One morning in April 2023, investigative reporter Jason Leopold wakes to a wild bit of news. According to a video released by a duo of Russian pranksters, Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell has been tricked into taking a video call with a Volodymyr Zelenskiy impersonator. How could this happen? Jason files a public records request, and documents from the Fed reveal the backstory ... that unfolds like a movie for your ears.
Fed emails read by comedians Josh Gondelman, Katherine Blanford and Adam Gilbert. Musical appearance (in Jason's head) by Fugazi.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Jason Leopold starts every morning the same way. He wakes
up in his Los Angeles home early, sometimes too early, sadly,
at like four or four or thirty. The house is still,
his wife sleeping, his dog, Bella Lakosi also sleeping. The
room's pitch black, curtains closed.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And then I see the glow of my cell phone
calling to me. Pick me up, Jason, pick me up.
See what's going on? Open me.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
As he reaches toward the nightstand for his phone, he's thinking.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Please, let there be a whole bunch of documents. Please,
Let there be a whole bunch of documents. Please. And
if there are documents, I'm not going to it first.
I want to save it till the very end.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
In the meantime, he's checking his push notifications for news
that broke on the East Coast while he slept.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
I'm thinking, okay, for your request. Interesting, We'll save it.
I wake up feeling like I constantly have to find
a new request. I don't like to fall behind. So
I've been building this pipeline for nearly twenty years.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
April twenty seventh, twenty twenty three, was no different. That day,
he was scrolling Twitter.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
It was called Twitter. Then he's scrolling, scrolling through. I'm scrolling,
scrolling through.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Until a tweet from his colleagues at Bloomberg caught his eye.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
FED chair Jerown Powell held a call with Russian pranksters
who were posing as Ukrainian President Voladimir Zelenski, according to
video shown on Russian TV. I mean, I just laughed.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Jason couldn't click the article fast enough, But after reading it,
he had more questions than answers. The most obvious.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
One, how the hell was he duped by Russian pranksters.
This is Jerome Powell. He's the chairman of the FED.
He said's interest rates? So, but how did that happen?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Jason left out of bed, giddy pacing.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I'm already imagining what the records look like. And I
know there's got to be records, and I'm playing out
the scenario of me getting the records.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Only one thing left to do.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I have to file a request right now, turn it up.
I'm investigative journalist Jason Leopold. I spend most of my
days getting documents from the government.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
I'm attorney Matt Topic, and I fight them in court
to open their files. When they don't want to from Bloomberg.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And No Smile. This is Disclosure, a podcast about buying
loose government secrets, the Freedom of Information Act, and the
unexpected places that takes us. Hey, Matt, have you ever
been pranked?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Like tip fall for a scam? It was an email
from someone It was like, I need help buying Amazon
gift cards. I don't know, like I can't get into where.
Can you please buy me these gift cards? And I'll
pay you back. But if you ever met the person
that it was purporting to be from, one hundred percent
that person would have done that. Like whoever scammed it,
they just dumb locked into like the exact right person,
(02:56):
and so like I kind of felt for it, and
then I got a call from Amazon. It was like, hey,
it looks like somebody's trying to scam me for these
And then I felt like a real idiot at that point.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Yeah, that is an elder abuse scam. I got to
look up your.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Age and I'm not even half as old as you.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
You know who else has been pranked? The Chairman of
the Federal Reserve, Jerome Powell. The thing is, Powell's a
guy who's walking in the shoes of Valan greens Band,
Ben Bernanki, and Janet Yellen. When a Fed chief coughs,
markets move. If there's a formula for job success, it's
that you run the central bank of the world's biggest
(03:36):
economic power while saying as little as humanly possible in
public about how you plan to do it. So back
in April twenty twenty three, Jerome Powell found himself in
a pickle. It turns out a meeting he thought he
had with Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelenski wasn't actually with Zelenzki
(03:56):
at all. It was with these two Russian pranksters. And
this all came to light in a video of their
meeting that went viral on social media. I see all
this and I am like, this is incredible Foyer material
like that. I knew there had to be a report.
I knew that there was probably, you know, a bunch
of emails behind the scenes. So I filed this request
(04:19):
with the Federal Reserve. What did you ask for it?
So whenever I file a request, I try to imagine,
like being a fly on the wall as everything's sort
of unfolding within a federal government agency. What does that
consist of? I'm imagining that while this was being planned,
that there's some email traffic, there's some discussions, and it
(04:39):
would be very clear that there'd be some kind of investigation, right.
I just know that from filing similar Foyer requests with
Agency Inspectors General. So I asked for final reports of
an investigation that may have taken place into how Powell
was duped, and so I kind of kept it pretty narrow.
I asked for a few days of records.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
You first get an acknowledgement that says, yes, we have
records and are processing them.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
So first just get an acknowledgment letter we got your request.
I check in with, you know, with the Federal Reserve.
They say they're processing the records. They send me a
few pages and withheld more than one hundred due to
an ongoing investigation. And the fighting begins with Federal Reserve
in terms of trying to probably lose these records. So
(05:26):
to quote the song Waiting Room by the great post
hardcore band Fugazi, I am a patient boy, Oh wait,
I wait, I wait, I wait. So I waited until
I got a nod from sources that the investigation was over,
and then in February twenty twenty four, I filed a
(05:48):
new request for some documents that I'd requested a year earlier,
and this time I hit paid dirt. I have to
hand it to the FED. They turn over a lot
of documents that really kind of lay out timeline, investigative reports,
staff emails with dates and timestamps, and I got to
tell you, the whole thing kind of played out like
a movie. So we're going to tell you parts of
(06:10):
it like it's a movie for your ears. We've even
invited a few comedians to read the emails. Oh yeah,
like who well, Matt, We've got Josh Gondleman, Katherine Blandford,
and Adam Gilbert.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
Awesome, I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
All right, here we go, Act one, Scene one. Just
after eight am on the morning of January tenth, twenty
twenty three, Powell's assistant received an email from Ukrainian email
address subject President of Ukraine Chairman Powell request it says
(06:43):
as read by Josh Gondleman, the way he would read
it if he was the one who wrote it, Dear redacted.
The employee's names were withheld.
Speaker 4 (06:52):
President of Ukraine Vladimir Zelenski would like to have a
conversation with Chairman of the Federal Reserve System, Honorable Jarre Powell.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
The email signature says it's from the Deputy Head of
the Office of President Selenski, a man named Kirilo Timoshenko.
He says Lensky wants to.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
Personally congratulate him with recent holidays.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
So wish him a happy New York Yes, and discuss
common issues and plans, such as.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
The impact of war in Ukraine on the world economy
and forecast on the economic situation in the world.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Wait, waito, Well, a foreign government wants to know what
the FEDS forecast of the future, Like everybody wants to
know that, right, right, isn't that like the thing they
don't do or when they do, it's like very very
carefully crafted.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
It's like, first of all, this is non public info.
I mean, yeah, totally, Howell probably does have a forecast
on the world economy based on you know, lots of
insider information, I hope. So, so the fact that they
even made that pitch, and you know, the assistant's like.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Right, so it's congratulations on the holidays. We want to
talk to you about the impact that the Ukrainian war
is having in the world economy, and we want to
know whether we should buy gold or what we should
do in the future before you make any public announceence. Okay,
all right, I'm with you, continued.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
He's like Zelenski just had a productive chat with the
President of the European Central Bank, Christine Legard. It went
so well. We want to do it again with Powell.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
We are ready to organize a video or telephone conversation
at any time convenient for your side. I will wait
for your response with best regards. Kirillo Timshenko.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Is Timyshenko a real person?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yes, that's the real name of an official for the
Ukrainian government. Four minutes later, Powell's assistant responded with this email,
as read by Catherine Blandford.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
We are in receipt of the request and we will
revert back.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
So do we have any idea how they got this
email address?
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yes, they got it from someone at the European Central Bank.
According to the rest of the email thread, if Leguard
took the meeting, Powell probably should too.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Do we know whether Powell has had other such calls
with other world leaders?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Like?
Speaker 3 (09:06):
Is this a normal common thing for him to be doing?
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Certainly other officials such as Christine Legard. I mean that
seems normal, but you know, speaking to the President of Ukraine.
I mean, yeah, it's I haven't seen any of it.
A few hours later, the assistant responded again, Powell had
agreed to the meeting. The assistant proposed dates and times.
They settled on January nineteenth, twenty twenty three, at nine
(09:32):
am Washington time.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
All right, So they're trying to sell it by being like, hey,
we know Zelensky previously talked to the European Central Bank?
Did that actually happen? Was there actually such a meeting?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Well, we'll get into that. A lot happened in those
nine days.
Speaker 6 (09:49):
Concern is mounting this morning over a new COVID sub
variant that is rapidly spreading across the country.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
About an hour and a half before the call was
scheduled to begin, one at the FED wrote an email
with a change of plans.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Their Kiri low chair Palell has tested positive for COVID.
He is very much looking forward to talking with President Zelenski,
but we would appreciate if the call today could be postponed.
We will work to reschedule the call as soon as possible.
Thank you for your understanding, Sincerely redacted.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Wait, do the records tell us what this person is
doing when they're sending the emails?
Speaker 2 (10:30):
No, Matt. Unfortunately these records do not include vibes. But
it's not hard to imagine the esteemed venues where important
government work takes place. So we've supplied some Less than
twenty minutes later, Dear.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Redacted, President Zelenski wish to share Powell.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
A speedy recovery.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Of course, let's move this conversation to a more favorable time. Also,
I know that this conversation is very important for President Zelenski,
and we are ready to arrange it at a convenient
time for Jair Powell as soon as possible.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
January twenty fourth, twenty twenty three was the new date
of the call. So January twenty fourth comes and Powell
is still recovering from COVID at home, but he's well
enough to put on a black sport jacket over a
white collared shirt and gold tie to hop on the
video call, and.
Speaker 6 (11:20):
We just say, it's a great honor to speak to you.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Now, we don't know what Powell is actually staring at
right here, because the recording doesn't show us a Lensky
side of the video call, but we can see Powell.
He's thin with a full head of gray white hair.
His virtual background appears to place him in a tranquil
reading nook with white walls, a yuppie white couch, and
a dainty white tea set overlooking us accluded forest.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
It's like, I know you're living in a war zone,
but look at this great environment that I get to
live in.
Speaker 6 (11:51):
I'm aware that Ukraine's suffering. People like me just want
to support you in any way we can, but I
have limited ways to do that in my professional job.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
All is clear from the jump that if this call
is about money for the war, there isn't much to discuss,
no matter.
Speaker 7 (12:07):
I think that you are a wise person, one of
the wisest person in the world.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
He asks about whether Russian sanctions are working.
Speaker 6 (12:16):
It seems like the Russians have been able to avoid
the harshest application of the sanctions.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
He debriefed Powell on his call with Christine Legard, who
he claims, said the United States can win any war
at any costs.
Speaker 7 (12:28):
There will be only one winner who has a big gun.
She told me that I like that.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
He even solicited Powell's opinion on his counterpart, Russian Central
bankhead Alvira Nebulina. She's quite good at her job.
Speaker 6 (12:41):
She's extraordinarily capable.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
At one point, the discussion veered into one of the
touchiest subjects pertaining to the US economy, interest rates.
Speaker 7 (12:49):
If the rate is raised further, the standards of living
of the population will fall. So how much should it
fall in order for the FETE to stop raising.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
The Powell sort of grimaced and looked off screen, perhaps
surprised by the question.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Why on earth would Zelensky be asking these questions? Isn't
Powell like, what the hell does this have to do
with Ukraine? He should have been very suspicious at this point.
Speaker 6 (13:15):
The market is already pricing in two more quarter percentage
point rate hikes. We'll look around after we make those
two and we'll say, you know, should we do any more?
And then the question will be how long do we
keep rates at this level? I think we'll keep him
there for quite some time.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Is this all things he's already said?
Speaker 6 (13:31):
Like?
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Is he just telling him what he's already publicly said?
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Well, that's the question. Well, let's come back to that.
And then comes the weird asks.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
We haven't gotten to the weird part yet.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, there yet.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Okay, all right, I'm so excited. Let's have it.
Speaker 7 (13:47):
If you could present me a printing press, I would
be really happy.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
We have one of those, but but we keep it
in the basement.
Speaker 7 (13:57):
Oh okay, you could also build a fourteenth for bank
or the Fed on our territory.
Speaker 5 (14:04):
We could do that.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Let me come back to you on that.
Speaker 6 (14:07):
Well, maybe we'll have a reserve bank and keep.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
He wants a pretty much. Wait, he's asking Powell if
he can have a printing press to print money. Is
that right?
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Yes, Diet, it's hilarious. The thirty minute call was zesty
to say, all thirty minute.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Call man, that's who should be running the US government,
is these pranksters? Because it's pretty good.
Speaker 7 (14:35):
I was really happy to talk to you.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And that was it. And mind you that this was
a two week ordeal of setting this up. According to
the documents the federal least, there was never once a
moment where anyone said, you know, hey, let's check out
the email addresses or or you know, have our security team,
(15:00):
you know, confirm any of this. It was just through
email setting it up. It was pretty easy.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
So no one on Powell's staff has ever seen the
movie Borat?
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Come on that this is a fan. You think they're
sitting around watching Borat?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
I mean somebody should.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Then three days after the meeting, that's when the unraveling began,
which you'll hear all about after the break. It's six
fifty nine am on January twenty seventh, twenty twenty three.
That's when a message lights up deer predacted.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
President Zelenski would like to thank Chair Powell once again
for this important conversation for us and express gratitude for
his professionalism.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
He has a small request.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Could you connect us with Secretary of the Treasury Janet
Yellen so that President Zelenski could discuss the economic situation
with hurt. President Zelenski would like to hold this conversation informally,
without the attention of the press. Therefore, we thought that
through you it would be fast and confidential.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
The assistant did as requested and shared Yellen's contact information.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
I can't wait to hear how that went over.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Then, a couple of weeks later, on February tenth, something
appeared to have spooked Powell's assistant. They emailed a person
in Leguard's office at the European Central Bank to ask
about Timyshenko's initial outreach.
Speaker 8 (16:35):
Dear redacted, I just want to confirm that the email
below Sea Trail is a legitimate email from you, and
that a phone call with President Zelensky did occur from
your office.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Best regards, redacted.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Then fifteen minutes later, Leguard's office responded, as read by
Adam Gilbert de redacted, and it sure didn't quell anyone's anxiety.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
She was a bit harry.
Speaker 9 (17:01):
We were in touch with mister Timoshenko and a video
call between President Zelenski and Madame mcguard took place on
sixth January.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
But in the meantime they explained that they'd recently learned
that Timoshenko had resigned from this position and shared a
Wikipedia link to prove it. Apparently he left office on
January twenty third, the day before the Powell meeting. They
had since heard from Timoshenko or someone claiming to be him,
which raised some alarm bells.
Speaker 9 (17:29):
So I assume this is not true, seeing that mister
Timoshenko now left the office of President Zelensky. In all
the above, I would be extra cautious when handling his request.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Kind regards, redacted.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Oh, so in other words, Leguard's office isn't sure if
they spoke to the real Timoshenko correct.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Seven minutes later, Powell's assistant wrote back.
Speaker 3 (17:54):
Thanks redacted. This is helpful.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
You can almost feel the panic beginning to set in.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
What is it that raised suspicions? Do we know? And
it wasn't for example, could you please send us a
printing press so we could print it balance.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Or build a Federal Reserve bank in Ukraine.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
That wasn't what tipped it off, because they already gave
over Yellen's contact information after that, so it must have
been something after that.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Have you ever had that moment where suddenly, like an
antenna just goes up, It just suddenly hits you like,
was this all a ruse? And that's how I imagine this
assistant was feeling, just I've been duped.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Maybe that really wasn't a Nigerian prince?
Speaker 2 (18:39):
Yeah, exactly exactly. On the same day as the email
exchange to the European Central Bank, the Federal Reserve Board
of Governors lodged a complaint with the agency's Office of
Inspector General. Four days later, on February fourteenth, they launched
an investigation in part to sniff out an imposter. That
(19:00):
question would answer itself.
Speaker 6 (19:03):
I'm glad you've made time to speak to me.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
On April twenty six, the video appeared on Rootube.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Is it Russian YouTube? I mean that's what it sounds like, exactly.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I got it.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I got it right to see. They'd never fool me.
Speaker 7 (19:17):
Your opinion is really important for me, So I would
like to ask you, what does your.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Use turns out? The impostors were two well known pranksters
nicknamed Vivan and Lexis. They've been pulling stunts to embarrass
world leaders for years.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
In twenty seventeen, they impersonated another Ukrainian official on a
call with then Congressman Adam Schiff Okay, what's the nature
of the com from and convinced him that Putin was
blackmailing Trump to cancel Russian sanctions.
Speaker 7 (19:46):
Well, there were pictures of naked Trump.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Okay shifts. People who said they thought the call was
bogus told the number of news outlets that they reported
the call to law enforcement. The prankster struck again in
twenty twenty.
Speaker 7 (20:01):
My friend as singer Billie Eilish and rapper Kenny West
are also fans of you.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
They got Bernie Sanders by posing as Greta Thunberg and
her father, saying they had some creative ways to endorse
his campaign.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
They would like to do a cool rap. Rap music
is popular now.
Speaker 7 (20:20):
Rap music is very popular.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
It's really very Sanders saying that is. The Sanders campaign
didn't comment on the authenticity of the call, but Vavana
and Lexis had a hot streak of posing as Zelenski.
Speaker 7 (20:31):
As your fun is Dumbledore Gay.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
In twenty twenty two, they called JK Rowling.
Speaker 7 (20:37):
I ordered that our fighters right avocada afradavra. Yeah, yeah,
on the on the missiles that we will launch it.
Speaker 3 (20:48):
So how do you like this joke?
Speaker 6 (20:50):
I love the joke. I love the joke.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
A spokesperson said, Rolling was a victim of a distasteful hoax.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Can we put in some audio of with Zile actually
sounds like am I crazy? The guy doesn't sound anything
like him at all?
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Okay, well, here's the real Zolensky.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
That's said the biggest donata of support and of peace.
We have to be very open to understand how to
stop the war.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Does not sound like Zelenski. I haven't seen anything like this,
And the reality is we were never supposed to see this, right,
you know, this was supposed to be a private conversation
with who Powell fought was Zolensky. So what these pranctures
throw out there publicly was something we were not supposed
to get any insight to. The video went viral, and
(21:39):
when the news made it to the US, other journalists
inundated the FED spokesperson with questions, I wanted to verify
a Bloomberg report and see if you had a statement
about January with Russian plans. For the most part, the
spokesperson brushed the incident off. She told one Fox reporter
that this happened to number of officials, including Leguard.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
So they did get Leguard.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
They did a video of the pranksters posing as Zelensky,
dropped a month before the Powell video. Leguard didn't seem
to make any public comments about it, though, okay, continue,
The FED spokesperson added, quote, I really hope that Fox
Business might decide not to give fraudulent hoaxes more attention
and legitimacy by further spreading their work.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
And what happened? Did Fox refrain from doing a story?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Oh, of course not everyone reported on this. Beyond that,
there wasn't much more to learn about the issue until
I got the documents. Do you want to know what
they said? Mat Yes. In November twenty twenty three, the
Inspector General issued their report.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Do you usually find that igs are like on the
more generous side of how much they'll give you versus
how much they'll withhold?
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Well, it depends on the IG which agency you're dealing with.
Keep in mind, and one of the second Trump administration's
first moves was firing the Inspectors General from a bunch
of departments and agencies. But for this request and a
lot of others, I filed. The Federal Reserve has been
transparent in terms of what their IG will disclose. What
they uncovered wasn't exactly espionage, but it was a stark
(23:18):
reality that all it takes to trick what we hope
is a secure institution the United State Central Banking System
is charm timing and a thimble of plausible deniability to
slip past the gate. The purpose of the investigation was
to determine if any quote, criminal statutes, regulations, or agency
(23:39):
policies within were violated. This was an embarrassing breach. So
the questions are, how did it happen, who approved it?
Where warning signs missed? The Inspector General got to work,
not with flashing lights or ray jackets, but with something
more bureaucratic and arguably more invasive, email, lots of it.
(24:02):
They pulled the thread back to January tenth, twenty twenty three,
to the very first message that arrived at the FED
on behalf of the impersonator. Then they cast a wide net.
Anyone who touched the meeting, scheduled it, heard about it,
mentioned it in a reply, all had their inbox pulled
into the drag net. Behind the scenes, eleven employees across
(24:23):
three departments were summoned for interviews, including Chair Powell himself.
The names of some others are redacted, but the bewilderment
wasn't because after all of that, investigators found quote no
violations of law, regulation or policy associated with this matter.
Sounds a bit like nothing to see here, right.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Law and regulation? I could see that. How is there
not a policy that was violated here? Like, isn't there
a policy that's like don't give interviews with people that
aren't really.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Who they say to be. Well, here's the real issue.
It's on clear if there were any protocols in place
to prevent this from happening. The report is detached and bureaucratic,
making you read between the lines quite a bit. It
passively identifies major vulnerabilities without naming them as failures, and
there were many failures. Through sounds like it. Let's take
(25:18):
the emails. While those interview told OIG investigators that quote
attention to detail regarding incoming email is crucial end quote.
I'm not so sure about that. I mean, the email
addresses are amazing.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
What are they?
Speaker 2 (25:32):
The email addresses are Office dot President at UKR dot
net dot net and airmac at Zolensky dot team. Have
you ever had those like phishing exercises to make sure
that you're not fish right? And they always like, you know,
(25:54):
check those check those domain names. So they're just getting
emails from what they think are the Ukrainian government or
Ukrainian government officials from dot team and at UKR dot net.
Official government email accounts generally don't reside on a dot
net or dot team domain.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Right, They reside on personal signal accounts, as we all know.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Right, But you see, the report doesn't even explicitly discuss
this email oversight. I just love this part of the report.
It says staff members are taking a closer look at senders,
email addresses and verifying contacts as necessary.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
That tells me absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
That's that's already It says nothing, but it's also says everything, because, Hey,
the Board of Governors is saying the Federal Reserve Board
that they're going to start taking closer look at senders,
email addresses and verifying contacts is necessary. I'm assuming they
haven't been doing that previously, but clearly they were not
(26:57):
doing that previously.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
So that's saying, like, we're going to start doing things
that have been recommended for the last thirty years in
dealing with the Internet.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Now, whose job was it to verify the contact? Investigators
learned that when the impersonator reached out to Powell's assistant, quote,
no single person or group was solely assigned to verify
the identity of foreign individuals who contact the board to
request to communicate with board members or officials. The reason
they don't usually have to. Powell has quote longstanding relationships
(27:28):
with his international counterparts, and one on one communications tend
to be with individuals well known to him.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
Yeah, like, so, what why does this matter? This is
not about foreign contacts. This could have been anything, right,
This could have been Fox News is reaching out, or
this could have been like the head of some US bank.
This has zero to do with the fact that the
scammers were not based in the US or that they
pretended to be somebody not in the US. They're completely
(27:56):
missing what the issue is. I think, yeah, I mean,
they could have been fished by any right. Shouldn't the
question just have been, like, do they have procedures to
ensure that like they're not getting fished or they're not
getting scammed, or that they, you know, generally ensure that
a purported center is the real center, not specifically to
only when it's like foreign leaders of other countries. That
(28:17):
just seems like a way that they could dodge like
the real question and just be, oh, well, this like
super specific thing, like they you know, this hasn't come
up before.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Instead, FED staff relied on the exchange with the European
Central Bank at the bottom of the email thread as
verification enough that the request from the impostor was legit. Generally,
when foreign officials do reach out, FED staff are supposed
to contact the Treasury department, which the fed's International Finance
Division did do. No one raised any concerns, and quote
(28:50):
all felt comfortable with Chair Powell meeting the individual because
Le Guard at the European Central Bank recently had a
conversation with the same person. But that process doesn't involve
verifying the identity of the person asking to talk to Powell.
The FED also doesn't have a process to loop in
external agencies such as the embassy's, Department of State or
(29:12):
the White House to verify the identity of a request.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
According to the records.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Yes, Matt, the entire show is about records.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
I'm just making sure the listener is following.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Nor are internal security and intelligence departments regularly involved with
vetting communications between the FED and foreign officials.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
This all feels like if you were making people like
do an online training about email security. This would be
like the one that's like obviously wrong when you see
what the other ones are right.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
This is a federal reserve and it was stunning to
see how the security vulnerabilities reached all the way, you know,
right to Powell's store. So Chair Powell stated that International
Finance is responsible for ensuring that foreign officials requesting to
communicate are properly verified and vetted. Powell's throwing, you know,
(30:08):
the International Finance Division under the bus chair. Powell reiterated
that this one on one meeting with the Zelenski impersonator
was extremely unusual, given that nearly all of his communications
are with people he is already deeply familiar with.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
So he's saying his communications are all people he's deeply
familiar I guess if he had any familiarity with Zelenski,
then he would have recognized it was obviously not Zolenski's.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Voice, right. But speaking of what Powell heard, let's get
into what happened on the video call itself after the break. Okay,
so Matt about the video. It's worth mentioning that the
report doesn't explicitly say what Powell was looking at, which
spares him some embarrassment. Vovan Alexis have been known to
(30:57):
u his deep fakes, but it's unclear if that's the
case in this instance. What Powell did recognize is that
Zelenski was surprisingly better at English than he expected and
appeared to be reading from a script. Investigators found that
the impersonator did not ask for any money, papers, documents,
(31:18):
or other things. Of value during the conversation.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Anit wait, wait, hold on a second, that is so
clearly wrong, right.
Speaker 10 (31:26):
Yeah, I think I think that that's like it asked
for a printing press that it's not true, and basically
essentially said, can you build a bank, a federal reserve
bank in Ukraine?
Speaker 2 (31:39):
But this is where it gets serious. There's a question
of whether or not Powell had disclosed potentially confidential Federal
Open Market Committee information to the Zelenski impersonator, particularly because
Powell talked about interest rates. This is what you asked
about earlier. The answer, it depends on who you ask.
One person interviewed said Powell's statement quote give at least
(32:01):
an appearance of looking like confidential information. But Powell disagreed.
So let's think about what he said.
Speaker 6 (32:08):
The market is already pricing in two more quarter percentage
point rate hikes.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
As far as the market expectation goes. That's true, but
it's what he says next.
Speaker 6 (32:17):
We'll look around after we make those two and we'll say,
you know, should we do any more?
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Powell told the IG he didn't think his comments quote
met the definition of confidential information because of the broad
market expectation that at least two interest rate increases were
going to occur, which the IG corroborated.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Now, does that mean that Powell had said that before
or that it's no big deal because everyone was already
assuming that to be the case, because it'll seem like
a little bit different to me.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, I mean it was essentially that there was an expectation,
based on the climate, that at least two rate increases
were going to happen.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
All right, now, I'm going to tell you why this
pisses me off, because if you try to get anything
out of the FED under Foya, it has already been
publicly said, they will tell you to off. Like they're
not going to give you anything. They're gonna say that
anything that the chairs ever said can move markets, and
so like we're not gonna tell you what time that
(33:13):
meeting started or whether they served coffee. They will give
you nothing at all if you make a flayer request
on the theory that it will all these bad things
will happen. But if I'm hearing you right, Powell said
something to these impersonators that he had not publicly said before.
But they're saying it's not a big deal because it's
what everybody thought was gonna happen anyway. Do I have
that just about right?
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Yeah, that's pretty much about right. You could say that
he's confirming the market's expectation, and at this time, the
Federal Reserve had not publicly announced a commitment to implement
two additional quarter percentage point interest rate hikes. But the
IG didn't take issue with this specific statement, probably because
even though Powell's comments gave the appearance that he might
(33:54):
have disclose confidential information, the chair has quote the authority
to upclass or down classify FLMC information at any time. So,
in other words, even though he may have disclosed non
public info, he's got the authority to classify it or
(34:14):
reveal it if he wants to. He has that unilateral
authority to do that.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I can think of at least one powerful government official
who would very much subscribe to the view that he
could say and do whatever he wants with any documents,
because he is the authority to do the same thing.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
While the meeting was preceded by quote a rare set
of factors end quote, including Powell taking the call from
his home due to illness, the IG concluded that nothing
illegal took place.
Speaker 3 (34:42):
I'm going to say this too about inspectors general, and
I mean no offense to any inspectors general, but the
incentives would seem to be such that you want to
show that you like found something wrong, but you also
don't want to blow up the whole federal government. It's
such an odd office. It's like part of the federal government,
but it's supposed to like ca all out wrongdoing by
the federal government. But I'm sort of skeptical how much
(35:03):
it wants to like really really take that on. I
don't know what do you think, Jason.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
They will reach conclusions, they will make a referral or
recommend an action. Right in this case, you know what
they said was they found no violations of law, regulation,
or policy associated with this matter.
Speaker 5 (35:21):
Right.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
The bottom line is this, They're not going to say,
you guys are a bunch of idiots. Get your together.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
I'm not saying that they should be going out of
their way to like publicly humiliate anybody or grandstand or
get about a soapbox. But I think that there can
be a tendency, or at least the effect of burying
the reality of it in a bunch of bureaucratic sounding
stuff that really kind of takes away from the public
(35:49):
really understanding and appreciating the full ramifications of what happened.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
That's why I'm here, Matt, so I can help them
appreciate what happened.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
I always forget it, but thank you for reminding me.
If if we had excellent government in America, you and
I would both have to find other jobs.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Right. I don't know what else I would do except
slang records.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
You could live up your T shirt collection for like, yeah,
easily three or four years.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
Have to sell some charts. So how could this have
been prevented? Powell says the simple fix would entail an
individual from the board calling the relevant embassy to verify
the contact. I mean the way that it's written. You
know you're reading it. It's so dry. But just think
of that. Powell's like, I know how we can resolve
(36:35):
this in the future. Just call the embassy to see
if that person actually sent the email. Now we have
to give credit where credit is due, because someone did
call the Ukrainian embassy, just not Powell staff that someone
was in the Treasury Department and when they called quickly
they had their answer. Presidence Lensky never requested a meeting
(36:57):
but that didn't happen until February eighth, two thousand, in
twenty three. By then it was too late. The joke
was on the FED. So there's your answer, Matt. What
spook Pal's assistant? None other than a little bit of
due diligence that should have been done well before the meeting.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
But they wait, They didn't do it until they reached
out after after We reached out to the Federal Reserve
for comment about this episode, but as of this recording,
the agency has not responded. So what's your take on
all this?
Speaker 2 (37:26):
The meeting revealed a break down an operational security and
a need to overhaul security protocols across the board, but
the IG makes no recommendations, and that makes me question
if the scope of the investigation was too narrowly defined
by did anyone violate existing rules? The report does say
that other internal agencies were also looking into this, but
(37:48):
records responsive to that weren't in this batch of records
or released to me more than a year after the incident.
This report is not instill a lot of confidence in
the public that the FED took serious that it lacked
elementary safeguards to prevent a massive breach by a foreign
actor that could have had national security consequences.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
This is the kind of thing that drives people nuts
about the federal government. Like you made a mistake. Just
admit I made a mistake. I get it. This is
what I'm gonna do different next time. But not sort
of like, oh well, other people screwed up too. We're
like here's my excuse, or like this isn't really that
big of a deal. Just own it for like five
seconds and then we can all move on. Like people
(38:30):
smart enough to see through that and it makes them
really mad.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
I agree.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Is this inspector general one of the inspector generals who's
since been fired?
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Nope, he wasn't touched.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
So that was hoping. Maybe we could we could get
the on the pod talk about it. But right, maybe
we could, maybe we can get Chairman Powell on the pod.
Would you like to come on and discuss this report?
We are who we say we are. Oh that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
So that's it for this one, but not for Powell
and me in a sense. We end where we be.
Speaker 5 (39:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
On April morning in twenty twenty five, Jason Leopold was
sitting up in bed.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Have n't brushed my teeth. I'm still there.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Scrolling the headlines when a story caught his eye.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
And I was like, oh, that's funny. I gotta follow
a foyer. So I followed a request with the Federal
Reserve for all adacted because it's classified.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Ooh, I can hardly wait for the records to come back.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Jason, Well, Matt, I'll let you know what the records say.
And a few years from Bloomberg and No Smiling, this
is Disclosure. The show is hosted by Matt Topic and
me Jason Leopold. It's produced by Heather Schroing and Sean
Cannon for No Smiling. Our editor for Bloomberg is Jeff Grocott.
(39:45):
Our executive producers for Bloomberg are Sage Bauman and me
Jason Leopold, and our executive producers for No Smiling are
Sean Cannon, Heather Schrowing, and Matt Topic. The Disclosure theme
song is by Nick, with additional music by Nick and
Epidemic Sound. Sound design and mixing is by Sean Cannon.
(40:06):
The emails in this episode were read by Josh Gondelman,
Katherine Blandford, and Adam Gilbert. For more Transparency News and
important document Thumps. You can subscribe to my Weeklyfoya Files
newsletter at Bloomberg dot com slash Foya Files. That's Foia Files.
To get every episode early on Apple podcasts. Become a
(40:28):
Bloomberg dot com subscriber today. Check out our special intro
offer right now at bloomberg dot com Slash podcast offer,
or click the link in the show notes. You'll also
unlock deep reporting data and analysis from reporters around the world.
We'll see you again next Tuesday.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
Did the Russian pranksters know how to foy you?
Jason Leopold starts every morning the same way. He wakes
up in his Los Angeles home early, sometimes too early, sadly,
at like four or four or thirty. The house is still,
his wife sleeping, his dog, Bella Lakosi also sleeping. The
room's pitch black, curtains closed.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And then I see the glow of my cell phone
calling to me. Pick me up, Jason, pick me up.
See what's going on? Open me.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
As he reaches toward the nightstand for his phone, he's thinking.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Please, let there be a whole bunch of documents. Please,
Let there be a whole bunch of documents. Please. And
if there are documents, I'm not going to it first.
I want to save it till the very end.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
In the meantime, he's checking his push notifications for news
that broke on the East Coast while he slept.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
I'm thinking, okay, for your request. Interesting, We'll save it.
I wake up feeling like I constantly have to find
a new request. I don't like to fall behind. So
I've been building this pipeline for nearly twenty years.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
April twenty seventh, twenty twenty three, was no different. That day,
he was scrolling Twitter.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
It was called Twitter. Then he's scrolling, scrolling through. I'm scrolling,
scrolling through.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Until a tweet from his colleagues at Bloomberg caught his eye.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
FED chair Jerown Powell held a call with Russian pranksters
who were posing as Ukrainian President Voladimir Zelenski, according to
video shown on Russian TV. I mean, I just laughed.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Jason couldn't click the article fast enough, But after reading it,
he had more questions than answers. The most obvious.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
One, how the hell was he duped by Russian pranksters.
This is Jerome Powell. He's the chairman of the FED.
He said's interest rates? So, but how did that happen?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Jason left out of bed, giddy pacing.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I'm already imagining what the records look like. And I
know there's got to be records, and I'm playing out
the scenario of me getting the records.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Only one thing left to do.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
I have to file a request right now, turn it up.
I'm investigative journalist Jason Leopold. I spend most of my
days getting documents from the government.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
I'm attorney Matt Topic, and I fight them in court
to open their files. When they don't want to from Bloomberg.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And No Smile. This is Disclosure, a podcast about buying
loose government secrets, the Freedom of Information Act, and the
unexpected places that takes us. Hey, Matt, have you ever
been pranked?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Like tip fall for a scam? It was an email
from someone It was like, I need help buying Amazon
gift cards. I don't know, like I can't get into where.
Can you please buy me these gift cards? And I'll
pay you back. But if you ever met the person
that it was purporting to be from, one hundred percent
that person would have done that. Like whoever scammed it,
they just dumb locked into like the exact right person,
(02:56):
and so like I kind of felt for it, and
then I got a call from Amazon. It was like, hey,
it looks like somebody's trying to scam me for these
And then I felt like a real idiot at that point.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Yeah, that is an elder abuse scam. I got to
look up your.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Age and I'm not even half as old as you.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
You know who else has been pranked? The Chairman of
the Federal Reserve, Jerome Powell. The thing is, Powell's a
guy who's walking in the shoes of Valan greens Band,
Ben Bernanki, and Janet Yellen. When a Fed chief coughs,
markets move. If there's a formula for job success, it's
that you run the central bank of the world's biggest
(03:36):
economic power while saying as little as humanly possible in
public about how you plan to do it. So back
in April twenty twenty three, Jerome Powell found himself in
a pickle. It turns out a meeting he thought he
had with Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelenski wasn't actually with Zelenzki
(03:56):
at all. It was with these two Russian pranksters. And
this all came to light in a video of their
meeting that went viral on social media. I see all
this and I am like, this is incredible Foyer material
like that. I knew there had to be a report.
I knew that there was probably, you know, a bunch
of emails behind the scenes. So I filed this request
(04:19):
with the Federal Reserve. What did you ask for it?
So whenever I file a request, I try to imagine,
like being a fly on the wall as everything's sort
of unfolding within a federal government agency. What does that
consist of? I'm imagining that while this was being planned,
that there's some email traffic, there's some discussions, and it
(04:39):
would be very clear that there'd be some kind of investigation, right.
I just know that from filing similar Foyer requests with
Agency Inspectors General. So I asked for final reports of
an investigation that may have taken place into how Powell
was duped, and so I kind of kept it pretty narrow.
I asked for a few days of records.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
You first get an acknowledgement that says, yes, we have
records and are processing them.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
So first just get an acknowledgment letter we got your request.
I check in with, you know, with the Federal Reserve.
They say they're processing the records. They send me a
few pages and withheld more than one hundred due to
an ongoing investigation. And the fighting begins with Federal Reserve
in terms of trying to probably lose these records. So
(05:26):
to quote the song Waiting Room by the great post
hardcore band Fugazi, I am a patient boy, Oh wait,
I wait, I wait, I wait. So I waited until
I got a nod from sources that the investigation was over,
and then in February twenty twenty four, I filed a
(05:48):
new request for some documents that I'd requested a year earlier,
and this time I hit paid dirt. I have to
hand it to the FED. They turn over a lot
of documents that really kind of lay out timeline, investigative reports,
staff emails with dates and timestamps, and I got to
tell you, the whole thing kind of played out like
a movie. So we're going to tell you parts of
(06:10):
it like it's a movie for your ears. We've even
invited a few comedians to read the emails. Oh yeah,
like who well, Matt, We've got Josh Gondleman, Katherine Blandford,
and Adam Gilbert.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
Awesome, I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
All right, here we go, Act one, Scene one. Just
after eight am on the morning of January tenth, twenty
twenty three, Powell's assistant received an email from Ukrainian email
address subject President of Ukraine Chairman Powell request it says
(06:43):
as read by Josh Gondleman, the way he would read
it if he was the one who wrote it, Dear redacted.
The employee's names were withheld.
Speaker 4 (06:52):
President of Ukraine Vladimir Zelenski would like to have a
conversation with Chairman of the Federal Reserve System, Honorable Jarre Powell.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
The email signature says it's from the Deputy Head of
the Office of President Selenski, a man named Kirilo Timoshenko.
He says Lensky wants to.
Speaker 4 (07:10):
Personally congratulate him with recent holidays.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
So wish him a happy New York Yes, and discuss
common issues and plans, such as.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
The impact of war in Ukraine on the world economy
and forecast on the economic situation in the world.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Wait, waito, Well, a foreign government wants to know what
the FEDS forecast of the future, Like everybody wants to
know that, right, right, isn't that like the thing they
don't do or when they do, it's like very very
carefully crafted.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
It's like, first of all, this is non public info.
I mean, yeah, totally, Howell probably does have a forecast
on the world economy based on you know, lots of
insider information, I hope. So, so the fact that they
even made that pitch, and you know, the assistant's like.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Right, so it's congratulations on the holidays. We want to
talk to you about the impact that the Ukrainian war
is having in the world economy, and we want to
know whether we should buy gold or what we should
do in the future before you make any public announceence. Okay,
all right, I'm with you, continued.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
He's like Zelenski just had a productive chat with the
President of the European Central Bank, Christine Legard. It went
so well. We want to do it again with Powell.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
We are ready to organize a video or telephone conversation
at any time convenient for your side. I will wait
for your response with best regards. Kirillo Timshenko.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Is Timyshenko a real person?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yes, that's the real name of an official for the
Ukrainian government. Four minutes later, Powell's assistant responded with this email,
as read by Catherine Blandford.
Speaker 5 (08:45):
We are in receipt of the request and we will
revert back.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
So do we have any idea how they got this
email address?
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yes, they got it from someone at the European Central Bank.
According to the rest of the email thread, if Leguard
took the meeting, Powell probably should too.
Speaker 3 (09:01):
Do we know whether Powell has had other such calls
with other world leaders?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Like?
Speaker 3 (09:06):
Is this a normal common thing for him to be doing?
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Certainly other officials such as Christine Legard. I mean that
seems normal, but you know, speaking to the President of Ukraine.
I mean, yeah, it's I haven't seen any of it.
A few hours later, the assistant responded again, Powell had
agreed to the meeting. The assistant proposed dates and times.
They settled on January nineteenth, twenty twenty three, at nine
(09:32):
am Washington time.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
All right, So they're trying to sell it by being like, hey,
we know Zelensky previously talked to the European Central Bank?
Did that actually happen? Was there actually such a meeting?
Speaker 2 (09:45):
Well, we'll get into that. A lot happened in those
nine days.
Speaker 6 (09:49):
Concern is mounting this morning over a new COVID sub
variant that is rapidly spreading across the country.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
About an hour and a half before the call was
scheduled to begin, one at the FED wrote an email
with a change of plans.
Speaker 5 (10:03):
Their Kiri low chair Palell has tested positive for COVID.
He is very much looking forward to talking with President Zelenski,
but we would appreciate if the call today could be postponed.
We will work to reschedule the call as soon as possible.
Thank you for your understanding, Sincerely redacted.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Wait, do the records tell us what this person is
doing when they're sending the emails?
Speaker 2 (10:30):
No, Matt. Unfortunately these records do not include vibes. But
it's not hard to imagine the esteemed venues where important
government work takes place. So we've supplied some Less than
twenty minutes later, Dear.
Speaker 4 (10:46):
Redacted, President Zelenski wish to share Powell.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
A speedy recovery.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Of course, let's move this conversation to a more favorable time. Also,
I know that this conversation is very important for President Zelenski,
and we are ready to arrange it at a convenient
time for Jair Powell as soon as possible.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
January twenty fourth, twenty twenty three was the new date
of the call. So January twenty fourth comes and Powell
is still recovering from COVID at home, but he's well
enough to put on a black sport jacket over a
white collared shirt and gold tie to hop on the
video call, and.
Speaker 6 (11:20):
We just say, it's a great honor to speak to you.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Now, we don't know what Powell is actually staring at
right here, because the recording doesn't show us a Lensky
side of the video call, but we can see Powell.
He's thin with a full head of gray white hair.
His virtual background appears to place him in a tranquil
reading nook with white walls, a yuppie white couch, and
a dainty white tea set overlooking us accluded forest.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
It's like, I know you're living in a war zone,
but look at this great environment that I get to
live in.
Speaker 6 (11:51):
I'm aware that Ukraine's suffering. People like me just want
to support you in any way we can, but I
have limited ways to do that in my professional job.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
All is clear from the jump that if this call
is about money for the war, there isn't much to discuss,
no matter.
Speaker 7 (12:07):
I think that you are a wise person, one of
the wisest person in the world.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
He asks about whether Russian sanctions are working.
Speaker 6 (12:16):
It seems like the Russians have been able to avoid
the harshest application of the sanctions.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
He debriefed Powell on his call with Christine Legard, who
he claims, said the United States can win any war
at any costs.
Speaker 7 (12:28):
There will be only one winner who has a big gun.
She told me that I like that.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
He even solicited Powell's opinion on his counterpart, Russian Central
bankhead Alvira Nebulina. She's quite good at her job.
Speaker 6 (12:41):
She's extraordinarily capable.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
At one point, the discussion veered into one of the
touchiest subjects pertaining to the US economy, interest rates.
Speaker 7 (12:49):
If the rate is raised further, the standards of living
of the population will fall. So how much should it
fall in order for the FETE to stop raising.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
The Powell sort of grimaced and looked off screen, perhaps
surprised by the question.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Why on earth would Zelensky be asking these questions? Isn't
Powell like, what the hell does this have to do
with Ukraine? He should have been very suspicious at this point.
Speaker 6 (13:15):
The market is already pricing in two more quarter percentage
point rate hikes. We'll look around after we make those
two and we'll say, you know, should we do any more?
And then the question will be how long do we
keep rates at this level? I think we'll keep him
there for quite some time.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Is this all things he's already said?
Speaker 6 (13:31):
Like?
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Is he just telling him what he's already publicly said?
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Well, that's the question. Well, let's come back to that.
And then comes the weird asks.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
We haven't gotten to the weird part yet.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, there yet.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Okay, all right, I'm so excited. Let's have it.
Speaker 7 (13:47):
If you could present me a printing press, I would
be really happy.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
We have one of those, but but we keep it
in the basement.
Speaker 7 (13:57):
Oh okay, you could also build a fourteenth for bank
or the Fed on our territory.
Speaker 5 (14:04):
We could do that.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Let me come back to you on that.
Speaker 6 (14:07):
Well, maybe we'll have a reserve bank and keep.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
He wants a pretty much. Wait, he's asking Powell if
he can have a printing press to print money. Is
that right?
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Yes, Diet, it's hilarious. The thirty minute call was zesty
to say, all thirty minute.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Call man, that's who should be running the US government,
is these pranksters? Because it's pretty good.
Speaker 7 (14:35):
I was really happy to talk to you.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And that was it. And mind you that this was
a two week ordeal of setting this up. According to
the documents the federal least, there was never once a
moment where anyone said, you know, hey, let's check out
the email addresses or or you know, have our security team,
(15:00):
you know, confirm any of this. It was just through
email setting it up. It was pretty easy.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
So no one on Powell's staff has ever seen the
movie Borat?
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Come on that this is a fan. You think they're
sitting around watching Borat?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
I mean somebody should.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Then three days after the meeting, that's when the unraveling began,
which you'll hear all about after the break. It's six
fifty nine am on January twenty seventh, twenty twenty three.
That's when a message lights up deer predacted.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
President Zelenski would like to thank Chair Powell once again
for this important conversation for us and express gratitude for
his professionalism.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
He has a small request.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Could you connect us with Secretary of the Treasury Janet
Yellen so that President Zelenski could discuss the economic situation
with hurt. President Zelenski would like to hold this conversation informally,
without the attention of the press. Therefore, we thought that
through you it would be fast and confidential.
Speaker 2 (16:13):
The assistant did as requested and shared Yellen's contact information.
Speaker 3 (16:17):
I can't wait to hear how that went over.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Then, a couple of weeks later, on February tenth, something
appeared to have spooked Powell's assistant. They emailed a person
in Leguard's office at the European Central Bank to ask
about Timyshenko's initial outreach.
Speaker 8 (16:35):
Dear redacted, I just want to confirm that the email
below Sea Trail is a legitimate email from you, and
that a phone call with President Zelensky did occur from
your office.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Best regards, redacted.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Then fifteen minutes later, Leguard's office responded, as read by
Adam Gilbert de redacted, and it sure didn't quell anyone's anxiety.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
She was a bit harry.
Speaker 9 (17:01):
We were in touch with mister Timoshenko and a video
call between President Zelenski and Madame mcguard took place on
sixth January.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
But in the meantime they explained that they'd recently learned
that Timoshenko had resigned from this position and shared a
Wikipedia link to prove it. Apparently he left office on
January twenty third, the day before the Powell meeting. They
had since heard from Timoshenko or someone claiming to be him,
which raised some alarm bells.
Speaker 9 (17:29):
So I assume this is not true, seeing that mister
Timoshenko now left the office of President Zelensky. In all
the above, I would be extra cautious when handling his request.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Kind regards, redacted.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Oh, so in other words, Leguard's office isn't sure if
they spoke to the real Timoshenko correct.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Seven minutes later, Powell's assistant wrote back.
Speaker 3 (17:54):
Thanks redacted. This is helpful.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
You can almost feel the panic beginning to set in.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
What is it that raised suspicions? Do we know? And
it wasn't for example, could you please send us a
printing press so we could print it balance.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Or build a Federal Reserve bank in Ukraine.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
That wasn't what tipped it off, because they already gave
over Yellen's contact information after that, so it must have
been something after that.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Have you ever had that moment where suddenly, like an
antenna just goes up, It just suddenly hits you like,
was this all a ruse? And that's how I imagine this
assistant was feeling, just I've been duped.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
Maybe that really wasn't a Nigerian prince?
Speaker 2 (18:39):
Yeah, exactly exactly. On the same day as the email
exchange to the European Central Bank, the Federal Reserve Board
of Governors lodged a complaint with the agency's Office of
Inspector General. Four days later, on February fourteenth, they launched
an investigation in part to sniff out an imposter. That
(19:00):
question would answer itself.
Speaker 6 (19:03):
I'm glad you've made time to speak to me.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
On April twenty six, the video appeared on Rootube.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Is it Russian YouTube? I mean that's what it sounds like, exactly.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I got it.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
I got it right to see. They'd never fool me.
Speaker 7 (19:17):
Your opinion is really important for me, So I would
like to ask you, what does your.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Use turns out? The impostors were two well known pranksters
nicknamed Vivan and Lexis. They've been pulling stunts to embarrass
world leaders for years.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
In twenty seventeen, they impersonated another Ukrainian official on a
call with then Congressman Adam Schiff Okay, what's the nature
of the com from and convinced him that Putin was
blackmailing Trump to cancel Russian sanctions.
Speaker 7 (19:46):
Well, there were pictures of naked Trump.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Okay shifts. People who said they thought the call was
bogus told the number of news outlets that they reported
the call to law enforcement. The prankster struck again in
twenty twenty.
Speaker 7 (20:01):
My friend as singer Billie Eilish and rapper Kenny West
are also fans of you.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
They got Bernie Sanders by posing as Greta Thunberg and
her father, saying they had some creative ways to endorse
his campaign.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
They would like to do a cool rap. Rap music
is popular now.
Speaker 7 (20:20):
Rap music is very popular.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
It's really very Sanders saying that is. The Sanders campaign
didn't comment on the authenticity of the call, but Vavana
and Lexis had a hot streak of posing as Zelenski.
Speaker 7 (20:31):
As your fun is Dumbledore Gay.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
In twenty twenty two, they called JK Rowling.
Speaker 7 (20:37):
I ordered that our fighters right avocada afradavra. Yeah, yeah,
on the on the missiles that we will launch it.
Speaker 3 (20:48):
So how do you like this joke?
Speaker 6 (20:50):
I love the joke. I love the joke.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
A spokesperson said, Rolling was a victim of a distasteful hoax.
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Can we put in some audio of with Zile actually
sounds like am I crazy? The guy doesn't sound anything
like him at all?
Speaker 2 (21:06):
Okay, well, here's the real Zolensky.
Speaker 3 (21:09):
That's said the biggest donata of support and of peace.
We have to be very open to understand how to
stop the war.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
Does not sound like Zelenski. I haven't seen anything like this,
And the reality is we were never supposed to see this, right,
you know, this was supposed to be a private conversation
with who Powell fought was Zolensky. So what these pranctures
throw out there publicly was something we were not supposed
to get any insight to. The video went viral, and
(21:39):
when the news made it to the US, other journalists
inundated the FED spokesperson with questions, I wanted to verify
a Bloomberg report and see if you had a statement
about January with Russian plans. For the most part, the
spokesperson brushed the incident off. She told one Fox reporter
that this happened to number of officials, including Leguard.
Speaker 3 (22:03):
So they did get Leguard.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
They did a video of the pranksters posing as Zelensky,
dropped a month before the Powell video. Leguard didn't seem
to make any public comments about it, though, okay, continue,
The FED spokesperson added, quote, I really hope that Fox
Business might decide not to give fraudulent hoaxes more attention
and legitimacy by further spreading their work.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
And what happened? Did Fox refrain from doing a story?
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Oh, of course not everyone reported on this. Beyond that,
there wasn't much more to learn about the issue until
I got the documents. Do you want to know what
they said? Mat Yes. In November twenty twenty three, the
Inspector General issued their report.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Do you usually find that igs are like on the
more generous side of how much they'll give you versus
how much they'll withhold?
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Well, it depends on the IG which agency you're dealing with.
Keep in mind, and one of the second Trump administration's
first moves was firing the Inspectors General from a bunch
of departments and agencies. But for this request and a
lot of others, I filed. The Federal Reserve has been
transparent in terms of what their IG will disclose. What
they uncovered wasn't exactly espionage, but it was a stark
(23:18):
reality that all it takes to trick what we hope
is a secure institution the United State Central Banking System
is charm timing and a thimble of plausible deniability to
slip past the gate. The purpose of the investigation was
to determine if any quote, criminal statutes, regulations, or agency
(23:39):
policies within were violated. This was an embarrassing breach. So
the questions are, how did it happen, who approved it?
Where warning signs missed? The Inspector General got to work,
not with flashing lights or ray jackets, but with something
more bureaucratic and arguably more invasive, email, lots of it.
(24:02):
They pulled the thread back to January tenth, twenty twenty three,
to the very first message that arrived at the FED
on behalf of the impersonator. Then they cast a wide net.
Anyone who touched the meeting, scheduled it, heard about it,
mentioned it in a reply, all had their inbox pulled
into the drag net. Behind the scenes, eleven employees across
(24:23):
three departments were summoned for interviews, including Chair Powell himself.
The names of some others are redacted, but the bewilderment
wasn't because after all of that, investigators found quote no
violations of law, regulation or policy associated with this matter.
Sounds a bit like nothing to see here, right.
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Law and regulation? I could see that. How is there
not a policy that was violated here? Like, isn't there
a policy that's like don't give interviews with people that
aren't really.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Who they say to be. Well, here's the real issue.
It's on clear if there were any protocols in place
to prevent this from happening. The report is detached and bureaucratic,
making you read between the lines quite a bit. It
passively identifies major vulnerabilities without naming them as failures, and
there were many failures. Through sounds like it. Let's take
(25:18):
the emails. While those interview told OIG investigators that quote
attention to detail regarding incoming email is crucial end quote.
I'm not so sure about that. I mean, the email
addresses are amazing.
Speaker 3 (25:31):
What are they?
Speaker 2 (25:32):
The email addresses are Office dot President at UKR dot
net dot net and airmac at Zolensky dot team. Have
you ever had those like phishing exercises to make sure
that you're not fish right? And they always like, you know,
(25:54):
check those check those domain names. So they're just getting
emails from what they think are the Ukrainian government or
Ukrainian government officials from dot team and at UKR dot net.
Official government email accounts generally don't reside on a dot
net or dot team domain.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Right, They reside on personal signal accounts, as we all know.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Right, But you see, the report doesn't even explicitly discuss
this email oversight. I just love this part of the report.
It says staff members are taking a closer look at senders,
email addresses and verifying contacts as necessary.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
That tells me absolutely nothing.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
That's that's already It says nothing, but it's also says everything, because, Hey,
the Board of Governors is saying the Federal Reserve Board
that they're going to start taking closer look at senders,
email addresses and verifying contacts is necessary. I'm assuming they
haven't been doing that previously, but clearly they were not
(26:57):
doing that previously.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
So that's saying, like, we're going to start doing things
that have been recommended for the last thirty years in
dealing with the Internet.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Now, whose job was it to verify the contact? Investigators
learned that when the impersonator reached out to Powell's assistant, quote,
no single person or group was solely assigned to verify
the identity of foreign individuals who contact the board to
request to communicate with board members or officials. The reason
they don't usually have to. Powell has quote longstanding relationships
(27:28):
with his international counterparts, and one on one communications tend
to be with individuals well known to him.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
Yeah, like, so, what why does this matter? This is
not about foreign contacts. This could have been anything, right,
This could have been Fox News is reaching out, or
this could have been like the head of some US bank.
This has zero to do with the fact that the
scammers were not based in the US or that they
pretended to be somebody not in the US. They're completely
(27:56):
missing what the issue is. I think, yeah, I mean,
they could have been fished by any right. Shouldn't the
question just have been, like, do they have procedures to
ensure that like they're not getting fished or they're not
getting scammed, or that they, you know, generally ensure that
a purported center is the real center, not specifically to
only when it's like foreign leaders of other countries. That
(28:17):
just seems like a way that they could dodge like
the real question and just be, oh, well, this like
super specific thing, like they you know, this hasn't come
up before.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Instead, FED staff relied on the exchange with the European
Central Bank at the bottom of the email thread as
verification enough that the request from the impostor was legit. Generally,
when foreign officials do reach out, FED staff are supposed
to contact the Treasury department, which the fed's International Finance
Division did do. No one raised any concerns, and quote
(28:50):
all felt comfortable with Chair Powell meeting the individual because
Le Guard at the European Central Bank recently had a
conversation with the same person. But that process doesn't involve
verifying the identity of the person asking to talk to Powell.
The FED also doesn't have a process to loop in
external agencies such as the embassy's, Department of State or
(29:12):
the White House to verify the identity of a request.
Speaker 3 (29:15):
According to the records.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Yes, Matt, the entire show is about records.
Speaker 3 (29:20):
I'm just making sure the listener is following.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Nor are internal security and intelligence departments regularly involved with
vetting communications between the FED and foreign officials.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
This all feels like if you were making people like
do an online training about email security. This would be
like the one that's like obviously wrong when you see
what the other ones are right.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
This is a federal reserve and it was stunning to
see how the security vulnerabilities reached all the way, you know,
right to Powell's store. So Chair Powell stated that International
Finance is responsible for ensuring that foreign officials requesting to
communicate are properly verified and vetted. Powell's throwing, you know,
(30:08):
the International Finance Division under the bus chair. Powell reiterated
that this one on one meeting with the Zelenski impersonator
was extremely unusual, given that nearly all of his communications
are with people he is already deeply familiar with.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
So he's saying his communications are all people he's deeply
familiar I guess if he had any familiarity with Zelenski,
then he would have recognized it was obviously not Zolenski's.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
Voice, right. But speaking of what Powell heard, let's get
into what happened on the video call itself after the break. Okay,
so Matt about the video. It's worth mentioning that the
report doesn't explicitly say what Powell was looking at, which
spares him some embarrassment. Vovan Alexis have been known to
(30:57):
u his deep fakes, but it's unclear if that's the
case in this instance. What Powell did recognize is that
Zelenski was surprisingly better at English than he expected and
appeared to be reading from a script. Investigators found that
the impersonator did not ask for any money, papers, documents,
(31:18):
or other things. Of value during the conversation.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Anit wait, wait, hold on a second, that is so
clearly wrong, right.
Speaker 10 (31:26):
Yeah, I think I think that that's like it asked
for a printing press that it's not true, and basically
essentially said, can you build a bank, a federal reserve
bank in Ukraine?
Speaker 2 (31:39):
But this is where it gets serious. There's a question
of whether or not Powell had disclosed potentially confidential Federal
Open Market Committee information to the Zelenski impersonator, particularly because
Powell talked about interest rates. This is what you asked
about earlier. The answer, it depends on who you ask.
One person interviewed said Powell's statement quote give at least
(32:01):
an appearance of looking like confidential information. But Powell disagreed.
So let's think about what he said.
Speaker 6 (32:08):
The market is already pricing in two more quarter percentage
point rate hikes.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
As far as the market expectation goes. That's true, but
it's what he says next.
Speaker 6 (32:17):
We'll look around after we make those two and we'll say,
you know, should we do any more?
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Powell told the IG he didn't think his comments quote
met the definition of confidential information because of the broad
market expectation that at least two interest rate increases were
going to occur, which the IG corroborated.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Now, does that mean that Powell had said that before
or that it's no big deal because everyone was already
assuming that to be the case, because it'll seem like
a little bit different to me.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, I mean it was essentially that there was an expectation,
based on the climate, that at least two rate increases
were going to happen.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
All right, now, I'm going to tell you why this
pisses me off, because if you try to get anything
out of the FED under Foya, it has already been
publicly said, they will tell you to off. Like they're
not going to give you anything. They're gonna say that
anything that the chairs ever said can move markets, and
so like we're not gonna tell you what time that
(33:13):
meeting started or whether they served coffee. They will give
you nothing at all if you make a flayer request
on the theory that it will all these bad things
will happen. But if I'm hearing you right, Powell said
something to these impersonators that he had not publicly said before.
But they're saying it's not a big deal because it's
what everybody thought was gonna happen anyway. Do I have
that just about right?
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Yeah, that's pretty much about right. You could say that
he's confirming the market's expectation, and at this time, the
Federal Reserve had not publicly announced a commitment to implement
two additional quarter percentage point interest rate hikes. But the
IG didn't take issue with this specific statement, probably because
even though Powell's comments gave the appearance that he might
(33:54):
have disclose confidential information, the chair has quote the authority
to upclass or down classify FLMC information at any time. So,
in other words, even though he may have disclosed non
public info, he's got the authority to classify it or
(34:14):
reveal it if he wants to. He has that unilateral
authority to do that.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
I can think of at least one powerful government official
who would very much subscribe to the view that he
could say and do whatever he wants with any documents,
because he is the authority to do the same thing.
Speaker 2 (34:30):
While the meeting was preceded by quote a rare set
of factors end quote, including Powell taking the call from
his home due to illness, the IG concluded that nothing
illegal took place.
Speaker 3 (34:42):
I'm going to say this too about inspectors general, and
I mean no offense to any inspectors general, but the
incentives would seem to be such that you want to
show that you like found something wrong, but you also
don't want to blow up the whole federal government. It's
such an odd office. It's like part of the federal government,
but it's supposed to like ca all out wrongdoing by
the federal government. But I'm sort of skeptical how much
(35:03):
it wants to like really really take that on. I
don't know what do you think, Jason.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
They will reach conclusions, they will make a referral or
recommend an action. Right in this case, you know what
they said was they found no violations of law, regulation,
or policy associated with this matter.
Speaker 5 (35:21):
Right.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
The bottom line is this, They're not going to say,
you guys are a bunch of idiots. Get your together.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
I'm not saying that they should be going out of
their way to like publicly humiliate anybody or grandstand or
get about a soapbox. But I think that there can
be a tendency, or at least the effect of burying
the reality of it in a bunch of bureaucratic sounding
stuff that really kind of takes away from the public
(35:49):
really understanding and appreciating the full ramifications of what happened.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
That's why I'm here, Matt, so I can help them
appreciate what happened.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
I always forget it, but thank you for reminding me.
If if we had excellent government in America, you and
I would both have to find other jobs.
Speaker 2 (36:05):
Right. I don't know what else I would do except
slang records.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
You could live up your T shirt collection for like, yeah,
easily three or four years.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
Have to sell some charts. So how could this have
been prevented? Powell says the simple fix would entail an
individual from the board calling the relevant embassy to verify
the contact. I mean the way that it's written. You
know you're reading it. It's so dry. But just think
of that. Powell's like, I know how we can resolve
(36:35):
this in the future. Just call the embassy to see
if that person actually sent the email. Now we have
to give credit where credit is due, because someone did
call the Ukrainian embassy, just not Powell staff that someone
was in the Treasury Department and when they called quickly
they had their answer. Presidence Lensky never requested a meeting
(36:57):
but that didn't happen until February eighth, two thousand, in
twenty three. By then it was too late. The joke
was on the FED. So there's your answer, Matt. What
spook Pal's assistant? None other than a little bit of
due diligence that should have been done well before the meeting.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
But they wait, They didn't do it until they reached
out after after We reached out to the Federal Reserve
for comment about this episode, but as of this recording,
the agency has not responded. So what's your take on
all this?
Speaker 2 (37:26):
The meeting revealed a break down an operational security and
a need to overhaul security protocols across the board, but
the IG makes no recommendations, and that makes me question
if the scope of the investigation was too narrowly defined
by did anyone violate existing rules? The report does say
that other internal agencies were also looking into this, but
(37:48):
records responsive to that weren't in this batch of records
or released to me more than a year after the incident.
This report is not instill a lot of confidence in
the public that the FED took serious that it lacked
elementary safeguards to prevent a massive breach by a foreign
actor that could have had national security consequences.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
This is the kind of thing that drives people nuts
about the federal government. Like you made a mistake. Just
admit I made a mistake. I get it. This is
what I'm gonna do different next time. But not sort
of like, oh well, other people screwed up too. We're
like here's my excuse, or like this isn't really that
big of a deal. Just own it for like five
seconds and then we can all move on. Like people
(38:30):
smart enough to see through that and it makes them
really mad.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
I agree.
Speaker 3 (38:34):
Is this inspector general one of the inspector generals who's
since been fired?
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Nope, he wasn't touched.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
So that was hoping. Maybe we could we could get
the on the pod talk about it. But right, maybe
we could, maybe we can get Chairman Powell on the pod.
Would you like to come on and discuss this report?
We are who we say we are. Oh that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
So that's it for this one, but not for Powell
and me in a sense. We end where we be.
Speaker 5 (39:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
On April morning in twenty twenty five, Jason Leopold was
sitting up in bed.
Speaker 2 (39:06):
Have n't brushed my teeth. I'm still there.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Scrolling the headlines when a story caught his eye.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
And I was like, oh, that's funny. I gotta follow
a foyer. So I followed a request with the Federal
Reserve for all adacted because it's classified.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Ooh, I can hardly wait for the records to come back.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Jason, Well, Matt, I'll let you know what the records say.
And a few years from Bloomberg and No Smiling, this
is Disclosure. The show is hosted by Matt Topic and
me Jason Leopold. It's produced by Heather Schroing and Sean
Cannon for No Smiling. Our editor for Bloomberg is Jeff Grocott.
(39:45):
Our executive producers for Bloomberg are Sage Bauman and me
Jason Leopold, and our executive producers for No Smiling are
Sean Cannon, Heather Schrowing, and Matt Topic. The Disclosure theme
song is by Nick, with additional music by Nick and
Epidemic Sound. Sound design and mixing is by Sean Cannon.
(40:06):
The emails in this episode were read by Josh Gondelman,
Katherine Blandford, and Adam Gilbert. For more Transparency News and
important document Thumps. You can subscribe to my Weeklyfoya Files
newsletter at Bloomberg dot com slash Foya Files. That's Foia Files.
To get every episode early on Apple podcasts. Become a
(40:28):
Bloomberg dot com subscriber today. Check out our special intro
offer right now at bloomberg dot com Slash podcast offer,
or click the link in the show notes. You'll also
unlock deep reporting data and analysis from reporters around the world.
We'll see you again next Tuesday.
Speaker 3 (40:49):
Did the Russian pranksters know how to foy you?
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