Creative powerhouse Keith Cartwright launched an agency during one of the most challenging moments in history and isn’t looking back. We talk to him about the alluring draw of entrepreneurship and the lessons about process he’ll take with him into the future. Plus, he elaborates on the power of creativity in combating racial bias and helping brands understand how they can use business to shift, shape and mold what happens in society.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Good Company is a production of I heart radio creativity
as a role and actually is, in my humble opinion,
the most powerful force alive when used in the right way. Hi,
I'm Michael Casson. Welcome to Good Company, where I'll explore
(00:21):
how marketing, media, entertainment and tech are intersecting, transforming our
lives and the way we do business at a breakneck speed.
I'll be joined by some of the greatest business minds
at strongest leaders who will share how they build companies
from the ground up or transform them from the inside out.
My bed is you'll pick up a lesson or two
along the way. It's all good. It's a great pleasure
(00:45):
to welcome you, Keith. I'm happy to say that whilst
you were famous before, one of the great additions to
my life in the last year was the opportunity to
put a name in a face together with Keith Cartwright.
When we first chat, did I had a Rene Zellwagger
moment when I said you had me at Hellan and
you did. Because I just think your energy and your
(01:08):
creativity and just the Keith Cartwright of it all is
a good place to be, particularly for somebody like myself
who respects those who kind of step out and make
that move, and you know it's about a year ago
you left a comfortable spot at seventy two and Sonny,
and while we both live in Los Angeles, we know
(01:30):
that that just is what it is. And the two
things in Los Angeles that haven't changed, or it is
generally seventy two and Sonny number one and number two.
When people tell you directions somewhere and you say how
long will it take me to get there, they still
say ten? And you know at least one of those
is not true. But taking a move like that from
a perch that you had to create Cartwright and do
(01:52):
it in the context of w PP with them as
your partner, and in the world of A k Qua
and A You found yourself in such an interesting position
in a came at such a unique moment. I just
got to ask you the question, as an entrepreneur to
another entrepreneur, what was kind of appealing to you at
(02:14):
this moment in a time when everybody was kind of
happy to just stay where they were, maybe you took
that bold move and broke out. Was there any particular reason,
Keith or and how did the world around us you know,
pandemic and the like influence you. Yeah, you know for fault, Michael,
thank you for having me and those accolades coming from
(02:34):
you means a whole lot because mutually have you've been
a name without a face and it's so good to
meet you. You know. The thing about starting this company
in this business, you know, it was before the pandemic hit,
So the inspiration was based in in an eight feeling
that I think all entrepreneurs sort of have, which is
(02:56):
you humbly but in some ways foolishly or or with
a certain level of provider, feel like you can do better.
And when you have that idea and that vision, it's
not passing right, it stays with you. And you know
sometimes that feeling gets in the way of working for
someone else. It's not malicious and it's not that you're
(03:20):
trying to show up your boss or anything like that.
You just see it differently. And I think anyone who's
an inventor or an entrepreneur, or anyone who has a vision,
they have to go and do it and try it.
You said something that I have to jump in and
interrupt for a moment because there's a famous theologian named
(03:40):
Hill L. In the Jewish religion, and of the many
quotes that are attributed to him, one that we've all
used in different ways. And you just actually said it,
If not me, who and if not now win? And
so I don't mean to get biblical here, but you
you've basically said that I know I'm ready and this
is the time. So again, if not me, who and
(04:01):
if not now? When that's what you just said, That's
exactly right, And that's what sparked it for me. You know,
I felt like it was time for me to give
it a shot. And I did it before the pandemic.
The pandemic hit. I started in January. The pandemic hit,
let's just say January to March really got nasty. In March,
(04:22):
it was our first real engagement. Up to that point,
I'm looking for chairs and tables. But in March we
finally got a client who was ready to get to work.
It was an LDMH client. They were out of Milan
and we were literally about to get on a plane
when the first report came out that there was a
(04:44):
massive spread of COVID nineteen in Milan. Well, what's funny, Keith.
My my first acknowledgement of the pandemic being something to
worry about. I had a scheduled meeting with a woman
by the name of Christen O'Hara, whose Chief Community Ocation's
officer at Hurst, and her office called my office on
March fourth and said, Kristen has to cancel because she's
(05:09):
got to be in quarantine. I hadn't heard that word
yet because she just came back from the fashion shows
in Milan, and it was on the Wednesday, March fourth,
so a week before the lockdown, and I went, whoa really, yeah, okay,
we gotta pay attention here, like like, anyway, I'm so
funny you said that because that was Milan, because everything
(05:30):
in northern Italy was so on fire then, and it
was like, whoa, this is this is something we gotta
be a little more serious about here. Yeah. Yeah, well,
I gotta tell you. When that happened, I was like, man,
I don't even know if I'm gonna be able to
get this thing started. The world is on fire. I'm
trying to start a company. But it actually ended up
being an interesting trajectory for how we work in our process. Right,
(05:53):
So we didn't have a process, We didn't really have
a way of working and we were, you know, like
a ninetive child, just willing to try anything, you know,
embracing this thing which is very common now called zoom,
and and working closely with our partners and and really
having a mutual fear but but also ambition to figure
(06:14):
it out. I think it was felt and we were
at a try anything, what do you need, We're here
to help mentality, and I think clients felt that, so,
you know, not to go through the list of clients,
but we ended up working with this Milan client. We
did everything virtually, and then other clients started to call,
(06:36):
and we had in place a way of getting to
them early and often working with them in a way
that was actually helping them figure out a way to
work because we were doing it with other clients. And
then just having a can do attitude about everything I
think was blessing in disguise for us and actually catapulted us,
pasted our partners who had to break down a process
(06:59):
right and then figure out how to rebuild it with
tons of people. So we had a little bit of
a running start, and I think that will always be
in the history of our business. I think one of
the key moments that set us apart, and it's to
this day, a year and some change later, a part
of our process obviously and will continue to be. What's
brilliant about that is the yoke of what was done
(07:23):
wasn't pulling you down. You looked at it and said,
I'm just putting in my words. I don't have a process.
I'm going to go do it this way because this
is the way we have to do it. It's interesting
because that is a big advantage. You're not undoing. You're
just doing that right first. If you if you're undoing,
you gotta undo, and then you've got to figure out
what's next. You just said here, you know, listen, it's
like that old line, you know from one of the
(07:44):
old movies. You know, Mom's got drapes. Let's put on play.
We've got to be creative. We've gotta gotta do it.
Let me switch gears. Because when you talk about, you know,
kicking off in January, the pandemic hits everybody from a
marketer perspective, the creative. Everybody's got to step back. Everybody's
got to say, wait a minute, toned deaf, this that
(08:04):
can you I used Quick Service as one of the
great examples quick service restaurants would always do beauty shots
of food, the juicy hamburger, the great looking French fries,
the pandemic hits, and every quick service restaurant all of
that went away. Now you were focusing on frontline workers,
you were focusing on the message. You were focusing on that.
(08:26):
And so we had that shift that had to happen
on a dime. And then just as we felt it's
like Jaws three, just when you thought it was safe
to go back in the water, George Floyd, that's right,
and then all of a sudden, we've got to step
back again, and we have to be introspective and we
have to make sure we're not And then you co
found Saturday Morning. That's right. So talk to me about that,
(08:51):
because I think Saturday Morning speaks so much to the
world we're living in today. This isn't about woke or asleep.
This is about reality. Yeah, this is about what we
have to deal with. And I'd love you to spend
a few minutes talking about what motivated you. Yeah. So
you know, we started myself and my co founders Saturday Morning.
(09:12):
And look, it's no mystery these atrocious events that have
been happening. I've been happening well before it's been brought
to bear or brought to light, rather because of technology
and because of the spread of you know, the information
(09:33):
about how these things are happening, people being there and
being there at the first account or I think creating
an uproar and and a level of disgust that is
long overdue. The Civil rights movement really kicked off because
of television. Dr King was was brilliant in using television
as a means to appeal to white society to say, hey,
(09:54):
are you okay with this? It's okay with you, and
they weren't. And it was the merger of you know,
the civil rights movement and those from white society who
are sympathetic enough to do what was necessary to make
it an actual movement. And so on Saturday morning. You know,
we are creatives. We believe that creativity has a role
(10:15):
and actually is, in my humble opinion, the most powerful
force alive. When used in the right way, it can
move mountains. Creativity can move mountains. Why can't it be
used to help dispel and and shift racial bias. So,
(10:35):
you know, it's kind of like to see her movement, okay,
the industry has to see her movement, and the tagline
was you have to see her to be her. If
you can't see yourself there or imagine yourself in that circumstance,
you probably won't think it's possible. And that's kind of
(10:56):
what you're saying. I mean, if we don't shoine a
light on it, we don't know what's happening. Just because
it's happening over there doesn't mean it's not happening. That
is was the impetus for the Look, which is the
piece we did for Procter and Gamble. We wanted to
make a silent film that would translate anywhere in the
world about what it feels like to be a black man,
(11:16):
from the moment you wake up to the moment you
get to work. And this I think that the success
of that film and everything that came about from it,
and all the people who have written about it and
talked about it are intrigued by the fact that we
were able to demonstrate racial bias without even saying one
word and describing it. Again, that's the power of creativity.
(11:38):
So as a goal in a mission of ours, you know,
we didn't start this to be we don't consider ourselves
an agency. We're essentially a creative consortium, even though we
work with brands, and we want to help brands understand
how they can use the power of business to shift
shape and mold what's going on in society in the
space of racial discrimination. I'm gonna really switch years here
(12:00):
because you talk about how strong creative can be to
make those missions clearer and to tell the story, because
we are all in the business of storytelling. I started
by mentioning I lost a really good friend last week.
He was a very famous lawyer. And I gave a
quote to the Wall Street Journal today when they said
what made him a great lawyer? He was a very
(12:22):
famous litigator. I said, he was a wonderful storyteller. Whether
it was at dinner, telling you a story and capturing
your attention. He had that ability to tell a jury
or a judge a story. That's what made him successful.
He told a story. And if you think about that,
(12:43):
I'm gonna flip and say, we're in a different issue today.
We're in the issue of privacy. We're in the issue
really switching from what we're talking about now, but talking
about the power of creativity. I've been saying for quite
some time. If we want to educate the community and
the consumer on privacy issues and on cookies and all
the things that are happening and in the regulatory space
(13:05):
with that issue right now, and the creepy factor of
g I have a conversation with Keith Cartwright about American
Airlines and I now get forty two American airlines. Ad
how did they know? You know that? That creepy part.
I think it's incumbent on the creative industry, on the
creative agencies, on the creative people in our world to
(13:25):
communicate to the clients, to the consumers. Why the tradeoff
is there? Is it worth my letting you know more
about me so that you can serve me messages that
are more relevant to me. At basic principle and marketing right,
it's the same thing. The creative industry has to step up.
It's a tribute to you that you did that. Not
(13:46):
only a tribute to you, because it's your community, it's
our community. But again I go back to see her.
If you can't know about it, you can't understand it.
And the information flow, the information super highway that we
used to all this this thing called the web. Okay,
It's the famous line of good news travels fast, bad
(14:07):
news travels faster. With everybody having bodycams and videos everywhere
you go, nothing's a secret anymore, right, you know. It's funny.
The thing that I've learned in my three plush years
working Saturday morning and this, this applies to I think
all forms of communication, there is most often than not
(14:29):
a general good in people. And when we are creating
this these pieces of communication, we are appealing to that
general good in people. And you know, yes, there are
those who are misinformed, there are those who are angry
for different reasons because they may feel disenfranchised, and then
there are evil people. But I think it's such a small,
(14:50):
small fraction of the global society, and sometimes people just
need to hear it differently, and they need to be be
very differently. And again we're getting very historical and very spiritual.
But one of the great quotes from the Diary of
Anne Frank, one of the most famous stories in history,
is that quote that says, at the end of the day,
(15:13):
I still believe people are really good at heart. Yeah
for her, she said, coming from her hiding in a
one by one basement, You know, within an inch of
her life, which she lost obviously, but you know that
idea that people are still good. Hard to understand it
from her perspective and sometimes from yours or mine, But
(15:36):
yet you have to keep that nugget of hope. And boy,
I could spend Saturday morning and Tuesday afternoon and the
rest of the week on this with you, God knows,
But I'd like to ask you one sort of final
question this morning, and and that is we've had to
learn how to collaborate differently as an industry, but as
a world. Collaboration touches so many things from a creative perspective,
(16:02):
the ability to be in person, have that war room,
get that white board up, drawing stuff on the walls.
How is that transferred for you to this environment where
we're not yet all the way back. We've had to
collaborate differently, and and how has that impacted you from
the creative process because people get their creative juice flowing
in different ways. Yeah, I will start by saying this
(16:24):
is not good for creative I think we are doing
an amicable job as an industry figuring out how to
do it. And I think there's been some some great
ideas that have come out in this space. You know,
I'm judging some award shows right now, and you know
there's some stuff I'm like, Wow, they pull that off
in this moment. But by no means is this the
way we should be working now. That being said, I
(16:46):
think we have discovered a new tool and a valuable
tool in a new way to do business, and I
think we're trying to figure out how to be efficient.
I still love the idea that we don't need to
always be sitting in an office all the time in
order to get it is done. I think in retrospect
the next five or teen years are kids and grandkids,
it's going to think we were crazy to get up
at nine and or get up at eight and go
(17:07):
to work at not be at work at nine and
league five. It's like, why were you doing that all
the time. So I think we're in the evolution of that.
But when it comes to creativity, there's a kinetic energy
between human beings. There's a synapsis that happens when you're
in the same room with each other. I believe that
there are multiple people in the same room and you're
bouncing ideas off and you you know this, Michael, you
know a percent of communication is non verbal. So if
(17:29):
someone is sitting to the left of me and they're
reacting to an idea that's being presented by someone to
the right of me, I get impulses from that. An
input from that absolutely lets me there's something there, you know,
I always say the strongest business combinations are people who
can communicate non verbally. When I've got a good partner,
a good associate, or a good collaborat or a good colleague,
(17:50):
those with whom I can communicate without speaking are the
ones that we get the most done. I can just
look at them where they can look at me, and
you just read somebody quickly, and we're all on this
planet called zoom. Now, even when you're watching, if people
are looking down, you know what they're doing. People are
looking over here, you know what they're doing. You can
get it, but it's not exactly. Believe me, I understand.
Because I'm an in person guy. I can immodestly work
(18:13):
a room as well as anyone I know, and I
can also have the room work me pretty well. These
rooms are different. These rooms are different. You know. It's
it doesn't mean you can't succeed. It just means it's
more challenging. Well, Keith, look, this is really actually been
way more fulfilling conversation than I set out to have
(18:34):
with you today because I had a whole different list
of questions I was going to ask you. But I'm
happy we got to where we got to. Keith Cartwright,
I want to thank you for joining you have a great,
great weekend and a great Saturday morning. I'm Michael Casson.
Thanks for listening to a Good Company. Good Company. It's
(18:56):
a production of My Heart Radio special. Thanks to Lena Peterson,
Chief end Officer and Managing director of pedia Link, for
a vision of good Company, and to Jen Seely, vice
President Marketing Communications of Media Link for programming amazing talent
and contact. Good Company is edited by Jessica Crinchich
Good Company is a production of I heart radio creativity
as a role and actually is, in my humble opinion,
the most powerful force alive when used in the right way. Hi,
I'm Michael Casson. Welcome to Good Company, where I'll explore
(00:21):
how marketing, media, entertainment and tech are intersecting, transforming our
lives and the way we do business at a breakneck speed.
I'll be joined by some of the greatest business minds
at strongest leaders who will share how they build companies
from the ground up or transform them from the inside out.
My bed is you'll pick up a lesson or two
along the way. It's all good. It's a great pleasure
(00:45):
to welcome you, Keith. I'm happy to say that whilst
you were famous before, one of the great additions to
my life in the last year was the opportunity to
put a name in a face together with Keith Cartwright.
When we first chat, did I had a Rene Zellwagger
moment when I said you had me at Hellan and
you did. Because I just think your energy and your
(01:08):
creativity and just the Keith Cartwright of it all is
a good place to be, particularly for somebody like myself
who respects those who kind of step out and make
that move, and you know it's about a year ago
you left a comfortable spot at seventy two and Sonny,
and while we both live in Los Angeles, we know
(01:30):
that that just is what it is. And the two
things in Los Angeles that haven't changed, or it is
generally seventy two and Sonny number one and number two.
When people tell you directions somewhere and you say how
long will it take me to get there, they still
say ten? And you know at least one of those
is not true. But taking a move like that from
a perch that you had to create Cartwright and do
(01:52):
it in the context of w PP with them as
your partner, and in the world of A k Qua
and A You found yourself in such an interesting position
in a came at such a unique moment. I just
got to ask you the question, as an entrepreneur to
another entrepreneur, what was kind of appealing to you at
(02:14):
this moment in a time when everybody was kind of
happy to just stay where they were, maybe you took
that bold move and broke out. Was there any particular reason,
Keith or and how did the world around us you know,
pandemic and the like influence you. Yeah, you know for fault, Michael,
thank you for having me and those accolades coming from
(02:34):
you means a whole lot because mutually have you've been
a name without a face and it's so good to
meet you. You know. The thing about starting this company
in this business, you know, it was before the pandemic hit,
So the inspiration was based in in an eight feeling
that I think all entrepreneurs sort of have, which is
(02:56):
you humbly but in some ways foolishly or or with
a certain level of provider, feel like you can do better.
And when you have that idea and that vision, it's
not passing right, it stays with you. And you know
sometimes that feeling gets in the way of working for
someone else. It's not malicious and it's not that you're
(03:20):
trying to show up your boss or anything like that.
You just see it differently. And I think anyone who's
an inventor or an entrepreneur, or anyone who has a vision,
they have to go and do it and try it.
You said something that I have to jump in and
interrupt for a moment because there's a famous theologian named
(03:40):
Hill L. In the Jewish religion, and of the many
quotes that are attributed to him, one that we've all
used in different ways. And you just actually said it,
If not me, who and if not now win? And
so I don't mean to get biblical here, but you
you've basically said that I know I'm ready and this
is the time. So again, if not me, who and
(04:01):
if not now? When that's what you just said, That's
exactly right, And that's what sparked it for me. You know,
I felt like it was time for me to give
it a shot. And I did it before the pandemic.
The pandemic hit. I started in January. The pandemic hit,
let's just say January to March really got nasty. In March,
(04:22):
it was our first real engagement. Up to that point,
I'm looking for chairs and tables. But in March we
finally got a client who was ready to get to work.
It was an LDMH client. They were out of Milan
and we were literally about to get on a plane
when the first report came out that there was a
(04:44):
massive spread of COVID nineteen in Milan. Well, what's funny, Keith.
My my first acknowledgement of the pandemic being something to
worry about. I had a scheduled meeting with a woman
by the name of Christen O'Hara, whose Chief Community Ocation's
officer at Hurst, and her office called my office on
March fourth and said, Kristen has to cancel because she's
(05:09):
got to be in quarantine. I hadn't heard that word
yet because she just came back from the fashion shows
in Milan, and it was on the Wednesday, March fourth,
so a week before the lockdown, and I went, whoa really, yeah, okay,
we gotta pay attention here, like like, anyway, I'm so
funny you said that because that was Milan, because everything
(05:30):
in northern Italy was so on fire then, and it
was like, whoa, this is this is something we gotta
be a little more serious about here. Yeah. Yeah, well,
I gotta tell you. When that happened, I was like, man,
I don't even know if I'm gonna be able to
get this thing started. The world is on fire. I'm
trying to start a company. But it actually ended up
being an interesting trajectory for how we work in our process. Right,
(05:53):
So we didn't have a process, We didn't really have
a way of working and we were, you know, like
a ninetive child, just willing to try anything, you know,
embracing this thing which is very common now called zoom,
and and working closely with our partners and and really
having a mutual fear but but also ambition to figure
(06:14):
it out. I think it was felt and we were
at a try anything, what do you need, We're here
to help mentality, and I think clients felt that, so,
you know, not to go through the list of clients,
but we ended up working with this Milan client. We
did everything virtually, and then other clients started to call,
(06:36):
and we had in place a way of getting to
them early and often working with them in a way
that was actually helping them figure out a way to
work because we were doing it with other clients. And
then just having a can do attitude about everything I
think was blessing in disguise for us and actually catapulted us,
pasted our partners who had to break down a process
(06:59):
right and then figure out how to rebuild it with
tons of people. So we had a little bit of
a running start, and I think that will always be
in the history of our business. I think one of
the key moments that set us apart, and it's to
this day, a year and some change later, a part
of our process obviously and will continue to be. What's
brilliant about that is the yoke of what was done
(07:23):
wasn't pulling you down. You looked at it and said,
I'm just putting in my words. I don't have a process.
I'm going to go do it this way because this
is the way we have to do it. It's interesting
because that is a big advantage. You're not undoing. You're
just doing that right first. If you if you're undoing,
you gotta undo, and then you've got to figure out
what's next. You just said here, you know, listen, it's
like that old line, you know from one of the
(07:44):
old movies. You know, Mom's got drapes. Let's put on play.
We've got to be creative. We've gotta gotta do it.
Let me switch gears. Because when you talk about, you know,
kicking off in January, the pandemic hits everybody from a
marketer perspective, the creative. Everybody's got to step back. Everybody's
got to say, wait a minute, toned deaf, this that
(08:04):
can you I used Quick Service as one of the
great examples quick service restaurants would always do beauty shots
of food, the juicy hamburger, the great looking French fries,
the pandemic hits, and every quick service restaurant all of
that went away. Now you were focusing on frontline workers,
you were focusing on the message. You were focusing on that.
(08:26):
And so we had that shift that had to happen
on a dime. And then just as we felt it's
like Jaws three, just when you thought it was safe
to go back in the water, George Floyd, that's right,
and then all of a sudden, we've got to step
back again, and we have to be introspective and we
have to make sure we're not And then you co
found Saturday Morning. That's right. So talk to me about that,
(08:51):
because I think Saturday Morning speaks so much to the
world we're living in today. This isn't about woke or asleep.
This is about reality. Yeah, this is about what we
have to deal with. And I'd love you to spend
a few minutes talking about what motivated you. Yeah. So
you know, we started myself and my co founders Saturday Morning.
(09:12):
And look, it's no mystery these atrocious events that have
been happening. I've been happening well before it's been brought
to bear or brought to light, rather because of technology
and because of the spread of you know, the information
(09:33):
about how these things are happening, people being there and
being there at the first account or I think creating
an uproar and and a level of disgust that is
long overdue. The Civil rights movement really kicked off because
of television. Dr King was was brilliant in using television
as a means to appeal to white society to say, hey,
(09:54):
are you okay with this? It's okay with you, and
they weren't. And it was the merger of you know,
the civil rights movement and those from white society who
are sympathetic enough to do what was necessary to make
it an actual movement. And so on Saturday morning. You know,
we are creatives. We believe that creativity has a role
(10:15):
and actually is, in my humble opinion, the most powerful
force alive. When used in the right way, it can
move mountains. Creativity can move mountains. Why can't it be
used to help dispel and and shift racial bias. So,
(10:35):
you know, it's kind of like to see her movement, okay,
the industry has to see her movement, and the tagline
was you have to see her to be her. If
you can't see yourself there or imagine yourself in that circumstance,
you probably won't think it's possible. And that's kind of
(10:56):
what you're saying. I mean, if we don't shoine a
light on it, we don't know what's happening. Just because
it's happening over there doesn't mean it's not happening. That
is was the impetus for the Look, which is the
piece we did for Procter and Gamble. We wanted to
make a silent film that would translate anywhere in the
world about what it feels like to be a black man,
(11:16):
from the moment you wake up to the moment you
get to work. And this I think that the success
of that film and everything that came about from it,
and all the people who have written about it and
talked about it are intrigued by the fact that we
were able to demonstrate racial bias without even saying one
word and describing it. Again, that's the power of creativity.
(11:38):
So as a goal in a mission of ours, you know,
we didn't start this to be we don't consider ourselves
an agency. We're essentially a creative consortium, even though we
work with brands, and we want to help brands understand
how they can use the power of business to shift
shape and mold what's going on in society in the
space of racial discrimination. I'm gonna really switch years here
(12:00):
because you talk about how strong creative can be to
make those missions clearer and to tell the story, because
we are all in the business of storytelling. I started
by mentioning I lost a really good friend last week.
He was a very famous lawyer. And I gave a
quote to the Wall Street Journal today when they said
what made him a great lawyer? He was a very
(12:22):
famous litigator. I said, he was a wonderful storyteller. Whether
it was at dinner, telling you a story and capturing
your attention. He had that ability to tell a jury
or a judge a story. That's what made him successful.
He told a story. And if you think about that,
(12:43):
I'm gonna flip and say, we're in a different issue today.
We're in the issue of privacy. We're in the issue
really switching from what we're talking about now, but talking
about the power of creativity. I've been saying for quite
some time. If we want to educate the community and
the consumer on privacy issues and on cookies and all
the things that are happening and in the regulatory space
(13:05):
with that issue right now, and the creepy factor of
g I have a conversation with Keith Cartwright about American
Airlines and I now get forty two American airlines. Ad
how did they know? You know that? That creepy part.
I think it's incumbent on the creative industry, on the
creative agencies, on the creative people in our world to
(13:25):
communicate to the clients, to the consumers. Why the tradeoff
is there? Is it worth my letting you know more
about me so that you can serve me messages that
are more relevant to me. At basic principle and marketing right,
it's the same thing. The creative industry has to step up.
It's a tribute to you that you did that. Not
(13:46):
only a tribute to you, because it's your community, it's
our community. But again I go back to see her.
If you can't know about it, you can't understand it.
And the information flow, the information super highway that we
used to all this this thing called the web. Okay,
It's the famous line of good news travels fast, bad
(14:07):
news travels faster. With everybody having bodycams and videos everywhere
you go, nothing's a secret anymore, right, you know. It's funny.
The thing that I've learned in my three plush years
working Saturday morning and this, this applies to I think
all forms of communication, there is most often than not
(14:29):
a general good in people. And when we are creating
this these pieces of communication, we are appealing to that
general good in people. And you know, yes, there are
those who are misinformed, there are those who are angry
for different reasons because they may feel disenfranchised, and then
there are evil people. But I think it's such a small,
(14:50):
small fraction of the global society, and sometimes people just
need to hear it differently, and they need to be be
very differently. And again we're getting very historical and very spiritual.
But one of the great quotes from the Diary of
Anne Frank, one of the most famous stories in history,
is that quote that says, at the end of the day,
(15:13):
I still believe people are really good at heart. Yeah
for her, she said, coming from her hiding in a
one by one basement, You know, within an inch of
her life, which she lost obviously, but you know that
idea that people are still good. Hard to understand it
from her perspective and sometimes from yours or mine, But
(15:36):
yet you have to keep that nugget of hope. And boy,
I could spend Saturday morning and Tuesday afternoon and the
rest of the week on this with you, God knows,
But I'd like to ask you one sort of final
question this morning, and and that is we've had to
learn how to collaborate differently as an industry, but as
a world. Collaboration touches so many things from a creative perspective,
(16:02):
the ability to be in person, have that war room,
get that white board up, drawing stuff on the walls.
How is that transferred for you to this environment where
we're not yet all the way back. We've had to
collaborate differently, and and how has that impacted you from
the creative process because people get their creative juice flowing
in different ways. Yeah, I will start by saying this
(16:24):
is not good for creative I think we are doing
an amicable job as an industry figuring out how to
do it. And I think there's been some some great
ideas that have come out in this space. You know,
I'm judging some award shows right now, and you know
there's some stuff I'm like, Wow, they pull that off
in this moment. But by no means is this the
way we should be working now. That being said, I
(16:46):
think we have discovered a new tool and a valuable
tool in a new way to do business, and I
think we're trying to figure out how to be efficient.
I still love the idea that we don't need to
always be sitting in an office all the time in
order to get it is done. I think in retrospect
the next five or teen years are kids and grandkids,
it's going to think we were crazy to get up
at nine and or get up at eight and go
(17:07):
to work at not be at work at nine and
league five. It's like, why were you doing that all
the time. So I think we're in the evolution of that.
But when it comes to creativity, there's a kinetic energy
between human beings. There's a synapsis that happens when you're
in the same room with each other. I believe that
there are multiple people in the same room and you're
bouncing ideas off and you you know this, Michael, you
know a percent of communication is non verbal. So if
(17:29):
someone is sitting to the left of me and they're
reacting to an idea that's being presented by someone to
the right of me, I get impulses from that. An
input from that absolutely lets me there's something there, you know,
I always say the strongest business combinations are people who
can communicate non verbally. When I've got a good partner,
a good associate, or a good collaborat or a good colleague,
(17:50):
those with whom I can communicate without speaking are the
ones that we get the most done. I can just
look at them where they can look at me, and
you just read somebody quickly, and we're all on this
planet called zoom. Now, even when you're watching, if people
are looking down, you know what they're doing. People are
looking over here, you know what they're doing. You can
get it, but it's not exactly. Believe me, I understand.
Because I'm an in person guy. I can immodestly work
(18:13):
a room as well as anyone I know, and I
can also have the room work me pretty well. These
rooms are different. These rooms are different. You know. It's
it doesn't mean you can't succeed. It just means it's
more challenging. Well, Keith, look, this is really actually been
way more fulfilling conversation than I set out to have
(18:34):
with you today because I had a whole different list
of questions I was going to ask you. But I'm
happy we got to where we got to. Keith Cartwright,
I want to thank you for joining you have a great,
great weekend and a great Saturday morning. I'm Michael Casson.
Thanks for listening to a Good Company. Good Company. It's
(18:56):
a production of My Heart Radio special. Thanks to Lena Peterson,
Chief end Officer and Managing director of pedia Link, for
a vision of good Company, and to Jen Seely, vice
President Marketing Communications of Media Link for programming amazing talent
and contact. Good Company is edited by Jessica Crinchich
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