September 9, 2025 • 36 mins
From rock ’n’ roll dreams to sacred sound, Krishna Das’s story is one of redemption and renewal. Known as the “chant master of American yoga,” KD has touched millions through kirtan—a practice of music, devotion, and letting go.
Joined by his longtime collaborator Nina Rao, he sits down with hosts Martin Luther King III, Arndrea Waters King, Marc Kielburger, and Craig Kielburger to share how music, devotion, and service became the foundation of his life.
Together, they reveal how:
- Letting go is a daily practice that builds real strength
- Music can transform pain into connection
- Service and love are inseparable
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I was addicted to cocaine, previous cocaine. I didn't save myself.
I couldn't.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
He was a rock musician searching for meaning. Then a
chance encounter in India set him on a path he
never expected.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
I always felt I was missing something. It was peace
missing and I was always looking for that.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Somehow Krishna Das found a new kind of stage and
a new way to heal himself and the world.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Attributed to a miracle and the ability to keep letting
go and coming back home. If we let ourselves be
destroyed by what's going on in the outside world, what
good will read?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Anybody?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Join host Martin Luther King the Third, Andrea Waters, King,
Mark Kilberger, and Craig Kilberger for a conversation about starting over,
finding your purpose, and the wisdom learned along the way.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
You promised me now you would give up cocaine from
that moment to this man, and.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I was like, welcome to my legacy. Today, we're honored
to sit down with an extraordinary guest who has spent
most of his adult life sharing the transformational power of
chanting with the world. Krishna Das. Now your friends call
you KD and your biggest fans call you kt Is
(01:17):
it all right if we call you Katie?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
No problem?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Well it was very kind because you've got four fans,
and you've got two super fans if I can call
him out, especially you got Andrea and you got Mark,
who would fly anywhere to hear you perform. Katie is
known as the chant Master of American yoga, bringing the
ancient practice of Kurtan to global audiences and helping countless
(01:39):
people find solace and connection through music. He has recorded
seventeen albums, performed on some of the world's biggest stages,
and even earned a Grammy nomination for his work. Now,
as our listeners and viewers know, what makes conversations on
my legacy unexpected and unique is we don't just hear
from extraordinary individuals. We also hear from the people people
(02:00):
who know them best. Kadie, would you start off please
by introducing your guest Nina and sharing what makes her
such an important part of your life and your work.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
For sure?
Speaker 1 (02:10):
You know, without Nina, I just be home watching TV.
You know that's the truth. Nina's she makes it possible
me for me to get out there and do what
I have to do. We met a long time ago,
and then she invited me out to lunch and I said,
we're going to spend a lot of time together. We're
going to be together for a long time. And since
(02:31):
that day it's been full time. Really, she's extraordinary, not
only I mean, she sings better than me, and she
studies chanting and the real Indian tradition. You know, I'm
kind of New York via Long Island Indian tradition. She's
(02:52):
got the real stuff. I call her up when I
wake up in the morning where am I? And she
tells me so literally and figurably literally. I travel so
much sometimes I can't even find the bathroom in the
hotel room.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
You know, we understand the hands.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Katie.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
You mentioned a moment ago India via Long Island. That's
rather a unique journey. And in my legacy we talk
about people's origin, what made them who they are, And
so I'm curious, can you reflect back a little bit
on your childhood in Long Island and any of the
early indications that you would become the extraordinary Krishna Das.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
First of all, I don't see myself as the extraordinary Chrishnads.
There was always something missing in my life In fact,
I go out to dinner maybe once a month with
some of my old high school friends, and there's a
couple of people that usually dominate the conversation, both lawyers,
by the way, they weren't there that night. So one
of the women said to me, you know, I've known
(03:54):
now since you know, nineteen sixties.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
She said, so, why did you go to India? I said, I.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Went, WHOA, somebody's actually asking me a real question here.
So I said, well, you know, I always felt I
was missing something, there was a piece missing, and I
was always looking for that somehow. And she said, oh,
I never felt that. And that just broke my heart
because I saw that, you know, whatever it was that
(04:21):
was pulling me and leading me in my life, and
she didn't have that. And what it is is, I
think the recognition that there is something to find, something
deeper in life than what appears on the outside, in
the surface. And some of us have finished the journey
and others of us are like on the way. But
(04:42):
that's our requirement, is that longing and I always had that.
Speaker 6 (04:46):
You actually were the head of a rock band, right,
the Blue Oyster Cult.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
It was a bunch of high school kids from Stonybrook,
where I was at school, and a friend of mine
they met a friend who was a little older, and
they started, you know, smoking, and they started to want
that they wanted to have a band, so they needed
a singer. So he invited me to come play with them,
and we hung out for a while. But they were
too young and too stupid, and I was too old
(05:14):
and too stupid, so we went in different directions directions.
A few years later, they had become fairly well known
as the Soft White Underbelly. It was the sixties, you know,
and I had met Ramdas who just lit my life
up in a new direction. But I went back to school.
(05:35):
On my way up to see him to live with him.
We went to a Jimmy Hendricks concert Wow. And after
the concert we were hanging around and the manager of
the band said, you know, the guy.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Who replaced you.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
We have a whole recording, but the guy who replaced
you can't sing. Come back cut the vocal tracks.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
We have the tour.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
And this was my dream, you know, this was being
handed to me. But I had tripped and fallen in
something much deeper, much more fulfilling, And and that was
when I met Ramdas.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
So I just said.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Nah, and but look, but look look at now what
do I do?
Speaker 3 (06:21):
Right?
Speaker 1 (06:22):
I travel around, I sing to people just so like
I always wanted to do it, and I can do
it sitting down.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
I don't have to like work out all the time.
Speaker 5 (06:29):
And I must say, you are rock star.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
You're here.
Speaker 7 (06:32):
Well, Nina, I can't stress how incredible and Christians, how
meaningful these conversations for all of us, including me. The
first thing we wake up in the morning is listen
to your music. In the evening, listen to your music.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (06:46):
I get emotional just thinking of your music because you
and your music, and Nina, by definition, you and your
entire presence, your music connects me to consciousness. You were
talking about relationship with Ramdas and just how amazing that was,
how much it had an impact on you. You know Ramdas
(07:07):
of Courts For those who don't know, Harvard trained psychologist
wrote that seminar book here now, spiritual leader, can you
take us back to those days and what was that
relationship like and how did you guys become friends and
how did he have an impact in your life?
Speaker 1 (07:23):
Well, you know, when I walked into the room where
Ramdas is sitting, I felt this spacious, wide presence like
the sky, you know, and from that moment on there
was a part of me that was always aware of that.
You know, like we walked down the street, we don't
even know, we forget this guy's there, but this guy
(07:44):
is so vast and everything's inside of that. You know,
nothing can be outside of that space. And then when
I went to India and actually got to the temple
where the Baba lived, it was confusing at first because
how did that all fit in there in that body?
You know, it was this little guy wrapped in a blanket.
You know, it's very hard for us, in our lives,
(08:06):
in our relationships, in our interactions with the world and
everybody in it, to trust in the goodness of people,
even if they don't know it, even if they don't
feel it. You know, we all have that place within
us that is pure beauty and pure love and pure goodness.
And being in India with the Baba, my heart just
(08:29):
developed this feeling of trust in that situation and that
allowed it to relax and let go of a lot
of the programs that are always running, you know, telling
us we're not enough if we need this, this one.
We want this, we don't want this, we're afraid of this.
We like this, you know, the stuff that kind of
rules us and limits us. So being in that presence,
(08:52):
with that being it was the beginning of braining really
to let go. Which, by the way, what happens when
we chanted the way I share the chanting is the
way I do it. You sing, and then when you
notice you're not paying attention, you sing. That's the whole thing.
Nothing else is required. And because when we let go
(09:14):
of the stuff that pulls us out of ourselves, we
fall into that deeper place of goodness and love and
kindness and compassion and all that.
Speaker 7 (09:24):
Your Guru used to say, let everyone serve everyone, and
remember God, how do you do that every day?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Well, I wish I listened to me more. There's a
funny story. So one day he was very angry and
he came to the temple and when he walked in,
the guy who he hated the most handed him a
plate of food because we're being fed across the courtyard
with maharajis sitting there watching the seat, and he took
(09:54):
the food and he threw in the guy's face right
in front of Maharadi, mahar goes something wrong, come here,
Rumdas goes and sits down my heart. He says, what's wrong?
And Ramda says, I can't stand impurity and myself or
in others right, so my heart. He looks round us
(10:14):
up and down a few times and he says, I
don't see the impurity, and Rhymers just broke out crying.
Right my heart. He says, round us, love everyone and
tell the truth. So Ramda said, the truth is I
don't love everyone. My heard you lean in a little
(10:35):
closer and said, Rumdas, love everyone and tell the truth.
And that became his the star that he followed his
whole life. And you know, he had a catastrophic stroke
and he lived for over twenty years in a wheelchair.
But he used to say to me, the stroke saved
my life. Why was that because he had there was
(10:57):
stuff that he couldn't get to inside that was driving him,
making him unhappy, causing suffering, and he just wasn't able
to get to it. But once the stroke happened, he
had no option. He had to be with it and
he had to surrender to it. He couldn't change what
(11:18):
was happening, so he had to find a way to
live with the situation and not let it destroy him.
And that idea of loving everyone and telling the truth.
When those two things finally came together for him, when
you were with him, all you felt was their love
(11:39):
and everyone was in it, and which is so unusual
for a Westerner. We don't think, we don't in a sense,
you could say he became like a saint.
Speaker 8 (11:48):
You know, Oh, Nina, your grandfather, I believe or you
or introduced you to chant it. Can you talk about
him and how that experience occurred.
Speaker 9 (12:02):
So we grew up outside of India a lot. My
father traveled for his work and we would go back
to visit my grandfather in a small village on the
coast of India where he was retired. But in his
home was a harmonium and he started singing this prayer
to Ganesha, who's one of our deities that I worshiped
(12:25):
in India. And it was done in the most natural,
beautiful way. He said, I'm going to sing this line
and you repeat. That was it, and it felt natural.
Everybody came. Later that evening, people in the village came
and sang in what we call satsang where everybody comes
together in community and does practice. But the way it's
(12:48):
done in India is it's not really an event. It's
just something that happens on a regular basis in people's
homes in temples. And that's how I was first introduced
to it and really stayed with me because I didn't
do it much after that. My father, my grandfather passed
away until I met Krishnadas without knowing and I had
(13:09):
no idea who he was. I didn't know what was
going to happen. I actually thought I was going to
leave the yoga retreat because I saw somebody and I thought,
oh my gosh, this is going to be a westerner
or a failed Indian musician. I don't I think it's
going to be terrible.
Speaker 5 (13:23):
I really read all this.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
She knew me right away.
Speaker 9 (13:27):
And I had never seen him before. And when he
walked in, you know, I thought this is worse than
a failed Indian musician. But as soon as he sat
down and he started home, I moved from the back
of the room to the front of the room, not
knowing how, and you know, three hours later, there I was,
(13:48):
and in some ways I never left. That was my connection,
and I said, it was just the most amazing thing
this retreat. And they said, you know, he sings every
week at this Yuga studio And I said really, And
they gave me the tape and I put it in
my car and I didn't stop listening to it until
basically the tape broke wow, and I found out that
(14:12):
he was singing at the yoga studio every Monday. And
we connected, we became friends, and he would pick me up,
remember going down FDR Drive and those daisy cheese and
so we would go and get nachos. I just felt
I wanted to support him in whatever way. There was
no business to manage in those days.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
There was no business.
Speaker 9 (14:34):
There was no business, but he did need a drummer,
and I learned one beat.
Speaker 6 (14:40):
So can you explain what is unique about the type
of chanting that you do, Kirton, and how can it
speak to our hearts?
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Well, you know, as Westerners, we have a hard time
believing there's anything beyond Mickey Mouse, you know, you know,
because I was living a culture that doesn't really support
that so much. So even though I've kind of absorbed
all this from India, when I'm also Western, when I sing,
(15:12):
I don't ask myself to try to make anything happen.
I simply keep coming back to the sound of the mantra,
these are the names of God. And I find that
this practice brains me to let go of the stuff
that holds me down, that weighs me down, you know,
the shadows in our own hearts, and the ability to
(15:34):
keep letting go and coming back home for a second,
letting go, coming back. This is a brings the inner
strength that actually helps you overcome just about anything. It's
an inner strength that you get from these practices. And
if we want to love everyone, serve everyone, and remember,
if we want to do that, we need some strength
to do that because this world, especially these days, doesn't
(15:59):
support that kind of thing easily. So each one of
us has to be find a way to connect to
that deeper place.
Speaker 6 (16:06):
And it's interesting because for me, for many years I
worked monitoring hate groups and hate crimes such as the
klu klutz Klan and neo Nazis and skinheads, and one
of the things that I had in my office was
that we must never become like that which we're fighting against,
which is a quote by Belle Hooks. It was my
(16:27):
north star, and so it's one thing to have that,
you know, on your wall, but I also had to
find a way of looking at such topics, and we
also would monitor hate crimes, and so I had to
find a way to continually to make sure that I
would not become like that which we were standing against. Sure,
(16:48):
and one way.
Speaker 5 (16:49):
That I did that was through your music.
Speaker 6 (16:52):
So at night, you know, after kind of being in
that world all day, I would come and put the
CD on and you know, find a way I would
begin my day and also end my day as a
way to clear out the energy and radiate, you know,
to be for something rather than against. And so for
all of those years of that, I thank you.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
What It's true, that's that's what the power of chanting is,
and it comes from an ancient spiritual tradition, and it
connects us with that place within us that's deeper than
all that other stuff. Gives us a chance to take
a breath in a deeper place and be able to
let go of all the reactions and the stuff we
(17:32):
have to deal with every day, all the inside and
outside of us.
Speaker 6 (17:36):
You know, are there any other types of music that
both of you tend to listen to and enjoy. That
also brings like for me, obviously, I love your music.
I love gospel music. It brings me to that same place.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
Oh well, you know when I'm really messed up, I
have to listen to it. Charles, especially America the Beautiful
Boy if you want to, you know, how can you
bear that?
Speaker 3 (18:00):
It's so beautiful?
Speaker 9 (18:01):
That's a good song for now.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Yeah, but you know, just.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Growing up in the sixties with rock and roll, it's
still a place where I go back to a lot.
And the weirdest thing is now on Facebook because of
the way I my likes, you know, I'm getting to
see I just saw The Stones, you know, from nineteen
sixty five, you know, well, a black and white video
of the Stones. This is the music that changed my
(18:28):
life at that time.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
If you were creating your playlist, besides Criton, who would
be on Ray Charleston.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
Richarles, well, you know Ray, Charles, Van Morrison, Steely Dan
what they were friends of mine. Tibetan chanting is I
really listened to a lot of Tibetan. There's an incredible
lama who lives in Paris, actually teaches in French at
Tibetan actually it's Bhutanese and they made a CD which
really was I listened to it for years nothing else
(18:58):
than that for years on the Lama's Chant.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Actually it's fantastic.
Speaker 4 (19:02):
Hell for all of our social followers, they're going to
be putting out the Rolling Stones Van Morrison and the
Tibetan Chance.
Speaker 5 (19:09):
I just love that combination.
Speaker 10 (19:12):
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Speaker 5 (19:30):
Now back to my legacy.
Speaker 7 (19:32):
Now, Prist, you have gone through this path, but equally
you've had some struggles along the way, especially upon the
passing of your Guru, and how challenging that was for you,
and if I'm not mistaken, having to even numb yourself
with drugs at some points during that process. How did
you overcome that? And what advice do you have for
people who are in that depth of challenge to find
(19:54):
a sense of purpose and hope in such challenging times.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
People ask me a lot I get a lot of
questions about addiction. Because I was addicted to cocaine, freebase
cocaine for two years. I don't know what to tell you.
I was saved. I didn't save myself. I couldn't. I
was out of here.
Speaker 7 (20:12):
What do you mean by I was saved?
Speaker 3 (20:14):
I couldn't save myself.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Well, for instance, I had, I had become addicted to cocaine.
And my Indian father, with whose family I lived many
for a long time in India, came to America to visit
the Westerners. Actually it was in Canada first, so I
flew from California, the state of my father's apartment. I
(20:38):
was up all night smoking freebase. Next morning, I get
on the plane and I fly to Montreal. I get
a car. I drive out to the country where he
was staying. I walked into the house and they say, oh,
he's sitting he's upstairs. So I walked up the stairs
and I saw him sitting in a room talking to somebody,
his backwards to the door. As I got towards the door,
(21:02):
I stopped and I started to back away. I don't
know what I was feeling, but I I didn't want
to go in that room. And at that point, he
literally he had his back to the door. He turned
and he pointed to me and goes, you promise me, now,
you would give up cocaine? Promise me now.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
I just looked at him.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I said, okay, I couldn't say no to him.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
I wouldn't. I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
It was too much a low man. I just said, okay,
from that moment to this moment, not even the thought
about it. And you know what that's like, I mean,
addicting his addiction. And I wouldn't have been able to
do it myself.
Speaker 7 (21:48):
Well, what do you attribute that to his love?
Speaker 3 (21:51):
I would attribute to.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
A miracle? Andy, What else can you say? I wouldn't
be here. My mother was an alcoholic, although she was
cleaned the last twenty years. But I didn't have it.
I didn't have the wiring to live this long, and they,
for whatever reason, it was like, okay, let the kid live.
(22:18):
You know, I don't know why, but here I am.
Speaker 7 (22:21):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
I wish I could give you some advice, but I can't.
Speaker 7 (22:26):
So, Nita, I'm fascinated you've said that you're todd or
chanting is a way to clean the mirror of your heart.
What do you mean by that and how have you
been able to do that.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Through your work.
Speaker 9 (22:35):
One of the main practices that actually learned from Krishna Das,
even though it's something that's been going on in India for
a long time, is a chant called the Hanuman Chaalisa.
And there's something in the power of the mantra, the
chant itself. The word mantra comes from Man and tra
mone means mind, but it's the heart mind. It's not
(22:59):
necessarily the is where thoughts are, but it's a place
where understanding takes place, where we in our heart and
our brain come together. Thra is a tool or an
instrument of or for the mind. It's a way in
which to also create new thought patterns in our mind.
They call it navashabda samskaras. So we're born with thought
(23:23):
patterns and I don't know where they come from, but
they come and go. But how do we not get
pulled away by that? So it's almost a purifying process
in the hearing and the repetition of these words and names.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
And the idea is that when we look out at
the world, what do we see? We see our likes
and dislikes, our preferences. We see what we're afraid of,
we see what we want, We see all these things.
It's colored. It's a subjective view, which everybody has their
own subjective view. These practices, and what that is. You're
(23:58):
looking in a mirror that's covered in dust. What you
see is the dust. So when we look out there,
what we're seeing is the dust, which is our stuff.
So through these practices, that dust is polished off the mirror,
and then when you look in the mirror, you see
what's true. And then what's true, of course, is that
oneness of all of us, and even the people we
(24:21):
don't like are just as much divine as we are,
but we don't see that because we're stuck in our reactions.
So these practices and letting go, like coming back when
you're chanting, just letting go, coming back, letting go, coming back,
that is cleaning the mirror of our hearts so that
we experience directly real love, real love that doesn't come
(24:42):
and go, that you don't get from somewhere, that you
don't fall in or fall out of. But that's our
true nature. And then when you see that in yourself,
you see it everywhere, and then we you know, are
you going to be bad to your foot? Everybody's a
part of the one body, you know, so why would
you do anything to hurt anyone? If you've seen that,
(25:05):
That's when India is really you know, Eastern spirituality is
much more about that oneness, love everyone and tell the truth.
Speaker 11 (25:16):
I think we as humans all hopefully derive inspiration from somewhere,
and I can often look to my dad and the
prophetic messages that he had that even to this day,
even though they met, delivered over fifty years ago, they
are still relevant to this moment. Where do you derive
(25:38):
your inspiration for the work that you're consistently doing throughout
our planet?
Speaker 1 (25:43):
For me, it's the Guru, you know, It's nothing was
real in my life until I met him, and then
being in the presence of these incredible beings in India,
His devote, these his families, how they lived with such
devotion to truth, devotion to to treating everyone as family,
(26:03):
you know, and the way we were accepted. And we
were a bunch of idiots, you know, we didn't know
how to how to get down the street, you know,
and they were so kind to us and so loving
and so supportive. I saw him treat everyone with love
and affection. Miracles that fell off of him, you know,
just like rainwater off. It was amazing just to watch that,
(26:27):
but it was all in the service of helping people.
And we're leaving stuff.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Man, Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might
tap that button and stay connected to conversations that count.
Now back to my legacy, Chris Us.
Speaker 7 (26:45):
I was wondering, how were you bestowed that name Krishnanadas
servants of Krishna and what was that experience like for you?
Speaker 1 (26:51):
Well, I told you about rummed Us. Rummed Us had
a Volkswagen bus in India and we were driving and around.
We drive to the temple every day from the town
with maybe sixteen seventeen eighteen people in this litt Volkswagen
bus hanging off the top, on the roof, off the back,
and it was making such a scene that I think
Mahaji snapped his fingers and the bus broke down. But
(27:15):
before that he says, Ramdas you're a saint, you shouldn't drive.
Give him the keys. So I got the keys to
the bus and I got my first name, which was driver.
For about a year I was driver, right, So I thought,
I wrote in my diary. One night, I said, well,
everybody else, is you know this or that? Colleague? Does
(27:37):
you know Ramdas? This dos Baga Vanda you know? And
I guess I'll be driver. Not so bad. The next
day I get to the temple and I get called
into my Horji's room and he looks me. He says
Argin Nick Krishna, Nick Krishna Das. And I said, Krishna Das, I'm.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
A rum kind of guy. I'm a Hanuman guy. What Krishna?
Speaker 1 (27:58):
And he laughed, He said this, okay, it's okay. Honeyman
with a monkey. God is Honeyman the perfect servant of love?
Is that Honaman served Christian too? It's okay, okay.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
It's interesting because it feels that you both have talked
about how an Indian particular spirituality is infused into everything,
and I find that certainly throughout the East as well.
You know, it is different than in the West, and
so also the chanting and kretan it also Mark said,
it connects him with consciousness. It connects me with sacred
(28:32):
to remember the sacredness which we you know, So it's
that reconnecting with that part of us that we don't
get as much of in this in this part of
the world.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
It's the mother of the world really, I mean, it's
so many of the traditions come from that earth in India,
you know. And they actually say that the earth itself,
the ground, supports spiritual awareness. It's just something in the
magnets ism or the vibration of the earth there that
(29:05):
makes it easier for saints to live there. Wow, it's
just the holy place. I mean, not just because there's
been thousands and thousands and thousands of years of seekers
wandering around looking for that that love all the time,
you know, so it has an effect on the place.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
One of the things that I'm struck by this conversation
is the remembrance of the connection between India and the
civil rights movement. I was thinking about ram Das and
it hit his girl. When you think about the fact
that Martin Luther King Junior found such inspiration in Mahatma's
Gandhi and utilize that technology in order to transform our
(29:51):
nation and world, To utilize that, as Gandhi calls Raha,
that soul force and that that torch was all so
passed and utilized to change our nation here as well.
So even from a political sense, we have so much
a debt of gratitude to to India, I will say,
(30:13):
as it relates to India. I also was just thinking
about Martin's fathers quote that to other countries he comes
as a tourist, but to India he came as a pilgrim.
Speaker 7 (30:26):
Lovely, So, Christian, can I just ask you, I mean,
there's so much chaos in the world right now, really yes,
no idea? Really well, you keep on chanting because it's
got you in a good space. So with the chaos
that we are seeing politically, culturally, personally, you know what
(30:47):
and how do people find peace and all of this?
Speaker 1 (30:50):
That's what I do all the time. What do you
mean if we let ourselves be destroyed by what's going
on in the outside world?
Speaker 3 (30:57):
What good are we to anybody?
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Job is to find a way to live in the
world in a good way and to be engaged in
with the world, but not to be destroyed by it.
You know, we can't let ourselves because then we just
suffer and everybody else suffers, and there's no benefit for anybody. Absolutely,
So these practices are not just for ourselves, there for
(31:20):
everybody we meet, everybody we see, everybody we've ever met
or ever will see. Every time you bring a drop
of water into the world, it adds to the to
the to the relieving of thirst. So every drop of love,
every drop of caring, every drop of compassion, of thinking
about others. The main teaching in the East is don't
(31:40):
think about yourself. When I was having a nervous breakdown,
and I mean I was hallucinating, I was being pulled
into this black hole in the ground, I mean I
was out of here. My ERGI called for me and
I ran and I said, Bobo, what's going Just don't
think about yourself? How do you not think about yourself?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Right?
Speaker 1 (31:59):
Because that planet of need is what all our thoughts
orbittering on. So it's only through some time to practice,
whether it's devotional practice or meditation or it doesn't matter,
that trains us to release that stuff again and again
and again, and we all come back ultimately to the
(32:22):
same place because it's the same.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
Now.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
You said consciousness and you said sacredness, they're not different.
Consciousness isn't just like something kind of cold awareness. The
qualities of being is consciousness, awareness, love, and happiness. They're
all one thing, and that's what we are inside, and
(32:46):
that's what these names are, the names of that place
inside that we chant them onto us.
Speaker 6 (32:51):
One of the things that we are working on collectively
is a project called Realize the Dream, and our goal
is to have one hundred million hours of service by
the one hundredth birthday of Martin Luther King Junior, in
order for us to remember that place of connection and
(33:12):
community and love and peace as a way of us
to come together and work together and stand together. And
I know, Nina, you've done so much in conservation and
community building, and I think we all would like to
know how you see the connection between spirituality and service.
Speaker 9 (33:32):
Well, it takes us back to what Maharaji said, right
and what he said to Ramdas also love everyone, serve everyone,
and remember God. I don't see them as different. One
is a pathway to the other, one sets the intention
for the other, and the practice is the remembering of God.
(33:53):
And the way that you were saying what keeps you
grounded is like finding a way to bring that into
serving others in whichever smallest way, one on one. It
doesn't have to be a big organization of any kind.
It's just try to help people who are in front
of you. And you know, for me, my connection with
(34:14):
the environment and the natures is a big part of
where I feel grounded.
Speaker 4 (34:20):
Katie Nan, as i've listened to you, what's overcoming is
this sense of peace. Because when Mark asked his question
a few moments ago, preambled the chaos in the world,
and Katie, you jokingly said, really, I thought, you know,
I thought there was a gentle tease, which of course
it partially was. But more than that, you talked about
(34:43):
there isn't always the chaos in the world because we
can find the piece. And just listening to the two
of you has been beautiful to remind our listeners and
our viewers of the idea that it's simple things we
do from our our gift of a chance, the simple
(35:03):
acts of service, how we create this positive impact in
the world. We've had some extraordinary people in this conversation,
but only the two of you have ever brought such
emotion and such devotion to Mark to bring them to tears,
And so I want to invite Mark to close with
his words.
Speaker 7 (35:21):
Yeah, just on behalf of all of us is thank you, guys,
for all of us and all the listeners. I'd really
encourage our listeners not just to listen to this conversation,
but to listen, to deeply listen to this conversation because
your words are so profound, so loving, so important. And
what you guys do every single day is you help
to reconnect. You help to reconnect people to themselves. You
(35:44):
help to reconnect people to others, and you help to
reconnect people to our world, including our natural world. So
thank you so much for what you do. Thank you
for helping to bring consciousness back is such a powerful way.
Thank you for introducing people like me and my family
to consciousness. So thank you, thank you, thank you both.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
It's wonderful.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (36:08):
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share, and follow us
on at my Legacy movement on social.
Speaker 5 (36:16):
Media and YouTube.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus content every Thursday
at its core. This podcast honors doctor King's vision of
the beloved community and the power of connection.
Speaker 5 (36:30):
A Legacy Plus Studio.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
Production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and executive producer Suzanne Hayward
co executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen on the iHeartRadio app
or wherever you get your podcasts,
I was addicted to cocaine, previous cocaine. I didn't save myself.
I couldn't.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
He was a rock musician searching for meaning. Then a
chance encounter in India set him on a path he
never expected.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
I always felt I was missing something. It was peace
missing and I was always looking for that.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Somehow Krishna Das found a new kind of stage and
a new way to heal himself and the world.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
Attributed to a miracle and the ability to keep letting
go and coming back home. If we let ourselves be
destroyed by what's going on in the outside world, what
good will read?
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Anybody?
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Join host Martin Luther King the Third, Andrea Waters, King,
Mark Kilberger, and Craig Kilberger for a conversation about starting over,
finding your purpose, and the wisdom learned along the way.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
You promised me now you would give up cocaine from
that moment to this man, and.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
I was like, welcome to my legacy. Today, we're honored
to sit down with an extraordinary guest who has spent
most of his adult life sharing the transformational power of
chanting with the world. Krishna Das. Now your friends call
you KD and your biggest fans call you kt Is
(01:17):
it all right if we call you Katie?
Speaker 3 (01:18):
No problem?
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Well it was very kind because you've got four fans,
and you've got two super fans if I can call
him out, especially you got Andrea and you got Mark,
who would fly anywhere to hear you perform. Katie is
known as the chant Master of American yoga, bringing the
ancient practice of Kurtan to global audiences and helping countless
(01:39):
people find solace and connection through music. He has recorded
seventeen albums, performed on some of the world's biggest stages,
and even earned a Grammy nomination for his work. Now,
as our listeners and viewers know, what makes conversations on
my legacy unexpected and unique is we don't just hear
from extraordinary individuals. We also hear from the people people
(02:00):
who know them best. Kadie, would you start off please
by introducing your guest Nina and sharing what makes her
such an important part of your life and your work.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
For sure?
Speaker 1 (02:10):
You know, without Nina, I just be home watching TV.
You know that's the truth. Nina's she makes it possible
me for me to get out there and do what
I have to do. We met a long time ago,
and then she invited me out to lunch and I said,
we're going to spend a lot of time together. We're
going to be together for a long time. And since
(02:31):
that day it's been full time. Really, she's extraordinary, not
only I mean, she sings better than me, and she
studies chanting and the real Indian tradition. You know, I'm
kind of New York via Long Island Indian tradition. She's
(02:52):
got the real stuff. I call her up when I
wake up in the morning where am I? And she
tells me so literally and figurably literally. I travel so
much sometimes I can't even find the bathroom in the
hotel room.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
You know, we understand the hands.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Katie.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
You mentioned a moment ago India via Long Island. That's
rather a unique journey. And in my legacy we talk
about people's origin, what made them who they are, And
so I'm curious, can you reflect back a little bit
on your childhood in Long Island and any of the
early indications that you would become the extraordinary Krishna Das.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
First of all, I don't see myself as the extraordinary Chrishnads.
There was always something missing in my life In fact,
I go out to dinner maybe once a month with
some of my old high school friends, and there's a
couple of people that usually dominate the conversation, both lawyers,
by the way, they weren't there that night. So one
of the women said to me, you know, I've known
(03:54):
now since you know, nineteen sixties.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
She said, so, why did you go to India? I said, I.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Went, WHOA, somebody's actually asking me a real question here.
So I said, well, you know, I always felt I
was missing something, there was a piece missing, and I
was always looking for that somehow. And she said, oh,
I never felt that. And that just broke my heart
because I saw that, you know, whatever it was that
(04:21):
was pulling me and leading me in my life, and
she didn't have that. And what it is is, I
think the recognition that there is something to find, something
deeper in life than what appears on the outside, in
the surface. And some of us have finished the journey
and others of us are like on the way. But
(04:42):
that's our requirement, is that longing and I always had that.
Speaker 6 (04:46):
You actually were the head of a rock band, right,
the Blue Oyster Cult.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
It was a bunch of high school kids from Stonybrook,
where I was at school, and a friend of mine
they met a friend who was a little older, and
they started, you know, smoking, and they started to want
that they wanted to have a band, so they needed
a singer. So he invited me to come play with them,
and we hung out for a while. But they were
too young and too stupid, and I was too old
(05:14):
and too stupid, so we went in different directions directions.
A few years later, they had become fairly well known
as the Soft White Underbelly. It was the sixties, you know,
and I had met Ramdas who just lit my life
up in a new direction. But I went back to school.
(05:35):
On my way up to see him to live with him.
We went to a Jimmy Hendricks concert Wow. And after
the concert we were hanging around and the manager of
the band said, you know, the guy.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Who replaced you.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
We have a whole recording, but the guy who replaced
you can't sing. Come back cut the vocal tracks.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
We have the tour.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
And this was my dream, you know, this was being
handed to me. But I had tripped and fallen in
something much deeper, much more fulfilling, And and that was
when I met Ramdas.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
So I just said.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Nah, and but look, but look look at now what
do I do?
Speaker 3 (06:21):
Right?
Speaker 1 (06:22):
I travel around, I sing to people just so like
I always wanted to do it, and I can do
it sitting down.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
I don't have to like work out all the time.
Speaker 5 (06:29):
And I must say, you are rock star.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
You're here.
Speaker 7 (06:32):
Well, Nina, I can't stress how incredible and Christians, how
meaningful these conversations for all of us, including me. The
first thing we wake up in the morning is listen
to your music. In the evening, listen to your music.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (06:46):
I get emotional just thinking of your music because you
and your music, and Nina, by definition, you and your
entire presence, your music connects me to consciousness. You were
talking about relationship with Ramdas and just how amazing that was,
how much it had an impact on you. You know Ramdas
(07:07):
of Courts For those who don't know, Harvard trained psychologist
wrote that seminar book here now, spiritual leader, can you
take us back to those days and what was that
relationship like and how did you guys become friends and
how did he have an impact in your life?
Speaker 1 (07:23):
Well, you know, when I walked into the room where
Ramdas is sitting, I felt this spacious, wide presence like
the sky, you know, and from that moment on there
was a part of me that was always aware of that.
You know, like we walked down the street, we don't
even know, we forget this guy's there, but this guy
(07:44):
is so vast and everything's inside of that. You know,
nothing can be outside of that space. And then when
I went to India and actually got to the temple
where the Baba lived, it was confusing at first because
how did that all fit in there in that body?
You know, it was this little guy wrapped in a blanket.
You know, it's very hard for us, in our lives,
(08:06):
in our relationships, in our interactions with the world and
everybody in it, to trust in the goodness of people,
even if they don't know it, even if they don't
feel it. You know, we all have that place within
us that is pure beauty and pure love and pure goodness.
And being in India with the Baba, my heart just
(08:29):
developed this feeling of trust in that situation and that
allowed it to relax and let go of a lot
of the programs that are always running, you know, telling
us we're not enough if we need this, this one.
We want this, we don't want this, we're afraid of this.
We like this, you know, the stuff that kind of
rules us and limits us. So being in that presence,
(08:52):
with that being it was the beginning of braining really
to let go. Which, by the way, what happens when
we chanted the way I share the chanting is the
way I do it. You sing, and then when you
notice you're not paying attention, you sing. That's the whole thing.
Nothing else is required. And because when we let go
(09:14):
of the stuff that pulls us out of ourselves, we
fall into that deeper place of goodness and love and
kindness and compassion and all that.
Speaker 7 (09:24):
Your Guru used to say, let everyone serve everyone, and
remember God, how do you do that every day?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Well, I wish I listened to me more. There's a
funny story. So one day he was very angry and
he came to the temple and when he walked in,
the guy who he hated the most handed him a
plate of food because we're being fed across the courtyard
with maharajis sitting there watching the seat, and he took
(09:54):
the food and he threw in the guy's face right
in front of Maharadi, mahar goes something wrong, come here,
Rumdas goes and sits down my heart. He says, what's wrong?
And Ramda says, I can't stand impurity and myself or
in others right, so my heart. He looks round us
(10:14):
up and down a few times and he says, I
don't see the impurity, and Rhymers just broke out crying.
Right my heart. He says, round us, love everyone and
tell the truth. So Ramda said, the truth is I
don't love everyone. My heard you lean in a little
(10:35):
closer and said, Rumdas, love everyone and tell the truth.
And that became his the star that he followed his
whole life. And you know, he had a catastrophic stroke
and he lived for over twenty years in a wheelchair.
But he used to say to me, the stroke saved
my life. Why was that because he had there was
(10:57):
stuff that he couldn't get to inside that was driving him,
making him unhappy, causing suffering, and he just wasn't able
to get to it. But once the stroke happened, he
had no option. He had to be with it and
he had to surrender to it. He couldn't change what
(11:18):
was happening, so he had to find a way to
live with the situation and not let it destroy him.
And that idea of loving everyone and telling the truth.
When those two things finally came together for him, when
you were with him, all you felt was their love
(11:39):
and everyone was in it, and which is so unusual
for a Westerner. We don't think, we don't in a sense,
you could say he became like a saint.
Speaker 8 (11:48):
You know, Oh, Nina, your grandfather, I believe or you
or introduced you to chant it. Can you talk about
him and how that experience occurred.
Speaker 9 (12:02):
So we grew up outside of India a lot. My
father traveled for his work and we would go back
to visit my grandfather in a small village on the
coast of India where he was retired. But in his
home was a harmonium and he started singing this prayer
to Ganesha, who's one of our deities that I worshiped
(12:25):
in India. And it was done in the most natural,
beautiful way. He said, I'm going to sing this line
and you repeat. That was it, and it felt natural.
Everybody came. Later that evening, people in the village came
and sang in what we call satsang where everybody comes
together in community and does practice. But the way it's
(12:48):
done in India is it's not really an event. It's
just something that happens on a regular basis in people's
homes in temples. And that's how I was first introduced
to it and really stayed with me because I didn't
do it much after that. My father, my grandfather passed
away until I met Krishnadas without knowing and I had
(13:09):
no idea who he was. I didn't know what was
going to happen. I actually thought I was going to
leave the yoga retreat because I saw somebody and I thought,
oh my gosh, this is going to be a westerner
or a failed Indian musician. I don't I think it's
going to be terrible.
Speaker 5 (13:23):
I really read all this.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
She knew me right away.
Speaker 9 (13:27):
And I had never seen him before. And when he
walked in, you know, I thought this is worse than
a failed Indian musician. But as soon as he sat
down and he started home, I moved from the back
of the room to the front of the room, not
knowing how, and you know, three hours later, there I was,
(13:48):
and in some ways I never left. That was my connection,
and I said, it was just the most amazing thing
this retreat. And they said, you know, he sings every
week at this Yuga studio And I said really, And
they gave me the tape and I put it in
my car and I didn't stop listening to it until
basically the tape broke wow, and I found out that
(14:12):
he was singing at the yoga studio every Monday. And
we connected, we became friends, and he would pick me up,
remember going down FDR Drive and those daisy cheese and
so we would go and get nachos. I just felt
I wanted to support him in whatever way. There was
no business to manage in those days.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
There was no business.
Speaker 9 (14:34):
There was no business, but he did need a drummer,
and I learned one beat.
Speaker 6 (14:40):
So can you explain what is unique about the type
of chanting that you do, Kirton, and how can it
speak to our hearts?
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Well, you know, as Westerners, we have a hard time
believing there's anything beyond Mickey Mouse, you know, you know,
because I was living a culture that doesn't really support
that so much. So even though I've kind of absorbed
all this from India, when I'm also Western, when I sing,
(15:12):
I don't ask myself to try to make anything happen.
I simply keep coming back to the sound of the mantra,
these are the names of God. And I find that
this practice brains me to let go of the stuff
that holds me down, that weighs me down, you know,
the shadows in our own hearts, and the ability to
(15:34):
keep letting go and coming back home for a second,
letting go, coming back. This is a brings the inner
strength that actually helps you overcome just about anything. It's
an inner strength that you get from these practices. And
if we want to love everyone, serve everyone, and remember,
if we want to do that, we need some strength
to do that because this world, especially these days, doesn't
(15:59):
support that kind of thing easily. So each one of
us has to be find a way to connect to
that deeper place.
Speaker 6 (16:06):
And it's interesting because for me, for many years I
worked monitoring hate groups and hate crimes such as the
klu klutz Klan and neo Nazis and skinheads, and one
of the things that I had in my office was
that we must never become like that which we're fighting against,
which is a quote by Belle Hooks. It was my
(16:27):
north star, and so it's one thing to have that,
you know, on your wall, but I also had to
find a way of looking at such topics, and we
also would monitor hate crimes, and so I had to
find a way to continually to make sure that I
would not become like that which we were standing against. Sure,
(16:48):
and one way.
Speaker 5 (16:49):
That I did that was through your music.
Speaker 6 (16:52):
So at night, you know, after kind of being in
that world all day, I would come and put the
CD on and you know, find a way I would
begin my day and also end my day as a
way to clear out the energy and radiate, you know,
to be for something rather than against. And so for
all of those years of that, I thank you.
Speaker 3 (17:09):
Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
What It's true, that's that's what the power of chanting is,
and it comes from an ancient spiritual tradition, and it
connects us with that place within us that's deeper than
all that other stuff. Gives us a chance to take
a breath in a deeper place and be able to
let go of all the reactions and the stuff we
(17:32):
have to deal with every day, all the inside and
outside of us.
Speaker 6 (17:36):
You know, are there any other types of music that
both of you tend to listen to and enjoy. That
also brings like for me, obviously, I love your music.
I love gospel music. It brings me to that same place.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
Oh well, you know when I'm really messed up, I
have to listen to it. Charles, especially America the Beautiful
Boy if you want to, you know, how can you
bear that?
Speaker 3 (18:00):
It's so beautiful?
Speaker 9 (18:01):
That's a good song for now.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Yeah, but you know, just.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
Growing up in the sixties with rock and roll, it's
still a place where I go back to a lot.
And the weirdest thing is now on Facebook because of
the way I my likes, you know, I'm getting to
see I just saw The Stones, you know, from nineteen
sixty five, you know, well, a black and white video
of the Stones. This is the music that changed my
(18:28):
life at that time.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
If you were creating your playlist, besides Criton, who would
be on Ray Charleston.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
Richarles, well, you know Ray, Charles, Van Morrison, Steely Dan
what they were friends of mine. Tibetan chanting is I
really listened to a lot of Tibetan. There's an incredible
lama who lives in Paris, actually teaches in French at
Tibetan actually it's Bhutanese and they made a CD which
really was I listened to it for years nothing else
(18:58):
than that for years on the Lama's Chant.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
Actually it's fantastic.
Speaker 4 (19:02):
Hell for all of our social followers, they're going to
be putting out the Rolling Stones Van Morrison and the
Tibetan Chance.
Speaker 5 (19:09):
I just love that combination.
Speaker 10 (19:12):
If you're looking for stories that move you, insights that
shift you, in conversations that stay deeply within you, do
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Speaker 5 (19:30):
Now back to my legacy.
Speaker 7 (19:32):
Now, Prist, you have gone through this path, but equally
you've had some struggles along the way, especially upon the
passing of your Guru, and how challenging that was for you,
and if I'm not mistaken, having to even numb yourself
with drugs at some points during that process. How did
you overcome that? And what advice do you have for
people who are in that depth of challenge to find
(19:54):
a sense of purpose and hope in such challenging times.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
People ask me a lot I get a lot of
questions about addiction. Because I was addicted to cocaine, freebase
cocaine for two years. I don't know what to tell you.
I was saved. I didn't save myself. I couldn't. I
was out of here.
Speaker 7 (20:12):
What do you mean by I was saved?
Speaker 3 (20:14):
I couldn't save myself.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Well, for instance, I had, I had become addicted to cocaine.
And my Indian father, with whose family I lived many
for a long time in India, came to America to visit
the Westerners. Actually it was in Canada first, so I
flew from California, the state of my father's apartment. I
(20:38):
was up all night smoking freebase. Next morning, I get
on the plane and I fly to Montreal. I get
a car. I drive out to the country where he
was staying. I walked into the house and they say, oh,
he's sitting he's upstairs. So I walked up the stairs
and I saw him sitting in a room talking to somebody,
his backwards to the door. As I got towards the door,
(21:02):
I stopped and I started to back away. I don't
know what I was feeling, but I I didn't want
to go in that room. And at that point, he
literally he had his back to the door. He turned
and he pointed to me and goes, you promise me, now,
you would give up cocaine? Promise me now.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
I just looked at him.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I said, okay, I couldn't say no to him.
Speaker 3 (21:29):
I wouldn't. I couldn't.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
It was too much a low man. I just said, okay,
from that moment to this moment, not even the thought
about it. And you know what that's like, I mean,
addicting his addiction. And I wouldn't have been able to
do it myself.
Speaker 7 (21:48):
Well, what do you attribute that to his love?
Speaker 3 (21:51):
I would attribute to.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
A miracle? Andy, What else can you say? I wouldn't
be here. My mother was an alcoholic, although she was
cleaned the last twenty years. But I didn't have it.
I didn't have the wiring to live this long, and they,
for whatever reason, it was like, okay, let the kid live.
(22:18):
You know, I don't know why, but here I am.
Speaker 7 (22:21):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (22:22):
I wish I could give you some advice, but I can't.
Speaker 7 (22:26):
So, Nita, I'm fascinated you've said that you're todd or
chanting is a way to clean the mirror of your heart.
What do you mean by that and how have you
been able to do that.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Through your work.
Speaker 9 (22:35):
One of the main practices that actually learned from Krishna Das,
even though it's something that's been going on in India for
a long time, is a chant called the Hanuman Chaalisa.
And there's something in the power of the mantra, the
chant itself. The word mantra comes from Man and tra
mone means mind, but it's the heart mind. It's not
(22:59):
necessarily the is where thoughts are, but it's a place
where understanding takes place, where we in our heart and
our brain come together. Thra is a tool or an
instrument of or for the mind. It's a way in
which to also create new thought patterns in our mind.
They call it navashabda samskaras. So we're born with thought
(23:23):
patterns and I don't know where they come from, but
they come and go. But how do we not get
pulled away by that? So it's almost a purifying process
in the hearing and the repetition of these words and names.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
And the idea is that when we look out at
the world, what do we see? We see our likes
and dislikes, our preferences. We see what we're afraid of,
we see what we want, We see all these things.
It's colored. It's a subjective view, which everybody has their
own subjective view. These practices, and what that is. You're
(23:58):
looking in a mirror that's covered in dust. What you
see is the dust. So when we look out there,
what we're seeing is the dust, which is our stuff.
So through these practices, that dust is polished off the mirror,
and then when you look in the mirror, you see
what's true. And then what's true, of course, is that
oneness of all of us, and even the people we
(24:21):
don't like are just as much divine as we are,
but we don't see that because we're stuck in our reactions.
So these practices and letting go, like coming back when
you're chanting, just letting go, coming back, letting go, coming back,
that is cleaning the mirror of our hearts so that
we experience directly real love, real love that doesn't come
(24:42):
and go, that you don't get from somewhere, that you
don't fall in or fall out of. But that's our
true nature. And then when you see that in yourself,
you see it everywhere, and then we you know, are
you going to be bad to your foot? Everybody's a
part of the one body, you know, so why would
you do anything to hurt anyone? If you've seen that,
(25:05):
That's when India is really you know, Eastern spirituality is
much more about that oneness, love everyone and tell the truth.
Speaker 11 (25:16):
I think we as humans all hopefully derive inspiration from somewhere,
and I can often look to my dad and the
prophetic messages that he had that even to this day,
even though they met, delivered over fifty years ago, they
are still relevant to this moment. Where do you derive
(25:38):
your inspiration for the work that you're consistently doing throughout
our planet?
Speaker 1 (25:43):
For me, it's the Guru, you know, It's nothing was
real in my life until I met him, and then
being in the presence of these incredible beings in India,
His devote, these his families, how they lived with such
devotion to truth, devotion to to treating everyone as family,
(26:03):
you know, and the way we were accepted. And we
were a bunch of idiots, you know, we didn't know
how to how to get down the street, you know,
and they were so kind to us and so loving
and so supportive. I saw him treat everyone with love
and affection. Miracles that fell off of him, you know,
just like rainwater off. It was amazing just to watch that,
(26:27):
but it was all in the service of helping people.
And we're leaving stuff.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Man, Scrolling won't change your life, but subscribing just might
tap that button and stay connected to conversations that count.
Now back to my legacy, Chris Us.
Speaker 7 (26:45):
I was wondering, how were you bestowed that name Krishnanadas
servants of Krishna and what was that experience like for you?
Speaker 1 (26:51):
Well, I told you about rummed Us. Rummed Us had
a Volkswagen bus in India and we were driving and around.
We drive to the temple every day from the town
with maybe sixteen seventeen eighteen people in this litt Volkswagen
bus hanging off the top, on the roof, off the back,
and it was making such a scene that I think
Mahaji snapped his fingers and the bus broke down. But
(27:15):
before that he says, Ramdas you're a saint, you shouldn't drive.
Give him the keys. So I got the keys to
the bus and I got my first name, which was driver.
For about a year I was driver, right, So I thought,
I wrote in my diary. One night, I said, well,
everybody else, is you know this or that? Colleague? Does
(27:37):
you know Ramdas? This dos Baga Vanda you know? And
I guess I'll be driver. Not so bad. The next
day I get to the temple and I get called
into my Horji's room and he looks me. He says
Argin Nick Krishna, Nick Krishna Das. And I said, Krishna Das, I'm.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
A rum kind of guy. I'm a Hanuman guy. What Krishna?
Speaker 1 (27:58):
And he laughed, He said this, okay, it's okay. Honeyman
with a monkey. God is Honeyman the perfect servant of love?
Is that Honaman served Christian too? It's okay, okay.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
It's interesting because it feels that you both have talked
about how an Indian particular spirituality is infused into everything,
and I find that certainly throughout the East as well.
You know, it is different than in the West, and
so also the chanting and kretan it also Mark said,
it connects him with consciousness. It connects me with sacred
(28:32):
to remember the sacredness which we you know, So it's
that reconnecting with that part of us that we don't
get as much of in this in this part of
the world.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
It's the mother of the world really, I mean, it's
so many of the traditions come from that earth in India,
you know. And they actually say that the earth itself,
the ground, supports spiritual awareness. It's just something in the
magnets ism or the vibration of the earth there that
(29:05):
makes it easier for saints to live there. Wow, it's
just the holy place. I mean, not just because there's
been thousands and thousands and thousands of years of seekers
wandering around looking for that that love all the time,
you know, so it has an effect on the place.
Speaker 6 (29:25):
One of the things that I'm struck by this conversation
is the remembrance of the connection between India and the
civil rights movement. I was thinking about ram Das and
it hit his girl. When you think about the fact
that Martin Luther King Junior found such inspiration in Mahatma's
Gandhi and utilize that technology in order to transform our
(29:51):
nation and world, To utilize that, as Gandhi calls Raha,
that soul force and that that torch was all so
passed and utilized to change our nation here as well.
So even from a political sense, we have so much
a debt of gratitude to to India, I will say,
(30:13):
as it relates to India. I also was just thinking
about Martin's fathers quote that to other countries he comes
as a tourist, but to India he came as a pilgrim.
Speaker 7 (30:26):
Lovely, So, Christian, can I just ask you, I mean,
there's so much chaos in the world right now, really yes,
no idea? Really well, you keep on chanting because it's
got you in a good space. So with the chaos
that we are seeing politically, culturally, personally, you know what
(30:47):
and how do people find peace and all of this?
Speaker 1 (30:50):
That's what I do all the time. What do you
mean if we let ourselves be destroyed by what's going
on in the outside world?
Speaker 3 (30:57):
What good are we to anybody?
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Job is to find a way to live in the
world in a good way and to be engaged in
with the world, but not to be destroyed by it.
You know, we can't let ourselves because then we just
suffer and everybody else suffers, and there's no benefit for anybody. Absolutely,
So these practices are not just for ourselves, there for
(31:20):
everybody we meet, everybody we see, everybody we've ever met
or ever will see. Every time you bring a drop
of water into the world, it adds to the to
the to the relieving of thirst. So every drop of love,
every drop of caring, every drop of compassion, of thinking
about others. The main teaching in the East is don't
(31:40):
think about yourself. When I was having a nervous breakdown,
and I mean I was hallucinating, I was being pulled
into this black hole in the ground, I mean I
was out of here. My ERGI called for me and
I ran and I said, Bobo, what's going Just don't
think about yourself? How do you not think about yourself?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Right?
Speaker 1 (31:59):
Because that planet of need is what all our thoughts
orbittering on. So it's only through some time to practice,
whether it's devotional practice or meditation or it doesn't matter,
that trains us to release that stuff again and again
and again, and we all come back ultimately to the
(32:22):
same place because it's the same.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
Now.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
You said consciousness and you said sacredness, they're not different.
Consciousness isn't just like something kind of cold awareness. The
qualities of being is consciousness, awareness, love, and happiness. They're
all one thing, and that's what we are inside, and
(32:46):
that's what these names are, the names of that place
inside that we chant them onto us.
Speaker 6 (32:51):
One of the things that we are working on collectively
is a project called Realize the Dream, and our goal
is to have one hundred million hours of service by
the one hundredth birthday of Martin Luther King Junior, in
order for us to remember that place of connection and
(33:12):
community and love and peace as a way of us
to come together and work together and stand together. And
I know, Nina, you've done so much in conservation and
community building, and I think we all would like to
know how you see the connection between spirituality and service.
Speaker 9 (33:32):
Well, it takes us back to what Maharaji said, right
and what he said to Ramdas also love everyone, serve everyone,
and remember God. I don't see them as different. One
is a pathway to the other, one sets the intention
for the other, and the practice is the remembering of God.
(33:53):
And the way that you were saying what keeps you
grounded is like finding a way to bring that into
serving others in whichever smallest way, one on one. It
doesn't have to be a big organization of any kind.
It's just try to help people who are in front
of you. And you know, for me, my connection with
(34:14):
the environment and the natures is a big part of
where I feel grounded.
Speaker 4 (34:20):
Katie Nan, as i've listened to you, what's overcoming is
this sense of peace. Because when Mark asked his question
a few moments ago, preambled the chaos in the world,
and Katie, you jokingly said, really, I thought, you know,
I thought there was a gentle tease, which of course
it partially was. But more than that, you talked about
(34:43):
there isn't always the chaos in the world because we
can find the piece. And just listening to the two
of you has been beautiful to remind our listeners and
our viewers of the idea that it's simple things we
do from our our gift of a chance, the simple
(35:03):
acts of service, how we create this positive impact in
the world. We've had some extraordinary people in this conversation,
but only the two of you have ever brought such
emotion and such devotion to Mark to bring them to tears,
And so I want to invite Mark to close with
his words.
Speaker 7 (35:21):
Yeah, just on behalf of all of us is thank you, guys,
for all of us and all the listeners. I'd really
encourage our listeners not just to listen to this conversation,
but to listen, to deeply listen to this conversation because
your words are so profound, so loving, so important. And
what you guys do every single day is you help
to reconnect. You help to reconnect people to themselves. You
(35:44):
help to reconnect people to others, and you help to
reconnect people to our world, including our natural world. So
thank you so much for what you do. Thank you
for helping to bring consciousness back is such a powerful way.
Thank you for introducing people like me and my family
to consciousness. So thank you, thank you, thank you both.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
It's wonderful.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (36:08):
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
If you enjoy today's conversation, subscribe, share, and follow us
on at my Legacy movement on social.
Speaker 5 (36:16):
Media and YouTube.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
New episodes drop every Tuesday, with bonus content every Thursday
at its core. This podcast honors doctor King's vision of
the beloved community and the power of connection.
Speaker 5 (36:30):
A Legacy Plus Studio.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
Production distributed by iHeartMedia creator and executive producer Suzanne Hayward
co executive producer Lisa Lyle. Listen on the iHeartRadio app
or wherever you get your podcasts,
Hosts And Creators
Craig Kielburger
Marc Kielburger
Martin Luther King III
Arndrea Waters King
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