kind of a
stent in your arm. I if it's too personal to ask,
but can you talk a little bit about what the
situation is like for you and the other medical professionals
that you're with, Like, what's what's going on there that
dehydration or what what are you facing.
Speaker 9 (12:41):
Any of us have just been hit with gastroentritis, so
whether it was something we ate or you know, we
had some water that wasn't purified.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
For the most part, we're drinking bottled water.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
But now we're a little nervous about that supply, so
we've been starting to ration that a little bit more
so rationing that leads to the hydration. It's warm here.
I'm not used to this climate. I'm doing twenty dressing
changes in four hours.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
You know, it's hard, strenuous work.
Speaker 9 (13:10):
So me and my roommate personally, we had gastrotritis, so
you know, we're dehydrated from that.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
We both had ibs for two days.
Speaker 9 (13:22):
I received three and a half liters of fluid and
continued to.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Work as much as I could through that because you know, you're.
Speaker 9 (13:29):
Here and the idea of being in bed sick it
was devastating. I'm here to help and I'm sick and
I can't help, and it just wasn't acceptable.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
And what kind of wounds and illnesses are you guys saying, like,
what's a rough breakdown? Just from your perspective having treated
so many people now.
Speaker 9 (13:51):
So lots of tragic amputations, so explosions and they lose
limbs at the site and then extensive blast injuries with
shrapnel that ends up causing a wound to need to
be amputated later on. So we have those extensive blast
(14:12):
injuries and then burns on top of that, lots of
head injuries with that.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
So if you.
Speaker 9 (14:18):
Imagine a blast and getting thrown out one of my patients,
she's an eleven year.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Old, Oh, this is going to be tough.
Speaker 9 (14:26):
She lost bad and she was found two houses over
from their home, and her and her brother were brought
to our hospital and her brother died in the emergency room.
So she suffered a cut to her head down to
her skull, fractured pelvis, a fractured leg, and extensive blast
(14:52):
injuries to the back side of her legs where it's
going to take months to heal if she doesn't get
infected here and multiple graphs if she doesn't get infected.
Speaker 1 (15:05):
So you know, this is this is what we're seeing
the magnitude.
Speaker 9 (15:09):
I work at a Level one trauma burned center, and
I have not seen this magnitude at this frequency. At
one point, we were getting you know, five, six of
these at a time, and you know, a level one
Trump will.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Struggle with that, let alone a place that has no.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Resources and correct me if I'm wrong. To recover from
injuries like that you generally need more calories, more nutrition
than average. Can you talk a little bit about what
people are, what people have access to, and what the
effect of that is on their recovery?
Speaker 9 (15:48):
Very simply what they have access to is nothing, you know,
or near nothing. We're talking about maybe one can of
ensure for an entire day for one of these wound page.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
That no one can survive.
Speaker 9 (16:04):
On that, let alone someone who has an extensive injury.
Our patients back in America, you know, they fight with
us and say I can eat, I can eat, you know,
and two days later we're putting a feeding tube in
them because you can.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
You just physically can't consume that amount of calories.
Speaker 9 (16:19):
So it's leading to infections, graph losses if we ever
get to that point, further amputations, just so many complications
because of that.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
And somebody from your mission sent us video and control
room if you can put up this vo they send
us this video of the scene from a from a
safe house that some of the medical staff were using.
That's the trip from the safe house to the hospital.
They were then told don't go back to the safe
(16:51):
house anymore. It's not safe, it's too close. We think
the idef might strike it even if they're deconflicting and
give them the coordinates. So I'm curious, did you spend
any time in a safe house and are you hearing shelling?
What's the situation like as we speak with regards to violence.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
So our team in particular has only been at the
hospital staying at the hospital. A couple team members have
ventured out to visit surrounding areas and they just speak
of the devastation kind of like what you have shown
from inside the hospital, which is considered a green zone.
(17:33):
We are hearing shelling all the time on stant whirl
of the drones.
Speaker 9 (17:39):
This morning at six point thirty am was the largest
last that I have ever heard, and it felt like
it was in the next building over.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
It woke me out of a dead.
Speaker 9 (17:52):
Sleep and my heart nearly jumped out of my chest
and I just sat there and I kept waiting.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
I kept waiting for another one, and there were, but
fortunately not for us this time.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
I assume that some of the medical staff who were
Palestinian there were in some of the other hospitals that
have been, you know, raided by the IDEF. What have
have they given you any advice on how to handle
doing this work in this in this war zone, and
what have they told you about their experience in other hospitals.
Speaker 9 (18:29):
So some of the other hospitals, you know, it's just infrastructure.
I think at this point, seven eight months out, the
infrastructure has just gone. So some of the other hospitals
were run a little bit more smoothly.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
This one there's been just so much chaos.
Speaker 9 (18:45):
But I think it's you know, you think of all
the people who have displaced here and have been continually displaced.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
So I heard.
Speaker 9 (18:55):
I'm not sure if this is accurate, but at one
point there was thirteen thousand people occupying our hospital corridors
on this campus here, and you know, when we came,
you had just a small path to walk through the
entire hospital, and there were walls and walls of curtains
(19:16):
and tarts housing off families, little living quarters. So yeah,
other hospitals, I don't think quite they had their own
problems from what I hear, and obviously when they were invaded,
absolutely had issues, but I don't think they had this
mass displacement. To hear, that just is leading to even
(19:37):
more chaos.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
As you're thinking about the possibility of leaving, Like how
do you balance the different factors. On the one hand,
you've got the Palestinians who were in the hospital saying,
you know, if Westerners leave, were all going to be killed.
On the other hand, you need people to replace you
otherwise the thing completely collapses. But then on the third
(20:00):
and you guys are rationing water and running out of supplies.
I assume some are in facing significant health risks. How
are people kind of thinking through the series of terrible
options in front of you?
Speaker 9 (20:13):
Now, this team has been so so amazing.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
I cannot speak to the magnitude of how wonderful this
team is.
Speaker 9 (20:23):
Everybody cares so much about the Palestinian people here. We're
very adamant about the fact that we can't just leave
without replacement.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
But that does mean replacement of not only personnel, but supplies.
We you know, we've kind of learned from the Palestinians
here like to give.
Speaker 9 (20:45):
Like you see them and they have nothing, and they're
constantly inviting you for tea and what little food they
have they're giving and giving. So as a volunteer here,
it's hard not to want to do the same thing
for these people, and the thought of leaving them and
abandoning them is just it's not on our minds.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
You had mentioned by the way that a child had
opened what he thought was a can of tuna and
had one of them had an arm blown off. Is
that a cluster bomb that looks like a can of tuna? What?
What are people finding like in the street there?
Speaker 9 (21:24):
I am I'm not quite certain about that, but I
was called to the OAR to help and I was
told his story. You know, people are hungry, they find
stuff they want to eat, so.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
You know.
Speaker 9 (21:39):
There's potential that these things are getting placed in people's
houses when the IOF is you know, reading homes and
stuff and then affecting people like children are finding them
and when you're hungry.
Speaker 1 (21:57):
You can't blame them, right.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Wow, that's dark.
Speaker 5 (22:02):
Can't blame them?
Speaker 3 (22:03):
That is that is dark? And any any final thoughts
like what what what is what is the understaffing doing?
What's it like working in a hospital that is this understaffed?
And any final thoughts people should know about what the
situation is right now.
Speaker 9 (22:19):
So, yeah, the understaff we've we've gone into the ICU
two mornings now and found patients in a state of
rigor mortis. So that's meaning that they have been dead
for some time. All their IV lines were still running,
they were still hooked up to all the machines and
it showed a flatline on the monitor.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
But there's just no staff to respond. You walk into the.
Speaker 9 (22:44):
ICU and there's alarms twenty four to seven on every
single patient. So, you know, I asked a nurse about
this because I wanted to understand, like, are you exhausted?
Speaker 1 (22:56):
What is it?
Speaker 9 (22:57):
And I eventually got out from or that. When the
patient comes in, they know who's going to live and
who's not. And you know, you only have so many resources,
which includes you know, personal strength and resources, and to
put that emotion and strength into somebody that you know
(23:18):
is not going to make it is too much for
them after such a long period.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Of doing this, So you know, people are dying.
Speaker 9 (23:26):
People are dying, and things aren't getting caught. Just a
lot of extra unneeded death.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
I think, Yeah, what portion do you think of people
who are dying? There would not die if they were
in your trauma, if in your facility back in Oregon.
Speaker 9 (23:47):
I mean, I don't I don't know about specific numbers,
but I mean, eighty ninety percent of these injuries are survivable.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Right, just with basic with the with basic supplies and
attention and calories exactly.
Speaker 9 (24:05):
But and that's the hardest thing to sit back and
not have any control over.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
I know it needs to be done, but I have
nothing to do it with.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
What's the prospect for you before we let you go?
What's when? When? When do you expect that you, you
and your team will be able to get out and
get swapped in with a new mission.
Speaker 9 (24:27):
You know, we have our next team sitting in Egypt waiting.
I personally have just kind of settled in.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
I don't know.
Speaker 9 (24:38):
You know, we're promised daily that tomorrow we'll get a
convoy out.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
I can't think about that, you know.
Speaker 9 (24:45):
I'm just taking care of the people here and taking
care of my team.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
And myself right now.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Well, if and when you do get on that convoy,
we we all desperately hope that the IDF does not
fire on it. I hope that the attention that is
finally being paid to this at least helps a little bit.
Speaker 5 (25:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
Well, Nurse Johnson, thank you so much for everything you're doing.
Deeply appreciate it, Appreciate your time. All right. That was
Nurse Monica Johnston, who's volunteering at the European hospital and
stranded there by Israel siege. Meanwhile, here in the United States,
if you can put up this next element, the Wall
(25:31):
Street Journal broke the news that President Joe Biden is
moving forward with another billion dollars in new weapons for
the very military that is besieging American medical staff in
Gaza at the moment, to be spent mostly on tank shells, mortars,
and other offensive weapons, not just for Gaza presumably, but
(25:56):
also for the saber rattling that Israel is doing worth
with Lebanon. So this comes after, you know, Biden and
the White House made big news by saying that they
were stopping a shipment of three thousand, five hundred bombs
in retaliation basically for Netanyahu rebuffing every American public attempt,
(26:20):
I say public attempt rather than private attempt to stop
them from launching this rafa invasion that is killing all
of the people that that nurse Johnson just described to us. Afterwards,
Young Kirby said, look, Israel's getting all the weapons that
it needs. I don't understand what everybody's so upset about,
because we stopped these this one shipment of three thousand,
(26:42):
five hundred bombs. There are other reports that Israel was saying, look,
we already have all the weapons we need to invade Rafa.
Now doesn't mean it's not a symbolic shift perhaps, but
that doesn't help the people who are going to be
on the receiving end of these tank shells. I don't think.
Speaker 4 (26:58):
And so Acxios has this morning as well that Yahoo
has been ranting that Israel quote isn't a vassal state
of the United States, which.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I meant this point.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
It's so he says.
Speaker 4 (27:15):
According to one of his aids, he said, we are
not a vassal state of the United States. According to
three people of his remarks, including with knowledge of his remarks,
including one of his aids, this was in on a
rant in a meeting with his security cabinet. So obviously
the relationship has actually put it here is quote strained
at the moment, and Biden is trying to deal with
(27:36):
that in different ways that I have that are amounting
to this is nothing new but a completely inconsistent hodgepodge
policy towards this war that makes absolutely no sense.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
And this is what I don't get. Okay, you're not
a vassal state. Fine, then arm yourself.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
Well, they arm yourself in don't repeatedly say over and
over again that we could not fight this war without
the Americans. And so if you can't fight a war
that is existential, And I agree, I think this is
I think Israel faces existential threats from people around it,
And we may disagree in that, but I think that's true.
But you know Netanyahu, his security cabinet that said the
(28:20):
stakes of this war are existential, and we can't do
it without the Americans.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
Well, I mean, I think also destiny. Actually a good
point that he made in that debate that we had
was it's no longer existential that they are an industrial economy,
like they're powerful enough on their own.
Speaker 5 (28:39):
That American supports not existential.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
That in general, like Lebanon's not going to overrun them.
Hamas with whatever ten thousand fighters it's got left, is
not going to overrun them. Jordan's certainly isn't in any
mood to go to war with Egypt is not invading
Saudi Arabia, and the UAE just want to do business
like their place is secure. In that sense, It's not
(29:02):
like nineteen seventy three where you have Arab states who
are actually like will willing to like launch a military
invasion that that's over, Like that's done even without I
think American military support anymore. And a mass just doesn't
have the potential. And the Palestinian authority is a subcon
contractor of the Israeli government, So I've been many subcontracts,
(29:26):
subcontractors who have kind of taken over government. So that's
that's unlikely. Yeah, but yeah, tactical vehicles, mortar shells, tank shells,
all of the weapons that they're using to just annihilate RAFA,
and that we're going to send a billion a billion
dollars more, nice round number.
Speaker 4 (29:46):
Well, it's the same thing with the Biden Do you
care about what are defined internationally as war crimes or not?
I mean they care about it when it's putin, they
don't care about it. It's just obviously everyone knows at
this point that it's bullshit. But it's a Biden administration
that continues to enforce these like bullshit ideas about how
(30:08):
the war is being prosecuted and what international law is
supposed to look like when it's convenient and again not
new in American politics, not new in world politics, but
to maintain that posture and to have it, you know,
informing armshipments and very specific policy details in such an
uneven and inconsistent way just politically even for Biden a
(30:32):
disaster let alone, you know what it's actually doing in
the war.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
Yeah, and the American Medical Mission is an interesting proxy
on this. Hn Kaudrey and I over at the Intercept
broke this news on Monday that was that this was happening,
and it's it's an interesting proxy. Not in the sense
that American lives are inherently worth more than Palestinian lives.
They aren't. And I spoke previously with Nurse Johnson and
(30:57):
she was saying the same thing that she can tell
just that politically that everybody just acknowledges that American lives
are more valuable than Palestinian lives, including the Palestinians. That
the Palestinians will say, we really hope that if you leave,
that other Westerners come in and replace you, because otherwise
we're all going to be slaughtered like we need like
(31:20):
those are that's those are actual human shields, like Americans
shielding other civilians because the thinking is that the IDF
is not willing to kill in mass American citizens but
that thinking is even being challenged, like the UN convoy
was fired on Monday, killing a foreign driver of that vehicle.
(31:42):
Now they're having intense difficulties. So we broke this on Monday,
Washington Post, and we see others have since followed up
in the reporting. Yeah, so it's it's a global story
at this point. People know that there are these American
citizens and Canadian citizens trapped in this hospital. If netnya
who cared, he could do he could easily resolve this situation.
(32:06):
They control this area. Okay, seven minute drive from that
hospital to Rafa, they control the border crossing Monica could
be out within the next hour. If Netnah who cared
and net Yah who knows that they're trapped there, they
don't have the supplies they need, that the American citizens
and Canadian citizens are themselves facing serious health complications, and
(32:31):
instead she's woken up by the biggest shelling that she's
ever heard since being there at six thirty this morning.
He knows they're there, and they're shelling right nearby. Anyway,
they're being told to stay away from windows, and it
really does upend this assumption that your American passport or
your Canadian passport gives you any protection even as we're
(32:56):
sending them another billion dollars in weapons, and.
Speaker 4 (33:00):
You know, just as we're because you have been an interesting,
more interesting reporting to talk about. But as we're wrapping
this up, there are how many American hostages about five
American hostages that are still remaining and barely even talk
about that. But you know, speaking of on that point,
a producer, Max sent a tweet from Dennis Ross yesterday
(33:21):
where he says, one thing is clear, the fact that
the idea of has to go back into Jibalia and
other places in zuman units.
Speaker 5 (33:28):
Actually, speaking of what we were just talking about with Nurse.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
Johnston is a reminder that no plan existed for what
would replace Hamas. Yes, Hamas is weakened, but without an
alternative to it, it will fill the vacuum. And Israel
needs an answer. So from the interest of the United States,
the American hostages that are still being held, American aid
workers that you reported on shouldn't.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Held hostage being how should more American hostages in that
hospital than being held by Hamas.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Now And just from the pure perspective of again the
interests of actual Americans over there, But how has Biden
handled this situation. How does the Biden administration advanced American
interests in this situation?
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Pretty damning.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Yeah, as Biden said, if you harm an American, we'll respond. Yeah,
terms and conditions apply, Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 10 (34:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
All right, Ray, you have some more reporting on a
PAK in the United States in the campaign atmosphere as
recreding into November.
Speaker 5 (34:27):
What have you got?
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Yeah, well, I'm all worked up about this. Let's talk
about APAX influence in the third Congressional District out in Oregon.
About two weeks ago, two candidates in an Oregon congressional
race held a rare joint press conference where they leveled
a charge against a third candidate. Take a listen to
the local news coverage.
Speaker 11 (34:44):
Moving on, we wanted to bring you an update now
to a story we told you about last night, the
heated three way race for the third congressional district in
Oregon that's Earl Blumenauer's seat in Congress. Last week, two
of the candidates, Shushila Jayapaul and Eddie Morales, held her
a press conference accusing the candidate, Maxine Dexter, of taking
dark money washed through a super pac called three fourteen Action.
(35:07):
They claimed without any evidence that three fourteen Action could
be a front for far right donors looking to take
them out of the race.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
The candidate getting all that dark Bunny support is Maxine Dexter,
a state representative and local doctor. At a debate, she
was pressed by her opponent Eddie Morales to name the
source of the funding. Take a listen.
Speaker 12 (35:26):
I want to spend the last second of mine asking Maxine, MAXI,
will you look at the camera until Auction three, one, five,
three or four Action to disclose their donors before May twentieth?
Speaker 5 (35:37):
Do you yes? I observedly answer the question.
Speaker 10 (35:40):
It is absolutely They are legally obligated to.
Speaker 5 (35:44):
Disclose there before the day before the election.
Speaker 10 (35:47):
Eddie, you understand as well as I do.
Speaker 12 (35:49):
This is the public forum. You can tell them and
this is.
Speaker 10 (35:51):
It is a public forum. And I believe in discussion
and deliberation.
Speaker 11 (35:55):
Enom funding.
Speaker 5 (35:56):
You absolutely not.
Speaker 3 (35:58):
I've not taken Okay, I have to there, but I
need to let Nextine have a final word here.
Speaker 10 (36:02):
I will just say that this entire thing is frankly absurd.
I have put my values on record. I have four
years of voting records on progressive values. I have stood
firm with people who have supported me, and against people
who have supported me. I took an oath of office,
and I've taken an oath as a physician to keep
(36:24):
people at the center and do no harm. My integrity
is frankly being questioned here, which is absolutely offensive.
Speaker 3 (36:31):
All right, Well, we don't want to offend anybody, and
of course anybody accused of anything without evidence ought to
have a chance to defend themselves. So let's take a
closer look. And to be fair to accusers, it did
look off random. State representatives don't generally find themselves on
the winning end of millions of dollars of super pac
spending for no reason. And Soshilajyapaul the candidate in the middle.
(36:55):
There is the older sister of Promilagia Paul, one of
apacs most concerted adversaries on Capitol Hill and the powerful
chair of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. APAC had been unsuccessfully
recruiting a challenger to Primilagiapoul in her Seattle district. Now,
looking for clues as to who might be funding the
dark money operation, you could turn to the news outlet
(37:17):
Jewish Insider, which does a great job covering congressional primaries
through an Israel Palestine prism. In early December, Jewish Insider
flagged Sushila Jyapaul's candidacy as alarming to Israel advocates, elevating
the potential candidacy of Dexter as a strong opponent. So
after a few days of reporting, I confirmed it was
(37:38):
indeed APAC, and I found two sources who had knowledge
of how specifically APAK had begun playing in the race
without disclosing its role. It was routing money indeed through
the Pro Science quote unquote Pro Science superPAC called three
fourteen Action Fund. So I published that story on May
tenth at the Intercept. Now here's our friends at the
local TV station again. Three Fourteen's response.
Speaker 11 (38:01):
Jaiapaul and Morales are demanding that Dexter tell three fourteen
Action to reveal the donors. Now they say they think
they could be related to pro Israel group APAK, and
some recent reporting from the news outlet The Intercept supports
that claim. We reached out to three fourteen Action Group
yesterday and they did respond to us. We asked if
(38:22):
MAGA Republicans are among their donors. They didn't outright say no,
but they did say that they've spent tens of millions
of dollars backing other Democrats to defeat mega Republicans in
other states. They also said there's no evidence to support
a claim that APAK is among their donors, and that
they disclose their donors every reporting cycle and follow the
(38:43):
letter of the law. So again not outright denying that
APAC is involved, just there's no evidence there yet.
Speaker 3 (38:49):
So the Portland Mercury did some strong follow up reporting
on the race midweek, but Maxine Dexter continued to profess
ignorance even in the face of that reporting. But then
undeniable pieces of evidence began to emerge. While the Superpacks
aren't required to disclose their donors until the day before
the election, the candidate herself has to disclose regularly down
(39:12):
the campaign stretch, so she had to produce what's called
a forty eight hour report after a May seventh fundraiser.
Now at that fundraiser, of the nearly eighty donors who
gave that day, nearly ninety percent are also donors to
a pack. In other words, it was an Apack fundraiser,
which you can find out just by searching the names
of those donors on the site there. The next day,
(39:35):
Dexter disclosed having raised nearly six hundred thousand dollars in
the month of April, after raising just about three hundred
thousand dollars during her entire campaign before that. Doubling or
tripling your fundraising in the last few weeks of the
race is not typical. That is not normal. And inside
that six hundred thousand dollars were scores of additional Apack donors.
(39:58):
Of the ones we checked, we gave up after while
because it was it was pointless. It was very obvious
what was going on. But Okay, maybe it's a huge
coincidence that Apack donors are giving to her campaign, but
it's not a packed donors who are behind the super
Pac spending. How do we know Apak actually organized all this? Well.
I called one of the donors on the list and
got through to her. This is Jney Dallisman. At first
(40:21):
she said she didn't remember giving to Dexter at all.
When I told her the three thy three hundred dollars
donation of hers was in the FEC records, it clicked
for her. She said, quote, I give all of my
contributions through a pack whenever I am asked to give
to their endorsed candidates. I give so Dexter is an
endorsed candidate, even though that's not public. If that wasn't
(40:43):
enough to put the pieces together, a staffer at three
fourteen Action Fund, angry that a pack ostensibly dedicated to
electing candidates with a science background was having its mission
distorted to support pro Israel candidates, reached out to me
to share inside information. They told me directly about the
nature of the APACK driven operation. It was a pack.
(41:06):
Three fourteen took to Twitter to respond to my article,
but did so four minutes before I even published it,
and they accidentally denied the wrong thing they wrote here.
Ryan Graham from The Intercept is once again making up
stories out of thin air. His latest accusation that three
fourteen Action is a front group, or that three fourteen
will be spending against Representative Corey Bush as a complete fabrication.
(41:28):
But I had not, in fact reported that three fourteen
Action was expanding its campaign to target Bush directly. I
reported that three fourteen, with the heat on them, was
planning to set up a shell pack they could funnel
APAC money through, and so Emily, I think what's going
on here. So if you're trying, here's the question people
would ask, like, if you try to put together this
(41:49):
plan that you're that voters are not going to find
out that it's a PAC money until May twentieth, and
the election is May twenty first, and Oregon is mail balloting,
so everybody basically will voted by that's late enough. Why
would you schedule a May seventh fundraiser when you know
you're going to have to disclose those donors forty eight
hours later? And from what I've heard from people involved
(42:10):
in this is that they thought they would get away
with it, that nobody would notice that it's Oregon, it's
a small race, it's a small race. Who cares not
even an incumbent. It's an incumbent sister, but it's not
an incumbent.
Speaker 5 (42:22):
Presumably has nothing to do with foreign policy.
Speaker 3 (42:25):
Yeah, it's like the race is about homelessness, basically, Like
that's the big issue that they're that they're running their
ads on. The APAC funded ads are hitting Giapaul because
she was on the County Commission, and the County Commission
did a legitimately terrible job when it comes to a homelessness.
So actually that's like, that's a clean hit. It's just
(42:46):
let's not pretend that APAC cares like that's not their mission.
Their mission is not to eradicate homelessness in Portland.
Speaker 5 (42:53):
Why does APAC care about this?
Speaker 3 (42:54):
Seriously, from everything I've been able to gather, a Giapaul
is no a It supports an immediate ceasefire and is generally,
you know, sympathetic with the pill Palst and cause and
critical of apacad. She doesn't want a PAC money, et cetera.
But it's it's it's to get at Pramila Giapaul, I
(43:14):
see because Pramila that makes more sense. So the Squad
are their most outspoken kind of opponents that are elevated
in the press. But Giapaul has more power in the
caucus itself, ninety to one hundred members of Progressive Caucus.
She shares that caucus. She has a direct line to
the White House's She can make things happen in ways
(43:37):
that members of the Squad can't. They and according to
my reporting, they very much tried to recruit an opponent
to her. They ran polling in Seattle trying to find
ways that that she would be soft. They would have
been willing to spend I'm sure million, many millions of dollars.
They're spending twenty plus million to take out Jamal Bowman.
They could spend millions to take out Giapoul, but they
(43:59):
couldn't find a challenger. They have, she got one challenger
at the very last minute. But the person seems like
a bit of a crank, like running in like four
different races. Is the very outspoken pro is real person
in that But it's I don't think that's an APAC recruit.
And so if you can't go after Giapaul directly in Seattle, hey,
here's her sister who I should have played audio of her.
(44:21):
You saw she looks just like her. She also sounds
just like her. You're like, there's no way that's a
different person.
Speaker 4 (44:26):
It's got to be the same person. Once agains are wrong.
Speaker 3 (44:30):
Right, sources are wrong. So but I think the reason
that they held the APEC fundraiser on the seventh is
that they knew they'd have to disclose, but they didn't
think anybody care by that point, right, and then okay,
maybe somebody flags it in the by May ninth. At
that point it takes a week to report it out. Now,
it's towards now it's basically election day, and because you
(44:54):
need the reporting early enough that the candidates can then
get it out to voters not all watching counterpoints and
reading the intercept, but they should be. But believe or not,
they're not, so you have to so there has to
be the local news has to pick it up, which
is which is now starting to happen. Uh. The sheer
amount of money being spent probably is enough to overwhelm
(45:17):
and elect Dexter.
Speaker 5 (45:18):
It's a crazy amount.
Speaker 3 (45:19):
I mean, it might blow back now that it's now
that it's out and the local press is finally starting
to cover it in a in a better way. You
saw that one because they that that news outlet had
done some dismissive reporting in the past, saying like, oh
this is there's nothing to this, but now they're But
now when they got three fourteen's response, they're like, hmm.
Speaker 5 (45:37):
Maybe Ryan Groom sources.
Speaker 3 (45:39):
Are right, Maybe are right, this is this is actually
not a denial, because that's the funny thing. Just disclose
your donor Yeah, of course. And I think three fourteen
went so aggressive in its public response because they didn't
know that I had an internal source of theirs, and
so just a note for the organizations, like wait until
(45:59):
the article comes out, or call me like I emailed them,
like gave my number, call me then you can find
out what I've got and then you can shape your
response instead. I've never seen a more desperate and guilty
looking response.
Speaker 4 (46:12):
I like how they responded to the wrong thing too. Yeah,
it's just great all around.
Speaker 1 (46:16):
Right.
Speaker 3 (46:17):
And the other reason they wouldn't endorse directly through three
fourteen action with Bush is that Bush's opponent is Guy
Wesley Bell, who's a prosecutor. He's not a scientist, like
they're supposed to only endorse scientists and doctors, So they'd
have to set up a different pack. There's one in
Portland called Americans for Responsive Government No No Voters for
(46:39):
Responsive Government. That they registered it on April first, because
if you registered it on March thirty first, then they
would have to disclose by the end of the month.
April first means they don't have to disclose until May twentieth. Now,
let's give APEC credit where it's due. They beat the
Capitol police officer, Harry Dunn. They did in Maryland's third
(47:01):
district last night for some reason, and people still to
this day do not know why they decided to spend
millions of dollars backing local state legislator Sarah Elfreth. Harry
Dunn had never really said anything critical of Israel. Why
they decided to make a January sixth Capitol police officer,
(47:24):
the guy that they spent millions of target is actually
unknown at this point. They also try to beat this Democrat,
Dave min in a primary in California, who also had
not said anything. Both of them non white, and there's
some suspicion that like, if you are non white, APAC
(47:45):
believes APAK is suspicious of your politics when it comes
to Palestinians until otherwise, until proven otherwise. They've done a
trip there and you know, done your I would be
nice if they would tell us. They don't they they
don't tell us. But the most fun news out of Maryland,
as we talked about at the top of the show,
(48:06):
is that David Trone, Yeah it was a good one,
lost to Angela also Brooks. David Trone is the owner
of Total Wine, which great store. Terrible person. He's famously
spent like something like fourteen million dollars trying to win
Jamie Raskin's seat.
Speaker 5 (48:26):
I thought it was more than that.
Speaker 3 (48:27):
It might have been he, but this is a primary,
a House primary. Not only did he lose to Raskin,
he lost to Chris Matthews's wife, who got finished second,
who was a famous local news anchor in her own
right in DC. He finished third, not only spending the
most money to lose a House primary in history, didn't
(48:48):
even finish the second. So then he switched and he
moved out to western Maryland and John Delaney left office,
so he was able to buy his way into that seat.
Tried to spend sixty plus million dollars to win the
Senate seat. Everybody thought it was his to win, but
Angela also Brooks beat him. She won with basically basically
(49:09):
Baltimore City PG and Charles County in Maryland, but she
also take a little Kent County prerogative. She's currently tied,
so I'm from king went to Kent County High School.
Kent County is a small county over on the very rural,
small county over on the eastern Shore. I haven't checked
the very latest. When I checked this morning, she was
tied seven two to seven twenty two in the in
(49:34):
Kent County with Trone, So I don't even have to
ask my mom. I'm sure she was also Brooks.
Speaker 4 (49:41):
Yeah, so they're now fifty four to forty one point nine,
So fifty four to forty two roughly overall, and then
in Kent.
Speaker 5 (49:52):
It's forty eight forty eight right now.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
Do they have the vote totals? It was flairity.
Speaker 4 (49:57):
We've see about fifteen hundred total votes right now. Okay, yeah,
so it's dead. He high ballgame in Kent County.
Speaker 5 (50:04):
As a wise woman once said.
Speaker 3 (50:05):
There's no Total Wine in Kent County.
Speaker 5 (50:07):
Money can't buy you class.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
Money can't buy you class. It's true, It's it's awesome.
It's great to see Trone beaten.
Speaker 5 (50:14):
It's always good to see money.
Speaker 3 (50:16):
Yes, not win the day the stole, like the Stoller's
anti monopoly crowd went after Trone and a super pack
basically launched a campaign hitting him on anti trust stuff.
Speaker 5 (50:29):
Because anti trust super.
Speaker 3 (50:30):
Pack, Yeah, because Total Wine is engaged in all sorts
of anti trust violations allegedly and is in the process
of getting prosecuted basically, and so and Trone politically is
like an anti anti trust. He's a pro trust. He's
for trusts because he is a he is a trust owner,
(50:53):
he owns a trust and so allegedly, basically, what the
Total Wine does is it suppressed, is it it punishes
supple and it gets better, It gets better deals on
booze than the mom and pops do. And it was
allegedly enforcing that in a pretty kind of ruthless way.
And what's amazing is during this campaign, David Trone's company
(51:17):
sued the Biden administration in relation to this fight that
they're having. So a Democratic senator running for a Democratic
Senate seat sued the Democratic president over anti trust policy
while he was running for Senate. Democratic voters said no,
(51:39):
so good for them.
Speaker 4 (51:40):
I was going to say that this segment was peak Portland,
but it has now become peak Ryan Grimm because what
started as a deep investigation into the various meddling of
a pac turned into a rant about the pro trust
organization structurally of Total Wine.
Speaker 3 (52:00):
I'm not sure how we got there, but you.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
Didn't see it coming. That was a Shamalan style.
Speaker 3 (52:06):
But here it's all about big money.
Speaker 5 (52:08):
All about big money. Yeah, that's the overhanging.
Speaker 3 (52:12):
And so the election is May twenty first in Portland
we'll see, like if they lose this despite spending millions
of dollars against Jaya Paul, that would be a huge
blow to them because that would leave them with just
Harry Dunn so far as the person they beat. They
and the January sixth protesters are the only ones that
(52:34):
have beaten Harry done and nobody else.
Speaker 4 (52:37):
Well, best of luck to Apak going forward. And that
does it for us on today's Wednesday edition of Counterpoints.
But of course we now do a wonderful Friday show
and that will be this week conversation with betto Work.
I imagine they'll be some debate back and forth. We
haven't taped it yet, but a conversation with Betoo Work
on the border, and that's really exciting.
Speaker 5 (52:58):
I really appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Setting that up right, Yeah, love Betto. I uh first
interviewed Beto when he was a El Paso City councilman
because he was pushing a pot legalization initiative referendum in
like not a reference, just a little resolution in like
two thousand and nine. I interviewed him for that and
(53:21):
I interviewed the sitting congressman at the time, and the
congressman said, if this passes the El Paso City Council,
like federal funding is going to be at risk. Beto
took that as a threat that how dare you threaten
federal funds over my pot resolution? And Beto ran against
him for Congress after reading that and beat him in
(53:42):
the primary. He was a border patrol guard, so he
beat a border patrol guard to get the Congress.
Speaker 5 (53:47):
You guys are just jen X.
Speaker 4 (53:49):
Yeah, brothers, we are yea brothers and the brothers in
the plant.
Speaker 3 (53:54):
Yeah exactly.
Speaker 4 (53:56):
You got a clubhouse because this is a treehouse. You
just like smoke weed and skateboard and listen to Nirvana.
Speaker 3 (54:03):
Yeah, we're not going to sell out man, but really
looking forward. Yeah all right, So come back Thursday night
Friday for Counterpoints Friday with Beto o'rourk. Otherwise Crystal Sograby
here tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (54:18):
And stay tuned of course to your inbox for just
updates on the greater Breaking Points universe going forward.
Speaker 5 (54:24):
And we'll see you next week. Ryan will see you
early next week.
Speaker 3 (54:26):
That's right, I'll be there Tuesday. Also, you get a
lot of me next week. All right, see you guys later.
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