June 23, 2021 • 30 mins
Minnie questions Hoda Kotb, broadcast journalist, TV host, and author. Hoda shares how the hardest year of her life prepared her to land her dream job, a heart-breaking memory of listening to James Taylor, and the phone call at 11:53 that changed her life.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I am thrilled that you're here, excited to be here?
Or the distress like when's my time with many? How
old are your girls now? Or and to oh my god,
you're in the weeds, oh foreign to holy Molly, baby birds.
(00:22):
I know that people feel this way about their children,
but my son, he is just the best person I know.
I could talk to him forever. Gosh, it's funny, he's
downstairs drinking kool Aid, which we just drove to the
American store to gain. So Hello, I'm mini driver and
welcome to many questions. I've always loved Pruces questionnaire. It
(00:43):
was originally an eighteenth century parlor game meant to reveal
an individual's true nature. But with so many questions, there
wasn't really an opportunity to expand on anything. So I
took the format of Pruce's questionnaire and adapted What I
think are seven of the most important questions you could
ever ask someone. They are when and where were you happiest?
(01:05):
What is the quality you like least about yourself? What relationship,
real or fictionalized, defines love for you? What question would
you most like answered, What person, place, or experience has
shaped you the most? What would be your last meal?
And can you tell me something in your life that
(01:27):
has grown out of a personal disaster. The more people
we ask, the more we begin to see what makes
us similar and what makes us individual. I've gathered a
group of really remarkable people who I am honored and
humbled to have had a chance to engage with. My
guest today is herd a cut b who is really
(01:48):
the most surprising and interesting person who we probably already
think we know. I know, I did. She's been the
co anchor of The Today Show since two thousand eighteen,
been a tireless advocate breast cancer awareness and surviving cancer herself,
and became a mother later in her life, which gives
her a perspective on motherhood that I found extremely relatable
(02:09):
and joyful. Okay, so, like you know these questions, dying
to hear what your answers are, What would be your
last meal? I've debated this because this is a big
I think I would have Joel's salmon. He barbecued salmon
every Saturday, and it is the best samy. It like
(02:30):
melts in your mouth and it reminds me of us.
So I would have that. I would have really crispy, crunchy,
delicious French fries only because for my whole life that's
been my comfort food and I would love that I
would have my mom's spark lava. I can close my
eyes and taste it. She's eighty six and she still
(02:51):
makes it, and it's delicious, and it reminds me of
all the goodness in my mom. Reminds me of our
kitchen when we were kids. And then would probably eat
about three gallons of ice cream because I'm not allowed
to eat ice cream because I've got a very role
Oh well, that won't matter your dairy problem. Yeah, when
I wondered what I want to eat at all, who knows,
maybe feel terrible at the end. My club is stocking
(03:14):
to Marry. My team is Marry, and she's outside eating
a sandwich. My team is my dog, and he's going
to bark definitely in the stocking mirror, and she's like,
I just have ice water. Are you to my stomach
when I eat? Oh my god, your last meal? Eat it? Yeah.
I mean I realized in asking this question that implicit
(03:36):
in the question is you know, and then you're gonna
die or that's it. It's out and it's like, isn't
that what we'd really be thinking about, like what Mary says,
like I wouldn't be able to eat a thing. I
would just drink water. I don't know. I think it's that.
What is the food that connects you most to life,
regardless of whether you're about to die or not. I
(03:57):
love food so much. When I speak to people who
are like, yeah, you know, it's fuel, I just want
to I just want to punch them. Really. One of
my favorite desserts is a sheet cake, like a sheet
birthday cake. Yeah, I just want to sit on my
couch sometimes because I make them for everybody's birthday. I
just want to sit on my couch when it was home.
I can't beat myself when people are around with this
(04:19):
big spoon and that sheet cake and just sit there
and just scoop that up like that would be one
of my favorite nights. I just agree with you. There
is covert food that is a category of living that
doesn't get enough play. Like I like standing up in
my kitchen with a sheet of mozza with really thick,
(04:41):
delicious French salted butter and mar might and I like
to stand up and listen to the radio and look
out at what's happening on the street, total rear window.
It with my mom, I and Matza. I've never told
anybody that, Hoda, I've never admitted that, but that's what
I like to do, and I like to stand up
(05:02):
when I'm doing it. By the way, the covert eating
Joel had any idea what I ate when he went
out of town and be like, oh god, when the
kids go to bed, if Joel's out, chirp and Chicken
has a rack of ribs that has all kinds of barbecue.
I literally get a roll of paper towels. I sit
(05:22):
in front of the TV on the floor. It's gross
and I just go for it and I'm like done
with it. And I wanted to dispose of the evidence
just in case I've done that special trash bag for
food that you don't want anyone to know that you ate.
I was imagining that it's a full rack of ribs.
It's not even a half rack. Girl. And what I
(05:43):
want to do sometimes to stop myself this is t M.
I is when I eat enough of the cake and
I just have to throw it away. I just have
to get cascake and pour it all. Because sometimes sometimes
after an hour or so, it was I could bite in.
There have to ruin it so that you can't go back,
(06:04):
because if we're sitting on top of the can, it's
still okay. Every Woman, every woman I know, except the
one who said that food was fuel, understands that pouring
on something to ruin it. Do you remember in the
beginning of Alma and Louise, this is great scene where
Gina Davis is on the phone with her husband who's
(06:26):
being horrible, and she just keeps going to the fridge
and she takes out like a Snickers bar and she
takes a bite, and she wraps up, and she puts
it back in and she goes and does something else,
and she eats the whole thing through the whole scene.
And I do that always. I pretend like I'm not
going to finish the chocolate bar, the cake, the buns,
the ice cream, the mochi, the super thin of the cake,
(06:48):
the tiny thin that's my That's what my friend said
to me. So dinner, I was like, oh, I'll just
have I'll just have a little tiny piece of cake,
and she was low, yeah, because you're gonna the rest
of the kitchen when everyone else is drinking coffee. She's right,
what person, place, or experience most altered your life? I
(07:12):
mean for the better, it was my kids, and probably
for the worst was you know. I was said a
sorority formal. I was a trying out and my brother
who also went to Virginia Tech, he was another fraternity
and we were having our formal or whatever. We were
dancing and drinking and all the stuff, and my brother
runs in and I was like, oh my god. My
brother always said he was going to crash trying out formals,
(07:34):
like he gave his buddy did it? And he said
come outside, and I said what he goes come outside
and he's talked to you, and I go now, I
said that you need to tell me and he said
Dad had a heart attack and he died. It was
like you couldn't even compute what was going on. And
I remember we got into a car and we drove
(07:56):
to his apartment where he shared with a bunch of
other people, and we laid on the bed. So when
I was remembering, and I played James Taylor on the
turntable over and over and over and over until we
went home that morning. I think, you know, losing him
(08:16):
that young, I mean I went without my contacts. I'm
legally blind. I had on headphones and I would walk
around campus just obliviously for most of the year, I think,
and it's funny, it was the worst thing in the world,
But I often look around where I am now and wonder.
You know, you always want to add a girl from
your dad, you know you always want to you did it,
(08:38):
and throughout my career, I think there were probably a
few spots where he probably would have said, well, good
for you, you did it, and then I would have
been done. But instead, when you don't have that at
a girl, you're like, I guess there's more of this
mountain to climb. Let's see, let's see, let's see. And
you may keep pushing yourself for something that isn't coming.
(08:59):
But at the end of the day, it landed me
in a beautiful place. Now I have a beautiful family,
and you know, all those great things happened as a
result of it. So I think that event was really
life changing and helped me in some ways, and it
left me with unfinished business and others. Like you know,
we just were super close. He was closer with my
(09:21):
brother and my sister than me. I used to sometimes
sit in my car with him and we wouldn't we
wouldn't say anything. I was trying to think something to say, Yeah,
I it's so funny. I remember sitting next to my
dad at the Academy Awards. It was so amazing that
he was there, and my mom was there and my sister,
and he's holding my hand as they're reading at the
nominees and he leans over and he's like, darling, you're
(09:42):
not going to win. And I was like, what, wait
do you He's like, yeah, no, you're not going to win.
And he was squeezing my hand. He was like, it's okay,
you'll win something else. And it was so funny. I
swear to you. I was still chuckling when they read
out kim basing his name. I was still laughing. You're
just going You've got to be fucking kidding me. But
(10:04):
it was so perfect. It was like, that was the
attic girl that I needed in that moment. Oh my god, Daddy,
(10:24):
in your life, can you tell me about something that
has grown out of a personal disaster. Yes, there was
a biggie. I was working here at NBC and everything
was great. I worked at Dateline. I was newly married
Ladi Dai Da. Life was great. I went for a
(10:44):
routine mammogram and she felt something and she said, you
should get it checked. So in this weird span of
a week, I found out that I needed amystectomy, and
at the same time, I found out that the guy
who I was married to was being unfaithful, and I
(11:06):
literally was like, what is happening? Like what happened? I
didn't understand, and I went for surgery and was horrible.
So in that time afterwards, I was in covering, which
was just laying around watching Law and Order and trying
to figure out what I was matter about the sickness
(11:28):
or the soon to be ex husband, And in the
middle of all of it, I had this sort of
weird epiphany which happens, I think sometimes when everything is crummy,
and all of a sudden I realized like I had
made it, and I got these four words that sort
of came to me, and they were you can't scare me.
And I learned at work they were starting a new
(11:51):
hour of the Today Show, a fourth hour, and I
did something I had never done before I've never really liked,
raised my hand and said picked me for this job,
because here's why I'm so good. I just worked really hard.
I was like, seeing you over here, I'm the one working. Hey,
if you want to promote me, I'm over here, like
I was that one, not the one who strung themselves
with Christmas lights and talked about how good they were.
(12:13):
So in this moment, with that epiphany and that feeling
I was having, I said, you know what, I'm gonna
go ask for that effing job. And I still remember.
I got me elevator of thirty rock and went to
the fifty second floor, which was all the way up,
and I walked into Jeff Zupper's office at the time
he was heading up NBC, and I said, Jeff, I
(12:35):
had this epiphany. I got better. You can't scare me.
I want this job. He was like, okay, you are
who are you againt He had been through brain cancer,
so he understood that feeling of unstoppability kind of. And
I finished my speech. My heart was pounding. I did it.
I'd never done that. People saw me as a dateline person.
(12:56):
I was an Afghanistan and I had a couple of
producers pulling for me, and I ended up getting that
damn job. And I thought to myself Oh my god.
If I hadn't gotten sick, I wouldn't have the guts,
like I wouldn't have had the courage. I wouldn't have
had the mojo. I wouldn't have gone up. I would
have never asked. I would have waited like I usually do.
But instead it was urgent, like my life had margins.
(13:18):
There was a beginning and an end, like stop wasting time.
Like that hit me. It was like all of a sudden,
life was urgent, and that happened. I ended up getting it,
and I thought, well, talk about the silver lining of
a yucky, horrible, terrible couple of years turned into a
job that turned into another job. I mean, I can't
(13:38):
even believe I'm fifty six and I'm doing the today,
Like how did that happen? Like how did it happen?
I'm still stunned even now as I sit in my
office wondering, like, Wow, that was weird, but I think
that was it. And going through the divorce and a
sickness and going through two things at once, it's like,
(13:59):
you can it really pile all your sadness in one place.
You've got to split it. Maybe that helps you in
a weird way, like I'm mad at him. Why am
I sick? You know? Then I'm like I'm feeling better.
What a jump, you know, And so all of a
sudden you're like, oh, okay, well here I am. I
think I made it through. Wow. God, I wish when
the really bad, hard stuff was happening that concurrent with
(14:24):
fair and worry and fair and worry could be this
idea that I know something's going to grow out of this.
I know that this is not for nothing. It's funny
that we can look back and we can see that,
but at the time when it's happening. It was astonishes
me that we can't comfort ourselves with, well, it's most
(14:45):
likely going to happen, which is, as he said, something grows. Yes, yeah,
you're right. I would have loved to have known in
the middle of all those days, like, don't worry, there's
something coming, because then you realize, like, you're only here
for a minute, So you do you that's it, that's all.
You get. One right around the sun, so you can
tiptoe around and make everyone feel better and do what
(15:08):
you do, or you can speak it, say it out
loud kind of thing. What relationship, real or fictionalized defines
love for you. I had to think about this one
for a while. I have a best friend who I've
known for twenty years. Her name is Karen. She met
(15:30):
her husband in New Orleans. We we both lived there
and he was a police officer. She's a reporter, and
it was a beautiful romance. And over the years I
watched that relationship and I was always in awe that
because it worked on all cylinders. It worked as a partnership,
(15:50):
as a romantic relationship, they connected in all the ways,
and I hadn't seen many relationship that worked everywhere. Usually
it's like, well this is from friends, and this is
for my husband. And it seemed like they had a
connection that worked everywhere. And he got very very ill
a couple of years ago, and sadly he passed away.
And it was really since his passing that I watched
(16:15):
Karen speak about the love she has for him in
this moment, and I was so struck by the depth.
I knew it was deep, but I think it was
watching her number one go to hospital room after hospital
room for years and years, writing notes, writing notes, writing notes,
talking to doctors, another doctor. I have to follow up,
(16:36):
I have to call back why aren't they doing this?
What's up with the insurance? It was endless, endless. She
was there. She was always there, And I flew to
MD Anderson a few times just to be there with them.
And I walked in and she was always determined and
driven and had that look. And meantime she was flying
priests in to talk to John. And she's probably like
(16:58):
the most selfless person I've ever met, and the kindest.
And they have a daughter who's graduating high school, and
there's a lot that's happening in that world. Yet here
she is, you know, speaking about the love of her husband,
and it was underscore. And two weeks ago I was
asking her this question about a priest who had come
(17:18):
to visit John when he was ill, and he was
from India, and I said, whatever happened to Father Balla
this priest who came and is he okay in India
with everything that's going on with COVID? And she said, well,
he's in a remote area. Said you know, they're building
a church there, and I said, oh wow, that's terrific.
Shees she said they should have to walk five miles,
but now they're building one in their community. I said,
how did they do that? That's great? She said, well,
(17:39):
they just got the you know, all the equipment and
things that they needed and they built it. And I said, oh,
that's great. And she said, you know, some of the
equipment could be expensive, but anyway, they got it. And
I said how did they? How did they get all
that equipment and things to build a church? And she
they they just got it. And I said, please tell
me how they got it and she said, supplies are inexpensive,
(17:59):
and the dollar goes a long way. And I looked
at her and I said, okay, I said, did you
and she doesn't ever say And then she said her
husband's name is John long Quillow and she said, oh,
they called it the John Renquillow Church. Oh my goodness,
I thought, like the depth of first of all, her
(18:20):
humility is beyond my comprehension. She'll never tell you she's
done something good. She probably regrets that she told me
that story because she doesn't like to share that she's
doing something. She just does things. You know, she'll give
everything away and not mention it. She selflessly and with
great humility, helped this community build a church. She didn't
(18:41):
want to mention it, and they because they loved John
called it the John Lonquillo Church, because she always says
he's as close to a saying that she can emagine.
Do you think that devotion and selflessness others the cornerstones
of love? Well, that's beautiful that you put it that way.
I guess I feel like I see it personified in people,
(19:03):
but I guess I've never broken it down. But yeah,
the depth is more than a wee click, more than
we have a lot in common, more than I can
tell him things, you know. There's a depth there that
I think is rare. I don't think everyone gets to
experience that kind of relationship. And he John on Sundays,
(19:27):
he would go off in the morning, and she said,
I don't know what he's doing, probably running, you know,
and etcetera, etcetera. She didn't learn until years later that
he was always stopping at this older woman's house to
sit with her. Her husband died and that was one
of his stops in the morning. But he didn't talk
about it. He just did it. And I said, well,
I think John's probably a saint. You are too, I
just know, But saints don't say funk, so I couldn't be.
(19:51):
I thought, will the cool saints say fuck? But anyway,
it just struck me to watch that and they have
this young daughter and just I'm watching her and listen.
It doesn't always shake out the way that you think
it should in quotes, and it sounds like that young woman,
(20:12):
what she has had, what she has seen of love,
and what she has experienced of devotion is irreplaceable and
will be with her forever. And it's not that one
should ever have an either or like either you have
a dad or you have this amazing example of devotion
and love. But but how incredible that she does have that,
(20:32):
and that that's his legacy. It's very hard when you
lose someone to think about legacies because you really just
you don't care. You're like, I don't care about the legs.
I just want them here. I want them here to
hug and to touch and to feel and to be
with and to talk to. But the reality is, if
they've played their hand and it's done, what is left
behind them is really genuinely what you celebrate. Right, Yeah,
(20:57):
that's good. Yeah, So tell me when and when were
you happiest. I'm my happiest in this moment. And the
(21:20):
reason I say that is because I've had so many
beautiful moments in my life, but nothing comes close to
what happened to me four years ago where Joe and
I adopted Haley. And I think, when you don't think
you're going to get something because you don't know why
it wasn't in your cards. And I always dreamt of
(21:43):
being a mom. I thought it was in my d
n A. I had some bumps in the road, a
divorce and an illness, and then you realize, We'll wait.
I think the window went past me, and you almost
are shocked, like what happened? How did I miss that window?
So I would say out loud, all I wanted to
do was be a school teacher, and I would say, so,
(22:03):
I'm done with this job at the Today Show, I'm
going to be a school teacher, because it was the
closest I could get to being with kids. And I
was actually thinking about, like, how do I get my
education degree? I don't have that. What do I do?
How do I do it? And then one day I
actually watched a video and it was a child in Syria.
The place had been bombed and he had soot on
(22:25):
his face, and I just I was struggling with it.
And I looked at that kid and I said, oh
my god, what I wouldn't do to be the mother
to that child. And that was like the final sign.
There were so many signs before, but I think that
was the sign. And I said, if God tells you something,
pay attention. Stop turning your head, stop saying not now,
stop saying it's too late, stop stops up. And so
(22:47):
I approached the guy who had been dating for I
don't know six months, who has a grown daughter, and
I was like, how am I gonna say this? And
I guess this will show me whether or not he
loves me enough. And I said to him, I'm gonna
ask you something that's very important to me, but I
(23:08):
don't want you to answer right now. I need you
to think about it. And I said, I have these
feelings that I cannot push away anymore. And that's it,
Like I have to say it out loud or I'll explode.
You know that feeling when you you're carrying something it's heavy.
I really do. And I said, I would like to
explore adoption with you, and literally it was like one thousand,
(23:30):
two thousand three. I was looking at his face and
I was thinking to myself in this weird five second vacuum,
everything was about to change everything. Either I was going
to think maybe he doesn't love me enough and maybe
this was over, or he was going to say yes
and our lives would change in another way. And he literally,
(23:52):
meaning maybe. On the second number five, he said to me, oh,
I don't need a week. I don't need any time
to think about it. The answers yes, and I literally
fell on his chest and stabbed because it was like,
finally I said it out loud. You know the thing
you're most scared of, say that loud. In either way
it's resolved, you might as well say it. And literally
(24:13):
I just saw it like I still saw the mess
earri scenes on his teacher. I was like that kind
of starving. But anyway, that was the beginning. Wow, So
you would have done it anyway if that had meant
the end of your relationship. You would have chosen being
a mother over being in a relationship with someone that
you loved. It was that important to you. I never
actually never thought about because I didn't have to make
(24:34):
the choice. But yes, it's the most extraordinary thing when
you know something, you just know. When I was pregnant
with Henry. They do this terrible but I suppose necessary
test where they basically look at the DNA from your
partner and yours mixed together, and it spits out a
number of the likelihood of you having a child with disabilities,
(24:58):
and it gives you a X number in X thousand.
And I wasn't in the thousands. I wasn't in the hundreds.
I was in the teens, like it was very likely.
And I wrestled with the idea of getting an amniocentesis
because I was like, I'm having this baby no matter what.
(25:20):
I had the amnia because I was like, I will
be forewarned, I will know. And I was like, I'm
having this baby. I'm having this baby no matter what.
And I knew it. I knew it as clear as
a bell. There's very few moments in life where we're
that sure about things clearly. You're right is when you
know without a blink, when you know and you know
(25:41):
what's so weird. I'm you know, as I'm sitting here
in my office, I was sitting in the chair that
you can't see it's behind you. When the adoption agency
texted me and I called it the project, because I
really wanted to look at my phone when it rang
and said that project Ashley, and she wrote called me
and I looked at the bolts and I was like,
(26:02):
oh my god. So I literally sat there to get
a yellow pad and I looked at the clock. It's
like eleven fifty three. I said, this is the moment.
Like this, there will always be like a before and after.
And I scribbled all that stuff down and then I
hit the button and I called her and she said
(26:24):
two words, she's here. I was like, I don't know
what a live birth feels like, but that was pretty cool.
When I just got there, it was pretty amazing. And
it was one of those times Dan still everything's frozen.
It's like your life changes in a blink, like just
like that, and there's a before and after. How long
(26:45):
was it from the beginning of the process to that
phone call. We got the call in January and I
had talked to Joel in November. Wow, we had just
moved in together. It was November. Because they said it
could take a year, as aid a joy at me,
take some time, and I was like, it's actually not
(27:06):
take you the time. It's just like when it happens.
It happens. You know your life is about to take
a crazy turn. It was very quick, how amazing? Gosh,
well that is that was you? You you're sitting there
with your yellow legal pad. Was me waiving the pregnancy test?
Just you know, there's a before and an asked at
this moment of like you you don't know? And then
(27:28):
oh my god, you know were you excited right away?
Oh my god, I was. I've been told I couldn't
have children. I've been told when I was very young.
This this pretty awful doctor. You know, I'm eighteen years old.
And he basically compared all my tubes and my uterus
is basically sort of looking like a you bend in
(27:50):
a toilet, and he was like, chances of you having
a child extremely unscreamed, unlike I would say I'll never
have a child. And I was like, well, is there
like anything, is there anything I could do? So anything
I can do? Like you know, I'm eighteen, I'm sitting
there in my paper gown open at the back, and
he goes, well, you know, you could have a lot
(28:10):
of sex, and so if you shake something loose. I
I just remember stumbling out of there being like this
is no you know, nobody, nobody helps you deal with
that concept. But it's interesting how you're you know, we
didn't have I mean, I say, back then, you and
I are kind of around the same age, but it
wasn't like there was a therapist or someone to really
(28:33):
talk to about this huge idea. Your life sort of
grows around it. So when things change when I became pregnant,
or I imagine when you get this call that you
are actually going to be a mother, like it is
actually going to happen to say, it's life changing. I
don't know if there are times words don't really they
(28:54):
don't really suffice, but it was epic and immense, and
it definitely made me feel like there was some greater
power at work. I feel like I should pay you
for a therapy session. You can, I'll send you my
papal information, or you can just do a direct transfer.
I'd like that. Hold It's been such an incredible pleasure
(29:16):
talking to you. Thank you so much. I'm sorry you
crowd your mascara. That's okay, so great. Thank you. You
can watch Holda every weekday on the Today Show, and
she will also be co anchoring the Tokyo Olympics from
July to August eight. Mini Questions is hosted and written
(29:41):
by Me Mini Driver, Supervising producer Aaron Kaufman, Producer Morgan Lavoy,
Research assistant Marissa Brown. Original music Sorry Baby by Mini Driver,
Additional music by Aaron Kaufman, Executive produced by Me Minni Driver.
(30:02):
Special thanks to Jim Nikolay, Will Pearson, Addison No Day,
Lisa Castella and Nick Oppenheim at w kPr, de La Pescadore,
Kate Driver and Jason Weinberg, and for constantly solicited tech support,
Henry Driver,
I am thrilled that you're here, excited to be here?
Or the distress like when's my time with many? How
old are your girls now? Or and to oh my god,
you're in the weeds, oh foreign to holy Molly, baby birds.
(00:22):
I know that people feel this way about their children,
but my son, he is just the best person I know.
I could talk to him forever. Gosh, it's funny, he's
downstairs drinking kool Aid, which we just drove to the
American store to gain. So Hello, I'm mini driver and
welcome to many questions. I've always loved Pruces questionnaire. It
(00:43):
was originally an eighteenth century parlor game meant to reveal
an individual's true nature. But with so many questions, there
wasn't really an opportunity to expand on anything. So I
took the format of Pruce's questionnaire and adapted What I
think are seven of the most important questions you could
ever ask someone. They are when and where were you happiest?
(01:05):
What is the quality you like least about yourself? What relationship,
real or fictionalized, defines love for you? What question would
you most like answered, What person, place, or experience has
shaped you the most? What would be your last meal?
And can you tell me something in your life that
(01:27):
has grown out of a personal disaster. The more people
we ask, the more we begin to see what makes
us similar and what makes us individual. I've gathered a
group of really remarkable people who I am honored and
humbled to have had a chance to engage with. My
guest today is herd a cut b who is really
(01:48):
the most surprising and interesting person who we probably already
think we know. I know, I did. She's been the
co anchor of The Today Show since two thousand eighteen,
been a tireless advocate breast cancer awareness and surviving cancer herself,
and became a mother later in her life, which gives
her a perspective on motherhood that I found extremely relatable
(02:09):
and joyful. Okay, so, like you know these questions, dying
to hear what your answers are, What would be your
last meal? I've debated this because this is a big
I think I would have Joel's salmon. He barbecued salmon
every Saturday, and it is the best samy. It like
(02:30):
melts in your mouth and it reminds me of us.
So I would have that. I would have really crispy, crunchy,
delicious French fries only because for my whole life that's
been my comfort food and I would love that I
would have my mom's spark lava. I can close my
eyes and taste it. She's eighty six and she still
(02:51):
makes it, and it's delicious, and it reminds me of
all the goodness in my mom. Reminds me of our
kitchen when we were kids. And then would probably eat
about three gallons of ice cream because I'm not allowed
to eat ice cream because I've got a very role
Oh well, that won't matter your dairy problem. Yeah, when
I wondered what I want to eat at all, who knows,
maybe feel terrible at the end. My club is stocking
(03:14):
to Marry. My team is Marry, and she's outside eating
a sandwich. My team is my dog, and he's going
to bark definitely in the stocking mirror, and she's like,
I just have ice water. Are you to my stomach
when I eat? Oh my god, your last meal? Eat it? Yeah.
I mean I realized in asking this question that implicit
(03:36):
in the question is you know, and then you're gonna
die or that's it. It's out and it's like, isn't
that what we'd really be thinking about, like what Mary says,
like I wouldn't be able to eat a thing. I
would just drink water. I don't know. I think it's that.
What is the food that connects you most to life,
regardless of whether you're about to die or not. I
(03:57):
love food so much. When I speak to people who
are like, yeah, you know, it's fuel, I just want
to I just want to punch them. Really. One of
my favorite desserts is a sheet cake, like a sheet
birthday cake. Yeah, I just want to sit on my
couch sometimes because I make them for everybody's birthday. I
just want to sit on my couch when it was home.
I can't beat myself when people are around with this
(04:19):
big spoon and that sheet cake and just sit there
and just scoop that up like that would be one
of my favorite nights. I just agree with you. There
is covert food that is a category of living that
doesn't get enough play. Like I like standing up in
my kitchen with a sheet of mozza with really thick,
(04:41):
delicious French salted butter and mar might and I like
to stand up and listen to the radio and look
out at what's happening on the street, total rear window.
It with my mom, I and Matza. I've never told
anybody that, Hoda, I've never admitted that, but that's what
I like to do, and I like to stand up
(05:02):
when I'm doing it. By the way, the covert eating
Joel had any idea what I ate when he went
out of town and be like, oh god, when the
kids go to bed, if Joel's out, chirp and Chicken
has a rack of ribs that has all kinds of barbecue.
I literally get a roll of paper towels. I sit
(05:22):
in front of the TV on the floor. It's gross
and I just go for it and I'm like done
with it. And I wanted to dispose of the evidence
just in case I've done that special trash bag for
food that you don't want anyone to know that you ate.
I was imagining that it's a full rack of ribs.
It's not even a half rack. Girl. And what I
(05:43):
want to do sometimes to stop myself this is t M.
I is when I eat enough of the cake and
I just have to throw it away. I just have
to get cascake and pour it all. Because sometimes sometimes
after an hour or so, it was I could bite in.
There have to ruin it so that you can't go back,
(06:04):
because if we're sitting on top of the can, it's
still okay. Every Woman, every woman I know, except the
one who said that food was fuel, understands that pouring
on something to ruin it. Do you remember in the
beginning of Alma and Louise, this is great scene where
Gina Davis is on the phone with her husband who's
(06:26):
being horrible, and she just keeps going to the fridge
and she takes out like a Snickers bar and she
takes a bite, and she wraps up, and she puts
it back in and she goes and does something else,
and she eats the whole thing through the whole scene.
And I do that always. I pretend like I'm not
going to finish the chocolate bar, the cake, the buns,
the ice cream, the mochi, the super thin of the cake,
(06:48):
the tiny thin that's my That's what my friend said
to me. So dinner, I was like, oh, I'll just
have I'll just have a little tiny piece of cake,
and she was low, yeah, because you're gonna the rest
of the kitchen when everyone else is drinking coffee. She's right,
what person, place, or experience most altered your life? I
(07:12):
mean for the better, it was my kids, and probably
for the worst was you know. I was said a
sorority formal. I was a trying out and my brother
who also went to Virginia Tech, he was another fraternity
and we were having our formal or whatever. We were
dancing and drinking and all the stuff, and my brother
runs in and I was like, oh my god. My
brother always said he was going to crash trying out formals,
(07:34):
like he gave his buddy did it? And he said
come outside, and I said what he goes come outside
and he's talked to you, and I go now, I
said that you need to tell me and he said
Dad had a heart attack and he died. It was
like you couldn't even compute what was going on. And
I remember we got into a car and we drove
(07:56):
to his apartment where he shared with a bunch of
other people, and we laid on the bed. So when
I was remembering, and I played James Taylor on the
turntable over and over and over and over until we
went home that morning. I think, you know, losing him
(08:16):
that young, I mean I went without my contacts. I'm
legally blind. I had on headphones and I would walk
around campus just obliviously for most of the year, I think,
and it's funny, it was the worst thing in the world,
But I often look around where I am now and wonder.
You know, you always want to add a girl from
your dad, you know you always want to you did it,
(08:38):
and throughout my career, I think there were probably a
few spots where he probably would have said, well, good
for you, you did it, and then I would have
been done. But instead, when you don't have that at
a girl, you're like, I guess there's more of this
mountain to climb. Let's see, let's see, let's see. And
you may keep pushing yourself for something that isn't coming.
(08:59):
But at the end of the day, it landed me
in a beautiful place. Now I have a beautiful family,
and you know, all those great things happened as a
result of it. So I think that event was really
life changing and helped me in some ways, and it
left me with unfinished business and others. Like you know,
we just were super close. He was closer with my
(09:21):
brother and my sister than me. I used to sometimes
sit in my car with him and we wouldn't we
wouldn't say anything. I was trying to think something to say, Yeah,
I it's so funny. I remember sitting next to my
dad at the Academy Awards. It was so amazing that
he was there, and my mom was there and my sister,
and he's holding my hand as they're reading at the
nominees and he leans over and he's like, darling, you're
(09:42):
not going to win. And I was like, what, wait
do you He's like, yeah, no, you're not going to win.
And he was squeezing my hand. He was like, it's okay,
you'll win something else. And it was so funny. I
swear to you. I was still chuckling when they read
out kim basing his name. I was still laughing. You're
just going You've got to be fucking kidding me. But
(10:04):
it was so perfect. It was like, that was the
attic girl that I needed in that moment. Oh my god, Daddy,
(10:24):
in your life, can you tell me about something that
has grown out of a personal disaster. Yes, there was
a biggie. I was working here at NBC and everything
was great. I worked at Dateline. I was newly married
Ladi Dai Da. Life was great. I went for a
(10:44):
routine mammogram and she felt something and she said, you
should get it checked. So in this weird span of
a week, I found out that I needed amystectomy, and
at the same time, I found out that the guy
who I was married to was being unfaithful, and I
(11:06):
literally was like, what is happening? Like what happened? I
didn't understand, and I went for surgery and was horrible.
So in that time afterwards, I was in covering, which
was just laying around watching Law and Order and trying
to figure out what I was matter about the sickness
(11:28):
or the soon to be ex husband, And in the
middle of all of it, I had this sort of
weird epiphany which happens, I think sometimes when everything is crummy,
and all of a sudden I realized like I had
made it, and I got these four words that sort
of came to me, and they were you can't scare me.
And I learned at work they were starting a new
(11:51):
hour of the Today Show, a fourth hour, and I
did something I had never done before I've never really liked,
raised my hand and said picked me for this job,
because here's why I'm so good. I just worked really hard.
I was like, seeing you over here, I'm the one working. Hey,
if you want to promote me, I'm over here, like
I was that one, not the one who strung themselves
with Christmas lights and talked about how good they were.
(12:13):
So in this moment, with that epiphany and that feeling
I was having, I said, you know what, I'm gonna
go ask for that effing job. And I still remember.
I got me elevator of thirty rock and went to
the fifty second floor, which was all the way up,
and I walked into Jeff Zupper's office at the time
he was heading up NBC, and I said, Jeff, I
(12:35):
had this epiphany. I got better. You can't scare me.
I want this job. He was like, okay, you are
who are you againt He had been through brain cancer,
so he understood that feeling of unstoppability kind of. And
I finished my speech. My heart was pounding. I did it.
I'd never done that. People saw me as a dateline person.
(12:56):
I was an Afghanistan and I had a couple of
producers pulling for me, and I ended up getting that
damn job. And I thought to myself Oh my god.
If I hadn't gotten sick, I wouldn't have the guts,
like I wouldn't have had the courage. I wouldn't have
had the mojo. I wouldn't have gone up. I would
have never asked. I would have waited like I usually do.
But instead it was urgent, like my life had margins.
(13:18):
There was a beginning and an end, like stop wasting time.
Like that hit me. It was like all of a sudden,
life was urgent, and that happened. I ended up getting it,
and I thought, well, talk about the silver lining of
a yucky, horrible, terrible couple of years turned into a
job that turned into another job. I mean, I can't
(13:38):
even believe I'm fifty six and I'm doing the today,
Like how did that happen? Like how did it happen?
I'm still stunned even now as I sit in my
office wondering, like, Wow, that was weird, but I think
that was it. And going through the divorce and a
sickness and going through two things at once, it's like,
(13:59):
you can it really pile all your sadness in one place.
You've got to split it. Maybe that helps you in
a weird way, like I'm mad at him. Why am
I sick? You know? Then I'm like I'm feeling better.
What a jump, you know, And so all of a
sudden you're like, oh, okay, well here I am. I
think I made it through. Wow. God, I wish when
the really bad, hard stuff was happening that concurrent with
(14:24):
fair and worry and fair and worry could be this
idea that I know something's going to grow out of this.
I know that this is not for nothing. It's funny
that we can look back and we can see that,
but at the time when it's happening. It was astonishes
me that we can't comfort ourselves with, well, it's most
(14:45):
likely going to happen, which is, as he said, something grows. Yes, yeah,
you're right. I would have loved to have known in
the middle of all those days, like, don't worry, there's
something coming, because then you realize, like, you're only here
for a minute, So you do you that's it, that's all.
You get. One right around the sun, so you can
tiptoe around and make everyone feel better and do what
(15:08):
you do, or you can speak it, say it out
loud kind of thing. What relationship, real or fictionalized defines
love for you. I had to think about this one
for a while. I have a best friend who I've
known for twenty years. Her name is Karen. She met
(15:30):
her husband in New Orleans. We we both lived there
and he was a police officer. She's a reporter, and
it was a beautiful romance. And over the years I
watched that relationship and I was always in awe that
because it worked on all cylinders. It worked as a partnership,
(15:50):
as a romantic relationship, they connected in all the ways,
and I hadn't seen many relationship that worked everywhere. Usually
it's like, well this is from friends, and this is
for my husband. And it seemed like they had a
connection that worked everywhere. And he got very very ill
a couple of years ago, and sadly he passed away.
And it was really since his passing that I watched
(16:15):
Karen speak about the love she has for him in
this moment, and I was so struck by the depth.
I knew it was deep, but I think it was
watching her number one go to hospital room after hospital
room for years and years, writing notes, writing notes, writing notes,
talking to doctors, another doctor. I have to follow up,
(16:36):
I have to call back why aren't they doing this?
What's up with the insurance? It was endless, endless. She
was there. She was always there, And I flew to
MD Anderson a few times just to be there with them.
And I walked in and she was always determined and
driven and had that look. And meantime she was flying
priests in to talk to John. And she's probably like
(16:58):
the most selfless person I've ever met, and the kindest.
And they have a daughter who's graduating high school, and
there's a lot that's happening in that world. Yet here
she is, you know, speaking about the love of her husband,
and it was underscore. And two weeks ago I was
asking her this question about a priest who had come
(17:18):
to visit John when he was ill, and he was
from India, and I said, whatever happened to Father Balla
this priest who came and is he okay in India
with everything that's going on with COVID? And she said, well,
he's in a remote area. Said you know, they're building
a church there, and I said, oh wow, that's terrific.
Shees she said they should have to walk five miles,
but now they're building one in their community. I said,
how did they do that? That's great? She said, well,
(17:39):
they just got the you know, all the equipment and
things that they needed and they built it. And I said, oh,
that's great. And she said, you know, some of the
equipment could be expensive, but anyway, they got it. And
I said how did they? How did they get all
that equipment and things to build a church? And she
they they just got it. And I said, please tell
me how they got it and she said, supplies are inexpensive,
(17:59):
and the dollar goes a long way. And I looked
at her and I said, okay, I said, did you
and she doesn't ever say And then she said her
husband's name is John long Quillow and she said, oh,
they called it the John Renquillow Church. Oh my goodness,
I thought, like the depth of first of all, her
(18:20):
humility is beyond my comprehension. She'll never tell you she's
done something good. She probably regrets that she told me
that story because she doesn't like to share that she's
doing something. She just does things. You know, she'll give
everything away and not mention it. She selflessly and with
great humility, helped this community build a church. She didn't
(18:41):
want to mention it, and they because they loved John
called it the John Lonquillo Church, because she always says
he's as close to a saying that she can emagine.
Do you think that devotion and selflessness others the cornerstones
of love? Well, that's beautiful that you put it that way.
I guess I feel like I see it personified in people,
(19:03):
but I guess I've never broken it down. But yeah,
the depth is more than a wee click, more than
we have a lot in common, more than I can
tell him things, you know. There's a depth there that
I think is rare. I don't think everyone gets to
experience that kind of relationship. And he John on Sundays,
(19:27):
he would go off in the morning, and she said,
I don't know what he's doing, probably running, you know,
and etcetera, etcetera. She didn't learn until years later that
he was always stopping at this older woman's house to
sit with her. Her husband died and that was one
of his stops in the morning. But he didn't talk
about it. He just did it. And I said, well,
I think John's probably a saint. You are too, I
just know, But saints don't say funk, so I couldn't be.
(19:51):
I thought, will the cool saints say fuck? But anyway,
it just struck me to watch that and they have
this young daughter and just I'm watching her and listen.
It doesn't always shake out the way that you think
it should in quotes, and it sounds like that young woman,
(20:12):
what she has had, what she has seen of love,
and what she has experienced of devotion is irreplaceable and
will be with her forever. And it's not that one
should ever have an either or like either you have
a dad or you have this amazing example of devotion
and love. But but how incredible that she does have that,
(20:32):
and that that's his legacy. It's very hard when you
lose someone to think about legacies because you really just
you don't care. You're like, I don't care about the legs.
I just want them here. I want them here to
hug and to touch and to feel and to be
with and to talk to. But the reality is, if
they've played their hand and it's done, what is left
behind them is really genuinely what you celebrate. Right, Yeah,
(20:57):
that's good. Yeah, So tell me when and when were
you happiest. I'm my happiest in this moment. And the
(21:20):
reason I say that is because I've had so many
beautiful moments in my life, but nothing comes close to
what happened to me four years ago where Joe and
I adopted Haley. And I think, when you don't think
you're going to get something because you don't know why
it wasn't in your cards. And I always dreamt of
(21:43):
being a mom. I thought it was in my d
n A. I had some bumps in the road, a
divorce and an illness, and then you realize, We'll wait.
I think the window went past me, and you almost
are shocked, like what happened? How did I miss that window?
So I would say out loud, all I wanted to
do was be a school teacher, and I would say, so,
(22:03):
I'm done with this job at the Today Show, I'm
going to be a school teacher, because it was the
closest I could get to being with kids. And I
was actually thinking about, like, how do I get my
education degree? I don't have that. What do I do?
How do I do it? And then one day I
actually watched a video and it was a child in Syria.
The place had been bombed and he had soot on
(22:25):
his face, and I just I was struggling with it.
And I looked at that kid and I said, oh
my god, what I wouldn't do to be the mother
to that child. And that was like the final sign.
There were so many signs before, but I think that
was the sign. And I said, if God tells you something,
pay attention. Stop turning your head, stop saying not now,
stop saying it's too late, stop stops up. And so
(22:47):
I approached the guy who had been dating for I
don't know six months, who has a grown daughter, and
I was like, how am I gonna say this? And
I guess this will show me whether or not he
loves me enough. And I said to him, I'm gonna
ask you something that's very important to me, but I
(23:08):
don't want you to answer right now. I need you
to think about it. And I said, I have these
feelings that I cannot push away anymore. And that's it,
Like I have to say it out loud or I'll explode.
You know that feeling when you you're carrying something it's heavy.
I really do. And I said, I would like to
explore adoption with you, and literally it was like one thousand,
(23:30):
two thousand three. I was looking at his face and
I was thinking to myself in this weird five second vacuum,
everything was about to change everything. Either I was going
to think maybe he doesn't love me enough and maybe
this was over, or he was going to say yes
and our lives would change in another way. And he literally,
(23:52):
meaning maybe. On the second number five, he said to me, oh,
I don't need a week. I don't need any time
to think about it. The answers yes, and I literally
fell on his chest and stabbed because it was like,
finally I said it out loud. You know the thing
you're most scared of, say that loud. In either way
it's resolved, you might as well say it. And literally
(24:13):
I just saw it like I still saw the mess
earri scenes on his teacher. I was like that kind
of starving. But anyway, that was the beginning. Wow, So
you would have done it anyway if that had meant
the end of your relationship. You would have chosen being
a mother over being in a relationship with someone that
you loved. It was that important to you. I never
actually never thought about because I didn't have to make
(24:34):
the choice. But yes, it's the most extraordinary thing when
you know something, you just know. When I was pregnant
with Henry. They do this terrible but I suppose necessary
test where they basically look at the DNA from your
partner and yours mixed together, and it spits out a
number of the likelihood of you having a child with disabilities,
(24:58):
and it gives you a X number in X thousand.
And I wasn't in the thousands. I wasn't in the hundreds.
I was in the teens, like it was very likely.
And I wrestled with the idea of getting an amniocentesis
because I was like, I'm having this baby no matter what.
(25:20):
I had the amnia because I was like, I will
be forewarned, I will know. And I was like, I'm
having this baby. I'm having this baby no matter what.
And I knew it. I knew it as clear as
a bell. There's very few moments in life where we're
that sure about things clearly. You're right is when you
know without a blink, when you know and you know
(25:41):
what's so weird. I'm you know, as I'm sitting here
in my office, I was sitting in the chair that
you can't see it's behind you. When the adoption agency
texted me and I called it the project, because I
really wanted to look at my phone when it rang
and said that project Ashley, and she wrote called me
and I looked at the bolts and I was like,
(26:02):
oh my god. So I literally sat there to get
a yellow pad and I looked at the clock. It's
like eleven fifty three. I said, this is the moment.
Like this, there will always be like a before and after.
And I scribbled all that stuff down and then I
hit the button and I called her and she said
(26:24):
two words, she's here. I was like, I don't know
what a live birth feels like, but that was pretty cool.
When I just got there, it was pretty amazing. And
it was one of those times Dan still everything's frozen.
It's like your life changes in a blink, like just
like that, and there's a before and after. How long
(26:45):
was it from the beginning of the process to that
phone call. We got the call in January and I
had talked to Joel in November. Wow, we had just
moved in together. It was November. Because they said it
could take a year, as aid a joy at me,
take some time, and I was like, it's actually not
(27:06):
take you the time. It's just like when it happens.
It happens. You know your life is about to take
a crazy turn. It was very quick, how amazing? Gosh,
well that is that was you? You you're sitting there
with your yellow legal pad. Was me waiving the pregnancy test?
Just you know, there's a before and an asked at
this moment of like you you don't know? And then
(27:28):
oh my god, you know were you excited right away?
Oh my god, I was. I've been told I couldn't
have children. I've been told when I was very young.
This this pretty awful doctor. You know, I'm eighteen years old.
And he basically compared all my tubes and my uterus
is basically sort of looking like a you bend in
(27:50):
a toilet, and he was like, chances of you having
a child extremely unscreamed, unlike I would say I'll never
have a child. And I was like, well, is there
like anything, is there anything I could do? So anything
I can do? Like you know, I'm eighteen, I'm sitting
there in my paper gown open at the back, and
he goes, well, you know, you could have a lot
(28:10):
of sex, and so if you shake something loose. I
I just remember stumbling out of there being like this
is no you know, nobody, nobody helps you deal with
that concept. But it's interesting how you're you know, we
didn't have I mean, I say, back then, you and
I are kind of around the same age, but it
wasn't like there was a therapist or someone to really
(28:33):
talk to about this huge idea. Your life sort of
grows around it. So when things change when I became pregnant,
or I imagine when you get this call that you
are actually going to be a mother, like it is
actually going to happen to say, it's life changing. I
don't know if there are times words don't really they
(28:54):
don't really suffice, but it was epic and immense, and
it definitely made me feel like there was some greater
power at work. I feel like I should pay you
for a therapy session. You can, I'll send you my
papal information, or you can just do a direct transfer.
I'd like that. Hold It's been such an incredible pleasure
(29:16):
talking to you. Thank you so much. I'm sorry you
crowd your mascara. That's okay, so great. Thank you. You
can watch Holda every weekday on the Today Show, and
she will also be co anchoring the Tokyo Olympics from
July to August eight. Mini Questions is hosted and written
(29:41):
by Me Mini Driver, Supervising producer Aaron Kaufman, Producer Morgan Lavoy,
Research assistant Marissa Brown. Original music Sorry Baby by Mini Driver,
Additional music by Aaron Kaufman, Executive produced by Me Minni Driver.
(30:02):
Special thanks to Jim Nikolay, Will Pearson, Addison No Day,
Lisa Castella and Nick Oppenheim at w kPr, de La Pescadore,
Kate Driver and Jason Weinberg, and for constantly solicited tech support,
Henry Driver,
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