May 20, 2024 • 23 mins
This week hosts Tiffany Cross, Angela Rye, and Andrew Gillum ask themselves, is this show a safe space? What is our obligation as a show to create a safe space for ourselves and for the audience, and what does “safe space” mean, anyway?
This is a follow up from last week’s MiniPod that got a liiittle heated.
Welcome home y’all!
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Thank you to the Native Land Pod team:
Angela Rye as host, executive producer and cofounder of Reasoned Choice Media; Tiffany Cross as host and producer, Andrew Gillum as host and producer, and Gabrielle Collins as executive producer; Loren Mychael is our research producer, and Nikolas Harter is our editor and producer. Special thanks to Chris Morrow and Lenard McKelvey, co-founders of Reasoned Choice Media.
Theme music created by Daniel Laurent.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Native Plan Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership
with Recent Choice Media. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome,
all right, Welcome home, everybody. This is Tiffany Gross, Andrew
Gailam and Angela Rai and you are tuned into this
week's mini pod. Welcome Home. Welcome Home is not enthusiastic enough.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome, we mean it, We mean it.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
I mean it.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I don't have to yell to be we mean it.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Welcome home. This is our home and this is your home.
And just like any family, we have disagreements sometimes, and
so we thought it was important to share one of
those more heated, intense discussions that we had last week
with you all, and to know that right after that
podcast was over, maybe ten minutes after everybody was good,
(00:51):
we were all all back, because that's how it works
with family.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Well, you skip some steps, but I'll let you have it.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
What do you we can say what we want to
say about it. And Andrew, do you want me to
say the whole thing or do you want me to say.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
I'll say this is I knew that in the moment
while we had already had a long day, and then
of course we got to the subject of what value
each of us puts on what we choose and desire
to platform. And that does feel a little personal because
you're now asking me what lens, what vet do I
put on on on what I think we should be
(01:28):
talking about on the show, and to the extent that
we scrutinize each other's you know, vetting, it could feel
real personal. So I completely got that. But I will
sell you this and I think I said this angelout tip.
I can't remember who one of y'all that. What I
knew in that moment, although it was very tense and whatnot,
(01:49):
was that we were not going to leave New York
without resolution, which is not something that I would bet on.
And many really relationships that I know of, friendships, romantic
relationships are otherwise where you have confidence that there's enough
love and respect in this space that before we leave
(02:13):
this place we will be reconciled, even if it is
we still disagree. But guess what, it was never my
intention to hurt you and not I'm really sorry that
you were hurt by what I say, like that backhanded thing.
Right fact, that's not going to happen because that's not
who we are that's not who we are at this
(02:34):
stage in our lives. And the other thing that I
appreciate about who we are and not who we are
about this stage in our lives is that I don't
think either of us feel like we've got to beast
one another like we got to one up end. I
don't feel like I have anything to prove to either
one of you. What I felt like I want to
do is to show up as my best self every time,
(02:57):
and even in those moments where I can't. I want
to be able to count on the fact that y'all
know me well enough that you and loved me and
care for me enough that you'll have grace and those
moments where we can't. And so I just I know
y'all have more to say about this, because you had
some after conversation. I just felt like, I know it's
(03:17):
heated right now, but you know what, keep it pushing
because we're not leaving this space without feeling complete.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
I love that. I think you know.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
I was feeling really defensive, and I was telling Tiff
when we walked out of the room, like we were
all walking down the stairs quietly. We recorded some other
evergreen content that honestly, it might end up being trash
because my energy was completely off. I wouldn't even hardly
look at tiv I was like lookingside was talking about
Andrew feels like he was talking himself, which doesn't just
(03:47):
happen when we're mad.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Sometimes Andrew to preach it anyway by himself.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
He'd be like, somebody gonna get it, hello, lights. But
the bottom line is I literally walked out the room
and I turned around the Tivy. I was like, you
hurt my feelings, and I was in tears, and then
she was like, don't cry. You're gonna make me cry,
and that is I mean, that's it. I think that
part of I think part of what happened is, you know,
a lot of times in life people aren't in tune
(04:15):
with where they are on their journeys.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
And so.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
I think I've done a lot of work from a
therapy perspective to like, no, oh, this person was rising
up because sixth grade Angela showed up.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
I was feeling bullied.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
Nobody was saying anything to bully me, but I was
feeling it, and Tiff give it. Being the media strategy
she is, she was like, oh my god, I could
see that because you were literally sandwich between me and Andrew
and we were on the same side.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
You were in the middle, so you're like squished. I
was like, oh my god, I didn't even think about that.
So there's that. Plus I'm not sleeping.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
We're working really hard on Marilyn Moseby's petition, like there's
so many things happening. I'm waking up at tiffany hours,
and for any of you all that know me, no,
like I'm a night out, so that means I'm sleeping
like three or four hours right now. So I think
I was uniquely tender from that, just like when you
have a little kid with if it's your child, you know,
it's like, oh, no, you need to go to bed.
It was one of those sleepy you're not thinking clearly,
(05:12):
you're you know, you're delirious, and I just I was
feeling tender, and so I thank God for this safe
podspace that we've created where I could say I'm feeling tender.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
And when Tiff said you think I said.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
That, how I heard it was very different than her
intention because she started feeling defensive, like, how could you possibly.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Think I was saying that? And then I was like
why would you talk to me in that towne?
Speaker 4 (05:34):
And then we were crying, and then Andrew missed all
the tears, but I think deep down somewhere he probably
had one single thug tear, because.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Every now and then not the glory tear too.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
But I will also just say I think one of
the things that that moment did for me, you guys,
is it made me connect to what our listeners may
have felt when they talked about how answer questions. And
so the question I have today really is, in this
space that we created, our pod, our unique little bubble,
(06:10):
our safety bubble, what is our obligation to each other
and then to our broader audience to hold that safe space,
to ensure that people don't feel over attacked, that they
don't feel like they're being put on the defensive, that
they don't feel like we're trivializing what they say, and
certainly that we're not doing that to each other. And
then what is our responsibility when somebody may have a
(06:32):
trigger that maybe we're not even aware of.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Like how do you navigate that space?
Speaker 4 (06:37):
I think this is one thing that will help us
not only be a better podcast, but better people to
be in relationship with whether it's your church, community, your family,
your friends, whomever, like, what is our responsibility collectively and
as individuals to create safety?
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Sure, well, I will give my assessment and answering that question.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I think.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
You know, Angela, you carry a lot, and we're all
Type A person out like extreme Type A personalities, and
it's very few people being a Type A personality. It's
very few people I'm going to trust that you have
it all together. But Angela is definitely one of those people.
If Angel's like I'm taking lead on this, I trust
that you have it all together. So my takeaway might
(07:24):
be a little different from both of you guys. My
takeaway is just because there are people in your life
and your circle who are always on top of things,
who always have it together, we have to also caution
ourselves that we're not doing the superwoman myths on these people,
you know, because honestly, the way I thought, I expected
this to be a brawl and how we cover, but
(07:46):
not a brawl in the way that it was. But
that Angel's going to feel really strongly and come back
and say, well, let me tell you why you and
Andrew are wrong. And I think I did not in
that moment hold space for everything and was feeling and
going through and doing and so the lesson I think
as a takeaway is don't assume because the person in
(08:07):
your life does always juggle on everything, is always on
top of it. Is always that person. Like we all
have a right to, you know, have a moment. You know,
ANGELI are always quick to take ownership of things. And
I'm like, I don't think it's all on anybody, you know,
I think it's in how we all collectively hold space
for each other. I'm giving sometimes, you know, Andrew was,
(08:28):
you know, saying we needn't be so high brow or whatever.
Like Andrew says said that to me sometimes, and I
wanted him to say it on air that day because
I'm like, they're probably people out there who feel that way.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
I like highlighting our different perspectives and disagreement because we
you know, we get to do that here. We didn't
get to do that in other spaces because we were
like under the umbrella of like black commentators. But the
the we're not homogeneous in our community and so we
get to have these nuanced disagreements in what we cover.
I thought it was a really robust conversation that one.
(09:00):
I don't like when things escalate to that level. But
the comfort in being friends with people for multiple decades,
as you know, there's is family, and it's going where
we wanted to be good and not we're going to
be good, you know. And we communicate spoken and unspoken,
you know. And so I wish Andrew had been on
his job and had been following me and behind the
(09:21):
scenes footage and getting us hugging in the alley whatever.
But it it just I thought, it's a different lesson,
I know. But then you should have been out there
on camera with your camera phone.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
No, I shouldn't have sas not loving hip hop to
like our vts.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
And I think we all deal with like these things differently, right,
So Angela at a different point may have needed us
to lean in or to pull out. But you and
I may have a different relationship with conflict or with
the way in which conflict is handled. So, for instance,
if things get too emotional for a long time, for me,
(10:01):
if things got really emotional, my first comment was, and
Jay is going to like, amen, this was You're not
a victim. We both have our grievances here, this is you,
This is where I am da da, but neither of
us are victims here. And it was now that in reflection,
I'm thinking, what a harsh insense it is, and like
(10:21):
non loving way to approach a conflict is to say
like you're not a victim. That is like the worst
place to go with it. And thank God for Angela
introducing me to therapy in a way that I had
never been before really helped me to get outside of it,
because the only thing I needed to hear was how
are you feeling? And whether I feel like I did
(10:44):
something to necessitate that or not. The truth is is
that a person who I love and cared deeply about
reacted to a thing that I did or said in
this way, and that isn't what I want to happen.
I want you to hear me, clearly, but I certainly
don't want to level you in the process. I don't
want you to walk away feeling like you're less intelligent,
or you have less to contribute, or that your voices
(11:06):
and as important or as valued. And I'll just disclose.
You know, Angelina, I had a conversation yesterday after our
don Limit interview, and I was, you know, saying to
her that you know, I've sort of gotten used to,
at least in some ways in our podcast, like not
really fighting for the space in every conversation. Like if
(11:30):
comments are being had or being said and either I'm
not invited directly into it, or the conversation takes place
and I've not made a contribution, my default position might
be like, Okay, I'm not of value at this space
and in this time. And the adjustment, or the compromise
(11:53):
I made with myself is like, Okay, just accept that
in some spaces and at certain times you won't be
of value. And what Angela was pointing out was that
may be an incident where you might not feel that way,
but to the point that that becomes now your conduct.
You've negotiated yourself into a space where every week you
(12:14):
now feel like you have to just sort of sit
with it, be quiet, keep it moving. Time is going.
I don't know how to shut up. Whatever the thing
is is that the self talk that I'm telling myself
now we are completely disrupting the very environment we're trying
to create for ourselves. The very environment we're trying to
create is that I don't have to be curated through
(12:36):
the world's lens that if this conversation takes me away
from one about politics and one about the fact that, gosh,
I feel, you know, no real worth in this moment,
and I don't want to be in a I have
too much respect for myself. I'd like to think that
I don't want to be anywhere where my contribution isn't valid,
(13:01):
where I'm not making a contribution at all. And to
your point, Angela, about where we have to be respectful
and where do our listeners show up? They show up
all the way through this. It breaks. I can't tell
y'all if you're on the listening side of this, what
it did to Angela and Tiffany when we got some
comments about from some of the listeners who said, I
(13:22):
felt like you all disrespected the questioner here, like you
just completely. I'm sitting on the I'm sitting here with
them on a you know, on the telephone, and they're like,
I can't believe that. I just I can't believe I
wasn't aware of that and this, and and they're going
back and forth. I'm like, y'all, you want to call
them on three ay, y'all want to FaceTime? I mean,
you're like, what are we.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
Going to do.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, I was saying.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
He was genuine.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
That's the scary part. He really wanted to FaceTime these people.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Absolutely was serious. I was like, we have to unburden this,
and I'm really sick of this. I can't believe we
said that. And I got to go back and look
at the video and all that kind off. I'm like, look,
which I want to do about it? And so so
just know that it isn't anyone's intention to go that way.
And I think in our apology the following week, I
mentioned that sometimes we're not even responding directly to what
(14:09):
the question is, which is part of our obligation to
respond to what the question is, because you posed it
and we respect you enough to give you an answer.
But we're responding to all of the clouds, the layers
of stuff that we've had to dig through all week,
and all of everybody else's misimpressions about that thing. And
now we feel like, oh, this is the window to
correct the rest of the world, not you, the questioner,
(14:31):
but the rest of the world on that perspective. And
so I have nothing but love and respect for our audience,
and that has to mean more than our words. That
it has to be manifest in our actions, not just
in the way that we experience it, but also the
way that you, our listeners, experience it. And that's just
the work in progress. But know our heart.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Please all right, job, We're going to take a quick break,
but don't go anywhere, because we still want to talk
more about how to create safe spaces, not just for us,
but for you as well. We'll be right back. I
even like having this conversation and putting it out there
(15:10):
for our viewers because I want the audience to feel
like they are part of the conversation. And I think
what they appreciated about the mini pod last week is
they felt like they were eavesdropping on a private disagreement
with all of us. And I think all of us
maintain how we feel. I don't think Angela you feel
any different. I don't think Andrew you feel a different.
(15:31):
I don't feel any different. And it's like, yeah, we
can have these three opposing points of view and still
come together as family, as friends and you know, spend
time with you other and laugh and you know, nothing changes.
And I think that's what we're the society we're trying
to build and go for in terms of our audience
and the things that we platform here and creating a
(15:53):
safe space for our viewers and for each other. I
just want to make this plea to our audience and say,
even when we disagree with you, we love you. You know.
I think that I often say this to Angela, and
I probably said this to you too, Andrew, Like, I
think it's black people. We don't have the privilege to
dislike each other, you know, right, But but there are
(16:16):
people who you know, they're not my favorite people, you know,
So among us, I'm like, I don't really rock with him,
I don't really rock with her. But out here in
this world, if something were happening, then I got to
be a part of the army defending that person, you know.
And so we feel that way. Even when you give
a comment that I feel is a little disrespectful to
the w NBA, we still welcome you, brother, We welcome
(16:38):
you a comment, you know, like you're gonna have to
get some of the smoke.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Although I did think it was a hoax.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
But yeah, well either way, you know, I hope it wasn't.
I hope, I hope he had more respect for us
than giving a hoax. But who knows even when we
disagree that we want you to pull up a seat
to this table. You know, we've all come from spaces
where we didn't feel welcome. For twenty four years, I
didn't feel welcome in you know, mostly white run newsrooms
(17:04):
that constantly dismiss my input and value and opinions. So
I don't ever want either of my co hosts to
feel like they don't have value. And I certainly don't
want our audience, who shows up to us every week
twice a week to hear us, to not feel like
they have value. So we thank y'all for rocking with us,
for tuning in every week. I thank you Angela for
(17:26):
inviting me and Andrew to be part of this podcast
and build this thing brick by brick with you. I
think you Andrew for the times that we have on
this podcast. But honestly, my favorite time is when we're
not on the podcast, and it's just when Andrew and
I get one on one time. I feel like it's
so calming. I'm always telling you some personal drama I
(17:46):
have or something, you know, Andela off doing something, she's
going a flight, she doing something else, and I'm all
about like where's a good restaurant, so Andrew and I'll
go eat sometimes. But Angela and I also spend a
lot of time too as the ladies. We have a
whole girl group, so I get my alone time with
each of them. But with Andrew, I just I truly
(18:07):
value you, both personally and professionally. So I just I
love y'all for having the space and just thank y'all
for for for dealing on the days when I'm giving
whatever I'm giving, when i'm giving highbrow to Andrew told
you the anti when we were walking in Sancho Park.
(18:36):
He was so like smooth jazz when you know how
he does. Angela and he was like, I had I
was a bit elevated at the time. And sometimes when
I'm like that, I it means I go inward. Okay,
I just get mute. What does that mean to It
means that I had a mood ordering substance that sent
me on a flight. Okay, and it is a good,
(18:59):
beautiful Okay. Andrew was talking to me, and I hear it.
But sometimes your thoughts are like they run away. You're
like no, no, no, wait, and the thought is gone. And
Andrew was like, you know when you get like this,
you just have this judgmental look on your face, and
I don't care for it.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Just exuding judgment.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
But I have It's not even it just I was
laughing so hard because he said it was just so
funny to me. I'm like, see this, y I don't
care for it.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
I don't care for it.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
It's just it's so proper that in most places I
wouldn't have two words to say to the other person
about how they look or what they're giving.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Andrew, you give the craziest cussouts with no cuss words
and big words. Sometimes you make up the words as well.
But yeah, like yes, baby, hilarious.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
All right?
Speaker 1 (19:52):
Do we do we feel complete with this conversation or
do we.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Well, we didn't read the comment I wanted to read.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
I believe it's Denice Paris right, and it says I
have been listening to your podcast since episode one. Just
so y'all know, we are not going to make a
practice of reading these comments. We expect for you to
send in videos, but just because it was on point
since episode one, I share the podcast a few times.
I believe in what you are doing because it is
(20:18):
imperative and needed. After listening to your last mini pod,
I resonate with all your viewpoints because they are valid.
I must say I lean toward Angela as I too
was blindsided, as I would have never imagined millions on
millions of people could ever be scammed by Trump. I
am from NYC, and my very arrogance thought people knew
(20:41):
he was deplorable in every aspect of being empty, nothing
good and possibly evil. Keep going and know that your
valuable information is appreciated. Keep fighting for the good and
as you know, great things start small. Sometimes I love
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
I love that I share. I'm assure you of it.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
Angela, No, no, no, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
I really think like she was like, I agree with
her screaming on the podcast. She was saying she agreed
with like being blindsided by like y'all really think you
should vote for this?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
That was ny get it? Yeah, so not that part.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
But yes, I do appreciate the I But you know,
I appreciate that no matter how we feel or what
we say, we're three intelligent people with people out there
who will reflect back like yes you had a good point,
or yes I agree with you, or yes I agree
with all three of you. All I think that's what
it's for, So I like that we You don't want
all three of us having the same perspective coming up
(21:38):
with the same ideas, you know, Yeah, well we don't.
But the one thing I would love to ask our listeners,
if you guys don't mind, is we didn't dive enough
into what it looks like to create a safe space.
And since we are so lacking and safety in so
many places. Some people at home don't have safety, some
people at work don't have safety, some people in their
neighborhoods don't have safety.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
What does it look like?
Speaker 4 (21:58):
What does it look like to create safety on this podcast?
Speaker 3 (22:02):
For you?
Speaker 4 (22:02):
What would what would it look like to be in
this bubble with us and to feel like you have
a safe place to process your political gripes, to get
talking points to take back to your families, into your communities.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
What does it look like to create safety here?
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Do we want that on video or in comments or both?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
I would love the videos I love because I want
to play them and see that I want I want
the video responses. We have a video on our Instagram
page at native lampod where you can see how to
submit a video. We will repost that in our stories
when this air, so you all can send in your
videos and let us know what safety looks like to
you on and.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
That. We love the money that jingles, but we prefer the.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
We did a whole Broadway routine in Central Park.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
We and our movies. We did a whole thing.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Anyway, Stay tuned for me and Andrew.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
I'm excited that he's got some movie lines.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
We have a whole.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
We'll do.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
That's well, that's so welcome home. Thanks for listening, y'all.
Remember to rate, review, subscribe, and tune into our regular
episode on Thursday. Thank you guys for giving us safety
to even have this platform. We look forward to hearing
how we can give you that safety back. Welcome home, y'all,
hey man, Welcome Home. Native Lampod is a production of
(23:28):
iHeartRadio and partnership with Recent Choice Media
Native Plan Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership
with Recent Choice Media. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome,
all right, Welcome home, everybody. This is Tiffany Gross, Andrew
Gailam and Angela Rai and you are tuned into this
week's mini pod. Welcome Home. Welcome Home is not enthusiastic enough.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome, we mean it, We mean it.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
I mean it.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I don't have to yell to be we mean it.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Welcome home. This is our home and this is your home.
And just like any family, we have disagreements sometimes, and
so we thought it was important to share one of
those more heated, intense discussions that we had last week
with you all, and to know that right after that
podcast was over, maybe ten minutes after everybody was good,
(00:51):
we were all all back, because that's how it works
with family.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Well, you skip some steps, but I'll let you have it.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
What do you we can say what we want to
say about it. And Andrew, do you want me to
say the whole thing or do you want me to say.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
I'll say this is I knew that in the moment
while we had already had a long day, and then
of course we got to the subject of what value
each of us puts on what we choose and desire
to platform. And that does feel a little personal because
you're now asking me what lens, what vet do I
put on on on what I think we should be
(01:28):
talking about on the show, and to the extent that
we scrutinize each other's you know, vetting, it could feel
real personal. So I completely got that. But I will
sell you this and I think I said this angelout tip.
I can't remember who one of y'all that. What I
knew in that moment, although it was very tense and whatnot,
(01:49):
was that we were not going to leave New York
without resolution, which is not something that I would bet on.
And many really relationships that I know of, friendships, romantic
relationships are otherwise where you have confidence that there's enough
love and respect in this space that before we leave
(02:13):
this place we will be reconciled, even if it is
we still disagree. But guess what, it was never my
intention to hurt you and not I'm really sorry that
you were hurt by what I say, like that backhanded thing.
Right fact, that's not going to happen because that's not
who we are that's not who we are at this
(02:34):
stage in our lives. And the other thing that I
appreciate about who we are and not who we are
about this stage in our lives is that I don't
think either of us feel like we've got to beast
one another like we got to one up end. I
don't feel like I have anything to prove to either
one of you. What I felt like I want to
do is to show up as my best self every time,
(02:57):
and even in those moments where I can't. I want
to be able to count on the fact that y'all
know me well enough that you and loved me and
care for me enough that you'll have grace and those
moments where we can't. And so I just I know
y'all have more to say about this, because you had
some after conversation. I just felt like, I know it's
(03:17):
heated right now, but you know what, keep it pushing
because we're not leaving this space without feeling complete.
Speaker 3 (03:23):
I love that. I think you know.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
I was feeling really defensive, and I was telling Tiff
when we walked out of the room, like we were
all walking down the stairs quietly. We recorded some other
evergreen content that honestly, it might end up being trash
because my energy was completely off. I wouldn't even hardly
look at tiv I was like lookingside was talking about
Andrew feels like he was talking himself, which doesn't just
(03:47):
happen when we're mad.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Sometimes Andrew to preach it anyway by himself.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
He'd be like, somebody gonna get it, hello, lights. But
the bottom line is I literally walked out the room
and I turned around the Tivy. I was like, you
hurt my feelings, and I was in tears, and then
she was like, don't cry. You're gonna make me cry,
and that is I mean, that's it. I think that
part of I think part of what happened is, you know,
a lot of times in life people aren't in tune
(04:15):
with where they are on their journeys.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
And so.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
I think I've done a lot of work from a
therapy perspective to like, no, oh, this person was rising
up because sixth grade Angela showed up.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
I was feeling bullied.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
Nobody was saying anything to bully me, but I was
feeling it, and Tiff give it. Being the media strategy
she is, she was like, oh my god, I could
see that because you were literally sandwich between me and Andrew
and we were on the same side.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
You were in the middle, so you're like squished. I
was like, oh my god, I didn't even think about that.
So there's that. Plus I'm not sleeping.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
We're working really hard on Marilyn Moseby's petition, like there's
so many things happening. I'm waking up at tiffany hours,
and for any of you all that know me, no,
like I'm a night out, so that means I'm sleeping
like three or four hours right now. So I think
I was uniquely tender from that, just like when you
have a little kid with if it's your child, you know,
it's like, oh, no, you need to go to bed.
It was one of those sleepy you're not thinking clearly,
(05:12):
you're you know, you're delirious, and I just I was
feeling tender, and so I thank God for this safe
podspace that we've created where I could say I'm feeling tender.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
And when Tiff said you think I said.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
That, how I heard it was very different than her
intention because she started feeling defensive, like, how could you possibly.
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Think I was saying that? And then I was like
why would you talk to me in that towne?
Speaker 4 (05:34):
And then we were crying, and then Andrew missed all
the tears, but I think deep down somewhere he probably
had one single thug tear, because.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
Every now and then not the glory tear too.
Speaker 4 (05:45):
But I will also just say I think one of
the things that that moment did for me, you guys,
is it made me connect to what our listeners may
have felt when they talked about how answer questions. And
so the question I have today really is, in this
space that we created, our pod, our unique little bubble,
(06:10):
our safety bubble, what is our obligation to each other
and then to our broader audience to hold that safe space,
to ensure that people don't feel over attacked, that they
don't feel like they're being put on the defensive, that
they don't feel like we're trivializing what they say, and
certainly that we're not doing that to each other. And
then what is our responsibility when somebody may have a
(06:32):
trigger that maybe we're not even aware of.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Like how do you navigate that space?
Speaker 4 (06:37):
I think this is one thing that will help us
not only be a better podcast, but better people to
be in relationship with whether it's your church, community, your family,
your friends, whomever, like, what is our responsibility collectively and
as individuals to create safety?
Speaker 1 (06:53):
Sure, well, I will give my assessment and answering that question.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I think.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
You know, Angela, you carry a lot, and we're all
Type A person out like extreme Type A personalities, and
it's very few people being a Type A personality. It's
very few people I'm going to trust that you have
it all together. But Angela is definitely one of those people.
If Angel's like I'm taking lead on this, I trust
that you have it all together. So my takeaway might
(07:24):
be a little different from both of you guys. My
takeaway is just because there are people in your life
and your circle who are always on top of things,
who always have it together, we have to also caution
ourselves that we're not doing the superwoman myths on these people,
you know, because honestly, the way I thought, I expected
this to be a brawl and how we cover, but
(07:46):
not a brawl in the way that it was. But
that Angel's going to feel really strongly and come back
and say, well, let me tell you why you and
Andrew are wrong. And I think I did not in
that moment hold space for everything and was feeling and
going through and doing and so the lesson I think
as a takeaway is don't assume because the person in
(08:07):
your life does always juggle on everything, is always on
top of it. Is always that person. Like we all
have a right to, you know, have a moment. You know,
ANGELI are always quick to take ownership of things. And
I'm like, I don't think it's all on anybody, you know,
I think it's in how we all collectively hold space
for each other. I'm giving sometimes, you know, Andrew was,
(08:28):
you know, saying we needn't be so high brow or whatever.
Like Andrew says said that to me sometimes, and I
wanted him to say it on air that day because
I'm like, they're probably people out there who feel that way.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
I like highlighting our different perspectives and disagreement because we
you know, we get to do that here. We didn't
get to do that in other spaces because we were
like under the umbrella of like black commentators. But the
the we're not homogeneous in our community and so we
get to have these nuanced disagreements in what we cover.
I thought it was a really robust conversation that one.
(09:00):
I don't like when things escalate to that level. But
the comfort in being friends with people for multiple decades,
as you know, there's is family, and it's going where
we wanted to be good and not we're going to
be good, you know. And we communicate spoken and unspoken,
you know. And so I wish Andrew had been on
his job and had been following me and behind the
(09:21):
scenes footage and getting us hugging in the alley whatever.
But it it just I thought, it's a different lesson,
I know. But then you should have been out there
on camera with your camera phone.
Speaker 3 (09:34):
No, I shouldn't have sas not loving hip hop to
like our vts.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
And I think we all deal with like these things differently, right,
So Angela at a different point may have needed us
to lean in or to pull out. But you and
I may have a different relationship with conflict or with
the way in which conflict is handled. So, for instance,
if things get too emotional for a long time, for me,
(10:01):
if things got really emotional, my first comment was, and
Jay is going to like, amen, this was You're not
a victim. We both have our grievances here, this is you,
This is where I am da da, but neither of
us are victims here. And it was now that in reflection,
I'm thinking, what a harsh insense it is, and like
(10:21):
non loving way to approach a conflict is to say
like you're not a victim. That is like the worst
place to go with it. And thank God for Angela
introducing me to therapy in a way that I had
never been before really helped me to get outside of it,
because the only thing I needed to hear was how
are you feeling? And whether I feel like I did
(10:44):
something to necessitate that or not. The truth is is
that a person who I love and cared deeply about
reacted to a thing that I did or said in
this way, and that isn't what I want to happen.
I want you to hear me, clearly, but I certainly
don't want to level you in the process. I don't
want you to walk away feeling like you're less intelligent,
or you have less to contribute, or that your voices
(11:06):
and as important or as valued. And I'll just disclose.
You know, Angelina, I had a conversation yesterday after our
don Limit interview, and I was, you know, saying to
her that you know, I've sort of gotten used to,
at least in some ways in our podcast, like not
really fighting for the space in every conversation. Like if
(11:30):
comments are being had or being said and either I'm
not invited directly into it, or the conversation takes place
and I've not made a contribution, my default position might
be like, Okay, I'm not of value at this space
and in this time. And the adjustment, or the compromise
(11:53):
I made with myself is like, Okay, just accept that
in some spaces and at certain times you won't be
of value. And what Angela was pointing out was that
may be an incident where you might not feel that way,
but to the point that that becomes now your conduct.
You've negotiated yourself into a space where every week you
(12:14):
now feel like you have to just sort of sit
with it, be quiet, keep it moving. Time is going.
I don't know how to shut up. Whatever the thing
is is that the self talk that I'm telling myself
now we are completely disrupting the very environment we're trying
to create for ourselves. The very environment we're trying to
create is that I don't have to be curated through
(12:36):
the world's lens that if this conversation takes me away
from one about politics and one about the fact that, gosh,
I feel, you know, no real worth in this moment,
and I don't want to be in a I have
too much respect for myself. I'd like to think that
I don't want to be anywhere where my contribution isn't valid,
(13:01):
where I'm not making a contribution at all. And to
your point, Angela, about where we have to be respectful
and where do our listeners show up? They show up
all the way through this. It breaks. I can't tell
y'all if you're on the listening side of this, what
it did to Angela and Tiffany when we got some
comments about from some of the listeners who said, I
(13:22):
felt like you all disrespected the questioner here, like you
just completely. I'm sitting on the I'm sitting here with
them on a you know, on the telephone, and they're like,
I can't believe that. I just I can't believe I
wasn't aware of that and this, and and they're going
back and forth. I'm like, y'all, you want to call
them on three ay, y'all want to FaceTime? I mean,
you're like, what are we.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
Going to do.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, I was saying.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
He was genuine.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
That's the scary part. He really wanted to FaceTime these people.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Absolutely was serious. I was like, we have to unburden this,
and I'm really sick of this. I can't believe we
said that. And I got to go back and look
at the video and all that kind off. I'm like, look,
which I want to do about it? And so so
just know that it isn't anyone's intention to go that way.
And I think in our apology the following week, I
mentioned that sometimes we're not even responding directly to what
(14:09):
the question is, which is part of our obligation to
respond to what the question is, because you posed it
and we respect you enough to give you an answer.
But we're responding to all of the clouds, the layers
of stuff that we've had to dig through all week,
and all of everybody else's misimpressions about that thing. And
now we feel like, oh, this is the window to
correct the rest of the world, not you, the questioner,
(14:31):
but the rest of the world on that perspective. And
so I have nothing but love and respect for our audience,
and that has to mean more than our words. That
it has to be manifest in our actions, not just
in the way that we experience it, but also the
way that you, our listeners, experience it. And that's just
the work in progress. But know our heart.
Speaker 1 (14:49):
Please all right, job, We're going to take a quick break,
but don't go anywhere, because we still want to talk
more about how to create safe spaces, not just for us,
but for you as well. We'll be right back. I
even like having this conversation and putting it out there
(15:10):
for our viewers because I want the audience to feel
like they are part of the conversation. And I think
what they appreciated about the mini pod last week is
they felt like they were eavesdropping on a private disagreement
with all of us. And I think all of us
maintain how we feel. I don't think Angela you feel
any different. I don't think Andrew you feel a different.
(15:31):
I don't feel any different. And it's like, yeah, we
can have these three opposing points of view and still
come together as family, as friends and you know, spend
time with you other and laugh and you know, nothing changes.
And I think that's what we're the society we're trying
to build and go for in terms of our audience
and the things that we platform here and creating a
(15:53):
safe space for our viewers and for each other. I
just want to make this plea to our audience and say,
even when we disagree with you, we love you. You know.
I think that I often say this to Angela, and
I probably said this to you too, Andrew, Like, I
think it's black people. We don't have the privilege to
dislike each other, you know, right, But but there are
(16:16):
people who you know, they're not my favorite people, you know,
So among us, I'm like, I don't really rock with him,
I don't really rock with her. But out here in
this world, if something were happening, then I got to
be a part of the army defending that person, you know.
And so we feel that way. Even when you give
a comment that I feel is a little disrespectful to
the w NBA, we still welcome you, brother, We welcome
(16:38):
you a comment, you know, like you're gonna have to
get some of the smoke.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Although I did think it was a hoax.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
But yeah, well either way, you know, I hope it wasn't.
I hope, I hope he had more respect for us
than giving a hoax. But who knows even when we
disagree that we want you to pull up a seat
to this table. You know, we've all come from spaces
where we didn't feel welcome. For twenty four years, I
didn't feel welcome in you know, mostly white run newsrooms
(17:04):
that constantly dismiss my input and value and opinions. So
I don't ever want either of my co hosts to
feel like they don't have value. And I certainly don't
want our audience, who shows up to us every week
twice a week to hear us, to not feel like
they have value. So we thank y'all for rocking with us,
for tuning in every week. I thank you Angela for
(17:26):
inviting me and Andrew to be part of this podcast
and build this thing brick by brick with you. I
think you Andrew for the times that we have on
this podcast. But honestly, my favorite time is when we're
not on the podcast, and it's just when Andrew and
I get one on one time. I feel like it's
so calming. I'm always telling you some personal drama I
(17:46):
have or something, you know, Andela off doing something, she's
going a flight, she doing something else, and I'm all
about like where's a good restaurant, so Andrew and I'll
go eat sometimes. But Angela and I also spend a
lot of time too as the ladies. We have a
whole girl group, so I get my alone time with
each of them. But with Andrew, I just I truly
(18:07):
value you, both personally and professionally. So I just I
love y'all for having the space and just thank y'all
for for for dealing on the days when I'm giving
whatever I'm giving, when i'm giving highbrow to Andrew told
you the anti when we were walking in Sancho Park.
(18:36):
He was so like smooth jazz when you know how
he does. Angela and he was like, I had I
was a bit elevated at the time. And sometimes when
I'm like that, I it means I go inward. Okay,
I just get mute. What does that mean to It
means that I had a mood ordering substance that sent
me on a flight. Okay, and it is a good,
(18:59):
beautiful Okay. Andrew was talking to me, and I hear it.
But sometimes your thoughts are like they run away. You're
like no, no, no, wait, and the thought is gone. And
Andrew was like, you know when you get like this,
you just have this judgmental look on your face, and
I don't care for it.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Just exuding judgment.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
But I have It's not even it just I was
laughing so hard because he said it was just so
funny to me. I'm like, see this, y I don't
care for it.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
I don't care for it.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
It's just it's so proper that in most places I
wouldn't have two words to say to the other person
about how they look or what they're giving.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
Andrew, you give the craziest cussouts with no cuss words
and big words. Sometimes you make up the words as well.
But yeah, like yes, baby, hilarious.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
All right?
Speaker 1 (19:52):
Do we do we feel complete with this conversation or
do we.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Well, we didn't read the comment I wanted to read.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
I believe it's Denice Paris right, and it says I
have been listening to your podcast since episode one. Just
so y'all know, we are not going to make a
practice of reading these comments. We expect for you to
send in videos, but just because it was on point
since episode one, I share the podcast a few times.
I believe in what you are doing because it is
(20:18):
imperative and needed. After listening to your last mini pod,
I resonate with all your viewpoints because they are valid.
I must say I lean toward Angela as I too
was blindsided, as I would have never imagined millions on
millions of people could ever be scammed by Trump. I
am from NYC, and my very arrogance thought people knew
(20:41):
he was deplorable in every aspect of being empty, nothing
good and possibly evil. Keep going and know that your
valuable information is appreciated. Keep fighting for the good and
as you know, great things start small. Sometimes I love
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
I love that I share. I'm assure you of it.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
Angela, No, no, no, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (21:03):
I really think like she was like, I agree with
her screaming on the podcast. She was saying she agreed
with like being blindsided by like y'all really think you
should vote for this?
Speaker 3 (21:13):
That was ny get it? Yeah, so not that part.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
But yes, I do appreciate the I But you know,
I appreciate that no matter how we feel or what
we say, we're three intelligent people with people out there
who will reflect back like yes you had a good point,
or yes I agree with you, or yes I agree
with all three of you. All I think that's what
it's for, So I like that we You don't want
all three of us having the same perspective coming up
(21:38):
with the same ideas, you know, Yeah, well we don't.
But the one thing I would love to ask our listeners,
if you guys don't mind, is we didn't dive enough
into what it looks like to create a safe space.
And since we are so lacking and safety in so
many places. Some people at home don't have safety, some
people at work don't have safety, some people in their
neighborhoods don't have safety.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
What does it look like?
Speaker 4 (21:58):
What does it look like to create safety on this podcast?
Speaker 3 (22:02):
For you?
Speaker 4 (22:02):
What would what would it look like to be in
this bubble with us and to feel like you have
a safe place to process your political gripes, to get
talking points to take back to your families, into your communities.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
What does it look like to create safety here?
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Do we want that on video or in comments or both?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
I would love the videos I love because I want
to play them and see that I want I want
the video responses. We have a video on our Instagram
page at native lampod where you can see how to
submit a video. We will repost that in our stories
when this air, so you all can send in your
videos and let us know what safety looks like to
you on and.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
That. We love the money that jingles, but we prefer the.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
We did a whole Broadway routine in Central Park.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
We and our movies. We did a whole thing.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Anyway, Stay tuned for me and Andrew.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
I'm excited that he's got some movie lines.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
We have a whole.
Speaker 4 (22:58):
We'll do.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
That's well, that's so welcome home. Thanks for listening, y'all.
Remember to rate, review, subscribe, and tune into our regular
episode on Thursday. Thank you guys for giving us safety
to even have this platform. We look forward to hearing
how we can give you that safety back. Welcome home, y'all,
hey man, Welcome Home. Native Lampod is a production of
(23:28):
iHeartRadio and partnership with Recent Choice Media
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