November 16, 2025 • 42 mins
Day after day, case after case, Tom Smith returned to the job with a clear sense of purpose: protect, respond, and stand with the people beside him. On this episode of Zone 7, Sheryl McCollum talks with the retired NYPD detective about the path that led him from patrol work to the Joint Terrorism Task Force and ultimately, to a lifetime of service recognized at the national level. Tom shares how his father shaped his calling, how partnership becomes its own lifeline, and how a series of events during one 12-hour shift in the Bronx has stayed with him ever since.
Highlights:
- (0:00) Sheryl welcomes listeners to Zone 7 and introduces guest Tom Smith
- (1:15) Tom shares how his father's NYPD career inspired his own path
- (5:00) Reconnecting with Detective Ralph, the most decorated detective in NYPD history
- (7:00) A single shift: rooftop rescue, shooting scene, infant CPR, and a fallen officer
- (12:15) Deployment to Afghanistan on a kidnapping case
- (14:45) The emotional burden carried by spouses and families
- (18:30) Choosing the right partner and building trust that saves lives
- (30:15) Tom reflects on being inducted to the National Law Enforcement Hall of Fame
- (33:45) Table 15: friendship, laughter, and shared history
- (40:00) Continuing tradition and community beyond the job
- (41:15) Closing reflections on service, loyalty, and legacy
Guest Bio:
Tom Smith is a retired NYPD detective and 2024 National Law Enforcement Hall of Fame inductee. Over 30 years of service, he worked in patrol, narcotics, and robbery investigations and spent 17 years working with the FBI/NYPD on the Joint Terrorism Task Force, including an overseas deployment to Afghanistan. Tom co-hosts the podcast Gold Shields, lectures on criminal justice and terrorism and provides investigative commentary for national media outlets.
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Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award-winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnline, forensic and crime scene expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and co-author of the textbook Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. She is the founder and director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute, a national collaboration that advances techniques for solving cold cases and assists families and law enforcement with unsolved homicides, missing persons, and kidnappings.
Social Links:
- Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com
- Twitter: @ColdCaseTips
- Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum
- Instagram: @officialzone7podcast
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Y'all, this is a special Zone seven. We are going
to talk to somebody that the heroes look up to.
You don't have to look any further than the National
Law Enforcement Hall of Fame that honors officers that have
gone above and beyond the call of duty. And tonight
(00:28):
we have Tom Smith. He is a part of my
Zone seven. He is a part of my table fifteen,
and we're going to talk about that. But I welcome
him humbly. I know his background, I know his track record,
I know his career.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Sir, how are you?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I am great, and you just made my day even
better being here. It's always a privilege and an honor
no matter where we are, as long as we're together,
and doing a show like this makes it even more special.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
You know, let's just start from the beginning.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
You selected, of all the departments in the world, of
all the levels, state, local, and federal, the New York
City Police Department.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Why in YPD.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
My dad was an NYPD detective for twenty six years
from nineteen fifty to nineteen seventy six, So that's all
I knew. I knew one department in this world, and
it was the NYPD. I grew up idolizing my dad
and wanting to be like him, just like every little
boy you know in the world growing up and looking
(01:39):
at this six foot three, two twenty you know, pound
irishman who controlled his world in law enforcement and was
respected like crazy. And that's what I wanted. That's what
I wanted to be, just like him, to steal his
(02:01):
shield when he came home from work and put it
on my belt, that run around and chase my sisters.
So that was you know, growing up, I was I
was doing one or two things, Charlotte, I was playing baseball,
or it was gonna be a cop, and there was
no thought of anywhere else. It was going to be
the NYPD, and that was it. So when you have
(02:24):
that drive of wanting to be like your dad and
wanting to serve in the best police department in the world,
you do it one thousand and one hundred miles an hour.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
And that's what I did better than anybody, I'm gonna
tell you. But you know, I think about your dad.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Too, from the fifties to the sixties.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
You want to talk about decades being a stark difference,
and then rolling into the seventies, I mean, honey, he's
got some stories.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Oh it was. It was when I was with him
and go into a Yankee game. That was a history
lesson anytime we went into the city, whether we went
to my sister's house, you know, apartment who lived on
the East Side, or we would go to a Yankee game.
Because part of the day wasn't just going to Yankee Stadium.
We would stop at the four four and go up
(03:18):
to the squad. We'd go to the four to one
for Apache and go to the squad and see all
his friends and his partners that he worked with, you know. Uh,
And that was part of it. So that's what I
mean by it was. It was surrounding me, and it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
A lift.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
It was yeah, we're going here, We're going here, and
standing in a room with a bunch of just the
best there was at that time, and then driving around
the streets and having him point out, oh, yeah, that
happened here, that double homicide happened over here, and we
chase that guy down that alleyway. It was just all
(04:00):
the time and talk about getting ready for a career
when you were young. That's what that's what I got,
and I loved every second of it. Me and my dad.
I mean, think about this. Part of and you know
this because we're from the same generation. Part of your
night or our night was sitting down together and watching
(04:23):
the six o'clock news. That was like a TV show.
It wasn't the news. It was like, Okay, at six o'clock,
let's see what's going on in the world. And we
would sit there and if there was a story about
a homicide that was on the news, I would talk
to him about it, like, Hey, how would you do this?
How would you do that? Where would you start? Who
would you talk to? And that was the conversation during
(04:45):
the news we would have if there was a story
that was a crime story. And that's what I was
so interested in, you know, growing up, and it just
led to what I became.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
And you know, the world is a small place sometimes.
And I interviewed somebody on Zone seven, detective Ralph, remember who? Yes,
And it was so incredible because you texted me and said, Hey,
do you have a phone number for him?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
I think he knew my dad.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Will you tell us just a little bit about that
when you reconnected with him?
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Yeah. I had known about Ralph last year and then
just schedules and life kind of gets in a way
of getting in touch with him, and I lost touch
with him, and I actually don't know what happened to
his contact that I had. And then I saw that
you had him on and reached right out to him.
He remembered me, and I actually had the opportunity to
(05:42):
go to his house and see all the medals and
everything he had. And he's the most decorated NYPD detective
in its history. I mean, a man is an absolute
walking legend. But even better was talking to him about
stories I knew and I had heard from my dad
(06:05):
and they actually worked in the four to one and
FOURID apache at the same time, he vaguely remembered my
dad showed him a couple of pictures of him and
he did. So, you know, like you said, big world,
but small world, especially in our world, which shrinks tremendously
when we start talking and throwing names around. It doesn't
(06:29):
matter where you are on this coast or the West coast.
If you talk enough to a cop, you're going to
find someone in common that you have.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Yes, Yes, And I just thought that reunion was amazing,
and the pictures of the two of y'all in his
house with all of those medals and.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Plaques and commendations. It was just it got to me
because I know your dad would have loved that.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Oh God, it would have been He would have went
with me. Are you kidding me? If I had said
to him, if he was still alive, and I said, hey,
I'm going to see Ralph, you know, he'd be like,
all right, let's go love it. He would have let
me go by myself.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Tell me your toughest night there was one.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
And it's funny you bring that up, because I'll go
down and speak in in the NYPD Academy quite often,
either at the CIC course, which is the Coronel investigation
course with new detectives, and I'll go and talk to them,
or once in a while I'll get to speak to
the recruits and in even colleges that I go and
speak at, and I tell him about this one night,
(07:35):
and God's honest true that this was the night. I'm
going to try to remember it. My partner and I
we were in uniform, and we start off the night
assisting narcotics who was chasing this guy down the street.
So we get in a foot pursuit into a park,
roll around in the park, lock him up, rip my shirt.
(07:55):
Have to go back to the priest and get a
new shirt. Later on that night, four people get shot
on the corner of one four nine in Broadway. Have
to assist them and go to that scene, and anti
crime ended locking the guy up who did the shooting.
So we're assisting running around with that with four people shot.
(08:16):
A little time later, a sixteen year old girl wanted
to jump off a twenty story building and me and
my partner got up to the roof in time, grabbed her,
flipped their back over the fence, and got her out
of that situation. A couple of hours later, we get
a call of an eight day old baby that's not breathing.
(08:39):
We run up to the apartment, grab the baby that
is totally unresponsive and not breathing, run down the stairs,
jump in the car I'm driving. My partner has the
baby on his lap. We're doing one hundred miles an
hour up riverside drive to Columbia Presbyterian Hospital, and the
other cops in my command and the Northern command and
(09:01):
the three four shutting the streets down as we're going.
We're doing CPR in the front seat of the car
on an eight day old baby and get to the
emergency room and kind of slide sideways into the emergency
port and as soon as we did that, the baby
started crying. And then about an hour or two later,
(09:23):
we get a call that there's a cop shot in
the four to four preestinct, which is in the Bronx,
and they're coming over to Columbia Press because just in
the area of the Bronx they were. It was the
closest hospital in Manhattan, and they're flying over there and
we're flying up to the hospital to start shut some
streets down or whatever, and they pull into the emergency room.
(09:44):
We were just at with a great event that happened
a couple hours earlier, saving a baby, and now we
have a cop that shot pulling into the same area
and get in the back seat and get him out
of the car and up on a stretcher and into
the emergency room and unfortunately ended up dying from multiple
(10:05):
gunshot wounds. That was one night, that was one four
to twelve tour that I won't forget, and it's thirty
probably thirty two years ago, and I just rattled it
off the way I did because that's the kind of
night that was.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
It's burned in that memory. How about your most memorable arrest?
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Most memorable arrest was probably the shooting we were in.
I was involved in a shooting in nineteen ninety three,
a month after I got married. So Ange loved that.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
With her, and she is so lovely and she is
so supportive and she is just I mean, I don't
have enough wonderful things to say about her.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
But the time and of that a month literally it
ended up by the time we got back from our honeymoon.
It was probably, yeah, about two or three weeks later,
we get in a shooting with three individuals who robbed
the supermarket. One of the cops I was with got
shot during the exchange of gunfire. He got shot in
(11:21):
the leg. He was okay, he survived, but ended up
getting off the job. But we have this this shooting
with three individuals. Ralph was at my wedding. The couple
got shot. My partner who I was with that day,
was at my wedding. So we were all friends, not
just you know, partners, working, and we ended up getting
(11:44):
all three of them. We shot two of them. We
end up arresting all three and all three did about
one hundred years in jail. They're still in jail, which
is the best part. But that was, you know, it
was personal because of obviously them trying to kill us
in them shooting Ralph. So that was probably the one
(12:06):
that certainly stands out.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Now, you've already mentioned being in shootouts, in different situations
that were clearly dangerous, being on bridges. What was the
most dangerous situation in your thirty five years?
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Probably when I went to Afghanistan for three months as
part of the Joint Tyrorism Task Force. We were sent
over there on a kidnapping case, and there were numerous
things that we ran into over there. Unfortunately, can't get
into the specifics of them, but think about just being
(12:48):
an NYPD cop and dealing with New York City or
the Bronx or Brooklyn wherever you might be, and now
being in the middle of a war zone and playing
by their rules, which there are aren't any, you know,
so having to deal with that and got out of,
you know, a couple of tough situations that we were in,
(13:09):
and the reason for getting out of them was not
being you know, tough for anything. It was pure experience
in not panicking and not overreacting to one or two
things and having a great partner at the time and
keeping our heads on and just you know, methodically kind
(13:29):
of working with each other to get out of a
couple of tough situations. But that was probably you know,
even afterwards, Cheryl, we you know, my partner after getting
out of one situation, looks at me and yells, hey,
I guess we're not in the Bronx anymore.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
And hey, y'all, it wasn't like y'all were working in
you know, Disneyland. No, I mean y'all had a pretty
rough environment. Y'all were working in every day.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Yeah, every day, every single And when you got back
to Embassy compound, you know, you took a deep breath
that you got back, you know, and you were thankful
for it because it was you know, if you were
the passenger in the car driving around, that was your job.
You had to watch everyone walking, every car driving, every
double parked car, every you know, everything going on around
(14:22):
you because the driver was just driving. So it was
very stressful being out on the street when you had
to go and do wherever, or you had to drive
up to Bogram or wherever we had to go. So
when the day was done, and you were very thankful
you were back home.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
When you sign up for the NYPD at eighteen, nineteen,
twenty twenty one, Afghanistan is not crossing your mind. And
I bet you there's a lot of people listening right
now that don't even realize that a police officer is
going to be sent into a war zone on a kidnapping.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Case, right and and that's kind of that was the
family you know. Here, here's the tough part, Sheryl. During
the time, you know, we're we're bound by you know,
classification and top secret clearances and all that when we're working.
So think about this. To even add more to that,
my family knew I was going to Afghanistan, but had
(15:22):
no idea why because I couldn't tell them why. So
I mean think about that, you know, thinking of their
stress level of you know, dad and your husband's going
to a war zone and you're an NYPD detective first
of all, why wow, so yep, and then not being
able to explain it, and then staying there for three months,
(15:44):
not a week, not a few days, three months of
not knowing why I was there. So you know, there's
things that happened in a career, and I tell you know,
I just mentioned being at the CIC course. When I
go there and talk to you young detectives, I tell them,
and it happened to me. You have to be prepared
(16:06):
for your entire world and career changing in one minute.
And that happened to me. You know, I would have
been absolutely the happiest detective in New York City if
I ended up on a homicide squad in the Bronx.
That was my goal. That's where I wanted to be.
That was it. That was the top of the line
(16:26):
that I thought in the NYPDA, And then nine to
eleven happens, and one hundred and two minutes later, I'm
assigned to the Terrorism Taskforce and around the world. So
that's what I tell them. You know, it's great to
have a plan, but you have to be ready to
adapt to something else, because the world is what it
is today.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
And you know, you go home and you're literally packing
and you tell Angie, Hey, you know, I don't know
how long I'm going to be gone. I can't tell
you what I'm doing. I can't take exactly I can
tell you Afghanistan, but I can't take exactly anything else.
You know, Feya and she and she just has to
be smiling and supportive. I'm gonna tell you right now,
(17:09):
if I did not have the job that I have
and did not have the understanding that I do, I
wish Walt McCollum would walk in here and tell me, Hey,
I'm packing. I got to go, and I can't tell
you where, I can't tell you with who, and I
can't tell you for how long. You ain't gonna make
it to the door, sugar. I'm telling you so.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
It takes a to me. She deserves part of your award.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Oh God. And I said it that night.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
You did, You did it, and you said it beautifully
and it was true.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Though it was true because you know, spouses don't get
enough credit militarily and in law enforcement or first responders
as much as they should, because we know what we're doing,
we know where we're at, we know the situations where
we're in, and we're trained to handle them. They're sick
(18:00):
X amount of miles away not knowing where we are,
and to do that, I mean, think of you know,
my wife, think about that for thirty years, not a
couple of weeks, thirty years of that thought in your
head of God. I really hope you come home tonight,
(18:22):
you know, and living with that, and then not just
taking care of yourself, but then taking care of three
kids on top of that.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Well, I will say this publicly again for the rookies
that are listening, for the young people going into this career,
pick your partner.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Take some time.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
I'm just telling you, it will make all the difference
in your life. I mean, Tom, you had an impossible
job to go to a war zone when you had
not been in the military. Correct and Angie could have
been crying and carrying and throwing stuff and having a fit,
and the kids could be all out of control, and
(19:05):
that would have made your job impossible. But that's not
what you had at home. And I just want people
to hear that, because if you've got somebody that's jealous,
if you've got somebody that doesn't have your back, if
you're with somebody that doesn't really want the best for you, you.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Might want to think about that relationship.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Yeah, yeah, it's you know, I'm listening. I say it
all the time, and me and you have had this discussion,
not only you know, the night of the induction, but
you know after that that I'm lucky. You know, I'm
one of the fortunate ones, because so many marriages don't work,
and so many things go wrong in relationships with police officers,
(19:49):
and I'm one of the lucky ones. To be with
the same woman for thirty five years is not the norm.
And and that's sad to say, you know, that's and
I've said it so many times. I hate the reaction
I get when I'm out somewhere speaking and I say,
you know, I've been with the same woman for thirty
(20:10):
five years, and people look at me, Oh my god, really,
and that shouldn't be And that's sad that that's the reaction,
but it's the reality of it.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Especially in our world. Most of the people we know
are on their second or third marriage. Yes, absolutely, So again,
take your time picking, take your time speaking of good partners.
Tell us about being paired up with somebody and you're
working twelve hours if not more in a car.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
It is one of the most important decisions you can
make in the nypday. And you know, this goes back,
and it's a funny story, but this goes back to
watching my dad and watching him with his partners. I mean,
I still to this day speak to quite often. And
(21:00):
Joe actually just just passed away a couple of years ago,
one of my dad's partners and his family that's from
fifty some odds sixty years ago that they worked together,
and I still am in touch with his entire family.
And that's how that's what I grew up watching of
what partners were like and the relationship of families, and
(21:23):
not just you know, partners in the job, but family
relationships and them coming down to our house down the
Jersey Shore, and like I said this day, still reaching
out to them and seeing how they're doing, what's going on,
how are things all that, And that's what I grew
up watching. So that and here's here's the fun the
(21:45):
funny part of it, as silly as it's going to sound.
My favorite TV show growing up with Starsking Hodge and.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Parts a good one.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
Part start right. Part of Star Skin Hodge was them
as partners and the way they were together, and I
as a young kid, going, I want that. That's the
partner I want and took that into the job and
I was lucky as anything to have some of the
most reliable, smart, tactical friends that were partners and each
(22:21):
of them had a different role in my career. You know,
when I was on patrol, George Faguero was my partner
and we were I mean, we did it right. We
knew each other. We had codes for certain things and
keywords for you know, you know, when one of them
got us out of a bad situation. One night, if
(22:42):
you want to hit just real quick, we pull a
car over, and we had a deal. We had we
had a system that if we called each other by
a different name, something was wrong. And we pulled a
car over one night on St. Nicholas Avenue, right off
of one four one hundred and forty five Street, and
I'm at the passenger I'm at the driver window and
(23:04):
figures at the passenger window. He didn't have a passenger,
solo driver and I'm looking around. I'm talking to him,
and Figure goes, hey, mikey okay. I go yep, I'm
all good. And with that didn't even ask open the door,
grab the guy out of the car, pulled him out
of the car, cuffed him on St. Nicholas Avenue, right,
(23:25):
you know, in the middle of the street. Cuff him on,
like what's up. And he goes in the back seat
and pulls a shotgun out of under the seat of
the driver's side seat. He saw the barrel sticking out,
grab it. We end up running him and he was
wanted for three bank robberies down in North Carolina.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
But he's just that trust.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Like you said, you didn't question it, you didn't go
huh yeah, oh my gosh, just pure action because you
know he's got you mm hm.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
And that was a lot of trust. So you know,
do that on patrol with him, and then you know,
call us Perez, my partner in narcotics and in the
robbery squad, you know, and call us what I tell
him all the time. You know, he's the guy who
taught me how to be a detective, and just his
mindset of, hey, think outside the box, don't get caught
in that box. You know, let's let's think outside this,
(24:20):
how we get this, how do we get that? And
don't ever stop until we get the bad guys. You know,
he had a saying when we were in narcotics, just
get the bad guys. We'll figure everything else out later.
And I still use I use that my whole career.
Just get the bad guys. Everything else we'll figure out.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Well, there's brilliance in that My partner, Leslie Saunders. You know,
she's much older than me. She's probably gonna listen to
this episode, so I think she's eighty eighty one. But anyway, Wow,
But you know that trust, that understanding. You know, we
(25:00):
had that thing. Leslie can take anything, she can take
being called anything. You can be as vulgar and as
rude and as profane as you want, but if you
call her stupid, we have a situation. I don't know why.
I've never really known, because she's not stupid. She's one
of the brightest people that I know, but something about
(25:20):
somebody calling her that. So you you know, understanding your partner,
you can save that person getting in trouble.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
You know, you take over the.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Person that's being you know, loud and you know, trying
to degrade you and you know, cuse at you, so
that your partner doesn't take a swing or doesn't you know,
get caught on camera. You know, you got to have
that understanding. And I always felt like part of my
job wasn't just to make sure we were saved, but
(25:51):
to make sure, you know, she looked good and you
know we did the right thing.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Sure, and you know, There was one time quick you'll
love this if I.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Can, Honey, it is your show. You talk about what
you want.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
There was one time that Carlos actually got mad at me.
It maned relatively mad. So we're in a robbery squad
and you know, you go back to when you when
you ask for you know, your best arrest. I contemplated
telling you this story, but the shooting was was went
above it, but this one was really close. We get
(26:26):
called into the lieutenant's office and he says, hey, you know,
we got this pattern. You know of these two shootings
and these four robberies we think are connected. What do
we got on it? Do we have anyone? You know,
I'm doing the chief's office at one o'clock and he's
going to rip me a new one for this thing
being open. What do we have? And we're like, well,
(26:48):
we don't have really anything, boss. We got. All we
had was a male black named Jerome with gold teeth
in the bronx. That's all we had. So so, being
the wise ass that I was at the time, I
looked at him and I go, what time's your meeting?
He goes one o'clock. Now it's like nine thirty ten,
(27:08):
o'clock in the morning. So I go, all right, we'll
have it by one o'clock and he goes, get out
of my office. I'm like, we'll have him by one o'clock.
We walk out of his office. Carlos looks and me.
He goes, what are you doing. I'm like, he goes,
what are you way to your mind? I go, come on,
let's go. He goes, Tommy, we have Jerome in the Bronx.
(27:29):
I'm like, yeah, I know, let's go. So we go
out and he's looking at me like, I mean, he
literally wanted to knock my head off because I did this.
So I go, come on, let's go. We go out.
He's like where we go? And he said, let's go
the first location of the shooting up on the Grand Concourse.
Walking across the street towards the building, and this kid's
(27:49):
walking across towards us, and he kind of looks at
us a little funny. So I stopped. I said, listen,
if he turns around, we're going to go grab and
talk to him. So the kid turns around, looks at us.
We run back across the street were grabbing him, like hey,
what's going on? And they start asking about the shooting.
He goes, I don't know who did it. I don't
know his name, but I know where his sister lives. Okay,
(28:09):
where's his sister lives? He gives us the address, so
we go over there and we're sitting in front of,
you know, on this block. We have no idea where
on the street this possible sister lives. And we're sitting
there and this kid's walking down the street and he's
got a brown paper bag in his hand, having a drink.
So Carlos is in the passenger seat. Who can talk
(28:32):
to anybody. Carlos could talk to the devil, I mean,
with no issue whatsoever. And he calls him over and
he starts talking to him, and I look over and
the kid's not opening his mouth. So he said, Carlos,
make him laugh, just stay, just tell a joke, make
him laugh, and the kid laughs. He's got gold teeth.
(28:53):
So we get out of the car and we're like, hey, bro, listen,
you can't have an open beer, can you know? Everyone
sees us talking to you. We got to give you
a summons or some if you have your license. He goes, no,
I don't like. What's your name? He's like, you know.
He comes up with his Kevin or something. So we're like,
all right, oh, Mikey, I'm sorry, said Michael. He says,
(29:14):
Michael's my name. We're like, all right, listen, where's your license?
Hits up in my sister's apartment. Okay, let's go upstairs
with his sister's apartment and get your get your license.
We go inside. He opens the door and his assist
and he goes, hey, the police are here. They gonna
give me a summons for an open container. The sister
yells out, Jerome, why are you always getting in trouble?
(29:36):
We grab him, throw him in the hallway, get him
on the ground, cuff him, go back to the precinct.
Twelve forty five.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Tom Smith, twelve forty five.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
I call, We get to the office. I call the
chief's office and I asked for the Lieutenant's like, what
do you want? I said, we got him? He goes,
what I go, we got him? I said, you want
us to deliver them to you? You want to come
see him? He goes, I'll be right there. He walked
in and couldn't believe it.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Yeah, that's why you're a legend right there. So let's
talk about when you got the call about the Hall
of Fame.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
Yeah, you know, we had nominated Kimber Gest to be
in a Hall of fame. Who is Oh my god,
I mean if she didn't get in a Hall of fame,
there shouldn't be a Hall of Fame. Basically, you know,
that's why someone like her, who got shot eight times
and survived, is why the Hall of Fame was developed.
(30:42):
So we had nominated her right after we interviewed her
on the show. And one morning I'm here and Adam,
Megan and Danny facetimeed me. And that wasn't unusual. We
had talked before, you know, about whatever whatever trip coming
up or whatever it might have been. So them calling
(31:05):
on a face wasn't unusual. So Meghan starts going, Hey,
I just want to let you know Kimber got in.
So I'm like, oh my god, you just made my year,
you just made everything. I'm happy as hell great. I'm
thinking about Kimber. And while I'm thinking about Kimber, Meghan
(31:26):
says my name and I go, why did you just
say my name? So Megan goes, did you hear anything
I just said to you? For the last like forty seconds,
I'm like, no, what'd you say? She's like. Then I
look at her, I'm like, why are you crying?
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (31:43):
And she's like, yeah, you And then she told me
that I got in and I was getting the Lifetime
Achievement Award and I just went wait, what, Like, what
are you talking about? I'm happy for Kimber. We're talking
about her. She's like, no, you got and then she
starts telling me that I got going to be inducted.
It took about ten seconds and I had to hang
(32:05):
up and I'm like, listen, I can't. I got to
call you guys back, because thirty years of emotions and
what you did and how you did it all came
rushing into my head in one shot. And it was
an extremely proud moment. And obviously the first person I
(32:28):
think of was my dad, wishing he was still here,
that I could have called him and told him that,
you know, and everything he instilled in me and taught me,
and how do you do this and why you're doing it?
You know, all that came out, so you can imagine,
you know, what I was feeling at that time, and
(32:48):
then having the opportunity to tell my family and then
about an hour later, I got to call him back,
but it was, you know, something so oh incredibly unexpected,
because we don't and I said it that night, Cheryl,
we don't go into this job to get things like this.
(33:10):
We don't. It's not on a checklist, it's not on
a to do list. You know. I want to be
a copy and get in the National Law Enforcements's Hall
of Fame. That's not even thought about, and that's not
why we get into law enforcement. So when you're thought
of like that and able to be inducted into such
an organization like this, it's a tremendous honor that I
(33:36):
just cherish all the time.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Let's talk a little bit about Table fifteen. Yes, because
for most people, this type of night is elegant, it's formal,
it's beautiful, it's a once in a lifetime. It's probably
just the pinnacle of your career. I mean, there is
(34:04):
nothing any higher, right.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
But not our table hunt.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Well, you made sure of that because and you were
right in saying it. Listen, we have to there's too
much seriousness that goes into our job and our profession
because most of the time we have to be a
certain way and carry ourselves a certain way. But when
you have the opportunity to just enjoy something with every
(34:35):
breath you have. And we laughed and joked and cried
and had the best time. You know, when you have
you know, twenty five tables staring at us and looking
over us because because we're laughing so much.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Night the Cool Kids Table, Thank you. Listen. We have
Kimber and herr nuggets in the.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
We had Kimber and her mom, You and your lovely bride,
Dan and his lovely bride, and Walt and I And
let me tell you, we laughed a lot. But I
want everybody to hear me when I tell y'all when
Dan Murphy turns and says, you want to know the
best practical joke I ever pulled, the night is going
(35:23):
to take a turn, okay, And then Kimber follows up
with hers and then Tom Smith says, well, this may
or may.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Not have happened.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Well, at that point, I just thought, man, if this
table had a recording show, it could be its own show.
And everything we talked about was true. Every story I told,
every story y'all told, absolutely true. But honey, it would
probably get us in a little bit of trouble with
some folks, because oh.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
My god, it we told her from practical jokes to
you know, situations all in on the street and things
we did. Was it was just you know, it was
a special night to begin with, but then it was
just extra that was like it was just an like
extra endings of a ballgame of what it was. And
(36:17):
we deserve that, you know. I say this all the time,
shar and you do too, that it's okay for cops
to feel that they deserve something, you know, a good
night like that. It's okay to feel that and to
understand that and to cherish those because we don't get
a lot of them, you know, and when we do,
(36:40):
we have to enjoy it because we just go through
way too much that ninety nine percent of the people
in this country would never even think of doing. And
when you have a chance to just laugh and joke
around with people who are now part of your family
and love and respect, it makes that night so much
(37:02):
more special. And Table fifteen is gonna pop up again
in April of twenty twenty six, for sure.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
For sure, And I'll tell you know what they've done
with this Hall of fame.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
You said it that night, and it is the truth.
It is a family.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
It is it's just, and it's a special family because
of what it represents. It's it's these stories and these
situations that people go through and get acknowledged. And Megan
and Adam do God's work because without them, no one
(37:39):
knows about these stories. No one knows about Kimber guests
who got shot eight times, you know, and survived, you know.
No one knows those stories of others who won awards
at night, the Canaan Awards, you know, you know, all
those and it gives everyone an opportunity to not just
(38:01):
the stories, but see the people who live through them.
And that's even more of an impact. When these people
are standing up on a stage and telling the story
of their induction and they're real, their flesh and blood,
their humans. They cry, they fail, and it all comes
(38:23):
to a head that night. Thanks to Megan and Adam's
hard work throughout a year. I mean, they start twenty
twenty five, happened in March, Megan started twenty twenty six
the following week.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
Right, And let me just tell you, Megan and Adam
both they live it, they feel it, they believe in it.
They cry, they they feel every inductee and want to
make sure that they are honored in a way that
their families are going to be proud of. Is it
(38:59):
in just a hey, congratulations, you know you did a
great job this one night. That's not it all year long.
They reach out all year long. They're like, hey, everything good,
Happy birthday, happy anniversary. Make sure you've already blocked out
the date for April. Like they want this family to
come back together year after year.
Speaker 3 (39:19):
Yeah, no doubt. That's a great point because the night
is put together for all the families and the pop
and circumstance and the stuff on tables and the speakers
and the extra things that they have going on before
the induction night, This ceremony is all for families because
(39:39):
Megan and Adam understand that law enforcement is not a
singular entity. It's a family that goes through. Every single
thing that that cop goes through, the heartache, the pain,
the failures, the injuries, all of that is a family thing.
(40:01):
And they understand that, and that's why those nights are special.
Speaker 1 (40:05):
And you know, Tom and I started a tradition sort
of sub level. Not everybody knows about it, but it's
something that's going to continue and it's one of those things.
It's almost like a secret code and that means the
world to me. So I cannot wait for this April
to watch you continue this tradition, sir.
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Yes, and the only reason, and just to let you know,
we didn't do it last year because I wasn't going
to do it without you being there. So you know
that's why it wasn't done last year. So we're both
going to be there this year to continue that. And
you know that's I get through a speech that was,
(40:46):
you know, emotional, and I got through it and then
you throw your part in. I was like, really, you know,
I got through this and now you're going to throw
this at me. But it was and it's still where
I put it that and it's going to be removed
in April and it's going to be in someone else's hands.
So I can't wait for that.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Love it well, Tom Smith, I love you, I adore you,
I respect you. I am so proud that you were
the first guest for the National Law Enforcement Hall of
Fame Highlight Own Zone seven.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
Well, I couldn't be more honored. And you know how
I feel about you talk about clicking with someone and
just an immediate connection was what me and you are
and continue to be. You know, for everyone listening to this,
we talk well at least once a week just to
(41:43):
say hi, because the respect level of our industry can
get mired in nonsense a lot. And when you fall
in love with true people who just have a admiration
and respect for it makes life so much better. And
(42:04):
you go through heartaches in his job and a lot
of bad stuff, but then when you get to where
we are now, it's all worth it because you're in
my family and I love you dearly and everything you
do and to have you be part of my life
is a blessing.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
I'm Cheryl McCollum and this is his own seven
Y'all, this is a special Zone seven. We are going
to talk to somebody that the heroes look up to.
You don't have to look any further than the National
Law Enforcement Hall of Fame that honors officers that have
gone above and beyond the call of duty. And tonight
(00:28):
we have Tom Smith. He is a part of my
Zone seven. He is a part of my table fifteen,
and we're going to talk about that. But I welcome
him humbly. I know his background, I know his track record,
I know his career.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Sir, how are you?
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I am great, and you just made my day even
better being here. It's always a privilege and an honor
no matter where we are, as long as we're together,
and doing a show like this makes it even more special.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
You know, let's just start from the beginning.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
You selected, of all the departments in the world, of
all the levels, state, local, and federal, the New York
City Police Department.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Why in YPD.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
My dad was an NYPD detective for twenty six years
from nineteen fifty to nineteen seventy six, So that's all
I knew. I knew one department in this world, and
it was the NYPD. I grew up idolizing my dad
and wanting to be like him, just like every little
boy you know in the world growing up and looking
(01:39):
at this six foot three, two twenty you know, pound
irishman who controlled his world in law enforcement and was
respected like crazy. And that's what I wanted. That's what
I wanted to be, just like him, to steal his
(02:01):
shield when he came home from work and put it
on my belt, that run around and chase my sisters.
So that was you know, growing up, I was I
was doing one or two things, Charlotte, I was playing baseball,
or it was gonna be a cop, and there was
no thought of anywhere else. It was going to be
the NYPD, and that was it. So when you have
(02:24):
that drive of wanting to be like your dad and
wanting to serve in the best police department in the world,
you do it one thousand and one hundred miles an hour.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
And that's what I did better than anybody, I'm gonna
tell you. But you know, I think about your dad.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Too, from the fifties to the sixties.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
You want to talk about decades being a stark difference,
and then rolling into the seventies, I mean, honey, he's
got some stories.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Oh it was. It was when I was with him
and go into a Yankee game. That was a history
lesson anytime we went into the city, whether we went
to my sister's house, you know, apartment who lived on
the East Side, or we would go to a Yankee game.
Because part of the day wasn't just going to Yankee Stadium.
We would stop at the four four and go up
(03:18):
to the squad. We'd go to the four to one
for Apache and go to the squad and see all
his friends and his partners that he worked with, you know. Uh,
And that was part of it. So that's what I
mean by it was. It was surrounding me, and it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
A lift.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
It was yeah, we're going here, We're going here, and
standing in a room with a bunch of just the
best there was at that time, and then driving around
the streets and having him point out, oh, yeah, that
happened here, that double homicide happened over here, and we
chase that guy down that alleyway. It was just all
(04:00):
the time and talk about getting ready for a career
when you were young. That's what that's what I got,
and I loved every second of it. Me and my dad.
I mean, think about this. Part of and you know
this because we're from the same generation. Part of your
night or our night was sitting down together and watching
(04:23):
the six o'clock news. That was like a TV show.
It wasn't the news. It was like, Okay, at six o'clock,
let's see what's going on in the world. And we
would sit there and if there was a story about
a homicide that was on the news, I would talk
to him about it, like, Hey, how would you do this?
How would you do that? Where would you start? Who
would you talk to? And that was the conversation during
(04:45):
the news we would have if there was a story
that was a crime story. And that's what I was
so interested in, you know, growing up, and it just
led to what I became.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
And you know, the world is a small place sometimes.
And I interviewed somebody on Zone seven, detective Ralph, remember who? Yes,
And it was so incredible because you texted me and said, Hey,
do you have a phone number for him?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
I think he knew my dad.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Will you tell us just a little bit about that
when you reconnected with him?
Speaker 3 (05:21):
Yeah. I had known about Ralph last year and then
just schedules and life kind of gets in a way
of getting in touch with him, and I lost touch
with him, and I actually don't know what happened to
his contact that I had. And then I saw that
you had him on and reached right out to him.
He remembered me, and I actually had the opportunity to
(05:42):
go to his house and see all the medals and
everything he had. And he's the most decorated NYPD detective
in its history. I mean, a man is an absolute
walking legend. But even better was talking to him about
stories I knew and I had heard from my dad
(06:05):
and they actually worked in the four to one and
FOURID apache at the same time, he vaguely remembered my
dad showed him a couple of pictures of him and
he did. So, you know, like you said, big world,
but small world, especially in our world, which shrinks tremendously
when we start talking and throwing names around. It doesn't
(06:29):
matter where you are on this coast or the West coast.
If you talk enough to a cop, you're going to
find someone in common that you have.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Yes, Yes, And I just thought that reunion was amazing,
and the pictures of the two of y'all in his
house with all of those medals and.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
Plaques and commendations. It was just it got to me
because I know your dad would have loved that.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Oh God, it would have been He would have went
with me. Are you kidding me? If I had said
to him, if he was still alive, and I said, hey,
I'm going to see Ralph, you know, he'd be like,
all right, let's go love it. He would have let
me go by myself.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
Tell me your toughest night there was one.
Speaker 3 (07:12):
And it's funny you bring that up, because I'll go
down and speak in in the NYPD Academy quite often,
either at the CIC course, which is the Coronel investigation
course with new detectives, and I'll go and talk to them,
or once in a while I'll get to speak to
the recruits and in even colleges that I go and
speak at, and I tell him about this one night,
(07:35):
and God's honest true that this was the night. I'm
going to try to remember it. My partner and I
we were in uniform, and we start off the night
assisting narcotics who was chasing this guy down the street.
So we get in a foot pursuit into a park,
roll around in the park, lock him up, rip my shirt.
(07:55):
Have to go back to the priest and get a
new shirt. Later on that night, four people get shot
on the corner of one four nine in Broadway. Have
to assist them and go to that scene, and anti
crime ended locking the guy up who did the shooting.
So we're assisting running around with that with four people shot.
(08:16):
A little time later, a sixteen year old girl wanted
to jump off a twenty story building and me and
my partner got up to the roof in time, grabbed her,
flipped their back over the fence, and got her out
of that situation. A couple of hours later, we get
a call of an eight day old baby that's not breathing.
(08:39):
We run up to the apartment, grab the baby that
is totally unresponsive and not breathing, run down the stairs,
jump in the car I'm driving. My partner has the
baby on his lap. We're doing one hundred miles an
hour up riverside drive to Columbia Presbyterian Hospital, and the
other cops in my command and the Northern command and
(09:01):
the three four shutting the streets down as we're going.
We're doing CPR in the front seat of the car
on an eight day old baby and get to the
emergency room and kind of slide sideways into the emergency
port and as soon as we did that, the baby
started crying. And then about an hour or two later,
(09:23):
we get a call that there's a cop shot in
the four to four preestinct, which is in the Bronx,
and they're coming over to Columbia Press because just in
the area of the Bronx they were. It was the
closest hospital in Manhattan, and they're flying over there and
we're flying up to the hospital to start shut some
streets down or whatever, and they pull into the emergency room.
(09:44):
We were just at with a great event that happened
a couple hours earlier, saving a baby, and now we
have a cop that shot pulling into the same area
and get in the back seat and get him out
of the car and up on a stretcher and into
the emergency room and unfortunately ended up dying from multiple
(10:05):
gunshot wounds. That was one night, that was one four
to twelve tour that I won't forget, and it's thirty
probably thirty two years ago, and I just rattled it
off the way I did because that's the kind of
night that was.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
It's burned in that memory. How about your most memorable arrest?
Speaker 3 (10:32):
Most memorable arrest was probably the shooting we were in.
I was involved in a shooting in nineteen ninety three,
a month after I got married. So Ange loved that.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
With her, and she is so lovely and she is
so supportive and she is just I mean, I don't
have enough wonderful things to say about her.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
But the time and of that a month literally it
ended up by the time we got back from our honeymoon.
It was probably, yeah, about two or three weeks later,
we get in a shooting with three individuals who robbed
the supermarket. One of the cops I was with got
shot during the exchange of gunfire. He got shot in
(11:21):
the leg. He was okay, he survived, but ended up
getting off the job. But we have this this shooting
with three individuals. Ralph was at my wedding. The couple
got shot. My partner who I was with that day,
was at my wedding. So we were all friends, not
just you know, partners, working, and we ended up getting
(11:44):
all three of them. We shot two of them. We
end up arresting all three and all three did about
one hundred years in jail. They're still in jail, which
is the best part. But that was, you know, it
was personal because of obviously them trying to kill us
in them shooting Ralph. So that was probably the one
(12:06):
that certainly stands out.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Now, you've already mentioned being in shootouts, in different situations
that were clearly dangerous, being on bridges. What was the
most dangerous situation in your thirty five years?
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Probably when I went to Afghanistan for three months as
part of the Joint Tyrorism Task Force. We were sent
over there on a kidnapping case, and there were numerous
things that we ran into over there. Unfortunately, can't get
into the specifics of them, but think about just being
(12:48):
an NYPD cop and dealing with New York City or
the Bronx or Brooklyn wherever you might be, and now
being in the middle of a war zone and playing
by their rules, which there are aren't any, you know,
so having to deal with that and got out of,
you know, a couple of tough situations that we were in,
(13:09):
and the reason for getting out of them was not
being you know, tough for anything. It was pure experience
in not panicking and not overreacting to one or two
things and having a great partner at the time and
keeping our heads on and just you know, methodically kind
(13:29):
of working with each other to get out of a
couple of tough situations. But that was probably you know,
even afterwards, Cheryl, we you know, my partner after getting
out of one situation, looks at me and yells, hey,
I guess we're not in the Bronx anymore.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
And hey, y'all, it wasn't like y'all were working in
you know, Disneyland. No, I mean y'all had a pretty
rough environment. Y'all were working in every day.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Yeah, every day, every single And when you got back
to Embassy compound, you know, you took a deep breath
that you got back, you know, and you were thankful
for it because it was you know, if you were
the passenger in the car driving around, that was your job.
You had to watch everyone walking, every car driving, every
double parked car, every you know, everything going on around
(14:22):
you because the driver was just driving. So it was
very stressful being out on the street when you had
to go and do wherever, or you had to drive
up to Bogram or wherever we had to go. So
when the day was done, and you were very thankful
you were back home.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
When you sign up for the NYPD at eighteen, nineteen,
twenty twenty one, Afghanistan is not crossing your mind. And
I bet you there's a lot of people listening right
now that don't even realize that a police officer is
going to be sent into a war zone on a kidnapping.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Case, right and and that's kind of that was the
family you know. Here, here's the tough part, Sheryl. During
the time, you know, we're we're bound by you know,
classification and top secret clearances and all that when we're working.
So think about this. To even add more to that,
my family knew I was going to Afghanistan, but had
(15:22):
no idea why because I couldn't tell them why. So
I mean think about that, you know, thinking of their
stress level of you know, dad and your husband's going
to a war zone and you're an NYPD detective first
of all, why wow, so yep, and then not being
able to explain it, and then staying there for three months,
(15:44):
not a week, not a few days, three months of
not knowing why I was there. So you know, there's
things that happened in a career, and I tell you know,
I just mentioned being at the CIC course. When I
go there and talk to you young detectives, I tell them,
and it happened to me. You have to be prepared
(16:06):
for your entire world and career changing in one minute.
And that happened to me. You know, I would have
been absolutely the happiest detective in New York City if
I ended up on a homicide squad in the Bronx.
That was my goal. That's where I wanted to be.
That was it. That was the top of the line
(16:26):
that I thought in the NYPDA, And then nine to
eleven happens, and one hundred and two minutes later, I'm
assigned to the Terrorism Taskforce and around the world. So
that's what I tell them. You know, it's great to
have a plan, but you have to be ready to
adapt to something else, because the world is what it
is today.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
And you know, you go home and you're literally packing
and you tell Angie, Hey, you know, I don't know
how long I'm going to be gone. I can't tell
you what I'm doing. I can't take exactly I can
tell you Afghanistan, but I can't take exactly anything else.
You know, Feya and she and she just has to
be smiling and supportive. I'm gonna tell you right now,
(17:09):
if I did not have the job that I have
and did not have the understanding that I do, I
wish Walt McCollum would walk in here and tell me, Hey,
I'm packing. I got to go, and I can't tell
you where, I can't tell you with who, and I
can't tell you for how long. You ain't gonna make
it to the door, sugar. I'm telling you so.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
It takes a to me. She deserves part of your award.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Oh God. And I said it that night.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
You did, You did it, and you said it beautifully
and it was true.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
Though it was true because you know, spouses don't get
enough credit militarily and in law enforcement or first responders
as much as they should, because we know what we're doing,
we know where we're at, we know the situations where
we're in, and we're trained to handle them. They're sick
(18:00):
X amount of miles away not knowing where we are,
and to do that, I mean, think of you know,
my wife, think about that for thirty years, not a
couple of weeks, thirty years of that thought in your
head of God. I really hope you come home tonight,
(18:22):
you know, and living with that, and then not just
taking care of yourself, but then taking care of three
kids on top of that.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Well, I will say this publicly again for the rookies
that are listening, for the young people going into this career,
pick your partner.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Take some time.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
I'm just telling you, it will make all the difference
in your life. I mean, Tom, you had an impossible
job to go to a war zone when you had
not been in the military. Correct and Angie could have
been crying and carrying and throwing stuff and having a fit,
and the kids could be all out of control, and
(19:05):
that would have made your job impossible. But that's not
what you had at home. And I just want people
to hear that, because if you've got somebody that's jealous,
if you've got somebody that doesn't have your back, if
you're with somebody that doesn't really want the best for you, you.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Might want to think about that relationship.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Yeah, yeah, it's you know, I'm listening. I say it
all the time, and me and you have had this discussion,
not only you know, the night of the induction, but
you know after that that I'm lucky. You know, I'm
one of the fortunate ones, because so many marriages don't work,
and so many things go wrong in relationships with police officers,
(19:49):
and I'm one of the lucky ones. To be with
the same woman for thirty five years is not the norm.
And and that's sad to say, you know, that's and
I've said it so many times. I hate the reaction
I get when I'm out somewhere speaking and I say,
you know, I've been with the same woman for thirty
(20:10):
five years, and people look at me, Oh my god, really,
and that shouldn't be And that's sad that that's the reaction,
but it's the reality of it.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Especially in our world. Most of the people we know
are on their second or third marriage. Yes, absolutely, So again,
take your time picking, take your time speaking of good partners.
Tell us about being paired up with somebody and you're
working twelve hours if not more in a car.
Speaker 3 (20:39):
It is one of the most important decisions you can
make in the nypday. And you know, this goes back,
and it's a funny story, but this goes back to
watching my dad and watching him with his partners. I mean,
I still to this day speak to quite often. And
(21:00):
Joe actually just just passed away a couple of years ago,
one of my dad's partners and his family that's from
fifty some odds sixty years ago that they worked together,
and I still am in touch with his entire family.
And that's how that's what I grew up watching of
what partners were like and the relationship of families, and
(21:23):
not just you know, partners in the job, but family
relationships and them coming down to our house down the
Jersey Shore, and like I said this day, still reaching
out to them and seeing how they're doing, what's going on,
how are things all that, And that's what I grew
up watching. So that and here's here's the fun the
(21:45):
funny part of it, as silly as it's going to sound.
My favorite TV show growing up with Starsking Hodge and.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Parts a good one.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
Part start right. Part of Star Skin Hodge was them
as partners and the way they were together, and I
as a young kid, going, I want that. That's the
partner I want and took that into the job and
I was lucky as anything to have some of the
most reliable, smart, tactical friends that were partners and each
(22:21):
of them had a different role in my career. You know,
when I was on patrol, George Faguero was my partner
and we were I mean, we did it right. We
knew each other. We had codes for certain things and
keywords for you know, you know, when one of them
got us out of a bad situation. One night, if
(22:42):
you want to hit just real quick, we pull a
car over, and we had a deal. We had we
had a system that if we called each other by
a different name, something was wrong. And we pulled a
car over one night on St. Nicholas Avenue, right off
of one four one hundred and forty five Street, and
I'm at the passenger I'm at the driver window and
(23:04):
figures at the passenger window. He didn't have a passenger,
solo driver and I'm looking around. I'm talking to him,
and Figure goes, hey, mikey okay. I go yep, I'm
all good. And with that didn't even ask open the door,
grab the guy out of the car, pulled him out
of the car, cuffed him on St. Nicholas Avenue, right,
(23:25):
you know, in the middle of the street. Cuff him on,
like what's up. And he goes in the back seat
and pulls a shotgun out of under the seat of
the driver's side seat. He saw the barrel sticking out,
grab it. We end up running him and he was
wanted for three bank robberies down in North Carolina.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
But he's just that trust.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Like you said, you didn't question it, you didn't go
huh yeah, oh my gosh, just pure action because you
know he's got you mm hm.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
And that was a lot of trust. So you know,
do that on patrol with him, and then you know,
call us Perez, my partner in narcotics and in the
robbery squad, you know, and call us what I tell
him all the time. You know, he's the guy who
taught me how to be a detective, and just his
mindset of, hey, think outside the box, don't get caught
in that box. You know, let's let's think outside this,
(24:20):
how we get this, how do we get that? And
don't ever stop until we get the bad guys. You know,
he had a saying when we were in narcotics, just
get the bad guys. We'll figure everything else out later.
And I still use I use that my whole career.
Just get the bad guys. Everything else we'll figure out.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
Well, there's brilliance in that My partner, Leslie Saunders. You know,
she's much older than me. She's probably gonna listen to
this episode, so I think she's eighty eighty one. But anyway, Wow,
But you know that trust, that understanding. You know, we
(25:00):
had that thing. Leslie can take anything, she can take
being called anything. You can be as vulgar and as
rude and as profane as you want, but if you
call her stupid, we have a situation. I don't know why.
I've never really known, because she's not stupid. She's one
of the brightest people that I know, but something about
(25:20):
somebody calling her that. So you you know, understanding your partner,
you can save that person getting in trouble.
Speaker 2 (25:29):
You know, you take over the.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Person that's being you know, loud and you know, trying
to degrade you and you know, cuse at you, so
that your partner doesn't take a swing or doesn't you know,
get caught on camera. You know, you got to have
that understanding. And I always felt like part of my
job wasn't just to make sure we were saved, but
(25:51):
to make sure, you know, she looked good and you
know we did the right thing.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
Sure, and you know, There was one time quick you'll
love this if I.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Can, Honey, it is your show. You talk about what
you want.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
There was one time that Carlos actually got mad at me.
It maned relatively mad. So we're in a robbery squad
and you know, you go back to when you when
you ask for you know, your best arrest. I contemplated
telling you this story, but the shooting was was went
above it, but this one was really close. We get
(26:26):
called into the lieutenant's office and he says, hey, you know,
we got this pattern. You know of these two shootings
and these four robberies we think are connected. What do
we got on it? Do we have anyone? You know,
I'm doing the chief's office at one o'clock and he's
going to rip me a new one for this thing
being open. What do we have? And we're like, well,
(26:48):
we don't have really anything, boss. We got. All we
had was a male black named Jerome with gold teeth
in the bronx. That's all we had. So so, being
the wise ass that I was at the time, I
looked at him and I go, what time's your meeting?
He goes one o'clock. Now it's like nine thirty ten,
(27:08):
o'clock in the morning. So I go, all right, we'll
have it by one o'clock and he goes, get out
of my office. I'm like, we'll have him by one o'clock.
We walk out of his office. Carlos looks and me.
He goes, what are you doing. I'm like, he goes,
what are you way to your mind? I go, come on,
let's go. He goes, Tommy, we have Jerome in the Bronx.
(27:29):
I'm like, yeah, I know, let's go. So we go
out and he's looking at me like, I mean, he
literally wanted to knock my head off because I did this.
So I go, come on, let's go. We go out.
He's like where we go? And he said, let's go
the first location of the shooting up on the Grand Concourse.
Walking across the street towards the building, and this kid's
(27:49):
walking across towards us, and he kind of looks at
us a little funny. So I stopped. I said, listen,
if he turns around, we're going to go grab and
talk to him. So the kid turns around, looks at us.
We run back across the street were grabbing him, like hey,
what's going on? And they start asking about the shooting.
He goes, I don't know who did it. I don't
know his name, but I know where his sister lives. Okay,
(28:09):
where's his sister lives? He gives us the address, so
we go over there and we're sitting in front of,
you know, on this block. We have no idea where
on the street this possible sister lives. And we're sitting
there and this kid's walking down the street and he's
got a brown paper bag in his hand, having a drink.
So Carlos is in the passenger seat. Who can talk
(28:32):
to anybody. Carlos could talk to the devil, I mean,
with no issue whatsoever. And he calls him over and
he starts talking to him, and I look over and
the kid's not opening his mouth. So he said, Carlos,
make him laugh, just stay, just tell a joke, make
him laugh, and the kid laughs. He's got gold teeth.
(28:53):
So we get out of the car and we're like, hey, bro, listen,
you can't have an open beer, can you know? Everyone
sees us talking to you. We got to give you
a summons or some if you have your license. He goes, no,
I don't like. What's your name? He's like, you know.
He comes up with his Kevin or something. So we're like,
all right, oh, Mikey, I'm sorry, said Michael. He says,
(29:14):
Michael's my name. We're like, all right, listen, where's your license?
Hits up in my sister's apartment. Okay, let's go upstairs
with his sister's apartment and get your get your license.
We go inside. He opens the door and his assist
and he goes, hey, the police are here. They gonna
give me a summons for an open container. The sister
yells out, Jerome, why are you always getting in trouble?
(29:36):
We grab him, throw him in the hallway, get him
on the ground, cuff him, go back to the precinct.
Twelve forty five.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Tom Smith, twelve forty five.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
I call, We get to the office. I call the
chief's office and I asked for the Lieutenant's like, what
do you want? I said, we got him? He goes,
what I go, we got him? I said, you want
us to deliver them to you? You want to come
see him? He goes, I'll be right there. He walked
in and couldn't believe it.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
Yeah, that's why you're a legend right there. So let's
talk about when you got the call about the Hall
of Fame.
Speaker 3 (30:19):
Yeah, you know, we had nominated Kimber Gest to be
in a Hall of fame. Who is Oh my god,
I mean if she didn't get in a Hall of fame,
there shouldn't be a Hall of Fame. Basically, you know,
that's why someone like her, who got shot eight times
and survived, is why the Hall of Fame was developed.
(30:42):
So we had nominated her right after we interviewed her
on the show. And one morning I'm here and Adam,
Megan and Danny facetimeed me. And that wasn't unusual. We
had talked before, you know, about whatever whatever trip coming
up or whatever it might have been. So them calling
(31:05):
on a face wasn't unusual. So Meghan starts going, Hey,
I just want to let you know Kimber got in.
So I'm like, oh my god, you just made my year,
you just made everything. I'm happy as hell great. I'm
thinking about Kimber. And while I'm thinking about Kimber, Meghan
(31:26):
says my name and I go, why did you just
say my name? So Megan goes, did you hear anything
I just said to you? For the last like forty seconds,
I'm like, no, what'd you say? She's like. Then I
look at her, I'm like, why are you crying?
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (31:43):
And she's like, yeah, you And then she told me
that I got in and I was getting the Lifetime
Achievement Award and I just went wait, what, Like, what
are you talking about? I'm happy for Kimber. We're talking
about her. She's like, no, you got and then she
starts telling me that I got going to be inducted.
It took about ten seconds and I had to hang
(32:05):
up and I'm like, listen, I can't. I got to
call you guys back, because thirty years of emotions and
what you did and how you did it all came
rushing into my head in one shot. And it was
an extremely proud moment. And obviously the first person I
(32:28):
think of was my dad, wishing he was still here,
that I could have called him and told him that,
you know, and everything he instilled in me and taught me,
and how do you do this and why you're doing it?
You know, all that came out, so you can imagine,
you know, what I was feeling at that time, and
(32:48):
then having the opportunity to tell my family and then
about an hour later, I got to call him back,
but it was, you know, something so oh incredibly unexpected,
because we don't and I said it that night, Cheryl,
we don't go into this job to get things like this.
(33:10):
We don't. It's not on a checklist, it's not on
a to do list. You know. I want to be
a copy and get in the National Law Enforcements's Hall
of Fame. That's not even thought about, and that's not
why we get into law enforcement. So when you're thought
of like that and able to be inducted into such
an organization like this, it's a tremendous honor that I
(33:36):
just cherish all the time.
Speaker 1 (33:43):
Let's talk a little bit about Table fifteen. Yes, because
for most people, this type of night is elegant, it's formal,
it's beautiful, it's a once in a lifetime. It's probably
just the pinnacle of your career. I mean, there is
(34:04):
nothing any higher, right.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
But not our table hunt.
Speaker 3 (34:11):
Well, you made sure of that because and you were
right in saying it. Listen, we have to there's too
much seriousness that goes into our job and our profession
because most of the time we have to be a
certain way and carry ourselves a certain way. But when
you have the opportunity to just enjoy something with every
(34:35):
breath you have. And we laughed and joked and cried
and had the best time. You know, when you have
you know, twenty five tables staring at us and looking
over us because because we're laughing so much.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Night the Cool Kids Table, Thank you. Listen. We have
Kimber and herr nuggets in the.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
We had Kimber and her mom, You and your lovely bride,
Dan and his lovely bride, and Walt and I And
let me tell you, we laughed a lot. But I
want everybody to hear me when I tell y'all when
Dan Murphy turns and says, you want to know the
best practical joke I ever pulled, the night is going
(35:23):
to take a turn, okay, And then Kimber follows up
with hers and then Tom Smith says, well, this may
or may.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Not have happened.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Well, at that point, I just thought, man, if this
table had a recording show, it could be its own show.
And everything we talked about was true. Every story I told,
every story y'all told, absolutely true. But honey, it would
probably get us in a little bit of trouble with
some folks, because oh.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
My god, it we told her from practical jokes to
you know, situations all in on the street and things
we did. Was it was just you know, it was
a special night to begin with, but then it was
just extra that was like it was just an like
extra endings of a ballgame of what it was. And
(36:17):
we deserve that, you know. I say this all the time,
shar and you do too, that it's okay for cops
to feel that they deserve something, you know, a good
night like that. It's okay to feel that and to
understand that and to cherish those because we don't get
a lot of them, you know, and when we do,
(36:40):
we have to enjoy it because we just go through
way too much that ninety nine percent of the people
in this country would never even think of doing. And
when you have a chance to just laugh and joke
around with people who are now part of your family
and love and respect, it makes that night so much
(37:02):
more special. And Table fifteen is gonna pop up again
in April of twenty twenty six, for sure.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
For sure, And I'll tell you know what they've done
with this Hall of fame.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
You said it that night, and it is the truth.
It is a family.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
It is it's just, and it's a special family because
of what it represents. It's it's these stories and these
situations that people go through and get acknowledged. And Megan
and Adam do God's work because without them, no one
(37:39):
knows about these stories. No one knows about Kimber guests
who got shot eight times, you know, and survived, you know.
No one knows those stories of others who won awards
at night, the Canaan Awards, you know, you know, all
those and it gives everyone an opportunity to not just
(38:01):
the stories, but see the people who live through them.
And that's even more of an impact. When these people
are standing up on a stage and telling the story
of their induction and they're real, their flesh and blood,
their humans. They cry, they fail, and it all comes
(38:23):
to a head that night. Thanks to Megan and Adam's
hard work throughout a year. I mean, they start twenty
twenty five, happened in March, Megan started twenty twenty six
the following week.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
Right, And let me just tell you, Megan and Adam
both they live it, they feel it, they believe in it.
They cry, they they feel every inductee and want to
make sure that they are honored in a way that
their families are going to be proud of. Is it
(38:59):
in just a hey, congratulations, you know you did a
great job this one night. That's not it all year long.
They reach out all year long. They're like, hey, everything good,
Happy birthday, happy anniversary. Make sure you've already blocked out
the date for April. Like they want this family to
come back together year after year.
Speaker 3 (39:19):
Yeah, no doubt. That's a great point because the night
is put together for all the families and the pop
and circumstance and the stuff on tables and the speakers
and the extra things that they have going on before
the induction night, This ceremony is all for families because
(39:39):
Megan and Adam understand that law enforcement is not a
singular entity. It's a family that goes through. Every single
thing that that cop goes through, the heartache, the pain,
the failures, the injuries, all of that is a family thing.
(40:01):
And they understand that, and that's why those nights are special.
Speaker 1 (40:05):
And you know, Tom and I started a tradition sort
of sub level. Not everybody knows about it, but it's
something that's going to continue and it's one of those things.
It's almost like a secret code and that means the
world to me. So I cannot wait for this April
to watch you continue this tradition, sir.
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Yes, and the only reason, and just to let you know,
we didn't do it last year because I wasn't going
to do it without you being there. So you know
that's why it wasn't done last year. So we're both
going to be there this year to continue that. And
you know that's I get through a speech that was,
(40:46):
you know, emotional, and I got through it and then
you throw your part in. I was like, really, you know,
I got through this and now you're going to throw
this at me. But it was and it's still where
I put it that and it's going to be removed
in April and it's going to be in someone else's hands.
So I can't wait for that.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
Love it well, Tom Smith, I love you, I adore you,
I respect you. I am so proud that you were
the first guest for the National Law Enforcement Hall of
Fame Highlight Own Zone seven.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
Well, I couldn't be more honored. And you know how
I feel about you talk about clicking with someone and
just an immediate connection was what me and you are
and continue to be. You know, for everyone listening to this,
we talk well at least once a week just to
(41:43):
say hi, because the respect level of our industry can
get mired in nonsense a lot. And when you fall
in love with true people who just have a admiration
and respect for it makes life so much better. And
(42:04):
you go through heartaches in his job and a lot
of bad stuff, but then when you get to where
we are now, it's all worth it because you're in
my family and I love you dearly and everything you
do and to have you be part of my life
is a blessing.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
I'm Cheryl McCollum and this is his own seven
Host
Nancy Grace
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