October 20, 2022 • 63 mins
On today’s episode, we share a conversation between Whitnie Goins (Diversity, Equity & Inclusion Professional) and Devi Brown, from the Molson Coors Beverage Company’s annual Month of Inclusion. Within the Month of Inclusion theme of ‘intersectionality,’ Molson Coors held unfiltered discussions on the intersectionality within mental health. Whitnie Goins leads the conversation with questions on generational trauma, ancestorial healing, and the impacts on personality from various traumatic experiences.
Connect: @DeviBrown Whitnie Goins
Visit: MolsonCoors.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
M from grandmothers who whispered in their baby girl ill
two fathers on dimly lit street corners, instructing young soldiers
to always keep their eyes open. You be queen, you
(00:21):
were fired. You will pass through centuries on the hands
of your daughters. They called you wisdom. Proverbs on the
backs of diamond eyed school children who grew into hymnals
recited by amethyst holding urban philosophers who recited neighborhood commandments
out of the windows of restored Alchemedo chariots. To keep
the warmth of their blood. Be wise, be smart, being black,
(00:46):
opal brown courts, bloodstone, and prayer. Be every form of
jim see King told, scribe, scribe, told son, son, told wife,
wife told her daughter, and daughter told the as this is.
Told me that you would come to give wisdom. They
(01:06):
said you would come. Dropping Hey, Welcome back to the
Dropping Gym's podcasts, your soft place to land for conversations
on higher consciousness and making all of our healing applicable
to our day to day lives. This is a place
of self discovery, This is a place of honest, non
(01:28):
judgmental communication, and this is the place to expand. This week.
I am very excited to share this conversation with you.
One of our amazing sponsors here at the Black Effect
Network and I Heart Radio is the most in group,
and they invited me into their offices to have a
fireside chat with the very dynamic woman who runs and
(01:51):
heads their diversity and inclusion, Whitney Goins, And it was
such a privilege to be in conversation with her. It
was really cool finding out that she is an avid
listener of The Dropping Gym's podcast. And when I tell you,
we went so deep, We went so deep that this
conversation honestly really moved me, and I was thinking about
(02:12):
it for days afterwards. Especially, I was thinking about Whitney,
the amazing woman who's doing such powerful work at that company,
and had just the absolutely most beautiful, expansive, divine conversation
with her. It was such a pleasure to answer these
questions and to hear her thoughts and to connect with
(02:33):
those in the audience. And so they did me the
honor of allowing me to share this very private speaking
that I did for them, very private private speaking that
I did for them with my Dropping Gem's audience. So huge, huge,
thank you, so much gratitude to Molson. So much gratitude
to Whitney. You are incredible. Love speaking with you and
(02:56):
so happy to share this conversation with you. Some of
the things we i'ved into with structural oppression, we dove
into wellness in the workplace, and we also talked at
a very high level about what it is to really
expand diversity and inclusion, especially in the wellness space. So
(03:17):
these are the conversations I love having. This is some
of the corporate side work that I do, and I'm
excited to share it with you here. So please take
a listen to all of the beautiful gems, to all
of the incredible questions UM, and and considerations that Whitney shared,
And here we go. Oh my goodness, it's such a
(03:40):
pleasure to be here, UM, and thank you for being
here with us today. Thank you so much for joining.
I cannot tell you how many messages UM, the d
e I team has received expressing the pure excitement to
have you joined us today. So I really just want
to reiterate the undeniable impact, UM, that you are having
on the lives of so so many and we're just
(04:03):
so grateful that you've created, as you like to say
on your podcast as a soft place for us to land.
So thank you, thank you so much. Wow. So, Debbie
in our conversation today talking about mental health in the
bipoch community, UM, first, I would really love to just
start by talking a bit about your journey. Um So.
You you've mentioned, you know how oftentimes you would walk
(04:26):
into these spaces and maybe the only person that looks
like um you, so he tell us what was the
catalyst for your journey or exploration into the mental health
and healing space? Wow, what a beautiful question, you know
when they I think when I look back at like
some of the early trappings of my life, I think
we all kind of have this undercurrent of a knowing
(04:47):
that there's more available to us, or that maybe experiences
we've had in our lives maybe there's something more, Maybe
there's something better, or maybe there's something we need to explore.
Whether we tune into it or not is completely up
to our spirits and the timing in our life. But
you know, my initial my initial career in broadcasting, UM,
(05:10):
I started to get really burned out and I started
really feel like ego was leading my life in a
way that was not sustainable or healthy and terminology then,
But when I started having anxiety before I walked into
the building at work, because it seemed so against who
I was, I knew something had to shift. And that's
(05:33):
when I started my my mental health, emotional health, spiritual
health journey. This is roughly around somewhere in between ten
and twelve years ago when I went to my very
first retreat, and initially I walked in that space and
I was experiencing just a profound upgrade in my consciousness
and the way that I was able to see myself
in the world. And while I was having that experience,
(05:55):
I was also having the dual experience of being the
only per sin of color in every room and the
youngest person at the time in all of those rooms.
And so it was this experience that was also very
similar to what it is to be a person of
color in this country, this dual existence of having a
challenge that not everyone is aware of and still having
(06:19):
a life that is filled with all the things that
life is filled with. Um that's when I really started
to look not only at my own journey, but why
some of this work did it always feel so accessible
or organic in other non white communities, so touching on that. Um,
I'm really interested to hear your perspective on you know,
(06:41):
why do you think that people of color are behind
or maybe even hesitant in a mental health space? You know,
what are what are those barriers? So this is gonna
be a pretty full answer because it's not just one thing.
You know, we have to think of historical context any
time we have conversation about people of color, specifically in
(07:02):
this country. And you know there it's interesting right when
we think of wellness, when we think of the ability
to tap into well being, even though it's been put
under the capitalistic filter, it is free, being quiet, sitting still,
connecting with nature. It is something we can kind of
naturally do. But if you think of some of the
(07:22):
barriers we have in place our own mental health, like
centuries of having experiences that were deeply harmful, uh, not
just physically but emotionally and spiritually, and never being able
to talk about them, or if you talked about them,
nothing ever changed. We saw advancement and immense suppression at
(07:43):
every turn. We've witnessed immense violence, um harm to women,
to children, to our men, And so that as the
undercurrent of an experience of of seeking more for yourself.
It's always going to limit you in a subconscious way.
We and think about things like going out and connecting
with nature, right going camping or taking a hike. That
(08:06):
feels natural in our day to day culture. But if
you look historically, black and brown people were segregated and
not allowed to visit national parks, state parks, the beaches
were segregated. Some things that seem natural and easy in
the year of two, there could be potentially subconscious experiences
(08:27):
at play that just make you think you can't access
those things. And then there's a lot of cultural programming,
and I think all of us, no matter the cultural background,
we're awakening into a new time where you can speak
freely about your own lived experience. And it was just
a couple of decades ago that I think it was
(08:47):
really commonplace in most households to say, don't show your
dirty laundry, don't talk about it. We're fine over it,
you know. So there there are so many structures at
play that keep us from ourselves, and I think it's
really important to reflect on that because it helps us
have the courage to stand up for ourselves, to come
(09:09):
more and to cast aside maybe behaviors or thought processes
that don't nourish our mental health, right and you mentioned, um,
you know, don't air dirty laundry and things like that.
They go one thing you forgot about two was oh,
just go pray about it, right, Um. So there was
always that, um, you know, and I think having religion,
(09:31):
as you know, such a cornerstone is beautiful, but sometimes
I think we would use it to almost cover up
the mental health journey that probably should be embarked upon. Right.
So I feel like that was also another barrier, um
as far as education understanding that you know, just because
I am seeking out this particular um, I'm trying to
(09:52):
learn about mental health in other ways of healing, does
not me I'm necessarily going against the religion. But I
was raised with as well. That is so beautifully said.
And if I can add, you know, sometimes in the
systems of our deep belief culturally, in the systems of
the churches and how they really held us up in
communities when there weren't spaces for that. There is so
(10:13):
much beauty in that and so much necessity in that,
and very often it lacks process for real change. You know,
something about sometimes going into a church setting and that
being the only place that you look for more is
it bypasses the actual experience and process of what it
(10:34):
is to change oneself and it goes directly to the
have faith and more. But if we're biblically, you know
what is found in the Bible is space with faith
without works is dead. And so it's so much more
sometimes than just coming in and kind of putting on
that performative everything will be okay. I have faith there
(10:54):
are real things that we experience in this life that
are deeply complex and layer that I have to have
additional processes and care to be able to work through
and transcend. Absolutely, thank you for adding that on That
was beautifully said, UM. And in your previous answer you
also talked about just like UM, we started talking about
(11:16):
barriers the centuries um of things that Bipop communities have
had to experience. And on your podcast Dropping Gems, I've
also heard you speak about generational imprinting. UM. For those
who are maybe not familiar with the term, would you
mind explaining what generational imprinting is for the audience. Audience, Absolutely,
(11:37):
and the way that I conveyed on my show, it's
in ourier, generational trauma or what we're kind of more
loosely referring to as generational trauma, and that is really
um it's the impact of every generation that preceded us
on not only our mental and emotional health, but also
the cells of our physical body. And the Box is
(11:57):
having a lot of research around this, but there is
you know, a beautiful example would be when you think
about things that maybe went on in your grandmother's history
for those of us that are able to be connected
to knowledge and stories of previous generations, if your grandmother
went through a trauma, which let's be kind of um
(12:22):
real about this, if you are a person of color
in this country, almost every single generation, including those living
have experience not just trauma, but complex trauma, which means
things that are stacked upon you every single day, which
is a little bit more intricate than the experience of PTSD,
(12:43):
which is also a piece of that, but c PTSD
means it's not just one thing. It is the fibers
of everything in your life regularly, consistently. And so if
someone in your family system experience a trauma, uh or
several traumas, that would impact the way they were able
(13:04):
to parent you based on what they had access to
for their own healing. Something that we almost i would
say universally, though nothing is a monolith, something that we
almost universally know is that no generation before this one
really had access to therapy, had access to meditation, had
(13:24):
access to all the books or the Instagram memes or
the things that are now motivating us. You internalize it, right,
And a lot of previous generations also had a lot
of disease in their body that was manifesting from this
emotional mental pain. And so if your ancestor your elder
(13:44):
did not get a chance to work through these things,
to heal themselves, to find another way of being, the
way they parented, you was impacted by that, which could
mean many things. Could potentially mean some emotional neglect, it
could mean physical experiences of abuse um or it could
just mean continuing living a really challenging life and not
(14:07):
having opportunities for your mental health. That then it's passed
down to you, and until someone stops it or shifts
the experiences, it continues down. It continues down. So we
are generation of healing. This is the first time in
human history that we know of that we have collectively,
in a mainstream way, begun speaking to these bigger elements
(14:31):
and beginning to attempt to work through them. So if
that's the case right now, in that means for the
last let's say, five hundred years or three thousand, all
of that was happening, All of that was happening until
it met you in this moment. So that's pretty much
a simplistic way of sharing how that process can work
(14:53):
in our lives and in our families. Thank you when
you said, UM, you know, just think about like your grandmother, Like,
I like instantly felt myself getting emotional, like just thinking
about you know what the generations before us have gone through. UM,
And I feel like, I mean you you made some
really amazing points UM as far as us being the
(15:14):
generation of healing and just the additional resources that we have.
But also you talked about UM, you know, parenting and
understanding that you know, a lot of times our parents
are merely giving us what they were given, right, So
sometimes you just don't have those resources and UM, you're
doing the best that you can with what you were given.
And I know you talk a lot about healed parenting
on UM your podcasts and in many interviews, but I
(15:37):
think that we have to also understand Um, It's like
a lot of the getting over generational trauma and starting
our healing starts with forgiveness as well. So I really
wanted to transition into more about that generational trauma and
ancestral healing. I'm starting, particularly UM with generational trauma. So
(15:57):
staying on that path of UM trauma and grief. I
heard you quote one time and you said, grief never
leaves you, it just changes forms. And I thought that
was such an amazing and powerful quote as we think
about it, going back to the conversation of you know,
generations again, so that past being passed down, the changing forms. Right.
So I mentioned forgiveness, but what are some other ways
(16:20):
that you suggest, UM on how we can deal with
grief that has become so generational, so familiar, that it
almost feels like you can't escape, Like it's it's become
a part of the DNA. Yeah, absolutely, and it and
it absolutely has. It has become a part of our DNA.
It has been, you know, become trapped in ourselves. And
(16:40):
I think as science continues to explore and substantiate the
very real things that so many people have known and
spoken to over the centuries, you know, it's in There's
a There's a really amazing book, and I think this
example might might really fit. Um. Many books are out
now gratefully on helping to unpack some of this understanding
(17:04):
of the way things get stored in our bodies. The
Body Keeps Or is a really beautiful book. I also
love Resuma Manicans My Grandmother's Hands. One of the things
Resuma speaks to in that book is he shares a
powerful example of how trauma manifests as personality. And you
may not even know it, and you may spend your
entire life behaving as you and it's not really the
(17:28):
truth of who you are. It's just the layers and
layers of trauma that have developed as the way you
show up in the world. So, for instance, if your
mother experienced a kind of trauma or had an upbringing
where she was forced to be quiet, or experience things
that made her go inside and be very quiet or
(17:50):
be very um minimized, she may pass down that pattern
of behavior to you, and you take it on because
that to what was role modeled for you. And so
you may be as someone who has social anxiety or
is very shy, or is not able to really stand
up for yourself and you don't know why, because maybe
(18:13):
your life experiences haven't added up for you to actually
be behaving that way. But somehow this is who you
are in the world. What's so important is that was
just that was your rearing right, so that was the
imprint of personality on you that you're now living. What
is so powerful and important is when we come into
a space of wanting more, wanting to investigate and really
(18:35):
support our mental health and our emotional health, you have
to stop and look at what makes you you and
be willing to challenge it a little bit, be willing
to get self aware enough to where you say, is
this actually the truth of who I am? Is there
an opportunity to change my behavior, to test out some
new things? And then you just have to get your
(18:58):
practice going, get your support going, you know, seek out
assistance to explore your mental health, perhaps with the therapist
if that feels right, or through meditation, um through different
somatic practice. But creating systems and structures that allow you
to explore yourself with support are incredibly important, and that
(19:20):
is how we begin to dismantle some of that programming.
We have to first figure out that it exists, see
where it's living inside of us, and then begin the
process of greeting it with awareness in order to release it.
But we have to be willing to see ourselves. We
have to, and I want to say that knowing that
for some people that is a lot more challenging than others.
(19:45):
Some of our stories are really deep, some of our
stories are really painful, and so I just want to
acknowledge that that sometimes the journey is more challenging than
other people. And that's why it feels like people may
be outpacing you or being able to, you know, get
their healing or their breakthrough faster. We have complex individual experiences. Wow,
(20:09):
if you all did not realize or understand why her
podcast was called dropping Gym's before because she just dropped
so many Oh my goodness, that was so beautifully, said
Debbie Um. And I think a lot of times, especially
I mean when I first tuned into your podcast, the
things that you kind of introduced this to it's our
(20:32):
first time hearing that. So too for someone to say,
you know, your personality actually may not be who you are,
and it's something that was imprinting and past. It's so
powerful and and almost earth shaking to hear UM and
you mentioned resma menicum and amazing for those of you
who are not familiar with resthma UM and author and psychotherapists.
(20:54):
But in your episode with him, Debbie, UM, he actually
talked about and I think it goes back to making
how hard it is to make sure that we're not
becoming numb to seeing this so often on TV or
in the media. But he he mentioned, you know, when
we watch black bodies being destroyed, UM, it creates a
collective anguish in our community, UM, and then a lot
(21:15):
of times we turn that collective anguish into personal anguish
and then UM it has such an effect on our
body that we don't realize. But on top of that,
we are then left trying to heal UM communal horrors
with individual healing strategies and it just simply doesn't work. UM.
So we kind of talked about the generational UM imprinting
(21:38):
and and the pain that that can cause. But where
do we start with attempting to heal those generational traumas?
I know you mentioned UM it starts with that awareness
and kind of confronting that head on, But any other
thoughts on just where to start because I know, like,
after people leave this conversation again, they're probably hearing things
for the first time. You're like, Okay, she just racked
my whole world. Where now where do I? Oh? Yes,
(22:03):
you know? And I want to say this with as
much gravity as possible because one thing, um, just in
my years of teaching and speaking to this, that you know,
I've begun to recognize as a norm is that very
often the response is shared seems so simplistic that people
(22:25):
can hear them, and they can hear them repeatedly and
still say, but where do I start? Where's the beginning space?
Because we think that those things could never actually match
the depths and the vastness of what we've gone through.
So if I were to offer something and say, you know,
first begin by connecting to your breath, get centered in
(22:47):
your body, that sounds so simple that if you are
a survivor of complex trauma, or if your life experiences
have just been complex, you reject it because you say,
what is breathing gonna do? What is two minutes or
thirty seconds of Okay, everyone wants to tell me to
(23:08):
close my eyes and no, you know, and it seems
um so unhelpful that you don't attempt. And the truth is,
some of those things that I'm gonna go through a
couple more in a moment, those are the exact things
that dismantle it and make this work possible. To live
your healing, to live in the things that you're seeking
(23:30):
for yourself and the growth that you're seeking for yourself.
It is the detailed, tiny still moments that allow the
grief to be met and released. And so when we
when I speak to meditation, when I speak to getting centered,
one of the things that comes up for a lot
of people, and this is I believe the starting point
(23:54):
is learning how to slow your body down. Because one
half of the spectrum um society has just taught us
to go, go, go, hustle, culture, grind, girl, boss yep,
kill it. So we're fast, fast, fast, fast, fast fast. Right. Also,
you may have had a parent that had a very
challenging experience raising you because of all the other things
(24:16):
happening in their life. So everything might have had to
feel come on, let's go, we gotta do this, Go
do do do do right. We're used to moving, walking
back for no reason, and even when you don't have
somewhere to go and We're used to avoiding ourselves with
our own thoughts, and sometimes it feels like a rumination,
like maybe they are intrusive thoughts of experiences you've had
(24:37):
that run on a loop in your mind and that
brings a lot of pain. Would also just be thinking
about everything but yourself all day, calling that care, concern,
and worry, but it being your tool of avoiding yourself.
These are not judgments. It's just important to see how
do we individually respond to things. When you take a
moment to begin a meditation practice, even if it's two
(25:01):
minutes a day, five minutes a day, eventually building up
to the recommended twenty five minutes two times a day,
you're able to connect to a part of yourself where
everything you've experienced is able to be processed, either released,
or it's able to find a new home. And so
when we begin a meditation practice, getting still in silent
(25:24):
sometimes feels really scary at first, because all of a sudden,
you're feeling everything you have been trying not to feel
your whole life that passes. In order to be free
of it, you have to feel it and it has
to be expressed. Meditation allows you to come into a
space where you're able to learn how to come back
(25:44):
into your body so that you can be present with
yourself and not constantly moving so fast, thinking so much
that before you know what, you look up and your
life is past and you don't really know how you
lived it. So those practice this is to begin find
time to be with yourself in a new way. If
(26:06):
you're not yet ready to sit down and close your
eyes and connect to the present moment, considering every day
taking a walk and being silent on that walk, if
it's around your block, if it's your lunch break, but
learn how to hold silence for yourself. Learn how to
not to choose the path of small talk first or
(26:30):
having conversation, so that you can control not being asked
questions or not speaking about yourself. It's important to notice
how we're responding to ourselves and then trying to slow down,
to look around, to be present while being quiet, to
be in the company of other people while being quiet. Um,
(26:52):
that would be a powerful first step. True. You also
mentioned you know, the hustle culture and and just constantly
grinding and we can go, go, go, yeah, and what
popped into my head? I wonder how much of that
(27:12):
is a response to feeling like we need to prove
our productivity or like a trauma or survival response. So
going back to again just generational, generationally feeling like we
have to do that we are a productive element of society. UM. Yeah,
that that popped into my head. And then you also
mentioned UM. Sometimes people you'll offer, you know, simple advice
(27:35):
and people will reject it. And I talked, UM, I
heard you talk about UM in a previous interview. How
sometimes if we don't know something, will reject it. In
in the example you actually use, sometimes we simply reject
joy because we haven't known that or felt that, or
maybe even seeing that UM within our household or within
our families. And again it's because we're constantly moving in
that survival UM survival mode. So going back to families, UM,
(28:01):
because I feel like, you know, not saying that within
the bipop communities UM, that we have stronger family ties,
but I will say that in bipot communities UM, family
is truly the cornerstone. Right, So when dealing with you
step out into the world and you're dealing with racism
and systemic oppression, coming home to your family has has
been that cornerstone that has helped you continue moving. But Debbie,
(28:24):
what do you do or what advice do you have
to offer for people who I feel like sometimes coming
home to their family also isn't safe. So, in this
era of hashtag protect your peace, um, how is it
possible to protect your peace but also um, not necessarily
desert your family when you feel like your family isn't
on that same healing path or maybe even awareness about
(28:45):
mental health. Ye, beautiful, beautiful question. We have to connect
to our peace first before we can ever consider or
manage or respond to another person's lack of peace. So
it's really important that you know, especially in service to
this question, if you are on a path of wanting
(29:06):
to have a different experience in your life or in
your family structure, making a commitment to that saying I
will do whatever is necessary to have the experiences I
know I want to have, to have the ability to
expand to do something differently. You know, UM, when you
(29:28):
connect to a higher consciousness, when you connect to a
deeper awareness about yourself, your impact on yourself, your impact
in the world. There are layers and levels to how
you will reintegrate to the rest of your life with
people who not be doing the work. And it's so
(29:48):
important to feed yourself to such an excess on this
spiritual journey that you are able to greet others from
your overflow and not from your So you're not taking
from you to be able to stand in that you
are experiencing that with an overflow and with compassion, because
the fact is, not everyone is going to change in
(30:12):
this lifetime. Not everyone is going to have the opportunity
or the ability to heal through things that have happened
to them. And something that has been powerful for me
is shifting into such a deep witnessing and compassion of
that right because if I have the ability to meet
myself with that courage and the practical, disciplined behavior that's
(30:35):
necessary for change, and someone else isn't. Something I'm for
sure is even if they don't say it, how much
that hurts, right, how much living like that is actually
very challenging. Even if this is the person that is
the antagonist of your life, that's a challenging life to
be in, and so one recognizing that, so you can
(30:56):
make it not personal. Because as you establish boundaries, people
will climb them, people will want to bypass them, and
coming into a space of recognizing that that is their trained,
learned behavior is not personal and looking through the lens
of how challenging it is for you to change and
(31:19):
knowing is that person doing the same work as I am?
Are they doing all of these things that I'm doing
that are very challenging for me? Mostly the answer is no.
And if it's no, you know, being realistic and saying, well,
how could I expect a different response? It's not about
them changing, It's about me changing, changing the way I
(31:41):
relate to their trauma and or choosing to distance myself
from it, because that is a very real choice that
can be made by each of us. You don't have
to stay in something because you've always been in it.
Mm hmm. And I feel like a lot of times
when we embark on these these journeys, um, whether it's
(32:04):
mental health or just overall improvement, a lot of times
you want to kind of drag people along with us,
um or like put on that superhero cape and like
when we talk about some of our our closest family
members or our friends. UM, So I understand what you
mean as far as accepting where they are and understanding
and recognizing I mean, gosh, if I'm if I'm doing
(32:26):
all this work and it's this hard for me, I
can only imagine you know, um, you know, are they
putting in that same amount of work? But how do you?
And I feel like I'm asking a question within the question,
how do you accept someone for or maybe it's more so,
how do you resist the urge not to want to
you know, pull them along and and just help them
(32:47):
and show them. I mean, your your life could be
so much better. Let me help you. Um, how do
you and how have you manage I guess personally um
with close friends or family members and kind of recognizing, gosh,
I love you, but I have to dis to myself,
you know. As honorable as that sounds and feels, it's
(33:09):
actually very very um sometimes deceptive self sabotage. This idea
that we're someone else's savior, right, this idea that we're
charged with being a superhero and carrying someone on our back,
or that we are meant to fix them. Very often
that is an extra layer of our own trauma, our
(33:32):
own coping mechanisms, and our tools of avoidance. You know,
I for the first few years on this journey, especially
as someone who was kind of on this journey before
UM mental health was really coined or like this training
or it became mainstream, and before uh, you know, everyone
(33:55):
had access to the books and the memes and the things.
It can mean doubly isolating. It can be very lonely.
Make no mistake, you know. It is frustrating because you're
understanding the depth of UM, the extreme polarities about being alive, joy, grief, hardship, happiness,
(34:19):
Like we are always in between two extremes. So one
kind of really challenging yourself. What is my obsession with
making someone else change or getting them to get it?
Can I turn my gaze inward? You know? Is that
actually called to come back to self and to stop
looking at someone through my judgments Because even though they
(34:42):
are quote unquote good judgments, right like you to want
more for yourself, I want you to have more, it's
also a judgment because we're saying I don't have faith
or belief that that person can do it for themselves.
I don't make your belief that their life is perfectly
disign for them and that they will connect with the
(35:03):
tools if it is on their path and supposed to
be possible. UM. So I think always turning the gays
in word and choosing to not be filled with frustration
for another's life choices and behaviors, but turning that gaze
towards If I don't like that, what's another choice I
(35:25):
can make? Right? I mean, that's like that was like
an indirect read, like, oh my god, that thank you
for that? And every I feel like every time you
say something, every time you drop a gym girl, I'm like,
I just have to receive it. It's like a deep inhale. Um.
So thank you. I do want to acknowledge. We got
(35:45):
a few questions from the audience, So someone said, you know,
I loved hearing your perspective on compassion. How do you
shift your default from personal anger, bitterness, pain, et cetera
um to a place of more empathy and compassion and
thoughts on that. Oh yes, thank you for that and
whoever shared it. You have to get in your practice.
(36:08):
You know something that I feel is a true responsibility
of mine to share when I speak. Is that growth,
real change, an ability to be a version of yourself
you haven't been yet. It is not done in a
weekend of vision boarding. It is not done by just
(36:28):
listening to my conversation today. It is by listening to
this conversation and reflecting on it over time, and then
taking things you heard and putting them an active process
with you in every single day. Coming into a space,
especially if your intention is to be in a space
(36:48):
where you hold more empathy and compassion for yourself and others,
you have to build a structure that supports that intention.
You have to be clear and say out loud that
that is your intention, and create some processes UM, whether
that is at home, personal meditation, opportunities to have nourishing
(37:11):
experiences for yourself, reading books, journaling your thoughts, having expression
about the things in your life, and or experiencing you know,
UM therapy whatever type that is needed, whether that is cognitive, somatic,
DPT for some, there's so many different kinds of therapy,
(37:33):
or group therapy, or or seeking outside council. You know,
you have to actually make all of those things daily
choices and part of the new ways you'll be experiencing
yourself and your life regularly to be able to live
from that space. And it does not take as long
(37:54):
as you'd imagine, but it does take thought and intention
and I think you um when you say thought and
intention and you. You've touched on this many times to
just being alone with ourselves, and when we think about
how often we truly avoid being alone with ourselves, and
(38:14):
I think a lot of times even now, we we
think about, um, you know, listening to music as therapeutic
and just always kind of having some sort of background noise,
But how often are we truly sitting alone with our
own thoughts? And I feel like that truly is kind
of the first key and really understanding who you are,
your desires, your wants, and like you said, uncovering that
true personality and unpacking maybe what was imprinted in diving
(38:38):
into who you truly are. Yes, another question that came
in so someone said, Um, Debbie, I'm an impact and
can feel that your message is resonating with so many
people watching. But can you also touch on living and
acting in vibrational alignment with what you are looking for?
So I eat the law of attraction. I found when
(38:59):
talking to many there's about their own awakening journey, that
this is a piece that many people miss. Yeah, absolutely,
it is. So my response to this, and I think
I experience it um similarly but slightly different to the
law of attraction. I believe in aligned choice making. And
(39:19):
so if you are clear that you want your life
to be different, if there has been awarenesses that have
come through, and if there have been real consideration and
thought about how you make this happen day today, awareness
and alignment in your choices and in your daily behavior
(39:41):
and action are what really support that vibrational alignment that
allow you to become a magnetic presence in this world,
that allow you to have experiences that, um, the words
I used for myself are shrouded in a lot of
grace and ease. When you've admitted to wanting change and
(40:02):
there is an intention set and you are being very
intentional about your personal behavior always matching your intention. We
cannot control others. So I am not saying that people
are not going to try you right like I'm not
saying that people aren't gonna still become ring up running
up to you with the exact things that I've been doing.
(40:22):
But we notice is that when you stay in your integrity,
when you stay in your aligned choices, very quickly, that
shifts very eally. You start really connecting to a higher
version of even the people that you know, and you
start calling in and making space for people that are
much more of a vibrational fit for your life, more
(40:46):
connected to the level of consciousness that you wish to
be living in. And so those day to day choices
of really staying in personal integrity, making a higher choice,
not a codependent choice, right, not a nice voice, and
I know something because I think I'll be perceived by
another in this way, I'm making the choice that is
(41:07):
the best fit for my intention, and I am not
causing harm to others. That vibrational alignment ushers in everything.
So I have recognized in myself and in clients and
in many people that I've worked with over the years.
It leads to an ease in your healing process. It
leads to a rapid amount of breakthrough thoughts, which enhances
(41:30):
your creativity and enhances your own ability to experience yourself.
And you begin to notice that the types of experiences
that you kept repeating with people, whether that was maybe
um having a consistent menu of betrayals in your life,
having to consist any of maybe friends that don't have
(41:50):
the emotional intelligence that you do or the heart that
you do, You start to notice that that is naturally
being cast aside, and that um, how your choices and
how your versions of experiences begin to come in effortlessly
really through no um, no extreme seeking of yours. You
(42:13):
are drawing these things to you. But it all happens
because of who you're choosing to be consistently. M wow,
and I think podcast episode I need this audio. This
is you are so incredible with me. Thank you. I
would be honor Debbie. UM. But you talked about, you
(42:35):
know a lot of times how we find ourselves kind
of repeating cycles, UM. And it reminds you, honestly of
one of my favorite UM gospel songs about cycles. UM.
And in the song it states, you know, the devil
learns from your mistakes even if you don't. And within
this conversation, okay, now I started thinking about, like what
(42:56):
the devil watching like generations of us, right and repeating
those same cycles and giving us those same lessons, but
even within ourselves, UM, consciously trying to break those cycles
and learn. You talked about, you know, repeated betrayals and
understanding you know, why am I being presented with the
same lessons and how can I break that cycle? UM?
That's really powerful? Thank you. Uh. Maybe I did also
(43:19):
want to ask, do you have any tangible resources or
like favorite books are and go free to drop. You
know the title of your book and your cards and
all that, UM, but any tangible UM items that people
can build UM can use to build their own toolbox
of daily practices for our own mental health. And also
did want to UM let the audience know we have
(43:39):
about ten minutes left for questions or Debbie leads it
into meditation, so if you want to submit those, but yeah,
any tangible resources that you that you have for us. Absolutely,
I think first I would UM shameless not shameless plug,
but I would definitely recommend my podcast and what I
really love about my podcast. So some of the background
(44:00):
is I am a meditation teacher, i am a trauma
informed healer, I'm an energy healer some other things as well.
But everything we talk about on that show is from
that very very practical lens of how can I connect
to this information and live it? How can you make
this useful and of service to myself and others right now?
(44:25):
And on the show UM, sometimes it's just me talking
and I'm answering questions or doing meditations, but I really
seek out all of the emerging and often unknown thought
leaders in this space of wellness across a really multidimensional view. So,
you know, when I think of wellness the way that
(44:45):
we speak to it publicly now, it's very centered on
mental health. But I believe in the pillars of well being.
I believe that we have to have a holistic lens
for everything that we want to manifest in our life
with which means meeting it mentally, physically, emotionally, and spiritually
and so on that show we touch on, we talked
(45:07):
about psychedelics and leading information in the psychedelic field with
experts in that space of how that extends itself to healing.
I have spoken with somatic therapists, with psychotherapists, with shamans,
with medicine, women, with elders who have been doing this
work in indigenous spaces for decades. We talk about intimacy,
(45:29):
we talk about you know, so many different layers of
how complex sometimes our experiences show up in our lives.
So that is something that I really love about being
able to do that show in that way with the
Black Effect Network. I would also recommend you know, there's
so many gorgeous books that can kind of really begin
(45:50):
to your consciousness. I believe in looking for books that
are about a higher awakening, that are specifically about conscious
us and so UM. Dr Deepak Chobra is a phenomenal,
phenomenal resource for that. His life's work has been a
blessing to myself and so many and he you know,
(46:12):
he's written nearly a hundred books in the course of
his life. Some things that people don't know is that
you know, in a lot of his books he explores
consciousness through not just wisdom traditions, but you know a
book that he has a few books on Christ, on
Jesus and Christ consciousness and your Veda and you know
(46:34):
Vedic philosophy, quantum physics. Those books are so powerful. I
think start with UM the seven spiritual Laws of Success,
because I think those laws really begin to expand us
in a way UM that has a lot of ease
to it. To understand um our ability as creators in
(46:55):
our own life too create new pathways for ourselves. UM.
I also really recommend my dear friend Resumminicum's books. He
has uh my Grandmother's Hands that I mentioned, and he
also has his latest book, The Quaking of America, which
is really exploring this intersection of spirituality and social and
(47:15):
racial justice. Another book that I really love right now,
especially from more of a feminine point of view, would
be Elizabeth Lesser's book Cassandra Speaks and exploring the intersectionality
of spirituality, awakening to consciousness, and feminism. So there's there's
(47:36):
so many different ways to approach this work, but those
books I think are really powerful. One more by Elizabeth Lesser,
a book that I love is called Broken Open. I
think it's a really gorgeous way to shift your understanding
of pain you have experience in your life and how
to really use that as a fuel for more. Thank you,
(48:00):
And I'm gonna sprinkle one in there too, UM from
an amazing conversation that you had with Dr Rita Walker. Um.
So Dr Rita Walker, psychologist, researcher, um, but the author
of a book that I will recommend UM on, an
Unapologetic Guide to Black Mental Health. True. So, Debvie, I
(48:24):
just want to thank you. Someone says, you know, I
have tears in my eyes, UM, just listening to you,
so thank you so much for being here. And before
we get into the meditation, just want to reiterate the
importance of UM this session and why I asked you
to join us. Today. So UM, going back to the
conversation that you had with Dr Rita Walker, you all
talked about UM, this element of forced resilience UM and
(48:48):
MYOP communities. I think you've done such a phenomenal job
of talking us through UM just how much that can
impact and really imprints on us UM, but also recognizing
the importance of awareness forgiveness UM and how to embark
on our mental health journey. So thank you so so
much for sharing UM sharing that, and then you also
(49:10):
talked about, you know, the complex post traumatic stress UM.
So thank you for being here with us today and
before we go into the meditation, is there anything else
that you would like to I guess leave the leave
the guests with before we get into our zone. Yes,
I would share, you know, just really spend time thinking
(49:36):
where in my life can I slow down if I
get present enough, you know, is there opportunity to walk
slower sometimes? Is there opportunity as I'm rushing through my
house or for those that have children, as I'm getting
you know, my children ready to not have to feel
so frantic about it, to heat a little bit of
(49:56):
different language in the way that I speak to myself
and the way that I speak to my children or others,
you know, is their way to slow down in the
present moment. Sometimes that's not possible, and I want to
honor that, But in some moments it really is, and
we don't recognize it possible to do that, just start
(50:18):
thinking that thought, seeing where it leads you day to
day in your day choices, your daily interactions, the small moments,
how quickly you may be making your coffee, the energy
you are giving off if you're somewhere ordering a coffee,
you're walking as their opportunity to put my back a
little bit straighter as I do, is there own to
(50:42):
connect to my breath and to slow down, especially when
it's just me by myself. Those moments give you the
powerful ability to start shifting your bigger life choices and
the bigger ability to play with time, to be really
present in the things that matter to you. Because one
(51:03):
of the hardships of um sometimes feeling like you're in
a battle with your mental or emotional health. That robs
you of the good moments too, Because we are ourselves
to move so quickly through moments of discomfort that our
bodies and brains and hearts now move really quickly through
(51:24):
the good stuff too through the joy, and so we
don't even get to feel that, and we deserved to
feel that when it's present. Absolutely, thank you, thank you,
thank you. And I think this session has done a
really great job of UM putting answer perspective. So at
most imports, we really like to approach to diversity, equity
(51:45):
and inclusion UM from a lens of empathy. And so
I think today with you sharing again just the impact
that UM some communities have had to face for centuries,
and how that has impacted mental health and the barriers
for generations to come, and how we're dealing with that
generational trauma and grief and UM now I'm barking on
(52:06):
these different healing practices. I think that does a great
job of just setting perspective so people can understand, UM,
you know why there are certain barriers for certain communities
when it comes to mental health and in those journeys.
So thank you so much, Debbie, and I am now
going to go backstage while you lead us through UM
a meditation for let's say, a session to over about
(52:29):
nine minutes, maybe five to six minutes or so beautiful. Okay,
everyone that can connect to the sound of my voice
right now that is joining us. And want to invite
you to notice your body before we close your eyes.
So wherever you happen to be sitting, you may be
(52:50):
in more of an upright chair similar to myself. You
may have found a little comfort on the ground. I
want to just invite you to get a little more comfortable.
So it just here the mean, if that feels good,
notice your body. Allow your spine to come into a
space that feels upright, strong and supportive, and allow your
(53:15):
belly in front of you to be soft. So it
really just let your stomach go a little and let
your spine be as straight and supportive as it can be.
And I want to invite you now to gently close
your eyes. And as you gently close your eyes, connect
(53:42):
to that body. And now come into your body and
connect to your breath. And as you're sitting now, it
might feel comfortable to bring one hand forward and connect
the palm of that hand to your heart's ace, or
it might feel comfortable to have both of your hands
(54:05):
poems up resting on your thighs in a state of receiving.
And here we're going to connect to a very simple
but powerful box breath. This is a system of four
seconds four times. So when I begin this breath process,
(54:26):
we will inhale through our nose for four seconds. Well,
then hold that breath at the top for four seconds.
Well then slowly release the breath through our nose for
four seconds. And then we'll hold our breath again at
the bottom for four seconds. And we will do that
(54:48):
together three times in a row. I'll keep the count
for us. Allow yourself to begin the inhale in through
your nose, now why and two three four hold the
breath two three four release through your nose two three four,
(55:20):
hold up the bottom two three four. Begin you're next
inhale here two three four hold it out the top
two three four and release through your nose two three
(55:50):
four and hold at the bottom two three four. Begin
your next in hell here, counting silently in your own mind,
hold it release m hm, hold and I gently returned
(56:28):
to a breath that feels nourishing in your body at
your own pace. I still gently closed m And from
this space, let's bring your awareness to the very top
of your head, your crown, and slowly begin to scan
(56:53):
from the inside out, slowly moving from the top of
your head down own noticing your ears, your jaw, Is
there opportunity to relax your jaw here, release your face
down your neck now noticing your shoulders, is there opportunity
(57:17):
to release and relax your shoulders. Spine still straight and supportive,
belly still soft, Breath gently flowing in and out from
your chest, moving down now your chest, noticing your heart,
(57:38):
greeting it, moving down to your elbows, to your waist,
noticing and releasing your hips, the tops of your legs,
(57:58):
your knees, mhmm, your calves, your ankles, your feet, your toes.
Taking a nice deep breath in here, nourishing all of
your organs and releasing and connecting to your breath, bringing
(58:36):
your awareness to the center of your chest, the very
center of your heart and your heart space. And now
I'm going to bring forward the four soul questions. And
as I say each question, allowed allow yourself to ask
(58:58):
the question silently internally to yourself, without trying to fill
it with an answer. Who am I? Who am I?
What do I really want? What do I really want?
(59:30):
What is my purpose? What is my purpose? How can
I serve? How can I serve? And releasing the questions,
(59:57):
taking it deep in hell, here in through your nose.
Try for six seconds one, two, three, four, five six,
releasing through your mouth with a sigh. We'll do that
(01:00:20):
breath one more time together, keeping your own count here.
M hm mh. Coming back into the present moment, waking
(01:00:41):
your body up, wiggling your toes, wiggling your fingers, shaking
out your shoulders, coming into the present moment. The light
in me recognizes and honors the light in you. Taking
a brief bow for myself and others generally, opening your
(01:01:07):
eyes and not mistake m M. I love that conversation.
Thank you once again to Molson, to Whitney for this
dynamic conversation that you also courageously had within your workspace,
(01:01:27):
within your corporation, very impactful corporation in the world. Thank
you for letting me have a space to expand on
thoughts and ideas that are incredibly important to me and
to my work in the world. It's a big love
to you, Molson, grow, big love to you Whitney. You
enjoyed this conversation and especially if it really resonated as
(01:01:51):
something you think should be heard in your work space,
I want to go ahead and encourage you and give
you that permission maybe drop this conversation in the Slack channel.
Drop this conversation at the next meeting and really begin
to explore and dissect and unpack some of things that
we have the opportunity to talk about. Leave a comment
(01:02:13):
and if I've started rating, if you feel so, calls
and if you have the band with today and we
will be back next week. Your soul work for this
week is suggest think of three things that you found
interesting in this conversation or that resonated or that led
you to another place of yourself, and write down the
thoughts that you're experiencing right now. Catch you next week,
(01:02:37):
Big Love. Hey, find me on social Let's connect at
Debbie Brown. That's Twitter and Instagram, or go to my
website Debbie Brown dot com. And if you're listening to
the show on Apple Podcasts, please please please don't forget
to rate, review and subscribe and send this episode to
(01:02:58):
a friend. Drop James is the production of I Heart
Radio and The Black Effect Network. It's produced by Jackie's
and me, Debbie Brown. For more podcasts from My Heart Radio,
visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.
M from grandmothers who whispered in their baby girl ill
two fathers on dimly lit street corners, instructing young soldiers
to always keep their eyes open. You be queen, you
(00:21):
were fired. You will pass through centuries on the hands
of your daughters. They called you wisdom. Proverbs on the
backs of diamond eyed school children who grew into hymnals
recited by amethyst holding urban philosophers who recited neighborhood commandments
out of the windows of restored Alchemedo chariots. To keep
the warmth of their blood. Be wise, be smart, being black,
(00:46):
opal brown courts, bloodstone, and prayer. Be every form of
jim see King told, scribe, scribe, told son, son, told wife,
wife told her daughter, and daughter told the as this is.
Told me that you would come to give wisdom. They
(01:06):
said you would come. Dropping Hey, Welcome back to the
Dropping Gym's podcasts, your soft place to land for conversations
on higher consciousness and making all of our healing applicable
to our day to day lives. This is a place
of self discovery, This is a place of honest, non
(01:28):
judgmental communication, and this is the place to expand. This week.
I am very excited to share this conversation with you.
One of our amazing sponsors here at the Black Effect
Network and I Heart Radio is the most in group,
and they invited me into their offices to have a
fireside chat with the very dynamic woman who runs and
(01:51):
heads their diversity and inclusion, Whitney Goins, And it was
such a privilege to be in conversation with her. It
was really cool finding out that she is an avid
listener of The Dropping Gym's podcast. And when I tell you,
we went so deep, We went so deep that this
conversation honestly really moved me, and I was thinking about
(02:12):
it for days afterwards. Especially, I was thinking about Whitney,
the amazing woman who's doing such powerful work at that company,
and had just the absolutely most beautiful, expansive, divine conversation
with her. It was such a pleasure to answer these
questions and to hear her thoughts and to connect with
(02:33):
those in the audience. And so they did me the
honor of allowing me to share this very private speaking
that I did for them, very private private speaking that
I did for them with my Dropping Gem's audience. So huge, huge,
thank you, so much gratitude to Molson. So much gratitude
to Whitney. You are incredible. Love speaking with you and
(02:56):
so happy to share this conversation with you. Some of
the things we i'ved into with structural oppression, we dove
into wellness in the workplace, and we also talked at
a very high level about what it is to really
expand diversity and inclusion, especially in the wellness space. So
(03:17):
these are the conversations I love having. This is some
of the corporate side work that I do, and I'm
excited to share it with you here. So please take
a listen to all of the beautiful gems, to all
of the incredible questions UM, and and considerations that Whitney shared,
And here we go. Oh my goodness, it's such a
(03:40):
pleasure to be here, UM, and thank you for being
here with us today. Thank you so much for joining.
I cannot tell you how many messages UM, the d
e I team has received expressing the pure excitement to
have you joined us today. So I really just want
to reiterate the undeniable impact, UM, that you are having
on the lives of so so many and we're just
(04:03):
so grateful that you've created, as you like to say
on your podcast as a soft place for us to land.
So thank you, thank you so much. Wow. So, Debbie
in our conversation today talking about mental health in the
bipoch community, UM, first, I would really love to just
start by talking a bit about your journey. Um So.
You you've mentioned, you know how oftentimes you would walk
(04:26):
into these spaces and maybe the only person that looks
like um you, so he tell us what was the
catalyst for your journey or exploration into the mental health
and healing space? Wow, what a beautiful question, you know
when they I think when I look back at like
some of the early trappings of my life, I think
we all kind of have this undercurrent of a knowing
(04:47):
that there's more available to us, or that maybe experiences
we've had in our lives maybe there's something more, Maybe
there's something better, or maybe there's something we need to explore.
Whether we tune into it or not is completely up
to our spirits and the timing in our life. But
you know, my initial my initial career in broadcasting, UM,
(05:10):
I started to get really burned out and I started
really feel like ego was leading my life in a
way that was not sustainable or healthy and terminology then,
But when I started having anxiety before I walked into
the building at work, because it seemed so against who
I was, I knew something had to shift. And that's
(05:33):
when I started my my mental health, emotional health, spiritual
health journey. This is roughly around somewhere in between ten
and twelve years ago when I went to my very
first retreat, and initially I walked in that space and
I was experiencing just a profound upgrade in my consciousness
and the way that I was able to see myself
in the world. And while I was having that experience,
(05:55):
I was also having the dual experience of being the
only per sin of color in every room and the
youngest person at the time in all of those rooms.
And so it was this experience that was also very
similar to what it is to be a person of
color in this country, this dual existence of having a
challenge that not everyone is aware of and still having
(06:19):
a life that is filled with all the things that
life is filled with. Um that's when I really started
to look not only at my own journey, but why
some of this work did it always feel so accessible
or organic in other non white communities, so touching on that. Um,
I'm really interested to hear your perspective on you know,
(06:41):
why do you think that people of color are behind
or maybe even hesitant in a mental health space? You know,
what are what are those barriers? So this is gonna
be a pretty full answer because it's not just one thing.
You know, we have to think of historical context any
time we have conversation about people of color, specifically in
(07:02):
this country. And you know there it's interesting right when
we think of wellness, when we think of the ability
to tap into well being, even though it's been put
under the capitalistic filter, it is free, being quiet, sitting still,
connecting with nature. It is something we can kind of
naturally do. But if you think of some of the
(07:22):
barriers we have in place our own mental health, like
centuries of having experiences that were deeply harmful, uh, not
just physically but emotionally and spiritually, and never being able
to talk about them, or if you talked about them,
nothing ever changed. We saw advancement and immense suppression at
(07:43):
every turn. We've witnessed immense violence, um harm to women,
to children, to our men, And so that as the
undercurrent of an experience of of seeking more for yourself.
It's always going to limit you in a subconscious way.
We and think about things like going out and connecting
with nature, right going camping or taking a hike. That
(08:06):
feels natural in our day to day culture. But if
you look historically, black and brown people were segregated and
not allowed to visit national parks, state parks, the beaches
were segregated. Some things that seem natural and easy in
the year of two, there could be potentially subconscious experiences
(08:27):
at play that just make you think you can't access
those things. And then there's a lot of cultural programming,
and I think all of us, no matter the cultural background,
we're awakening into a new time where you can speak
freely about your own lived experience. And it was just
a couple of decades ago that I think it was
(08:47):
really commonplace in most households to say, don't show your
dirty laundry, don't talk about it. We're fine over it,
you know. So there there are so many structures at
play that keep us from ourselves, and I think it's
really important to reflect on that because it helps us
have the courage to stand up for ourselves, to come
(09:09):
more and to cast aside maybe behaviors or thought processes
that don't nourish our mental health, right and you mentioned, um,
you know, don't air dirty laundry and things like that.
They go one thing you forgot about two was oh,
just go pray about it, right, Um. So there was
always that, um, you know, and I think having religion,
(09:31):
as you know, such a cornerstone is beautiful, but sometimes
I think we would use it to almost cover up
the mental health journey that probably should be embarked upon. Right.
So I feel like that was also another barrier, um
as far as education understanding that you know, just because
I am seeking out this particular um, I'm trying to
(09:52):
learn about mental health in other ways of healing, does
not me I'm necessarily going against the religion. But I
was raised with as well. That is so beautifully said.
And if I can add, you know, sometimes in the
systems of our deep belief culturally, in the systems of
the churches and how they really held us up in
communities when there weren't spaces for that. There is so
(10:13):
much beauty in that and so much necessity in that,
and very often it lacks process for real change. You know,
something about sometimes going into a church setting and that
being the only place that you look for more is
it bypasses the actual experience and process of what it
(10:34):
is to change oneself and it goes directly to the
have faith and more. But if we're biblically, you know
what is found in the Bible is space with faith
without works is dead. And so it's so much more
sometimes than just coming in and kind of putting on
that performative everything will be okay. I have faith there
(10:54):
are real things that we experience in this life that
are deeply complex and layer that I have to have
additional processes and care to be able to work through
and transcend. Absolutely, thank you for adding that on That
was beautifully said, UM. And in your previous answer you
also talked about just like UM, we started talking about
(11:16):
barriers the centuries um of things that Bipop communities have
had to experience. And on your podcast Dropping Gems, I've
also heard you speak about generational imprinting. UM. For those
who are maybe not familiar with the term, would you
mind explaining what generational imprinting is for the audience. Audience, Absolutely,
(11:37):
and the way that I conveyed on my show, it's
in ourier, generational trauma or what we're kind of more
loosely referring to as generational trauma, and that is really
um it's the impact of every generation that preceded us
on not only our mental and emotional health, but also
the cells of our physical body. And the Box is
(11:57):
having a lot of research around this, but there is
you know, a beautiful example would be when you think
about things that maybe went on in your grandmother's history
for those of us that are able to be connected
to knowledge and stories of previous generations, if your grandmother
went through a trauma, which let's be kind of um
(12:22):
real about this, if you are a person of color
in this country, almost every single generation, including those living
have experience not just trauma, but complex trauma, which means
things that are stacked upon you every single day, which
is a little bit more intricate than the experience of PTSD,
(12:43):
which is also a piece of that, but c PTSD
means it's not just one thing. It is the fibers
of everything in your life regularly, consistently. And so if
someone in your family system experience a trauma, uh or
several traumas, that would impact the way they were able
(13:04):
to parent you based on what they had access to
for their own healing. Something that we almost i would
say universally, though nothing is a monolith, something that we
almost universally know is that no generation before this one
really had access to therapy, had access to meditation, had
(13:24):
access to all the books or the Instagram memes or
the things that are now motivating us. You internalize it, right,
And a lot of previous generations also had a lot
of disease in their body that was manifesting from this
emotional mental pain. And so if your ancestor your elder
(13:44):
did not get a chance to work through these things,
to heal themselves, to find another way of being, the
way they parented, you was impacted by that, which could
mean many things. Could potentially mean some emotional neglect, it
could mean physical experiences of abuse um or it could
just mean continuing living a really challenging life and not
(14:07):
having opportunities for your mental health. That then it's passed
down to you, and until someone stops it or shifts
the experiences, it continues down. It continues down. So we
are generation of healing. This is the first time in
human history that we know of that we have collectively,
in a mainstream way, begun speaking to these bigger elements
(14:31):
and beginning to attempt to work through them. So if
that's the case right now, in that means for the
last let's say, five hundred years or three thousand, all
of that was happening, All of that was happening until
it met you in this moment. So that's pretty much
a simplistic way of sharing how that process can work
(14:53):
in our lives and in our families. Thank you when
you said, UM, you know, just think about like your grandmother, Like,
I like instantly felt myself getting emotional, like just thinking
about you know what the generations before us have gone through. UM,
And I feel like, I mean you you made some
really amazing points UM as far as us being the
(15:14):
generation of healing and just the additional resources that we have.
But also you talked about UM, you know, parenting and
understanding that you know, a lot of times our parents
are merely giving us what they were given, right, So
sometimes you just don't have those resources and UM, you're
doing the best that you can with what you were given.
And I know you talk a lot about healed parenting
on UM your podcasts and in many interviews, but I
(15:37):
think that we have to also understand Um, It's like
a lot of the getting over generational trauma and starting
our healing starts with forgiveness as well. So I really
wanted to transition into more about that generational trauma and
ancestral healing. I'm starting, particularly UM with generational trauma. So
(15:57):
staying on that path of UM trauma and grief. I
heard you quote one time and you said, grief never
leaves you, it just changes forms. And I thought that
was such an amazing and powerful quote as we think
about it, going back to the conversation of you know,
generations again, so that past being passed down, the changing forms. Right.
So I mentioned forgiveness, but what are some other ways
(16:20):
that you suggest, UM on how we can deal with
grief that has become so generational, so familiar, that it
almost feels like you can't escape, Like it's it's become
a part of the DNA. Yeah, absolutely, and it and
it absolutely has. It has become a part of our DNA.
It has been, you know, become trapped in ourselves. And
(16:40):
I think as science continues to explore and substantiate the
very real things that so many people have known and
spoken to over the centuries, you know, it's in There's
a There's a really amazing book, and I think this
example might might really fit. Um. Many books are out
now gratefully on helping to unpack some of this understanding
(17:04):
of the way things get stored in our bodies. The
Body Keeps Or is a really beautiful book. I also
love Resuma Manicans My Grandmother's Hands. One of the things
Resuma speaks to in that book is he shares a
powerful example of how trauma manifests as personality. And you
may not even know it, and you may spend your
entire life behaving as you and it's not really the
(17:28):
truth of who you are. It's just the layers and
layers of trauma that have developed as the way you
show up in the world. So, for instance, if your
mother experienced a kind of trauma or had an upbringing
where she was forced to be quiet, or experience things
that made her go inside and be very quiet or
(17:50):
be very um minimized, she may pass down that pattern
of behavior to you, and you take it on because
that to what was role modeled for you. And so
you may be as someone who has social anxiety or
is very shy, or is not able to really stand
up for yourself and you don't know why, because maybe
(18:13):
your life experiences haven't added up for you to actually
be behaving that way. But somehow this is who you
are in the world. What's so important is that was
just that was your rearing right, so that was the
imprint of personality on you that you're now living. What
is so powerful and important is when we come into
a space of wanting more, wanting to investigate and really
(18:35):
support our mental health and our emotional health, you have
to stop and look at what makes you you and
be willing to challenge it a little bit, be willing
to get self aware enough to where you say, is
this actually the truth of who I am? Is there
an opportunity to change my behavior, to test out some
new things? And then you just have to get your
(18:58):
practice going, get your support going, you know, seek out
assistance to explore your mental health, perhaps with the therapist
if that feels right, or through meditation, um through different
somatic practice. But creating systems and structures that allow you
to explore yourself with support are incredibly important, and that
(19:20):
is how we begin to dismantle some of that programming.
We have to first figure out that it exists, see
where it's living inside of us, and then begin the
process of greeting it with awareness in order to release it.
But we have to be willing to see ourselves. We
have to, and I want to say that knowing that
for some people that is a lot more challenging than others.
(19:45):
Some of our stories are really deep, some of our
stories are really painful, and so I just want to
acknowledge that that sometimes the journey is more challenging than
other people. And that's why it feels like people may
be outpacing you or being able to, you know, get
their healing or their breakthrough faster. We have complex individual experiences. Wow,
(20:09):
if you all did not realize or understand why her
podcast was called dropping Gym's before because she just dropped
so many Oh my goodness, that was so beautifully, said
Debbie Um. And I think a lot of times, especially
I mean when I first tuned into your podcast, the
things that you kind of introduced this to it's our
(20:32):
first time hearing that. So too for someone to say,
you know, your personality actually may not be who you are,
and it's something that was imprinting and past. It's so
powerful and and almost earth shaking to hear UM and
you mentioned resma menicum and amazing for those of you
who are not familiar with resthma UM and author and psychotherapists.
(20:54):
But in your episode with him, Debbie, UM, he actually
talked about and I think it goes back to making
how hard it is to make sure that we're not
becoming numb to seeing this so often on TV or
in the media. But he he mentioned, you know, when
we watch black bodies being destroyed, UM, it creates a
collective anguish in our community, UM, and then a lot
(21:15):
of times we turn that collective anguish into personal anguish
and then UM it has such an effect on our
body that we don't realize. But on top of that,
we are then left trying to heal UM communal horrors
with individual healing strategies and it just simply doesn't work. UM.
So we kind of talked about the generational UM imprinting
(21:38):
and and the pain that that can cause. But where
do we start with attempting to heal those generational traumas?
I know you mentioned UM it starts with that awareness
and kind of confronting that head on, But any other
thoughts on just where to start because I know, like,
after people leave this conversation again, they're probably hearing things
for the first time. You're like, Okay, she just racked
my whole world. Where now where do I? Oh? Yes,
(22:03):
you know? And I want to say this with as
much gravity as possible because one thing, um, just in
my years of teaching and speaking to this, that you know,
I've begun to recognize as a norm is that very
often the response is shared seems so simplistic that people
(22:25):
can hear them, and they can hear them repeatedly and
still say, but where do I start? Where's the beginning space?
Because we think that those things could never actually match
the depths and the vastness of what we've gone through.
So if I were to offer something and say, you know,
first begin by connecting to your breath, get centered in
(22:47):
your body, that sounds so simple that if you are
a survivor of complex trauma, or if your life experiences
have just been complex, you reject it because you say,
what is breathing gonna do? What is two minutes or
thirty seconds of Okay, everyone wants to tell me to
(23:08):
close my eyes and no, you know, and it seems
um so unhelpful that you don't attempt. And the truth is,
some of those things that I'm gonna go through a
couple more in a moment, those are the exact things
that dismantle it and make this work possible. To live
your healing, to live in the things that you're seeking
(23:30):
for yourself and the growth that you're seeking for yourself.
It is the detailed, tiny still moments that allow the
grief to be met and released. And so when we
when I speak to meditation, when I speak to getting centered,
one of the things that comes up for a lot
of people, and this is I believe the starting point
(23:54):
is learning how to slow your body down. Because one
half of the spectrum um society has just taught us
to go, go, go, hustle, culture, grind, girl, boss yep,
kill it. So we're fast, fast, fast, fast, fast fast. Right. Also,
you may have had a parent that had a very
challenging experience raising you because of all the other things
(24:16):
happening in their life. So everything might have had to
feel come on, let's go, we gotta do this, Go
do do do do right. We're used to moving, walking
back for no reason, and even when you don't have
somewhere to go and We're used to avoiding ourselves with
our own thoughts, and sometimes it feels like a rumination,
like maybe they are intrusive thoughts of experiences you've had
(24:37):
that run on a loop in your mind and that
brings a lot of pain. Would also just be thinking
about everything but yourself all day, calling that care, concern,
and worry, but it being your tool of avoiding yourself.
These are not judgments. It's just important to see how
do we individually respond to things. When you take a
moment to begin a meditation practice, even if it's two
(25:01):
minutes a day, five minutes a day, eventually building up
to the recommended twenty five minutes two times a day,
you're able to connect to a part of yourself where
everything you've experienced is able to be processed, either released,
or it's able to find a new home. And so
when we begin a meditation practice, getting still in silent
(25:24):
sometimes feels really scary at first, because all of a sudden,
you're feeling everything you have been trying not to feel
your whole life that passes. In order to be free
of it, you have to feel it and it has
to be expressed. Meditation allows you to come into a
space where you're able to learn how to come back
(25:44):
into your body so that you can be present with
yourself and not constantly moving so fast, thinking so much
that before you know what, you look up and your
life is past and you don't really know how you
lived it. So those practice this is to begin find
time to be with yourself in a new way. If
(26:06):
you're not yet ready to sit down and close your
eyes and connect to the present moment, considering every day
taking a walk and being silent on that walk, if
it's around your block, if it's your lunch break, but
learn how to hold silence for yourself. Learn how to
not to choose the path of small talk first or
(26:30):
having conversation, so that you can control not being asked
questions or not speaking about yourself. It's important to notice
how we're responding to ourselves and then trying to slow down,
to look around, to be present while being quiet, to
be in the company of other people while being quiet. Um,
(26:52):
that would be a powerful first step. True. You also
mentioned you know, the hustle culture and and just constantly
grinding and we can go, go, go, yeah, and what
popped into my head? I wonder how much of that
(27:12):
is a response to feeling like we need to prove
our productivity or like a trauma or survival response. So
going back to again just generational, generationally feeling like we
have to do that we are a productive element of society. UM. Yeah,
that that popped into my head. And then you also
mentioned UM. Sometimes people you'll offer, you know, simple advice
(27:35):
and people will reject it. And I talked, UM, I
heard you talk about UM in a previous interview. How
sometimes if we don't know something, will reject it. In
in the example you actually use, sometimes we simply reject
joy because we haven't known that or felt that, or
maybe even seeing that UM within our household or within
our families. And again it's because we're constantly moving in
that survival UM survival mode. So going back to families, UM,
(28:01):
because I feel like, you know, not saying that within
the bipop communities UM, that we have stronger family ties,
but I will say that in bipot communities UM, family
is truly the cornerstone. Right, So when dealing with you
step out into the world and you're dealing with racism
and systemic oppression, coming home to your family has has
been that cornerstone that has helped you continue moving. But Debbie,
(28:24):
what do you do or what advice do you have
to offer for people who I feel like sometimes coming
home to their family also isn't safe. So, in this
era of hashtag protect your peace, um, how is it
possible to protect your peace but also um, not necessarily
desert your family when you feel like your family isn't
on that same healing path or maybe even awareness about
(28:45):
mental health. Ye, beautiful, beautiful question. We have to connect
to our peace first before we can ever consider or
manage or respond to another person's lack of peace. So
it's really important that you know, especially in service to
this question, if you are on a path of wanting
(29:06):
to have a different experience in your life or in
your family structure, making a commitment to that saying I
will do whatever is necessary to have the experiences I
know I want to have, to have the ability to
expand to do something differently. You know, UM, when you
(29:28):
connect to a higher consciousness, when you connect to a
deeper awareness about yourself, your impact on yourself, your impact
in the world. There are layers and levels to how
you will reintegrate to the rest of your life with
people who not be doing the work. And it's so
(29:48):
important to feed yourself to such an excess on this
spiritual journey that you are able to greet others from
your overflow and not from your So you're not taking
from you to be able to stand in that you
are experiencing that with an overflow and with compassion, because
the fact is, not everyone is going to change in
(30:12):
this lifetime. Not everyone is going to have the opportunity
or the ability to heal through things that have happened
to them. And something that has been powerful for me
is shifting into such a deep witnessing and compassion of
that right because if I have the ability to meet
myself with that courage and the practical, disciplined behavior that's
(30:35):
necessary for change, and someone else isn't. Something I'm for
sure is even if they don't say it, how much
that hurts, right, how much living like that is actually
very challenging. Even if this is the person that is
the antagonist of your life, that's a challenging life to
be in, and so one recognizing that, so you can
(30:56):
make it not personal. Because as you establish boundaries, people
will climb them, people will want to bypass them, and
coming into a space of recognizing that that is their trained,
learned behavior is not personal and looking through the lens
of how challenging it is for you to change and
(31:19):
knowing is that person doing the same work as I am?
Are they doing all of these things that I'm doing
that are very challenging for me? Mostly the answer is no.
And if it's no, you know, being realistic and saying, well,
how could I expect a different response? It's not about
them changing, It's about me changing, changing the way I
(31:41):
relate to their trauma and or choosing to distance myself
from it, because that is a very real choice that
can be made by each of us. You don't have
to stay in something because you've always been in it.
Mm hmm. And I feel like a lot of times
when we embark on these these journeys, um, whether it's
(32:04):
mental health or just overall improvement, a lot of times
you want to kind of drag people along with us,
um or like put on that superhero cape and like
when we talk about some of our our closest family
members or our friends. UM, So I understand what you
mean as far as accepting where they are and understanding
and recognizing I mean, gosh, if I'm if I'm doing
(32:26):
all this work and it's this hard for me, I
can only imagine you know, um, you know, are they
putting in that same amount of work? But how do you?
And I feel like I'm asking a question within the question,
how do you accept someone for or maybe it's more so,
how do you resist the urge not to want to
you know, pull them along and and just help them
(32:47):
and show them. I mean, your your life could be
so much better. Let me help you. Um, how do
you and how have you manage I guess personally um
with close friends or family members and kind of recognizing, gosh,
I love you, but I have to dis to myself,
you know. As honorable as that sounds and feels, it's
(33:09):
actually very very um sometimes deceptive self sabotage. This idea
that we're someone else's savior, right, this idea that we're
charged with being a superhero and carrying someone on our back,
or that we are meant to fix them. Very often
that is an extra layer of our own trauma, our
(33:32):
own coping mechanisms, and our tools of avoidance. You know,
I for the first few years on this journey, especially
as someone who was kind of on this journey before
UM mental health was really coined or like this training
or it became mainstream, and before uh, you know, everyone
(33:55):
had access to the books and the memes and the things.
It can mean doubly isolating. It can be very lonely.
Make no mistake, you know. It is frustrating because you're
understanding the depth of UM, the extreme polarities about being alive, joy, grief, hardship, happiness,
(34:19):
Like we are always in between two extremes. So one
kind of really challenging yourself. What is my obsession with
making someone else change or getting them to get it?
Can I turn my gaze inward? You know? Is that
actually called to come back to self and to stop
looking at someone through my judgments Because even though they
(34:42):
are quote unquote good judgments, right like you to want
more for yourself, I want you to have more, it's
also a judgment because we're saying I don't have faith
or belief that that person can do it for themselves.
I don't make your belief that their life is perfectly
disign for them and that they will connect with the
(35:03):
tools if it is on their path and supposed to
be possible. UM. So I think always turning the gays
in word and choosing to not be filled with frustration
for another's life choices and behaviors, but turning that gaze
towards If I don't like that, what's another choice I
(35:25):
can make? Right? I mean, that's like that was like
an indirect read, like, oh my god, that thank you
for that? And every I feel like every time you
say something, every time you drop a gym girl, I'm like,
I just have to receive it. It's like a deep inhale. Um.
So thank you. I do want to acknowledge. We got
(35:45):
a few questions from the audience, So someone said, you know,
I loved hearing your perspective on compassion. How do you
shift your default from personal anger, bitterness, pain, et cetera
um to a place of more empathy and compassion and
thoughts on that. Oh yes, thank you for that and
whoever shared it. You have to get in your practice.
(36:08):
You know something that I feel is a true responsibility
of mine to share when I speak. Is that growth,
real change, an ability to be a version of yourself
you haven't been yet. It is not done in a
weekend of vision boarding. It is not done by just
(36:28):
listening to my conversation today. It is by listening to
this conversation and reflecting on it over time, and then
taking things you heard and putting them an active process
with you in every single day. Coming into a space,
especially if your intention is to be in a space
(36:48):
where you hold more empathy and compassion for yourself and others,
you have to build a structure that supports that intention.
You have to be clear and say out loud that
that is your intention, and create some processes UM, whether
that is at home, personal meditation, opportunities to have nourishing
(37:11):
experiences for yourself, reading books, journaling your thoughts, having expression
about the things in your life, and or experiencing you know,
UM therapy whatever type that is needed, whether that is cognitive, somatic,
DPT for some, there's so many different kinds of therapy,
(37:33):
or group therapy, or or seeking outside council. You know,
you have to actually make all of those things daily
choices and part of the new ways you'll be experiencing
yourself and your life regularly to be able to live
from that space. And it does not take as long
(37:54):
as you'd imagine, but it does take thought and intention
and I think you um when you say thought and
intention and you. You've touched on this many times to
just being alone with ourselves, and when we think about
how often we truly avoid being alone with ourselves, and
(38:14):
I think a lot of times even now, we we
think about, um, you know, listening to music as therapeutic
and just always kind of having some sort of background noise,
But how often are we truly sitting alone with our
own thoughts? And I feel like that truly is kind
of the first key and really understanding who you are,
your desires, your wants, and like you said, uncovering that
true personality and unpacking maybe what was imprinted in diving
(38:38):
into who you truly are. Yes, another question that came
in so someone said, Um, Debbie, I'm an impact and
can feel that your message is resonating with so many
people watching. But can you also touch on living and
acting in vibrational alignment with what you are looking for?
So I eat the law of attraction. I found when
(38:59):
talking to many there's about their own awakening journey, that
this is a piece that many people miss. Yeah, absolutely,
it is. So my response to this, and I think
I experience it um similarly but slightly different to the
law of attraction. I believe in aligned choice making. And
(39:19):
so if you are clear that you want your life
to be different, if there has been awarenesses that have
come through, and if there have been real consideration and
thought about how you make this happen day today, awareness
and alignment in your choices and in your daily behavior
(39:41):
and action are what really support that vibrational alignment that
allow you to become a magnetic presence in this world,
that allow you to have experiences that, um, the words
I used for myself are shrouded in a lot of
grace and ease. When you've admitted to wanting change and
(40:02):
there is an intention set and you are being very
intentional about your personal behavior always matching your intention. We
cannot control others. So I am not saying that people
are not going to try you right like I'm not
saying that people aren't gonna still become ring up running
up to you with the exact things that I've been doing.
(40:22):
But we notice is that when you stay in your integrity,
when you stay in your aligned choices, very quickly, that
shifts very eally. You start really connecting to a higher
version of even the people that you know, and you
start calling in and making space for people that are
much more of a vibrational fit for your life, more
(40:46):
connected to the level of consciousness that you wish to
be living in. And so those day to day choices
of really staying in personal integrity, making a higher choice,
not a codependent choice, right, not a nice voice, and
I know something because I think I'll be perceived by
another in this way, I'm making the choice that is
(41:07):
the best fit for my intention, and I am not
causing harm to others. That vibrational alignment ushers in everything.
So I have recognized in myself and in clients and
in many people that I've worked with over the years.
It leads to an ease in your healing process. It
leads to a rapid amount of breakthrough thoughts, which enhances
(41:30):
your creativity and enhances your own ability to experience yourself.
And you begin to notice that the types of experiences
that you kept repeating with people, whether that was maybe
um having a consistent menu of betrayals in your life,
having to consist any of maybe friends that don't have
(41:50):
the emotional intelligence that you do or the heart that
you do, You start to notice that that is naturally
being cast aside, and that um, how your choices and
how your versions of experiences begin to come in effortlessly
really through no um, no extreme seeking of yours. You
(42:13):
are drawing these things to you. But it all happens
because of who you're choosing to be consistently. M wow,
and I think podcast episode I need this audio. This
is you are so incredible with me. Thank you. I
would be honor Debbie. UM. But you talked about, you
(42:35):
know a lot of times how we find ourselves kind
of repeating cycles, UM. And it reminds you, honestly of
one of my favorite UM gospel songs about cycles. UM.
And in the song it states, you know, the devil
learns from your mistakes even if you don't. And within
this conversation, okay, now I started thinking about, like what
(42:56):
the devil watching like generations of us, right and repeating
those same cycles and giving us those same lessons, but
even within ourselves, UM, consciously trying to break those cycles
and learn. You talked about, you know, repeated betrayals and
understanding you know, why am I being presented with the
same lessons and how can I break that cycle? UM?
That's really powerful? Thank you. Uh. Maybe I did also
(43:19):
want to ask, do you have any tangible resources or
like favorite books are and go free to drop. You
know the title of your book and your cards and
all that, UM, but any tangible UM items that people
can build UM can use to build their own toolbox
of daily practices for our own mental health. And also
did want to UM let the audience know we have
(43:39):
about ten minutes left for questions or Debbie leads it
into meditation, so if you want to submit those, but yeah,
any tangible resources that you that you have for us. Absolutely,
I think first I would UM shameless not shameless plug,
but I would definitely recommend my podcast and what I
really love about my podcast. So some of the background
(44:00):
is I am a meditation teacher, i am a trauma
informed healer, I'm an energy healer some other things as well.
But everything we talk about on that show is from
that very very practical lens of how can I connect
to this information and live it? How can you make
this useful and of service to myself and others right now?
(44:25):
And on the show UM, sometimes it's just me talking
and I'm answering questions or doing meditations, but I really
seek out all of the emerging and often unknown thought
leaders in this space of wellness across a really multidimensional view. So,
you know, when I think of wellness the way that
(44:45):
we speak to it publicly now, it's very centered on
mental health. But I believe in the pillars of well being.
I believe that we have to have a holistic lens
for everything that we want to manifest in our life
with which means meeting it mentally, physically, emotionally, and spiritually
and so on that show we touch on, we talked
(45:07):
about psychedelics and leading information in the psychedelic field with
experts in that space of how that extends itself to healing.
I have spoken with somatic therapists, with psychotherapists, with shamans,
with medicine, women, with elders who have been doing this
work in indigenous spaces for decades. We talk about intimacy,
(45:29):
we talk about you know, so many different layers of
how complex sometimes our experiences show up in our lives.
So that is something that I really love about being
able to do that show in that way with the
Black Effect Network. I would also recommend you know, there's
so many gorgeous books that can kind of really begin
(45:50):
to your consciousness. I believe in looking for books that
are about a higher awakening, that are specifically about conscious
us and so UM. Dr Deepak Chobra is a phenomenal,
phenomenal resource for that. His life's work has been a
blessing to myself and so many and he you know,
(46:12):
he's written nearly a hundred books in the course of
his life. Some things that people don't know is that
you know, in a lot of his books he explores
consciousness through not just wisdom traditions, but you know a
book that he has a few books on Christ, on
Jesus and Christ consciousness and your Veda and you know
(46:34):
Vedic philosophy, quantum physics. Those books are so powerful. I
think start with UM the seven spiritual Laws of Success,
because I think those laws really begin to expand us
in a way UM that has a lot of ease
to it. To understand um our ability as creators in
(46:55):
our own life too create new pathways for ourselves. UM.
I also really recommend my dear friend Resumminicum's books. He
has uh my Grandmother's Hands that I mentioned, and he
also has his latest book, The Quaking of America, which
is really exploring this intersection of spirituality and social and
(47:15):
racial justice. Another book that I really love right now,
especially from more of a feminine point of view, would
be Elizabeth Lesser's book Cassandra Speaks and exploring the intersectionality
of spirituality, awakening to consciousness, and feminism. So there's there's
(47:36):
so many different ways to approach this work, but those
books I think are really powerful. One more by Elizabeth Lesser,
a book that I love is called Broken Open. I
think it's a really gorgeous way to shift your understanding
of pain you have experience in your life and how
to really use that as a fuel for more. Thank you,
(48:00):
And I'm gonna sprinkle one in there too, UM from
an amazing conversation that you had with Dr Rita Walker. Um.
So Dr Rita Walker, psychologist, researcher, um, but the author
of a book that I will recommend UM on, an
Unapologetic Guide to Black Mental Health. True. So, Debvie, I
(48:24):
just want to thank you. Someone says, you know, I
have tears in my eyes, UM, just listening to you,
so thank you so much for being here. And before
we get into the meditation, just want to reiterate the
importance of UM this session and why I asked you
to join us. Today. So UM, going back to the
conversation that you had with Dr Rita Walker, you all
talked about UM, this element of forced resilience UM and
(48:48):
MYOP communities. I think you've done such a phenomenal job
of talking us through UM just how much that can
impact and really imprints on us UM, but also recognizing
the importance of awareness forgiveness UM and how to embark
on our mental health journey. So thank you so so
much for sharing UM sharing that, and then you also
(49:10):
talked about, you know, the complex post traumatic stress UM.
So thank you for being here with us today and
before we go into the meditation, is there anything else
that you would like to I guess leave the leave
the guests with before we get into our zone. Yes,
I would share, you know, just really spend time thinking
(49:36):
where in my life can I slow down if I
get present enough, you know, is there opportunity to walk
slower sometimes? Is there opportunity as I'm rushing through my
house or for those that have children, as I'm getting
you know, my children ready to not have to feel
so frantic about it, to heat a little bit of
(49:56):
different language in the way that I speak to myself
and the way that I speak to my children or others,
you know, is their way to slow down in the
present moment. Sometimes that's not possible, and I want to
honor that, But in some moments it really is, and
we don't recognize it possible to do that, just start
(50:18):
thinking that thought, seeing where it leads you day to
day in your day choices, your daily interactions, the small moments,
how quickly you may be making your coffee, the energy
you are giving off if you're somewhere ordering a coffee,
you're walking as their opportunity to put my back a
little bit straighter as I do, is there own to
(50:42):
connect to my breath and to slow down, especially when
it's just me by myself. Those moments give you the
powerful ability to start shifting your bigger life choices and
the bigger ability to play with time, to be really
present in the things that matter to you. Because one
(51:03):
of the hardships of um sometimes feeling like you're in
a battle with your mental or emotional health. That robs
you of the good moments too, Because we are ourselves
to move so quickly through moments of discomfort that our
bodies and brains and hearts now move really quickly through
(51:24):
the good stuff too through the joy, and so we
don't even get to feel that, and we deserved to
feel that when it's present. Absolutely, thank you, thank you,
thank you. And I think this session has done a
really great job of UM putting answer perspective. So at
most imports, we really like to approach to diversity, equity
(51:45):
and inclusion UM from a lens of empathy. And so
I think today with you sharing again just the impact
that UM some communities have had to face for centuries,
and how that has impacted mental health and the barriers
for generations to come, and how we're dealing with that
generational trauma and grief and UM now I'm barking on
(52:06):
these different healing practices. I think that does a great
job of just setting perspective so people can understand, UM,
you know why there are certain barriers for certain communities
when it comes to mental health and in those journeys.
So thank you so much, Debbie, and I am now
going to go backstage while you lead us through UM
a meditation for let's say, a session to over about
(52:29):
nine minutes, maybe five to six minutes or so beautiful. Okay,
everyone that can connect to the sound of my voice
right now that is joining us. And want to invite
you to notice your body before we close your eyes.
So wherever you happen to be sitting, you may be
(52:50):
in more of an upright chair similar to myself. You
may have found a little comfort on the ground. I
want to just invite you to get a little more comfortable.
So it just here the mean, if that feels good,
notice your body. Allow your spine to come into a
space that feels upright, strong and supportive, and allow your
(53:15):
belly in front of you to be soft. So it
really just let your stomach go a little and let
your spine be as straight and supportive as it can be.
And I want to invite you now to gently close
your eyes. And as you gently close your eyes, connect
(53:42):
to that body. And now come into your body and
connect to your breath. And as you're sitting now, it
might feel comfortable to bring one hand forward and connect
the palm of that hand to your heart's ace, or
it might feel comfortable to have both of your hands
(54:05):
poems up resting on your thighs in a state of receiving.
And here we're going to connect to a very simple
but powerful box breath. This is a system of four
seconds four times. So when I begin this breath process,
(54:26):
we will inhale through our nose for four seconds. Well,
then hold that breath at the top for four seconds.
Well then slowly release the breath through our nose for
four seconds. And then we'll hold our breath again at
the bottom for four seconds. And we will do that
(54:48):
together three times in a row. I'll keep the count
for us. Allow yourself to begin the inhale in through
your nose, now why and two three four hold the
breath two three four release through your nose two three four,
(55:20):
hold up the bottom two three four. Begin you're next
inhale here two three four hold it out the top
two three four and release through your nose two three
(55:50):
four and hold at the bottom two three four. Begin
your next in hell here, counting silently in your own mind,
hold it release m hm, hold and I gently returned
(56:28):
to a breath that feels nourishing in your body at
your own pace. I still gently closed m And from
this space, let's bring your awareness to the very top
of your head, your crown, and slowly begin to scan
(56:53):
from the inside out, slowly moving from the top of
your head down own noticing your ears, your jaw, Is
there opportunity to relax your jaw here, release your face
down your neck now noticing your shoulders, is there opportunity
(57:17):
to release and relax your shoulders. Spine still straight and supportive,
belly still soft, Breath gently flowing in and out from
your chest, moving down now your chest, noticing your heart,
(57:38):
greeting it, moving down to your elbows, to your waist,
noticing and releasing your hips, the tops of your legs,
(57:58):
your knees, mhmm, your calves, your ankles, your feet, your toes.
Taking a nice deep breath in here, nourishing all of
your organs and releasing and connecting to your breath, bringing
(58:36):
your awareness to the center of your chest, the very
center of your heart and your heart space. And now
I'm going to bring forward the four soul questions. And
as I say each question, allowed allow yourself to ask
(58:58):
the question silently internally to yourself, without trying to fill
it with an answer. Who am I? Who am I?
What do I really want? What do I really want?
(59:30):
What is my purpose? What is my purpose? How can
I serve? How can I serve? And releasing the questions,
(59:57):
taking it deep in hell, here in through your nose.
Try for six seconds one, two, three, four, five six,
releasing through your mouth with a sigh. We'll do that
(01:00:20):
breath one more time together, keeping your own count here.
M hm mh. Coming back into the present moment, waking
(01:00:41):
your body up, wiggling your toes, wiggling your fingers, shaking
out your shoulders, coming into the present moment. The light
in me recognizes and honors the light in you. Taking
a brief bow for myself and others generally, opening your
(01:01:07):
eyes and not mistake m M. I love that conversation.
Thank you once again to Molson, to Whitney for this
dynamic conversation that you also courageously had within your workspace,
(01:01:27):
within your corporation, very impactful corporation in the world. Thank
you for letting me have a space to expand on
thoughts and ideas that are incredibly important to me and
to my work in the world. It's a big love
to you, Molson, grow, big love to you Whitney. You
enjoyed this conversation and especially if it really resonated as
(01:01:51):
something you think should be heard in your work space,
I want to go ahead and encourage you and give
you that permission maybe drop this conversation in the Slack channel.
Drop this conversation at the next meeting and really begin
to explore and dissect and unpack some of things that
we have the opportunity to talk about. Leave a comment
(01:02:13):
and if I've started rating, if you feel so, calls
and if you have the band with today and we
will be back next week. Your soul work for this
week is suggest think of three things that you found
interesting in this conversation or that resonated or that led
you to another place of yourself, and write down the
thoughts that you're experiencing right now. Catch you next week,
(01:02:37):
Big Love. Hey, find me on social Let's connect at
Debbie Brown. That's Twitter and Instagram, or go to my
website Debbie Brown dot com. And if you're listening to
the show on Apple Podcasts, please please please don't forget
to rate, review and subscribe and send this episode to
(01:02:58):
a friend. Drop James is the production of I Heart
Radio and The Black Effect Network. It's produced by Jackie's
and me, Debbie Brown. For more podcasts from My Heart Radio,
visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.
Host
Devi Brown
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