Dan Brunner, EX-FBI: Catching Criminals and Keeping Your Kids Safe Online

This week, Leslies speaks with Dan Brunner, a former FBI agent. Dan and Leslie talk about the 764, an online threat to your kids. They also talk about ways to educate your kids about being online and how to keep them safe. Dan also talks about his career catching criminals and how that led him to where he is now.

Hosted by Leslie Dobson. Produced by Liam Billingham. Executive producers are Paul Anderson and Scott McCarthy for Workhouse Media. The views expressed in this podcast episode are solely those of the guest speaker and do not reflect the views of the host or the production company.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Olay, you're here.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
Welcome to intentionally Disturbing. I'm doctor Leslie and this week
I have the honor of speaking to Dan Brunner. He
is former FBI. He is pretty cool. I met him
because I actually poached one of his articles about the
online social media cult seven sixty four that is really

(00:27):
harming and manipulating our children. So we talk a lot
about this, but we also talk about how to educate
your children about being safe and being online. And we
talk about Dan's career where he caught a lot of
criminals like MS thirteen and where he's going now. He's
actually starting a podcast and I can't wait for you

(00:50):
to hear about that as well. Olay, Okay, Dan, thank
you for doing this my pleasure. I'm I'm really excited
to talk to you. I was really excited to talk
to you before, but I just got off the phone
with the dad of a victim of seven sixty four

(01:10):
and now like, I'm emotional and excited to talk to you.

Speaker 3 (01:14):
Yeah, it's it's tough.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
It was a horrifying story, you.

Speaker 3 (01:18):
Know, being a you know, a parent of young children
that are coming up in the age in the time
you know where they're going to start really exposing themselves
on the internet. You know, I'm in the position, you know,
with my background and having been with the FBI, I
have a better position to really be aware. But I'm
less than one percent of this country, you know, of people,
so obviously, you know, we want to get to as

(01:39):
many people and educate people through your platform and through
my website, and you know, educate them and how to
really be prepared and how to stay ahead of these
guys because they really are really just vultures and they're
looking for the opening. So I agreed, I'm glad you
have that.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, I mean, if it's okay with you, maybe well
maybe I'll tell you kind of what this dad told me,
and then we can kind of dive into what this
seven sixty four group is, and then we can jump
into your career as a special agent and Rushed thirteen
and all of these amazing stories you have. So the

(02:20):
way we met was you and I Dan. I poached
one of your articles and made a TikTok and Instagram
video out of it because I thought it was an
incredible article. It went viral, and then this dad stitched
my article on TikTok and said, yeah, it's wonderful that
Interval took down this radicalized group, of this extremist group

(02:43):
seven sixty four, but it pops back up. And even
though the lead guy got taken down, he still got
a bunch of people working under him. And in February
of twenty twenty five, they finally convinced this man's daughter
to kill herself on a live stream, after she had
done five live stream attempts before. So from age thirteen

(03:06):
to sixteen, she was groomed and at sixteen, just a
few months ago, she ended her life.

Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah, no, it's it's horrible situation, and you know, we'll
dive into it deeper, and you know what the you
know what the implications are for the family and parents
and children. And I don't ever I hope I never
ever go through what you know, he experienced. But I'm
glad that he spoke to you because it's important to
get the message out there and to you know, understand

(03:34):
that with the power of the Internet these days, there
is no place that they cannot touch. You know, whether
you live in Bozeman, Montana, or Wayne, New Jersey, or
La you know, California, someone has access to the Internet.
That means they have access to your child. So yeah
we can, we'll be able to discuss that today.

Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I'd love to walk through what can parents look for?
So what this dad was able to see was that
he was the little girl was originally playing on roadblocks
and was asked to help draw pictures and do little
things on roadblocks.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
Innocent, right.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
He thought it was another little girl, and that's what
she started telling her parents because he was telling her
to tell her parents, and it moved into.

Speaker 1 (04:27):
He started to extort her.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
He started to convince her to harm herself in order
to fulfill this bucket list that they have where you
have to do all these things to hurt yourself in
order to earn your place in the group. So now
their kids are like striving to be a part of
these extremist groups. Then what happened was the parents were doxed.

(04:51):
Their cell phones were doxed and they were sent child images.
So once the child images were on the parents' phones,
they were swatted and police and FBI shut up to
their homes to see that there were child images on
their phones. Now it was all it was all cleared up.
The FBI is on their side. They've taken on the case.

(05:14):
But now they are being harassed and they are continuing
to get random phone calls, the videos of their daughter
are being sent to them continuously.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Still, well, see, here's the thing is with seven sixty four,
you'll understand this. Like I dealt with Hispanic gangs, MS thirteenth,
any Thais in a Agua cartels. That's what I did
for the majority of my career. But I also worked
domestic terrorism. I worked to you know, investigating groups with
white supremacy, and this type of crime is now has

(05:46):
been evolved. The fact of all of these other groups
that I was investigating, you know, they are you know,
whether they were drug trafficking or human trafficking. As horrible
as all of these are, it's a profit. It's a
game for them to earn money, for them to grow
their enterprise, for them to grow their organization. With seven
six four, it's just pure evil. It's just pure manipulation

(06:11):
and power to show that they have power over the child,
that they can manipulate them using the Internet and getting
them into a position of power over the child. And
then once they have that power, obviously they're continuing and
then for them it's just the joy of you know,

(06:31):
the evil and these That's why I look at these
people as pure evil. These are people that you know,
don't do anything for profit. They're doing it just because
they can. And that's what makes them like truly evil
that that they want to get you know, financially, they
want to get money. No that they're you know, maybe
they may be extorting at the beginning, but at the

(06:54):
end of the day is they want to get their
you know, their victim to to suffer. They want to
get the family to suffer. That's where they get their
joy from is seeing the suffrage from of all these families.
And that's what makes it even worse, it makes it
even more horrible. And being able to you know, identify

(07:15):
you know, these individuals and just giving your child unfettered
access to the Internet, giving them an iPad without you
putting the security procedures, and all these companies that have
you know, digital devices, iPad, Google, Android devices, they all
have you know, tools for the parent to set up
the structure of no they can't chat. And I've been

(07:37):
very very you know, vehement, you know, with my children
and saying, you know, I'm controlling I am, I am
in charge of the iPad I can see everything. I
can see what you're searching, so that they know that
you know there there's someone over them, that there's no secretive,
there's no you know, secret chatting. They don't chat with
on online groups. They don't do that. I tell them
that that's not allowed. You and I have various structure

(08:00):
rules which you know I can discuss and and how
to really you know, protect your family later on. But
these are the things that I work at and making
sure that my children are best protected based on my training.
I'm based on that, and even and I recognize that
no matter how much I do, there's still gonna be

(08:20):
always a possibility of these individuals getting through my net
because they're one step ahead of us. But what I
look at it is is one of my things that
I do in my company is security consulting. And when
I tell my clients is saying, listen, I'm never going
to be able to say one hundred percent, you won't
be attacked, you won't you know, won't get robbed, you
won't go But what I'm going to do is create

(08:43):
enough barriers between you and the bad guys so they
make it so difficult to get to the victim that
they're going to go on. There's just too much work.
Let's move on to the next target. They're looking for
the one, you know, the child that doesn't have protection,
that doesn't have the parents that are overseeing. I'm not
saying micro manage your children. Sometimes that does have to

(09:05):
be done. You micromanage and you're looking at them. But
there are lots of tools on Apple and Android devices
where you could set it up certain age limits, you know,
and and staying away from certain games. You know, there's
certain games roadblocks and you know that I just don't
give them access to it. And so you know, it's
it's a process of being a parent, and that's our

(09:27):
job because it's.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
People that so with roadblocks.

Speaker 2 (09:32):
Though like for me, like I've never I've never played roadblocks.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
Right, what's happening?

Speaker 2 (09:37):
How are these people getting to the kids through roadblocks?

Speaker 3 (09:41):
Well, I think the relationship they're building a relationship with
the child. So in these rooms where you can look
at it, it's not just roadblocks. You can look at
all all these online platforms PlayStation, you know, in other
video game and Xbox and computers where there's rooms where
you're sitting there with with what you're building and there's

(10:03):
people talking to each other, and those voices can be manipulated.
So your child who is eight, nine, ten, eleven, thirteen
years old is sitting in this room and they're they're
having fun. There's other people that come in and they
strike up a conversation. They may be on other sides
of the planet, they may be on the side of
the world, and to them it sounds like another thirteen
year old. So of course they're going to strike up

(10:24):
a conversation. And then before you know it, these people
know how to get them and manipulate them their minds
to do what they say. Hey, I want you to
you know, can we do this? Can we do this?
And the most important part is and I've taught my children,
and I said that to them plainly from the beginning, said,
if anybody ever ever says to you these words, you

(10:45):
come to me immediately. If anybody ever says to you,
don't tell your parents, because you'll get in trouble if
that ever happens to you. I told them, come to me.
I will not one hundred percent, will not judge you,
I will not punish you. But you come to me
and tell me this, because then that's someone manipulating them.
They're saying, hey, don't tell your parents because you could

(11:06):
get in trouble. Even if it was a fellow eight, nine,
ten year old, that's somebody I don't want my kids
to be friends with because they're doing it for nefarious reasons.
So it's all about really, you know, staying ahead of it.

Speaker 2 (11:20):
Wait, and I think one of the common things is
don't tell your parents.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
Because they'll be killed. I will kill them.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
I mean, it's such an extreme threat. And then they say,
you know, I know your address, I know your parents' names, right, and.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
It's too much for the kids. And that's why I say,
if they ever say to you, don't tell your parents
and then whatever follows, I need to know that first
part where they say don't tell your parents, and then
I could set up a protection around us. We need
to block it off. We need to And there's lots
of different things which I advise my clients on how
to best prepare themselves and how to deal with the situation. Well,

(11:54):
I've got cybersecurity experts that I work with, who you know,
are able to shore up and how to set the
Wi Fi password so you're not be able to hack
and doxing is such a prevalent thing now these days,
where you know, people can threaten I know where you live,
I know your address. See that. But that's too much
for the child who's eight ninety ten to understand. Give

(12:16):
that to the parent. And if the parent doesn't understand,
you reach out for somebody, whether it be local law
enforcement or somebody like myself. You reach out to me,
I will gladly advise you. You know, no charge. I
will talk to you and say, hey, this is what
you need to do. One two three is to shore
up the situation to protect your child because seven six'
four they don't. Care they you know obviously they you,

(12:38):
know they want to. Product they want to they want
to see the. Reaction that's their their narcissism is it's
all about them and seeing how they manipulate the victim
and then by, extension the victim's. Family so it's it's
LIKE i, said it's pure. EVIL i really.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Want to get your tips on how to protect. Kids
but my biggest question is why are are they fucking doing?
This where is this coming?

Speaker 3 (13:02):
FROM i think it's you know, what it's they're finding
people who are clearly. Broken you know mentally. Broken and you,
know as a, society we all know. This we all
know That Jeffrey, dahmers we all know you know the
type of serial. Killers you know that the that in the,
eighties nineties and two, thousands they really hid in the.

(13:23):
Shadows now they're able to hide behind the computer. Screen
they're able to really you, know get to people. Instead
they don't have to go hunt in their. Neighborhood they're
able to hunt in the. World and then they use,
roadblocks they use the other video game platforms as they're
hunting grounds and they're looking for. That and that's the

(13:43):
best way for me to really look at it is
they're getting. Joy and that's What Jeffrey dahmer was interviews
and all these other serial killers they've been And Ted,
bundy you, know they Received they felt joy by having
power over their, victims by having being able to take their.
Lives and this, is you, know a vulnerable member of.

(14:03):
Society and by looking at, THEM i, mean we grew
up in the. Eighties you knew the you, know the
child on the milk cart and on the back of
the milk. Car it happened in the, eighties and now
this is this is this today's version of how they're
getting to our. Children these are the same deprived people,
who LIKE i, said hide behind the computer screen and

(14:24):
do their evil, deeds and they find other people because
of The, internet they find other people that really are able,
to you, know talk to them and understand the same
thing that they're talking. About as joyous as The internet,
is there is an evil side to. IT i mean
it's opening up you, know where you're able to sit
down and talk to people of your own political the

(14:45):
same decision you're your sexual, orientation your religious. Orientation you,
know if uminate have it in your, community then now
these evil people know exactly where to, hide whether it
be in the Dark web or whether it be in
these gaming, sites and they're able to connect and then,
SAY i mean it doesn't have to be in the neighborhood.
Anymore you could have one person In New York, city
one person in la one person In, england and they

(15:07):
just find each other and they're able to work this.
Together and that's how seven and sixty four came to.
Be and you, know purely satanic and evil group.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
Spoken from AN fbi. AGENT i mean your words have
so much. Weight the one thing the dad said to
me today was the platforms have created a place for
predators to sit and.

Speaker 1 (15:29):
Wait it's like a pond full of.

Speaker 3 (15:31):
Fish, yeah that's an excellent way to. Say and you,
know obviously from his, point you know her, perspective he
knows better than anybody. Else and that's what's, horrible is
was his. Loss but he's. Right they're sitting there waiting
for the vulnerable. Thing they're waiting for the target that is.
Unprotected they're not going to sit there and, work, work, work,

(15:52):
work work to try and manipulate or you, know to
have somebody do some evil things to themselves if it's
worked for. Them they want the easy. Target they're looking
for the child that is not. Protected they're looking for
the computer that doesn't have The Wi fi pass or isn't,
restricted or you, know the child that is unaware Of,
hey somebody's talking to. ME i shouldn't be talking to.

(16:14):
Them click you, know turn it. Off you. Know the
awareness that the parents have to have is really important
because you can't depend on the child to be, like,
okay you're going to know at nine ten years old
when somebody, no, no they don't, know and they don't
know and whether the parent, says all my kids are. Fine,
no your kids do not. Know so you, KNOW i

(16:35):
would you, know beg to say, SAYS i don't care
how mature you think your child. Is they are not
ready for seven six. Four and then if you question,
that talk to this. Father you know understand listening to his,
voice they're not ready for seven and six. Four these
people are at another, level and that's why they're targeting
the most you, know the age group which can be

(16:57):
most manipulated and may be easiest target to pull their
strings and get them to do what they.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
Want it's fucking.

Speaker 3 (17:04):
Horrendous, yeah, no it's it's it's LIKE i, said pure.
EVIL i, MEAN i, MEAN i dealt WITH ms thirteen,
Members i've dealt With trinidadio's cartel. Members they're you, know
they're evil in their, way but they're a part of
a criminal. Enterprise they're doing it to make. Money they're
taking over, neighborhoods they're extorting from, restaurants and they're executing

(17:29):
other people they deem as a threat to themselves or
to their. GROUP i get, that AND i understand, that
and that's evil from, this but this is pure. Evil
this is LIKE i, Said Jeffrey dahmer Ted bundy type
of serial, killers and they're using instead of you, know right,
now there's the there's the big rumor up on The
East coast that there's a serial, killer you, know through

(17:50):
they've found countless number of bodies In, Connecticut, Massachusetts Rhode
island and bodies just a. Bit so people are you,
know they love having the theory of that there's a
serial killer out there in The northeast right. Now but
the fact of the matter is these guys use The
internet as their playground and all they're doing is waiting
for the right victim to swim.

Speaker 2 (18:10):
By and it just makes me think as a, psychologist
how many kids have killed themselves and we've thought it
was because of their mental, illness and the parents have
been unaware that they were groomed into killing. Themselves part
of the bucket list for seven sixty four is that

(18:30):
you get yourself into an, er you get a, diagnosis
you get, medication you stay.

Speaker 1 (18:35):
Two, weeks you come. Out you're earning your.

Speaker 2 (18:37):
Stripes, right you write, seven you carve it into your
body seven sixty, four which this man's daughter. Did and
so we're also it's evil like how much of how
much are we mistaking mental illness for this extreme miss.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
Grooming, well you, Know i'll leave that to the experts
like you and yourself to to designate and diagnose mental.
INSTABILITY i look at it as LIKE i, said that
these are pure evil, people and the problem is this

(19:13):
if you don't have a parent that's. Aware the problem
we have these days with investigations that THE fbi is,
conducting AND i know The United States Attorney's office they're
working on. THIS i KNOW fbi investigations are being conducted
into seven sixty. Four but the problem is, this by
the time that seven sixty four member has been, identified

(19:34):
who have they gotten? To that's so's it's it's not
like a bank robbery where a bank was. Robbed, okay
we know a Bankrub, okay now we got to chase
put the clues, together the. Evidence we. Don't you, know
it's a lot of times this we don't know that
a seven six four member has, identified, targeted and manipulated
one of your children until it's too. Late, unfortunately THE,

(19:58):
fbi from WHAT i, understand is working. Case but it's
after the, fact after the. Loss so that's why it's
really dependent on the parent or guardian to sit there
with the child and tell, them you, know there's there's
there's certain things you don't tell and you shield the
child from, that but you tell them enough to, say, hey,
listen come find. Me there's no questions, asked and then

(20:21):
you just you protect them and you, know and from the,
beginning from when my son started playing a, PlayStation i
always told him, never you don't, chat you don't chat with.
People you don't chat with. People you don't chat with,
people and that's. It and so now that he's had
that in his head for three years of no, chatting no,
chatting no, chatting he now immediately when he logs on

(20:42):
he mutes his. Mic so he's just used to. It,
hey that's that's the. NORM i don't listen to the chat.
ROOMS i don't involve myself in. Conversations and that's for
me to protect him and, saying, hey it's become the.
Norm now you're not part of. Conversations you don't. Chat you,
KNOW i don't know who your chat with If i'm
not sitting. There most of the, Time i'm sitting near

(21:04):
him when he's playing on the. PlayStation but even, then you,
KNOW i can't be everywhere at all the, Time so
it's about trying to stay one step ahead and telling, them, hey,
listen there are some pretty bad people in these chat.
Rooms i'm sure most of them are. Fine if you
find your, friends you connect with your, friends that's. Fine
but if you ever see, this, this, this if they

(21:25):
ever say to, you, hey don't tell your, parents or
oh you, know or they make you do things that
you're not quite, sure or if they threaten, us or saying,
HEY i know where you, live those are the big red.
Flags come find. ME i won't judge. You it's a
full get out of jail free, card BUT i will protect.
You and that's that's really what we have to do these.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
Days we'll be right back after this.

Speaker 2 (21:45):
Break do you have any other tips that that you
commonly share in your practice to protect the family and
the home and.

Speaker 3 (21:55):
Children, WELL i, mean it's studies have shown now that
we've had social media and the internet are now for
a good you, know fifteen. Years there's studies have shown
that children of, sixteen, seventeen eighteen have SAID i kind
of wish my parents hadn't let me have social media

(22:17):
because you, know the social media really alters the child's
head of LIKE i got to get the hit of
how many likes DID i? Get or how many you,
know boom boom, boom you, know get THE i gotta
get those likes. UP i gotta GET i got to
create a mess YouTube page Or, instagram pager this whatever
kids or. Snapchat So i've told my kids they're not.

(22:37):
Good they don't get a phone until probably you, know
they're early just for befourteenage, years, eleven, twelve and they
do not get social. Media they don't get any social
media at all until minimum sixteen years. Old and they've
shown me that they're mature enough to have social, media
and at which TIME i still would watch over them

(22:58):
until they're, eighteen until they're out of my house and you,
know they're paying for their, phones at which Point i've
done EVERYTHING i can up until they're. Eighteen BUT i
still will tell, them, Hey i'm always here for. You
if you have a, QUESTION i will answer it for.
You but all these formative years right, now this is
the big. Time this is where you really need to
be on top of your. Children and you, know people are, like,

(23:20):
WELL i need TO i shouldn't you? Know you, KNOW
i want to HAVE i want him to be my
friend OR i want to be you, KNOW i don't
want to be a helicopter. Parent, yes yes you, do you.
Don't we're not supposed to be friends with our. Children
we're supposed to be their guardian and we're supposed to
watch out for them and show them the. Way so
giving them this wide area latitude of letting them, grow

(23:41):
letting them, explore that is not the. Way that is
the target that these seven six four. Members and there
are countless other breakoff groups just like seven six, Four
so just say seven six four is the only one
is not. Accurate there are countless others that are out
there which have yet to be. Identified so to be,
vigilant that's our job as. Parents we need to stay with,

(24:02):
them we need to show them the. Way and if
you don't know the, way, Listen i'm more than. HAPPY
i write these, articles the same one you know that
you you looked, at you saw on the ARTICLE i
give guidance at different. Cybers you, know things to prepare yourself,
for how to prepare you Know Wi fi sit Your
Wi fi passwords and really it's. Awareness it's just handing

(24:23):
them on an iPad is absolutely without any checks or.
Balances it is not only are you giving them access
to the. World the world is getting access to your.
Child so you, know if they're not old enough to
drive a car or drink, beer they're not old enough
for the internet unfettered access to the internet.

Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yet AND i love that you you offer an, age
but you you offer a maturity level with, that, Right
it's not just about the. Number it's about knowing your
kid and their maturity and their capacity to navigate.

Speaker 3 (24:53):
This, no, absolutely and that's and that's part of. It
And i've told, THEM i, said good, grades you stay
with your sports that you guys are or are. Doing
you have to show me that you are. Responsible AND i,
mean if you have an irresponsible, child who doesn't you,
know isn't you know behaving, Well, okay you lose your,
iPad you lose your, phone you lose your. Thing it

(25:14):
got to be, more you, know on top of our
children these, days because of The, internet because of the open.
Access AND i told my, CHILDREN i, said, listen this
is about when we'll talk about getting you a. PHONE i.
Have they have devices now Where i'm able to talk
to them, directly Where i'm able to track them Where
i'm able to, say, hey you need a message to,

(25:35):
me this is what you. Have so they have devices
they have you, know you know there's lots of different.
WAYS i watch your gizmo watch The verizon makes where
you could have direct communication and no one else can call.
Them based on the settings that you do in the,
app you could say these are the only numbers that
are able to call. Them and if an outside, Number
i've tested, this an outside number tries to call, them

(25:57):
it says the number you have called is not in.
Service so but they're able to call me at any
times if they, say Hey, DAD i need to come,
out And i've told, THEM i, said, listen if you're
ever at a friend's, house you're ever at a situation
where you're not, comfortable you just call me and, say Hey,
dad you KNOW i really miss. You you, know you
know what are we having for dinner? Time and THEN
i Know i'm on my way. Over and that's just

(26:17):
our secret little, word our secret code. Word and they also,
know you, know if anybody comes to pick them up
at school that is not myself or my, wife they
know they're specially that person that's supposed to pick them,
up is given a code, word so they know this code,
word so our children, Know, HEY i may tell, them,
hey my Friend jeff is supposed to pick you. Up

(26:39):
they're not going to get in the, car even though
they Know. Jeff they're not going to get in the
car Until jeff says the code word WHICH i gave,
him which would be the code of the. Day And
i'll give them a code Of, hey, Say jeff should
say this code word to, you. Pineapple and if he
doesn't say, pineapple you don't get in the car with.
Him so it's just LIKE i, said different layers of.
Security even though they Know, jeff they don't get in
the car unless they hear the code. Word so it's

(27:01):
it's trying to stay on top of. Things and you
know a lot of. That a lot of times it's
the people that are closest to the child who really
take advantage of the. Child so that's why it's even
even LIKE i, said even best, friends you, know even
close friends you, know even sometimes even family members that
you know shouldn't be at the school and unless you
have the code. Word so this is Where i'm you,
know trying to set the boundaries for my, children and

(27:24):
they always have had this. Boundary they've always know That i'm.
There so WHEN i move the, boundary, okay this is
they're used to. It they're used to. This. Okay dad's
always setting. Boundaries can't have it til, here can have
it till. Here so despite their friends who are, eight,
nine ten years old may have a, phone they, understand
don't ask because it's not going to.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
Happen one THING i wanted to mention was that even
if you pick off an online perpetrator or a perpetrator
in real, life it doesn't mean that they haven't groomed
another individual to follow in their. Footsteps AND i think
it's important to remind parents that.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
You can never be relieved of.

Speaker 3 (28:04):
This, listen the seven six four is just like any
other criminal. Enterprise you take out a, leader you take
out a drug, dealer there's going to be someone to
fill those. SPOTS i can't tell you how MANY ms
thirteen MEMBERS i took, out how MANY ms thirteen LEADERS
i took, out and they had a replacement within, days
they had a. Replacement so it was it was the constant.
BATTLE i knew that we were not going to DEFEAT ms.

(28:26):
Thirteen we just had to defeat them at the local
level or at the international. Level taking out certain to
make it a difficult for them to. Process take out
the big you, know the big, players to make their
lives difficult. Again you, know you take out a seven
sixty four membership, leader there's going to be someone there
to take their spot right away and continue. Operations it's

(28:49):
it's never, ending it's never ending.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Fight that's a great.

Speaker 2 (28:52):
Lead and can you can tell us all about your,
CAREER i, mean tell us of your awesomeness taking Down america's.

Speaker 3 (29:00):
WANTED i appreciate. It, so, YEAH i spent and SO
i did nine years in The navy before THE, fbi
and then nine to eleven occurred and THE fbi was.
RECRUITING i was an instructor at The Naval academy and
THE fbi came, recruiting and they were looking for lots
of different, things and everybody you know looks at you,

(29:20):
know traditionally it's they're looking for accountants and lawyers and. Such,
well one of the things they're also looking for is
people who speak other, languages AND i Speak spanish. Fluently
my parents are immigrants From chile And, argentina and SO
i was raised Speaking spanish in my. Home SO i
raised my, HAND i, said, okay give it a. Shot
and a year LATER i was at THE Fbi academy

(29:41):
AND i got stationed In, Newark New, jersey WHERE i
spent twenty years In, newark fifteen of those HUNTING ms,
thirteen and for the last four years of my, CAREER
i was part of a group Called Joint Test Force,
vulcan which were hand pick. Agents you, know there was
only three of that were picked for initially at the

(30:01):
outset which was to go after the leaders OF ms thirteen.
Internationally SO i would pick off leaders that were In
mexico and bring in The United states for you, know charges
that we had been able to get them. Here but you,
know more, importantly my my area of, responsibility my aor
Was New. Jersey SO ms thirteen. Leaders there's a lot
OF ms thirteen activity In New jersey And Long, Island,

(30:23):
Virginia North. Carolina there's a it's a it's a big.
Presence and you, Know i've had numerous cases, where you,
know doing large racketeering cases rico where you're investigating the
organization the group as a. Whole now for people who
don't Know Rico rico is you know something that was
brought around and is a statute that was created in

(30:45):
the seventies to go after the, mafia you, know The Closa,
nostra The italian, mob and they were able to utilize
that to investigate gangs and large criminal. Organizations, whereas if
you can prove that an individual commits two different, acts
two separate acts of crime on behalf of the, gang

(31:08):
either to elevate the status of the, gang give profit
to the, gang or elevate their own status within the,
gang that's called a racketeering. Act so we could charge
them with. Racketeering, so for, example we had a case In,
Plainfield New, jersey where the group called The Plainfield locals
SARVATUCA pls were conducting criminalis toa they were drug, dealing

(31:30):
they were, extorting and they were committing. Homicides that was
part of their. Control that was controlling the, environment controlling
the neighborhood's fear for them to make a profit and
to raise their. Status so every one of these acts
were reco acts and they murdered, people and they murdered
a lot of, people and we in twenty thirteen we

(31:51):
started an investigation at THE fbi In newark and eventually
got to twenty sixteen where we went to trial with
them and ended up charging fourteen different members under one racketeering.
Investigation one of them was a guy individual by the
name Of Walter Giovanni. Gomez he had murdered who was

(32:15):
his friend at the, time but he had thought that that,
Individual Julio, matute had been hanging out with the rival
Gang Eighteenth, Street So walter decided to take upon himself
with a co conspirator to murder, him and they, brutally
brutally murdered. Him the co conspirator was, Caught walter was.
Not he escaped and in twenty eleven he fled and

(32:38):
was believed that he had gone To. Maryland so in
twenty sixteen when we had the trial for the eight
remaining members who had not taken a, plea all of those,
individuals it was a four month trial is huge In New.
Jersey they were all found. Guilty and if you're found
guilty of murder in the aid of, racketeering there's only
one sentence life mandatory, life and you were not getting,

(32:58):
out so you're going to die in prison in final
in prison is there no death? Penalty it was a
death penalty. Case, yes there was the potential for the
penalty of death penalty in this trial because it was so,
brutal but nobody got the death.

Speaker 1 (33:14):
Penalty how did he murder the last?

Speaker 3 (33:16):
Guy they were smoking weed drinking all night And julio
got up to go to work at six in the
morning And walter and his co conspirator got. Up So
walter hit him on the head with a baseball, bat
sliced his, throat and then stabbed him seventeen times in
his back with an ice. Pick when The Union County

(33:38):
prosecutor's office came to arrest, him he jumped out of
second floor window and disappeared into the, night and he
was never seen again until twenty, sixteen when as soon
as the trial was, done THE Us Attorney's, office WHICH
i was working with THE, ausa said go get. Him
SO i started working with our Public affairs office and

(33:59):
putting a pass on him in with the areas we
believed that he was hiding, out which WERE ms thirteen,
Strongholds Long, Island, Maryland, virginia And North, carolina WHERE i
believed he had. Fled it was hiding amongst his. FRIENDS
i got no results from. THAT i got very little,
tips no. Results THEN i spoke to Our Violent Crimes

(34:22):
division and they had said there's a spot open on
the Ten Most. Wanted and after it took me a
year of working with them and getting the application, DONE
i was able to get him onto the FBI's Ten
Most wanted In april of twenty, seventeen and then the
tips started coming. IN i was doing interviews On, Telemundo

(34:44):
univision and the, media AND i really was focusing my
energy On. Maryland but The MARYLAND ms thirteen really have
a good working relationship WITH ms thirteen In New. JERSEY
i started putting him up on billboards all Over maryland
and some came in and none of them really flushed.
Out they were all. Nothing and then one day In,

(35:05):
august we got a phone. Call individual, said, hey, LISTEN
i play soccer here In maryland and that guy looks really.
FAMILIAR i think that guy THAT i saw on the
board is the guy you're looking. For we, Said, okay
this sounds like a pretty credible. Tip so we went
out to the address of one of the vehicle that

(35:26):
was where the individual was seen getting into and he,
left he had given us a, plate so we went
to the house and it was just a surveillance. Team
so when THE fbi conducts an, arrest if it's for one,
person typically come with ten to twelve agents so they
overwhelmed the individual so that there's no chance that they fight.
Back so it is when we arrest, somebody it's not
like TWO fbi, agents it's ten to. Twelve but we're.

(35:49):
Surveillance we typically do only four to six. Members four
is a small it's somewhere in the six to six
to eight. Range so we were doing surveillance and we
sat on the house where the vehicle license plate had
come back to his registered and we wanted to see
if there were other vehicles in the parking. Lot while
we're sitting, there we see a woman come out and

(36:09):
get into the vehicle in, question and we, said all,
right let's follow. Her let's see where she. Goes so
we followed her down the road and she went to
a strip, mall and while we're sitting in the strip
mall waiting for her to do, something she doesn't get
out of. Car all of a, sudden we See walter
come out of a barber. Shop he was getting his,
haircut and at which point we decided we was, like,
well there's only six of, us but we can't pass

(36:30):
up this. Opportunity we see, him he's. Here we don't
have an arrest, plan but you, know we're trained. Agents
we were at task force officers with. Us everybody knows
what they're. Doing everybody's been trained. Well so we jumped
out and we arrested, him and he within the day
he was admitting who he, was and we transferred him
back To New jersey where eventually it took about a

(36:52):
month or, two but he pled guilty to all the
charges because a lot of it has to do with
the trial that, happened you, know a year or two years.
Earlier we had convicted so many of them and they
have received life, sentences and he saw. This and plus
we had a lot of witnesses who testified for. Us
they were confidential informants and individuals who were part of

(37:15):
his gang who had decided to flip and take an
easier deal so that they could. Testify so they took
a you, know you, know it was up to the
judge to make the final, decision but they received a
lighter sentence because of their. Testimony when he saw, this
the confidential, informants the, testimonies and the results of mandatory,
life he took a. Plee so he he was sentenced

(37:37):
to twenty five years in federal. Prison and we're, now
you know about, what ten years into. That so he's
got another fifteen years and at which, time as soon
as he's, done he'll get deported back to A.

Speaker 2 (37:48):
Salvador could he get out early at?

Speaker 3 (37:51):
All, No, no there's no you have to serve the
full twenty five.

Speaker 2 (37:55):
Years, wow how many years did you spend tracking this?

Speaker 3 (37:59):
Guy, WELL i sort of was lightly doing it in twenty,
fourteen twenty, fifteen but we were preparing for the. Trial
so THE ausas where we had eight individuals going to,
trial all at the same, time which is not very
common in a federal. Trial it's not very. Common typically sometimes,

(38:22):
one two or three defendants is somewhat the. Norm but
to have eight defendants all at the same, time THE
Us Attorney's office In New jersey had decided they want
to go forward with all. Eight instead of doing eight separate,
Trials we'll do one, big huge. Trial and THE ausa
saw that IF i had arrested, him IF i had

(38:42):
captured him right before the, trial that would completely change
the perspective of the trial because not only would he
because he's charged as part of this, group most likely
it would postpone the. Trial so they had spent almost
a year preparing for this, trial getting every, witness getting
every piece of, evidence everything in. Line IF i had

(39:02):
captured him before the, trial it would have completely changed
the narrative of how everything was, constructed because every witness
is in a certain place for an exact, reason set
up the. Story here's the, story here are the supporting,
witnesses and here's the, evidence and so everything is in
line by THE Us attorney's, office they put everything in,

(39:22):
line show the, evidence these physical, evidence the supporting, evidence
and it's all put there. Together so bringing what you,
know IF i had Captured, walter it would change. That
so they were telling, me they're, like you, know when
we were a year out from the, trial they're, like
let's ease up on the. Hunt, okay if he comes,
up he comes, up there's nothing to, it but let's

(39:43):
not find him until this trial is. Done and literally
like the day after the, sentencing you, Know mike, two
A usa said go, forth go get them because they was.
Done we had gotten, received we had received not the,
sentence but the, yeah the. Sentence when they were set
they were found, guilty they were, said, okay that's, lockdown

(40:05):
the trial has. Done go Find. Walter and then it
took me after, That it took me about a year
and a half to find him to get that arrest In, WASHINGTON. Dc,
wow but it was worth. It it was worth every minute of.

Speaker 1 (40:19):
It oh, yeah it's fucking. Amazing thank you.

Speaker 3 (40:23):
Guys LIKE i, SAID i had a lot of. Fun
so a lot of agents in THE, fbi they spend, ten,
twelve fourteen, years you, know working the streets of wherever
they are working their. Crime and then they'll go on
to become a supervisor whether they're tired of work in
the streets or they want to get a promotion for
a little bit more. MONEY i never did. THAT i

(40:43):
never took the. Promotion and you can choose not to be.
Promoted you can choose. It you can you, know either
you step up to the plate or you. Don't AND
i chose BECAUSE i loved working the. STREETS i loved
being putting together the thousand piece chicksaw puzzles and THENSA
i worked For Great. Ausa he's out In california's there
In La. Now he put it so. WELL a rico

(41:05):
is a thousand piece jigsaw, puzzle and there's a thousand
different pieces and everything needs to fit together to form
the entire, picture which is where we were ready for.
Trial and that's WHY i worked EVERYTHING i did during my,
INVESTIGATIONS i worked hand in hand with THE Us Attorney's
office BECAUSE i was always preparing for. TRIAL i believe
it's it's somewhere like eighty in the mid eighty eighty

(41:27):
five percent OF fbi investigations never see a day in.
Court they never see a day in court because so
much evidence is collected correctly by THE fbi agents legally
working with the, courts working with THE Us Attorney's, office
that the defendant is. Overwhelmed they they're, like, wow, okay
you've got my, voice you've got my, video you've got.
Informants and they don't want to do. It they don't

(41:49):
want to go to trial because you, know if they
go to trial for twenty five you, know they could
face twenty. Years if they go to, Trial they're, like oh,
no IF i take a, Plea i'll do ten years
so a lot of times they'll take plea offers and
it never sees a day in. Court my, guys they
were looking at, life so they had nothing to. Lose they're,
like you, KNOW i can only win unless But i'm

(42:11):
not going to cop and be a. Snitch i'm not
going to SAY i admit. Something so that's FOR ms thirteen.
World they never wanted to admit they were snitch and
they never wanted to admit they were.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
GUILTY i appreciate your explanation OF rico, too because as
The Shawn colmes trial plays, OUT i think there's eight
million influencers trying to explain it to the audience like
they actually know what it, is and no one has
explained it the way that you just.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
Did, well it's important with The Sean i've been following
that and they're saying very, well THE Us Attorney's office
needs to show that these victims that he was manipulating
was to further his music, empire his musical, company just
committing the crimes of whatever they call, them freak offs
or sexual harassment or sexual, assault that in and itself

(42:58):
is not A, rico but he is using her to
further his criminal his you know music, empire that's the
racketeering because that's his. Organization he used. It he utilized
his music industry as a criminal enterprise to further his criminal,
enterprise to make, money to utilize, people to create the

(43:20):
status around. Himself so that's where THE rico is they're.
Charging is a little bit more difficult THAN ms thirteen
because you all to get that as saying a tattoo.
Photographs that's a little bit easier to establish. That with this,
one it'll be a little bit more, difficult BUT i
think they're getting there very.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
Nicely we're going to take a quick break and we'll
be right.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
Back, okay question for, you what's the most disturbing thing
you've ever experienced or.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
Seen the most disturbing thing was probably my life case
THAT i helped out. On. So Essex, County New jersey
is a county In New jersey and eastern part Of
New jersey In Northeast, jersey and The Essex County prosecutor's
office reached out to me and they, said, hey we've
got two missing. PEOPLE i actually know they've got one

(44:15):
missing person and one victim of a, murder and we
believe it's connected to AN ms thirteen group right here In,
Irvington orange And, Newark New. Jersey do you know anything about? This?
NOW i was the LEAD ms thirteen investigator for The
state Of New jersey for THE fbi In, newark so

(44:36):
most of, it you, know passed through. Me so it
was there Was there's still a lot of MEMBERS ms
thirteen THAT i didn't, know BUT i, was you, KNOW
i had was very well known in the law enforcement.
Community so he came to me and they asked, me
AND i had an informant that could provide, information and
we tapped into him and we found out some, information
and he went and started talking to this, group you,

(44:57):
know using, recordings and we were super him and we
were able to get a location on where not only
was we believed the body, was but where they had
killed the. Individual there's a beautiful mansion that had been
had fallen into disrepair in a beautiful neighborhood In, Orange New.
Jersey it literally was a, mansion completely. Overgrown nobody had

(45:20):
lived there for, years and we walked in there to
go look at, it and there's still was. Furniture it
literally had people had walked out of, There i'd say
five years prior and never sold, it and it'd just
fallen into, disrepair overgrown, everything and which understood as to
why they targeted. This we went to the upstairs bathroom
that the informant told us and we found a complete

(45:41):
like murder, SCENE i, mean it was blood everywhere in the.
Bathtub sought we brought IN Fbi Evidence response team for
over the course of three, DAYS i believe they processed.
It took everything, meticulously pieces of. Carpet really were slow
to get. Everything but now our job was to find the.
Body and we were told that it was in a

(46:03):
state park not too far from the, area that they
had taken the body. There and now we had already
identified who these individuals. Were we had taken them into
custody on probable cause then and The Essex County Prosecutors
office had taken them into custody based on the information
from the tip from the, informant and at which point

(46:25):
then we started. Hunting we started. Walking we literally were.
Walking we did a you, know working with my. Squad
we would walk through the woods and we were pointed
as to, okay it was right here in the woods
of this. Area we spent days out. There we brought
a cadaver dog out. There we spent days looking for
this and looking for a disrupted soil because it hadn't

(46:45):
happened that long in the. Past but. Nothing we couldn't find,
anything and at one POINT i remember standing in the.
WOODS i remember standing in the woods there AND i
was sitting, there, going where is this? BODY i know it's,
HERE i didn't know where it. Was a few days,
later we kept working with the with these, individuals and
a lot of them were, fifteen sixteen years. Old these

(47:06):
are YOUNG ms thir team, members and finally we were
able to break one of them and he, said all,
Right i'll show you where it's. At he walked out
to the woods and said he pointed straight to the.
Ground he, said here's the. Body and it was, EXACTLY i,
say within a foot or two of WHERE i, was you,
know standing there was going and you, know this is
the perfect spot and you're. Hiding that's exactly where it
was he was being. Hit but the ground didn't show.

(47:27):
This so we started, digging, digging, digging and at three
feet you, know we're thinking that you, know from the
perspective of a you, know, criminal we're you, know we're
thinking that they're going to bury the body one to
two feet and then you, know leave it. There no three.
Feet they're still, saying now we don't see. Anything keep,
digging you're not even. Close we got down to six
feet down and we found garbage bags full of body.

(47:51):
Parts they had chopped out the. Victim they had you,
know literally dissected him, arms, shoulders, legs put it all.
Together and that's where they had done it at that.
House that's WHY i was so. Bloody and they had
dissected this young man and buried him, there and that's
where the body was. Discovered that was probably the most disturbing,
scene you, know seeing the abandoned, house bloody, walls. Everything

(48:16):
it was just it was really kind of like at
all like a, movie a haunted house. Movie it was really.
Amazing it was.

Speaker 2 (48:22):
Crazy did you open the plastic bags to see the
body or is that someone else's?

Speaker 3 (48:27):
Job, well the medical examiner was. There he is the.
One so the body was discovered and then the medical
examiner was called in from The Essex county and they
are the ones that you, know to preserve, evidence took
the body. Out they did open the bag there on
scene to be able to positively identify the individual because
he had numerous. Tattoos he was not gang, affiliated but

(48:51):
they just targeted him because they think that he, was you,
know encroaching on their. Territory it maybe small amounts of.
Drugs it was like.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
For you to see, that to see the bags, OPENING i, mean,
like are there maggots at this?

Speaker 3 (49:06):
Point, no because he was buried so, deep and he
was so, deep the body was very well. Preserved body
was AND i had only been there a week or,
so maybe two, weeks but the body was very well
preserved because it was inside a plastic bag garbage back
and it was buried six feet, under so there hadn't
had a. Chance so when you opened, up literally the

(49:27):
skin color was you, know it was. Pink he still
had skin color. Pink the tattoos had bright, colors but
once it touched, air it immediately started to immediately. Deteriorate
by the time he had left the, scene the body
was already deteriorating very very.

Speaker 2 (49:45):
Rapidly, wow that's incredible and such a difficult.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
Case oh my.

Speaker 2 (49:55):
God, Okay i'm going to hit you with four. Questions,
shoot if you could commit a crime and get away with,
it what would it.

Speaker 3 (50:04):
Be, ah that's a good. Question PROBABLY i. WOULDN'T i
wouldn't want anybody to get. HURT i wouldn't want to
do anything like that that somebody would. Hurt, probably you
know WHAT i, sometimes you, Know i've got A New
jersey inside of. Me so IF i could you give
somebody a love, tap a little boom, boom get out

(50:26):
of my way type of road, RAGE i probably would
do that just for people to get out of my. Way,
sometimes you, Know i'm not Very you, know the drivers
In New jersey and In, montana they're two different, tea
two different types of, people two different types.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
Of SO i have following my life was going to
be threatened In jersey because of?

Speaker 3 (50:43):
Driving oh, yeah, no, no it's it's it's without a.
Doubt it's if you learn how to drive In New,
jersey you can drive. Anywhere it's really it's.

Speaker 2 (50:53):
Crazy, Okay next, question the death penalty. QUESTION I i
love this question because depending on a person's, profession it's
always very different the. Answer but if you had to
die by death, penalty how would you want to?

Speaker 3 (51:08):
Go, WELL i would not want to feel. IT i
would want on Just i'd say so a probably lethal
injection BECAUSE i believe, that you, KNOW i don't have
a lot of experience in death, penalty BUT i believe
it's it's kind of like where you know you're putting
a you, know a dog to sleep or an. Animal
you go to sleep, first and then the second fluid

(51:30):
is the one that will stop your. HEART i would
want to just go to, sleep because you do, gunshot
maybe you'll live for like five or ten. Seconds later
you get. Hanging that's not one hundred percent. Sure you,
know you may end up, choking hanging there for like
eighteen minutes twenty, minutes and electrocution sounds. Horrific SO i
wouldn't want to be. ELECTED i want to want the electric.

(51:51):
Chair so probably lethal.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
INJECTION i THINK i would do the same.

Speaker 2 (51:57):
Thing talked to a scientist and she said she'd want
to know at least the studies behind the medications use
for the lethal. INJECTION i agree, with we want to
make sure they're going to be effective.

Speaker 1 (52:10):
Exactly, okay last.

Speaker 2 (52:14):
Question, yes can you tell me a secret that no
one else?

Speaker 3 (52:17):
Knows uh secret that no one else? Knows you know what?
It's it's people that really know me know, This but you,
know the GENERAL i you, KNOW i am in awe
of my wife Of. Christine she, is you, know the

(52:39):
best thing that's ever happened to. Me she's my best.
FRIEND i love working with. HER i know a lot
of people talk about, how you, know husband wife working,
together you, know doesn't really work out, Sometimes AND i
couldn't imagine being with anybody. Else so you know the
fact THAT, i LIKE i, Said i'm you, know she
is the PERSON i trust the most on this, earth
AND i run everything by, her and she is absolutely

(53:01):
the PERSON i trust the. Most and LIKE i, said
she's my best. FRIEND i wouldn't want to be anywhere
else without. Her If i'm not with, her it's you,
Know i'm missing. Her and you, know she's she's. Spectacular you,
know she's THE ceo of the, company so TECHNICALLY i
work for, her but it's it's she's she's so, smart
she's a spectacular and LIKE i, said people that know

(53:24):
me know how MUCH i love. Her but LIKE i,
said you, know if it's a secret that not everybody else,
knows that's that's the fact that. IS i, Mean i'm,
lucky lucky to have met. Her you, know we met
later in, life you, know WHEN i was thirty nine
and she was thirty, eight or you, know fortunate enough
to have two wonderful children. Together and LIKE i, Said

(53:44):
I'm i'm GLAD i waited thirty nine years for.

Speaker 1 (53:46):
Her the secret is that your mushy.

Speaker 3 (53:49):
Ah i'll tell, Anybody, OH i had.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
ANYBODY i had one question THAT i forgot to ask
about changing a, law WHICH i really would love your
answer on if you could change a law in a
maror what would that be law In?

Speaker 3 (54:01):
America, well in today's. ENVIRONMENT i you, know that's a
that's a really good. Question you know it changes. Constantly you,
know it's that's a really good. Question IF i could
change a, law you, know change an existing law or

(54:24):
create a. Law you, know IF i was you, know
In congress and just, boom just make a new, law
you KNOW i would make. It you, Know i'm glad
that there are there are so many rules in the court,
system you, know to make sure that every, agent every
law enforcement officer follows the rules. Correctly you, know and

(54:45):
people you, Know i've been, questioned you, know you, KNOW
i get put on the stand WHEN i during my,
TRIALS i was questioned about everything THAT i. Did but
everything was precise to the, point and making sure that
everything was done directly and legally above. Board AND i
never ever broke a, rule broke a law to get my,

(55:07):
cases to get my people to the, Position i'd rather
do it completely. Legally so that that's a question that
really you'd have to sit down and really think, about
because you know the laws that are in, place you,
know And i'm gonna cop out on this. One i'm.
Apology i'm anap out on the last question because the
laws that are in place are, good are good a,
Right They're they're there for a. REASON i think it

(55:29):
would you, know it would be something that affects me
personally up here In, montana whether it be you, KNOW
i don't have to register my vehicle once a year
and you know Pay. Montana you know The montana registration,
fees which you know costs me like five hundred dollars
a car once a, year whereas In New jersey you
don't have to do it every couple of. Years, here
it's every, year and that's how they collect that's how

(55:51):
we have state income. Tax so it's probably something here In,
montana BUT i wouldn't. CHANGE i, mean it's as beautiful up,
here AND i love it That i've retired up here
with With christine and the. Kids so it's so probably
something along those.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
LINES i like. THAT i, mean you work for the,
government you're happy with.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
It, Yeah, No i'm you, know, YEAH i. Don't you, know,
PERSONALLY i haven't seen something that's off the top of
my head that it would, say, oh that's gotta, change you.
Know And i'm sure there's Something i'll think of later
on in like an hour or two'll be, like, OH
i should have said, That but it's nothing that sticks
right off the top of my. HEAD i, Mean i'm
pretty happy having. Worked LIKE i, SAID i worked international,
TERRORISM i worked domestic. TERRORISM i chased white supremacists In New,

(56:34):
jersey which suppose you, know by the, way it's one
of the worst states in the in The union for white.
Supremacists and then THE ms thirteen and the. Cartels so you,
Know i've been around different types of federal, statues federal
crimes and stuff like, that so those are the you,
Know i'm pretty familiar with. Those so but, yeah thank

(56:58):
you for doing, this Oh, leslie doc is my, pleasure you.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
KNOW I i, think, like so you're going to put
to start a. Podcast we just don't know where it's gonna.
Land but right So i'm in your your.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Website what's your?

Speaker 3 (57:10):
Website so my website Is brunercierragroup dot. Com And i've
got a substack also which Is brunercierragroup dot substack dot,
com so you can sign up for the newsletter on on.
Substack And i'm On instagram To Bruner Sierra. Group And
i'm On twitter As Daniel brunner. One On, TWITTER i
don't Use twitter that. Much that is very VERY i

(57:34):
don't tweet that. MUCH i just watch everything that's. Happening
there's a lot of that on On twitter is you,
know bots and things like. That so you really got
to take it with a grand. Assault, instagram you, KNOW
i collaborate with. You and, Yes i'm in talks with
some people to partner up with a very very good

(57:54):
friend of, mine one of probably one of my best.
Friends that he AND i have known each other since
we were nine years, old and he has a vast large.
Experience I'M i won't get into it because we haven't
like into his, background but he was in the, military
vast large experience in the, military and he And i've
known each other since we're nine years. Old then we
are like two peas in a. Pod so there is

(58:15):
talks about us launching a web, podcast and there's a
lot of people that are. Interested So i've already got
five guests who want to Launch get In, it and
so we're looking to launch within the next couple of.
Weeks i've got a couple of meetings set up here
in the next couple of days to find out more
if there's if there's sufficient, Interest.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
I'm excited for.

Speaker 3 (58:34):
You thank.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
You i'll be a.

Speaker 3 (58:36):
Guest no, You we've already got you lined, Up so
you and LIKE i, said four other people have already
been you, know we've gotten verbal commitments that they're excited about.
It it's gonna it's gonna cover lots of different. Subjects
so we're not gonna just talk about true. Crime, yeah
we're gonna talk ABOUT fbi. Cases i'll HAVE fbi agents,
On we'll have members of the military that you, know
my friend has been affiliated with and he knows they're

(58:57):
talking about their. Stories but this is not a a battle,
story you, know type of podcast to, say, well this
is what happened when we come. In we're going to have,
those but we're going to talk about larger subjects subject you,
know topics that really impact something like, you mental, health you,
KNOW ptsd men's mental, health women's mental. Health so we're
going to cover a lot of different, topics a lot

(59:19):
of different great uh uh people are are said they're
they're excited about. It so we're looking forward to. It
we'll get you more and once we, launch we'll we'll
let you.

Speaker 2 (59:28):
Know, yeah all come, on we'll talk About Charles manson and.
Acceleration that's what's. Reoccurring, okay thank you for doing.

Speaker 3 (59:37):
This thank, you. DOC i appreciate it and look forward
to it. Again all, right.

Speaker 2 (59:48):
Thanks for watching and listening To Intentionally. Disturbing i'll see
you next. Time Intentionally disturbing is a podcast from, me Doctor.
Leslie it's distributed BY. Iheartmdia Liam billiam is the senior
producer and he also edits the show and puts up

(01:00:11):
with my. Shit Katie cobbs does the social media and
she attempts to keep me in my, lane not always.
Successful the executive producers Are Paul anderson And scott McCarthy
For Workhouse, media who have told me not to text.
Them twenty four to. Seven but you know, What i'm

(01:00:31):
still The. Boss thanks again for. Listening we'll see you
next week from