April 22, 2022 • 60 mins
The multi-talented artist discusses "Every Little Moment" and "Freedom," the lead singles off his upcoming record 'Jude' — his first new album in a decade. He also describes the catharsis of performing his father's song "Imagine" for the first time publicly in an effort to raise money for Ukrainian aid, and his NFT fundraiser featuring artifacts from his personal connection of Beatles memorabilia.
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runts Hog,
but that's enough about me. My guest today is a
man of many talents. He's a gifted photographer, filmmaker, and
author who has raised millions for global charitable causes through
his White Feather Foundation. He's a man on the move,
(00:22):
but musical talent, you could says in his blood. His
platinum selling solo debut is a lot reached the upper
echelons of the charts across the globe on the strength
of melodic maister works like too Late for Goodbyes, Say
You're Wrong, and of course the title track. A string
of well loved albums were to follow, with Help Yourself
being a personal favorite, and now he's gearing up to
(00:44):
release his first new record in more than a decade.
The album in question is called Jude, named for the
Beatles classic he inspired as a young boy over half
a century ago. It helps mark a season of reflection
for the artist, whose relationship with his familiar legacy hasn't
always been easy. Earlier this year, he staged the fundraiser
auctioning n f T s based on memorabilia from his
(01:05):
personal collection heirlooms to him a musical history for the
rest of us. Days ago, he stunned fans by performing
his father's song Imagining publicly for the very first time.
It was part of the Global Citizens Stand Up for
Ukraine's social media rally campaign, which has already raised ten
point one billion euros for Ukrainian aid. Though reluctant to
(01:27):
sing the song for years, the performance proved to be
a Catharsis forum and a delight for the rest of
us to say. He's reconciled with his past as a
little too simplistic, but the joy and lightness of being
as a parent on Jude, which is due out later
this year. He announced the album with a stirring double
a side single, Every Little Moment, backed with Freedom. Both
(01:48):
are badly needed messages of hope and soulace, much in
the spirit of Imagine fifty years ago. It's my pleasure
and privilege to welcome Julian Lennon. I hope you enjoy
our conversation a fraction as much as I do. Well.
(02:08):
It is such such an honor to speak to you.
I've been a fan of yours for for so many years,
and you you have new music on the way, Jude,
which I've been privileged to hear, and it is just incredible.
Um you had the whole album, yes, and it is
absolutely remarkable. And it sounds like this album has its
roots back in in some tapes that date back to
the vlat era. I think, how did this hold correct
(02:30):
Jude project begin for you? The jew journey? You know, Listen,
I never stopped doing music one way or another. I
may leave it alone for a few months here and there,
or even six months, you know, or even a year sometimes,
but it's always there, you know. And a couple of
years ago, um, I was changing business management, and I
(02:55):
found that they had boxes, literally boxes in their basement
of all my earlier stuff, I mean real too reels
of too Late for Goodbyes, a lot, and um all
the other demos that we put back together in those days.
I think we were using an old Fostex six track
or something like that four track I don't even know anymore. Um.
(03:18):
And then I also found a bunch of cassettes, you know,
I mean, okay, let's say not a bunch of hundreds
of cassettes, and that that tapes and the elysis twelve
track tapes and just a whole bunch of stuff, and
I thought, oh, and they were They've been left just
(03:39):
in an open dust in the basement, you know, out
of boxes. This is why, this is why I'm changing
business management right bringing there, So I m and I
was praying that they were, that they were going to
be okay, sent them off to you know, I found
that what whichever the top digital transfer company was, they
(04:04):
baked the tapes and then they transfer all of them,
uh you know into downloadable or c d s or whatever.
And fortunately all the stuff in there was was still
listenable and or usable as well. So, um, you know,
I've I've found a lot of stuff in there that
(04:24):
I'm still catalogic, you know, that potential thing, you know,
good ideas, uh co write ideas this that you know.
But I came across a few of from thirty years
ago that when I used to live here in l A,
when I used to have a little home studio and
my garage and and even in my little guest bedroom
(04:47):
at that time, and uh, there were some tracks there
that I'd always loved, but they never sat right with
what I was doing at that particular point in time.
They were kind of I won't say there were one off.
They were just different grooves and different headspace and they
just didn't sit with anything I was doing over the
last thirty years. Um. And so as it was time
(05:09):
to well, not time, but I was, I was. I
was planning on, uh, releasing a few things, you know,
singles and EPs. Maybe that was about it wasn't really
planning on an album. And uh so I with my
old my old, oldest best friend in the world, Justin Clayton,
(05:30):
who co wrote with me on many of the albums
and went on world tours with me. Um, he'd taken
an engineering course, so we started going through all this
stuff and it was a lot easier for him to
catalog this stuff than for me. You know, I'd be there,
but he'd be doing all the text stuff. And we
realized that some of those songs, like every Little Moment
(05:52):
and not one Night in particular, were you know and
love Don't Let Me Down. Uh, you know, it was
anywhere between thirty I mean a mix between thirty twenty
and ten years of different work and in the process
of let's say upgrading it, upgrading, the updating the production
(06:17):
on the tracks, you know, putting new drums with great
drummers on, you know, new keyboards here and there predominantly
the track within great nick Um like Every Little moment
the verse vocals are from thirty plus years ago. Uh,
(06:38):
same with not One Night, and except the new vogue,
new new vocals which were done about five years ago
were on the choruses of every Little moment Um. And
so I started doing a you know, updating a bunch
of old stuff. But in the process I started playing
around with new ideas. And what really took a left
(06:58):
turn with this why us that when COVID hit, Justin
had to go back to England where he lives. And
so we were in the middle of doing stuff and
you know, I think we've finished about five tracks, um
not mixed, but had ruff mixes. Justin goes back and
now I'm confronted with the idea that if I want
(07:20):
to get anything done, I'm probably going to have to
engineer it myself and do it myself. Um. You know,
we do a bit of the zoom you know, and
the audio movers, which is so we can play music
in real time and stuff and hear each other work.
But I took on that I started Freedom in fact,
(07:40):
was the first song that I started to engineer and
produce myself, just on my own in lockdown. They wondering
if I can even do it? Yeah, and Freedom came
out and it had such well I should I say Freedom?
I I finished Freedom, and I just of the vibe
(08:01):
that came out of this learning process again of trying
to create music without really knowing what I was doing,
and just engineering my way backwards really into figuring what
to do, and I think out of doing all of
these older songs and new songs in roughly the same
(08:23):
time period over the last three or four years. You know,
there was some semblance of connection there sonically because it's me,
but it was really Spike uh Stent that the mixer
that you know, once I had the framework of the
album and the list and the tyle, passing it on
(08:43):
to him one track at a time literally over the
course of a year, which was to mix it was
was was you know, an effort in a struggle and
and and difficult. But what I think he brought to
the table because he has such a specific style too,
was for me, if I thought I got the best
(09:05):
out of the rough mixes, you know, and I thought
there were nine or ten in my my in my
humble opinion, I think uh, Spike took it up to
you know, I call what he did a Nigel. He
turned it up to number A Liven literally. So so
(09:30):
there's there's a there's a a soundscape that's now built
because of the way he's taken what we did justin
I did in the in the in the production, and
he's just made it. There's not wall of sand, but
certainly there's a feel and a flow sonically throughout the
whole thing, even though there's quite a few different song
(09:51):
types really you know, I mean there really are. It's
not like the same theme all the way through, but
again sonically and because it's me doing it, it's a
there is a connection all the way through. And because
of the way the order in which the songs were placed.
Because for me, if you're going to do an album album,
(10:13):
uh you know, the idea that we're going to do
vinyl on this, then that then you have to have,
you know, because the true listeners will play the tracks
all the way through the way they're meant to be.
And I you know, I'd like to follow Adele and
in what she did that. If you're going to listen
to this album, you're listening to it in this particular order.
(10:36):
And I think that's correct as an artist, you know,
to be able to say, please listen to it the
way it's meant to meant to be. You know, it's
sequenced for a reason. You know, we're not just splashing
paint at the war here. There's this specifics involved here,
you know, in in your emotional journey that you're tasting.
I completely agree. I mean, songs hit you in a
(10:58):
different way depending on how you're feeling, and the music
of the prior track will completely influence that on the
um on the release for this record, you've you've called
it a coming of age album and hearing you talk
about sort of the learning of of how to to
engineer on a song like Freedom Again, was that sort
of something like that that factor into Was that sort
(11:19):
of why it feels more of a of a coming
of age? Not really, to be honest with you, it
was more about, you know, the whole lockdown thing was
very very heavy. You know, I was I was in
the South Trench in Monica. It was you know, you
(11:39):
couldn't leave the house without written paperwork, saying for you
know that what you're going out for, you were only
allowed out for one hour, whether that's walking, you know,
getting some kind of exercise or going to the nearest
grocery store, and uh, you were only allowed out within
one kilometer. So it was it was heavy, you know.
(12:03):
The first I loved it because no cars, no noise,
but wind in the trees, peace and quiet. It was
glorious at first. I really, you know, everybody was panicking
a little. I don't know, it's quite nice and to
be to be honest with you, I hadn't stayed home
for more than a few months at a time anyway,
(12:25):
because they're all was working, traveling, whether it's phot dog
feed documentaries or whatever, children's consent. You know, the list
goes on. But this this was very much a moment
of reflection. You know, a lot of the songs. You know,
although I'm i'm i'm I'm putting it out there as
an idea to people as listeners, but you know, it's
(12:47):
looking in the mirror. Really, I mean, in all honesty,
it's therapy. It's looking in the mirror. It's asking me
all those questions that you're hearing about. I mean, that's
really what this is about. You know. I I always
write about things that I know or I'm dealing that
I'm going through. Um, you know, and as I've said
regarding even every little moment, this is about the internal
(13:11):
struggles of war that we have with ourselves more than
anything else. Yes, it reflects upon the world and what
we have to deal with on the outside, the wars
that we deal with, But it's mostly about, you know,
if you can fix this first, you know, as they
always say, you know, you know, if you can fix
yourself first, if you can love yourself first, then you'll
(13:33):
be able to love the rest of the world. So
that is where the basis from all this comes from.
It's just going through that journey on different slightly different
musical styles. But you know, so yeah, that's you know,
That's what I can say really about it in that
regard that, and also I guess the other thing in
(13:56):
regards to calling it Jude was that, yeah, it's coming
of age. In regards to Dad the Beetle's that song, um,
you know number one, especially with imagine as we might
talk about. You know, I was fearful. I never said
I would never sing it. I just said you know,
(14:19):
it'll be one day when the time is right and
it's appropriate. Um. And so you know a week ago
when I said, yes, okay, now is the time, I thought, oh, b'ga,
how am I going to do this? Yeah, because I
literally for thirty years been afraid for this moment, that
(14:40):
moment to come. Yeah, because you know, listen, the media
has been beating me up for the most part for
you know, thirty years. Um, and I've just been slowly
but surely. No, I'm not giving up screwed a lot
of you. I'm doing I'm doing it this way. This
is why I Also, I delved into so many other
(15:01):
creative fields because also I wanted a platform of work
that I knew I was capable of. And you know,
fortunately I've been very I've had a very lucky run
with the children's books New York Times best seller Would
Kiss the Ground, the documentary that was Borderline up for
an Oscar. But I mean we were close, um, um,
(15:23):
you know, and just the White Feather foundational of the
work that we do on that front. Um. But it
was about addressing the song you know, hey Jude, um
and listening to the words and sort of coming to
terms with the words and and finally being finding my place,
(15:46):
especially after doing imagine, at some kind of place of
peace in my life, i e. Not Being anxious about
being me anymore, not being anxious or afraid being me anymore,
coming to terms with being who I am, and being
who I am on so many levels is June. So
(16:09):
I figured here and now this is it. I'm chucking
it all in in a good way, not throwing it away,
chucking it in and you know, keeping my fingers across
and or I mean, I've got to say the last
week ten days has been mind blowing for me because
I've never had such positive across the board response, not
(16:32):
only to my dad's so I imagine, but but even
for the two news songs that have just come out,
and and uh, you know, we'll continue to throw things
out there for for for you know, the next few months,
and then of course kind of autumn time ish will
(16:52):
be you know, getting the album out there, especially in
final so you know, it's all good, you know. I
feel I feel, probably for the first time ever, that
I can walk around with not being afraid and with
my head held high, you know, because I've always been
people have always been kind of weird with me in
(17:14):
the past, that either staring at you across the room
or you know, if you go into a particular like
on the road in the older days, we stopped at
a diner and you know, they just put Beatles songs
on to see if I reacted, to see if it
was me. That's terrible. Really, really, that's what you've got,
(17:34):
you know, that's all you've got, said, I used to
I used to have to deal with that crap all
the frigging time, so it was so frustrating. But really,
just can't you just come up and say, hey, you Julian,
you know, and it's you know. So anyway, I'm over
all of that now. I think I've laid my foundation
(17:54):
on many levels of what I do and I'm proud
to big doing everything that I'm doing now. So it's
a different it's a different world, you know, I'm feeling
I'm like, maybe just a little bit of an adult
I am. I'm so happy to hear you say that,
and no, no, but just to hear that that that
(18:20):
you feel that happiness and you know I was it. Um.
I mean, it's interesting for me to hear to hear
that you say you were nervous to do that song because,
as as a fan of both yours and your father's,
I think all that we just wanted to to was
it cathartic for you? I suppose is the question? Massively? Massively?
(18:41):
I mean, this is why I can walk partly half
the reason why I can walk around with my headheld high.
Because you know, again, when I said yes, I thought,
how the brig am I going to do this? How
am I going to do it? Where it makes sense
to me, where it's real to me, it's honest and
truthful from my perspective. Honor him, but do it. I
(19:05):
have to find my own way. And the first thing
I thought at the moment I said yes, I said,
I can't do it on piano. Piano gives it a
certain style of rhythm. It's, you know, a bit of
a honky donk plunky donk. And I mean, don't get
me wrong, it's still an incredible, beautiful song in the
way it was the original, of course, but I needed
to find a different way. Um and I immediately just thought, okay,
(19:28):
acoustic guitar. Acoustic guitar that changes the field could give
it not a swing, but a little more looser than
the original. And I thought, well, okay, who do I know.
That's a great guitarist that I can reach out to
tomorrow for today. Uh and it's free on Tuesday, um
and um and has a studio and of course no
(19:51):
bet fot Night had done Karma Police for another charitable
thing when we were in lockdown, you know, so we
did the whole video, uh, you know, a continents apart,
but it worked together, and we worked very well together.
So I got in touch with him, said no, no,
imagine Tuesday acoustic guitar. So he said, yeah, great. He
(20:12):
just flown in. He'd been in the Azores in Portugal,
which is where he's from. And and so I turned
up in his house and he hadn't even played the
song through yet, and so I went, you haven't haven't
rehearsed it? He said no, you know, I figured we'd
(20:33):
just do it, you know, ok, let's do it now
because I got to figure out if it's works or not.
And anyway, we literally sang it, literally sang it through
maybe twice, just sitting on the terrace outside, and went, okay,
like that field, let's just do it. And so we
(20:56):
go in this little studio. I mean, it's a tiny, little,
you know studio, and he laid down just one rough
of the guitar and I came in sang it about
four times, just picked the best nuances and the most
honest approach um. And you know, the idea was to
(21:16):
sing it as as as raw as possible, as as
true to Dad's version as possible, but with my own nuances.
My I said, I tend to sit back when I
sing rather than being on the beat, so I'm not
a little more loose. I'm not sure if that's the
(21:37):
right word, but and so you know, and once we've
done that, I just went, okay, that feels okay, it
feels right. There are imperfections, without questions, but but leieve
that because it's real, and I don't want that. This
cannot be a produced thing, you know, it just has
(21:58):
to be raw me. No, no, thank you very much.
And then I booked a studio the next day for
the idea of a video because we needed one. And
we go to the studio and there's a great d
op thor who knew brought him with this company, Atlantis,
(22:20):
and I just said, I was looking for high contrast,
you know, different dark light, and the manager of the
studio said, we we we've got some candles. He comes
out with like fifty candles, you know, fake. I said,
can't we get some real ones? So we get the
(22:40):
real you know, I said, no, you'll burn the place down, okay,
and understood, I won't burn the place down, but I
know what you're saying. So so I where the studio is,
Capital Studios. It's Hollywood, you know, I said, listen, there's
got to be some shops around here to have the flickering,
you know, fake candles too. So I sent my poor manager,
(23:03):
Rebecca out walking the streets, not in that manner of course,
looking for flickering candles, and she came back with about
another fifty. So, uh, you know, we just laid them down,
turn the lights out, and then I thought that we'd
have something placed around us for a bit more. Luck
(23:23):
just used the light of the candle. That was it
the whole thing, um. And luckily with the Capital Studios,
they had about, you know, thirty mic stands which we
take the candles onto around the room. But at the
end of the day, I mean I think we did
again two or four takes and just cut it together
(23:46):
and that was it and when we all saw it,
but you know, the finished thing, we just went that
you couldn't be more honest or all with the production
than the way we did it. You know. Anyway, again, Uh,
the response has just been uh jaw dropping, I mean
truly jaw dropping, so much so that you know, we
(24:10):
have to release it as a single, you know, I
mean talk about timing here. I'm trying to release the
news new music and this thing is getting in the way.
Only joking, but we have to release it as a
single soon. We're just putting all the pieces together to
make it work because you know, I mean with everything
(24:32):
going to uh stand up for Ukraine and other refugees
around the world, so that that's the idea that we
throw it out there, all the money goes to that
A S A p M. Because it would be stupid,
not too so. Not that that's competing with the other work,
with the other new work. In fact, I think they're
(24:53):
embracing each other. And that's the kind of feeling and
response I'm getting, uh, you know from the I'm like,
I'm looking at all social platforms and just read through
and I'm like, wow, Okay, this is great. This is great.
You know, I don't think I've been so widely accepted ever,
So I'm happy with that for a change. And the
(25:16):
great thing is, you know, if I've gone out, you know,
out and about, you know, I thought, okay, it might
be weird and might get botton again. I'm going to
keep the mask on to go shopping in some places
I do. But funnily enough, people, anybody that has running
(25:36):
to me is just said, love the new stuff, love
the magic. I'm going that's great, thank you on one's
and upwards. That's what I said. So it's been you know,
it's been magical. I've said it's been magical, probably for
the first time I ever like that, so well deserved.
(26:08):
It's a it's a beautiful thing you're doing, and it's
a beautiful version of your dad's song and beautiful new music.
I mean, I just the new record is just so astonishing.
I wanted to ask you mean you mentioned this earlier
that you know, you're obviously an incredibly accomplished photographer and filmmaker,
both art forms that require a gift for observation. I
was wondering if the same applied to uh to your songwriting.
(26:32):
Do you get more inspiration from looking outward or looking inward,
but both listen. Predominantly the stuff is written about my experiences,
what I've gone through, what I'm going through. But it's
of course observation of friends and other people that I
see what they're doing and what they're dealing with and
what they're going through. Um, you know, so it was
(26:56):
both ways. I don't overthink it, you know, just if
something comes to mind, I'll just run with it and
try and make it work as a piece, as a poem,
as a song, as a you know, uh uh for
me again, for me, it has to mean something. It's
(27:16):
and also with most things I do, you know, I
look at it like cooking because I'm a closet chere
uh and ye know, it's about adding the right ingredients
for me, at least for a song. Um yeah, whatever
you're saying lyrically has to have to the sound and
(27:39):
motion of the track has to The melody has to
send that same message. The song has the same the
same message. The music has to say the same message,
so that if you played the melody or the lyrics
or the song independently, they would all give you the
same feeling. And when all those three or whatever amount development.
(28:00):
When all of that comes together, that's when I get
goose sponsed to go, oh yes, that feels okay. If
I feel that somebody else has got to feel that,
come on please, So that's you know, that's where it's at.
That's how I how I do think. Is there for you?
You're gonna hang up on me for asking this question?
Is there an element of superstition involved for you? Is
(28:22):
there a time of day that you feel is your
your your time to write, or a special instrument that
you feel is I don't want to call it a
lucky instrument, but is there is there some sort of
supernatural element to songwriting for you? Um? With everything I
do again, has it has? Number one? It has to
be organic. Can't be it pushed issue creatively, can't do it,
(28:46):
don't want to do it. Didn't that if I if
I try to do that, it doesn't feel real to me.
Uh so yeah, That's why I say that I can
go without, you know, writing and recording for months, you know,
just if it doesn't if it's not doing something for me.
(29:07):
And that's why that's why I'm happy I've found so
many other outlets Because if that's not working for me.
Now I'm going to go and do that. Um, I
need to find one outlet that just says, lie on
the beach, say for for a month, don't do anything,
give yourself a bloody rest, will you. That's what I need.
(29:29):
That outlet like on a plane to an island. That's
what I did with no no stress. At some point
I'll get there soon. Would you actually enjoy that? Or
would you get there and think, okay, all right, I
need to I need to work on a book now,
or I need to work in a film or something,
you know. Funnily enough, it's like what I what I
do love to do is either get on a motorbike
(29:50):
because I'm a biker, have always been since my teens.
Either that or a convertible weather permitting, of course. Uh.
And I love going for drives, you know. Uh. My
thing wherever I go for for the first time, you know,
I look at him at once and then throw it
(30:13):
away and then discover where I am and I'll just drive.
I'll take a camera with me. It's like a few
years ago when I was here and I had an
afternoon enough and I kept hearing about the Sultan Sea.
So I just went. I just went for the afternoon,
drove there, fell in love with it, had my camera
(30:34):
with me. Now I've got a whole collection of Sultan
Tea images that I absolutely adore. Almost run out of
petrol in the mini in the middle of blackness and
was worried that I was going to be taken in
the back somewhere whatever that means. But you know, fortunately
I found a guest station. Or I've been running on
empty for a long time. So I like risks and
(30:55):
challenge sometimes, you know, I don't. I like again, I
like things happening organically. If it's if it's scheduled or
it's planned, I'm not really interested, you know. In fact,
I get anxious from planned an organized things. Really truly,
It's like waking up in the morning. If I if
(31:16):
I can't wake up naturally, you're going to get me
in a funny mood all day, no alarms. Oh, I agree,
if only, if only? But yeah, you know, that's that's
the dream when I'm on when I'm on my own
working schedule, is wake up when you wake up naturally,
and okay, let's go. You know, I I'm not sure
(31:41):
I might be reading more into this than you intended.
But I loved the opening track save Me, especially of Jude,
and I thought it was an interesting sentiment given your
your previous song and album Help Yourself. I wasn't sure
quite how much they were in conversation with each other,
or if there was any connection. It's all in conversation
with each other. I believe you me Um uh yeah,
(32:07):
I mean again, it's it's all. It's all about looking
in the mirror and questioning yourself and trying to figure out,
how do you balance this weird life, this weird existence,
this weird world. How do you make it work? Where
you're not? You don't wake up fearful and full of
anxiety every morning, which is something I've lived with for
(32:29):
a long time. There was a few years back before
COVID that I woke up with pure just fear in
my heart for the day and anxiety just you know,
just what what's going to be thrown at me today. Um.
But all of the questions that I've presented to myself,
(32:50):
I think I've I've found a pathway through that. I
can't say specifically what those things are, but a lot
of it comes down to and there won't say specific meditation.
But it's about it's about taking a minute out to breathe,
you know, to really just say, shut it all out,
(33:11):
somewhere nice and quiet and just free focus on the
moment and that it will go and think about the
things that are really important and that really matter. And
when you do that, you realize that the rest really
doesn't matter. I mean, it does, but not in the
way that it should affect you, you know that. Uh.
(33:33):
I mean, obviously we were aware of the world around
us and the problems we face, and the fact that
it seems that for thousands of years we haven't learned anything,
which that which is staggering, especially now when we have
more available means of communication and learning, and we're still
bloody idiots. You know, it's unbelievable. It's mind boggling, you know.
(33:58):
Uh yeah, I'll leave that one at that one. How
do you quiet your mind though, for those times of
the day when you're when you're taking a moment to breathe,
because I'm I know I struggle with that, and I'm
sure so many other people do as well. But the
moment that they should be taking to to take and
have a breath, I think, oh well, I could take
this moment to actually do all the things that are
(34:18):
stressing me out. And how do you quiet those thoughts
and actually have that moment be something that replenishes you.
Sometimes it's very difficult, you know. I mean one of
my results was again as I said, getting in the
car and going for a drive, putting some music on,
looking at some different scenery. Um, that ninety of the
(34:42):
time works. But there are some times that it just
that anxiety of that fear just doesn't disappear. And I think, again,
as you just mentioned, I think doing stuff, getting the
list out of the way, whatever that says, whatever it
means on a personal or working level or business level,
(35:06):
or again looking in the mirror and just going okay, okay, yeah,
talking sense into yourself sometimes you know. Um, but I think, yeah,
I you know, I think it's not This is why
I'm such a doer, is because because if I don't
(35:27):
get things done, you know they're on the list, then
it stresses me out. You know, it just does. It's
an accumulative thing that can build to horrific levels. But
you know, this is why I like to call Monday
second Sunday. I'm taking that that's good because no question
(35:53):
about it. Even if I tell everybody to leave me alone,
somebody will be touched with me about work over the weekend.
And so funnily enough, I try as much as I
can to block out Monday so that it becomes it
really becomes you know, the world's open and doing stuff,
but I have time to breathe and do things, and
(36:15):
then Tuesday come into it full time. And you know,
isn't there this whole new thing. At least the Japanese
have been doing it for a long time, you know,
And a lot of companies are considering this is making
it a three four day work week, because not only
does this allow you a greater amount of rest of
breathing and time with your family, living, et cetera. But
(36:40):
you know it it distresses people because you know, we've
a weekend is a spec in the in the moment
of time, and all we do is we're working. We're
just bloody working non stuff. And then you you know,
you're you're supposed to retire it whatever, age sixty six,
and then you've got, you know, a few years left
(37:01):
to enjoy what you know, you're falling down. You you
can't see anything or hear anything anymore. What's that about? No,
So you know, and also they've they've proved that work
efficiency is through the roof when people have more time
with their friends and family and have moments to enjoy life. So,
(37:23):
you know, people and then you're determined that you have
this time period, which just go for it. And I'm
kind of borderline that, you know. So, um, it works.
It's working for me, that's for sure. You know. Uh.
Obviously there are schedules sometimes that you can't change, but
for the most part, you know, I can get my
(37:44):
second Sunday. I'm going for it. You know, this either
feels like a very appropriate or very inappropriate segue. But
but do you have plans to do? You have plans
to to toward you? Um? Are you listening? Thought about
it for years again, um. But the thing was that
I again I said to myself anywhere I really got
(38:07):
on the road again. I came up with an idea
literally about twenty years ago. A friend of mine and I, UM,
I wanted to do things differently, and so I thought,
you know, we're also tied in with the White Feather Foundation,
So I thought, okay, performing arts centers different cities around
(38:28):
the world, I'm not one that likes to go out,
you know, repeatedly and just doing that. I don't. I
don't have that interest or drive. I'd rather be going
to Africa and taking photographs, you know, and seeing new
worlds and and meeting new cultures. So, you know, I
think we will get around too, probably next year. There's
(38:52):
a few things coming up this year that are like
one off with charity with orchestras that that we're looking
at right now. Um But I do like the idea
of doing something in in in UH again in performing
arts theaters with partial or full orchestra, you know, tied
(39:12):
in with White Feather Foundation, UM, tied in the idea
making that we raise the issues, the biggest issues of
the problems in each of the location we've played and
we do the idea is to involve local TV and
radio competitions for the best artwork, the best photography, that
(39:34):
and the other, and that the work UH that is
sent in is judged and by a panel, and that
in the foyer of the places and cities that we
play is the best of the best of the local
art scene, from photography, sculptures to you name it. So
(39:58):
um so making the competition through radio, through TV, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera,
to to involve all of the local community and make
it you know, I think, rather than just hello, tor
bus rolls in. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's that's
(40:18):
my idea of doing something a bit more special, a
bit more unique, and a bit more different and uh
and doing good for the local community at the same time.
(40:48):
A few years back, you had um an exhibit of
your your i'll call umn your family heirlooms in Liverpool
for the White Feather Foundation. Do you have any plans
to do that in the States. I know there was
some complecations there, I think, Well, I mean COVID was accomplicated. Well, yeah,
that is also smaller. I you know, I collected a
(41:08):
fair amount of memorabilious stuff over the last thirty years,
predominantly uh Dad's stuff that was linked to me in
a very personal way, and it was more about collecting.
But I still plan to have a family one day
and just haven't found the right loony to hang with
just yet. Um. But she's out there somewhere. Um. But yeah, no,
(41:36):
it was it was about you know, heritage and legacy
and passing that on too. Hopefully my kids one day,
whenever that happens. But I haven't given up hope. But anyway,
so that was what it was all about. Original and
then there was a few people's items that one. But
that's an expensive world now, you know. Again, people think
(41:57):
that I've had a lot of money from the get go,
but I mean, I you know, when we were moms separating,
you know, we've got a little something. But anyway, it
doesn't cover the cost of a memorabilia, that's for sure.
So uh yeah, I've got a good collection together. And
we did tour it a little bit, as you said,
(42:19):
in Liverpool, which was great, probably the best spot for
it at that time ever really, and then a few
other countries and and I had plans to bring it
out here from museum, a couple of museums we were
talking to um and then you know, COVID and a
few other issues came into play as well. And I
(42:42):
so this is why the whole n f T thing
came out of it. I said, Okay, what's another way
of sharing what I have. I can't I can't tour
this stuff. And I hated being locked up in just
a vault, in a bank vault somewhere, what's the point
in having it, you know, So okay, this is another way,
it's another artistic platform. You know, we're the proportion go
(43:03):
to White Feather Foundation to that being the main thrust
and crups behind this because then I can keep working
on all the u because we only go through uh
a White Feather We just don't. We survived through donations
from the public, so we don't have any major sponsors
this that ne other. It's the people out There's the
(43:24):
fans out there that keep us alive and doing all
the good work that we do. So um, yes, so
the n f T thing came along. I think I'll
probably do a couple of more tied in with with
with some of the stuff I'm doing now. Who knows
what else. You know, we're just talking, but you know,
(43:45):
there are there's some great, great possibilities out then. Of
course I welcome the idea of being able to to
to tour that show, you know, in a couple of
cities through the US and around the world. So you know,
it's it's on a list. It's just had my hands full.
(44:06):
So you know, well we'll get to it. We'll get
to it. Oh, the n f t s were so interesting.
You you have such an incredible collection. I loved that
that Les Paul with the ruby glued to it and
the plague. I mean, how cool is that that was?
I mean I hadn't seen I hadn't seen that like
twenty years because it was in a bloody voult, you know,
(44:26):
just keeping safe. I didn't want to keep it at
home because then who knows what can happen then? And
but yeah, and I like the thing with the n
F T s. I did want to make it different
from anybody else. But thought, okay, well you can't just
have a picture just spinning right. What they all was
that I wouldn't want that. So I thought, okay, what
(44:47):
would I want? Okay, how about it a bit? But
the background story, right, you know, not only you know,
just write a piece about what it means, where it
came from, what the think is to me, and let
me read it. And so that's where they took on
a whole new platform for me and a whole new idea.
(45:09):
Is making it far more interesting for me as far
as NFPs go. There's having that one off vocal experience
on each of the items. Um. But but also you know,
tying in white feather in such a way that that
as long as that was perpetually, you know, making money
(45:31):
from sale or resale or whatever, white feather would survive,
you know, which is partly what it's all about. This
is an unfair question. But is there is there a
favorite of yours in your in your collection of is
there one piece that that means means the most too?
Are just is your favorite for any other reason? I
mean I loved all the guitars because I used to
(45:51):
play them, yeah thirty years ago. Um uh, But I
probably the afghan coat because it fits me. I want
a picture of that maybe all right, we'll see about
that one. I'll make a guess, children with clothes on underneath.
(46:21):
So yeah, because there are you know, there are pictures
of me sitting with dad, you know, with the afghan
coat on the back of the chair, you know, from
Magical Mystery Tour and you know all of that Stuffinitely
are I think anywhere I'm the Wars. I'm not sure
I think it did, but anyway, all that kind of Yeah,
(46:43):
So that one's quite special because you see him wear
it a lot throughout certain films and pictures over the
period that time. Period I read. I don't know if
this is true that, Um, your your picture of Lucy
in the sky with diamonds is owned by Dave Gilmour.
Is that is that true? Do you know where that's at?
(47:04):
I don't know where that's at. Oh yeah, I know
whether I know where that's up. Yeah. I asked him
for it back, UM, to be honest with you. Uh yeah,
And I've said this to Mom. I said, is it
and she went, I don't think so. All right, okay,
(47:27):
because I I don't remember specifically what that during was. Uh.
I thought personally, I thought it was a different one
another one. Um, all right, yeah, I was held. So
I've no idea. We'll get a rock and rock and
roll Indiana Jones going in on this case. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
(47:50):
good luck. I heard that that you seem poised to
pursue a theater track and you would offer to offer
a scholarship to uh Shakespeare Repertory Theater. When when did
music overtake the urge to be in theater for you?
And it was probably in the same h literally the
same time, friend, because at the school that I used
(48:12):
to go to in the world, which is twenty minutes
away from Liverpool where I used to live with my
mom and my grandmother. Um, at the end of each year,
you do a performance. You know, there'd be a performance
of some sort and one part of it was theater
or or any artistic creativity that you kind of come
(48:32):
up with. And so I my best friend, Justin Clayton
again had been taking uh guitar lessons from our gym
teacher who was a rock and roller still around Mr
wind Uh and you had, you know, grease back d
a head. You know, we're walking around school like that,
(48:54):
and we're going and then on the break school breaks,
you know, between lessons or if you have it, he
would teach people, you know, rock and roll on on
acoustic guitar. I mean, I mean, I have to admit
half the Magic Dragon was the first song we learned.
But but it did move quickly into you know, uh,
(49:18):
actually a lot of Chuck Berry track, roll Over Beethove
and and uh, well but let's go on uh and
quite a few other rock and rollers. And so we
got to a point where there was a few of
us but we said let's and I think any I
think we were thirteen or fourteen. It was the same
(49:40):
time at the end of the year, I was in
a place, one of the places, and we were also
performing at the first time, for the first time ever,
and so you know, I think I sang a couple
of songs, justin sang a couple of songs. Yeah, it
was a real rough rough Randy's little bands year old.
(50:03):
But um, once you get that, like most musicians say that,
that feedback, instantaneous feedback from the audience, you know, cheering
and clapping and all that. After a three and a
half minute song, you just go, why do anything else?
So that was it? That was That was literally it,
(50:27):
Why do anything else? That? This is fun? Yeah, that
was it. I feel like for for anyone who really
loves music, there's a crucial moment when they when they
discover songs for themselves. It's not something that they heard
through their parents or somebody else. There's a band that
they like that that's there's that's you know, really feels personal.
Who was that for you? I know you've talked about
(50:49):
Keith Jared and Steely Dan of cour were some other
people that really like made you fall in love with
music and something that was really belonged to you. Well,
I mean, I you know, in the earlier teen years.
I was very much a rocker. You know, my my
bands at that time were were I mean, the Beatles
were in there somewhere, but predominantly I was listening in
(51:14):
my youth, my early leather jacket biking youth were you
know a C d C. That was the first band
with Bond Scott. So that's the first band I ever
went to see. What Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You could
smoke in theaters and I was a heavy smoker even
(51:36):
at sixteen. Uh and uh and I'm clean as a
whiffle now, but yeah, bomb brain Dead, Okay, Angus was
sitting on bond scott shoulders. You know. Well, Angus is
soloing around the aisle. I remember running out and touching,
(51:58):
because that's what you did, touched your hero. Uh, touching
Pont's got an anger with my cigarette hand of course,
and then that being knocked into me and burning me.
So that was great of a very vivid memory of that. Uh.
The other band that that was an early one for
me was Rush. I loved Rush because of their They're
(52:22):
insane chord changes and melodies and melodies, and I mean
they're playing alone. I mean Neil Pert was just like
you know, I mean they were, they were all amazing
and I you know, the very serious h exams that
you have to do in England were at your O
levels and then your A levels. On the night of
(52:44):
my own levels, I was at Rush and then don't
kids don't do this home? And then turned up in
school going what are we doing today? Hence why I
have so many qualifications? What Toro was a permanent wave story,
you know whatever. Whenever I was seventeen. I couldn't even
(53:06):
tell you at this point, but I was one of
the first there. I was right the change, you know,
on the to the left side at the front of
the stage and uh yeah, then climbed back in the window,
you know, in the middle of the night. Yeah for
that being caught, I don't even think Mummy about that.
Some things are not meant to be talked about. Uh so. Yeah.
(53:30):
But aside from that, yeah, I mean I really did
get stuck at well. Led Zepp used to be an
absolute favorite. Um, I mean, Ronnie James, d O Black Fabbits,
you know, the list goes on. Uh and but then
you know, with the likes of Rush really taking me
on a slightly different journey than hearing stuff like Keith
(53:51):
Jarret my Clone concert, I just went to really do
because I started at that time. Mom Mom bought me
a piano for my I think sixteenth birthday, sixteenth or seventeen,
and I used to compose these twenty minute long instrumental
pieces just by ear. And then you know, I heard
about Keith Jared and I I went, oh, God, there are
(54:14):
guys that do that. But obviously I thought at that
time that if I wanted a career, and you know,
I'm not going to be a jazz classical player like
him and improv player, although I could have become that
if pushed that, but I thought, yeah, you know, I
wouldn't try writing song songs. So it was it was
(54:35):
because I used to write these long pieces. The idea
of editing that down to three to five minutes it
was a bit of a nightmare. So it was. It
was a self taught learning process of how to chop
those kind of chords into songs like this. And that's
why I've always looked for the unexpected chord to move
(54:56):
to next and or melody. I mean, there is some
sense in of regularity and rock and roll that you
can only have so many chords. But I do try
and write, try to write interesting passing chords or melodies
that are not the norm. Because the moment I hear
something in the world i'm writing that sounds anything like
(55:17):
anybody else's, I've got to move away from that immediately.
Uh yeah, Okay, obviously there are sometimes you just can't
avoid that, but I try my best too. But yeah,
clone concert, Keith Jarrett Steely, Dan again, melody melody, melody music. Uh,
(55:39):
just presence they're playing their technique. Uh again. Not that
I've mentioned this too often before, but actually, you know,
people say, yeah, come over and jam. No, I'm not
coming over and jam um. I can barely remember not
my name or the three or four chords of stand
(56:01):
by Me. Here's Here's the reason why is because I'm
not a practicing musician, you know. I my sole purpose
in life is not to be a musician. There are
too many other creative outlets that I love. So the
thing is, so I don't sit there playing every day
at all. I sit there to discover and write songs
(56:22):
I played by ear and I don't know what I'm
doing at the time. And I had this one occasion
where I had this complex twenty minutes piece and Herbie
Hancock came to the house and I said, will you
do pay this piece professionally? He said, what is that card?
I'm going I don't know. I don't know. How come
(56:45):
you don't know what it is? What the fucking jazz
masters is? My friend? You know you're the master on
anyway major seven flat nine with a thing of the base. No,
I don't know what that is. I don't want to
know what that is because if I knew, then it
wouldn't be a mystery to me. And mystery um so,
so he said, George, you have to learn to read
(57:07):
and write music so you can translate between your musical
partners that don't want to. I'm not going to do
that because then I would know what I'm doing, and
I don't want to know what I'm doing. That's about
That's I think I've done the same thing with every
creative outlet that I've gone into. Not a brigging clue.
That's why I have imposter Uh what's the impostor syndrome?
(57:29):
You but why how for all you've accomplished and achieved?
But yeah, this is why I'm you know, it's what
do you call it an overachieve or not, but it's
part of that. Yeah, I feel like I don't you know,
this is why I'm trying to find my way and
I do all this stuff. It's because I don't know
who knows. Um. So yeah, so I I can't just
(57:53):
be given in the guitar and told to play a song.
Don't do it. It's never appealed to me that to
do that. I don't know why. I'm a little jealous
of real players, but I just I'm too busy with
all the other crap that's going on in my head. Um,
And you know, people think, oh, such a diesel. Now. Literally,
(58:15):
I can't remember my own bloody lyrics for christ if
I'm not and I'm not judging, if I have to
go and play a show or I have to go
and rehearse, I don't know what chords I'm playing, I
don't know what the lyrics are. Again, have to rehearse
like anybody learning the song for the very first time.
I have to do that. So when when when the
(58:38):
idea of playing live, going on tour is an idea
that's a very big consideration for me. It's because it's
not just getting up there and doing it. I've got
to relearn every song I ever wrote, and you know,
in every way. So it's just it's it's a big
thing for me to do that because again I'm one
(58:59):
of these people that I do something right, record that,
put it away, put it out next, I'm onto the
next thing. I don't want to be there anymore. I'm
over there already, you know. So that's that's who I
am and where my head is at. I don't want
to stay still for a second. I might miss something,
you know, owards that's that's really me. That's it in
(59:22):
a nutshell, nutshell well that is I think a beautiful
note to end on. I want to let let you
get to your get to the next thing that you
need to move on to. But just thank you so
much for your time today, and most importantly, thank you
for your music. I've been a huge fan and it's
such an art to thank, a real pleasure. I hope
to see you in person one day. We hope you
(59:47):
enjoyed this episode of Inside the Studio, a production of
I Heart Radio. For more episodes of Inside the Studio
or other fantastic shows, check out the I Heart Radio app,
Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcast
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the
Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan Runts Hog,
but that's enough about me. My guest today is a
man of many talents. He's a gifted photographer, filmmaker, and
author who has raised millions for global charitable causes through
his White Feather Foundation. He's a man on the move,
(00:22):
but musical talent, you could says in his blood. His
platinum selling solo debut is a lot reached the upper
echelons of the charts across the globe on the strength
of melodic maister works like too Late for Goodbyes, Say
You're Wrong, and of course the title track. A string
of well loved albums were to follow, with Help Yourself
being a personal favorite, and now he's gearing up to
(00:44):
release his first new record in more than a decade.
The album in question is called Jude, named for the
Beatles classic he inspired as a young boy over half
a century ago. It helps mark a season of reflection
for the artist, whose relationship with his familiar legacy hasn't
always been easy. Earlier this year, he staged the fundraiser
auctioning n f T s based on memorabilia from his
(01:05):
personal collection heirlooms to him a musical history for the
rest of us. Days ago, he stunned fans by performing
his father's song Imagining publicly for the very first time.
It was part of the Global Citizens Stand Up for
Ukraine's social media rally campaign, which has already raised ten
point one billion euros for Ukrainian aid. Though reluctant to
(01:27):
sing the song for years, the performance proved to be
a Catharsis forum and a delight for the rest of
us to say. He's reconciled with his past as a
little too simplistic, but the joy and lightness of being
as a parent on Jude, which is due out later
this year. He announced the album with a stirring double
a side single, Every Little Moment, backed with Freedom. Both
(01:48):
are badly needed messages of hope and soulace, much in
the spirit of Imagine fifty years ago. It's my pleasure
and privilege to welcome Julian Lennon. I hope you enjoy
our conversation a fraction as much as I do. Well.
(02:08):
It is such such an honor to speak to you.
I've been a fan of yours for for so many years,
and you you have new music on the way, Jude,
which I've been privileged to hear, and it is just incredible.
Um you had the whole album, yes, and it is
absolutely remarkable. And it sounds like this album has its
roots back in in some tapes that date back to
the vlat era. I think, how did this hold correct
(02:30):
Jude project begin for you? The jew journey? You know, Listen,
I never stopped doing music one way or another. I
may leave it alone for a few months here and there,
or even six months, you know, or even a year sometimes,
but it's always there, you know. And a couple of
years ago, um, I was changing business management, and I
(02:55):
found that they had boxes, literally boxes in their basement
of all my earlier stuff, I mean real too reels
of too Late for Goodbyes, a lot, and um all
the other demos that we put back together in those days.
I think we were using an old Fostex six track
or something like that four track I don't even know anymore. Um.
(03:18):
And then I also found a bunch of cassettes, you know,
I mean, okay, let's say not a bunch of hundreds
of cassettes, and that that tapes and the elysis twelve
track tapes and just a whole bunch of stuff, and
I thought, oh, and they were They've been left just
(03:39):
in an open dust in the basement, you know, out
of boxes. This is why, this is why I'm changing
business management right bringing there, So I m and I
was praying that they were, that they were going to
be okay, sent them off to you know, I found
that what whichever the top digital transfer company was, they
(04:04):
baked the tapes and then they transfer all of them,
uh you know into downloadable or c d s or whatever.
And fortunately all the stuff in there was was still
listenable and or usable as well. So, um, you know,
I've I've found a lot of stuff in there that
(04:24):
I'm still catalogic, you know, that potential thing, you know,
good ideas, uh co write ideas this that you know.
But I came across a few of from thirty years
ago that when I used to live here in l A,
when I used to have a little home studio and
my garage and and even in my little guest bedroom
(04:47):
at that time, and uh, there were some tracks there
that I'd always loved, but they never sat right with
what I was doing at that particular point in time.
They were kind of I won't say there were one off.
They were just different grooves and different headspace and they
just didn't sit with anything I was doing over the
last thirty years. Um. And so as it was time
(05:09):
to well, not time, but I was, I was. I
was planning on, uh, releasing a few things, you know,
singles and EPs. Maybe that was about it wasn't really
planning on an album. And uh so I with my
old my old, oldest best friend in the world, Justin Clayton,
(05:30):
who co wrote with me on many of the albums
and went on world tours with me. Um, he'd taken
an engineering course, so we started going through all this
stuff and it was a lot easier for him to
catalog this stuff than for me. You know, I'd be there,
but he'd be doing all the text stuff. And we
realized that some of those songs, like every Little Moment
(05:52):
and not one Night in particular, were you know and
love Don't Let Me Down. Uh, you know, it was
anywhere between thirty I mean a mix between thirty twenty
and ten years of different work and in the process
of let's say upgrading it, upgrading, the updating the production
(06:17):
on the tracks, you know, putting new drums with great
drummers on, you know, new keyboards here and there predominantly
the track within great nick Um like Every Little moment
the verse vocals are from thirty plus years ago. Uh,
(06:38):
same with not One Night, and except the new vogue,
new new vocals which were done about five years ago
were on the choruses of every Little moment Um. And
so I started doing a you know, updating a bunch
of old stuff. But in the process I started playing
around with new ideas. And what really took a left
(06:58):
turn with this why us that when COVID hit, Justin
had to go back to England where he lives. And
so we were in the middle of doing stuff and
you know, I think we've finished about five tracks, um
not mixed, but had ruff mixes. Justin goes back and
now I'm confronted with the idea that if I want
(07:20):
to get anything done, I'm probably going to have to
engineer it myself and do it myself. Um. You know,
we do a bit of the zoom you know, and
the audio movers, which is so we can play music
in real time and stuff and hear each other work.
But I took on that I started Freedom in fact,
(07:40):
was the first song that I started to engineer and
produce myself, just on my own in lockdown. They wondering
if I can even do it? Yeah, and Freedom came
out and it had such well I should I say Freedom?
I I finished Freedom, and I just of the vibe
(08:01):
that came out of this learning process again of trying
to create music without really knowing what I was doing,
and just engineering my way backwards really into figuring what
to do, and I think out of doing all of
these older songs and new songs in roughly the same
(08:23):
time period over the last three or four years. You know,
there was some semblance of connection there sonically because it's me,
but it was really Spike uh Stent that the mixer
that you know, once I had the framework of the
album and the list and the tyle, passing it on
(08:43):
to him one track at a time literally over the
course of a year, which was to mix it was
was was you know, an effort in a struggle and
and and difficult. But what I think he brought to
the table because he has such a specific style too,
was for me, if I thought I got the best
(09:05):
out of the rough mixes, you know, and I thought
there were nine or ten in my my in my
humble opinion, I think uh, Spike took it up to
you know, I call what he did a Nigel. He
turned it up to number A Liven literally. So so
(09:30):
there's there's a there's a a soundscape that's now built
because of the way he's taken what we did justin
I did in the in the in the production, and
he's just made it. There's not wall of sand, but
certainly there's a feel and a flow sonically throughout the
whole thing, even though there's quite a few different song
(09:51):
types really you know, I mean there really are. It's
not like the same theme all the way through, but
again sonically and because it's me doing it, it's a
there is a connection all the way through. And because
of the way the order in which the songs were placed.
Because for me, if you're going to do an album album,
(10:13):
uh you know, the idea that we're going to do
vinyl on this, then that then you have to have,
you know, because the true listeners will play the tracks
all the way through the way they're meant to be.
And I you know, I'd like to follow Adele and
in what she did that. If you're going to listen
to this album, you're listening to it in this particular order.
(10:36):
And I think that's correct as an artist, you know,
to be able to say, please listen to it the
way it's meant to meant to be. You know, it's
sequenced for a reason. You know, we're not just splashing
paint at the war here. There's this specifics involved here,
you know, in in your emotional journey that you're tasting.
I completely agree. I mean, songs hit you in a
(10:58):
different way depending on how you're feeling, and the music
of the prior track will completely influence that on the
um on the release for this record, you've you've called
it a coming of age album and hearing you talk
about sort of the learning of of how to to
engineer on a song like Freedom Again, was that sort
of something like that that factor into Was that sort
(11:19):
of why it feels more of a of a coming
of age? Not really, to be honest with you, it
was more about, you know, the whole lockdown thing was
very very heavy. You know, I was I was in
the South Trench in Monica. It was you know, you
(11:39):
couldn't leave the house without written paperwork, saying for you
know that what you're going out for, you were only
allowed out for one hour, whether that's walking, you know,
getting some kind of exercise or going to the nearest
grocery store, and uh, you were only allowed out within
one kilometer. So it was it was heavy, you know.
(12:03):
The first I loved it because no cars, no noise,
but wind in the trees, peace and quiet. It was
glorious at first. I really, you know, everybody was panicking
a little. I don't know, it's quite nice and to
be to be honest with you, I hadn't stayed home
for more than a few months at a time anyway,
(12:25):
because they're all was working, traveling, whether it's phot dog
feed documentaries or whatever, children's consent. You know, the list
goes on. But this this was very much a moment
of reflection. You know, a lot of the songs. You know,
although I'm i'm i'm I'm putting it out there as
an idea to people as listeners, but you know, it's
(12:47):
looking in the mirror. Really, I mean, in all honesty,
it's therapy. It's looking in the mirror. It's asking me
all those questions that you're hearing about. I mean, that's
really what this is about. You know. I I always
write about things that I know or I'm dealing that
I'm going through. Um, you know, and as I've said
regarding even every little moment, this is about the internal
(13:11):
struggles of war that we have with ourselves more than
anything else. Yes, it reflects upon the world and what
we have to deal with on the outside, the wars
that we deal with, But it's mostly about, you know,
if you can fix this first, you know, as they
always say, you know, you know, if you can fix
yourself first, if you can love yourself first, then you'll
(13:33):
be able to love the rest of the world. So
that is where the basis from all this comes from.
It's just going through that journey on different slightly different
musical styles. But you know, so yeah, that's you know,
That's what I can say really about it in that
regard that, and also I guess the other thing in
(13:56):
regards to calling it Jude was that, yeah, it's coming
of age. In regards to Dad the Beetle's that song, um,
you know number one, especially with imagine as we might
talk about. You know, I was fearful. I never said
I would never sing it. I just said you know,
(14:19):
it'll be one day when the time is right and
it's appropriate. Um. And so you know a week ago
when I said, yes, okay, now is the time, I thought, oh, b'ga,
how am I going to do this? Yeah, because I
literally for thirty years been afraid for this moment, that
(14:40):
moment to come. Yeah, because you know, listen, the media
has been beating me up for the most part for
you know, thirty years. Um, and I've just been slowly
but surely. No, I'm not giving up screwed a lot
of you. I'm doing I'm doing it this way. This
is why I Also, I delved into so many other
(15:01):
creative fields because also I wanted a platform of work
that I knew I was capable of. And you know,
fortunately I've been very I've had a very lucky run
with the children's books New York Times best seller Would
Kiss the Ground, the documentary that was Borderline up for
an Oscar. But I mean we were close, um, um,
(15:23):
you know, and just the White Feather foundational of the
work that we do on that front. Um. But it
was about addressing the song you know, hey Jude, um
and listening to the words and sort of coming to
terms with the words and and finally being finding my place,
(15:46):
especially after doing imagine, at some kind of place of
peace in my life, i e. Not Being anxious about
being me anymore, not being anxious or afraid being me anymore,
coming to terms with being who I am, and being
who I am on so many levels is June. So
(16:09):
I figured here and now this is it. I'm chucking
it all in in a good way, not throwing it away,
chucking it in and you know, keeping my fingers across
and or I mean, I've got to say the last
week ten days has been mind blowing for me because
I've never had such positive across the board response, not
(16:32):
only to my dad's so I imagine, but but even
for the two news songs that have just come out,
and and uh, you know, we'll continue to throw things
out there for for for you know, the next few months,
and then of course kind of autumn time ish will
(16:52):
be you know, getting the album out there, especially in
final so you know, it's all good, you know. I
feel I feel, probably for the first time ever, that
I can walk around with not being afraid and with
my head held high, you know, because I've always been
people have always been kind of weird with me in
(17:14):
the past, that either staring at you across the room
or you know, if you go into a particular like
on the road in the older days, we stopped at
a diner and you know, they just put Beatles songs
on to see if I reacted, to see if it
was me. That's terrible. Really, really, that's what you've got,
(17:34):
you know, that's all you've got, said, I used to
I used to have to deal with that crap all
the frigging time, so it was so frustrating. But really,
just can't you just come up and say, hey, you Julian,
you know, and it's you know. So anyway, I'm over
all of that now. I think I've laid my foundation
(17:54):
on many levels of what I do and I'm proud
to big doing everything that I'm doing now. So it's
a different it's a different world, you know, I'm feeling
I'm like, maybe just a little bit of an adult
I am. I'm so happy to hear you say that,
and no, no, but just to hear that that that
(18:20):
you feel that happiness and you know I was it. Um.
I mean, it's interesting for me to hear to hear
that you say you were nervous to do that song because,
as as a fan of both yours and your father's,
I think all that we just wanted to to was
it cathartic for you? I suppose is the question? Massively? Massively?
(18:41):
I mean, this is why I can walk partly half
the reason why I can walk around with my headheld high.
Because you know, again, when I said yes, I thought,
how the brig am I going to do this? How
am I going to do it? Where it makes sense
to me, where it's real to me, it's honest and
truthful from my perspective. Honor him, but do it. I
(19:05):
have to find my own way. And the first thing
I thought at the moment I said yes, I said,
I can't do it on piano. Piano gives it a
certain style of rhythm. It's, you know, a bit of
a honky donk plunky donk. And I mean, don't get
me wrong, it's still an incredible, beautiful song in the
way it was the original, of course, but I needed
to find a different way. Um and I immediately just thought, okay,
(19:28):
acoustic guitar. Acoustic guitar that changes the field could give
it not a swing, but a little more looser than
the original. And I thought, well, okay, who do I know.
That's a great guitarist that I can reach out to
tomorrow for today. Uh and it's free on Tuesday, um
and um and has a studio and of course no
(19:51):
bet fot Night had done Karma Police for another charitable
thing when we were in lockdown, you know, so we
did the whole video, uh, you know, a continents apart,
but it worked together, and we worked very well together.
So I got in touch with him, said no, no,
imagine Tuesday acoustic guitar. So he said, yeah, great. He
(20:12):
just flown in. He'd been in the Azores in Portugal,
which is where he's from. And and so I turned
up in his house and he hadn't even played the
song through yet, and so I went, you haven't haven't
rehearsed it? He said no, you know, I figured we'd
(20:33):
just do it, you know, ok, let's do it now
because I got to figure out if it's works or not.
And anyway, we literally sang it, literally sang it through
maybe twice, just sitting on the terrace outside, and went, okay,
like that field, let's just do it. And so we
(20:56):
go in this little studio. I mean, it's a tiny, little,
you know studio, and he laid down just one rough
of the guitar and I came in sang it about
four times, just picked the best nuances and the most
honest approach um. And you know, the idea was to
(21:16):
sing it as as as raw as possible, as as
true to Dad's version as possible, but with my own nuances.
My I said, I tend to sit back when I
sing rather than being on the beat, so I'm not
a little more loose. I'm not sure if that's the
(21:37):
right word, but and so you know, and once we've
done that, I just went, okay, that feels okay, it
feels right. There are imperfections, without questions, but but leieve
that because it's real, and I don't want that. This
cannot be a produced thing, you know, it just has
(21:58):
to be raw me. No, no, thank you very much.
And then I booked a studio the next day for
the idea of a video because we needed one. And
we go to the studio and there's a great d
op thor who knew brought him with this company, Atlantis,
(22:20):
and I just said, I was looking for high contrast,
you know, different dark light, and the manager of the
studio said, we we we've got some candles. He comes
out with like fifty candles, you know, fake. I said,
can't we get some real ones? So we get the
(22:40):
real you know, I said, no, you'll burn the place down, okay,
and understood, I won't burn the place down, but I
know what you're saying. So so I where the studio is,
Capital Studios. It's Hollywood, you know, I said, listen, there's
got to be some shops around here to have the flickering,
you know, fake candles too. So I sent my poor manager,
(23:03):
Rebecca out walking the streets, not in that manner of course,
looking for flickering candles, and she came back with about
another fifty. So, uh, you know, we just laid them down,
turn the lights out, and then I thought that we'd
have something placed around us for a bit more. Luck
(23:23):
just used the light of the candle. That was it
the whole thing, um. And luckily with the Capital Studios,
they had about, you know, thirty mic stands which we
take the candles onto around the room. But at the
end of the day, I mean I think we did
again two or four takes and just cut it together
(23:46):
and that was it and when we all saw it,
but you know, the finished thing, we just went that
you couldn't be more honest or all with the production
than the way we did it. You know. Anyway, again, Uh,
the response has just been uh jaw dropping, I mean
truly jaw dropping, so much so that you know, we
(24:10):
have to release it as a single, you know, I
mean talk about timing here. I'm trying to release the
news new music and this thing is getting in the way.
Only joking, but we have to release it as a
single soon. We're just putting all the pieces together to
make it work because you know, I mean with everything
(24:32):
going to uh stand up for Ukraine and other refugees
around the world, so that that's the idea that we
throw it out there, all the money goes to that
A S A p M. Because it would be stupid,
not too so. Not that that's competing with the other work,
with the other new work. In fact, I think they're
(24:53):
embracing each other. And that's the kind of feeling and
response I'm getting, uh, you know from the I'm like,
I'm looking at all social platforms and just read through
and I'm like, wow, Okay, this is great. This is great.
You know, I don't think I've been so widely accepted ever,
So I'm happy with that for a change. And the
(25:16):
great thing is, you know, if I've gone out, you know,
out and about, you know, I thought, okay, it might
be weird and might get botton again. I'm going to
keep the mask on to go shopping in some places
I do. But funnily enough, people, anybody that has running
(25:36):
to me is just said, love the new stuff, love
the magic. I'm going that's great, thank you on one's
and upwards. That's what I said. So it's been you know,
it's been magical. I've said it's been magical, probably for
the first time I ever like that, so well deserved.
(26:08):
It's a it's a beautiful thing you're doing, and it's
a beautiful version of your dad's song and beautiful new music.
I mean, I just the new record is just so astonishing.
I wanted to ask you mean you mentioned this earlier
that you know, you're obviously an incredibly accomplished photographer and filmmaker,
both art forms that require a gift for observation. I
was wondering if the same applied to uh to your songwriting.
(26:32):
Do you get more inspiration from looking outward or looking inward,
but both listen. Predominantly the stuff is written about my experiences,
what I've gone through, what I'm going through. But it's
of course observation of friends and other people that I
see what they're doing and what they're dealing with and
what they're going through. Um, you know, so it was
(26:56):
both ways. I don't overthink it, you know, just if
something comes to mind, I'll just run with it and
try and make it work as a piece, as a poem,
as a song, as a you know, uh uh for
me again, for me, it has to mean something. It's
(27:16):
and also with most things I do, you know, I
look at it like cooking because I'm a closet chere
uh and ye know, it's about adding the right ingredients
for me, at least for a song. Um yeah, whatever
you're saying lyrically has to have to the sound and
(27:39):
motion of the track has to The melody has to
send that same message. The song has the same the
same message. The music has to say the same message,
so that if you played the melody or the lyrics
or the song independently, they would all give you the
same feeling. And when all those three or whatever amount development.
(28:00):
When all of that comes together, that's when I get
goose sponsed to go, oh yes, that feels okay. If
I feel that somebody else has got to feel that,
come on please, So that's you know, that's where it's at.
That's how I how I do think. Is there for you?
You're gonna hang up on me for asking this question?
Is there an element of superstition involved for you? Is
(28:22):
there a time of day that you feel is your
your your time to write, or a special instrument that
you feel is I don't want to call it a
lucky instrument, but is there is there some sort of
supernatural element to songwriting for you? Um? With everything I
do again, has it has? Number one? It has to
be organic. Can't be it pushed issue creatively, can't do it,
(28:46):
don't want to do it. Didn't that if I if
I try to do that, it doesn't feel real to me.
Uh so yeah, That's why I say that I can
go without, you know, writing and recording for months, you know,
just if it doesn't if it's not doing something for me.
(29:07):
And that's why that's why I'm happy I've found so
many other outlets Because if that's not working for me.
Now I'm going to go and do that. Um, I
need to find one outlet that just says, lie on
the beach, say for for a month, don't do anything,
give yourself a bloody rest, will you. That's what I need.
(29:29):
That outlet like on a plane to an island. That's
what I did with no no stress. At some point
I'll get there soon. Would you actually enjoy that? Or
would you get there and think, okay, all right, I
need to I need to work on a book now,
or I need to work in a film or something,
you know. Funnily enough, it's like what I what I
do love to do is either get on a motorbike
(29:50):
because I'm a biker, have always been since my teens.
Either that or a convertible weather permitting, of course. Uh.
And I love going for drives, you know. Uh. My
thing wherever I go for for the first time, you know,
I look at him at once and then throw it
(30:13):
away and then discover where I am and I'll just drive.
I'll take a camera with me. It's like a few
years ago when I was here and I had an
afternoon enough and I kept hearing about the Sultan Sea.
So I just went. I just went for the afternoon,
drove there, fell in love with it, had my camera
(30:34):
with me. Now I've got a whole collection of Sultan
Tea images that I absolutely adore. Almost run out of
petrol in the mini in the middle of blackness and
was worried that I was going to be taken in
the back somewhere whatever that means. But you know, fortunately
I found a guest station. Or I've been running on
empty for a long time. So I like risks and
(30:55):
challenge sometimes, you know, I don't. I like again, I
like things happening organically. If it's if it's scheduled or
it's planned, I'm not really interested, you know. In fact,
I get anxious from planned an organized things. Really truly,
It's like waking up in the morning. If I if
(31:16):
I can't wake up naturally, you're going to get me
in a funny mood all day, no alarms. Oh, I agree,
if only, if only? But yeah, you know, that's that's
the dream when I'm on when I'm on my own
working schedule, is wake up when you wake up naturally,
and okay, let's go. You know, I I'm not sure
(31:41):
I might be reading more into this than you intended.
But I loved the opening track save Me, especially of Jude,
and I thought it was an interesting sentiment given your
your previous song and album Help Yourself. I wasn't sure
quite how much they were in conversation with each other,
or if there was any connection. It's all in conversation
with each other. I believe you me Um uh yeah,
(32:07):
I mean again, it's it's all. It's all about looking
in the mirror and questioning yourself and trying to figure out,
how do you balance this weird life, this weird existence,
this weird world. How do you make it work? Where
you're not? You don't wake up fearful and full of
anxiety every morning, which is something I've lived with for
(32:29):
a long time. There was a few years back before
COVID that I woke up with pure just fear in
my heart for the day and anxiety just you know,
just what what's going to be thrown at me today. Um.
But all of the questions that I've presented to myself,
(32:50):
I think I've I've found a pathway through that. I
can't say specifically what those things are, but a lot
of it comes down to and there won't say specific meditation.
But it's about it's about taking a minute out to breathe,
you know, to really just say, shut it all out,
(33:11):
somewhere nice and quiet and just free focus on the
moment and that it will go and think about the
things that are really important and that really matter. And
when you do that, you realize that the rest really
doesn't matter. I mean, it does, but not in the
way that it should affect you, you know that. Uh.
(33:33):
I mean, obviously we were aware of the world around
us and the problems we face, and the fact that
it seems that for thousands of years we haven't learned anything,
which that which is staggering, especially now when we have
more available means of communication and learning, and we're still
bloody idiots. You know, it's unbelievable. It's mind boggling, you know.
(33:58):
Uh yeah, I'll leave that one at that one. How
do you quiet your mind though, for those times of
the day when you're when you're taking a moment to breathe,
because I'm I know I struggle with that, and I'm
sure so many other people do as well. But the
moment that they should be taking to to take and
have a breath, I think, oh well, I could take
this moment to actually do all the things that are
(34:18):
stressing me out. And how do you quiet those thoughts
and actually have that moment be something that replenishes you.
Sometimes it's very difficult, you know. I mean one of
my results was again as I said, getting in the
car and going for a drive, putting some music on,
looking at some different scenery. Um, that ninety of the
(34:42):
time works. But there are some times that it just
that anxiety of that fear just doesn't disappear. And I think, again,
as you just mentioned, I think doing stuff, getting the
list out of the way, whatever that says, whatever it
means on a personal or working level or business level,
(35:06):
or again looking in the mirror and just going okay, okay, yeah,
talking sense into yourself sometimes you know. Um, but I think, yeah,
I you know, I think it's not This is why
I'm such a doer, is because because if I don't
(35:27):
get things done, you know they're on the list, then
it stresses me out. You know, it just does. It's
an accumulative thing that can build to horrific levels. But
you know, this is why I like to call Monday
second Sunday. I'm taking that that's good because no question
(35:53):
about it. Even if I tell everybody to leave me alone,
somebody will be touched with me about work over the weekend.
And so funnily enough, I try as much as I
can to block out Monday so that it becomes it
really becomes you know, the world's open and doing stuff,
but I have time to breathe and do things, and
(36:15):
then Tuesday come into it full time. And you know,
isn't there this whole new thing. At least the Japanese
have been doing it for a long time, you know,
And a lot of companies are considering this is making
it a three four day work week, because not only
does this allow you a greater amount of rest of
breathing and time with your family, living, et cetera. But
(36:40):
you know it it distresses people because you know, we've
a weekend is a spec in the in the moment
of time, and all we do is we're working. We're
just bloody working non stuff. And then you you know,
you're you're supposed to retire it whatever, age sixty six,
and then you've got, you know, a few years left
(37:01):
to enjoy what you know, you're falling down. You you
can't see anything or hear anything anymore. What's that about? No,
So you know, and also they've they've proved that work
efficiency is through the roof when people have more time
with their friends and family and have moments to enjoy life. So,
(37:23):
you know, people and then you're determined that you have
this time period, which just go for it. And I'm
kind of borderline that, you know. So, um, it works.
It's working for me, that's for sure. You know. Uh.
Obviously there are schedules sometimes that you can't change, but
for the most part, you know, I can get my
(37:44):
second Sunday. I'm going for it. You know, this either
feels like a very appropriate or very inappropriate segue. But
but do you have plans to do? You have plans
to to toward you? Um? Are you listening? Thought about
it for years again, um. But the thing was that
I again I said to myself anywhere I really got
(38:07):
on the road again. I came up with an idea
literally about twenty years ago. A friend of mine and I, UM,
I wanted to do things differently, and so I thought,
you know, we're also tied in with the White Feather Foundation,
So I thought, okay, performing arts centers different cities around
(38:28):
the world, I'm not one that likes to go out,
you know, repeatedly and just doing that. I don't. I
don't have that interest or drive. I'd rather be going
to Africa and taking photographs, you know, and seeing new
worlds and and meeting new cultures. So, you know, I
think we will get around too, probably next year. There's
(38:52):
a few things coming up this year that are like
one off with charity with orchestras that that we're looking
at right now. Um But I do like the idea
of doing something in in in UH again in performing
arts theaters with partial or full orchestra, you know, tied
(39:12):
in with White Feather Foundation, UM, tied in the idea
making that we raise the issues, the biggest issues of
the problems in each of the location we've played and
we do the idea is to involve local TV and
radio competitions for the best artwork, the best photography, that
(39:34):
and the other, and that the work UH that is
sent in is judged and by a panel, and that
in the foyer of the places and cities that we
play is the best of the best of the local
art scene, from photography, sculptures to you name it. So
(39:58):
um so making the competition through radio, through TV, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera,
to to involve all of the local community and make
it you know, I think, rather than just hello, tor
bus rolls in. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's that's
(40:18):
my idea of doing something a bit more special, a
bit more unique, and a bit more different and uh
and doing good for the local community at the same time.
(40:48):
A few years back, you had um an exhibit of
your your i'll call umn your family heirlooms in Liverpool
for the White Feather Foundation. Do you have any plans
to do that in the States. I know there was
some complecations there, I think, Well, I mean COVID was accomplicated. Well, yeah,
that is also smaller. I you know, I collected a
(41:08):
fair amount of memorabilious stuff over the last thirty years,
predominantly uh Dad's stuff that was linked to me in
a very personal way, and it was more about collecting.
But I still plan to have a family one day
and just haven't found the right loony to hang with
just yet. Um. But she's out there somewhere. Um. But yeah, no,
(41:36):
it was it was about you know, heritage and legacy
and passing that on too. Hopefully my kids one day,
whenever that happens. But I haven't given up hope. But anyway,
so that was what it was all about. Original and
then there was a few people's items that one. But
that's an expensive world now, you know. Again, people think
(41:57):
that I've had a lot of money from the get go,
but I mean, I you know, when we were moms separating,
you know, we've got a little something. But anyway, it
doesn't cover the cost of a memorabilia, that's for sure.
So uh yeah, I've got a good collection together. And
we did tour it a little bit, as you said,
(42:19):
in Liverpool, which was great, probably the best spot for
it at that time ever really, and then a few
other countries and and I had plans to bring it
out here from museum, a couple of museums we were
talking to um and then you know, COVID and a
few other issues came into play as well. And I
(42:42):
so this is why the whole n f T thing
came out of it. I said, Okay, what's another way
of sharing what I have. I can't I can't tour
this stuff. And I hated being locked up in just
a vault, in a bank vault somewhere, what's the point
in having it, you know, So okay, this is another way,
it's another artistic platform. You know, we're the proportion go
(43:03):
to White Feather Foundation to that being the main thrust
and crups behind this because then I can keep working
on all the u because we only go through uh
a White Feather We just don't. We survived through donations
from the public, so we don't have any major sponsors
this that ne other. It's the people out There's the
(43:24):
fans out there that keep us alive and doing all
the good work that we do. So um, yes, so
the n f T thing came along. I think I'll
probably do a couple of more tied in with with
with some of the stuff I'm doing now. Who knows
what else. You know, we're just talking, but you know,
(43:45):
there are there's some great, great possibilities out then. Of
course I welcome the idea of being able to to
to tour that show, you know, in a couple of
cities through the US and around the world. So you know,
it's it's on a list. It's just had my hands full.
(44:06):
So you know, well we'll get to it. We'll get
to it. Oh, the n f t s were so interesting.
You you have such an incredible collection. I loved that
that Les Paul with the ruby glued to it and
the plague. I mean, how cool is that that was?
I mean I hadn't seen I hadn't seen that like
twenty years because it was in a bloody voult, you know,
(44:26):
just keeping safe. I didn't want to keep it at
home because then who knows what can happen then? And
but yeah, and I like the thing with the n
F T s. I did want to make it different
from anybody else. But thought, okay, well you can't just
have a picture just spinning right. What they all was
that I wouldn't want that. So I thought, okay, what
(44:47):
would I want? Okay, how about it a bit? But
the background story, right, you know, not only you know,
just write a piece about what it means, where it
came from, what the think is to me, and let
me read it. And so that's where they took on
a whole new platform for me and a whole new idea.
(45:09):
Is making it far more interesting for me as far
as NFPs go. There's having that one off vocal experience
on each of the items. Um. But but also you know,
tying in white feather in such a way that that
as long as that was perpetually, you know, making money
(45:31):
from sale or resale or whatever, white feather would survive,
you know, which is partly what it's all about. This
is an unfair question. But is there is there a
favorite of yours in your in your collection of is
there one piece that that means means the most too?
Are just is your favorite for any other reason? I
mean I loved all the guitars because I used to
(45:51):
play them, yeah thirty years ago. Um uh, But I
probably the afghan coat because it fits me. I want
a picture of that maybe all right, we'll see about
that one. I'll make a guess, children with clothes on underneath.
(46:21):
So yeah, because there are you know, there are pictures
of me sitting with dad, you know, with the afghan
coat on the back of the chair, you know, from
Magical Mystery Tour and you know all of that Stuffinitely
are I think anywhere I'm the Wars. I'm not sure
I think it did, but anyway, all that kind of Yeah,
(46:43):
So that one's quite special because you see him wear
it a lot throughout certain films and pictures over the
period that time. Period I read. I don't know if
this is true that, Um, your your picture of Lucy
in the sky with diamonds is owned by Dave Gilmour.
Is that is that true? Do you know where that's at?
(47:04):
I don't know where that's at. Oh yeah, I know
whether I know where that's up. Yeah. I asked him
for it back, UM, to be honest with you. Uh yeah,
And I've said this to Mom. I said, is it
and she went, I don't think so. All right, okay,
(47:27):
because I I don't remember specifically what that during was. Uh.
I thought personally, I thought it was a different one
another one. Um, all right, yeah, I was held. So
I've no idea. We'll get a rock and rock and
roll Indiana Jones going in on this case. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
(47:50):
good luck. I heard that that you seem poised to
pursue a theater track and you would offer to offer
a scholarship to uh Shakespeare Repertory Theater. When when did
music overtake the urge to be in theater for you?
And it was probably in the same h literally the
same time, friend, because at the school that I used
(48:12):
to go to in the world, which is twenty minutes
away from Liverpool where I used to live with my
mom and my grandmother. Um, at the end of each year,
you do a performance. You know, there'd be a performance
of some sort and one part of it was theater
or or any artistic creativity that you kind of come
(48:32):
up with. And so I my best friend, Justin Clayton
again had been taking uh guitar lessons from our gym
teacher who was a rock and roller still around Mr
wind Uh and you had, you know, grease back d
a head. You know, we're walking around school like that,
(48:54):
and we're going and then on the break school breaks,
you know, between lessons or if you have it, he
would teach people, you know, rock and roll on on
acoustic guitar. I mean, I mean, I have to admit
half the Magic Dragon was the first song we learned.
But but it did move quickly into you know, uh,
(49:18):
actually a lot of Chuck Berry track, roll Over Beethove
and and uh, well but let's go on uh and
quite a few other rock and rollers. And so we
got to a point where there was a few of
us but we said let's and I think any I
think we were thirteen or fourteen. It was the same
(49:40):
time at the end of the year, I was in
a place, one of the places, and we were also
performing at the first time, for the first time ever,
and so you know, I think I sang a couple
of songs, justin sang a couple of songs. Yeah, it
was a real rough rough Randy's little bands year old.
(50:03):
But um, once you get that, like most musicians say that,
that feedback, instantaneous feedback from the audience, you know, cheering
and clapping and all that. After a three and a
half minute song, you just go, why do anything else?
So that was it? That was That was literally it,
(50:27):
Why do anything else? That? This is fun? Yeah, that
was it. I feel like for for anyone who really
loves music, there's a crucial moment when they when they
discover songs for themselves. It's not something that they heard
through their parents or somebody else. There's a band that
they like that that's there's that's you know, really feels personal.
Who was that for you? I know you've talked about
(50:49):
Keith Jared and Steely Dan of cour were some other
people that really like made you fall in love with
music and something that was really belonged to you. Well,
I mean, I you know, in the earlier teen years.
I was very much a rocker. You know, my my
bands at that time were were I mean, the Beatles
were in there somewhere, but predominantly I was listening in
(51:14):
my youth, my early leather jacket biking youth were you
know a C d C. That was the first band
with Bond Scott. So that's the first band I ever
went to see. What Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You could
smoke in theaters and I was a heavy smoker even
(51:36):
at sixteen. Uh and uh and I'm clean as a
whiffle now, but yeah, bomb brain Dead, Okay, Angus was
sitting on bond scott shoulders. You know. Well, Angus is
soloing around the aisle. I remember running out and touching,
(51:58):
because that's what you did, touched your hero. Uh, touching
Pont's got an anger with my cigarette hand of course,
and then that being knocked into me and burning me.
So that was great of a very vivid memory of that. Uh.
The other band that that was an early one for
me was Rush. I loved Rush because of their They're
(52:22):
insane chord changes and melodies and melodies, and I mean
they're playing alone. I mean Neil Pert was just like
you know, I mean they were, they were all amazing
and I you know, the very serious h exams that
you have to do in England were at your O
levels and then your A levels. On the night of
(52:44):
my own levels, I was at Rush and then don't
kids don't do this home? And then turned up in
school going what are we doing today? Hence why I
have so many qualifications? What Toro was a permanent wave story,
you know whatever. Whenever I was seventeen. I couldn't even
(53:06):
tell you at this point, but I was one of
the first there. I was right the change, you know,
on the to the left side at the front of
the stage and uh yeah, then climbed back in the window,
you know, in the middle of the night. Yeah for
that being caught, I don't even think Mummy about that.
Some things are not meant to be talked about. Uh so. Yeah.
(53:30):
But aside from that, yeah, I mean I really did
get stuck at well. Led Zepp used to be an
absolute favorite. Um, I mean, Ronnie James, d O Black Fabbits,
you know, the list goes on. Uh and but then
you know, with the likes of Rush really taking me
on a slightly different journey than hearing stuff like Keith
(53:51):
Jarret my Clone concert, I just went to really do
because I started at that time. Mom Mom bought me
a piano for my I think sixteenth birthday, sixteenth or seventeen,
and I used to compose these twenty minute long instrumental
pieces just by ear. And then you know, I heard
about Keith Jared and I I went, oh, God, there are
(54:14):
guys that do that. But obviously I thought at that
time that if I wanted a career, and you know,
I'm not going to be a jazz classical player like
him and improv player, although I could have become that
if pushed that, but I thought, yeah, you know, I
wouldn't try writing song songs. So it was it was
(54:35):
because I used to write these long pieces. The idea
of editing that down to three to five minutes it
was a bit of a nightmare. So it was. It
was a self taught learning process of how to chop
those kind of chords into songs like this. And that's
why I've always looked for the unexpected chord to move
(54:56):
to next and or melody. I mean, there is some
sense in of regularity and rock and roll that you
can only have so many chords. But I do try
and write, try to write interesting passing chords or melodies
that are not the norm. Because the moment I hear
something in the world i'm writing that sounds anything like
(55:17):
anybody else's, I've got to move away from that immediately.
Uh yeah, Okay, obviously there are sometimes you just can't
avoid that, but I try my best too. But yeah,
clone concert, Keith Jarrett Steely, Dan again, melody melody, melody music. Uh,
(55:39):
just presence they're playing their technique. Uh again. Not that
I've mentioned this too often before, but actually, you know,
people say, yeah, come over and jam. No, I'm not
coming over and jam um. I can barely remember not
my name or the three or four chords of stand
(56:01):
by Me. Here's Here's the reason why is because I'm
not a practicing musician, you know. I my sole purpose
in life is not to be a musician. There are
too many other creative outlets that I love. So the
thing is, so I don't sit there playing every day
at all. I sit there to discover and write songs
(56:22):
I played by ear and I don't know what I'm
doing at the time. And I had this one occasion
where I had this complex twenty minutes piece and Herbie
Hancock came to the house and I said, will you
do pay this piece professionally? He said, what is that card?
I'm going I don't know. I don't know. How come
(56:45):
you don't know what it is? What the fucking jazz
masters is? My friend? You know you're the master on
anyway major seven flat nine with a thing of the base. No,
I don't know what that is. I don't want to
know what that is because if I knew, then it
wouldn't be a mystery to me. And mystery um so,
so he said, George, you have to learn to read
(57:07):
and write music so you can translate between your musical
partners that don't want to. I'm not going to do
that because then I would know what I'm doing, and
I don't want to know what I'm doing. That's about
That's I think I've done the same thing with every
creative outlet that I've gone into. Not a brigging clue.
That's why I have imposter Uh what's the impostor syndrome?
(57:29):
You but why how for all you've accomplished and achieved?
But yeah, this is why I'm you know, it's what
do you call it an overachieve or not, but it's
part of that. Yeah, I feel like I don't you know,
this is why I'm trying to find my way and
I do all this stuff. It's because I don't know
who knows. Um. So yeah, so I I can't just
(57:53):
be given in the guitar and told to play a song.
Don't do it. It's never appealed to me that to
do that. I don't know why. I'm a little jealous
of real players, but I just I'm too busy with
all the other crap that's going on in my head. Um,
And you know, people think, oh, such a diesel. Now. Literally,
(58:15):
I can't remember my own bloody lyrics for christ if
I'm not and I'm not judging, if I have to
go and play a show or I have to go
and rehearse, I don't know what chords I'm playing, I
don't know what the lyrics are. Again, have to rehearse
like anybody learning the song for the very first time.
I have to do that. So when when when the
(58:38):
idea of playing live, going on tour is an idea
that's a very big consideration for me. It's because it's
not just getting up there and doing it. I've got
to relearn every song I ever wrote, and you know,
in every way. So it's just it's it's a big
thing for me to do that because again I'm one
(58:59):
of these people that I do something right, record that,
put it away, put it out next, I'm onto the
next thing. I don't want to be there anymore. I'm
over there already, you know. So that's that's who I
am and where my head is at. I don't want
to stay still for a second. I might miss something,
you know, owards that's that's really me. That's it in
(59:22):
a nutshell, nutshell well that is I think a beautiful
note to end on. I want to let let you
get to your get to the next thing that you
need to move on to. But just thank you so
much for your time today, and most importantly, thank you
for your music. I've been a huge fan and it's
such an art to thank, a real pleasure. I hope
to see you in person one day. We hope you
(59:47):
enjoyed this episode of Inside the Studio, a production of
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