Work in Progress: Malin Akerman

Unfiltered, unapologetic, and utterly magnetic—Malin Åkerman is fresh off her bold, twist-filled turn in "The Hunting Wives" and opens up about embracing freedom on screen, the power of female friendship, and the honesty that fuels both her marriage and her career.  

Plus, find out the current state of the show's second season and how she and her husband feel about her new status as a queer icon.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, everyone, It's Sophia. Welcome to Work in Progress. Well,
hey everybody, or if we're talking about today's guests, should
I say hey, y'all. I am so excited that one

(00:23):
of my favorite women in this industry is here for
an interview I've been dying to do because, like all
of you, I am absolutely obsessed with The Hunting Wives.
Malin Ackerman is here with us today. Friends. You know
her from twenty seven Dresses to Billions. She is one
of the most incredible chameleons in our industry. Always full

(00:47):
of charm, always full of conviction, and she makes every
project she's a part of better. And now she is
the talk of the town thanks to The Hunting Lives
on Netflix. We've just found out we're getting a season two,
thank god, because we need more of this twist bill
that sexy series. Fans and critics alike have been blown

(01:10):
away by Molin's old, layered, courageous performance, and she is
officially in the canon of Queer Icons now. Not only
is she such an advocate for women to be represented
and seen and to be written in whole and exciting ways,
she's also an outspoken advocate for children's mental health, she

(01:31):
is an incredible mother and she is someone I am
so proud to call my friend. Let's dive in and
talk all things with Molin. I have a way I

(01:53):
really like to start with people, but with you, I
want to start in a very unique manner because you
are one of my favorite humans and also one of
the two Swedes in my life for so long. Well women,
I also have a lovely, handsome Swedish man who makes
my one of my best friends very happy. But one

(02:14):
of the things I love about my other amazing, hot,
iconic female Swedish friend, Tovlo, is that she's like, yeah,
that's not actually how I say my name, Like her
name is Toulou. Yeah, so I'm like, everyone is always
like Malan Ackerman, how do you actually pronounce your name?

Speaker 2 (02:32):
So if we were to say it in Swedish, it's
Marlin Keman hot, which sounds almost Jamaican with old there's
almost like a there's a cadence to Swedish Morlyn Marlin.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
Oh no, it is more of an a than I'm
saying Marlin Marlin.

Speaker 2 (02:48):
Yeah, it's the eye that liked. So that's why when
it's translated, we just my mom. When we moved to Canada.
She would just say it, but try to make it
more English, and she say malina, but everyone here wants
say malin or mailing because that's how it's spelt. Fair enough,
But if we were to add an L, then that
would probably help out, like a shopping mall and going in.

(03:08):
It interesting how it's kind of pronounced okay, cool. I
like it.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
I like it a lot. It's also not lost on
me because you know, my dad is Canadian. Yep, Like
the Canadians can hear each other from a mile away. Oh,
so you've got the Swedish and you've got that certain
sound like it comes out our us friends listening people
are like, well, what do you mean? They always think
it's just about but it's like Americans say Toronto, yeah,

(03:33):
like I'm going to Toronto, and Canadians say Toronto Toronto
like Montreal, not Montreal. And so I hear that, and
I'm just aware of all that, all the accents in
your life.

Speaker 2 (03:47):
You've got like a one degree of separation. Yeah, yeah,
there's a few coming in there.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
I love it. I also for our friends at home
feel so amped. I was telling the whole team since
we're here in person today that we've known each other
for almost twenty years.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
It's been a lot. I have a picture of you
kissing my pregnant belly. Oh my god, at the dinner
in Washington, DC. Yes, do you remember that. Yes, we
have known each other alone. Now my boys twelve years old.

Speaker 1 (04:13):
It's so crazy. And it's like, there's nothing better than
seeing your friends win.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
Yes, absolutely, so happy for seeing your friends period, or
see your friends win.

Speaker 1 (04:22):
Yeah, I mean book, but it's just like, yeah, I
just love it. I love it. I love it. I
really felt geeked last weekend, you know, emy weekend, all
the things happening, watching people like run across a room
to be like you're so amazing, You're so hot. I
was like shit, and it was just great. I really
love I just love this moment.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
I love it. It's been so much fun and it's
so fun. It was such a fun weekend. And just
to look back and just see your smiling face every
now and then, I mean, it was just it just
felt so beautiful because, like you said, I'm the same
I think when my friends are winning, I get so excited. Yeah,
you know, Michelle Monahan is a really good friend of
mine and the white notice and like there's just so

(05:04):
much to celebrate, and it's so lovely to have girlfriends
like that, because girls can really just when we prop
each other up, when we support each other, or we
can rule the world. Tell you so, it just is
fun and beautiful to look around and feel like I've
got a great group of girls around me, and that
is really special.

Speaker 1 (05:24):
It's amazing. Yeah, and I think especially to be in
the moment we're in in our lives where we've gone
through the early career stuff. Brittany and I were talking
about this in a way, like you meet some of
your favorite people and then everyone gets scattered all over
the world working like you know, marbles, and you go
through growth, you probably evolve out of some friendships that

(05:48):
aren't the best for you.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
Yeah, and then you like come back to your.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
Core humans and you go, oh my god, I feel
like I have I nailed it.

Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah, totally. That's the best part. I got people to
share this with this is awesome.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
The thing I normally ask people and I'm excited to
hear your answer, especially because you have a twelve year old,
is you know everybody tunes in, they listen, they've watched
the show, They've watched all your films, they know you
and your work. I'm always really curious if, as an adult,
at this point in your career, this point in your
personal journey, if we could like be in a sci

(06:27):
fi show and we could walk onto the playground and
see our eight year old selves or our nine year
old selves. Like if you got to hang out with
that little girl, would you would you see yourself in her?
Does the does the sort of through line of the
woman you've become make sense across the journey or do
you think she'd be like, sorry, what is your life? Like?

Speaker 2 (06:49):
You're doing well? If you showed her the hunting wise,
she'd be like, what, well, what we.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
Could get maybe like arrested for that?

Speaker 2 (06:58):
Yeah, totally, you can't show me your I think there
are pieces to it the track. But I also think
if I look at that little eight year old girl,
I was so shy and so insecure, but still very

(07:21):
goofy and positive. So there was like this combination where
I go, yeah, I mean I feel like everyone has
two paths that they can take in life for many
but two specific like one that kind of goes down
downward spiral and one that just conquers everything, and so
I can see both of those things in the little

(07:41):
eight year old. But I definitely could have seen it
go a different way had I listened to all the
little gremlins that were in my head. But luckily along
the way there were mentors and people that just kept
showing me that silver lining.

Speaker 1 (07:54):
Wow, what are your gremlins?

Speaker 2 (08:00):
You know, I really don't like to voice them out
loud because I don't love to give them the power.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
I like that.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
I've worked a lot on quieting them, and I work
a lot with my son on that right now, on
anything that's bothering him, to bring his truthful voice out,
his gut voice versus the gremlins that are telling him things.
And usually those gremlins are also other kids being mean
or whatever it is, and then you start to believe
that those things as truths. So we speak a lot

(08:29):
about that and just not giving it power. So I
don't ever like to voice them out loud. I know
their mind. I mean I will to my therapist. But
that's my biggest work in progress, is just being more
in my own power and my own shoes and listening
to my gut, which was not always easy and is
still a work in progress.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
Oh, it's such a hard journey. Yeah. And I especially
think that the era we came up in, Yeah, the
way women were treated in absolutely the media, the way
I mean it was just so vicious. Yeah, and it
was designed to make us crazy and to take I
love the way you say it, like, don't give them power.
It's like I've I've decided to sort of name mine.

(09:13):
I'm like, there's a little self doubt monster, and there's
like all these little monsters. And every week in therapy
and like all the monsters get to come to the
tea party totally and like my higher self is going
to entertain them and then put them back in their place.
But it's so interesting the way you phrase it, first
of all, to really learn to feed your goodness and

(09:36):
your power instead of the other side of the seesaw
we all have, and that you can see like, oh
it could have split here, Oh this could have changed that.
You know. For some reason, you saying that about your
young self made me think, yeah, I have all my
own versions of that. But the way I get to

(09:59):
watch my part r live and the person that she is, like,
you know, she is very clear about how access to sport.
That was the thing that pulled her down the good
path yea, when everything around her was dangerous and scary.
And I don't know, I think about particularly for all

(10:20):
of us, what sport and what the arts do for people,
but especially for women. Yeah, like it's huge, it changes
everything for us. When did you start to get into
that as a kid, because I know, you know, you
moved from Sweden to Canada. How that's obviously a crazy

(10:40):
culture shock. You know, it's a crazy shift.

Speaker 2 (10:43):
Do you know? What's interesting is that I would say
that Sweden and Canada have a lot of similarities, you know,
because kindness. Yeah, there's a little more logic and politically
in the past it hasn't been so torn, you know,
and so it was a pretty logical place to grow up.

(11:03):
Like you put money into taxes and they go to
healthcare and you get free healthcare, and like you get
free schooling, and like university costs. It cost me four
thousand dollars a year to go to university.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
I mean you get a return on your investment.

Speaker 2 (11:13):
Exactly, and the same with Sweden, Like it's a free
university and everything like it works, and so that wasn't
a huge there wasn't really a huge culture shock. Again,
I was two years old, so I wouldn't have noticed
a difference.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
Yeah that's true, you're so small.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
But looking at it and going and my dad moved
back to Sweden when I was six, so I spent
a lot of time going back and forth and comparing
the two, you know, unconsciously just comparing them. But it
felt like a like there was a similarity. I think
it would have been very different going from America to Sweden. Yeah,
there is more of a culture shock there. But I

(11:50):
loved growing up in Canada and that was you know,
it was hard because my dad went back to Sweden
when I was six, and I was such a daddy's girl,
but he had to do it because we just didn't
have finances. And I got a better job offer in
Sweden and my mom wanted to stay in Canada. She
preferred it there, so it was an amicable split, thank god.

(12:11):
But I would be I would get on a plane
at six years old by myself and like do the
chaperone thing and go see my dad in the summer
and spend the summer's there. So it was again silver
linings to everything, where like I got this beautiful sort
of duality of culture growing up or spent three to
four months in Sweden, March breaks and Christmas and stuff,
and then also the influence of Canada and growing up there.

Speaker 1 (12:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:33):
And I think you had a question, but I don't
remember what it was.

Speaker 1 (12:35):
I don't really either, but I love it. It's like
I think sometimes when people ask me about perspective, you know,
when you talk about logic, the sort of inherent desire
to take care of your neighbors, yeah, and to know
that they're valuable. I really think that kind of duality

(12:57):
in childhood can give that to you. It's like being
shown rather than being.

Speaker 2 (13:02):
Told yeah always.

Speaker 1 (13:04):
And I think a lot about it because you know,
I grew up here. My dad came from Canada in
the seventies to go to art school. My mom moved
out here from New York. I grew up here in
the middle of LA But it was like very normal, cute,
normal little neighborhood.

Speaker 2 (13:18):
It's so crazy to say about normal little neighborhood, Like a.

Speaker 1 (13:21):
Normal little neighborhood. Like nobody had a big, fancy house.
Nobody was like doing any of what you see on
like selling sunset or right right now, and my childhood
was summers up in a five thousand person cattle ranch
town in central California.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Oh wow, And.

Speaker 1 (13:37):
So like we would catch frogs on Friday nights in
the creek.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
Like that's what there was to do totally.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
And the back and forth of it. I think really
now reflecting back, if I hung out with my eight
year old self, I'd realize the reason I love people
and I love the world so much is because I
get so excited to dip into anyone's place space, culture city, yeah,
and figure out what they like to do on a
Friday night.

Speaker 2 (14:03):
Yeah, And that's huge, and I think that is I
think being a global citizen is really really important. And
I think being curious about other people and being open
to discussion about, you know, advancing that a little further,
not just what they do on a Friday, but like
what's your life like and what are your beliefs and
why and what do you care about? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (14:24):
Who makes you feel seen?

Speaker 2 (14:25):
Not just in your own little circle because we all
have the same opinions, but when you reach outside and
you kind of see the world for what it is,
there's so much beauty to be found in it.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
Yeah, we'll be back in just a minute. But here's
a word from our sponsors. It's interesting too for us
to be sitting here in this moment because we have
been activists and advocates for such a long time. We
do live in a time where things have shifted away

(14:56):
from the logic you speak of, Like you talk have
a logic account and I was like, you mean, you're
not an alternative fact. It's like an alternative fact is
a lie.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
There is a lie, Like.

Speaker 1 (15:07):
We can have differences of opinion, but like, for example,
I'm like, racism is not a difference of opinion like that.
Don't know, We're not going to do that. We're not
going to excuse cruelty and call it thought.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
No, you know, And we do seem to be in
this place.

Speaker 1 (15:27):
I mean, we don't seem we see it where we
are going down this really dark path. And this is
going to seem like a weird moment to segue to
your wonderful show. But stay with me, or I see
so many people being scared to be seen. So many
people understand that their identity is threatened, now that their

(15:50):
ability to have rights is threatened. Now, I you know,
I've been putting this movie together and like literally everywhere
people are like, oh no, no, no, we can't touch queer
content right now. And then along comes the Hunting Wives show,
and I I just am like, not only is it
an important thing to have out in the zeitgeist, but

(16:12):
right now that your show is the biggest show on
streaming right now, Like, how do you wrap your head
around that, not just as an actor, but also as
a global citizen, as someone who knows how much representation matters?
Like are you do you just feel like you have
whiplash all the time?

Speaker 2 (16:29):
A little bit, yeah, but like a fun whiplash, a
great whiplash, a really happy one. And like you said,
the representation is when we're not we're not. The thing
is that we're not presenting as anything. It's just it's
it's not like coming out and going this is the
L word or this is you know what I mean,
but it is an exploration of what it is to

(16:53):
be human. I'm not going to get this is like,
it's not a prestige show. And like bro Becca says herself,
it's an anti pristige show. It's it's popcorn, it's fun,
it's entertainment, but it's also just real inherent human curiosity
and people being fluid, And I'm not going to sit
here and say I'm representing the LGBTQ community, but also

(17:15):
I'm so glad that it represents many aspects of it
in the community. But I think that's also why it's
being so widely received, is because no one's putting it
in your face, going it's a bunch about a bunch
of gay women who are and then some people might
just go, I'm not going to watch something that's gay content.

(17:35):
But because it's presenting as house weves of Texas who
are getting it on with each other and like exploring
their sexuality. And I've said it before, like I think
most people are quite fluid, and society is just put
certain boundaries on what a marriage looks like it looks like,

(17:57):
or what a relationship looks like, or what human should
look like, and what it meant what your sexuality should
and shouldn't look like. So I just feel like this
just creates a bit of freedom. And it's with both
worlds conservatives and liberal yes, and it's mixing the worlds
together and we're loving both of them. And so it's
this weird combination, this beautiful magical combination that's just hit

(18:21):
home for many people.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
Yeah, I think that's part of the profundity of it. Like,
don't get me wrong, we all love a prestige show.
I would actually argue that this also is. But I
do think there's a there's been a strangeness that maybe
we haven't necessarily looked at where Yeah, if we're going

(18:43):
to do the L word, which I love, like me too,
you're going to do it in LA And so then
suddenly it's, oh, that's a gay place. Like I just
sent a video yesterday a waitress in Ohio, like you know,
went to the table to do the thing, and the
older woman having dinner with her daughter said what white

(19:03):
wine do you have? And she suggested one and she said, oh, no,
that's from California. I don't support that state. There's too
many gay people there. I'll take the white wine from
New Zealand. And the waitress said, you know, there's okay,
I'm pretty sure there's gay people in New Zealand. And
the woman just looked at her and she said, would
you like another server, because ma'am, I'm a lesbian. And

(19:24):
the woman, she said, was so flustered, and she was like,
I'll have someone else bring you your wine so you
don't have to talk to a gay person, and she did.
She gave the table away and her video made me
so sad because I was like, who are we becoming?
I don't know, but I love what you're doing on
the show because you're reminding people like people are people

(19:46):
everywhere everywhere, there's gay people everywherehere.

Speaker 2 (19:52):
Who cares?

Speaker 1 (19:54):
I know what?

Speaker 2 (19:55):
Who somebody falls in love with what they do in
the bedroom? Who ca I don't. I don't want to
know what that woman does in the bedroom. By the way,
I don't care, but I don't give a You do
whatever you want. If you want to get pegged, then
get pegged. Go for our girlfriend like that. I just
why are we so? There's so many bigger problems yeah

(20:17):
than who somebody loves it literally doesn't matter. It blows
my mind. Love is love is love, and God there's love.
Thank God for it. It saves the world. And then
why are people so mad at it? You know it
just it can't. It makes me really upset. Things like that.

Speaker 1 (20:34):
Well, the thing is, if if you can create the
illusion of impropriety for something good or by the way,
frankly something irrelevant. Then you can create an identity war.
It's like a religious war. Logic can't win it, and
then people aren't paying attention to the fact that we

(20:54):
don't have health care and that our kids can't read.

Speaker 2 (20:57):
Or literary of course, so.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
It's fun to watch how inherently honest a show like
yours is, and that that honesty actually makes it quite subversive.

Speaker 2 (21:09):
Yeah, I'm like, this is I Rebecca Cutter has done
an incredible job.

Speaker 1 (21:13):
Incredible. So when you you mentioned getting pegged, I know
from our conversations that you got to that scene and went,
oh my god, can you tell the people about the
first how the show came your way sure, and how
you knew you had to do it, and how interestingly

(21:35):
your husband was kind of the show's biggest champion.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Yeah, he's my biggest champions, by the way. Yes, So
the whole series landed in my inbox, all eight episodes. Wow,
And that's, as you know, very unusual. Usually get a
pilot and you kind of have to make up the
rest and hope that this character goes somewhere cool. So
I got all eight episodes, I started reading and I

(22:00):
was in a mood because I just lost a job
to a very zegeisty show and literally that day and
I was like, and then this came along and I
was like, what is this? Red State n Ari? Anti abortion?
Like is this? Who is this? Who I'm going to play?
Is this it? And that was just like first episode

(22:22):
and I didn't know what this was it, what was coming? Yeah,
And so I read on and then I handed it
to my husband. I was like, can you just read
this and like let me know your thoughts because I'm
really starting to fall in love with this character and
I think there's more there, Like there's an underlying theme
in this that is not on the page, and I
feel like there's so much to do with this and

(22:43):
there's so much to play with. And he started reading
it because are you kidding me? Why wouldn't you do this?
I mean you were tailor made for this. This role
is tailor made for you. And I was like, wait
a second, there's that's a loaded liked am I father.
I'm not sure if that's.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Good or not.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
But he just meant, you know, there are You'll get
to showcase so much of your talent in this is
what he was saying. He is, I mean, I've taken
on project projects before, and he's like, you're better than this.
You should not be doing this. You're is so much
better than this, and that's such a beautiful thing to say.
But at the same time, going no, im not, there's
one of my little grumlins coming out. I'm like, no, no,

(23:22):
this is fine. This is perfect for little me. This
is I mean, I've got a job, this is amazing.
So he's always been pushing me to put my goal
a little bit higher for myself. Yeah, And so this
came along and then I read it. I was reading
it and I was loving every moment of it. It's
such a page turner. And then I got to the

(23:44):
episode where Callie is with her husband in the bedroom
and spoiler alert, but she pegs him. And now I've
had many discussions with friends of mine who are straight men,
gay men, and you know, women all across the board
who pegging has come up quite a bit over the

(24:06):
few of the past few years. People just being honest.
It's not like it hasn't existed, it's just people starting
to te People just didn't talk about it, didn't talk
about it. And so when this came up, I was like,
oh my god, this is amazing. I've never seen this
on television before. And I bet you so many people
will relate to this. We'll want to try it, We'll
want it, you know, get curious about it. And so

(24:31):
that was sort of the nail in the coffin for me,
was that scene where you know, I know I wasn't
doing the scene, but I just went, this is so brave.
It's brave, very very brave to just be out there
with that.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Yes, by the way, I have I've been waiting for
this to tell you this story.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:47):
So back in the day, early days of One Tree Hill,
my two roommates from college had moved after college Jenny York,
and I was basically the third roommate, and I'd fly
up there on the weekends to see Ali and Bro
and one of our best friends, Paul, was Ali's coworker
at BNCPR if you remember, like back in the day,

(25:08):
I don't know, Ragman nim and Cafarelli public Relations.

Speaker 2 (25:11):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (25:11):
And sometimes I would fly to New York for like
an audition. Yeah, and where was I gonna go. It'd
be like a Thursday. I'd be flying up in the morning,
flying back on you know, Eastern seaboard, you know, and
I would go to her office and I got to
be really really good friends with Ali's coworker, Paul. And
at the time, this was probably like two thousand and six,

(25:34):
they got hired to do pr for a very high
end sex toy company and nobody was talking about sex toys.
And I remember Paul being like, yeah, gotta come look
at that the cabinet and he opened it and we
all were like blushing. We were like what the is
all of that?

Speaker 2 (25:49):
Like what what?

Speaker 1 (25:51):
And then like you're curious, and then you're also like
I have to go because I can't be seen in
public having this conversation, which is so silly, the way
we've all been shamed about sex, which people have been
having since the dawn of time. Sure, and I will
never forget Paul telling me. I was like, what's the
weirdest thing that this company sells the most of? Because
they got all the data right, and he said, the

(26:11):
thing they sell the most of that they are the
most surprised by is strap ons for women in Red
States to peg their husbands. And by the way, I go,
I go, where do they go the most? And he said, ironically, Ohio, Wow,
Paul happens to be Paul Down's, the creator of Hacks
Get Out, Yes, Oh Yes, and this observance like this company.

(26:36):
When him and Lucia first started working together writing together
before they were married, they did essentially like a funnier
die video called Dildo Sport, and they came up with.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
The idea because of this that's amazing sex.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Way company he represented for a time, So everyone should
watch that. It's on YouTube. It's the funny one. But
like when you say, nobody talks.

Speaker 2 (26:58):
About it, nobody talks about because, like you just said,
we've all been shamed. Yeah, sex is normal and kinks
are normal as long as it's too consenting adults, go
for it, baby, whatever you like, have a nicety. I
also I'm very I am very curious about people's things,
Like I find it fascinating and that's why the conversations

(27:20):
have come up, and I'm like, what do you like?
What do you guys do? Is there anything fun like
or do you have a fantasy or like, what's something
that you are nervous to ask your wife to do
or your husband or like yes, or your boyfriend or girlfriend.

Speaker 1 (27:31):
What's something you've recently learned about your sexuality that surprised you,
you know.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
Yeah, you know I thought you were asking me. You're
just no. I mean, it's such a nice question. You
can answer it totally. Want to own nothing surprising with
my sexual I know myself very well.

Speaker 1 (27:46):
I love it. Okay, that is a question also if
it's not too personal. But to your point, I think
people at home might not have people to have these conversations.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Yeah, totally.

Speaker 1 (27:58):
Your husband is your biggest champion. Yeah, he was like,
do this show go have this conversation about how this
woman who lives in a very you know, like you said,
anti abortion place, has had one, which we know is
so common because you see these guys passing these laws
about our bodies and then we hear about the mistresses
his abortions. They've paid for it. I'm also curious, how, like,

(28:24):
because the show is so sexy, yeah, and it requires
a lot of sex, how do you navigate that in
your relationship? And how? I mean, your husband is the
nicest man, he's also so evolved. So I asked this
question not specifically for him, more for maybe other husbands
of queer women, like how does he navigate you in

(28:47):
your fullness? Like, how does he not get nervous about
it or jealous about it.

Speaker 2 (28:52):
Honestly, how did you have the conversation? I have a unicorn,
I feel like, I really do. I think it stems
from his father, who is a wonderful human as well.
And he said to Jack, once, Jack is my husband's name,
he said to him, once, you know I met your mother,

(29:14):
this wild, free spirit that I knew I could never
put in a cage, nor did I ever want to.
So I never ever tried to change her mother, because
she is who she is, and that's who I fell
in love with. And I think Jack has taken that
on and just gone, you are this whatever, X, Y,
and Z woman that he fell in love with, whatever

(29:35):
he fell in love with. With me, he would never
try to change that because that's what he fell in
love with. I am who he fell in love with,
and so whatever I come with is what he wants.
And so he's also in the business, so he understands
what it really is like to do an intimate scene.
As you know as well. It's not super sexy, it's

(29:58):
not supertic. It's very technical, yeah, but it's beautiful to
watch once it's all said and done.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
It when it's edited together, and you don't hear they're
going I need you to turn your heads to inches
because you're in this person's light. But once that's all gone,
it looks great.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Its beautiful music to it, you know, So he knows
all of that stuff as well. And then on top
of that, I mean, it's like I said, it's it's
mostly me and other women in this show. And that's
a lot of guys will say that that's one of
their fantasies is just either girlfriend or a wife or
whatever with another woman. And so for him there's a

(30:35):
little bit of like, whoa, this is exciting, and you know,
Brittany and Jamie Ray they're just beautiful women. But he's
on set, he meets everyone. We make it like I
know that sounds weird, but like a family affair, it's
just there's the security there and there's no we don't
have jealousy in our relationship. It's just we've got no

(30:57):
room for it. We're just not not those people. Yeah,
there's no to be. You know, we've made this commitment.
We know what our commitment is to each other and
what our rules and our boundaries are, and we adhere
to them. You know I'm old enough. Now I'm forty
seven years old. I know what I want and I need,
and we're very vocal about it. When I was twenty
in my twenties, I could never have had these kinds

(31:17):
of discussions. I could never have explored the kind of
marriage that we have. Like I just didn't have the vocabulary.
I didn't have the tools, I didn't have the confidence.
I didn't know who I was. Now I know who
I am, and entering into this relationship with Jack, I
was very open about who I am, what I want
in a relationship. If it's going to work that I'm

(31:38):
still a work in progress that I probably am going
to change. Hopefully we'll change together. But I said, you know,
in our vows when we get married, I'm not going
to say forever because that would be a lie because
I don't know, no but that's true or not. But
every day I'm going to try my best to be
the best wife and best partner. But that's all I
can promise. So you know, we have a lot of

(32:01):
really great discussions. He's he's a really great person to
talk to and that's why it works. Communication is key.

Speaker 1 (32:06):
Yeah, we'll be back in just a minute after a
few words from our favorite sponsors. What an amazing thing
to find that not only your relationship with yourself, but
a relationship with yourself that I think when you get
forged in both evolution and fire, frankly, when you know

(32:31):
yourself in a way that you can then have such
a healthy relationship with another person. And when you get
it as essentially a second chance, like when you did
it younger and with less knowledge, and it wasn't right
for you, and you figured out how to both own
that and extricate yourself from that and not let it

(32:54):
harden you to the possibility of something good in the future.

Speaker 2 (32:58):
Absolutely the two paths where you could go down the
really dark path or you could go silver lining, whereas
I'm yeah, yeah, But it's also that I don't know
if you've noticed this, but as you get older, all
the sayings that we heard told to us as young
is that we could never wrap our heads around and
that one real big truth is you have to love

(33:19):
yourself first in or to love somebody else. And it's
as simple as that, and that's the hardest thing to do.
But when you start to love yourself, then you start
to be able to have a really great relationship with
somebody else. And that's been really true, and that's the
exploration that I'm having with my husband right now.

Speaker 1 (33:36):
It's beautiful and it watching you guys together like in
real in the real world, people are like, wait.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
What not just he's not on the show.

Speaker 1 (33:46):
He's not like secretly on the show, seeing how lovely
and like generative your relationship is together.

Speaker 2 (33:56):
Oh that's a nice word.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yeah, I feel like I can see it in your
free him on camera, you know, and it's and it's
so cool, like when you've watched all your friends do
all their things and you you see them and you're
just like, oh, you're in a whole nother like you've
I don't know what you're doing, but it's working, like
you know, and you go like you leveled it up

(34:19):
like in your spirit. And I love seeing it for you,
and frankly, I love seeing you and Brittany have the
experience together because you know, twenty years ago, we were
a lot of people's gay awakenings. John Ducker Must Die
and even that was so through the male gaze, like
my character teaching her character how to kiss, and then
you know, the camera turning and realizing a guy was watching.

(34:43):
I remember doing press and being like, you know, we
were so lucky we got to do that together, and
hearing the way we answered the question and being like, oh,
it wasn't about that. It was weird for us to
kiss each other. It was like it didn't feel great
to be on camera for like a guy's entertainment. And right,
you guys just being together. I'm like, we've really made

(35:04):
some progress.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
I'm so proud. Same, No, girl. That was the beauty
about this show too. Is the beauty of this show
now that we're continuing, is that we everything has been
through the female gaze. Yes, and that's really cool. I've
never experienced that before because, like you just said, most
of it has been through the male gaze. And that's okay,
do but but this is our turn, and this is

(35:28):
every woman. Every director was a woman, And the woman
who directed mine and Brittany's first intimate scene is Melanie Mayron,
and she is herself lesbian, and so she's like, I
want this to be beautiful and what we think is
sexy and what we deem is sexy and also have

(35:49):
that nuance of the tenderness and the love and the
excitement behind it, you know, So that was really beautiful
to just have that discussion. And Rebecca Cutter as well,
who you know, has been with women and men and
just is is very open to making it just beautiful
in the way that we feel is beautiful.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
Well, and something that has been really interesting, as you know,
a queer person is watching rather than like you know,
who's day. You know, you're dating, you're experimenting, you're doing
whatever you're doing being in this relationship as long as
I've been in it now with ash watching some of

(36:29):
my straight friends. Yeah, and even some friends that realize
maybe they're more curious than they thought observe our intimacy.
And I don't mean like we don't have, you know,
someone in the bedroom. But a friend of mine said
to me the other day, we'd had friends over and like,
you know, you're buzz you're buzzing around, you're hosting. We
like we we went around the kitchen island and we

(36:49):
like we're talking to each other in the corner, and
we separated and like went and did the thing. My
friend said, I watched you too, have this moment, have
this sweetness together, the way you like wrapped your arms
around each other and kissed each other and then you
looked at each other you said something. I don't know
what it was. You went she said, my husband has
never kissed me like that unless he's trying to me.

(37:11):
And I was like, the difference in intimacy sure is,
I'm realizing is revelatory even for people who aren't having
the intimacy I'm having and watching you guys and the
way you talk about even how you create it. Do

(37:31):
you think there's something that's so amazing for audiences not
only because you know you are playing a very openly
bisexual woman, but because someone who they might feel they
identify with, someone like Britney's character, who they until they
learn a little more they thought was like always straight,
is exploring her fluidity. Like I'm amazed that that there's

(37:56):
so many women being like, oh, this isn't just a show,
as you said at the top, for lesbians, like this
is a show for everyone, and like am I am?
I maybe a little by like are there things I
haven't explored myself?

Speaker 2 (38:07):
Absolutely? And I think you know adultery aside, I guess
you know it's women behaving badly for like in many
terrible ways to be.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
Good for anyone who hasn't seen it. Your character on
the show is in an acknowledged open relationship.

Speaker 2 (38:22):
Yeah, but yes, we don't call it open. That's for liberals,
as she says, that's for the liberals on the web.
We have any agreements and how we do our marriage right,
and this is accepted. But I do go outside those
boundaries and see the young man that which is which
is not many no nos in that the fact.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
That you're so liable on this show, I mean crazy
in life, that that isn't like a five alarm fire.
I'm like, wow, okay, this is really something.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
I think people hated that part the most, which I get,
which is it's two tiers, too young and best friends.
It's just not sun like, it's just and but what every.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
Is that everyone hates And what a wonderful actor he
is to be clear lovely person, but he's playing an
unlikable man. Oh no, derm, it's wonderful. I was going
to say that the gentleman who plays Britney's husband, like
everybody just hates hates having characters so much that they're like, girl,
cheat on your husband.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
He sucks. Well to go back to what you were
just beginning in this was you know, women explore like
exploring seeing Britney's character. And I think it all comes
down to being seen, whether you're in a queer relationship
or a straight relationship or whatever it is. Because I
what you just said about you and Ash I have
with Jack, I think we can have those intimate moments

(39:36):
and that. And I said that to him in the beginning.
I said that, Listen, I always thought intimacy I did
as a woman, thought intimacy was was physical and sexual,
and I'm precursor to secual one hundred percent. I was like, intimacy,
that's what that is. That was the equation for me.
And then I started working on myself and then I
met Jack and I said, listen, I don't think I've
ever been truly intimate with somebody. I've never shared a lot.

(39:59):
I've held everyone at an arm's length to protect myself.
And so I'm going to try this new thing of
like letting some guards down and let you in and
be intimate with you. Yes, and that was really hard
for me, but that's why our relationship is the way
it is. So I think that in this show, intimacy
is what's missing in her relationship with her husband and

(40:20):
she finds it Margo sees her or at least is
feigning to or whatever. However, this is unfolding but to
be seen. And I think that Margo is being seen
in a different light by Sophie as well, because all
of her gals that she hangs out with, it's very
on a very different surface than it is with Brittany
who comes in and it is very emotionally intelligent and

(40:42):
sees different facets of Margo. And I think the intimacy
part is what most people are looking for, and whether
it's with a woman or a man or whatever. I
wish everyone could go out there and find an intimate partner.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
Yes, well, after the four of us were out on Saturday,
Ash even was like, oh, she was like, I know
she's our people, but like he's also, he's my people.

Speaker 2 (41:04):
I was like he had the same thing about like
I really like that girl, as she seems so cool.
See can we hang out? I was like, well, they
live on the East Coast, but yes.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
It's so cool and how how does it feel?

Speaker 2 (41:23):
Like?

Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yes, the representations gorgeous and yes, what a freeing experience
to be directed by women and to have real intimacy
be part of sexuality instead of sexuality, be the exclusive
representation of intimacy. Like also, even just because you girls
are my friends, like my d ms are so filled

(41:45):
with the whole game, Annette, who's so happy about this show?
How is the experience for you?

Speaker 2 (41:50):
And I?

Speaker 1 (41:51):
And I am curious too because we are in a
moment where queer women who date women and then date men,
or queer women who wind up mary men are in
a struggle about what their identity looks like, what biphobia
looks like, what what the judgment of lesbians looks like like.

(42:11):
It's a It's a mishmashy mess. How how do you
see it in terms of what you're representing? What's the feedback?
How does it feel? Are you having the best time?

Speaker 2 (42:24):
I'm having the best time. I don't. I also don't
want to claim that property of like I'm represent you
know what I mean? I don't just playing, but I'm
playing this woman. And I'm so happy that people are
again feeling seen maybe or feeling that there's representation on
TV for them. That's all beautiful. Yeah, and I And

(42:46):
again it's back to that thing of like I to
have to label yourself is so crazy. It's just all
the label actually is that it's condensed to just human.
You're just humans. All of what you just said, like
lesbian and then straight and then or whatever your preference is.
That's just the human experience. So the fact that we

(43:06):
have to label it all the time is a shame
because again that comes with different levels of shame. And like,
you know, but and I'll say it again, I think
most people are born fluid, and I think that society
just kind of says you have to be one or
the other, you have to fit in a pocket, and
you don't. Yeah, And I think that's what's so fun

(43:27):
about this show.

Speaker 1 (43:28):
Yeah, and now a word from our wonderful sponsors. By
the way, what I certainly learned and I will never
forget this sort of aha moment for me of you know,

(43:50):
going through my own dissolution and realizing like I built
this picture perfect life and what I learned in the
first year of it was that it really wasn't and
how do you reconcile that? And what do you do?
And I will never forget having this conversation because I'd
been away from everyone, and when you're isolated, it can
be harder to deal with hardship. And I remember facetiming

(44:16):
one of my best friends. I was at the point
where I was like, I can only tell two people
a day that I have to take apart the whole
house I've built essentially like brick by brick, and it's
too hard to have this conversation. And I called one
of my best friends, Rory, who has a phenomenal podcast
about the horrors of dating and is coming out with
a book, like the perfect person to talk about, like

(44:39):
I'm waking up to the fact that this is so
and what am I going to do? And Rory was like,
I'm so proud of you, and we've been waiting and this,
that and the other was just the most supportive friend.
And she said like, but what happened? Like what's gone on?

Speaker 2 (44:52):
You know?

Speaker 1 (44:52):
Because I called her from the middle of the night
in London, and I was like, ah, I just like
we're performers, right, we know how to keep things under wraps.
We know how to smile and do our jobs no
matter what's going on at home. And I was like,
I like in a room like full of people there
was like prass and I saw a couple of my girlfriends,
and you know, I've been in Europe by myself for

(45:13):
three months and I saw some of my friends and
I was just like in the corner with all these
great like power lesbians sobbing about how bad things are.
And she was like, well, yeah, because women obviously you
need that. She goes, I just have to say, I know,
your like role in life is that you're here to
dismantle the patriarchy. You want to create real equity. She

(45:34):
was like, I just don't think you like men.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
And I was like, no, but I.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
I do like Kenny and Cameron and all our restriens.
She goes, no, no, no, no, I think like intimately, I
think you think you're into men and women, and I
actually think you really don't like men.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
And I was like, yea, I have a relationship with
a man that was like interesting.

Speaker 1 (45:54):
Is there actually a reverse version of this where society
has made me think I'm like somewhere fluid in the
middle and I'm actually really not like is that my moment?

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Is that? A huh?

Speaker 1 (46:08):
I've always been open, but like, have I been as
open as I as I deserve for myself?

Speaker 2 (46:14):
Right?

Speaker 1 (46:14):
And so to your point, regardless of what direction those
labels go in they I think they can reduce the
permission you give yourself to, Yeah, to find yourself in
the world.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
Absolutely, And look how hard it is to be anything
other than straight right now and live and a deer
to the rules, the rules whatever, those are that part.
But yeah, it's much easier to fall into Let me
get the house and the white pick of fence and
the dog and the babies and the marriage. And you're
like boring, Like, whereas who's talking about the intimacy, who's

(46:48):
talking about being seen? He's talking about communication? What does
it look like inside behind closed doors? Yes, what is
that relationship? What should it be?

Speaker 1 (46:57):
It's been really interesting because I have a girlfriend who
you know, came from like a very traditional religious turned
out to be like culty, terrifying thing, but had that
as well. Yeah, and the unpacking we've done recently together
of what it looks like to not only have to
go through the dismantling of the image of your life,

(47:20):
but to reckon with the fact that there is a
large part of society that would rather you be in
a traditional marriage that is toxic, violent, full of theft,
full of emotional fiscal finance. You know, physical, any kind
of abuse, then be holistically happy with someone the same

(47:42):
gender as you. You're like, WHOA, We've gotten so far
out of it's so crazy, Like we're off the track
here of goodness for people. And so I just love
that this show you're making that that is so you
called it popcorn, and I'm like, no, it's art because
it's what I experience as a viewer of your show

(48:03):
is the camp of it. It's self awareness.

Speaker 2 (48:06):
It is sure.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
It is playing into total subversive subversiveness and total stereotype
at the same time, which is so hard to balance.
And you're shocking people all the time and reminding people
that everyone's kind of going through a version of the
same thing in this tightened television environment. And I'm just like,
this is what the show we need right now because

(48:28):
people are out here coming for gay marriage and like
things are crazy and we needed this.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
I'm so glad. I listen. I give kudos to Rebecca
Cutter for creating this. This is really we're along for
the ride, and I'm so happy to be on this ride.
And I love it. I think it's brilliant and I
love towing that line of like I say, popcorn because
I think it's entertaining, you know, and it is. It's entertainment.
It's supposed to be entertaining, but yes, it has definitely

(48:56):
a lot of different elements to it that are causing,
and rightfully so.

Speaker 1 (49:01):
I also think entertainment sometimes gets knocked as though it's
frivolous when it's actually the most powerful medicine. Like the
thing that changed American opinion on civil rights for gay
people was Will and Grace. Oh wow, people were like, oh,
we love those guys, Oh why do we judge people like, well,

(49:27):
the gay people I know are nice and wait a second,
and it really helped shift public opinion. And I think
it's incredibly important to entertain people and remind them to
be curious about their neighbors instead of judgmental. You know. Absolutely,

(49:47):
it's more valuable now than ever, and I think it's
been so valuable for so long. And I think it's
why when people ask why so many entertainers are pro
social justice or universal health care or policies that take
care of people, it's because we get to know people
everywhere and every kind.

Speaker 2 (50:08):
Of from all different walks of life exactly, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
Exactly, and even for you, like your mental health advocacy
is something I've always admired the way you've shared, you know,
about your experience learning to caretake for a parent struggling.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
With depression, Like yeah, parentified.

Speaker 1 (50:25):
Child stuff, mental health like these are heavy topics, but
when brought to light, they they can be lifted up.

Speaker 2 (50:34):
Absolutely. Yeah, And I think you're right. I think bringing
it through entertainment is a great way to do it
so it doesn't I always think about like PSAs and
how heavy PSAs can be sometimes, like we should find
a way to do PSAs that are through comedy so
that it really resonates with people. But I agree. I
just think that, you know, mental health stuff was always
like nobody talked about it when I was a kid.

(50:55):
That was it just I didn't even know. I didn't
even know that my mom was depressed. I didn't even
know that word. So I just was trying to figure
out what was happening all the time, right without talking
to anybody, of course, you know, and it was just
me and my mom because my dad was doesn't even
tell him, like what would I say? What were the
words that I was going to use? Right, So having
that now and having a kid who's twelve years old,

(51:18):
and how they have a class in school every single
week called life Skills and it's all about wow, mental
health and communication, and you know, it's fantastic. I have
a boy who talks about his feelings and that's incredible
and I think that's the right thing to do, you know,
And that's and I know that's not across the board,

(51:40):
not everywhere, but I think we're on our way towards that.
And the more that we talk about it and the
more we put it out there, well.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
Just to say, hey, this happens to everybody.

Speaker 2 (51:50):
Yeah, it's so normal. Yeah, unfortunately, but it is.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
Yeah, yeah, it's really interesting. Do you think do you
think that was part of what led you where you're
acting career to study psychology, which, by the way, is
such good fuel for an acting career.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
I think for sure that's what led me to psychology.
I think again, not having access to a therapist or
even understanding that that's something that I should be reaching
out to, you know, at seventeen years old, psychology was
just so fascinating to me. It was so interesting because
all of a sudden I was getting answers to my

(52:26):
own questions. Yes, they're going oh my God, this could
be so helpful for everyone else. And my my younger
brother had stuff going on and nobody understood it, and
schools weren't helping out. OCD really severe, and so it
was really difficult in school for him, and there was
nobody there who understood it or could help him. And
so I thought, you know what I met with the

(52:47):
Health Minister of Canada. I was like, I'd like to
change the school systems please. I'd like to make sure
that we have counselors in every classroom, especially in high schools.
They can nip things in the butt and be there
to support people. Goes, all right, once you've got your education,
come on in and we'll sit down and make a plan. Wow,
still waiting for me. I mean, you know, acting took over,
but but I do think that that's what led me

(53:09):
into it was just all the different and and and
also friends and people in my own high school and
two people who took their own lives, two kids that
I knew in high school who took their own lives
because of mental health issues and nobody was talking about it.
So it's just stuff like that that I think led
me to want to get into it. And yes, great

(53:30):
for acting because because you're going into somebody's psyche and
going all right, what's their background and what have happened
in their life? Yeah, Margo Banks? Where does Margo come from?
Boy's story? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (53:44):
What are for folks at home? What are the things
you you want them to know about? Not just the
show obviously, like if you're living under a rock and
you haven't watched it, catch up, but in terms of
things that are important to you, like what organizations you
want to tell every listener of the show about right now?

Speaker 2 (54:02):
Well, you know, I again, mental health is a huge
one for me. I want everyone to feel like it's
okay to talk about everything that's going on in their lives.
And kids specifically are a huge one because I know
certainly growing up I didn't always have the best mentors.

(54:24):
You know, my dad is wonderful, but he was far away.
My mom is wonderful, but she had especially she was
struggling in her own stuff. Yeah, So to give children
especially a voice is really huge. So it's a children's
mental health organization and it used to be called Honor Sleeves,
but it's Angel Carter who started it, and she's Aaron

(54:49):
Carter of the Carter family that Carter and Aaron Carter
went through some severe mental health issues that ended up
in his death, and so she started this organization a
few years ago and I absolutely love it. And they
have this website that has all these tools for schools, caretakers, anybody,
parents on how to begin conversations. They have complete curriculums

(55:12):
for schools to incorporate to help children out. So I
think that one's really important, starting from you know, the
ground up, when they're young and susceptible and receptive as well.
I think that's really important. So that's that's one of
my biggest ones. But there's a lot of different I mean,
Environmental Media Association, I've been aboard on the board for
that for a very long time. And Opportunity and Turn

(55:34):
Opportunity International, which is a micro financing organization that focus
mainly on women and they give them financial aid but
also courses on how to start a business and how
to sustain that. So it's not just like here's some money,
good luck, it's.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
Like here's here's the seed of what you need and
here's how to build.

Speaker 2 (55:55):
Yeah, so those are just focusing on that kind of stuff.
Keeping the world turning.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
Well, yeah, I think speaking truth to power is so important.
But if if we do that and then don't follow
it with the opportunity to act, I think we can
just make people feel even more scared. And so the
action is so important. And what I love about our
jobs and being able to highlight a plethora of things
we're passionate about is like, not every listener is going

(56:23):
to say, oh, that's my one issue to one thing.
Totally everyone is inspired to do something, and so you
know when people will say, as I know they've said
this to you and they've said it to me, as like, oh,
you know, you should really pick a lane, It's like, no,
I get to be a megaphone so I can help
everyone else pick a lane. I should be a menu,
and then everybody else gets to like pick what they're

(56:45):
inspired about.

Speaker 2 (56:46):
It's just it's just pointing people in the right direction
because I know I'm the same way that the things
that I'm passionate about is going, Well, where do I start?
How do I start? I don't want to just like
also give money, but I also want to see you
like on the ground grassroots, what could be done? And
what are the actions I can take?

Speaker 1 (57:05):
Well, and sustained engagement is what really creates change. Like, yeah,
money is valuable, but I know there's college kids who
listen to this podcast that are like, Hi, I'm broke,
and I'm like, yeah, we've been there.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Yeah, given your time, volunteers is just as valuable, and
to to sustain engagement is what changes community. So it
feels tell people if you're broke, tell people who have
money to invest in people who don't to get involved
in volunteer. Like there's so many different ways, but it's
like nowadays, I feel like it's so much easier because
you can go online and there are websites. I think

(57:36):
it's hit.

Speaker 1 (57:37):
Yeah, we never have any of this. Okay before I
let you go, so you can get to your next thing.
When do we get season two?

Speaker 2 (57:47):
Next summer? Baby?

Speaker 1 (57:49):
But like I want it now, I know you Okay,
have to wait, okay, all right, next time. Sometimes the
streaming shows don't come out for like two and a
half years. Yeah, so I can, I can, I can?

Speaker 2 (57:59):
I can wait. They got smart and we're starting already
now in November to just found out about season two.
Poor Rebecca Cutter is under pressure just writing everything. Usually
you get like five months of a writer's room. But
she's got a month and a half till we start. Oh,
I hope for all the fans, I hope.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
Her writer's room is well caffeinated, well stocked. You mentioned
it earlier as working on feeding the good essentially you.
Is there anything else that feels like a work in
progress in your life or is that really the overarching gorgeous.

Speaker 2 (58:34):
Yeah, I think that's it's. I am a work in progress.
We all are. I am working on myself every single
day and using the pause method of before I say anything,
what is the purpose and what do I want to

(58:56):
put out there and what do I want to get back?
But I feel like I've come to a place in
my life where I feel like, here I am. Oh,
I finally see who I am, and I see it,
working on it, but I'm loving it. And so yeah,
I just think my dad is the one who always
said look for the silver lining, and he's been That's

(59:18):
been key in my life because there always is. There
always always is. And the biggest one for me was
when my son's father and I split my first husband.
I split my son was only four months old, and
that was really really tough, and the silver lining was
that one of my best girlfriends moved in with me
for a year and a half, helped me raise my son,

(59:40):
and we had the best time. Yeah. And I wouldn't
have had that had I stayed, had me and my
husband worked out, we would have had a different journey,
would have been different and beautiful and great. But this
was awesome.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:51):
So the silver linings are really something to look out
for always.

Speaker 1 (59:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
But yeah, just just working on you know, authenticity and positivity.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
I love that. Well, you are a human light bulb.
You are the most joyous to be around. Thank you
for coming today, and tell Rebecca to write faster.