July 6, 2020 • 49 mins
TIME magazine named him one of the “Top 100 Most Influential People in the World.” Men’s Fitness hailed him as one of the fittest men on the planet. He’s run 50 marathons in 50 states in 50 consecutive days, 350 miles non-stop. He won the World’s Toughest Footrace, the Badwater Ultramarathon, running 135 miles nonstop across Death Valley during the middle of summer; and that's but a few of his incredible accomplishments. Need a little motivation for your fitness plan? Listen to this episode with Dean Karnazes and you won’t get a little, but a whole lot of powerful inspiration to take you program (and your life) to the next level.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Fitness Disrupted, a production of I Heart Radio.
I am Tom Holland, and this is Fitness Disrupted. I
say it frequently because I wholeheartedly believe it to my core.
(00:20):
I have the greatest job in the world. I get
to help people look better, feel better, and live longer.
And one of the ways in which I do that
is I get to talk to people like my next guest,
Dean car Nazis. Almost almost wanted to drop an F
bomb there, Dean car Nazis. He's amazing. Some of you
(00:44):
know exactly who he is, some of you do not.
I will give you his bio shortly. It is insane.
It is amazing, and he started, you know, as a
real person like all of us. He's just an ordinary
person who has done extraordinary things. And that's gonna sound
(01:04):
insane when I read you his list of accomplishments. But
he is one of the nicest, most humble and and
amazing people when it comes to athletic achievements that I
have had the good fortune to speak with. And I
did interview him many years ago. I had a radio show,
our long Live show, and back when he was I
(01:25):
think his first book. He's got four of his own
and two chicken Soup of the Soul. He's UH contributed
to those as well. But I spoke with him and
I have followed him over the years. As I've talked
about before, I study and get inspired by the people
who have accomplished amazing things, and I tend to follow
what they did and to you know, learn from their
(01:48):
uh mistakes, failures if you want to call them that,
which we don't call failures though. It's all learning experience.
But Dean car Nazis, let me just I'm gonna give
you the full buy because I can't leave things out,
all right, So here we go. Dean car Nassis. Time
magazine named him one of the top one hundred most
influential people in the world. Men's Fitness hailed him as
(02:11):
one of the fittest men on the planet, and Stanley
of Marvel Comics he called him a real superhuman I
would say superhero right. And acclaimed endurance athlete and New
York Times bestselling author, Dean Carnassis has pushed his body
in his mind too inconceivable limits. Among his many accomplishments,
he has run fifty marathons in fifty states in fifty days. Okay.
(02:34):
That's how some of you may have heard of him.
You may not have connected the name to the accomplishment.
Dean ran fifty marathons in fifty different states in fifty days.
Just the logistics of that alone are nightmarish. But he
did it, and he did it ridiculously well. Okay. He's
also run three hundred and fifty continuous miles for going
sleep for three nights. He's run across the Sahara Desert
(02:57):
in one hundred and twenty degree temperatures. He's running marathon
to the South Pole in negative forty degrees. This one
I love. There's a two hundred mile relay race that
teams of twelve do, so they trade off. One guy runs,
the next guy runs, the next person runs, the next
woman runs. Whatever your team is twelve people. Dean, he
does it by himself. And he's done it by himself
ten separate times. Okay. His long list of competitive achievements
(03:21):
include winning the world's toughest foot race, the bad Water
Ultra Marathon. That is where people, you run one hundred
and thirty five miles NonStop across Death Valley in the
middle of summer. You think that three mile run around
your neighborhood in July is bad try a hundred and
thirty five miles across Death Valley in the middle of summer.
He has raced and competed on all seven continents of
(03:43):
the planet twice over Okay. Dean is also an ESPN
sp winner, a three time recipient of Competitor Magazines in
Durance Athlete of the Year Award, and he serves as
a US Ambassador US Athlete Ambassador. He's twice carried the
Olympic torch in two thousand nineteen, and he received the
President's Counsel on Sports, Fitness and Nutritional Lifetime Achievement Awards.
(04:05):
Now Dean has been You've seen him most likely on
all the top shows from The Today's Show, Sixty Minutes
Late Show with Dave Lehman, back in the Day, Howard Stern,
all of them. He's in all the magazines, the newspapers.
They have chronicled his incredible achievements. Um, but this I love.
It's his unique ability to enthuse athletes of all abilities
(04:28):
and backgrounds that truly set Dean apart. Despite his many accomplishments, awards,
and distinctions, he remains most proud of his ongoing contributions
of time and funding two programs aimed at getting children
and youth outdoors and active. He has raised millions of
dollars for charity and was awarded the prestigious Community Leadership
Award by the President's Council on Physical Fitness and Sports. Okay,
(04:51):
it's just amazing. Goes on and on and on um
and Dean is believable because his achievements and accomplishments are real. Uh.
I say this, and I will probably bring it up
when I speak with him in just a moment. Um.
I've met a lot of ultra guys, and listen, there's
a reason people seek out those races and run hundred
miles or more and a lot of times, let's just
(05:14):
say they are more internal. Dean is a guy you
would want to sit down at a bar and have
a beer with. And he's just he's super approachable, he's
super likable. Uh. He's accomplished a ridiculous amount, yet he's
a nice guy. I think that's where I'm going. He's
a really, really nice guy who's done incredible things. And
if you need to be inspired, if you're at a
(05:36):
point in your life where you say you know I
just don't feel good mentally, I don't feel good physically.
I need to be inspired. This is the show for you,
and I'm gonna give you his books and and how
to connect to him at the end of the show.
And that's another way you gotta pick up and start with.
This first book actually just amazing. So wait to you
hear his story. So for those of you who know
(05:57):
who he is, get excited. Uh we're gonna catch up
with him. And for those of you who have no
idea who Dean car Nazis is, be prepared to be
blown away. We will be right back with Dean Carnassis,
(06:22):
and we are back. I say it almost every show,
but I truly have the greatest job in the world,
although Dean Carnassis does as well. We get to make
our passion our vocation and it's not easy, but it's
so super rewarding. And I not only get to help
people live a better live, but I get to talk
to people like Dean Carnassis. So Dean, thank you so
much for taking the time to uh to speak with
(06:45):
me today. It's good to be reconnecting. It's been a while,
and I got I got some funny stories for you.
You know, I wasn't going to give him away when
we spoke earlier. But yeah, it's been a while and
and thank you so much. So what are we up
to now? I got four books that you've written, and
to that kind of co written with chicken soup. Yeah,
oh you've done your homework, yes before I'm working working
(07:05):
on the fifth the first book, Um, ironic, well not ironic,
but I guess luckily the first book is being made
into a motion picture. Stop. So yeah, yeah, who's playing you?
Hopefully it's here. I can't I'm wonder non just cloth
like I did. I did have to kill me. Oh
come on, come on right here, do it now? It
(07:26):
it's someone you would recognize. Yeah, that is congratulations, That
is awesome. Not only do I do my homework, Dean,
I own all your books. You know, it's interesting. I
was talking with a fitness person recently who you know.
I was just surprised they don't buy the books, they
don't keep the books. I have all the books that
I talk about, I take notes in them. I want
to own them. You know. My office is filled and
I'm holding your your first one in my hand right now.
(07:48):
So yeah, oh yeah, you gotta read all this stuff
if you're in this industry, right, that's so exciting. Yeah,
So Ultra marathon Man, that that book you'll you know,
soon enough, it'll be up on the screen. So I
can't say streaming streaming in your in your kitchen near you. Yeah,
and we'll talk about that, you know, because your sport
(08:08):
and I've done a little bit, not even close to
what you've done. But it's all about obstacles, it's all
about moving forward. We'll talk about that. But for those
of you who don't know, it is one of the
greatest reads, and it's pretty much how Dean you know,
made his mark. To begin with, I would say, and
it's called Ultra marathon Man, Confessions of an All Night Runner.
You start to read it, you can't put it down.
You go, this guy is completely nuts, but in a
(08:29):
great way, and it's so inspiring. And that's what Fitness
Disrupted is about, is not only breaking through the myths
and giving you the science and the exercise science, but
it's bringing you people like Dean to show you that
whatever you think your limitations are, that you're so wrong,
right Dean, and I just want to start there because
I know your story. Many of my listeners know your story,
but some don't. So what was that turning point when
(08:50):
you said, you know, I'm changing my life. You said
it a million times bad literally bad to you. I
mean that was you. You know my story, But I
was you know, I used to love to run as
a kid, and then I stopped running. I thought running
was boring, it was a waste of time. So I
went to college, you know, I went to graduate school,
and I went to business school, and I had this
(09:11):
cush corporate job in San Francisco. But I hated my life.
I just I wasn't. I wasn't a business guy. Like
I just did not dig it, you know. I was
good at it, but I hated it. And on the
night of my thirtieth birthday, I was in a bar
with my buddies, you know, doing what you do on
your thirtieth birthday. And at midnight, I said I was leaving,
and then I call it, where are you going? I was,
have another ranut of key led your thirtieth birthday, And
(09:32):
I said, now, uh, instead of celebrating, you know, getting drunk,
I'm gonna celebrate by running thirty miles. And they looked
at me and they said, but you're not a runner,
you're drunk, and I said, I am, and I'm still
gonna do it. I literally I walked out of a bar.
I didn't even own running gear, but I think I
had these like, uh, these silk you know, jockeys underwear
(09:52):
on these briefs. So I peeled off my pants and
just started stumbling south. And seven hours, eight hours later
her I ended up in Halfing Bay, thirty miles away.
And that changed, of course, my life that night. And
if I remember correctly, I read it a while back,
but it wasn't the phone call to your wife and hey,
come get me. Yeah, she said, you know, she's she's
(10:15):
like my my wife's not a big party. And you know,
she's like, you've never not come home, Like you know,
she's my high school sweetheart, and she's like, the entire
time i've known you, you've never not come home. Is
everything okay? And I said, yeah, everything is just strange.
That really good. Um, but I need a ride and
she's like where, yeah, no questions asked. I said, I'm
on in front of the seven eleven, uh, you know,
down the way, and she's like, well, you mean on
(10:36):
Geary Street and I'm like a little further down the
way half bay. She's like, what at thirty miles away?
How did you get there? And I said I ran.
She's like, you ran from where? I said, I ran
from the bar, and she's like the whole time, you don't,
saund very stable. I'll be right there. Yeah, we married
the same woman. You know, my wife too. I put
her through a bunch of things like that. Nothing surprised her.
(10:57):
But I can always say, you know, Dean ran thirty
miles from home and then called you know, and that's
pre uber right, or both of our wives what you
say it would have been. It would have been a
lot easier these days, right, Yeah, so not to date ourselves.
This is pretty cell phone yeah, oh my gosh. Yeah.
And yeah, and that kind of started it for you, right,
You said that was the turning point. And you know,
most people don't have that huge epiphany or or they
(11:19):
don't realize they're having it, or they're too scared to
act upon it, right, But you weren't. You said, okay,
I'm making a change. You know, Tom. What it was,
I literally saw a picture of myself the fifty years
old as I was running down the Street. That night,
I thought, you know, you're either gonna end up you know,
fat involved and probably driving the expensive, you know, red
sports car on your on your third or fourth marriage,
(11:41):
you know, or you're gonna you're gonna do something different
with your life. And I thought, you know, even if
you end up fat involved and driving the expensive red
sports car on your third or fourth marriage, if you
try and fail, you'll just be happier than not trying
at all. And I thought it'd be better to fail
and not pull it off than not to try. And
I went for it. You know, I can so relate,
(12:03):
you know, similar but different. I was a trainer back
in the you know for decades, and I used to
train those guys. So when I was doing my research
and reading your story and remembering back to the book,
so I used to train those guys who didn't make
that decision, who were making you know, millions on Wall Street.
I trained billionaires the whole nine yards, and so many
of them were so unhappy dean, to the point that
(12:23):
one guy literally said to me, it's right at the
end of when I was finishing up my personal training career,
he stopped and he looked at me. He goes, you know, Tom,
I hate you. And he was kidding, but he was
and he said, what are you What are you talking about?
He goes, No, guys like me hate you. He said,
we have so much more money than you. I was like,
that's nice. And he said, but you're so happy. And
we see you running down the street at noon and
you know, wearing shorts and cut off you know, no
(12:44):
sleep and and but you're happy. And I go, yeah,
and Dean, my family are all financed. And at a
similar time in my life, I said, you know what,
you couldn't pay me twenty million dollars to put on
a suit and go work on Wall Street. And sure
these have been you know, you gotta hustle, right, and
we'll talk about your hustle. But it's so worth it,
it's so worth it. Yeah, I can't. I couldn't agree more.
(13:05):
And um, yeah, I'm working a lot harder than I
would be working if I was a business guy. But
you know, to your point, it doesn't seem like work, right,
you know, I'm I'm happy. What's the great line, d
And it's it's we work eighty hours a week so
we don't have to work forty, right, but that's the
fun is we love what we're doing. I mean again,
the opportunity to speak to you again today, to have
(13:25):
this forum, to put your story out there. It's gonna
inspire people. And you know, if it inspires them just
to get started with an exercise plan and we'll talk
about kids, because I know you're into that and I'm
super into that with fitness. But you know, even though
you look back and you say, oh my gosh, it
was so worth it. Yeah, And I mean your audience
is probably a lot of fit people that are listening
to this, But you know, if you do want that
(13:47):
sparking inspiration, maybe try my first book. And the reason
I'm kind of shamelessly plugging it is that, you know,
so many people said I read a lot of training books,
and you know, I knew what I had to do,
but nothing like lit that in Eternal flame within me
to go out there and do it. And for some reason,
my my booket It's approachable, like it's just I'm just
an average guy, Like I'm not a super super fit guy.
(14:08):
I'm just an average guy and I went and did
these things, and I think it gives other people permission
to try, like they read about the stories of this
average guy and they're like, I'm kind of average too.
I'm gonna I'm gonna try this, and they and they
do it, you know, and that's that's a great I mean,
that's a good I think everyone wins in that scenario. Yeah,
and it's you know, I laugh about you know, they'll
(14:29):
say you're not a normal person. Yes you are. You're
you're a normal person who has done extraordinary things. But
everyone is capable of that, right, So to suddenly put
you in this category and go, of course you've done
and we'll talk about it, and I gave you know,
your resume at the beginning. It's insane, but there you
didn't come out of the womb running ultramare funds. Right.
What was the point, actually, I've never asked you this.
(14:50):
What was the point where you said, you know, I'm
good at this. There's had to be a moment, like
a race or a moment where you go, you know,
at first it's two finish, right, and then it suddenly go,
maybe I'm actually can be competitive. That's a funny question.
I've never got that question before. And all you know,
and as many interviews as I've done, and um, I know.
(15:11):
I I guess I don't think I'm good at it.
Maybe that's you know, can you ever be good at
running a marathonomy? You can always be better? I guess.
So even though I've ended up on the podium, you know,
and have one races, I guess I'm always thinking, jeez,
I've never really had a you know, when you're running
for a hundred miles, you know over twenty four hours
(15:31):
you can always get better, right, I mean, it's it's
not like a hundred yard hundred meter sprint, where you
know you're shaping microseconds. You always can reflect back and
say I think I can do better, and maybe that
maybe I'm just chasing a windmill. You know. It's just
like I don't think I'm that good at it. I
think I've got a lot of room to improve and
and maybe that's what's keeping me going. It's just that
kind of child's that child's mind about it, that you know,
(15:52):
I want to learn, I still want to grow, and
I still want to get better. And you know what
I think it separates you too, is that many of
the durance friends of mine, people I've met spoken with, interviewed,
you don't listen let's be honest. A lot of them
have a rage right there is there's an anger that
fuels it, and a lot of that gets you through,
as you and I know, and I was there as
(16:13):
a you know, when I was younger, not to the
degree I would say many of you know my friends were,
but you know that that gets you through. I don't
get that from you, you know, and maybe you're just
hiding it really well, but you seem really happy. A
lot of these guys are not people you necessarily want to,
you know, have a beer with. And I've always said
that about you. The first time we spoke, I said,
you know, Dean is a different guy from many of
the ultra guys I've met. You actually would sit and
(16:34):
want to have a beer with him, not you know,
to put down other you know, ultra people, but a
different breed and maybe fueled by a different fuel. Um,
do you find that with you or you just hiding
some anger that I don't hear it? And and you
were so humble. It's it's rare, you know, maybe it's
it's self directed thoughts and that I um, I just
(16:56):
thought coming from a place of love is going to
get you further than coming from a place of anger
and competition and hostility. Um. You know, let's face it,
comparing yourself to others is a recipe for unhappiness. So
I figured that out, and I've just said, you know, um,
if someone that you compete with gets you recognized and
(17:17):
they get recognition, celebrate that, be happy for them, you know,
don't be jealous. And that really requires it requires some
disciplined thinking, but it gets you further. Um, you know, forget,
like learn to forgive. That's a really hard quality to
actually do. But if you can actually forgive people, and
if you can learn just to compete with yourself, that ultimately,
(17:37):
you know, the only one you have to answer to
is the person you see in the mirror every morning.
That is that is it? So if you can look
at yourself in the mirror and say I'm happy with
who I am, then what more is there? Right? Right?
And I love that because it's not a zero sum game,
as you're saying, right, and so many people approach it
that way. If this guy is successful, then he's taking
away from me. And listen, I remember when you first
(17:59):
started really hitting at hearing, you know, and I'm sure
you did. I'm sure you've got the emails, and you
know people were jealous because holy account, you're not supposed
to make money, you know, and not supposed to have
the notoriety and fame that you achieved and and continue
to enjoy. But as you said, it's it's it's not
about them, and that that takes a lot of miles though, Dean,
I think that takes a lot of suffering. Let's talk
(18:19):
about suffering, because you've talked about you know, human nature
is such that we were supposed to avoid pain and
seek pleasure. And your sport is one in mind that
I enjoy as well. We do the opposite. There's such uh,
such power and such peace in the suffering. Yeah, I
mean my quote is there there's magic and misery. Yeah, yeah,
(18:41):
And I think, yeah, anyone who's been there to relate
to it. I mean, I think we're never more alive
than we were at those apex moments where we're questioning
can we keep going? And you know, I see that
people run a marathon in some people who are not
runners look at me there like you're crazy. Like the
other guy run. You know that my office made or
some guy's uncle, you know, ran the Boston marathon, and
(19:03):
I said to them, no, you run a marathon. It
will change you. You'll get to that moment, you know,
that come to Jesus moment where it will change you
and you'll reflect, you'll learn a lot about yourself, and
you'll feel more alive than ever And as much pain
as you're gonna be in, you'll never feel more alive.
And it's a strange dichotomy, isn't it. Yeah, And I'm
(19:24):
still trying to figure it out. You know. I think
that's why we keep racing. Right we go? What is it?
And why is it so cathartic? And one of my
you know pseudo psycholitical, you know, psychological rather um analysis
of it is there's something when we choose it, right Dean,
It's like we chose this. You get out there, you go.
You know, so often in life everything is out of
our control. So you have the boss you hate, or
(19:47):
you know, the relationship you don't want to be and
whatever it may be. And you know this is suffering
that I don't have as much control over as I want.
When you go out there and you go, I'm gonna
do this endurance race, there's something really powerful about saying
this was my choice, right, And I'm not sure why
it's so nice, but it is. Yeah, I guess that's
a toured swords. I'm not you're thinking, you know, Jesus,
(20:07):
I paid for this, actually voluntarily signed up and paid
for this. Yeah, and so much misery. Yeah, but now
you're absolutely right. And you know, I think you know
the high achievement in um endurance sports is it's like
it becomes paramounting people's lives. I mean, I know people
that are to your point, are so successful and like
(20:29):
CEO is a big companies. You walked in their office
and what's most prominently displayed is their Iron Man medal, Right,
Like that makes them most proud, is you know, doing
this incredibly difficult endurance event, right, because you know, having
trained many of those guys, you know they all have
the cars, they all get the houses, they all achieved
that level of of monetary success for the most part,
(20:50):
Then it becomes what have you done? And I used
to That's how I you know, finished my career as
a coach and trainer was helping those people who thought
they could and and you know did achieve the those
you know experiences. Because that's I'm sure what you're about.
That's what I'm about. We both travel the world. I
am so fortunate, feels so fortunate to have had those experiences.
And that's what I'm doing with my kids. And you
(21:10):
take your whole family right there there, your crew, and
what's better than that, right, It's about experiences, not material things.
At the end of the day. I can't agree more.
I mean, my kids have been to you know, South America, Australia,
Canada many times, Europe many times. We've had some wonderful
experiences and hopefully you know, as we're talking right now,
(21:32):
I'm thinking, when is the next time, you know, we
can get over and I love so much. Yeah, that's
that's one thing that is really um. You know, the
door has been shut solid with me and I'm sure
you as well as you You're not flying around the
globe anymore these days. No, And I don't want to
forget what you just said. I interviewed Bass Routing. I
don't I'm sure if you know who, he is, a
(21:52):
former m M, A guy amazing right, and gosh, he's
such a great guy. And we were talking about he
was saying how he had some of his fighters and
he said, you know, if I took you in a
room and you fought someone and you lost, wouldn't matter
if no one knew. And so what he was getting
to was that back what you were talking about earlier,
that it should only matter to you. And I remember
(22:12):
when I first started racing and and started doing pretty
well and then the internet hitting. So my first iron
Man actually a similar that's similar, but it was at
age thirty on my birthday, said there's an iron Man
in New Zealand. I didn't own a bike, I couldn't
swim a app but I said I'm gonna do that
and it was amazing, changed my life. But there was
really no internet, so I didn't have to worry about
people checking my times. Right, So when you first started,
(22:34):
you must have had pressure as you were these books
were coming out and you were doing better. Was there
a shift from where he said, you know what, I
got to kind of do well to where you said,
you know, I really don't care. There absolutely was, and
it was a point where, um, you know, people said, oh,
he's not that good, and that when races, well, you know,
got lucky. And then there's a race called the bad
Water Ultra Marathon, which is called the world's toughest foot
(22:55):
race and I won the world you know, I won
the bad Water and I'm like, okay, what else do
I have to prove? I just want the world stubs
for race, you know. And then people say, oh, he's
done nothing, he's never won a race, and like, pull
it two weeks ago, one bad Water and you're on
the internet. I have never won a race. Like, you
don't even know who I am. You're criticizing me and
you don't you know nothing about me. And at that point,
(23:17):
I'm like, you know what, you can spend a lot
of time reading negative comments about yourself and it's gonna
get you nowhere. So again, it just got back to
the you know, to the to the the analogies. Can
you look yourself in the mirror and take you know,
I'm happy and I'm proud of who I am. And
was that freeing for you? I remember, you know, I
always put it as you know, you're doing the Iron
(23:37):
Man for me and I'm on the you know, I'm
not hitting my times and I'm on the marathon and
I'm literally writing that email. I'm writing I was never
a fan of the race reports personally, but you know,
the email to friends, you know what went wrong right
and during the race, and then you know, you get
to that cathartic moment whereas you said, I don't care
this is about it's ruining my experience. You I'm halfway
around the world, I'm doing this incredible event. Who cares
(23:59):
what my time is? Um was that cathartic for you
after you won that race and you said, you know what,
now it's truly I'm just going to enjoy it in
a way that I happened before. It was absolutely and
you're absolutely, You're so right. I mean, you know, I
remember writing about the disappointing hundred mile race. You know,
I was I was hoping to crack twenty hours and
I was like twenty one hours, and I'm thinking, how,
(24:19):
you know, I apologize to people and how I just
walked up and I wasn't good at and like, oh,
you just ran a hundred mile. Anyone from the sane
you know perspective reading that would be, how can how
can you be upset that you just ran a hundred
miles at twenty one hours? Like you ran through the
mountains a hundred miles without stopping, and you're you're writing
a you know, an obituary to your friends, like why
(24:41):
you just died out there? And the five percent in
who understand what twenty one versus twenty hours means. They're
the ones who were anyway, They're the ones that we're
gonna put you down regardless, right, so you can't win.
Oh my gosh, I love it. So question for you
you're obviously we're both I did not just you. You know,
we're getting older. What do you do to stay healthy?
What's the cross training routine? I'm sure people want to know. Well,
(25:03):
it's it's NonStop. It's you know, training is life and
life is training. I mean from the moment I get up,
I'm constantly doing something that's involving physical activity. I mean
even right now I'm standing up. I hope you're standing
up to standing desk exactly, walking back in that. Yeah,
we're working back and forth. And before we got on,
(25:23):
I've got this hit training routine that's about twelve minutes.
It's just body weight. So it's push ups, pull ups,
sit ups, chair dips, and burpies. So I cycled through
those throughout the course of the day. I'll probably do
four or five sets of those every day and it's
just it's quick and it just you know, get your
metabolism wrapped up. And then I'm obviously I'm still running
(25:44):
as much as ever, more than ever now actually because
I can't travel, so you know, I'm everything I'm doing
is about fitness, and I'm also doing a lot of
cross training. Um with the Ellipticgo. There's a there's a
stand up bike that I just love and it's it's
basically like an elliptical machine in the gym, but it
sound wheels so I could be outside. Yeah, I love
(26:05):
it too, I have I have to. It's super it's
super geeky. You know, it looks like a big brain man.
That's my kids always say. But I love the thing.
I mean, it's such a great workout. And you know,
you don't get saddle I used to cycle, and you
know you don't get saddle sores. You're not hunched over
in that Viking position. There's a lot to be said
about the Elliptic and I just love the thing. And
they came out with a mountain bike version the trail.
(26:28):
Yeah that's cool. Yeah with shocks and yeah, yeah, funny
story with that. So years ago, became friends with a
couple of the owners and they said, hey, you want
to try out this new thing. I said, of course,
and so they gave it to me and I never
I didn't get on it. And then they said, hey, Tom,
we're gonna do the Manhattan to Montalk right a hundred
fifty miles, and they said, you want to do with us,
and I said sure. And it was like two weeks away.
(26:49):
I said, I better get on this thing because I
gotta do a d and I had done it on
a bike, you know, it was farther than an iron
but I've done it once or twice on a bike
before and it was challenging. But it's flat. It's it's
not it's just a long day. But I thought this
is different, Like, I have no idea what I'm getting
into this thing. So I took it out for like
an hour, uh to your point, so one hour one time.
Then I got on it Manhattan and Montalk. I think
(27:10):
it took like ten eleven hours. I got up the
next day. I felt I didn't feel like I had
done anything, and that's insane. Even with the bike and
it was flat. It truly is such a low impact
to no impact form of exercise. And it was invented
for that reason, right by guys who couldn't run the
way they wanted to and what were they gonna do, right,
and this was the solution. Yeah. Well and but but
(27:32):
this is damn good. Well it's a good workout as well.
I mean, um yeah, that's what I love about it's
it's an efficient workout and you know, you get your
heart rate up. It's not as easy as cycling because
you're not as aerodynamics. You're standing up right right, so
you know, in fear of my there's like fear junk
miles and you're always kind of working on the lift
to go. But to your point, when you wake up
the next morning, you know your your joints don't hurt.
(27:54):
Oh yeah, and it's a show. Yeah, don't don't misunderstand
those of you listening that it's it's not a great
workout because you're standing the whole time. So I keep
finding myself trying to sit down and you're like, well
you don't have that option. So like the core workout
and then going up hills if you are on a
hilly course, that is you know, challenging especially I have
the original one Dean as along with you know, a
(28:15):
later model but not the most recent. So I always
pull out, always say to people like, you know, get
a bike that's that's metal and weighs fifty pounds, so
you gotta workout, right, exactly. I use the other one
in the race. Yeah, I have one of those models
as well. And you're right. I mean they've evolved a lot.
That thing is it's a it's a it's a beast, yeah,
(28:36):
and it is definitely a workout. Just to get that
thing out of the garage is to workout exactly, And
I love it. You just you just have to love attention,
right because cars slowed down, you go to Starbucks, you
get tend people around you. Uh. It's super fun. Though
it's so polarizing, Like I mean, half the people like
what the hell is that? The other half like that
is the coolest thing I've ever seen. Right, And if
(28:57):
everyone's got an opinion about it, like no one just
in heads turn like crazy and at first, yeah, because
they kind of look at you like, oh, it's a no,
something's different about that guy standing up. One thing I
have to ask you too, and it's it's one of
these tough questions, but you know, you have run three
and fifty miles. You've done all these things. So when
you read books like you know Timothy Noakes, Lore of Running,
(29:18):
his Central Governor theory, and then you've got I love
Alex Hutchinson and the book endure Um. You know, and
the question is, and who better to answer it than you?
What do you truly believe? Is it? Is it the body?
Is that the brain? Is that a combination of two
that slows us down? What has been your experience? I'm
bind all of the above. I mean, I really believe
(29:39):
the central governor theory um. But that said, I've had
my body in places where I don't care how strong
my mind was. I'm not I'm not moving right, you know.
I've passed out running like I just could not get
any more output, no matter how much you know Jedi
mind games. I played right, So I think it? And
(30:00):
when does it all to come together magically? I'll tell
you what. I cannot figure out the formula. You know.
I've I've rested and recovered for long periods before racing,
had good races and had bad races. You know, I've
raced back to back and had good races and had
bad races. I don't know what it is that ultimate
that comes together to create a really great race. But
(30:22):
you know, I think they they're you know, they're absolutely
nailing the factors that are played. How to get the
you know, the stars aligned is a different question. Yeah,
And that's that's there's the art, right Dean, there's the
If it were that simple, everyone would follow that formula.
And and that's why it's always driven me nuts. And
that's exactly what the show is about, right is we
can look at the science, we can look at the data,
(30:44):
we can look at the anecdotal, but at the end
of the day, we're all in equals one. And the
story I tell quickly is I did an iron Man
in Where was it, Uh, it doesn't matter, Kentucky. I think.
Two weeks later there was a local marathon, small and
I said, you know what, let me ride this. Fitness
people said you're crazy, and I said, you know, I
was younger or whatever, and I ran the fastest marathon ever,
(31:04):
actually one. It was a tiny marathon, ran a twofour
for me, you know, I'm bigger, and it was ridiculous.
But I got up that morning I didn't want to
run at all. I didn't feel great. The gun went
off and things happened. And that's what we have to
kind of get across to people, is, no matter how
you feel, you know, my best races, and I'm sure
many of yours were as well, were the ones I
felt the worst at the start, that gun goes off
(31:25):
and something happens. Yeah, And I mean I've had races
to where you know, I'll never forget the Angels Crest hundred, um,
you know, twenty five miles into it, I cramed. I
mean I was I could not move. My legs were
just locked in cramps, and I thought, you're done. Is
this is an instant DNF. I didn't do anything. I
didn't have salt, I didn't do anything. I just stood
(31:45):
up and kind of started walking and I finished third
place overall. I mean I was like, what what has
happened there? I have no idea? So I talked about
that mindset though, Deine. So when you got up, what
was the what was the mindset? It was just get
to the tree. There's there's a tree ten feet up
the way. Just walked to the tree. I was like Frankenstein.
Both my legs were a lot rigid, and I got
(32:08):
to the tree. I'm like, I get to the rock,
all right, get to the bend in the in the trail,
and and you know et crow. I mean I sat
there and had people passing me. I was I was
obviously it was probably twenty five minute miles. I was
doing walking, and it just loosened up and I started
running slowly and and then I started feeling good. I
(32:29):
have no idea and so what happened? Yeah, I you know.
And that's what I want people to understand. Now. I
know so many people listen to this conversation Dean, and
they said, well, we're not gonna run a hundred miles,
We're gonna gonna do anything close to that. And that's
not the point. The point is, no matter where you
are and how you feel in the moment, this is
the greatest gift that I was given Dan from these races.
And I'm sure you experienced it as well as no
(32:50):
matter how bad you feel at the moment, as you
just described, Ken and will get better and all the
cliches hold true, right, just people don't believe them. I
would say, all the the answers to life the or
on Instagram, right, it's just people don't apply it's all
there also sayings that people, you know, it's just they
don't truly believe it because they haven't suffered, they haven't
seen and built that self efficacy, right, And I think
(33:13):
so much of it as failure, the fear of failure.
And when we have that mindset that you and I
just talked about, where it doesn't matter who cares what
anyone else thinks, then you're open to do whatever you want. Yeah,
I agree, And I mean I just tell people experiment.
I mean, just you know, have fun with it. If
you can't, you know, sign up for a fifty mile
race and just lay yourself out and enjoy the experience. Right,
(33:35):
And you know, what have you gotten to this point to?
Now this is gonna sound weird. And I've done enough
races in my you know, uh kind of wheelhouse that
I got to the point where I don't want to
get hurt. So I never trained as much as everyone else,
and you know, didn't go as far even close to
as far as frequent as you did. But with iron Man,
I go, okay, kind of achieved as you said, did
the Hawaiian iron Man a couple of times, wanted to
(33:56):
break ten hours, did that, so I trained less and
less and less, and I think part of it was, hey,
it's a great excuse, right, I'm gonna be honest. I'm
not gonna go fast because I didn't put in the work.
But then I also feel like I wanted to make
it harder because I knew I could do a team
and your bare Mountain fifty K I signed up for
that wasn't running it at all. Really a little bit,
but not the miles I should have. The night before
(34:17):
that race, I went on the website and this was
what last May I think, and it said it was full.
I said, I don't take that. I don't believe it.
So I went on and said, let me see if
it'll still take my application. Sure enough, the night before
it took it, and I showed up and I suffered
my butt off, but it was amazing, and it's just
just getting out there and doing it, enjoying it. I thought,
(34:38):
you know, as it took me forever, you ran that
one as well, right, did you set us off and
then go? You know, I mean that that whole event
was my my baby. Yeah, you know, you're you're a sick,
sick person. That was one of the world I haven't
done a lot of that stuff. That was just straight
up and down. That was horrific, But I loved it. No,
I I'm I'm shaking my head and agree. I'm not
(34:59):
an email with you. That is a tough race. And
it's you're talking about and you don't want to get injured.
I'm like, that is just not the race you want
to do. If you're trying to get injured. You put
us down like the roots the rocks. Yeah, and you
know what's so humbling though. What I loved it is
I'm getting past by what fifty miles at mile twenty
(35:19):
four or whatever, and it's just you know, you go,
this is how fortunate I am. And that's where we'll
kind of pull this all together, dan Is. I always
feel when I'm feeling bad, I remember being an iron
Man's and seeing someone in a wheelchair on the sidelines
or whatever, and you go, no matter how bad you
feel at that moment, how fortunate we are to be
doing it right and especially making our careers from doing it.
You can't, we can't complain. No, it's it's we're privileged
(35:42):
in that regard, although we've worked to get what we have.
But I wouldn't trade it for the world. I mean,
it's the best feeling in the world to be out
there suffering with someone else. I mean, shared suffering brings
people together. And I think you just you hit it,
you know, on the head when you said, you know
you see someone in a wheelchair. You know they're just
saying that. You know. I used to feel sorry. I
(36:02):
had no shoes until I met a man they had
no feet, right, So it's just those kind of poignant moments. Uh,
they're beautiful, right, right, We're all suffering, and we're all
in that same race. And and that's why I would
say when I used to coach charity before the race,
you know, it's not a matter of if something's gonna
go wrong, but what and how you deal with that? Right?
I love the line by Mike Tyson. Everyone has a plan,
right until you get punched in the face. That's that's
(36:26):
one of my last PEP talks. I think to the
charity I coach, and they were probably happy before iron
Man like Classid, I said, who's the first, you know,
who's first time? It's about fifty of them, I said,
who has a plan? All of them? I said, well,
that's real good. You know, what does Mike Tyson say,
I said that all gonna get punched in the face,
so it will be harder than others. So we're gonna
get punched three times, but you just get up and again,
these are the cliches things we read about, but you're
(36:48):
a living proof of that. So you know, you you
talked about in one of the interviews recently, you know,
your chicken soup for the soul and a story about
you know, just how powerful exercises for the mind for depression.
We always think of it, or most people think of
it from the neck down. And you were talking about
a soldier and PTSD, And I think in the times
we are in now, we control what we can and
(37:09):
part of the insanity and the control we can have
is through exercise, right, and just explain to people how
powerful that is and how they can do it whenever
they want to feel better. Yeah, I mean, anyone who's running.
I mean, you know, you come home with the way
of the world on your shoulders, with so many problems,
and you go out the door and you run for
an hour and you come back and all of a sudden,
(37:29):
they're not they're they're they're put in perspective, and they're
certainly not nearly as captive over you as they were
when you left. So exercise has the power to rejuvenate.
It brings, you know, a renewal. It's a renewal of
your soul and your spirit. And I think more people
are experiencing that because of the lockdown right now. Ironically,
you know, the race the whole racing scene is non
(37:51):
existent right now, but more people are running than ever,
and I think people are discovering that that magic in running.
And I hope this trend continues because I think again,
it's good for everyone. It's good for the air we breathe, um,
it's good for humanity. And people are discovering what we've
known for years, and I think that's a beautiful thing,
and I hope it's a trend that continues for many
(38:13):
years to come. I agree. I agree percent. I just
looked in as I'm going out for my bike rides
or runs, and it looks like a really badly designed triathlon.
There are people on the wrong side of the road.
I don't know what it is where you are, and
I love it, but there are so many people you know, walking, biking, strollers, Uh,
and at the end of the day though, it just
makes me happy, as you said, because we want people
to find what we have and the enjoyment and how
(38:36):
it's free. It's free. You just got to get out
there and do it. What is next, you said, the
movie that's so exciting. I can't wait to see that.
And you sure you can't tell us who the actor
is right now, I'll tell you this when they came
to me, When the producer came to he said, we
want to buy rights to your book. Uh I, I said,
the one thing I need written in this contract is
(38:56):
anyone attached to it has to has to have run
a marathon like I don't. You're not gonna be able
to Like it would be so easy for Hollywood to
do it. You know, a cheesy running movie, right. I'm
a surfer as well. I mean, you look at surfing
movies at Hollywood down you're like, um, you roll your eyes.
And I just said, only only when someone who's actually
run the legitimate marathon is going to be able to capture, um,
(39:19):
what we do and and convey it properly. So everyone
that's involved is full on runners and and they're big
time personalities as well. So it's gonna delight anyone in
the injurerention. So this helps me where to look down. Now,
I just got to figure out the actor that looks
like you that's run a marathon, fits the age that's on. Well, congratulations,
(39:40):
I have you know, read everything you've done and you know,
looked up to you, and uh just feel so fortunate
to be able to have this conversation with you and
bring you know more people your story. Is there another
book in the works or anything like that, or what's
a race? I think you've done it all. Yeah, No,
I mean I have another book that should be out.
That's what you're saying, was us Yeah, trust later this summer,
(40:02):
but I think it's gonna be um now, spring of
next year, just because all the book stort are closed.
So another book, and it's it's kind of it's a memoir,
I mean a memoir, So it's kind of a it's
about you know, my first book was a coming of
age book is kind of learning this whole secret world
of ulture endurance and this one most recent books. You know,
how do you stay the course? How do you stay
(40:23):
true to you know, what you love? As you get
older and you start you know, talk facing some of
the things you talked about. You know, you have to
work harder to keep your same you know, level of fitness,
and you know, things start happening in your body that
never used to happen when you're younger. You know, how
do you how do you? You know? How do you?
How do you persevere in the sport that's all about perseverance, right,
(40:45):
and you're living proof of it and that's you know,
it should be so inspiring to so many people. And
you know, I'm sure when you get older, Dean, you're
gonna have bad knees? Right where contail party thing? At
what age will you you get credit for it? Right?
Is it sixty seventy eight? Where they go? Maybe it
was right? Maybe maybe it's not bad for your knees,
(41:06):
you know. I mean, I'll end with just a crazy story.
But my my mom is from this island called Ikadia,
which is in Greece. And I don't know if you've
heard of the Blue Zones, So yeah, so this island
and Greece is one of the Blue Zones. So we're
at this island last summer and these people there, this
has the highest concentrations of centenarians on a new place
(41:28):
on Earth, so more people people that lived to be
a hundred. And we're at this village up in the
hills and these people they look like mountain goats. But
this woman comes walking back into the village and she's
so upset. She's a hundred and four and she's an entrepreneur.
She just started this new business and but she's really upset.
And when we were saying, you know what, why are
you so upset, she said, well, I walked three miles
(41:48):
to the bank, and then I walked three miles back,
and I'm like, well, that seems like a pretty good
hike to me. Why are you so upset? She said, Well,
I wanted to borrow some money for my business, and
the bank has a policy they don't lend money to
anyone over a hundred and three. Stop. I couldn't get
(42:08):
my loan, damn it. Oh my gosh. I love that story,
and I didn't make the connection. I love the Blue Zones.
And again, for people who don't know that's it's one
of the greatest books and series of books to read.
And you know, they drink wine. And what I love
in that book to Dean is how often they go
to find the person that they're looking for and they'll say, oh,
you know, I came to this farm and I found
someone who looked to be about seventy seventy five years old,
(42:30):
and they turned out to be a hundred four, right,
but they just, oh my god, I love that. I
love that. All right, you have to your question. I mean,
it's a their cuteness answer to your question, when do
I be able to play the age card? I still
got thirty or forty more years on that one. Now
that I know you have those genetics, I mean I
knew you had the Greek genetics, but I didn't know
(42:50):
you had that specific the island. You literally lived to
be a hundred and ten. That's awesome and I encourage everyone. Actually,
I'm glad you brought it up. Read that book the
Blue Zones. It's another thing too, you know, you read
Dean's book Ultra marathon Man and all the other ones,
and you start to make the connections. You go, Okay,
this inspires me. And these people the way they live
that's the greatest research, right is the six different five
(43:11):
or six different places in the world where they live
so long and there are things that they share in common. Right,
that's awesome, Dean. I couldn't be more just fortunate to
speak with you again. Thank you so much for taking
the time. And when are we gonna do another horrible
bare Mountain fifty or something like that in the future, right, Oh,
my gosh, we'll see I mean hopefully running. You know,
(43:31):
events will come back online next year. Yeah, we got
many many torture tortures adventures still for you to go.
Tom awesome. I'll prom with you down there now that
I know you designed it, I'm gonna I'm gonna seek
out your events because they are truly cathartic. I'll leave
it at that, Dean. Thank you so much. Uh, good
luck with the movie and the book, and ak forward
to hopefully having you back when you come out with
(43:53):
both of those, and we'll talk again on all right,
thank you so much. We will be right back. I
started the show by saying I have the greatest job
in the world, and I will finish the show by
(44:15):
saying I have the greatest job in the world. And
yes I am standing, and yes I am actually sweating.
I love that that he brought that up, that he's
walking around. I'm walking around if you want to learn
what NEAT is non exercise activity thermogenesis. Listen to my
podcast on that. By the way, it goes to what
we're talking about, standing working movement into your entire day.
(44:37):
But how great was that interview? How great is Dean Carnassis.
He is so unbelievable, so humble, has put his body
and mind through the unspeakable, through the unspeakable, And I
get so motivated and inspired by by connecting with people
(44:58):
like him, And that's why I feel so fortunate to
have this job. That as he said, we we both
worked really hard to get here, don't you know, misunderstand
it takes a lot to give up what he gave
up and and to start at the bottom and to
literally put his body through torture to do what he loves.
But neither him nor I would change a moment of it.
(45:21):
And I love bringing guys like him and women like
him to you, people who just say, you can do
whatever you want to do. You can make your passion
your vocation. You can make an incredible living off running,
but you gotta work hard, you gotta believe in yourself,
and you have to be passionate about it. Let me
(45:44):
go through his books because if you are inspired, if
you need to be inspired, these are for you. And
we're just gonna start at the beginning. So we talked
about Ultra marathon Man Confessions of an All Night Runner.
He will get you in the first couple of pages
Ultra marathon Man, Confessions of an All Night Runner. Then
(46:05):
he has a book called Run twenty six point two
Stories of Blisters and Bliss with a great title. Then
that fifty marathons in fifty States and fifty days. That
book is called fifty by fifty Secrets I learned running
fifty marathons in fifty days and how you two can
achieve super endurance. And then in really interesting one, the
(46:25):
last one I read too, and I believe it's the
last one he wrote personally, The Road to Sparta, reliving
the ancient battle and epic run that inspired the world's
greatest foot race. And again then he's contributed to different
two different chicken soups for the Soul books. And we
just learned this movie coming out about Ultra marathon Man.
Couldn't be more excited for that and for him, and
(46:49):
I just really encourage you to take to heart what
you can do and to listen to his story, to
read his books, and by the way, goa to his
website is Ultra marathon Man dot com. Books are there,
his events are there, and a lot more media for
him as well. But this show is not just about
(47:10):
busting the myths and giving you the exercise science. We
need that. But if you don't have hope, if you
don't believe in yourself the motto of my life the
three words I live by, then all else is lost.
And he is not special. He has done special things
(47:32):
and you can too. We are all ordinary people with
the ability to do extraordinary things. That comes down to mindset,
and that comes down to being open to not being perfect,
to having those moments when you don't think you can
get through it because you can, because you can, no
(47:58):
matter how bad you feel. I love the story he told,
and I've had so many experiences like that throughout my
racing career, when the body gives up and you say
and you mentally you give up, or you can give up.
And what you learn when you do it enough is
that the body comes back. You just have to be
in the moment and you keep moving forward because every
(48:19):
step forward is a step towards the finished line. So
thank you for listening. Thank you too, Dean for taking
the time. I'm inspired, I'm getting ready to go for
a run right now myself. And again I say it
at the end of every show for a reason. We
(48:39):
control three things. How much we move. And the more
you move, the better you're gonna feel what we put
into our mouths. The more you eat healthy foods, the
better you're gonna feel physically and mentally, and finally, our attitudes.
And it's all connected. The more you move, the better
you eat, the better you're going to feel mentally. It's
(49:01):
all connected, and we control all three things. Thank you
for listening. I am Tom Holland. This is Fitness Disrupted.
Believe in Yourself. Fitness Disrupted is a production of I
(49:22):
Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit
the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to your favorite shows. H
Welcome to Fitness Disrupted, a production of I Heart Radio.
I am Tom Holland, and this is Fitness Disrupted. I
say it frequently because I wholeheartedly believe it to my core.
(00:20):
I have the greatest job in the world. I get
to help people look better, feel better, and live longer.
And one of the ways in which I do that
is I get to talk to people like my next guest,
Dean car Nazis. Almost almost wanted to drop an F
bomb there, Dean car Nazis. He's amazing. Some of you
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know exactly who he is, some of you do not.
I will give you his bio shortly. It is insane.
It is amazing, and he started, you know, as a
real person like all of us. He's just an ordinary
person who has done extraordinary things. And that's gonna sound
(01:04):
insane when I read you his list of accomplishments. But
he is one of the nicest, most humble and and
amazing people when it comes to athletic achievements that I
have had the good fortune to speak with. And I
did interview him many years ago. I had a radio show,
our long Live show, and back when he was I
(01:25):
think his first book. He's got four of his own
and two chicken Soup of the Soul. He's UH contributed
to those as well. But I spoke with him and
I have followed him over the years. As I've talked
about before, I study and get inspired by the people
who have accomplished amazing things, and I tend to follow
what they did and to you know, learn from their
(01:48):
uh mistakes, failures if you want to call them that,
which we don't call failures though. It's all learning experience.
But Dean car Nazis, let me just I'm gonna give
you the full buy because I can't leave things out,
all right, So here we go. Dean car Nassis. Time
magazine named him one of the top one hundred most
influential people in the world. Men's Fitness hailed him as
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one of the fittest men on the planet, and Stanley
of Marvel Comics he called him a real superhuman I
would say superhero right. And acclaimed endurance athlete and New
York Times bestselling author, Dean Carnassis has pushed his body
in his mind too inconceivable limits. Among his many accomplishments,
he has run fifty marathons in fifty states in fifty days. Okay.
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That's how some of you may have heard of him.
You may not have connected the name to the accomplishment.
Dean ran fifty marathons in fifty different states in fifty days.
Just the logistics of that alone are nightmarish. But he
did it, and he did it ridiculously well. Okay. He's
also run three hundred and fifty continuous miles for going
sleep for three nights. He's run across the Sahara Desert
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in one hundred and twenty degree temperatures. He's running marathon
to the South Pole in negative forty degrees. This one
I love. There's a two hundred mile relay race that
teams of twelve do, so they trade off. One guy runs,
the next guy runs, the next person runs, the next
woman runs. Whatever your team is twelve people. Dean, he
does it by himself. And he's done it by himself
ten separate times. Okay. His long list of competitive achievements
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include winning the world's toughest foot race, the bad Water
Ultra Marathon. That is where people, you run one hundred
and thirty five miles NonStop across Death Valley in the
middle of summer. You think that three mile run around
your neighborhood in July is bad try a hundred and
thirty five miles across Death Valley in the middle of summer.
He has raced and competed on all seven continents of
(03:43):
the planet twice over Okay. Dean is also an ESPN
sp winner, a three time recipient of Competitor Magazines in
Durance Athlete of the Year Award, and he serves as
a US Ambassador US Athlete Ambassador. He's twice carried the
Olympic torch in two thousand nineteen, and he received the
President's Counsel on Sports, Fitness and Nutritional Lifetime Achievement Awards.
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Now Dean has been You've seen him most likely on
all the top shows from The Today's Show, Sixty Minutes
Late Show with Dave Lehman, back in the Day, Howard Stern,
all of them. He's in all the magazines, the newspapers.
They have chronicled his incredible achievements. Um, but this I love.
It's his unique ability to enthuse athletes of all abilities
(04:28):
and backgrounds that truly set Dean apart. Despite his many accomplishments, awards,
and distinctions, he remains most proud of his ongoing contributions
of time and funding two programs aimed at getting children
and youth outdoors and active. He has raised millions of
dollars for charity and was awarded the prestigious Community Leadership
Award by the President's Council on Physical Fitness and Sports. Okay,
(04:51):
it's just amazing. Goes on and on and on um
and Dean is believable because his achievements and accomplishments are real. Uh.
I say this, and I will probably bring it up
when I speak with him in just a moment. Um.
I've met a lot of ultra guys, and listen, there's
a reason people seek out those races and run hundred
miles or more and a lot of times, let's just
(05:14):
say they are more internal. Dean is a guy you
would want to sit down at a bar and have
a beer with. And he's just he's super approachable, he's
super likable. Uh. He's accomplished a ridiculous amount, yet he's
a nice guy. I think that's where I'm going. He's
a really, really nice guy who's done incredible things. And
if you need to be inspired, if you're at a
(05:36):
point in your life where you say you know I
just don't feel good mentally, I don't feel good physically.
I need to be inspired. This is the show for you,
and I'm gonna give you his books and and how
to connect to him at the end of the show.
And that's another way you gotta pick up and start with.
This first book actually just amazing. So wait to you
hear his story. So for those of you who know
(05:57):
who he is, get excited. Uh we're gonna catch up
with him. And for those of you who have no
idea who Dean car Nazis is, be prepared to be
blown away. We will be right back with Dean Carnassis,
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and we are back. I say it almost every show,
but I truly have the greatest job in the world,
although Dean Carnassis does as well. We get to make
our passion our vocation and it's not easy, but it's
so super rewarding. And I not only get to help
people live a better live, but I get to talk
to people like Dean Carnassis. So Dean, thank you so
much for taking the time to uh to speak with
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me today. It's good to be reconnecting. It's been a while,
and I got I got some funny stories for you.
You know, I wasn't going to give him away when
we spoke earlier. But yeah, it's been a while and
and thank you so much. So what are we up
to now? I got four books that you've written, and
to that kind of co written with chicken soup. Yeah,
oh you've done your homework, yes before I'm working working
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on the fifth the first book, Um, ironic, well not ironic,
but I guess luckily the first book is being made
into a motion picture. Stop. So yeah, yeah, who's playing you?
Hopefully it's here. I can't I'm wonder non just cloth
like I did. I did have to kill me. Oh
come on, come on right here, do it now? It
(07:26):
it's someone you would recognize. Yeah, that is congratulations, That
is awesome. Not only do I do my homework, Dean,
I own all your books. You know, it's interesting. I
was talking with a fitness person recently who you know.
I was just surprised they don't buy the books, they
don't keep the books. I have all the books that
I talk about, I take notes in them. I want
to own them. You know. My office is filled and
I'm holding your your first one in my hand right now.
(07:48):
So yeah, oh yeah, you gotta read all this stuff
if you're in this industry, right, that's so exciting. Yeah,
So Ultra marathon Man, that that book you'll you know,
soon enough, it'll be up on the screen. So I
can't say streaming streaming in your in your kitchen near you. Yeah,
and we'll talk about that, you know, because your sport
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and I've done a little bit, not even close to
what you've done. But it's all about obstacles, it's all
about moving forward. We'll talk about that. But for those
of you who don't know, it is one of the
greatest reads, and it's pretty much how Dean you know,
made his mark. To begin with, I would say, and
it's called Ultra marathon Man, Confessions of an All Night Runner.
You start to read it, you can't put it down.
You go, this guy is completely nuts, but in a
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great way, and it's so inspiring. And that's what Fitness
Disrupted is about, is not only breaking through the myths
and giving you the science and the exercise science, but
it's bringing you people like Dean to show you that
whatever you think your limitations are, that you're so wrong,
right Dean, and I just want to start there because
I know your story. Many of my listeners know your story,
but some don't. So what was that turning point when
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you said, you know, I'm changing my life. You said
it a million times bad literally bad to you. I
mean that was you. You know my story, But I
was you know, I used to love to run as
a kid, and then I stopped running. I thought running
was boring, it was a waste of time. So I
went to college, you know, I went to graduate school,
and I went to business school, and I had this
(09:11):
cush corporate job in San Francisco. But I hated my life.
I just I wasn't. I wasn't a business guy. Like
I just did not dig it, you know. I was
good at it, but I hated it. And on the
night of my thirtieth birthday, I was in a bar
with my buddies, you know, doing what you do on
your thirtieth birthday. And at midnight, I said I was leaving,
and then I call it, where are you going? I was,
have another ranut of key led your thirtieth birthday, And
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I said, now, uh, instead of celebrating, you know, getting drunk,
I'm gonna celebrate by running thirty miles. And they looked
at me and they said, but you're not a runner,
you're drunk, and I said, I am, and I'm still
gonna do it. I literally I walked out of a bar.
I didn't even own running gear, but I think I
had these like, uh, these silk you know, jockeys underwear
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on these briefs. So I peeled off my pants and
just started stumbling south. And seven hours, eight hours later
her I ended up in Halfing Bay, thirty miles away.
And that changed, of course, my life that night. And
if I remember correctly, I read it a while back,
but it wasn't the phone call to your wife and hey,
come get me. Yeah, she said, you know, she's she's
(10:15):
like my my wife's not a big party. And you know,
she's like, you've never not come home, Like you know,
she's my high school sweetheart, and she's like, the entire
time i've known you, you've never not come home. Is
everything okay? And I said, yeah, everything is just strange.
That really good. Um, but I need a ride and
she's like where, yeah, no questions asked. I said, I'm
on in front of the seven eleven, uh, you know,
down the way, and she's like, well, you mean on
(10:36):
Geary Street and I'm like a little further down the
way half bay. She's like, what at thirty miles away?
How did you get there? And I said I ran.
She's like, you ran from where? I said, I ran
from the bar, and she's like the whole time, you don't,
saund very stable. I'll be right there. Yeah, we married
the same woman. You know, my wife too. I put
her through a bunch of things like that. Nothing surprised her.
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But I can always say, you know, Dean ran thirty
miles from home and then called you know, and that's
pre uber right, or both of our wives what you
say it would have been. It would have been a
lot easier these days, right, Yeah, so not to date ourselves.
This is pretty cell phone yeah, oh my gosh. Yeah.
And yeah, and that kind of started it for you, right,
You said that was the turning point. And you know,
most people don't have that huge epiphany or or they
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don't realize they're having it, or they're too scared to
act upon it, right, But you weren't. You said, okay,
I'm making a change. You know, Tom. What it was,
I literally saw a picture of myself the fifty years
old as I was running down the Street. That night,
I thought, you know, you're either gonna end up you know,
fat involved and probably driving the expensive, you know, red
sports car on your on your third or fourth marriage,
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you know, or you're gonna you're gonna do something different
with your life. And I thought, you know, even if
you end up fat involved and driving the expensive red
sports car on your third or fourth marriage, if you
try and fail, you'll just be happier than not trying
at all. And I thought it'd be better to fail
and not pull it off than not to try. And
I went for it. You know, I can so relate,
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you know, similar but different. I was a trainer back
in the you know for decades, and I used to
train those guys. So when I was doing my research
and reading your story and remembering back to the book,
so I used to train those guys who didn't make
that decision, who were making you know, millions on Wall Street.
I trained billionaires the whole nine yards, and so many
of them were so unhappy dean, to the point that
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one guy literally said to me, it's right at the
end of when I was finishing up my personal training career,
he stopped and he looked at me. He goes, you know, Tom,
I hate you. And he was kidding, but he was
and he said, what are you What are you talking about?
He goes, No, guys like me hate you. He said,
we have so much more money than you. I was like,
that's nice. And he said, but you're so happy. And
we see you running down the street at noon and
you know, wearing shorts and cut off you know, no
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sleep and and but you're happy. And I go, yeah,
and Dean, my family are all financed. And at a
similar time in my life, I said, you know what,
you couldn't pay me twenty million dollars to put on
a suit and go work on Wall Street. And sure
these have been you know, you gotta hustle, right, and
we'll talk about your hustle. But it's so worth it,
it's so worth it. Yeah, I can't. I couldn't agree more.
(13:05):
And um, yeah, I'm working a lot harder than I
would be working if I was a business guy. But
you know, to your point, it doesn't seem like work, right,
you know, I'm I'm happy. What's the great line, d
And it's it's we work eighty hours a week so
we don't have to work forty, right, but that's the
fun is we love what we're doing. I mean again,
the opportunity to speak to you again today, to have
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this forum, to put your story out there. It's gonna
inspire people. And you know, if it inspires them just
to get started with an exercise plan and we'll talk
about kids, because I know you're into that and I'm
super into that with fitness. But you know, even though
you look back and you say, oh my gosh, it
was so worth it. Yeah, And I mean your audience
is probably a lot of fit people that are listening
to this, But you know, if you do want that
(13:47):
sparking inspiration, maybe try my first book. And the reason
I'm kind of shamelessly plugging it is that, you know,
so many people said I read a lot of training books,
and you know, I knew what I had to do,
but nothing like lit that in Eternal flame within me
to go out there and do it. And for some reason,
my my booket It's approachable, like it's just I'm just
an average guy, Like I'm not a super super fit guy.
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I'm just an average guy and I went and did
these things, and I think it gives other people permission
to try, like they read about the stories of this
average guy and they're like, I'm kind of average too.
I'm gonna I'm gonna try this, and they and they
do it, you know, and that's that's a great I mean,
that's a good I think everyone wins in that scenario. Yeah,
and it's you know, I laugh about you know, they'll
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say you're not a normal person. Yes you are. You're
you're a normal person who has done extraordinary things. But
everyone is capable of that, right, So to suddenly put
you in this category and go, of course you've done
and we'll talk about it, and I gave you know,
your resume at the beginning. It's insane, but there you
didn't come out of the womb running ultramare funds. Right.
What was the point, actually, I've never asked you this.
(14:50):
What was the point where you said, you know, I'm
good at this. There's had to be a moment, like
a race or a moment where you go, you know,
at first it's two finish, right, and then it suddenly go,
maybe I'm actually can be competitive. That's a funny question.
I've never got that question before. And all you know,
and as many interviews as I've done, and um, I know.
(15:11):
I I guess I don't think I'm good at it.
Maybe that's you know, can you ever be good at
running a marathonomy? You can always be better? I guess.
So even though I've ended up on the podium, you know,
and have one races, I guess I'm always thinking, jeez,
I've never really had a you know, when you're running
for a hundred miles, you know over twenty four hours
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you can always get better, right, I mean, it's it's
not like a hundred yard hundred meter sprint, where you
know you're shaping microseconds. You always can reflect back and
say I think I can do better, and maybe that
maybe I'm just chasing a windmill. You know. It's just
like I don't think I'm that good at it. I
think I've got a lot of room to improve and
and maybe that's what's keeping me going. It's just that
kind of child's that child's mind about it, that you know,
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I want to learn, I still want to grow, and
I still want to get better. And you know what
I think it separates you too, is that many of
the durance friends of mine, people I've met spoken with, interviewed,
you don't listen let's be honest. A lot of them
have a rage right there is there's an anger that
fuels it, and a lot of that gets you through,
as you and I know, and I was there as
(16:13):
a you know, when I was younger, not to the
degree I would say many of you know my friends were,
but you know that that gets you through. I don't
get that from you, you know, and maybe you're just
hiding it really well, but you seem really happy. A
lot of these guys are not people you necessarily want to,
you know, have a beer with. And I've always said
that about you. The first time we spoke, I said,
you know, Dean is a different guy from many of
the ultra guys I've met. You actually would sit and
(16:34):
want to have a beer with him, not you know,
to put down other you know, ultra people, but a
different breed and maybe fueled by a different fuel. Um,
do you find that with you or you just hiding
some anger that I don't hear it? And and you
were so humble. It's it's rare, you know, maybe it's
it's self directed thoughts and that I um, I just
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thought coming from a place of love is going to
get you further than coming from a place of anger
and competition and hostility. Um. You know, let's face it,
comparing yourself to others is a recipe for unhappiness. So
I figured that out, and I've just said, you know, um,
if someone that you compete with gets you recognized and
(17:17):
they get recognition, celebrate that, be happy for them, you know,
don't be jealous. And that really requires it requires some
disciplined thinking, but it gets you further. Um, you know, forget,
like learn to forgive. That's a really hard quality to
actually do. But if you can actually forgive people, and
if you can learn just to compete with yourself, that ultimately,
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you know, the only one you have to answer to
is the person you see in the mirror every morning.
That is that is it? So if you can look
at yourself in the mirror and say I'm happy with
who I am, then what more is there? Right? Right?
And I love that because it's not a zero sum game,
as you're saying, right, and so many people approach it
that way. If this guy is successful, then he's taking
away from me. And listen, I remember when you first
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started really hitting at hearing, you know, and I'm sure
you did. I'm sure you've got the emails, and you
know people were jealous because holy account, you're not supposed
to make money, you know, and not supposed to have
the notoriety and fame that you achieved and and continue
to enjoy. But as you said, it's it's it's not
about them, and that that takes a lot of miles though, Dean,
I think that takes a lot of suffering. Let's talk
(18:19):
about suffering, because you've talked about you know, human nature
is such that we were supposed to avoid pain and
seek pleasure. And your sport is one in mind that
I enjoy as well. We do the opposite. There's such uh,
such power and such peace in the suffering. Yeah, I
mean my quote is there there's magic and misery. Yeah, yeah,
(18:41):
And I think, yeah, anyone who's been there to relate
to it. I mean, I think we're never more alive
than we were at those apex moments where we're questioning
can we keep going? And you know, I see that
people run a marathon in some people who are not
runners look at me there like you're crazy. Like the
other guy run. You know that my office made or
some guy's uncle, you know, ran the Boston marathon, and
(19:03):
I said to them, no, you run a marathon. It
will change you. You'll get to that moment, you know,
that come to Jesus moment where it will change you
and you'll reflect, you'll learn a lot about yourself, and
you'll feel more alive than ever And as much pain
as you're gonna be in, you'll never feel more alive.
And it's a strange dichotomy, isn't it. Yeah, And I'm
(19:24):
still trying to figure it out. You know. I think
that's why we keep racing. Right we go? What is it?
And why is it so cathartic? And one of my
you know pseudo psycholitical, you know, psychological rather um analysis
of it is there's something when we choose it, right Dean,
It's like we chose this. You get out there, you go.
You know, so often in life everything is out of
our control. So you have the boss you hate, or
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you know, the relationship you don't want to be and
whatever it may be. And you know this is suffering
that I don't have as much control over as I want.
When you go out there and you go, I'm gonna
do this endurance race, there's something really powerful about saying
this was my choice, right, And I'm not sure why
it's so nice, but it is. Yeah, I guess that's
a toured swords. I'm not you're thinking, you know, Jesus,
(20:07):
I paid for this, actually voluntarily signed up and paid
for this. Yeah, and so much misery. Yeah, but now
you're absolutely right. And you know, I think you know
the high achievement in um endurance sports is it's like
it becomes paramounting people's lives. I mean, I know people
that are to your point, are so successful and like
(20:29):
CEO is a big companies. You walked in their office
and what's most prominently displayed is their Iron Man medal, Right,
Like that makes them most proud, is you know, doing
this incredibly difficult endurance event, right, because you know, having
trained many of those guys, you know they all have
the cars, they all get the houses, they all achieved
that level of of monetary success for the most part,
(20:50):
Then it becomes what have you done? And I used
to That's how I you know, finished my career as
a coach and trainer was helping those people who thought
they could and and you know did achieve the those
you know experiences. Because that's I'm sure what you're about.
That's what I'm about. We both travel the world. I
am so fortunate, feels so fortunate to have had those experiences.
And that's what I'm doing with my kids. And you
(21:10):
take your whole family right there there, your crew, and
what's better than that, right, It's about experiences, not material things.
At the end of the day. I can't agree more.
I mean, my kids have been to you know, South America, Australia,
Canada many times, Europe many times. We've had some wonderful
experiences and hopefully you know, as we're talking right now,
(21:32):
I'm thinking, when is the next time, you know, we
can get over and I love so much. Yeah, that's
that's one thing that is really um. You know, the
door has been shut solid with me and I'm sure
you as well as you You're not flying around the
globe anymore these days. No, And I don't want to
forget what you just said. I interviewed Bass Routing. I
don't I'm sure if you know who, he is, a
(21:52):
former m M, A guy amazing right, and gosh, he's
such a great guy. And we were talking about he
was saying how he had some of his fighters and
he said, you know, if I took you in a
room and you fought someone and you lost, wouldn't matter
if no one knew. And so what he was getting
to was that back what you were talking about earlier,
that it should only matter to you. And I remember
(22:12):
when I first started racing and and started doing pretty
well and then the internet hitting. So my first iron
Man actually a similar that's similar, but it was at
age thirty on my birthday, said there's an iron Man
in New Zealand. I didn't own a bike, I couldn't
swim a app but I said I'm gonna do that
and it was amazing, changed my life. But there was
really no internet, so I didn't have to worry about
people checking my times. Right, So when you first started,
(22:34):
you must have had pressure as you were these books
were coming out and you were doing better. Was there
a shift from where he said, you know what, I
got to kind of do well to where you said,
you know, I really don't care. There absolutely was, and
it was a point where, um, you know, people said, oh,
he's not that good, and that when races, well, you know,
got lucky. And then there's a race called the bad
Water Ultra Marathon, which is called the world's toughest foot
(22:55):
race and I won the world you know, I won
the bad Water and I'm like, okay, what else do
I have to prove? I just want the world stubs
for race, you know. And then people say, oh, he's
done nothing, he's never won a race, and like, pull
it two weeks ago, one bad Water and you're on
the internet. I have never won a race. Like, you
don't even know who I am. You're criticizing me and
you don't you know nothing about me. And at that point,
(23:17):
I'm like, you know what, you can spend a lot
of time reading negative comments about yourself and it's gonna
get you nowhere. So again, it just got back to
the you know, to the to the the analogies. Can
you look yourself in the mirror and take you know,
I'm happy and I'm proud of who I am. And
was that freeing for you? I remember, you know, I
always put it as you know, you're doing the Iron
(23:37):
Man for me and I'm on the you know, I'm
not hitting my times and I'm on the marathon and
I'm literally writing that email. I'm writing I was never
a fan of the race reports personally, but you know,
the email to friends, you know what went wrong right
and during the race, and then you know, you get
to that cathartic moment whereas you said, I don't care
this is about it's ruining my experience. You I'm halfway
around the world, I'm doing this incredible event. Who cares
(23:59):
what my time is? Um was that cathartic for you
after you won that race and you said, you know what,
now it's truly I'm just going to enjoy it in
a way that I happened before. It was absolutely and
you're absolutely, You're so right. I mean, you know, I
remember writing about the disappointing hundred mile race. You know,
I was I was hoping to crack twenty hours and
I was like twenty one hours, and I'm thinking, how,
(24:19):
you know, I apologize to people and how I just
walked up and I wasn't good at and like, oh,
you just ran a hundred mile. Anyone from the sane
you know perspective reading that would be, how can how
can you be upset that you just ran a hundred
miles at twenty one hours? Like you ran through the
mountains a hundred miles without stopping, and you're you're writing
a you know, an obituary to your friends, like why
(24:41):
you just died out there? And the five percent in
who understand what twenty one versus twenty hours means. They're
the ones who were anyway, They're the ones that we're
gonna put you down regardless, right, so you can't win.
Oh my gosh, I love it. So question for you
you're obviously we're both I did not just you. You know,
we're getting older. What do you do to stay healthy?
What's the cross training routine? I'm sure people want to know. Well,
(25:03):
it's it's NonStop. It's you know, training is life and
life is training. I mean from the moment I get up,
I'm constantly doing something that's involving physical activity. I mean
even right now I'm standing up. I hope you're standing
up to standing desk exactly, walking back in that. Yeah,
we're working back and forth. And before we got on,
(25:23):
I've got this hit training routine that's about twelve minutes.
It's just body weight. So it's push ups, pull ups,
sit ups, chair dips, and burpies. So I cycled through
those throughout the course of the day. I'll probably do
four or five sets of those every day and it's
just it's quick and it just you know, get your
metabolism wrapped up. And then I'm obviously I'm still running
(25:44):
as much as ever, more than ever now actually because
I can't travel, so you know, I'm everything I'm doing
is about fitness, and I'm also doing a lot of
cross training. Um with the Ellipticgo. There's a there's a
stand up bike that I just love and it's it's
basically like an elliptical machine in the gym, but it
sound wheels so I could be outside. Yeah, I love
(26:05):
it too, I have I have to. It's super it's
super geeky. You know, it looks like a big brain man.
That's my kids always say. But I love the thing.
I mean, it's such a great workout. And you know,
you don't get saddle I used to cycle, and you
know you don't get saddle sores. You're not hunched over
in that Viking position. There's a lot to be said
about the Elliptic and I just love the thing. And
they came out with a mountain bike version the trail.
(26:28):
Yeah that's cool. Yeah with shocks and yeah, yeah, funny
story with that. So years ago, became friends with a
couple of the owners and they said, hey, you want
to try out this new thing. I said, of course,
and so they gave it to me and I never
I didn't get on it. And then they said, hey, Tom,
we're gonna do the Manhattan to Montalk right a hundred
fifty miles, and they said, you want to do with us,
and I said sure. And it was like two weeks away.
(26:49):
I said, I better get on this thing because I
gotta do a d and I had done it on
a bike, you know, it was farther than an iron
but I've done it once or twice on a bike
before and it was challenging. But it's flat. It's it's
not it's just a long day. But I thought this
is different, Like, I have no idea what I'm getting
into this thing. So I took it out for like
an hour, uh to your point, so one hour one time.
Then I got on it Manhattan and Montalk. I think
(27:10):
it took like ten eleven hours. I got up the
next day. I felt I didn't feel like I had
done anything, and that's insane. Even with the bike and
it was flat. It truly is such a low impact
to no impact form of exercise. And it was invented
for that reason, right by guys who couldn't run the
way they wanted to and what were they gonna do, right,
and this was the solution. Yeah. Well and but but
(27:32):
this is damn good. Well it's a good workout as well.
I mean, um yeah, that's what I love about it's
it's an efficient workout and you know, you get your
heart rate up. It's not as easy as cycling because
you're not as aerodynamics. You're standing up right right, so
you know, in fear of my there's like fear junk
miles and you're always kind of working on the lift
to go. But to your point, when you wake up
the next morning, you know your your joints don't hurt.
(27:54):
Oh yeah, and it's a show. Yeah, don't don't misunderstand
those of you listening that it's it's not a great
workout because you're standing the whole time. So I keep
finding myself trying to sit down and you're like, well
you don't have that option. So like the core workout
and then going up hills if you are on a
hilly course, that is you know, challenging especially I have
the original one Dean as along with you know, a
(28:15):
later model but not the most recent. So I always
pull out, always say to people like, you know, get
a bike that's that's metal and weighs fifty pounds, so
you gotta workout, right, exactly. I use the other one
in the race. Yeah, I have one of those models
as well. And you're right. I mean they've evolved a lot.
That thing is it's a it's a it's a beast, yeah,
(28:36):
and it is definitely a workout. Just to get that
thing out of the garage is to workout exactly, And
I love it. You just you just have to love attention,
right because cars slowed down, you go to Starbucks, you
get tend people around you. Uh. It's super fun. Though
it's so polarizing, Like I mean, half the people like
what the hell is that? The other half like that
is the coolest thing I've ever seen. Right, And if
(28:57):
everyone's got an opinion about it, like no one just
in heads turn like crazy and at first, yeah, because
they kind of look at you like, oh, it's a no,
something's different about that guy standing up. One thing I
have to ask you too, and it's it's one of
these tough questions, but you know, you have run three
and fifty miles. You've done all these things. So when
you read books like you know Timothy Noakes, Lore of Running,
(29:18):
his Central Governor theory, and then you've got I love
Alex Hutchinson and the book endure Um. You know, and
the question is, and who better to answer it than you?
What do you truly believe? Is it? Is it the body?
Is that the brain? Is that a combination of two
that slows us down? What has been your experience? I'm
bind all of the above. I mean, I really believe
(29:39):
the central governor theory um. But that said, I've had
my body in places where I don't care how strong
my mind was. I'm not I'm not moving right, you know.
I've passed out running like I just could not get
any more output, no matter how much you know Jedi
mind games. I played right, So I think it? And
(30:00):
when does it all to come together magically? I'll tell
you what. I cannot figure out the formula. You know.
I've I've rested and recovered for long periods before racing,
had good races and had bad races. You know, I've
raced back to back and had good races and had
bad races. I don't know what it is that ultimate
that comes together to create a really great race. But
(30:22):
you know, I think they they're you know, they're absolutely
nailing the factors that are played. How to get the
you know, the stars aligned is a different question. Yeah,
And that's that's there's the art, right Dean, there's the
If it were that simple, everyone would follow that formula.
And and that's why it's always driven me nuts. And
that's exactly what the show is about, right is we
can look at the science, we can look at the data,
(30:44):
we can look at the anecdotal, but at the end
of the day, we're all in equals one. And the
story I tell quickly is I did an iron Man
in Where was it, Uh, it doesn't matter, Kentucky. I think.
Two weeks later there was a local marathon, small and
I said, you know what, let me ride this. Fitness
people said you're crazy, and I said, you know, I
was younger or whatever, and I ran the fastest marathon ever,
(31:04):
actually one. It was a tiny marathon, ran a twofour
for me, you know, I'm bigger, and it was ridiculous.
But I got up that morning I didn't want to
run at all. I didn't feel great. The gun went
off and things happened. And that's what we have to
kind of get across to people, is, no matter how
you feel, you know, my best races, and I'm sure
many of yours were as well, were the ones I
felt the worst at the start, that gun goes off
(31:25):
and something happens. Yeah, And I mean I've had races
to where you know, I'll never forget the Angels Crest hundred, um,
you know, twenty five miles into it, I cramed. I
mean I was I could not move. My legs were
just locked in cramps, and I thought, you're done. Is
this is an instant DNF. I didn't do anything. I
didn't have salt, I didn't do anything. I just stood
(31:45):
up and kind of started walking and I finished third
place overall. I mean I was like, what what has
happened there? I have no idea? So I talked about
that mindset though, Deine. So when you got up, what
was the what was the mindset? It was just get
to the tree. There's there's a tree ten feet up
the way. Just walked to the tree. I was like Frankenstein.
Both my legs were a lot rigid, and I got
(32:08):
to the tree. I'm like, I get to the rock,
all right, get to the bend in the in the trail,
and and you know et crow. I mean I sat
there and had people passing me. I was I was
obviously it was probably twenty five minute miles. I was
doing walking, and it just loosened up and I started
running slowly and and then I started feeling good. I
(32:29):
have no idea and so what happened? Yeah, I you know.
And that's what I want people to understand. Now. I
know so many people listen to this conversation Dean, and
they said, well, we're not gonna run a hundred miles,
We're gonna gonna do anything close to that. And that's
not the point. The point is, no matter where you
are and how you feel in the moment, this is
the greatest gift that I was given Dan from these races.
And I'm sure you experienced it as well as no
(32:50):
matter how bad you feel at the moment, as you
just described, Ken and will get better and all the
cliches hold true, right, just people don't believe them. I
would say, all the the answers to life the or
on Instagram, right, it's just people don't apply it's all
there also sayings that people, you know, it's just they
don't truly believe it because they haven't suffered, they haven't
seen and built that self efficacy, right, And I think
(33:13):
so much of it as failure, the fear of failure.
And when we have that mindset that you and I
just talked about, where it doesn't matter who cares what
anyone else thinks, then you're open to do whatever you want. Yeah,
I agree, And I mean I just tell people experiment.
I mean, just you know, have fun with it. If
you can't, you know, sign up for a fifty mile
race and just lay yourself out and enjoy the experience. Right,
(33:35):
And you know, what have you gotten to this point to?
Now this is gonna sound weird. And I've done enough
races in my you know, uh kind of wheelhouse that
I got to the point where I don't want to
get hurt. So I never trained as much as everyone else,
and you know, didn't go as far even close to
as far as frequent as you did. But with iron Man,
I go, okay, kind of achieved as you said, did
the Hawaiian iron Man a couple of times, wanted to
(33:56):
break ten hours, did that, so I trained less and
less and less, and I think part of it was, hey,
it's a great excuse, right, I'm gonna be honest. I'm
not gonna go fast because I didn't put in the work.
But then I also feel like I wanted to make
it harder because I knew I could do a team
and your bare Mountain fifty K I signed up for
that wasn't running it at all. Really a little bit,
but not the miles I should have. The night before
(34:17):
that race, I went on the website and this was
what last May I think, and it said it was full.
I said, I don't take that. I don't believe it.
So I went on and said, let me see if
it'll still take my application. Sure enough, the night before
it took it, and I showed up and I suffered
my butt off, but it was amazing, and it's just
just getting out there and doing it, enjoying it. I thought,
(34:38):
you know, as it took me forever, you ran that
one as well, right, did you set us off and
then go? You know, I mean that that whole event
was my my baby. Yeah, you know, you're you're a sick,
sick person. That was one of the world I haven't
done a lot of that stuff. That was just straight
up and down. That was horrific, But I loved it. No,
I I'm I'm shaking my head and agree. I'm not
(34:59):
an email with you. That is a tough race. And
it's you're talking about and you don't want to get injured.
I'm like, that is just not the race you want
to do. If you're trying to get injured. You put
us down like the roots the rocks. Yeah, and you
know what's so humbling though. What I loved it is
I'm getting past by what fifty miles at mile twenty
(35:19):
four or whatever, and it's just you know, you go,
this is how fortunate I am. And that's where we'll
kind of pull this all together, dan Is. I always
feel when I'm feeling bad, I remember being an iron
Man's and seeing someone in a wheelchair on the sidelines
or whatever, and you go, no matter how bad you
feel at that moment, how fortunate we are to be
doing it right and especially making our careers from doing it.
You can't, we can't complain. No, it's it's we're privileged
(35:42):
in that regard, although we've worked to get what we have.
But I wouldn't trade it for the world. I mean,
it's the best feeling in the world to be out
there suffering with someone else. I mean, shared suffering brings
people together. And I think you just you hit it,
you know, on the head when you said, you know
you see someone in a wheelchair. You know they're just
saying that. You know. I used to feel sorry. I
(36:02):
had no shoes until I met a man they had
no feet, right, So it's just those kind of poignant moments. Uh,
they're beautiful, right, right, We're all suffering, and we're all
in that same race. And and that's why I would
say when I used to coach charity before the race,
you know, it's not a matter of if something's gonna
go wrong, but what and how you deal with that? Right?
I love the line by Mike Tyson. Everyone has a plan,
right until you get punched in the face. That's that's
(36:26):
one of my last PEP talks. I think to the
charity I coach, and they were probably happy before iron
Man like Classid, I said, who's the first, you know,
who's first time? It's about fifty of them, I said,
who has a plan? All of them? I said, well,
that's real good. You know, what does Mike Tyson say,
I said that all gonna get punched in the face,
so it will be harder than others. So we're gonna
get punched three times, but you just get up and again,
these are the cliches things we read about, but you're
(36:48):
a living proof of that. So you know, you you
talked about in one of the interviews recently, you know,
your chicken soup for the soul and a story about
you know, just how powerful exercises for the mind for depression.
We always think of it, or most people think of
it from the neck down. And you were talking about
a soldier and PTSD, And I think in the times
we are in now, we control what we can and
(37:09):
part of the insanity and the control we can have
is through exercise, right, and just explain to people how
powerful that is and how they can do it whenever
they want to feel better. Yeah, I mean, anyone who's running.
I mean, you know, you come home with the way
of the world on your shoulders, with so many problems,
and you go out the door and you run for
an hour and you come back and all of a sudden,
(37:29):
they're not they're they're they're put in perspective, and they're
certainly not nearly as captive over you as they were
when you left. So exercise has the power to rejuvenate.
It brings, you know, a renewal. It's a renewal of
your soul and your spirit. And I think more people
are experiencing that because of the lockdown right now. Ironically,
you know, the race the whole racing scene is non
(37:51):
existent right now, but more people are running than ever,
and I think people are discovering that that magic in running.
And I hope this trend continues because I think again,
it's good for everyone. It's good for the air we breathe, um,
it's good for humanity. And people are discovering what we've
known for years, and I think that's a beautiful thing,
and I hope it's a trend that continues for many
(38:13):
years to come. I agree. I agree percent. I just
looked in as I'm going out for my bike rides
or runs, and it looks like a really badly designed triathlon.
There are people on the wrong side of the road.
I don't know what it is where you are, and
I love it, but there are so many people you know, walking, biking, strollers, Uh,
and at the end of the day though, it just
makes me happy, as you said, because we want people
to find what we have and the enjoyment and how
(38:36):
it's free. It's free. You just got to get out
there and do it. What is next, you said, the
movie that's so exciting. I can't wait to see that.
And you sure you can't tell us who the actor
is right now, I'll tell you this when they came
to me, When the producer came to he said, we
want to buy rights to your book. Uh I, I said,
the one thing I need written in this contract is
(38:56):
anyone attached to it has to has to have run
a marathon like I don't. You're not gonna be able
to Like it would be so easy for Hollywood to
do it. You know, a cheesy running movie, right. I'm
a surfer as well. I mean, you look at surfing
movies at Hollywood down you're like, um, you roll your eyes.
And I just said, only only when someone who's actually
run the legitimate marathon is going to be able to capture, um,
(39:19):
what we do and and convey it properly. So everyone
that's involved is full on runners and and they're big
time personalities as well. So it's gonna delight anyone in
the injurerention. So this helps me where to look down. Now,
I just got to figure out the actor that looks
like you that's run a marathon, fits the age that's on. Well, congratulations,
(39:40):
I have you know, read everything you've done and you know,
looked up to you, and uh just feel so fortunate
to be able to have this conversation with you and
bring you know more people your story. Is there another
book in the works or anything like that, or what's
a race? I think you've done it all. Yeah, No,
I mean I have another book that should be out.
That's what you're saying, was us Yeah, trust later this summer,
(40:02):
but I think it's gonna be um now, spring of
next year, just because all the book stort are closed.
So another book, and it's it's kind of it's a memoir,
I mean a memoir, So it's kind of a it's
about you know, my first book was a coming of
age book is kind of learning this whole secret world
of ulture endurance and this one most recent books. You know,
how do you stay the course? How do you stay
(40:23):
true to you know, what you love? As you get
older and you start you know, talk facing some of
the things you talked about. You know, you have to
work harder to keep your same you know, level of fitness,
and you know, things start happening in your body that
never used to happen when you're younger. You know, how
do you how do you? You know? How do you?
How do you persevere in the sport that's all about perseverance, right,
(40:45):
and you're living proof of it and that's you know,
it should be so inspiring to so many people. And
you know, I'm sure when you get older, Dean, you're
gonna have bad knees? Right where contail party thing? At
what age will you you get credit for it? Right?
Is it sixty seventy eight? Where they go? Maybe it
was right? Maybe maybe it's not bad for your knees,
(41:06):
you know. I mean, I'll end with just a crazy story.
But my my mom is from this island called Ikadia,
which is in Greece. And I don't know if you've
heard of the Blue Zones, So yeah, so this island
and Greece is one of the Blue Zones. So we're
at this island last summer and these people there, this
has the highest concentrations of centenarians on a new place
(41:28):
on Earth, so more people people that lived to be
a hundred. And we're at this village up in the
hills and these people they look like mountain goats. But
this woman comes walking back into the village and she's
so upset. She's a hundred and four and she's an entrepreneur.
She just started this new business and but she's really upset.
And when we were saying, you know what, why are
you so upset, she said, well, I walked three miles
(41:48):
to the bank, and then I walked three miles back,
and I'm like, well, that seems like a pretty good
hike to me. Why are you so upset? She said, Well,
I wanted to borrow some money for my business, and
the bank has a policy they don't lend money to
anyone over a hundred and three. Stop. I couldn't get
(42:08):
my loan, damn it. Oh my gosh. I love that story,
and I didn't make the connection. I love the Blue Zones.
And again, for people who don't know that's it's one
of the greatest books and series of books to read.
And you know, they drink wine. And what I love
in that book to Dean is how often they go
to find the person that they're looking for and they'll say, oh,
you know, I came to this farm and I found
someone who looked to be about seventy seventy five years old,
(42:30):
and they turned out to be a hundred four, right,
but they just, oh my god, I love that. I
love that. All right, you have to your question. I mean,
it's a their cuteness answer to your question, when do
I be able to play the age card? I still
got thirty or forty more years on that one. Now
that I know you have those genetics, I mean I
knew you had the Greek genetics, but I didn't know
(42:50):
you had that specific the island. You literally lived to
be a hundred and ten. That's awesome and I encourage everyone. Actually,
I'm glad you brought it up. Read that book the
Blue Zones. It's another thing too, you know, you read
Dean's book Ultra marathon Man and all the other ones,
and you start to make the connections. You go, Okay,
this inspires me. And these people the way they live
that's the greatest research, right is the six different five
(43:11):
or six different places in the world where they live
so long and there are things that they share in common. Right,
that's awesome, Dean. I couldn't be more just fortunate to
speak with you again. Thank you so much for taking
the time. And when are we gonna do another horrible
bare Mountain fifty or something like that in the future, right, Oh,
my gosh, we'll see I mean hopefully running. You know,
(43:31):
events will come back online next year. Yeah, we got
many many torture tortures adventures still for you to go.
Tom awesome. I'll prom with you down there now that
I know you designed it, I'm gonna I'm gonna seek
out your events because they are truly cathartic. I'll leave
it at that, Dean. Thank you so much. Uh, good
luck with the movie and the book, and ak forward
to hopefully having you back when you come out with
(43:53):
both of those, and we'll talk again on all right,
thank you so much. We will be right back. I
started the show by saying I have the greatest job
in the world, and I will finish the show by
(44:15):
saying I have the greatest job in the world. And
yes I am standing, and yes I am actually sweating.
I love that that he brought that up, that he's
walking around. I'm walking around if you want to learn
what NEAT is non exercise activity thermogenesis. Listen to my
podcast on that. By the way, it goes to what
we're talking about, standing working movement into your entire day.
(44:37):
But how great was that interview? How great is Dean Carnassis.
He is so unbelievable, so humble, has put his body
and mind through the unspeakable, through the unspeakable, And I
get so motivated and inspired by by connecting with people
(44:58):
like him, And that's why I feel so fortunate to
have this job. That as he said, we we both
worked really hard to get here, don't you know, misunderstand
it takes a lot to give up what he gave
up and and to start at the bottom and to
literally put his body through torture to do what he loves.
But neither him nor I would change a moment of it.
(45:21):
And I love bringing guys like him and women like
him to you, people who just say, you can do
whatever you want to do. You can make your passion
your vocation. You can make an incredible living off running,
but you gotta work hard, you gotta believe in yourself,
and you have to be passionate about it. Let me
(45:44):
go through his books because if you are inspired, if
you need to be inspired, these are for you. And
we're just gonna start at the beginning. So we talked
about Ultra marathon Man Confessions of an All Night Runner.
He will get you in the first couple of pages
Ultra marathon Man, Confessions of an All Night Runner. Then
(46:05):
he has a book called Run twenty six point two
Stories of Blisters and Bliss with a great title. Then
that fifty marathons in fifty States and fifty days. That
book is called fifty by fifty Secrets I learned running
fifty marathons in fifty days and how you two can
achieve super endurance. And then in really interesting one, the
(46:25):
last one I read too, and I believe it's the
last one he wrote personally, The Road to Sparta, reliving
the ancient battle and epic run that inspired the world's
greatest foot race. And again then he's contributed to different
two different chicken soups for the Soul books. And we
just learned this movie coming out about Ultra marathon Man.
Couldn't be more excited for that and for him, and
(46:49):
I just really encourage you to take to heart what
you can do and to listen to his story, to
read his books, and by the way, goa to his
website is Ultra marathon Man dot com. Books are there,
his events are there, and a lot more media for
him as well. But this show is not just about
(47:10):
busting the myths and giving you the exercise science. We
need that. But if you don't have hope, if you
don't believe in yourself the motto of my life the
three words I live by, then all else is lost.
And he is not special. He has done special things
(47:32):
and you can too. We are all ordinary people with
the ability to do extraordinary things. That comes down to mindset,
and that comes down to being open to not being perfect,
to having those moments when you don't think you can
get through it because you can, because you can, no
(47:58):
matter how bad you feel. I love the story he told,
and I've had so many experiences like that throughout my
racing career, when the body gives up and you say
and you mentally you give up, or you can give up.
And what you learn when you do it enough is
that the body comes back. You just have to be
in the moment and you keep moving forward because every
(48:19):
step forward is a step towards the finished line. So
thank you for listening. Thank you too, Dean for taking
the time. I'm inspired, I'm getting ready to go for
a run right now myself. And again I say it
at the end of every show for a reason. We
(48:39):
control three things. How much we move. And the more
you move, the better you're gonna feel what we put
into our mouths. The more you eat healthy foods, the
better you're gonna feel physically and mentally, and finally, our attitudes.
And it's all connected. The more you move, the better
you eat, the better you're going to feel mentally. It's
(49:01):
all connected, and we control all three things. Thank you
for listening. I am Tom Holland. This is Fitness Disrupted.
Believe in Yourself. Fitness Disrupted is a production of I
(49:22):
Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit
the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you
listen to your favorite shows. H
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