May 12, 2022 • 38 mins
On the eve of IRCA's historic signing, "President Ronald Reagan" reflects on his legacy.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi listeners, just a quick heads up out of the
shadows tell stories of people fleeing and living in sometimes
violent environments. There's this photo of two men who were
superstars in the eighties. One of them is in a sharp,
(00:23):
pinstriped suit, standing there stoically, not exactly awkward, but he's
standing very still and stiff, standing tall. It's a big
difference from the way I'm used to seeing him. Even
in photos he's usually a big, winding ball of electricity.
(00:44):
But maybe it's because on this day in Fernando Vallenzuela
is standing in the White House next to maybe one
of the only people in America that is more famous,
President Ronald Reagan. In the early eighties, the Dodgers picture
was so talented and well known that the phenomen of
(01:06):
his fame was cobbed Fernando Mania. It was infectious to
root for this five eleven Gordo from Sonoda, a rookie
who was so good in his first season with Los
Dwyers that he made history by capturing the cy Young
Award and the Rookie of the Year Award, and the
attention of millions of fans all over the world. Fernando
(01:30):
was so famous that he made baseball more popular internationally.
He created a whole generation of Mexican American fans of
the sport. He also helped the Dodgers win the World
Series and thus made his way to the Oval Office
to meet an equally famous fan, the President of the
United States. And I have this theory that maybe Fernando
(01:53):
just did a little bit more than win games for
my favorite baseball team. He went over the country at
a time when Mexican immigrants like him were being rounded
up in immigration raids and blamed for all of America's woes.
He humanized people like my parents, And even now when
I look back at his legacy, I feel seen, which
(02:17):
brings me back to that photo of the two eighties
superstars standing next to the President is Hope in a
pinstripe suit, Because maybe that day in the White House
was the day Reagan saw us too. It's a moment
where a Mexican wasn't seen as a threat, but something
to be celebrated, to be recognized, Fernando standing tonics to
(02:41):
one of the most powerful people on the planet, who
in just a few years will get a bill on
his desk that will do more than make us feel seen.
It will give us a chance to be Americans. And
I don't know if this moment Fernando and Reagan meeting
has much of an impact on Reagan, a staunch conservative
(03:01):
whose policies like the war on drugs and trickle down
economics largely decimated my community, that it influenced his decision
to sign a bill that would give three million families
a shot at coming out of the shadows. Because honestly,
it's hard to tell what's going through Reagan's head that
day in but it's for sure fun to imagine, Mr
(03:27):
because maybe, just maybe and went a little something like this. Okay,
you ready, it's November six, Mr President. There's a whole
(03:47):
bunch of press outside waiting to see what you're going
to do about SP twenty two two. So tell me
what it is again. Simpson's bill. Oh, he won't shut
up about it. You remember, Oh Simpson, the football player. No, no,
Mr President, the cowboy from Cody, the tall fellow ron.
(04:09):
Where are you on this one? Well? What's up? Oh?
That's right, the bill legalizing all the Mexicans. How could
I forget? This was a tough one, A lot to
put on one man's shoulders. But thankfully that man was me,
the gipper, ron ron Ronnie the money. That's right. I'm
(04:33):
Ronald Reagan, I'm Patty Rodriguez, and I'm Mary Glendo. And
this is out of the shadows. Children of eighty six.
Immigrants and their children have long lived in the shadows
of America. Their destinies aren't just shaped by where they
come from, but by their particular place in history. In
(04:54):
the lives of millions of immigrants and their children were
changed by one lucky stroke of a pen by an
likely allah, President Ronald Reagan. This podcast will examine the
ripple effects the bill had on first generation kids of immigrants,
who are navigating intergenerational mobility and transforming the cultural landscape.
This is an untold story of luck, timing, triumph, opportunity, survival,
(05:19):
and of course hope. I have to admit Eric, before
we started this podcast, I didn't know a lot about
(05:40):
Ronald Reagan, and I realized for a lot of Latinos
Mexican Americans, especially, Reagan's legacy is kind of like an iceberg.
You know, when you first see an iceberg poking its
head out of the water. At first, it looks small,
pretty even, like you see it one way, but then
you realize how big it actually is beyond what's on
(06:02):
the surface. It's so big and deep and devastating. I
totally get that Reagan's true legacy also depends on who
you ask, and we asked a lot of people. I mean,
I think Ronald Reagan was the devil. I definitely feel, like,
(06:24):
definitely complicted feelings. And it's so complex and contradictory because
he's also one of the reasons you're here in the
first place, and you left your land. When I think
about Ronald Reagan, I think about you know, I know
that he was an actor, Like if that never happened,
like I would not be doing what I do. There
was a lot of things that I felt had more
(06:47):
of a negative impact, like the increase in homelessness and
all of that stuff. A lot of damage was done,
reaching back to even Ronald Reagan when he was governor
here when we were outed up a lot of people
and set him across the border, and some of the
probably weren't Mextic considered that they were probably things. Yeah, yeah,
(07:08):
everyone's a critic. Ever since I could remember, I wanted
to be a gangster or I mean Franklin Delanor Roosevelt,
the greatest scratch that second greatest president of all time
(07:30):
f D R H. Golly. I witnessed firsthand what that
man could do. See. I was there in the depression
when good, honest Americans, white people felt hopeless, people were starving,
and things felt dim. But hearing f DR was like
a warm blanket. You people must not lose faith. Let
(07:53):
us unite in banishing fear. And also the Japanese. We
just announced us special camp. I mean a housing opportunity
for the Japanese in America. Wow, good old Franklin Frankie,
my boy, he was really my um what what what
(08:15):
do your kids call it? How do I help you understand? Oh? Wait, yes,
I got it. F DR was like my tupac. I
remember the first time frank made me feel warm inside.
It was the winter of ninety three. I was heartbroken.
Not only had my father lost his job in the depression,
(08:37):
but my dear Sally told me we can't go steady anymore.
So when Frankie talked about not being afraid, it was
like he was talking directly to me. I pulled myself
up by my bootstraps and started dating Sally's sister. Boy,
could she cut a rug? So I vowed to be
(08:57):
like my hero. He helped he, so did I. He
did radio, so did I. He became president, well so
did I. Mr President, damonies, and get off your high horse.
(09:18):
You're no john Ford yourself. I mean what what was
what was I high? Yes, the Mexicans? Yes, where are
we on that? M hmm? What after you are? Do? Oh?
Dang it all to hell? Like I said, this was
a tough one. On one hand, unemployment was really high.
(09:38):
It was double digits when Reagan came in, and people
were really concerned about that. But you also had the
growers also said, everybody's going to be eating tomatoes growing
in Mexico because we're not going to be able to
grow tomatoes, the rapples or whatever in the US because
we don't have the labor. I don't understand. If unemployment
is so high, why is there a problem finding workers
(10:01):
to pick our tomatoes? Well? Mr President, those aren't well
they're not really American jobs. Farming Oh it's not really farming. Um,
it's u picking, harvesting it best. But real American blue
collar workers, well, well they're salt of the earth. And
(10:22):
they could. Now I'm not telling you what to do
because I know you ate that, but this bill could
cost some people their jobs, not us, mind you. He
just won our last election. But the last thing Americans
want is to compete with Well, Fernando Mania is alive
(10:44):
and well, this kid from Mexico is a phenomenon, or,
as they would say down South, Fernando pitch of bitch.
Oh that's a job that once belonged to an American. Ah. Yes,
Fernando Allen's way a lot. It's June of the Middle East. Well, well,
(11:07):
the Middle East is the Middle East, and I've decided
to start selling weapons to China. Raiders of the Lost
Arc is hitting theaters. God, I would have been great
in that one. And then there was Fernando. Hell of
a picture, and I know something about that. I won
the series against the Yankees. In the winning game, pitched
(11:28):
lights out on the Warner Brothers law as Grover Cleveland Alexander.
So when I tell you Fernando was the real deal,
I know from which I speak. Another strike out by
Fernando Valenzuela, and that's a no hit up, folks. He's
a pollous but off the mound very shy man. He
came to the White House for lunch and hardly spoke
(11:50):
a word. By God, there was this other guy with him,
an interpreter of some sort. What was his name? That's right, JJ.
The most powerful people in the country were in line
waiting for this kid who was only anything years old,
who couldn't speak about the English. So they consigned them
(12:12):
a baseball or an autograph. Now, wait a minute, he
doesn't mean me. F d R would not stand in
line to ask for an autograph, and neither would I.
I stand in line for no one. It was listening
to Ragan, then the Vice President, George Bush, Father, the
Senator of the State, Alexander Haig, the Secretary of the things.
(12:34):
Gospel was better from Los Angeles. Okay, so I was there.
Maybe I got an autograph, Maybe I had a soft
spot for the kid. Even FDR like baseball, and you
should have seen this Fernando kid. Not only was he great,
but he reminded me of my best pal back in
(12:56):
Los Angeles, Peppe Rubies. Out of the shadows, will be
right back now, back to the show. Oh, my first
(13:18):
time walking into Jason's was like walking into the green
room at the Tonight Show. Jason's was a restaurant in
Beverly Hills that was known for three things. The clientele
I'm talking Sinatra, Jimmy Stewart, Elizabeth Taylor, all the chili. Heck,
(13:39):
Liz had it flown into Rome when she was filming Cleopatra. Man,
I would have been great in that film. Can you
imagine me as Julius Caesar Germanicus guard to escort Queen
Cleopatra to her apartments? Anyway, where was i? Ah? Yes?
The third thing was pepe Ruise, the legend dairy bartender
(14:01):
and Amy go too to the stars, even future stars
like me. How's it going, young man? You look lost? What? What? Oh?
He their friend? Uh? Sorry, you just have a big audition,
Sam would pepper ree, No, I'm not the director. Sam
would a knight at the opera? Oh yes, I love
(14:22):
that picture. Mr Marcus over there. Time flies like an arrow,
for it flies like a banana. Wow, this is quite
a place. You know what? You need a drink? Well?
What do you recommend? Whom do you like? Dean Martin? What?
What is he here? Not today? But I'll make you
Mr Martin's favorite vodka, A bit of sherry orange Rent
(14:45):
and my secret oil orange shows which Stuart, that's more
jeepers a name did a flame of love. It was
inspired by his song And I'll give you Dean Martin's
confidence until midnight. Oh is that right? That's right? Amigo?
Realuise Huh? Is that Italian? No Spanish? Mexican? Well yeom meymo.
(15:10):
Ronald Reagan, Nice to meet you. How you peppe? The usual? Please?
Oh my god, ground show? Why how did you call me?
Man's as only as old as the woman he feels?
My god, what an angel? That's no angel, that's uh,
(15:30):
that's Nancy d They call her queen of no Peppe.
That's some mory. Nancy Davis, my god, the love of
my life. Well you sure are tall, aren't you. Well?
The weather is fine up here. It's a little warn
do fruit. She was had brand new, recently arrived as
(16:01):
a young contract player at MGM. Yes, that's Karen to Multi,
my wife's biographer. A truth teller if I ever met one.
He was an actor who had, you know, didn't have
exactly an illustrious career, and he was hitting middle age
(16:23):
and he was finding it sort of harder and harder
to come by parts his first wife had essentially walked
out of the marriage, so he was kind of at
a low point in his life when when he met Nancy.
Nancy would never really kind of make it as an
actress on her own either, So both of these people
(16:45):
were at a point in their lives where you would
not have expected like great things out of their future,
but it really turned out that they you know, it
was quite a match. Now, wait a minute, Karen, you
don't know what you're It's more complicated than that, Oh Nancy, Yes,
(17:07):
Mr President, Mr President, that's itty. Wrap your lips around running.
Stop out of it? What what what are you even
talking about? I'm not out of it. I'm in here,
damn it. I'm in it. Now give me that damn bill,
I'm gonna sign that thing for Peppe for love. Oh
(17:31):
stop that, yesha, stop give me that thing. And you know,
damn it, I'll fire you in a minute. I made you,
I'll make you. Wait, wait, don't what would at all do?
My mom loved Donald Reagan. She prays for him all
(17:51):
the time. I've known that since I was little. I
always just kind of like had my parents thinking, you know,
Reagan was a great president. People say he was an optimist.
Well he was, but he was also an idealist. The
more you learn about Reagan, the harder it is to
square some of his decisions that impacted my community the
real Reagan. You know, they always said about Reagan. That's
(18:15):
one of his biographers, veteran journalist leukennont what you see
is what you get, And I I think that's one
of the silliest phrases I've ever heard, because sometimes he
got a lot more than you saw, and sometimes you didn't.
You didn't get anything. If you talk to enough people
who personally benefited from Reagan's policies, you start to get
(18:35):
this picture of greatness. Nancy Reagan's biographer Karen to Multi
especially tied Reagan's thinking on the issue of immigration to
an inherent optimistic patriotism. I do think that Reagan and
a lot of conservatives had this very idealistic view of
America that it was a country of strivers. I mean
(18:59):
that it was it was a place that people came
because they were seeking freedom and opportunity, and that that
freedom and that opportunity should essentially be available. When I
hear that and imagine the gipper hanging out with guys
like Paperuis and Fernando. It's really easy for me to
(19:20):
tap into my own optimism, especially when I try to
imagine Reagan having to decide whether he was going to
sign or veto Urka. But that optimism, like Patty said
at the top of the show, is just the tip
of the iceberg, because if you look at Reagan's policies
as a whole, they paint a different picture. Here's Homeboy
(19:42):
Industry's founder, father Boyle. A lot of damage was done
reaching back to even Ronald Reagan when he was governor
here where he shut down all the mental hospitals with
the promise that there would be smaller, more community based
and that's exactly why the largest mental institution on the
planet Earth is Los Angeles County Jail. And we owe
(20:05):
it to him for that. And here's Communities in Schools,
Los Angeles executive director Elmer Roldan. Ronald Reagan's policies told
people that anything that was happening in the streets of
America that was even it was impacting Black communities or
Latino communities, was a product of our violent nature. The
(20:29):
crack epidemic that aids epidemic wouldn't have been what they
became if it wasn't for his positions to who, what
and why When it comes to Reagan can be a
bit of a minefield, especially for people like me and
for most of the people who make this podcast Patty, Karen, Betsy,
(20:49):
and Caesar, who all had parents or relatives that benefited
from IRKA directly or indirectly. For us, Reagan's legacy is
hard to reconcile. That was fascinated by the fact that
he was a Republican, and I wanted to understand why.
I was now shocked by that me finding out what
(21:10):
happened in Central America, which I didn't know, and then
I started feeling guilty for having these feelings. My dad
has always said that his favorite president is Ronald Reagan,
and it's interesting because we didn't even get amnesty from it.
So it was just because of him helping out so
many other people that in my household it was like,
(21:32):
this is a good guy, so my entire life. To me,
of course, I'm gonna think he's a good guy. Who's
my dad thinks he's a good guy. So I think,
for the first time, working on this podcast, now I
think I'm able to make my own educated opinion, not
based on what my parents taught me, but based on
my own research. What's fascinating to me about Ronald Reagan
(21:52):
is the juxtaposition of someone who spoke very passionately about immigrants,
but then on the back sekend he was also doing
these really atrocious things. It's like a complicated web of
like ship going on, like even him, you know, stepping
away from like what FDR did and like going against that.
I don't know, it's like an interesting story. Yes, f
(22:15):
d R, Franklin, Delano Roosevelt, not a saint, not even close.
Another guy who did good and bad and it really
all depended on what you look like and who you were.
And thinking about that, the full legacy of Ronald Reagan's
life as a politician, I think that there was more
going through his head when it came to Erica, more
(22:37):
than just Fernando and Peperois. Or maybe it really was
as simple as what what f DR do out of
the shadows? Will be right back now, back to the show,
(23:13):
damn it all the hell? That is the question that
guided my soul. How do I become FDR? Think like him,
lead like him, be like him. I realized a long
time ago, you needed to be like to be that powerful,
and I figured the easiest way to get people to
(23:35):
like me was to be seen. And what better way
to be seen than on the big screen? Randy, Randy,
where's the rest of me? Cat? Cat Cat? Let's try
this again, but but this time do it well? Or
or this time try to act. He had been a
kind of not very successful movie actor, had been more
(23:56):
successful as the host of a couple of television program
but he did have this way of speaking and of
connecting with people. All right, Karen, Maybe I wasn't the
best actor, but but it didn't matter. I needed people
to know my name. I needed the power. And what
better way to be at the seat of power than
(24:17):
as the face of the General Electric Company. No, I'm
not recording, I promise, well, did you see me on
TV last night? To see those those monkeys? Oh? Gosh, sorry,
wrong clip. Here's the g e thing. Here is Ronald Reagan.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. It's my pleasure to appear
with Cloris Leachman and she he presents. Stick your hands
(24:40):
up and hand us the loote. General Electric money is
our most important product. Part of the gig was traveling
the country and meeting with General Electric employees all over
the country. I mean he would talk to tens of
thousands of people, and even in the fifties he was
adv cating very much the sorts of things that he
(25:05):
would later become his hamart. Working as the host of
ge Theater kind of required me to be a conservative
and a good actor has to believe he is the character. Sorry, FDR.
I had to ditch that Democrats ship because it wasn't
taking me anywhere, which I didn't mind because the bag
was good. Man, Do I love money? I basically became
(25:28):
Alec Baldwin and thirty Rock, except more conservative, and boy
did I have power. Finally, so I became president of
the Screen Actors Guild. Will you name names? Senator McCarthy, Oh, boy,
who I have a list as long as you're bar
dab oh my. So he was the president of the
(25:53):
Union and he did testify in Congress, and he really
walked of very very narrow wine between Again, you have
to understand what the country was going through at the time,
and the Union had been in the middle of all
these gigantic battles. Uh and they're, you know, over communism.
(26:19):
Well you didn't hear this from me, but I hear
that redhead, you know, the one she's married to, that
Spanish fellow. Well I heard the hair Dante, the only
red she carries in her purse. She's got some explaining
to do. It would later be revealed that both Reagan
and his first wife, Jane Wyman, were FBI informants during
(26:41):
all of this. Uh, to be fair, like, like I've
done most of my life, I just read whatever script
the directors put in front of me. Well, in this case,
it just happened to be j Edgar Hoover, and hey,
I was able to get actors residual checks. You're welcome,
Tom Hanks. I at that. So not all bad? Right? So? Yes,
(27:03):
the battles with communists and the specifically communists in the
Hollywood unions that sort of implanted the anti communist side
of his of this ideology. Yeah, kill those COMMI bastards.
I'll give you all my guns if you will. The president,
you'll need to snap out of it. You're having a
(27:25):
Central American flash back. After sag and ge that angry
Barry Goldwater hit me up with another gig. He basically
wanted me to tell people to vote for him. Good
luck with that, Barry. The way I saw it, Barry
was going to lose even if I was able to
(27:45):
channel the Almighty's voice and command people to vote for him.
So I thought it was the perfect opportunity for a
little bit of Ronnie magic. I spit a couple of
bars to the crowd, and they ate that it up.
I've spent most of my life as a Democrat. I
recently have seen fit to follow another course the money.
(28:09):
There has come a time for choosing between being broken,
righteous or making a buck off the backs of others.
It was one of my fine air moments, and it
led to the next bag. Some dudes came up to me, like,
you ever think of running for office ship? Not really,
but they gave me a mill for my campaign, and
(28:31):
I had to take it because I was still out
here hustling, trying to be like my boy Frankie Roosevelt.
But you know, by destroying everything he built, Mrs Welfare
Queen tear down that mall, My campaign was ironclad. I
talked a little bit about welfare queens cutting social programs,
(28:54):
making America great again, and general inspirational shit, change the
game type it. And then there was the war. I
led comfortably from home against the Red Army by funding
civil wars in Central America. It was primarily through the
prism of the proxy wars that were going on at
(29:17):
the time with the Soviet Union and anti communism. And
you know, he would compare the Contras in Nicaragua, the
you know, Founding Fathers. So I made Central America a
killing field, big deal. I wasn't going to relive Vietnam.
(29:38):
We had the damn commies just a boat right away.
I'm pretty sure Franklin Delano Roosevelt would have knute the
bastards if I had done that. I bet these damn
Mexican Commies wouldn't be all up in my face. I
bet we don't lose half the Western hemisphere to that
Red menace. In fact, the more I think about it,
(30:00):
that man was a gangster, and so am I Does
that mean you've come to your senses? Damn right, I'm
not signing this on American dribble. Get me my veto stand. Ronnie,
you better look at this. Oh what is it? So?
(30:24):
In November of nine at you know, at a moment
when the Senate has just in the mid term elections,
gone from being Republican held to Democratic held. Word gets
out that Ronald Reagan has secretly been trading arms to Iran,
(30:47):
one of America's enemies, a country that has been branded
a terrorist country. Reagan has secretly been trading arms to
Iran in an effort to get out American hostages that
were held in the Middle East. And that is bad enough,
(31:09):
and that is you know, it is a violation of
every US policy there was. But then a few weeks later,
it is discovered that the money from those arms sales
is actually going in contravention of a law that Congress
had passed to fund the Nicaraguan rebels. The contrast, I mean,
(31:33):
it was a flat out violation of the law. So
you had both in Iran, a violation of US policy,
but also lawbreak going on within the White House. And
it becomes clear very quickly that if Ronald Reagan knew
(31:54):
about the diversion of this money, he is in danger
of getting impeached. And it really does become the biggest
crisis of his presidency. Man alive, there's a whole bunce
of press outside the room waiting you know what you
have to do. A real one does what he has
(32:17):
to do to survive. I'm very pleased that you could
all be here today. This bill, the Immigration Reform and
Control Act of that I will sign in a few
minutes is the most comprehensive reform of our immigration laws
since nineteen fifty two. It's the product of one of
(32:39):
the longest and most difficult legislative undertakings in the last
three Congresses. Further, it's an excellent example of a truly
successful bipartisan effort the administration of the allies of immigration
reform on both sides of the Capital and both sides
of the Aisle work together to accomplish these critically important
(33:00):
reforms to control illegal immigration. Al Right, So, maybe it's
a little cynical of me to imagine Ronald signing the
bill that gave my parents amnesty Urica to divert attention
from the Iran Contra scandal that almost got him locked up.
Maybe he did have more idealistic motives. Maybe it was
because he lived and worked in a very Latino city
(33:22):
and state before he got to the White House. Maybe
it was fandom of Fernando and the Dodgers, or his
lifelong friendship with the Mexican bartender named Peperois. I don't
know though, f Dr Johnson Nixon, Bush, Trump, Clinton, Reagan
honestly as a Mexican American kid who grew up in
(33:45):
Southeast Dely in the nineties, it's hard for me not
to see most moves by presidents in this country as
gangsters doing gangster ship. But the truth is, after more
than a year reading about it and dozens of interviews
with experts, I'm still lost on Reagan and Urica. After
(34:08):
all that, I still didn't really know about this guy.
Why did the same guy who I have to honestly
thank for giving my parents amnesty is the same dude
that is championed by conservatives, the guy who used parts
of Latin America as a proxy war game to fight
a European superpower, The guy who led the war on
(34:29):
drugs that gave rise to cartel violence, and whose domestic
policies felt like they were directly aimed at keeping black
and brown people from ever having a shot. But here's
the thing. I'm gonna pull the curtain way back and
say that when I was writing this episode, I had
(34:50):
no idea that my partner and co host Patti Rodriguez
had tracked down the author of a letter that may
prove Reagan's motives were actually pure and she was just
a ten year old kid writing to the most powerful
man in the world asking for him to do the
right thing. Please help us with this one thing, All
(35:14):
we Go residents. That's on the next episode of Out
of the Shadows, Children of eighty six. If you love
this podcast, please help us get the word out by following, rating, reviewing,
and sharing it with your friends. I'm Christopher Matthew Spencer,
(35:39):
and I played a fictional version of Ronald Reagan, FDR
and many of the other voices you heard today, who
were all invented and dramatized for the purposes of entertainment.
This episode also featured some very real legendary voices. They're
great journalist Mario Lena Salinas, author and Gif figaroa legendary
(36:02):
Dodgers broadcaster, Heim Haden, Nancy Reagan's biographer, Karen Tumulti, Ronald
Reagan's biographer, Luke Cannon, Father Boyle Al Murodan Lila Villas,
Marlino Rosco, Borney Santos, Rena, Solise Lose Thompson, Adriano Venegas
(36:23):
and Alejandro via Bando. Thank you everyone. Out of the
Shadows is written by Caesar Hernandez. It's also written, edited, hosted,
and executive produced by Patti Rodriguez and Eric Galindo. It's
produced by Betticrdanaz, Karen Lopez and Gabby Watts. It's sound design,
(36:46):
mixed and mastered by Jesse nice Longer. Our studio engineer
is Clay Hillenburg. Karen Garcia That's Me is our announcer.
Out of the Shadows is the production of In the
Other Productions and School of Humans in partnership with I
Hearts Michael Tura Podcast Network. The podcast is also executive
(37:09):
produced by Giselle Bancees, Virginian Prescott, Brandon Barr and Chad Crowley.
Our marketing and our team is led by Jasmine Maheia.
Original music by a Arenas and if you loved his
cover of Los Caminos la vida this podcast theme song,
you can listen to it on all music platforms. Historical
(37:31):
audio for Out of the Shadows comes from the Reagan
Presidential Library and the National Archives. Special thanks to Ian Vargas,
Alex and Ali Caitlin. Becker, gob Chabran, Daisy Church, Angel
Lopez Galindo, Julianna Gamis, Ryan Gordon, Brian Matheson, Claudia Marti ConA,
(37:58):
Oscar Ramirez, John Rodriguez, Juan Rodriguez, Joshua Sandovald, Eric Sclar,
Tony Sorrentino, and Megan Tangy
Hi listeners, just a quick heads up out of the
shadows tell stories of people fleeing and living in sometimes
violent environments. There's this photo of two men who were
superstars in the eighties. One of them is in a sharp,
(00:23):
pinstriped suit, standing there stoically, not exactly awkward, but he's
standing very still and stiff, standing tall. It's a big
difference from the way I'm used to seeing him. Even
in photos he's usually a big, winding ball of electricity.
(00:44):
But maybe it's because on this day in Fernando Vallenzuela
is standing in the White House next to maybe one
of the only people in America that is more famous,
President Ronald Reagan. In the early eighties, the Dodgers picture
was so talented and well known that the phenomen of
(01:06):
his fame was cobbed Fernando Mania. It was infectious to
root for this five eleven Gordo from Sonoda, a rookie
who was so good in his first season with Los
Dwyers that he made history by capturing the cy Young
Award and the Rookie of the Year Award, and the
attention of millions of fans all over the world. Fernando
(01:30):
was so famous that he made baseball more popular internationally.
He created a whole generation of Mexican American fans of
the sport. He also helped the Dodgers win the World
Series and thus made his way to the Oval Office
to meet an equally famous fan, the President of the
United States. And I have this theory that maybe Fernando
(01:53):
just did a little bit more than win games for
my favorite baseball team. He went over the country at
a time when Mexican immigrants like him were being rounded
up in immigration raids and blamed for all of America's woes.
He humanized people like my parents, And even now when
I look back at his legacy, I feel seen, which
(02:17):
brings me back to that photo of the two eighties
superstars standing next to the President is Hope in a
pinstripe suit, Because maybe that day in the White House
was the day Reagan saw us too. It's a moment
where a Mexican wasn't seen as a threat, but something
to be celebrated, to be recognized, Fernando standing tonics to
(02:41):
one of the most powerful people on the planet, who
in just a few years will get a bill on
his desk that will do more than make us feel seen.
It will give us a chance to be Americans. And
I don't know if this moment Fernando and Reagan meeting
has much of an impact on Reagan, a staunch conservative
(03:01):
whose policies like the war on drugs and trickle down
economics largely decimated my community, that it influenced his decision
to sign a bill that would give three million families
a shot at coming out of the shadows. Because honestly,
it's hard to tell what's going through Reagan's head that
day in but it's for sure fun to imagine, Mr
(03:27):
because maybe, just maybe and went a little something like this. Okay,
you ready, it's November six, Mr President. There's a whole
(03:47):
bunch of press outside waiting to see what you're going
to do about SP twenty two two. So tell me
what it is again. Simpson's bill. Oh, he won't shut
up about it. You remember, Oh Simpson, the football player. No, no,
Mr President, the cowboy from Cody, the tall fellow ron.
(04:09):
Where are you on this one? Well? What's up? Oh?
That's right, the bill legalizing all the Mexicans. How could
I forget? This was a tough one, A lot to
put on one man's shoulders. But thankfully that man was me,
the gipper, ron ron Ronnie the money. That's right. I'm
(04:33):
Ronald Reagan, I'm Patty Rodriguez, and I'm Mary Glendo. And
this is out of the shadows. Children of eighty six.
Immigrants and their children have long lived in the shadows
of America. Their destinies aren't just shaped by where they
come from, but by their particular place in history. In
(04:54):
the lives of millions of immigrants and their children were
changed by one lucky stroke of a pen by an
likely allah, President Ronald Reagan. This podcast will examine the
ripple effects the bill had on first generation kids of immigrants,
who are navigating intergenerational mobility and transforming the cultural landscape.
This is an untold story of luck, timing, triumph, opportunity, survival,
(05:19):
and of course hope. I have to admit Eric, before
we started this podcast, I didn't know a lot about
(05:40):
Ronald Reagan, and I realized for a lot of Latinos
Mexican Americans, especially, Reagan's legacy is kind of like an iceberg.
You know, when you first see an iceberg poking its
head out of the water. At first, it looks small,
pretty even, like you see it one way, but then
you realize how big it actually is beyond what's on
(06:02):
the surface. It's so big and deep and devastating. I
totally get that Reagan's true legacy also depends on who
you ask, and we asked a lot of people. I mean,
I think Ronald Reagan was the devil. I definitely feel, like,
(06:24):
definitely complicted feelings. And it's so complex and contradictory because
he's also one of the reasons you're here in the
first place, and you left your land. When I think
about Ronald Reagan, I think about you know, I know
that he was an actor, Like if that never happened,
like I would not be doing what I do. There
was a lot of things that I felt had more
(06:47):
of a negative impact, like the increase in homelessness and
all of that stuff. A lot of damage was done,
reaching back to even Ronald Reagan when he was governor
here when we were outed up a lot of people
and set him across the border, and some of the
probably weren't Mextic considered that they were probably things. Yeah, yeah,
(07:08):
everyone's a critic. Ever since I could remember, I wanted
to be a gangster or I mean Franklin Delanor Roosevelt,
the greatest scratch that second greatest president of all time
(07:30):
f D R H. Golly. I witnessed firsthand what that
man could do. See. I was there in the depression
when good, honest Americans, white people felt hopeless, people were starving,
and things felt dim. But hearing f DR was like
a warm blanket. You people must not lose faith. Let
(07:53):
us unite in banishing fear. And also the Japanese. We
just announced us special camp. I mean a housing opportunity
for the Japanese in America. Wow, good old Franklin Frankie,
my boy, he was really my um what what what
(08:15):
do your kids call it? How do I help you understand? Oh? Wait, yes,
I got it. F DR was like my tupac. I
remember the first time frank made me feel warm inside.
It was the winter of ninety three. I was heartbroken.
Not only had my father lost his job in the depression,
(08:37):
but my dear Sally told me we can't go steady anymore.
So when Frankie talked about not being afraid, it was
like he was talking directly to me. I pulled myself
up by my bootstraps and started dating Sally's sister. Boy,
could she cut a rug? So I vowed to be
(08:57):
like my hero. He helped he, so did I. He
did radio, so did I. He became president, well so
did I. Mr President, damonies, and get off your high horse.
(09:18):
You're no john Ford yourself. I mean what what was
what was I high? Yes, the Mexicans? Yes, where are
we on that? M hmm? What after you are? Do? Oh?
Dang it all to hell? Like I said, this was
a tough one. On one hand, unemployment was really high.
(09:38):
It was double digits when Reagan came in, and people
were really concerned about that. But you also had the
growers also said, everybody's going to be eating tomatoes growing
in Mexico because we're not going to be able to
grow tomatoes, the rapples or whatever in the US because
we don't have the labor. I don't understand. If unemployment
is so high, why is there a problem finding workers
(10:01):
to pick our tomatoes? Well? Mr President, those aren't well
they're not really American jobs. Farming Oh it's not really farming. Um,
it's u picking, harvesting it best. But real American blue
collar workers, well, well they're salt of the earth. And
(10:22):
they could. Now I'm not telling you what to do
because I know you ate that, but this bill could
cost some people their jobs, not us, mind you. He
just won our last election. But the last thing Americans
want is to compete with Well, Fernando Mania is alive
(10:44):
and well, this kid from Mexico is a phenomenon, or,
as they would say down South, Fernando pitch of bitch.
Oh that's a job that once belonged to an American. Ah. Yes,
Fernando Allen's way a lot. It's June of the Middle East. Well, well,
(11:07):
the Middle East is the Middle East, and I've decided
to start selling weapons to China. Raiders of the Lost
Arc is hitting theaters. God, I would have been great
in that one. And then there was Fernando. Hell of
a picture, and I know something about that. I won
the series against the Yankees. In the winning game, pitched
(11:28):
lights out on the Warner Brothers law as Grover Cleveland Alexander.
So when I tell you Fernando was the real deal,
I know from which I speak. Another strike out by
Fernando Valenzuela, and that's a no hit up, folks. He's
a pollous but off the mound very shy man. He
came to the White House for lunch and hardly spoke
(11:50):
a word. By God, there was this other guy with him,
an interpreter of some sort. What was his name? That's right, JJ.
The most powerful people in the country were in line
waiting for this kid who was only anything years old,
who couldn't speak about the English. So they consigned them
(12:12):
a baseball or an autograph. Now, wait a minute, he
doesn't mean me. F d R would not stand in
line to ask for an autograph, and neither would I.
I stand in line for no one. It was listening
to Ragan, then the Vice President, George Bush, Father, the
Senator of the State, Alexander Haig, the Secretary of the things.
(12:34):
Gospel was better from Los Angeles. Okay, so I was there.
Maybe I got an autograph, Maybe I had a soft
spot for the kid. Even FDR like baseball, and you
should have seen this Fernando kid. Not only was he great,
but he reminded me of my best pal back in
(12:56):
Los Angeles, Peppe Rubies. Out of the shadows, will be
right back now, back to the show. Oh, my first
(13:18):
time walking into Jason's was like walking into the green
room at the Tonight Show. Jason's was a restaurant in
Beverly Hills that was known for three things. The clientele
I'm talking Sinatra, Jimmy Stewart, Elizabeth Taylor, all the chili. Heck,
(13:39):
Liz had it flown into Rome when she was filming Cleopatra. Man,
I would have been great in that film. Can you
imagine me as Julius Caesar Germanicus guard to escort Queen
Cleopatra to her apartments? Anyway, where was i? Ah? Yes?
The third thing was pepe Ruise, the legend dairy bartender
(14:01):
and Amy go too to the stars, even future stars
like me. How's it going, young man? You look lost? What? What? Oh?
He their friend? Uh? Sorry, you just have a big audition,
Sam would pepper ree, No, I'm not the director. Sam
would a knight at the opera? Oh yes, I love
(14:22):
that picture. Mr Marcus over there. Time flies like an arrow,
for it flies like a banana. Wow, this is quite
a place. You know what? You need a drink? Well?
What do you recommend? Whom do you like? Dean Martin? What?
What is he here? Not today? But I'll make you
Mr Martin's favorite vodka, A bit of sherry orange Rent
(14:45):
and my secret oil orange shows which Stuart, that's more
jeepers a name did a flame of love. It was
inspired by his song And I'll give you Dean Martin's
confidence until midnight. Oh is that right? That's right? Amigo?
Realuise Huh? Is that Italian? No Spanish? Mexican? Well yeom meymo.
(15:10):
Ronald Reagan, Nice to meet you. How you peppe? The usual? Please?
Oh my god, ground show? Why how did you call me?
Man's as only as old as the woman he feels?
My god, what an angel? That's no angel, that's uh,
(15:30):
that's Nancy d They call her queen of no Peppe.
That's some mory. Nancy Davis, my god, the love of
my life. Well you sure are tall, aren't you. Well?
The weather is fine up here. It's a little warn
do fruit. She was had brand new, recently arrived as
(16:01):
a young contract player at MGM. Yes, that's Karen to Multi,
my wife's biographer. A truth teller if I ever met one.
He was an actor who had, you know, didn't have
exactly an illustrious career, and he was hitting middle age
(16:23):
and he was finding it sort of harder and harder
to come by parts his first wife had essentially walked
out of the marriage, so he was kind of at
a low point in his life when when he met Nancy.
Nancy would never really kind of make it as an
actress on her own either, So both of these people
(16:45):
were at a point in their lives where you would
not have expected like great things out of their future,
but it really turned out that they you know, it
was quite a match. Now, wait a minute, Karen, you
don't know what you're It's more complicated than that, Oh Nancy, Yes,
(17:07):
Mr President, Mr President, that's itty. Wrap your lips around running.
Stop out of it? What what what are you even
talking about? I'm not out of it. I'm in here,
damn it. I'm in it. Now give me that damn bill,
I'm gonna sign that thing for Peppe for love. Oh
(17:31):
stop that, yesha, stop give me that thing. And you know,
damn it, I'll fire you in a minute. I made you,
I'll make you. Wait, wait, don't what would at all do?
My mom loved Donald Reagan. She prays for him all
(17:51):
the time. I've known that since I was little. I
always just kind of like had my parents thinking, you know,
Reagan was a great president. People say he was an optimist.
Well he was, but he was also an idealist. The
more you learn about Reagan, the harder it is to
square some of his decisions that impacted my community the
real Reagan. You know, they always said about Reagan. That's
(18:15):
one of his biographers, veteran journalist leukennont what you see
is what you get, And I I think that's one
of the silliest phrases I've ever heard, because sometimes he
got a lot more than you saw, and sometimes you didn't.
You didn't get anything. If you talk to enough people
who personally benefited from Reagan's policies, you start to get
(18:35):
this picture of greatness. Nancy Reagan's biographer Karen to Multi
especially tied Reagan's thinking on the issue of immigration to
an inherent optimistic patriotism. I do think that Reagan and
a lot of conservatives had this very idealistic view of
America that it was a country of strivers. I mean
(18:59):
that it was it was a place that people came
because they were seeking freedom and opportunity, and that that
freedom and that opportunity should essentially be available. When I
hear that and imagine the gipper hanging out with guys
like Paperuis and Fernando. It's really easy for me to
(19:20):
tap into my own optimism, especially when I try to
imagine Reagan having to decide whether he was going to
sign or veto Urka. But that optimism, like Patty said
at the top of the show, is just the tip
of the iceberg, because if you look at Reagan's policies
as a whole, they paint a different picture. Here's Homeboy
(19:42):
Industry's founder, father Boyle. A lot of damage was done
reaching back to even Ronald Reagan when he was governor
here where he shut down all the mental hospitals with
the promise that there would be smaller, more community based
and that's exactly why the largest mental institution on the
planet Earth is Los Angeles County Jail. And we owe
(20:05):
it to him for that. And here's Communities in Schools,
Los Angeles executive director Elmer Roldan. Ronald Reagan's policies told
people that anything that was happening in the streets of
America that was even it was impacting Black communities or
Latino communities, was a product of our violent nature. The
(20:29):
crack epidemic that aids epidemic wouldn't have been what they
became if it wasn't for his positions to who, what
and why When it comes to Reagan can be a
bit of a minefield, especially for people like me and
for most of the people who make this podcast Patty, Karen, Betsy,
(20:49):
and Caesar, who all had parents or relatives that benefited
from IRKA directly or indirectly. For us, Reagan's legacy is
hard to reconcile. That was fascinated by the fact that
he was a Republican, and I wanted to understand why.
I was now shocked by that me finding out what
(21:10):
happened in Central America, which I didn't know, and then
I started feeling guilty for having these feelings. My dad
has always said that his favorite president is Ronald Reagan,
and it's interesting because we didn't even get amnesty from it.
So it was just because of him helping out so
many other people that in my household it was like,
(21:32):
this is a good guy, so my entire life. To me,
of course, I'm gonna think he's a good guy. Who's
my dad thinks he's a good guy. So I think,
for the first time, working on this podcast, now I
think I'm able to make my own educated opinion, not
based on what my parents taught me, but based on
my own research. What's fascinating to me about Ronald Reagan
(21:52):
is the juxtaposition of someone who spoke very passionately about immigrants,
but then on the back sekend he was also doing
these really atrocious things. It's like a complicated web of
like ship going on, like even him, you know, stepping
away from like what FDR did and like going against that.
I don't know, it's like an interesting story. Yes, f
(22:15):
d R, Franklin, Delano Roosevelt, not a saint, not even close.
Another guy who did good and bad and it really
all depended on what you look like and who you were.
And thinking about that, the full legacy of Ronald Reagan's
life as a politician, I think that there was more
going through his head when it came to Erica, more
(22:37):
than just Fernando and Peperois. Or maybe it really was
as simple as what what f DR do out of
the shadows? Will be right back now, back to the show,
(23:13):
damn it all the hell? That is the question that
guided my soul. How do I become FDR? Think like him,
lead like him, be like him. I realized a long
time ago, you needed to be like to be that powerful,
and I figured the easiest way to get people to
(23:35):
like me was to be seen. And what better way
to be seen than on the big screen? Randy, Randy,
where's the rest of me? Cat? Cat Cat? Let's try
this again, but but this time do it well? Or
or this time try to act. He had been a
kind of not very successful movie actor, had been more
(23:56):
successful as the host of a couple of television program
but he did have this way of speaking and of
connecting with people. All right, Karen, Maybe I wasn't the
best actor, but but it didn't matter. I needed people
to know my name. I needed the power. And what
better way to be at the seat of power than
(24:17):
as the face of the General Electric Company. No, I'm
not recording, I promise, well, did you see me on
TV last night? To see those those monkeys? Oh? Gosh, sorry,
wrong clip. Here's the g e thing. Here is Ronald Reagan.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. It's my pleasure to appear
with Cloris Leachman and she he presents. Stick your hands
(24:40):
up and hand us the loote. General Electric money is
our most important product. Part of the gig was traveling
the country and meeting with General Electric employees all over
the country. I mean he would talk to tens of
thousands of people, and even in the fifties he was
adv cating very much the sorts of things that he
(25:05):
would later become his hamart. Working as the host of
ge Theater kind of required me to be a conservative
and a good actor has to believe he is the character. Sorry, FDR.
I had to ditch that Democrats ship because it wasn't
taking me anywhere, which I didn't mind because the bag
was good. Man, Do I love money? I basically became
(25:28):
Alec Baldwin and thirty Rock, except more conservative, and boy
did I have power. Finally, so I became president of
the Screen Actors Guild. Will you name names? Senator McCarthy, Oh, boy,
who I have a list as long as you're bar
dab oh my. So he was the president of the
(25:53):
Union and he did testify in Congress, and he really
walked of very very narrow wine between Again, you have
to understand what the country was going through at the time,
and the Union had been in the middle of all
these gigantic battles. Uh and they're, you know, over communism.
(26:19):
Well you didn't hear this from me, but I hear
that redhead, you know, the one she's married to, that
Spanish fellow. Well I heard the hair Dante, the only
red she carries in her purse. She's got some explaining
to do. It would later be revealed that both Reagan
and his first wife, Jane Wyman, were FBI informants during
(26:41):
all of this. Uh, to be fair, like, like I've
done most of my life, I just read whatever script
the directors put in front of me. Well, in this case,
it just happened to be j Edgar Hoover, and hey,
I was able to get actors residual checks. You're welcome,
Tom Hanks. I at that. So not all bad? Right? So? Yes,
(27:03):
the battles with communists and the specifically communists in the
Hollywood unions that sort of implanted the anti communist side
of his of this ideology. Yeah, kill those COMMI bastards.
I'll give you all my guns if you will. The president,
you'll need to snap out of it. You're having a
(27:25):
Central American flash back. After sag and ge that angry
Barry Goldwater hit me up with another gig. He basically
wanted me to tell people to vote for him. Good
luck with that, Barry. The way I saw it, Barry
was going to lose even if I was able to
(27:45):
channel the Almighty's voice and command people to vote for him.
So I thought it was the perfect opportunity for a
little bit of Ronnie magic. I spit a couple of
bars to the crowd, and they ate that it up.
I've spent most of my life as a Democrat. I
recently have seen fit to follow another course the money.
(28:09):
There has come a time for choosing between being broken,
righteous or making a buck off the backs of others.
It was one of my fine air moments, and it
led to the next bag. Some dudes came up to me, like,
you ever think of running for office ship? Not really,
but they gave me a mill for my campaign, and
(28:31):
I had to take it because I was still out
here hustling, trying to be like my boy Frankie Roosevelt.
But you know, by destroying everything he built, Mrs Welfare
Queen tear down that mall, My campaign was ironclad. I
talked a little bit about welfare queens cutting social programs,
(28:54):
making America great again, and general inspirational shit, change the
game type it. And then there was the war. I
led comfortably from home against the Red Army by funding
civil wars in Central America. It was primarily through the
prism of the proxy wars that were going on at
(29:17):
the time with the Soviet Union and anti communism. And
you know, he would compare the Contras in Nicaragua, the
you know, Founding Fathers. So I made Central America a
killing field, big deal. I wasn't going to relive Vietnam.
(29:38):
We had the damn commies just a boat right away.
I'm pretty sure Franklin Delano Roosevelt would have knute the
bastards if I had done that. I bet these damn
Mexican Commies wouldn't be all up in my face. I
bet we don't lose half the Western hemisphere to that
Red menace. In fact, the more I think about it,
(30:00):
that man was a gangster, and so am I Does
that mean you've come to your senses? Damn right, I'm
not signing this on American dribble. Get me my veto stand. Ronnie,
you better look at this. Oh what is it? So?
(30:24):
In November of nine at you know, at a moment
when the Senate has just in the mid term elections,
gone from being Republican held to Democratic held. Word gets
out that Ronald Reagan has secretly been trading arms to Iran,
(30:47):
one of America's enemies, a country that has been branded
a terrorist country. Reagan has secretly been trading arms to
Iran in an effort to get out American hostages that
were held in the Middle East. And that is bad enough,
(31:09):
and that is you know, it is a violation of
every US policy there was. But then a few weeks later,
it is discovered that the money from those arms sales
is actually going in contravention of a law that Congress
had passed to fund the Nicaraguan rebels. The contrast, I mean,
(31:33):
it was a flat out violation of the law. So
you had both in Iran, a violation of US policy,
but also lawbreak going on within the White House. And
it becomes clear very quickly that if Ronald Reagan knew
(31:54):
about the diversion of this money, he is in danger
of getting impeached. And it really does become the biggest
crisis of his presidency. Man alive, there's a whole bunce
of press outside the room waiting you know what you
have to do. A real one does what he has
(32:17):
to do to survive. I'm very pleased that you could
all be here today. This bill, the Immigration Reform and
Control Act of that I will sign in a few
minutes is the most comprehensive reform of our immigration laws
since nineteen fifty two. It's the product of one of
(32:39):
the longest and most difficult legislative undertakings in the last
three Congresses. Further, it's an excellent example of a truly
successful bipartisan effort the administration of the allies of immigration
reform on both sides of the Capital and both sides
of the Aisle work together to accomplish these critically important
(33:00):
reforms to control illegal immigration. Al Right, So, maybe it's
a little cynical of me to imagine Ronald signing the
bill that gave my parents amnesty Urica to divert attention
from the Iran Contra scandal that almost got him locked up.
Maybe he did have more idealistic motives. Maybe it was
because he lived and worked in a very Latino city
(33:22):
and state before he got to the White House. Maybe
it was fandom of Fernando and the Dodgers, or his
lifelong friendship with the Mexican bartender named Peperois. I don't
know though, f Dr Johnson Nixon, Bush, Trump, Clinton, Reagan
honestly as a Mexican American kid who grew up in
(33:45):
Southeast Dely in the nineties, it's hard for me not
to see most moves by presidents in this country as
gangsters doing gangster ship. But the truth is, after more
than a year reading about it and dozens of interviews
with experts, I'm still lost on Reagan and Urica. After
(34:08):
all that, I still didn't really know about this guy.
Why did the same guy who I have to honestly
thank for giving my parents amnesty is the same dude
that is championed by conservatives, the guy who used parts
of Latin America as a proxy war game to fight
a European superpower, The guy who led the war on
(34:29):
drugs that gave rise to cartel violence, and whose domestic
policies felt like they were directly aimed at keeping black
and brown people from ever having a shot. But here's
the thing. I'm gonna pull the curtain way back and
say that when I was writing this episode, I had
(34:50):
no idea that my partner and co host Patti Rodriguez
had tracked down the author of a letter that may
prove Reagan's motives were actually pure and she was just
a ten year old kid writing to the most powerful
man in the world asking for him to do the
right thing. Please help us with this one thing, All
(35:14):
we Go residents. That's on the next episode of Out
of the Shadows, Children of eighty six. If you love
this podcast, please help us get the word out by following, rating, reviewing,
and sharing it with your friends. I'm Christopher Matthew Spencer,
(35:39):
and I played a fictional version of Ronald Reagan, FDR
and many of the other voices you heard today, who
were all invented and dramatized for the purposes of entertainment.
This episode also featured some very real legendary voices. They're
great journalist Mario Lena Salinas, author and Gif figaroa legendary
(36:02):
Dodgers broadcaster, Heim Haden, Nancy Reagan's biographer, Karen Tumulti, Ronald
Reagan's biographer, Luke Cannon, Father Boyle Al Murodan Lila Villas,
Marlino Rosco, Borney Santos, Rena, Solise Lose Thompson, Adriano Venegas
(36:23):
and Alejandro via Bando. Thank you everyone. Out of the
Shadows is written by Caesar Hernandez. It's also written, edited, hosted,
and executive produced by Patti Rodriguez and Eric Galindo. It's
produced by Betticrdanaz, Karen Lopez and Gabby Watts. It's sound design,
(36:46):
mixed and mastered by Jesse nice Longer. Our studio engineer
is Clay Hillenburg. Karen Garcia That's Me is our announcer.
Out of the Shadows is the production of In the
Other Productions and School of Humans in partnership with I
Hearts Michael Tura Podcast Network. The podcast is also executive
(37:09):
produced by Giselle Bancees, Virginian Prescott, Brandon Barr and Chad Crowley.
Our marketing and our team is led by Jasmine Maheia.
Original music by a Arenas and if you loved his
cover of Los Caminos la vida this podcast theme song,
you can listen to it on all music platforms. Historical
(37:31):
audio for Out of the Shadows comes from the Reagan
Presidential Library and the National Archives. Special thanks to Ian Vargas,
Alex and Ali Caitlin. Becker, gob Chabran, Daisy Church, Angel
Lopez Galindo, Julianna Gamis, Ryan Gordon, Brian Matheson, Claudia Marti ConA,
(37:58):
Oscar Ramirez, John Rodriguez, Juan Rodriguez, Joshua Sandovald, Eric Sclar,
Tony Sorrentino, and Megan Tangy
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