35 - A Small Foreign Faction

This week on My Favorite Murder, Karen and Georgia reflect and ruminate on the circus surrounding the life and death of JonBenét Ramsey. Pop culture gone mad.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Shall we Oh, yeah, okay, yeah, what was going through
your mind?

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Just Oh, I was thinking about my old roommate who's
the scream sneeze, And I was getting legitimately angry about
the amount of time I spent with people I didn't
like in the nineties because I was on drugs and drink.

Speaker 1 (00:35):
Maybe you were on drugs and drink because you couldn't
stand the most of the people you were around.

Speaker 3 (00:39):
I think that had a lot to do with it.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
And yet I felt very like suit fakely loyal or something,
or like like I was supposed to make it work
out somehow. But yeah, if you're friends with the scream sneezer,
cancel the friendship immediately. It's the most obnoxious habit in
the world. Like, what happened to you that you neat attention?
You sneeze?

Speaker 1 (01:02):
My mom? What happened to her? I don't know, but
she screams sneeze.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
Wait she listens. We can't talk about her, mom, Mom,
she knows, she knows what she fucking did to me
in my life. It is because it's just you know,
your sneeze is coming. If you're a scream sneezer, I
don't She's so all of a sudden, it's someone screaming.

Speaker 1 (01:21):
She loves attention. There's no you're completely right about that. Yeah,
like that's a thing, that's a that's a connection. Yeah, Mom,
I love you, But Jesus fucking Christ, I mean she knows,
she doesn't care. Do you think a lot of people
think that they just started this podcast accidentally, like skipped
the beginning of Yes, and really that was the beginning.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
That was the beginning. We're trying new beginnings. It's called complaint.
We're just a hard complaint at the top, angry complaining.
Then we go into our pre written intro. Go ahead,
Georgia High, Hey, thanks for tuning in to my favorite murder.
My name is Georgia hart Stark.

Speaker 1 (01:57):
And my name Ishn Kilgera. And this is pre We've
been practicing this for months.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
We wrote it and then we sent it off to
a professional editor. They sent back some suggestions. Ye, god,
that was a great beginning of a podcast.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
You're welcome for being fucking professional. That's why this episode's
so expensive for you guys.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
Yeah, that's right, because of this amazing high quality writing.

Speaker 1 (02:24):
How much money we spend we don't.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
Even say, have we said the words my favorite murder
yet I think I mentioned it.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
Okay, get get get.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Uh anyway, do you want to just kick right into
corrections corner?

Speaker 1 (02:36):
Absolutely? I have one? Do you go ahead?

Speaker 2 (02:39):
No?

Speaker 1 (02:39):
No, because I actually I do have like one that
I did I fucked up last week? Oh why not?

Speaker 2 (02:45):
Like so I'm trying to steal my thunder? Why would
you do so?

Speaker 1 (02:51):
This mass shooting in Australia led to crazy strict gun laws,
which is amazing. And everyone who messaged me was like,
we thought that the Sandy Hook shooting was going to
be the same incident, right, and we think you're a
terrible place because it wasn't. But here's ours, here's this
positive thing, and it's great, amazing and we're all very

(03:11):
happy with me.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Did you tell them about our saltwater taffy? Because we
can be pretty great when we try.

Speaker 3 (03:16):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yes, there are people are who have major problems getting
guns to kill children, specifically.

Speaker 1 (03:25):
Yeah, they don't have the problems. They don't have major
problems getting guns.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
No, I meant they have problems in their lives. Yes,
they are getting guns and how.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
Yeah, and however, it's very easy for them to get
guns even though they have major problems.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
It's totally fine for them to get guns.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
Let's talk about gun control.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
Yes, who doesn't love to hear all about that?

Speaker 1 (03:45):
All right? What's your correction's corner?

Speaker 2 (03:47):
Mine is the simple fact that Peoria is not three
miles away from Chicago, but three hours. And I swear
to fucking Christ, every single person in the Midwest texted
and tweeted and told me about it, personal friends, distant strangers,
everybody who could possibly say it was let and they

(04:08):
were saying it as if I had said Abraham Lincoln
was our first present. Like, excuse me, Peoria is not
three miles away.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
Karen as the as the other half of this podcast.
Oh yes, I'm exonerating you from that needing to be
a fucking thing for you to apologize for.

Speaker 2 (04:24):
Sometimes when I'm reading off my Wikipedia print out, my
eye will tell me something that isn't there on the church.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
That's what I'm doing, And like, okay, all right, so
we're in Los Angeles. If someone said that at San
Francisco is three hours from here, would you say no?
Would you tell them it's six hours? And would it
make it different?

Speaker 2 (04:42):
No?

Speaker 1 (04:42):
You know what I would do?

Speaker 3 (04:43):
I would withhold the true information, and then I would gloat.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
There you go.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
Yeah, I would say I'm better than that person. Secretly
everyone it's just to be more selfish. Yeah, they do
there gloat more said it. Talk to us.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Late in episode thirty five, Kieren and George just became
real mean, just just became a big asshole. It was weird.

Speaker 2 (05:03):
They went into gun control ship and then they just
got rude. And that's when I said, I've had it.
Here's a positive, because it's not all like that with it.
I have a positive to go ahead, do you really well?
My positive you know about But let's fake and pretend
like you've never heard this story before. So Stephen hasn't
heard it. Stephen, I'm not looking at you anymore, see it,

(05:23):
don't look at me. So I was doing something working
probably and then killing time before I had to go
somewhere else. So when I have an hour to kill,
I go to J Crew or some such place where
I can get a long sleeve of cotton shirt.

Speaker 1 (05:38):
Real quick caters. This is not a fucking ad paid
us to do.

Speaker 3 (05:42):
No, we're not sneaking an add it on.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
No, we haven't done that yet. And we were for
the right money.

Speaker 3 (05:47):
We're blatant. Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 2 (05:49):
They haven't paid us enough to sneak an add in
on you yet yet.

Speaker 1 (05:54):
So I go over to the Grove.

Speaker 2 (05:56):
If you are not have never visited Los Angeles or
not from around here, the Grove is like the.

Speaker 4 (06:01):
Three hours away from three hours from the heart of
Los Angeles is a mall where they basically tried to
make it if there was a small town where everyone
was obsessed with shopping, and that's what the Grove looks like.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
There's a train or a trolley or something gardens. So anyhow,
I go into j crewe try to get myself a
shirt and the guy, the first guy that says how
are you or do you want me any help? And
I'm like, no, no, leave me alone. And then he
asked me again a little bit later, and I'm like,
does he think I'm a shoplifter? I've worked retail, I

(06:38):
know what this. You're patrolling me? And then finally he
came up and he goes, what's your name? And I
go Karen, And he goes what's your last name? And
I go, what are you doing? Never tell them your
last name? And then he goes, are you from the podcast?
My fall murder and yes, and then he lost his
mind on me and he told me this is the

(07:00):
thing that got me. So, look, we are having some
nice success with this podcast. It's very, very exciting, very
it's quite bewildering, and it's just like a weird it's
just weird, yea. But I didn't think we were to
the level of people recognizing us from a podcast at
the Grove. No, that's that's The Grove is like the

(07:21):
biggest It's like the it's like tourist go there.

Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yes, it's like a big thing.

Speaker 3 (07:25):
Mario low business this show from there.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
A fucking Lopez does a show from there.

Speaker 3 (07:29):
It's a high end recognition spot.

Speaker 1 (07:31):
Definitely.

Speaker 3 (07:32):
So Trey, who is the young man who is talking
to you?

Speaker 2 (07:35):
Up? Trey?

Speaker 1 (07:36):
You think they're listening right now?

Speaker 2 (07:37):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yes, I do.

Speaker 2 (07:37):
Because what he told me was that the j crew
of the Grove listens to our podcast when they shut
down at night and have to fold down the store.
Love you, so they He couldn't believe that no one
that he closes with was there to see you.

Speaker 1 (07:51):
Think that they all think he's lying. And now this
is happening.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
Well, girl, we took a picture to prove and then
someone wrote to the Twitter page and said, I can't
believe I was an and shift when Trey met Karen
from my favorite murder, and the whole thing was just
this super cute. He was so happy. It just is
so wonderful. Yeah, we see people that excited, and well, yeah,
that was the cutest thing Stephen is that at one

(08:14):
point he was just asking me all these questions and stuff, and.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
Then at one point he goes, where's Georgia right now?

Speaker 3 (08:20):
I was just like, I honestly don't know.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
That's so cute. All right, So we're gonna do a
personal appearance. We're gonna do surprise drop in.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
Oh what a j crew close closing shift drop in
at the grove? Yeah right now, And then everyone hurts
around to the door of but we're not there.

Speaker 3 (08:37):
Where're shoplifting. I'm going to go in there and shoplift
and see if anyone says a word in my face.

Speaker 1 (08:42):
You know they won't.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
So deal with that level, Stephen. Get on this level
of fame that we're now all on.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
Stephen, You're gonna get recognized next, not me, hope. So no,
I'm waiting for someone to yell to me like there
a transaction or like a thing, and then for somebody
yell stay sexy, because like that would be That's my dream,
is that someone doesn't say they recognize me, doesn't say
listen to the podcast, but when I'm leaving our interaction,

(09:11):
our transaction or whatever the fuck a parking lot, they
yell at me. They do a shout out, and I
will fucking scream at the top of my top of
my lines, don't get.

Speaker 3 (09:20):
Murdered, will you scream sneeze at them.

Speaker 1 (09:24):
At the top of the line, at the top of
my nasal passages.

Speaker 2 (09:27):
You know. It's funny though, Like my friend Alison Agasti,
who I work with, love the shit out of She's
the greatest, uh and I work with her and I
walked into our writer's room the other day and there's like,
you know, nine people in there or whatever, and.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
She goes, I was listening to your podcast.

Speaker 2 (09:42):
And then I got all embarrassed and like shut her
down basically, and I later had to go sorry.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
I received that thanks erectly.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
I was like, it was it's that thing where like
it's super exciting and I don't want to overly be like,
let's talk about it for five minutes. Yeah, because I'm
of course, I'm so judgment all of others that I'm
positive I'm going to get that judgment.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
But well, I keep hoping my parents will then do
it and I can be like, no, it's a great,
it's a big and they don't care. Right.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
Oh, I got my sister started listening. This is a
miracle of all miracles is my sister Laura is now
a listener and constantly texting me things we need to do,
things we need to say, stuff we need to talk about.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Let's have older sister corner. Yes, how she boss the
older sisters are we should for sure.

Speaker 2 (10:29):
She had some very interesting observations about the John Benet special. Hey,
speaking of not to segue corner you right into what
we're doing. But let's take a let's take a casual,
super casual quick break.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
Did you just let me off? Oh you looked at
your middle finger while you were taking a drink. It's
very subtle.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
I actually flip people off like this where I barely
move my it's just a side fingers.

Speaker 3 (10:58):
I just very slightly middle finger up. It's more feminine.

Speaker 1 (11:02):
I just remember in elementary school, because everything got scrutinized
and everything you did was stupid to everyone. Yes, that
like the way you flip people off was made fun of. Yes,
so I just got really good at doing it correctly.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
So you do the one where it's two shorter fingers,
you don't pull all your fingers, pull, pull all your fingers, dad,
is the proper fuck you?

Speaker 1 (11:23):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Instead of this, Yeah, I don't know what that is.
This is California. It looks like a cute little bird
or something. This is nor cal fuck you where you
kind of leave your surrounding middle fingers up there like.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
They're like between the first and second knuckle.

Speaker 3 (11:35):
This is so visual that we should not be talking
through I mean in insanity.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
Let's go, let's take a casual quick break and we'll
teach each other our middle fingers, okay, and then we'll
come back. You guys ready for Jean Benet all jeanbrenet.

Speaker 3 (11:47):
All at the time, but Jean Benet time, everybody, let's
do it?

Speaker 1 (11:52):
How many?

Speaker 2 (11:54):
There needs to be a code word for when we're
not actually going to take it, because we always say
let's not take let's not do this, let's take it out, But.

Speaker 1 (12:01):
Like, when do we mean it? And when we don't Oh,
you like.

Speaker 2 (12:03):
It almost like a safety Yeah. They call that during
sex like a safe word.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
Yeah, because Stephen gets confused and he goes to write something.
And I'll not just kidding believe that, but I take
it as a challenge. Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 2 (12:14):
You we leave this all up to Stephen, and he
beautifully edits. Do you imagine if he just had to,
like the whole thing? Is this kind of insane bulk?
And then Steven's our cult leader and it's just whatever
he says.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
Good, that's right. No, I'm in the basement. I have
no basement. We're in the basement. This is like the Alamo,
and we're back. Let's make jokes and stuff and then
get into something real fucked up.

Speaker 2 (12:43):
Well, people have been continually tweeting us since, like the
ads for the Jambrenet specials started, Yeah, saying can't wait
for it to hear what you guys say about all this?

Speaker 1 (12:54):
Me too.

Speaker 2 (12:55):
Then when I want to a t voit the other night,
they were three choices.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
I have a question. Yes, do you still have TiVo
or do you just still call it that?

Speaker 2 (13:04):
I call it that, Okay, it's my that's my verb
of that because I'm dvring is stupid.

Speaker 1 (13:08):
Yeah, no, I find with the TVO where I just
didn't know if that was still a thing.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
If I had the actual brand. Yeah no, I've drapped TV. Okay,
because you must know.

Speaker 1 (13:16):
Again, no one's paying us ship for any of this
shit for fuck the ship for fuck. If they want
to give us fuck for shit, then they can market,
they can email mark this Stephens. But what's the safe word?
Screen sneeze? Just kidding, all right? So yeah, so you

(13:40):
had multiple gens. There were three.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
Choices, and then I was like, oh, I don't know
when I am met with that kind of a life challenge,
which is choose which the correct made for TV docu
series about John Beneze murders, choose your own jobine, I like,
totally turn the channel. I'm like, oh, look, Father Brown's on.
Then I just watched something, so oh, I forgot to fucking.

Speaker 1 (14:02):
Talk about how obsessed I am with our new I
want your DNA inside of me? Hector who Rommy, That's
what I was gonna say. I know I was too,
and that's why I stopped talking. And I'm like, care,
I'll get it right.

Speaker 2 (14:18):
I'm so into ram e Manuel, He's so dishonest, it's
fucking hot.

Speaker 1 (14:24):
I've been watching mister Remy Malick. Remy Mallick will talk
about it next time, but I've been obsessed speaking of
things I just don't want to deal with. And then
so I watch something as with my mister Robot.

Speaker 3 (14:33):
Oh yeah, it's a that's a great shoot.

Speaker 1 (14:35):
All right, very good show. I feel like we're desecrating
the fucking memory of Joan Benet by just not taking
it seriously.

Speaker 2 (14:41):
Look, there's no way here. First of all, if we are,
we're not the first. Because watching these specials, for me,
one of the overarching feelings was this is disgusting. It's
disgusting because they would show these pictures of her that
do that intentionally, do not look like a six year
old where you just go what the thing that I

(15:04):
was surprised that they didn't talk about in at least
the CBS one, which is the one I watched this
morning on CBS dot Com streaming had to join pay
five ninety nine for a free membership.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
What again, they're not paying us anything, as you can tell,
but the fact that Karen had to pay.

Speaker 2 (15:19):
I had to pay money, and I'm mad because I
did it. Going I just need to get this taken
care of. I'll cancel it later. I'm not going to
In five months, I will have paid them like fifty
dollars for never watching.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
And they should be paying you to talk about them
a cocky I've become, all right, So okay, when I
joked that it was a choose your own adventure, that
is actually completely correct because I tried to watch a
couple of them, and every single one of them is
so clearly with agenda yes, pregnant with agenda yes. And

(15:55):
some of them won't and I won't say who and
what won't show the photos of her as a normal child, right,
because yeah, that doesn't.

Speaker 2 (16:03):
That doesn't serve what their their their media message of
what they're talking about.

Speaker 1 (16:08):
There's a video of her that to me, and I
wrote in the thing, I wrote that, like for l
dot com.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
Can I plug it? I just suddenly felt awkward about it.
I can get used to it.

Speaker 1 (16:17):
I'm not plugging it. I'm just how fucking happy I am.
And I might cry from like how good it feels.
Because I started on live journal writing let's I'm gonna
be honest, and I didn't graduate community college.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
And you wrote two amazing articles for l dot com
that were so readable and so wonderful. They're on our
twitter feed if you need to find them.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
They're great read.

Speaker 2 (16:39):
Karen.

Speaker 1 (16:40):
That means so much coming for me because I'm you're
an incredible writer, my friend, and that means a lot
to me.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
And my sister said the same thing.

Speaker 1 (16:45):
Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
And she's a teacher who kind of can't spell. That
means a lot to me, who kind of kids she's listening,
I'm going to do stuff like.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
I would like to thank the editors of L for
making me look like I know how to punctuate shit
apostrophe ss will be the death of me. But they didn't.
They made it not seen that way anyways. Oh yeah,
in and I was like, go, everyone stop and go
look at photos of her as a normal kid. Yes,
because it's a different fucking story. And there's this video
of her that they show in slow mo of her mom.

(17:17):
It's her as a little kid. It's like a home video.
Her mom is scratching the top of her head and
she nestles her head into her mom's leg. Have you
seen this? Yeap?

Speaker 2 (17:25):
And it's just so sweet and human and reminds me
of me and my mom is a kid, and it's
it's this like goofy, sweet little girl whose mommy is
is comforting her and doing this thing she probably does
a lot, which is scratch her head. You know, we
all have this thing, very maternal, very comforting thing. Now,

(17:45):
was this before or after Patsy had dyed her hair blonde?
Because I didn't know. I didn't know when I saw
that that it was dyed. I don't know why. And
when the friend in a CBS one, when the friend
talks about seeing Joan Beney for the first time with
dyed blonde hair and Patsy being like, no, it's.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Just lying about she lied about it.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
But then I thought, if she was murdered when she
was six, she must have had that blonde hair for
at least a couple months, if not a year before,
which means someone died.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
A five year.

Speaker 2 (18:17):
Old's hair blonde bleached. I mean, bleaching your hair is disgusting.
If you've ever had your hair dyed, women know, it's
like a very gross, intense chemical process on a five
year old.

Speaker 1 (18:30):
That's crazy, just but I don't But in the pageantry circuit,
I don't think it's that weird. Which was which she
was in.

Speaker 2 (18:39):
Yes, except weird, that's my That was my point is
no one talks about that. The pageantry circuit is basically
a strange, weird commercial for pedophiles. And there's no there's
no reason you should have a six year old girl
dressed like an Atlanta Aires or hairs. Uh, there's no,

(18:59):
there's no the reason we should be seeing a little
girl basically cause playing an adult Richard.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
But I okay, here's my thing with John Benay Ramsey
and the whole case is that I will argue the
opposite of anything that's argued yes, because there's such a
huge argument because it's there's never going to be any
conclusions yes, And every single piece of evidence and I
wrote some of them down has an argument for the
other side, right exactly. And that's what I kind of
love about this is because I really don't like being like,

(19:27):
this is my opinion and here's the argument why, and
I won't listen to you in your opinion. It's like
I'm not doing that, not you, No, no, no, no no,
I mean, like any other debate that people.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Have right, no, exactly when people do, when people absolutely
decide how they feel right and won't come off of it.

Speaker 1 (19:42):
No, I totally.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
I agree that in every other way, except for it
unnerves me how normalized the pageant system is, where it's
it's only little girls. But that's the thing is that
it is normalized for certain people, including Patsy Ramsey who
was a pageant queen and they're from the South. Yes.

Speaker 3 (20:03):
True, So it.

Speaker 1 (20:03):
Wasn't that weird to her. It wasn't like she was
in her mind abusing this girl and dyeing her hair.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
It was like, I don't think it's necessarily abuse. I
just think it's a you're putting shit on a child,
a little girl long before she needs to be dealing
with it.

Speaker 1 (20:19):
Completely agrees with it. I just don't. It's just like
when people present not you, when it is presented that
there are there is proof that this is why, these
why she was murdered by the parents, and how fucked
up facings were. I just don't think they are like
a lot I agree.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
No, No, I'm not arguing that the pageants prove they
did it. I'm arguing that that dying a six year
old's hair shows very bad decision making skills and just
a weird But these are people that like. I also
didn't know they had two of their own planes. I
didn't know they were the level of rich that they are.

Speaker 1 (20:57):
If you're arguing that dying a four year old's hair
blonde is proof that this parent doesn't have the best
the child's best interest in mind, and therefore it makes
sense why she would have been part of the maybe
the murderer of the cover up. But I agree with you, Yeah, yeah,
that makes sense to me. Yeah, man, should we get

(21:19):
into this?

Speaker 3 (21:20):
Yeah, we're I tell you we're a starter.

Speaker 1 (21:24):
Should we are we starting them? Can you even hit play?
Can you delete?

Speaker 2 (21:30):
Oh? Man?

Speaker 1 (21:31):
I mean, okay, the CBS thing and here one of
the rules on our Facebook group is don't talk shit
about other podcasts. That's right, And the hosts of the
CBS show have a true crime podcast. Oh I didn't
know that. Yeah, Stephen Won you go ahad and look
that up if you don't mind. I just think, uh so,

(21:51):
I liked them a lot, and I think they had
the best interests and I don't think I think their
inte integrity based people. I just think that the moment
you are clearly going for a certain.

Speaker 3 (22:05):
What's the word agenda?

Speaker 1 (22:06):
Like agenda, you can't like the moment I saw that
John Ramsey was being interviewed for one of the documentaries,
I was like, I was out because he wouldn't agree
to do it unless the agenda was Yeah, yes, that's right.
So what did you think about Burke Ramsey's interview with
I didn't watch it.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
I watched close on Doctor Phil.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yes, I smile launch it either, But you saw that
he was smiling for me a lot of it.

Speaker 3 (22:31):
Yes, I think that Burke Ramsey might be on the spectrum.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
That's what I thought too. I don't think it's fair
to I don't think smiling is fair. Isn't isn't a
sign of any No, that's nerves. Here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
If you have been around TV or done TV, I've
watched a lot of people act super weird on TV.

Speaker 1 (22:52):
Especially. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Was that that whole thing pretaped like there was no
audience when he was talking to Doctor Phil.

Speaker 1 (22:58):
Or no audience? Yeah see.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
And I think I said this before, But the reason
I didn't watch it is because I have a friend
who is a producer on it, and she was like,
nothing came of it.

Speaker 3 (23:06):
They didn't reveal anything. So I was like, oh, it's boring.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
But then a bunch of people started tweeting at us
of like this behavior and all this different stuff.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
It was definitely weird behavior, but I don't think it
was indicative of someone who is guilty or innocent, or
you can read anything out of it.

Speaker 3 (23:22):
Is it was it weird for a person that has
two planes.

Speaker 2 (23:25):
I mean, like, this is the person that's never literally
never done an interview before in his life. No, and
probably never had to really be in the world in
a real way in his life.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
And so I think the reason this whole interview happened
is because they somehow knew that the CBS documentary was
coming out that kind of pointed towards him. So this
is like a quick, fuck, let's let's get this out
before it comes out. So he maybe didn't even want
to do it. No way did he want to do it.
He's freaked out. Oh god, oh my god, there's so

(23:57):
much to talk about.

Speaker 2 (23:58):
But he also, you know, he's already suing CBS, is
he really? That's what That's what someone told me. It
worked today because we were all talking about this morning. Yeah,
and because I said, everyone was talking about why possibly
would they have reduced it from three or four episodes too,
and I was saying it could have been a thing
where they let them do it, but they said because
they because I'm obsessed, of course with the pageant part

(24:20):
and the and any kind of the any it felt
like any They just dismissed any any kind of sexual
molestation or anything. They just dismissed it out of hand,
which seems very unlikely to me. I wrote that in
the l article that it's like, oh, yeah, I'm ripping
you off from the l arc could you not? I'm

(24:41):
going to see it was my idea.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
I'm going to see you for what's it called when
someone copies your ship? Just copying?

Speaker 2 (24:46):
Just see them make me sound smarter in that clip.
All right, Okay, here's the looking for the button, I
know your button nose. Here's the stuff I liked from
that I didn't know about from the CBS show.

Speaker 1 (25:01):
I really loved. I love handwriting and linguistic analysis. I
think it's fucking fascinated. Yeah, the fact that someone pointed
out that no one would ever write that they were
a small foreign faction. Yes, you make yourself seem bigger.
You don't seem like you're a small, little group of people. Yes,
very interesting. And also no one calls themselves foreign.

Speaker 3 (25:22):
Right exactly.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
And if you are a band getting together right now
and you don't name your smell self small foreign faction,
you're a fucking idiot.

Speaker 1 (25:30):
I'll murdia. Yeah, punk crockers, get it together. I know
that phrase.

Speaker 2 (25:35):
There was like all those things about the phrasing and
the like and as sorry if I'm jumping on this
on ours, but I was freaking out when they got
to the part where the ransom letter quotes Speed.

Speaker 3 (25:47):
I didn't know dirty hairy, dirty Harry.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
It is just like you.

Speaker 2 (25:51):
How So, if if this is Patsy and John and
they're covering up you know the one theory that they
were really shoving in your face on the CBS one,
If that was true, then oh, they really think that
they're so much smarter than everybody else that they can
add in lines from the movie Speed and have nobody

(26:14):
catch on.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
They actually do okay really quick. Stephen was like brought
his phone or me to show me a thing that
I'd asked him, and I completely forgot what I had
asked him, So I was like, what is he? I
don't remember what I'm okay, The podcast that the hosts
of the CBS show do is Real Crime Profile, which
I've listened to. It's a great podcast. Yes, I agree.
Let's you know what, Let's okay, so let's start. Be
ready to start. Let's what is your theory like overall? Like,

(26:39):
what's your favorite theory? Oh? I think that I think
it was Burke. Okay, how do we think? I think
Burke got angry and didn't I don't think he meant
to do it.

Speaker 2 (26:53):
No, I don't either. I don't think I think he
wanted to hurt her. I think that, But a lot
of the stuff that they need that was like, oh,
you know, God forbid that he do this or that
is all stuff little kids do. Brothers and sisters especially
are really mean and vicious with each other. So like
a lot of that stuff didn't freak me out because
it's like, yeah, yeah, you hit your brother or sister

(27:15):
with a piece of train track or whatever. My sister
and I used to I've talked about it before getting
getting into fights where you're being beaten with a remote
control and shit.

Speaker 1 (27:23):
The first thing I got punched in the stomach was
when I was like five by my sister. Yeah, like that.

Speaker 2 (27:29):
Standard thing because you as a kid, you don't know
how strong you are, you don't know how much it hurts, and.

Speaker 1 (27:33):
You're angry and you have no parental supervision.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (27:36):
I wrote an article that met our friend Katsullen, her
brother bears her childhood teeth mark scar on his body
because they were so angry that they did that. You
just get angry at people.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
But and also it's the thing of if he did that,
and he was super angry, and it does make sense
that she's the little princess that gets all.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Of the mom's attention and he was older.

Speaker 2 (28:02):
It would have been different if he was younger, but
he's older, so he was used to having all of
her attention and not got kind of redirected, which is
very painful and awful if you already was having a
little bit of like developmental or if there's just some
issue with like he's a little slow, or he's a
little bit emotionally off, whatever it is.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
Yeah, which which a lot of things I read say
he was a little bit of a weird kid, which
I mean I grew up with a weird kid.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
I understand that they're weird. Yeah, yes, that does. Let
mean they're Yeah, here's the thing. My sister said. She
texted me and said, the thing with the feces is
really bad. That's usually a sign of sexual molestage.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
Now the wedding, the bed thing, so John Benet wet
her bed regularly, they said, Burke might have too. That
to me is hard because what my bed like when
I should I did do? I sucked my thumb until
like second grade. I was never molested, right, So it's
you can't just say that definitively no.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
But the shit thing, shit is a much bigger deal
because even when you're little, you don't it's not natural
to like it was as if they were saying, and
I don't know any more than what they presented on that,
but it was as if they were saying, he would
shit on her stuff or he would like wipe shit places.
And my sister has been a grammar school teacher for

(29:24):
over twenty years, and she has a master's degree and
like in developmental education or whatever. I'm not exactly sure,
but you fix that, fix her degree, But essentially, this
is what she does and deals with kids a lot
that are going through this, and she was just.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
Like, that's bad.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
That's that's the worst thing she heard in the whole
thing was anytime a kid has like got his hands
and shit and he's not a baby, Well, she had.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
This is the thing they revealed in the CBS thing
is that she had a great fruit sized shit in
her bed. Right. That sounds painful and fucked up and
not normal.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
No, like he was collecting it or no, that she
just saved having to go to that She was so
uncomfortable going to the bathroom that she waited until she
was in bed.

Speaker 4 (30:15):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (30:16):
I thought I thought he put it there from what oh,
because they said the maid found it right, And I
was thinking that he was like trying to wreck her
shit because the.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
Other stuff make her look like a gross Yes, can
I say that? Like I kind of I feel bad
for Burke in this whole thing. It's very bad. And
then I read something, you know, I made everyone on
our Facebook group and send us their theories and send
us what they found that was interesting in their thoughts
and everything, and one of them was that Burke actually

(30:46):
doesn't even know that he doesn't know that he caused
that blow. He might have done it, and they were like,
go to bed and he doesn't remember it. He may
be somewhere deep down does, but he doesn't know that
he put that whole thing into Actually, I feel bad
for this kid who clearly has some iss.

Speaker 2 (31:05):
I think he knows something though, because remember that interview
he has with the cop and he won't say the cops, yeah,
what's in the bowl?

Speaker 3 (31:11):
And he just won't say it, like he.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
Goes, he goes. Oh. So in the CBS documentary they
show clips which is like, I could watch this for
hours of uh of Burke being interviewed by a psychologist
or social worker post like when he was a kid.
The only time they was two times they let him
be questioned, and in it, you know, they're talking and

(31:34):
I actually, it's amazing. They show him a photo of
the table, the crime scene table, which has a bowl
of pineapple out with Burke's fingerprints on it and in
Joan Benet's stomach after she died as an undigested piece
of pineapple. And so the social worker, the psychologist shows

(31:54):
Burke a photo of the pineapple and says what is this?
Shows him the bowl of pineapple and he says, I
don't know. It looks like cereal or something. And he says, well,
what could that be and then Burke goes, oh, like
he knows not to say. Yeah it is.

Speaker 2 (32:09):
Yes, that's weird, but it's like a you know, a
little kid thinking he's out smarting someone. Yeah, and there's
this you're watching from this camera overhead. He also is
in a very weird physical position in that chair.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
He's very word physically, he's very antsy in a weird way.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
But he gets down on all fours when he's looking
at that picture, and I understand it's like a kid's way,
like almost like child's pose. But to me in that situation,
it gave me the creeps, like it was just weird.

Speaker 3 (32:40):
He was he wasn't.

Speaker 2 (32:41):
He was very silted in his voice, but he looked
incredibly comfortable.

Speaker 3 (32:45):
It was almost chill.

Speaker 1 (32:46):
He was chill. It was weird. How do we okay? So,
like my theory in my mind, the mastermind of this
whole fucking entire thing, which is that Burke unknowingly hit
her over the head or throw a flashlight through. So
someone mentioned maybe he didn't actually like hit her, maybe
he threw this flashlight at her. Yeah, and this happened,

(33:09):
and it was staged. In my mind, the mastermind of
the whole thing is not Patsy, who was bringing who
is just being thrown out of the bus, fucking completely
in this whole thing. It's someone who's still alive, and
so I'm scared to it's John Ramsy. It's John Ramsey.
I really think John Ramsey is the fucking entire mastermind
because and another thing I was thinking too, is that

(33:31):
like their interviews post right after what happened are creepy
and fucking weird. The CNN interview, Yeah, like all of
their like them calling the press to give an interview,
and you had mentioned it before that when someone asks
to ask Patsy, who's clearly on fucking valum.

Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yes, she's on so many pills.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, They ask her, do you think it was an
outside intruder? And she's shaking her head and no with
her eyes closed, and the minute John says yes, she
starts to nod yes, yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:59):
She goes into weird circle and then tries to like yeah,
but she also does her She's doing a lot of
like long blinking yep, and it's almost like she just
doesn't want to she just wants to disappear.

Speaker 1 (34:10):
Well, here's what I think. Okay, I definitely think Patsy
wrote the note, the ransom letter. It's not a fucking note, No,
it's a four page I think Berg accidentally hit her.
I think they conspired to cover it up, maybe with
with John being the mastermind. I think he took her downstairs,
Jean Manet's body downstairs, to you know, make it staged

(34:33):
as a kidnapping. And I don't think Patsy realized the
extent of how he covered it up. I think she
thought he'd put a pillow over her face. She thought
she would be suffocated. But when Patsy found out the
extent of what he did to her body, I think
then she and she still had to go with it. Yeah.

(34:55):
I think that that's why she was so freaked out
by it. I don't think she was like, do you
know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (35:01):
Yes, And that's a horrible idea, like just that you
would be put in that position as a mother.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:07):
The one that gives me more comfort because it's so
much less tragic, And it's based on that nine one
one dispatcher who suddenly was under a gag order for
years and never talked to anything.

Speaker 1 (35:19):
No one ever tried to interview her.

Speaker 3 (35:20):
But here's the thing, that's weird to me.

Speaker 2 (35:21):
No one ever tried to interview her, and she wasn't
under a gag order. So when was the gag order
lifted that she can be talking on that.

Speaker 1 (35:28):
I don't think it ever was. I think she was
just like, she's for it. I think once they exonerated
the Ramseys, it was just gone. Well.

Speaker 2 (35:37):
What was interesting to me is she said that that
moment where Patsy thought she hung up the phone, okay,
I never knew about that. That either that Patsy makes
this niem on one call, which I didn't listen. Of course,
snippets here and there. I cannot listen to it.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
It's horrifying.

Speaker 3 (35:49):
Well, and especially because it's it's bad acting.

Speaker 2 (35:52):
I from that alone, if you just made me guess
off the NIE one one call, I'd say they're they're
complicit in some way. But that Patsy thinks she hangs
the phone up, and then they're recording what's happening in
their kitchen, and the nine one one operator is on
the line listening and trying to listen, okay, And the thing, well,

(36:14):
just the one thing that that nine one one operator
said was her tone. Once she was like so hysterical
and get someone here, get someone here, who were you
hang up the phone right when your child is missing
and that's your lifeline. Hanging up the phone is crazy.
And then b her vocal tone changes immediately to the
point where that's what gave that nine dispatch her the

(36:34):
creeps because.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
Because she's hysterical, she's freaking out. She's not answering that
n any one dispatchers questions. The minute she says who
are you, she clearly says I'm She clearly states her
name everything, I'm the mother, and clearly gives an answer. Yes.

Speaker 2 (36:52):
Suddenly the hysteria isn't so out of control. And it's
true that.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
I like this in the CBS documentary where they said
you don't hang up on a night.

Speaker 3 (37:00):
Call, No, no one does.

Speaker 1 (37:01):
No one hangs up it's your lifeline.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
That was the coolest part.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
I mean, I understand.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
Look, this is just like Jack the Ripper, where there's
so many experts now yeah, and there's so many, so
many theories that it's just out of control.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
It's never gonna I don't think it'll ever be solved.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
I don't know unless there's some something gets dug up,
like literally, or you know some hidden thing.

Speaker 1 (37:21):
I didn't. I don't hear what they I didn't hear.
At the end of the nine on one call, the
hang up what is purported to be said by who,
by anyone in the family. I believe the nine to
one operator when she says I heard I thought I
heard Patsy say I called I called nine. I called
the police. Now, yeah, that sounds that sounds more believable

(37:46):
to me than when they when they did the whole
gammick of slowing down the nine on one call and
slowing down people heard in the background and whose voice is, who's.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
You hear what you want to hear? Yes, that's very true.
And also that part was ludicrous because well it was
just TV. I mean, that's the part where I was
just sitting there going, oh, they're really trying to stretch
this out. I bet you when they cut that other
stuff in the other episodes, they had to go back
and like fill time or something, because that was so ludicrous.
First of all, every sound editor in the world would

(38:14):
watch that and just be like, these are the people
I hate working with. You don't have to tell me
that we need to go back and reduce the noise
because clearly. That's until you can hear what people are saying.
We have to keep on trying to clarify the clip. Yeah,
like the idea that they were sitting next to that
man going bring this dome or bring this up, where
it's just like, yeah, the guy actually knows how to
use the machine.

Speaker 1 (38:34):
And the moment someone tells you what they're hearing, you
hear it too. Of course, even if it's not there.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
And especially with something like this where it's like, oh,
you're hearing Patsy Ramsey's voice, you're hearing John Ramsey's voice.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
I just said, yeah. But at the same time, what
they're arguing by hearing Brooke Ramsey's voice at the end
of that is that he wasn't in bed. And I
have a lot of problems with the idea that he
was in bed through that whole time, because A, why
when you just found out that your child is kidnapped
and gone, would you let your other child be somewhere else?

(39:09):
You would grab the other child and make sure they're
by your fucking side.

Speaker 3 (39:12):
That's the first thing you would do, the first.

Speaker 1 (39:13):
Thing you would do. Yes, why didn't he get out
of bed when he heard his mom flipping the fuck
out to see what was going on. What was wrong?

Speaker 2 (39:20):
Well, what he said in those interviews is he's a
real deep sleeper all the time, always right. He's using
words like I'm always always, I never hear anything.

Speaker 3 (39:28):
I'm always a deep sleeper.

Speaker 2 (39:30):
Okay, correct, Yeah, So that's why would they lie about that?

Speaker 3 (39:35):
Because they're lying because the whole thing is bullshit.

Speaker 2 (39:38):
And I mean that kind of thing where like the
nin'm on one dispatcher heard things that even if she
didn't hear exact words, like she was talking about the
vocal tone change, so she knows that Patsy thought the
phone was hung up and suddenly the act was dropped,
and that's what she was hearing.

Speaker 3 (39:56):
Maybe she got the words wrong or right, we don't know.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
But like that in and of itself, also when Burke goes,
what did you find that little quote? Which you can
hear pretty clearly, but it's like it's such a weird
little voice, like he's you don't heard. It doesn't sound scared,
he doesn't sound upset. He sounds like someone that's going
through that with not a lot of worship. Okay, so
what about Okay, why would let's say that they all

(40:22):
had something to do with it.

Speaker 1 (40:23):
She wrote the nine one one, I mean the ransom letter.
Why would they call nine one one immediately without getting
rid of the body in the morning, Like, why wouldn't
they Why wouldn't he have taken the body out and
disposed of it?

Speaker 2 (40:41):
I mean, who the fuck knows? Because I think it's
because it's still their daughter. So they're not going to
leave their daughter a garbage dump. They're not going to
stick her in a dumpster or hide her under a
log or something paint brush up her.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
But they didn't.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
I don't think they did that if they didn't talk
about that in the CBS thing.

Speaker 3 (40:59):
But I don't why why would he do that?

Speaker 1 (41:03):
But it was?

Speaker 2 (41:03):
But there From what I can tell, problem with this
case too, is that there's so many things I've heard about,
For example, that there was a book turned, there was
a dictionary in someone's study turned to the word incest.
The only place I've ever seen that is in you know,
forums of people writing about the case.

Speaker 1 (41:22):
I've never seen that in a actual you know, crime
scene write up.

Speaker 3 (41:29):
Yeah, that sounds like something a seventh grade girl would say.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Yeah, there's so much shit, And there was a book
open on the desk. You guys, there was so much shit.
There is so much shit that I'm like, well, I
heard this thing was what they found, but it's not
in the autopsy report, So why would it.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
Because it's like weird gossip because people start talking about
stuff like this and suddenly it takes on a life
of its own. But here's the thing I thought, when
they were going over all those crimes, the crime scene footage,
who the fuck sees that their son killed their daughter
by hitting around the head with a flashlight, takes that flashlight,
sticks it on the kitchen counter and leaves it there.

(42:06):
That's the thing that you would dump and get rid of.
And that's the thing that baffled I kept saying, is
this picture from earlier where they just know for a
fact they own this flash light here.

Speaker 1 (42:17):
But okay, well I'm gonna immediately argue the other way,
do it because I can, and I like it. Yes,
you're fucking freaking out. You had to start a ransom
note twice three times because you're freaking out. You don't
think to move this one piece. I just don't think
you think everything through. And there's no plot on it,

(42:38):
as they showed by having the fucking most fucked up
kid in the world hit a goddamn mannekin with pigskin
and a wig.

Speaker 2 (42:45):
All of that was like, all of that, I say,
shame on you a CBS, because that was not necessary.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
It was super creepy.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
He looked like a little child actor, but his eyes
were a bit wild. The whole thing of that was growth.

Speaker 1 (42:57):
Honestly, that whole time, I felt so bad for the
hosts because I was you can tell that. The producer
was like, you have to fucking do this, Y, and
both the hosts were like, I'm a fucking journalist, I'm
a fucking like we're.

Speaker 3 (43:11):
Trying to Y.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yeah, we're and you need this clip.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
The lighter version of that is the cop that volunteered
to get tased twice.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
I wish the kid had done it.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
A six foot cop who was two hundred pounds is
being tased to show what it might have been like
for Jean Beneit, which is like, sorry, none of this
equates that.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
That and when they were in a parking lot and
the hosts were gonna go speak to the ramsays that
couldn't be recorded, and there was a whole like five
minutes of that of them waiting around in the parking
lot for the host to come back and talk about unnecessary.
The whole thing was unnecessary.

Speaker 2 (43:50):
It was they were I think they were trying to
be verite, but it was also they're like, so we've
got this insane interview that we've been waiting for. But
the guys like, not on camera, but I'll tell you
what I know. Yeah, you just can't record it. So
they need to They need the what do you call
it like, They need the authenticity of the fact that

(44:10):
they got this huge get that legitimate, Like this is
legitimate because we're actually speaking to them. It also shows
to me, as a person that's worked in TV for
a long time, the run and gun style where you
have to make up solutions on the fly. And if
you are thinking it would be cool to work in TV,
just go and look at Eddie Schmidt, the producer of

(44:32):
the show, standing in the Safeway parking lot watching all
the beautiful SUVs drive away while he stands there with
the cameraman.

Speaker 1 (44:39):
For four and a half hours, probably waiting.

Speaker 2 (44:41):
Yeah, they ate a bunch of Safeway donuts and just
kicked it, waiting to find out what happened.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
Because that's what it's really like. And you know what, Okay,
here's a fucking thing. Maybe they did talk to the
fucking Whites on camera, and the Whites said the same
thing they always say, very fucking you know, bullet pointed,
and it wasn't as interesting, and so they said, let's
pretend like they wouldn't speak to us. Yes, that a thing.

Speaker 2 (45:06):
Well, yeah, because the thing that I was shocked by.
Another piece of information was that fleet White wrote an
open letter telling John Ramsey you need to cooperate with
the police totally.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
That's crazy. They were.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
The Whites came over the morning of the murder. They
were the groups of people.

Speaker 1 (45:24):
All after the phony nine on one call.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
And fleet White was with John Ramsey when he found
John Banne's box.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
I wonder if those two people feel used as fuck.

Speaker 2 (45:33):
Well they were, they were, because that's another thing they
talked about is that's a very common thing, invite someone
in to witness you finding the body. You don't find
the body alone. If you've done it, you bring people
into witness.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
Yeah. That was fucking fascinating.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
Yes, there's a lot of like if you choose to
look at it through this one angle, right, which I
think we should do the opposite in a minute too.

Speaker 1 (45:59):
I think we should look at it for an entry
ter angle.

Speaker 2 (46:01):
But in that way a man who has two planes.
First of all, a sidebar for people for millionaires. A
millionaire's house is kind of a shitty house.

Speaker 1 (46:12):
Like there was.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
It was clearly pre the declutter trend of the mid
two thousands because there was so much shit everywhere, and
it was like there was like fake autumn leaves that
were plastic in a drawer that was hanging down from
the top of a like shelving system. It was like, what, sorry,
you're rich, what is this house? And when they went
to like open Jambannes's bedroom door, there were all those

(46:35):
hand marks on the outside. Did you see there was
like a finger marks or like kids grabbing the door.
It just was like it was weird to me. And
this whole time, when they say her body was found
in the wine cellar, yeah, I'm picturing a wine.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
Set now, that was the most depressing creepy room I've
ever seen it.

Speaker 2 (46:50):
It was the cement room where they threw old shit
and maybe kept some wine. I don't know, but like it.
The whole thing was there was a lot of cognitive dissonance.

Speaker 1 (46:59):
Can tell you. When they were doing the like walkthrough
of it, I was thinking, I watch a shit ton
of agh TV, and the whole time I was like, well,
you take down this wall and you'd open the basement
up so it could be like a man cave and
it'd have an open concept thing, and the spiral staircase
is so dated and unnecessary. Like the whole time I
was like thinking of the property brothers being like, you

(47:19):
take the fucking.

Speaker 2 (47:20):
Wall down, the spiral staircase, it looks like something that
would be in my hometown, in a house that was
left over from nineteen sixty five. Like it is so
weird and tacky, and like if you've ever gone down
one of those metals spiral staircases in a house, that's
so it feels like you're gonna die there, You're.

Speaker 1 (47:37):
Gonna fall fucking face forward into the other the bar
that's on the next spiral.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
It's so weird that whole part. But I guess my
point actually was super rich people like that that are
kind of there.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
They're the people.

Speaker 2 (47:50):
They don't even fly first class, they don't fly commercial
at all.

Speaker 1 (47:54):
Oh wait, they get their own fun.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
They have private plane they're private plane rich.

Speaker 2 (47:58):
These are people who think they can get away with
whatever because they already are up above the fray.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
They are not.

Speaker 3 (48:05):
Anywhere near Judy and Johnny Lunch.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
How crazy is it that she was twenty one years
old when they got married.

Speaker 3 (48:11):
Yeah, and he'd already had a whole family.

Speaker 1 (48:13):
He was what then? I think he was like sixteen
years older than her. That means he was like in
his mid late thirties. Yeah, twenty one year old girl
that he marries. Yeah, I mean we've all met twenty
one year olds. They're fucking idiots.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
Yeah, even that seems uncommon these days, Like twenty one
is a bit of a throwback.

Speaker 1 (48:33):
So he marries this trophy wife. They have a trophy daughter,
man and the third place son. All right. There else
was likely terrible. I liked that it was told that
seventy six percent of the ransom note was bullshit, erroneous.

Speaker 2 (48:50):
Yeah, too much. All you needed was these four lines
they're selling. They kept saying the phrase they're selling.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
They're selling it that there wasn't There didn't need to
be blood from the blow to the head, even though
they showed it in the worst way possible. That that
was interesting. Also, so you get you see this ransom
note letter, it says, don't call the fucking cops or
will behead your daughter multiple times. Yes, the first thing
they'd do is call the cops. Yes, why is that.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
Even if because they wrote the letter, and yeah, it's
not actually gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
Even if the letter wasn't even if they didn't do
it and the letter was found, they still made so
many mistakes and it was still a fake ransom note
no matter. That's what's so hard about it is, no
matter what, it was a fake ransom note. Yes, that's
one hundred percent. So it's hard to be like, who
wrote this ransom note? You can't be like, but it

(49:46):
was a fake ransom note. So the parents didn't know
the ransom note was fake no matter what.

Speaker 2 (49:50):
Yes, there's no small foreign faction, no kid, and the
kid was already dead in.

Speaker 1 (49:55):
The basement, right, So it's not like and you clearly
didn't bring this. If the ransom note had been brought
in and then she was found dead, it would have
been like, oh, they meant to kidnap, permit it didn't happen, right.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
Also, the point they made very early, and that is
like to me. The proof of almost everything is you
don't kidnap a six year old girl out of a
millionaire's house and ask for one hundred thousand dollars. That's
the dumbest fucking part of it, where it's like you
have a living child, it's millions. You ask for millions,
and you know this person's a millionaire. They talk about him,

(50:28):
they talk about him as if they know him so personally.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
Well, they say a couple things in it. They say
that that get it out of your account, so they
know that that's how much that he has at least
that in his account. Not get the fucking money, no
matter what you can do. The other thing is get
a big enough quote at tashay case, who gives a
shit what size bag? You know, get a brown paper bag.
You don't need to tell this person that get this

(50:51):
much money. Period.

Speaker 2 (50:53):
Yes, well that's yeah, that's clearly someone just having.

Speaker 1 (50:58):
Thinking way too hard about this and also believing their
own shit.

Speaker 2 (51:02):
Like that's that thing where instead of having this self
consciousness to go is this believable or whatever, it was
just like sit down and have creative writing session.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
Yeah, and saying get some rest, you're gonna this is
gonna be complicated.

Speaker 2 (51:16):
It's like she okay, let's just say it was Patsy
writing this thing.

Speaker 1 (51:19):
She sat down at it, she started out. But he
might have been dictating.

Speaker 3 (51:23):
He could have been dictating. Let's not her handwrite.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
She was a journalist major too, so she knows how
to write. Yes, could go on, Sorry.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
No, no, no, But it is just that idea of
like you get started, you're already got the adrenaline running
some insane shit, you're you're in a surreal place anyway,
then you just start kind of going for it where
it's you're quoting speed.

Speaker 1 (51:43):
Yeah, you're like, here's this she does, the girl does.
Here's what people who have seen too many movies about
it think that a ransom letter is written.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
What about just can we skip to the part where
they interviewed the gardener and he talked about Patsy Ramsey
coming out to talk about the OJ.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
Verdict.

Speaker 2 (52:04):
That part I was like, I don't care what else
happens in this thing. The idea that there's a first
person person eyewitnessed talking about Patsy Ramsey's reaction to OJ,
which is.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
That you can get away with murder in America.

Speaker 2 (52:18):
Yes, but there was also just it was that, but
then it was also just the general kind of mashup
of like this is like pop culture gone mad on
my TV right now.

Speaker 1 (52:28):
It's interesting how much the oj the Simpsons had to
do with this murt like how much they were affected
by each other. And you know, I was reading some
of the movie quotes and how similar they were. And
there were also people online who are fucking brilliant, interesting
people who say, here's when this movie showed in Boulder,

(52:49):
like near the date of her murder, like the night
before one of the one of the movies was played
on TV. Oh my god, you know, November twenty ninth,
this movie was played on TV in Boulder.

Speaker 2 (53:02):
It's really fucking interesting. That's the ship, like that really is.
It's the wave of the future. It's people armchair detective
who are going to solve the big stuff totally, because
that's the kind of stuff that you know, like if
cops and all those cops that talk like that one
investigator that quit because he was like this is disgusting.

(53:25):
Loved seeing him young and then seeing him interviewed. He
was hot stuff, super fucking hot. He was hot.

Speaker 3 (53:32):
And also just his like burning sense of justice was delicious.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
Oh my god, and he wants him to I want
him to win.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
Yeah, And it's that thing of like, well, he quits,
so then nothing goes forward. But then it's like yeah,
but or he stays and goes insane or takes the
fall or it or.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
Is or hates himself for the rest of his life
because he didn't do the right, He didn't do anything right.
Quitting sometimes is like the only way you can show
how passionate you are about something.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
Right. It's a state, it's a real political statement. And
if he was told this has become a political situation,
then he has to be political too. You just have
to play on the on the playing field.

Speaker 1 (54:10):
Well, that them saying that everyone indict everyone voted to
indict the Ramseys for having some hand in jombine dying,
and the fucking police chief just being like no, thanks
giving a news conference that they're not doing it now.

Speaker 2 (54:32):
One of the very first last Podcast on the Left
episodes I listened to on your recommendation was their John
Benet Ramsy Is.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
It two part that? Yeah? Last podcast and Lass has
a two part shambin a Ramsey episode that's very fucking incredible.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
So thoroughly researched. It's so awesome.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
But one of the to me, most fascinating parts was
them talking about how John Ramsey is a millionaire because
he's got this computer programming company or some computer something company,
but that they don't really know what it does. It
has a government contract, I believe, they said, and he
makes millions of dollars a year, but they can't really

(55:10):
figure out.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
What he does.

Speaker 2 (55:12):
We got to ask mister robot, that's all right, he's
coming back. The robot gotta shut him down.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
And then we gotta go to Rama Manuel and be.

Speaker 2 (55:19):
Like, what the fuck are you doing later this happens,
and are you doing later?

Speaker 3 (55:24):
But I just thought that was it.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
I love that theory because I love there there is
some bigger thing at work keeping the District Attorney of
Boulder underneath John Ramsey's thumb. Why does he have that
much power? Aside from just money, there's got Boulder mail.

Speaker 1 (55:41):
Since, I mean, this is so dumb, but since watching
mister robot hacking emails seems like a very easy thing
to do, hacking fucking internet searches. You have some shit
on someone, and.

Speaker 3 (55:55):
Oh so you think he did that to them?

Speaker 1 (55:57):
I just was baby. Maybe they have some shit on
the fucking chief of police, you know emails. I mean,
let's go to the fucking obvious child pornography anything.

Speaker 3 (56:09):
Yeah, and he knows about it before even the police
would know.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
Sure's you. That's fascinating.

Speaker 2 (56:15):
I liked how they jumped straight to Patsy is an
mk ultra robot.

Speaker 1 (56:21):
Yeah, I just well, I wrote let's go back to
my l article. I wrote in it that how beautiful
would it be if it was mk ultra or if
it was God damn it.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
Steven need the moment I said mk ultra, Stephen's phone
started barking, and it's like the mk ultra the government's
trying to shut us. Yeah, we're talking about it.

Speaker 1 (56:46):
Stephen, you're fired.

Speaker 3 (56:47):
Steve Stephen, you're rehired at a higher rate.

Speaker 1 (56:52):
Elvis, you're in. Yeah. I would love it if it
were that simple, that interesting and interesting and not awful.
But the reality is, like parents kill their children more
than strangers kill their children or kill people's children.

Speaker 2 (57:10):
Yes, it's always from the family. That's the first place
they look for a reason. It's usually an inside job,
and it's also the darkest choice. So it's the biggest
bummer that most people don't want to look at at all.

Speaker 1 (57:22):
I know, because that's anybody. It's horrible. Yeah, I think,
I mean go, it's hard to find them. Actually I
was looking for them today. But the initial press interviews
with John Ramsey, which you can see in the CBSTOC
are cold and creepy.

Speaker 3 (57:39):
Yeah, he's a real creeper.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
I don't think that that necessarily, Like as people have
said about many people in this series, like, I think
we're just learning now how people grieve, what they look
like when they're under pressure, and all this stuff.

Speaker 1 (57:54):
And you know, I agree with that all completely, but
this is fucking goodbye. Let's move on.

Speaker 3 (58:00):
Yes, it's it's very.

Speaker 2 (58:04):
It's so telling once you relook at it and like
under aside from thinking exactly who did it or exactly
what the situation was, I just know that like my father,
Like if you're talking about someone who just died, you
even if you're a man and a strong man and

(58:24):
you were in a war, you whatever, Yeah, you're your child,
you would get choked up. You just that's your the
words are coming out of your mouth and you're listening
to them. If you have a total disconnect, then you're
then you give a great press conference.

Speaker 1 (58:38):
Can I say, let me let's impart a personal part
of this because people fucking love that. But when I
was like thirteen and on drugs and like a really
bad kid, and one night I just didn't come home
and my sister had dropped me off somewhere and I
just went out with my fucking punk rock friends and
my parents called the police and we're freaking out. And

(58:59):
my brother later said to me, like, the next when
I finally came home and I've just been on drugs
all night, was like and neither with my dad. He said,
I heard Dad in the other room weeping, weeping, and
my Dad's not like that, right, And I fucking that
was one of the things that made me stop doing drugs. Yeah,
So the thought of my dad weeping at me just
not being home, right. So the fact that he's just

(59:22):
I mean, I know we all react differently, yes, but
the reaction his fucking demeanor is.

Speaker 3 (59:31):
Cold cold, It's incredibly doesilt put.

Speaker 1 (59:34):
His arm around his wife who's crying.

Speaker 2 (59:36):
No, there's a real, like he has a real be
of a bank manager feel to him, where he's letting
you know your house is getting foreclothes.

Speaker 1 (59:44):
Yeah, and I and I don't have I have shut
myself off from other people's emotions for so long that
I just don't care well.

Speaker 2 (59:52):
And also like he's in business mode where this is
an emergency all the like emergency cord got pulled, and
now that's the mode he's in, and he's completely like
compartmentalized all all of everything.

Speaker 1 (01:00:04):
The emergency garrot got pulled.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
Oh dude, that thing is such a bummer.

Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
I think he was in the Navy and he worked
for a small foreign faction in the Philippines. Is that true?
And their SBTC it has something to do with the navy?
Is that true?

Speaker 3 (01:00:28):
It's victory is signing things?

Speaker 2 (01:00:30):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
I wrote a thing is signing things?

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
Victory with an exclamation because that's so stupid. Here's okay,
although I am changing my email signature, do you dare me?

Speaker 3 (01:00:41):
Am I doing it right?

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
Oh? Do it?

Speaker 1 (01:00:42):
Okay? So I read victory. I wrote a bunch of
shit of like, I read a bunch of mostly the
comments on people's blog posts about what it was. We're
fucking more interesting than the blog post. One of them
was it was on websloths. Someone said, on your phone,
keep had the number corresponds with three or four letters.

(01:01:02):
Look for SBTC. The numbers are seven two eight two
seven two eight two corresponds with PA TC pat C.
Don't underestimate us, John, use that good Southern common sense
of yours. It's up to you now, John. Victory for

(01:01:23):
pat C, I know, but what is that? Victory for Patsy? Patsy?

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
So maybe Patsy? I mean, I know it's her, but
I'm how.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
I don't know it's it's so it's one of those Yeah,
isn't that interesting?

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
Yes, it is, has nothing to do with it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:38):
Well, Also, that's a really good that's a really good
way to make up a code. Total.

Speaker 1 (01:01:43):
Let's do it right now, I mean, tick one?

Speaker 3 (01:01:45):
What's your name?

Speaker 1 (01:01:46):
Hard kill? Hard kill? Hard kill? All right? Here, let
me write I wrote like a bunch of fucking thoughts. Uh,
why sign a ransom note? To begin with?

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
Right?

Speaker 3 (01:01:54):
Nobody signs a ransom No one expects you to put
your name on there?

Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
Now? Did you know? There were also a should do
a quick like, let's do the side of it was
an intruder because there's a lot of them. Okay, let's
do it. There were thirty eight registered sex offenders living
within two miles of the house in Bolder. Yes, that's
a lot. That's a lot in Bold or small. John
Benay had been to the pediatrician. Pediatrician over the last

(01:02:20):
three years of her life twenty seven times. That's a lot.
That's too many. That's too many. Wait, was Patsy some
kind of weird? She might have had munch much as
boy for sure. Yeah, that's what that says to me. Okay.
If Patsy had nothing to do with any of it,
and John did, it makes sense that she's the one

(01:02:42):
to like who if someone makes the panic nine one
one call, the other person is telling them not to
read the note it says not to call. Yes, so
one way or the other, you know what I mean.
Like she's being manipulated, right, Yeah. I think Patsy was
manipulated this whole time. Maybe she knew some things and
so she could tell the truth.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
Yes, I think that's what it looked like in Natzienna
in her interview where she's got pale eyes and she's
going I love my daughter with her eyes closed close.

Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
Yeah, yeah there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
I think that she maybe knew some of it and
agreed to it and didn't realize the extent of her
husband's fucking awfulness, but also that idea that she would
be telling she she said, if we live in Bolder,
which she said the phrase if we live in Bolder,
which I wrote down, don't they live in Bolder?

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
I would, I would tell everyone in Bolder if we
live in Bolder, And she says, I tell my friends.
So it's this like weird thing of like, who are
you telling?

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
Yes, and she's saying there's a killer out there, hold
your baby's tight.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
But the idea that.

Speaker 2 (01:03:47):
That's a given, yeah, Like you don't have to underline
that if you are this morning mother, who as.

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
If she didn't because she was very protective of her children.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
Yeah, oh, you said in your elerta, you said the
thing about we have to stop using the word pants.

Speaker 1 (01:04:02):
Oh can we not?

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
It's so true. But you know what I thought of
is Henry Lee. Doctor Henry Lee has such a thick accent.

Speaker 1 (01:04:10):
Yeah, I bet you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
The word underwear was hard for him to say in
much in the same way that I would not be
able to say anything in any dialect of Chinese, and
I would have to keep it pretty like clear and basic.

Speaker 1 (01:04:23):
That's what I thought of.

Speaker 2 (01:04:24):
Is like, I bet penty is easier to hear than
any kind of real.

Speaker 1 (01:04:28):
I do feel bad. I felt that that whole time
that he needed that he that they thought he needed
to be subtitled.

Speaker 3 (01:04:35):
He did need to be did he? Yes, one hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (01:04:38):
I never knew what he was saying because I was
I was doing stuff around the kitchen.

Speaker 1 (01:04:42):
Then I would have to turn and.

Speaker 3 (01:04:43):
Look, Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
I always feel bad for people who get subtitled who
don't really need to.

Speaker 1 (01:04:47):
I think it's like a it's like nagging them. It is.

Speaker 2 (01:04:51):
It feels, well, that's very American. I think that's like
it feels like, on the surface shameful. But the first
thing I thought of was if I were in China,
I wouldn't be subtitled. I wouldn't be appearing because I
cannot speak and I can. I have a little bit
of high school French, yeah, but only about five Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Then instead of trying to speak in French, you would
be like, can you just fucking subtitle my english Man? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
Yeah, yeah, I'm just gonna talk, and then you subtitle
all of it because yeah, and I mean that guy. Also,
on top of that, I was like, I was gonna
say that thing about the panties, and then I'm like, wait,
is that racist?

Speaker 3 (01:05:28):
Is that problematic or whatever?

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
And then I'm like, this man is such a famous
and prolific and legendary forensic pathology.

Speaker 1 (01:05:36):
If you don't watch true crime shit, you wouldn't know
that doctor Lee, Henry Lee, is someone that we all
fucking admire. He's everyone. The minute he's in on it,
you're like, oh, this is legit.

Speaker 3 (01:05:47):
And also he has a building.

Speaker 2 (01:05:49):
They went to his building with his name on the
front of it to talk about some of that DNA stuff,
So like, there's no sweat off Henry Lay's back in
any way.

Speaker 1 (01:05:58):
Absolutely not. Yeah, and he's not gonna He's also not
going to bullshit. He's not going to be paid to
do a show with his opinion no, because they need
a certain opinion. He's not gonna lie.

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
No. I feel like all of those scientists really were
there because this thing is fucked and we need to
look at it and at least just organize the paperwork.

Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
At the very least, I agree this show is great.
I wish we could see the last unaired portion of I.

Speaker 3 (01:06:27):
Want to know what they cut out.

Speaker 1 (01:06:28):
I think we expect everyone over by not showing that.

Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
But I wonder if it was stuff that the berg
Ramsey's lawyers were like, go ahead and er it will
own CBS in a year.

Speaker 1 (01:06:38):
What I was thinking is that the four.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
Biasment docuseries before it covered so much of it already
that they didn't were like, you know what, we don't
need to add this maybe except for well, I have
to see the other ones to know, but I don't know.
I mean, because their whole thing was like, we're going
to discover all the stuff on it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:06:59):
Werner, oh god, I love him has a straight up
Peaky Blinders haircut. If you watch Peaky Blinders, that's the
same hair. This second I saw him, I was like,
oh my god.

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
Love him. Picture him and Henry Lee put in a
house together and they just there's.

Speaker 3 (01:07:18):
When people stop being polite and start being real.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
Like that is my dream. And then like there's just
like they just get like every morning they wake up
and it's instead of Tyra Male, it's like a fucking
corpse and they have to figure out what happened to him.
Tyra Male it's a corpse. Oh my god, how great
would that be?

Speaker 2 (01:07:37):
I mean, we should just start our own network I
feel like because also Warner spits guesting on Peaky Blinders.

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
Oh gorgeous.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
He could be the German Irish guy that comes in
and just point some stuff out.

Speaker 1 (01:07:55):
Listen, Emmy's next year, We're there, sure winning all of that.

Speaker 2 (01:08:00):
We'll go down to the shrine and stand around near
that Burger care.

Speaker 1 (01:08:04):
I'll get a fucking rent the runway dress. Yeah, the
whole thing actually made me.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
It made me think of like all of those other
cases where people the more people talk about it, the
more people hear bullshit, the more like you know, like
the we talked about the John Mark Carr theory where
he had confessed to being her killer while he was
in Malaysia somewhere to get out, to get out of
being in jail because he's child's molester who had gotten

(01:08:35):
arrested for I think child sex tourism and knew that
if he went to jail there he would just die
in a pit somewhere. And so he confessed to killing
John Benet and then was extra And when he was
extradited and everyone was talking about it, my sister gets
a phone call from our childhood friend.

Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
I didn't tell you this, you did, but I don't remember,
and she goes, oh.

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
My god, see that guy on the news right now.
That's the guy from my church group I've been complaining about.
And apparently Carr lived in Pedaluma and was in my
sister's friends church group and was the guy that everyone's like,
I want to cancel a church group next week. I
feel so weird, like he was creeping people out and
super weird, super like super just bad vibe suspicious. And

(01:09:22):
then I mean, how like satisfying would that be? And
then you see him like basically confessing to the murder
of Dombini Rams and minute I see him, like you
know when there's like the clips or the trailers to
a jambinet fucking you know, docuseries, and I see him,
I'm like, oh, this isn't legit.

Speaker 1 (01:09:39):
No, I don't want to hear about him. No, no, no,
he has nothing to do with it aside from sensationalism.

Speaker 2 (01:09:45):
He should just get a big Red Herring costume, because
that's all he is. Should be all right, I'm gonna
read a couple of things. Felicia said she did some
digging last night and feel super confident about the Burke
theory she'd learned some things she hadn't before. Okay, this
is interesting. There was a fourteen year old girl that
was sexually molested by an intruder about nine months after

(01:10:05):
Jean Binet was murdered, very close to the Ramsey home.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
Quote. Amy was sexually assaulted in her bed by an
intruder that they believed was lying in wait for four
to six hours before the attack while they were all asleep.
He was never caught and the Boulder police disregarded the
mother's suggestion that he could have been the killer of
Jean Mainey. Amy and John Maine Ramsey attended the same
dance studio. Ow a lot of Okay, So the fact

(01:10:32):
that they had a walk through of their Christmas decorated house,
the Ramseys, Yeah, what was it a couple of days
before the murder?

Speaker 3 (01:10:40):
What was it like a public walk through?

Speaker 1 (01:10:42):
Yeah? Oh, I like you know, like when you do
like a haunted house. Yeah, yeah, Halloween. So there, And
the theory is that while the Ramses were at a
Christmas party that night, someone fucking came in broken, knew,
someone who had a key got in and hid and waited.

Speaker 3 (01:11:00):
Yeah, totally possible.

Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
And then they're like, depending on what side do you
want to argue either the window in the basement had
no leaves where someone scooted in, or had an undisturbed
spider web. Yeah, where that would have been disturbed if
someone had scooted in. Like everyone who has a fucking
definitive answer about this needs to stop it, because there's

(01:11:25):
not one no.

Speaker 2 (01:11:26):
And that's that's the crazy the cobweb one watching them
on that one show going In and Out, where I
was just like, yeah, but then there's the one time
where you don't touch it at all and because you're
really skinny because you're on match or this or that,
like you're careful one billion, yes, exactly. The thing that
I was thought was very suspicious was they the first

(01:11:48):
of all, they're these millionaires, they have two planes, but
they have a broken windowpane in their basement and they
don't fix it. Like I'm the most irresponsible person in
the world. And when I broke my kitchen window, I
fixed it within three days. Yeah, because it's your house. Yeah,
and it's an open window, like it's unsafe, it's glass.
And then there was some somewhere in that where the

(01:12:10):
John Ramsay said that they left it like that because
he locked himself out a lot, right, which is insane.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
He actually had admitted to that being his fault.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
I thought was very weird, super weird because to me,
it's like, oh, are you trying to justify if there's
some latent print somewhere, because it does get a high
to key. There's one million things, especially as a millionaire,
they crop do, Yeah, buy a second fucking house, Like
there's all these things you could do instead of breaking
a window and leaving it that way.

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
I thought it was really like there's some things that
to me were like, well, if you want to argue
this thing this way, you say this. If you want
to argue with you, Like there's things like like the
taser marks. If you want it to be an intruder,
it's taser marks. If you don't want it to be
an intruder, it's train track spurks, toy train track marks. Yes,

(01:13:03):
every piece of evidence can be argued either way you
fucking wanted to be argued.

Speaker 2 (01:13:07):
I did think it was interesting when they argued the
taser that tasers don't put you to sleep. They actually
like get your adrenaline going and like zap.

Speaker 1 (01:13:14):
You and make you screen much awake.

Speaker 2 (01:13:16):
Yeah, that's an interesting thing, I think, And I think
that that could point to shoddy the super shoddy police
work of that. These as weird assumptions where it's like
they were they were actually measuring it and being like, yeah,
this doesn't even fit a taser shape, it doesn't.

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
I think the thing for me, all right, let's let's
do our big conclusion. Great, I think, because I'm so tired.
I'm so tired too. Let's do the thing between between
I think the ransom letter and the nine one one
call and what happened between when the cops came and

(01:13:55):
her body was found put down and then oh, I think.

Speaker 2 (01:14:00):
Those all over the houses my neighbors and friends and
picked up DNA all over the carpet, and I think
those things are the most telling more than anything else
in the Pineapple. But also and I think those things
all point to it inside job.

Speaker 1 (01:14:17):
And it makes more sense to me that one of
the three people aside from John and A in that
house that night had something to do with it more
than a stranger or someone else outside of it. Yeah,
it just makes more sense, it does. I Mean.

Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
The thing that's maddening I guess is that could be
a little bit of everything. Yeah, it could be an
intruder who opened that window and saw the suitcase in
the room and put it there because he was like,
I'm going to go get that little girl and take
her out the way. There's all these things that it
could be a little piece of each. But yes, I

(01:14:59):
agree and leave that the the ransom note is a
lie and it's a fabrication, and the nine woman calls bullshit.
I don't bo, I don't buy her level it's acting
and it's not good acting. And then the fact that
that mag light flashlight fits the whole in Chompone's head

(01:15:23):
perfectly is devastating like proof that, or at least devastating
too much, But it's that thing of like then you
I just it suddenly made sense of like she did
yet another irritating thing to him, and he grabbed something
nearby threw it out her, or like ran behind her

(01:15:45):
and cracked.

Speaker 3 (01:15:45):
Her without me knowing, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
You don't have to be like, you know, crazy the
good sun evil child to make a terrible mistake to me.

Speaker 1 (01:15:55):
Patsy and Burke are Patsy's and John's the puppy.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
Yeah, ego, Well, he's going to take care of business
like this the worst case scenario thing happened.

Speaker 3 (01:16:11):
Yeah, and yeah, he's going to fix it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:13):
And did you know that? So out of all the they did,
I really liked the when they take apart the ransom
note and look letter by letter of who matches So,
oh god, where'd it go? So all these people were
get my notes from under my cat? Oh god, where

(01:16:36):
to go? Well, a hundred people they're they're writing, their
handwriting was compared to the ransom note. Everyone was cleared,
and everyone keeps saying like, well, Patsy Ramsey was inconclusive.
Out of the one hundred people, hers was the only
one that wasn't cleared. Yeah, that was quote inconclusive. Yeah.

(01:16:59):
She also wrote out the words one hundred and eighteen
thousand dollars instead of the numbers. Yeah. Yes, nobody fucking does. No,
one doesn't when asked to rewrite the ransom note. She
did that. But I also I just I have so
much sympathy for her.

Speaker 2 (01:17:15):
Well, yeah, the idea that she would she would know
that her child was murdered and then have to be
a part of the cover up, have to be the.

Speaker 1 (01:17:23):
Voice of the cover up, the grieving mother.

Speaker 2 (01:17:26):
And so then balance those feelings of you actually really
did lose your child, but now in the name just say,
if it's the book, in the name of your other child,
you have to continue on and do this thing.

Speaker 1 (01:17:38):
Yeah, that's a sickening proposition, especially when you're someone who
appearances mean so much. Never you and I don't give
a fuck. I'm sitting fucking spread eagle right now with
shorts and I don't give a shit.

Speaker 2 (01:17:49):
My roots need to be dyed so bad that strangers
laugh at me on the street. And yeah, to be
wrapped up in that world, that trapping of it is
its own pageantry. It's an adult version of that of
look at my home. Now there are balls of shit
in my daughter's bed, look at my son put there.

Speaker 1 (01:18:09):
But children, please look at my Christmas tree. And you're
still winning. You're still gonna win the crown if you're
the fucking best at it. That's right. It's just different insanity.

Speaker 2 (01:18:20):
Also, there was that one quote where a little girl
and it's the woman that was interviewed, I call her
the wine friend that said I was I was, you know,
turned out cast out from that friendship where I was like, yeah,
because you talk to fucking reporters and you clearly, just
like ran blabbing the second you could. But she said
that her daughter had gone up to John Banney's room

(01:18:41):
at her one time and was looking at all the
trophies and said, what are these? And she said, I
just won those, but they're really my mom's. Yeah, thinking,
first of all, I don't buy that that actually happened.
That's not like some I don't like an anecdote someone
would write on Twitter about their brilliant child because it's
such an old soul kind of thing, knowing that's like
her comventing on her the reality of her own life

(01:19:04):
in a way, as if she's not a part of it,
to say, yes, my mother's very wrapped up in my career.
Talk about this on CBS when I'm dead. Yeah, it
doesn't make sense for a six year old. Maybe if
she was eight or I mean, who knows.

Speaker 1 (01:19:17):
Everyone wants to make their kids seem like an old soul,
but really they're just fucking they screamed. They're the fucking lot.

Speaker 2 (01:19:23):
They're new souls to everybody else in the restaurant when
you're child screaming, so shut it. Oh no, was that
enough Jean Benet talk for everybody?

Speaker 1 (01:19:35):
I think it was a lot. I think I'm done
talking about this anymore.

Speaker 2 (01:19:39):
Yeah, unless there's new information, Yeah, I would be interested
in new information. But I feel like we've just hit
a peek, a true zenith of Jean Benet reporting and
and also just THO, it's this thing of everybody going
true crime is so hot, right, yeah, true crime or whatever,
where it's just like, yeah, but we don't need to
keep talking at the same thing over over.

Speaker 1 (01:20:00):
The amount of research I've done on this person that
I this case said I'm really very interested in, and
I feel a lot of fucking sadness and pain for
that the victim. I feel like, I like, keep fucking
searching it and getting into it and talking about it.
I'm just I'm not I'm desecrating her fucking memory. And
I just I can't keep looking at fucking autopsy photos.

Speaker 3 (01:20:24):
No, it's also it's not good for your brain.

Speaker 2 (01:20:26):
No, like it's not it's you're not related, you don't
work on it, you don't put yourself through it. I
saw a picture on Twitter moments this morning because there
was nothing I was. I was up at like six
and there was nothing going on Twitter, so I went
I made the grave mistake of touching the moment's button
and seeing what the story was doing the thing and
it said something about John Binney. But the picture was
one where I was like, is this Angelina Joe Lee?

(01:20:48):
Like her mouth is open and her head is tipped back,
and she's got all kinds of fucking makeup on, and
her hair's brushed away from her head so you can
see like her tall forehead and she truly looks like
she's twenty and it is such a sexual picture. And
that's the picture Twitter Moments chose to use as the
Champney headline picture. Not the cute one Nope, where she's
got the little bangs and the little hat and she

(01:21:10):
just looks like she's on vacation. It was like she
might as well have been like grabbing her own neck.
It was such a sexual, like perfume commercial.

Speaker 1 (01:21:17):
Let's stop doing this. It's stop it. It's gross to her.

Speaker 2 (01:21:22):
It's not gonna stop though, because it's it's there's it's
so fucking salacious and it's so mysterious.

Speaker 1 (01:21:28):
She is a sweet she We're gonna file her away
as a sweet baby angle and she will be in
and your you're in mine. And my favorite murderer's hearts,
and we feel awful and wish it would be solved,
but it's not. It's just not. There's not.

Speaker 2 (01:21:44):
Even if it gets solid, people are gonna say it's
a fucking conspiracy, right, Yeah, Keep keep your babies close,
and keep your foreign factions even closer, and the punk
rock band and stay sexy and don't get murdered.

Speaker 1 (01:22:03):
Elvis want to

Speaker 2 (01:22:03):
Cookie, Cookie Cookie, good boy,