May 1, 2025 • 41 mins
Tori could not be more joyful to welcome her forever friend Soleil Moon Frye to the show today. It’s truly like listening in on a girls sleepover. “Donna & Punky” talk about their teenage years, what boys they kissed, and what boys they wanted to kiss.
You will hear stories they’ve never before shared publicly, or even with each other! Tori and Soleil delve into personal experiences of love and loss, and how their light from within continues to lead the way. It’s her own personal journey and experiences that inspired Soleil to make her incredible new documentary “The Carters”. A truly beautiful and important film that everyone should see.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Misspelling with Tori Spelling and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
How long have we known each other? We were just
trying to figure this out the other day.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
We're like since we were little, since we were teenagers.
And then we were talking about your eighteenth birthday, Oh
my gosh, and how gorgeous you are. I still remember
I was wearing the coveralls, some coverall, but they were
like cool, I don't know, they were like con tempo
casual coveralls or something. You were in this beautiful white dress, a.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Liah like bandage dress. I was like trying to be like,
look at me.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I made it.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
And you had the absolute hottest guys in the world
at your birthday, and I just remember.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Yes, are you kidding me?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
You had Luke, Brian, Yeah, Jason, Yeah, I mean Ian,
I mean it was I in there. Wait anyway, it
was just the hottest guys. I'm and I and all
of young Hollywood, all.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Of young Hollywood, and then all of my like real
friends from high school. Yes, So it was like this
odd balance. And then I just remember like that night,
like Luke and Jason were just like I was like
a Tory sandwich for like my eighteenth birthday.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
No, it was like wild.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
I mean, what an amazing sandwich to be between I mean,
I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
And for me not to have eyes for Brian is weird.
Like I couldn't even tell you what Brian said that night,
what he was wearing that night.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
I remember what he was wearing pictures for your birthday.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
Okay, I think, okay, okay, so so follow me and
tell me if you remember this I remember Brian wearing
because obviously okay, so truth be told. We both have
so much love for Brian, obviously you, I mean, your
love story is the most exquisite, most beautiful, just I'm
mine bent by it. And I also had a great
(02:10):
deal of love for Brian, and we both still have
a great deal of love for Brian and Sharna, of course,
just to reminisce, because it's so fun being nostalgic.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Do you remember I remember.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Brian was wearing a copper Do you remember a copper suit?
Like a copper orangish coming back to you? Weeziest memory ever?
Speaker 1 (02:28):
And I can't don't tell him this, tell us I
don't even remember him there, Like it was the one
night in history of life that I wasn't focused on Brian.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Austin Grass Okay, well, I may have pictures otherwise, because
I vaguely remember him doing like the Roger rabbit or
something like I have Maye. It's also because I have
pictures too of it that like, you know, is it
like how much do we remember through photographs?
Speaker 1 (02:56):
And like my memory is like I see it in
my head, but you're like that as well, So like
it's wild At that one night, I don't remember, but
Luke and Jason were like it was so kind too.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
It was like here's our cast met and our.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Friends and the producer's daughter and like it's her eighteenth
birthday and we are like the heart throbs of America
of the world right now, and like we're just going
to devote all our attention to her. Like what it's
how generous?
Speaker 4 (03:27):
So sweet?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
I think she's in Brisley was wearing a tie if
I remember correctly, Yeah, tie, Like something that I love
that we've spoken about is as wild and outrageous as
our lives were, and as colorful and as crazy as
everything was, we still very much had that innocence and
(03:49):
excitement of oh my goodness, like, look at these heart throbs.
I suppose like what other people feel when they go
to like a football game or you know, some kind
of exquisitive at high school.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
It was just like it was a totally.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Unorthodox childhood, but in a lot of.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
Ways it was.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I mean I was always boy crazy, always have been
the same. It was ingrained in me from the time
I was born.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
And yeah, so anyway, and I know I told you this,
but yeah, like that eighteenth birthday party, I will never
forget because that's when Luke Perry kissed me.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
In the limo. I filed the story before, but can't
get over that kiss me in.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
The limo with all my like not my high school
girlfriends from the show, but my high school girlfriends from
real life. Like they were all there and like it
was just magical.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Okay, Tori, I want to know everything about the kiss
because I Luke Perry's.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
So much and he would have kissed you.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
I have a great Perry story that I don't even
know that I haven't shared much. But first I want
to hear about the kiss and then I'll tell you
my Luke Perry story.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
So he was like we were going into this big, long,
like white stretched limo, like prom limo, going back to
my parents. The manor and like we were just all
going to hang out and everybody was coming back, and
he like, we're like come with us, and he's like okay,
and he like dove into the limo with me and
the girls. And I don't even remember how it happened.
He was like sitting on the floors, we were all
piled in and I don't know, we just kissed. It
(05:22):
wasn't like this crazy long kiss. It was just like
a moment. But to me, it was like everything was
it like was it a kiss on the lips or
was it? Was there actual tongue in the kiss?
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Wow?
Speaker 1 (05:34):
I don't remembers. It was an open mouthed place. Yeah,
did you did you?
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Are we allowed to say this on the rio deal?
Speaker 2 (05:43):
This touch of his tongue? Well, I was eighteen, so
I guess I was legal. It was fine? Right?
Speaker 4 (05:50):
Was there tongue involvatory? That's all I have to know?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Did you touch Luke Berry's tongue? That sounds so r
I'm sure yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
And I also remember he gave me gun earrings for
my eighteenth birthday.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
I mean, he gave you gun earrings and his tongue.
I mean that says it all.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
I can't like girl.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
It's like, oh, this whole entire internmy is gonna have
to be censored and or not.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yeah, he gave me gun earrings, but that was because
like he was like a cowboy.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
And like he was and there was anything.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
Like no, no, I know.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
I mean it's like, so he was such a good
human being and so sweet and then played this series.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Did you pierce them immediately?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Probably should have, but.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Then you know, that was a Saturday night and Monday
went back to set and like you know, there was Brian,
so I forgot all about Luke.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I'm the prize, I'm the prize.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
Okay, so my Luke story.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
He uh.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
He was just the kindest, most most beautiful spirit, as
you know, and he was always so kind to me.
And I remember on one of my birthdays, I went
and visited you guys on the set, and he gave
me this huge hug in love. And of course, where
(07:13):
would I want to spend my birthday, you know, other
than with all all of you, And I know I'm blushing.
And I had such a crush on him, and he
was so kind and sweet and he was such a
beautiful listener. I remember him being such a beautiful listener
and so warm and always made you feel so.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Loved.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
And so we had this, we had this moment where
so we worked with the same person. I guess we
must have had the same manager or agent or something.
And the person, I mean, this is absolutely insane. The
person was learning how to fly and decided that they
would take us in learning to fly. Luke Whuke and
(08:00):
I right, because we had this person that like worked
with us both okay, and this is a crazy story.
This is a crazy story. And he said, why don't
we all go to Catalina for lunch. Now we're not
talking about this isn't like some private plane, big plane whatever.
It's like you know those teeny tiny little planes that
people learn how to, you know, the teeny tiny plane,
the teeny tiny plane that somebody learns how to.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
It has like a propeller.
Speaker 4 (08:22):
Yeah, it's like it has like a.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Propeller, right, is that right?
Speaker 3 (08:28):
This was so terrified, so so okay, so literally it's yeah,
it's like, you know, a little thing in the front
and it's like a three seater.
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Oh I know, I know.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Okay, Remember again, this is not a private plane. This
is not a fancy plane. This is the kind of
plane somebody learns how to fly and he's like, let me.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Take you guys out to lunch.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Right, So Luke and I go on this plane to
Catalina and we go and you know, it's a little
you know, and I too am really like.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
And so we get to lunch and we actually get
there and we land and we're like, okay, hey, we're good,
We're good, you know, Okay, we got here. When we
go to leave, like the clouds have come in and
it's like stormy, and literally they're like are we able
to fly? Now? Remember this guy is like just learned
how to fly, and like we're going on his big
(09:25):
outing out and literally I remember as the plane, this
is so insane. As the plane goes off, there's like
this mountaintop in Catalina that it goes off and all
of a sudden, it just drops and it drops, and
I literally like at this point, I don't even know
(09:46):
that we have seat belts on, because we are convinced
that like this is it. They jump into well what
I did. I jumped into Looperry's arms. I threw myself
in his arms and we ended up somehow. I think
we ended up on the floor of the This is
of the plane, if I remember correctly, And because we're convinced,
(10:09):
and the plane's going like this, because the plane's going
like going up and down and up and down, and
so what happens I cannot I've never shared this story
in the entire Yeah, And the plane is going like this, right,
like up and down, up and down, and he and
I are like up and down, sharing our life stories
because we are convinced that this is it. And he's
(10:31):
holding me in his arms and I'm holding him in
my arms, and we just our entire lives flashed in
front of us. And I was able to like share
my life in all of the you know, thirty minute
plane ride, and it was just actually one of the
most beautiful experiences in my life, and that bonded us forever.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
And I don't think I've ever told that story ever.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
I'm like blown away, which is for a callback. I
wasn't their tongue.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
The plane was going like this, and I probably was.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
I don't even know if I was like sixteen years
old at the time or anything. It was just more
like he I thought we were convinced that the plane
and so he was just like, but that protect.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Well, well that's what I was thinking.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
I was like, well, if you're gonna you know anyone.
Speaker 4 (11:24):
And that was the other thing was I was like,
as much.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
As I was terrified, I was like, but I am
in Luke Perry's arm, So it was like of like
being really afraid. And also that Luke Perry was like
my superhero like in the moment.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
And I was like, oh my god.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
It was Yeah, it was crazy, but we landed safely,
and I always remember that, was that a crazy story?
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (11:47):
I got I got, like.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Wow, like imagine that headline though, No.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
God, no, no, no, no, it was so magical. It's
like one of it's like, it's one of my favorite memories.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
My God, Harry and Punky Power like Peril and plane
Punky Perry Power, Punky Pary Power Perry Punky didn't work
this time as a Peril. No.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
No, I'm sorry, it's sorry. Sorry.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
You know what.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
I should have just kissed him. I should have just
kissed I should have kissed him. I should have just
grabbed him.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
And oh he was probably I can I just imagine
he was probably sweet and telling you it was going
to be okay, and He's like, tell me about your life,
and yeah, I.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Didn't think it was going to be okay.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
And because we really like we were really.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Yeah, what was the guy saying that was flying this plane?
Speaker 4 (12:43):
I think he was just trying to like keep the
plane up.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
And it's a crazy story, do you guys, Land, Punky
and Perry there you go. I mean a story. See,
it's a first, it's a first. I gotta share a story.
First story Clouds Brittain in the Clouds written and I
will never forget that.
Speaker 4 (13:04):
It was so it was really beautiful.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Did you ever get a small plane again after that?
Speaker 4 (13:10):
You know, on a few occasions.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I don't think I have ever, but I was I had.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
I mean, these are all going to sound like crazy stories.
I remember flying into Idaho at one point to me
who I love so much, and she was, you know,
helped essentially bring my children into this world, and she's
so amazing. And at one time we were again I
found myself in a plane and Bruce, the incredible Bruce
(13:40):
Willis was there and and you know, the plane was
This is all going to sound like crazy Hollywood stories,
but again, like it was like somehow we ended up
going on a family trip or something, and and there
was turbulence, and I just remember thinking, well, Bruce Willis
is here on the plane, so we're good. Like I
felt somehow inevitably like safer because Bruce was on the plane,
(14:02):
and I was like, you're die hard dude, like I'm good.
That was different that I was like, cool, he like
kept it all together. I felt safe. And then yeah,
there weren't many of those experiences after that. I think
after that, I was like, I'll be taking Southwest.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
Yeah, jet Blue has my name, So I all over.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
A story like that, like because you felt like and
this is not going to sound normal to anyone, or
maybe it will, Like Bruce Willis is on this plane,
it's going to be okay.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
A thousand percent, So like a thousand percent, I was like,
he can.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
It's like having taught like if Tom Cruise was like,
you know, like fly you know you're like, oh, Tom
Cruise here, it's all gonna be okay, which, by the way,
way I mean with Tom Cruise, I feel like everything
is is okay when it's in a step world, Like
I'm just like like I I.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah, he would have like jumped down and like Superman,
the plane oh, a thousand percent.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
He would have carried the plane like com Cruise were
just like carries the plane.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
He's got you and he's like.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
No one, I'm talking cruise. Okay. So I used to
panic on planes, like be so.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
I believe I even talking about planes. I just don't worry. Okay, okay, okay, tom.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Me so panic on planes. And I'd always count how
many babies were on the plane, because I always thought, well,
if there's babies, like, God's not gonna take us right now,
we know this is not true.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
This is irrational, by.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
The way, everyone has done this. Everyone.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
And then I'm on a plane once and Michael Bolton
was on the plane and this is like in his heyday,
not his hair day, his hey day at some point
and he was on and for some reason before they
like closed the doors.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
I don't know why, he got up and got off
the plane.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
And I was like, oh, now I'm fucked, like in
my weird like a rational fear, I was like, Michael
Bolton's here, Nothing's gonna happen. And as he gets up,
I literally turned to my friend I said, we're getting
off the plane, and she goes, this is crazy. This
is fear has gone too far. I said, I know
(16:15):
it's irrational. I can't help myself. Right now, before they
close those doors, Michael Bolton got off.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
We had to get off. We go off the plane.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
You got off got a flane.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Yeah, because Michael Bolton did correct And did you tell
Michael Bolton this ever?
Speaker 2 (16:28):
No, I don't think so. Do you know why he
got off the plane? No, no, idea.
Speaker 4 (16:32):
He probably was on the wrong plane.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
He probably had too many like cocktails and like ended
up on the wrong But in.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
My mind, it's like, if he's on the plane, the
plane won't ever go down, so I have to get
off this flight.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Of course I checked the flight later. The flight was fine,
nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
God, that is hysterical.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, well it's so it's wild.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
Yeah, I mean, well, you and I will have some
fun traveling together. Then I went into the Amazon not
too long ago, and that was wild. And that's like
one of those planes where they like it down the windows,
you know kind of thing. Well, yeah, yeah, like I
went into the Amazon. I went and stayed with a
tribe in Ecuador, which was unbelievable. It was really mind blowing.
And and to get in you take this, you know,
(17:14):
this tiny plane and then they drop you off in
the middle of the Amazon and they come back a
week later to pick you up. It's really it was
a really profound experience. And myself, well, so here. So
there was a small group of us, and my dear
friend who's here with me now can attest to this
because they were with me and and and and I'm
(17:35):
not kidding. You could roll down the plastic you know,
like window sides, and that's you know, and yeah and uh.
And on the way back it was like I think,
I think, I think we had like a backpack or something.
And they were like, oh, no, you have to take
the backpack off because the way you know of the
so tory, I know how to get you through your fear.
(17:56):
You have to come with me to the Amazon, okay,
and we will go and visit the tribe there, and
you will no longer have a fear of lying. I've
gotten better, and you've got so much better, and this
is going to be, this is going to be, this
is going to be. Your next step is I'm going
to go into the jungle. And once you have gone
(18:17):
and flown over the jungle in one of these you know, cue.
You know, they don't like parachute you out, No, they
they land and then they say goodbye, and then they
leave and you go and live in the jungle for
however long you live there.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
And it's really spectacular. I mean that's did you film this?
You film everything?
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Well? I filmed.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
I filmed parts of it for sure, and then wanted
to be very respectful of the tribe that welcomed us
in so so there was parts that I documented, in
parts that just remain in my heart.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
It was very life changing. Is this where you had
the shaman experience.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
I've had a few experiences with shamans, and that was
that was an double experience with Yeah, is.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
That the one that told you, uh, that was a
different one.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
We tell that story, sure, of course and around my
heart our hearts. Yeah, And it's so wild because I
was talking to Brian about this too, and it's so
that the shaman there in the jungle.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
It was wild.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
I remember hugging just just the whole experience opening my
heart so much, you know, And.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
And so yeah, absolutely, we can tell it.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
You can, you can, you can share, I can share
however you want.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
This is wild that we've known each other for so long,
you me and Brian. Obviously you and Brian stayed connected,
like I lost touch with friends and just in and
out of life. And I'm so happy and grateful to
be reconnected with you, and I don't want to lose
you again. I feel like this is the time in
our journey we're supposed to reconnect and now together.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
But absolutely everything happens for a reason.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
But it's wild. I have five kids, Brian has five kids.
You have four kids.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
It's like, yeah that there's a lot of kids between
fourteen kids between.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Anti moth I'm glad you did it for us. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
At first I was sinking nineteen, but you know, fourteen
might as well be nineteen.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Fourteen kids.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
Yeah, So my feeling is, I wonder if you agree.
I'm like, okay, with this many kids, they better really
make a huge difference an impact in the world. I'm like,
they gotta, they gotta, and they are.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
I'm just busy trying to keep them alive.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Every every night they go to bed, account all of
them like there's that too, well more night.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It's just like just getting through it. You are and
so are.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Your parents, all of us. But I think our biggest connection,
at least from my perspective, is that we truly lead
with our hearts and with kindness. And that's my biggest
takeaway from my kids. Like people say, what do they
want to be? And I said, you know what, that's irrelevant.
I hope they make great changes in this world. I
(21:05):
hope they do what their passions are and what their
loves are and do well from and prosper. But leading
with kindness is just my biggest thing, and I'm glad
that they all have that from me.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Absolutely, your beautiful, open, exquisite heart that I love so much,
I loved so much. And what I was sharing with
you and I was sharing with Brian, was that I
had met this incredible shaman and was feeling very vulnerable
(21:39):
in my life, as I so often do. And I
think when we move through life and loss and love
and allow the light to come in, you know that
it's so much of our processing, you know. And we've
also experienced a great deal of grief, you know, and
(22:02):
and we've spoken of, you know, chasing grief away. And
I know for me, I tried to love it away
and work it away and just how it comes back,
you know, to find its way to you. And I
think that's something that you and Brian and I have
spoken about so openly, you know, And ever since I
(22:23):
was young, I mean, I've had the most incredible relationships
and I've also lost some of like the closest people
in my life. And so I was speaking with this
shaman and he said to me, you go through life
with a broken heart, and that is your journey. That
(22:45):
is part of your journey, is going through life with
a broken heart. I had never heard anything like that before,
and yet at the same time, it gave me so
much clarity because it it allows us to connect and
to be open with each other and to see that
(23:09):
that pain and that transformation of pain and delight is
our super power, you know. Yeah, And then it allows
other people to share with us and for us to
share with them with the genuine being parts of our being,
and to have compassion and empathy and all of these
(23:30):
elements that I think are so truly who you are
and certainly so much of of I feel the best
versions of myself. And so that that was a really
incredible moment where I just felt like all in my
walls just you know, breaking down, you know.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
And it's also I think the definition what we're told
the definition of a broken heart isn't always exactly what
we think it means. Because we've also talked about kind
of the openness of a broken heart, the thought if
you just visually see a broken heart, kind of broken
part that's inside of it, that's where the love and
(24:16):
light and the ass coming.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Through, well exactly.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
And that's one of my favorite Leonard Cohen quotes, one
of my favorite musicians ever, has to do with you
know how the broken parts are were the lights? You know?
And and so I think that it's you put it
so beautifully, which is to change the narrative within ourselves.
(24:42):
You know what I mean that that the parts of
us that have been broken, the loss that we've experienced,
the trials and tribulations, have been so much of our
expansion into the light, right, And I really believe that
we're instruments for something so much bigger than us. And
(25:03):
so every day, one of my dearest friends said, so
like every day I ask the universe, allow me to
be an instrument for me, for you, Let me be
an instrument for you, and so on a daily basis,
and I look to the universe and I asked, let
me be an instrument, you know, for you and and
my highest good, a vessel, a vessel for the good
(25:27):
and the world, and that that's so much of who
you are as well.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Still deserved to fall in love.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Oh well, absolutely, we deserve a lot of love. And
that's the and that's that's that, that's that part of
so much of what we've spoken about around worthiness and
self worth and value and how we value ourselves. I
think something that's really incredible to me though, is also
(25:56):
the fact that love to me to day looked so
different than the traditional kind of love that I had
thought of because I had a very unorthodox life, as
we did, right, and my dad was incredible and my
mom super mom.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
You know.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
My dad, you know, was a total rabble rouser, wasn't
always around, but he gave me a lot of love.
And I think that when I got married, I was
I was searching for that tradition and thinking, okay, well,
traditional you know, family values. And as time went on
and we evolved in different ways and had these incredible
(26:39):
children and came through that, I then, you know, have
had these very incredible, interesting experiences. And one of the
first people I came together with was one of my
best friends from childhood, Seth, and it was a totally
different kind of love. It was like that teen love again,
you know. And Seth bins Or was like my childhood.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Wait, I don't know him.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
Okay, did you ever hear the song Butterfly by Crazy Town?
I said you she did my butterfly Baby? You don't
know this on Butterflies, like one of the biggest anthems
of the nineties.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Don't we exceed me right now?
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Okay, I'll play it for you. Okay, we'll play it here.
But essentially musician, yes.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
A musician I had not really kept up with like his.
I hadn't really kept I hadn't really kept up with
his like whole bad boy you know, teen years. The
last time I had seen him, I had done a
music video with him when I was like twenty years
old or something, and so we hadn't seen that.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
We had grown up together.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
We were friends from twelve thirteen years old, and literally
we came together. He was sober when we came together,
and I was just like, oh my gosh. It was
like this teen beautiful love and it was a whole other.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Kind of love.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
And and we came together, and then he relapsed three
to four months into us coming together, and it was
Devin stating, and we had started making this documentary about
his life and to do this, and it was incredibly
beautiful in so many ways and so emotional in so
(28:12):
many ways. And he passed away this this last summer.
And and so my point being that I haven't really
talked about this yet, Like you know, you know, to
grieve so deeply means that we had to have loved
and that love and that lightning and a bottle love
(28:36):
that I felt for that time, you know, that was endless,
you know, and love him so much. And and and
I think, you know, the whole experience gave me such
a deeper understanding on love and loving without judgment, and
such an understanding around you know, mental health and addiction
(28:57):
and looking at addiction more as disease.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
And then that led.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
Me to this journey with the Carters and this incredible
journey that I've been on with this documentary. That I
was able to process so much of the grief through
this story that hit home so you know, hard for me.
So my point is back to love that I think
(29:28):
love comes in so many different stages, right, And it's
like you could experience months or years with somebody and
have some of the greatest love in your life in
that lightning model moment, you know, and deep love of friendship,
my love for you and us coming together where we
(29:49):
hadn't seen each other for years, and it's like you
just pick up right where you left off. Right the
love that I have with friendships now, the love that
I have with my children, and like I think, falling
in love and love looks like so many different shapes
and sizes. It's the mirror of who we are and
(30:09):
when we're our most genuine self, and that.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Reflects back to us.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
So I suppose as much as I love the idea
of falling in love and sharing my life with that
person in romance, right, I also want to be so
aware that love exists all around me and that I
am in love with each and every person that reflects
(30:36):
back the best version of myself and that doesn't have
to be defined to one.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Person that reflects back.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
That was beautiful, Hey, carry that forever that it's be
able to realize that that is. And I mean, I'm
guessing I know the answer to this. You don't believe
in regrets.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Yeah, SELFE is far, so far is so precious. I
had a lot of be honest, I feel like I
had to work through a great deal of even when
when you know that it's not your faulty, you're not
able to save somebody and that they have to save
(31:18):
themselves regardless of that. Oh my god, we're getting so deeper.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Right.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
So I had this thing where like sit and this
is like really stuck with me where seth He would
say he just wanted a nightstand, you know, in the house,
And I think that to him was symbolic of like
him just feeling like he had a place to call home.
And he was somebody that listened so well. So Mother's
(31:44):
Day it's like I would say, oh, you know things
in passing, I love making right, I want to be
able to make rice. And he would show up with
a rice cooker and I never had a mirror that
I could look close enough, and.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
He show up with a mirror. Like he listened so well,
he checked in so much lunch.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
And I remember that on a Christmas morning he said
I just want a nightstand. And he had said it
so many times and I never heard it, you know,
so for months after his passing, I was like, oh,
the next time that, I'm like, I.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Won't forget to get that night stand, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
So it was such a learning process and it was
such a journey and I wouldn't take back one second
of it. And I think it's also what gave me
the strength to then do the Carters, because I don't
know that I would have been able to understand this
family's journey, you know, or be there for Angel the
(32:46):
way that I wanted to, in the way that I
had to show up in the way that I think
is a documentarian. It is my my responsibility to show
up to provide a safe space for someone. Had I
not learned so much through that experience, so you know,
(33:08):
I had to like move through and let go of
the guilt and the shame and you know all of
those things that come with, you know, having a kind
of you know, wanting to save people, because I think
that's just innately in my inner being, wanting to do
what I can to you know, save everyone around me,
but realizing like I have to you know, first and
(33:29):
foremost always be there to save myself.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (33:33):
And that's something that is you know, a constant learning experience,
you know.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
I have. So I watched the cart and it was
so brilliant. I came away from it just having such
a better understanding. And I never I'm not a judging person,
(33:59):
but you know, we only know what we know and
what we're told. And being able to change a narrative
Aaron Carter and just and.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
His legacy, it was.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Hauntingly beautiful and heartbreaking, and that's the only thing.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
I think.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
I have so much admiration for you, and you're such
a beautiful storyteller and it made me really happy that
Angel is able to tell the story you want it.
I'm so you were that vessel. Thank you so much,
(34:46):
and it's out now. I'm paramount plus and I want
everyone to watch it just because I want them to
know what a beautiful love story this is really and
everyone can relate to it on some level.
Speaker 3 (34:58):
I'm so so thankful that you watched it. You know,
Angel has such a courageous, beautiful, brave heart. And as
we're talking about loss, I mean she had lost her sister, Leslie,
she had lost her twin brother Aaron, and her father
(35:22):
when we started this journey, and then she lost her
sister be Jay and talk about coming through loss and
turning that loss and pain into light.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
She is such an example of that.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
And to be able to share her truth and to
see this family's transformation of how much they want to
help make the world a better place because of their strength,
(36:00):
and how we talk about in our generational trauma, and
at the core, how much I wanted to really help
share a story that had to do with mental health
and addiction that touches so many of us, including myself
in an honest way. I just I'm so thankful that
(36:24):
they trusted in me, and that the team, the incredible
team from Paramount, plus an incredible team from Candle Media,
and just the entire team involved with it, that they
allowed me to create a safe space for Angel to
share her story. And just I'm so thankful, and I
really hope that it touches lives and that people have
(36:46):
a better understanding because so many people think that.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
That it's a choice.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
You know, that the addiction is a choice that people
make every day, and you know, and I remember, you know,
I remember Set at one point saying to me, I've
tried everything. I dare any doctor, like literally, he's so
wanted to live and Aaron is such a beautiful example
(37:13):
of that, this beautiful, vibrant, lively, wonderful, just beautiful spirit
that you see in all of those early years, you know,
and what is that that point in which you know
someone breaks or isn't able to continue on that journey.
(37:34):
And so I really hope that this documentary helps people
that are struggling and also to have a better understanding,
you know, and creates conversations, meaningful conversations that we have
to be having around mental health and addiction for sure.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
And it just stuck with me, Like you and you're
talking about now and you will listen.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
But you do listen well.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
And that's the thing is with Kid ninety, I said
that I was like, I didn't listen, and then it
was so wild because again I tried to listen, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
And so.
Speaker 3 (38:08):
I'm going to continue to do my best to listen,
but tell me, but.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
No, you listen.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
And like I feel, you know, I can't speak for
our friendship when we were teenagers, but our friendship now,
you know, going forward, I feel like you listened so
so well and you create that safe space even for
your humans, you know, not on camera like that they
feel comfortable just sharing and not feeling judged. It's such
(38:34):
a safe place. But you know, I know you interview
everyone and you do all of it. And then so
the one time that we really heard your voice in
it is you said to Angel when she said, you know,
Nix said he wants therapy, and.
Speaker 2 (38:50):
You said, is that why the two of you are
still here?
Speaker 1 (38:53):
And she said yes, sorry if I'm not verbatim seeing it,
and that just like you're breaking the wall, and like
saying that, just like that was like gut punched me
because I was like, I think it's so important. It's
such an important conversation and none of us can do
it alone, and not just mental health, not just addiction,
(39:14):
and specifically the mental health. I feel like it's something
like we didn't talk about it when I was growing up.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
No one talked about it.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
That was a stigmatism, like someone was like, oh, they
go to a therapist, what's wrong, or like you know,
and it's such a conversation that I feel like perhaps
our kids talk too freely.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
About and kind of throw it away.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
So there has to be that happy medium that we
all find.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
But thank you for doing the story.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
And I think it's really beautiful, and I think you
should get.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
A nice.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
You were realizing me we thought about getting it. Yeah,
we could refer a bish one Die Wyatt.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
You know, break if you want night the night stand
in my heart I do.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I definitely break in and let the light is for
broken heart feeling.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
Oh well, okay, wait, I'll tell you one more great
story and we can close on this, which I went
on a date some some time ago, because you know,
I mean, I like this, I like this, I like
this story.
Speaker 4 (40:23):
So I went on a date.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
And and this gentleman takes me to this beautiful dinner.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
I love going.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
I'm manifesting a gentleman. I'm going to put this out
of the universe. A gentleman takes me to fantastic dinner
because we're manifesting here.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
Okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
And and afterwards he is telling me what he loves
to collect, and he says, oh, I love to collect watches.
He runs through the collection of things that he collects,
and he turned to me and said, what do you collect?
Speaker 4 (41:04):
And I said, I collect memories.
Speaker 2 (41:09):
Mm hmm. That's you.
Speaker 4 (41:12):
That's who I am. That's you are your memory collectors.
So the nightstand is right here in my memory.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And that's all you need. I understand. That's beautiful. Wait
what else did he collect?
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Who knows? Apparently a lot of things. I love you.
I laughed, I cried.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
I love you. I love you so much. No more.
I really want you to take me in the Amazon.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
Okay, we're going to the Amazon. We're collecting memories.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Yes, for the rest of our lives. I love you
so much. I'm so grateful for you.
Misspelling with Tori Spelling and iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
How long have we known each other? We were just
trying to figure this out the other day.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
We're like since we were little, since we were teenagers.
And then we were talking about your eighteenth birthday, Oh
my gosh, and how gorgeous you are. I still remember
I was wearing the coveralls, some coverall, but they were
like cool, I don't know, they were like con tempo
casual coveralls or something. You were in this beautiful white dress, a.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Liah like bandage dress. I was like trying to be like,
look at me.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I made it.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
And you had the absolute hottest guys in the world
at your birthday, and I just remember.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Yes, are you kidding me?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
You had Luke, Brian, Yeah, Jason, Yeah, I mean Ian,
I mean it was I in there. Wait anyway, it
was just the hottest guys. I'm and I and all
of young Hollywood, all.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Of young Hollywood, and then all of my like real
friends from high school. Yes, So it was like this
odd balance. And then I just remember like that night,
like Luke and Jason were just like I was like
a Tory sandwich for like my eighteenth birthday.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
No, it was like wild.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
I mean, what an amazing sandwich to be between I mean,
I mean.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
And for me not to have eyes for Brian is weird.
Like I couldn't even tell you what Brian said that night,
what he was wearing that night.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
I remember what he was wearing pictures for your birthday.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
Okay, I think, okay, okay, so so follow me and
tell me if you remember this I remember Brian wearing
because obviously okay, so truth be told. We both have
so much love for Brian, obviously you, I mean, your
love story is the most exquisite, most beautiful, just I'm
mine bent by it. And I also had a great
(02:10):
deal of love for Brian, and we both still have
a great deal of love for Brian and Sharna, of course,
just to reminisce, because it's so fun being nostalgic.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
Do you remember I remember.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Brian was wearing a copper Do you remember a copper suit?
Like a copper orangish coming back to you? Weeziest memory ever?
Speaker 1 (02:28):
And I can't don't tell him this, tell us I
don't even remember him there, Like it was the one
night in history of life that I wasn't focused on Brian.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Austin Grass Okay, well, I may have pictures otherwise, because
I vaguely remember him doing like the Roger rabbit or
something like I have Maye. It's also because I have
pictures too of it that like, you know, is it
like how much do we remember through photographs?
Speaker 1 (02:56):
And like my memory is like I see it in
my head, but you're like that as well, So like
it's wild At that one night, I don't remember, but
Luke and Jason were like it was so kind too.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
It was like here's our cast met and our.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Friends and the producer's daughter and like it's her eighteenth
birthday and we are like the heart throbs of America
of the world right now, and like we're just going
to devote all our attention to her. Like what it's
how generous?
Speaker 4 (03:27):
So sweet?
Speaker 3 (03:27):
I think she's in Brisley was wearing a tie if
I remember correctly, Yeah, tie, Like something that I love
that we've spoken about is as wild and outrageous as
our lives were, and as colorful and as crazy as
everything was, we still very much had that innocence and
(03:49):
excitement of oh my goodness, like, look at these heart throbs.
I suppose like what other people feel when they go
to like a football game or you know, some kind
of exquisitive at high school.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
It was just like it was a totally.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
Unorthodox childhood, but in a lot of.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
Ways it was.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I mean I was always boy crazy, always have been
the same. It was ingrained in me from the time
I was born.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
And yeah, so anyway, and I know I told you this,
but yeah, like that eighteenth birthday party, I will never
forget because that's when Luke Perry kissed me.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
In the limo. I filed the story before, but can't
get over that kiss me in.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
The limo with all my like not my high school
girlfriends from the show, but my high school girlfriends from
real life. Like they were all there and like it
was just magical.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Okay, Tori, I want to know everything about the kiss
because I Luke Perry's.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
So much and he would have kissed you.
Speaker 1 (04:50):
Oh.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
I have a great Perry story that I don't even
know that I haven't shared much. But first I want
to hear about the kiss and then I'll tell you
my Luke Perry story.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
So he was like we were going into this big, long,
like white stretched limo, like prom limo, going back to
my parents. The manor and like we were just all
going to hang out and everybody was coming back, and
he like, we're like come with us, and he's like okay,
and he like dove into the limo with me and
the girls. And I don't even remember how it happened.
He was like sitting on the floors, we were all
piled in and I don't know, we just kissed. It
(05:22):
wasn't like this crazy long kiss. It was just like
a moment. But to me, it was like everything was
it like was it a kiss on the lips or
was it? Was there actual tongue in the kiss?
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Wow?
Speaker 1 (05:34):
I don't remembers. It was an open mouthed place. Yeah,
did you did you?
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Are we allowed to say this on the rio deal?
Speaker 2 (05:43):
This touch of his tongue? Well, I was eighteen, so
I guess I was legal. It was fine? Right?
Speaker 4 (05:50):
Was there tongue involvatory? That's all I have to know?
Speaker 3 (05:53):
Did you touch Luke Berry's tongue? That sounds so r
I'm sure yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
And I also remember he gave me gun earrings for
my eighteenth birthday.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
I mean, he gave you gun earrings and his tongue.
I mean that says it all.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
I can't like girl.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
It's like, oh, this whole entire internmy is gonna have
to be censored and or not.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yeah, he gave me gun earrings, but that was because
like he was like a cowboy.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
And like he was and there was anything.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
Like no, no, I know.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
I mean it's like, so he was such a good
human being and so sweet and then played this series.
Speaker 4 (06:34):
Did you pierce them immediately?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Probably should have, but.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Then you know, that was a Saturday night and Monday
went back to set and like you know, there was Brian,
so I forgot all about Luke.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I'm the prize, I'm the prize.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
Okay, so my Luke story.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
He uh.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
He was just the kindest, most most beautiful spirit, as
you know, and he was always so kind to me.
And I remember on one of my birthdays, I went
and visited you guys on the set, and he gave
me this huge hug in love. And of course, where
(07:13):
would I want to spend my birthday, you know, other
than with all all of you, And I know I'm blushing.
And I had such a crush on him, and he
was so kind and sweet and he was such a
beautiful listener. I remember him being such a beautiful listener
and so warm and always made you feel so.
Speaker 4 (07:35):
Loved.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
And so we had this, we had this moment where
so we worked with the same person. I guess we
must have had the same manager or agent or something.
And the person, I mean, this is absolutely insane. The
person was learning how to fly and decided that they
would take us in learning to fly. Luke Whuke and
(08:00):
I right, because we had this person that like worked
with us both okay, and this is a crazy story.
This is a crazy story. And he said, why don't
we all go to Catalina for lunch. Now we're not
talking about this isn't like some private plane, big plane whatever.
It's like you know those teeny tiny little planes that
people learn how to, you know, the teeny tiny plane,
the teeny tiny plane that somebody learns how to.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
It has like a propeller.
Speaker 4 (08:22):
Yeah, it's like it has like a.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Propeller, right, is that right?
Speaker 3 (08:28):
This was so terrified, so so okay, so literally it's yeah,
it's like, you know, a little thing in the front
and it's like a three seater.
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Oh I know, I know.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Okay, Remember again, this is not a private plane. This
is not a fancy plane. This is the kind of
plane somebody learns how to fly and he's like, let me.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
Take you guys out to lunch.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
Right, So Luke and I go on this plane to
Catalina and we go and you know, it's a little
you know, and I too am really like.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
And so we get to lunch and we actually get
there and we land and we're like, okay, hey, we're good,
We're good, you know, Okay, we got here. When we
go to leave, like the clouds have come in and
it's like stormy, and literally they're like are we able
to fly? Now? Remember this guy is like just learned
how to fly, and like we're going on his big
(09:25):
outing out and literally I remember as the plane, this
is so insane. As the plane goes off, there's like
this mountaintop in Catalina that it goes off and all
of a sudden, it just drops and it drops, and
I literally like at this point, I don't even know
(09:46):
that we have seat belts on, because we are convinced
that like this is it. They jump into well what
I did. I jumped into Looperry's arms. I threw myself
in his arms and we ended up somehow. I think
we ended up on the floor of the This is
of the plane, if I remember correctly, And because we're convinced,
(10:09):
and the plane's going like this, because the plane's going
like going up and down and up and down, and
so what happens I cannot I've never shared this story
in the entire Yeah, And the plane is going like this, right,
like up and down, up and down, and he and
I are like up and down, sharing our life stories
because we are convinced that this is it. And he's
(10:31):
holding me in his arms and I'm holding him in
my arms, and we just our entire lives flashed in
front of us. And I was able to like share
my life in all of the you know, thirty minute
plane ride, and it was just actually one of the
most beautiful experiences in my life, and that bonded us forever.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
And I don't think I've ever told that story ever.
Speaker 1 (10:55):
I'm like blown away, which is for a callback. I
wasn't their tongue.
Speaker 4 (11:02):
The plane was going like this, and I probably was.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
I don't even know if I was like sixteen years
old at the time or anything. It was just more
like he I thought we were convinced that the plane
and so he was just like, but that protect.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Well, well that's what I was thinking.
Speaker 3 (11:21):
I was like, well, if you're gonna you know anyone.
Speaker 4 (11:24):
And that was the other thing was I was like,
as much.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
As I was terrified, I was like, but I am
in Luke Perry's arm, So it was like of like
being really afraid. And also that Luke Perry was like
my superhero like in the moment.
Speaker 4 (11:38):
And I was like, oh my god.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
It was Yeah, it was crazy, but we landed safely,
and I always remember that, was that a crazy story?
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (11:47):
I got I got, like.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Wow, like imagine that headline though, No.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
God, no, no, no, no, it was so magical. It's
like one of it's like, it's one of my favorite memories.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
My God, Harry and Punky Power like Peril and plane
Punky Perry Power, Punky Pary Power Perry Punky didn't work
this time as a Peril. No.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
No, I'm sorry, it's sorry. Sorry.
Speaker 3 (12:16):
You know what.
Speaker 4 (12:16):
I should have just kissed him. I should have just
kissed I should have kissed him. I should have just
grabbed him.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
And oh he was probably I can I just imagine
he was probably sweet and telling you it was going
to be okay, and He's like, tell me about your life,
and yeah, I.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Didn't think it was going to be okay.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
And because we really like we were really.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
Yeah, what was the guy saying that was flying this plane?
Speaker 4 (12:43):
I think he was just trying to like keep the
plane up.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
And it's a crazy story, do you guys, Land, Punky
and Perry there you go. I mean a story. See,
it's a first, it's a first. I gotta share a story.
First story Clouds Brittain in the Clouds written and I
will never forget that.
Speaker 4 (13:04):
It was so it was really beautiful.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
Did you ever get a small plane again after that?
Speaker 4 (13:10):
You know, on a few occasions.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I don't think I have ever, but I was I had.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
I mean, these are all going to sound like crazy stories.
I remember flying into Idaho at one point to me
who I love so much, and she was, you know,
helped essentially bring my children into this world, and she's
so amazing. And at one time we were again I
found myself in a plane and Bruce, the incredible Bruce
(13:40):
Willis was there and and you know, the plane was
This is all going to sound like crazy Hollywood stories,
but again, like it was like somehow we ended up
going on a family trip or something, and and there
was turbulence, and I just remember thinking, well, Bruce Willis
is here on the plane, so we're good. Like I
felt somehow inevitably like safer because Bruce was on the plane,
(14:02):
and I was like, you're die hard dude, like I'm good.
That was different that I was like, cool, he like
kept it all together. I felt safe. And then yeah,
there weren't many of those experiences after that. I think
after that, I was like, I'll be taking Southwest.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
Yeah, jet Blue has my name, So I all over.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
A story like that, like because you felt like and
this is not going to sound normal to anyone, or
maybe it will, Like Bruce Willis is on this plane,
it's going to be okay.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
A thousand percent, So like a thousand percent, I was like,
he can.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
It's like having taught like if Tom Cruise was like,
you know, like fly you know you're like, oh, Tom
Cruise here, it's all gonna be okay, which, by the way,
way I mean with Tom Cruise, I feel like everything
is is okay when it's in a step world, Like
I'm just like like I I.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah, he would have like jumped down and like Superman,
the plane oh, a thousand percent.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
He would have carried the plane like com Cruise were
just like carries the plane.
Speaker 4 (15:03):
He's got you and he's like.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
No one, I'm talking cruise. Okay. So I used to
panic on planes, like be so.
Speaker 4 (15:17):
I believe I even talking about planes. I just don't worry. Okay, okay, okay, tom.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Me so panic on planes. And I'd always count how
many babies were on the plane, because I always thought, well,
if there's babies, like, God's not gonna take us right now,
we know this is not true.
Speaker 2 (15:32):
This is irrational, by.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
The way, everyone has done this. Everyone.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
And then I'm on a plane once and Michael Bolton
was on the plane and this is like in his heyday,
not his hair day, his hey day at some point
and he was on and for some reason before they
like closed the doors.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
I don't know why, he got up and got off
the plane.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
And I was like, oh, now I'm fucked, like in
my weird like a rational fear, I was like, Michael
Bolton's here, Nothing's gonna happen. And as he gets up,
I literally turned to my friend I said, we're getting
off the plane, and she goes, this is crazy. This
is fear has gone too far. I said, I know
(16:15):
it's irrational. I can't help myself. Right now, before they
close those doors, Michael Bolton got off.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
We had to get off. We go off the plane.
Speaker 4 (16:22):
You got off got a flane.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Yeah, because Michael Bolton did correct And did you tell
Michael Bolton this ever?
Speaker 2 (16:28):
No, I don't think so. Do you know why he
got off the plane? No, no, idea.
Speaker 4 (16:32):
He probably was on the wrong plane.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
He probably had too many like cocktails and like ended
up on the wrong But in.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
My mind, it's like, if he's on the plane, the
plane won't ever go down, so I have to get
off this flight.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Of course I checked the flight later. The flight was fine,
nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (16:46):
God, that is hysterical.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, well it's so it's wild.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
Yeah, I mean, well, you and I will have some
fun traveling together. Then I went into the Amazon not
too long ago, and that was wild. And that's like
one of those planes where they like it down the windows,
you know kind of thing. Well, yeah, yeah, like I
went into the Amazon. I went and stayed with a
tribe in Ecuador, which was unbelievable. It was really mind blowing.
And and to get in you take this, you know,
(17:14):
this tiny plane and then they drop you off in
the middle of the Amazon and they come back a
week later to pick you up. It's really it was
a really profound experience. And myself, well, so here. So
there was a small group of us, and my dear
friend who's here with me now can attest to this
because they were with me and and and and I'm
(17:35):
not kidding. You could roll down the plastic you know,
like window sides, and that's you know, and yeah and uh.
And on the way back it was like I think,
I think, I think we had like a backpack or something.
And they were like, oh, no, you have to take
the backpack off because the way you know of the
so tory, I know how to get you through your fear.
(17:56):
You have to come with me to the Amazon, okay,
and we will go and visit the tribe there, and
you will no longer have a fear of lying. I've
gotten better, and you've got so much better, and this
is going to be, this is going to be, this
is going to be. Your next step is I'm going
to go into the jungle. And once you have gone
(18:17):
and flown over the jungle in one of these you know, cue.
You know, they don't like parachute you out, No, they
they land and then they say goodbye, and then they
leave and you go and live in the jungle for
however long you live there.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
And it's really spectacular. I mean that's did you film this?
You film everything?
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Well? I filmed.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
I filmed parts of it for sure, and then wanted
to be very respectful of the tribe that welcomed us
in so so there was parts that I documented, in
parts that just remain in my heart.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
It was very life changing. Is this where you had
the shaman experience.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
I've had a few experiences with shamans, and that was
that was an double experience with Yeah, is.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
That the one that told you, uh, that was a
different one.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
We tell that story, sure, of course and around my
heart our hearts. Yeah, And it's so wild because I
was talking to Brian about this too, and it's so
that the shaman there in the jungle.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
It was wild.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
I remember hugging just just the whole experience opening my
heart so much, you know, And.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
And so yeah, absolutely, we can tell it.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
You can, you can, you can share, I can share
however you want.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
This is wild that we've known each other for so long,
you me and Brian. Obviously you and Brian stayed connected,
like I lost touch with friends and just in and
out of life. And I'm so happy and grateful to
be reconnected with you, and I don't want to lose
you again. I feel like this is the time in
our journey we're supposed to reconnect and now together.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
But absolutely everything happens for a reason.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
But it's wild. I have five kids, Brian has five kids.
You have four kids.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
It's like, yeah that there's a lot of kids between
fourteen kids between.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
Anti moth I'm glad you did it for us. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
At first I was sinking nineteen, but you know, fourteen
might as well be nineteen.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Fourteen kids.
Speaker 3 (20:20):
Yeah, So my feeling is, I wonder if you agree.
I'm like, okay, with this many kids, they better really
make a huge difference an impact in the world. I'm like,
they gotta, they gotta, and they are.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
I'm just busy trying to keep them alive.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Every every night they go to bed, account all of
them like there's that too, well more night.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It's just like just getting through it. You are and
so are.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Your parents, all of us. But I think our biggest connection,
at least from my perspective, is that we truly lead
with our hearts and with kindness. And that's my biggest
takeaway from my kids. Like people say, what do they
want to be? And I said, you know what, that's irrelevant.
I hope they make great changes in this world. I
(21:05):
hope they do what their passions are and what their
loves are and do well from and prosper. But leading
with kindness is just my biggest thing, and I'm glad
that they all have that from me.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Absolutely, your beautiful, open, exquisite heart that I love so much,
I loved so much. And what I was sharing with
you and I was sharing with Brian, was that I
had met this incredible shaman and was feeling very vulnerable
(21:39):
in my life, as I so often do. And I
think when we move through life and loss and love
and allow the light to come in, you know that
it's so much of our processing, you know. And we've
also experienced a great deal of grief, you know, and
(22:02):
and we've spoken of, you know, chasing grief away. And
I know for me, I tried to love it away
and work it away and just how it comes back,
you know, to find its way to you. And I
think that's something that you and Brian and I have
spoken about so openly, you know, And ever since I
(22:23):
was young, I mean, I've had the most incredible relationships
and I've also lost some of like the closest people
in my life. And so I was speaking with this
shaman and he said to me, you go through life
with a broken heart, and that is your journey. That
(22:45):
is part of your journey, is going through life with
a broken heart. I had never heard anything like that before,
and yet at the same time, it gave me so
much clarity because it it allows us to connect and
to be open with each other and to see that
(23:09):
that pain and that transformation of pain and delight is
our super power, you know. Yeah, And then it allows
other people to share with us and for us to
share with them with the genuine being parts of our being,
and to have compassion and empathy and all of these
(23:30):
elements that I think are so truly who you are
and certainly so much of of I feel the best
versions of myself. And so that that was a really
incredible moment where I just felt like all in my
walls just you know, breaking down, you know.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
And it's also I think the definition what we're told
the definition of a broken heart isn't always exactly what
we think it means. Because we've also talked about kind
of the openness of a broken heart, the thought if
you just visually see a broken heart, kind of broken
part that's inside of it, that's where the love and
(24:16):
light and the ass coming.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Through, well exactly.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
And that's one of my favorite Leonard Cohen quotes, one
of my favorite musicians ever, has to do with you
know how the broken parts are were the lights? You know?
And and so I think that it's you put it
so beautifully, which is to change the narrative within ourselves.
(24:42):
You know what I mean that that the parts of
us that have been broken, the loss that we've experienced,
the trials and tribulations, have been so much of our
expansion into the light, right, And I really believe that
we're instruments for something so much bigger than us. And
(25:03):
so every day, one of my dearest friends said, so
like every day I ask the universe, allow me to
be an instrument for me, for you, Let me be
an instrument for you, and so on a daily basis,
and I look to the universe and I asked, let
me be an instrument, you know, for you and and
my highest good, a vessel, a vessel for the good
(25:27):
and the world, and that that's so much of who
you are as well.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Still deserved to fall in love.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Oh well, absolutely, we deserve a lot of love. And
that's the and that's that's that, that's that part of
so much of what we've spoken about around worthiness and
self worth and value and how we value ourselves. I
think something that's really incredible to me though, is also
(25:56):
the fact that love to me to day looked so
different than the traditional kind of love that I had
thought of because I had a very unorthodox life, as
we did, right, and my dad was incredible and my
mom super mom.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
You know.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
My dad, you know, was a total rabble rouser, wasn't
always around, but he gave me a lot of love.
And I think that when I got married, I was
I was searching for that tradition and thinking, okay, well,
traditional you know, family values. And as time went on
and we evolved in different ways and had these incredible
(26:39):
children and came through that, I then, you know, have
had these very incredible, interesting experiences. And one of the
first people I came together with was one of my
best friends from childhood, Seth, and it was a totally
different kind of love. It was like that teen love again,
you know. And Seth bins Or was like my childhood.
Speaker 2 (27:02):
Wait, I don't know him.
Speaker 3 (27:03):
Okay, did you ever hear the song Butterfly by Crazy Town?
I said you she did my butterfly Baby? You don't
know this on Butterflies, like one of the biggest anthems
of the nineties.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Don't we exceed me right now?
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Okay, I'll play it for you. Okay, we'll play it here.
But essentially musician, yes.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
A musician I had not really kept up with like his.
I hadn't really kept I hadn't really kept up with
his like whole bad boy you know, teen years. The
last time I had seen him, I had done a
music video with him when I was like twenty years
old or something, and so we hadn't seen that.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
We had grown up together.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
We were friends from twelve thirteen years old, and literally
we came together. He was sober when we came together,
and I was just like, oh my gosh. It was
like this teen beautiful love and it was a whole other.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Kind of love.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
And and we came together, and then he relapsed three
to four months into us coming together, and it was
Devin stating, and we had started making this documentary about
his life and to do this, and it was incredibly
beautiful in so many ways and so emotional in so
(28:12):
many ways. And he passed away this this last summer.
And and so my point being that I haven't really
talked about this yet, Like you know, you know, to
grieve so deeply means that we had to have loved
and that love and that lightning and a bottle love
(28:36):
that I felt for that time, you know, that was endless,
you know, and love him so much. And and and
I think, you know, the whole experience gave me such
a deeper understanding on love and loving without judgment, and
such an understanding around you know, mental health and addiction
(28:57):
and looking at addiction more as disease.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
And then that led.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
Me to this journey with the Carters and this incredible
journey that I've been on with this documentary. That I
was able to process so much of the grief through
this story that hit home so you know, hard for me.
So my point is back to love that I think
(29:28):
love comes in so many different stages, right, And it's
like you could experience months or years with somebody and
have some of the greatest love in your life in
that lightning model moment, you know, and deep love of friendship,
my love for you and us coming together where we
(29:49):
hadn't seen each other for years, and it's like you
just pick up right where you left off. Right the
love that I have with friendships now, the love that
I have with my children, and like I think, falling
in love and love looks like so many different shapes
and sizes. It's the mirror of who we are and
(30:09):
when we're our most genuine self, and that.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Reflects back to us.
Speaker 3 (30:13):
So I suppose as much as I love the idea
of falling in love and sharing my life with that
person in romance, right, I also want to be so
aware that love exists all around me and that I
am in love with each and every person that reflects
(30:36):
back the best version of myself and that doesn't have
to be defined to one.
Speaker 2 (30:41):
Person that reflects back.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
That was beautiful, Hey, carry that forever that it's be
able to realize that that is. And I mean, I'm
guessing I know the answer to this. You don't believe
in regrets.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Yeah, SELFE is far, so far is so precious. I
had a lot of be honest, I feel like I
had to work through a great deal of even when
when you know that it's not your faulty, you're not
able to save somebody and that they have to save
(31:18):
themselves regardless of that. Oh my god, we're getting so deeper.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Right.
Speaker 3 (31:24):
So I had this thing where like sit and this
is like really stuck with me where seth He would
say he just wanted a nightstand, you know, in the house,
And I think that to him was symbolic of like
him just feeling like he had a place to call home.
And he was somebody that listened so well. So Mother's
(31:44):
Day it's like I would say, oh, you know things
in passing, I love making right, I want to be
able to make rice. And he would show up with
a rice cooker and I never had a mirror that
I could look close enough, and.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
He show up with a mirror. Like he listened so well,
he checked in so much lunch.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
And I remember that on a Christmas morning he said
I just want a nightstand. And he had said it
so many times and I never heard it, you know,
so for months after his passing, I was like, oh,
the next time that, I'm like, I.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Won't forget to get that night stand, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
So it was such a learning process and it was
such a journey and I wouldn't take back one second
of it. And I think it's also what gave me
the strength to then do the Carters, because I don't
know that I would have been able to understand this
family's journey, you know, or be there for Angel the
(32:46):
way that I wanted to, in the way that I
had to show up in the way that I think
is a documentarian. It is my my responsibility to show
up to provide a safe space for someone. Had I
not learned so much through that experience, so you know,
(33:08):
I had to like move through and let go of
the guilt and the shame and you know all of
those things that come with, you know, having a kind
of you know, wanting to save people, because I think
that's just innately in my inner being, wanting to do
what I can to you know, save everyone around me,
but realizing like I have to you know, first and
(33:29):
foremost always be there to save myself.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (33:33):
And that's something that is you know, a constant learning experience,
you know.
Speaker 1 (33:39):
I have. So I watched the cart and it was
so brilliant. I came away from it just having such
a better understanding. And I never I'm not a judging person,
(33:59):
but you know, we only know what we know and
what we're told. And being able to change a narrative
Aaron Carter and just and.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
His legacy, it was.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Hauntingly beautiful and heartbreaking, and that's the only thing.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
I think.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
I have so much admiration for you, and you're such
a beautiful storyteller and it made me really happy that
Angel is able to tell the story you want it.
I'm so you were that vessel. Thank you so much,
(34:46):
and it's out now. I'm paramount plus and I want
everyone to watch it just because I want them to
know what a beautiful love story this is really and
everyone can relate to it on some level.
Speaker 3 (34:58):
I'm so so thankful that you watched it. You know,
Angel has such a courageous, beautiful, brave heart. And as
we're talking about loss, I mean she had lost her sister, Leslie,
she had lost her twin brother Aaron, and her father
(35:22):
when we started this journey, and then she lost her
sister be Jay and talk about coming through loss and
turning that loss and pain into light.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
She is such an example of that.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
And to be able to share her truth and to
see this family's transformation of how much they want to
help make the world a better place because of their strength,
(36:00):
and how we talk about in our generational trauma, and
at the core, how much I wanted to really help
share a story that had to do with mental health
and addiction that touches so many of us, including myself
in an honest way. I just I'm so thankful that
(36:24):
they trusted in me, and that the team, the incredible
team from Paramount, plus an incredible team from Candle Media,
and just the entire team involved with it, that they
allowed me to create a safe space for Angel to
share her story. And just I'm so thankful, and I
really hope that it touches lives and that people have
(36:46):
a better understanding because so many people think that.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
That it's a choice.
Speaker 3 (36:51):
You know, that the addiction is a choice that people
make every day, and you know, and I remember, you know,
I remember Set at one point saying to me, I've
tried everything. I dare any doctor, like literally, he's so
wanted to live and Aaron is such a beautiful example
(37:13):
of that, this beautiful, vibrant, lively, wonderful, just beautiful spirit
that you see in all of those early years, you know,
and what is that that point in which you know
someone breaks or isn't able to continue on that journey.
(37:34):
And so I really hope that this documentary helps people
that are struggling and also to have a better understanding,
you know, and creates conversations, meaningful conversations that we have
to be having around mental health and addiction for sure.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
And it just stuck with me, Like you and you're
talking about now and you will listen.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
But you do listen well.
Speaker 3 (37:57):
And that's the thing is with Kid ninety, I said
that I was like, I didn't listen, and then it
was so wild because again I tried to listen, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
And so.
Speaker 3 (38:08):
I'm going to continue to do my best to listen,
but tell me, but.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
No, you listen.
Speaker 1 (38:13):
And like I feel, you know, I can't speak for
our friendship when we were teenagers, but our friendship now,
you know, going forward, I feel like you listened so
so well and you create that safe space even for
your humans, you know, not on camera like that they
feel comfortable just sharing and not feeling judged. It's such
(38:34):
a safe place. But you know, I know you interview
everyone and you do all of it. And then so
the one time that we really heard your voice in
it is you said to Angel when she said, you know,
Nix said he wants therapy, and.
Speaker 2 (38:50):
You said, is that why the two of you are
still here?
Speaker 1 (38:53):
And she said yes, sorry if I'm not verbatim seeing it,
and that just like you're breaking the wall, and like
saying that, just like that was like gut punched me
because I was like, I think it's so important. It's
such an important conversation and none of us can do
it alone, and not just mental health, not just addiction,
(39:14):
and specifically the mental health. I feel like it's something
like we didn't talk about it when I was growing up.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
No one talked about it.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
That was a stigmatism, like someone was like, oh, they
go to a therapist, what's wrong, or like you know,
and it's such a conversation that I feel like perhaps
our kids talk too freely.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
About and kind of throw it away.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
So there has to be that happy medium that we
all find.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
But thank you for doing the story.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
And I think it's really beautiful, and I think you
should get.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
A nice.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
You were realizing me we thought about getting it. Yeah,
we could refer a bish one Die Wyatt.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
You know, break if you want night the night stand
in my heart I do.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
I definitely break in and let the light is for
broken heart feeling.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
Oh well, okay, wait, I'll tell you one more great
story and we can close on this, which I went
on a date some some time ago, because you know,
I mean, I like this, I like this, I like
this story.
Speaker 4 (40:23):
So I went on a date.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
And and this gentleman takes me to this beautiful dinner.
Speaker 4 (40:31):
I love going.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
I'm manifesting a gentleman. I'm going to put this out
of the universe. A gentleman takes me to fantastic dinner
because we're manifesting here.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
Okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
And and afterwards he is telling me what he loves
to collect, and he says, oh, I love to collect watches.
He runs through the collection of things that he collects,
and he turned to me and said, what do you collect?
Speaker 4 (41:04):
And I said, I collect memories.
Speaker 2 (41:09):
Mm hmm. That's you.
Speaker 4 (41:12):
That's who I am. That's you are your memory collectors.
So the nightstand is right here in my memory.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
And that's all you need. I understand. That's beautiful. Wait
what else did he collect?
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Who knows? Apparently a lot of things. I love you.
I laughed, I cried.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
I love you. I love you so much. No more.
I really want you to take me in the Amazon.
Speaker 3 (41:40):
Okay, we're going to the Amazon. We're collecting memories.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Yes, for the rest of our lives. I love you
so much. I'm so grateful for you.
Host
Shannen Doherty
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