June 8, 2025 • 45 mins
Brad Simpson, husband of missing Suzanne Simpson, and his attorney fight to squash his indictment. As state attorneys continuing gathering evidence from the Texas Rangers, the attorney say prosecutor has enough evidence to proceed with a motion to quash the indictment.
The arrest affidavit for Brad Simpson, accused of murdering his wife, provides a detailed timeline of his activities the day before he reported her missing. The husband and father spent the day running suspicious errands, some of them in front of his 5-year-old daughter.
The day after neighbors overheard the Simpsons fighting, Brad Simpson’s truck filled and emptied as he drove around San Antonio. First, Simpson placed his phone in “lockdown mode,” preventing location tracking. Forced to rely on surveillance footage, police spotted Simpson’s truck at a grocery store at 12:33 a.m.
The truck bed was empty except for an ice chest. The next morning, when Simpson took his daughter to school, two full white trash bags had been added to the bed. Later, when Simpson was seen at a Boerne Whataburger drive-thru more than an hour later, police observed a heavy-duty trash can and a firewood rack weighing down an object covered by a blue tarp.
Law enforcement uncovered damning evidence that led a grand jury to indict Simpson not only for tampering with evidence but also for murder. Lab testing revealed Suzanne Simpson’s DNA on a reciprocating saw from Simpson’s toolbox.
In his first court appearance, Brad Simpson wore red prisoner attire with his hands cuffed in front of him. He swayed back and forth in his swivel chair, speaking only to confirm his identity and converse with his attorney.
Although the hearing was brief, Simpson was observed with what has been described as a sly grin.
Joining Nancy Grace today:
- Jeff Horny - Longtime Friend of Suzanne and Brad Simpson
- Caryn Stark - Psychologist, renowned TV and Radio trauma expert and consultant, www.carynstark.com, Instagram: carynpsych, FB: Caryn Stark Private Practice
- Ben Powers - Criminal Defense Attorney, Facebook: Legal Powers PLLC, https://legalpowers.com
- Brian Fitzgibbons - Director of Operations for USPA Nationwide Security, uspasecurity.com, Instagram: @uspa_nationwide_security, Fmr. Marine and Iraq war veteran
- Dr. Kendall Crowns - Chief Medical Examiner Tarrant County, Lecturer: Burnett School of Medicine at TCU (Texas Christian University)
- Zachary-Taylor Wright - Trending Digital Reporter with MySA; website: MySanAntonio.com; Twitter: @Zachthereporter
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a gorgeous young mom. Suzanne
Simpson is seen arguing with her husband outside their elite,
argy old country club. The neighbor after that here's screams
(00:21):
outside is convinced that Suzanne everything suddenly goes quiet. She's
never seen again in the Last Days, another development in
the search for Suzanne. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
Thank you for being with us. In the last Days.
Brad Simpson has filed a motion to quash a hearing
(00:46):
It was set for thirty days in connection with wife
Suzanne's murder case. Still no body. Brad Simpson, the husband Surprise.
The husband Simpson, an almost part ma'am, is believed to
have murdered his wife last year. The discovery hearing was
(01:07):
originally scheduled in Judge Joel Pettis's four hundred and thirty
seventh District Court, but now Brad Simpson wants to quash it.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
What is quash mean? Basically kick it out of court?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Okay, what do we know about Suzanne's disappearance and where
is she or her body?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
They met in college at the University of Texas.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Nice guy, charismatic, engaging.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
You know Suzanne was a little tiny thing, but.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
For Suzanne, it wasn't perfect time.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
It's just tragic.
Speaker 5 (01:43):
Man.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
I can't even imagine she didn't deserve that at all.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
If just the thought of Suzanne's body out decomposing in
a trash site or a disposal site, it's getting worse.
The hand held reciprocating Saul belonging to the husband absolutely
has his Anne Simpson's DNA on it. Why why would
(02:09):
that be there? Take a listen to what the almost
pdchief had to say.
Speaker 6 (02:13):
So we're holding out hope that maybe, you know, maybe
she's trying to be away from the home, to get
away from that situation. That's not totally uncommon, but what
is uncommon. What is unusual is that this was a
woman who worked and was very dependable, and loved her
children and was always in contact with her children and
her family and her friends. We would love for her
(02:34):
to be alive. Obviously, there's nothing concrete that says she's
not alive. And again, I owe it to the family,
We all owe it to the family to speak of
her in a way where other people have been found,
like I said, injured and distressed, lost, troubled, hiding away.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
All of those things are possible now.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
From our friends at WAI joining me an all star
panel to make sense of what we are learning right now.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
This is not the update I wanted to report to
you tonight.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
For a first out to Zachary Taylor right joining us,
a trending digital reporter with my essay, my san Antonio.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Zachary, thank you so much for being with us.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Explain to me how the husband's reciprocating saw.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
You know what? Just pause, Zachary. I want to hear
everything you've got to say.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But for people that don't know what a reciprocating saw is,
let me go to doctor Kendall Crown's joining us, the
chief medical Examiner in Tarrett County, that's Fort Worth, the
Texas Jurisdiction esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine TCU,
Doctor Kendall Crown, thank you so much for being with us.
Before I get into your usual topics, and that is
(03:45):
the discovery of bodies. What you can tell from bodies,
what you can tell from an autopsy? Could you explain
and demonstrate what is a reciprocating saw.
Speaker 7 (03:55):
Certainly so, reciprocating saws are saws that use a blade.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
They actually have.
Speaker 7 (03:59):
My here is a large, fairly large saw. It has
a blade that goes backwards in the forwards, which is
the reciprocating movement of the saw. And they can be
used to cut through metal, wood, bone, tissue, you name it.
They use them in the meat cutting industry to cut
a part cattle.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Hold on, let me see that again. Could you turn
that on one more time? Doctor Kimlin. Crown's sure, Jeff
Horny is joining me, right, I heard it, Thank you.
Jeff Horny is with us right now, joining us from
San Antonio, longtime friend of both Suzanne and Brad Simpson,
(04:40):
her husband, Jeff Horny.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I don't know how you can sit there and look
at that saw.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
It looks like a giant version of the electric knife
people use at Thanksgiving and Christmas to cut a turkey
or a roast or something.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Sure he knew what he was doing. Look at that knowing, Suzanne.
It's terrible.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
And disgusting actually, And.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
He's a hunter.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
You know, if you've used one of those saws, you
know that it's not real clean. It doesn't just make
a beautiful clean cut. And yes, I saw him in
the courtroom and he looked like he'd been doing push
ups for months. You know, he looks like a thug,
is what he looks like, what he's turned out to be.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So it's sad man.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
We were talking to Jeff Horny, who's been a longtime
friend of not only Susanne the missing mom, but the husband.
Zacharychell are right, thank you for holding a trending digital
reporter with my sa my san Antonio. Zachary again, thank
you for being with us. I want to backtrack just
a moment. You know, I just heard Jeff Horny state
(05:49):
that the husband, who is presumed innocent under the law,
these are just allegations right now, Zachary, I don't know
how him being a hunter has anything to do with
his wife's DNA being on a reciprocating so oh I do.
I do know the connection he made. He was making
the connection that the saw could be let me just
(06:13):
say contaminated or still caked with animal detried us from
prior hunting trips. I don't know a nice way to
say it. That's why I'm searching for the words. But
Zachary Taylor right, tell me how and where this reciprocating
saw it was discovered?
Speaker 4 (06:32):
So the reciprocating saw was discovered in Brett's possession and
their believe in their family home, but it was hidden away,
which is part of his accusations against him, is that
he attempted to conceal it from investigators, and of course
the DNA did link back to Susannah.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Zachary, you stated that the DNA is found on.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Simpson's saw, but where was the saw?
Speaker 4 (06:59):
The pacificatting saw was found in Brad Simpson's toolbox.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
You know, Zachary Taylor right joining us from my San Antonio. Zachary,
I understand that the husband, Brad Simpson, tried to hide
the saw absolutely.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
So that's part of the accusations made against him, is
that he attempted to conceal the saw from investigators initially,
and so when they were able to find it and
link it back to Suzanne, they charged him with tempering
with evidence.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Well, if it's right there in his toolbox, I don't
understand how he's trying to hide it. I'm certainly not
taking his side. But you know, Ben Power is joining me,
high profile defense attorney at Legal Powers.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Ben, the worst thing.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
You can do if this ever makes it to a
jury is for the prosecutor to state something in opening
statements like.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Yes, and he tried to hide the saw.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
And then it comes out that he didn't, because if
you're wrong as a prosecutor on one fact, it taints
everything else.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
It takes your good facts.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And you stand up in front of a jury and
you say he tried to hide the saw, because you
know what the hiding part is the big indicator that
something the fairius has occurred. Being powers, how do I
know she didn't try to use the saw one time
and cut her finger on I mean, it could be
a million things, but the fact that he then tried
to hide it puts it in a whole another light
(08:24):
been powers.
Speaker 5 (08:25):
Yeah, I agree. I think it's important that if you're
going to use the accusation that he tried to hide
the saw and it turns out his toolbox. Obviously where
that toolbox was found, and the key to having it
is trying to hide it. But I agree with that.
You just said you don't want to lose credibility with
jury overstating or trying to extend your proof beyond what
(08:46):
your proof actually can show. And so I think the
importance for the saw in this context is how it's
thread in the larger tapestry of the story, So I
wouldn't unnecessarily try to extend it past its value, which
is her dnage on the saw. And for the state,
that's a good facts and defense. That's certainly a problem
(09:06):
we're going to have to address the trial.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Let me nail this down, Zachary, tail all right? If
the saw with his wife's DNA on it, and you
know another thing I got to find out, Zachary, and
we may not know it yet.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Is it blood? Because just go with me for a moment.
Do I believe this is true?
Speaker 6 (09:23):
No?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Could one's or believe it absolutely? What if she was
using a saw and she cut herself through it? I
believe this luxury real estate mom was out working with
a reciprocating saw. No, I don't, okay, but.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
That is a legitimate argument to be made to a jury.
Or Zachary.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
What if it is bone, Now that's a whole another
can of worms. What if it is hair, hair, scalp,
It could be a number of things that would clearly
tell a jury that the saw was used on her
to dismember her. So, hey, I gotta nail down is
(10:04):
it true? He tried to hide it. And you know what, Zachary,
when you don't know a horse, look at his track record.
We already know he asked a friend. As a matter
of fact, I believe you told me this. He asked
a friend to hide a gun, and the friend hid
the gun in a false wall, and the gun was found,
and the friend, of course blabbed, he told me to
hide it. So we know he has a track record
(10:26):
of hiding evidence. Now that's one thing, but that doesn't
prove to me he tried to hide this saw. I
need to know how did he try to hide the saw?
Where are we getting that?
Speaker 4 (10:37):
So that comes directly from the charges against him. But
we don't have the exact details on where police found
the saw, other than it being in his toolbox. So
your plants are completely accurate. And we also don't know
precisely what DNA they found on the saw.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Brad Simpson moving to quash a hearing set in connection
with his wife Suzanne's murder. Judge Padez had initially set
a thirty day window for the hearing to occur as
evidence from the Texas Rangers is still being collected. I
hope that includes her body, but as of yet nobody
(11:26):
has been found. Now, as the state's attorneys continue to
gather evidence, the Texas Rangers still conducting investigation translation looking
for her body. Simpson's lawyer said they had enough evidence
to proceed with a motion to quash the indictment. That's right,
(11:49):
throw out the indictment. The judge offered Simpson's lawyers a thirty,
sixty or ninety day option for the next hearing. Of course,
they're sticking with a thirty day window, holding the state's
feet to the fire to get the evidence to move forward. Now,
if they were smart, I think that file for emotion
(12:10):
for speedy trial and make the state go forward without
a body. You can't be held indefinitely under the constitution
waiting for trial. That's why we have the right to
a speedy trial under our constitution. Typically, a speedy trial
is within the term or the next two terms of
(12:32):
the indictment being handed down. A term in most jurisdictions
is about three months. Every three to four months, a
new grand jury is impaneled, which would mean a speedy trial.
Demand would guarantee a trial within let's say three six
(12:52):
nine months ish from the day of the indictment. What
is in that discovery? What do we know about Susan's disappearance?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Brians Gibbons joining me.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Brian is the director of Operations for USPA Nationwide Security,
who leads teams of investigators all around the country trying
to find missing people. Brian, just go with me for
a moment. The saw in the toolbox, that's not damning,
that's not incriminating.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
That means nothing to me.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I need to know it kind of what part of DNA,
What type of DNA is it?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
For instance, if it's hair and scalp, it's over for him.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
If it's just a little blood, well that could have
an innocent explanation. Not that I believe it, but it could.
So what about this, Brian? If the toolbox itself, we
know the saw is in the toolbox, But if the
toolbox itself, let's just say, was buried in the backyard, Okay,
that indicates nefarious intent. If it was flung in a river,
(13:56):
we have to know more facts before we can just
blurt out it was hit.
Speaker 8 (14:00):
Yeah, As Attorney Ben Powers just said, we're looking at
a whole tapestry of things laid out in this charging document.
So where it was concealed, how it was concealed is
certainly going to come out later. But there was a
reason that investigators put that in the documents. Okay, we
see him concealing the cell phone, we see him concealing
the guns. Now we read about him concealing the saw.
(14:22):
They're laying out a pattern of behavior from Brad Simpson.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Here.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
You know, Ryan, I gave up cursing, or I said
I was giving up cursing when I had the twins.
But on this special special occasion, let me just say,
they damn well better show me later because Karen Start
joining me renounced psychologist, TV radio trauma expert. You can
find her at karenstart dot com. Karen, you know I
(14:47):
live through the Ja Simpson trial, Mayhey Rottenhill.
Speaker 9 (14:51):
One little beauty thing, the glove, one little beauty thing,
And I guarantee you, Karen Stark, if I could have
gotten that courtroom and gone up to Simpson, I would have.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Gotten that glove on his hand, no question. But one thing,
that one thing tainted the whole case. It messed up
the whole case. Like here, if the state says he
hit it, and then you can't prove he hit it
a technical legal term, they're screwed.
Speaker 10 (15:22):
You know, I would think, Nancy, that they would not
say that he was tampering with the evidence or hiding
it unless there was actually a reason.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Stop. Brother Kimmel.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Crowns is demonstrating what a reciprocating handheld saw is. Does
that come with another blade, a detachable blade?
Speaker 7 (15:45):
Yes, it comes with multiple different blades depending on what
you're trying to saw up. It can come with ones
that'll work on a metal. It also comes with ones
that'll trim trees, things of that nature.
Speaker 11 (15:56):
So, for those of you just joining US medical examiner,
doctor Kendall Crowns is demonstrating a reciprocating saw.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Go ahead, Okay, thank you, doctor Crowns.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
You know, to Zachary Taylor Wright, the big bombshell tonight
is that Suzanne's DNA is found on that reciprocating saw.
But there is other evidence that's extremely disturbing.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
The problem with a reciprocating saw is that in the leading.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Up to tonight, we were looking for a body because
nobody wouldn't you agree, Jeff Horney, There's no way Suzann
would have stayed away from her children this long.
Speaker 4 (16:48):
Yeah, absolutely not, So that.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Means we're looking for a body.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
But now that the reciprocating saw has entered the scene
with her DNA on it, that means he has very
likely been dismembered. Is going to make the discovery of
her remains much more difficult.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
What does that mean to a prosecutor?
Speaker 1 (17:06):
That means this may very well be a no body case,
as in, there will never be a body discovered. But
what else do we know? Zachary Taylor right.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Joining us from my San Antonio.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
We were just describing Brad Simpson going out for a
what a Burger? He certainly did not lose his appetite
in light of his wife missing. Now I know I'm
projecting Zachary Taylor right.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
But when I learned my fiance.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Had been murdered, I lost down to eighty nine pounds.
The thought of food literally made me sick, nauseous, and
I went so long. I remember the first thing I ingested,
and it was orange juice and something my mom had
in the fridge.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
So I know that's just my experience.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
But when I hear about Brad Simpson in the middle
of his wife missing, pigging out at what a Burger,
I'm not a shrink.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Or a dietitian, but that just doesn't sit right with me.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I mean, we don't know exactly what he purchased at
Waburger so far, but we do know that he did,
in fact stop at Waterburger with some we'll say, suspicious
items in his trunk that he later unloaded after making
two separate stops. And we also know, according to the
restaurant off A David, he's accused of burning the couple
(18:30):
of electronics as well out of Benderah home.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
First of all, he puts his phone in quote lockdown mode,
Ryan Gibbons joining us USPA Nationwide Security. I don't know
what lockdown mode means. I guess that means like airplane mode.
Speaker 8 (18:49):
Right, this is going to go, This is going to
go one step beyond that, Nancy. So once that phone
enters lockdown mode, you have no data being transmitted from
that phone to the cloud, to any towers. So tracking
Brad Simpson's movements with the phone would become nearly impossible
at that point.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Ben Power is joining me, high profile lawyer with legal powers.
Ben kind of reminds me of Brian Coberger. Just so happens,
he turns his phone off exactly the time the four
University Idahos students are murdered in their beds.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
What a coink you think, Ben?
Speaker 5 (19:30):
I do agree that turing off his phone is certainly
not a practice of the defense.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
You know.
Speaker 5 (19:36):
It definitely is consistent with trying to have his activities
where he's going, what he's doing. There are other layers
of allegations in the war and against him the show.
He's pretty active after the altercation that he had of
Suzanne and the activity involved on the home depot to
get different items like trash bags, tarts, concrete buckets, things
(19:59):
like that.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
There is a discovery we talk about lockdown, Ben Powers,
Ben Powers, the phone being put in lockdown mode? Is
that the same thing as airplane mode? Or is it
something more?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
What is it?
Speaker 5 (20:13):
It's something more. It's something that's intended to avoid hitting
those things on the towers so that he could conceal
his movements. Okay, the thing I guess he wasn't baking
on his car head GPS line as well. So kind
of idiot defeated the purpose of what he hoped to achieve.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
You know, Ben Powers, would you agree that at this
juncture in our technological world, A jury is going to
view putting your phone in airplane mode or lockdown as
being as bad as placing.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
You at the scene.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
I mean, if he had at any sense at all,
he would have left his phone on at his home,
but instead he put it in lockdown. So I think
it has a very nefarious or sinister connotation to juries
because jury's didn't just fall off the turnip truck, Ben Powers,
they don't have their phone in lockdown.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
They may not even know how.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
To find lockdown on their phone, so that is going
to signal to them that something sinister was happening.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
And I agree that the problem the state still has
got to have is that's all peers that would come
in after the fact, after the allegation that he killed Suzanne.
They don't have anything before. They don't have any premeditations,
any planning before. This is all posts and so they're
still going to have a problem with establishing, you know,
(21:36):
with this avoluntary manslaughter.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
Ben Powers, You're right, they've got a problem.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Apparently, evidence from the Texas Rangers is taking longer than
anyone expected to be received by the state. The prosecution
stillating on forensic testing to be completed.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Prosecutors say they expect.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
To have five to six terabytes of evidence originating from
Texas Rangers, and let me tell you something, those rangers
don't play. Meanwhile, the defense says it's got about one
terabyte of discovery it still needs to go through before
moving forward with their motion to quash the indictment. Okay,
(22:24):
that's a lot of legal mumbo jumbo about when we're
going to have a hearing and.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Will the indictment be quashed.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I can tell you right now that indictment is not
going to be quashed, okay, just because there's not a body.
From what we know, circumstantial evidence indicates that Brad Simpson
was arguing with his wife and grabbing her or pulling
her by her arm outside their home. After the argument
outside the country club, a scream occurred from Susanne and
(22:51):
then everything went quiet. Now she's missing. I guess a
jury can add two plus two to get four. That
indictment is not going to be just because there is
only circumstantial evidence. But actually we don't know what all
the evidence is yet because all the discovery has not
been assimilated by Texas Rangers and handed over to prosecutors.
(23:13):
So we don't know what there is. There could be
a lot more, but what do we know. You know, Jeff,
how exactly do you know them? Who did you know first?
Speaker 3 (23:22):
I knew Suzanne first and then I met I met
Brad after that, before they even know each other.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
So how would you describe him?
Speaker 3 (23:30):
You know, he was a different dude. He was a
little weird, a little different, but you know he was
he was always uh, you know, smiling and and I'll
be honest with you that being a year younger than me,
I didn't see him a lot. The only time I
(23:51):
saw him was back at the frat house and everybody
was drinking beer and and you know, doing doing what
we do there. So you know, I've spent a summer
with Brad before his freshman year, you know, rushing our
(24:15):
fraternity and getting to know him and trying to get him.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
To Okay, Well, I don't need to hear about rush season.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
What I want to hear about, Jeff Horny is when
you said he was odd. That's what I want to
hear about. You know the old quote everyone is odd.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
But me and the and I think the a bit
queer at times.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
What that means h and everyday parlance is everybody thinks
everybody else is weird but themselves. Okay, So when you
say he was odd, you just can't put that out
there and leave it hanging.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
What did he do that was odd?
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Well, he never went anywhere with Suzanne. She was always
by herself, football games, by yourself, to watch her daughter's
chair parties herself. Never Brad was was was very rarely there.
Uh So that was that was that was odd to me.
You know, I don't know what else you want me
(25:12):
to say.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
I I I was around.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
I was around them because I Suzanne was a friend
of mine. You know, she's the one that would call
me and invite me to their parties. I wasn't you know,
Brad would not call me and invite me. Uh he
he is a you know again, the the the community
(25:37):
is is a uh a party driven community.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
You know.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
There was a lot of partying and alcohol. And there's
this group of mainly Alamo Heights men that raised money
for underprivileged folks and they they the cavaliers is what
they're called. And he was a cavalier. So you know,
(26:06):
he had some good qualities. I think, you know, I
think he might have been an okay father and took
his kids hunting and fishing. I just know he was
not a very good husbook.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
I don't know that allegedly murdering the mother of your
children qualifies as being a good father.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Hey, Zachary Taylor, right, got a question for you.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
I'm trying to go along with the police and these
recent court filings as to everything that they have uncovered
with his phone in lockdown mode, police had to go
to extreme methods, gathering surveillance video from all over homes, businesses,
red lights, you name it. Let me talk to you
about that, because what they have put together without the
(26:52):
use of his phone is survellance video showing his truck
at a grocery store at twelve thirty three a. M uhh,
he must have had a snack attack. Twelve thirty three am,
he said, the grocery store. Nothing in the bed of
his truck but an ice chest. Then when he takes
his daughter to school the next morning, where was Suzanne
she normally takes him to school. There are two full
(27:15):
white trash bags added in the truck bed.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Okay. Then when he spotted at that Bernie what burger
an hour later, now he's.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Got a heavy duty trash can with a firewood rat
weighing down an object now covered with the blue tarp.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Wow, a lot happened after he dropped his daughter off. Huh.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
Absolutely. He also made a stop at a home depot
where he bought concrete, a large bucket, and some I
believe cleaning spray with bleach before he asked for directions
to the nearest dump site.
Speaker 12 (27:50):
Simpson then stops at the Bernie home depot. Simpson buys
concrete mix, a bucket, trash bags, and chlorox spray. On
his way out, Simpson asks for directions to the new dump.
Surveillance footage captures Simpson leaving the dump, then stopping for gas.
The two white trash bags are no longer in the bed.
Simpson then drives to Medina, just west of the family
(28:12):
home in Bandera. When Simpson is spotted again back in Bernie,
the tarp and whatever was underneath it are gone.
Speaker 13 (28:19):
Simpson is on his way back from Bernie when he
receives the call, but Suzanne isn't there for their daughter.
Simpson picks her up around three point thirty, then heads
to his usual car wash with her. Video shows Simpson,
washing the interior around the driver's seat and rear left
passenger seat, cleaning up what he claims were concrete stains
in his car, Cleaning up.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
The vehicle at the car wash. You know, straight out
of the playbook A Photus Dulos. You know, Dulos charged
in the murder of his wife, a Connecticut mother of five,
and police in Connecticut did an incredible job of piecing
(29:00):
togather video from all sorts of origins.
Speaker 13 (29:04):
You know what, listen, investigators believe photos. Dulos parks his
employees Red Tacoma a few blocks from Jennifer Dulo's home,
then rides a bike the rest of the way, lying
in wait for her to return. After attacking her in
the garage, cops believe Dulo's loads Jennifer dead or unconscious
in the back of her own suv, then transfers her
(29:24):
body into the Tacoma. Less than a week later, without
his employee's knowledge, Dulos takes the truck again. Dulos is
caught on video paying for a car wash in cash.
His girlfriend, Michelle Treconis, later tells authorities he was trying
to clean a coffee spill. Despite Dulo's efforts, investigators still
managed to recover Jennifer Dulos's DNA from the passenger seat.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
To be in Power's high profile defense attorney. Why is
it when there is a murder or somebody goes missing,
suddenly husbands and or suspects turn into Nate Nix. Jody
Arias did all the laundry after she murdered Travis Alexander. Whoopsie,
she left her digital camera in the laundry, and you
(30:10):
see her foot by the dead body in the digicam.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Helps that hurt. Then Scott Peterson.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Went on a laundry jag, Clinton doing all the laundry
in the home and cleaning up.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
It goes on and on and on.
Speaker 5 (30:25):
Ben Powers, I thank it's for the obvious reason that
they are very active and very busy and whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
Powers, weren't you the veteran defense attorney? Because I'm hearing
an echo. You're just saying what I just said. What's
your defense In this case of Simpson cleaning out his
vehicle around the time his wife goes missing.
Speaker 5 (30:46):
I think most you can just say it's odd because
they still don't.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
Have a body.
Speaker 5 (30:50):
They don't have anything to say how he took her
life when he took her life, where he took her life,
where he just remembered her, where she is if he
did dismember her. At the moment, all they have is
DNA on the boatsault that no one can really explain.
There's a lot of speculation that can go.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Okay, okay, point will taken, Ben Powers, point will taken.
Zachary tail are right? Tell me about his movements that day.
I want to talk about the tarp, the bleach that
stops at the grocery at twelve thirty in the morning,
then going to a dump site, then driving all around
the area making stops, and all those big bags of
(31:28):
trast then disappear every time he makes a stop, and
a surveillance video something's been moved out of the bed
of his trunk. So why is it that day suddenly
it's in and out, in and out with the truck
bed just tons of trash bags a tart for Pete's sake,
I can.
Speaker 4 (31:43):
Tell you why he did it. All I can do
is tell you what he's accused of doing, and that is,
like you mentioned, starting the morning with some suspicious activity,
including driving out to Bernie after dropping off his daughter
with only a nice Chester his trunk and the art
started in the bed of his truck before he's then
(32:04):
seen in Bernie with large trash fins and then stops
at the depot where he's then seen that water burger
with the large object covered by a tart, and then
he asks for directions to the nearest dump there and Bernie,
and he's shortly seen on surveillance camera footage after visiting
(32:25):
the deck with the two trash bags gone, but he
still has the large item covered with the tar. He
then proceeds to drive to Bandera, which officers reportedly know
from license plate readers and other surveillance footage that they
see of his truck driving out there. He then stops
in Bandera for only less than fifteen minutes before he's
(32:47):
then seen driving back towards Bernie with the tart and
the large item under the tar being gone.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Even those whose Antips's body has never been found to date.
A Bear Canny grand jury indicted Brad Simpson on charges
of murder, of tampering with evidence with the intent to
impair a human corpse, tampering and or fabricating physical evidence
with the intent to impair, and possessing prohibited weapons. Susanne,
(33:20):
a mother of four, last seen at a party at the.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Ritzy Argyle Club.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Now, let's see that was on October six, but it
wasn't around ten pm October seven that husband Brad Simpson
reported her missing. We know they were involved in a
dispute the night she disappeared, not only at the country club,
but outside her home according to a neighbor. We also
(33:48):
have Brad Simpson's business partner, James Cotter. He's been charged
in connection with the case for hiding a gun. He's
accused of helping Simpson hide in AK forty seven that
was illegally modified. The firearm was modified into a machine
gun and was not correctly registered.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Whoopsie.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Some of the evidence we do know about is surveillance
footage showing Brad Simpson driving with three large trash bags,
photos dulos all over again, a heavy TV trash can,
and a quote large bulky item wrapped in a blue
tarp the day after she disappears. Now we learn that
from an arrest warrant AFFI David Susanne Simpson's remains I
(34:37):
believe in the Bandera area, but they have never been found. Surprise, surprise, again. Husband,
Brad Simpson has shown very little emotion about his wife's disappearance,
and he is not cooperating with investigators.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
It's like the same old playbook.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Come on, this is the same exact thing Fotus Dulos did.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Okay, there's a copious amount.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Of blood found in the garage outside of Jennifer's car
after she came back from drop off that morning at school.
She's never been found, but he Traconas and his girlfriend,
that's certainly.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
One way to put it.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Michelle Traconas are caught on video driving all around town
going to I believe it was five different trash receptacles
caught on video throwing away sponges, rags, towels, all soaked
in blood, the wife, Jennifer Dulos shirt and Bras soaked
(35:33):
in blood. So how smart is Simpson because he's just
doing the same old playbook for Pete's sake.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
I don't think he's very smart.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
I'm you know, after I heard that they found the
found her DNA on the reciprocating saws. He's crazy. I mean,
I don't know what he could have to get all
that done in the few hours that he got done.
I'd like to know what he was on to do that, you.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Know, Uh, yeah, has Brian Fitzgibbons, Brian, do you ever
wish that suspect, of course he's presumed innocent, would do
something different? I mean, don't you know that if the
authorities have already gotten him on video at the water
(36:24):
burger and the grocery store and the here and the there,
they're going to have video of him disposing of stuff,
although he may have disposed of it in a remote
area where we're never going to find it.
Speaker 8 (36:36):
Yeah, Nancy, at this point that I certainly wish all
the time that you know, a defendant would come forward
with the truth, right, But at this point we're probably
dealing with multiple disposal sites, potentially bodies of water, potentially
different dump sites, and uh, you know this this is
going to be very complicated. But so far as a wish,
(36:58):
of course, I feel that all the time I wish
you'd come forward and give us the truth.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
A major update in the search for Suzanne Simpson, the
missing Texas mom luxury realtor.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
Listens Park Police Department, along with the Texas Rangers, have
charged Brad Chandler Simpson with murder in the death of
his wife, Suzanne Clark Simpson.
Speaker 14 (37:19):
The rangers have not stopped investigating this case as it
has been turned over to the District Attorney's department. The
District Attorney starts their process in the prosecution phase, even
though we are not stopping our search for Suzanne Clark Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
That from our friends at k e NS five.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
And you were hearing the almost part Chief of Police
Feddale valet House and Sergeant Dion Cockrell from the Texas
Department of Public Safety. So now there is a formal
charge the District attorney now starting the prosecution phase, will
more be made clear?
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Maybe not.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
We don't have a right to know all of the
details surrounding this case. Straight out to doctor Kendall Crown,
chief medical Examiner in Terran County. That's Fort Worth, Texas,
doctor Kumba crowns. I'm thinking back on Photosdulos and how
he and his lover Michelle Chaconis were hiding Jennifer, the
(38:14):
mother of his five children. I mean hiding throwing away
into dumpsters, into trash receptacles all over town. What man
throws the same bag of trash in five different trash cans?
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Okay, food for thought.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
But if we find, if we discover that Susanne has
been dismembered, that could.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Mean anything from a leg to a digit.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
So how do you go about if any part of
her is found connecting that back to Susanne Sipson?
Speaker 7 (38:51):
So well, what you would have to do is whatever
you receive, you would get tissue, bone, marrow, whatever you
can pull off of it, and then submit that for DNA.
If it would happened to be a finger, you could
actually get fingerprints from it if it's still intact enough,
and you could do it that way. But in this
type of case, with the parts being found over time,
(39:12):
that each part that is found is going to have
to have DNA testing done on it to make sure
it's from her. But once you do find a part,
especially if it's like a large portion, like a thigh
or something like that, you know she's been murdered. You
know she's been cut up.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Joining me is renowned psychologist Karen Start joining us from Manhattan. Karen,
the loss of your mother is overwhelming, I've been told,
But then the additional shock that she's been murdered, then
the additional shock that she has been dismembered. Now, if
(39:51):
the children don't accept that. They are left with the
specter of my mom's not dead, she just abandoned me.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
So what are your thoughts?
Speaker 10 (40:03):
Well, no matter which way this turns out, Nancy's children
don't have a mother anymore. So there is so much
they've been exposed to. They're going to need a tremendous
amount of help.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
In my hand, the newly released charging documents straight out
to my saint Antonio Zachary tail all right, Zachary, tell
me in a nutshell about these allegations, and they are
only that allegations.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
He has not been proven guilty. What do you know?
Speaker 4 (40:29):
So I know he's been charged with the murder of
Suzanne Simpson, and I also know he's been charged with
two bounts of tempering with evidence. One is linked to
the gun that he had his friend had and the
reciprocating saw that they alleged that he attempted to conceal
from investigators. Then he was also charged with tempering with
evidence with the intent to conceal his wife's body, although
(40:54):
very little information has been presented on that charge. And
then those are the charges he's facing, but they're all
being questioned by his defense attorney.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
In the last hours Brad Simpson in court before Judge
Joel Petz with the.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
Attorneyship be identified in films. He's a stand appreciation. See
you can gie more from mister Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Okay, and Sarah you Brad the challenger of Simpson.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
That from our friends A KA, B B Zachary Taylor,
what happened in court.
Speaker 4 (41:22):
There is quite a bit that's set to happen in
the coming months. He Brad Simpson is said to be
before the judge again on December nineteenth. Now that's a
motion to amend conditions, but very little has been filed
with the court to tell us or offer any kind
of insight into what his defense attorney might be looking
to do, although in the past he has sought to
(41:45):
reduce the bond amount and change the bond conditions to
allow him to see his children. And then he'll be
back before the judge on February twelve.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Well, you're right again. When you don't know a horse,
look at his track record. Now, Brad Simpson is that
the charges be thrown out.
Speaker 11 (42:02):
Listen, there's emotion to watch the inditement, which I think
will give it a leader date.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
That's for our friends at kabb to Ben Powers in
a nutshell, Ben a nutshell. The state doesn't give a
killer a gold star or an A plus plus because
they get rid of the body that's not happening. The
state doesn't have to lay out in the indictment how
the victim was killed.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
If they can prove it.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
Sure put it in there, for instance, by manual strangulation,
by shooting with the weapon, by stabbing, But it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (42:37):
The state doesn't have to prove how she was killed.
They just have to.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Convince a jury that she has been killed and that
he did it in this jurisdiction.
Speaker 5 (42:45):
Well, I disagree with that. They have to lay out
what their theory of the killing is. You know, there's
a big difference between a voluntary manslaughter, which is accidental killing,
and a first degree murder, which is premeditated killing. It
sounds like his defense attorneys are saying, you're saying he
killed her, but you're not telling us how when where
any of the important details that go to your theory
(43:06):
of premeditation. And so that's what they're attacking with their
most recent pilence is the lack of proof that goes
towards premeditation, like the state is trying to make it
out to be.
Speaker 1 (43:15):
So, Ben Powers, let me understand in your mind, the
state has to lay out the exact.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Mode of murder. So you've never encountered a case where.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
There was no body to be found and the mode
of murder was unknown. Are you telling me you've never
seen a no body case indictment.
Speaker 5 (43:37):
What I'm saying is this most recent motion sounds like
what I would call a deal in particulars. It's basically
the defense throw down the gauntlet and saying, okay, state,
you say my client premeditated killed this person.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
I know what they filed, Ben, I know what the
defense filed. We just had reporters say that. But then
you said the indictment must show mode of murder.
Speaker 5 (43:58):
When I say mode, I mean in this case, they're
saying it's premeditated, and then must include a factual allegation
that supports premeditation being charged.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
For all of you.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Would be wife killers out there, an indictment does not
have to show how you killed your partner. Okay, you
getting rid of the body is not going to help you.
And in Diamond only has to allege that you committed
premeditated murder. The jurisdiction and the name of the victim.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
The rest can be proven at trial. The state is
still building its case. If you know or think you
know anything about the disappearance of Texas's mom, Suzanne Simpson
or the movements of her husband, Brad Simpson, who is
presumed innocent, please dial two one zero two zero nine
(44:55):
two seven zero one two one zero two zero nine two.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
Seven zero one.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Let's remember now an American hero David Ennsbrenner, Aitchison, p D. Kansas,
shot and killed in the line of duty. Served twenty
four years in law enforcement. Survived by wife now widow, Carrie,
and children without a father, Avery, Abby and Celia. American
(45:22):
hero Sergeant David Endsbrenner. Nancy Gray signing off goodbye friend.
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a gorgeous young mom. Suzanne
Simpson is seen arguing with her husband outside their elite,
argy old country club. The neighbor after that here's screams
(00:21):
outside is convinced that Suzanne everything suddenly goes quiet. She's
never seen again in the Last Days, another development in
the search for Suzanne. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
Thank you for being with us. In the last Days.
Brad Simpson has filed a motion to quash a hearing
(00:46):
It was set for thirty days in connection with wife
Suzanne's murder case. Still no body. Brad Simpson, the husband Surprise.
The husband Simpson, an almost part ma'am, is believed to
have murdered his wife last year. The discovery hearing was
(01:07):
originally scheduled in Judge Joel Pettis's four hundred and thirty
seventh District Court, but now Brad Simpson wants to quash it.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
What is quash mean? Basically kick it out of court?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Okay, what do we know about Suzanne's disappearance and where
is she or her body?
Speaker 3 (01:29):
They met in college at the University of Texas.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Nice guy, charismatic, engaging.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
You know Suzanne was a little tiny thing, but.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
For Suzanne, it wasn't perfect time.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
It's just tragic.
Speaker 5 (01:43):
Man.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
I can't even imagine she didn't deserve that at all.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
If just the thought of Suzanne's body out decomposing in
a trash site or a disposal site, it's getting worse.
The hand held reciprocating Saul belonging to the husband absolutely
has his Anne Simpson's DNA on it. Why why would
(02:09):
that be there? Take a listen to what the almost
pdchief had to say.
Speaker 6 (02:13):
So we're holding out hope that maybe, you know, maybe
she's trying to be away from the home, to get
away from that situation. That's not totally uncommon, but what
is uncommon. What is unusual is that this was a
woman who worked and was very dependable, and loved her
children and was always in contact with her children and
her family and her friends. We would love for her
(02:34):
to be alive. Obviously, there's nothing concrete that says she's
not alive. And again, I owe it to the family,
We all owe it to the family to speak of
her in a way where other people have been found,
like I said, injured and distressed, lost, troubled, hiding away.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
All of those things are possible now.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
From our friends at WAI joining me an all star
panel to make sense of what we are learning right now.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
This is not the update I wanted to report to
you tonight.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
For a first out to Zachary Taylor right joining us,
a trending digital reporter with my essay, my san Antonio.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Zachary, thank you so much for being with us.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Explain to me how the husband's reciprocating saw.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
You know what? Just pause, Zachary. I want to hear
everything you've got to say.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
But for people that don't know what a reciprocating saw is,
let me go to doctor Kendall Crown's joining us, the
chief medical Examiner in Tarrett County, that's Fort Worth, the
Texas Jurisdiction esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine TCU,
Doctor Kendall Crown, thank you so much for being with us.
Before I get into your usual topics, and that is
(03:45):
the discovery of bodies. What you can tell from bodies,
what you can tell from an autopsy? Could you explain
and demonstrate what is a reciprocating saw.
Speaker 7 (03:55):
Certainly so, reciprocating saws are saws that use a blade.
Speaker 5 (03:58):
They actually have.
Speaker 7 (03:59):
My here is a large, fairly large saw. It has
a blade that goes backwards in the forwards, which is
the reciprocating movement of the saw. And they can be
used to cut through metal, wood, bone, tissue, you name it.
They use them in the meat cutting industry to cut
a part cattle.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Hold on, let me see that again. Could you turn
that on one more time? Doctor Kimlin. Crown's sure, Jeff
Horny is joining me, right, I heard it, Thank you.
Jeff Horny is with us right now, joining us from
San Antonio, longtime friend of both Suzanne and Brad Simpson,
(04:40):
her husband, Jeff Horny.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
I don't know how you can sit there and look
at that saw.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
It looks like a giant version of the electric knife
people use at Thanksgiving and Christmas to cut a turkey
or a roast or something.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Sure he knew what he was doing. Look at that knowing, Suzanne.
It's terrible.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
And disgusting actually, And.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
He's a hunter.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
You know, if you've used one of those saws, you
know that it's not real clean. It doesn't just make
a beautiful clean cut. And yes, I saw him in
the courtroom and he looked like he'd been doing push
ups for months. You know, he looks like a thug,
is what he looks like, what he's turned out to be.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So it's sad man.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
We were talking to Jeff Horny, who's been a longtime
friend of not only Susanne the missing mom, but the husband.
Zacharychell are right, thank you for holding a trending digital
reporter with my sa my san Antonio. Zachary again, thank
you for being with us. I want to backtrack just
a moment. You know, I just heard Jeff Horny state
(05:49):
that the husband, who is presumed innocent under the law,
these are just allegations right now, Zachary, I don't know
how him being a hunter has anything to do with
his wife's DNA being on a reciprocating so oh I do.
I do know the connection he made. He was making
the connection that the saw could be let me just
(06:13):
say contaminated or still caked with animal detried us from
prior hunting trips. I don't know a nice way to
say it. That's why I'm searching for the words. But
Zachary Taylor right, tell me how and where this reciprocating
saw it was discovered?
Speaker 4 (06:32):
So the reciprocating saw was discovered in Brett's possession and
their believe in their family home, but it was hidden away,
which is part of his accusations against him, is that
he attempted to conceal it from investigators, and of course
the DNA did link back to Susannah.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Zachary, you stated that the DNA is found on.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Simpson's saw, but where was the saw?
Speaker 4 (06:59):
The pacificatting saw was found in Brad Simpson's toolbox.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
You know, Zachary Taylor right joining us from my San Antonio. Zachary,
I understand that the husband, Brad Simpson, tried to hide
the saw absolutely.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
So that's part of the accusations made against him, is
that he attempted to conceal the saw from investigators initially,
and so when they were able to find it and
link it back to Suzanne, they charged him with tempering
with evidence.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Well, if it's right there in his toolbox, I don't
understand how he's trying to hide it. I'm certainly not
taking his side. But you know, Ben Power is joining me,
high profile defense attorney at Legal Powers.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
Ben, the worst thing.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
You can do if this ever makes it to a
jury is for the prosecutor to state something in opening
statements like.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
Yes, and he tried to hide the saw.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
And then it comes out that he didn't, because if
you're wrong as a prosecutor on one fact, it taints
everything else.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
It takes your good facts.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And you stand up in front of a jury and
you say he tried to hide the saw, because you
know what the hiding part is the big indicator that
something the fairius has occurred. Being powers, how do I
know she didn't try to use the saw one time
and cut her finger on I mean, it could be
a million things, but the fact that he then tried
to hide it puts it in a whole another light
(08:24):
been powers.
Speaker 5 (08:25):
Yeah, I agree. I think it's important that if you're
going to use the accusation that he tried to hide
the saw and it turns out his toolbox. Obviously where
that toolbox was found, and the key to having it
is trying to hide it. But I agree with that.
You just said you don't want to lose credibility with
jury overstating or trying to extend your proof beyond what
(08:46):
your proof actually can show. And so I think the
importance for the saw in this context is how it's
thread in the larger tapestry of the story, So I
wouldn't unnecessarily try to extend it past its value, which
is her dnage on the saw. And for the state,
that's a good facts and defense. That's certainly a problem
(09:06):
we're going to have to address the trial.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Let me nail this down, Zachary, tail all right? If
the saw with his wife's DNA on it, and you
know another thing I got to find out, Zachary, and
we may not know it yet.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Is it blood? Because just go with me for a moment.
Do I believe this is true?
Speaker 6 (09:23):
No?
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Could one's or believe it absolutely? What if she was
using a saw and she cut herself through it? I
believe this luxury real estate mom was out working with
a reciprocating saw. No, I don't, okay, but.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
That is a legitimate argument to be made to a jury.
Or Zachary.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
What if it is bone, Now that's a whole another
can of worms. What if it is hair, hair, scalp,
It could be a number of things that would clearly
tell a jury that the saw was used on her
to dismember her. So, hey, I gotta nail down is
(10:04):
it true? He tried to hide it. And you know what, Zachary,
when you don't know a horse, look at his track record.
We already know he asked a friend. As a matter
of fact, I believe you told me this. He asked
a friend to hide a gun, and the friend hid
the gun in a false wall, and the gun was found,
and the friend, of course blabbed, he told me to
hide it. So we know he has a track record
(10:26):
of hiding evidence. Now that's one thing, but that doesn't
prove to me he tried to hide this saw. I
need to know how did he try to hide the saw?
Where are we getting that?
Speaker 4 (10:37):
So that comes directly from the charges against him. But
we don't have the exact details on where police found
the saw, other than it being in his toolbox. So
your plants are completely accurate. And we also don't know
precisely what DNA they found on the saw.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Brad Simpson moving to quash a hearing set in connection
with his wife Suzanne's murder. Judge Padez had initially set
a thirty day window for the hearing to occur as
evidence from the Texas Rangers is still being collected. I
hope that includes her body, but as of yet nobody
(11:26):
has been found. Now, as the state's attorneys continue to
gather evidence, the Texas Rangers still conducting investigation translation looking
for her body. Simpson's lawyer said they had enough evidence
to proceed with a motion to quash the indictment. That's right,
(11:49):
throw out the indictment. The judge offered Simpson's lawyers a thirty,
sixty or ninety day option for the next hearing. Of course,
they're sticking with a thirty day window, holding the state's
feet to the fire to get the evidence to move forward. Now,
if they were smart, I think that file for emotion
(12:10):
for speedy trial and make the state go forward without
a body. You can't be held indefinitely under the constitution
waiting for trial. That's why we have the right to
a speedy trial under our constitution. Typically, a speedy trial
is within the term or the next two terms of
(12:32):
the indictment being handed down. A term in most jurisdictions
is about three months. Every three to four months, a
new grand jury is impaneled, which would mean a speedy trial.
Demand would guarantee a trial within let's say three six
(12:52):
nine months ish from the day of the indictment. What
is in that discovery? What do we know about Susan's disappearance?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Brians Gibbons joining me.
Speaker 1 (13:06):
Brian is the director of Operations for USPA Nationwide Security,
who leads teams of investigators all around the country trying
to find missing people. Brian, just go with me for
a moment. The saw in the toolbox, that's not damning,
that's not incriminating.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
That means nothing to me.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
I need to know it kind of what part of DNA,
What type of DNA is it?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
For instance, if it's hair and scalp, it's over for him.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
If it's just a little blood, well that could have
an innocent explanation. Not that I believe it, but it could.
So what about this, Brian? If the toolbox itself, we
know the saw is in the toolbox, But if the
toolbox itself, let's just say, was buried in the backyard, Okay,
that indicates nefarious intent. If it was flung in a river,
(13:56):
we have to know more facts before we can just
blurt out it was hit.
Speaker 8 (14:00):
Yeah, As Attorney Ben Powers just said, we're looking at
a whole tapestry of things laid out in this charging document.
So where it was concealed, how it was concealed is
certainly going to come out later. But there was a
reason that investigators put that in the documents. Okay, we
see him concealing the cell phone, we see him concealing
the guns. Now we read about him concealing the saw.
(14:22):
They're laying out a pattern of behavior from Brad Simpson.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Here.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
You know, Ryan, I gave up cursing, or I said
I was giving up cursing when I had the twins.
But on this special special occasion, let me just say,
they damn well better show me later because Karen Start
joining me renounced psychologist, TV radio trauma expert. You can
find her at karenstart dot com. Karen, you know I
(14:47):
live through the Ja Simpson trial, Mayhey Rottenhill.
Speaker 9 (14:51):
One little beauty thing, the glove, one little beauty thing,
And I guarantee you, Karen Stark, if I could have
gotten that courtroom and gone up to Simpson, I would have.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Gotten that glove on his hand, no question. But one thing,
that one thing tainted the whole case. It messed up
the whole case. Like here, if the state says he
hit it, and then you can't prove he hit it
a technical legal term, they're screwed.
Speaker 10 (15:22):
You know, I would think, Nancy, that they would not
say that he was tampering with the evidence or hiding
it unless there was actually a reason.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Stop. Brother Kimmel.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Crowns is demonstrating what a reciprocating handheld saw is. Does
that come with another blade, a detachable blade?
Speaker 7 (15:45):
Yes, it comes with multiple different blades depending on what
you're trying to saw up. It can come with ones
that'll work on a metal. It also comes with ones
that'll trim trees, things of that nature.
Speaker 11 (15:56):
So, for those of you just joining US medical examiner,
doctor Kendall Crowns is demonstrating a reciprocating saw.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
Go ahead, Okay, thank you, doctor Crowns.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
You know, to Zachary Taylor Wright, the big bombshell tonight
is that Suzanne's DNA is found on that reciprocating saw.
But there is other evidence that's extremely disturbing.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
The problem with a reciprocating saw is that in the leading.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Up to tonight, we were looking for a body because
nobody wouldn't you agree, Jeff Horney, There's no way Suzann
would have stayed away from her children this long.
Speaker 4 (16:48):
Yeah, absolutely not, So that.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
Means we're looking for a body.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
But now that the reciprocating saw has entered the scene
with her DNA on it, that means he has very
likely been dismembered. Is going to make the discovery of
her remains much more difficult.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
What does that mean to a prosecutor?
Speaker 1 (17:06):
That means this may very well be a no body case,
as in, there will never be a body discovered. But
what else do we know? Zachary Taylor right.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Joining us from my San Antonio.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
We were just describing Brad Simpson going out for a
what a Burger? He certainly did not lose his appetite
in light of his wife missing. Now I know I'm
projecting Zachary Taylor right.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
But when I learned my fiance.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Had been murdered, I lost down to eighty nine pounds.
The thought of food literally made me sick, nauseous, and
I went so long. I remember the first thing I ingested,
and it was orange juice and something my mom had
in the fridge.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
So I know that's just my experience.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
But when I hear about Brad Simpson in the middle
of his wife missing, pigging out at what a Burger,
I'm not a shrink.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Or a dietitian, but that just doesn't sit right with me.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
I mean, we don't know exactly what he purchased at
Waburger so far, but we do know that he did,
in fact stop at Waterburger with some we'll say, suspicious
items in his trunk that he later unloaded after making
two separate stops. And we also know, according to the
restaurant off A David, he's accused of burning the couple
(18:30):
of electronics as well out of Benderah home.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
First of all, he puts his phone in quote lockdown mode,
Ryan Gibbons joining us USPA Nationwide Security. I don't know
what lockdown mode means. I guess that means like airplane mode.
Speaker 8 (18:49):
Right, this is going to go, This is going to
go one step beyond that, Nancy. So once that phone
enters lockdown mode, you have no data being transmitted from
that phone to the cloud, to any towers. So tracking
Brad Simpson's movements with the phone would become nearly impossible
at that point.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Ben Power is joining me, high profile lawyer with legal powers.
Ben kind of reminds me of Brian Coberger. Just so happens,
he turns his phone off exactly the time the four
University Idahos students are murdered in their beds.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
What a coink you think, Ben?
Speaker 5 (19:30):
I do agree that turing off his phone is certainly
not a practice of the defense.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
You know.
Speaker 5 (19:36):
It definitely is consistent with trying to have his activities
where he's going, what he's doing. There are other layers
of allegations in the war and against him the show.
He's pretty active after the altercation that he had of
Suzanne and the activity involved on the home depot to
get different items like trash bags, tarts, concrete buckets, things
(19:59):
like that.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
There is a discovery we talk about lockdown, Ben Powers,
Ben Powers, the phone being put in lockdown mode? Is
that the same thing as airplane mode? Or is it
something more?
Speaker 2 (20:12):
What is it?
Speaker 5 (20:13):
It's something more. It's something that's intended to avoid hitting
those things on the towers so that he could conceal
his movements. Okay, the thing I guess he wasn't baking
on his car head GPS line as well. So kind
of idiot defeated the purpose of what he hoped to achieve.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
You know, Ben Powers, would you agree that at this
juncture in our technological world, A jury is going to
view putting your phone in airplane mode or lockdown as
being as bad as placing.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
You at the scene.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
I mean, if he had at any sense at all,
he would have left his phone on at his home,
but instead he put it in lockdown. So I think
it has a very nefarious or sinister connotation to juries
because jury's didn't just fall off the turnip truck, Ben Powers,
they don't have their phone in lockdown.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
They may not even know how.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
To find lockdown on their phone, so that is going
to signal to them that something sinister was happening.
Speaker 5 (21:15):
And I agree that the problem the state still has
got to have is that's all peers that would come
in after the fact, after the allegation that he killed Suzanne.
They don't have anything before. They don't have any premeditations,
any planning before. This is all posts and so they're
still going to have a problem with establishing, you know,
(21:36):
with this avoluntary manslaughter.
Speaker 1 (21:37):
Ben Powers, You're right, they've got a problem.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Apparently, evidence from the Texas Rangers is taking longer than
anyone expected to be received by the state. The prosecution
stillating on forensic testing to be completed.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
Prosecutors say they expect.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
To have five to six terabytes of evidence originating from
Texas Rangers, and let me tell you something, those rangers
don't play. Meanwhile, the defense says it's got about one
terabyte of discovery it still needs to go through before
moving forward with their motion to quash the indictment. Okay,
(22:24):
that's a lot of legal mumbo jumbo about when we're
going to have a hearing and.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Will the indictment be quashed.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I can tell you right now that indictment is not
going to be quashed, okay, just because there's not a body.
From what we know, circumstantial evidence indicates that Brad Simpson
was arguing with his wife and grabbing her or pulling
her by her arm outside their home. After the argument
outside the country club, a scream occurred from Susanne and
(22:51):
then everything went quiet. Now she's missing. I guess a
jury can add two plus two to get four. That
indictment is not going to be just because there is
only circumstantial evidence. But actually we don't know what all
the evidence is yet because all the discovery has not
been assimilated by Texas Rangers and handed over to prosecutors.
(23:13):
So we don't know what there is. There could be
a lot more, but what do we know. You know, Jeff,
how exactly do you know them? Who did you know first?
Speaker 3 (23:22):
I knew Suzanne first and then I met I met
Brad after that, before they even know each other.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
So how would you describe him?
Speaker 3 (23:30):
You know, he was a different dude. He was a
little weird, a little different, but you know he was
he was always uh, you know, smiling and and I'll
be honest with you that being a year younger than me,
I didn't see him a lot. The only time I
(23:51):
saw him was back at the frat house and everybody
was drinking beer and and you know, doing doing what
we do there. So you know, I've spent a summer
with Brad before his freshman year, you know, rushing our
(24:15):
fraternity and getting to know him and trying to get him.
Speaker 2 (24:19):
To Okay, Well, I don't need to hear about rush season.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
What I want to hear about, Jeff Horny is when
you said he was odd. That's what I want to
hear about. You know the old quote everyone is odd.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
But me and the and I think the a bit
queer at times.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
What that means h and everyday parlance is everybody thinks
everybody else is weird but themselves. Okay, So when you
say he was odd, you just can't put that out
there and leave it hanging.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
What did he do that was odd?
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Well, he never went anywhere with Suzanne. She was always
by herself, football games, by yourself, to watch her daughter's
chair parties herself. Never Brad was was was very rarely there.
Uh So that was that was that was odd to me.
You know, I don't know what else you want me
(25:12):
to say.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
I I I was around.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
I was around them because I Suzanne was a friend
of mine. You know, she's the one that would call
me and invite me to their parties. I wasn't you know,
Brad would not call me and invite me. Uh he
he is a you know again, the the the community
(25:37):
is is a uh a party driven community.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
You know.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
There was a lot of partying and alcohol. And there's
this group of mainly Alamo Heights men that raised money
for underprivileged folks and they they the cavaliers is what
they're called. And he was a cavalier. So you know,
(26:06):
he had some good qualities. I think, you know, I
think he might have been an okay father and took
his kids hunting and fishing. I just know he was
not a very good husbook.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
I don't know that allegedly murdering the mother of your
children qualifies as being a good father.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Hey, Zachary Taylor, right, got a question for you.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
I'm trying to go along with the police and these
recent court filings as to everything that they have uncovered
with his phone in lockdown mode, police had to go
to extreme methods, gathering surveillance video from all over homes, businesses,
red lights, you name it. Let me talk to you
about that, because what they have put together without the
(26:52):
use of his phone is survellance video showing his truck
at a grocery store at twelve thirty three a. M uhh,
he must have had a snack attack. Twelve thirty three am,
he said, the grocery store. Nothing in the bed of
his truck but an ice chest. Then when he takes
his daughter to school the next morning, where was Suzanne
she normally takes him to school. There are two full
(27:15):
white trash bags added in the truck bed.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Okay. Then when he spotted at that Bernie what burger
an hour later, now he's.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Got a heavy duty trash can with a firewood rat
weighing down an object now covered with the blue tarp.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Wow, a lot happened after he dropped his daughter off. Huh.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
Absolutely. He also made a stop at a home depot
where he bought concrete, a large bucket, and some I
believe cleaning spray with bleach before he asked for directions
to the nearest dump site.
Speaker 12 (27:50):
Simpson then stops at the Bernie home depot. Simpson buys
concrete mix, a bucket, trash bags, and chlorox spray. On
his way out, Simpson asks for directions to the new dump.
Surveillance footage captures Simpson leaving the dump, then stopping for gas.
The two white trash bags are no longer in the bed.
Simpson then drives to Medina, just west of the family
(28:12):
home in Bandera. When Simpson is spotted again back in Bernie,
the tarp and whatever was underneath it are gone.
Speaker 13 (28:19):
Simpson is on his way back from Bernie when he
receives the call, but Suzanne isn't there for their daughter.
Simpson picks her up around three point thirty, then heads
to his usual car wash with her. Video shows Simpson,
washing the interior around the driver's seat and rear left
passenger seat, cleaning up what he claims were concrete stains
in his car, Cleaning up.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
The vehicle at the car wash. You know, straight out
of the playbook A Photus Dulos. You know, Dulos charged
in the murder of his wife, a Connecticut mother of five,
and police in Connecticut did an incredible job of piecing
(29:00):
togather video from all sorts of origins.
Speaker 13 (29:04):
You know what, listen, investigators believe photos. Dulos parks his
employees Red Tacoma a few blocks from Jennifer Dulo's home,
then rides a bike the rest of the way, lying
in wait for her to return. After attacking her in
the garage, cops believe Dulo's loads Jennifer dead or unconscious
in the back of her own suv, then transfers her
(29:24):
body into the Tacoma. Less than a week later, without
his employee's knowledge, Dulos takes the truck again. Dulos is
caught on video paying for a car wash in cash.
His girlfriend, Michelle Treconis, later tells authorities he was trying
to clean a coffee spill. Despite Dulo's efforts, investigators still
managed to recover Jennifer Dulos's DNA from the passenger seat.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
To be in Power's high profile defense attorney. Why is
it when there is a murder or somebody goes missing,
suddenly husbands and or suspects turn into Nate Nix. Jody
Arias did all the laundry after she murdered Travis Alexander. Whoopsie,
she left her digital camera in the laundry, and you
(30:10):
see her foot by the dead body in the digicam.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Helps that hurt. Then Scott Peterson.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
Went on a laundry jag, Clinton doing all the laundry
in the home and cleaning up.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
It goes on and on and on.
Speaker 5 (30:25):
Ben Powers, I thank it's for the obvious reason that
they are very active and very busy and whatever it is.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
Powers, weren't you the veteran defense attorney? Because I'm hearing
an echo. You're just saying what I just said. What's
your defense In this case of Simpson cleaning out his
vehicle around the time his wife goes missing.
Speaker 5 (30:46):
I think most you can just say it's odd because
they still don't.
Speaker 4 (30:49):
Have a body.
Speaker 5 (30:50):
They don't have anything to say how he took her
life when he took her life, where he took her life,
where he just remembered her, where she is if he
did dismember her. At the moment, all they have is
DNA on the boatsault that no one can really explain.
There's a lot of speculation that can go.
Speaker 1 (31:07):
Okay, okay, point will taken, Ben Powers, point will taken.
Zachary tail are right? Tell me about his movements that day.
I want to talk about the tarp, the bleach that
stops at the grocery at twelve thirty in the morning,
then going to a dump site, then driving all around
the area making stops, and all those big bags of
(31:28):
trast then disappear every time he makes a stop, and
a surveillance video something's been moved out of the bed
of his trunk. So why is it that day suddenly
it's in and out, in and out with the truck
bed just tons of trash bags a tart for Pete's sake,
I can.
Speaker 4 (31:43):
Tell you why he did it. All I can do
is tell you what he's accused of doing, and that is,
like you mentioned, starting the morning with some suspicious activity,
including driving out to Bernie after dropping off his daughter
with only a nice Chester his trunk and the art
started in the bed of his truck before he's then
(32:04):
seen in Bernie with large trash fins and then stops
at the depot where he's then seen that water burger
with the large object covered by a tart, and then
he asks for directions to the nearest dump there and Bernie,
and he's shortly seen on surveillance camera footage after visiting
(32:25):
the deck with the two trash bags gone, but he
still has the large item covered with the tar. He
then proceeds to drive to Bandera, which officers reportedly know
from license plate readers and other surveillance footage that they
see of his truck driving out there. He then stops
in Bandera for only less than fifteen minutes before he's
(32:47):
then seen driving back towards Bernie with the tart and
the large item under the tar being gone.
Speaker 1 (32:54):
Even those whose Antips's body has never been found to date.
A Bear Canny grand jury indicted Brad Simpson on charges
of murder, of tampering with evidence with the intent to
impair a human corpse, tampering and or fabricating physical evidence
with the intent to impair, and possessing prohibited weapons. Susanne,
(33:20):
a mother of four, last seen at a party at the.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Ritzy Argyle Club.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Now, let's see that was on October six, but it
wasn't around ten pm October seven that husband Brad Simpson
reported her missing. We know they were involved in a
dispute the night she disappeared, not only at the country club,
but outside her home according to a neighbor. We also
(33:48):
have Brad Simpson's business partner, James Cotter. He's been charged
in connection with the case for hiding a gun. He's
accused of helping Simpson hide in AK forty seven that
was illegally modified. The firearm was modified into a machine
gun and was not correctly registered.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Whoopsie.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Some of the evidence we do know about is surveillance
footage showing Brad Simpson driving with three large trash bags,
photos dulos all over again, a heavy TV trash can,
and a quote large bulky item wrapped in a blue
tarp the day after she disappears. Now we learn that
from an arrest warrant AFFI David Susanne Simpson's remains I
(34:37):
believe in the Bandera area, but they have never been found. Surprise, surprise, again. Husband,
Brad Simpson has shown very little emotion about his wife's disappearance,
and he is not cooperating with investigators.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
It's like the same old playbook.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Come on, this is the same exact thing Fotus Dulos did.
Speaker 2 (34:57):
Okay, there's a copious amount.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Of blood found in the garage outside of Jennifer's car
after she came back from drop off that morning at school.
She's never been found, but he Traconas and his girlfriend,
that's certainly.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
One way to put it.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
Michelle Traconas are caught on video driving all around town
going to I believe it was five different trash receptacles
caught on video throwing away sponges, rags, towels, all soaked
in blood, the wife, Jennifer Dulos shirt and Bras soaked
(35:33):
in blood. So how smart is Simpson because he's just
doing the same old playbook for Pete's sake.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
I don't think he's very smart.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
I'm you know, after I heard that they found the
found her DNA on the reciprocating saws. He's crazy. I mean,
I don't know what he could have to get all
that done in the few hours that he got done.
I'd like to know what he was on to do that, you.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Know, Uh, yeah, has Brian Fitzgibbons, Brian, do you ever
wish that suspect, of course he's presumed innocent, would do
something different? I mean, don't you know that if the
authorities have already gotten him on video at the water
(36:24):
burger and the grocery store and the here and the there,
they're going to have video of him disposing of stuff,
although he may have disposed of it in a remote
area where we're never going to find it.
Speaker 8 (36:36):
Yeah, Nancy, at this point that I certainly wish all
the time that you know, a defendant would come forward
with the truth, right, But at this point we're probably
dealing with multiple disposal sites, potentially bodies of water, potentially
different dump sites, and uh, you know this this is
going to be very complicated. But so far as a wish,
(36:58):
of course, I feel that all the time I wish
you'd come forward and give us the truth.
Speaker 1 (37:03):
A major update in the search for Suzanne Simpson, the
missing Texas mom luxury realtor.
Speaker 6 (37:09):
Listens Park Police Department, along with the Texas Rangers, have
charged Brad Chandler Simpson with murder in the death of
his wife, Suzanne Clark Simpson.
Speaker 14 (37:19):
The rangers have not stopped investigating this case as it
has been turned over to the District Attorney's department. The
District Attorney starts their process in the prosecution phase, even
though we are not stopping our search for Suzanne Clark Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
That from our friends at k e NS five.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
And you were hearing the almost part Chief of Police
Feddale valet House and Sergeant Dion Cockrell from the Texas
Department of Public Safety. So now there is a formal
charge the District attorney now starting the prosecution phase, will
more be made clear?
Speaker 2 (37:52):
Maybe not.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
We don't have a right to know all of the
details surrounding this case. Straight out to doctor Kendall Crown,
chief medical Examiner in Terran County. That's Fort Worth, Texas,
doctor Kumba crowns. I'm thinking back on Photosdulos and how
he and his lover Michelle Chaconis were hiding Jennifer, the
(38:14):
mother of his five children. I mean hiding throwing away
into dumpsters, into trash receptacles all over town. What man
throws the same bag of trash in five different trash cans?
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Okay, food for thought.
Speaker 1 (38:29):
But if we find, if we discover that Susanne has
been dismembered, that could.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Mean anything from a leg to a digit.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
So how do you go about if any part of
her is found connecting that back to Susanne Sipson?
Speaker 7 (38:51):
So well, what you would have to do is whatever
you receive, you would get tissue, bone, marrow, whatever you
can pull off of it, and then submit that for DNA.
If it would happened to be a finger, you could
actually get fingerprints from it if it's still intact enough,
and you could do it that way. But in this
type of case, with the parts being found over time,
(39:12):
that each part that is found is going to have
to have DNA testing done on it to make sure
it's from her. But once you do find a part,
especially if it's like a large portion, like a thigh
or something like that, you know she's been murdered. You
know she's been cut up.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
Joining me is renowned psychologist Karen Start joining us from Manhattan. Karen,
the loss of your mother is overwhelming, I've been told,
But then the additional shock that she's been murdered, then
the additional shock that she has been dismembered. Now, if
(39:51):
the children don't accept that. They are left with the
specter of my mom's not dead, she just abandoned me.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
So what are your thoughts?
Speaker 10 (40:03):
Well, no matter which way this turns out, Nancy's children
don't have a mother anymore. So there is so much
they've been exposed to. They're going to need a tremendous
amount of help.
Speaker 1 (40:14):
In my hand, the newly released charging documents straight out
to my saint Antonio Zachary tail all right, Zachary, tell
me in a nutshell about these allegations, and they are
only that allegations.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
He has not been proven guilty. What do you know?
Speaker 4 (40:29):
So I know he's been charged with the murder of
Suzanne Simpson, and I also know he's been charged with
two bounts of tempering with evidence. One is linked to
the gun that he had his friend had and the
reciprocating saw that they alleged that he attempted to conceal
from investigators. Then he was also charged with tempering with
evidence with the intent to conceal his wife's body, although
(40:54):
very little information has been presented on that charge. And
then those are the charges he's facing, but they're all
being questioned by his defense attorney.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
In the last hours Brad Simpson in court before Judge
Joel Petz with the.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
Attorneyship be identified in films. He's a stand appreciation. See
you can gie more from mister Simpsons.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Okay, and Sarah you Brad the challenger of Simpson.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
That from our friends A KA, B B Zachary Taylor,
what happened in court.
Speaker 4 (41:22):
There is quite a bit that's set to happen in
the coming months. He Brad Simpson is said to be
before the judge again on December nineteenth. Now that's a
motion to amend conditions, but very little has been filed
with the court to tell us or offer any kind
of insight into what his defense attorney might be looking
to do, although in the past he has sought to
(41:45):
reduce the bond amount and change the bond conditions to
allow him to see his children. And then he'll be
back before the judge on February twelve.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Well, you're right again. When you don't know a horse,
look at his track record. Now, Brad Simpson is that
the charges be thrown out.
Speaker 11 (42:02):
Listen, there's emotion to watch the inditement, which I think
will give it a leader date.
Speaker 1 (42:08):
That's for our friends at kabb to Ben Powers in
a nutshell, Ben a nutshell. The state doesn't give a
killer a gold star or an A plus plus because
they get rid of the body that's not happening. The
state doesn't have to lay out in the indictment how
the victim was killed.
Speaker 2 (42:29):
If they can prove it.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
Sure put it in there, for instance, by manual strangulation,
by shooting with the weapon, by stabbing, But it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (42:37):
The state doesn't have to prove how she was killed.
They just have to.
Speaker 1 (42:40):
Convince a jury that she has been killed and that
he did it in this jurisdiction.
Speaker 5 (42:45):
Well, I disagree with that. They have to lay out
what their theory of the killing is. You know, there's
a big difference between a voluntary manslaughter, which is accidental killing,
and a first degree murder, which is premeditated killing. It
sounds like his defense attorneys are saying, you're saying he
killed her, but you're not telling us how when where
any of the important details that go to your theory
(43:06):
of premeditation. And so that's what they're attacking with their
most recent pilence is the lack of proof that goes
towards premeditation, like the state is trying to make it
out to be.
Speaker 1 (43:15):
So, Ben Powers, let me understand in your mind, the
state has to lay out the exact.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Mode of murder. So you've never encountered a case where.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
There was no body to be found and the mode
of murder was unknown. Are you telling me you've never
seen a no body case indictment.
Speaker 5 (43:37):
What I'm saying is this most recent motion sounds like
what I would call a deal in particulars. It's basically
the defense throw down the gauntlet and saying, okay, state,
you say my client premeditated killed this person.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
I know what they filed, Ben, I know what the
defense filed. We just had reporters say that. But then
you said the indictment must show mode of murder.
Speaker 5 (43:58):
When I say mode, I mean in this case, they're
saying it's premeditated, and then must include a factual allegation
that supports premeditation being charged.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
For all of you.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Would be wife killers out there, an indictment does not
have to show how you killed your partner. Okay, you
getting rid of the body is not going to help you.
And in Diamond only has to allege that you committed
premeditated murder. The jurisdiction and the name of the victim.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
That's it.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
The rest can be proven at trial. The state is
still building its case. If you know or think you
know anything about the disappearance of Texas's mom, Suzanne Simpson
or the movements of her husband, Brad Simpson, who is
presumed innocent, please dial two one zero two zero nine
(44:55):
two seven zero one two one zero two zero nine two.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
Seven zero one.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Let's remember now an American hero David Ennsbrenner, Aitchison, p D. Kansas,
shot and killed in the line of duty. Served twenty
four years in law enforcement. Survived by wife now widow, Carrie,
and children without a father, Avery, Abby and Celia. American
(45:22):
hero Sergeant David Endsbrenner. Nancy Gray signing off goodbye friend.
Host
Nancy Grace
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