July 14, 2022 • 35 mins
On their first episode, Rasha and Yvette take us to their hometown of Honolulu, Hawaii, where they discuss the mysterious 1982 murder of Lisa Au.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
You're listening to Facing Evil, a production of I Heart
Radio and Tenderfoot TV. The views and opinions expressed in
this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating in
the show and do not represent those of I Heart
Radio or Tenderfoot TV. This podcast contains subject matter which
may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised. Hello, everyone,
(00:29):
welcome or a komo ma, which means welcome in Hawaiian
to the very first episode of our new podcast, Facing
Evil from Tenderfoot TV and I Heart Radio. We are
your hosts. I'm Rosha Peccarero and I'm a vegin Tile
and some of you may already be familiar with our
voices from our hit podcast Root of Evil, the True
(00:52):
story of the Hodel Family and the Black Dahlia. Root
of Evil is where we talked about our family's history
and connection to George Hodel, who happened to be the
prime suspect in the Black Dahlia murder case, which is
also known as the Elizabeth Short murder case. We've known
about our crazy, dark family history our entire lives, but
(01:12):
Yvette and I are so thankful that we had our
beautiful mother, Fauna hotel. A woman who rose above her
difficult and crazy upbringing, and she always looked for the
best in all of the people around her, and we've
always found the light in the dark because of her.
And that is what we are going to do with
(01:34):
this new podcast, right, that's right. So each week we're
going to be joined by our amazing producer, Mr Trevor Young,
and we're going to discuss true crime stories that we
think that need to be brought into the light, and
we're going to share our own unique perspective on the
cases and people involved. And throughout the season, we're also
(01:58):
going to be joined by some very special guests that
are sharing their stories and we'll hear from others that
can shed light on particular cases. So, since we are sisters,
contrary to popular belief, we do not have the same
opinion a lot of the time, but we have beautiful conversations,
(02:18):
We tease each other, and you know, we just want
you all to come along on this journey with us. Yes,
we do. So with that being said, let's get to
our first case, the case of Lisa Au, nineteen year
old woman who went missing in Hawaii in Since this
is our first episode, we wanted to share a story
(02:40):
from a place that is very personal to us. This
is home, This is Hawaii, and most people think of
our beautiful hometown in Honolulu, Hawaii as a paradise, which
it absolutely is. But it's really a place just like
any other and it's not free from crime, order or
(03:00):
other horrible tragedies. Right, So this is sort of a
double edged sort of an episode. While we're so happy
to be talking about our home, we're also turning over
a few stones and looking at the darker side of
what is usually a very sunny place. Each week, our
producer Trevor is going to come in and give us
(03:22):
a rundown on a case. So now let's hear about
Lisa al Well. It's one of the biggest unsolved mysteries
in Hawaii. Who killed Lisa Awl She was on her
way home when she was stopped and abducted from that
Kailua location. If you're old enough, you remember the fear
(03:43):
that spread through the community when a policeman was suspected.
Law enforcement pursued that theory for years, overlooking other evidence.
Lisa al was born on July to Chester Dennis Owl
and put Teres Mahia e Kalani akima Ao ka Uamano.
(04:04):
Lisa was of Chinese, Hawaiian, and European descent. She was
raised on the island of Oahu, and after high school,
she pursued a career as a hairstylist. After attending a
training program at trend Setter's Beauty College, Lisa started working
as a hairdresser at the Susan Beer Salon in Kailua
in Honolulu County. She was there for about five weeks
(04:27):
before she went missing. Around this time, she was dating
a University of Hawaii student named Doug Holmes, and on
the evening of July, Lisa went to see her boyfriend
Doug at his sister's apartment. At twelve twenty am, Lisa
called her roommate to say she'd be coming home soon,
(04:49):
but Lisa never came home that night. The next morning,
they found Lisa's car parked on the side of a road,
but Lisa was nowhere to be found. It would be
another ten days before a jogger would come across Lisa's
decomposed remains on the other side of the island. So
(05:09):
what happened to Lisa and how could something so gruesome happen?
In a beautiful place like Hawaii. It's heartbreaking to me
that anything like this happened, you know, And I think,
you know, our moms sheltered us so much that we
we didn't see a whole lot of crime. I mean,
(05:30):
you know, I mean I had to like ask one
of my dear friends, like who's also Hawaiian. I'm like,
do you know of any murders or anything? And she
told me about Lisa. And when I looked it up,
I mean, I was too little, but Yvette, you were
like fourteen fifteen, Yeah, I was. I was fifteen, and
I remember a little bit. I mean, you know, all
of us living through a pandemic. It's like trying to
(05:52):
go back in my brain and remember things is a
whole another story. But I do remember, you know, Mom
was driving into town, so from where we lived, Pearl City,
right driving all the way into town, and there was
this this thing going on about you know, being afraid,
women being afraid to be pulled over by police. So
(06:14):
I do remember some of that. Connecting the dots, yeah,
connecting the dots right to this particular case. But growing
up there, y'all didn't really kind of have the feeling
that it was unsafe to be in Hawaii or the
crime or murder with things that really have not at all,
not ever never, I've never heard of murder, like That's
why I had to ask around. Yeah, yeah, I mean
(06:37):
we and we left our doors unlocked all the time,
and you know, left our screen doors open. So no,
not at all. And that's why this case really hits
home for us because it it's centers around Kailua in Hawaii,
not far from where we grew up, you know, and
we actually lived in Kailua. And one of the men
(06:58):
with mom, yeah I lived, I lived the island, yes, yes,
and you know haw VII Like Trevors you said, like
it is really one of the safest places in the
United States. And it's seen, you know, a decline in
violent crime over you know, the last few years. Um.
(07:19):
It's currently placed forty four out of the fifty states
in the list of violent crimes per capita. But that
was not always the case, especially in the seventies and eighties.
And many people may not know that violent crimes in
Hawaii increased sharply in the nineteen seventies and actually peaked
in the nineteen eighties. Right And even though we were
growing up in Hawaii. Mom sheltered us from all of that.
(07:42):
I mean she kept us busy seven, over protected, overprotective
in all types of activities, so we weren't sitting at home,
you know, watching TV. But there was a huge influx
of new people moving to the islands, and of course
with that there's more crime. Yeah, it's interesting. I mean
the uptick and crime in the seventies and eighties, I
(08:04):
mean that was happening across the country at the time.
The seventies and eighties were just particularly dangerous. There was
just a huge uptick in crime, murder, robbery, all throughout
that period, drugs, and so yeah, I think you're just
kind of came to Hawaii along with people moving there,
you know, throughout that decade um and sadly, this is
really the same time period that you know, Lisa al
(08:24):
goes missing and everything happens to her. So yeah, I
guess even though it is a safe place, unfortunately for Lisa,
you know, she happened to be a young woman at
a time when there was, as you're describing, you know,
all these new people and all this new crime coming
to the island exactly. So let's look closer at the
night that Lisa aw actually went missing, which was January,
(08:47):
so Lisa had worked a shift at the hair salon
and by the time her shift was over or we
would say pawhannah, which means you're done with work. So
when she was Pauhana, it was pouring rain outside. This
is something that's normal on the Kilos side, the windward
side of the island, it always rains. So she just
gotten her temporary driver's license, so maybe she wasn't the
(09:09):
most experienced driver. Regardless, she decided to brave the rain
and go see her boyfriend Doug, and Doug was having
dinner at his sister's apartment in Mkiki on the other
side of town, so mckiki's right next to waike Kei.
It's probably a good thirty five minute drive from the
salon where Lisa was working, so it's it's kind of
(09:32):
a trek in the rain. Um Her co workers said
later that there was nothing different about Lisa that night.
She was her friendly, bubbly kind self and Lisa ended
up leaving work at nine o'clock and, like so many
of us in ha VII, since she was going to
dinner and going somewhere. She can't go empty handed, so
(09:53):
she stopped at the grocery store to get polk. And
if you don't know what polke is, you're living under
a rock, because it is crack. I mean, I think
it's made its way onto the mainland. Now there's polk bowls,
but back then you could just go and you'd get
it from the deli and it's the most delicious raw
fish soaked in show you or soy sauce and onions
(10:14):
and it's just amazing. But I'm sorry, I'm yeah, you're
going on a polk tangent um. But anyway, so Lisa
and her poke arrived at her boyfriend's sister's house and
her name was Kristen, and she arrived for a late
dinner and she ended up leaving that night about twelve twenty,
(10:37):
So this is now turning into Thursday, January one. So
Kristin actually offered to let Lisa stay with her for
the night so she didn't have to drive back in
the rain, but Lisa declined, but she did call her
roommate to let her know that she was on her
way home, right and so Doug Wood he would later
testify that he and Lisa left his sister's apartment at
(11:00):
the same time, but they left in different cars, so
they both went in their own cars. Doug went back
to the University of Hawaii dorm, and he thought it
was just a normal night until the very next morning
when he got a call from Lisa's parents asking where
was Lisa. Yeah, I guess nobody really knew by this point.
(11:23):
You know, it's now the morning of January, Lisa is
still not back. So finally it's her roommates who are
super concerned, you know, early morning by this point, and
they are the ones who contact the police their report
are missing. And the rest of this information comes from
Hawaii News Now, who did a lot of really good
reporting at the time. But according to them, Doug went
(11:44):
out to look for Lisa, and he's the one that
reported to police that he found her car. And her
car was a nineteen seventy six Toyota. It was parked
on the shoulder of the highway in Mona. Wheely, Am
I getting that right right? Very close? Okay, sorry, working
on my Hawaiian but I'm still doing good, tex and
I'm telling you very good, right. So, anyways, the car
(12:08):
was parked on the shoulder of the highway in Mana
WHEELI near the old Kailua drive in, which sounds fun.
When it was open, it was spooky, very spooky. Yeah.
The drive in was only about two miles from her
apartment though, and just about a hundred yards from a
public telephone. So when they found her car, the car
battery had actually died, but they were able to determine
(12:30):
that the windshield wipers and the parking lights had been
left on by Lisa or whoever. Also, the driver's side
window was about halfway down, and the responding officer also
reported that there was about two to three inches of
water on the floor of the car, and so the
seat and the rest of the car was just completely soaked, trenched,
covered in water. And the crazy thing about that, Trevor,
(12:51):
is that her purse was still on the seat and
it was completely dry. And I know, for me and
I'm sure for you, rush it to like, we would
never leave our purse, never if we were stranded somewhere
or something happened, that would be the first thing that
we would grab right absolutely, And I'm just gonna say,
my conspiracy mind, that should not have been a dry purse,
(13:15):
you know, like say, she was abducted and grabbed like
I'm sorry, the purse is going to be drenched to
of course, it's it's pouring rain. It's pouring rain, and
there you know, there's fishy. It's very fishy. And as
we know, there are no signs of Lisa or what
happened to her. All right, well we need to take
a quick break. So after a couple of very fun
(13:35):
ads will come back and talk about what the police
found and some of the people they interviewed. So coming
back to this case, the search for Lisa began almost
immediately after her car was found. And that's something you
have to know about the people of Hawaii. They come together.
(13:59):
They distributed thousands of flyers, officials and volunteers, scoured all
of the surrounding areas, including the nearby Kawai Nui Marsh,
throughout Kailua and kanye o He and Waimanalo. So, just
to give you some perspective on this, this is on
the windward side of the island. This is where Lisa worked,
(14:20):
where she lived, is where her car was found. So
they were only focusing on that side of the island,
even though she had been on the town side of
the island, the Makai side in Makiki the night before
she ended up going missing. So that's a big piece
of that puzzle here right. Sadly, though, there were multiple
(14:43):
days that passed without any ransom calls, any letters coming in,
no one saw anything any clues about Lisa, and that
had police officers and the people of Hawaii fearing the worst.
So on January one, a man was jogging with his
dog on Tantalus Drive And Tantalus is not too far
(15:04):
from waiki Ki and it's a place that only locals go.
It's beautiful, you can see all of waiki Ki and
all of you know, the Mackay side of the island,
but it's a local spot. Tourists don't go there. They
do not, They wouldn't know how to get there, no,
unless they were with a local exactly. So this jogger
(15:24):
was up on Tantalus Drive and he actually stumbled across
human remains. The body was found in some brush down
a deep ravine on the side of the road. She
was nude and the remains were severely decomposed. And remember
this was January one, and she only went missing on
(15:45):
January one, so it was officially later confirmed to be
Lisa Ou, but the state of decomposition was so advanced
that the corner was not able to determine a cause
of death. And still like I don't understand, like to
this day, forty years later, like they still don't know
(16:06):
what happened. It just it makes me so sad um
Trevor didn't The homicide detectives also have issues with how
the corner even handled the autopsy to begin with. Yeah,
it turns out the body was actually looked at a
number of times as a result of kind of poor
autopsy job the first time. But anyways, Hawaiian News Now
(16:26):
has a really great article on this, and they talked
about how Detective Burke Cornell, who was largely in charge
of this case, I really didn't think that the coroner
did a thorough job on that first autopsy. So they
ended up exhuming Lisa's body in for a second autopsy,
and they wanted to see if they could try and
determine a cause of death the second time, because I
(16:46):
didn't get it the first time. What they did end
up finding was not great, pretty troubling. In fact, they
found that Lisa's body was still inside the police body
bag that they put it in, and the release and
dirt and trash like in the bag and in her hair.
It was just like a mess. The detective also reported
that her body had never even been washed, which is wild.
(17:08):
How does that even happen? Just incompetence, I don't know.
Um So, anyways, even after this autopsy though, the investigators
couldn't identify a cause of death. Sadly, that's just crazy, right,
Like is it incompetence or was it planned that way?
(17:29):
It's possible. I mean, I think a big part of it,
too is any time a body has been out for
days and days at a time, like your, chances of
being able to determine how they died is infinitely less
each passing day, especially if it's outside and it's you know,
surrounded by breash and nature. It's it's going to decompose
a lot faster. And there is ten days you know
(17:49):
not to um, you know, excuse the way the body
was treated and kind of poorly examined. Um, But I
guess to me, all I'm saying is I'm not surprised
that they weren't able to determine a cause of death,
regardless of how the body was stored and it's so
heartbreaking to know that Lisa was treated that way, because death,
even though it's heartbreaking, it can be sacred, right. But
(18:11):
I'm sure that her family was, you know, in the
depths of their grief exactly, didn't didn't open who knows.
Maybe they told them to have a closed casket funeral,
who knows, but it's it. It makes me very sad.
I do know for a fact that she is now
buried at the Valley of the Temples in um on
(18:32):
Kanye Hay Side, and it's absolutely stunning. So at least
I know she has a beautiful final resting place. Yeah,
it's one of the most beautiful places actually on the island.
So she is on sacred grounds now. Yeah. So there
were actually some witnesses from that night. The Honolulu Star
Bulletin actually reported that several police officers remembered seeing Lisa's
(18:55):
car on the side of the road and they saw
a man and a woman the side of the car.
A few different theories came out about what happened to Lisa.
One was that she was abducted on her way home,
potentially killed elsewhere, and that the car was staged, which
I think we all three can be an agreement that
(19:15):
that's probably what happened. Yeah, that to me that is
obviously wanted to present what happened. I mean, the crime
scene tech said that Lisa's car had been wiped clean
of any evidence, right, and the officer thought that her
purse being dry, right, we all was questionable. Hello, and
that had been put there on the seat after the
(19:37):
rain stopped that night. Yeah, yeah, no, one million percent.
Yeah no. So additionally, there was another person who testified,
and her name was Charlotte Kamaka, and she was a
newspaper delivery driver. She was on her route and she
said that she saw a man about two thirty in
(19:58):
the morning. He was in a blue car and he
had a female passenger who appeared to be asleep or unconscious.
She also said that the head was bobbing back and forth,
you know, and she was her route was the Polly Highway,
so that's a windy road, right, rush like right? I remember, yeah,
(20:21):
I remember watching um I don't. I think they talked
about it What You News Now And actually another local
podcast I was listening to that interviewed Charlotte Komaca before
she passed. Because she gave that interview with the Grand
Jury and she said that she saw the head bobbing
with the turns. Yeah, yeah, I would say more unconscious,
not so much sleeping. Yeah. I mean, what does that
(20:44):
tell you then, if there's kind of like a half
conscious like head bobbing, that this person is either like
you know, drugs, or that they are dead or like
severely wounded to the point where they're like, you know,
not really able to keep their body up. You know,
maybe she's been attacked at this point, but it's still
like hanging on um, right, and she has no control
(21:04):
of her she has no control of her body. And sadly,
that is about all the leads that the investigators would get.
They did, however, find some suspects, and we will talk
about this is right after a quick ad break. All right,
(21:25):
it's time to talk about the suspects. And let me
just first point out I always think it's the boyfriend
right away, and I know most people do, but with
the limited reporting in this there's not a whole lot
of evidence that points to Doug Holmes. And he has
since moved to Australia and has commented many times and
(21:46):
said that he hopes that the killer of Lisa is found,
and I guess he has cooperated in the past. However,
he's still on the list. But the big theory in
this case, and it's been widely suggested that Lisa was
murdered by a police officer. Yeah, this one's interesting to me,
and I know we all heard a VET allude to
(22:07):
this earlier when she was talking about remembering the case,
and the main thing she remembered was that, you know,
there was kind of some fear about being pulled over
by police officers. So that's where this comes from. Yes, yes,
and that is because the main suspect was actually a
veteran police officer guy named Thomas Burne. So Burne had
(22:28):
been on the same highway as Lisa that night and
he reportedly pulled over a different woman for erratic driving.
A Ki Lewis supermarket checkout. Woman identified Burne as the
officer who had pulled her over. That's how we know that.
Burne admitted that he was there, but denied stopping Lisa
or of course killing her. Of course, yeah, of course
(22:53):
he's going to deny it. Still, though the investigation focused
largely on burn as you were saying, Sha and his
car and house were searched thoroughly. There were two police
dogs who were trained to find drugs and bombs that
were used to see if they could detect any of
Lisa's sins on his car or any of his belongings.
(23:13):
The dogs did pick up something from Burne's car. They
had some kind of reaction, but it was unclear what
they were reacting to, and so they couldn't really connect
burn that way. And so for all these reasons, burn
was never charged in the case. Um so he's still
considered a suspect largely, and there's been a lot of
debate about it over the years, but you know, again,
(23:34):
never charged, convicted, and so therefore we don't know who
killed Lisa. Yeah, and it right, and it goes back
and forth like was it the boyfriend or was it
a police officer or someone in impersonating a police or
someone someone impersonating the police officer. But it's interesting because
I spoke to one of my friends who lives in Hawaii,
and she said she's about three years older than me,
(23:56):
so she would have been, you know, eighteen at the time.
And she said years later, in the salon where she worked,
she had one of the detectives from the Lisa Ou
case in her chair and they started chatting, you know,
about the case, and she said that he felt that
the boyfriend absolutely did it. That was his opinion. Yeah. So,
(24:22):
but you said one thing that's interesting, You said, impersonating
a police officer. Where does that theory come from? Well,
that comes from in Hawaii at the time, there are
police officers could put the blue light on top of
their cars. So it was like a grill that was
there and they could just PLoP the blue light on there.
So you know, everybody was thinking that it was a
(24:43):
police officer. Now all of a sudden, they're thinking that
there are copycats out there that are going to start
pulling over tourists or you know, luring women to the
side and you know, doing something terrible to this because
get those lights? Is that why people think? And the
person vehicles back then, they were using their own cars,
(25:03):
so really anybody like with their own car could just
go buy a blue lights. And so actually in ninety two,
the Honolulu Police Department actually banned officers from using the
supplemental blue lights as a reaction to Lisa's unsolved murder
because I think it created a lot of mass hysteria,
especially in Honolulu. Yeah, I created a frenzy, right, and
(25:26):
we're afraid, so afraid, like our mom. And so the
other theory that I think is absolutely crazy is that
they were trying to pin Lisa as murder on the
Golden State Killer, who has now been identified as James DeAngelo,
who is a former police officer, or they actually thought
(25:47):
that it possibly like Lisa could have been the first
murder in the still unidentified serial killer known as the
Honolulu Strangler. And I honestly, like, I'd never heard about
the Honolulu Strangler until doing research for this actual case.
Do you know anything about it? Event No, and that's no,
(26:09):
I did not. And I asked my friend again the
same question, and she remembers that case those cases as well,
and I said, well, do you think you know one
had to do with the other, And she said she
didn't feel that way at all. You know, So, um,
were you familiar with these at all? Trevor, our true
crime expert, Yeah, I mean, obviously I'm familiar with the
(26:30):
Golden State Killer and Joseph James D'Angelo. That was a
huge thing back in I guess eighteen or so when
he was found out, um, And it's a pretty common
thing at any time one of these serial killers from
you know, decades past is discovered that people try and
connect them with all these other unsolved cases where they
(26:53):
don't know who the killer is. I remember people thought like,
you know, he could have been also the Zodiac, or
that the Zodiac was the the Unit bomber. You know.
So people are always like making these crazy connections between
these famous serial killers, and I get it. I understand
where the temptation comes from. But I was less familiar
with the Honolulu strangler. However, I had heard about it
(27:14):
in reference to some d DNA technology announcements that had
come out recently. It was one of those cases where
they thought they could use new DNA technology to help
solve the case, which has been a really big thing
in recent years. So I had kind of heard about
it in passing, but happy to talk about it a
little bit more here because it is an interesting case,
and that one, more so than the Golden State Killer,
(27:37):
I think, could have some legs as a theory. Um.
So anyways, I'll just tell you about it and then
we can think about it a little bit. It makes
any sense if it's connected to Lisa, but basically, from
May to April of nineteen eighty six, five women were
murdered in a similar fashion to one another. Their names
(27:59):
were Vicky Gay Purdy, Regina Sakamoto, Denise Hughes, Luise Medeiros,
and Linda Pesci. Each woman was found nude with her
hands bound behind her back, and three of them had
been sexually assaulted or raped. So already the m O
kind of sounds different from Lisa, right right, right? Um So,
(28:20):
because Lisa's cause of death, though has still not really
been determined, it's difficult to tell if she had been strangled,
if she had been bound, if she had been sexually assaulted.
Uh And since she was not found under any of
those conditions, there's not really a lot of evidence to
back up the theory that she was connected to the
Honolulu Strangler. Still, though, it's, you know, possible, It's possible
(28:42):
that Lisa, you know, having happened many years earlier, was
like maybe the first victim of the Honolulu Strangler, that
maybe she was like a test a test case, test
case for him, or I assume him, you know, and
then he would go on to murder and kill five
other women. Uh, you know, we've heard of that happening.
You know, the Zodiac case. For example, there were a
(29:03):
number of unconnected cases, unconfirmed cases that happened years, years
before the official Zodiett killings that looked really, really similar.
So a lot of people kind of assume that those
cases are connected, but that they were as I was
just mentioning, like kind of test cases for the Zodiac.
So it's not unheard of, could be connected, but you know,
at the end of the day, we don't have any
way to confirm that. It's funny that you mentioned the
(29:26):
Zodiac because our great uncle Steve Hodell connected, you know,
he believes that our great grandfather, George Hoddell was also
the Zodiac killer. It's like, what is that about. I
don't know. I didn't read. They always try to put
them all together. I know I attributed to Akham's razor, right,
(29:48):
Like the simplest answer to any sort of complex issue is,
you know, the most easy one to digest, and therefore
people attracted. You always say these amazing nuggets. Trevor, Oh
my goodness, I wish I could just get in your
brain sometimes, Oh my gosh, but what do you guys? Okay,
(30:09):
So but what do you think about Doug. Do you
guys think that the boyfriend could have done it? I mean,
what do you think? I feel like Russia kind of
said it already, you know. I mean again, I know
people are quick too, you know, go for the partner
as the person who likely did it, and for good reason.
I mean, that is very often the case, right, I mean,
(30:30):
I think the first people you should look at are
the people who know the victim, right, people in close proximity,
significant others, neighbors, etcetera, etcetera. Um. But in this case,
it just feels unlikely. It feels unlikely based off of
his testimony. It feels unlikely based on the fact that
there's just nothing tying him to the case. You know,
I don't know if anybody else had any thoughts, but
I mean, you know, I I have to agree with you.
(30:53):
I think originally I thought, yeah, it was a boyfriend,
because you know again, I go back to like, how
do you let your girlfriend, you know, drive the Polly
and it's pouring rain at night, and you know, and
there's an argument, and I think, well, maybe something happened
and so he planned all this, you know, something bad
(31:13):
happened accidentally possibly, I don't know. But the more that
I think about it, I don't think the boyfriend was
the one who did it. I think that um my
gut is leaning more towards a police officer, what yeah
or something. I just I just, yeah, things things are
(31:37):
just not adding up, especially when we go back and
we're talking about like her body right, and how the
coroners the way that it was not cleaned and bagged,
and like that's a that's a procedure that is supposed
to be done. So why wasn't that done? Oh so
(31:58):
there's a conspiracy theory to work here. Yeah, So I'm
just I'm just I mean, I don't know, but that's
just my two cents. See, and I always lean towards
the boyfriend, but because I don't want to hurt anyone.
You know, Doug has come out in you know, last
few years especially you know, I think he was interviewed
(32:19):
for how About You News now and he said, you know,
because he's moved on to Australia, has a family, has
moved on in his life. But he definitely, you know,
has said that he wants to find Lisa's killer and
help in any way that he can but I still
can't get it out of my mind that he was
the last person to be with her. So I don't know.
(32:40):
I just valid point though, Yvette and and Trevor. I
just I want Lisa to find justice, right, We just
we just hope that the truth one day comes out
what really happened to her, Right, That's the most important
thing here exactly. So now it's time for our last
(33:00):
segment of the show, Our Ima. This will be the
final part of every single episode of Facing Evil, and
IMA in Hawaiian means to move onward and upward, and
most importantly, to move forward. It's our final message of
hope and healing that we want to give to each
of you today. We dedicate our im to Lisa out
(33:25):
and all the other people in Hawaii who never had
their cases resolved. It's so important to us UM today
to spread this message of hope that we will find
the truth about Lisa, and that the land, the Aina
of Hawaii will provide that truth absolutely and hopefully this
(33:48):
will bring some peace to Lisa's Ohanna, onward and upward.
Imam ya, well that's our show for today, our very
first one. Mahallanuila, Thank you so much. For joining us.
We'd love to hear what you thought about today's discussion
(34:11):
and if there's a case that you'd like us to cover,
you can always find us on social media or email
us at Facing Evil Pod at tenderfoot dot tv Until
next time a Loha. Facing Evil is a production of
(34:47):
I Heart Radio and Tenderfoot TV. The show is hosted
by Russia, Pecarero and a Veil. Matt Frederick and Alex
Williams our executive producers on behalf of I Heart Radio,
with sers Trevor Young and Jesse Funk, Donald Albright and
Payne Lindsay our executive producers on behalf of Tenderfoot TV,
alongside producer Tracy Kaplan. Our researcher is Claudia Dafrico. Original
(35:13):
music by Makeup and Vanity Set. Find us on social
media or email us at Facing Evil pot at tenderfoot
dot tv. For more podcasts from I Heart Radio or
Tenderfoot TV, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
You're listening to Facing Evil, a production of I Heart
Radio and Tenderfoot TV. The views and opinions expressed in
this podcast are solely those of the individuals participating in
the show and do not represent those of I Heart
Radio or Tenderfoot TV. This podcast contains subject matter which
may not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised. Hello, everyone,
(00:29):
welcome or a komo ma, which means welcome in Hawaiian
to the very first episode of our new podcast, Facing
Evil from Tenderfoot TV and I Heart Radio. We are
your hosts. I'm Rosha Peccarero and I'm a vegin Tile
and some of you may already be familiar with our
voices from our hit podcast Root of Evil, the True
(00:52):
story of the Hodel Family and the Black Dahlia. Root
of Evil is where we talked about our family's history
and connection to George Hodel, who happened to be the
prime suspect in the Black Dahlia murder case, which is
also known as the Elizabeth Short murder case. We've known
about our crazy, dark family history our entire lives, but
(01:12):
Yvette and I are so thankful that we had our
beautiful mother, Fauna hotel. A woman who rose above her
difficult and crazy upbringing, and she always looked for the
best in all of the people around her, and we've
always found the light in the dark because of her.
And that is what we are going to do with
(01:34):
this new podcast, right, that's right. So each week we're
going to be joined by our amazing producer, Mr Trevor Young,
and we're going to discuss true crime stories that we
think that need to be brought into the light, and
we're going to share our own unique perspective on the
cases and people involved. And throughout the season, we're also
(01:58):
going to be joined by some very special guests that
are sharing their stories and we'll hear from others that
can shed light on particular cases. So, since we are sisters,
contrary to popular belief, we do not have the same
opinion a lot of the time, but we have beautiful conversations,
(02:18):
We tease each other, and you know, we just want
you all to come along on this journey with us. Yes,
we do. So with that being said, let's get to
our first case, the case of Lisa Au, nineteen year
old woman who went missing in Hawaii in Since this
is our first episode, we wanted to share a story
(02:40):
from a place that is very personal to us. This
is home, This is Hawaii, and most people think of
our beautiful hometown in Honolulu, Hawaii as a paradise, which
it absolutely is. But it's really a place just like
any other and it's not free from crime, order or
(03:00):
other horrible tragedies. Right, So this is sort of a
double edged sort of an episode. While we're so happy
to be talking about our home, we're also turning over
a few stones and looking at the darker side of
what is usually a very sunny place. Each week, our
producer Trevor is going to come in and give us
(03:22):
a rundown on a case. So now let's hear about
Lisa al Well. It's one of the biggest unsolved mysteries
in Hawaii. Who killed Lisa Awl She was on her
way home when she was stopped and abducted from that
Kailua location. If you're old enough, you remember the fear
(03:43):
that spread through the community when a policeman was suspected.
Law enforcement pursued that theory for years, overlooking other evidence.
Lisa al was born on July to Chester Dennis Owl
and put Teres Mahia e Kalani akima Ao ka Uamano.
(04:04):
Lisa was of Chinese, Hawaiian, and European descent. She was
raised on the island of Oahu, and after high school,
she pursued a career as a hairstylist. After attending a
training program at trend Setter's Beauty College, Lisa started working
as a hairdresser at the Susan Beer Salon in Kailua
in Honolulu County. She was there for about five weeks
(04:27):
before she went missing. Around this time, she was dating
a University of Hawaii student named Doug Holmes, and on
the evening of July, Lisa went to see her boyfriend
Doug at his sister's apartment. At twelve twenty am, Lisa
called her roommate to say she'd be coming home soon,
(04:49):
but Lisa never came home that night. The next morning,
they found Lisa's car parked on the side of a road,
but Lisa was nowhere to be found. It would be
another ten days before a jogger would come across Lisa's
decomposed remains on the other side of the island. So
(05:09):
what happened to Lisa and how could something so gruesome happen?
In a beautiful place like Hawaii. It's heartbreaking to me
that anything like this happened, you know, And I think,
you know, our moms sheltered us so much that we
we didn't see a whole lot of crime. I mean,
(05:30):
you know, I mean I had to like ask one
of my dear friends, like who's also Hawaiian. I'm like,
do you know of any murders or anything? And she
told me about Lisa. And when I looked it up,
I mean, I was too little, but Yvette, you were
like fourteen fifteen, Yeah, I was. I was fifteen, and
I remember a little bit. I mean, you know, all
of us living through a pandemic. It's like trying to
(05:52):
go back in my brain and remember things is a
whole another story. But I do remember, you know, Mom
was driving into town, so from where we lived, Pearl City,
right driving all the way into town, and there was
this this thing going on about you know, being afraid,
women being afraid to be pulled over by police. So
(06:14):
I do remember some of that. Connecting the dots, yeah,
connecting the dots right to this particular case. But growing
up there, y'all didn't really kind of have the feeling
that it was unsafe to be in Hawaii or the
crime or murder with things that really have not at all,
not ever never, I've never heard of murder, like That's
why I had to ask around. Yeah, yeah, I mean
(06:37):
we and we left our doors unlocked all the time,
and you know, left our screen doors open. So no,
not at all. And that's why this case really hits
home for us because it it's centers around Kailua in Hawaii,
not far from where we grew up, you know, and
we actually lived in Kailua. And one of the men
(06:58):
with mom, yeah I lived, I lived the island, yes, yes,
and you know haw VII Like Trevors you said, like
it is really one of the safest places in the
United States. And it's seen, you know, a decline in
violent crime over you know, the last few years. Um.
(07:19):
It's currently placed forty four out of the fifty states
in the list of violent crimes per capita. But that
was not always the case, especially in the seventies and eighties.
And many people may not know that violent crimes in
Hawaii increased sharply in the nineteen seventies and actually peaked
in the nineteen eighties. Right And even though we were
growing up in Hawaii. Mom sheltered us from all of that.
(07:42):
I mean she kept us busy seven, over protected, overprotective
in all types of activities, so we weren't sitting at home,
you know, watching TV. But there was a huge influx
of new people moving to the islands, and of course
with that there's more crime. Yeah, it's interesting. I mean
the uptick and crime in the seventies and eighties, I
(08:04):
mean that was happening across the country at the time.
The seventies and eighties were just particularly dangerous. There was
just a huge uptick in crime, murder, robbery, all throughout
that period, drugs, and so yeah, I think you're just
kind of came to Hawaii along with people moving there,
you know, throughout that decade um and sadly, this is
really the same time period that you know, Lisa al
(08:24):
goes missing and everything happens to her. So yeah, I
guess even though it is a safe place, unfortunately for Lisa,
you know, she happened to be a young woman at
a time when there was, as you're describing, you know,
all these new people and all this new crime coming
to the island exactly. So let's look closer at the
night that Lisa aw actually went missing, which was January,
(08:47):
so Lisa had worked a shift at the hair salon
and by the time her shift was over or we
would say pawhannah, which means you're done with work. So
when she was Pauhana, it was pouring rain outside. This
is something that's normal on the Kilos side, the windward
side of the island, it always rains. So she just
gotten her temporary driver's license, so maybe she wasn't the
(09:09):
most experienced driver. Regardless, she decided to brave the rain
and go see her boyfriend Doug, and Doug was having
dinner at his sister's apartment in Mkiki on the other
side of town, so mckiki's right next to waike Kei.
It's probably a good thirty five minute drive from the
salon where Lisa was working, so it's it's kind of
(09:32):
a trek in the rain. Um Her co workers said
later that there was nothing different about Lisa that night.
She was her friendly, bubbly kind self and Lisa ended
up leaving work at nine o'clock and, like so many
of us in ha VII, since she was going to
dinner and going somewhere. She can't go empty handed, so
(09:53):
she stopped at the grocery store to get polk. And
if you don't know what polke is, you're living under
a rock, because it is crack. I mean, I think
it's made its way onto the mainland. Now there's polk bowls,
but back then you could just go and you'd get
it from the deli and it's the most delicious raw
fish soaked in show you or soy sauce and onions
(10:14):
and it's just amazing. But I'm sorry, I'm yeah, you're
going on a polk tangent um. But anyway, so Lisa
and her poke arrived at her boyfriend's sister's house and
her name was Kristen, and she arrived for a late
dinner and she ended up leaving that night about twelve twenty,
(10:37):
So this is now turning into Thursday, January one. So
Kristin actually offered to let Lisa stay with her for
the night so she didn't have to drive back in
the rain, but Lisa declined, but she did call her
roommate to let her know that she was on her
way home, right and so Doug Wood he would later
testify that he and Lisa left his sister's apartment at
(11:00):
the same time, but they left in different cars, so
they both went in their own cars. Doug went back
to the University of Hawaii dorm, and he thought it
was just a normal night until the very next morning
when he got a call from Lisa's parents asking where
was Lisa. Yeah, I guess nobody really knew by this point.
(11:23):
You know, it's now the morning of January, Lisa is
still not back. So finally it's her roommates who are
super concerned, you know, early morning by this point, and
they are the ones who contact the police their report
are missing. And the rest of this information comes from
Hawaii News Now, who did a lot of really good
reporting at the time. But according to them, Doug went
(11:44):
out to look for Lisa, and he's the one that
reported to police that he found her car. And her
car was a nineteen seventy six Toyota. It was parked
on the shoulder of the highway in Mona. Wheely, Am
I getting that right right? Very close? Okay, sorry, working
on my Hawaiian but I'm still doing good, tex and
I'm telling you very good, right. So, anyways, the car
(12:08):
was parked on the shoulder of the highway in Mana
WHEELI near the old Kailua drive in, which sounds fun.
When it was open, it was spooky, very spooky. Yeah.
The drive in was only about two miles from her
apartment though, and just about a hundred yards from a
public telephone. So when they found her car, the car
battery had actually died, but they were able to determine
(12:30):
that the windshield wipers and the parking lights had been
left on by Lisa or whoever. Also, the driver's side
window was about halfway down, and the responding officer also
reported that there was about two to three inches of
water on the floor of the car, and so the
seat and the rest of the car was just completely soaked, trenched,
covered in water. And the crazy thing about that, Trevor,
(12:51):
is that her purse was still on the seat and
it was completely dry. And I know, for me and
I'm sure for you, rush it to like, we would
never leave our purse, never if we were stranded somewhere
or something happened, that would be the first thing that
we would grab right absolutely, And I'm just gonna say,
my conspiracy mind, that should not have been a dry purse,
(13:15):
you know, like say, she was abducted and grabbed like
I'm sorry, the purse is going to be drenched to
of course, it's it's pouring rain. It's pouring rain, and
there you know, there's fishy. It's very fishy. And as
we know, there are no signs of Lisa or what
happened to her. All right, well we need to take
a quick break. So after a couple of very fun
(13:35):
ads will come back and talk about what the police
found and some of the people they interviewed. So coming
back to this case, the search for Lisa began almost
immediately after her car was found. And that's something you
have to know about the people of Hawaii. They come together.
(13:59):
They distributed thousands of flyers, officials and volunteers, scoured all
of the surrounding areas, including the nearby Kawai Nui Marsh,
throughout Kailua and kanye o He and Waimanalo. So, just
to give you some perspective on this, this is on
the windward side of the island. This is where Lisa worked,
(14:20):
where she lived, is where her car was found. So
they were only focusing on that side of the island,
even though she had been on the town side of
the island, the Makai side in Makiki the night before
she ended up going missing. So that's a big piece
of that puzzle here right. Sadly, though, there were multiple
(14:43):
days that passed without any ransom calls, any letters coming in,
no one saw anything any clues about Lisa, and that
had police officers and the people of Hawaii fearing the worst.
So on January one, a man was jogging with his
dog on Tantalus Drive And Tantalus is not too far
(15:04):
from waiki Ki and it's a place that only locals go.
It's beautiful, you can see all of waiki Ki and
all of you know, the Mackay side of the island,
but it's a local spot. Tourists don't go there. They
do not, They wouldn't know how to get there, no,
unless they were with a local exactly. So this jogger
(15:24):
was up on Tantalus Drive and he actually stumbled across
human remains. The body was found in some brush down
a deep ravine on the side of the road. She
was nude and the remains were severely decomposed. And remember
this was January one, and she only went missing on
(15:45):
January one, so it was officially later confirmed to be
Lisa Ou, but the state of decomposition was so advanced
that the corner was not able to determine a cause
of death. And still like I don't understand, like to
this day, forty years later, like they still don't know
(16:06):
what happened. It just it makes me so sad um
Trevor didn't The homicide detectives also have issues with how
the corner even handled the autopsy to begin with. Yeah,
it turns out the body was actually looked at a
number of times as a result of kind of poor
autopsy job the first time. But anyways, Hawaiian News Now
(16:26):
has a really great article on this, and they talked
about how Detective Burke Cornell, who was largely in charge
of this case, I really didn't think that the coroner
did a thorough job on that first autopsy. So they
ended up exhuming Lisa's body in for a second autopsy,
and they wanted to see if they could try and
determine a cause of death the second time, because I
(16:46):
didn't get it the first time. What they did end
up finding was not great, pretty troubling. In fact, they
found that Lisa's body was still inside the police body
bag that they put it in, and the release and
dirt and trash like in the bag and in her hair.
It was just like a mess. The detective also reported
that her body had never even been washed, which is wild.
(17:08):
How does that even happen? Just incompetence, I don't know.
Um So, anyways, even after this autopsy though, the investigators
couldn't identify a cause of death. Sadly, that's just crazy, right,
Like is it incompetence or was it planned that way?
(17:29):
It's possible. I mean, I think a big part of it,
too is any time a body has been out for
days and days at a time, like your, chances of
being able to determine how they died is infinitely less
each passing day, especially if it's outside and it's you know,
surrounded by breash and nature. It's it's going to decompose
a lot faster. And there is ten days you know
(17:49):
not to um, you know, excuse the way the body
was treated and kind of poorly examined. Um, But I
guess to me, all I'm saying is I'm not surprised
that they weren't able to determine a cause of death,
regardless of how the body was stored and it's so
heartbreaking to know that Lisa was treated that way, because death,
even though it's heartbreaking, it can be sacred, right. But
(18:11):
I'm sure that her family was, you know, in the
depths of their grief exactly, didn't didn't open who knows.
Maybe they told them to have a closed casket funeral,
who knows, but it's it. It makes me very sad.
I do know for a fact that she is now
buried at the Valley of the Temples in um on
(18:32):
Kanye Hay Side, and it's absolutely stunning. So at least
I know she has a beautiful final resting place. Yeah,
it's one of the most beautiful places actually on the island.
So she is on sacred grounds now. Yeah. So there
were actually some witnesses from that night. The Honolulu Star
Bulletin actually reported that several police officers remembered seeing Lisa's
(18:55):
car on the side of the road and they saw
a man and a woman the side of the car.
A few different theories came out about what happened to Lisa.
One was that she was abducted on her way home,
potentially killed elsewhere, and that the car was staged, which
I think we all three can be an agreement that
(19:15):
that's probably what happened. Yeah, that to me that is
obviously wanted to present what happened. I mean, the crime
scene tech said that Lisa's car had been wiped clean
of any evidence, right, and the officer thought that her
purse being dry, right, we all was questionable. Hello, and
that had been put there on the seat after the
(19:37):
rain stopped that night. Yeah, yeah, no, one million percent.
Yeah no. So additionally, there was another person who testified,
and her name was Charlotte Kamaka, and she was a
newspaper delivery driver. She was on her route and she
said that she saw a man about two thirty in
(19:58):
the morning. He was in a blue car and he
had a female passenger who appeared to be asleep or unconscious.
She also said that the head was bobbing back and forth,
you know, and she was her route was the Polly Highway,
so that's a windy road, right, rush like right? I remember, yeah,
(20:21):
I remember watching um I don't. I think they talked
about it What You News Now And actually another local
podcast I was listening to that interviewed Charlotte Komaca before
she passed. Because she gave that interview with the Grand
Jury and she said that she saw the head bobbing
with the turns. Yeah, yeah, I would say more unconscious,
not so much sleeping. Yeah. I mean, what does that
(20:44):
tell you then, if there's kind of like a half
conscious like head bobbing, that this person is either like
you know, drugs, or that they are dead or like
severely wounded to the point where they're like, you know,
not really able to keep their body up. You know,
maybe she's been attacked at this point, but it's still
like hanging on um, right, and she has no control
(21:04):
of her she has no control of her body. And sadly,
that is about all the leads that the investigators would get.
They did, however, find some suspects, and we will talk
about this is right after a quick ad break. All right,
(21:25):
it's time to talk about the suspects. And let me
just first point out I always think it's the boyfriend
right away, and I know most people do, but with
the limited reporting in this there's not a whole lot
of evidence that points to Doug Holmes. And he has
since moved to Australia and has commented many times and
(21:46):
said that he hopes that the killer of Lisa is found,
and I guess he has cooperated in the past. However,
he's still on the list. But the big theory in
this case, and it's been widely suggested that Lisa was
murdered by a police officer. Yeah, this one's interesting to me,
and I know we all heard a VET allude to
(22:07):
this earlier when she was talking about remembering the case,
and the main thing she remembered was that, you know,
there was kind of some fear about being pulled over
by police officers. So that's where this comes from. Yes, yes,
and that is because the main suspect was actually a
veteran police officer guy named Thomas Burne. So Burne had
(22:28):
been on the same highway as Lisa that night and
he reportedly pulled over a different woman for erratic driving.
A Ki Lewis supermarket checkout. Woman identified Burne as the
officer who had pulled her over. That's how we know that.
Burne admitted that he was there, but denied stopping Lisa
or of course killing her. Of course, yeah, of course
(22:53):
he's going to deny it. Still, though the investigation focused
largely on burn as you were saying, Sha and his
car and house were searched thoroughly. There were two police
dogs who were trained to find drugs and bombs that
were used to see if they could detect any of
Lisa's sins on his car or any of his belongings.
(23:13):
The dogs did pick up something from Burne's car. They
had some kind of reaction, but it was unclear what
they were reacting to, and so they couldn't really connect
burn that way. And so for all these reasons, burn
was never charged in the case. Um so he's still
considered a suspect largely, and there's been a lot of
debate about it over the years, but you know, again,
(23:34):
never charged, convicted, and so therefore we don't know who
killed Lisa. Yeah, and it right, and it goes back
and forth like was it the boyfriend or was it
a police officer or someone in impersonating a police or
someone someone impersonating the police officer. But it's interesting because
I spoke to one of my friends who lives in Hawaii,
and she said she's about three years older than me,
(23:56):
so she would have been, you know, eighteen at the time.
And she said years later, in the salon where she worked,
she had one of the detectives from the Lisa Ou
case in her chair and they started chatting, you know,
about the case, and she said that he felt that
the boyfriend absolutely did it. That was his opinion. Yeah. So,
(24:22):
but you said one thing that's interesting, You said, impersonating
a police officer. Where does that theory come from? Well,
that comes from in Hawaii at the time, there are
police officers could put the blue light on top of
their cars. So it was like a grill that was
there and they could just PLoP the blue light on there.
So you know, everybody was thinking that it was a
(24:43):
police officer. Now all of a sudden, they're thinking that
there are copycats out there that are going to start
pulling over tourists or you know, luring women to the
side and you know, doing something terrible to this because
get those lights? Is that why people think? And the
person vehicles back then, they were using their own cars,
(25:03):
so really anybody like with their own car could just
go buy a blue lights. And so actually in ninety two,
the Honolulu Police Department actually banned officers from using the
supplemental blue lights as a reaction to Lisa's unsolved murder
because I think it created a lot of mass hysteria,
especially in Honolulu. Yeah, I created a frenzy, right, and
(25:26):
we're afraid, so afraid, like our mom. And so the
other theory that I think is absolutely crazy is that
they were trying to pin Lisa as murder on the
Golden State Killer, who has now been identified as James DeAngelo,
who is a former police officer, or they actually thought
(25:47):
that it possibly like Lisa could have been the first
murder in the still unidentified serial killer known as the
Honolulu Strangler. And I honestly, like, I'd never heard about
the Honolulu Strangler until doing research for this actual case.
Do you know anything about it? Event No, and that's no,
(26:09):
I did not. And I asked my friend again the
same question, and she remembers that case those cases as well,
and I said, well, do you think you know one
had to do with the other, And she said she
didn't feel that way at all. You know, So, um,
were you familiar with these at all? Trevor, our true
crime expert, Yeah, I mean, obviously I'm familiar with the
(26:30):
Golden State Killer and Joseph James D'Angelo. That was a
huge thing back in I guess eighteen or so when
he was found out, um, And it's a pretty common
thing at any time one of these serial killers from
you know, decades past is discovered that people try and
connect them with all these other unsolved cases where they
(26:53):
don't know who the killer is. I remember people thought like,
you know, he could have been also the Zodiac, or
that the Zodiac was the the Unit bomber. You know.
So people are always like making these crazy connections between
these famous serial killers, and I get it. I understand
where the temptation comes from. But I was less familiar
with the Honolulu strangler. However, I had heard about it
(27:14):
in reference to some d DNA technology announcements that had
come out recently. It was one of those cases where
they thought they could use new DNA technology to help
solve the case, which has been a really big thing
in recent years. So I had kind of heard about
it in passing, but happy to talk about it a
little bit more here because it is an interesting case,
and that one, more so than the Golden State Killer,
(27:37):
I think, could have some legs as a theory. Um.
So anyways, I'll just tell you about it and then
we can think about it a little bit. It makes
any sense if it's connected to Lisa, but basically, from
May to April of nineteen eighty six, five women were
murdered in a similar fashion to one another. Their names
(27:59):
were Vicky Gay Purdy, Regina Sakamoto, Denise Hughes, Luise Medeiros,
and Linda Pesci. Each woman was found nude with her
hands bound behind her back, and three of them had
been sexually assaulted or raped. So already the m O
kind of sounds different from Lisa, right right, right? Um So,
(28:20):
because Lisa's cause of death, though has still not really
been determined, it's difficult to tell if she had been strangled,
if she had been bound, if she had been sexually assaulted.
Uh And since she was not found under any of
those conditions, there's not really a lot of evidence to
back up the theory that she was connected to the
Honolulu Strangler. Still, though, it's, you know, possible, It's possible
(28:42):
that Lisa, you know, having happened many years earlier, was
like maybe the first victim of the Honolulu Strangler, that
maybe she was like a test a test case, test
case for him, or I assume him, you know, and
then he would go on to murder and kill five
other women. Uh, you know, we've heard of that happening.
You know, the Zodiac case. For example, there were a
(29:03):
number of unconnected cases, unconfirmed cases that happened years, years
before the official Zodiett killings that looked really, really similar.
So a lot of people kind of assume that those
cases are connected, but that they were as I was
just mentioning, like kind of test cases for the Zodiac.
So it's not unheard of, could be connected, but you know,
at the end of the day, we don't have any
way to confirm that. It's funny that you mentioned the
(29:26):
Zodiac because our great uncle Steve Hodell connected, you know,
he believes that our great grandfather, George Hoddell was also
the Zodiac killer. It's like, what is that about. I
don't know. I didn't read. They always try to put
them all together. I know I attributed to Akham's razor, right,
(29:48):
Like the simplest answer to any sort of complex issue is,
you know, the most easy one to digest, and therefore
people attracted. You always say these amazing nuggets. Trevor, Oh
my goodness, I wish I could just get in your
brain sometimes, Oh my gosh, but what do you guys? Okay,
(30:09):
So but what do you think about Doug. Do you
guys think that the boyfriend could have done it? I mean,
what do you think? I feel like Russia kind of
said it already, you know. I mean again, I know
people are quick too, you know, go for the partner
as the person who likely did it, and for good reason.
I mean, that is very often the case, right, I mean,
(30:30):
I think the first people you should look at are
the people who know the victim, right, people in close proximity,
significant others, neighbors, etcetera, etcetera. Um. But in this case,
it just feels unlikely. It feels unlikely based off of
his testimony. It feels unlikely based on the fact that
there's just nothing tying him to the case. You know,
I don't know if anybody else had any thoughts, but
I mean, you know, I I have to agree with you.
(30:53):
I think originally I thought, yeah, it was a boyfriend,
because you know again, I go back to like, how
do you let your girlfriend, you know, drive the Polly
and it's pouring rain at night, and you know, and
there's an argument, and I think, well, maybe something happened
and so he planned all this, you know, something bad
(31:13):
happened accidentally possibly, I don't know. But the more that
I think about it, I don't think the boyfriend was
the one who did it. I think that um my
gut is leaning more towards a police officer, what yeah
or something. I just I just, yeah, things things are
(31:37):
just not adding up, especially when we go back and
we're talking about like her body right, and how the
coroners the way that it was not cleaned and bagged,
and like that's a that's a procedure that is supposed
to be done. So why wasn't that done? Oh so
(31:58):
there's a conspiracy theory to work here. Yeah, So I'm
just I'm just I mean, I don't know, but that's
just my two cents. See, and I always lean towards
the boyfriend, but because I don't want to hurt anyone.
You know, Doug has come out in you know, last
few years especially you know, I think he was interviewed
(32:19):
for how About You News now and he said, you know,
because he's moved on to Australia, has a family, has
moved on in his life. But he definitely, you know,
has said that he wants to find Lisa's killer and
help in any way that he can but I still
can't get it out of my mind that he was
the last person to be with her. So I don't know.
(32:40):
I just valid point though, Yvette and and Trevor. I
just I want Lisa to find justice, right, We just
we just hope that the truth one day comes out
what really happened to her, Right, That's the most important
thing here exactly. So now it's time for our last
(33:00):
segment of the show, Our Ima. This will be the
final part of every single episode of Facing Evil, and
IMA in Hawaiian means to move onward and upward, and
most importantly, to move forward. It's our final message of
hope and healing that we want to give to each
of you today. We dedicate our im to Lisa out
(33:25):
and all the other people in Hawaii who never had
their cases resolved. It's so important to us UM today
to spread this message of hope that we will find
the truth about Lisa, and that the land, the Aina
of Hawaii will provide that truth absolutely and hopefully this
(33:48):
will bring some peace to Lisa's Ohanna, onward and upward.
Imam ya, well that's our show for today, our very
first one. Mahallanuila, Thank you so much. For joining us.
We'd love to hear what you thought about today's discussion
(34:11):
and if there's a case that you'd like us to cover,
you can always find us on social media or email
us at Facing Evil Pod at tenderfoot dot tv Until
next time a Loha. Facing Evil is a production of
(34:47):
I Heart Radio and Tenderfoot TV. The show is hosted
by Russia, Pecarero and a Veil. Matt Frederick and Alex
Williams our executive producers on behalf of I Heart Radio,
with sers Trevor Young and Jesse Funk, Donald Albright and
Payne Lindsay our executive producers on behalf of Tenderfoot TV,
alongside producer Tracy Kaplan. Our researcher is Claudia Dafrico. Original
(35:13):
music by Makeup and Vanity Set. Find us on social
media or email us at Facing Evil pot at tenderfoot
dot tv. For more podcasts from I Heart Radio or
Tenderfoot TV, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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