January 23, 2025 • 55 mins
Relationship guru Jillian Turecki joins Chelsea to talk about taking ownership over what you bring to a relationship, how you may be giving away your power by expecting someone else to solve your problems, and why finding “the one” is a crock of sh*t. Then: A newly-sober caller frets when his ex wants to know what’s currently going on in his bedroom. A new girlfriend worries that her boyfriend has too many female friends. And the apps are proving difficult when a bit of information has potential matches heading for the door.
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Find Jillian’s new book here
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Need some advice from Chelsea? Email us at DearChelseaPodcast@gmail.com
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Executive Producer Catherine Law
Edited & Engineered by Brad Dickert
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The views and opinions expressed are solely those of the Podcast author, or individuals participating in the Podcast, and do not represent the opinions of iHeartMedia or its employees. This Podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, mental health counseling or therapy, or as imparting any health care recommendations at all. Individuals are advised to seek independent medical, counseling advice and/or therapy from a competent health care professional with respect to any medical condition, mental health issues, health inquiry or matter, including matters discussed on this Podcast. Guests and listeners should not rely on matters discussed in the Podcast and shall not act or shall refrain from acting based on information contained in the Podcast without first seeking independent medical advice.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, Catherine, Hi Chelsea, how are you Hi? I'm good.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I'm staying at a hotel in Los Angeles while I
record my audio book. I've been recording my audiobook for
the last two days. Today should be the last day
if you haven't pre ordered my book, I'll Have What
She's Having. It comes out February twenty fifth. And I
didn't smoke any weed or drink alcohol for three days
leading up to my audiobook recording so that I could
sound as crisp as possible. Because of so many of
(00:26):
my fans listen to my audio books, especially for my
last audiobook, so I really wanted to.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Deliver on that. That is real commitment, Chelsea, That is commitment.
I'm a professional.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Yeah, And you know what, I love listening to a
comedy like a book by a comedian read by the author.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Like that's the way to go for those, right right?
What else is happening? Updates? Updates? I'm moving back into
my house tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Oh, the Critics' Choice Awards are now February seventh, Friday night,
February seventh, so they've been moved to that date, so
I will be hosting those. And the fires are they
are almost contained.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I wouldn't say they are fully contained.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, I think they're mostly contained. It seems like they're
not threatening homes much anymore. They're not covering it on
the news at least, so not totally out. But now
it's sort of like moving into what do we do
now and rebuilding. Yeah, you know, something I heard from
several people that I think is really important to remember
is that, like, you know, we all give to our
(01:24):
gofundmes and friends and people, you know, and Red Cross
and all that good stuff. And I think people are
going to be realizing what they need a little bit
further down the line, like in a few months when
they start the rebuilding process or start to sort of
get life figured out, Like people may need more help
than so like check in, check in on folks.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Our guest today is a certified relationship coach, author, teacher,
and host of the podcast Jillian on Love. Her new
book It Begins with You The Nine Hard Truths about
Love that will Change Your Life. It's out now. Please
welcome Jillian to Reki. Jillian, Welcome, Welcome to Dear Chelsea.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I love books, all books, and then I love self
help books. Especially when I'm in the right mood and
I'm in the mood for self help. So your new book,
which is called It Begins with You, The Nine Hard
Truths about Love that will Change Your Life, is out now.
So the nine Hard Truths, I feel like some of
them are obvious truths, and then some of them aren't
(02:24):
so obvious.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Would you agree with me? Yeah, I absolutely would.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
And which ones are not the obvious ones? In your opinion?
Speaker 5 (02:30):
It begins with you. I don't think is that obvious
to people. It might be obvious to people who actually
maybe do a lot of inner work, but I don't
think it's that obvious to people. And I think what's
not also not obvious is I don't know, the mind
is a battlefield. I mean, I think people also know that,
but don't really understand how that actually directly impacts.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
The quality of your relationships.
Speaker 5 (02:52):
Right that making peace with your parents might not be
so obvious, What do you think is not?
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I think making peace with your parents is not as obvious.
I think everyone realizes that that's necessary, even though I
do believe it tugs at everybody. You know, everyone has
their biggest problems or their parents, whether they know it
or not. And then the other one that is, no
one is coming to save you. Yeah, no one is
coming to save which is bad news. Yeah, yeah, it's
bad news, but it's important news for you to know.
Speaker 5 (03:19):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, no one is coming to save you.
I mean, you know, I think that I know for
me and everyone who I've worked with. It's not necessarily conscious,
but a lot of people will say, well, once I
meet that person, once I meet the one, then then yeah,
then I'll feel okay, Then things will be okay, then
(03:40):
my problems will go away. And even if they're not,
even on some intellectual level, they know that's not true.
There's so much emphasis on Stockham like this right person
and when this right person comes into your life, everything's
going to fall into place, and it's not true.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
But where did that begin?
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Do you think with romanticism?
Speaker 2 (04:00):
I mean it seems pretty obvious, but I'm like, who
started it?
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Like, you know, because.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
You know, like centuries ago, I don't think there was
this we roam we started as a modern age started
to romanticize things because if you were really like an
inca or someone who was like living on the land,
you're not going to be like I.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Have to meet the love of my life that trying
to get.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Fucking by no day know by you know, peeling potatoes
that hopefully you found exactly. So I guess it is
modern civilization that started to create and monetize it. Really
yea nassism, because I mean, I've heard from so we
hear so many people this idea. It's such a silly notion.
It's like Disneyland esque. It's so someone's gonna come and
(04:45):
you're a princess, and then when they see you, you
become the princess. But you don't have to evolve, change
or grow at all. It's just going to all be
okay once they get once they find you absolutely and
then what are they do? You realize how much power
that gives another person.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Also get yes, because if you give someone the power
to make you, if you think someone else is going
to make you happy, they also have the power to
make you miserable because you're putting all the emphasis on them.
It's all how they make you feel. And fulfillment is
an inside job. Like someone who comes into your life.
I really believe that the whole point of a relationship
(05:21):
is to make life a little bit easier and a
little bit better. There's no point in being a relationship
with someone that makes your life more difficult, and a
lot of people put up with that. But the reality
is is that you know, the real work begins once
you're in the relationship. And everyone thinks, well, once I
find that person, like that's actually you know, they think
that the work.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Is really find it, But well, the work with another
person happens once you find the relationship. But the work
you could be doing the work all the time on
yourself to prepare for a relationship, absolutely absolutely, which is
like you know, because right, so both things are true.
Speaker 5 (05:56):
Both things are true, but also you can do a
lot of work on yourself to prepare yourself for the relationship,
which I always think you should be preparing, But you're
never going to be fully prepared for what is going
to come up in you when you're actually in the relationship, because.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Then why would you even exist on earth if you
were here to have no problems.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Yeah, that's not a real thing. And I think that
people don't really understand. I know, I didn't really understand
what it means to actually to love that love is
a practice, love is a verb, Love.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
Isn't just a feeling.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
And I think that what's embedded in this whole notion
of the one in romanticism is that it's just this feeling,
and so it should be easy and this person should
just make me feel great and I should feel great
when I'm around them. When the reality is to be
in a relationship long term, you have to wake up
every day and make a choice to show up, to
make a choice to love this person, to make a
(06:48):
choice to communicate. And the more complicated you are, or
the more selfish you are, or the more ill equipped
you are to understand what it is to mean to
love someone, the more problems you're going to have in
a relationship.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
Yes, And I also think that when you are talking
about relationship and romanticizing that this ideology because I definitely
felt it growing up, like Oh, I'm going to meet
the one and we're going to have the greatest love
story of all time. And then I started to get
older and I'm like, wouldn't it be fun to have
a lot of love stories instead of just one and
putting all of your eggs into one basket. And the
(07:23):
way that our society, specifically America, I mean, I think
it's a global thing but it's very American to be like, oh,
there's so much emphasis on spending your life with another person.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
That's a really long time.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Longer.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
They say, if you can live through the next twelve
or fifteen years, you can live until you're one hundred
and twenty. I already talked about how I don't want that,
and you can't afford that, and what am.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I going to be doing stand up when I'm one
hundred and eighteen years old, Like fuck, I don't want that.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But because we're extending lives and everything, like it's just
of course, it's a beautiful idea and concept, but it's
the reality of it is just so silly. It's like, yeah,
one in I don't know. I don't know what the
stats are. Do you about how many couples make it
past fifty years and are happy?
Speaker 4 (08:15):
I don't love.
Speaker 5 (08:16):
I actually don't know the stats. But I think that
if you're going to be with someone for a really
long time, let's say, let's just say even over ten years,
twenty years, thirty years, you're going to have many relationships.
Within the same relationship, You're going to have many if
you're married to someone, it's going to be many marriages.
So these are not my words, but Esther prel will say,
you know, some people will have many different relationships with
(08:37):
different people, and some people will have many different relationships
with the same person. And I think that if you
want to commit to someone long term, then you have
to understand that fundamentally, that it is a choice. That
one thing that is absolutely guaranteed in life is that
nothing is permanent, right, constant We're in constant flux, and
(08:59):
there's constant change. So to love someone long term is
to be able to you have to be able to
accept that there's going to be change. And I think
fundamentally human beings that we really struggle with that.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, because changes, change sounds scarier than it sounds like
you're losing something.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yes, so many people, right, change they associate with grief.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Why do you have to change? That's a loss?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
Change can also like putting something away and getting something
else in return, doesn't mean you're losing anything. In fact,
it can mean quite the opposite, that are gaining. Absolutely,
so we have these it's like we've gotten this these
almost energies around these terms that have gotten completely out
of control. The one romanticism, you know, change, change, is good.
Speaker 4 (09:44):
You complete me?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Yeah, yeah, you complete me? What a load of shit.
My dog completes me.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
My dog completes me too.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Please come as close to it completing me as anybody
else has.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
So what's your situation. Are you married?
Speaker 5 (09:58):
No? So I was married, and the relations the marriage
was actually really really painful, and how it ended was
extremely painful.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
So let's talk about that story. Okay, yeah, that's pretty
That was hard to read. I can't imagine it. Yeah, okay,
I mean it's a good start to a book. Yeah, sure,
yeah gets you in.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
He gets you in because he hooks you. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
So when I started seeing him, I thought when we
got married, I was thirty eight, and I thought, well,
you know, I'm older, I'm wiser, I've been working with
people for so many years. I know what I'm doing.
But boy did I not know what I was doing.
And so when our relationship leading up to marriage, I
always say it was about ninety percent good because we
(10:44):
were actually very compatible and we got along really well
in many different ways. But ten percent was very problematic.
Now people will say, well, no relationship is perfect. Yes,
although that ten percent was extremely significant. So that when
we got married, then the ten percent became the ninety percent,
and the ninety percent then became the ten percent. And
(11:05):
so people think. Another thing that people don't understand. They
think that, oh, the once we get married, everything will
be okay. No, no, no, no, your problems get mag get
magnified once you're married and so.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
And then once you have children, they magnify again, and
they magnify again.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
And this is from someone who's never been married or
ever have children. And I know this to be true.
Speaker 5 (11:27):
And you know, yeah, because I'm sure you have many
people in your life who are married with kids.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
And I'm psychic, and you're telling me when I look
at a couple of what's going on?
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Yeah, but no, it's true, it's true. But it's interesting.
I've never heard of put this way, the ten and
ninety flip.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
So that was and it's because of a lot of
different things, red flags that I didn't see and didn't understand,
Like we didn't have certain conversations that were incredibly important.
There were certain things that I weren't that I wasn't
saying because I was so afraid to.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Rock the boat.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
And about having children.
Speaker 5 (12:03):
Part of it was about having children. Part of it
was just about certain things that upset me in the relationship,
things that you just need to talk about, you know,
you need to sit down and have a conversation about.
But I you know, there was a very and I
write about in the book, there was a very significant
night that should have been a deal breaker for me,
or should have at least been a very serious conversation
(12:23):
that I sat down and had with him, But for me,
it was more just like, let me suppress how horrible
that felt, because I don't want to face the possibility
of this not being the one and this is that
is something that millions of people do.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And what was the incident? Can you tell us? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (12:42):
I mean I talk about it in the book, but
let me share about it a little bit here because
it's important. Like we went to this event in New
York City called Sleep No More.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I don't know if I've been there. Yeah, yeah, I
went there.
Speaker 5 (12:53):
So you know that when you're there, they put they
give you masks, and everyone have the same mask, and
then they separate you from who from whoever you went
there with. And he was on the way there, he
was acting weird, he was shut down. I had no
idea what was going on. That was something that was
very familiar from my father. My father would shut down
a lot, and then you would never know what his
(13:14):
mood would be.
Speaker 4 (13:15):
So I didn't.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
Realize because I had had, you know, my prior to him,
I'd had some really beautiful relationships where like the trauma
from my past was not ignited, but this one was right.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
So there's no What do you.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Think about that though?
Speaker 5 (13:30):
Like?
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Why is it?
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Sometimes? I mean, if the whole point of being here
is to learn and to.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Grow, Yeah, so when you're in a relationship that isn't
bringing something up, what's the point of that?
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Or maybe you're there for the other person.
Speaker 5 (13:42):
I don't think you should be in I don't think
that being in a relationship that is constantly triggering your
suffering and your past is a good relationship.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
I don't think that should be constant.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
I think if that's happening and two people are like, whoa,
this is what's happening, and then they can work on
it and keel together, that's wonderful And that's definitely a possibility.
Why in the past was I in a relationship that
wasn't reminiscent of my relationship my trauma with my father,
and then later, because context matters. It matters where you
(14:13):
are in your life, it matters how old you are,
what other stressors are in your life. Context matters.
Speaker 6 (14:20):
You know.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
It's like, you could be anxiously very anxious in one
relationship and not anxious in another, and part of that
has to do with who you're with. And it's like, oh, well,
why were you attracted to the person who treats you
like shit in one stage of your life but not
in another? But what was going on in that stage
of your life?
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, right right, okay, so back to sleep no more?
Speaker 5 (14:39):
So back to sleep no more? So he was acting weird.
I had no idea. I went to the familiar thing
of just sort of like, what's wrong, And then you
know he's saying nothing's wrong, and so I'm all anxious
as opposed to something. What I would do today is
maybe not in that moment, but I would have had
a conversation with him like something was definitely off. I
don't like how it feels. We need to talk about it,
(15:01):
because my standard is if you can't talk about what's
going on inside of you, we're not going to be
in a relationship. Maybe you know, I'm also sensitive to timing.
It's not going to be all in my timing that
we have the conversation. But if you can't have a
conversation about something that's bothering you and you're just going
to shut down, you don't have a chance with me.
(15:22):
Right But back then, all I could think was fear.
So we go to sleep no more and we're separated.
But there were many times throughout the course of the night.
You know, you recognize even with the mask, you know
who your partner is, you know what they're wearing, you
know their body. And when I would see him, I
would be like, oh, yes, now we're going to reunite,
(15:45):
and he would act like he didn't see me. And
then I don't know what was going on with him
that night, and it just sort of blew over and
I never addressed it again. And that was very very
significant because that was mean and it was very rejecting.
I mean, it was very weird. But it's not about him.
(16:08):
It's about me. It's about the fact that I.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Didn't say anything.
Speaker 5 (16:12):
It's about like, what was going on with me that
I was too afraid to bring this up. So it's
really I really want people to stop blaming the other
and to look within and be like, what's my pattern here?
Speaker 4 (16:22):
What is it? Get curious about yourself.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
So now, so you do a lot of couples counseling.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
So when I first embarked in on this journey of
helping people in their relationships, I worked with hundreds of
couples because when we when he and I went to
couple's therapy, was terrible, and I thought there has to
be another way.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Well, it was so bad about it.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
No one was holding anyone accountable.
Speaker 5 (16:47):
You know, when I work with people, and when I
consider a good therapist is someone who's holding you accountable
and being like, look, this is what's going on, and
really helping us understand what's underneath it all. But holding accountable.
It's not about like let me hold your hand and
let me hold.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
Your hand and play. I agree, you know.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
It can't be like you have to be compassionate, but
you also have to be you have to tell the truth, yes,
as a counselor coach therapist.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Otherwise it becomes a form of enabling.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
Yeah, and then no one's getting better. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
I don't understand that approach and I don't like it
because yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Yeah, so I thought there had to be another way,
and so I really wanted to help couples.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
And then I was.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
Like, well, you know, I really like working with individuals too,
people who are heartbroken because I was devastated and I
rebuilt my life, so I like helping people rebuild their
life after devastation. I liked working with I was like, Wow,
so much of this is who you pick. It's who
you choose, and so many people are choosing terrible partners
or try or going out into dating pool feeling desperate.
(17:45):
Choose me, pick me, pick me, pick me, Let me
help some individuals. So I like helping people sort of
like in every area and.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Journey in every area, but do you have rehiphip not
on every area, in every stage of where they are
in their relationship, Okay, And also helping people who are
really like looking for love.
Speaker 4 (18:04):
Oh yeah I love that. Yeah I love helping people
look for love.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yeah, well who wouldn't love that? Yeah that's spreading love?
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, absolutely wonderful. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, it's hard to when you're the way you're talking
about it just makes me think, you know, everywhere, every
person is in a different place on their quote unquote journey,
and some people aren't even on a fucking journey, you
know what I mean, they're just like whatever. So it's
like when people kind of cross paths. You know, I'm
not one of those people who thinks everything happens for
a reason, but I think many things do.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
And sometimes it really has nothing to do with.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
You, Like you're not the A character and every and
every story you're not you're the A character, and you're yeah,
sometimes you're here for other people.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
So I just always find it interesting where people cross
paths because it's like you also, like if two people
come together and there is no friction and there is
just like la la la la, la la la.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
That sounds suspicious too.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
You want to be unearthing, like you want to be
looking within and improving and without friction, and there's no
reason to do that absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:02):
And also what causes chemistry ignites chemistry between two people,
it's like differences and also whending nights chemistry between two people,
it's like, oh, you're your own person, and so am
I let's like rumble a little bit with this. But
to what degree? It should not be chaos? It should
not be chaos. If there's chaos, something's wrong.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Mm hmm, Okay, I just want to read a couple
more of these. Just less is not the same thing
as love. And also, like I think I wrote this
in my new book that something about you know, don't
confuse missing somebody, you.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Know, with belonging with someone.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, absolutely, right, Like those two things kind of sound familiar.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:42):
I mean I think so when we meet someone and
we're attracted, we can lose our minds a little bit,
you know, And that's oftentimes when we throw our standards
out the window and we think, oh, this person has
to be the person, and we think, oh, they are
the person, And a lot of people what they do
is they move really fast, They play house with each
other even though they're strangers. And again it's that feeling
(20:07):
of I would do anything for this person. This person's amazing.
And what we what a lot of people do is
unconsciously they put each other on pedestals. And what happens
is once reels starts to happen, So once the honeymoon
starts to once the novelty wears off.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
When is this usually let's discuss that.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
I think it's anywhere between three to six to three
to six months to a year, but usually three to
six six months once the novelty wears off and there
might be like, you know, an argument.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
I just want everyone to put it on. Put it
on the record that Doug just ran into the room
when you said three to six to nine months to
a year, because we are coming.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Up on a year, and that it's going to be
of owning him having him.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yes, yes, I don't consider him him. I don't consider
him to be owned by me.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
I guess him to be my partner. I get it
on sexual and romantic. I get it on romantic, let's
not be sexual about it. But yeah, but yes, okay,
because because I heard someone say something like two years,
I'm like, no one has to your honeymoon.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
Like yeah, yeah, I can't think but a year but
a year maybe, but like but you know, changes, so
you know, that's when the masks come off and we
kind of get real. And what happens is so this
ties into the one we meet someone we think they're amazing,
and what we're doing on an unconscious level is that
(21:34):
we're projecting our ideal onto them. Oh, they they're perfect partner,
they're perfect me, they're perfect for me, and then as
soon as reel comes up, you know, our flaws come up,
conflict comes up, things that are not so comfortable. Then
what a lot of people do, and I've done this too,
is like, oh wait, you're not who I thought you were,
Like you're not perfect again. They would never admit to
(21:57):
this because it's not so much like conscious, but it's
like you're not perfec Anyone who's on the pedestal ultimately
becomes the fallen hero, right, It's like you're gonna come
off because the realness is gonna come So you know,
once the novelty wears off, that's when you know if
you really have what it takes to make it with something.
Some people they are so addicted to that lusty high
because they don't understand the reality of what it is
(22:19):
to love someone. Yeah that really, it really is a choice,
and it's a verb, and it's a practice, and it's
an intentional practice, and it means you have to have
difficult conversations and it means you have to have a
lot of tolerance. I don't want you to tolerate bullshit,
but you have to know where your limits are. Because
no one is perfect. No one is perfect. We are
all very complicated, complex creatures with a lot of nuance.
(22:44):
And I think a lot of people, myself included, walk
this earth not knowing where their limits are for what
is t They're either expecting perfection or they're tolerating a
little too much.
Speaker 7 (22:57):
Sense.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Before we take a break, I just want to ask
you one life question back to sleep No More. Did
you ever finally bring that up to him at the
end of the relationship or is that something you discovered
through therapy to that night that was a red flag.
Speaker 4 (23:09):
I didn't discover it through therapy.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
I discovered on my own, in my own self reflection,
And no, I never brought it up to him, And
I think it was just the sort of cathartic writing about it.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
Yeah, Okay, we're going to take a break and we'll
be right back with Gillian Tareki.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
And we're back with Jillian. Okay, So we have some callers,
we have some letters. What do we have?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Well, we'll start with our callers today.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
It's always exciting. I love taking callers. Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 8 (23:39):
So.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Dusty is an interesting situation because he had written in
about a recent X about a year ago and followed
up with him recently, and he has a question about
that X. But he's somebody who's really taking a responsibility
for himself and his actions. And you'll hear a little
bit about that in the email.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
So did we already answer a question from him before?
Speaker 7 (23:59):
No?
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Oh huh, I had just like seen his previous question. Okay,
So he says, Dear Chelsea, to begin, I want to
tell you how much fun I've had listening to your podcast.
I followed you Chelsea since I first tuned into Chelsea
Lately in junior high. I'm newly sober and just celebrated
six months of sobriety. I left my previous relationship just
over a year ago. It was hot, heavy, fast, and
(24:20):
I was still an absolute mess for the entirety of it.
Things ended up going south for us. I've taken accountability
for the things I had done while with him, and
as he has done the same in return. He and
I have a great relationship now as friends. We've been
in communication daily and he's a major source of support
for me since moving halfway across the country and getting
sober and working the program, and now I find myself
(24:40):
leaps ahead of where I was in terms of confidence
self awareness, honesty with myself and others, and my ability
to put myself out there again. I've started dating again,
and this is where things seem to be a little
confusing for me. As friends do we chat about dating. However,
he started asking very intimate questions about my sex life
and wanting to know what was happening with my dates
when look as a friend, I know what it's like
(25:02):
to be curious, supportive, and excited for friends when they're
going out and having fun, hot, horny times after a
long hiatus, but it obviously feels different when it's coming
from someone used to wear a ring for So my
question is how do I find balance and what to
share and what not to share. I feel turned off
by the level of curiosity he seems to be having,
and I can also tell when he's trying too hard
(25:23):
to appear unbothered.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
Help Dusty.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Hi, Dusty, Hi, Dusty Bye. This is our special guest today,
Jilly and Tareki. She just wrote a book about love.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
How are you.
Speaker 7 (25:35):
Hi.
Speaker 4 (25:35):
Nice to meet you, so nice to meet too.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Congratulations on your six months sobriety Mark. That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (25:40):
Yeah, Dusty, Dusty, I.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Said, congratulations on your six months sobriety, Mark, I thought
you were saying, oh, call him okay, Mark, Dusty. Yeah,
well this has got that no, keep it in. I
think I think that's good.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
How are you doing well? Thank you?
Speaker 1 (26:00):
Sounds like do you feel like he still has feelings
for you?
Speaker 8 (26:03):
So that was kind of my thought initially. So I
this whole time, I just started dating again, probably I
don't know, a month and a half ago now, so,
and he and I broke up over a year ago now,
so I guess like we hadn't talked about that. Like
I said, we talk all the time. So whenever I
(26:23):
did start seeing someone or I was going on dates
and this and that, the way he responded it just
like his voice got really high pitched and like he
just seemed like overly excited, and I just felt like
it was disingenuine. So I was like, it made me
feel awkward because I felt like he felt awkward.
Speaker 6 (26:44):
Yeah, and he was trying to be supportive.
Speaker 8 (26:46):
And I just was like, oh, maybe this isn't actually
that great.
Speaker 6 (26:51):
So does that make sense?
Speaker 4 (26:53):
Yeah, I actually have a question for you. So, congratulations
on sobriety.
Speaker 6 (26:57):
Thanks, thank you?
Speaker 4 (26:58):
Are you are you your yes? Yeah, exactly. Are you
in a program. Are you in AA or anything like that? Yes, okay, Okay,
I have.
Speaker 6 (27:06):
A sponsor and I'm working a program.
Speaker 5 (27:08):
And what does your sponsors say about dating only five
to six months into sobriety.
Speaker 8 (27:14):
So the group that I'm in is pretty lucy goosey
about it, Okay. I would say it's kind of just
based on I think, like situational individual, person by person.
Speaker 6 (27:27):
Okay, there is kind of that blanket rule.
Speaker 8 (27:29):
Yeah, you probably know this of like don't date within
your first year. Yeah, but with my with my group,
it's not.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
It's not it's more individual, it's more individual.
Speaker 6 (27:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
And are you looking for what kind of partnership are
you looking for? Are you looking for long term partnership?
Are you looking like? What what do you want?
Speaker 8 (27:49):
So, because I am six months sober, everything does feel
very new. So right now what I'm looking for is
just I think to find myself figure it out, like in dating,
like I'm wanting to fill I think more comfortable with it.
I obviously would like to find somebody that I could
develop a long term relationship with, but I want to
(28:11):
enjoy the process.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
Of Yeah, So right now, that's.
Speaker 8 (28:14):
That's like number one is just enjoying who I meet
and seeing what happens.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
That's the attitude everyone should have when you day. That's
like perfect, it's like a renewal you get you know.
Speaker 8 (28:23):
Absolutely yeah, and it feels so new, you know, like
doing everything sober, sober dates, you know, blah blah blah,
but very different. So it's just it's I'm figuring it out.
Speaker 5 (28:33):
Yeah, So what's one thing. I'm sure there's a few things,
but if you were to like name one or two
things that you really want to do differently as a
sober person as it relates to.
Speaker 6 (28:43):
Dating, I realized that my.
Speaker 8 (28:47):
Like I used to fill up my cup kind of
with who I was with, yeah, solely, and kind of
lost my own kind of identity in the relationship. And
I had so many expectations I would attach myself well,
you know, I'd like cling on for dear life to
that person, and it was really unhealthy. And so now
I think, really it's just about finding myself.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
Can you ask the question again? I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
Yeah, no, you're doing great, great question.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
It's a very good question.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
So it's worth taking the time to like answer it
and think about it.
Speaker 5 (29:21):
Yeah, And I think you're I think you were really
you're onto something. I wanted to know what you wanted
to do. Differently as a sober person as it relates
to dating.
Speaker 8 (29:31):
It's kind of like a slogan. But I want to
have a relationship and not take a hostage. I think
would be like primary, like I want to have my
own identity outside of the relationship, have healthy attachment style,
healthy habits, and just like it's just my goal to
to enjoy it for I think, like how.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
How it is in like reality and in truth?
Speaker 8 (29:57):
And instead of like creating a like how do I explain,
like I wasn't prepared for follow up questions? No, I
instead of kind of creating a narrative of what I
think it should be in my head, I want to
enjoy it for what it is and it kind of
release control of how I used to try to maintain control.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
If that makes sense, It all makes sense. I think
that's beautiful.
Speaker 5 (30:20):
What are you doing in your life currently to bolster
up your sense of self so that you're not looking
for your for yourself only in another person?
Speaker 8 (30:32):
Well, I mean I think everything has changed in my life.
Number one would be, you know, I'm hitting meetings, I'm
working with my sponsor, and I'm working my program and
that is really the most important thing for me right now.
Speaker 6 (30:47):
That's unique to me.
Speaker 8 (30:49):
I've learned how to be a better friend to those
people I have in my life. So I feel like
really nice, like re getting to know like a couple
of these people who have been so close to me
for so long, and like I realized that there were
like some blocks between us that are kind of going
away or like we're kind of redefining our friendship now.
So I have other things, you know, Yoga is huge
(31:11):
for me. I started doing yoga every single day. I
fell in love with it.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Good for ye too. Yeah.
Speaker 8 (31:16):
So just stuff like that is kind of I think
what I'm doing for myself.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
But as it relates to the AX, which is the
original question, right, like what are you supposed to.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Do about his ex? It's the X, right, It's not
a new guy, right.
Speaker 6 (31:30):
It's the X. Yeah.
Speaker 8 (31:31):
So he was very supportive of me this whole past
what thirteen fourteen months since we broke up, he's been
He was really supportive for me in the beginning right
after the breakup, because I was so attached to him
that it was like, I don't even think I would
have been able to go a day without talking to him.
It was intense and I was having panic attacks all
(31:52):
the time. Wasn't sober yet. And with that, I do
feel like this sense of anytime I kind of want
to create a boundary or anything, or like have like
a conversation where it's just really honest, because we had
issues with honesty when we were together. It's part of
the reason why we're not together. But as a friend,
I think he's amazing. But I think whenever I try
(32:13):
to have like a boundary set in place, I struggle
with that, and I struggle.
Speaker 6 (32:18):
With in my head.
Speaker 8 (32:20):
It's like I want my friendships to be limitless and
like us not have like blocks with each other, like
have things we can't say to each other.
Speaker 6 (32:27):
I want it to be very open.
Speaker 8 (32:28):
But like with him in this situation, it does feel
like maybe a temporary boundary or something. But it's like
I have guilt whenever I do that. I'm kind of
rambling a lot here.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah, I know we're asking you a lot of questions,
asking you a lot of questions like an actual it's
like almost like we have like one therapy session. Yeah,
and I'm into it, So don't worry about it because
you have some like you've done so much for yourself
and you're so honest and so forthcoming. Very I mean,
I'm sitting watching an admiration of you, how much you've
done with your life and how self aware you've become.
(32:59):
That's really awesome. And I think everyone has trouble. I'm
just going to jump in here. Obviously Julianne interrupted me
when you see fit, but everyone has a hard time
creating boundaries. I totally have a hard time creating boundaries.
It's like I never even thought of it. It's like
a boundary, Oh I have to create Oh I forgot,
Like I never even knew I had to do that.
But when the opportunity arises to create one, that's your
(33:22):
opportunity to do it gently and with love and actually
attribute it to your own self work. All this work
I'm doing on myself, I'm learning that we actually don't
have a healthy boundary around this. So while this is
kind of strange to have to say to you, I
think for the betterment and the strength of our friendship,
like we're just not going to talk about dating for
(33:42):
a while, or you know, whatever you want to you know,
whatever time frame you want to build it around. But
I think if you guys have remained friends for this
period of time after that relationship and went through all
that stuff together, he's only going to respect you from
creating a bounce. Maybe not right in that moment, but
(34:02):
over time.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
He will respect that.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
Yeah, I would agree with that.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
And I think it's an opportunity for you to create
a new pattern, like with with not just him. You know,
you may have to create a boundary with the next
person you date or another person in your life. But
it's very good to understand how that's done and to
do it effectively, sober and with grace.
Speaker 5 (34:22):
Yeah, And it's okay that this is very uncomfortable, Like
you're learning something new, you're creating new patterns, and it
is going to be uncomfortable and it's going to feel
awkward and you're going to have a lot of resistance
to it, and that's part of the process. But it's also,
as you know, is so important, right, So, and you
(34:43):
can be really forthcoming about it and be like this
is really hard for me, but you know this, I
just is this is part of what I'm working on,
and this is what feels right for me.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Yeah, and as you said, you know, the pitch of
his voice went up, and he felt a little awkward,
like it might be a little bit of a relief
for him to not have have to go there with
you and like talk about those things specifically.
Speaker 6 (35:03):
So, oh my god, the questions he asked. I was like,
why would you ask me that?
Speaker 8 (35:08):
Like I was like, that's a lot, you know, yeah,
to be curious about anyway.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Okay, well I think you got the message right I did.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
I appreciate you guys so much.
Speaker 7 (35:20):
I appreciate you too.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Thank you. Does this room look cozy? I still have
to figure very cold good.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
I have to figure out we need a different plant.
This plant blocks the bookcase. So anyway, send us a plant. Okay,
thank you?
Speaker 6 (35:35):
Yeah, medium at work. That's about it.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
So we'll ask the next caller.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
All right, well thanks, thanks, otherwise known as Mark. So
didn't he seem like he was in great shape?
Speaker 1 (35:50):
He did.
Speaker 5 (35:51):
Yeah, but you sound you mean a great shape emotionally, yeah,
like very self aware, very like he's doing the work.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
He is really I respect that one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (36:03):
And he was very honest and he had a lot
of again awareness about what his pattern was. So yeah,
I'm and he's doing it. He's got the sponsor, he's
in the program, so that's great and I'm rooting for him.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
It really seemed like he's somebody who's taking a responsibility
for himself. Even looking at the email he sent a
year ago, was you know, which admittedly he wrote drunk
and he was like it was much more like sort
of finger point, whereas the eemail is all like I've
re taken I've taken responsibility for my stuff. And I
just thought he was such a cutie.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Yeah, such a cuty Yeah. Well, our next caller is Carly.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
She is thirty two, and this one sort of coincidentally
also has a sobriety theme, but really just a coincidence there.
I'd love to talk to her about some of her
online dating stuff as well. So she says, Dear Chelsea,
I'm thirty two, female and on the apps. Unfortunately I
can't drink for some low key medical reasons, but I
truly still enjoy going out to bars, parties, wineries, et cetera.
(36:55):
When a guy on the dating apps asks me out,
I always disclose that I can't drink. Something like that
sounds great, just so you know, I don't really drink,
but I still like to do drinks and go out
and I'm totally cool if you drink three times in
the last month. I've said this and the guy says, oh, yeah,
that's totally cool. Let's go on out on XT day.
Then XT day comes no confirmation of the date, and
(37:15):
they are radio silent when I reach out, and they
usually unmatch me the next day. I prefer to disclose this,
but many of my friends keep telling me not to.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (37:25):
How should I handle this? I feel like it's a
lie biomission to just show up on a date without
disclosing I can't drink, but these stupid men out here
seem incapable of understanding that I truly don't care if
they're drinking. Obviously, I'm not going to be hooking up
with a drunk man while sober. But can we not
even get out on the first date to see if
we're compatible at all?
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Carly?
Speaker 4 (37:43):
You know what I think? I think? Remove? I think, Hi, Carly, hy, how.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
Are you Carly great? Thanks for having me?
Speaker 5 (37:49):
Yeah, I think you should just remove drinking altogether from
the date. I think you should say, look, I don't
really drink and we do something else. I would love to,
like maybe go bowling or do this, or maybe meet
for coffee. I actually think that it's a problem that
so many people go on dates and drink. Is you
know what happens when people drink, They look at someone
they think, yeah, I'm attracted to them because it's the
(38:10):
alcohol talking.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
So I think I don't.
Speaker 5 (38:15):
I think you absolutely should say, you know, I don't drink,
and I kind of prefer to do something else.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
What do you think? Because that's actually going to.
Speaker 5 (38:24):
Any guy who's like not into that or disappears great,
let him because that is exactly not your guy.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
It's the one who's gonna be like cool.
Speaker 5 (38:35):
You know, I'm not really a big drinker either, and
I you know, would love to take you whatever, hiking, walking, coffee, breakfast, bowling,
whatever the hell it is, dancing, whatever it is.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
And so, yeah, what are your two cents?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
I don't know. I kind of disagree. Okay, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
You're making it like that you're only available, Like it
almost sounds like you'll you'll never be open to going
out for drinks. And she just said she's totally happy
going out for drinks because if someone says, I don't drink,
Can we do something else? I would take that to mean, oh,
that's what our whole thing is going to be. Like,
what if I want to go have a couple drinks
one night, You're not gonna sit with me. I understand
what you're saying, but I think for the purposes of
(39:14):
meeting people, I'm not saying you should lie and say
take out the drinking. But I don't think it's a
problem for you to go at like it's nice to
demonstrate that you can go somewhere, go out for drinks
with somebody and it's not an issue, you know what
I mean, Because then they know that, oh, she does
a drink, but that's fine, she's cool, she's fun. We
can go to a bar, we can hang out, we
can play pool, we can play darts. There's other things
that can happen there besides just sitting and drinking, you know. So,
(39:36):
I mean, I'm the guy that is breaking up with
you because you're sober, Like I'm if I went out
with a guy who didn't tell me they didn't drink,
I would be annoyed, Yeah, because I want to know that. Yeah,
of course you already know that, and it doesn't mean
that I wouldn't date somebody who didn't drink.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
I mean I don't. I don't think i've Yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (39:53):
Have that if they're leading with it, yeah, but with
a drinker. You don't want to be with a big drinker.
Speaker 1 (39:59):
Yeah, but I don't know.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
I think you are reading a lot of people out
because they might be like, oh, she's gonna be judgy,
or she's gonna be you know what I mean, Like
she might be sober. I mean maybe if you want
to write, even in adendum, like I'm not in AA,
I just don't really drink a lot or not a
big drink, not a big drinker. And that's it, like,
you know, make it look less in the blow just
because some people are fine as long as they know
(40:23):
you're cool, and some people are just don't want to
be like you.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
She was telling them, she was saying I'm cool, she
was saying, I don't drink, but I'm totally fine. But
then what they do is that they then they don't
show up.
Speaker 7 (40:33):
Yeah, and that's what they've been doing recently. And I'm
just like, tell me that it's not okay and I'm
cool or expect it unmatch me great, but don't plan
a date and then.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Ghostw What city are you in?
Speaker 7 (40:45):
I'm right outside Philadelphia in South Jersey.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
Oh okay, I thought you were going to say.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
I was like, if you're in LA, it shouldn't be
an issue because everyone's fucking sober here anyway.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 5 (40:55):
Maybe they're not. Maybe they're not falling through because it's
not that I don't know. Maybe it's because they just
they want to get hammered with you and have a
good time. Either way, they're not your guy. What's important
to you in terms of a partner and his relationship
with alcohol.
Speaker 7 (41:10):
For me personally, I just have like some you know,
low key medical issues where I tend to like pass
out and have a seizure if I have certain medications
or alcohol. Yes, so I've just you know, I'm thirty
two now, I've lived my whole life, college, scrap parties,
law school, everything, not drinking, being around people who drink.
All of my friends drink. It's never really been an
(41:31):
issue for me except in this like one sphere of data.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Right, I'm gonna say, I think you're labeling yourself, even
though she's saying I'm okay with drinking.
Speaker 1 (41:40):
I think it's so.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
Do you think she should not say anything? I just
don't think you should do it.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I don't think you should put.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Such an emphasis on drinking, just like you shouldn't put
such an emphasis on most things, like when you're not
before you meet someone, like have them, have the experience
of meeting them. Take out the drinking thing, I think,
and just and then see if that changes the amount
of men that you actually match with, and then see
if that changes the quality of men that you match with,
because maybe it will have the effect that Jillian is saying,
(42:07):
which is you, thank God you're rid of all those people.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Anyway. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (42:11):
Maybe there's a couple of people in there that aren't
big drinkers, that just are like, oh, I'm on a
first date. I want to have a cocktail like that.
That's kind of like a very regular thing for people
to do, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (42:23):
And Carly, would you tell us a little bit about
You mentioned some really interesting things to me about your
experience on the apps, like kind of guys you're getting
hooked up with.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Can you tell us a little bit about that?
Speaker 7 (42:34):
Yeah, on the apps recently, I've been having this issue
where like, even when I do go on a few
dates with people, I get a lot of feedback about
that I have my shit together too much and that
makes them insecure.
Speaker 1 (42:48):
After the date or before the date.
Speaker 7 (42:50):
After when I do go out and date, it's like,
you know, two or three dates with someone and they're like, oh,
you know, I'm not in a place in my life
right now, and they use it as an excuse and
they even I'm like, oh, you own a house, you like,
know what you're doing with your life. And I'm still
trying to figure my life out at like thirty nine
years old, which is fine, everyone's in different areas. But
(43:11):
that's just kind of like something I've been getting a
lot recently.
Speaker 2 (43:14):
That you definitely don't want to diminish the fact that you.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
Have your shit together.
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 7 (43:20):
There's a little shit I could still figure out.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
So that's something that you don't want to start hiding
from men because you know, absolutely not exactly. I think
it's great that you have your shit together at thirty two,
and you know, it's amazing people until like thirty five ish,
I think to get their shit together. Yeah, thirty five
to forty anyway, Yeah, and beyond.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
But yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
That would be my advice just to remove that. Don't
put such an emphasis on it. Just you know, you're
open to whatever you can suggest. Always going to coffee. Also,
we're going for a walk. In your book, you talk
about what a co regulating experience walking is. Yeah, that's
the first time I've read that. I mean, I know
it to be true, coregulated, but.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Yeah, is it right?
Speaker 2 (43:58):
That's actually an It sounds kind of like a corny
thing to do on a date. I mean, I wouldn't
go for a walk with someone on a date. I
did it once and that's why I'll never do it again.
But it is actually a really good activity for two
people to do together.
Speaker 4 (44:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:14):
And you know what's something that I'll leave you with
is this. Sometimes the people who do have their quote
unquote shit together and are not You're they're not hookup material,
their wife material like, and I say that meaning like
they're not the person who you're just You're not they're
not just gonna like have a good time with you
and get wasted and go to bed together like you're
(44:36):
someone actually to be taken seriously. For many different reasons.
Sometimes those women they do have to wait a little
bit longer for the right per especially around your age group.
But don't let that discourage you. Never, as Chelsea said,
never diminish all that you've accomplished and that you have
your shit together, like you have to that you have
to be loud and proud about that.
Speaker 7 (44:57):
Okay, I'll try.
Speaker 4 (44:59):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
I love that, Jillian. Yeah, yeah, you are somebody they
bring home to mom.
Speaker 4 (45:04):
Yeah, yeah, you are. And that's a good thing and
that's a lovely thing.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
And also enjoy the process of all of this, Like
I know it may seem frustrating right now, but like
you'll never get this time back again.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
You know, you're thirty two, you're.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Single, you're on apps, Like, look at that as fun
and adventurous instead of the disappointment that comes with it.
There's also all these other fun, flirty things. Sometimes you
flirt with people that you never even go on a
date with. Yeah, and it's fun for like five days
or two weeks, and it never comes to fruition. But
like who cares, you know what I mean, it doesn't
fucking matter. It's like, enjoy all of this that's happening,
(45:38):
because you're never gonna be thirty two again, and you
might not be You might meet somebody, get married and
have kids and be like, God, I wish I went
on some more dates, you know what I mean?
Speaker 7 (45:46):
Well, I have been to more countries than days this year,
So I guess that's perfect.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
That's a good attitude too. I love that.
Speaker 5 (45:53):
Yeah, So you're a very interesting girl. You're a very
interesting woman, so you need you need an interesting guy.
And so anyone who's just like gonna be like, well,
she won't get wasted with me.
Speaker 4 (46:01):
That's not your guy.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
No, but do you have any plants that you can say,
because we need to put a plant in this area
that isn't this tall that just like kind of comes
up here and it's a little bit. I would keep
asking our callers, but our last caller he was not helpful.
Speaker 7 (46:15):
I kill all plants. I just got flowers and at
the farmers market and they're dead already, so I don't
I can keep dogs alive, but not plants.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
She does have an enormous black.
Speaker 4 (46:25):
Dog, just like you.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
I mean, I don't need her to keep my dog alive.
I mean, you keep your dog alive, and I'll try
to keep mine alive. But I guess we can call
this episode no plants for us.
Speaker 1 (46:36):
Okay, Well does that help you at all? Are you?
Speaker 7 (46:39):
Thank you?
Speaker 1 (46:39):
Okay, thanks, thanks for calling in.
Speaker 7 (46:43):
Bye bye, Jillan.
Speaker 3 (46:44):
Do you have advice for people who are on the
apps and are just like suffering.
Speaker 4 (46:49):
Advice?
Speaker 5 (46:50):
Well, I think there's a few things. One is that
really shouldn't don't depend it's designed to make you very dependent.
Don't depend on them entirely. Like actually, go out, meet people,
expand your circle, have fun, live your life to the fullest.
Don't get so obsessive about it. Expand your zip code.
That's important because also if you're in a big city
usually that can be more difficult. So go like to
(47:12):
the periphery. Maybe you have to drive thirty minutes, maybe
you have to dry.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
In an hour.
Speaker 4 (47:15):
I think it's worth it.
Speaker 5 (47:17):
And don't be having a million different texting exchanging exchanges
with lots of different people, Like focus on one person
at a time, honestly, and meet the person, whether it's
like through a FaceTime or zoom or in person quickly.
Because what I've been seeing a lot lately is that,
oh my god, I've been texting with this person. It's
been like two months but we haven't met, and it
(47:39):
creates this really weird false sense of intimacy. So just
like if you are in it because you want a relationship,
then you have to have discipline not to always be
on it. You have to have some clear standards and
also have some pictures of you where you're like smiling
and it's not just like a poe with all this makeup,
(48:01):
especially for women. And yeah, those are just my quick tips.
Speaker 1 (48:04):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (48:06):
Well, maybe let's take a break and we'll come back
with a quick question, A quicker question.
Speaker 2 (48:11):
Okay, we'll take a break and we'll be right back,
and we're back with Gilly and Tareki.
Speaker 3 (48:19):
And actually, before we're back, we can lose our headphones.
Speaker 1 (48:22):
I like my headphones. We feel it make me feel secure.
I know, what do you got?
Speaker 3 (48:27):
I've got either my boyfriend has a lot of female
friends or.
Speaker 4 (48:33):
My ex lover died.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
Oh what do you think?
Speaker 4 (48:38):
I think the ex lover died?
Speaker 3 (48:39):
Ex lover died?
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Okay?
Speaker 6 (48:40):
What is okay?
Speaker 8 (48:41):
Sure?
Speaker 1 (48:42):
I'm open?
Speaker 3 (48:42):
Okay, So, Tricia writes, Dear Chelsea, I just found out
that my former lover, with whom I was in an
extramarital relationship, died, a year ago. We were lovers undercover
for ten years, and I loved him. I was very
close to his wife. I know it's gross. She found
out about us because of a drunk email I sent
(49:04):
years ago when the guilt got the best of me,
admitting to our relationship.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
I'mother great advertisement for alcohol.
Speaker 4 (49:12):
Skewing that way today.
Speaker 3 (49:14):
I'm since widowed and have only had two exchanges via
LinkedIn with him since we broke up. But I started
to write her how sorry I was for her loss
and of course the damage I caused. But now I'm
rethinking writing her. Should I reach out? What say you, thanks, Trisha?
Speaker 1 (49:30):
No, no, do not no reason to leave her alone.
Let her grieve. Yeah, and you can do your grieving
by yourself.
Speaker 4 (49:38):
And she lost her her husband, so she's a grieving both. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:42):
Yeah, yeah, never mind her.
Speaker 4 (49:43):
Yeah, that's a big no.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Okay, I'm glad we're in agreement.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
Yeah, we do have probably time for that last other
quick we want to do?
Speaker 5 (49:51):
Sure?
Speaker 3 (49:52):
Okay, great, So, Susannah says dear Chelsea. I'm in a
new relationship where I feel secure for the most part.
My one hang up with him is that he has
a lot of female friends that he regularly talks to
and hangs out with, both single and married alike. Obviously,
I know I can't tell him who to be friends with,
but I just cannot relate at all. Because I don't
(50:12):
have any single straight men that I'm regularly talking to
and hanging out with. It feels like it could quickly become.
Speaker 4 (50:19):
A slippery slope.
Speaker 3 (50:21):
I have not brought this up to him yet because
I think it could easily be misconstrued as me being
the jealous type or acting like the crazy girlfriend. I
trust him, and I don't want to unnecessarily rock the
boat of an otherwise great thing. He's been single for
a long time, over a decade, so perhaps he doesn't
even realize that it might make me uncomfortable since he's
not used to having to consider someone else's feelings. My
(50:41):
question is is it worth bringing up since it makes
me feel uneasy or will it just naturally fade out
over time now that he isn't single? Is it totally
fine to be in a relationship and have a bunch
of single friends of the opposite sex? Basically, is this
a valid concern or am I just insecure? Susannah?
Speaker 4 (50:57):
How long have they been together? I forgot that.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
Let's see, it's just this new relationship. I don't think
we have a timeline.
Speaker 1 (51:04):
Would you like to answer this first? Would you like
to go first?
Speaker 5 (51:08):
I think that it's important when you're trying to foster
a new relationship, certain other relationships might have to change.
I also think that if you're gonna have a lot
of friendships, female friendships, and you're a straight man, you're
in a relationship with a woman, that she should be
(51:30):
introduced to these friends and included somewhat.
Speaker 6 (51:33):
You know.
Speaker 5 (51:34):
It really just and also depends does he have a
history with any of them? Has he hooked up with
any of them? Did he date any of them? Those
need boundaries around them, especially when you're trying to foster
like safety and trust in a new relationship.
Speaker 2 (51:48):
What do you think, Well, I think she hasn't even
broached the topic with him, and right now it doesn't
sound like it doesn't sound nefarious. It sounds like he
has a lot of friends that are girls, and I
think people should be confident.
Speaker 1 (52:00):
She said in the letter.
Speaker 2 (52:01):
I don't have I can't relate because I don't have
a lot of friends that are guys. Yeah, that's a
you problem, not a heat problem, Well I have. I'm
dating somebody who has lots of girlfriends.
Speaker 4 (52:11):
Uh huh.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
I have no issue with that whatsoever. I have lots
of guy friends. I mean most of them are gay,
but I have a lot of straight male friends. And
it's just not an issue because I'm confident and he's confident.
It's not a thing I don't think. I think if
their issues arise because of it, in addition to your
insecurity that is so far rooted in nothing, just her
(52:35):
own insecurity, if there were issues that were derived from
him in some one of these women, then yes it
becomes an issue. But right now it sounds like her issue,
not a him issue.
Speaker 7 (52:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (52:44):
I mean, look, the thing is I agree. I think
there's nuance. It's like, does he have these other friendships
and is he not is he not communicating with her
like when there.
Speaker 2 (52:52):
Should absolutely be free to meet all of them. Yeah,
be incorporated.
Speaker 4 (52:57):
I think there be integration. I think that's really important.
Speaker 1 (53:00):
Definitely.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (53:01):
So I think as long as there's integration and as
long as it's not like when there's where it gets messy.
It's like if they have a problem and he's going
to one of his female friends and he's not talking
to her, but that doesn't seem to be what's happening.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
But I do want to bring that up.
Speaker 5 (53:17):
Is something that does potentially happen in couples where it
absolutely can be a problem. Also, it can be a
problem with one of those friends as someone who like
a year ago, you were in a relationship with and
there isn't any like clear boundaries. But at the same time,
if it's just I do believe that there can be
friendship and that it absolutely could be just her insecurities
(53:37):
to your point, because I.
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Just don't think like you when you said I think
the first thing you said was like, you know, when
you're in a relationship, your other relationships have to change.
I actually I don't think that's true unless you have
some unhealthy relationships, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
Yes, it might mean like so like life.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
I mean also including the girl in your relationships, Yeah,
your girlfriend integration's really import I think where there needs
to be changed is like if you have if he
has a friendship with one of the women who's single,
and you know.
Speaker 5 (54:08):
She's the first person he texts in the morning and
they talk about everything, and they you know, they they
do their Saturday nights together when you have a relationship
that some of that relationship is going to have to change,
but other than that, no, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (54:25):
Okay, all right, well, thanks for writing in Susannah, and
thank you.
Speaker 1 (54:30):
To have a plant.
Speaker 4 (54:32):
I will email her now, Okay.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Okay, I like this. Okay, well everybody can order.
Speaker 2 (54:37):
It begins with you, the nine hard truth about love
that will change your life.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
Yes, thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (54:42):
Thank you for having me. It was so much fun.
Speaker 1 (54:44):
Yeah, good times.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
Okay, Well we'll see everybody or here everybody, or listen
to everybody or talk to everybody next week.
Speaker 6 (54:49):
Goodbye.
Speaker 3 (54:51):
If you'd like advice from Chelsea Shoots an email at
Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be sure
to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and
engineered by Brad Dickard executive producer Katherine law and be
sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot com
Hi, Catherine, Hi Chelsea, how are you Hi? I'm good.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I'm staying at a hotel in Los Angeles while I
record my audio book. I've been recording my audiobook for
the last two days. Today should be the last day
if you haven't pre ordered my book, I'll Have What
She's Having. It comes out February twenty fifth. And I
didn't smoke any weed or drink alcohol for three days
leading up to my audiobook recording so that I could
sound as crisp as possible. Because of so many of
(00:26):
my fans listen to my audio books, especially for my
last audiobook, so I really wanted to.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Deliver on that. That is real commitment, Chelsea, That is commitment.
I'm a professional.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Yeah, And you know what, I love listening to a
comedy like a book by a comedian read by the author.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Like that's the way to go for those, right right?
What else is happening? Updates? Updates? I'm moving back into
my house tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Oh, the Critics' Choice Awards are now February seventh, Friday night,
February seventh, so they've been moved to that date, so
I will be hosting those. And the fires are they
are almost contained.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I wouldn't say they are fully contained.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Yeah, I think they're mostly contained. It seems like they're
not threatening homes much anymore. They're not covering it on
the news at least, so not totally out. But now
it's sort of like moving into what do we do
now and rebuilding. Yeah, you know, something I heard from
several people that I think is really important to remember
is that, like, you know, we all give to our
(01:24):
gofundmes and friends and people, you know, and Red Cross
and all that good stuff. And I think people are
going to be realizing what they need a little bit
further down the line, like in a few months when
they start the rebuilding process or start to sort of
get life figured out, Like people may need more help
than so like check in, check in on folks.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Our guest today is a certified relationship coach, author, teacher,
and host of the podcast Jillian on Love. Her new
book It Begins with You The Nine Hard Truths about
Love that will Change Your Life. It's out now. Please
welcome Jillian to Reki. Jillian, Welcome, Welcome to Dear Chelsea.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I love books, all books, and then I love self
help books. Especially when I'm in the right mood and
I'm in the mood for self help. So your new book,
which is called It Begins with You, The Nine Hard
Truths about Love that will Change Your Life, is out now.
So the nine Hard Truths, I feel like some of
them are obvious truths, and then some of them aren't
(02:24):
so obvious.
Speaker 4 (02:24):
Would you agree with me? Yeah, I absolutely would.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
And which ones are not the obvious ones? In your opinion?
Speaker 5 (02:30):
It begins with you. I don't think is that obvious
to people. It might be obvious to people who actually
maybe do a lot of inner work, but I don't
think it's that obvious to people. And I think what's
not also not obvious is I don't know, the mind
is a battlefield. I mean, I think people also know that,
but don't really understand how that actually directly impacts.
Speaker 4 (02:51):
The quality of your relationships.
Speaker 5 (02:52):
Right that making peace with your parents might not be
so obvious, What do you think is not?
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I think making peace with your parents is not as obvious.
I think everyone realizes that that's necessary, even though I
do believe it tugs at everybody. You know, everyone has
their biggest problems or their parents, whether they know it
or not. And then the other one that is, no
one is coming to save you. Yeah, no one is
coming to save which is bad news. Yeah, yeah, it's
bad news, but it's important news for you to know.
Speaker 5 (03:19):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, no one is coming to save you.
I mean, you know, I think that I know for
me and everyone who I've worked with. It's not necessarily conscious,
but a lot of people will say, well, once I
meet that person, once I meet the one, then then yeah,
then I'll feel okay, Then things will be okay, then
(03:40):
my problems will go away. And even if they're not,
even on some intellectual level, they know that's not true.
There's so much emphasis on Stockham like this right person
and when this right person comes into your life, everything's
going to fall into place, and it's not true.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
But where did that begin?
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Do you think with romanticism?
Speaker 2 (04:00):
I mean it seems pretty obvious, but I'm like, who
started it?
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Like, you know, because.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
You know, like centuries ago, I don't think there was
this we roam we started as a modern age started
to romanticize things because if you were really like an
inca or someone who was like living on the land,
you're not going to be like I.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Have to meet the love of my life that trying
to get.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Fucking by no day know by you know, peeling potatoes
that hopefully you found exactly. So I guess it is
modern civilization that started to create and monetize it. Really
yea nassism, because I mean, I've heard from so we
hear so many people this idea. It's such a silly notion.
It's like Disneyland esque. It's so someone's gonna come and
(04:45):
you're a princess, and then when they see you, you
become the princess. But you don't have to evolve, change
or grow at all. It's just going to all be
okay once they get once they find you absolutely and
then what are they do? You realize how much power
that gives another person.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Also get yes, because if you give someone the power
to make you, if you think someone else is going
to make you happy, they also have the power to
make you miserable because you're putting all the emphasis on them.
It's all how they make you feel. And fulfillment is
an inside job. Like someone who comes into your life.
I really believe that the whole point of a relationship
(05:21):
is to make life a little bit easier and a
little bit better. There's no point in being a relationship
with someone that makes your life more difficult, and a
lot of people put up with that. But the reality
is is that you know, the real work begins once
you're in the relationship. And everyone thinks, well, once I
find that person, like that's actually you know, they think
that the work.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Is really find it, But well, the work with another
person happens once you find the relationship. But the work
you could be doing the work all the time on
yourself to prepare for a relationship, absolutely absolutely, which is
like you know, because right, so both things are true.
Speaker 5 (05:56):
Both things are true, but also you can do a
lot of work on yourself to prepare yourself for the relationship,
which I always think you should be preparing, But you're
never going to be fully prepared for what is going
to come up in you when you're actually in the relationship, because.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Then why would you even exist on earth if you
were here to have no problems.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Yeah, that's not a real thing. And I think that
people don't really understand. I know, I didn't really understand
what it means to actually to love that love is
a practice, love is a verb, Love.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
Isn't just a feeling.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
And I think that what's embedded in this whole notion
of the one in romanticism is that it's just this feeling,
and so it should be easy and this person should
just make me feel great and I should feel great
when I'm around them. When the reality is to be
in a relationship long term, you have to wake up
every day and make a choice to show up, to
make a choice to love this person, to make a
(06:48):
choice to communicate. And the more complicated you are, or
the more selfish you are, or the more ill equipped
you are to understand what it is to mean to
love someone, the more problems you're going to have in
a relationship.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
Yes, And I also think that when you are talking
about relationship and romanticizing that this ideology because I definitely
felt it growing up, like Oh, I'm going to meet
the one and we're going to have the greatest love
story of all time. And then I started to get
older and I'm like, wouldn't it be fun to have
a lot of love stories instead of just one and
putting all of your eggs into one basket. And the
(07:23):
way that our society, specifically America, I mean, I think
it's a global thing but it's very American to be like, oh,
there's so much emphasis on spending your life with another person.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
That's a really long time.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Longer.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
They say, if you can live through the next twelve
or fifteen years, you can live until you're one hundred
and twenty. I already talked about how I don't want that,
and you can't afford that, and what am.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I going to be doing stand up when I'm one
hundred and eighteen years old, Like fuck, I don't want that.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But because we're extending lives and everything, like it's just
of course, it's a beautiful idea and concept, but it's
the reality of it is just so silly. It's like, yeah,
one in I don't know. I don't know what the
stats are. Do you about how many couples make it
past fifty years and are happy?
Speaker 4 (08:15):
I don't love.
Speaker 5 (08:16):
I actually don't know the stats. But I think that
if you're going to be with someone for a really
long time, let's say, let's just say even over ten years,
twenty years, thirty years, you're going to have many relationships.
Within the same relationship, You're going to have many if
you're married to someone, it's going to be many marriages.
So these are not my words, but Esther prel will say,
you know, some people will have many different relationships with
(08:37):
different people, and some people will have many different relationships
with the same person. And I think that if you
want to commit to someone long term, then you have
to understand that fundamentally, that it is a choice. That
one thing that is absolutely guaranteed in life is that
nothing is permanent, right, constant We're in constant flux, and
(08:59):
there's constant change. So to love someone long term is
to be able to you have to be able to
accept that there's going to be change. And I think
fundamentally human beings that we really struggle with that.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, because changes, change sounds scarier than it sounds like
you're losing something.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
Yes, so many people, right, change they associate with grief.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Why do you have to change? That's a loss?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
Change can also like putting something away and getting something
else in return, doesn't mean you're losing anything. In fact,
it can mean quite the opposite, that are gaining. Absolutely,
so we have these it's like we've gotten this these
almost energies around these terms that have gotten completely out
of control. The one romanticism, you know, change, change, is good.
Speaker 4 (09:44):
You complete me?
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Yeah, yeah, you complete me? What a load of shit.
My dog completes me.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
My dog completes me too.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
Please come as close to it completing me as anybody
else has.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
So what's your situation. Are you married?
Speaker 5 (09:58):
No? So I was married, and the relations the marriage
was actually really really painful, and how it ended was
extremely painful.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
So let's talk about that story. Okay, yeah, that's pretty
That was hard to read. I can't imagine it. Yeah, okay,
I mean it's a good start to a book. Yeah, sure,
yeah gets you in.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
He gets you in because he hooks you. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
So when I started seeing him, I thought when we
got married, I was thirty eight, and I thought, well,
you know, I'm older, I'm wiser, I've been working with
people for so many years. I know what I'm doing.
But boy did I not know what I was doing.
And so when our relationship leading up to marriage, I
always say it was about ninety percent good because we
(10:44):
were actually very compatible and we got along really well
in many different ways. But ten percent was very problematic.
Now people will say, well, no relationship is perfect. Yes,
although that ten percent was extremely significant. So that when
we got married, then the ten percent became the ninety percent,
and the ninety percent then became the ten percent. And
(11:05):
so people think. Another thing that people don't understand. They
think that, oh, the once we get married, everything will
be okay. No, no, no, no, your problems get mag get
magnified once you're married and so.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
And then once you have children, they magnify again, and
they magnify again.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
And this is from someone who's never been married or
ever have children. And I know this to be true.
Speaker 5 (11:27):
And you know, yeah, because I'm sure you have many
people in your life who are married with kids.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
And I'm psychic, and you're telling me when I look
at a couple of what's going on?
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Yeah, but no, it's true, it's true. But it's interesting.
I've never heard of put this way, the ten and
ninety flip.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:42):
So that was and it's because of a lot of
different things, red flags that I didn't see and didn't understand,
Like we didn't have certain conversations that were incredibly important.
There were certain things that I weren't that I wasn't
saying because I was so afraid to.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Rock the boat.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
And about having children.
Speaker 5 (12:03):
Part of it was about having children. Part of it
was just about certain things that upset me in the relationship,
things that you just need to talk about, you know,
you need to sit down and have a conversation about.
But I you know, there was a very and I
write about in the book, there was a very significant
night that should have been a deal breaker for me,
or should have at least been a very serious conversation
(12:23):
that I sat down and had with him, But for me,
it was more just like, let me suppress how horrible
that felt, because I don't want to face the possibility
of this not being the one and this is that
is something that millions of people do.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
And what was the incident? Can you tell us? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (12:42):
I mean I talk about it in the book, but
let me share about it a little bit here because
it's important. Like we went to this event in New
York City called Sleep No More.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
I don't know if I've been there. Yeah, yeah, I
went there.
Speaker 5 (12:53):
So you know that when you're there, they put they
give you masks, and everyone have the same mask, and
then they separate you from who from whoever you went
there with. And he was on the way there, he
was acting weird, he was shut down. I had no
idea what was going on. That was something that was
very familiar from my father. My father would shut down
a lot, and then you would never know what his
(13:14):
mood would be.
Speaker 4 (13:15):
So I didn't.
Speaker 5 (13:16):
Realize because I had had, you know, my prior to him,
I'd had some really beautiful relationships where like the trauma
from my past was not ignited, but this one was right.
Speaker 4 (13:28):
So there's no What do you.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
Think about that though?
Speaker 5 (13:30):
Like?
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Why is it?
Speaker 1 (13:31):
Sometimes? I mean, if the whole point of being here
is to learn and to.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Grow, Yeah, so when you're in a relationship that isn't
bringing something up, what's the point of that?
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Or maybe you're there for the other person.
Speaker 5 (13:42):
I don't think you should be in I don't think
that being in a relationship that is constantly triggering your
suffering and your past is a good relationship.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
I don't think that should be constant.
Speaker 5 (13:50):
I think if that's happening and two people are like, whoa,
this is what's happening, and then they can work on
it and keel together, that's wonderful And that's definitely a possibility.
Why in the past was I in a relationship that
wasn't reminiscent of my relationship my trauma with my father,
and then later, because context matters. It matters where you
(14:13):
are in your life, it matters how old you are,
what other stressors are in your life. Context matters.
Speaker 6 (14:20):
You know.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
It's like, you could be anxiously very anxious in one
relationship and not anxious in another, and part of that
has to do with who you're with. And it's like, oh, well,
why were you attracted to the person who treats you
like shit in one stage of your life but not
in another? But what was going on in that stage
of your life?
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, right right, okay, so back to sleep no more?
Speaker 5 (14:39):
So back to sleep no more? So he was acting weird.
I had no idea. I went to the familiar thing
of just sort of like, what's wrong, And then you
know he's saying nothing's wrong, and so I'm all anxious
as opposed to something. What I would do today is
maybe not in that moment, but I would have had
a conversation with him like something was definitely off. I
don't like how it feels. We need to talk about it,
(15:01):
because my standard is if you can't talk about what's
going on inside of you, we're not going to be
in a relationship. Maybe you know, I'm also sensitive to timing.
It's not going to be all in my timing that
we have the conversation. But if you can't have a
conversation about something that's bothering you and you're just going
to shut down, you don't have a chance with me.
(15:22):
Right But back then, all I could think was fear.
So we go to sleep no more and we're separated.
But there were many times throughout the course of the night.
You know, you recognize even with the mask, you know
who your partner is, you know what they're wearing, you
know their body. And when I would see him, I
would be like, oh, yes, now we're going to reunite,
(15:45):
and he would act like he didn't see me. And
then I don't know what was going on with him
that night, and it just sort of blew over and
I never addressed it again. And that was very very
significant because that was mean and it was very rejecting.
I mean, it was very weird. But it's not about him.
(16:08):
It's about me. It's about the fact that I.
Speaker 4 (16:11):
Didn't say anything.
Speaker 5 (16:12):
It's about like, what was going on with me that
I was too afraid to bring this up. So it's
really I really want people to stop blaming the other
and to look within and be like, what's my pattern here?
Speaker 4 (16:22):
What is it? Get curious about yourself.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
So now, so you do a lot of couples counseling.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
So when I first embarked in on this journey of
helping people in their relationships, I worked with hundreds of
couples because when we when he and I went to
couple's therapy, was terrible, and I thought there has to
be another way.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Well, it was so bad about it.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
No one was holding anyone accountable.
Speaker 5 (16:47):
You know, when I work with people, and when I
consider a good therapist is someone who's holding you accountable
and being like, look, this is what's going on, and
really helping us understand what's underneath it all. But holding accountable.
It's not about like let me hold your hand and
let me hold.
Speaker 4 (17:02):
Your hand and play. I agree, you know.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
It can't be like you have to be compassionate, but
you also have to be you have to tell the truth, yes,
as a counselor coach therapist.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Otherwise it becomes a form of enabling.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
Yeah, and then no one's getting better. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
I don't understand that approach and I don't like it
because yeah.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Yeah, so I thought there had to be another way,
and so I really wanted to help couples.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
And then I was.
Speaker 5 (17:23):
Like, well, you know, I really like working with individuals too,
people who are heartbroken because I was devastated and I
rebuilt my life, so I like helping people rebuild their
life after devastation. I liked working with I was like, Wow,
so much of this is who you pick. It's who
you choose, and so many people are choosing terrible partners
or try or going out into dating pool feeling desperate.
(17:45):
Choose me, pick me, pick me, pick me, Let me
help some individuals. So I like helping people sort of
like in every area and.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Journey in every area, but do you have rehiphip not
on every area, in every stage of where they are
in their relationship, Okay, And also helping people who are
really like looking for love.
Speaker 4 (18:04):
Oh yeah I love that. Yeah I love helping people
look for love.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Yeah, well who wouldn't love that? Yeah that's spreading love?
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Yeah, absolutely wonderful. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
Yeah, it's hard to when you're the way you're talking
about it just makes me think, you know, everywhere, every
person is in a different place on their quote unquote journey,
and some people aren't even on a fucking journey, you
know what I mean, they're just like whatever. So it's
like when people kind of cross paths. You know, I'm
not one of those people who thinks everything happens for
a reason, but I think many things do.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
And sometimes it really has nothing to do with.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
You, Like you're not the A character and every and
every story you're not you're the A character, and you're yeah,
sometimes you're here for other people.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
So I just always find it interesting where people cross
paths because it's like you also, like if two people
come together and there is no friction and there is
just like la la la la, la la la.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
That sounds suspicious too.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
You want to be unearthing, like you want to be
looking within and improving and without friction, and there's no
reason to do that absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:02):
And also what causes chemistry ignites chemistry between two people,
it's like differences and also whending nights chemistry between two people,
it's like, oh, you're your own person, and so am
I let's like rumble a little bit with this. But
to what degree? It should not be chaos? It should
not be chaos. If there's chaos, something's wrong.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
Mm hmm, Okay, I just want to read a couple
more of these. Just less is not the same thing
as love. And also, like I think I wrote this
in my new book that something about you know, don't
confuse missing somebody, you.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Know, with belonging with someone.
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Yeah, absolutely, right, Like those two things kind of sound familiar.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:42):
I mean I think so when we meet someone and
we're attracted, we can lose our minds a little bit,
you know, And that's oftentimes when we throw our standards
out the window and we think, oh, this person has
to be the person, and we think, oh, they are
the person, And a lot of people what they do
is they move really fast, They play house with each
other even though they're strangers. And again it's that feeling
(20:07):
of I would do anything for this person. This person's amazing.
And what we what a lot of people do is
unconsciously they put each other on pedestals. And what happens
is once reels starts to happen, So once the honeymoon
starts to once the novelty wears off.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
When is this usually let's discuss that.
Speaker 5 (20:29):
I think it's anywhere between three to six to three
to six months to a year, but usually three to
six six months once the novelty wears off and there
might be like, you know, an argument.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
I just want everyone to put it on. Put it
on the record that Doug just ran into the room
when you said three to six to nine months to
a year, because we are coming.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
Up on a year, and that it's going to be
of owning him having him.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yes, yes, I don't consider him him. I don't consider
him to be owned by me.
Speaker 2 (20:59):
I guess him to be my partner. I get it
on sexual and romantic. I get it on romantic, let's
not be sexual about it. But yeah, but yes, okay,
because because I heard someone say something like two years,
I'm like, no one has to your honeymoon.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
Like yeah, yeah, I can't think but a year but
a year maybe, but like but you know, changes, so
you know, that's when the masks come off and we
kind of get real. And what happens is so this
ties into the one we meet someone we think they're amazing,
and what we're doing on an unconscious level is that
(21:34):
we're projecting our ideal onto them. Oh, they they're perfect partner,
they're perfect me, they're perfect for me, and then as
soon as reel comes up, you know, our flaws come up,
conflict comes up, things that are not so comfortable. Then
what a lot of people do, and I've done this too,
is like, oh wait, you're not who I thought you were,
Like you're not perfect again. They would never admit to
(21:57):
this because it's not so much like conscious, but it's
like you're not perfec Anyone who's on the pedestal ultimately
becomes the fallen hero, right, It's like you're gonna come
off because the realness is gonna come So you know,
once the novelty wears off, that's when you know if
you really have what it takes to make it with something.
Some people they are so addicted to that lusty high
because they don't understand the reality of what it is
(22:19):
to love someone. Yeah that really, it really is a choice,
and it's a verb, and it's a practice, and it's
an intentional practice, and it means you have to have
difficult conversations and it means you have to have a
lot of tolerance. I don't want you to tolerate bullshit,
but you have to know where your limits are. Because
no one is perfect. No one is perfect. We are
all very complicated, complex creatures with a lot of nuance.
(22:44):
And I think a lot of people, myself included, walk
this earth not knowing where their limits are for what
is t They're either expecting perfection or they're tolerating a
little too much.
Speaker 7 (22:57):
Sense.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Before we take a break, I just want to ask
you one life question back to sleep No More. Did
you ever finally bring that up to him at the
end of the relationship or is that something you discovered
through therapy to that night that was a red flag.
Speaker 4 (23:09):
I didn't discover it through therapy.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
I discovered on my own, in my own self reflection,
And no, I never brought it up to him, And
I think it was just the sort of cathartic writing about it.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
Yeah, Okay, we're going to take a break and we'll
be right back with Gillian Tareki.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
And we're back with Jillian. Okay, So we have some callers,
we have some letters. What do we have?
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Well, we'll start with our callers today.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
It's always exciting. I love taking callers. Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 8 (23:39):
So.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Dusty is an interesting situation because he had written in
about a recent X about a year ago and followed
up with him recently, and he has a question about
that X. But he's somebody who's really taking a responsibility
for himself and his actions. And you'll hear a little
bit about that in the email.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
So did we already answer a question from him before?
Speaker 7 (23:59):
No?
Speaker 3 (24:00):
Oh huh, I had just like seen his previous question. Okay,
So he says, Dear Chelsea, to begin, I want to
tell you how much fun I've had listening to your podcast.
I followed you Chelsea since I first tuned into Chelsea
Lately in junior high. I'm newly sober and just celebrated
six months of sobriety. I left my previous relationship just
over a year ago. It was hot, heavy, fast, and
(24:20):
I was still an absolute mess for the entirety of it.
Things ended up going south for us. I've taken accountability
for the things I had done while with him, and
as he has done the same in return. He and
I have a great relationship now as friends. We've been
in communication daily and he's a major source of support
for me since moving halfway across the country and getting
sober and working the program, and now I find myself
(24:40):
leaps ahead of where I was in terms of confidence
self awareness, honesty with myself and others, and my ability
to put myself out there again. I've started dating again,
and this is where things seem to be a little
confusing for me. As friends do we chat about dating. However,
he started asking very intimate questions about my sex life
and wanting to know what was happening with my dates
when look as a friend, I know what it's like
(25:02):
to be curious, supportive, and excited for friends when they're
going out and having fun, hot, horny times after a
long hiatus, but it obviously feels different when it's coming
from someone used to wear a ring for So my
question is how do I find balance and what to
share and what not to share. I feel turned off
by the level of curiosity he seems to be having,
and I can also tell when he's trying too hard
(25:23):
to appear unbothered.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
Help Dusty.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Hi, Dusty, Hi, Dusty Bye. This is our special guest today,
Jilly and Tareki. She just wrote a book about love.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
How are you.
Speaker 7 (25:35):
Hi.
Speaker 4 (25:35):
Nice to meet you, so nice to meet too.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Congratulations on your six months sobriety Mark. That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (25:40):
Yeah, Dusty, Dusty, I.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Said, congratulations on your six months sobriety, Mark, I thought
you were saying, oh, call him okay, Mark, Dusty. Yeah,
well this has got that no, keep it in. I
think I think that's good.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
How are you doing well? Thank you?
Speaker 1 (26:00):
Sounds like do you feel like he still has feelings
for you?
Speaker 8 (26:03):
So that was kind of my thought initially. So I
this whole time, I just started dating again, probably I
don't know, a month and a half ago now, so,
and he and I broke up over a year ago now,
so I guess like we hadn't talked about that. Like
I said, we talk all the time. So whenever I
(26:23):
did start seeing someone or I was going on dates
and this and that, the way he responded it just
like his voice got really high pitched and like he
just seemed like overly excited, and I just felt like
it was disingenuine. So I was like, it made me
feel awkward because I felt like he felt awkward.
Speaker 6 (26:44):
Yeah, and he was trying to be supportive.
Speaker 8 (26:46):
And I just was like, oh, maybe this isn't actually
that great.
Speaker 6 (26:51):
So does that make sense?
Speaker 4 (26:53):
Yeah, I actually have a question for you. So, congratulations
on sobriety.
Speaker 6 (26:57):
Thanks, thank you?
Speaker 4 (26:58):
Are you are you your yes? Yeah, exactly. Are you
in a program. Are you in AA or anything like that? Yes, okay, Okay,
I have.
Speaker 6 (27:06):
A sponsor and I'm working a program.
Speaker 5 (27:08):
And what does your sponsors say about dating only five
to six months into sobriety.
Speaker 8 (27:14):
So the group that I'm in is pretty lucy goosey
about it, Okay. I would say it's kind of just
based on I think, like situational individual, person by person.
Speaker 6 (27:27):
Okay, there is kind of that blanket rule.
Speaker 8 (27:29):
Yeah, you probably know this of like don't date within
your first year. Yeah, but with my with my group,
it's not.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
It's not it's more individual, it's more individual.
Speaker 6 (27:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
And are you looking for what kind of partnership are
you looking for? Are you looking for long term partnership?
Are you looking like? What what do you want?
Speaker 8 (27:49):
So, because I am six months sober, everything does feel
very new. So right now what I'm looking for is
just I think to find myself figure it out, like in dating,
like I'm wanting to fill I think more comfortable with it.
I obviously would like to find somebody that I could
develop a long term relationship with, but I want to
(28:11):
enjoy the process.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
Of Yeah, So right now, that's.
Speaker 8 (28:14):
That's like number one is just enjoying who I meet
and seeing what happens.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
That's the attitude everyone should have when you day. That's
like perfect, it's like a renewal you get you know.
Speaker 8 (28:23):
Absolutely yeah, and it feels so new, you know, like
doing everything sober, sober dates, you know, blah blah blah,
but very different. So it's just it's I'm figuring it out.
Speaker 5 (28:33):
Yeah, So what's one thing. I'm sure there's a few things,
but if you were to like name one or two
things that you really want to do differently as a
sober person as it relates to.
Speaker 6 (28:43):
Dating, I realized that my.
Speaker 8 (28:47):
Like I used to fill up my cup kind of
with who I was with, yeah, solely, and kind of
lost my own kind of identity in the relationship. And
I had so many expectations I would attach myself well,
you know, I'd like cling on for dear life to
that person, and it was really unhealthy. And so now
I think, really it's just about finding myself.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
Can you ask the question again? I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
Yeah, no, you're doing great, great question.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
It's a very good question.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
So it's worth taking the time to like answer it
and think about it.
Speaker 5 (29:21):
Yeah, And I think you're I think you were really
you're onto something. I wanted to know what you wanted
to do. Differently as a sober person as it relates
to dating.
Speaker 8 (29:31):
It's kind of like a slogan. But I want to
have a relationship and not take a hostage. I think
would be like primary, like I want to have my
own identity outside of the relationship, have healthy attachment style,
healthy habits, and just like it's just my goal to
to enjoy it for I think, like how.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
How it is in like reality and in truth?
Speaker 8 (29:57):
And instead of like creating a like how do I explain,
like I wasn't prepared for follow up questions? No, I
instead of kind of creating a narrative of what I
think it should be in my head, I want to
enjoy it for what it is and it kind of
release control of how I used to try to maintain control.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
If that makes sense, It all makes sense. I think
that's beautiful.
Speaker 5 (30:20):
What are you doing in your life currently to bolster
up your sense of self so that you're not looking
for your for yourself only in another person?
Speaker 8 (30:32):
Well, I mean I think everything has changed in my life.
Number one would be, you know, I'm hitting meetings, I'm
working with my sponsor, and I'm working my program and
that is really the most important thing for me right now.
Speaker 6 (30:47):
That's unique to me.
Speaker 8 (30:49):
I've learned how to be a better friend to those
people I have in my life. So I feel like
really nice, like re getting to know like a couple
of these people who have been so close to me
for so long, and like I realized that there were
like some blocks between us that are kind of going
away or like we're kind of redefining our friendship now.
So I have other things, you know, Yoga is huge
(31:11):
for me. I started doing yoga every single day. I
fell in love with it.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Good for ye too. Yeah.
Speaker 8 (31:16):
So just stuff like that is kind of I think
what I'm doing for myself.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
But as it relates to the AX, which is the
original question, right, like what are you supposed to.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Do about his ex? It's the X, right, It's not
a new guy, right.
Speaker 6 (31:30):
It's the X. Yeah.
Speaker 8 (31:31):
So he was very supportive of me this whole past
what thirteen fourteen months since we broke up, he's been
He was really supportive for me in the beginning right
after the breakup, because I was so attached to him
that it was like, I don't even think I would
have been able to go a day without talking to him.
It was intense and I was having panic attacks all
(31:52):
the time. Wasn't sober yet. And with that, I do
feel like this sense of anytime I kind of want
to create a boundary or anything, or like have like
a conversation where it's just really honest, because we had
issues with honesty when we were together. It's part of
the reason why we're not together. But as a friend,
I think he's amazing. But I think whenever I try
(32:13):
to have like a boundary set in place, I struggle
with that, and I struggle.
Speaker 6 (32:18):
With in my head.
Speaker 8 (32:20):
It's like I want my friendships to be limitless and
like us not have like blocks with each other, like
have things we can't say to each other.
Speaker 6 (32:27):
I want it to be very open.
Speaker 8 (32:28):
But like with him in this situation, it does feel
like maybe a temporary boundary or something. But it's like
I have guilt whenever I do that. I'm kind of
rambling a lot here.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah, I know we're asking you a lot of questions,
asking you a lot of questions like an actual it's
like almost like we have like one therapy session. Yeah,
and I'm into it, So don't worry about it because
you have some like you've done so much for yourself
and you're so honest and so forthcoming. Very I mean,
I'm sitting watching an admiration of you, how much you've
done with your life and how self aware you've become.
(32:59):
That's really awesome. And I think everyone has trouble. I'm
just going to jump in here. Obviously Julianne interrupted me
when you see fit, but everyone has a hard time
creating boundaries. I totally have a hard time creating boundaries.
It's like I never even thought of it. It's like
a boundary, Oh I have to create Oh I forgot,
Like I never even knew I had to do that.
But when the opportunity arises to create one, that's your
(33:22):
opportunity to do it gently and with love and actually
attribute it to your own self work. All this work
I'm doing on myself, I'm learning that we actually don't
have a healthy boundary around this. So while this is
kind of strange to have to say to you, I
think for the betterment and the strength of our friendship,
like we're just not going to talk about dating for
(33:42):
a while, or you know, whatever you want to you know,
whatever time frame you want to build it around. But
I think if you guys have remained friends for this
period of time after that relationship and went through all
that stuff together, he's only going to respect you from
creating a bounce. Maybe not right in that moment, but
(34:02):
over time.
Speaker 1 (34:03):
He will respect that.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
Yeah, I would agree with that.
Speaker 2 (34:07):
And I think it's an opportunity for you to create
a new pattern, like with with not just him. You know,
you may have to create a boundary with the next
person you date or another person in your life. But
it's very good to understand how that's done and to
do it effectively, sober and with grace.
Speaker 5 (34:22):
Yeah, And it's okay that this is very uncomfortable, Like
you're learning something new, you're creating new patterns, and it
is going to be uncomfortable and it's going to feel
awkward and you're going to have a lot of resistance
to it, and that's part of the process. But it's also,
as you know, is so important, right, So, and you
(34:43):
can be really forthcoming about it and be like this
is really hard for me, but you know this, I
just is this is part of what I'm working on,
and this is what feels right for me.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
Yeah, and as you said, you know, the pitch of
his voice went up, and he felt a little awkward,
like it might be a little bit of a relief
for him to not have have to go there with
you and like talk about those things specifically.
Speaker 6 (35:03):
So, oh my god, the questions he asked. I was like,
why would you ask me that?
Speaker 8 (35:08):
Like I was like, that's a lot, you know, yeah,
to be curious about anyway.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Okay, well I think you got the message right I did.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
I appreciate you guys so much.
Speaker 7 (35:20):
I appreciate you too.
Speaker 1 (35:22):
Thank you. Does this room look cozy? I still have
to figure very cold good.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
I have to figure out we need a different plant.
This plant blocks the bookcase. So anyway, send us a plant. Okay,
thank you?
Speaker 6 (35:35):
Yeah, medium at work. That's about it.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
So we'll ask the next caller.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
All right, well thanks, thanks, otherwise known as Mark. So
didn't he seem like he was in great shape?
Speaker 1 (35:50):
He did.
Speaker 5 (35:51):
Yeah, but you sound you mean a great shape emotionally, yeah,
like very self aware, very like he's doing the work.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
He is really I respect that one hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (36:03):
And he was very honest and he had a lot
of again awareness about what his pattern was. So yeah,
I'm and he's doing it. He's got the sponsor, he's
in the program, so that's great and I'm rooting for him.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
It really seemed like he's somebody who's taking a responsibility
for himself. Even looking at the email he sent a
year ago, was you know, which admittedly he wrote drunk
and he was like it was much more like sort
of finger point, whereas the eemail is all like I've
re taken I've taken responsibility for my stuff. And I
just thought he was such a cutie.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Yeah, such a cuty Yeah. Well, our next caller is Carly.
Speaker 3 (36:34):
She is thirty two, and this one sort of coincidentally
also has a sobriety theme, but really just a coincidence there.
I'd love to talk to her about some of her
online dating stuff as well. So she says, Dear Chelsea,
I'm thirty two, female and on the apps. Unfortunately I
can't drink for some low key medical reasons, but I
truly still enjoy going out to bars, parties, wineries, et cetera.
(36:55):
When a guy on the dating apps asks me out,
I always disclose that I can't drink. Something like that
sounds great, just so you know, I don't really drink,
but I still like to do drinks and go out
and I'm totally cool if you drink three times in
the last month. I've said this and the guy says, oh, yeah,
that's totally cool. Let's go on out on XT day.
Then XT day comes no confirmation of the date, and
(37:15):
they are radio silent when I reach out, and they
usually unmatch me the next day. I prefer to disclose this,
but many of my friends keep telling me not to.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
What do you think?
Speaker 3 (37:25):
How should I handle this? I feel like it's a
lie biomission to just show up on a date without
disclosing I can't drink, but these stupid men out here
seem incapable of understanding that I truly don't care if
they're drinking. Obviously, I'm not going to be hooking up
with a drunk man while sober. But can we not
even get out on the first date to see if
we're compatible at all?
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Carly?
Speaker 4 (37:43):
You know what I think? I think? Remove? I think, Hi, Carly, hy, how.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
Are you Carly great? Thanks for having me?
Speaker 5 (37:49):
Yeah, I think you should just remove drinking altogether from
the date. I think you should say, look, I don't
really drink and we do something else. I would love to,
like maybe go bowling or do this, or maybe meet
for coffee. I actually think that it's a problem that
so many people go on dates and drink. Is you
know what happens when people drink, They look at someone
they think, yeah, I'm attracted to them because it's the
(38:10):
alcohol talking.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
So I think I don't.
Speaker 5 (38:15):
I think you absolutely should say, you know, I don't drink,
and I kind of prefer to do something else.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
What do you think? Because that's actually going to.
Speaker 5 (38:24):
Any guy who's like not into that or disappears great,
let him because that is exactly not your guy.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
It's the one who's gonna be like cool.
Speaker 5 (38:35):
You know, I'm not really a big drinker either, and
I you know, would love to take you whatever, hiking, walking, coffee, breakfast, bowling,
whatever the hell it is, dancing, whatever it is.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
And so, yeah, what are your two cents?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
I don't know. I kind of disagree. Okay, I feel like.
Speaker 2 (38:52):
You're making it like that you're only available, Like it
almost sounds like you'll you'll never be open to going
out for drinks. And she just said she's totally happy
going out for drinks because if someone says, I don't drink,
Can we do something else? I would take that to mean, oh,
that's what our whole thing is going to be. Like,
what if I want to go have a couple drinks
one night, You're not gonna sit with me. I understand
what you're saying, but I think for the purposes of
(39:14):
meeting people, I'm not saying you should lie and say
take out the drinking. But I don't think it's a
problem for you to go at like it's nice to
demonstrate that you can go somewhere, go out for drinks
with somebody and it's not an issue, you know what
I mean, Because then they know that, oh, she does
a drink, but that's fine, she's cool, she's fun. We
can go to a bar, we can hang out, we
can play pool, we can play darts. There's other things
that can happen there besides just sitting and drinking, you know. So,
(39:36):
I mean, I'm the guy that is breaking up with
you because you're sober, Like I'm if I went out
with a guy who didn't tell me they didn't drink,
I would be annoyed, Yeah, because I want to know that. Yeah,
of course you already know that, and it doesn't mean
that I wouldn't date somebody who didn't drink.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
I mean I don't. I don't think i've Yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (39:53):
Have that if they're leading with it, yeah, but with
a drinker. You don't want to be with a big drinker.
Speaker 1 (39:59):
Yeah, but I don't know.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
I think you are reading a lot of people out
because they might be like, oh, she's gonna be judgy,
or she's gonna be you know what I mean, Like
she might be sober. I mean maybe if you want
to write, even in adendum, like I'm not in AA,
I just don't really drink a lot or not a
big drink, not a big drinker. And that's it, like,
you know, make it look less in the blow just
because some people are fine as long as they know
(40:23):
you're cool, and some people are just don't want to
be like you.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
She was telling them, she was saying I'm cool, she
was saying, I don't drink, but I'm totally fine. But
then what they do is that they then they don't
show up.
Speaker 7 (40:33):
Yeah, and that's what they've been doing recently. And I'm
just like, tell me that it's not okay and I'm
cool or expect it unmatch me great, but don't plan
a date and then.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
Ghostw What city are you in?
Speaker 7 (40:45):
I'm right outside Philadelphia in South Jersey.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
Oh okay, I thought you were going to say.
Speaker 2 (40:49):
I was like, if you're in LA, it shouldn't be
an issue because everyone's fucking sober here anyway.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (40:54):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 5 (40:55):
Maybe they're not. Maybe they're not falling through because it's
not that I don't know. Maybe it's because they just
they want to get hammered with you and have a
good time. Either way, they're not your guy. What's important
to you in terms of a partner and his relationship
with alcohol.
Speaker 7 (41:10):
For me personally, I just have like some you know,
low key medical issues where I tend to like pass
out and have a seizure if I have certain medications
or alcohol. Yes, so I've just you know, I'm thirty
two now, I've lived my whole life, college, scrap parties,
law school, everything, not drinking, being around people who drink.
All of my friends drink. It's never really been an
(41:31):
issue for me except in this like one sphere of data.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Right, I'm gonna say, I think you're labeling yourself, even
though she's saying I'm okay with drinking.
Speaker 1 (41:40):
I think it's so.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
Do you think she should not say anything? I just
don't think you should do it.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I don't think you should put.
Speaker 2 (41:45):
Such an emphasis on drinking, just like you shouldn't put
such an emphasis on most things, like when you're not
before you meet someone, like have them, have the experience
of meeting them. Take out the drinking thing, I think,
and just and then see if that changes the amount
of men that you actually match with, and then see
if that changes the quality of men that you match with,
because maybe it will have the effect that Jillian is saying,
(42:07):
which is you, thank God you're rid of all those people.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Anyway. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (42:11):
Maybe there's a couple of people in there that aren't
big drinkers, that just are like, oh, I'm on a
first date. I want to have a cocktail like that.
That's kind of like a very regular thing for people
to do, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (42:23):
And Carly, would you tell us a little bit about
You mentioned some really interesting things to me about your
experience on the apps, like kind of guys you're getting
hooked up with.
Speaker 1 (42:32):
Can you tell us a little bit about that?
Speaker 7 (42:34):
Yeah, on the apps recently, I've been having this issue
where like, even when I do go on a few
dates with people, I get a lot of feedback about
that I have my shit together too much and that
makes them insecure.
Speaker 1 (42:48):
After the date or before the date.
Speaker 7 (42:50):
After when I do go out and date, it's like,
you know, two or three dates with someone and they're like, oh,
you know, I'm not in a place in my life
right now, and they use it as an excuse and
they even I'm like, oh, you own a house, you like,
know what you're doing with your life. And I'm still
trying to figure my life out at like thirty nine
years old, which is fine, everyone's in different areas. But
(43:11):
that's just kind of like something I've been getting a
lot recently.
Speaker 2 (43:14):
That you definitely don't want to diminish the fact that you.
Speaker 1 (43:18):
Have your shit together.
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 7 (43:20):
There's a little shit I could still figure out.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
So that's something that you don't want to start hiding
from men because you know, absolutely not exactly. I think
it's great that you have your shit together at thirty two,
and you know, it's amazing people until like thirty five ish,
I think to get their shit together. Yeah, thirty five
to forty anyway, Yeah, and beyond.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
But yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
That would be my advice just to remove that. Don't
put such an emphasis on it. Just you know, you're
open to whatever you can suggest. Always going to coffee. Also,
we're going for a walk. In your book, you talk
about what a co regulating experience walking is. Yeah, that's
the first time I've read that. I mean, I know
it to be true, coregulated, but.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Yeah, is it right?
Speaker 2 (43:58):
That's actually an It sounds kind of like a corny
thing to do on a date. I mean, I wouldn't
go for a walk with someone on a date. I
did it once and that's why I'll never do it again.
But it is actually a really good activity for two
people to do together.
Speaker 4 (44:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (44:14):
And you know what's something that I'll leave you with
is this. Sometimes the people who do have their quote
unquote shit together and are not You're they're not hookup material,
their wife material like, and I say that meaning like
they're not the person who you're just You're not they're
not just gonna like have a good time with you
and get wasted and go to bed together like you're
(44:36):
someone actually to be taken seriously. For many different reasons.
Sometimes those women they do have to wait a little
bit longer for the right per especially around your age group.
But don't let that discourage you. Never, as Chelsea said,
never diminish all that you've accomplished and that you have
your shit together, like you have to that you have
to be loud and proud about that.
Speaker 7 (44:57):
Okay, I'll try.
Speaker 4 (44:59):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
I love that, Jillian. Yeah, yeah, you are somebody they
bring home to mom.
Speaker 4 (45:04):
Yeah, yeah, you are. And that's a good thing and
that's a lovely thing.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
And also enjoy the process of all of this, Like
I know it may seem frustrating right now, but like
you'll never get this time back again.
Speaker 1 (45:15):
You know, you're thirty two, you're.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Single, you're on apps, Like, look at that as fun
and adventurous instead of the disappointment that comes with it.
There's also all these other fun, flirty things. Sometimes you
flirt with people that you never even go on a
date with. Yeah, and it's fun for like five days
or two weeks, and it never comes to fruition. But
like who cares, you know what I mean, it doesn't
fucking matter. It's like, enjoy all of this that's happening,
(45:38):
because you're never gonna be thirty two again, and you
might not be You might meet somebody, get married and
have kids and be like, God, I wish I went
on some more dates, you know what I mean?
Speaker 7 (45:46):
Well, I have been to more countries than days this year,
So I guess that's perfect.
Speaker 1 (45:50):
That's a good attitude too. I love that.
Speaker 5 (45:53):
Yeah, So you're a very interesting girl. You're a very
interesting woman, so you need you need an interesting guy.
And so anyone who's just like gonna be like, well,
she won't get wasted with me.
Speaker 4 (46:01):
That's not your guy.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
No, but do you have any plants that you can say,
because we need to put a plant in this area
that isn't this tall that just like kind of comes
up here and it's a little bit. I would keep
asking our callers, but our last caller he was not helpful.
Speaker 7 (46:15):
I kill all plants. I just got flowers and at
the farmers market and they're dead already, so I don't
I can keep dogs alive, but not plants.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
She does have an enormous black.
Speaker 4 (46:25):
Dog, just like you.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
I mean, I don't need her to keep my dog alive.
I mean, you keep your dog alive, and I'll try
to keep mine alive. But I guess we can call
this episode no plants for us.
Speaker 1 (46:36):
Okay, Well does that help you at all? Are you?
Speaker 7 (46:39):
Thank you?
Speaker 1 (46:39):
Okay, thanks, thanks for calling in.
Speaker 7 (46:43):
Bye bye, Jillan.
Speaker 3 (46:44):
Do you have advice for people who are on the
apps and are just like suffering.
Speaker 4 (46:49):
Advice?
Speaker 5 (46:50):
Well, I think there's a few things. One is that
really shouldn't don't depend it's designed to make you very dependent.
Don't depend on them entirely. Like actually, go out, meet people,
expand your circle, have fun, live your life to the fullest.
Don't get so obsessive about it. Expand your zip code.
That's important because also if you're in a big city
usually that can be more difficult. So go like to
(47:12):
the periphery. Maybe you have to drive thirty minutes, maybe
you have to dry.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
In an hour.
Speaker 4 (47:15):
I think it's worth it.
Speaker 5 (47:17):
And don't be having a million different texting exchanging exchanges
with lots of different people, Like focus on one person
at a time, honestly, and meet the person, whether it's
like through a FaceTime or zoom or in person quickly.
Because what I've been seeing a lot lately is that,
oh my god, I've been texting with this person. It's
been like two months but we haven't met, and it
(47:39):
creates this really weird false sense of intimacy. So just
like if you are in it because you want a relationship,
then you have to have discipline not to always be
on it. You have to have some clear standards and
also have some pictures of you where you're like smiling
and it's not just like a poe with all this makeup,
(48:01):
especially for women. And yeah, those are just my quick tips.
Speaker 1 (48:04):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (48:06):
Well, maybe let's take a break and we'll come back
with a quick question, A quicker question.
Speaker 2 (48:11):
Okay, we'll take a break and we'll be right back,
and we're back with Gilly and Tareki.
Speaker 3 (48:19):
And actually, before we're back, we can lose our headphones.
Speaker 1 (48:22):
I like my headphones. We feel it make me feel secure.
I know, what do you got?
Speaker 3 (48:27):
I've got either my boyfriend has a lot of female
friends or.
Speaker 4 (48:33):
My ex lover died.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
Oh what do you think?
Speaker 4 (48:38):
I think the ex lover died?
Speaker 3 (48:39):
Ex lover died?
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Okay?
Speaker 6 (48:40):
What is okay?
Speaker 8 (48:41):
Sure?
Speaker 1 (48:42):
I'm open?
Speaker 3 (48:42):
Okay, So, Tricia writes, Dear Chelsea, I just found out
that my former lover, with whom I was in an
extramarital relationship, died, a year ago. We were lovers undercover
for ten years, and I loved him. I was very
close to his wife. I know it's gross. She found
out about us because of a drunk email I sent
(49:04):
years ago when the guilt got the best of me,
admitting to our relationship.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
I'mother great advertisement for alcohol.
Speaker 4 (49:12):
Skewing that way today.
Speaker 3 (49:14):
I'm since widowed and have only had two exchanges via
LinkedIn with him since we broke up. But I started
to write her how sorry I was for her loss
and of course the damage I caused. But now I'm
rethinking writing her. Should I reach out? What say you, thanks, Trisha?
Speaker 1 (49:30):
No, no, do not no reason to leave her alone.
Let her grieve. Yeah, and you can do your grieving
by yourself.
Speaker 4 (49:38):
And she lost her her husband, so she's a grieving both. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:42):
Yeah, yeah, never mind her.
Speaker 4 (49:43):
Yeah, that's a big no.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Okay, I'm glad we're in agreement.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
Yeah, we do have probably time for that last other
quick we want to do?
Speaker 5 (49:51):
Sure?
Speaker 3 (49:52):
Okay, great, So, Susannah says dear Chelsea. I'm in a
new relationship where I feel secure for the most part.
My one hang up with him is that he has
a lot of female friends that he regularly talks to
and hangs out with, both single and married alike. Obviously,
I know I can't tell him who to be friends with,
but I just cannot relate at all. Because I don't
(50:12):
have any single straight men that I'm regularly talking to
and hanging out with. It feels like it could quickly become.
Speaker 4 (50:19):
A slippery slope.
Speaker 3 (50:21):
I have not brought this up to him yet because
I think it could easily be misconstrued as me being
the jealous type or acting like the crazy girlfriend. I
trust him, and I don't want to unnecessarily rock the
boat of an otherwise great thing. He's been single for
a long time, over a decade, so perhaps he doesn't
even realize that it might make me uncomfortable since he's
not used to having to consider someone else's feelings. My
(50:41):
question is is it worth bringing up since it makes
me feel uneasy or will it just naturally fade out
over time now that he isn't single? Is it totally
fine to be in a relationship and have a bunch
of single friends of the opposite sex? Basically, is this
a valid concern or am I just insecure? Susannah?
Speaker 4 (50:57):
How long have they been together? I forgot that.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
Let's see, it's just this new relationship. I don't think
we have a timeline.
Speaker 1 (51:04):
Would you like to answer this first? Would you like
to go first?
Speaker 5 (51:08):
I think that it's important when you're trying to foster
a new relationship, certain other relationships might have to change.
I also think that if you're gonna have a lot
of friendships, female friendships, and you're a straight man, you're
in a relationship with a woman, that she should be
(51:30):
introduced to these friends and included somewhat.
Speaker 6 (51:33):
You know.
Speaker 5 (51:34):
It really just and also depends does he have a
history with any of them? Has he hooked up with
any of them? Did he date any of them? Those
need boundaries around them, especially when you're trying to foster
like safety and trust in a new relationship.
Speaker 2 (51:48):
What do you think, Well, I think she hasn't even
broached the topic with him, and right now it doesn't
sound like it doesn't sound nefarious. It sounds like he
has a lot of friends that are girls, and I
think people should be confident.
Speaker 1 (52:00):
She said in the letter.
Speaker 2 (52:01):
I don't have I can't relate because I don't have
a lot of friends that are guys. Yeah, that's a
you problem, not a heat problem, Well I have. I'm
dating somebody who has lots of girlfriends.
Speaker 4 (52:11):
Uh huh.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
I have no issue with that whatsoever. I have lots
of guy friends. I mean most of them are gay,
but I have a lot of straight male friends. And
it's just not an issue because I'm confident and he's confident.
It's not a thing I don't think. I think if
their issues arise because of it, in addition to your
insecurity that is so far rooted in nothing, just her
(52:35):
own insecurity, if there were issues that were derived from
him in some one of these women, then yes it
becomes an issue. But right now it sounds like her issue,
not a him issue.
Speaker 7 (52:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (52:44):
I mean, look, the thing is I agree. I think
there's nuance. It's like, does he have these other friendships
and is he not is he not communicating with her
like when there.
Speaker 2 (52:52):
Should absolutely be free to meet all of them. Yeah,
be incorporated.
Speaker 4 (52:57):
I think there be integration. I think that's really important.
Speaker 1 (53:00):
Definitely.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (53:01):
So I think as long as there's integration and as
long as it's not like when there's where it gets messy.
It's like if they have a problem and he's going
to one of his female friends and he's not talking
to her, but that doesn't seem to be what's happening.
Speaker 4 (53:15):
But I do want to bring that up.
Speaker 5 (53:17):
Is something that does potentially happen in couples where it
absolutely can be a problem. Also, it can be a
problem with one of those friends as someone who like
a year ago, you were in a relationship with and
there isn't any like clear boundaries. But at the same time,
if it's just I do believe that there can be
friendship and that it absolutely could be just her insecurities
(53:37):
to your point, because I.
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Just don't think like you when you said I think
the first thing you said was like, you know, when
you're in a relationship, your other relationships have to change.
I actually I don't think that's true unless you have
some unhealthy relationships, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
Yes, it might mean like so like life.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
I mean also including the girl in your relationships, Yeah,
your girlfriend integration's really import I think where there needs
to be changed is like if you have if he
has a friendship with one of the women who's single,
and you know.
Speaker 5 (54:08):
She's the first person he texts in the morning and
they talk about everything, and they you know, they they
do their Saturday nights together when you have a relationship
that some of that relationship is going to have to change,
but other than that, no, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (54:25):
Okay, all right, well, thanks for writing in Susannah, and
thank you.
Speaker 1 (54:30):
To have a plant.
Speaker 4 (54:32):
I will email her now, Okay.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Okay, I like this. Okay, well everybody can order.
Speaker 2 (54:37):
It begins with you, the nine hard truth about love
that will change your life.
Speaker 1 (54:40):
Yes, thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (54:42):
Thank you for having me. It was so much fun.
Speaker 1 (54:44):
Yeah, good times.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
Okay, Well we'll see everybody or here everybody, or listen
to everybody or talk to everybody next week.
Speaker 6 (54:49):
Goodbye.
Speaker 3 (54:51):
If you'd like advice from Chelsea Shoots an email at
Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be sure
to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and
engineered by Brad Dickard executive producer Katherine law and be
sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot com
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Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.