July 25, 2024 • 44 mins
Academy Award-winning actress Natalie Portman has displayed her versatility on the big screen, tackling a wide range of roles in films like May December, Thor, Black Swan, and the Star Wars franchise. Now, she is taking her talents to the small screen!
Natalie joins Sophia to discuss her role in the Apple TV+ miniseries "Lady in the Lake," including why now was the right time to make her TV debut, admitting one of her biggest fears, using 'dream work' as a preparation tool for the project, her role behind the scenes and the impetus for starting her own production company.
Natalie and Sophia also chat about the importance of celebrating other people's accomplishments, their 'work in progress,' and the exciting projects on the horizon!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome to Work in Progress. Hello friends,
welcome back to Work in Progress. Today we are joined
by someone who has been on the podcast before, who
(00:22):
I absolutely adore, who you know from enormous films like
Thor and Black Swan and Jackie. She has won an
Academy Award, a Golden Globe, a Screen Actors Guild Award
at bathto Ward.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
She just won the Critics' Choice Award.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
This woman literally has done it all and now she
is conquering television. Today's guest is none other than the
inimitable Natalie Portman, and she is here today to talk
with us about her new Apple TV Plus series Lady
in the Lake. She helped to produce it with her
company Mountain A and today.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I can't wait to talk.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
About what made her decide to jump into television, about
some of the incredible films she's made recently, including May December,
directed by Todd Haynes, which I'm sure you all saw
Natalie Starr's opposite Julianne Moore and it is a wild ride.
And of course we have to talk about our very
(01:22):
favorite Angel City FC. Natalie and I have a lot
to get into so with no further ado, let's get
to it. Hi, Rand, I'm so happy to have you
backed on the podcast today.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Hi, I am so glad to talk to you again.
As always, I am.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
I'm laughing too because for our friends listening when we
were tech checking, we realize that we're actually both in
the same city today, which never happens, so we could
have absolutely on this not on zoom.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
I know it's very ridiculous. I've not been hanging out
in person, but you know that's the same.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
I know this isn't so bad though.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I'm just so excited to talk all the things normally.
I like to ask, you know, people who come on
if they see like a through line to their career
today and their childhood. But I feel like you've answered
that question already. Uh, since you've been on the show before,
I guess I would ask for a tweak in that
(02:33):
since we last spoke. Do you feel any sort of
different connection to that question, or like a different connection
to your younger self from the place we sit today.
Speaker 4 (02:50):
I think I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
I always feel like there's repeating themes that I know,
not necessarily conscious of that.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I go back a lot, but I feel like the big.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
You know thing that I'm always trying to get toward
is finding like my own pleasure and my own joy
as opposed to pleasing others. I think that starting out
as a kid, a kid actor, was very much like,
you know, looking to the grown ups and being like,
did I do a good job?
Speaker 4 (03:31):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
And now the goal is always be like, you know,
is this making me happy? Not just you know, is
this making everyone else happy?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah? There, God, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
I I was just out in Utah in the spring
working on a movie, and I set a challenge for
myself to sure be in with all the departments and
see what the department heads need and do the technical
stuff I like at work, but to act for me,
(04:07):
like to actually just go to work and see if
I could remember what it felt like as a kid
doing theater, to feel like it was my after school thing,
like I was playing, yes, instead of it being so serious.
And nobody tells you that you might wake up one
day working and go, wait, have I how long has
it been since I did something for me?
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (04:29):
And also like you're saying, I mean, as a kid,
it's such play and we're so lucky to have jobs
that are essentially play, and so to not treat.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
It like that is crazy.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
I mean it's just like the most extreme form of
play you can have.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, if I think if you tap into it and
you don't let the pressure get to you and the
desire to be good for everyone and the you know
the privilege of it and whatever, it's I realized I
sort of got so in the weeds on making sure
it was running smoothly that I was forgetting to have
a good time.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Yeah, it's good to center joy.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Oh my god, to find joy at work is so cool.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And yeah, the joy and the play I like that.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Did the desire to cultivate that kind of play, to
find that sort of joy for yourself? Do you think
there's a nugget of that even in that little seedling
when you decided we needed a soccer team in La
when when you helped create and and and you know,
brew this idea for Angel City, Like, do you think
(05:40):
maybe as a mom looking at your family or you
wanted more play?
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (05:47):
I mean, well it is of course, uh you know,
emblematic that it's literally a game like it's yeah, you know,
it's supporting. Again, what other profession do people play at
their work. It's athletes, you know, as alongside actors, and
(06:10):
of course it's such a joyful fun thing for spectators
as well. And I definitely also just loved gathering with
other women in Times Up, and I feel like it
was kind of an unconscious way to continue that gathering.
(06:32):
You know, we are again a group of women, you know,
in our investor group alongside the team.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
Even though I could never.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Be an athlete, this is a way to be part
of a group with a bunch of athletes. And so yes,
it's absolutely again celebrating joy and celebrating play.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I got asked about it recently and I was laughing
thinking about growing up in La playing ayso soccer and
very quickly realizing, you know, oh yeah, for an asthmatic,
soccer might not be my best sport.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
We figured it out.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Like the theater kids who couldn't keep up with the
ones that run, we still figured it out, and we
did we essentially created Yeah. Yeah, it's like it's a
grown up clubhouse of all the most fun humans we know.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
Totally, I really loved that was.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Do you think there's something interesting too harnessing that energy
of Times Up? Like you were talking about being able
to gather as women, to have safe spaces to talk
about our experience is good and bad, you know, to
not just have to perform and smile all the time,
I think is so healing and clearly created such a
(07:57):
salient point that you see these groups happening, you know,
around the country, around the world, you see people getting
more frank about what it means to live in community
and have better community, and to build a sports team
feels like some of the best aspects of community. I
(08:17):
love that that there was a flip from gathering to
figure out what to do with pain to sort of
like flipping the pancake over and saying, Okay, if this
is the gathering, how do we move forward in pleasure,
in play, in pay equity, in all of these things
that you know, we know our industry agnostic, but that
we could certainly relate to. Do you ever sort of
(08:40):
sit back and go, holy shit, we really did it.
We really flipped the whole script on this.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
Well.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
I really think that the athletes led the way, you know,
they the athletes showed us where to go, and I
wouldn't want to, you know, take any of that credit
away from them. You know, watching Megan Rapino and Alex
Morgan and all of their teammates, you know, lead the
(09:10):
way for the pay equity conversation for the US women's
soccer team, and Becca Rue, who was their incredible representative
who got them pay equity. I mean, they were the
ones who showed us like this is both joyful and
(09:32):
virtuosic and changing, you know, changing the game for women
and really inspired everything. And it's also just so great.
I think with times up it, I realized how rarely
we celebrate each other. Women in our group who said,
(09:52):
you know, I remember like winning an award and it
feeling so lonely walking into the room after that. No
one said congrats or gave me a hug. And so
we started this. We started this ritual of celebrating someone
every time we met, that we would like celebrate someone's achievement.
And soccer is inherently that, Like you celebrate when one
(10:18):
person scores, the whole team scores, so you know, we
all jump on top of each other when that happens.
You know, it's such a great model for how we
should be all the time as women.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Totally, and I love the that analogy because it's it
requires the entire team to make that goal, it requires
the entire team to win a match. And I think
it's so cool, you know, loving that sport, loving the WNBA,
like even seeing the professional women's hockey leagues start to
take off.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And knowing that.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
I think the stat I can't remember if it's eighty
four or ninety four percent of women in the C
suite in their adult professional careers played either through high
school or into collegiate sports.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
And it's like, well, of course it tracks.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
You can be a team leader. You can go and
run a movie studio or a you know, massive corporation
because you know how to manage teams and support people,
demand better of them certainly, but also celebrate their wins
as a as a unit.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
And it's so cool.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Yeah, it's a good reminder always now, I'm always like
like it's it has to be conscious a little bit,
because I don't think it's been socialized into me. But
like when I see someone do something great, to like
reach out and be like that was amazing, I am
so like inspired by you. Thank you for thank you
(11:46):
for doing what you're doing, you know, And I think
it's we all should be conscious of a little bit
more celebrating each other's wins.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I totally agree. I heard a good thing the other day.
Someone was saying that I was meeting with this lovely
guy who helps run a family restaurant, and he was like,
if you guys like the food, it would really mean
a lot to us, you know, if you'd go on
and leave a review. And I was like, oh, yeah,
I guess I don't really think about that too often.
He's like, well, yeah, most of the time when people
(12:14):
are giving you feedback, it's a critique or a criticism.
And I thought about that, and we do, like even
on social media, we hear from all these negative voices,
and to just go out and be verbally and publicly
supportive and kind to people feels so.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Congract that nice tendency towards bitching. Yeah, I mean I
don't say it about other people. I feel like I'm
a subject to it myself. Like it's important to say
when you love something as much as when you're like
annoyed by.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Something totally totally, and to be like loud and out
front about it.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Feels so special.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
Yeah, rare.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
And now for our sponsors, how do you start to
practice those things? As you're finding you know, more either
capacity or regularity for your own joy, how do you
start to make more of it?
Speaker 4 (13:19):
How to make more joy or more Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Like any of it.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
I think all of it feels sort of generative to me.
And the way you're talking about it, I sort of
like the vision I'm having in my head is of
this you know, snowball gaining size. So if you're trying
to shift a practice like that to be more vocal
about what's great or to lean more into the things
(13:44):
that make you feel great, like, how how do you
do that? How do you grab those things out of
the air around you?
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Yeah. I think it's been very meaningful absolutely to be
more conscious about telling people when I think that they're
doing something amazing talking about it publicly. I think, you know,
like in a friend group, to like call out someone's
achievement to the friend group and be like, let's all
(14:10):
celebrate this person's achievement today or this person's like greatness
today is so wonderful, And I think is such a
great way to cultivate that appreciation and also for me,
just giving myself the permission to do something because it's
(14:34):
fun and not necessarily you know, some of the other
things that we put on ourselves, like for me, doing
things that I love doing that I'm not very good
at because I think so much of my life has
been about like being good and achieving and all this stuff.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
And you know.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Like painting, for me, I'm not very good at it,
but i' really enjoy it, and like that's become a
really important practice to like do something just because I
like it, not because anyone would be like, wow, that's amazing, Natalie.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
You know, like you, no one will say.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That to me about my painting, but it brings me happiness,
and so, you know, following those lines has been important
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
And I think it's tricky too, when, particularly when your
job is to make an art form, because then any
art can be work. So to sort of separate these,
you know, buckets, if you will, to give yourself a space, yeah,
to be not great at something, or to just do
(15:44):
it for fun and purposefully not try to judge the
quality of its art feels it feels like something you
have to cultivate, but probably something that makes you feel
more free, I would imagine.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Yeah, I think it free yourself from again having to
like please others, or perform for others, or get accolades
from others. Yeah, is you know, is definitely freeing. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
How does it apply then when you decide to go
from this stage in your career and make a movie.
I mean, you know, it's funny when I look back
over like the first FIO from your first visit, and
I think about, you know, how young you were. You
were twelve when Leon the Professional happened and you took
(16:34):
a break from acting to go through Harvard and talked.
I remember then about what you felt like you had
to prove because people love to give us those those
joyful monikers as actresses in the world, you know, to
go on and win at the Academy and to have
these you know, enormous career moments. Again, it's so amazing.
(16:59):
You're a wonderkind at what you know you do at
the art we all get to participate in, and yet
it's always measured. So now to find that balance in
your life, how does that balance maybe shift the way
you go to work, Like when you go to make
(17:19):
a project like Lady in the Lake, do you do
you intentionally try to carry more play space with you?
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Or is work for work and like play for painting
at home.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
No, I mean my work is all play and it's
actually I think what people remark to me most when
I'm working is that they're shocked by, like how unseerious
I am. Like really, it's like I'm very serious and
like being prepared and being professional, Like I do my research,
I do my prep, I show up.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
Knowing my lines.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
I'm like on time, but like all I want to
do between takes of like joke around, Like I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
I'm not one of those people.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
It's like everyone needs to be quiet so I can focus,
you know, I'm like laughing and joking and you know,
messing around because for me, that's how everything stays loose
and stays in that spirit of play that I think
it's so important to acting for me. But yeah, it
is something that I think people don't necessarily expect for me.
Speaker 4 (18:28):
Uh when before that, before they work with me.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
I love that. I absolutely love that.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
I think it's I think it's definitely related to starting
as a kid because people really actively tried to make
work like a play space for me as a kid,
which was great, and I think it's like, uh, you know,
for me, that's that's what acting is is, you know,
(18:56):
playing pretend.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
That's so cool. I wouldn't have thought about that.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I guess the sort of motivation for the grown ups
around you when you were young to gamify work because
of course they want to make it fun for you,
because you're just a little thing running around the set.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
And also like my first movie had things like my
parents dying in front of me and things that could
be quite scary if you weren't conscious of it being
like pretend. So I think everyone was constantly just like,
it's make believe, we're playing. We're just playing this game,
you know, so that it's not as dramatic. I guess, yeah,
(19:41):
such how I felt it was serious?
Speaker 1 (19:44):
Such an insane thing that, you know, this job sort
of asks you to do is suspend disbelief and basically
just psychologically torture yourself for the hours that you're at work.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
What drew you to the project? You know, to make
your debut in a leading television role. You're you know,
it's out now on Apple TV. It's so good for
the friends at home. Oh my god, Like, how how
did you decide you wanted to lean into a series?
Was it the team was it the script was it
(20:18):
kind of a mix of both.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
Well, I've been so impressed by how series have been
kind of like the leading art form in exploring characters.
It's such an incredible luxury to have that kind of
time to go into the detail and nuance of a character.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
And Alma as an artist I really.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Admire and adore, and it was incredible to get to
be led by her. She's a true visionary and also
an incredible human And it was just extraordinary to be
led by some when so strong, so inspiring, so creative
every day with positivity and real inspiration. And then these
(21:10):
characters are just to have these two women who are
so complex, who are so interesting and beautifully drawn, and
have them have such similar obstacles, but yet to have
my character kind of be blind to this woman's obstacles
beside her, they're in these kind of parallel worlds is
(21:34):
maybe one of my greatest fears. You know, that you
can be so caught up in your own struggle that
you don't see someone else's right next to you.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Yeah, to have to sit with that, I would imagine
prepping it. You know, you have to create that dissonance
for this character. But how painful to essentially just not
see someone else at work every day. Was it a
surreal thing, you know, to to film the series? Was
(22:06):
it much longer than you know, a movie is normally for.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
You, Yeah, it was. It was really intense. I think
that was the shock of it. Was the kind of
stamina both physically and emotionally to make something that's seven
hours long instead of two hours. And it was, you know,
so extreme what we went through every day scene wise,
(22:31):
I mean, incredibly fulfilling and interesting. But yes, it was
very sad too that I didn't get to work with
Moses Ingram that much, who I think is just so brilliant.
She's really like, just the most jaw dropping talent. And
because our characters have this kind of tragedy of you know,
(22:54):
not seeing each other though they're so close physically, you know,
we didn't get that much together.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
But I got to see her work.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
In the series, and it's just one of the best
performances I've ever seen.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's just so it's the whole thing
is quite breathtaking.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
How how did it feel, you know when you talk
about that in the edit?
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Winding up with seven hours versus two how did you
have to prepare for this show differently than you might
prepare for a film.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
It was very similar to how I would prepare for
a film, although there was something that was my first
time doing that Alma introduced me to which is so
interesting and now I've taken it into every project I've
done since, which is dream work, where she put me
(23:53):
together with the coach who you talk.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
To her about your dreams.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
You start, you know, writing down your dream and you
talked to her about your dreams, and she takes you
through like how it's connected to your character and how
it's connected to you and brings you and your character
together and really gets you into kind of subconscious really
interesting stuff. So that was something new for me. That
was a complete revelation. I had never really paid attention
(24:21):
to my dreams at all. And then you start going like,
I can't believe I'm ignoring half of my life. You know,
I spent half dreaming and I'm just not even paying
attention to what's going on most of the time.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Wow, So how long did you do that before starting
to work?
Speaker 4 (24:43):
I did it throughout, like I did it.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
I did it before we started, and then also while
we were while we were working, and.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
I think Alma also really welcomed our dreams into the story.
So she really incorporated all of our subconscious subconsciousness, subconsciousnesses,
I don't know what that conshy subconshi into the story
(25:16):
where she was just kind of it was a beautiful
thing to like kind of welcome everyone's dreams.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
That is so special. I've never heard of anyone doing that.
And now I'm going to go down a rabbit hole.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
It's it's pretty. It's a pretty revelatory tool.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I bet.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
So will you tell our friends at home, who you know,
didn't get lucky enough to get an advanced screening link
about the show and what yeah, maybe a little bit
about it and what drew you to it?
Speaker 3 (25:48):
So, Lady in a Lake is a series that centers
on two women. One is Cleo played by Moses Ingram,
who is a young mother in Baltimore, trying to make
ends meet for her children and working in many, many
(26:12):
different jobs, including some that are you know, uh dubious
to make ends meet, and she ends up the subject
of a murder unfortunately, that my character Maddie investigates. Maddie
(26:36):
is also a wife and mother in Baltimore during the
nineteen sixties and kind of breaks out of her life,
tries to go back to her early love of journalism,
and ends up investigating this murder and looking into Cleo's
(26:56):
life to kind of understand what led her to be
the Lady in the Lake.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
And I love that well, A.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
I love an amazing story that's based on a book
because I feel like it's such a rich world to
mine for details and as you said, character complexity for
two women like this. And Laura Littman, the author, has
this quote that I can't stop thinking about. She said
that she set out to write a novel about a
woman who wanted to matter. Oh and it just it
(27:29):
like sucker punched me in the best way in my
emotional core, because I thought, generationally, we have had so
many of these stories pass down. You know, this is
set in the sixties, but it feels incredibly modern in
that way. And when we talk about where we all
(27:49):
come from, when we talk about these you know, reckonings
like we were discussing with times up where people say
this has gone on for so long, it has to change.
We are sitting in a moment today where because of
what's happening in the world, and the rollback of our rights,
and you know, people saying me too, went too far,
(28:12):
all of these things that feel so insane. I know,
the feeling of being in rooms like the ones we
were referencing before, where women are looking around going but
we matter, don't we get to matter? And so it
feels so modern to be exploring that desire to be
(28:34):
a full human with permission to live a full life.
Did it feel really resonant for you today to look
back in on this in the sixties and say, oh,
the times are different, but I know the struggle.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
Yeah, I think you know, that's the joy of historical
pieces is that with the distance, you have a little
bit more clarity. Like you can't see the cloud when
you're in the cloud, you know, you can.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Have more perspective on it.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
And yeah, so many things have changed, like, you know,
my character in the show can't sell her car without
her husband's permission, and that's you know, only what fifty
fifty years ago, sixty years ago, and so so much
has changed, but also so much has not changed. And
(29:35):
I think it's really beautiful what Alma does. There's a
kind of gambling ring in the show where they bet.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
On their dreams.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
They have these dream books again, the dreams, and they
have a dream and depending on what dream they have,
there's a number and then they bet on that number.
And they're literally betting on their dreams. And I think
two women and are betting on their dreams, and it's
something beautiful and something we can recognize. Now you know
how much courage it takes to bet on your dream?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, yeah, I mean at any sort of stage. I
think about it now, you know, even when you're talking
about that, I think, well, yeah, for you as a
young woman, you know, to say I want to do this,
I'm going to pick a career, you know, before junior
(30:30):
high and from again this vantage point I think about.
You know, you and your producing partner, Sophie, you founded
Mountain A in twenty twenty one, right, So why did
you decide to bet on that dream? Why did you
decide to start a production company? How has that changed
your experience at this stage in your career.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
I felt very ready to kind of step into my adulthood,
which maybe is a little late, but I think that
as an actor you're often infantilized as in a way
where everyone takes care of everything for you and makes
all the problems go away. And there's a big moment
when you're like, I want to take care of the
(31:14):
problems myself, Like I am ready to be the person
people look to when something goes wrong and I'll fix it.
Speaker 4 (31:21):
You know, that's when you're a grown up.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
And I was ready to do that, and especially because
I Sophie, who had been my friend for many, many years,
was ready to start her own company at the same time.
Speaker 4 (31:36):
So we joined forces.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
And it's been so incredible to get to work with
someone I love and respect so much and who's so
good at what she does. And it's been incredible to
get to tell the stories we want to tell and
work with the artists we admire and you know, help
realize their visions that they have.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Yeah, we'll be back in just a minute after a
few words from our favorite sponsors. Well, so for anyone
at home who wants to work, you know, perhaps in
form or television, but is looking around going but what
is a production company? Can you give some folks a
little inside baseball on what a production company like yours does,
(32:21):
how you get off the ground, how you even begin
finding as you said, the projects you're excited to make.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Yeah, it's a great question because producers can do a
lot of different things I mean material and then develop
the material, meaning like maybe you find an article from
the news, or maybe you find a book that you
think is interesting, and then developing it might be finding
a writer or director who will then turn the book
(32:51):
or the article into a script. And then you help
find financing for it so that the project can get made,
or you know, talk to studios or networks about about
making it.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
That's another way.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
And then once something starts, then you are involved in
every aspect of you know, hiring people, finding locations, supporting
the director, and figuring out how to make the vision
they have for the project. Then after it's filmed, you
work on the edits and you give feedback, you find
(33:34):
distribution if you don't have it already, get it into festivals.
I mean it's really like you have you have a
lot to do at every aspect on the way, and
then if anything goes wrong, you're also like the fixer
of the problems.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah, it's a really all encompassing job and I'm used
to right, Yeah, and I really enjoy it. And I
also think to myself like there's just not enough time
in the day for all of the things that I
want to do and have a hand in and see and.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
You know, I want to go down.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
To wardrobe and pick the right blue sweater for that character.
And it's hard sometimes to you know, make it to
whatever your version of the sort of mountaintop is on
the project and then realize like, oh, I still can't
quite do it all.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
Yeah, it's I mean, it's incredible, and it's incredible to
have partners to share it with.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Also.
Speaker 3 (34:38):
I think that that's been something really lucky with Sophie
and Mikaela who also works with us, to you know,
be able to share those kinds.
Speaker 4 (34:47):
Of responsibilities because it is it is a lot.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yeah, and I think I don't know, I think maybe
for me, because I enjoy learning, I want to see
all of it, see everything to make sure I really
know what I'm doing and it Yeah, it only gets
done because there's the ability to sort of run it
as a relay race. It's it's definitely not an individual sport.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Yes, absolutely again.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
Yeah, and yeah, and that I think is.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
Why you know, artists and athletes have always had such
an interesting overlap, is because these are either metaphorically or
literally team sports that were a.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Part of.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
I'm curious, you know, for the production company, your first
project was May December, which I just thought was so incredible.
I mean, you and Julian Moore and Todd Haynes. It's
such a world that.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
You gave to us.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
And it was fascinating to me seeing the movie based
on that Mary Kayla Tarno case, because I remember the
case and the way in having an actor come to
meet the family.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I was like, oh my god, oh my god, oh
my god.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
It because it allowed for such inspection through your eyes
for us as the audience that you would normally never
get with a national case like that. What stage did
you see the script? Was it an idea? Was it
fully fleshed out?
Speaker 4 (36:23):
It was fully fleshed out.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
And Sammy Burt was who wrote it, and it's her
first produced screenplay, which is unbelievable. I mean, she's just
such an incredible writer. But she also, I mean her
kernel of the idea, she said, came thinking like what
happens to that couple twenty years after the scandal when
(36:47):
the spotlight has kind of gone away and then they
have adult kids who go away and they're like empty nesters,
and she just imagined them like alone in their house
in a kind of like haunted way. And I thought
that was such an interesting starting, you know, launching pad
for all of this complicated human stuff that happened.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
What an absolute trip.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I mean, I'm just thinking about it, even thinking about
the music.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
Oh, the music.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
Todd was so brilliant in his choice, I mean in
every choice he made, But the music just gave it
such like specific tone that I don't think anything else
would have signified. You know that it was like okay
to laugh, it was okay to feel sad, it was
okay to feel uncomfortable.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
That like, yeah, all of those things could coexist.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Oh yeah, it just added. It made my skin crawl
every time the chords would hit, and I was like,
they've done it.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
They've really done it. What do you want to do next?
Speaker 1 (37:55):
You know, having that come out be such an incredible film.
People are loving Lady in the Lake. You know, now
you've got a series ticked off the list. What motivates
you makes you feel excited, whether it's with Mountaine or
even in your life, you know, moving forward from today, Yeah, there's.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
A lot more at Mountainee that we're working on. We're
working on an animated film, We're working on a musical,
We're working on lots more films and series. So I
think that there's, yeah, we have a lot of exciting
projects coming up.
Speaker 4 (38:39):
And then personally, I think that it's really.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Yeah, a moment of finding purpose and you know, uh
and service, like trying to to really focus on on
that and how I can can do that more in
my community with my loved ones, you know, really being
(39:05):
present for that.
Speaker 4 (39:07):
You know.
Speaker 3 (39:07):
I think there's such a shift after forty of like,
you know, doing all this stuff for yourself and then
realizing what you can do for others.
Speaker 4 (39:19):
I don't know, it feels like the main focus.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Yeah, does that sort of.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
Central focus on service and on community? Do you think
that's something that helps you feel like that helps you
feel grounded and sort of rooted. In our industry, that
often means you have to move somewhere at the drop
of a hat, relocate for six months. It's very uprooting.
(39:48):
So do you think the community gives you that?
Speaker 3 (39:52):
Yes, I mean there's absolutely like the selfish aspect to service,
which is, you know, how grounding purpose is and how
grounding community is so absolutely like I completely cop to that,
you know, it's not just purely altruistic, like I get
(40:17):
so much out of out of that.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (40:20):
I don't think it's I hear you, but I don't.
I don't think you need to say that that's, you know,
a selfish.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
Thing, Like it's okay, Like it's a way great that
I get something out of it.
Speaker 4 (40:32):
You know.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
That would be my flip for you, is like, hey,
what a cool thing that you're getting so much out
of community and out of giving rather than just out
of taking. Like, I don't know, I think to your point,
whether it's forty or or what aha moment, I think
such a big life hack, such a beautiful revelation as oh,
(40:53):
I'm always going to have more joy if I'm outward
with others than I will be if I'm insular with myself.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
I think I think that's deeply chic. Ma'am.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Thank you, Yes, I think you deserve that. When we
think about this really sort of yummy space to be
where you're making incredible work, you have incredible purpose in
your life, you have incredible kids. You're looking ahead at
what brings you joy. You're finding play. It sounds like
(41:25):
such a well deserved, nice place to have your feet
in the ground.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
What feels like you're work in progress?
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Oh so much, so much.
Speaker 3 (41:41):
I think, I think to cultivate that service, to cultivate joy.
Speaker 4 (41:49):
I don't think those are like well.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
Practiced enough for me, like there, I'm to be conscious
of them, and so yes, those are you know, my
conscious like what I'm working at.
Speaker 4 (42:09):
What about you me?
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Oh gosh, you know, I think similarly to what you
were saying earlier, figuring out how to how to live
at my core for myself. It might sound so silly
to people listening, but it really was a shock going
from being raised, you know, to be like a good
(42:34):
daughter of immigrants and a good girl and a good
girl on set and a good soldier at work, and
someone who could smile through anything that was happening to
keep the ship moving for everyone on it. You know,
to actually ask yourself, what do I want? Where do
I find joy? And wait long enough until your inner
(42:56):
self can talk back to you is pretty It's a
seismic kind of shift. And so for me, figuring out
how to maintain that relationship with myself, with my highest self,
my you know in er knowing how you're calling whatever
you want to call it, to maintain that sort of
(43:20):
communication while being the person who does like to you know,
research nerdy data science and wants to know what's going
on and wants to figure out what we're going to
do about, you know, fighting for women and fighting for
disadvantaged peoples and et cetera, et cetera. Like I think
my work in progress is really beginning to sort of
(43:42):
toddler stomp my way into learning to show up for
myself in the way that I tend to show up
just for other people.
Speaker 4 (43:51):
Mmmm.
Speaker 3 (43:52):
That is very very eloquently put. That is beautiful.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Thanks.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
It's it's a word in progress for sure, but we're
getting there. We're getting there, and certainly more to come
on that. Well, thank you for today. You are always
such a joy.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
I like a part.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
I like a follow up interview so I can just
really get in the weeds of what's in the moment
with you and we don't have to do the full
overview despite it being a lovely overview.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
You.
Speaker 4 (44:28):
Thank you so much for taking the time and for
having me back. Yeah, and I'll talk to you soon.
That's y.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I would love it.
Hey everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome to Work in Progress. Hello friends,
welcome back to Work in Progress. Today we are joined
by someone who has been on the podcast before, who
(00:22):
I absolutely adore, who you know from enormous films like
Thor and Black Swan and Jackie. She has won an
Academy Award, a Golden Globe, a Screen Actors Guild Award
at bathto Ward.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
She just won the Critics' Choice Award.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
This woman literally has done it all and now she
is conquering television. Today's guest is none other than the
inimitable Natalie Portman, and she is here today to talk
with us about her new Apple TV Plus series Lady
in the Lake. She helped to produce it with her
company Mountain A and today.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I can't wait to talk.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
About what made her decide to jump into television, about
some of the incredible films she's made recently, including May December,
directed by Todd Haynes, which I'm sure you all saw
Natalie Starr's opposite Julianne Moore and it is a wild ride.
And of course we have to talk about our very
(01:22):
favorite Angel City FC. Natalie and I have a lot
to get into so with no further ado, let's get
to it. Hi, Rand, I'm so happy to have you
backed on the podcast today.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Hi, I am so glad to talk to you again.
As always, I am.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
I'm laughing too because for our friends listening when we
were tech checking, we realize that we're actually both in
the same city today, which never happens, so we could
have absolutely on this not on zoom.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
I know it's very ridiculous. I've not been hanging out
in person, but you know that's the same.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
I know this isn't so bad though.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
I'm just so excited to talk all the things normally.
I like to ask, you know, people who come on
if they see like a through line to their career
today and their childhood. But I feel like you've answered
that question already. Uh, since you've been on the show before,
I guess I would ask for a tweak in that
(02:33):
since we last spoke. Do you feel any sort of
different connection to that question, or like a different connection
to your younger self from the place we sit today.
Speaker 4 (02:50):
I think I don't know.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
I always feel like there's repeating themes that I know,
not necessarily conscious of that.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I go back a lot, but I feel like the big.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
You know thing that I'm always trying to get toward
is finding like my own pleasure and my own joy
as opposed to pleasing others. I think that starting out
as a kid, a kid actor, was very much like,
you know, looking to the grown ups and being like,
did I do a good job?
Speaker 4 (03:31):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:31):
And now the goal is always be like, you know,
is this making me happy? Not just you know, is
this making everyone else happy?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah? There, God, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
I I was just out in Utah in the spring
working on a movie, and I set a challenge for
myself to sure be in with all the departments and
see what the department heads need and do the technical
stuff I like at work, but to act for me,
(04:07):
like to actually just go to work and see if
I could remember what it felt like as a kid
doing theater, to feel like it was my after school thing,
like I was playing, yes, instead of it being so serious.
And nobody tells you that you might wake up one
day working and go, wait, have I how long has
it been since I did something for me?
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Yes?
Speaker 3 (04:29):
And also like you're saying, I mean, as a kid,
it's such play and we're so lucky to have jobs
that are essentially play, and so to not treat.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
It like that is crazy.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
I mean it's just like the most extreme form of
play you can have.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, if I think if you tap into it and
you don't let the pressure get to you and the
desire to be good for everyone and the you know
the privilege of it and whatever, it's I realized I
sort of got so in the weeds on making sure
it was running smoothly that I was forgetting to have
a good time.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Yeah, it's good to center joy.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Oh my god, to find joy at work is so cool.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And yeah, the joy and the play I like that.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Did the desire to cultivate that kind of play, to
find that sort of joy for yourself? Do you think
there's a nugget of that even in that little seedling
when you decided we needed a soccer team in La
when when you helped create and and and you know,
brew this idea for Angel City, Like, do you think
(05:40):
maybe as a mom looking at your family or you
wanted more play?
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (05:47):
I mean, well it is of course, uh you know,
emblematic that it's literally a game like it's yeah, you know,
it's supporting. Again, what other profession do people play at
their work. It's athletes, you know, as alongside actors, and
(06:10):
of course it's such a joyful fun thing for spectators
as well. And I definitely also just loved gathering with
other women in Times Up, and I feel like it
was kind of an unconscious way to continue that gathering.
(06:32):
You know, we are again a group of women, you know,
in our investor group alongside the team.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
Even though I could never.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
Be an athlete, this is a way to be part
of a group with a bunch of athletes. And so yes,
it's absolutely again celebrating joy and celebrating play.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I got asked about it recently and I was laughing
thinking about growing up in La playing ayso soccer and
very quickly realizing, you know, oh yeah, for an asthmatic,
soccer might not be my best sport.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
We figured it out.
Speaker 1 (07:14):
Like the theater kids who couldn't keep up with the
ones that run, we still figured it out, and we
did we essentially created Yeah. Yeah, it's like it's a
grown up clubhouse of all the most fun humans we know.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
Totally, I really loved that was.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Do you think there's something interesting too harnessing that energy
of Times Up? Like you were talking about being able
to gather as women, to have safe spaces to talk
about our experience is good and bad, you know, to
not just have to perform and smile all the time,
I think is so healing and clearly created such a
(07:57):
salient point that you see these groups happening, you know,
around the country, around the world, you see people getting
more frank about what it means to live in community
and have better community, and to build a sports team
feels like some of the best aspects of community. I
(08:17):
love that that there was a flip from gathering to
figure out what to do with pain to sort of
like flipping the pancake over and saying, Okay, if this
is the gathering, how do we move forward in pleasure,
in play, in pay equity, in all of these things
that you know, we know our industry agnostic, but that
we could certainly relate to. Do you ever sort of
(08:40):
sit back and go, holy shit, we really did it.
We really flipped the whole script on this.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
Well.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
I really think that the athletes led the way, you know,
they the athletes showed us where to go, and I
wouldn't want to, you know, take any of that credit
away from them. You know, watching Megan Rapino and Alex
Morgan and all of their teammates, you know, lead the
(09:10):
way for the pay equity conversation for the US women's
soccer team, and Becca Rue, who was their incredible representative
who got them pay equity. I mean, they were the
ones who showed us like this is both joyful and
(09:32):
virtuosic and changing, you know, changing the game for women
and really inspired everything. And it's also just so great.
I think with times up it, I realized how rarely
we celebrate each other. Women in our group who said,
(09:52):
you know, I remember like winning an award and it
feeling so lonely walking into the room after that. No
one said congrats or gave me a hug. And so
we started this. We started this ritual of celebrating someone
every time we met, that we would like celebrate someone's achievement.
And soccer is inherently that, Like you celebrate when one
(10:18):
person scores, the whole team scores, so you know, we
all jump on top of each other when that happens.
You know, it's such a great model for how we
should be all the time as women.
Speaker 1 (10:31):
Totally, and I love the that analogy because it's it
requires the entire team to make that goal, it requires
the entire team to win a match. And I think
it's so cool, you know, loving that sport, loving the WNBA,
like even seeing the professional women's hockey leagues start to
take off.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
And knowing that.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
I think the stat I can't remember if it's eighty
four or ninety four percent of women in the C
suite in their adult professional careers played either through high
school or into collegiate sports.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
And it's like, well, of course it tracks.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
You can be a team leader. You can go and
run a movie studio or a you know, massive corporation
because you know how to manage teams and support people,
demand better of them certainly, but also celebrate their wins
as a as a unit.
Speaker 2 (11:24):
And it's so cool.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Yeah, it's a good reminder always now, I'm always like
like it's it has to be conscious a little bit,
because I don't think it's been socialized into me. But
like when I see someone do something great, to like
reach out and be like that was amazing, I am
so like inspired by you. Thank you for thank you
(11:46):
for doing what you're doing, you know, And I think
it's we all should be conscious of a little bit
more celebrating each other's wins.
Speaker 1 (11:52):
I totally agree. I heard a good thing the other day.
Someone was saying that I was meeting with this lovely
guy who helps run a family restaurant, and he was like,
if you guys like the food, it would really mean
a lot to us, you know, if you'd go on
and leave a review. And I was like, oh, yeah,
I guess I don't really think about that too often.
He's like, well, yeah, most of the time when people
(12:14):
are giving you feedback, it's a critique or a criticism.
And I thought about that, and we do, like even
on social media, we hear from all these negative voices,
and to just go out and be verbally and publicly
supportive and kind to people feels so.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Congract that nice tendency towards bitching. Yeah, I mean I
don't say it about other people. I feel like I'm
a subject to it myself. Like it's important to say
when you love something as much as when you're like
annoyed by.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Something totally totally, and to be like loud and out
front about it.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Feels so special.
Speaker 4 (12:58):
Yeah, rare.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
And now for our sponsors, how do you start to
practice those things? As you're finding you know, more either
capacity or regularity for your own joy, how do you
start to make more of it?
Speaker 4 (13:19):
How to make more joy or more Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Like any of it.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
I think all of it feels sort of generative to me.
And the way you're talking about it, I sort of
like the vision I'm having in my head is of
this you know, snowball gaining size. So if you're trying
to shift a practice like that to be more vocal
about what's great or to lean more into the things
(13:44):
that make you feel great, like, how how do you
do that? How do you grab those things out of
the air around you?
Speaker 3 (13:50):
Yeah. I think it's been very meaningful absolutely to be
more conscious about telling people when I think that they're
doing something amazing talking about it publicly. I think, you know,
like in a friend group, to like call out someone's
achievement to the friend group and be like, let's all
(14:10):
celebrate this person's achievement today or this person's like greatness
today is so wonderful, And I think is such a
great way to cultivate that appreciation and also for me,
just giving myself the permission to do something because it's
(14:34):
fun and not necessarily you know, some of the other
things that we put on ourselves, like for me, doing
things that I love doing that I'm not very good
at because I think so much of my life has
been about like being good and achieving and all this stuff.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
And you know.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Like painting, for me, I'm not very good at it,
but i' really enjoy it, and like that's become a
really important practice to like do something just because I
like it, not because anyone would be like, wow, that's amazing, Natalie.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
You know, like you, no one will say.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That to me about my painting, but it brings me happiness,
and so, you know, following those lines has been important
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
And I think it's tricky too, when, particularly when your
job is to make an art form, because then any
art can be work. So to sort of separate these,
you know, buckets, if you will, to give yourself a space, yeah,
to be not great at something, or to just do
(15:44):
it for fun and purposefully not try to judge the
quality of its art feels it feels like something you
have to cultivate, but probably something that makes you feel
more free, I would imagine.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
Yeah, I think it free yourself from again having to
like please others, or perform for others, or get accolades
from others. Yeah, is you know, is definitely freeing. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
How does it apply then when you decide to go
from this stage in your career and make a movie.
I mean, you know, it's funny when I look back
over like the first FIO from your first visit, and
I think about, you know, how young you were. You
were twelve when Leon the Professional happened and you took
(16:34):
a break from acting to go through Harvard and talked.
I remember then about what you felt like you had
to prove because people love to give us those those
joyful monikers as actresses in the world, you know, to
go on and win at the Academy and to have
these you know, enormous career moments. Again, it's so amazing.
(16:59):
You're a wonderkind at what you know you do at
the art we all get to participate in, and yet
it's always measured. So now to find that balance in
your life, how does that balance maybe shift the way
you go to work, Like when you go to make
(17:19):
a project like Lady in the Lake, do you do
you intentionally try to carry more play space with you?
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Or is work for work and like play for painting
at home.
Speaker 3 (17:33):
No, I mean my work is all play and it's
actually I think what people remark to me most when
I'm working is that they're shocked by, like how unseerious
I am. Like really, it's like I'm very serious and
like being prepared and being professional, Like I do my research,
I do my prep, I show up.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
Knowing my lines.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
I'm like on time, but like all I want to
do between takes of like joke around, Like I don't.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
I'm not one of those people.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
It's like everyone needs to be quiet so I can focus,
you know, I'm like laughing and joking and you know,
messing around because for me, that's how everything stays loose
and stays in that spirit of play that I think
it's so important to acting for me. But yeah, it
is something that I think people don't necessarily expect for me.
Speaker 4 (18:28):
Uh when before that, before they work with me.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
I love that. I absolutely love that.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
I think it's I think it's definitely related to starting
as a kid because people really actively tried to make
work like a play space for me as a kid,
which was great, and I think it's like, uh, you know,
for me, that's that's what acting is is, you know,
(18:56):
playing pretend.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
That's so cool. I wouldn't have thought about that.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I guess the sort of motivation for the grown ups
around you when you were young to gamify work because
of course they want to make it fun for you,
because you're just a little thing running around the set.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
And also like my first movie had things like my
parents dying in front of me and things that could
be quite scary if you weren't conscious of it being
like pretend. So I think everyone was constantly just like,
it's make believe, we're playing. We're just playing this game,
you know, so that it's not as dramatic. I guess, yeah,
(19:41):
such how I felt it was serious?
Speaker 1 (19:44):
Such an insane thing that, you know, this job sort
of asks you to do is suspend disbelief and basically
just psychologically torture yourself for the hours that you're at work.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (19:58):
What drew you to the project? You know, to make
your debut in a leading television role. You're you know,
it's out now on Apple TV. It's so good for
the friends at home. Oh my god, Like, how how
did you decide you wanted to lean into a series?
Was it the team was it the script was it
(20:18):
kind of a mix of both.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
Well, I've been so impressed by how series have been
kind of like the leading art form in exploring characters.
It's such an incredible luxury to have that kind of
time to go into the detail and nuance of a character.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
And Alma as an artist I really.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Admire and adore, and it was incredible to get to
be led by her. She's a true visionary and also
an incredible human And it was just extraordinary to be
led by some when so strong, so inspiring, so creative
every day with positivity and real inspiration. And then these
(21:10):
characters are just to have these two women who are
so complex, who are so interesting and beautifully drawn, and
have them have such similar obstacles, but yet to have
my character kind of be blind to this woman's obstacles
beside her, they're in these kind of parallel worlds is
(21:34):
maybe one of my greatest fears. You know, that you
can be so caught up in your own struggle that
you don't see someone else's right next to you.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
Yeah, to have to sit with that, I would imagine
prepping it. You know, you have to create that dissonance
for this character. But how painful to essentially just not
see someone else at work every day. Was it a
surreal thing, you know, to to film the series? Was
(22:06):
it much longer than you know, a movie is normally for.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
You, Yeah, it was. It was really intense. I think
that was the shock of it. Was the kind of
stamina both physically and emotionally to make something that's seven
hours long instead of two hours. And it was, you know,
so extreme what we went through every day scene wise,
(22:31):
I mean, incredibly fulfilling and interesting. But yes, it was
very sad too that I didn't get to work with
Moses Ingram that much, who I think is just so brilliant.
She's really like, just the most jaw dropping talent. And
because our characters have this kind of tragedy of you know,
(22:54):
not seeing each other though they're so close physically, you know,
we didn't get that much together.
Speaker 4 (23:03):
But I got to see her work.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
In the series, and it's just one of the best
performances I've ever seen.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's just so it's the whole thing
is quite breathtaking.
Speaker 4 (23:17):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
How how did it feel, you know when you talk
about that in the edit?
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Winding up with seven hours versus two how did you
have to prepare for this show differently than you might
prepare for a film.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
It was very similar to how I would prepare for
a film, although there was something that was my first
time doing that Alma introduced me to which is so
interesting and now I've taken it into every project I've
done since, which is dream work, where she put me
(23:53):
together with the coach who you talk.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
To her about your dreams.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
You start, you know, writing down your dream and you
talked to her about your dreams, and she takes you
through like how it's connected to your character and how
it's connected to you and brings you and your character
together and really gets you into kind of subconscious really
interesting stuff. So that was something new for me. That
was a complete revelation. I had never really paid attention
(24:21):
to my dreams at all. And then you start going like,
I can't believe I'm ignoring half of my life. You know,
I spent half dreaming and I'm just not even paying
attention to what's going on most of the time.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Wow, So how long did you do that before starting
to work?
Speaker 4 (24:43):
I did it throughout, like I did it.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
I did it before we started, and then also while
we were while we were working, and.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 3 (24:54):
I think Alma also really welcomed our dreams into the story.
So she really incorporated all of our subconscious subconsciousness, subconsciousnesses,
I don't know what that conshy subconshi into the story
(25:16):
where she was just kind of it was a beautiful
thing to like kind of welcome everyone's dreams.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
That is so special. I've never heard of anyone doing that.
And now I'm going to go down a rabbit hole.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
It's it's pretty. It's a pretty revelatory tool.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I bet.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
So will you tell our friends at home, who you know,
didn't get lucky enough to get an advanced screening link
about the show and what yeah, maybe a little bit
about it and what drew you to it?
Speaker 3 (25:48):
So, Lady in a Lake is a series that centers
on two women. One is Cleo played by Moses Ingram,
who is a young mother in Baltimore, trying to make
ends meet for her children and working in many, many
(26:12):
different jobs, including some that are you know, uh dubious
to make ends meet, and she ends up the subject
of a murder unfortunately, that my character Maddie investigates. Maddie
(26:36):
is also a wife and mother in Baltimore during the
nineteen sixties and kind of breaks out of her life,
tries to go back to her early love of journalism,
and ends up investigating this murder and looking into Cleo's
(26:56):
life to kind of understand what led her to be
the Lady in the Lake.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
And I love that well, A.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
I love an amazing story that's based on a book
because I feel like it's such a rich world to
mine for details and as you said, character complexity for
two women like this. And Laura Littman, the author, has
this quote that I can't stop thinking about. She said
that she set out to write a novel about a
woman who wanted to matter. Oh and it just it
(27:29):
like sucker punched me in the best way in my
emotional core, because I thought, generationally, we have had so
many of these stories pass down. You know, this is
set in the sixties, but it feels incredibly modern in
that way. And when we talk about where we all
(27:49):
come from, when we talk about these you know, reckonings
like we were discussing with times up where people say
this has gone on for so long, it has to change.
We are sitting in a moment today where because of
what's happening in the world, and the rollback of our rights,
and you know, people saying me too, went too far,
(28:12):
all of these things that feel so insane. I know,
the feeling of being in rooms like the ones we
were referencing before, where women are looking around going but
we matter, don't we get to matter? And so it
feels so modern to be exploring that desire to be
(28:34):
a full human with permission to live a full life.
Did it feel really resonant for you today to look
back in on this in the sixties and say, oh,
the times are different, but I know the struggle.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
Yeah, I think you know, that's the joy of historical
pieces is that with the distance, you have a little
bit more clarity. Like you can't see the cloud when
you're in the cloud, you know, you can.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Have more perspective on it.
Speaker 3 (29:11):
And yeah, so many things have changed, like, you know,
my character in the show can't sell her car without
her husband's permission, and that's you know, only what fifty
fifty years ago, sixty years ago, and so so much
has changed, but also so much has not changed. And
(29:35):
I think it's really beautiful what Alma does. There's a
kind of gambling ring in the show where they bet.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
On their dreams.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
They have these dream books again, the dreams, and they
have a dream and depending on what dream they have,
there's a number and then they bet on that number.
And they're literally betting on their dreams. And I think
two women and are betting on their dreams, and it's
something beautiful and something we can recognize. Now you know
how much courage it takes to bet on your dream?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, yeah, I mean at any sort of stage. I
think about it now, you know, even when you're talking
about that, I think, well, yeah, for you as a
young woman, you know, to say I want to do this,
I'm going to pick a career, you know, before junior
(30:30):
high and from again this vantage point I think about.
You know, you and your producing partner, Sophie, you founded
Mountain A in twenty twenty one, right, So why did
you decide to bet on that dream? Why did you
decide to start a production company? How has that changed
your experience at this stage in your career.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
I felt very ready to kind of step into my adulthood,
which maybe is a little late, but I think that
as an actor you're often infantilized as in a way
where everyone takes care of everything for you and makes
all the problems go away. And there's a big moment
when you're like, I want to take care of the
(31:14):
problems myself, Like I am ready to be the person
people look to when something goes wrong and I'll fix it.
Speaker 4 (31:21):
You know, that's when you're a grown up.
Speaker 3 (31:23):
And I was ready to do that, and especially because
I Sophie, who had been my friend for many, many years,
was ready to start her own company at the same time.
Speaker 4 (31:36):
So we joined forces.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
And it's been so incredible to get to work with
someone I love and respect so much and who's so
good at what she does. And it's been incredible to
get to tell the stories we want to tell and
work with the artists we admire and you know, help
realize their visions that they have.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
Yeah, we'll be back in just a minute after a
few words from our favorite sponsors. Well, so for anyone
at home who wants to work, you know, perhaps in
form or television, but is looking around going but what
is a production company? Can you give some folks a
little inside baseball on what a production company like yours does,
(32:21):
how you get off the ground, how you even begin
finding as you said, the projects you're excited to make.
Speaker 3 (32:28):
Yeah, it's a great question because producers can do a
lot of different things I mean material and then develop
the material, meaning like maybe you find an article from
the news, or maybe you find a book that you
think is interesting, and then developing it might be finding
a writer or director who will then turn the book
(32:51):
or the article into a script. And then you help
find financing for it so that the project can get made,
or you know, talk to studios or networks about about
making it.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
That's another way.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
And then once something starts, then you are involved in
every aspect of you know, hiring people, finding locations, supporting
the director, and figuring out how to make the vision
they have for the project. Then after it's filmed, you
work on the edits and you give feedback, you find
(33:34):
distribution if you don't have it already, get it into festivals.
I mean it's really like you have you have a
lot to do at every aspect on the way, and
then if anything goes wrong, you're also like the fixer
of the problems.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah, it's a really all encompassing job and I'm used
to right, Yeah, and I really enjoy it. And I
also think to myself like there's just not enough time
in the day for all of the things that I
want to do and have a hand in and see and.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
You know, I want to go down.
Speaker 1 (34:17):
To wardrobe and pick the right blue sweater for that character.
And it's hard sometimes to you know, make it to
whatever your version of the sort of mountaintop is on
the project and then realize like, oh, I still can't
quite do it all.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
Yeah, it's I mean, it's incredible, and it's incredible to
have partners to share it with.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Also.
Speaker 3 (34:38):
I think that that's been something really lucky with Sophie
and Mikaela who also works with us, to you know,
be able to share those kinds.
Speaker 4 (34:47):
Of responsibilities because it is it is a lot.
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yeah, and I think I don't know, I think maybe
for me, because I enjoy learning, I want to see
all of it, see everything to make sure I really
know what I'm doing and it Yeah, it only gets
done because there's the ability to sort of run it
as a relay race. It's it's definitely not an individual sport.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Yes, absolutely again.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
Yeah, and yeah, and that I think is.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
Why you know, artists and athletes have always had such
an interesting overlap, is because these are either metaphorically or
literally team sports that were a.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
Part of.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
I'm curious, you know, for the production company, your first
project was May December, which I just thought was so incredible.
I mean, you and Julian Moore and Todd Haynes. It's
such a world that.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
You gave to us.
Speaker 1 (35:48):
And it was fascinating to me seeing the movie based
on that Mary Kayla Tarno case, because I remember the
case and the way in having an actor come to
meet the family.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
I was like, oh my god, oh my god, oh
my god.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
It because it allowed for such inspection through your eyes
for us as the audience that you would normally never
get with a national case like that. What stage did
you see the script? Was it an idea? Was it
fully fleshed out?
Speaker 4 (36:23):
It was fully fleshed out.
Speaker 3 (36:24):
And Sammy Burt was who wrote it, and it's her
first produced screenplay, which is unbelievable. I mean, she's just
such an incredible writer. But she also, I mean her
kernel of the idea, she said, came thinking like what
happens to that couple twenty years after the scandal when
(36:47):
the spotlight has kind of gone away and then they
have adult kids who go away and they're like empty nesters,
and she just imagined them like alone in their house
in a kind of like haunted way. And I thought
that was such an interesting starting, you know, launching pad
for all of this complicated human stuff that happened.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
What an absolute trip.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I mean, I'm just thinking about it, even thinking about
the music.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
Oh, the music.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
Todd was so brilliant in his choice, I mean in
every choice he made, But the music just gave it
such like specific tone that I don't think anything else
would have signified. You know that it was like okay
to laugh, it was okay to feel sad, it was
okay to feel uncomfortable.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
That like, yeah, all of those things could coexist.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
Oh yeah, it just added. It made my skin crawl
every time the chords would hit, and I was like,
they've done it.
Speaker 2 (37:51):
They've really done it. What do you want to do next?
Speaker 1 (37:55):
You know, having that come out be such an incredible film.
People are loving Lady in the Lake. You know, now
you've got a series ticked off the list. What motivates
you makes you feel excited, whether it's with Mountaine or
even in your life, you know, moving forward from today, Yeah, there's.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
A lot more at Mountainee that we're working on. We're
working on an animated film, We're working on a musical,
We're working on lots more films and series. So I
think that there's, yeah, we have a lot of exciting
projects coming up.
Speaker 4 (38:39):
And then personally, I think that it's really.
Speaker 3 (38:43):
Yeah, a moment of finding purpose and you know, uh
and service, like trying to to really focus on on
that and how I can can do that more in
my community with my loved ones, you know, really being
(39:05):
present for that.
Speaker 4 (39:07):
You know.
Speaker 3 (39:07):
I think there's such a shift after forty of like,
you know, doing all this stuff for yourself and then
realizing what you can do for others.
Speaker 4 (39:19):
I don't know, it feels like the main focus.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
Yeah, does that sort of.
Speaker 1 (39:25):
Central focus on service and on community? Do you think
that's something that helps you feel like that helps you
feel grounded and sort of rooted. In our industry, that
often means you have to move somewhere at the drop
of a hat, relocate for six months. It's very uprooting.
(39:48):
So do you think the community gives you that?
Speaker 3 (39:52):
Yes, I mean there's absolutely like the selfish aspect to service,
which is, you know, how grounding purpose is and how
grounding community is so absolutely like I completely cop to that,
you know, it's not just purely altruistic, like I get
(40:17):
so much out of out of that.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (40:20):
I don't think it's I hear you, but I don't.
I don't think you need to say that that's, you know,
a selfish.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
Thing, Like it's okay, Like it's a way great that
I get something out of it.
Speaker 4 (40:32):
You know.
Speaker 1 (40:33):
That would be my flip for you, is like, hey,
what a cool thing that you're getting so much out
of community and out of giving rather than just out
of taking. Like, I don't know, I think to your point,
whether it's forty or or what aha moment, I think
such a big life hack, such a beautiful revelation as oh,
(40:53):
I'm always going to have more joy if I'm outward
with others than I will be if I'm insular with myself.
Speaker 2 (40:59):
I think I think that's deeply chic. Ma'am.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Thank you, Yes, I think you deserve that. When we
think about this really sort of yummy space to be
where you're making incredible work, you have incredible purpose in
your life, you have incredible kids. You're looking ahead at
what brings you joy. You're finding play. It sounds like
(41:25):
such a well deserved, nice place to have your feet
in the ground.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
What feels like you're work in progress?
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Oh so much, so much.
Speaker 3 (41:41):
I think, I think to cultivate that service, to cultivate joy.
Speaker 4 (41:49):
I don't think those are like well.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
Practiced enough for me, like there, I'm to be conscious
of them, and so yes, those are you know, my
conscious like what I'm working at.
Speaker 4 (42:09):
What about you me?
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Oh gosh, you know, I think similarly to what you
were saying earlier, figuring out how to how to live
at my core for myself. It might sound so silly
to people listening, but it really was a shock going
from being raised, you know, to be like a good
(42:34):
daughter of immigrants and a good girl and a good
girl on set and a good soldier at work, and
someone who could smile through anything that was happening to
keep the ship moving for everyone on it. You know,
to actually ask yourself, what do I want? Where do
I find joy? And wait long enough until your inner
(42:56):
self can talk back to you is pretty It's a
seismic kind of shift. And so for me, figuring out
how to maintain that relationship with myself, with my highest self,
my you know in er knowing how you're calling whatever
you want to call it, to maintain that sort of
(43:20):
communication while being the person who does like to you know,
research nerdy data science and wants to know what's going
on and wants to figure out what we're going to
do about, you know, fighting for women and fighting for
disadvantaged peoples and et cetera, et cetera. Like I think
my work in progress is really beginning to sort of
(43:42):
toddler stomp my way into learning to show up for
myself in the way that I tend to show up
just for other people.
Speaker 4 (43:51):
Mmmm.
Speaker 3 (43:52):
That is very very eloquently put. That is beautiful.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
Thanks.
Speaker 1 (43:58):
It's it's a word in progress for sure, but we're
getting there. We're getting there, and certainly more to come
on that. Well, thank you for today. You are always
such a joy.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
I like a part.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
I like a follow up interview so I can just
really get in the weeds of what's in the moment
with you and we don't have to do the full
overview despite it being a lovely overview.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
You.
Speaker 4 (44:28):
Thank you so much for taking the time and for
having me back. Yeah, and I'll talk to you soon.
That's y.
Speaker 2 (44:35):
I would love it.
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