CHRISSIE EVERT: TENNIS LEGEND

A revealing and inspiring conversation with my broadcast partner about her career on the court and in the booth, and how adversaries became friends. Chrissie opens up about how cancer changed her, what it has taught her, and her important message to all of us about caring for our own health.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
I've walked the grounds of Wimbledon and the US Open
and Roland Garros with Chrissy ever and I've seen over
the years how fans have responded to Chrissy with great
affection and admiration, even awesome times, and why not. Her
tennis achievements are towering. The resume is well known, eighteen
major titles, a long stint at number one, a career

(00:32):
of remarkable consistency and longevity. We've also had the pleasure,
of course, of sharing the broadcast both at ESPN and
Chrissie for many years. We've called some of the best
moments in recent tennis history. Who've also sat there and
described some of the worst Grand Slam finals imaginable, some
serious clunkers, and that will make you closer as a
broadcast team. So Christy will talk about her career here,

(00:56):
of course, and we'll get some behind the scenes stuff
on our ESPN Tennis team, but also Chrissy will talk
about how her adversaries became her friends, Martina Navratilova and
John McEnroe, and of course we'll discuss Chrissy's fight with
cancer in recent years, how cancer changed her, what it
taught her, and most importantly, her message for the rest

(01:17):
of us how to look out for our health and
be our own advocate. So today I've got tennis Icon,
trusted broadcast partner and dear friend, Chrissy. Ever well, Chrissy,
thanks for taking time. We have so much to talk about.
It's great to see your face. And very soon we
will be at Wimbledon, back in that bunker office with

(01:42):
a great view of the world's most famous tennis court.
And I've had really the privilege and the fund of
sharing that space with you some of the biggest matches
in the tennis world in recent years. And I love
how as these two women are making their way to
center court for a moment in their lives. And you've
been the young players, the underdog, you've been the more

(02:02):
experienced player is the favorite. You've been the winner in
that court, the runner up on that court. You've experienced everything,
and I love how it makes you feel in those
moments before a big final.

Speaker 2 (02:13):
Yeah, that's a really special center court. You know, I'm
American and people always ask me what's your favorite major
and you know, I want to I want to say
the US Open because I'm an American and the crowd is
really behind Americans. But I grew up watching Wimbledon on
TV and it had such a royalty about it. And

(02:34):
as the late Dick Emberg said, it's it's like the
cathedral of tennis. You know that. He couldn't have said
any better. I always say when you when you are
are a player and you walk out on the court,
there's electricity and then there's like a hush, and then
it's almost like you feel the history. You feel that

(02:57):
the ghosts or the spirits that have been there before this,
Suzanne Langland and Marian Conley's and you know, Margaret Courts
and Billy Jean, and it just encompasses everything that tennis,
you know, all the good things that tennis is all about.
And I do. I get very emotional with you. You know,

(03:17):
I have tears my eyes whoever wins, because I know
it's going to change their life.

Speaker 1 (03:22):
The next thing you're going to do in that town's calendar, though,
is Roland Garros for European television, which you've done. We've
worked together at Rowing Garos, so I've seen how you
are treated in Paris, and I know that Wimbledon and
the US Open are your favorites. But at rowand Garros.
You walk around, it's like you're like the Queen of Paris.
I mean, all these French people come up and they're
they're kind of hushed and they're respectful. They don't know

(03:43):
if they should approach or not approach. I mean, you
won seven French Opens and you only lost six matches
in your career. You have more titles than losses seventy
two and six. That's ridiculous. Do you feel that when
you walk around Paris a bit, that it's like a
it's like a special place, and that you get that
treatment from the French who are not always the quickest

(04:04):
to embrace Americans.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
Every every year I get less and less because you know,
I've got you know, the white It's supposed to be blonde,
but it's I've got the white hair now. And you know,
I mean maybe people over fifty, you know, will like
recognize me, But no, I mean I can actually walk
through a crowd and won't get any fuss whatsoever.

Speaker 1 (04:27):
But that's kind of nice, I guess at this point.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yeah, no, it's good, but little fuss is okay. There's
a big difference, you know, on clay. Look, I started
playing on clay when I was six years old, so
I mastered it. I feel at a young age, I
got it. You know, we had a connection, Clay and
I did because it was about it was slowing up
the game. It was about having patients. It was about

(04:52):
having placement over power, it was about having dropshots. And
so when you grow up on a surface, you know,
it's almost like when you learn to ski at a
young age, you're just going to be great. But if
you learn to ski, you know, when you're forty years old,
forget it. So, you know, I think that that tournament
was special, but I didn't feel the pressure. I felt

(05:15):
more confidence. I mean, to win Wimblin for me was
more of a challenge because my game was not suited
for grass, and for me to figure out a way
to make those to be flexible and to adapt to
the grass, I had to change a few things. I
had to tweak a few things. And I'm probably more
proud of that the fact that you know, a baseliner

(05:37):
could win on grass. At that point, when most of
the players were certain Volley Philly Jean, Margaret Core and
Evan Gulagong Martinez, it was all about certain vale and
I didn't certain volley. So to win on that surface
I think was more of a challenge and maybe meant
more to me than Clay. I was very comfortable, very
confident every time I played the French Open.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
Yeah, that showed that's how you get to be seventy
two and six at that tournament. Hey, there was one time,
and remember this, when you did not get treated with
reverence and respect. In Paris. We were out to dinner yourself,
I think your sister was with us, Chris McKendree or
our ESPN host Patrick macro and we all decided, let's
let's go get some sushi. Let's try to find some

(06:19):
good sushi in Paris. Who had enough with their French food.
At the French at that time, they didn't have night matches.
You could actually get a dinner after we'd finished working.
So remember, we go to this little sushi restaurant next
to Notre Dame. It was an eelcity, I think, in
the middle of Paris, and we're having a good time.
We're carrying on and we're laughing, and it's a very

(06:40):
quiet little place and the sushi master is like eighty
years old over there behind the counter, creating the sushi
and eventually he sends one of the women who worked
there around the counter out to talk to these loud
Americans who are having a good time and enjoying the
other company. And we got shushed. We got asked to
quiet down and calm down and not make so much noise.

(07:01):
It's a little sushi restaurant. Remember that.

Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yes, I do remember that. But you know what, we
were making a lot of noise. We were obnoxious Americans.
I have to We were having fun. We probably had
a glass of wine too, but trust me, I the
one time I remember was that I tried to get
into Rolling Garylson. I forgot my pass, I forgot my badge,
and you know, I thought they'll know me, you know.
So I walk up and they say no, no, no, you

(07:25):
can't come in. And I was with some people and
they're going, she's Chris Ever and no, no, no, no, no no.
She wanted seven times, no no no no. Look look
at her drivers that They looked at my driver's license,
they look. I mean, we showed them everything and I
couldn't get in.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
So you know, they must have been a young person.
Didn't have a clue, right, come on, I mean, how
do you yeah, so what did you have to go
back to the hotel and get it. You couldn't, you
wouldn't get in the game.

Speaker 2 (07:47):
Yeah, yeah, no, no, no no. I think those people went
in and got a pass for me to get in,
So thank God for that. I think it was working.

Speaker 1 (07:56):
You know, you're one of the greats in the sport
that is not caught up in your own achievements. You
don't have an encyclopedic recall of how many times you've
won this title, or what your winning percentage was, your
record against a certain player, except for Martina, we'll get
to that later, but you just don't seem to get
caught up in that stuff. Chrisy and I think it's

(08:18):
it's nice because many players do have it their fingertips
everything they've ever done, and they'll tell you about it proactively.
Why was that sort of something that, hey, I achieved
this stuff, but I'm not going to attach that to
myself and make that part of my walking resume.

Speaker 2 (08:35):
I think because that's how I had longevity and consistency,
because I'd win a tournament and celebrate that night. If
I won Wimbledon, celebrate that night. The next day. I
was thinking, I've got Virginia Slims of Seattle in a week,
and I wanted to win that tournament just as badly

(08:56):
as I wanted to win Wimbledon. So I think an
or to carry that momentum for years and years and years.
I think you you can't think of the past. You know,
you have to think that every day is a new day.
You have to reset. You have to train hard and
not be to impress with what you did in the past,

(09:17):
and that that I always had, that I just wanted
to keep winning. I was hungry, you know. So No
I don't, but I do know my percentage because it's
the highest, and I do know think.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
Yes, I was going to say, I hope there's one
number of people here. Listen, you should know that Chrissy
Ever was one three hundred and nine wins one hundred
and forty six losses, so eighty nine point nine seven
winning percentages the ice in the open air, A male
or female, you got to give me.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
A ninety Come on at eighty nine point nine, I'm
hitting me. I tell everybody ninety.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
I mean you deserve to be rounded up the point
of three. I get ninety percent.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
No, that's the only one. Like when they say when
I'm doing it appearance and they say, what do you want,
you know, for your achievements. I go, I don't care.
Just just remember that one. I think it's still standing.
And everybody else, Serena, Martina, STEFFI, everybody else has broken
my other one. So that's you know, I'm proud.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
Of that still standing. That is never going to be
broken for a career.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
Yeah, I don't think so.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
But we've talked about the fact that all those wins
what you're expected. You took the court most of the time,
maybe unless it was against Martina or Stephie Groff, when
when you were later in your career, you're you were
fully expected to win. So the losses are more noteworthy.
Like when Serena loses, the headline is Serena loses, not
her opponent wins. You said, though, that losses played a

(10:42):
really important role for you and that you remember them
more than the wins.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
Well, let's put it this way. I emotionally reacted stronger
to losses than I did to wins because I did
didn't get again, I didn't get too excitable when I
won a major because I had to the next day.
Like I said, I put it behind me. I was
very happy, but I didn't get too excited. But when

(11:11):
I lost. I remember losing to Virginuate at Wimbledon. I
stayed in my hotel room for three days, in my robe,
and ate just ordered room service for three days. You know,
just probably gained five pounds. And you know, I remember
that was depressing. I mean, I understand depression because you know,

(11:32):
I guess I took my losses inside of me because
I didn't let emotion out on the court. I kept
a lot in and so. But but they also I
think they motivated me more, you know when I lost,
because I'd learned more about Okay, let's go back to
the drawing board, what do I have to do differently?
So I think that's the reason. But now looking back,

(11:54):
you know, when you get to a certain point and
you have that much, that many years between you know,
in your career and retiring, and now it's like I
only think the good moments. I never think of the
bad moments. So that's good.

Speaker 1 (12:09):
I'm relieved to hear that three days in your robe
in a hotel room ordering room service. I mean, did
somebody go knocking the door? And now you didn't have
probably the size of a team around you that modern
players have, or they be beating in the door trying
to talk you down off the ledge. But so three
three days by yourself and nobody can reach you, Christy
and say come on out of the room. You were

(12:30):
second best, okay, Chris.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
Compare that to you know, nowadays it's gone to a
point where a player will take a year off fair
point or six six months off, you know, because because
I don't know if it's a match. But you know,
we had we had, you know that the mental health,

(12:53):
which is such an important topic now, you know, and
which is everyone's talking about. We had it, but it
was in lesser terms in our day. You know, there
wasn't that much focus. There wasn't the the social media.
We didn't have the attention, the money, et cetera, et cetera.

(13:15):
So that was our little That was my little bout,
you know, those three days. And if that was the
worst thing that happened to me, you know, I was
in good shape.

Speaker 1 (13:27):
I think of you, and so do many others who
remember your career and as one of these symbols of
mental strength and toughness that leads to the kind of
consistencies you have within a match and then within a career.
And it's interesting to hear you say that you that
was it was part of you, but there were other
sides you kind of kept well hidden. A part of

(13:47):
your arm was to not show doubts and vulnerabilities if
you had them, or certainly you were able to get
over those moments where you weren't consistent, You didn't make
more mistakes than you wanted to. I did that. How
were you able to sort of suppress that part of
human nature so beautifully?

Speaker 2 (14:05):
Because the way I'm wired, you know, I came out
of the womb a certain personality. You know. I wasn't
a go getter like Billy Jean, and I wasn't emotional,
you know, outwardly emotional like Martina, which you know, which
I actually admired the way they were. But I was

(14:26):
quiet and I didn't have you know, Tennis gave me
self esteem. I didn't have a lot of confidence as
a kid, and Tennis gave me that feeling good about
myself achieving something. And I remember practicing and getting mad
and my dad saying to me, took me aside, and
he said, Christy, in a very nice way, he said,
let me just let me just give you a tip.

(14:46):
Don't show your opponent how you're feeling, because they'll use
that to their advantage. They'll say, aha, I've got her.
And I never forgot that. I never forgot that because
I would go out there and i'd be pretty much
you know. Again, they had nicknames for me, but I
would go out there and not show emotion. But it

(15:08):
was also focus and I didn't want to be distracted.
It was my personality and I used it to my advantage.
And as soon as I saw my opponent getting emotional, ieset,
uh huh, I've got her. You know it worked for me.
You know, you got to do whatever works for you.

Speaker 1 (15:26):
Did the nicknames bother you? No, No, I mean I'm
going to see you read like Ice Maiden or whatever
when you were a young player.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
Yeah, no, No, it's it's amazing because I think, like
they need a little miss poker face. Now would be
a compliment, right, I mean Ice made I think they'd
all be compliments now. It just shows that you're not
succumbing to of just losing your your focus. And so

(16:00):
I mean no, it really didn't bother me. That was
that was how I was the other thing, Chris was,
I was. I didn't think it was for me to
get emotional, or for me to go up and argue
with the lines men or to argue with the umpire.
To me, knowing that millions of people were watching, you know,

(16:21):
I just didn't think it was worth it. To me.
It felt like I was lowering. I would lower myself
if I did that. You know, I don't know. I
have to be honest. I just wanted to be you know,
it's important to be a good sport for me, admirable.

Speaker 1 (16:39):
You know. The beauty of tennis, though, is that different
personalities can emerge and excel and be stars and play
the game their own way and express themselves their own way.
So well, that was a certainly work for you. Yes,
beyond belief. We call maxes people like Serena who certainly
do show the world, including their opponent, how they're feeling

(17:00):
point to point, and that's that letting it out works
for them. And I think there's room to be all
different kinds of ways on the court.

Speaker 2 (17:09):
Well, you know, I often say the most important gift
that Richard Williams gave his daughters is to be fearless,
right from right from day one, you know, to just
be fearless, don't be afraid, go for everything, and the
world is your oyster. And I kind of grew up

(17:29):
in an environment that was, you know, children should be
seen and not heard. You know, that was the generation
I didn't argue with my dad. I was you know,
he was like, you know, I was kind of afraid
of him, and I didn't. I couldn't really, you know,
I didn't really have a voice growing up. So I

(17:49):
think that kind of carried over to my tennis. But
when I see John McEnroe and Serena and Martina, when
I see the emotions coming out, I'm like whistful, I'm like, God,
I missed out on that, you know, I missed out
on maybe some moments that I could have been that way,
you know, in a natural way. I could have let

(18:10):
myself go, let myself a little bit looser, and you know,
so I think it's great to have all different kinds
of personalities.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
You talked about your dad, Jimmy, who was an enormous
figure in tennis, especially down here in South Florida, and
he taught you the sport and your sisters and brothers
and many many others. But he taught you to behave
a certain way on the court. I guess, I guess
behave a certain way off the court from what you're
telling me. And yet when it came time for him

(18:39):
to watch sennis matches, who did he tell you was
his favorite player ever?

Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah, So this is a father who always kept who
always wanted me to, you know, be a lady out
there and you know, be controlled. And so I walk
in the house and I hear my dad laughing, and
I walk in the living room and he's watching John
can Roll on TV. And he said, oh, guys, he's
just great. He's just great to watch. And I go, Dad,

(19:07):
I go, you kidding me. I go, you brought me
up not to act like that. And he's your favorite player.
He just, yeah, it's my favorite player. So I'm like, okay, fine,
you know that's I guess. Maybe he's a guy. You know,
maybe a guy can do it and a girl, a
woman couldn't do it. I don't know, but he was
very amused by John.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
Yeah, it's so wonderful you guys work together, and you
couldn't have been more different on the court. Your personalities
on the set are different too, and both having a
humongous profile on the sport. You guys have the license
to spar with each other as few do, and the
way you guys play off of each other, and you
kind of look at him sideways when John veers into

(19:48):
the lane and women's tennis and talks with authority about
that and goes way over the time he's supposed to talk.
And I love John, believe he's been a guest on
this podcast. But watching you guys interact it is so fun.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
We didn't always get along well, I mean, it was
when we were both on the tour together. He thought
I remember he's he thought that I was fake because
I wasn't completely honest and press conferences like he would say,
you know, why not instead of always saying, oh, my

(20:21):
opponent just played, well, you know, if I lost a match,
why don't you just tell him how you really feel,
you know? And so he we didn't always get along,
and then I there are a couple of times with him,
you know, when I would see him act. I mean,
he was a little inappropriate at times on the court
when he acted up. So we didn't go It wasn't
really until honestly, until we retired and had kids. And

(20:45):
I kind of I had to talk with him. I
called him in when we were going to be working together,
and I called him in a room, and I remember saying,
we got to get along. I go, look, we have
so much in common. Before we didn't have hardly anything
in common. But now you know, we're both parents, and
we're both retired, and we're in a new profession. And

(21:05):
so it's been like fifteen years or twenty years since
I because I work with him for NBC as well
as ESPN, and so we work together a lot. And
now I see the softer side. As you see, there's
a real soft side to him and a very a
very caring side to him. He just he just has

(21:26):
to trust you. You know, you have to, you have
to pass the test. But you know there's a very
but lovable John Macaron. As he gets older, he's you know,
he gets more and more relaxed. I think that helps,
and not threatened by people and not combative, and you
know he's he's become, you know, really a calmer person.

Speaker 1 (21:50):
Getting to work with both you and John is such
a privilege in a treat and I'll have stories for
life from that. Well, you guys share in common though, Chris,
he is both you and on We're at the absolute
top of your sport, but also were at the top
of a second profession, tennis broadcasting, And I wonder if
you have some appreciation for how remarkable that is and

(22:10):
the pride you take in that because they're related. Of course,
you guys are talking about your experience on the court,
and that's part of your renouncing, but the jobs themselves
are very different. So to get to where you are
in the broadcasting business and for have it be for
decades and different continence recognized. I mean, I know that
John will never feel like broadcasting is as big a

(22:32):
deal as playing, but I think he appreciates being recognized
for what he's done on TV. I hope you do too, Yeah,
I mean.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
John, I mean, he's hired by everybody, so he better
recognize that. Everybody wants, you know, he's They love his personality.
I do. I was thrown into NBC the year after
I retired, and I remember Jimmy Connors and I were
doing the tennis and we're both horrible. We're both horrible.

(23:00):
It was it was no it was the comments, like
you know, that was a good down the line shot
and that you know, she's got to get her first
serve in, and uh, you know it just it was
so surface and we got no training. I mean we
know it to really nobody kind of guided us. And
I think right after your your right after you retire,

(23:23):
you know, maybe I needed to breathe. But I was
I was really bad. I was awful. So then fast forward,
fast forward, like twenty years later, when ESPN was interested
in me, what I think the reason why. Look, I
don't know if I'm any good, but I mean I'm

(23:43):
not bad. I wouldn't be bad. I wouldn't be working.
So I think the reason why I improved was the
fact that I have a task academy. I have a
task academy. I'm there every day. You know, I was
there every day, and I learned. I relearned the techechnique.
I relearned. You know, it's a new game. It's Western forehands,

(24:04):
it's open stance, it's it's not the same game as
when I was playing. So I relearned that I watched
the kids play tournaments. I'd see that the pros would
come in. You know, we we helped mass and Keys
and Alatamyanovich and we helped certain players don avickage, so
the pros would come in and I'd watch them train,

(24:26):
and so I kind of got I was like getting
an education by going to my task academy, and I
think that kind of made my commentating maybe a little
deeper and a little more informative. And of course I
feel like I can talk about the mental side with
my eyes closed, but the physical shot making was what

(24:50):
was different, and I had to so I had to
relearn the game.

Speaker 1 (24:54):
Well that's awesome. That's that's a lot of humility that
you've expressed there. I do want to get back to
the for Tennis Academy later on, because that's a very
important part of your life being around the game, whether
it's the pros you mentioned or the young kids who
are just trying to get better. I want to circle
back to that. But you talked about the mental side.
I mean, I think it's tough. Sometimes we're an all

(25:15):
time great. You never choked and you rarely made mistakes
in big moments, but that's not the reality for most
of the players that we talk about. So the challenge
of relating to those you know, fallible human emotions. For you,
I can see sometimes it just doesn't compute. She needs
to just just stop missing. Just stop missing shots. Cut
down in your errors. Easy to say, chrisy hard for

(25:38):
most players.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
You sound like my brother John, who he manages the
academy and we will sit there, we'll watch a junior
play and I'll say, Okay, she had three balls in
the bomb of the net in a row, and he'll go, Chrissy,
he goes, you're wired differently, stop it. You've won ninety
thousand matches. You know you're different. And I promise you.

(26:02):
My whole thing, even to this day is when I
look at these kids, is I still feel the player
that makes less errors is going to have like an
eighty percent chance of winning the match. I think that
carries over with juniors and pros. So I've always been
a real fan of not making errors. But yes, I've
had to adjust my thinking. And now it's like, you know,

(26:25):
I tell that, I tell our girls, you know, hit
down the middle, just it just hit down the middle,
you know, make the court small, you know.

Speaker 1 (26:36):
So I think consistency is just undervalue because people, it is,
don't worry about missing. They go for shots. That's the
modern power game. They on both the women's and the
men's side, and the errors pile up, and they're willing
to live with that because it's power. You got to hit,
make the first strike, and so we don't see the
consistency is not even taught at this point.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Look, when you're inside the bay and you've got some sitters,
you go for it. Okay, you pull the trigger. When
you're six feet behind the baseline, you don't pull the trigger.
I mean, it's kind of common sense. And I think
maybe growing up on play, I had that that. I
think I had that anticipation or I had that naturally

(27:19):
that feeling of when when to go flour shots and
when to hold back. I mean that came pretty easy
to me. But it's like, you got to keep the
court smaller, you've got to have big targets. You've got
to keep hitting the ball with acceleration and spin. You know,
it's there's like two or three easy things you've got
to move and you know, I think people forget the fundamentals.

(27:46):
People forget the most important simple things. They coaches have
to keep it simple with these kids.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
We've talked a little bit about the ESPN Tennis family,
and I'd like you to ress what that's meant to you,
Because I come into this from other sports. In two
thousand and three, began working with a lot of the
folks we talked about as well as Mary Joe Fernandez
and Pam Shriver and Patrick McEnroe and Darren Cahle and
Brad Gilbert and now James Blake and others, and for
a bunch of folks that came into this from a

(28:17):
purely individual sport where you are your boss of your
team if you even have a team, but you are
solely responsible for most things in your career and you're
out there by yourself, and it is not a team sport,
and now broadcasting, which is very much a team sport.
You have to come together and sort of share the
assignments and get along and try not to be envious

(28:38):
and try not to be jealous of what someone else
is doing. And it's pretty remarkable. I think that it's
a source of like endless gratitude for me, Chrissy to
work with you and this team. I know it's been
really really important to you. What's meant the friendships over
the years.

Speaker 2 (28:56):
Yeah, it's you have to leave your ego at the door,
so to speak. You know, and you really, you really do.
And I think that when you come from an individual sport,
you kind of have that that ego. I mean, I
I think what I've realized is after retiring and after

(29:17):
like living my life that everybody thought, you know, you know,
you're so humble and you know you really handle things
well and this and that. Yeah, I have. But I
also there's also entitlement, and there there is an ego,
and your ego's big. And I think in the beginning,

(29:39):
maybe maybe I was even looking around to see who
what assignments other people were getting. I'm sure I did,
and now I'm not sure I did. I did, and
and now it's it's like when you feel comfortable that
you're doing a good job, then you know it doesn't

(30:01):
matter what assignment you get. It doesn't matter what other
people are getting. It's you just want to root for
them as well. And you want the team aspect. You
want the team to look good, you want ESPN Tennis
to get some awards, and you want people to talk
about the ESPN team, you know, just as much as
you want them to talk about you individually. So it's

(30:24):
been growing, you know, it's been growth for me to
be on team because I know, because tennis, God, you
got to be selfish, so self absorbed and think about yourself.
But in this team aspect, you you stand out like
a sore thumb, and everybody knows if you think about yourself,
everybody knows. So it's but do we have a we

(30:44):
have a great team. We have so many, so many
different personalities from Brad Gilbert to John McEnroe, from Pam
to me, you know, I mean you just everybody's so different,
and I think that that adds to the the color
and the commentating.

Speaker 1 (31:03):
Yeah, perfectly said. It's a sport where people gravitate because
they don't want to share the ball. As you said,
individual sport athletes fend for themselves and they don't have
to be part of a team, and a lot of
them like that a lot. When you come into TV,
you're much in a team and you do have to
share the ball. You do have to get along and
go out to dinner, and whether you're in Melbourne, Australia
in the summer down there going to restaurants and hanging

(31:26):
out and then the trailer or Wimbledon, you know, in
the little village where tennis just takes over this Wimbledon
village and the commentators are all over the place, and yeah,
it's a much nicer experience if you do really not
just respect, but enjoy the company of the people that
you work with. And so we're lucky.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
And to even take it one step further, you know, I,
you know, I like it when Tennis Channel and NBC
and ESPN and Eurosport. I like it when everybody feels
that they're in this together and there's no jealousy and
there's no competition and there's nowhere better than you. You know,

(32:03):
I take it a step further, and I, you know,
I celebrate the other commentators from other networks as well,
and that's I've had to learn, you know, I've done that,
and I think we all, we're all, we all should
feel proud that we're representing the sport and we're explaining
what's going on to the spectators. And I think that's,

(32:25):
you know, very important.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
I know we've spoken and you said that that ESPN
Tennis team has been important to you in recent months
and years in your life. As most people will know, well,
you've battled the hell out of cancer and you've suffered
loss your sister Jeanie battle of arian cancer for a
couple of years and passed away early in twenty twenty.

(32:50):
And it was through her sad passage that you're able
to become aware of your own issues and your own risks.
So you've shared some of the story, Chris, I've been
very open and courageous, and I think inspired a lot
of people the way you've been so transparent about it.
But let's begin with Genie and what you saw your

(33:12):
dear sister, who was also a professional tennis player by
the way, in her time, go through and how that
changed you even before you you had to battle cancer yourself.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
Yeah, and I talk about how we discovered it because
you know, I don't think gene would mind me talking
about her journey, and because I think that people will
it's good information. But I was going to Singapore and
I invited my sister Genie to come along. She's two
years younger than me, and I was kind of we're late.
So I was running to the gate and I look
behind and she's walking fast, and she's huffing and puffing.

(33:47):
And this was I think November, and I said, Genie,
come on, we got to go down her. She goes wait,
I just just had a breath. And so we got
on the airplane and I said, okay, because yeah, I
just think I have like a I think I had
a chest infection, you know, last week, and I'm just
getting over it. And I go okay. So we landed

(34:08):
in Singapore and then we went to the gym the
next morning and she couldn't even walk fast on the treadmill.
And I looked at her and I said, are you
how are you feeling. She goes huffing and puffing, I'm
just out of breath. And I go, okay. This was
like on a Wednesday, and we were going to be
home on Monday, and I said, you called your doctor
right now, and on Monday you get an appointment. And
I go, this isn't this isn't good. And furthermore, when

(34:32):
I looked at her body, it was a little, you know,
it was a little swollen around the stomach area, and
it just it didn't look like her. So I go Genie,
and she goes, I'm going to go the doctor. Okay.
So we go home and she went to the doctor,
and you know, within a week, she had like stage four.
They announced that she had stage four of airing cancer

(34:55):
and meaning that it had spread to other organs. So
you know, they put her on chemoth therapy and they
they took a blood test to see if she had
the broka, the positive Broca gene, and ironically enough, the
test result came out negative, so she didn't have the

(35:16):
broco gene, but she had a she had a variant
of uncertain significance. And that's very those two words, uncertain significance,
which ninety five percent of the time turned out to
be normal, but basically it means it hasn't been tested enough.

(35:39):
So she had that, but she was so the doctor said,
you don't have to be tessecrasy, you know, and your
your siblings don't have to be testicas genies she's she's negative.
So Genie went through a two year horrible I mean
it was chemotherapy. Then it was you know, she she
had she tried, they doctors tried everything. I mean they

(36:01):
tried everything. She was but it was it's insidious ovarian
cancer because you don't it just it kills you. If
you're if you're stage three or four, it's it's dismal.
You know, you don't have a good chance. So she
passed away two years later, and you know, we were

(36:21):
all with her very She's so brave, you know, never complained,
never complained, but she had She just was a wonderful, wonderful,
wonderful person, put everybody before her. So consequently, after her death,
like you said, twenty twenty, I got a year later,

(36:44):
year or two years later, I got a phone call
from the hospital and it was a geneticist, a genetic doctor,
and they said, Chrissy, we want to inform you that
remember Jeanie carried that variant, that variant that we were
unsure about that normally ninety five percent of the time

(37:07):
would be normal. Well that has turned cancerous, and that
Genie would have the brock A gene. Right now she
would be brock A positive. So we advise you and
your siblings to get tested. I got tested the next day.
I was brock A positive. I was brock A positive,
and I'm like, are you kidding me? So, you know,

(37:27):
right right away, within a month I had my doctor
said let's be proactive. Let's just go in and have
the hysterectomy. Let's not even think about Ovary's out. Let's
just get the whole thing out. You know, you've had kids.
You don't need to worry about anything. Just get it out.
So had a total hysterectomy, and it was supposed to
be you know, proactive, and we were supposed to look

(37:48):
ahead and nothing was supposed to be there. And all
of a sudden, my doctor, you know, said the operation
went well. Three days later he came back and he said,
but you know what, we found out that you have
cancer in your fallopian tubes and you have cancer and
your ovaries as well, so we want to go in again.

(38:11):
And they went in ten days later to make sure
to see if the lymph nodes and all the organs
around if I had if it had spread. So, Chris,
it was a matter of me for those three days,
I was either going to be stage one or basically
stage four.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
M This is a matter of three weeks, Chrissy. You're
talking about thinking that that that rockavariant was not going
to be a part of your life, to getting that news,
to having a hysterectomy, to getting this other news going back.
I mean, what an incredibly terrifying but brief period of
time all this unfolded in.

Speaker 2 (38:50):
Yeah, I think that for those three days I I hibernated.
I just you know, I didn't tell I told my family,
but I just isolated myself and just try to be positive,
think positive thoughts and and just take deep breaths.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
And it was.

Speaker 2 (39:09):
It was probably the probably the worst three days of
my life. And then lo and behold. Three days later,
my doctor called me said, you're clear. I sent I said,
could I have the Could I have all the results
because I would like to send them to another hospital too.

(39:31):
I wanted a second, third opinion. I had three opinions.
They I had three different doctors to look at the
slides to make sure that I was clear, and they
all said I was clear. So that put me at
stage one ovarian cancer and I had to do six
bouts of chemotherapy. So that's that's really the story. And

(39:54):
I say, my sister saved my life at her expense,
and it's just it's a horrible I was at her expense.
But if Genie, you know, Genie, I don't know. I
hate to say it. I hate to even think about it.
Genie hadn't had it, you know, my doctor said. My
doctor said that this was December that I had a

(40:15):
double that I had hysterectomy, and my doctor said that
if it had been April, four months down the road,
it would have been for stage four.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
Yeah, as awful as it is to lose's sister, that's
beyond our control. You did say that you thought that
Genie's journey ended up saving your life. It did no way,
because it made you aware.

Speaker 2 (40:39):
Well it did I and you know what, thank God
for genetic testing. Genetic testing saved my life as well.
That's why if I'm going to have a message for anybody,
it's if you have you have to know your family history,
because if you have anything, if you have any genetic history,

(41:00):
and this is not even cancer, this is heart disease,
this is diabetes, these are other things as well, you
better get checked. You better get blood work, and you
better get checked and before it's too late. So so anyway,
just to continue that, that was half the battle with Braca.

(41:22):
With the positive Broca gene, you you have like a
sixty percent chance of getting ovarian cancer and you have
seventy five percent chance of getting breast cancer. So I
had a decision to make either take a chance, not
do anything with the breasts, just get them checked like
three times a year and hope for the best. My

(41:45):
doctor said, well, he goes, you can do that, but
then you if you have cancer, you have to go
through chemotherapy again and you have to have another operation,
and he goes. You know, they advise like ninety percent
of the doctor's advice to get a double mass sectomy
if you have the brock up postave gene. So that

(42:06):
was my route. That was my my journey, which just happened,
you know, really in the last six months. That's what's
been going on with me.

Speaker 1 (42:13):
Yeah, it's a decision based on the odds seventy a
half percent or not good odds obviously, so it's a
prudent choice, but still you're you're you're electing to have
surgery proactively through reuse risk. It's it's still got to
a little bit scary, I mean, and then to go
through that process, which so many women bravely do, and
then the reconstructor process after it. Yeah, it's a point

(42:35):
in which I masking MS say when is this going
to end? When is it when I'm I have like
a normal day.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
I know, it's it was a sixteen month journey. I'm
three months three weeks out I had my last surgery
on my breast three weeks ago, and you know, now
I'm you know, there's nowhere to go but up. And
I still have to, like three times a year go
to my you know, gynecologist and get checked and take

(43:01):
my blood and do all that. I mean, the first
five years are crucial, you know, after you've been diagnosed
with cancer.

Speaker 1 (43:09):
As we get older, it's more important to get as
much information as we can, no matter how potentially scary
that information is. You said earlier, know your family history.
What other messages you have for people, Christy when it
comes to looking out for their health and also dealing
with the bad news you know when it comes.

Speaker 2 (43:27):
Well, I mean, look, you should always get your annual exams.
I mean for a woman, that's you know, you have
to get your breast checked once a year anyway. You
get a colonoscopy if you have especially if you have
colon cancer in your family. So you make your medical appointments.

(43:48):
But the other thing is, if you feel anything different
going on in your body internally, don't wait three months,
go and wait three days and then go, Look, you
what's the worst thing that can happen? You're a hypochondriac.
I mean, you know, just if you feel anything different,
if you feel more tired, or if you're if you

(44:10):
have bleeding anywhere, or any kind of difference in your body,
just get it taken care of right away. I think
that I've learned, and I tell I've told my gosh,
I've I have two or three friends that have gotten
genetic testing and with not good results since this happened.

(44:35):
And only twenty percent of people, because men can get
can be brocke too, which is chess. Also, only twenty
percent of people who have who are brock A positive
know it. What does that tell you?

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Percent of walking around on borrow time when they don't
know it?

Speaker 2 (45:03):
Yeah, but we talk about even even heart diseasease. Probably
ninety percent of people are walking around with high blood
pressure and don't know it. Right, you know?

Speaker 1 (45:13):
So how has how has cancer changed you?

Speaker 2 (45:23):
I'm more in the moment. I'm more in the moment now.
I take deep breaths more and and appreciate it. Talk
to myself about appreciation and about gratitude. I'm more aware.

(45:44):
I think I'm more aware of things in life now.
I mean, it really it opens your eyes. I mean,
people have written millions of books about this, what happens
when you when you have cancer? How do you feel differently?
Just more I think more awareness, more attitude, and appreciating
that I still have this moment. But you know, I

(46:08):
still have that. I still the fear creeps in sometimes
because I'm sixty eight years old and it doesn't have
as much to do. Well. You always think you're going
to My parents both live to ninety, so you always think, oh,
you still have you know, you still have a good
portion of your life to live. But I think when

(46:28):
you get older and you've had cancer, you know, you
think about death more often as well.

Speaker 1 (46:38):
I've always admired that you are such a strong, resilient
person and that that has had to be on display
you lose your dad. Jimmy. We talked about that Genie's
passing and was told to me by others in your
family that Chrissy was always the one in the family
that others would look too for strength. You would be
the rock around which others would sort of gain strength

(47:02):
from and galvanized. So when you were the one that
was facing potentially grave situation and having to be the
vulnerable one, for some of us, that's not a very
comfortable position. You'd rather sort of be the one trying
to give strength to the one getting empathy. How was
that just opening yourself up and being, you know, vulnerable,
not just to the friends and family around you, but

(47:23):
also the members of the of the public.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
Well, I'm really lucky that my sister Claire was there
for me. You know, my sister. I had two sisters
and they are my best friends. Jeanie passed away and
so I have Claire. She was with me for all
my chemos. Andy, my ex husband, took me to all
my chemos and lucky to have him my kids. I mean,
I'm lucky. You rely on your family, But at the

(47:52):
same time, they have a life too, and I think,
you know, then all of a sudden they'll stay for
three days and then leave, and I think you're alone.
You know I'm alone. I was alone in the house
and and I'm thinking, you only have yourself to rely on. Really,
I mean, you can get comfort. People are great, but

(48:14):
at the end of the day, it's what's inside of
yourself that you you know, the feelings that you feel, and.

Speaker 1 (48:22):
You could project feelings Christy, but when you look in
the mirror and it's just you in the mirror. Sometimes
it's hard to hide from that, and that's where you
have to look, and you look at yourself and and
what what did you tell yourself when you saw yourself
in the mirror and your face and that stuff.

Speaker 2 (48:37):
What did I tell myself? I think, I think and
Andy and I talked about this a lot. I guess
I I think about after, you know, I just think
about how I screwed up my personal life and how
I after tennis. You know, I did feel I had
entitlement and with with with personal relationships, and you know,

(49:07):
I think, I think I really came to a moment
of realizing my mistakes and my poor choices and more
than more than my great choices and my great wins.
You know, it just came to God. You know, this
is life. That Tennis that was, you know, that was

(49:28):
like a third of my life. But it's not really
about relationships. It's not really about love. It's not really
about you know, humanity as much as when you retire
from tennis and you have kids and you get married,
and you know, I just I think, I look, I
did a whole three month intense imprint therapy where I

(49:52):
had a woman on you know, she was a therapist,
and she was. We went right from day one of
my life right up until now. And you know, and
I realize that success and fame, you know that they
can be toxic and they can it can hurt you
when you have people telling you how great you are

(50:13):
for since you've been a kid fifteen years old. You know,
deep inside, that's where you start to get a little entitlement,
and then you know, you make some bad decisions. And
I think I started so I kind of realized that,
you know, the reality of my life and my choices.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
That's tough stuff to have to deal with. Tough, but
then you come out of it and you're laughing about it.
You come out of it. I assume changed improved with
a better perspective in the terms we've worked. Since you've
come back from cancer, I've noticed a little difference. There's
a lightness to it. Maybe we all understand that the
calling a tennis match isn't the most damn important thing

(50:54):
in the world. When you face what you face and
you know that perfection is is it the goal and
needn't be an obsession because you've been shown what the
really important stuff is. And maybe learn what isn't so important.

Speaker 2 (51:11):
Yeah, I think I think it's it's.

Speaker 1 (51:14):
You got even better than you were before. By the way,
as a commentary, I think this had an effect of
sort of just I don't know if it's if loosening up.
These are my words, not yours, but I just sense
all of difference in how you sort of approach the
day to day.

Speaker 2 (51:29):
Well, I try to. You know, look, I have I've
always had a little anxiety disorder and me that's another
thing I've had. And I feel like I feel I
feel like, you know what more after you have cancer?
You know what more can they take away from you?
What more can you know? This world take take take

(51:52):
from you? I mean, and I realized that what what
what you give you get back? And I realized that
it's I mean, life is about more about giving. And
the ego will be get in the way. And you know,
but I'm sweating now thinking about it. You know, there

(52:15):
are a lot of lessons to be learned. I mean,
this is this is like for a book. There's just
or a ten hour session with you. I mean, there
are a lot of lessons to be learned.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
We don't stop learning, that's for sure. We don't stop
learning and hopefully, if we're lucky, until our last day.
And I thank you for sharing what you did there.
It's obviously it's just the surface, but it's powerful stuff.
And the way that you've handled it about your business
and then been open about it is enormously valuable and
important in being able to inspire people who have admired you,

(52:47):
but just making them aware of things that would never
have occurred to them. And say, if Chrissy is telling
me this, then it means something. If she dealt with
it and it helped her, that means something to me.
So don't ever underestimate the power of your example, Chrissy,
and message right.

Speaker 2 (53:01):
And I know, look, I think that I'm more open
Like you said, I think I'm more open to talking
about my wrong choices as well. And these are the
to help people also like these. This is what you
can fall into. This is you know what happens if
you I just think, I just think. You know, when

(53:24):
you have fame and fortune, I just it's just it
prevents you from really being a normal, down to earth
person in a lot of ways. You know, it really does.
And because yes we have to work hard on the court,
but off the court. Things are given to us. We
have suites at hotels, you know, we we have room service,

(53:48):
we have people giving us gifts, we have wonderful articles
written about I mean, we have endorsements, we have money.
You know, it's just everything's given. Everything's given to us.
And I don't know, that's just not that's not real life.
You pay a price for everything.

Speaker 1 (54:07):
Chris faller Well said, Chrissy, I'm always open to your wisdom,
and believe me you cancer is something that you and
your longtime rival Martina and Averageleovo also have in common.
So I know you guys would also be a ten
hour podcast to describe your relationship and your rivalry. I
get that we don't have time for that, but you

(54:29):
know you have been a dear friend to her from
a relationship that I'm sure was tense, that you guys
faced off eighty times eighty times at one point, you
win fifteen straight majors between you. The stats are mind boggling.
When the WTA rankings came into play in seventy five,
the first six hundred and fifteen weeks of the rankings,

(54:51):
you are Martine of A ranked number one for five
hundred and ninety two of six fifteen and the other
one was probably number two at the time. So you
guys are incredibly linked, more than any two I would
say athletes in the history of any sport. And you've
become friends. And how has that relationship been impacted by

(55:12):
the fact that Martina in recent months and years has
been battling breast cancer and also a throat cancer. But
she says she's now cancer free, thank god.

Speaker 2 (55:20):
Yeah, yeah, she she also had stage one, you know,
thank god. Like you said, you know, we got Look,
you're right. I mean it was tense for a while.
I mean we played for eighteen years against each other,
so it was definitely tense for a while. Our relationship
was up and down, and there were some jealousies and

(55:42):
with both of us and really competitiveness, and you know,
that's the tough thing about being an individual sport. But
at the end of our careers, middle to the end,
we just got really close because we are the only
ones in the locker room every Sunday, and so one
of us was always comforting the other one. And it
was beautiful. It was beautiful. And I think we got

(56:04):
to the stage when we got to our late twenties
early thirties that we didn't feel threatened by the other person.
We realized that what we had together, the rivalry, was
really special in tennis look, and it couldn't have been better.
We were totally the opposite, I mean in everything from
the way we play, to our personality, to our visions

(56:24):
and life and whatever. So we both have a place
in Aspen, and we both have a place in South Florida.
I mean, we ended up we're living in the same towns.
And then we get our cancers overlap. You know. I
had it first, and she came to the house. It

(56:45):
was very supportive. And then she called me and said,
call me asap. And I knew something was wrong, and
knew that she never calls and says that. And she
told me the double whammy of the throat and the breast,
and she goes, can you believe it? She was. She
was more mad than anything. I think she was just mad,
you know. And and I really to see what she

(57:08):
went through. She had radiation and chemotherapy, and it made
us closer. You know, we kept in touch, and we
we just we kind of laugh that it's so ironic
that these things happened to both of us At pretty
much the same time, and she she I feel like
I have a more kind of methodical kind of attitude

(57:30):
about you know, I'm taking one day at a time.
I'm getting my energy back, you know, every day. With Martina,
it was like it was like no, just keeping I mean,
she was skiing and Aspen last week while she's still
going through radiation. You know, she was skiing and she's
going out to dinner and she's she's damned leus cancer.
You know, this isn't going to stop me. And she

(57:52):
just she's very aggressive with her with her approach to it,
and I just, you know, again, we're different. You know,
I just have to laugh about it.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
Yeah, Well, there's different ways to attack it, and that's
each person's personal choice. But are you allowed to give
your advice because your personalities we're so different. You have
being been through it a little bit, uh for a
longer period of time. Do you share it? And is
she receptive to it?

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Well, you know, she had ship breast cancer before this,
so she actually went through this before I even I
did one thing about Martina and I, because we're so different,
we've learned a lot from each other, you know, We've
learned about how the other the other side lives, and

(58:38):
what the other side thinks and what I mean. This
is a woman who came from a communist country, checks pocket,
who's defected at a young age, and and her lifestyle
is different than mine, and her the way she plays tennis,
her approach to life, her mindset is a little different.

(58:59):
You know, we're so we're different, but we share a lot,
share a lot in common. You know, we've been number
one in the world, and we've you know, been heroes
to a lot of people, and we've had cancer and
we've had, you know, ups and downs in our relationships.
I always kidder because I go, you know, people give
me a hard time because I've been married three times.
I said, I can count, like I knew twelve girlfriends

(59:22):
that you had. I go, and I don't even know
how many you married, but I can name them right now,
I go, what do they give you a hard time?
You know?

Speaker 1 (59:33):
So we will stay out of the relationship area for
both of you. This podcast, as you said, we could
do three separate ten hour shows and the various things. Well,
it's been delightful. I mean, thanks again for sharing so
much of your life and your wisdom and your experiences
from a young age to where we sit here now.

(59:56):
I hope we can get together at Wimbledon. And it's
so hard to sho share meals. As you point out,
we don't get everybody's got their own schedule, and I
hope we can have the opportunity to sit in a
nice small restit in Wimblin with a bunch of our
friends at ESPN and get loud and get shushed again.
That's that's my that's my hope.

Speaker 2 (01:00:13):
Well, thank you. Thank you for being a mentor to
me when it comes to the broadcasting, because I didn't
you know, I was the new kid ten twelve years
ago and you've really been I just respect your work
so much that I love working with you, Chris, so
thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:00:30):
That's very kind. You know you have to be on
your a game. You know how nervous you make people
work a match with you when they haven't done so before.
One of the younger announcements of churse just just so
you know, be understanding with them because you get a
little nervous when you're in their presence within this booth.

Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
Yes, yes, no, I enjoyed it. Thank you for opening
me up and I hope that people can get the
message about their health, to know their family history and
to really be their own advocate of their own body.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
Is such a powerful message, and I'm grateful to Chrissy
for sharing it and for really opening up during our conversation.
She also told me that her family at the Ever
Tennis Academy in Boca, her brother John, the coaches there,
the young players were so crucial to her as she
was going through cancer treatment and recovering from surgeries. That

(01:01:21):
gave her a loving support group, some place to go
every day that she was able to and just be
surrounded by the sport that she loves. Can't wait to
reunite with Chrissy and our ESPN Tennis team at Wimbledon
in July. In the meantime, this is the final episode
of Follower, Who You Got? Season six. It's a shorter

(01:01:42):
season than usual, and there's some good reasons for that.
Headed off to Nepal with my brother Drew for a
couple weeks of trekking and climbing in the Koumbu region
around Everest, twenty five years after our first life changing
trip there. If this kind of thing interests you, the
was Vietna episode two of this season, we talk a
lot about the Himalayas, and then Jennifer and I are

(01:02:06):
headed off to celebrate our twentieth wedding anniversary. On our
twenty third anniversary back we honeymooned in Africa. The trip
has been postponed three years by various world events, but
finally we are going to get to Africa. I want
to thank Jennifer, my co executive producer on this podcast

(01:02:26):
for all six seasons. It's my voice you hear, but
her many talents and skills are a massive part of
every single episode, every facet of the episode, and am
filled with gratitude for that. Also want to thank the
folks at Octagon for helping put together this podcast, and
mostly thank all of you for finding and listening to

(01:02:49):
this podcast and giving us such wonderful feedback. There are
many great episodes that are archive. You invite you to
check those out over on Hiatus. Everyone has a story
and all of them are compelling, so enjoy that. Be well,
I'll talk to you soon