February 1, 2023 • 59 mins
In this episode Jill, Aja, and Laiya discusses what it’s like to be a black tourist in a Black country. What are the boundaries we have to uphold and respect as people of different diasporic cultures? They also dive into what it means to be a black gentrifier. To dive deeper into these topics, check out the links below. Call 866-HEY-JILL and leave us a message with your comments on this episode!
https://travelnoire.com/respect-foreign-cultures-travel-abroad
https://www.theroot.com/debating-whether-black-people-can-be-gentrifiers-misses-1846456925
https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/coco/db9orsI5O4gC
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to Jay dot im, a production of I Heart Radio.
What's up Everybody, It's it's it's Jill Scott. Here, it's
just Scott. Here, it's Jill Scott with an exclamation point
at the damn end. It's Jill Scott. I like to
(00:28):
throw a note on there. Let's just look Scott. Welcome
to Jay dot Il the podcast and my brown Can
you see my color? I too? Do? Oh like I
can't stand you. Yeah, it's given a slightly toasted chocolate cookie.
(00:55):
You can listen. These are the lies I want you
to throw all the time. I want you to continue
to fortify my brown skinness. Okay, all my life, okay,
all my life. I thought I was brown skin I
did not. You thought she was giving ginger Snap, but
(01:18):
she was really giving Nilo Way for girls. You know.
I did not give Nilla. I gave fig Newton. It's
okay because I'm projecting, because I have a cousin who
(01:40):
always pulling my neck. She's like, you're not as brown
as you think. I feel like you're not giving what
you think you're giving. Living a lie. I just knew.
I just knew because my grandmother was brown, and that man,
I was brown too. You couldn't tell me nothing different.
Want to know what are you talking about. I'm just
(02:04):
glad that the brown skinned girls are being seen, people
are actually paying attention to all that beauty blue ivy girls. Well,
the reason that I'm brown are benches. The reason a
(02:27):
little brown, or if you will, the reason for that
is because I went to St. Thomas over the holidays
and that was awesome. Beautiful, beautiful views, beautiful island. Um
sweet people, wonderful food. Um Man. We we saw three
different beaches and each one was just perfect, perfect. But
(02:53):
there was a moment when when I caught a little
wake up, a little realization, if you will, like your
Saint Clair and age grading Dazzler, Yeah, I had a
little realization of some things. Um As we're sitting there
and the sun is going down and we're like, oh,
that's so nice. The kids are playing in the water.
(03:15):
The lady that had been selling stuff along the beach,
um uh so, the cutest green bag. She she was like,
all right, I'm going home now, and we're like, okay,
good night, thank you, and she was like, and you
should go home too, and walked away and we were like,
(03:36):
oh that was different. We're saying. You know. Then we
happened to look to the right of me and the
chairs that were all along the beach are now few.
So the guy comes over who has graciously put up
our chairs and our umbrella for ten dollars each. He says, well,
(03:57):
it's time to take off the chairs. And I was like,
what you mean. He's like, well, um, it's it's time
to take off the chairs. I was like, but we're
in them, you know, we rented them. He was like,
you'll have to rent them again. It's different people now.
I was like, what now, I don't know if that's
the good same time, it's exit because thank you, thank you.
(04:19):
I was trying to just giving us the flavors. So
all of a sudden I smell like this mass weed.
I was like, wow, they didn't sell that on the
beach earlier, you know. And I was like, okay, I'm plotting,
you know, trying to catch some of that. And it
(04:41):
wasn't hard, I will say that, but I noticed the
people that had made this amazing meal. We had some
oxtail and some um some rice. Oh my god, that rice.
What did they put in that rice? I don't know,
but it was so good delicious meal. They're all standing
outside and everybody's rolling up one and I was like,
and they got a bear in hand. And I was like, oh.
(05:02):
I keep looking around and somebody's now getting their hair
braided and the music has changed, and I was like oh,
And I realized I got these kids here. It's time
took up. So I said, hey, y'all party the grown
up party. I'll start that. So so I'm thinking, yeah,
(05:25):
it does right, we got these kids. So I go
to the car with with Jet and we're standing there.
He's looking in the direction. The next thing I know,
the guy is in the car in front of us,
looks over at Jet and just stops in mid movement,
staring at him. So I'm looking at the guy and
looking at Jet. Jet is looking at him, looking at him.
(05:47):
He's looking at the guy, and I was like what
He was looking at Jet like mind f and business.
He was going to get something out of his glove compartment.
I said, hey, look at me, talk to me, talk
to me. I'm on because that look was not wasn't friendly.
(06:09):
He was cussing in his eyeballs. I was like, okay,
you ain't got a cussing me but this is the
same packing up the corn. Okay, it's not recognizing that
Jet as a boy and well now he's a man,
not yet amazing, I don't know, but he let him
and he let it be known. Much business because I'm
pulling something not just glove compartment, and it's none of
your concerns. Right. So we're standing there still. I could
(06:34):
see my family walking towards me, and I'm standing there
with Jet, and I see a little girl, this cute
little thing with two ponytails, and I say hi, she's
walking in between the cars. She walked all the way
past and came back. And when I tell you, baby
girl gave me the f you finger of sounds a
(06:56):
hard one. It was hard, and it shook a bit
like it was strong. But what she meant that and
looked at you in your face like that was definitely
meant for you, for you, bitch, for you move your feet.
You just said hello. I was like wow, and it
(07:18):
hit me like a brick. We're on their island. They've
been serving send us all day. They got her juice.
There are beverages, we bought bags and trinkets. Um they
made them oxtails with their bomb ass rice and served
it all friendly and nice all day long. But now
it's our time, tourists. It can't be our time, Like
(07:43):
if I ain't had my kids, can we risk it
is time for a time ago to go home. We're
black and grown. People were getting their hair braided. People
were playing dominoes. But that kind of party, why are
we not what it went from island drinks with the
with the little umbrella in them and playing this one
(08:03):
love music to different different for you, for you. It's
like when you go to certain restaurants where you eat
certain types of Asian food in all of the tables
(08:25):
the square, but that round table in the back it
is for the family. Yeah, you are teaching me things
an that round table back. Then nobody sits at that
round table. Is now even on the menu? They're not.
That's not even on the menu. After they close up
(08:45):
that way they eat in that That's right. I feel
like that more are welcoming, like you know, come on,
y'all get some of the same time. It's that y'all
might not know about. I thought that everybody was lovely,
everybody was sweet and nice and helpful. We needed directions
many times, and everybody was just they stopped what they
(09:06):
were doing. It helped us out. But at a time,
I think it's bigger than that. I think it's about
them keeping their island to themselves, to keep their culture,
to keep their way like and you're not invited unless
you're invited. We were not invited. And my people from St. Timas,
(09:29):
you look like a told you wouldn't have bought that bag,
and you wouldn't have rented that ten dollar chair when
you could have just took one. I don't like when
y'all make points more real talk after the break. It
(09:58):
reminds me of a situation out, you know, and this
is different. But I was real cool with my daughter's
principle some years ago and I was in there complaining,
you know, we was just chatting it up, and I'm
complaining about you don't people in the neighborhood, and yeah,
neighborhood changing, you know, neighbor you know, ain't They're coming
a little business here the house, you know, And I'm
(10:21):
having a shop coffee shop, coffee shop talk at the
at the school. He like he laughed at me and
was just like, oh, he's like, you're a gentrifier too.
Just clutches. I'm a what, I don't understand how you're gentified.
(10:43):
You've been living in your house for like twenty years.
I don't know what You've been living in my house
almost twenty years. But it still remains to be true
that when I bought my house, there were families and
people on my block that had been there for ten
plus years, twenty years, families people black folk, right, and
I bought my house at the top of the market
at that time. Those same people who lived on my
(11:05):
block could not afford to buy my house when I
bought it, right, But that's that's somewhat of the definition
of gentry because because there is a natural steady flow
of life where costs go up. At the time that
I bought, my neighborhood was changing, and things weren't changing
because I was again making those observations like, oh yeah,
(11:27):
those and I and I did somewhat come in with
some of that change. Now, yeah, you know, it's not
exactly the same. It was highlight what I think what
it did was highlights something that held the point he
was trying to make is that there is a difference
between the black folks in your community in terms of
what is available to them as opposed to what is
(11:48):
available to you. Now, you still black, but there's a
very important difference in the way that you are experiencing
this as opposed to the way some of your neighbors
are experienced Right, But how about this, though, you still
have some of the same disadvantages because I know, usually
when we're talking about white folks justifying an area or whatnot,
you know, I know the neighborhood always like to say, like,
(12:10):
y'all call the cops. Stay there, you call the cops.
It's the same rate as the people that have been
living there for photo years. Like, there's still some differences
with you being a black person versus like a white person.
And now and now Whole Foods wants to move in.
Hopefuls ain't coming because you're there. Yeah, and you're and
you're you're worried about You're a hundred percent correct about that,
(12:31):
But I think you're not rendering correct about that. What
I think is a nuance here is that because we
do have some parts of the way we experienced the
world is black people in common, that doesn't necessarily mean that,
you know, the way that we experienced the world is
the same and that we don't, I don't access to
(12:51):
certain privilege. And so like I was, um, I had
circled back to my reading list, and I pulled out
Bill Hooks again because what I've been thinking about her
since my birthday, honestly, because this this birthday, I realized
that we were born on the same day. La da dada,
so yes. And so I've been like, I'm circling back
(13:11):
to some of her work and I'm reading feminist theory
from margin to center. And one of the things that
she talked about was the early kind of misunderstanding around
feminism where you know, white women were not at all
adding into the equation, nor were they caring about adding
into the equation the experience of all women. They were
taking a very nuanced version of of sexism that was
(13:35):
only for educated, middle class white women and then saying
that it that it was speaking for all women, right
because they were women. And it's like, well, no, there's
even though we all are women, it's very different from
being a poor white woman, or being a poor black woman,
or being a black woman or all of these things
(13:56):
change the way that you experience, uh, you know, sexism
in America, where you fall in terms of the patriarchy
or the capitalist structure, or whatever the case may be, like, well,
all those things together, that that that total structure together
is important to acknowledge these nuances. And that's how you
got from Bill Hooks to like a Kimberly Crenshaw who
(14:19):
talks about intersectionality, where she made this super clear, like, yes,
we're all black, but it's different when you're a black
and a woman. When you are black a woman and
you're queer. When you're a black and you're a woman
and you're queer and you're overweight or disabled, these are
all the ways that the world becomes smaller and smaller
(14:40):
and less accessible to you. So it's important to understand that. Again,
you're in the same time as we all black. Yeah, yeah,
they don't kick us out, but you're not experienced in
the world. In a country where the main source of
income is tourism, tourism from people, and you're making very
(15:01):
little money. That money is not trickling down to your community.
People are coming and they're getting luxury. You're going into
these spaces, you're providing a part of that luxury, but
your community is not seeing that luxury. You're being paid
minimum wage. You don't have any understanding of the political
(15:21):
landscape in that country. You don't have any understanding of
the nuances and the complexities of being a Saint Thomas.
And I don't know why you say that, because I
was thinking. I was like, I don't know much about saying.
I'm just gonna stay in Jamaica, just where I feel safe.
That's where I feel like they want me, they want
(15:41):
me there. Well, there's a big difference. We stopped at
the wrong Airbnb with the wrong address, well what appeared
to be the right address, but it was definitely not
the house I rented, and I was like, what is
going on? Had to figure it out. Found the house
that we were going to, dramatically different, dramatically different. This
(16:04):
had a view of the ocean. Uh, just beautiful. I'll
say the view was just really great. But the difference
between that first house and the second house was massive.
And that means if the first house, you know, if
that's a community, do you see what I'm saying? And
(16:25):
there was the drastic difference between the people who live
up top in the mountains, our own houses up top
in the in the mountains, the Republic of the Island
was was French, and another part of the island was Dutch.
And I'm and then you go to like the jewelry stores,
and all the jewelry stores are owned by Indian folks.
(16:48):
So where does that leave the people of the island,
the indigenous people of the island, where does that leave them?
It's their island, So they want us to leave, I say,
it's time to go. That comes to the idea of
gate keeping. Aren't we supposed to gate keep some things
(17:09):
far I don't know were black Americans. We didn't figure
that out yet, but I'm glad they have. But I
thought it was beautiful and Beau and I would go
back to St. Thomas anytime and absolutely shout of respect
that they deserve. Not a problem for me. Thank you
so much for this delicious food and its beautiful island
and your great service all day. Thank you so much.
(17:31):
It does make you think, though, I mean, if after
Asia broke it down, it's like, well, shoot, here we
go with the work. It makes me feel like, you know,
before we travel somewhere, we need to do a little
bit of research. I said it in jest, but I
just don't feel comfortable in Dominican Republic like that. I
feel like it's very they shield the tourists a lot
(17:51):
from what's going on, and it's just such a big differential.
And on top of the fact that how they treat
hate you. But that's the whole enough thing. But what
I'm saying is is that should we start are researching
and knowing some things or do we I think a
big miss understanding, you know, especially I mean we're Black Americans.
As we continue to move through the the sifting through
(18:15):
and the breaking down of all the different things that
we've had to deal with and unlearned, It's like, I
think there is a lot of thinking around like black
excellence and and black ascension, and that a lot of
that's tied to wealth, and a lot of that is
(18:36):
tied to access and power and leisure, you know what
I'm saying, a kind of leisure, right, And I think
what happens is that because we associate this thing with
being good for us as a group, we forget that
the characteristic of that is being taken from you know,
(18:59):
historically from our oppressors, is taken from a white supremacist,
you know, like vacation, ain't the thoughts of vacationing, and
like vacation it's it's imagine. I'm just talking about just
being able to do things right. So just being able
having access to things right. So yeah, you can catch
(19:20):
a nice little Spirit flight or Southwest flight and go somewhere.
It don't cost you know who a lot of money,
and we think in the end, I'm not rich. But
I'm talking about the mentality of luxury, of the way
we present ourselves in other countries. And then that's why,
you know, you can go certain places and they're like,
you're American. They don't really care about that you're black
or anything else. You're American, and that for some people
(19:40):
that that's offensive, right, because I think there is a
thinking that and I think for Black Americans there isn't
thinking like I'm doing a good thing by having wealth,
by being able to experience luxury by doing that, and
there's nothing wrong with that, or I work hard for
it to make at least make y'all think that that's
what it is. I just work. But I think that
(20:01):
what it can look like when you go other places
is a black face acting like them. The that that
sense of um, what's the word of entitlement entitlement. Had
I been somebody else, I could have raised the ruckets.
(20:22):
What do you mean we have to pay for these
chairs again? We already paid for these enjoined No, but
imagine had I been somebody else, I got it. I
get it. It's time for y'all to go home YouTube,
because this is our beach on our island, and we're
going to chill out and relax and talk to our
(20:44):
people right here on this island. It's not it's not
right on this beach, and it's not time for you.
And I felt like that was a powerful thing. It's
just we don't we don't have We can't do that
to them. Y'all come here, you go do whatever, do
the things. I don't know. It just it's interesting. I'm like,
I'm kind of jealous. I guess it's coming out. I'm jealous.
(21:07):
And I'm also trying to figure out because we're always
talking about how to figure out how to do this
for ourselves, but they can't protect not our intellectual properties.
Or it's just like so and y'all using it too.
Like what you're listening to on the beach, you ain't
just listening to the dance hall, So like, come on,
don't do that to us, like, yeah, but I don't
(21:30):
think the intersectionality of all the things that we Yeah no,
I mean I get what you're saying too, and I
think and I think it's to know who's who right there.
I ain't got time to interview you. Go home. I
ain't got time for all of that. And I think
that if you were to immerse yourself in the culture,
if you were to go and stay for a while,
(21:54):
you know, and spend some time and work amnks and
and eat a monkst and chill where everybody else chill.
I think that way, you know, that's a way for
you to be invited to the cook out. Yeah, you know.
But other than that, you're here for a week or two. Yeah,
we're not doing but so much. This is a transactional relationship,
(22:14):
right and now the transaction is over and it's time
for you to go home. I thought it was very powerful. Yeah,
I mean, if you're a person who lives near let's
saying and this is probably not black folks, you know
what I'm saying, especially in Philly now, But like you know,
when they have the big festival down there, you know,
(22:35):
and people come to the city and it's like they all, right,
y'all bringing all this money out of yaut of YadA,
but it's Monday, Bye, it's Monday. But because they'd be
all molly and all funked up and making all this
trash everywhere. Yeah, but I feel like that in my
neighborhood about University of Pennsylvania, I'd be so glad when
the kids go back home for the summers, were making
(22:57):
my bus go the long way. You know, I'm saying, y'all,
y'all damn restaurants, you know now, And then I'd be
mad too. It's a love hate relationship because when they
go home, I ain't got to pay attention to I
don't got to see y'all. But then when y'all go home,
all the restaurants want to close early, like they cater
to y'all, but they don't care about us, you know
(23:20):
what I'm saying. It's like, yeah, when y'all on campus,
if something's going down, you can find a cop like that,
m Phil. But it's like, yeah, but when y'all go home,
you know, I gotta be careful about wearing walking at
night is my friendsifier, But go ahead, like that's why
you ask you guys a question. Okay, So let's say
(23:41):
that there is a nightclub and all kinds of black
people are performing, and everybody's welcome, and everybody's having a
good time. But at two am, some people and they've
got to go home for some people appear to be closed.
And then and then these artists continue to create amongst themselves, right,
(24:03):
and why and you understand why? Right? Okay, that that too.
So what happens at the club is is is a
white club or Indian club and it's in America and
you're not after two am, you gotta go, like how
do how? Like I feel real good about having something
(24:26):
from black people where we get together and nobody else
is there, nobody's invited, no phones allowed, and you know,
we're building something UM special between us right now? Like
that excites me. But what happens when it's the other
way around? All right, it's already the other way around.
(24:48):
But I mean honestly though, like and this is recent,
we had the conversation with with um. So it's just
so bad, That's the what I'm asking you. Since it
already exists there this we're left out of a lot
of things. You know what I'm saying, the question is
always the question has always been what its sacred for us?
And how do we keep it sacred? And one of
(25:09):
the reasons why we keep it sacred? And us and
and and and so that that question. I feel like
we're still all still trying to answer those things, you
know what I mean. But one real thing is too
is that being able. And one thing that's interesting about
the thing that happened at the same time it's is
that you're talking about something that's somewhat commodified where it's
like they found a way to say this space that
(25:32):
we occupy it do cost money. I mean, it is
for sale, you know, for rent. You know what I'm saying,
It is for rent, but it is not um to
the point where we're willing to sell every part of it.
So I think one of the things we struggle with,
or one of the things I struggle with the understanding,
(25:53):
is how do yeah, so we we we want to
make everything cost something, we want to sell everything, we
want to make everything into a hustle. But there's no
sense of boundary, there's no sense of that some things
you can't take it. But so far, you know, even
with black women, I find that too where it's like
sometimes I have I have some interesting thoughts around that too,
(26:15):
because like I was thinking about this the other day,
like black women right now, this whole thing, like we
have made ourselves very clearly a market, not on purpose,
you know, we've made ourselves a market. And so as
much as it feels good to be catered to, we're
also gonna it's gonna feel seasonal. That season is going
(26:38):
to pass, and then so we have to be clear
on who we are and what we are culturally as
black women, and what things we hold dear and sacred.
Because in a minute, they are not gonna want to
print any more T shirts with Black Girl Magic on it.
I'm just saying, like, I'm just saying, all that's gonna
(26:58):
be done. Hey, listen, they're shrinking their bodies back to
in a minute, the black girl body is not going
to be the hot chip. People are taking that ship
the funk out. Oh yeah, girl. They have something called
the skinny BBL. Now did you know that? Oh shocks,
Oh yes, the surgeries and folding back in. This is
(27:22):
why this is why we gate keep. This is why
we have to We have to hold on. You have
to hold on to something of our own. I just
wish that we could make a collective decision on what
it was. It might be too late. We're gonna take
a quick break and then we'll be right back. All
(27:54):
I'm saying is that we really are in a capitalistic society,
and we were raised as capit the list. So if
I have something good that I could sell to make money,
it's it's inbred. It's in there, it's in there, It's
all in us. I never realized how American I am
until I go to another country and be like, oh,
ship m h, I am one of them. We girl.
(28:16):
We see it on the internets all the time. It's
like everything that every people confuse liberation with, like, you know,
making money. It's the the LLC squad. You need to
get you a LLC, you need to get you a password,
you need to get it. It's like that. That's that's
how we're going to ascend as a race of people.
But I'm gonna bring this up because we remember we
talked to some show and he was saying how it
(28:37):
is a weird kind of relationship we have with blackness
and when to be black culture and where it's like
race as a construct. You know, it's a thing that
we were assigned in relationship to whiteness. So it it
has a funny history, you know, and I understand why
(28:59):
are we tend to misuse it because it was never
thing we ever really were. We didn't become black until
we got off the boats. Before we got on them boats,
we was you know, europe book. We was saying, you know, Ebo,
you know what I'm saying, Ashanti. We were these things.
(29:20):
We were ethnic groups that had practices and languages and
things in which we could unify around things that we
could do, you know, coming of age ceremonies. So we
became black in relationship to whiteness. So it gets tricky
at this by our Christmas. Yes, and now, of course
(29:42):
we have created culture that we're proud of. Yes, innovated,
and we've made this gumbo and we are responsible for
this and this has influenced the world. And so yes,
that's something to hold to your chest. But the fact
that we don't quite know how to deal with it
speak to the fact that it kind of don't exist.
(30:04):
Black isn't even a thing. Really really did make it
a thing. It may not have started as a thing,
but like you just said, didn't we like said a
thing what's at its root isn't a thing really, what's
at it's route. So it's all there. So like from
the jazz to the no, no, no, not, what we
(30:27):
made from it is beautiful. I'm saying, I understand why
we struggle with it because at the end of the day,
what we built, the beginnings of it is just a
response to something else, something that they put on us
that we actually aren't nobody actually white, and ain't nobody
(30:49):
actually black. You know what I'm saying, That particular binary
was created and it wasn't created by us. Now now
we're here now that being said, I love being black.
Being said, I'm proud of all that we have done.
That being said, I don't like to see people, uh
(31:11):
making it into a commodity in any and everybody getting
a piece and us getting nothing. With that being said,
I hate feeling eraced. All of those things are valid,
but I'm saying, this is what we're trying to achieve
and talk about. It's complicated, it's hard. It is complicated.
It is to see like for black Americans, well, I
(31:33):
guess here it's gonna be for us the most out
of everybody, but nobody is in their rightful place in
that way, which is interesting, right because liken't we all
moved from one area to multiples. Well, yeah, we're a
diaspora for sure, okay. And I say, even in those islands,
the history of those islands and how we got there,
(31:54):
their story can be compared to blackness in America in
a way, right, Like, I'm just it's to me, you're
saying that, You're saying that regardless of where where we are. Uh,
that makes sense, It does make sense. Mm hmm. You know,
(32:14):
I gotta I gotta room in my house, and I
have a lot of artwork that m I collected over
the years, things that that just instinctually, I was like, Ah,
this's got to come home with me. And I've I
brought this artwork home and I put all of this amazing,
beautiful artwork in my house. And I realized recently that
(32:40):
I knew that I knew for certain, maybe three or
four the masks on my walls. That's what I'm talking
about the time in some parts. But I don't know
all of those masks. I mean, I pray over them,
you know, I cleanse them. You know, I saved my stuff,
(33:03):
especially when it comes to a mask and something that
I don't necessarily know what it means. What I'm saying
is I collected it because it spoke to me. I
was like you coming home with me. That's how I
chose it. But do I do? I understand them all?
Not at all? And I think that's where the interesting
thing comes with being a black American. We have pieced
(33:24):
me on ourselves into this place. We don't we don't
know enough. We're aware of things. Being aware of them
doesn't mean that you understand it. We have all these
fabrics I know, I do something. I know what they are,
something I don't. I just like the fabric to another culture,
(33:47):
to some someone else. This could be a sacred fabric.
I don't know. You know. It was a whole argument
a few years ago around Kine, the whole argument about
this variation. Yes girl, yes, yes, but you know again
(34:07):
again you know, and we're moving into a different part
of this conversation now, but you know what, let's speak
on it. But then and again, when you think about
things like quilts, that is Africa, that's that's that's our Kente.
Those kinds of things are ways in which you see
our Africanness described and expressed in ways that were meant
(34:31):
to preserve who we were, right and who I believe.
The Quakers were making quilts, not about certain kinds of quilts, right,
So you have like I learned about this in class.
Whereas like um, you know, in certain parts of the South,
a lot of the a lot of the early quiotes
that we may had a lot of circles on them.
And this was a specific thing that spoke to the
(34:53):
Congo people who were in large groups in certain parts
of the Carolinas. And so they worked with goals and
circles and things where you know, so these were symbols
that came from their ethnic groups that they begin to
sow into clothing that they put on to pottery all
they and they start to see a lot of these things.
And so that kind of those kinds of practices exist
(35:15):
all over the diaspora. They exist in Brazil, they exist
in the Carolinas, they exist in the Caribbean, they exist everywhere.
So there's a very real diaspora that we're talking about here.
But I think culture, because it can be so local,
so specific, soul soul special. Right when we start talking
about black culture as an umbrella. It's big and wide.
(35:36):
That's a very large, big, wide thing. And to say
something is black is putting something that is so complex
and so diverse under an umbrella that white people invented.
You can say, okay, well because like really you could
say I'm from Chicago in the same way a person
says I'm Nigerian. Really you can do that because you
(35:57):
go to Chicago and it's black cultural dances in chip
cargo that exists, and we're built and made out of Chicago.
Now we do that. I feel like we do that
when somebody say you from d C. Is like, you
know what that means? I'm doing. But I feel like, again,
like I said, just just just not that we don't
do it, just you know, continuing to press and push
the idea of what culture is and how we identify culture.
(36:18):
Once we can identify it and really own it and
really recognize what is culture, what is sacred? I think
you gotta first acknowledge that it ain't a big umbrella
fun that's a whole lot of small, beautiful things, right,
That's what I think. And it does have some things
that tie it together for sure, because there's certain ways
(36:40):
we talk and like certain ways we do things that
we all do. Even like you ever read or sometimes
on Twitter and people like, oh, we were raised by
the same people. All black people raised by the same parents.
Everybody's parents did the same thing. Everybody. There is commonality
in generation that you grew up in that there's kind
manality amongst certain kinds of food. You said you had
(37:03):
that right, She's like, I don't know what was in
that rice. It's you know, when you think about Joe
Off and how that rice. Race is a thing for us,
But Joel Loft ain't the same as Nigerian Off. They're
gonna argue you down, you know what I'm saying. And
so it's a thing we have to be willing to
(37:25):
do a little more. I don't know, investigating, Investigate, That's
that's where I'm at with and go with the work, y'all. Yeah,
that's coming. That's the work. And I don't pretend to
know every all this stuff. It's a lot. It's a
lot because I do believe that it was the Quakers
(37:47):
that we're making quilts, and then other people grasp these
quilts or bought these quilts, and then slave owners had
black people enslaved people make these quilts, and then they
started twisting them and adding other things and symbols and such.
But it started from if I if I'm not I
think so I canna be wrong, But I don't know. Yeah,
(38:10):
I'm just just talking about just the way that we
start to see we adapt everything in order to make
it work for us and be a representation of us.
But there was a lot of adapting of things, you
know what I'm saying. So like, in order to do
(38:33):
actual research or investigation on things, you gotta do the
whole work. Take one thing, Take one thing that you
really like in your house. Everybody's got some black ship.
We all got some good all black and be interesting
(38:54):
black ship. Everybody got it in their house. You must,
I know you do, because sometimes you don't know what
it is. I got a little a piece of sculpture.
I thought it was the most beautiful thing. And my
maintenance man from Guatemala came into my apartment and he
was like, Oh, this is from my country. That's how
we call it. That's how we call the cows. Now,
I thought I got this thing hanging from my door,
(39:19):
like it's beautiful. But I'm just saying to say that,
check all your ship in your house because you I mean,
in order to build a culture. Because it's not fried
chicken and watermelon. It's some of it. It's some of
it because Dan watermelon is good at the summer. But
everybody loves watermelon. I don't know. I think so. I
(39:41):
think everybody loves watermelon. But you're not that black people.
You heard that real ship about watermelon though, right like
you heard it and Asian tell me if I'm wrong,
But you know, that whole stereotype bout watermelon came from
the fact that they said watermelon made like black men
more a poem, and so then they made it the
whole stereotype because of the black men's like I didn't
come from never heard. I want melon is that it
(40:02):
is a massive hydrator for those for those of us
who are descending from people who had to work in
fields and things like that. They had to eat things
and consume things that would hydrate them. People like I
didn't say what I said. I just meant what AGES
said because that sounds smarter. Stay there, No, I mean
if that's that's a story, I mean that that's a
(40:22):
story that things have multiple truths. Black black shoes. But
I think, you know, ultimately the gate keeping thing is
still up in the air because I still think we
still have a lot more owning and loving of ourselves
to do. And they got left though, if you could
pick something, I mean, really, girls, what do we have
(40:45):
left to say for ourselves? It's a good question. Traditions
talked about this on this podcast. Somebody got doogie braids
right now. And I own not making our own traditions.
That we just know things that we were passed down
(41:05):
to us, things that we know to do. I think
those are things that can never be taken from us,
that cannot be sold. These are things that we just do.
It's we just had cookers. We just hit a new year, right,
trust me. On on the white Internet, nobody was talking
(41:26):
about Coeople's black eyed peas, and girl was talking about
to my good Korean girlfriends on that took her black
eyed peace to all her good wife friends. I'm just
saying everything there's there's there's people experience huff Wig on
(41:47):
Amazon and the model was white, and I was like,
thank God to be giving to be joking. Shout out
the shade butter and shade moisture. Seriously, wow, Well, you
(42:08):
know the hair been taking jail. The hair been like this,
not like this, this is this is, this is the
next extra. The day of the white first white man
putting in the lock was the dated the head with
hair was gone. Can we talk like that ship? Just
map the funk up? Can we talk about a little
bit of family business real quick? Though. Yes, black folks
(42:30):
have invented and done a number of wonderful, amazing things
in which they have been stolen from us. But one
thing about Black Americans. If they're going to tell you
black people invented some ship, did they ain't event ship?
What you want to correct? You know that you know
that's black? Right? No, how you know you know so
(42:52):
and so you know the black folk you know that's
that's that the black people did that. No, No, they
didn't know that. They didn't. They didn't, they didn't know.
They don't give us credit for nothing. They take it
all proved, They didn't prove they didn't. You don't. Blacks
will tell you something in admitted. Don't every great white
idea is a black person about them. They'd be like, oh,
(43:18):
russels or well, you know, black black people invented the
ruffle girl, Combs brushes soap. You know, black people have
finished so what nobody clean before us? We know we clean.
I love it. I love it, Jill still thinking, come on, jail,
we'll be holding on to holding on to what you think,
(43:38):
Jill mm hmm. I just it's tough because if I
look at it any other race, like, I'll never understand
them either. Like, the only thing that came to mind
was powerful, beautiful black love between a couple. Oh girl,
(43:59):
they trying to get that. Like, I've had the privilege
to see it and I've had the privilege to be
in it. But I'm also there. I'm looking at this thing,
but I don't know it's that's a tough one too,
because love is love. Yeah, I think it's maybe Jill
(44:21):
Scott and Kindred, that's the last thing we got to
be can hold on to ship day. I think No,
I do think connection is a thing. I think connection
and you know, I do think that. I think there's
a tone. There's a way that black folk can communicate
without talking. There's a way we talk. Have you watched
Love and Hip? Have you seen the right We have
(44:44):
talked about this before, I know, But just cash me outside, Okay, exactly.
I don't. And the thing is, anytime I see love
between two folks, I'm always like, M, that's nice. Anytime,
you know, I'm like shot, these two people's relationship. I
(45:11):
don't know if they know, if she knows when when
um he's about to call. I don't know if she knows.
You know, when romanticize thing. Basically you're romanticizing. I think
I might be because I don't know. I know I
I always feel good when I see two people um
extend kindness to each other and are affectionate with each other.
(45:34):
That makes me feel good no matter what race it is.
I want to go ahead, y'all. So it can't be that.
It can't be that because you've done it now now
you don't know if this necessarily has as is black
love specific to two black folks? Well, we have obviously,
and what else are we gonna do like black black folks?
(45:55):
And you know what I mean, It is specific to
black folks because we're black and we folks and we
love each other. Right, But what you talk about, what
you're talking about, is there a specific kind of way
that we experience love to GILM that cannot be duplicated? Oh,
I think that's a movie. Baby, I think that's I
think that's a song. I think you says, I'm thinking
(46:16):
that it's worth investigating. Oh okay, okay, because because I'm caught,
you know what I mean, Like, I'm because you don't
want to romanticize black love either and make it seem
like it's a mystical thing. No, it's not mythical. It's real. Yeah,
mys mystical like Matt. Yeah, because because you don't want
(46:38):
it to feel like like trauma binding or something. It's like,
is it. It's got to be something more healthy and
connected and mm hmm sounds like homework. Y'all ain't no
answer to that. We lost It's it's take the lake
the L. I mean, we still do it better, We
(46:59):
still take that. We'll take the L for the moment. Okay,
more conversation after the break. I want you guys to
(47:21):
call us. I want you to send us messages. I
want you to let us know what is that thing?
What is that thing that we have that remains our own?
Because you would think you just be able to pop
up with a couple of answers on this thing, but
how about jumping the room. It's not even head wraps,
(47:44):
no moment, how about jumping the room. I don't really
see nobody else do that. I don't do that. You
reach it with that one because I got to reach.
I mean, I just think it's just everything, Like you said,
no one could do it like us. Whatever we do that,
whatever comes from whatever. Yeah, whatever it is that comes
(48:06):
from us, people can duplicate it, but they can't. They
can't do it. They can't do it. It's like it's
like you ever hear Tina Marie sing or yeahba don't
do that, Darre exceptions every rule, Jill uh, that's a
(48:27):
mighty beautiful wind. No no, no, no, Tina Portuguese. No,
so that's it's some brown it's somewhere and yeah, yeah,
but that's my goal down. Yes she does, she does,
(48:49):
so we can't even black children's books. I was just
thinking about it, like the sister who says, I'm gonna
remember her name, but she's um, she's very Dore's a
meme that goes around where she's just like, I'm not
saying that the girls are not doing their thing, but
they're not doing it. Okay, That's how I feel about it.
(49:09):
It's like I'm not saying that people aren't out there
doing their things, but they're not doing it. You know
what I'm saying. Em Dead, that's who said it. Shout
out to em C Dead. EMC dev said that. M
hmm right. What's really important is not that we gate
keep but that people know the history. That's what we're
(49:32):
talking about, and then we go with that. Investigation can
be tolerated. Say it again, we will not tolerate erature
it is that you're saying, because that's what's happening. It's
not the word rare are erasure money Those raisins and
(49:58):
slave owners are still on the money and they have schools.
Yeah that our kids go to. Yeah yeah, yeah, Well
I'm really saying that we could watch ourselves be raised.
(50:19):
We could do it. We could literally sit here and
watch ourselves be raised. That ship is is now what's
up in no way, shape or capacity, like, there's no
way we have to do. We have to investigate. We
have to find out our who who are people's is
not on my watch? How did you get here? Everybody
who's doing something, some black person somewhere made a sacrifice
(50:42):
for you to get there. Trying to learn the history,
the history of the history specifically in your path. Find
out who opened the door for you. That's how that's
something that we can hold on to. Our our history
cannot be raised because it's happening. It is uh happening.
(51:02):
It is a current event that people who have who
have open doors, people who have um open doors is
such a big is that that's a huge that's a
huge statement. Who have opened doors so that you can
advance a lot of people enter through back doors, so
(51:25):
you can walk through the front. And that's not a cliche,
that's facts. There's a lot of people who stayed up
all night picketing and and the knowledge of it is
literally under attack right now in many states in our country.
They are absolutely erasing our history. History that was already
not being taught. Now they're saying it's illegal to teach
(51:47):
it in we are being erased. They're saying that, um,
people don't read books as much as as they should,
or that they could. Um, maybe that's true. I would
like to invite anybody that reads stories, read stories to
(52:08):
um your friends. Y'all ain't doing nothing else. Read read
stories to your people. Haven't come over and drink some
wine or drink some whatever you got I don't care,
so did you knows? Is a nice thing? That's what's up.
That's cool, that's a good time. Ain't i'ing wrong with that?
And you can play music in between and also to
(52:29):
ask questions because I'm gonna I'm gonna just say this.
When I was cooking my collar greens and my black
eyed peas, my daughter came in there and she was
just like, Mom, you know, I was wondering why we
did this, and I found out why. She said, you know,
I was wondering why we did And she said, did
you know that a lot of that that during the
(52:50):
top of the year, that many of the slave owners
would settle up their debts by selling, you know, some
of their you know, human property, and they would you know,
they were up to anny on their human trafficking, right,
and that a lot of the enslaved people would feel
nervous around this time and think, you know, and they
(53:12):
would cook these meals as you know, just a good
luck thing to have the meal the next day to
celebrate if those who were able to stay. And that's
how we started the whole cooking of the collar greens
and the black eyed peas. That's that's where some of
that comes from. Also too, there's another tradition on New
Year's Um for enslaved people that makes it somewhat you know,
(53:34):
important as well, was that when the Emancipation Proclamation was signed,
it didn't go into effect until the following year, and
so a lot of enslaved people and free people had
watch night in which they were waiting for the top
of the year for it to be legal for the
Emancipatient Proclamation to go into effect so they could then
emancipate themselves. And so they were waiting for that time period.
(53:59):
So that time of the year is important to us.
So I think some of those things are stories we
can tell our families during those times. Two on Mother's
Day every year on Mother's Dad tell my children the
story of their birth. The stories and the storytelling is
how our history has been passed down from person to person.
Yeah we have books, Yeah we have movies and documentaries
(54:20):
and all that stuff, but let's not get rid also
two of the oral that's important and for us to
take that seriously within our households, we can't be erased.
That's the thing we learned. The history, we write, the
history we tell it it's just important. Otherwise they really
are going white. Every everything we worked for, we bled for,
(54:46):
all of that stuff is going to get forgotten. And
I don't know if y'all know ever seen that movie
Coco and Coco. It's an animated film that is based
in Mexican culture around the day. But what it talks
about is these people who were on the other side
of these spirits, of these people who have passed on
in your family, but that they are able to exist
(55:08):
and come back to the day of the life of
the living on the Day of the dead to visit
their families once a year, but they can no longer
come the moment someone in the family doesn't remember them, ah,
then they're gone for good. They can exist in the
spirit world. To turn to go with that, and yeah,
(55:30):
as long as you can remember them, they can come back.
And I think what's really important about that thinking culturally,
even though that's not my specific culture, what I take
from that is that remembrance is important. I say this,
I mean, this is off topic, but when people come
to my show and I'm singing songs and make them
(55:51):
feel al randy and excited and sensual, I say, I
know when you go home. You're gonna be making some
good love now on the fifth stroke, I just want
you to say thank you, Jill. I think do you
say that? Critics? Hey, you know, shout it out. I
(56:13):
feel it, shout. Can you imagine a collective where where
everybody in the audience go home and make some good
love and on that fifth stroke they'll be like, thank you, Jill.
I mean, how good must that feel? If I mean,
my goodness, let her say it, don't you don't say it, sir.
(56:34):
I'm just saying I know. I was just helping it.
When there is a collective energy about understanding, Yes, that
is a power and we that is something that we
can do. Pick up black ass thing in your house
right now and just find out what it is, where
(56:55):
it came from. It'll it'll help you understand why it's there.
That instinct, that instinct that is something that has passed
down to us as well. I can't forget that. Thank
you so much for listening to j dB Ill the podcast.
It is always a pleasure to have conversation that sparks conversation,
(57:20):
leave us a message, let us know some more things
that we should hold onto. Thanks for listening. How do
you eat an elephant one by it time. Hey, listeners,
it's Amber the producer here. I love that we're having
(57:41):
these conversations and really peeling back the depth and meeting
from these everyday experiences as black people have a few resources.
Lincoln the show notes that I want to share with you,
um one that dives deeper on how to travel respectfully,
respectfully okay, and another on the layered conversation about being
black genter fire. It's complicated, it really is, and I
(58:03):
hope we all keep these conversations going in our own
families and social circles. Oh and I will also share
the link for Coco, the movie Aga mentioned in the episode.
The film is incredibly y'all watch it immediately. Hi, if
(58:32):
you have comments on something he said in this episode
called eight six six, Hey, Jill, if you want to
add to this conversation, that's eight six six nine five
four five FI. Don't forget to tell us your name
and the episode you're referring to. You might just hear
your message on a future episode. Thank you for listening
(58:53):
to Jill Scott presents Jay dot Ill. The podcast h
J dot Ill is a production of I Heart Radio.
For more podcasts from I heart Radio, visit the I
heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
Welcome to Jay dot im, a production of I Heart Radio.
What's up Everybody, It's it's it's Jill Scott. Here, it's
just Scott. Here, it's Jill Scott with an exclamation point
at the damn end. It's Jill Scott. I like to
(00:28):
throw a note on there. Let's just look Scott. Welcome
to Jay dot Il the podcast and my brown Can
you see my color? I too? Do? Oh like I
can't stand you. Yeah, it's given a slightly toasted chocolate cookie.
(00:55):
You can listen. These are the lies I want you
to throw all the time. I want you to continue
to fortify my brown skinness. Okay, all my life, okay,
all my life. I thought I was brown skin I
did not. You thought she was giving ginger Snap, but
(01:18):
she was really giving Nilo Way for girls. You know.
I did not give Nilla. I gave fig Newton. It's
okay because I'm projecting, because I have a cousin who
(01:40):
always pulling my neck. She's like, you're not as brown
as you think. I feel like you're not giving what
you think you're giving. Living a lie. I just knew.
I just knew because my grandmother was brown, and that man,
I was brown too. You couldn't tell me nothing different.
Want to know what are you talking about. I'm just
(02:04):
glad that the brown skinned girls are being seen, people
are actually paying attention to all that beauty blue ivy girls. Well,
the reason that I'm brown are benches. The reason a
(02:27):
little brown, or if you will, the reason for that
is because I went to St. Thomas over the holidays
and that was awesome. Beautiful, beautiful views, beautiful island. Um
sweet people, wonderful food. Um Man. We we saw three
different beaches and each one was just perfect, perfect. But
(02:53):
there was a moment when when I caught a little
wake up, a little realization, if you will, like your
Saint Clair and age grading Dazzler, Yeah, I had a
little realization of some things. Um As we're sitting there
and the sun is going down and we're like, oh,
that's so nice. The kids are playing in the water.
(03:15):
The lady that had been selling stuff along the beach,
um uh so, the cutest green bag. She she was like,
all right, I'm going home now, and we're like, okay,
good night, thank you, and she was like, and you
should go home too, and walked away and we were like,
(03:36):
oh that was different. We're saying. You know. Then we
happened to look to the right of me and the
chairs that were all along the beach are now few.
So the guy comes over who has graciously put up
our chairs and our umbrella for ten dollars each. He says, well,
(03:57):
it's time to take off the chairs. And I was like,
what you mean. He's like, well, um, it's it's time
to take off the chairs. I was like, but we're
in them, you know, we rented them. He was like,
you'll have to rent them again. It's different people now.
I was like, what now, I don't know if that's
the good same time, it's exit because thank you, thank you.
(04:19):
I was trying to just giving us the flavors. So
all of a sudden I smell like this mass weed.
I was like, wow, they didn't sell that on the
beach earlier, you know. And I was like, okay, I'm plotting,
you know, trying to catch some of that. And it
(04:41):
wasn't hard, I will say that, but I noticed the
people that had made this amazing meal. We had some
oxtail and some um some rice. Oh my god, that rice.
What did they put in that rice? I don't know,
but it was so good delicious meal. They're all standing
outside and everybody's rolling up one and I was like,
and they got a bear in hand. And I was like, oh.
(05:02):
I keep looking around and somebody's now getting their hair
braided and the music has changed, and I was like oh,
And I realized I got these kids here. It's time
took up. So I said, hey, y'all party the grown
up party. I'll start that. So so I'm thinking, yeah,
(05:25):
it does right, we got these kids. So I go
to the car with with Jet and we're standing there.
He's looking in the direction. The next thing I know,
the guy is in the car in front of us,
looks over at Jet and just stops in mid movement,
staring at him. So I'm looking at the guy and
looking at Jet. Jet is looking at him, looking at him.
(05:47):
He's looking at the guy, and I was like what
He was looking at Jet like mind f and business.
He was going to get something out of his glove compartment.
I said, hey, look at me, talk to me, talk
to me. I'm on because that look was not wasn't friendly.
(06:09):
He was cussing in his eyeballs. I was like, okay,
you ain't got a cussing me but this is the
same packing up the corn. Okay, it's not recognizing that
Jet as a boy and well now he's a man,
not yet amazing, I don't know, but he let him
and he let it be known. Much business because I'm
pulling something not just glove compartment, and it's none of
your concerns. Right. So we're standing there still. I could
(06:34):
see my family walking towards me, and I'm standing there
with Jet, and I see a little girl, this cute
little thing with two ponytails, and I say hi, she's
walking in between the cars. She walked all the way
past and came back. And when I tell you, baby
girl gave me the f you finger of sounds a
(06:56):
hard one. It was hard, and it shook a bit
like it was strong. But what she meant that and
looked at you in your face like that was definitely
meant for you, for you, bitch, for you move your feet.
You just said hello. I was like wow, and it
(07:18):
hit me like a brick. We're on their island. They've
been serving send us all day. They got her juice.
There are beverages, we bought bags and trinkets. Um they
made them oxtails with their bomb ass rice and served
it all friendly and nice all day long. But now
it's our time, tourists. It can't be our time, Like
(07:43):
if I ain't had my kids, can we risk it
is time for a time ago to go home. We're
black and grown. People were getting their hair braided. People
were playing dominoes. But that kind of party, why are
we not what it went from island drinks with the
with the little umbrella in them and playing this one
(08:03):
love music to different different for you, for you. It's
like when you go to certain restaurants where you eat
certain types of Asian food in all of the tables
(08:25):
the square, but that round table in the back it
is for the family. Yeah, you are teaching me things
an that round table back. Then nobody sits at that
round table. Is now even on the menu? They're not.
That's not even on the menu. After they close up
(08:45):
that way they eat in that That's right. I feel
like that more are welcoming, like you know, come on,
y'all get some of the same time. It's that y'all
might not know about. I thought that everybody was lovely,
everybody was sweet and nice and helpful. We needed directions
many times, and everybody was just they stopped what they
(09:06):
were doing. It helped us out. But at a time,
I think it's bigger than that. I think it's about
them keeping their island to themselves, to keep their culture,
to keep their way like and you're not invited unless
you're invited. We were not invited. And my people from St. Timas,
(09:29):
you look like a told you wouldn't have bought that bag,
and you wouldn't have rented that ten dollar chair when
you could have just took one. I don't like when
y'all make points more real talk after the break. It
(09:58):
reminds me of a situation out, you know, and this
is different. But I was real cool with my daughter's
principle some years ago and I was in there complaining,
you know, we was just chatting it up, and I'm
complaining about you don't people in the neighborhood, and yeah,
neighborhood changing, you know, neighbor you know, ain't They're coming
a little business here the house, you know, And I'm
(10:21):
having a shop coffee shop, coffee shop talk at the
at the school. He like he laughed at me and
was just like, oh, he's like, you're a gentrifier too.
Just clutches. I'm a what, I don't understand how you're gentified.
(10:43):
You've been living in your house for like twenty years.
I don't know what You've been living in my house
almost twenty years. But it still remains to be true
that when I bought my house, there were families and
people on my block that had been there for ten
plus years, twenty years, families people black folk, right, and
I bought my house at the top of the market
at that time. Those same people who lived on my
(11:05):
block could not afford to buy my house when I
bought it, right, But that's that's somewhat of the definition
of gentry because because there is a natural steady flow
of life where costs go up. At the time that
I bought, my neighborhood was changing, and things weren't changing
because I was again making those observations like, oh yeah,
(11:27):
those and I and I did somewhat come in with
some of that change. Now, yeah, you know, it's not
exactly the same. It was highlight what I think what
it did was highlights something that held the point he
was trying to make is that there is a difference
between the black folks in your community in terms of
what is available to them as opposed to what is
(11:48):
available to you. Now, you still black, but there's a
very important difference in the way that you are experiencing
this as opposed to the way some of your neighbors
are experienced Right, But how about this, though, you still
have some of the same disadvantages because I know, usually
when we're talking about white folks justifying an area or whatnot,
you know, I know the neighborhood always like to say, like,
(12:10):
y'all call the cops. Stay there, you call the cops.
It's the same rate as the people that have been
living there for photo years. Like, there's still some differences
with you being a black person versus like a white person.
And now and now Whole Foods wants to move in.
Hopefuls ain't coming because you're there. Yeah, and you're and
you're you're worried about You're a hundred percent correct about that,
(12:31):
But I think you're not rendering correct about that. What
I think is a nuance here is that because we
do have some parts of the way we experienced the
world is black people in common, that doesn't necessarily mean that,
you know, the way that we experienced the world is
the same and that we don't, I don't access to
(12:51):
certain privilege. And so like I was, um, I had
circled back to my reading list, and I pulled out
Bill Hooks again because what I've been thinking about her
since my birthday, honestly, because this this birthday, I realized
that we were born on the same day. La da dada,
so yes. And so I've been like, I'm circling back
(13:11):
to some of her work and I'm reading feminist theory
from margin to center. And one of the things that
she talked about was the early kind of misunderstanding around
feminism where you know, white women were not at all
adding into the equation, nor were they caring about adding
into the equation the experience of all women. They were
taking a very nuanced version of of sexism that was
(13:35):
only for educated, middle class white women and then saying
that it that it was speaking for all women, right
because they were women. And it's like, well, no, there's
even though we all are women, it's very different from
being a poor white woman, or being a poor black woman,
or being a black woman or all of these things
(13:56):
change the way that you experience, uh, you know, sexism
in America, where you fall in terms of the patriarchy
or the capitalist structure, or whatever the case may be, like, well,
all those things together, that that that total structure together
is important to acknowledge these nuances. And that's how you
got from Bill Hooks to like a Kimberly Crenshaw who
(14:19):
talks about intersectionality, where she made this super clear, like, yes,
we're all black, but it's different when you're a black
and a woman. When you are black a woman and
you're queer. When you're a black and you're a woman
and you're queer and you're overweight or disabled, these are
all the ways that the world becomes smaller and smaller
(14:40):
and less accessible to you. So it's important to understand that. Again,
you're in the same time as we all black. Yeah, yeah,
they don't kick us out, but you're not experienced in
the world. In a country where the main source of
income is tourism, tourism from people, and you're making very
(15:01):
little money. That money is not trickling down to your community.
People are coming and they're getting luxury. You're going into
these spaces, you're providing a part of that luxury, but
your community is not seeing that luxury. You're being paid
minimum wage. You don't have any understanding of the political
(15:21):
landscape in that country. You don't have any understanding of
the nuances and the complexities of being a Saint Thomas.
And I don't know why you say that, because I
was thinking. I was like, I don't know much about saying.
I'm just gonna stay in Jamaica, just where I feel safe.
That's where I feel like they want me, they want
(15:41):
me there. Well, there's a big difference. We stopped at
the wrong Airbnb with the wrong address, well what appeared
to be the right address, but it was definitely not
the house I rented, and I was like, what is
going on? Had to figure it out. Found the house
that we were going to, dramatically different, dramatically different. This
(16:04):
had a view of the ocean. Uh, just beautiful. I'll
say the view was just really great. But the difference
between that first house and the second house was massive.
And that means if the first house, you know, if
that's a community, do you see what I'm saying? And
(16:25):
there was the drastic difference between the people who live
up top in the mountains, our own houses up top
in the in the mountains, the Republic of the Island
was was French, and another part of the island was Dutch.
And I'm and then you go to like the jewelry stores,
and all the jewelry stores are owned by Indian folks.
(16:48):
So where does that leave the people of the island,
the indigenous people of the island, where does that leave them?
It's their island, So they want us to leave, I say,
it's time to go. That comes to the idea of
gate keeping. Aren't we supposed to gate keep some things
(17:09):
far I don't know were black Americans. We didn't figure
that out yet, but I'm glad they have. But I
thought it was beautiful and Beau and I would go
back to St. Thomas anytime and absolutely shout of respect
that they deserve. Not a problem for me. Thank you
so much for this delicious food and its beautiful island
and your great service all day. Thank you so much.
(17:31):
It does make you think, though, I mean, if after
Asia broke it down, it's like, well, shoot, here we
go with the work. It makes me feel like, you know,
before we travel somewhere, we need to do a little
bit of research. I said it in jest, but I
just don't feel comfortable in Dominican Republic like that. I
feel like it's very they shield the tourists a lot
(17:51):
from what's going on, and it's just such a big differential.
And on top of the fact that how they treat
hate you. But that's the whole enough thing. But what
I'm saying is is that should we start are researching
and knowing some things or do we I think a
big miss understanding, you know, especially I mean we're Black Americans.
As we continue to move through the the sifting through
(18:15):
and the breaking down of all the different things that
we've had to deal with and unlearned, It's like, I
think there is a lot of thinking around like black
excellence and and black ascension, and that a lot of
that's tied to wealth, and a lot of that is
(18:36):
tied to access and power and leisure, you know what
I'm saying, a kind of leisure, right, And I think
what happens is that because we associate this thing with
being good for us as a group, we forget that
the characteristic of that is being taken from you know,
(18:59):
historically from our oppressors, is taken from a white supremacist,
you know, like vacation, ain't the thoughts of vacationing, and
like vacation it's it's imagine. I'm just talking about just
being able to do things right. So just being able
having access to things right. So yeah, you can catch
(19:20):
a nice little Spirit flight or Southwest flight and go somewhere.
It don't cost you know who a lot of money,
and we think in the end, I'm not rich. But
I'm talking about the mentality of luxury, of the way
we present ourselves in other countries. And then that's why,
you know, you can go certain places and they're like,
you're American. They don't really care about that you're black
or anything else. You're American, and that for some people
(19:40):
that that's offensive, right, because I think there is a
thinking that and I think for Black Americans there isn't
thinking like I'm doing a good thing by having wealth,
by being able to experience luxury by doing that, and
there's nothing wrong with that, or I work hard for
it to make at least make y'all think that that's
what it is. I just work. But I think that
(20:01):
what it can look like when you go other places
is a black face acting like them. The that that
sense of um, what's the word of entitlement entitlement. Had
I been somebody else, I could have raised the ruckets.
(20:22):
What do you mean we have to pay for these
chairs again? We already paid for these enjoined No, but
imagine had I been somebody else, I got it. I
get it. It's time for y'all to go home YouTube,
because this is our beach on our island, and we're
going to chill out and relax and talk to our
(20:44):
people right here on this island. It's not it's not
right on this beach, and it's not time for you.
And I felt like that was a powerful thing. It's
just we don't we don't have We can't do that
to them. Y'all come here, you go do whatever, do
the things. I don't know. It just it's interesting. I'm like,
I'm kind of jealous. I guess it's coming out. I'm jealous.
(21:07):
And I'm also trying to figure out because we're always
talking about how to figure out how to do this
for ourselves, but they can't protect not our intellectual properties.
Or it's just like so and y'all using it too.
Like what you're listening to on the beach, you ain't
just listening to the dance hall, So like, come on,
don't do that to us, like, yeah, but I don't
(21:30):
think the intersectionality of all the things that we Yeah no,
I mean I get what you're saying too, and I
think and I think it's to know who's who right there.
I ain't got time to interview you. Go home. I
ain't got time for all of that. And I think
that if you were to immerse yourself in the culture,
if you were to go and stay for a while,
(21:54):
you know, and spend some time and work amnks and
and eat a monkst and chill where everybody else chill.
I think that way, you know, that's a way for
you to be invited to the cook out. Yeah, you know.
But other than that, you're here for a week or two. Yeah,
we're not doing but so much. This is a transactional relationship,
(22:14):
right and now the transaction is over and it's time
for you to go home. I thought it was very powerful. Yeah,
I mean, if you're a person who lives near let's
saying and this is probably not black folks, you know
what I'm saying, especially in Philly now, But like you know,
when they have the big festival down there, you know,
(22:35):
and people come to the city and it's like they all, right,
y'all bringing all this money out of yaut of YadA,
but it's Monday, Bye, it's Monday. But because they'd be
all molly and all funked up and making all this
trash everywhere. Yeah, but I feel like that in my
neighborhood about University of Pennsylvania, I'd be so glad when
the kids go back home for the summers, were making
(22:57):
my bus go the long way. You know, I'm saying, y'all,
y'all damn restaurants, you know now, And then I'd be
mad too. It's a love hate relationship because when they
go home, I ain't got to pay attention to I
don't got to see y'all. But then when y'all go home,
all the restaurants want to close early, like they cater
to y'all, but they don't care about us, you know
(23:20):
what I'm saying. It's like, yeah, when y'all on campus,
if something's going down, you can find a cop like that,
m Phil. But it's like, yeah, but when y'all go home,
you know, I gotta be careful about wearing walking at
night is my friendsifier, But go ahead, like that's why
you ask you guys a question. Okay, So let's say
(23:41):
that there is a nightclub and all kinds of black
people are performing, and everybody's welcome, and everybody's having a
good time. But at two am, some people and they've
got to go home for some people appear to be closed.
And then and then these artists continue to create amongst themselves, right,
(24:03):
and why and you understand why? Right? Okay, that that too.
So what happens at the club is is is a
white club or Indian club and it's in America and
you're not after two am, you gotta go, like how
do how? Like I feel real good about having something
(24:26):
from black people where we get together and nobody else
is there, nobody's invited, no phones allowed, and you know,
we're building something UM special between us right now? Like
that excites me. But what happens when it's the other
way around? All right, it's already the other way around.
(24:48):
But I mean honestly though, like and this is recent,
we had the conversation with with um. So it's just
so bad, That's the what I'm asking you. Since it
already exists there this we're left out of a lot
of things. You know what I'm saying, the question is
always the question has always been what its sacred for us?
And how do we keep it sacred? And one of
(25:09):
the reasons why we keep it sacred? And us and
and and and so that that question. I feel like
we're still all still trying to answer those things, you
know what I mean. But one real thing is too
is that being able. And one thing that's interesting about
the thing that happened at the same time it's is
that you're talking about something that's somewhat commodified where it's
like they found a way to say this space that
(25:32):
we occupy it do cost money. I mean, it is
for sale, you know, for rent. You know what I'm saying,
It is for rent, but it is not um to
the point where we're willing to sell every part of it.
So I think one of the things we struggle with,
or one of the things I struggle with the understanding,
(25:53):
is how do yeah, so we we we want to
make everything cost something, we want to sell everything, we
want to make everything into a hustle. But there's no
sense of boundary, there's no sense of that some things
you can't take it. But so far, you know, even
with black women, I find that too where it's like
sometimes I have I have some interesting thoughts around that too,
(26:15):
because like I was thinking about this the other day,
like black women right now, this whole thing, like we
have made ourselves very clearly a market, not on purpose,
you know, we've made ourselves a market. And so as
much as it feels good to be catered to, we're
also gonna it's gonna feel seasonal. That season is going
(26:38):
to pass, and then so we have to be clear
on who we are and what we are culturally as
black women, and what things we hold dear and sacred.
Because in a minute, they are not gonna want to
print any more T shirts with Black Girl Magic on it.
I'm just saying, like, I'm just saying, all that's gonna
(26:58):
be done. Hey, listen, they're shrinking their bodies back to
in a minute, the black girl body is not going
to be the hot chip. People are taking that ship
the funk out. Oh yeah, girl. They have something called
the skinny BBL. Now did you know that? Oh shocks,
Oh yes, the surgeries and folding back in. This is
(27:22):
why this is why we gate keep. This is why
we have to We have to hold on. You have
to hold on to something of our own. I just
wish that we could make a collective decision on what
it was. It might be too late. We're gonna take
a quick break and then we'll be right back. All
(27:54):
I'm saying is that we really are in a capitalistic society,
and we were raised as capit the list. So if
I have something good that I could sell to make money,
it's it's inbred. It's in there, it's in there, It's
all in us. I never realized how American I am
until I go to another country and be like, oh,
ship m h, I am one of them. We girl.
(28:16):
We see it on the internets all the time. It's
like everything that every people confuse liberation with, like, you know,
making money. It's the the LLC squad. You need to
get you a LLC, you need to get you a password,
you need to get it. It's like that. That's that's
how we're going to ascend as a race of people.
But I'm gonna bring this up because we remember we
talked to some show and he was saying how it
(28:37):
is a weird kind of relationship we have with blackness
and when to be black culture and where it's like
race as a construct. You know, it's a thing that
we were assigned in relationship to whiteness. So it it
has a funny history, you know, and I understand why
(28:59):
are we tend to misuse it because it was never
thing we ever really were. We didn't become black until
we got off the boats. Before we got on them boats,
we was you know, europe book. We was saying, you know, Ebo,
you know what I'm saying, Ashanti. We were these things.
(29:20):
We were ethnic groups that had practices and languages and
things in which we could unify around things that we
could do, you know, coming of age ceremonies. So we
became black in relationship to whiteness. So it gets tricky
at this by our Christmas. Yes, and now, of course
(29:42):
we have created culture that we're proud of. Yes, innovated,
and we've made this gumbo and we are responsible for
this and this has influenced the world. And so yes,
that's something to hold to your chest. But the fact
that we don't quite know how to deal with it
speak to the fact that it kind of don't exist.
(30:04):
Black isn't even a thing. Really really did make it
a thing. It may not have started as a thing,
but like you just said, didn't we like said a
thing what's at its root isn't a thing really, what's
at it's route. So it's all there. So like from
the jazz to the no, no, no, not, what we
(30:27):
made from it is beautiful. I'm saying, I understand why
we struggle with it because at the end of the day,
what we built, the beginnings of it is just a
response to something else, something that they put on us
that we actually aren't nobody actually white, and ain't nobody
(30:49):
actually black. You know what I'm saying, That particular binary
was created and it wasn't created by us. Now now
we're here now that being said, I love being black.
Being said, I'm proud of all that we have done.
That being said, I don't like to see people, uh
(31:11):
making it into a commodity in any and everybody getting
a piece and us getting nothing. With that being said,
I hate feeling eraced. All of those things are valid,
but I'm saying, this is what we're trying to achieve
and talk about. It's complicated, it's hard. It is complicated.
It is to see like for black Americans, well, I
(31:33):
guess here it's gonna be for us the most out
of everybody, but nobody is in their rightful place in
that way, which is interesting, right because liken't we all
moved from one area to multiples. Well, yeah, we're a
diaspora for sure, okay. And I say, even in those islands,
the history of those islands and how we got there,
(31:54):
their story can be compared to blackness in America in
a way, right, Like, I'm just it's to me, you're
saying that, You're saying that regardless of where where we are. Uh,
that makes sense, It does make sense. Mm hmm. You know,
(32:14):
I gotta I gotta room in my house, and I
have a lot of artwork that m I collected over
the years, things that that just instinctually, I was like, Ah,
this's got to come home with me. And I've I
brought this artwork home and I put all of this amazing,
beautiful artwork in my house. And I realized recently that
(32:40):
I knew that I knew for certain, maybe three or
four the masks on my walls. That's what I'm talking
about the time in some parts. But I don't know
all of those masks. I mean, I pray over them,
you know, I cleanse them. You know, I saved my stuff,
(33:03):
especially when it comes to a mask and something that
I don't necessarily know what it means. What I'm saying
is I collected it because it spoke to me. I
was like you coming home with me. That's how I
chose it. But do I do? I understand them all?
Not at all? And I think that's where the interesting
thing comes with being a black American. We have pieced
(33:24):
me on ourselves into this place. We don't we don't
know enough. We're aware of things. Being aware of them
doesn't mean that you understand it. We have all these
fabrics I know, I do something. I know what they are,
something I don't. I just like the fabric to another culture,
(33:47):
to some someone else. This could be a sacred fabric.
I don't know. You know. It was a whole argument
a few years ago around Kine, the whole argument about
this variation. Yes girl, yes, yes, but you know again
(34:07):
again you know, and we're moving into a different part
of this conversation now, but you know what, let's speak
on it. But then and again, when you think about
things like quilts, that is Africa, that's that's that's our Kente.
Those kinds of things are ways in which you see
our Africanness described and expressed in ways that were meant
(34:31):
to preserve who we were, right and who I believe.
The Quakers were making quilts, not about certain kinds of quilts, right,
So you have like I learned about this in class.
Whereas like um, you know, in certain parts of the South,
a lot of the a lot of the early quiotes
that we may had a lot of circles on them.
And this was a specific thing that spoke to the
(34:53):
Congo people who were in large groups in certain parts
of the Carolinas. And so they worked with goals and
circles and things where you know, so these were symbols
that came from their ethnic groups that they begin to
sow into clothing that they put on to pottery all
they and they start to see a lot of these things.
And so that kind of those kinds of practices exist
(35:15):
all over the diaspora. They exist in Brazil, they exist
in the Carolinas, they exist in the Caribbean, they exist everywhere.
So there's a very real diaspora that we're talking about here.
But I think culture, because it can be so local,
so specific, soul soul special. Right when we start talking
about black culture as an umbrella. It's big and wide.
(35:36):
That's a very large, big, wide thing. And to say
something is black is putting something that is so complex
and so diverse under an umbrella that white people invented.
You can say, okay, well because like really you could
say I'm from Chicago in the same way a person
says I'm Nigerian. Really you can do that because you
(35:57):
go to Chicago and it's black cultural dances in chip
cargo that exists, and we're built and made out of Chicago.
Now we do that. I feel like we do that
when somebody say you from d C. Is like, you
know what that means? I'm doing. But I feel like, again,
like I said, just just just not that we don't
do it, just you know, continuing to press and push
the idea of what culture is and how we identify culture.
(36:18):
Once we can identify it and really own it and
really recognize what is culture, what is sacred? I think
you gotta first acknowledge that it ain't a big umbrella
fun that's a whole lot of small, beautiful things, right,
That's what I think. And it does have some things
that tie it together for sure, because there's certain ways
(36:40):
we talk and like certain ways we do things that
we all do. Even like you ever read or sometimes
on Twitter and people like, oh, we were raised by
the same people. All black people raised by the same parents.
Everybody's parents did the same thing. Everybody. There is commonality
in generation that you grew up in that there's kind
manality amongst certain kinds of food. You said you had
(37:03):
that right, She's like, I don't know what was in
that rice. It's you know, when you think about Joe
Off and how that rice. Race is a thing for us,
But Joel Loft ain't the same as Nigerian Off. They're
gonna argue you down, you know what I'm saying. And
so it's a thing we have to be willing to
(37:25):
do a little more. I don't know, investigating, Investigate, That's
that's where I'm at with and go with the work, y'all. Yeah,
that's coming. That's the work. And I don't pretend to
know every all this stuff. It's a lot. It's a
lot because I do believe that it was the Quakers
(37:47):
that we're making quilts, and then other people grasp these
quilts or bought these quilts, and then slave owners had
black people enslaved people make these quilts, and then they
started twisting them and adding other things and symbols and such.
But it started from if I if I'm not I
think so I canna be wrong, But I don't know. Yeah,
(38:10):
I'm just just talking about just the way that we
start to see we adapt everything in order to make
it work for us and be a representation of us.
But there was a lot of adapting of things, you
know what I'm saying. So like, in order to do
(38:33):
actual research or investigation on things, you gotta do the
whole work. Take one thing, Take one thing that you
really like in your house. Everybody's got some black ship.
We all got some good all black and be interesting
(38:54):
black ship. Everybody got it in their house. You must,
I know you do, because sometimes you don't know what
it is. I got a little a piece of sculpture.
I thought it was the most beautiful thing. And my
maintenance man from Guatemala came into my apartment and he
was like, Oh, this is from my country. That's how
we call it. That's how we call the cows. Now,
I thought I got this thing hanging from my door,
(39:19):
like it's beautiful. But I'm just saying to say that,
check all your ship in your house because you I mean,
in order to build a culture. Because it's not fried
chicken and watermelon. It's some of it. It's some of
it because Dan watermelon is good at the summer. But
everybody loves watermelon. I don't know. I think so. I
(39:41):
think everybody loves watermelon. But you're not that black people.
You heard that real ship about watermelon though, right like
you heard it and Asian tell me if I'm wrong,
But you know, that whole stereotype bout watermelon came from
the fact that they said watermelon made like black men
more a poem, and so then they made it the
whole stereotype because of the black men's like I didn't
come from never heard. I want melon is that it
(40:02):
is a massive hydrator for those for those of us
who are descending from people who had to work in
fields and things like that. They had to eat things
and consume things that would hydrate them. People like I
didn't say what I said. I just meant what AGES
said because that sounds smarter. Stay there, No, I mean
if that's that's a story, I mean that that's a
(40:22):
story that things have multiple truths. Black black shoes. But
I think, you know, ultimately the gate keeping thing is
still up in the air because I still think we
still have a lot more owning and loving of ourselves
to do. And they got left though, if you could
pick something, I mean, really, girls, what do we have
(40:45):
left to say for ourselves? It's a good question. Traditions
talked about this on this podcast. Somebody got doogie braids
right now. And I own not making our own traditions.
That we just know things that we were passed down
(41:05):
to us, things that we know to do. I think
those are things that can never be taken from us,
that cannot be sold. These are things that we just do.
It's we just had cookers. We just hit a new year, right,
trust me. On on the white Internet, nobody was talking
(41:26):
about Coeople's black eyed peas, and girl was talking about
to my good Korean girlfriends on that took her black
eyed peace to all her good wife friends. I'm just
saying everything there's there's there's people experience huff Wig on
(41:47):
Amazon and the model was white, and I was like,
thank God to be giving to be joking. Shout out
the shade butter and shade moisture. Seriously, wow, Well, you
(42:08):
know the hair been taking jail. The hair been like this,
not like this, this is this is, this is the
next extra. The day of the white first white man
putting in the lock was the dated the head with
hair was gone. Can we talk like that ship? Just
map the funk up? Can we talk about a little
bit of family business real quick? Though. Yes, black folks
(42:30):
have invented and done a number of wonderful, amazing things
in which they have been stolen from us. But one
thing about Black Americans. If they're going to tell you
black people invented some ship, did they ain't event ship?
What you want to correct? You know that you know
that's black? Right? No, how you know you know so
(42:52):
and so you know the black folk you know that's
that's that the black people did that. No, No, they
didn't know that. They didn't. They didn't, they didn't know.
They don't give us credit for nothing. They take it
all proved, They didn't prove they didn't. You don't. Blacks
will tell you something in admitted. Don't every great white
idea is a black person about them. They'd be like, oh,
(43:18):
russels or well, you know, black black people invented the
ruffle girl, Combs brushes soap. You know, black people have
finished so what nobody clean before us? We know we clean.
I love it. I love it, Jill still thinking, come on, jail,
we'll be holding on to holding on to what you think,
(43:38):
Jill mm hmm. I just it's tough because if I
look at it any other race, like, I'll never understand
them either. Like, the only thing that came to mind
was powerful, beautiful black love between a couple. Oh girl,
(43:59):
they trying to get that. Like, I've had the privilege
to see it and I've had the privilege to be
in it. But I'm also there. I'm looking at this thing,
but I don't know it's that's a tough one too,
because love is love. Yeah, I think it's maybe Jill
(44:21):
Scott and Kindred, that's the last thing we got to
be can hold on to ship day. I think No,
I do think connection is a thing. I think connection
and you know, I do think that. I think there's
a tone. There's a way that black folk can communicate
without talking. There's a way we talk. Have you watched
Love and Hip? Have you seen the right We have
(44:44):
talked about this before, I know, But just cash me outside, Okay, exactly.
I don't. And the thing is, anytime I see love
between two folks, I'm always like, M, that's nice. Anytime,
you know, I'm like shot, these two people's relationship. I
(45:11):
don't know if they know, if she knows when when
um he's about to call. I don't know if she knows.
You know, when romanticize thing. Basically you're romanticizing. I think
I might be because I don't know. I know I
I always feel good when I see two people um
extend kindness to each other and are affectionate with each other.
(45:34):
That makes me feel good no matter what race it is.
I want to go ahead, y'all. So it can't be that.
It can't be that because you've done it now now
you don't know if this necessarily has as is black
love specific to two black folks? Well, we have obviously,
and what else are we gonna do like black black folks?
(45:55):
And you know what I mean, It is specific to
black folks because we're black and we folks and we
love each other. Right, But what you talk about, what
you're talking about, is there a specific kind of way
that we experience love to GILM that cannot be duplicated? Oh,
I think that's a movie. Baby, I think that's I
think that's a song. I think you says, I'm thinking
(46:16):
that it's worth investigating. Oh okay, okay, because because I'm caught,
you know what I mean, Like, I'm because you don't
want to romanticize black love either and make it seem
like it's a mystical thing. No, it's not mythical. It's real. Yeah,
mys mystical like Matt. Yeah, because because you don't want
(46:38):
it to feel like like trauma binding or something. It's like,
is it. It's got to be something more healthy and
connected and mm hmm sounds like homework. Y'all ain't no
answer to that. We lost It's it's take the lake
the L. I mean, we still do it better, We
(46:59):
still take that. We'll take the L for the moment. Okay,
more conversation after the break. I want you guys to
(47:21):
call us. I want you to send us messages. I
want you to let us know what is that thing?
What is that thing that we have that remains our own?
Because you would think you just be able to pop
up with a couple of answers on this thing, but
how about jumping the room. It's not even head wraps,
(47:44):
no moment, how about jumping the room. I don't really
see nobody else do that. I don't do that. You
reach it with that one because I got to reach.
I mean, I just think it's just everything, Like you said,
no one could do it like us. Whatever we do that,
whatever comes from whatever. Yeah, whatever it is that comes
(48:06):
from us, people can duplicate it, but they can't. They
can't do it. They can't do it. It's like it's
like you ever hear Tina Marie sing or yeahba don't
do that, Darre exceptions every rule, Jill uh, that's a
(48:27):
mighty beautiful wind. No no, no, no, Tina Portuguese. No,
so that's it's some brown it's somewhere and yeah, yeah,
but that's my goal down. Yes she does, she does,
(48:49):
so we can't even black children's books. I was just
thinking about it, like the sister who says, I'm gonna
remember her name, but she's um, she's very Dore's a
meme that goes around where she's just like, I'm not
saying that the girls are not doing their thing, but
they're not doing it. Okay, That's how I feel about it.
(49:09):
It's like I'm not saying that people aren't out there
doing their things, but they're not doing it. You know
what I'm saying. Em Dead, that's who said it. Shout
out to em C Dead. EMC dev said that. M
hmm right. What's really important is not that we gate
keep but that people know the history. That's what we're
(49:32):
talking about, and then we go with that. Investigation can
be tolerated. Say it again, we will not tolerate erature
it is that you're saying, because that's what's happening. It's
not the word rare are erasure money Those raisins and
(49:58):
slave owners are still on the money and they have schools.
Yeah that our kids go to. Yeah yeah, yeah, Well
I'm really saying that we could watch ourselves be raised.
(50:19):
We could do it. We could literally sit here and
watch ourselves be raised. That ship is is now what's
up in no way, shape or capacity, like, there's no
way we have to do. We have to investigate. We
have to find out our who who are people's is
not on my watch? How did you get here? Everybody
who's doing something, some black person somewhere made a sacrifice
(50:42):
for you to get there. Trying to learn the history,
the history of the history specifically in your path. Find
out who opened the door for you. That's how that's
something that we can hold on to. Our our history
cannot be raised because it's happening. It is uh happening.
(51:02):
It is a current event that people who have who
have open doors, people who have um open doors is
such a big is that that's a huge that's a
huge statement. Who have opened doors so that you can
advance a lot of people enter through back doors, so
(51:25):
you can walk through the front. And that's not a cliche,
that's facts. There's a lot of people who stayed up
all night picketing and and the knowledge of it is
literally under attack right now in many states in our country.
They are absolutely erasing our history. History that was already
not being taught. Now they're saying it's illegal to teach
(51:47):
it in we are being erased. They're saying that, um,
people don't read books as much as as they should,
or that they could. Um, maybe that's true. I would
like to invite anybody that reads stories, read stories to
(52:08):
um your friends. Y'all ain't doing nothing else. Read read
stories to your people. Haven't come over and drink some
wine or drink some whatever you got I don't care,
so did you knows? Is a nice thing? That's what's up.
That's cool, that's a good time. Ain't i'ing wrong with that?
And you can play music in between and also to
(52:29):
ask questions because I'm gonna I'm gonna just say this.
When I was cooking my collar greens and my black
eyed peas, my daughter came in there and she was
just like, Mom, you know, I was wondering why we
did this, and I found out why. She said, you know,
I was wondering why we did And she said, did
you know that a lot of that that during the
(52:50):
top of the year, that many of the slave owners
would settle up their debts by selling, you know, some
of their you know, human property, and they would you know,
they were up to anny on their human trafficking, right,
and that a lot of the enslaved people would feel
nervous around this time and think, you know, and they
(53:12):
would cook these meals as you know, just a good
luck thing to have the meal the next day to
celebrate if those who were able to stay. And that's
how we started the whole cooking of the collar greens
and the black eyed peas. That's that's where some of
that comes from. Also too, there's another tradition on New
Year's Um for enslaved people that makes it somewhat you know,
(53:34):
important as well, was that when the Emancipation Proclamation was signed,
it didn't go into effect until the following year, and
so a lot of enslaved people and free people had
watch night in which they were waiting for the top
of the year for it to be legal for the
Emancipatient Proclamation to go into effect so they could then
emancipate themselves. And so they were waiting for that time period.
(53:59):
So that time of the year is important to us.
So I think some of those things are stories we
can tell our families during those times. Two on Mother's
Day every year on Mother's Dad tell my children the
story of their birth. The stories and the storytelling is
how our history has been passed down from person to person.
Yeah we have books, Yeah we have movies and documentaries
(54:20):
and all that stuff, but let's not get rid also
two of the oral that's important and for us to
take that seriously within our households, we can't be erased.
That's the thing we learned. The history, we write, the
history we tell it it's just important. Otherwise they really
are going white. Every everything we worked for, we bled for,
(54:46):
all of that stuff is going to get forgotten. And
I don't know if y'all know ever seen that movie
Coco and Coco. It's an animated film that is based
in Mexican culture around the day. But what it talks
about is these people who were on the other side
of these spirits, of these people who have passed on
in your family, but that they are able to exist
(55:08):
and come back to the day of the life of
the living on the Day of the dead to visit
their families once a year, but they can no longer
come the moment someone in the family doesn't remember them, ah,
then they're gone for good. They can exist in the
spirit world. To turn to go with that, and yeah,
(55:30):
as long as you can remember them, they can come back.
And I think what's really important about that thinking culturally,
even though that's not my specific culture, what I take
from that is that remembrance is important. I say this,
I mean, this is off topic, but when people come
to my show and I'm singing songs and make them
(55:51):
feel al randy and excited and sensual, I say, I
know when you go home. You're gonna be making some
good love now on the fifth stroke, I just want
you to say thank you, Jill. I think do you
say that? Critics? Hey, you know, shout it out. I
(56:13):
feel it, shout. Can you imagine a collective where where
everybody in the audience go home and make some good
love and on that fifth stroke they'll be like, thank you, Jill.
I mean, how good must that feel? If I mean,
my goodness, let her say it, don't you don't say it, sir.
(56:34):
I'm just saying I know. I was just helping it.
When there is a collective energy about understanding, Yes, that
is a power and we that is something that we
can do. Pick up black ass thing in your house
right now and just find out what it is, where
(56:55):
it came from. It'll it'll help you understand why it's there.
That instinct, that instinct that is something that has passed
down to us as well. I can't forget that. Thank
you so much for listening to j dB Ill the podcast.
It is always a pleasure to have conversation that sparks conversation,
(57:20):
leave us a message, let us know some more things
that we should hold onto. Thanks for listening. How do
you eat an elephant one by it time. Hey, listeners,
it's Amber the producer here. I love that we're having
(57:41):
these conversations and really peeling back the depth and meeting
from these everyday experiences as black people have a few resources.
Lincoln the show notes that I want to share with you,
um one that dives deeper on how to travel respectfully,
respectfully okay, and another on the layered conversation about being
black genter fire. It's complicated, it really is, and I
(58:03):
hope we all keep these conversations going in our own
families and social circles. Oh and I will also share
the link for Coco, the movie Aga mentioned in the episode.
The film is incredibly y'all watch it immediately. Hi, if
(58:32):
you have comments on something he said in this episode
called eight six six, Hey, Jill, if you want to
add to this conversation, that's eight six six nine five
four five FI. Don't forget to tell us your name
and the episode you're referring to. You might just hear
your message on a future episode. Thank you for listening
(58:53):
to Jill Scott presents Jay dot Ill. The podcast h
J dot Ill is a production of I Heart Radio.
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