November 14, 2023 • 59 mins
This week Brian celebrates the end of the SAG-AFTRA strike with star of Hulu's The Other Black Girl, Sinclair Daniel. They discuss Sinclair’s bi-coastal beginnings, how New York City shaped her early acting experiences, and the highs and lows of releasing a TV show during the actors' strike.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Once I got the role, I did chemistry reads with
all the Owens, all the Malaikahs. So I was on
the phone with these people a lot. Okay, I don't
even remember at what point I had the job. I
was just like, I hope there's a lab at the
end of this.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
I'm Sinclair Daniel and I play Nella and the other
Black Girls streaming on Hulu.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hello everybody, and welcome back to Off the Beat. I
have got some pep in my step today, of course.
I'm your host, Brian Baumgartner and Ding Dong. The Witch
is dead. Maybe you've heard the news, maybe you haven't.
The Screen Actors Guild strike is over. One hundred and
(00:53):
eighteen days later, sag Aftra has reached a deal with
the studios who that was a long time. We have
a new contract now that hopefully we'll make all this
time off worth it. It's been such a long road,
but I am so happy that we can all get
back to work now, which includes talking about shows, particularly
(01:18):
talking about new shows. Yes, now you may have noticed
there was a dearth of actors joining me on the
podcast here. Well, there's a very very good reason for that,
because nobody was allowed to talk about any shows or
movies that we're currently streaming on any platform. So I
have been chomping at the bit to tell you about
(01:41):
a recent project I did. As some of you know
from my conversations last year, I had the absolute pleasure
to work on the show The Other Black Girl, and
my guest today is the star of our show, Sinclair Daniel.
Sinclair plays Nella, who works at a publishing company. I
(02:03):
played Colin, one of the authors that said publishing company represents.
The show focuses on how Nella navigates office dynamics, race relations,
and well otherness as a black woman in a white
dominated space. Sinclair does an absolutely beautiful job as Nella,
(02:26):
dealing with all of the complexity and humor and darkness
that comes with She is so good everybody, and it
is so good for me to finally be able to
talk to another actor about well acting, especially new, recent,
important and great work. So I am so excited to
(02:48):
dive right back in to let you get to know
the funny, the brilliant, and the so so so talented
Sinclair Daniel. Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeak,
(03:09):
Bubble and Squeak, cooking every move over from the night. People. Hey,
how are you? I'm good? How are you?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
I'm good.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
It's been so long now.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I know, it's been a couple of like lifetimes.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
How are you doing.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
I'm good. You know. It's just now starting to get
like wintery cold. So drinking a lot of tea, wearing
a lot of scarves, having a good time.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Okay, you're in New York, right, yeah, I am yeah,
and it's getting it's getting cold. You're feeling fall.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
I'm feeling fall. We usually skip fall and skip spring
and just go straight to the extremes. So I'm really
trying to revel in the niceness that is happening outside
right now.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Well, you and I, Oh my gosh, we last. It's
been almost a year before if you could believe that, Uh,
it's been almost a year. I want to tell everybody
about how we got to know each other. But I
want but I want I want to start. I want
to start just with you. I want to I want to.
(04:32):
I wanta this is your life. This is okay, this
is s Claire Daniel's life. You grew up in New York?
Is that right?
Speaker 1 (04:40):
No? I didn't. Actually, I grew up in d C.
So not super far. But I was born in d
C and then lived around that DC Maryland, Virginia area
for a little bit, and then in high school and moved.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
To California, California. Where in California, Pasadena? Oh there, Da,
it's actually very nice and it's a really nice place.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
So you went to high school out here?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I did? Yeah, I went to LaSalle High School shout
out for two years. Shout out LaSalle in Pasadena.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah. Yeah, what was your So why did you move
to California? Was this? Was this a parental thing?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah? So my mom's parents were living in California and
she was looking for a little bit of a change
and they were getting older, so it just made sense
to go out there. We would go a couple of
times a year anyway. So you just hit the bullet.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
He bit the bullet and moved out. What what were
you interested in as a as a kid? What were
you what were you focused on? What were you interested in?
Speaker 1 (05:52):
I was really I was a theater kid through and through.
I was. Yes, I was just having this conversation with
my cousin the other night and she was like, wait,
how did you get into this again? I mean the
The answer is I had a lot of allergies as
a kid, and both my parents worked full time jobs,
so I needed something to do from three to six
(06:14):
pm that was indoors, okay, because I couldn't do the
sports without having an athletsack or an allergy episode. So yeah,
theater was kind of the answer for me, and I
just liked it, so I stayed with it.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, so this is like you're talking about like even
elementary school or was this like in high school?
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Okay, probably starting around fifth grade, and so I was
really into that. I was really I also liked winter
activity sports, so I also because no pollen, I liked
to ski and ice skate what you can also do
in California, which was very exciting to learn, right, surf
(06:58):
and ski in the same day.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And we're are you doing Were you doing like school
plays or were you branching out from that children's theater
or Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
I was doing the school plays. We would do like
one play in one musical year, and then I would
also do some summer programs. I started to do those.
I did like community Christmas time, theater productions, pretty much
anything that would allow like a kid to just come
(07:28):
and participate. I was. I was pretty into that.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And when you moved to Pasadena, did you get into
the I mean, I find it so lame, like to
call it Hollywood, but for lack of a better, more
accurate phrase, like did you start doing an agent thing
or were you doing commercials or were you still pretty
much just strictly doing theater in school and stuff.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Yeah, I was not doing all that stuff. I was
really of all the kids who were. I wanted to
be the kid who had to leave school early because
I had an audition and sorry, I can't come. I'm
going on the Disney Channel next week. But I was
very much not that. My mom was like, you're gonna
(08:15):
stay in school and if you do the play in school,
that's fine. I think I went to like one quote
unquote Hollywood audition and they required that we emancipated ourselves,
and so my mother said absolutely not and we went home.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Really yeah, I think I was.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
I could not even tell you what it was. I
went in. I was so excited I got to do
this one audition. It went really well. They called my
mom and they're like, okay, so how do you guys
feel about emancipation from your parent and I didn't know
if that was so I was like, yeah, let's do it,
and she said no, no, no, no, Wow.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I didn't even know that was a real And what's
the what's the point of that so they can better
control you?
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, I think it's so they can screw you over.
I think it's just like so they can have a
fourteen year old sign on the dotted line and they
don't need like a co uh, a co signer, no
guardian or anything. You speak for yourself essentially, or you
temporarily turn over your rights to somebody else. Like kind
of interesting dark when I got into it.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Wow, so that is that. That is not a good
that's not a good start. I'm surprised you are where
you are now, that's crazy, all right, So you you
continue to do the theater stuff, and then what makes
you decide now, okay, so you're doing theater because you
(09:52):
have allergies. You need an activity to do, right, But
when when is the moment for you that it changes
and you decide, no, no, this is not an activity.
Because everybody sort of has these moments right where it
turns from an activity to like, oh no, I can
this is what I want to do, Yeah, what what
(10:14):
was that? What was that for you?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I think it was less of a like Eureka moment
and more of, you know, the span of a couple
of years. And when I got to the age where
the school play was no longer kind of a requirement
or like you know, most kids didn't have to be
in it, I kept doing it because I thought it
(10:41):
was really fun. And I think that's really what has
always been the motivating factor to me, is that it's
just so much fun. And then in high school, when
I moved to California, they had a pretty good arts department,
and I joined their arts department. And really what it
came down to is college application. Because for whatever reason,
(11:02):
we ask seventeen year olds what they want to do
for the rest of their lives.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
It's crazy. I charge them.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Hundreds of thousands of dollars to follow through on that.
So I had to really sit with myself and just say,
what do I want to do for the rest of
my life? And the only thing that came up for
me really that I thought I was any good at
or that made me happy, or that I could in
(11:27):
reality see myself doing for a long time was acting
and performing. So I applied to college with that. That's
what I ended up majoring in. And luckily I had
parents who are very supportive of that dream and saw
it as a valid degree choice kind of path.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah, me too. You know, I think that we're rare.
I mean, you make the joke, but you know it
is true. It's it's insane that people are asked at
that age like, so what do you want to study?
What's your focus for work? Ever? But I think most
(12:08):
people change like three or four, absolutely five times. But
it sounds like you and myself, like once I got
on the train and it was a similar time for
me in high school. It was like, oh no, this
is this is actually what I want to do. You
went for it. Now you ended up going to the
(12:30):
prestigious Tish School of the Arts. They're back in now
your hometown of New York. Was this an audition process you, Yeah,
you auditioned to get in there.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yes, this was probably. College auditions were probably the most
stressful audition I've ever had in my life. And I'm
including TV movies, Broadway like college auditions, you know, states
were high and yes, so most schools require you to
do a contemporary monologue and a contrasting classical monologue, if
(13:11):
not more. And n Yu didn't ask for a classical monologue.
They just wanted to contemporary monologues. And they sent a
representative out to Los Angeles, which was nice, so I
didn't have to fly across the country. It was in
some hotel downtown where I think I later had prom
It was weird, but we go in there. I was
first of the day, first in line. I was like,
(13:31):
I need to get this over with so I can
start reading again. I go in there, I do my thing,
and then they ask for I do both my monologue,
and they ask for a classical monologue Shakespeare, and that
was not something on their requirements, and I had not
done it yet for my other auditions. I was keeping
that in my back pocket because the time hadn't come yet.
(13:54):
So I was panicking, and I remember taking my shoes off.
I just to like ground myself, and I took my
shoes off and I was in my socks and I
did my Shakespeare and then I left and it was
it was good. It ended up being working out. I
really didn't expect it to happen. I think it was
(14:15):
the only non California school I applied to It was
a pipe dream, but yeah it was. You know, you're
just sitting there in a hallway with other nervous, scared teenagers.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Just imagine what was Tish where you wanted to go?
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Yeah, I mean I had, I had, I had a
top three and Tish was on the top three. But
really I did not even think I would get in.
It just seemed like such a a dream reach, you know,
going to study acting in New York City. That's that
could never happen to somebody like me. But it did,
(15:01):
and I'm so glad I made that choice to apply
to try and then.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Also to go What did give you.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
A lot? And I also gave them a lot and
I'm still giving them some every month. But I did
get a lot out of that experience. I mean, I
still live in New York and going to college here.
My circle hasn't. I mean, I've met more people, but
my college circle is now my professional circle. These are
(15:34):
now people that hire me and I work with and
we just see each other all the time and it's amazing.
So it gave me a really amazing foundational community. You know,
I moved here as a teenager and I was hanging
out with other teenagers. And now these teenagers are associate
(15:55):
directors on Broadway. They are in the casting office at
CBS like we are, and we're friends. It gave me that,
It gave me a great sense of independence. There's not
much of a campus here. Our famous tedious slogan is
the city is your campus. So and yeah, that's what
(16:16):
they tell you. Give us all your money and we
won't even give you a quad. But it did. I mean,
I was going. I got an internship my freshman year
that was in Lincoln Center. I was seeing art shows
for free. I was taking advantage of all of the
student discounts for museums and outings and all these wonderful things.
(16:42):
So I felt like I grew up at my own speed,
at my own pace, but in a place that was
really built for me. I really felt a deep connection
to New York. I still do. I love it here
so much, and coming here through college was a really
(17:05):
fortunate transition. Wasn't just here had to figure stuff out?
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, I mean you bring up a couple of super
interesting points in terms of you know, you're in this
school and as you say, there's no quad, the city's
your campus, But it sounds like you really took advantage
of that and having though that variety of experience. It's
(17:33):
sort of the opposite of most college experiences, right, because
I feel like, almost intentionally, most colleges are we are
a bubble to help protect you and help you to
become who you're going to become. Right, I mean it's
like we're it's insular in a way, whereas it sounds
(17:59):
to me like for you, you had because you went
to NYU and you have these discounts. You didn't have
money or whatever, and but you were able to go
out and have those experiences in the city, which, right,
I mean, let's be honest, that's an that's a part
of the education I think of itself.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Right, Probably the best sell NYU can make is where
it is. It is New York University, so you get
New York that is promised. Yeah. I felt like a
baby bird being shoved out of the nest. But yeah,
(18:37):
we the adjustment period was brief because the city ways
for no one and then you just get on board
and it's been amazing.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah, do you feel like you like there's an experience
from when you're in high school and you're working on
shows and you have accomplished have you know, you've had
a various degree of success or whatever. You go to NYU,
(19:06):
which is an actor training program, which is the same
type of school that I went to. Do you feel
like you were I always felt like I was sort
of punched in the face very quickly about like, oh, no, son,
you don't know, you don't know anything. Yeah, right, like
you have you know, instincts, you have stage presence, but no,
(19:29):
this is do you feel like was that your experience
as well? Like here we're now going to tell you
how this actually works.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Yeah, we had a lot of uh that going on
in those first couple of weeks we had We had
people drop out in the first couple of weeks. It's
it's it's stark, and it's sudden. It's like, you know, ice,
cold water just being thrown on your face, right, And
a lot of kids who were previously big fishes in
(19:56):
little ponds, right and now diny minnows in the Pacific Ocean.
So I knew that going in, though I wanted that.
I wanted kind of to be punched in the face
a little because to me, that makes it real. I
wanted the hard work. I didn't want to fall into
(20:17):
any type of misconception that I'm going to move to
New York and like walk straight onto a set the
day I graduate. I wanted it to feel like I
was working hard so that when I accomplished things, I
wouldn't be afraid of them. But we yeah, we had.
(20:37):
I think probably what like a third didn't come back
for second year, switched majors or switched schools, switch cities.
You know, it's not for everybody, but it did happen.
I had a teacher on one of my first acting classes.
She just walks in the door and she goes, how
(21:00):
many of you have divorced parents? And you're like, oh,
that's kind of personal. But I raised my hand and
said it a couple of other people and she said,
I don't really know why the rest of you are
even here. And I was thinking to myself, what thing
to say looking around at all the happily married, a
(21:22):
couple of parent children in the room, well the tables
and turns.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Did you want to do theater? You wanted to be
an actor? You went you, you got in as an actor.
Did you want to do theater? What? Where? Where was
your brain? I mean you're still young, so I mean
you transition pretty quickly. But were did you want to
be an actor in anything? Did you have a particular
view in mind for what your future held.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
I think I went in like everybody else, wanting to
be in movies and on a hit television show with
many seasons and spin offs and reboots. And then I
got to New York and I really fell in love
with theater. I'd already been doing it, but to see
it done at a professional level consistently everywhere I went
(22:34):
was so inspiring, and I really wanted to do that.
So my junior year I actually opted to go study
abroad in London and study at RADA because I wanted
classical training. I wanted to go see West End shows,
fringe shows. I wanted to be in it. And then
(22:56):
I came back in my senior year, I went to
the film and television studio to just kind of go
the other way, and I was like, oh, yeah, I
really do like this stuff, so ultimately I'm all, I
like all of it. I want to do all of it.
I just did a play and it was the first
play I'd done in a while, and it felt so good,
(23:17):
you know, I was exhausted. I made no money, and
I couldn't have been happier I was. It just felt,
you know, your whole body gets engaged, and it's a
nice reminder for why I got into this.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Yeah, it's funny, I I think. I think that's the
difference between NYU and most other actor conservatory training programs.
I think because you said you entered of course wanting
TV series like that was never in my consciousness early on,
(23:56):
Like I just wanted to be an actor in the
theater like that was like that was the only thing
that I wanted and the only thing that I thought
that I would ever do, And I didn't even really
think about that. NYU has great actor training. How much
training are you getting? I mean you said, and I
(24:16):
don't know exactly what this means when you went back
your senior year film and television, Are you getting film
and television acting training as well, or training in the
business at all, or how does that work there?
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Yeah? They have so at ny you have to do
primary training first, so when you go you get sorted
into a studio. I always compare it to the Harry
Potter sorting hat. It's all the same school, but different
acting techniques, right, you don't get to choose, and you
have to stay there for two years. And then after
your two years you can go abroad, you can try
(24:51):
a different acting studio, or you can go do your
film and TV stuff, but you're not allowed to do
until you finish your theater training. So there's a school
NYU called Stone Street Studios, and that's the film and
TV side of things, and they really try and make
it all of those all of those things that you're
talking about. So it's you know, you work on camera
(25:14):
with scene work, scene study, but you also have classes
on how to read a call sheet and what a
typical contract might look like. And we have guest speakers
come in and then we have to role plaze the
first eighty, the second eighty, the boom op, the gaffer,
like you learn those things, which I actually found to
(25:37):
be the most valuable part of the whole education at
Stone Street was just learning how a set actually runs.
I don't know, nobody's gonna slow it down and explain
it to you want to get there.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
I know that, and I was when I started in
film and television. I was much older and knew not
absolutely nothing. And that's what I always say, like, in
some ways the hardest part of the job is like
figuring out how it actually works. Like if it's just
about saying your lines in character to another person, I'm
(26:11):
good with that. Like wait, why is this? Why is
this person under me? Why am I rattling this person
right now? I'm saying everyone close, everyone, so in my
face all the time. Yeah, uh, that's that's fascinating. All right.
So you graduate, You're in the big city. What what
(26:35):
what are you? What are you trying to do? Are
you just trying to work? It doesn't matter where it is.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
So I immediately I've been working as like hearing their
jobs through college Marista nannying, And then when I graduated,
I started working at a gym because I wanted to
have my days free to go sit around for hours
at Actors Equity and like hope to get seen for
(26:59):
an audition. So I would start my work day at
like four point thirty in the morning so that I
could be done by noon and then I could go
to Actors Equity and wait for six hours and then
maybe get seen live in the dream. So that was
post grad immediately, and I had done a showcase in
my senior year. Second semester and I had met my
(27:21):
manager and she was kind of just like, I like you,
let's see how this goes. So she would send me
little auditions here and there. I got my first TV appearance,
which was very cool for me, on one of those
New York courtroom shows. What was it was Madam Secretary.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Okay, that's what I thought, Madam Secretary.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
She wasn't that one. One wasn't actually that court roomy,
but it was. It's, you know, very New York type show.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Media Costello, Media Costello in Madam Secretary. So how was
that experience? Like being on a set for the first.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Time is incredible, I am. I mean every time I
step on a set, it's amazing. But I don't think
anything can really top the first time that you get
to go and you're sitting in the hair and makeup
chair and you're handed your scene for the day, and
you know, you get to talk to the director, you
get to talk to the actor who you've been watching
(28:22):
on television, Like there's just something so exciting about that.
I was nervous, so nervous, and I even now sometimes
when I watch that scene back, like, oh goodness, girl,
loosen up. Read a little bit, but you know, all
in time, it was. It was a really fun day.
I was just so happy, and I remember calling my
(28:45):
parents and I was like, I'm gonna be on TEAMV.
It was so exciting.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
But you were you were nervous, Yeah, I was.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
I was nervous. I was really nervous.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
How many days did you have that first time?
Speaker 1 (29:01):
I was there for five hours? It was not days.
A scene where we were sitting at a table, so
they did one over the shoulder, another over the shoulder,
wid at a medium. They called it okay.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
You end up working on some other shows there in
New York, Bull for one, The Good Fight. Do you
do you feel like you start gaining confidence with these
guest stars, you start feeling more comfortable, or is every
time you still get nervous.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
I mean, honestly, I find new reasons to get nervous
every time. It's different nerves. But when I was on
The Good Fight, I was My scene was with Audrey
McDonald and then Christine Baranski's sitting right across the table
from us, and I have to be talking about my
(29:57):
dead friend and I'm just in the presence of legends,
trying to sitting on a stand in a courtroom, so
everyone's just staring at me, and I'm staring at Audre
McDonald and she smelled so good and I just wanted
her to come stand next to me, and so that
made me nervous, but that was also a really it
ended up being a really fun day and Bull. I
(30:20):
was nervous because it was my first day, my first
job where I was on for multiple days. So I
was on Bull for I think ten days, So I
was nervous about that, you know, building a character, an
arc or something like that. But all of the previous
experiences inform the next one, which is great, But it
(30:44):
doesn't mean I'm not going to be nervous every time
I step onto a set, because it's always something new
to be nervous about.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yeah, I know you did a lot. I mean I
have seven here listed in front of me. I won't
go through all the titles, but a lot of short
films gaining experience. Now is this are these projects that
you're doing with some of your NYU cohorts. You guys
are putting stuff together, just trying to work there.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
Yeah. Some of them were NYU friends that we were,
you know, working with. Some were casting calls that I
answered in college just for other universities looking for actors.
One of my teachers had a friend who was making
(31:33):
a production who needed somebody and recommended me. And oh
I also spent a summer at Williamstown Theater Festival.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Oh yeah, me.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Eighteen and I was an apprentice there, and I'd say
second to NYU, if not even on par with NYU
as far as networking and meeting people, that was really great.
So a lot of those short films came out of
collaboration with people from there. You know, you just pick
up people along the way, and especially with social media
(32:06):
now you can just get connected so easily. Right, So
people are always looking for somebody to be in their
short film, and if you have the patience to do it,
they'll let you do it.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Right. At this point, you're auditioning, trying to find work,
working some in the theater. As you mentioned before, how
do you meet the folks on the other Black Girl?
Speaker 1 (32:36):
So, yes, I was coming out of When was that
so twenty twenty one? Is that twenty twenty one? Yes,
twenty twenty one, the top of twenty to twenty one.
I'm coming off of like a year nothing. I had
signed with my agent in February twenty twenty, and then
(32:56):
we all know what happens two weeks.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Later, right right, was just there was great timing.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Great timing. I yeah, fresh out of school. I was like,
I'm gonna take this by the whole, nothing, nothing, silence.
So top of between twenty one, I think one of
my first auditions is I get something in my inbox
says like untitled Insidious project, and I didn't know what
(33:24):
that meant, so I was like, I'm just gonna submit.
I get a call back, and then I find out
it's the Insidious franchise, like the horror movies, and I'm like,
oh my gosh, I actually love these. So I end
up booking that, and I while I'm on set for that,
I get this audition for the show called The Other
Black Girl. At this point, I'm sleeping on my friend's
couch underneath his bookshelf, and on his bookshelf is The
(33:47):
Other Black Girl. And so I novel the novel the book.
So I'm looking at my computer and I said, I've
seen that before, and I just turn around and grabbed
the book and start reading. And I was like, Okay,
well great, but I'm also trying to learn my lines
for this movie I'm doing, so I'm not really that focused.
So I when it comes time for my audition, I'm
(34:09):
on set for Insidious, I have to talk to the
director before Patrick Wilson. He was so lovely for this.
He gave me like an extra long lunch break and
he moved around the schedule so I could do this
zoom audition for the other Black Girl. And it was
great because I was already in hair makeup and I
was like, I feel fabulous, and so that was how
(34:30):
I got my first audition for that, and I auditioned
for Nella and then when they called me back, they
wanted me to read for Hazel. So I read for
Hazel and then they said, actually, you know, we kind
of feel like you fall in between these two characters
too much, so we're going to pass. And I was
(34:54):
pretty disappointed because I was like, I kind of feel
like I could do this. I feel like I get
this person character. But you know what happens. They passed,
and then three weeks later they called me back and
they said, we actually want to have you back in
for Nola. And at that point it just goes like
rapid fire. It's pretty much a call a week or
two calls a week or something like that. But it
(35:16):
ended up being like a July to October process.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
How many times did you read for them?
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (35:25):
How many times?
Speaker 1 (35:26):
I don't know. I want to say. I did my Nella,
I did my Hazel. I think I did one more
Nella after that, and then I did kind of like
a bracket style chemistry read which took three hours, and
then I did two chemistry reads with Ashley, who ended
up playing Hazel. And then once I got the role,
(35:51):
I did chemistry reads with all the Owens, all the Malaikahs.
So I was on the phone with these people a lot.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Okay, I don't.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Even remember point I had the job. I was just like,
I hope there's a job at the end of this.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Wow. I had no idea.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
It was quite the process. Yes, So also different countries.
I was traveling. I was on vacation, so I was
on a road trip on in a van in Iceland
when I had my first chemistry read and they said
we want to see you tomorrow. So I had to
get on my phone and find the nearest hotel on
the Icelandic like country side where the whole country's population
(36:34):
is like two hundred and fifty thousand people found one
room with the strongest WiFi in Iceland. I still think
about that hotel.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
And I did. I did my my reads in there.
My friend sat in the van. Wow, it was chaos.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
That's incredible. Did you when you when you were when
you were sleeping under the bookshelf and you turned around
and you picked up the book. Did you respond to
the book? I mean, I know you wanted a job
and spoiler alert, it's the lead, But did you respond
did you respond to the to the to the book?
Was there? Yes? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I mean when I picked up the book, I read
the back or the inside cover wherever the synopsis was,
and I said, this sounds really, really good. And then
I read the first couple of chapters. And then they
had also sent me the pilot, so I read the
pilot script and between I did all of that at
the same time. So between all of that, I was
already pretty hooked. I really felt like I knew who
(37:35):
Nella was and I identified with a lot of the
things that I was reading about her. And I didn't
finish the book until the end of the audition process.
I kind of didn't want to know how it ended,
but I was as they were sending me scripts, I
(37:57):
was reading little bits of the book and just kind
of getting more and more interested. And since it's it's
it's not necessarily mystery, but thriller. The not knowing, I
thought was helping me. I Wela doesn't know what's happening
to her, so I shouldn't know what's happening either.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
That's very That's very interesting and astute of you. I think.
By the way, the other black Girl New York Times
best selling book, Rave Book made into a series. Now,
did you have any connection with Rashida Jones.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Besides being a lifelong fan. Nope. I saw her name
and I was I called my dad had Jones. That's
what it says. Unless there's another one.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Yeah, I had no idea. They put you guys through
the ringer.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
Yeah, it was you know, and we all got there
and I was talking to everybody else, and Ashley had
a similar experience. I think they wanted to get it
right that those two relationship, I understand, you know, it
was you could find one but maybe didn't have great
chemistry with the other. And they made Ashley and I. I
think Ashley and I tested together two or three times
(39:16):
and it took hours, but nobody was trying to be
aloof about it. At one point, Todd, our producing director,
straight up set He's like, we really like you too,
and we really like you two together, so we're just
going to give you some stuff to heighten it so
we can send it off to the people at Hulu
(39:36):
and they'll love you as much as we do. And
I appreciated that transparency.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Yeah, that's awesome. You get this job, your first obviously
(40:03):
central leading role of a big series. Now, is there
nerves from you in beginning to work on the show.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
Yeah, there's nerves. It's a whole new thing to be
nervous about.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I I don't even know how to tell you the
nerves I was experiencing. But yes, lead of a show
that was a very well liked book, that's going to
be on a very popular streaming platform. And everyone kept
reminding me that, like, this is so cool. You're going
(40:42):
to be the lead of a hula show. You've never
done that before.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Yes, I know, yeah, I know that.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
So you know, I was really happy that we got
to go down a few weeks before we started shooting,
so we got to talk to everybody, We got to
do a few rehearsals, which I think is pretty rare
in the space, and had got to have a relationship
with the people we'd be spending the next four months
with ahead of time. And because the show moved so quickly,
(41:17):
we shot ten episodes in under four months, and we
were block shooting, so we were shooting multiple episodes at
the same time. The timeline was all messed up. We're
having different directors come in, we're having new actors join us. Honestly,
all that was going on really didn't give me enough
time to be nervous after a while, which I really appreciated.
(41:41):
We were just so busy and everyone there cared about
what we were making so much, and I was actually
just having so much fun because we had so many
amazing comedians on set and funny people that the whole
energy vibe was light, even though we were doing this
(42:02):
pretty herculean thing.
Speaker 2 (42:04):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting because you know, there are
you and Ashley and a lot of the other actors
who well, primarily one young with less experience, and then
you know you have people coming in like Eric McCormick
and Bellamy Young. Well, I was there. I was there
(42:30):
for a little bit, but I really enjoyed my work
with you. I thought you were fantastic to work with
and so open and receptive to Shenanigans that I would
try to.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
I appreciate it with you. I appreciated it because that
was still kind of early on in our process. So
every curveball took me out of my own head a
little bit. And I remember specifically that that that we
were doing where you know, Nella's fighting tooth and nail
through an apology and we got really I don't I
(43:11):
don't know what you and Dodd talked about, but every
take was different and I appreciated it. It was It
was great. But yes, being the youngest, the greenest on
set was daunting until I realized nobody else cared. They
(43:34):
they were They just wanted us all to do a
good job. Nobody was whispering, she's so young, this is
her first big job. They were like, we'd all hang
out in the actors holding and joke around and everybody
was just there was no hierarchy of of uh, you know,
(43:54):
status or anything. We were all chilling together and it
was really nice.
Speaker 2 (43:59):
Yeah, well, I mean it certainly helps that you're really good. No,
I mean, let's be honest about it, because if I mean,
if you were bad, yeah, there would have there would
have been tons of whisky. Yeah, yeah, there would have been,
especially from that McCormick guy. He is yeah, he is evil.
(44:20):
Love he can be he can be so evil. So
the show out in September.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
We're in the middle of sixty days, six days ago.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Today, sixty days ago today.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Well, maybe not six days, two months.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
Months, yeah, September, that's right, September thirteenth. We how did
let me tell you something. I felt horribly for you
and for Ashley, because I I just felt like this
(45:00):
was not fair to the two of you. Obviously, spoiler
alert for those of you listening. The show comes out
and we're in the middle of the first actor strike
in over fifty years. That's right, the last actor strike.
(45:22):
Ronald Reagan was president of the Union, not of the
United States. So it's over fifty years ago since the
last strike. And so they're making up rules as we
go along because there's no playbook to what happens, and
(45:42):
we're told that we cannot promote shows that that is
part of our job, which it is, is to promote shows,
and we were on strike, so that is not something
we were to do. And let me tell you, I
felt horribly for you and for Ashley because your work
(46:03):
is so strong and the material is so good. The
end product, which I watched by myself without talking about
it either, was so strong that I felt terribly for
you that you were not able to go through the
experience and get the attention that you deserved to get
(46:24):
for the work that you did. Was that difficult for
you for it to come out and not be able
to talk about it.
Speaker 1 (46:30):
Yeah, I would be lying if I said it wasn't difficult.
Speaker 2 (46:33):
Don't lie.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Yeah. No, it was such a conplex amalgamation of conflicting emotions.
It was just, you know, highs and lows every day.
I think that the actor strike was announced on June
twelfth or July twelfth, and our show, the Hollywood Reporter
(46:57):
announced our show's release date, so we were almost exactly
in line with the actors strike. So we had been
told in advance, you know, keep your summer open. We
have this big press rollout. We had talks about maybe
going up to Tiff and you know, they wanted to
(47:18):
do the talk show circuits and they wanted to do
all this, and it was so exciting also because you know,
this was my first anything of the size, and then
to learn in one day that none of that was
going to be happening, and that they were also going
to release the show without the promo and not bump
(47:39):
the release date we had. Yeah, that day was tough.
That that that learning that was like, oh no, the
next six months of my life that I've kind of
cleared out for this big thing is just not going
to happen anymore. But the show did still come out,
(48:00):
and though we were not allowed to talk about it
publicly or promote it publicly or post about it, it
really kind of personalized this experience for me because I
still heard from a lot of people. I still got
texts and calls and messages from folks I haven't heard
(48:22):
from in years, or I don't even know directly, and
they'd be sending me random billboards from Cincinnati or Los
Angeles or Chicago or Philadelphia. People from different countries are
reaching out to me saying they've watched the show, and
it's given me a little bit more time to read
those messages and have conversations with the people in my
life who were happy for me and have been following
(48:45):
this accomplishment. And at the end of the day, as
fun as all that stuff would have been, you can't
really miss what you never had. I am excited for
whatever project will allow me to have those type of experiences,
but I am no less proud of the work that
we did on this show. I'm glad that SAG was
(49:07):
able to get a deal that they feel is fair
so that next time we can go all out. But yeah,
you know it was. It was a lot of conflicting
emotions over the past couple of months, but ultimately ruled
by gratitude.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Good for you. That's uh, it's it's very mature. And look,
let me be let me, let me be honest with you.
That stuff isn't fun. It's really not it's really not funk.
It sounds it sounds it's way it sounds way better
(49:49):
than it is. But that being said, I was really
upset for particularly for the two of you now, because
you deserved to get that attention and I wanted. I mean, look,
(50:12):
the point of all of that promotion, fun or not,
is to get people to watch and so you know. Look,
it's part of what the fight was about, is not
having information about the streaming. I have no idea. I
will tell you this, which means absolutely nothing. But I
was set by my publicist the day that the trailer
(50:37):
came out, which said, you know, hey, here's the trailer
of your new show. Don't tweet about it, don't talk
about it, don't share it with anybody. But just what
was it for your not for your information, but I
don't know, for your consciousness. I don't know. They said
the trailer, and I clicked on it, and I showed
(51:02):
it to someone the next day. So I clicked on
it the next day and there were three or four
million views of this thing within twenty four hours.
Speaker 1 (51:10):
Yeah, so it got traction.
Speaker 2 (51:14):
That got subtraction. Now I don't know if people watch
the show or not, but I hope to God that
they did. Now for those of you who haven't seen
the other Black Girl one, do because I mean, jesus,
I'm in it. But too more importantly, Sinclair is in it.
(51:35):
I was there through I think episode five. So we're
not going to give spoilers away here because I really
want people to go and watch the show. But I
do want to mention something because I was gone at
five there was a unscheduled and by the way, who
knows if we're allowed to talk about this, but I
(51:57):
don't really care. There was an unse scheduled hiatus that
happened during the course of the show because of quote
wanting to go in a slightly different direction at the
end of the series. Was this done with the thought
(52:22):
of bringing it back for season two.
Speaker 1 (52:26):
I wish people would include me in those conversations. I
have to imagine, you know, like, what's the plan? I was.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
No, I it's no, it's more from me watching it.
It ends differently it had than what had been when
I was there. It ended differently than what it was
explained to how it was explained to me.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
We were ending You really see, I didn't. I did
not ask for the ending. I did not want to
know what the ending was, similar to like reading the book,
so I didn't figure out how they were going to
end it until I read the episode ten script. But
it does feel because it's different than the book.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
So it's different than the book. It's different and that's
what I mean. No one was filling me. I wasn't
in high level meetings. It was more conversations about it
and then when I watched it, because I didn't know
really what had happened after, you know, I didn't know
(53:40):
the end of the story from the serious perspective I
had read the book, and I went, oh, oh, well, yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (53:49):
Okay, Well I felt I felt like, you know, if
they're taking an extra couple of weeks to go and
rewrite the ending of a story that already has an end, right,
then that probably means that they want to do something
with the story as a whole, I would think, because
(54:10):
I mean, there's literally a book that could tell you
how to end it right, But to make a different choice,
a more left open choice, feels intentional. And obviously nobody
knew that we were going to release this show into
the strike, but I would hope that that intention is
(54:31):
still alive.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
And well, yeah, well I hope so too. Maybe Colin
will come back and melt down in some other horrific
way as well. Hope. I so enjoyed your work, and
I enjoyed one. I enjoyed working with you, and two
(54:54):
to see your journey played out, the complex of your performance,
the depth of your performance, and the reality of your
performance was stunning to watch, and you know what I
told you is true the within I'm gonna be real.
(55:20):
Within twelve minutes of me getting a text that the
strike was over, I emailed I couldn't find your number,
and I emailed Jordan and Gus and said, I need
to get a hold of Sinclair because.
Speaker 1 (55:39):
They've reached out, like the same day.
Speaker 2 (55:44):
Because I wanted to have you on. I wanted to
talk to you about you and your experience and and
the show because it's a show that deserves to be seen,
and I just I wish it all of the best,
and I hope we get to do it again sometimes.
Speaker 1 (56:02):
Well, thank you, I do too. It was truly the
most fun I've ever had on a job and exactly
why I do this and really affirming, and to do
that again would be such a blessing.
Speaker 2 (56:17):
Awesome. Congratulations. I'm I'm happy to hear you just went
back and did something in the theater as well. One
of these one of these days, one of these days,
I'll follow you and Eric back. Did you see his show?
Speaker 1 (56:31):
Yeah? We had three the other Black Girl members on
Broadway this fall, and I went to opening night of
all of them. Cheered my pants off. It was amazing.
Speaker 2 (56:40):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (56:41):
Yeah, the theater was calling, you know. Yeah, returning it
was fun. I did see Eric. He's hilarious. I didn't
expect anything less like truly just drove the whole show
with his comedic timing. It was phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (56:57):
He's the best. Oh, such a good time. Thank you
for coming on and taking the time to talk to me.
Good luck and everybody out there. I'm serious, go and
watch on the aforementioned Hulu The Other Black Girl starring
(57:18):
Sinclair Daniel. I promise you this, you won't be disappointed.
You won't be disappointed. Thanks Sinclair.
Speaker 1 (57:26):
Thank you so much, Brian.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
Sinclair. So great to have you on today. It was
such a pleasure to talk to you, a pleasure to
work with you. I'm so happy that I could finally
talk about this show that I do, really, really love,
and truly you're a big part of why I love
it so much. If you haven't already, go watch The
Other Black Girl streaming on Hulu. You're gonna love Sinclair.
(58:04):
You'll get a glimpse of me as well. You probably
forgot what I look like because all you do is
hear my voice now, but check it out. Yeah, We're back, Baby,
We're back. I will see you next week. Off the
(58:28):
Beat is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner,
alongside our executive producer Ling Lee. Our senior producer is
Diego Tapia. Our producers are Liz Hayes, Hannah Harris, and
Emily Carr. Our talent producer is Ryan Papa Zachary, and
our intern is Ali Amir Saheed. Our theme song Bubble
(58:49):
and Squeak, performed by the one and only Creed Bratton,
Once I got the role, I did chemistry reads with
all the Owens, all the Malaikahs. So I was on
the phone with these people a lot. Okay, I don't
even remember at what point I had the job. I
was just like, I hope there's a lab at the
end of this.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
I'm Sinclair Daniel and I play Nella and the other
Black Girls streaming on Hulu.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hello everybody, and welcome back to Off the Beat. I
have got some pep in my step today, of course.
I'm your host, Brian Baumgartner and Ding Dong. The Witch
is dead. Maybe you've heard the news, maybe you haven't.
The Screen Actors Guild strike is over. One hundred and
(00:53):
eighteen days later, sag Aftra has reached a deal with
the studios who that was a long time. We have
a new contract now that hopefully we'll make all this
time off worth it. It's been such a long road,
but I am so happy that we can all get
back to work now, which includes talking about shows, particularly
(01:18):
talking about new shows. Yes, now you may have noticed
there was a dearth of actors joining me on the
podcast here. Well, there's a very very good reason for that,
because nobody was allowed to talk about any shows or
movies that we're currently streaming on any platform. So I
have been chomping at the bit to tell you about
(01:41):
a recent project I did. As some of you know
from my conversations last year, I had the absolute pleasure
to work on the show The Other Black Girl, and
my guest today is the star of our show, Sinclair Daniel.
Sinclair plays Nella, who works at a publishing company. I
(02:03):
played Colin, one of the authors that said publishing company represents.
The show focuses on how Nella navigates office dynamics, race relations,
and well otherness as a black woman in a white
dominated space. Sinclair does an absolutely beautiful job as Nella,
(02:26):
dealing with all of the complexity and humor and darkness
that comes with She is so good everybody, and it
is so good for me to finally be able to
talk to another actor about well acting, especially new, recent,
important and great work. So I am so excited to
(02:48):
dive right back in to let you get to know
the funny, the brilliant, and the so so so talented
Sinclair Daniel. Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeak,
(03:09):
Bubble and Squeak, cooking every move over from the night. People. Hey,
how are you? I'm good? How are you?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
I'm good.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
It's been so long now.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I know, it's been a couple of like lifetimes.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
How are you doing.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
I'm good. You know. It's just now starting to get
like wintery cold. So drinking a lot of tea, wearing
a lot of scarves, having a good time.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Okay, you're in New York, right, yeah, I am yeah,
and it's getting it's getting cold. You're feeling fall.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
I'm feeling fall. We usually skip fall and skip spring
and just go straight to the extremes. So I'm really
trying to revel in the niceness that is happening outside
right now.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Well, you and I, Oh my gosh, we last. It's
been almost a year before if you could believe that, Uh,
it's been almost a year. I want to tell everybody
about how we got to know each other. But I
want but I want I want to start. I want
to start just with you. I want to I want to.
(04:32):
I wanta this is your life. This is okay, this
is s Claire Daniel's life. You grew up in New York?
Is that right?
Speaker 1 (04:40):
No? I didn't. Actually, I grew up in d C.
So not super far. But I was born in d
C and then lived around that DC Maryland, Virginia area
for a little bit, and then in high school and moved.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
To California, California. Where in California, Pasadena? Oh there, Da,
it's actually very nice and it's a really nice place.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
So you went to high school out here?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I did? Yeah, I went to LaSalle High School shout
out for two years. Shout out LaSalle in Pasadena.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah. Yeah, what was your So why did you move
to California? Was this? Was this a parental thing?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah? So my mom's parents were living in California and
she was looking for a little bit of a change
and they were getting older, so it just made sense
to go out there. We would go a couple of
times a year anyway. So you just hit the bullet.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
He bit the bullet and moved out. What what were
you interested in as a as a kid? What were
you what were you focused on? What were you interested in?
Speaker 1 (05:52):
I was really I was a theater kid through and through.
I was. Yes, I was just having this conversation with
my cousin the other night and she was like, wait,
how did you get into this again? I mean the
The answer is I had a lot of allergies as
a kid, and both my parents worked full time jobs,
so I needed something to do from three to six
(06:14):
pm that was indoors, okay, because I couldn't do the
sports without having an athletsack or an allergy episode. So yeah,
theater was kind of the answer for me, and I
just liked it, so I stayed with it.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Yeah, so this is like you're talking about like even
elementary school or was this like in high school?
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Okay, probably starting around fifth grade, and so I was
really into that. I was really I also liked winter
activity sports, so I also because no pollen, I liked
to ski and ice skate what you can also do
in California, which was very exciting to learn, right, surf
(06:58):
and ski in the same day.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
And we're are you doing Were you doing like school
plays or were you branching out from that children's theater
or Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
I was doing the school plays. We would do like
one play in one musical year, and then I would
also do some summer programs. I started to do those.
I did like community Christmas time, theater productions, pretty much
anything that would allow like a kid to just come
(07:28):
and participate. I was. I was pretty into that.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And when you moved to Pasadena, did you get into
the I mean, I find it so lame, like to
call it Hollywood, but for lack of a better, more
accurate phrase, like did you start doing an agent thing
or were you doing commercials or were you still pretty
much just strictly doing theater in school and stuff.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Yeah, I was not doing all that stuff. I was
really of all the kids who were. I wanted to
be the kid who had to leave school early because
I had an audition and sorry, I can't come. I'm
going on the Disney Channel next week. But I was
very much not that. My mom was like, you're gonna
(08:15):
stay in school and if you do the play in school,
that's fine. I think I went to like one quote
unquote Hollywood audition and they required that we emancipated ourselves,
and so my mother said absolutely not and we went home.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Really yeah, I think I was.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
I could not even tell you what it was. I
went in. I was so excited I got to do
this one audition. It went really well. They called my
mom and they're like, okay, so how do you guys
feel about emancipation from your parent and I didn't know
if that was so I was like, yeah, let's do it,
and she said no, no, no, no, Wow.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I didn't even know that was a real And what's
the what's the point of that so they can better
control you?
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Yeah, I think it's so they can screw you over.
I think it's just like so they can have a
fourteen year old sign on the dotted line and they
don't need like a co uh, a co signer, no
guardian or anything. You speak for yourself essentially, or you
temporarily turn over your rights to somebody else. Like kind
of interesting dark when I got into it.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Wow, so that is that. That is not a good
that's not a good start. I'm surprised you are where
you are now, that's crazy, all right, So you you
continue to do the theater stuff, and then what makes
you decide now, okay, so you're doing theater because you
(09:52):
have allergies. You need an activity to do, right, But
when when is the moment for you that it changes
and you decide, no, no, this is not an activity.
Because everybody sort of has these moments right where it
turns from an activity to like, oh no, I can
this is what I want to do, Yeah, what what
(10:14):
was that? What was that for you?
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I think it was less of a like Eureka moment
and more of, you know, the span of a couple
of years. And when I got to the age where
the school play was no longer kind of a requirement
or like you know, most kids didn't have to be
in it, I kept doing it because I thought it
(10:41):
was really fun. And I think that's really what has
always been the motivating factor to me, is that it's
just so much fun. And then in high school, when
I moved to California, they had a pretty good arts department,
and I joined their arts department. And really what it
came down to is college application. Because for whatever reason,
(11:02):
we ask seventeen year olds what they want to do
for the rest of their lives.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
It's crazy. I charge them.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
Hundreds of thousands of dollars to follow through on that.
So I had to really sit with myself and just say,
what do I want to do for the rest of
my life? And the only thing that came up for
me really that I thought I was any good at
or that made me happy, or that I could in
(11:27):
reality see myself doing for a long time was acting
and performing. So I applied to college with that. That's
what I ended up majoring in. And luckily I had
parents who are very supportive of that dream and saw
it as a valid degree choice kind of path.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah, me too. You know, I think that we're rare.
I mean, you make the joke, but you know it
is true. It's it's insane that people are asked at
that age like, so what do you want to study?
What's your focus for work? Ever? But I think most
(12:08):
people change like three or four, absolutely five times. But
it sounds like you and myself, like once I got
on the train and it was a similar time for
me in high school. It was like, oh no, this
is this is actually what I want to do. You
went for it. Now you ended up going to the
(12:30):
prestigious Tish School of the Arts. They're back in now
your hometown of New York. Was this an audition process you, Yeah,
you auditioned to get in there.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yes, this was probably. College auditions were probably the most
stressful audition I've ever had in my life. And I'm
including TV movies, Broadway like college auditions, you know, states
were high and yes, so most schools require you to
do a contemporary monologue and a contrasting classical monologue, if
(13:11):
not more. And n Yu didn't ask for a classical monologue.
They just wanted to contemporary monologues. And they sent a
representative out to Los Angeles, which was nice, so I
didn't have to fly across the country. It was in
some hotel downtown where I think I later had prom
It was weird, but we go in there. I was
first of the day, first in line. I was like,
(13:31):
I need to get this over with so I can
start reading again. I go in there, I do my thing,
and then they ask for I do both my monologue,
and they ask for a classical monologue Shakespeare, and that
was not something on their requirements, and I had not
done it yet for my other auditions. I was keeping
that in my back pocket because the time hadn't come yet.
(13:54):
So I was panicking, and I remember taking my shoes off.
I just to like ground myself, and I took my
shoes off and I was in my socks and I
did my Shakespeare and then I left and it was
it was good. It ended up being working out. I
really didn't expect it to happen. I think it was
(14:15):
the only non California school I applied to It was
a pipe dream, but yeah it was. You know, you're
just sitting there in a hallway with other nervous, scared teenagers.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
Just imagine what was Tish where you wanted to go?
Speaker 1 (14:37):
Yeah, I mean I had, I had, I had a
top three and Tish was on the top three. But
really I did not even think I would get in.
It just seemed like such a a dream reach, you know,
going to study acting in New York City. That's that
could never happen to somebody like me. But it did,
(15:01):
and I'm so glad I made that choice to apply
to try and then.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Also to go What did give you.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
A lot? And I also gave them a lot and
I'm still giving them some every month. But I did
get a lot out of that experience. I mean, I
still live in New York and going to college here.
My circle hasn't. I mean, I've met more people, but
my college circle is now my professional circle. These are
(15:34):
now people that hire me and I work with and
we just see each other all the time and it's amazing.
So it gave me a really amazing foundational community. You know,
I moved here as a teenager and I was hanging
out with other teenagers. And now these teenagers are associate
(15:55):
directors on Broadway. They are in the casting office at
CBS like we are, and we're friends. It gave me that,
It gave me a great sense of independence. There's not
much of a campus here. Our famous tedious slogan is
the city is your campus. So and yeah, that's what
(16:16):
they tell you. Give us all your money and we
won't even give you a quad. But it did. I mean,
I was going. I got an internship my freshman year
that was in Lincoln Center. I was seeing art shows
for free. I was taking advantage of all of the
student discounts for museums and outings and all these wonderful things.
(16:42):
So I felt like I grew up at my own speed,
at my own pace, but in a place that was
really built for me. I really felt a deep connection
to New York. I still do. I love it here
so much, and coming here through college was a really
(17:05):
fortunate transition. Wasn't just here had to figure stuff out?
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, I mean you bring up a couple of super
interesting points in terms of you know, you're in this
school and as you say, there's no quad, the city's
your campus, But it sounds like you really took advantage
of that and having though that variety of experience. It's
(17:33):
sort of the opposite of most college experiences, right, because
I feel like, almost intentionally, most colleges are we are
a bubble to help protect you and help you to
become who you're going to become. Right, I mean it's
like we're it's insular in a way, whereas it sounds
(17:59):
to me like for you, you had because you went
to NYU and you have these discounts. You didn't have
money or whatever, and but you were able to go
out and have those experiences in the city, which, right,
I mean, let's be honest, that's an that's a part
of the education I think of itself.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Right, Probably the best sell NYU can make is where
it is. It is New York University, so you get
New York that is promised. Yeah. I felt like a
baby bird being shoved out of the nest. But yeah,
(18:37):
we the adjustment period was brief because the city ways
for no one and then you just get on board
and it's been amazing.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah, do you feel like you like there's an experience
from when you're in high school and you're working on
shows and you have accomplished have you know, you've had
a various degree of success or whatever. You go to NYU,
(19:06):
which is an actor training program, which is the same
type of school that I went to. Do you feel
like you were I always felt like I was sort
of punched in the face very quickly about like, oh, no, son,
you don't know, you don't know anything. Yeah, right, like
you have you know, instincts, you have stage presence, but no,
(19:29):
this is do you feel like was that your experience
as well? Like here we're now going to tell you
how this actually works.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Yeah, we had a lot of uh that going on
in those first couple of weeks we had We had
people drop out in the first couple of weeks. It's
it's it's stark, and it's sudden. It's like, you know, ice,
cold water just being thrown on your face, right, And
a lot of kids who were previously big fishes in
(19:56):
little ponds, right and now diny minnows in the Pacific Ocean.
So I knew that going in, though I wanted that.
I wanted kind of to be punched in the face
a little because to me, that makes it real. I
wanted the hard work. I didn't want to fall into
(20:17):
any type of misconception that I'm going to move to
New York and like walk straight onto a set the
day I graduate. I wanted it to feel like I
was working hard so that when I accomplished things, I
wouldn't be afraid of them. But we yeah, we had.
(20:37):
I think probably what like a third didn't come back
for second year, switched majors or switched schools, switch cities.
You know, it's not for everybody, but it did happen.
I had a teacher on one of my first acting classes.
She just walks in the door and she goes, how
(21:00):
many of you have divorced parents? And you're like, oh,
that's kind of personal. But I raised my hand and
said it a couple of other people and she said,
I don't really know why the rest of you are
even here. And I was thinking to myself, what thing
to say looking around at all the happily married, a
(21:22):
couple of parent children in the room, well the tables
and turns.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Did you want to do theater? You wanted to be
an actor? You went you, you got in as an actor.
Did you want to do theater? What? Where? Where was
your brain? I mean you're still young, so I mean
you transition pretty quickly. But were did you want to
be an actor in anything? Did you have a particular
view in mind for what your future held.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
I think I went in like everybody else, wanting to
be in movies and on a hit television show with
many seasons and spin offs and reboots. And then I
got to New York and I really fell in love
with theater. I'd already been doing it, but to see
it done at a professional level consistently everywhere I went
(22:34):
was so inspiring, and I really wanted to do that.
So my junior year I actually opted to go study
abroad in London and study at RADA because I wanted
classical training. I wanted to go see West End shows,
fringe shows. I wanted to be in it. And then
(22:56):
I came back in my senior year, I went to
the film and television studio to just kind of go
the other way, and I was like, oh, yeah, I
really do like this stuff, so ultimately I'm all, I
like all of it. I want to do all of it.
I just did a play and it was the first
play I'd done in a while, and it felt so good,
(23:17):
you know, I was exhausted. I made no money, and
I couldn't have been happier I was. It just felt,
you know, your whole body gets engaged, and it's a
nice reminder for why I got into this.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Yeah, it's funny, I I think. I think that's the
difference between NYU and most other actor conservatory training programs.
I think because you said you entered of course wanting
TV series like that was never in my consciousness early on,
(23:56):
Like I just wanted to be an actor in the
theater like that was like that was the only thing
that I wanted and the only thing that I thought
that I would ever do, And I didn't even really
think about that. NYU has great actor training. How much
training are you getting? I mean you said, and I
(24:16):
don't know exactly what this means when you went back
your senior year film and television, Are you getting film
and television acting training as well, or training in the
business at all, or how does that work there?
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Yeah? They have so at ny you have to do
primary training first, so when you go you get sorted
into a studio. I always compare it to the Harry
Potter sorting hat. It's all the same school, but different
acting techniques, right, you don't get to choose, and you
have to stay there for two years. And then after
your two years you can go abroad, you can try
(24:51):
a different acting studio, or you can go do your
film and TV stuff, but you're not allowed to do
until you finish your theater training. So there's a school
NYU called Stone Street Studios, and that's the film and
TV side of things, and they really try and make
it all of those all of those things that you're
talking about. So it's you know, you work on camera
(25:14):
with scene work, scene study, but you also have classes
on how to read a call sheet and what a
typical contract might look like. And we have guest speakers
come in and then we have to role plaze the
first eighty, the second eighty, the boom op, the gaffer,
like you learn those things, which I actually found to
(25:37):
be the most valuable part of the whole education at
Stone Street was just learning how a set actually runs.
I don't know, nobody's gonna slow it down and explain
it to you want to get there.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
I know that, and I was when I started in
film and television. I was much older and knew not
absolutely nothing. And that's what I always say, like, in
some ways the hardest part of the job is like
figuring out how it actually works. Like if it's just
about saying your lines in character to another person, I'm
(26:11):
good with that. Like wait, why is this? Why is
this person under me? Why am I rattling this person
right now? I'm saying everyone close, everyone, so in my
face all the time. Yeah, uh, that's that's fascinating. All right.
So you graduate, You're in the big city. What what
(26:35):
what are you? What are you trying to do? Are
you just trying to work? It doesn't matter where it is.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
So I immediately I've been working as like hearing their
jobs through college Marista nannying, And then when I graduated,
I started working at a gym because I wanted to
have my days free to go sit around for hours
at Actors Equity and like hope to get seen for
(26:59):
an audition. So I would start my work day at
like four point thirty in the morning so that I
could be done by noon and then I could go
to Actors Equity and wait for six hours and then
maybe get seen live in the dream. So that was
post grad immediately, and I had done a showcase in
my senior year. Second semester and I had met my
(27:21):
manager and she was kind of just like, I like you,
let's see how this goes. So she would send me
little auditions here and there. I got my first TV appearance,
which was very cool for me, on one of those
New York courtroom shows. What was it was Madam Secretary.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Okay, that's what I thought, Madam Secretary.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
She wasn't that one. One wasn't actually that court roomy,
but it was. It's, you know, very New York type show.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Media Costello, Media Costello in Madam Secretary. So how was
that experience? Like being on a set for the first.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Time is incredible, I am. I mean every time I
step on a set, it's amazing. But I don't think
anything can really top the first time that you get
to go and you're sitting in the hair and makeup
chair and you're handed your scene for the day, and
you know, you get to talk to the director, you
get to talk to the actor who you've been watching
(28:22):
on television, Like there's just something so exciting about that.
I was nervous, so nervous, and I even now sometimes
when I watch that scene back, like, oh goodness, girl,
loosen up. Read a little bit, but you know, all
in time, it was. It was a really fun day.
I was just so happy, and I remember calling my
(28:45):
parents and I was like, I'm gonna be on TEAMV.
It was so exciting.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
But you were you were nervous, Yeah, I was.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
I was nervous. I was really nervous.
Speaker 2 (28:59):
How many days did you have that first time?
Speaker 1 (29:01):
I was there for five hours? It was not days.
A scene where we were sitting at a table, so
they did one over the shoulder, another over the shoulder,
wid at a medium. They called it okay.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
You end up working on some other shows there in
New York, Bull for one, The Good Fight. Do you
do you feel like you start gaining confidence with these
guest stars, you start feeling more comfortable, or is every
time you still get nervous.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
I mean, honestly, I find new reasons to get nervous
every time. It's different nerves. But when I was on
The Good Fight, I was My scene was with Audrey
McDonald and then Christine Baranski's sitting right across the table
from us, and I have to be talking about my
(29:57):
dead friend and I'm just in the presence of legends,
trying to sitting on a stand in a courtroom, so
everyone's just staring at me, and I'm staring at Audre
McDonald and she smelled so good and I just wanted
her to come stand next to me, and so that
made me nervous, but that was also a really it
ended up being a really fun day and Bull. I
(30:20):
was nervous because it was my first day, my first
job where I was on for multiple days. So I
was on Bull for I think ten days, So I
was nervous about that, you know, building a character, an
arc or something like that. But all of the previous
experiences inform the next one, which is great, But it
(30:44):
doesn't mean I'm not going to be nervous every time
I step onto a set, because it's always something new
to be nervous about.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Yeah, I know you did a lot. I mean I
have seven here listed in front of me. I won't
go through all the titles, but a lot of short
films gaining experience. Now is this are these projects that
you're doing with some of your NYU cohorts. You guys
are putting stuff together, just trying to work there.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
Yeah. Some of them were NYU friends that we were,
you know, working with. Some were casting calls that I
answered in college just for other universities looking for actors.
One of my teachers had a friend who was making
(31:33):
a production who needed somebody and recommended me. And oh
I also spent a summer at Williamstown Theater Festival.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Oh yeah, me.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Eighteen and I was an apprentice there, and I'd say
second to NYU, if not even on par with NYU
as far as networking and meeting people, that was really great.
So a lot of those short films came out of
collaboration with people from there. You know, you just pick
up people along the way, and especially with social media
(32:06):
now you can just get connected so easily. Right, So
people are always looking for somebody to be in their
short film, and if you have the patience to do it,
they'll let you do it.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Right. At this point, you're auditioning, trying to find work,
working some in the theater. As you mentioned before, how
do you meet the folks on the other Black Girl?
Speaker 1 (32:36):
So, yes, I was coming out of When was that
so twenty twenty one? Is that twenty twenty one? Yes,
twenty twenty one, the top of twenty to twenty one.
I'm coming off of like a year nothing. I had
signed with my agent in February twenty twenty, and then
(32:56):
we all know what happens two weeks.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
Later, right right, was just there was great timing.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Great timing. I yeah, fresh out of school. I was like,
I'm gonna take this by the whole, nothing, nothing, silence.
So top of between twenty one, I think one of
my first auditions is I get something in my inbox
says like untitled Insidious project, and I didn't know what
(33:24):
that meant, so I was like, I'm just gonna submit.
I get a call back, and then I find out
it's the Insidious franchise, like the horror movies, and I'm like,
oh my gosh, I actually love these. So I end
up booking that, and I while I'm on set for that,
I get this audition for the show called The Other
Black Girl. At this point, I'm sleeping on my friend's
couch underneath his bookshelf, and on his bookshelf is The
(33:47):
Other Black Girl. And so I novel the novel the book.
So I'm looking at my computer and I said, I've
seen that before, and I just turn around and grabbed
the book and start reading. And I was like, Okay,
well great, but I'm also trying to learn my lines
for this movie I'm doing, so I'm not really that focused.
So I when it comes time for my audition, I'm
(34:09):
on set for Insidious, I have to talk to the
director before Patrick Wilson. He was so lovely for this.
He gave me like an extra long lunch break and
he moved around the schedule so I could do this
zoom audition for the other Black Girl. And it was
great because I was already in hair makeup and I
was like, I feel fabulous, and so that was how
(34:30):
I got my first audition for that, and I auditioned
for Nella and then when they called me back, they
wanted me to read for Hazel. So I read for
Hazel and then they said, actually, you know, we kind
of feel like you fall in between these two characters
too much, so we're going to pass. And I was
(34:54):
pretty disappointed because I was like, I kind of feel
like I could do this. I feel like I get
this person character. But you know what happens. They passed,
and then three weeks later they called me back and
they said, we actually want to have you back in
for Nola. And at that point it just goes like
rapid fire. It's pretty much a call a week or
two calls a week or something like that. But it
(35:16):
ended up being like a July to October process.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
How many times did you read for them?
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (35:25):
How many times?
Speaker 1 (35:26):
I don't know. I want to say. I did my Nella,
I did my Hazel. I think I did one more
Nella after that, and then I did kind of like
a bracket style chemistry read which took three hours, and
then I did two chemistry reads with Ashley, who ended
up playing Hazel. And then once I got the role,
(35:51):
I did chemistry reads with all the Owens, all the Malaikahs.
So I was on the phone with these people a lot.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
Okay, I don't.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Even remember point I had the job. I was just like,
I hope there's a job at the end of this.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Wow. I had no idea.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
It was quite the process. Yes, So also different countries.
I was traveling. I was on vacation, so I was
on a road trip on in a van in Iceland
when I had my first chemistry read and they said
we want to see you tomorrow. So I had to
get on my phone and find the nearest hotel on
the Icelandic like country side where the whole country's population
(36:34):
is like two hundred and fifty thousand people found one
room with the strongest WiFi in Iceland. I still think
about that hotel.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
And I did. I did my my reads in there.
My friend sat in the van. Wow, it was chaos.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
That's incredible. Did you when you when you were when
you were sleeping under the bookshelf and you turned around
and you picked up the book. Did you respond to
the book? I mean, I know you wanted a job
and spoiler alert, it's the lead, But did you respond
did you respond to the to the to the book?
Was there? Yes? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (37:12):
I mean when I picked up the book, I read
the back or the inside cover wherever the synopsis was,
and I said, this sounds really, really good. And then
I read the first couple of chapters. And then they
had also sent me the pilot, so I read the
pilot script and between I did all of that at
the same time. So between all of that, I was
already pretty hooked. I really felt like I knew who
(37:35):
Nella was and I identified with a lot of the
things that I was reading about her. And I didn't
finish the book until the end of the audition process.
I kind of didn't want to know how it ended,
but I was as they were sending me scripts, I
(37:57):
was reading little bits of the book and just kind
of getting more and more interested. And since it's it's
it's not necessarily mystery, but thriller. The not knowing, I
thought was helping me. I Wela doesn't know what's happening
to her, so I shouldn't know what's happening either.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
That's very That's very interesting and astute of you. I think.
By the way, the other black Girl New York Times
best selling book, Rave Book made into a series. Now,
did you have any connection with Rashida Jones.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Besides being a lifelong fan. Nope. I saw her name
and I was I called my dad had Jones. That's
what it says. Unless there's another one.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Yeah, I had no idea. They put you guys through
the ringer.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
Yeah, it was you know, and we all got there
and I was talking to everybody else, and Ashley had
a similar experience. I think they wanted to get it
right that those two relationship, I understand, you know, it
was you could find one but maybe didn't have great
chemistry with the other. And they made Ashley and I. I
think Ashley and I tested together two or three times
(39:16):
and it took hours, but nobody was trying to be
aloof about it. At one point, Todd, our producing director,
straight up set He's like, we really like you too,
and we really like you two together, so we're just
going to give you some stuff to heighten it so
we can send it off to the people at Hulu
(39:36):
and they'll love you as much as we do. And
I appreciated that transparency.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Yeah, that's awesome. You get this job, your first obviously
(40:03):
central leading role of a big series. Now, is there
nerves from you in beginning to work on the show.
Speaker 1 (40:15):
Yeah, there's nerves. It's a whole new thing to be
nervous about.
Speaker 2 (40:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I I don't even know how to tell you the
nerves I was experiencing. But yes, lead of a show
that was a very well liked book, that's going to
be on a very popular streaming platform. And everyone kept
reminding me that, like, this is so cool. You're going
(40:42):
to be the lead of a hula show. You've never
done that before.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Yes, I know, yeah, I know that.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
So you know, I was really happy that we got
to go down a few weeks before we started shooting,
so we got to talk to everybody, We got to
do a few rehearsals, which I think is pretty rare
in the space, and had got to have a relationship
with the people we'd be spending the next four months
with ahead of time. And because the show moved so quickly,
(41:17):
we shot ten episodes in under four months, and we
were block shooting, so we were shooting multiple episodes at
the same time. The timeline was all messed up. We're
having different directors come in, we're having new actors join us. Honestly,
all that was going on really didn't give me enough
time to be nervous after a while, which I really appreciated.
(41:41):
We were just so busy and everyone there cared about
what we were making so much, and I was actually
just having so much fun because we had so many
amazing comedians on set and funny people that the whole
energy vibe was light, even though we were doing this
(42:02):
pretty herculean thing.
Speaker 2 (42:04):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting because you know, there are
you and Ashley and a lot of the other actors
who well, primarily one young with less experience, and then
you know you have people coming in like Eric McCormick
and Bellamy Young. Well, I was there. I was there
(42:30):
for a little bit, but I really enjoyed my work
with you. I thought you were fantastic to work with
and so open and receptive to Shenanigans that I would
try to.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
I appreciate it with you. I appreciated it because that
was still kind of early on in our process. So
every curveball took me out of my own head a
little bit. And I remember specifically that that that we
were doing where you know, Nella's fighting tooth and nail
through an apology and we got really I don't I
(43:11):
don't know what you and Dodd talked about, but every
take was different and I appreciated it. It was It
was great. But yes, being the youngest, the greenest on
set was daunting until I realized nobody else cared. They
(43:34):
they were They just wanted us all to do a
good job. Nobody was whispering, she's so young, this is
her first big job. They were like, we'd all hang
out in the actors holding and joke around and everybody
was just there was no hierarchy of of uh, you know,
(43:54):
status or anything. We were all chilling together and it
was really nice.
Speaker 2 (43:59):
Yeah, well, I mean it certainly helps that you're really good. No,
I mean, let's be honest about it, because if I mean,
if you were bad, yeah, there would have there would
have been tons of whisky. Yeah, yeah, there would have been,
especially from that McCormick guy. He is yeah, he is evil.
(44:20):
Love he can be he can be so evil. So
the show out in September.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
We're in the middle of sixty days, six days ago.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Today, sixty days ago today.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Well, maybe not six days, two months.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
Months, yeah, September, that's right, September thirteenth. We how did
let me tell you something. I felt horribly for you
and for Ashley, because I I just felt like this
(45:00):
was not fair to the two of you. Obviously, spoiler
alert for those of you listening. The show comes out
and we're in the middle of the first actor strike
in over fifty years. That's right, the last actor strike.
(45:22):
Ronald Reagan was president of the Union, not of the
United States. So it's over fifty years ago since the
last strike. And so they're making up rules as we
go along because there's no playbook to what happens, and
(45:42):
we're told that we cannot promote shows that that is
part of our job, which it is, is to promote shows,
and we were on strike, so that is not something
we were to do. And let me tell you, I
felt horribly for you and for Ashley because your work
(46:03):
is so strong and the material is so good. The
end product, which I watched by myself without talking about
it either, was so strong that I felt terribly for
you that you were not able to go through the
experience and get the attention that you deserved to get
(46:24):
for the work that you did. Was that difficult for
you for it to come out and not be able
to talk about it.
Speaker 1 (46:30):
Yeah, I would be lying if I said it wasn't difficult.
Speaker 2 (46:33):
Don't lie.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Yeah. No, it was such a conplex amalgamation of conflicting emotions.
It was just, you know, highs and lows every day.
I think that the actor strike was announced on June
twelfth or July twelfth, and our show, the Hollywood Reporter
(46:57):
announced our show's release date, so we were almost exactly
in line with the actors strike. So we had been
told in advance, you know, keep your summer open. We
have this big press rollout. We had talks about maybe
going up to Tiff and you know, they wanted to
(47:18):
do the talk show circuits and they wanted to do
all this, and it was so exciting also because you know,
this was my first anything of the size, and then
to learn in one day that none of that was
going to be happening, and that they were also going
to release the show without the promo and not bump
(47:39):
the release date we had. Yeah, that day was tough.
That that that learning that was like, oh no, the
next six months of my life that I've kind of
cleared out for this big thing is just not going
to happen anymore. But the show did still come out,
(48:00):
and though we were not allowed to talk about it
publicly or promote it publicly or post about it, it
really kind of personalized this experience for me because I
still heard from a lot of people. I still got
texts and calls and messages from folks I haven't heard
(48:22):
from in years, or I don't even know directly, and
they'd be sending me random billboards from Cincinnati or Los
Angeles or Chicago or Philadelphia. People from different countries are
reaching out to me saying they've watched the show, and
it's given me a little bit more time to read
those messages and have conversations with the people in my
life who were happy for me and have been following
(48:45):
this accomplishment. And at the end of the day, as
fun as all that stuff would have been, you can't
really miss what you never had. I am excited for
whatever project will allow me to have those type of experiences,
but I am no less proud of the work that
we did on this show. I'm glad that SAG was
(49:07):
able to get a deal that they feel is fair
so that next time we can go all out. But yeah,
you know it was. It was a lot of conflicting
emotions over the past couple of months, but ultimately ruled
by gratitude.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Good for you. That's uh, it's it's very mature. And look,
let me be let me, let me be honest with you.
That stuff isn't fun. It's really not it's really not funk.
It sounds it sounds it's way it sounds way better
(49:49):
than it is. But that being said, I was really
upset for particularly for the two of you now, because
you deserved to get that attention and I wanted. I mean, look,
(50:12):
the point of all of that promotion, fun or not,
is to get people to watch and so you know. Look,
it's part of what the fight was about, is not
having information about the streaming. I have no idea. I
will tell you this, which means absolutely nothing. But I
was set by my publicist the day that the trailer
(50:37):
came out, which said, you know, hey, here's the trailer
of your new show. Don't tweet about it, don't talk
about it, don't share it with anybody. But just what
was it for your not for your information, but I
don't know, for your consciousness. I don't know. They said
the trailer, and I clicked on it, and I showed
(51:02):
it to someone the next day. So I clicked on
it the next day and there were three or four
million views of this thing within twenty four hours.
Speaker 1 (51:10):
Yeah, so it got traction.
Speaker 2 (51:14):
That got subtraction. Now I don't know if people watch
the show or not, but I hope to God that
they did. Now for those of you who haven't seen
the other Black Girl one, do because I mean, jesus,
I'm in it. But too more importantly, Sinclair is in it.
(51:35):
I was there through I think episode five. So we're
not going to give spoilers away here because I really
want people to go and watch the show. But I
do want to mention something because I was gone at
five there was a unscheduled and by the way, who
knows if we're allowed to talk about this, but I
(51:57):
don't really care. There was an unse scheduled hiatus that
happened during the course of the show because of quote
wanting to go in a slightly different direction at the
end of the series. Was this done with the thought
(52:22):
of bringing it back for season two.
Speaker 1 (52:26):
I wish people would include me in those conversations. I
have to imagine, you know, like, what's the plan? I was.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
No, I it's no, it's more from me watching it.
It ends differently it had than what had been when
I was there. It ended differently than what it was
explained to how it was explained to me.
Speaker 1 (52:59):
We were ending You really see, I didn't. I did
not ask for the ending. I did not want to
know what the ending was, similar to like reading the book,
so I didn't figure out how they were going to
end it until I read the episode ten script. But
it does feel because it's different than the book.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
So it's different than the book. It's different and that's
what I mean. No one was filling me. I wasn't
in high level meetings. It was more conversations about it
and then when I watched it, because I didn't know
really what had happened after, you know, I didn't know
(53:40):
the end of the story from the serious perspective I
had read the book, and I went, oh, oh, well, yeah, oh.
Speaker 1 (53:49):
Okay, Well I felt I felt like, you know, if
they're taking an extra couple of weeks to go and
rewrite the ending of a story that already has an end, right,
then that probably means that they want to do something
with the story as a whole, I would think, because
(54:10):
I mean, there's literally a book that could tell you
how to end it right, But to make a different choice,
a more left open choice, feels intentional. And obviously nobody
knew that we were going to release this show into
the strike, but I would hope that that intention is
(54:31):
still alive.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
And well, yeah, well I hope so too. Maybe Colin
will come back and melt down in some other horrific
way as well. Hope. I so enjoyed your work, and
I enjoyed one. I enjoyed working with you, and two
(54:54):
to see your journey played out, the complex of your performance,
the depth of your performance, and the reality of your
performance was stunning to watch, and you know what I
told you is true the within I'm gonna be real.
(55:20):
Within twelve minutes of me getting a text that the
strike was over, I emailed I couldn't find your number,
and I emailed Jordan and Gus and said, I need
to get a hold of Sinclair because.
Speaker 1 (55:39):
They've reached out, like the same day.
Speaker 2 (55:44):
Because I wanted to have you on. I wanted to
talk to you about you and your experience and and
the show because it's a show that deserves to be seen,
and I just I wish it all of the best,
and I hope we get to do it again sometimes.
Speaker 1 (56:02):
Well, thank you, I do too. It was truly the
most fun I've ever had on a job and exactly
why I do this and really affirming, and to do
that again would be such a blessing.
Speaker 2 (56:17):
Awesome. Congratulations. I'm I'm happy to hear you just went
back and did something in the theater as well. One
of these one of these days, one of these days,
I'll follow you and Eric back. Did you see his show?
Speaker 1 (56:31):
Yeah? We had three the other Black Girl members on
Broadway this fall, and I went to opening night of
all of them. Cheered my pants off. It was amazing.
Speaker 2 (56:40):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (56:41):
Yeah, the theater was calling, you know. Yeah, returning it
was fun. I did see Eric. He's hilarious. I didn't
expect anything less like truly just drove the whole show
with his comedic timing. It was phenomenal.
Speaker 2 (56:57):
He's the best. Oh, such a good time. Thank you
for coming on and taking the time to talk to me.
Good luck and everybody out there. I'm serious, go and
watch on the aforementioned Hulu The Other Black Girl starring
(57:18):
Sinclair Daniel. I promise you this, you won't be disappointed.
You won't be disappointed. Thanks Sinclair.
Speaker 1 (57:26):
Thank you so much, Brian.
Speaker 2 (57:39):
Sinclair. So great to have you on today. It was
such a pleasure to talk to you, a pleasure to
work with you. I'm so happy that I could finally
talk about this show that I do, really, really love,
and truly you're a big part of why I love
it so much. If you haven't already, go watch The
Other Black Girl streaming on Hulu. You're gonna love Sinclair.
(58:04):
You'll get a glimpse of me as well. You probably
forgot what I look like because all you do is
hear my voice now, but check it out. Yeah, We're back, Baby,
We're back. I will see you next week. Off the
(58:28):
Beat is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner,
alongside our executive producer Ling Lee. Our senior producer is
Diego Tapia. Our producers are Liz Hayes, Hannah Harris, and
Emily Carr. Our talent producer is Ryan Papa Zachary, and
our intern is Ali Amir Saheed. Our theme song Bubble
(58:49):
and Squeak, performed by the one and only Creed Bratton,
Host
Brian Baumgartner
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