September 12, 2025 • 28 mins
Activist and organizer Cristina Jiménez, co-founder of United We Dream, joins Maria Hinojosa on Latino USA. Listen in on the conversation, as Cristina reflects on growing up undocumented in Queens, the experience of finding her voice among other undocumented people, and how she transformed her fear into power. For Cristina, migration is not just a story about borders and legislation, it's also a story about love. Her story is a true testament of resilience, community, and hope, as she shares insights from her new memoir, Dreaming of Home: How We Turn Fear into Pride, Power, and Real Change.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Dear let you know USA listener.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Before we start, you should know that if you want
to listen to this episode, add free just joins and
you can join for as little as seven dollars a month.
Joining also gets you behind the scenes access and yes,
some cheesemake. So click the link in the episode description
and after you do that, then click play.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Let's go to the show. Dear listener.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You know, I meet a lot of people, but there
are some people who I need who stick out, some
people who I know are going to have a big
impact on American history. Yeah, I mean American history. One
of those people is Christina Jimenez. She has been regarded
(01:02):
as one of the most important immigration activists over the
last couple of decades, and I've been wanting to talk.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
To her for several months.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Gatristina Himenez is the co founder of United We Dream,
which is the largest immigrant youth led movement in the country.
She grew up undocumented in Queens, New York, and for
years she lived in fear that she or her parents
would be deported, worried that her family would be torn apart.
(01:33):
Earlier this year, Gatristina Himeniz released her memoir Dreaming of home,
how we turn fear into pride, power and real change.
She like I was a guest at the Raissado Festival
in Aspen, Colorado, late in August. It's a gathering that
celebrates Latino culture, leadership and creativity, and like a good activist,
(01:55):
Gatistina captured the moment that we're facing.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Here is here. I think it won't go away, And
what I will tell your listeners is that this is
a moment of realizing that silence and hiding won't protect us,
but community will.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
From Futuro Media, it's Latino USA. I'm Maria Rosa. Today
my conversation with one of the very few American activists
to ever win the MacArthur Genius Award. Her name is
Christina human Is. We're going to talk about the strength
and need for activism in order to protect immigrant communities
these days, also the fear of losing her own husband
(02:45):
to ice officers, and Christina and I both get quite
personal about the constant need to make this country love us.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Christina Himan is, welcome to Latino USA.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
I've been wanting to speak to you for I don't know, officially,
maybe a year, so great to have you on the show.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Madia, it's so wonderful to be here. I love Latino, USA,
and it's such a dream come true to be in
this conversation with you.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
So, Christina, you know, a year ago, I don't know
if you remember the conversation that we had. Basically what
you said to me was, I'm afraid. I'm afraid of
my book releasing. I'm formally undocumented, I'm an activist. The
book has been out now, So what do you think
now about that fear that you had?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
You know, Maria, a lot of people in the book
events I've been across the country asked me this question
of so when does your fear go away or how
does that happen? And I have to be real and
vulnerable that even though I am a naturalized citizen today
(04:03):
though let's be clear, under the current conditions and this government,
people who are naturalized are not safe either. But even
earlier in the year before many of the attacks on
even naturalized citizens came up, the fear has not left
my body because I have loved ones who have daka,
(04:32):
loved ones who are undocumented. I'm so connected to many
members of my community and my family that are impacted
by all that's happening right now. And I also know
that my work organizing communities, being out there fighting for
people's right and dignity makes me a target. But the
(04:57):
fear is here. I think you won't go away. And
what I'll tell your listeners is that this is a
moment of realizing that silence and hiding won't protect us,
but community will.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
I don't know if people understand that actually living undocumented
is a highly existential experience, and so I'm wondering about
this notion of, you know, philosophically understanding that as an
undocumented person, as an immigrant not born in this country,
that we have a philosophy of life that moves us,
(05:42):
which is when we're scared the nemos mio, we don't
know what's going to happen, but one foot in front
of the other.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, that's what I learned from my parents, Maria, and
in this book is such an moment to the courage
of my parents and what I learned from you know,
it's not like they told me, miha. This is where
courage looks like. They never had that like conversation and
you know, the dinner table with me, But it was
by watching and seeing how they did, and in fact,
(06:10):
you know, both of them passed away and they were
unable to say their last goodbyes because that we were
undocumented in this country. And I watch that, and I
tell you, when I travel abroad and I have to
come through customs again, I always, I always fear that
I'm not going to be let in, and I have
done nothing wrong other than being any immigrant in this country.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
It's interesting because you know, the narrative by this administration
is one that as immigrants, you and I are like, well,
who is he talking about? You know that we are takers,
that we are losers, that we are people who are
prone to criminality. All of this is the opposite of
(06:53):
what we actually experience. And I often find myself, Christina,
just wishing that people could understand that strength. And a
lot of the theme of your book is you actually
have power, immigrants, undocumented immigrants, You actually have.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Power, and we are heroes. Just to think about all
of the mothers, father's families that come the risks so
much their lives literally and survive so much by the
way to cross different places to get here. And I
always remember when I was writing the book My Dea,
(07:31):
there was this woman under the Biden administration in the
first couple of months, where Kamala Harris goes to Guatemala
and she has a press conference with the president of Guatemala.
I want to be clear to folks in this region
who are thinking about making that dangerous trek to the
United States Mexico border. And the whole point of that
(07:51):
press conference was to say, do not come, do not come.
And I sat with that in tears, that the first
black and immigrant vice president, women who are being a
champion for immigrant rights, for saying that, and that she
was using this big, powerful platform to send that message.
(08:14):
And I sat with it because it's almost like a
denial that there are greater forces that push people to
leave their homes, as if we like dream to choose
to leave everything behind not knowing what you know, what
is going to be a stake, risking our lives. We
don't do that out of fun and joy or because
(08:35):
we dream of it. When I wrote my book, I
kept thinking about Tony Morrison and how she unapologetically wrote
for black people. I wrote this book for the undocumented
young girl that was ashamed and afraid and had no
hope or felt powerless. I wrote it for that girl.
(08:57):
I wrote it for our hinted for our people to
also confront us that sometimes we believe those lives. I
believe those lives, and I tap into this vulnerability in
the book to say, like, I don't want to just
talk about the Americans that believe all these lies.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I believe these lies.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
I grew up in a nine to eleven era in
New York City where everything I heard about being an
immigrant being not from this country was shame, bad, bad,
bad bad. I internalized those lives. I believed that somehow me,
my parents had done something wrong for coming to this country.
(09:38):
I internalize the lie, and my journey gets transformed that idea,
and that lie gets transformed and gets shed because I
meet on document the young people that are fighting deportations.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Take us to that moment when you decide, after being
very tenuous about the whole notion about being an activist,
when you're like, no, no, no, I'm gonna go public
now with the thing that has been the most shameful, hidden, scary,
and you're like, Soichika, but you're about to hear me
what happened in that moment and why did you decide
(10:18):
to do that?
Speaker 3 (10:19):
The context is the early two thousands, the terrorist attacks
of nine to eleven happened, and the country moves in
a direction of fighting terror. But the way that that
looks like for domestic policy in particular, which was, you
know what many of us experience was the creation of
homeland security, increase resources for the tension and deportation. All
(10:44):
of us become a target in Muslim communities, immigrant communities.
This notion of fighting deportations was not a thing in
that day. And then I get to know about Marican Sales.
American Sales is the first undocumented young person and her
and her family, because of nine eleven policies in Missouri,
ends up being targeted for deportation, and she has the
(11:07):
courage to share his story publicly.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
I got off that stage and I had students come
up to me and they said thank you, and I
said for what? But they were like tears streaming down
their face. I can't tell my story, but it is
my fear, and you're living my biggest fear.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
So what do I have to lose? And then I
saw all these people. I get invited to my first rally,
So I joined this rally and I'm scared. I'm not
even like chanting. But then I start chanting, and I
hold a sign, and I become part of the crowd
(11:45):
that is chanting education not deportation, Education not deportation, and
I start getting goose bombs, like I'm chanting with all
of these people that I don't even know. What I
realized is that in that crowd there were students from
the city of University of New York, some of them
that I know, but there was also a lot of
(12:06):
Americans from all walks of.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Life that don't even know Marie.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Nobody has met her in person, and yet they were
fighting for her right to stay. And that Maria was
the moment that totally transformed things for me, because if
people that did not even know Marie were fighting for her,
and if I was to be the next Marie Gonzales
facing deportation, I wanted that community to be fighting for
(12:30):
me too.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Coming up on Latino USA, the challenges of building aggress
roots movement.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Conflict is going to emerge. Differences are going to emerge,
Difference of opinion around strategy are going to emerge. We
had a conflict with the older generation stay with us notes,
(13:09):
Hey we're back, Let's jump back into the conversation with
Pristina Hi Minez, and we're going to pick it up
by talking about the making of the organization United We Dream,
which happened in two thousand and eight.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
You're now not just an activist, you are, in fact
making history as an activist in the United States because
you helped co found United We Dream, which was an
immigrant led youth movement that frankly changed history. To me,
this is like when United We Dream shows up right,
I'm wondering about how you see that transition to it's
(13:45):
not just you as one of many activists. It's like, no,
now I'm going to co found an organization to help
represent these hundreds and thousands of people.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
You know. In my book, I tell the journey on
my transformation of finding my voice and my power in
this community of organizers, in this community of young, courageous
people that are fighting deportations. Many of them have lost
family members to deportations, and they are such a big
source of inspiration for me to tap into that courage.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
And my hope.
Speaker 3 (14:19):
Is that by people learning about this journey, they can
also see themselves in it. This book is for anyone
who's afraid right now. This book is for anyone who
has ever felt like you don't belong or that has
felt powerless or hopeless. And my hope in people and
readers being able to follow my journey of a shame
and afraid to like unapologetically undocumented, unafraid and leading the
(14:43):
building of a movement and an organization is that we
can do that too. You can do that too, and
it is hopeful, and it's inspiring and it's empowering. And also, Maria,
it's really hard. It's really hard. Even when we find
spaces of community where we have a share vision and
(15:04):
share values, conflict is going to emerge. Differences are going
to emerge, Difference of opinion around strategy are going to emerge,
and then the question for us as leaders and organizers
are how do we deal with that. We had a
conflict with the older generation.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
The older generation didn't want you guys out on the
street pushing right. They were saying, no, no, no, alguba pasad,
why are you guys protesting your bringing attention to us.
Don't do that, gay La Boca.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I want to remind people the planting of the seeds
and the work were happening in the early two thousands,
so it takes over ten years to get to this
point that moment. What it does is that it shows
us what power we having, what we don't.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Have, because twenty ten is a huge defeat for the
immigrant rights movement, for young immigrant right lead rights leaders
like yourself.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
The film of DOCA to pass the.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Criticism from the older generation saying we should not be
doing this piecemeal. Also, it should be comprehensive immigration reform.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
You for having the courage.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
To stand here today to demand immigration reform.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
I cannot a justice today. The Senate voted against the
Dream Act. It would have offered a path to citizenship
to some illegal immigrant students who plan to join the
military or go to college.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
So, Cristina, was DOCA a mistake? Was it not a mistake?
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Now? I stand behind Doc. Can I tell you why?
It's not about being right? And you know, often in
leadership people not being open to recognizing mistakes. I could
tell you about other mistakes that I think that we've made.
But DOCA, it's a huge victory for us to own
because the millions of lives that happen changed were all
(16:58):
worth it. There are millions of lives of DACA recipients
who were able to pursue a college education, who were
able to buy homes, who were able to get cars,
who were able to support their family members, who were
able to get insurance, healthy insurance for the first time
in their lives, to treat diseases that they've never been
(17:20):
able to treat. The number of people that then also
happened to fall in love and you know, find a
pathway through marriage that DACA allowed for that to happen.
DACA also allowed for many people to go back and
see there are a bulitos and there are abuelitas and
say good byes. Nobody will take that away from us,
(17:44):
no one, And that impact there are millions of lives
that have been touched. I mean, people don't think about this,
but you know, if you want to be a policy
wonk about it, DOCA was an out of poverty program.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
About to say, people don't talk about the fact that
DACA actually had an impact on the American economy because
you can employ them, they could buy the homes, they
could get enrolled into college.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
But it's also la vida destra hintic cambio. So there
are the days and moments that I feel very tired,
and I feel very angry at myself for wanting this
country to want as Maria.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Oh my god, when you said that, I feel rejected
when you said that, this fight of always.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Wanting to have this country love.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
You, and so we work so hard and we write
books and we're like doing sixteen childs and it's.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Like, will you just see us?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
It's exhausting, it's exhausting, and so I feel sometimes mad
on myself for still longing for this country to see
me as one of their own. And I'm just cry
right now.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
That both of us were trying. This is ridiculous, right,
And yet, Maria, when I hold true.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Is that it's also in this country where I found
my purpose and I found my voice, and I found
a community that comes from a rich tradition of civil
rights fighters, women rights, indigenous people, black people that have
been fighting for this country to really live up to
(19:22):
those aspirational values of freedom and equality for all people
that we have yet to achieve. But it is in
that rich tradition that you and I and many of
us get to be part of it now and carry
that lineage and that tradition forward. And that's also what
this country has given me. This country has also given
(19:42):
me my family. My husband is only here because Americans
from all walks of life for his release from a
detention facility in upstin New York and prevented his deportation.
And Walter and I now continue to live in New
York and have a three year old that was born here.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Last story.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
It's only possible because Americans made a choice to fight
for justice, and that is what brings me hope right
now because I see people all across the country fighting
for their neighbors, immigrants not immigrants. This is like a
multiracial moment where people are realizing this ain't about just immigrants,
(20:29):
It's about all of us. And for our Latinos and Latinas,
trust me, we are now part of the vision that
they have for this country. The folks that want to
keep this country white, and they want to weaken this
democracy and leave under undemocratic conditions. They don't want us,
whether you have papers or not. When I think about
(20:51):
the young Christinas out in the world right now, this
is their moment. And as a student of history and
also now you know, a professor at the City University
of New York, I teach my students that when you
look at the world. There's never been social transformation with
that young people at the front.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
We'll be right back, bay, Yes, hey, we're back. Here's
the last part of my conversation with Christina Jimenez. Okay,
(21:35):
and now a difficult question, because we've all lived through this, right,
which is your expectation, your prediction about how this is
a moment where Latinos and Latinas are going to be
transformational yet again, because have been throughout history, and yet
Latinos and Latinas did vote for Donald Trump in numbers
(21:56):
that we had not seen before.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
What is your understanding of.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
What to do with the conservative Latinos and Latinas who
voted for Donald Trump and who many of them still
are believing the rhetoric that the only people that are
being targeted are the criminals.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Absolutely, and we have to be sober about this.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Maria.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
I don't think that the mass deportations and the mass
pain and terror that it's happening is magically going to
transform people. But I do think it opens an opportunity
for those of us who are interested in social change
and who are committed to it, and who are committed
to building power for our community. We have an opportunity
(22:36):
in front of us, but it's up to us to
make that happen. They don't feel like this administration has
delivered on their economic interest, like the price of X
had not gone down because of mass importations folks, right,
Like it takes no science or no data to just
like realize the deportation of the workers that are actually
making our food train possible. And I think people are
(22:59):
starting to know is who's really to blame? People in
power and billionaires that just want to get more money
out of this situation. So I think that it is
our job to be able to make those connections. Migration
is a love story. We may not think about immigration
as a love story, and what I try to do
(23:20):
with this book is that it is I witness my
parents taking this great risk because they love me and
they love our family. I also experienced and seeing Americans
from all walks of life, even right now, fighting against
deportations out of love for their neighbors and their friends
and their family members. Like the high schooler in Massachusetts
(23:43):
whose volleyball team rallied marched, you know, took action to
get him out of detention. And that's love, just with
a very emotional.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Day for these students, filled with tears, prayers and a
strong sense of unity for Marcelo Gomez and Jnight remains
and Ice customers. By the size of that crowd, the
students walking out of the school, Marcelo Gomez has a
lot of people in his corner. About your love story
with your husband, Walter, you were very trepidacious at first,
and yet when you jumped in with him, suddenly you're
(24:16):
now faced with not the trepidation of love, but the
fact that your husband has been detained. He was not
your husband at the time, right, but that your boyfriend
had been detained.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
We were not even not even. So this is the
thing that happens. Everybody around us is telling us, like
you all, like are such a great match, look at
the energy that you all have when you're with each other,
and you're like such bad as organizers, you'll should date.
And we're telling our friends separately, like no way, he's
(24:47):
on document, this, she's on document. You don't want to
do that, Like imagine pull your heart at so much
risk of falling in love with someone who could potentially
be the ported tomorrow. No way, And the idea that
I could be in a situation where I may never
see him again. Was the thing that helped me recognize
(25:09):
what sometimes we often ignore, that it's already in our heart,
and he had the same feeling, and so we didn't
even have to talk much about it. I think we knew.
That's when we decided, no matter what like and what
happens and the uncertainty of both being undocumented, we're not
going to let this injustice and this system that wants
(25:32):
to take away our freedom, our freedom to love each other.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
So the love story is actually thanks to the repression
that leads to the activism that leads to the love story.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
He's been a journey, but we're going strong and if anything,
just even more committed to making this world better place
for our son and for all of our kids.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
We love a good telenovela story and where it ends
with love.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
We love that. Gristina Jimenez, thank you so much for
joining me on Leatino USA. So great to be with you. Maria,
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
That was Gristina ki Minez, activist organizer and co founder
of United We Dream, the largest immigrant youth led movement
in the country. She and I spoke in Aspen, Colorado
after the Raisavo Festival. That's it for today. This episode
(26:49):
was produced by Adriana Rodriguez. It was edited by our
managing editor Fernanda Echavarri. It was mixed by Stephanie LeBeau.
Special thanks to Aspen Public Radio and Daniel Costello. The
Latino USA team also includes Roxanna Guire, Julia Caruso, Jessica Ellis,
Renaldo Leans Junior, Andrea Lopez, Cruzado, Luis Luna, Gloni mar Marquez,
(27:13):
Julieta Martinelli, Monica Moranez, Garcia, JJ Krubin and Nancy Trujillo.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Penilee Ramirez and I.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Are executive producers and I'm your host, Mariao Josa. Latino
USA is part of Iheart's Mykududa podcast network. Executive producers
at iHeart are Leo Gomez and Arlene Santana. Join us
again on our next episode. In the meantime, I'll see
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(27:43):
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Dear let you know USA listener.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Before we start, you should know that if you want
to listen to this episode, add free just joins and
you can join for as little as seven dollars a month.
Joining also gets you behind the scenes access and yes,
some cheesemake. So click the link in the episode description
and after you do that, then click play.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Let's go to the show. Dear listener.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
You know, I meet a lot of people, but there
are some people who I need who stick out, some
people who I know are going to have a big
impact on American history. Yeah, I mean American history. One
of those people is Christina Jimenez. She has been regarded
(01:02):
as one of the most important immigration activists over the
last couple of decades, and I've been wanting to talk.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
To her for several months.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Gatristina Himenez is the co founder of United We Dream,
which is the largest immigrant youth led movement in the country.
She grew up undocumented in Queens, New York, and for
years she lived in fear that she or her parents
would be deported, worried that her family would be torn apart.
(01:33):
Earlier this year, Gatristina Himeniz released her memoir Dreaming of home,
how we turn fear into pride, power and real change.
She like I was a guest at the Raissado Festival
in Aspen, Colorado, late in August. It's a gathering that
celebrates Latino culture, leadership and creativity, and like a good activist,
(01:55):
Gatistina captured the moment that we're facing.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Here is here. I think it won't go away, And
what I will tell your listeners is that this is
a moment of realizing that silence and hiding won't protect us,
but community will.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
From Futuro Media, it's Latino USA. I'm Maria Rosa. Today
my conversation with one of the very few American activists
to ever win the MacArthur Genius Award. Her name is
Christina human Is. We're going to talk about the strength
and need for activism in order to protect immigrant communities
these days, also the fear of losing her own husband
(02:45):
to ice officers, and Christina and I both get quite
personal about the constant need to make this country love us.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Christina Himan is, welcome to Latino USA.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
I've been wanting to speak to you for I don't know, officially,
maybe a year, so great to have you on the show.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Madia, it's so wonderful to be here. I love Latino, USA,
and it's such a dream come true to be in
this conversation with you.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
So, Christina, you know, a year ago, I don't know
if you remember the conversation that we had. Basically what
you said to me was, I'm afraid. I'm afraid of
my book releasing. I'm formally undocumented, I'm an activist. The
book has been out now, So what do you think
now about that fear that you had?
Speaker 3 (03:39):
You know, Maria, a lot of people in the book
events I've been across the country asked me this question
of so when does your fear go away or how
does that happen? And I have to be real and
vulnerable that even though I am a naturalized citizen today
(04:03):
though let's be clear, under the current conditions and this government,
people who are naturalized are not safe either. But even
earlier in the year before many of the attacks on
even naturalized citizens came up, the fear has not left
my body because I have loved ones who have daka,
(04:32):
loved ones who are undocumented. I'm so connected to many
members of my community and my family that are impacted
by all that's happening right now. And I also know
that my work organizing communities, being out there fighting for
people's right and dignity makes me a target. But the
(04:57):
fear is here. I think you won't go away. And
what I'll tell your listeners is that this is a
moment of realizing that silence and hiding won't protect us,
but community will.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
I don't know if people understand that actually living undocumented
is a highly existential experience, and so I'm wondering about
this notion of, you know, philosophically understanding that as an
undocumented person, as an immigrant not born in this country,
that we have a philosophy of life that moves us,
(05:42):
which is when we're scared the nemos mio, we don't
know what's going to happen, but one foot in front
of the other.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, that's what I learned from my parents, Maria, and
in this book is such an moment to the courage
of my parents and what I learned from you know,
it's not like they told me, miha. This is where
courage looks like. They never had that like conversation and
you know, the dinner table with me, But it was
by watching and seeing how they did, and in fact,
(06:10):
you know, both of them passed away and they were
unable to say their last goodbyes because that we were
undocumented in this country. And I watch that, and I
tell you, when I travel abroad and I have to
come through customs again, I always, I always fear that
I'm not going to be let in, and I have
done nothing wrong other than being any immigrant in this country.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
It's interesting because you know, the narrative by this administration
is one that as immigrants, you and I are like, well,
who is he talking about? You know that we are takers,
that we are losers, that we are people who are
prone to criminality. All of this is the opposite of
(06:53):
what we actually experience. And I often find myself, Christina,
just wishing that people could understand that strength. And a
lot of the theme of your book is you actually
have power, immigrants, undocumented immigrants, You actually have.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Power, and we are heroes. Just to think about all
of the mothers, father's families that come the risks so
much their lives literally and survive so much by the
way to cross different places to get here. And I
always remember when I was writing the book My Dea,
(07:31):
there was this woman under the Biden administration in the
first couple of months, where Kamala Harris goes to Guatemala
and she has a press conference with the president of Guatemala.
I want to be clear to folks in this region
who are thinking about making that dangerous trek to the
United States Mexico border. And the whole point of that
(07:51):
press conference was to say, do not come, do not come.
And I sat with that in tears, that the first
black and immigrant vice president, women who are being a
champion for immigrant rights, for saying that, and that she
was using this big, powerful platform to send that message.
(08:14):
And I sat with it because it's almost like a
denial that there are greater forces that push people to
leave their homes, as if we like dream to choose
to leave everything behind not knowing what you know, what
is going to be a stake, risking our lives. We
don't do that out of fun and joy or because
(08:35):
we dream of it. When I wrote my book, I
kept thinking about Tony Morrison and how she unapologetically wrote
for black people. I wrote this book for the undocumented
young girl that was ashamed and afraid and had no
hope or felt powerless. I wrote it for that girl.
(08:57):
I wrote it for our hinted for our people to
also confront us that sometimes we believe those lives. I
believe those lives, and I tap into this vulnerability in
the book to say, like, I don't want to just
talk about the Americans that believe all these lies.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I believe these lies.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
I grew up in a nine to eleven era in
New York City where everything I heard about being an
immigrant being not from this country was shame, bad, bad,
bad bad. I internalized those lives. I believed that somehow me,
my parents had done something wrong for coming to this country.
(09:38):
I internalize the lie, and my journey gets transformed that idea,
and that lie gets transformed and gets shed because I
meet on document the young people that are fighting deportations.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Take us to that moment when you decide, after being
very tenuous about the whole notion about being an activist,
when you're like, no, no, no, I'm gonna go public
now with the thing that has been the most shameful, hidden, scary,
and you're like, Soichika, but you're about to hear me
what happened in that moment and why did you decide
(10:18):
to do that?
Speaker 3 (10:19):
The context is the early two thousands, the terrorist attacks
of nine to eleven happened, and the country moves in
a direction of fighting terror. But the way that that
looks like for domestic policy in particular, which was, you
know what many of us experience was the creation of
homeland security, increase resources for the tension and deportation. All
(10:44):
of us become a target in Muslim communities, immigrant communities.
This notion of fighting deportations was not a thing in
that day. And then I get to know about Marican Sales.
American Sales is the first undocumented young person and her
and her family, because of nine eleven policies in Missouri,
ends up being targeted for deportation, and she has the
(11:07):
courage to share his story publicly.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
I got off that stage and I had students come
up to me and they said thank you, and I
said for what? But they were like tears streaming down
their face. I can't tell my story, but it is
my fear, and you're living my biggest fear.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
So what do I have to lose? And then I
saw all these people. I get invited to my first rally,
So I joined this rally and I'm scared. I'm not
even like chanting. But then I start chanting, and I
hold a sign, and I become part of the crowd
(11:45):
that is chanting education not deportation, Education not deportation, and
I start getting goose bombs, like I'm chanting with all
of these people that I don't even know. What I
realized is that in that crowd there were students from
the city of University of New York, some of them
that I know, but there was also a lot of
(12:06):
Americans from all walks of.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
Life that don't even know Marie.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Nobody has met her in person, and yet they were
fighting for her right to stay. And that Maria was
the moment that totally transformed things for me, because if
people that did not even know Marie were fighting for her,
and if I was to be the next Marie Gonzales
facing deportation, I wanted that community to be fighting for
(12:30):
me too.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Coming up on Latino USA, the challenges of building aggress
roots movement.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Conflict is going to emerge. Differences are going to emerge,
Difference of opinion around strategy are going to emerge. We
had a conflict with the older generation stay with us notes,
(13:09):
Hey we're back, Let's jump back into the conversation with
Pristina Hi Minez, and we're going to pick it up
by talking about the making of the organization United We Dream,
which happened in two thousand and eight.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
You're now not just an activist, you are, in fact
making history as an activist in the United States because
you helped co found United We Dream, which was an
immigrant led youth movement that frankly changed history. To me,
this is like when United We Dream shows up right,
I'm wondering about how you see that transition to it's
(13:45):
not just you as one of many activists. It's like, no,
now I'm going to co found an organization to help
represent these hundreds and thousands of people.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
You know. In my book, I tell the journey on
my transformation of finding my voice and my power in
this community of organizers, in this community of young, courageous
people that are fighting deportations. Many of them have lost
family members to deportations, and they are such a big
source of inspiration for me to tap into that courage.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
And my hope.
Speaker 3 (14:19):
Is that by people learning about this journey, they can
also see themselves in it. This book is for anyone
who's afraid right now. This book is for anyone who
has ever felt like you don't belong or that has
felt powerless or hopeless. And my hope in people and
readers being able to follow my journey of a shame
and afraid to like unapologetically undocumented, unafraid and leading the
(14:43):
building of a movement and an organization is that we
can do that too. You can do that too, and
it is hopeful, and it's inspiring and it's empowering. And also, Maria,
it's really hard. It's really hard. Even when we find
spaces of community where we have a share vision and
(15:04):
share values, conflict is going to emerge. Differences are going
to emerge, Difference of opinion around strategy are going to emerge,
and then the question for us as leaders and organizers
are how do we deal with that. We had a
conflict with the older generation.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
The older generation didn't want you guys out on the
street pushing right. They were saying, no, no, no, alguba pasad,
why are you guys protesting your bringing attention to us.
Don't do that, gay La Boca.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I want to remind people the planting of the seeds
and the work were happening in the early two thousands,
so it takes over ten years to get to this
point that moment. What it does is that it shows
us what power we having, what we don't.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Have, because twenty ten is a huge defeat for the
immigrant rights movement, for young immigrant right lead rights leaders
like yourself.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
The film of DOCA to pass the.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Criticism from the older generation saying we should not be
doing this piecemeal. Also, it should be comprehensive immigration reform.
Speaker 1 (16:13):
You for having the courage.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
To stand here today to demand immigration reform.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
I cannot a justice today. The Senate voted against the
Dream Act. It would have offered a path to citizenship
to some illegal immigrant students who plan to join the
military or go to college.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
So, Cristina, was DOCA a mistake? Was it not a mistake?
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Now? I stand behind Doc. Can I tell you why?
It's not about being right? And you know, often in
leadership people not being open to recognizing mistakes. I could
tell you about other mistakes that I think that we've made.
But DOCA, it's a huge victory for us to own
because the millions of lives that happen changed were all
(16:58):
worth it. There are millions of lives of DACA recipients
who were able to pursue a college education, who were
able to buy homes, who were able to get cars,
who were able to support their family members, who were
able to get insurance, healthy insurance for the first time
in their lives, to treat diseases that they've never been
(17:20):
able to treat. The number of people that then also
happened to fall in love and you know, find a
pathway through marriage that DACA allowed for that to happen.
DACA also allowed for many people to go back and
see there are a bulitos and there are abuelitas and
say good byes. Nobody will take that away from us,
(17:44):
no one, And that impact there are millions of lives
that have been touched. I mean, people don't think about this,
but you know, if you want to be a policy
wonk about it, DOCA was an out of poverty program.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
About to say, people don't talk about the fact that
DACA actually had an impact on the American economy because
you can employ them, they could buy the homes, they
could get enrolled into college.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
But it's also la vida destra hintic cambio. So there
are the days and moments that I feel very tired,
and I feel very angry at myself for wanting this
country to want as Maria.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Oh my god, when you said that, I feel rejected
when you said that, this fight of always.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Wanting to have this country love.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
You, and so we work so hard and we write
books and we're like doing sixteen childs and it's.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Like, will you just see us?
Speaker 3 (18:43):
It's exhausting, it's exhausting, and so I feel sometimes mad
on myself for still longing for this country to see
me as one of their own. And I'm just cry
right now.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
That both of us were trying. This is ridiculous, right,
And yet, Maria, when I hold true.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Is that it's also in this country where I found
my purpose and I found my voice, and I found
a community that comes from a rich tradition of civil
rights fighters, women rights, indigenous people, black people that have
been fighting for this country to really live up to
(19:22):
those aspirational values of freedom and equality for all people
that we have yet to achieve. But it is in
that rich tradition that you and I and many of
us get to be part of it now and carry
that lineage and that tradition forward. And that's also what
this country has given me. This country has also given
(19:42):
me my family. My husband is only here because Americans
from all walks of life for his release from a
detention facility in upstin New York and prevented his deportation.
And Walter and I now continue to live in New
York and have a three year old that was born here.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Last story.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
It's only possible because Americans made a choice to fight
for justice, and that is what brings me hope right
now because I see people all across the country fighting
for their neighbors, immigrants not immigrants. This is like a
multiracial moment where people are realizing this ain't about just immigrants,
(20:29):
It's about all of us. And for our Latinos and Latinas,
trust me, we are now part of the vision that
they have for this country. The folks that want to
keep this country white, and they want to weaken this
democracy and leave under undemocratic conditions. They don't want us,
whether you have papers or not. When I think about
(20:51):
the young Christinas out in the world right now, this
is their moment. And as a student of history and
also now you know, a professor at the City University
of New York, I teach my students that when you
look at the world. There's never been social transformation with
that young people at the front.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
We'll be right back, bay, Yes, hey, we're back. Here's
the last part of my conversation with Christina Jimenez. Okay,
(21:35):
and now a difficult question, because we've all lived through this, right,
which is your expectation, your prediction about how this is
a moment where Latinos and Latinas are going to be
transformational yet again, because have been throughout history, and yet
Latinos and Latinas did vote for Donald Trump in numbers
(21:56):
that we had not seen before.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
What is your understanding of.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
What to do with the conservative Latinos and Latinas who
voted for Donald Trump and who many of them still
are believing the rhetoric that the only people that are
being targeted are the criminals.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Absolutely, and we have to be sober about this.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Maria.
Speaker 3 (22:16):
I don't think that the mass deportations and the mass
pain and terror that it's happening is magically going to
transform people. But I do think it opens an opportunity
for those of us who are interested in social change
and who are committed to it, and who are committed
to building power for our community. We have an opportunity
(22:36):
in front of us, but it's up to us to
make that happen. They don't feel like this administration has
delivered on their economic interest, like the price of X
had not gone down because of mass importations folks, right,
Like it takes no science or no data to just
like realize the deportation of the workers that are actually
making our food train possible. And I think people are
(22:59):
starting to know is who's really to blame? People in
power and billionaires that just want to get more money
out of this situation. So I think that it is
our job to be able to make those connections. Migration
is a love story. We may not think about immigration
as a love story, and what I try to do
(23:20):
with this book is that it is I witness my
parents taking this great risk because they love me and
they love our family. I also experienced and seeing Americans
from all walks of life, even right now, fighting against
deportations out of love for their neighbors and their friends
and their family members. Like the high schooler in Massachusetts
(23:43):
whose volleyball team rallied marched, you know, took action to
get him out of detention. And that's love, just with
a very emotional.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Day for these students, filled with tears, prayers and a
strong sense of unity for Marcelo Gomez and Jnight remains
and Ice customers. By the size of that crowd, the
students walking out of the school, Marcelo Gomez has a
lot of people in his corner. About your love story
with your husband, Walter, you were very trepidacious at first,
and yet when you jumped in with him, suddenly you're
(24:16):
now faced with not the trepidation of love, but the
fact that your husband has been detained. He was not
your husband at the time, right, but that your boyfriend
had been detained.
Speaker 3 (24:25):
We were not even not even. So this is the
thing that happens. Everybody around us is telling us, like
you all, like are such a great match, look at
the energy that you all have when you're with each other,
and you're like such bad as organizers, you'll should date.
And we're telling our friends separately, like no way, he's
(24:47):
on document, this, she's on document. You don't want to
do that, Like imagine pull your heart at so much
risk of falling in love with someone who could potentially
be the ported tomorrow. No way, And the idea that
I could be in a situation where I may never
see him again. Was the thing that helped me recognize
(25:09):
what sometimes we often ignore, that it's already in our heart,
and he had the same feeling, and so we didn't
even have to talk much about it. I think we knew.
That's when we decided, no matter what like and what
happens and the uncertainty of both being undocumented, we're not
going to let this injustice and this system that wants
(25:32):
to take away our freedom, our freedom to love each other.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
So the love story is actually thanks to the repression
that leads to the activism that leads to the love story.
Speaker 3 (25:51):
He's been a journey, but we're going strong and if anything,
just even more committed to making this world better place
for our son and for all of our kids.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
We love a good telenovela story and where it ends
with love.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
We love that. Gristina Jimenez, thank you so much for
joining me on Leatino USA. So great to be with you. Maria,
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
That was Gristina ki Minez, activist organizer and co founder
of United We Dream, the largest immigrant youth led movement
in the country. She and I spoke in Aspen, Colorado
after the Raisavo Festival. That's it for today. This episode
(26:49):
was produced by Adriana Rodriguez. It was edited by our
managing editor Fernanda Echavarri. It was mixed by Stephanie LeBeau.
Special thanks to Aspen Public Radio and Daniel Costello. The
Latino USA team also includes Roxanna Guire, Julia Caruso, Jessica Ellis,
Renaldo Leans Junior, Andrea Lopez, Cruzado, Luis Luna, Gloni mar Marquez,
(27:13):
Julieta Martinelli, Monica Moranez, Garcia, JJ Krubin and Nancy Trujillo.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Penilee Ramirez and I.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Are executive producers and I'm your host, Mariao Josa. Latino
USA is part of Iheart's Mykududa podcast network. Executive producers
at iHeart are Leo Gomez and Arlene Santana. Join us
again on our next episode. In the meantime, I'll see
you on all of our social media and especially on
Instagram and Dear listener, remember join Futuro Plus. You get
(27:43):
to listen to the episodes without any ads, and also
you get bonus content behind the scenes.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Cheese may just do it. You'll love it.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
Uduo Plus Now Astell approximaes Chao.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Latino USA is made possible in part by the Anni E.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
Casey Foundation.
Speaker 4 (28:06):
Creates a brighter future for the nation's children by strengthening families,
building greater economic opportunity, and transforming communities. W. K. Kellogg
Foundation a partner with communities where children come first, and
funding for Latino
Speaker 3 (28:22):
USA's coverage of a culture of Health is made possible
in part by a grant from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation.
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