November 30, 2022 • 59 mins
David Archuleta joins Jonathan and Jaymes as he continues to proudly share his journey. A journey which at age 30, finally allowed him to find peace in his truth. From his “faith crisis” and stepping away from the Mormon church to the moment that helped him finally speak his truth, we cover it all.
David’s story is one that many can relate to and hopefully even more will find healing from.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
This is Pridecast with Jonathan Bennett James on I Heart Radio. Hey, everybody,
welcome to a new episode of Pridecast. It's Jonathan Bennett,
your host, joined by my handsome, hunky and happy Amritam husband,
James Vaughan. Say hello, James. I know I do this
every time. It's a gag. I'm doing a bit. I'm
(00:25):
doing a bit. So we are so excited because today's
episode we have David arch Aletta and we had a
conversation with him that is so so moving. I have
to say this could be one of my favorite episodes
we've ever done because there's so much emotion and so
many feelings in this Pridecast. It's a very honest conversation
(00:49):
and it might be tough for some people to hear
because we do. He does talk about faith and you know,
struggles with it and what he's going through. Yeah, it's
it's very important, especially for those of us that that
grew up in faith based households. I think this is
a really wonderful conversation that is going to be helpful
to a lot of people. We actually just wrapped it
(01:10):
up so it's very fresh for us and now we're
going to play it for you right now. All right,
we are welcoming the one and only, uh pop icon,
pop culture icon singer extraordinary. He does it all. The
one and only, the talented, fabulous, and famous David Archiletta
is joining us on podcast today. Hello David Archiletta, Hello,
(01:34):
Hey Jonathan, Hey podcast. I love that you're joining us
from the guest room at your parents house. Is that
what you said? Yeah, yeah, we've all been there. This
is This is a little bed for when my niece
is taking a napp and things here because my mom
watches over her a lot. So I think during the
(01:55):
holidays when you've got to do some type of press
our media and you're like at the house you grew
up in, and you're like, Okay, where do I go?
Where's the best place to do this? And it looks
like it's not a quiet space. In my childhood home,
there would not be a quiet space. A whole out
of redneck screaming in the background. Where are you from? Virginia? Virginia,
(02:16):
But the southern part where the gas station starts serving
fried chicken, it's a very now. So I live in
I live in Tennessee and they have a gas station
that serves fried chicken right right by my house. And
is it not the best fried chicken ever? The Gas
fried chicken is always the best of the area. You know, Yeah,
(02:36):
they don't disappoint you know what I think? Do you
know that we met I want to say ten years
ago at a tree lighting. I met you for five
seconds really just seeing your face right now. It was
one of those moments where I'm like, oh my gosh,
I've met David Archier. Let up, it was you. It
was you and I think Ariana Grande and it was
(02:58):
like the Hollywood Am I not? Am I crazy? Were you?
There was like a Hollywood crazy or I'm both? I'm both?
But up at it was at the Hollywood, Um, the
Hollywood and Highland like remember you know like the Kodak
hid there's like that, you know, the big like Kodak
Theater where you know they do the Oscars. There was
(03:20):
a big tree lighting ceremony and you sang at it. Yeah,
what was I sing with that? It was just me
and Ariana Grande was there in Ariana Grande before a
Grande was Ariana Grande. This is this is right after
idol would make sense. I was wondered why she followed
me on Twitter. It was the tree lighting ceremony. Yes,
(03:43):
I hosted it, and you guys saying I just realized
that it was for Camp Heartland or like one Heartland.
It was a camp for kids with HIV and like
we were raising money. Yep, that's so crazy. Well, it's
good to see you again, David Archilata. Good to see you.
And you've had You've had a lot of stuff going on.
I mean, we want to talk about You've had such
(04:04):
just a momentous year of for so many reasons. But
like what I want to talk about first, because I'm
that guy, we got to talk about Joseph. Oh, and
it's fitting for that musical. Yes, we used the code
as um a template for our background of prosperation. You
just love that. Of all the things we could talk to,
(04:26):
David Archer, let about my husband goes for Can we
talk about the musical you did? Yes? Because I'm a
music Did you have so much fun being Joseph? I
loved it. I want to do it again. It was
so fun. Well, what was some of your favorite parts
about playing that character? Because so I mean, so many
people that have you done it? I did it in
high school obviously high school. But it's just the most
(04:49):
fun show to do. Is it's just fun and energetic
and happy. Yeah, and like when you're backstage and tell
me if this happened to you when you're back stage
and the like, like the I think it's the third song,
the don't don't don't, don't, don't, don't like you. No
matter how many times you do the show, you still
(05:10):
get chills when that music comes. Yeah, it is so yeah, exhilarating.
I love that song. That's like my that's my favorite
song in the musical too. Jacob Jacob and sons so good.
Did you guys do a mega mix? Yeah? Oh yeah,
of course you can't. Now you can't do? Joseph about
the mega mix? Wait, because I'm not in this room.
(05:33):
Where did you? Where did you do Joseph at? I
did it in the St. George, Utah and Southern Utah,
like an hour forty minutes out of Las Vegas, and
there was the two ocon Amphi Theater. It's surrounded by
red rocks. It is incredible. Wait, I know that shows.
I know the theater about you know, Josh, Yeah, oh
(05:55):
my gosh, Josh and I used to do shows together
back and oh my gosh, Josh was when I left,
he was the next Joseph I now happened. It's all
clicking in my head and now I feel like I'm
a part of this conversation. Who is your narrative? Um,
the Katie Lamark. She is incredible. She is incredible. I
(06:18):
don't know her, but I want to know her because
you need to know her. Jessica Voss did it at
one of the other ones this summer. I think she
did a Muni the one of my favorite alphabas from
Wicked was the narrator And I was like, do I
just book a ticket and fly there just to watch her?
Because I would I know, Yeah, you didn't know. Well,
(06:39):
David's love going on. I'm just very busy doing podcast,
you know. Just we gotta we gotta celebrate the lgbt
Q plus community, which we are so excited to have
you on celebrating the lgbt Q plus community. Yeah, this
is like, this is a new thing, Like I'm learning
how to just get my get what what is it?
(07:00):
Get planted into this, get a feel and celebrate it
and love it, embrace it. Yeah, I've I've really loved
getting to you know, it's it's really unfortunate because I
spent so much of my life being afraid of it,
which I guess is common. It's it's a common thing
that people go through, especially like in faith based communities.
(07:21):
And you're talking to two of them. Ye, yes, okay,
I want to hear your stories. Oh my gosh, well
we want to hear your Yeah, I'm loving this. I
I spent so much time being afraid of it, Like
it's like something to fear, something to despise. If you
experience it yourself, do everything you can to suppress it
(07:42):
to what you know, as I've heard many people now
tell me they that they've gone through this experience of
praying the gay away. So I spent most of my
life doing that until last year as a thirty year old,
and I you know, it was a lot of the
a lot of the like verbage that was used. It's like, oh,
(08:06):
you're not If someone would be like I think I'm gay,
I think I'm queer, they'd be like, I think I'm
a lesbian, Like, oh, you're not gay, you just have
same sex attraction. Don't say you're gay, because if you
say you're gay, you're accepting it. You're admitting it and
like allowing it to be a part of you, which
is this, that's the same. But if you just acknowledge
(08:28):
that you are attracted to the same sex, you don't
have to act on that, so there's still hope for
you essentially. So so then it's like, Okay, I'm not gay.
I just struggle with this, and so I'm gonna pray
and work at it. And that's what I did. I
just kind of took that approach because that's how I
was raised, you know, hearing it at church, and so
(08:49):
I was like, Okay, I'm gonna work on it. And
I came out to my to my mom and my
little sisters. When I was twenty three, I had served
a mission for my church, the Latter day Saint missionary
and Sheila for two years preaching the gospel and doing
all this. And that's when I it was that that
was my first time I came to terms with myself
(09:10):
when I was a Mormon missionary. And I told my
mission president, I said, because you're around guys the whole time,
like you live with them, and I've never lived with
other guys my age before, and I had to come
to terms with the feelings I would get sometimes around them,
I'm like, I don't even want these feelings, but I'm
getting them. This is super embarrassing for me. And so
I told my mission president because I was like, oh
(09:31):
my gosh, am I gonna be like sent home from
my mission for having these feelings? Like I had heard
things like that happened before, like I'd talked to some
people who now that. It's like like a girl who's
coming came out to her mission president and he was like,
I'm so disappointed in you, like like like he almost
like she couldn't be forgiven for like admitting this. So
(09:53):
I was like, oh my gosh. But my mission president,
I was really fortunate. He was a super loving He
didn't say anything like I thought he was gonna tell
me like this is how you need to work on it.
He's just like you're doing a great job and like
you're a great missionary and just keep doing what you
do and I love you and and God loves you.
So I was like, oh, okay. But I went home
and told my parents, but I was like, I think
(10:15):
I'm gay, but I said, I'm gonna work on it.
So so I took that approach, and I, you know,
I got I started dating girls because that was like
like marriage is the ultimate goal in in the latter
day sat culture. Like it's like get married because that
is the most godly you can become. Creating a family
(10:37):
and pro creating, like you get the chance to create life.
That's the closest you can be to God and the
greatest joy you can accomplish. Like we have temples or
like we have these temples that Latter day Saints build
and it's like considered like heaven on earth, and you
go there and you get like married for time and
(10:59):
all each her any So it's like such a big deal,
like they make a huge deal out of it. And
so I was like, okay, I'm gonna get married. I
I started dating. I dated one girl, got engaged to her,
and then I just couldn't go through with it. I
thought maybe it's her and she thought, okay, She's like
(11:21):
what did I do wrong? I'm like I don't know. Um.
Then the second time through, I got engaged again for
a second time two a girl I met in Europe actually,
and so once again like I was staying through with it,
but then I was just like I don't feel like
my conscience wouldn't let me go through with it again.
(11:41):
And I was open with her. I was like, you know,
I'm attracted to guys and and but I was like,
but I'm still gonna make it work like girls in
our culture. It's like you here, It's like there are
people just like they do with depression, just like they
do with alcoholism. Some people deal with some metal health problems.
Other people deal one of those things that people deal
with is same sex attraction. So like people are encouraged
(12:05):
to help others work through their problems and through faith
and God, like, we can overcome this problem, this challenge
and have a happy life and happy marriage. So that's
what you know. So even I would talk to them
openly about it, but they but they were still cool
with it. But that didn't work. And then I got
engaged a third time. That was last year. So this
(12:26):
was in the spam of like the since the eight
years that I had come out to my parents. I
was like, I'm still gonna you know, through my faith,
God's going to change me, help me overcome my same
sex attraction. Um, but the last time I just felt like, Okay,
it's not any of these girls problems, They're all wonderful,
(12:48):
and this is I have to be honest with myself
and I just have to come to terms that maybe
I like because I was like, oh, I'm you know,
I'm bisexual because I still like these girls. And I
was like, you know, I'm never whether I'm like gay
or just inspect him a bisexual. I have to be
honest with myself. I like guys and I'm never. I
(13:08):
started feeling like this hatred for the girls. I was engaged.
I was supposed to be in love with them, and
I was feeling anger and hatred for them. Like it
was like like I felt like I was gonna explode.
So I was like, this isn't good. And I was
talking to one of my friends who she got married
to someone who was lg a guy who's LGBT, and
(13:32):
they got married, had five kids. He served in like
church leadership positions. She was saying, how like I was there,
I think, visiting with my ex fiance and she was
telling me the story and she's like, we had five kids,
like four of them observed missions and we were married
for twenty years, and all of a sudden, she's like,
I find some things and I tried to approach him
(13:53):
because it's like and he just exploded on her because
he thought like he was doing a good job hiding it.
He was like, you know, playing the part I had
kids was serving in his church. He started beating her
and and it's like it explodes and I was just like,
she's just like I She's like, I wasn't mad at
(14:15):
what that he was the way he was. I was
just mad that, um, you know, he had to felt
like he had to hide it and like and acted
out the way he did. And I was just like,
you know what, the council I'm getting right now is
leading me to that path, Like I don't want I
already feel that anger happening because I'm trying to be
(14:36):
something that I'm not. I'm trying to make it look
like I'm this happy, straight guy who's going to have
a happy straight life, and I know that's that's not
what I am. And this anger and bitterness that's building
up inside of me, he's gonna gonna get worse if
I keep faking this. And I was like, I don't
want to put anyone through that. I don't want to
(14:57):
be the cause of someone else's suffering just because I
tried to look straight and you know, make all the
Mormons who are watching me happy that I was following
God's path the way they thought it needed to look.
And so I told I was having these horrible anxiety attacks.
(15:19):
I had dinner with my ex fiance and I had
an anxiety attack again, and I was just like I need,
I need a break, And I said I can't see
for like, I need like three weeks because I was like,
I'm gonna take three weeks to work on praying and
fasting to see if God, if I have enough faith,
Like maybe this is just the trial of my faith.
(15:41):
And it's been sixteen years that I've been praying about
this now at this point, but maybe this is like
the ultimate goal, Like I'm so close to getting married
for a third time, and maybe it's just the devil
trying to take away my soul and prevent me from
having this marriage that I'm supposed to have that he
wants me to have. So I was praying and praying
and fasting where it's like you don't eat and you
(16:03):
don't drink so that you like humble yourself before God,
and uh, I started feeling like nothing I was like numb.
And that's when I started like going smiling down because
I didn't talk to anyone. I was so embarrassed because
I'm like, in the back of my head, I knew.
I was like, David, you like guys more than more
(16:25):
than girls, and maybe you have to come to terms
with that. And I was just like no, Like for me,
that was the devil talking to me. He was trying
to take me down, and I was like, I can't
let that happen. I can't, and so I was praying
even harder. I was like I didn't want to. I
stopped talking to my family, I stopped talking to my friends.
(16:48):
And I think that's a pretty dangerous thing to do,
because when you're feeling really sad and getting depressed and
you isolate yourself, you start thinking thoughts you shouldn't think.
You started thinking like, um, I don't know, it's just
it can be you need helps sometimes you need help
(17:08):
to go through. But I didn't know who to talk
to you. At that point. I was still going to church.
I was still like, I was like, I'm going to
do everything I need to, but it was like making
me feel even worse, and um, so I started I
was like, what do I do? I think in my heart,
I'm like I need to come to terms with this.
I need to admit this to myself. But I was like,
(17:30):
if I admit this, then I am giving my giving
myself away. And so I was like, Okay, what's worse?
Because I felt that like about to just pop out
and like explode. I couldn't hold it down anymore. And
so I was like, before that happens, what's worse for
me to become gay and end up with the guy
(17:52):
or doing something doing stuff I'm not supposed to be
doing with guys, or maybe I should just eminate things
before it to prevent it from getting there. I was
looking at as a better option to end my life
than two become gay after the fact. Like now that
(18:25):
I've come out, like I've seen that is pretty common,
Like unfortunately that is way more common than it should
be with people of faith and and specifically with people
in my church, like Latter Day scenes, oh, because because
it's just that conflict that it's causing, Like you hear
(18:47):
like homosexuality and they're they're like pauring it up like
the sin with like killing people. So like you're looking
at yourself as like if I've become a homosexual, like
I'm my evilness is equal to those of murderers, and
it's like I don't want to deal bad. I don't
want to live my life like feeling that on myself.
(19:08):
So you're thinking like, okay, but it just got to
a point where I'm like, well, I was just going
back and forth in my head. I'm like, well, maybe
even if I was gay, and maybe if I even
ended up with a guy, maybe there's some value to
my life still, like maybe I can make up for it,
Like even if I'm this horrible gay person, queer person,
(19:31):
maybe it's still I can still contribute to life so
that it's not entirely bad for me to keep being here.
So like that was like the things I was going
through with my mind. So I'm like maybe, but at
the same time, you feel so disappointed in yourself because
it's like I was supposed to be married, I was
supposed to have this wife and have these children and
(19:54):
live this dream, this dream life that you're you're taught
as growing up as a ladder. They say, so a
k A Mormon. So um, there's just a point where
it's just like I don't want to deal with this,
Like I don't feel like God's hearing me. I must
not have enough faith, Like no matter how hard I try,
I just maybe I'm a faithless person. Or maybe I'm cursed.
(20:17):
Maybe God really doesn't like me and he's just showing
me that he doesn't. Maybe he doesn't want me around.
But I'm like or like maybe I'm not good enough,
Like maybe I'm not strong enough and I'm showing my weakness.
So you start like I was. I was just like
thinking like, well, maybe if I just go off, I
can just speed up right now and I can just
drive off the curb and like it will look like
(20:40):
it wasn't on purpose, because I didn't want to have
that weight of like my family, thinking like I saw
how people who end their lives how much it affects
the family, Like I don't want to do that to
my family. I love them too much to leave them
feeling like they did something wrong. So and I didn't
want to hurt their lives. But I was like, if
(21:02):
it looks like an accident, then maybe it won't be
as bad. And that was like going back and forth
for a couple a few weeks, Like when I was
in that time where I just isolated myself and it's
I don't I don't think that's a good thing. It's
just how it was. But I finally got to the
point where I just finally felt this like opening and
(21:23):
I like came out of the numbness and I just
was like, I think that's God, this feeling that I've
always recognized as God. I've had a faith crisis this year,
so like now I'm like, I don't know what to call,
like God greater, like some something greater out there, like
higher self. But I always called the God. And that's
(21:45):
what I was feeling at that point. And I just
dropped to my knees and I was like God, like
desperately just saying, God, if you're there, and if you
really have a purpose for me, please take this away
from me. I don't. I'm so tired. I don't know
what to do with this anymore. Like no matter how
(22:06):
hard I try, it's not enough. So please please, Like
I know you can change water into wine. I know
you can allow the blind to see, like that's what
they taught me, So surely you can change me if
that's your will. And I just got this clear response
it was so clear and sure and like just assuring,
(22:31):
like peaceful, but like strong. He just said, David, you
need to stop asking me this. As you can see,
you've been asking for over half of your life now
for me to change you and change something that I
don't intend to change. It's like it's like I don't
see you the same way you see you. I don't
(22:53):
see you the same way a lot of people do
a lot of even while meeting people who are following
me see you. He's like, and I, now I need
you to take time to understand that. And I said,
I was like, I didn't. I wasn't expecting that. Like
I thought he was gonna be like, yes, David, you
finally shown your trial of faith and you passed the
(23:14):
test like like the Abraham was about to kill his son.
And Isaac like, no, wait, you don't actually have to
do that, like you've shown your proven yourself worthy and faithful.
But he was like, no, you need to stop asking
you this. I'm like, huh, And I said, I don't
want to mess up though, like I don't want to
make I just don't want to mess up. And he said, well,
(23:36):
then perhaps you need to do what you think are mistakes.
So do you realize you're allowed to make mistakes. I
give you permission to make mistakes, and then you're as
you make mistakes, you're going to realize what you thought
were mistakes aren't mistakes. And I knew what he was
talking about, a God or whatever it um. I understood
(23:57):
it as God as I had always understood at that point,
like said, but it just said, and if you make mistakes,
if you do mess up, that's why you can always
come to me and we can work through this together.
And so I don't know if that was like my
higher self, it's like that's God. I don't know, but
(24:18):
I knew that was what I needed. And I knew
what God was referring to as like, Okay, I just
need to get to know guys and date them. And
I and then like I was doing yardwork a cup
like not long after that, and I just felt like
this feeling and say, like you need to share this,
(24:38):
like just and so I posted on Instagram about it.
And that was my coming out last year of June,
and just I was all sweaty from doing yard work,
but I was just like, I don't know, I didn't
think anything of it like I didn't. I was literally
still sweaty from yeah. And if I didn't realize how
(24:59):
many people, how much it's going to mean to everybody.
So the thing David, like you, I sit here and
listen to you, like your struggle so mimics what I
went through with the Christian Church, being raised Baptist in
the South, Like I hear so many things. I'm like, yes,
that that that that that, but like realize the struggle
that you went through to get to hear just by
(25:21):
sharing your story, there's somebody, if not many, somebody's that
are not going to go through the struggle you went
through because now you've shown them, look what happens. Look
when you get to the other side of it. The
way that's lifted, the fact that you do get to
live your life authentically and you do survive, and you
not only survived, but you thrive. And I think it's
(25:43):
so beautiful that you're sharing this with everybody because the
good that you were going to do. You're going to
stop people from going through the struggle you went through
just by telling your story, and you should be really
proud of yourself for that. And you're gonna stop people
from getting hopefully by sharing that, sharing your story of struggle,
you are going to stop the people from getting to
the dark places that you got to that you were
(26:06):
able to pull out of, because so many times some
people don't pull out of those And by you sharing that,
and I'm sitting here crying because of you know, you're
trying to find your purpose and you know you're talking
about what your purposes, you know, in what you're supposed
to be doing. Just from you sharing the story of
(26:30):
how you didn't want to disappoint the people that were
listening to you, you helped heal me because I know
what it's like, just says, well, you do. I relate
to that so much of when I was in when
I did mean girls and being in the closet and
not being able to come out. I was living in this,
(26:52):
you know, very similar situation to you. And it was
like people people finding out that I was gay. I
was so afraid that I was going to disappoint all
the people that have like built me up and helped
me have a career and like ben Fans and like
followed my journey and done that. I was so afraid
that they were going to be disappointed by me. When
(27:12):
they if they found out that I was gay, and
just for you, from you sharing that about you, it
helped heal me a little bit. I could feel it
healing inside my heart because like it was just a
little like, oh, someone else has done this. I'm not
alone someone else because what we do is a weary,
weird profession, right, it's not not a lot of people
do this. And so by you sharing that, you helped
(27:34):
heal me just now on this podcast, it helped. So
thank you. Oh that's beautiful. See, this is why we
share these stories, this right here. Yeah, the reason that's
so important. It's therapeutic to get it, you know, to
get it out. And I'm I'm so glad that it's
(27:54):
that it's heal healing to hear because sometimes it's like
it's hurtful, but it's like when someone else is going
through that same pain, it's so nice to let them
know they're not alone. I know. It meant so much
to me when I like the people who who like
I was watching, Um, there's a guy who's in my church.
His name is Charlie Bird. He was this mask. He
(28:16):
was the b y U s Cosmo, the Cougar mascot
and he went viral doing his ESPN dance like dances
and um and he came out as like the mascot,
but also came out as gay. And I was kind
of like, what, like it's okay to be gay and
be a Mormon. Like I was just like what, And
(28:37):
they they a lot of people are like, no, you
shouldn't use the word gay like that. That's what they
were saying, and amongst like our like our church and
like some of the people who are higher up with this.
And He's like, but that's how I identify myself. And
they're like, no, we're not. Like some of the people like, well,
your book won't be able to come out if you
use that word. But he just like, you know what,
(28:59):
I have to use it. And he had the courage
and he was like I'm going to risk, you know,
I'm gonna still put it out and let people know
I'm gay and let them know why it's okay. Well
it's not a bad thing to be that. And one
of my friends gave me that book during COVID and
I was just kind of like, why are you giving
me this book? Because I wasn't you know, I wasn't
terms with myself yet, and she was like, no, it's
(29:21):
it's a great book. It's a great even like even
if you're not not um LGBT, it's a great like
spiritual book to read. I was like, and I hauled off.
I was like, I don't want to read that because
I was uncomfortable with it, like I was working so
hard to avoid that conversation and having to confront it.
But when I read it, I was just like, oh wow,
(29:42):
because he he had he described it. He's like, I'm gay,
Like his audience is like Mormons that he's talking to
with this, it was like on this church comp bookstore,
desert book and he's like, I'm gay, and this is
why identify as gay? Because usually with it's like, no,
you have same sex attraction. If you're following God. If
you say you're gay, then you're like following the devil.
(30:04):
And so he's like, this is why identify as gay
because he's like, yes, I'm attracted to the same sex,
but there's so many other things that that label I
identify with. He's like, I'm a dancer. It's like you
are reading this book probably because you've seen me dancing.
He's like, I love art, I love fashion. He's like,
I have an eye for design. He's like, I'm sentimental.
(30:25):
I get along really well with women and so and
so he's like, you know, if if I was, he's like,
it's not just like this attraction to the same sex.
He's like, I feel like being gay is like this,
there's so many other things to being who I am.
He's like, and if I wasn't gay, I wouldn't be
who I am anymore. And I thought that was It
(30:46):
was so comforting to see that because our church would
always just say gay people all they think about a sex.
They're just lustful and their horny and they just want
to like do like weird unnatural sexual things with with
each other with the same sex, and that's all they're thinking.
So this is like my first time seeing someone and
(31:07):
I was able to relate to him, like, so you
mean it's okay to be the way I am, Like,
it's not this evil thing. So um, and that's why
I'm like, I'm trying. Sometimes it's like, oh my gosh,
it's like a heavy thing to always talk about. But
I'm like, I want people, especially people like in churches,
you know, who grew up like we did and in
like faith cultures to know like it's actually not bad
(31:30):
to be the way you are and and help them
understand a little bit why, like it's you can be
happy and and it's like a wonderful thing. It's a
beautiful it's beautiful. It's beautiful to be queer. Yeah, I
look at like you talk about religion, like I look
at how I grew up, and I say, like, there's
a level of brainwashing that happened in the church I
(31:51):
grew up in, and it is telling you you can
only be one way. Like I was listening to you
talk about how they would phrase things so our church
would say struggle with homosexuality, like and that was their
thing they tried to put up for spence. It would
make you feel like, oh, I should feel bad for
feeling this way, and also I'm struggling, just like I
may struggle with lying or whatever else it is. And
(32:11):
they brainwash you to think that. And then I even
heard you say some of the terminology they would say,
like if I become gay, you don't become gay. You
just accept the fact that you are and you learn
to love it and celebrate it. And the minute you do,
tell me if I'm wrong here, But if they're not,
that weight that just comes off and all that fear
that you had just disappears, because all of a sudden,
(32:34):
it feels like now you're actually living a life that's
in the light. You're actually living a life completely as yourself.
And when you're not doing that lying or lying to
yourself or lying to other people, the anger goes away.
When you're not doing that lying to yourself for other people,
that fear goes away because it's all just real, it's
the truth. And like that's the thing, like I always say,
(32:56):
like I always talk about you are listening at home,
this is what you should get from this, Like get
the hope from this, get the fact that, like it
is so much better when you are just yourself. And
if you are in a place where you're still letting
religion or whatever you were taught beat you down, Like no,
that's just Oftentimes it's not people being malicious. It's just
that they don't know any better because it's all they
(33:17):
were taught, and so they try to put it on you.
And it's okay to let it go and just thrive
as who you are, Like screw that, I'm gonna have
a breade, and I think it's so important to have
(33:49):
like the conversation, like because when I came out, a
lot of like some of the conservative people who who
had an opinion, like they said the same thing I'd
heard a lot growing up. Well, why why is this?
Why do you have to say it out loud? Why
why don't you just keep this to yourself? And I'm like,
because all y'all cared about who I was dating, who
I was gonna marry, Like y'all wanted to know everything
(34:11):
else about me. And now that I'm saying why I'm not.
And also it's like I need, we need to have
this uncomfortable conversation, especially in the churches, And because they're
not used to it like that there, they haven't been
exposed to it, and they're like, oh, like, why are
you exposing this to this? We've we've also avoided this.
I'm like, you know what, I tried to avoid that.
(34:33):
I tried to avoid that all my life, until to
the point where I thought it would be better to
terminate myself to to not have to deal with it.
I'm like, they're way too many other people in the
same position who are feeling the same way. So it's like,
we need to talk about it, and then he was
one of those people, so we you are doing a
really good thing by saying it, like because again, like
the more we say it, the more people realize they're
(34:55):
not alone, and the more hope we give to people.
So I'm just is so awesome that you are using
your voice right now to do this. I just think
it's a beautiful, beautiful thing. There are people out there
listening David that are feeling exactly like James's feeling, and
they are feeling exactly like I'm feeling, which is wow.
(35:15):
I feel like someone sees me. I come from a
faith based based background where I have struggled with my
faith and might have it. You know, you have a
faith crisis where you're feeling one way, but because of
your faith in the way you were raised and the
different churches you've grown up with, you're torn in a
(35:35):
different direction. So there's people are out there listening to
this podcast right now and you're here speaking about it.
So for the people that are listening that feel like
they're being seen by listening to your story, what would
you tell them? The people that are going through the
same struggle that you are. I hope, like, if you're
(35:56):
here listening to this, I hope you can see that
us three, you know, we've come out, we've and we're
hopefully you can hear our stories and see that you're
not alone. That you know. I feel like some of
the word wording that we hear in religion can make
us feel isolated, like where the problem and like we
(36:18):
struggle misunderstood. So I hope you know by hearing us
three talk openly about our experiences that we've gone through,
what you're feeling like. I just hope you know you're
not alone. We're where You're with you, we got you,
and that it's that it's there. It's really beautiful. One,
(36:38):
it's scary to work through. I guess the inner homophobia
that we've been taught, been taught to be afraid of ourselves,
and we think that it's bad to to accept that part.
It's terrifying. But once when you have the courage to
accept yourself, you feel this love that you've never allowed
(37:03):
yourself to experience for yourself, and you find this new confidence,
this new joy, and it's just like wow, like you
it's like I can actually live my life and enjoy it.
I don't have to hide, I don't have to pretend
to be something else. And it's and it's like, you know,
I'm not I'm not an evil person. I'm I'm I'm
(37:26):
being the way I was, Like you know that prayer
that I had. It's like it's like, you know, we're designed.
We are designed differently, but we're not designed less than
we can have the same amount of joy. We can
enjoy relationships um just as equally as anyone else can,
and it's so beautiful, and we can have companionship, we
(37:50):
can have families if we want. Like that is still
it may look a little differently as all than then
what's considered like the standard look, but you can experience
the same amount of joy and happiness and you deserve it.
You deserve to have it. Listen, Dave, I think honestly,
and like maybe I've just had a lot of a
(38:10):
lot of time out as myself now to look at
it differently. I think where we live a better life.
I think it's a life of true honesty. It's a
lie because because once you get that to be honest
about who you are, you pick up the strength to
be honest everywhere and you live a much more authentic
real life because of that. So I think I think
(38:31):
before you plus, like I get to be married to
a dude that's so fun. Dude, yes, a very good
looking man, very good looking, but beyond that, it's my
best buddy. It's Mary, my best buddy, and and have
all this with him, so like it's it's a really
cool thing. So how did it's thrilled to be gay?
And I think gays have Like I'm gonna go ahead
(38:53):
and say it, like I'm not gonna say like, we're
like more funner, better, but gosh, we are more fun
and we just are because no one's ever said, oh
my boring gay best friend. Sentence has never been said
in the history of the world. They're like, oh my god,
my amazing, hilarious gay bff. No one's ever said, oh
(39:13):
my boring gay friend who is just a wallflower? Right,
Like that's ever been set. So it's that lets me
be able to say we have more fun and we
are we are more fun. So we David, I heard
David ask where we met? We met? We met? So
I used to host a TV show that Jonathan was
a guest on and and I was promoting Halloween Wars
(39:34):
because I was actually episode one of podcast. If you
ever get to go back to the first episode of
our pridecast that we did, we met, I met, I
was I was hosting Halloween Wars on Food Network. That
this always the motion you use for hosting my lef. Yeah,
this is a microphone, but it's not. It's a microphone.
I was hosting Halloween Wars on Food Network and I
(39:57):
went on his show to promote my show, and we
met and instantly fell in love. And then I left
him and I ran back and I said, I have
to meet you in the parking lot because I need
to kiss you to see if this is going to
be forever true story rush exactly as he was last thing,
David Archer let us crush from his speakers. He came
(40:17):
back to see if it was a crush and how
long ago was this funny? It was in fact real,
Oh my gosh, six years, six years. It was basic
years ago. We got married this year. Congratulations, thank you.
And this makes me so happy to see I love
because it gives like, you know, I don't have a
lot of examples of like I think they like prevented
me from seeing gay people happy to discourage me from
(40:40):
feeling like I could be happy if I accepted this.
So I just love y'all just killing it. Thank you,
And it's it's funny because as we say, David, as
we welcome. It's it's funny though because I really do
identify with you, because because we do have a certain
level of like weird job where what we do people
notice and it's a whole thing. We don't want to
let down our fans, and you just feel like like
(41:02):
I understand it. So it's like, I remember when I
came out. I came out with an Instagram post as well.
I Instagram post. I wasn't sweaty. I posted a picture
of us. Well maybe we were sweaty. I'm gonna look
up David. I posted a picture of us, uh, just
like together, like cuddling kind of, and I just was like,
(41:23):
you know what this is the I love this guy
and like I love him and like just posted that
and I remember just going viral, like or not viral,
but just everyone like, oh my god, you know John
the man, Like everyone's like going crazy about it. But
when I hit post that, you feel it physically come
off you. The stress and the weight that you've been
(41:45):
carrying for sixteen years. You feel it go like oh okay,
and it just it. It doesn't make it perfect, but
a huge chunk of it leaves and then the rest
is able to dissipate over time. So and it's still dissipating, right.
There's still a little little things on my shoulders and
stuff I have to, you know, brush off because I
feel like, oh, one of those little those little negative
(42:07):
nancies are coming up on my and it's like, no,
that's not real, that's not real, and you have to
brush them off always. But it does. So I do
I identify with that whole story of the post. I
love it. I love it. Yes, thank you to instal
is me to come out. Yes, because like there is,
there's so much joy in it too, that like we
need to talk about because, like you said, David, like
(42:28):
they do in religion, they hide it from you. They
hide the fact that there is joy, They hide the
fact that you will have this happiness. I was taught
that I will never have my happily ever after if
I choose this life, which a k A just means
except who I am. And that is so wrong to
all those pastors and preachers and even little puppets. We
had puppets. Don't even get me started on that. The
(42:50):
puppets trying to tell us how like you were wrong
because the happiness is out there to be had. Have
you gotten this one? I want to know because we
talked about this on podcast a lot. We ask people
about their first pride. Yes, have you gotten to go
to a pride yet? You know? I didn't. I don't
think I've gone to private. I've gone to what's called
the Love Loudfest that Dan Reynolds from Imagine Dragons Doud
(43:11):
in Utah. He's amazing. So that was my first like
fest of any kind of pride I went. I've gone
to it a few years ago as well, but this
is my first time that I participated in it. Out
this is a queer guy and so what was that like?
It was? It was here in Salt Lake. It was
(43:32):
really scary because I never talked to it, like face
to face with people, and to do it in Salt
Lake City was really terrifying. Actually I was. I was
having an anxiety attack before but um and on stage.
Actually I was having an anxiety attack, but at the
same time it was so liberating. Because I felt like
(43:52):
I didn't have to put this front on for everybody,
because literally, like I was used as like this example
in the church to be like this is how you
want to be, Like this is how we want our
kids to to be, like, look how faithful and true
and he is to like his beliefs. And so I
was scary because I felt like I was exposing myself
(44:13):
like just completely like just new to out there, I felt.
And but it felt like I had nothing else to
hide anymore, and it was really relieving. Ah. And this
is because this is pridecast we always ask everyone, and
this is something that you know, this year has been
(44:35):
your big year where you come out and been able
to talk about this. So you know it's gonna mean
something different to you now than it's going to mean
to you two years from now, five years from now,
two months from now, Right now, in this moment, what
does pride mean to you? Pride is like the sense
of it's acknowledging all of you, and it's accepting all
(44:59):
of you and then having confidence in that. It's like
these levels, uh of learning how to just fully love
all of you and love parts of you that you
were told you didn't have permission to that, you were
told you weren't allowed to love, and to finally take
(45:19):
that and own it back, to finally gain ownership of
what was taken from you, to feel like you needed
to reject this part of you that's always a part
of you, it's like and it's part of your essence,
and so to to gain confidence and full love in that.
I feel like totally deserves the title of pride because
(45:43):
and people be like, you know, oh, but you know,
why why do you say pride and stuff? I'm like,
because it's like I had to learn how to be
okay with that word too, for those very things. It's
like I'm gaining back ownership of a part that I
was always told old I was I needed to be
ashamed of I need. I'm gaining it back. And yeah,
(46:06):
and it's it. Does you feel a sense of pride,
like like I feel you feel stronger. You feel stronger.
I feel like you and I need to hang out
cha because like we're the same person, like we will
just sing songs and musicals. We can't do it without it,
(46:28):
um and I want to I do want to address
like because we've be talking about like religion, and stuff.
Here there are some really wonderful people of faith and
different religions that we even have in our lives. We
have wonderful Christian friends, we have wonderful Mormon friends, et cetera,
and they are out there. Um, would you did you
want to talk about how? Because I see that the
(46:48):
Mormon Church has has come out and uh what do
they say that it supports kindifying protections for same sex marriage?
And like, we have some very progressive Mormon friends I
feel that have always been very supportive of us and
progressive Christian people. Um what what do you I mean?
Is it? Are you even a placeat to have thoughts
on where do we think religion goes from here with
(47:10):
loving queer people and accepting queer people and celebrating queer people.
Because my thought is that man got ahold of all
of these scriptures way too much and tweaked it for
what they wanted down the line as interpretations and interpretations
and interpretations went on. And so do you think there's
a space where you know, the different faiths can be
(47:32):
celebratory of us wonderful, amazing queer people, the best people. Yeah,
Like I said, I've had a bit of a faith crisis.
I've had to take a step back and step away
from my faith and beliefs. But I do I agree
with you with that people just according to whatever is
the social constructure of the time. People just interpret what
(47:55):
scripture is to fit whatever they want to believe, or
whatever they're uncomfortable with, whatever they don't understand and they
are scared of, so they label it as bad and
try to change how scripture sounds to fit fit that. UM.
But I feel like there's there has to be space.
(48:16):
I feel like we're in a time. Someone who's telling
me this, someone was saying, we're in a time of
enlightenment now, like we're in this technological You can't hide
things away anymore. It's my friend's mom like you, you
can't hide things. You can't just label something and take
someone's word for it. You have too many resources to
see for yourself how things actually are, including the LGBT
(48:38):
community and individuals. UM. You can't label them as bad
because like you can see it for yourself how they
really are and what they're about. But I feel like
churches in order to not if they want to keep growing,
they have to make room for for for LGBT for everyone,
and yeah, for everybody, not yet, not just not just
(48:59):
LGBT people. UM, finding common ground for everybody to feel included.
And there's I was having conversations with one of my
church leaders, and it's like when I first spoke to him,
he didn't know what I was going to bring up.
And I was talking to him about my sexuality and
he tried to stop the conversation because he was uncomfortable.
(49:19):
He's an older gentleman where they didn't talk about this,
and he said, well, he's like, I don't know what
to tell you. I don't understand this topic. He's like,
I don't know what it's like to be gay. He said,
let me find someone else for you to talk to,
and I said, he's so. He said, let me find
someone else free to talk to to help you understand it.
And I said, I don't need someone to help me
(49:39):
understand it, like I'm already I've already gone through this,
Like all I need is for you to listen to
what I'm going through and what I have to share.
And UM, I've had to meet with him several times.
He's like one of the higher higher leaders in my church.
So it's like he's in charge of a lot of
what other people are gonna believe, and they're ideologies. He
(50:01):
has a lot of influence. And he was saying I
went to talk with him again, um, just the other week,
I think last week, and he said he said, he said,
this is the first time I've ever had an in
depth conversation with someone who's who's gay, and and well
I think about the topic and I was like, and
(50:24):
I said, well, it's I feel like this is overdue
and it is crucial. And he said this isn't going
to go away, is it? And I said, no, it's not.
He said, it's only going to keep growing. I said, yeah,
it is going to keep going because more people are
gonna just not hide. And I said, most people feel
like people are leaving the church because you don't give
(50:47):
them an option, because like there's it's kind of like
this expectation, which is why it's so complicated with Latter
day Saints, is if you get married, they may excommunicate you.
If you're in the same sex marriage, they will consider
It's like I said, I see myself marrying a man
if I get married, I see myself marrying a man.
So why am I going to stay in this church,
(51:07):
because he was like, well, why did you leave the church?
Why did you say it publicly? Because I I've told
People magazine that I was I had stepped away from
my church. And He's like, what, And I said, I
don't want to be in a place and I don't
want to act like I'm a part of this organization
that I'm I've stepped away from now, and I don't
want the reason one of the reasons, There are several reasons,
(51:30):
but I don't want to be somewhere where if I
decide I want to marry and commit myself to someone
I love through marriage, that there's gonna be hanging over
my head, this fear that they're going to remove my
baptism covenant that I made with Christ because I'm considered
someone who's rebelling against God and that I've that I'm
like denying his spirit and committing this horrible thing against God.
(51:53):
Like why would I why would I want to stay
here with with that judgment being placed on when I
know I'm good, Like I know I'm making the right
decision for me. And so he was thinking about that,
and he was saying, He's like, you know, we don't
know why we don't know why gay people are why
God like has this why gay people exist. And I'm like,
(52:17):
you're you're talking about it as if it's a problem,
I said, And instead of talking about as if it's
an issue, why don't what about considered it as if
that's how God intended it, Like we are just designed
differently than heterosexual people and still fully can find joy
in our relationships and belong and be happy. I said,
(52:40):
we need to stop looking at it that way. And
so I feel like you have to have uncomfortable conversations
with people because for them like we don't want to
talk about this. But I'm like and and I was
really happy because he said, well, I feel like to
find solutions, you have to gain understanding. And that's when
he said, I've never talked to like a person this
(53:01):
indebt before. And I said, well, I'd be happy to
talk to more people and more of the leaders because
I feel like this needs to happen. And I said,
my friend Charlie Bird, I'm like, he's trying to talk
to some of the leaders And I said, you won't
talk to him. I'm like, why not? He has a
great perspective, he's a great advocate for people like me,
(53:23):
and he's still in the church at this point at least.
I can't speak for his future. But I said, but
you won't talk to him? Why not? I said, I
can only imagine. I'm like, it was hard for me
to have a conversation with you, and I've known you've
all for like over a decade now, and I've been
like this public figure in the church. I can only
imagine how hard it's been for everyone else. So I'm
hoping that I can at least get my foot in
(53:44):
the door to help the conversation keep going for the
rest of the people, so they don't feel like, well,
maybe it's better for me to not be here anymore.
Like I want to just completely wipe that away. So
whether if you decide you want to be religious and
and queer that you can safely do that, that you're
literally changing the face of it, you're using it for good,
(54:08):
and you're literally changing the face of it, Because I mean,
who's to say that with what the Church of Jesus
Christ letter to the Saints came out that they're in
support of codifying same sex marriage right and so that
doesn't happen without people like you having those conversations with
the highest up leaders of that organization. So you're literally
(54:31):
changing the face of acceptance in this religion. I think
a lot of these religions who are going to learn
like you, either learn or get left behind. Yes, the
world is growing, the world is changing. People are learning
to love themselves and accept themselves in love and accept
each other. And so to be continued, I guess with
this with I'm certainly not a part of religion I
(54:52):
grew up in anymore. I'm definitely in a different place
than that. So to be continued. To be continued, Listen, David,
I when did you get back to your family? Because
I know you are at your family's home, but I
know you got a lot of stuff to promote. So
I'm just gonna let you shamelessly shameless. This is a
shameless plus shameless plugs. You have a Christmas tour, David.
(55:14):
Let me remind you have a Christmas tour. Tell us
about it. You have a song called I do that too. Yeah,
Christmas tour. More, the more, the merrier Christmas tour. And
uh I have I think I have like nine or
ten shows still that I'm doing, Like in Texas, Arizona, Utah,
Las Vegas, and uh up until December with those and
(55:39):
then faith in Me I released. That was the last
song I released a couple of months ago, I think.
And it was kind of like my song where I
was describing what it's like to feel finally being okay
with myself and allowed myself to like who I like?
So and and that is like the sensation. It feels
like it's exciting and it's like you just wanna yeah.
(56:02):
So it's faiths it's my song that it's really fun.
I wanted to feel like you're dancing in your room
like no one's watching. But I did that in out
in the Streets because that's what it feels like coming
out in a sense. So, and my good friend Kevin McHale.
(56:23):
He was one of my first He was on one
of my only gay friends I had when I first
came out. So I called him. He directed the video
and I called him like, so do you know Kevin, Yes,
we've met him before, Yes, Okay, he is the best.
So he and Justin Thorne directed it. But I called Kevin,
I'm like, what is this like, I'm like, I don't
(56:43):
know what it's like. To date a guy, Like, how
is it? I asked him, and he's just he was
so cool and so open with me, and he's like,
if you ever have questions, you can call me any time.
So he's awesome. Yes, And you now have your gay
uncles right here, Jonathan and you call when when you're
going through the woes and the highs and the lows
(57:04):
of your relationships, you call, you call Jonathan and James
and say, okay, gounles um from this part he just
said this, but we went on a date and now
he wants to do this and I don't know, and
we we'll we'll walk you through it, okay. But I
would just I would just tell you this. Don't don't
let that damage that un educated people put on you
(57:26):
affect you now in your quest for love. Don't take
the baggage from the uneducated people into the new relationship
because it's not real. It's not real when you get
so you get to start this fresh beginning. You are
going to feel very young. Listen, not to preach at
you right now, but you are going to feel very
young because when you are dating genuinely and authentically, it
(57:49):
feels like you're just dating for the first time as
like a teenager. So that stuff's all going to pop up.
Know that it's all accurate, it's all real, and it's
all okay, and you're you're happy. Ending has come? Is
that our new show? Thank you, David art Love. It's
us like pre screening dates Sweet Man's Life. Okay, fine, fine,
(58:11):
we'll let you do it. I know, but you call
us if you need us. All right, David, thank you
so much for joining us on podcasts. I know that
this episode is going to change people's hearts, it's going
to change their minds, and it's going to help people
feel seen. I know that for a fact because you
helped us feel seen. So thank you so much for
joining us on podcast Thank you. Thanks Jonathan James too
(58:34):
great and we need to hang, Yes, we will have to.
How do people get tickets for your tour? Oh? They
can go to David Archiletta dot com and I have
a link on my Instagram. I thinking on my TikTok
David Archie or my TikTok and Instagram handles. I mean,
it's David Archiletta. He's a legend. You'll find him on
social media. Type his name and go see his Christmas tour,
(58:57):
make sure you listen to his new song faith In,
and have a fantastic holiday. David, we will talk to
you soon. Happy to her and Bud Thanks, Happy to her.
Bye bye
This is Pridecast with Jonathan Bennett James on I Heart Radio. Hey, everybody,
welcome to a new episode of Pridecast. It's Jonathan Bennett,
your host, joined by my handsome, hunky and happy Amritam husband,
James Vaughan. Say hello, James. I know I do this
every time. It's a gag. I'm doing a bit. I'm
(00:25):
doing a bit. So we are so excited because today's
episode we have David arch Aletta and we had a
conversation with him that is so so moving. I have
to say this could be one of my favorite episodes
we've ever done because there's so much emotion and so
many feelings in this Pridecast. It's a very honest conversation
(00:49):
and it might be tough for some people to hear
because we do. He does talk about faith and you know,
struggles with it and what he's going through. Yeah, it's
it's very important, especially for those of us that that
grew up in faith based households. I think this is
a really wonderful conversation that is going to be helpful
to a lot of people. We actually just wrapped it
(01:10):
up so it's very fresh for us and now we're
going to play it for you right now. All right,
we are welcoming the one and only, uh pop icon,
pop culture icon singer extraordinary. He does it all. The
one and only, the talented, fabulous, and famous David Archiletta
is joining us on podcast today. Hello David Archiletta, Hello,
(01:34):
Hey Jonathan, Hey podcast. I love that you're joining us
from the guest room at your parents house. Is that
what you said? Yeah, yeah, we've all been there. This
is This is a little bed for when my niece
is taking a napp and things here because my mom
watches over her a lot. So I think during the
(01:55):
holidays when you've got to do some type of press
our media and you're like at the house you grew
up in, and you're like, Okay, where do I go?
Where's the best place to do this? And it looks
like it's not a quiet space. In my childhood home,
there would not be a quiet space. A whole out
of redneck screaming in the background. Where are you from? Virginia? Virginia,
(02:16):
But the southern part where the gas station starts serving
fried chicken, it's a very now. So I live in
I live in Tennessee and they have a gas station
that serves fried chicken right right by my house. And
is it not the best fried chicken ever? The Gas
fried chicken is always the best of the area. You know, Yeah,
(02:36):
they don't disappoint you know what I think? Do you
know that we met I want to say ten years
ago at a tree lighting. I met you for five
seconds really just seeing your face right now. It was
one of those moments where I'm like, oh my gosh,
I've met David Archier. Let up, it was you. It
was you and I think Ariana Grande and it was
(02:58):
like the Hollywood Am I not? Am I crazy? Were you?
There was like a Hollywood crazy or I'm both? I'm both?
But up at it was at the Hollywood, Um, the
Hollywood and Highland like remember you know like the Kodak
hid there's like that, you know, the big like Kodak
Theater where you know they do the Oscars. There was
(03:20):
a big tree lighting ceremony and you sang at it. Yeah,
what was I sing with that? It was just me
and Ariana Grande was there in Ariana Grande before a
Grande was Ariana Grande. This is this is right after
idol would make sense. I was wondered why she followed
me on Twitter. It was the tree lighting ceremony. Yes,
(03:43):
I hosted it, and you guys saying I just realized
that it was for Camp Heartland or like one Heartland.
It was a camp for kids with HIV and like
we were raising money. Yep, that's so crazy. Well, it's
good to see you again, David Archilata. Good to see you.
And you've had You've had a lot of stuff going on.
I mean, we want to talk about You've had such
(04:04):
just a momentous year of for so many reasons. But
like what I want to talk about first, because I'm
that guy, we got to talk about Joseph. Oh, and
it's fitting for that musical. Yes, we used the code
as um a template for our background of prosperation. You
just love that. Of all the things we could talk to,
(04:26):
David Archer, let about my husband goes for Can we
talk about the musical you did? Yes? Because I'm a
music Did you have so much fun being Joseph? I
loved it. I want to do it again. It was
so fun. Well, what was some of your favorite parts
about playing that character? Because so I mean, so many
people that have you done it? I did it in
high school obviously high school. But it's just the most
(04:49):
fun show to do. Is it's just fun and energetic
and happy. Yeah, and like when you're backstage and tell
me if this happened to you when you're back stage
and the like, like the I think it's the third song,
the don't don't don't, don't, don't, don't like you. No
matter how many times you do the show, you still
(05:10):
get chills when that music comes. Yeah, it is so yeah, exhilarating.
I love that song. That's like my that's my favorite
song in the musical too. Jacob Jacob and sons so good.
Did you guys do a mega mix? Yeah? Oh yeah,
of course you can't. Now you can't do? Joseph about
the mega mix? Wait, because I'm not in this room.
(05:33):
Where did you? Where did you do Joseph at? I
did it in the St. George, Utah and Southern Utah,
like an hour forty minutes out of Las Vegas, and
there was the two ocon Amphi Theater. It's surrounded by
red rocks. It is incredible. Wait, I know that shows.
I know the theater about you know, Josh, Yeah, oh
(05:55):
my gosh, Josh and I used to do shows together
back and oh my gosh, Josh was when I left,
he was the next Joseph I now happened. It's all
clicking in my head and now I feel like I'm
a part of this conversation. Who is your narrative? Um,
the Katie Lamark. She is incredible. She is incredible. I
(06:18):
don't know her, but I want to know her because
you need to know her. Jessica Voss did it at
one of the other ones this summer. I think she
did a Muni the one of my favorite alphabas from
Wicked was the narrator And I was like, do I
just book a ticket and fly there just to watch her?
Because I would I know, Yeah, you didn't know. Well,
(06:39):
David's love going on. I'm just very busy doing podcast,
you know. Just we gotta we gotta celebrate the lgbt
Q plus community, which we are so excited to have
you on celebrating the lgbt Q plus community. Yeah, this
is like, this is a new thing, Like I'm learning
how to just get my get what what is it?
(07:00):
Get planted into this, get a feel and celebrate it
and love it, embrace it. Yeah, I've I've really loved
getting to you know, it's it's really unfortunate because I
spent so much of my life being afraid of it,
which I guess is common. It's it's a common thing
that people go through, especially like in faith based communities.
(07:21):
And you're talking to two of them. Ye, yes, okay,
I want to hear your stories. Oh my gosh, well
we want to hear your Yeah, I'm loving this. I
I spent so much time being afraid of it, Like
it's like something to fear, something to despise. If you
experience it yourself, do everything you can to suppress it
(07:42):
to what you know, as I've heard many people now
tell me they that they've gone through this experience of
praying the gay away. So I spent most of my
life doing that until last year as a thirty year old,
and I you know, it was a lot of the
a lot of the like verbage that was used. It's like, oh,
(08:06):
you're not If someone would be like I think I'm gay,
I think I'm queer, they'd be like, I think I'm
a lesbian, Like, oh, you're not gay, you just have
same sex attraction. Don't say you're gay, because if you
say you're gay, you're accepting it. You're admitting it and
like allowing it to be a part of you, which
is this, that's the same. But if you just acknowledge
(08:28):
that you are attracted to the same sex, you don't
have to act on that, so there's still hope for
you essentially. So so then it's like, Okay, I'm not gay.
I just struggle with this, and so I'm gonna pray
and work at it. And that's what I did. I
just kind of took that approach because that's how I
was raised, you know, hearing it at church, and so
(08:49):
I was like, Okay, I'm gonna work on it. And
I came out to my to my mom and my
little sisters. When I was twenty three, I had served
a mission for my church, the Latter day Saint missionary
and Sheila for two years preaching the gospel and doing
all this. And that's when I it was that that
was my first time I came to terms with myself
(09:10):
when I was a Mormon missionary. And I told my
mission president, I said, because you're around guys the whole time,
like you live with them, and I've never lived with
other guys my age before, and I had to come
to terms with the feelings I would get sometimes around them,
I'm like, I don't even want these feelings, but I'm
getting them. This is super embarrassing for me. And so
I told my mission president because I was like, oh
(09:31):
my gosh, am I gonna be like sent home from
my mission for having these feelings? Like I had heard
things like that happened before, like I'd talked to some
people who now that. It's like like a girl who's
coming came out to her mission president and he was like,
I'm so disappointed in you, like like like he almost
like she couldn't be forgiven for like admitting this. So
(09:53):
I was like, oh my gosh. But my mission president,
I was really fortunate. He was a super loving He
didn't say anything like I thought he was gonna tell
me like this is how you need to work on it.
He's just like you're doing a great job and like
you're a great missionary and just keep doing what you
do and I love you and and God loves you.
So I was like, oh, okay. But I went home
and told my parents, but I was like, I think
(10:15):
I'm gay, but I said, I'm gonna work on it.
So so I took that approach, and I, you know,
I got I started dating girls because that was like
like marriage is the ultimate goal in in the latter
day sat culture. Like it's like get married because that
is the most godly you can become. Creating a family
(10:37):
and pro creating, like you get the chance to create life.
That's the closest you can be to God and the
greatest joy you can accomplish. Like we have temples or
like we have these temples that Latter day Saints build
and it's like considered like heaven on earth, and you
go there and you get like married for time and
(10:59):
all each her any So it's like such a big deal,
like they make a huge deal out of it. And
so I was like, okay, I'm gonna get married. I
I started dating. I dated one girl, got engaged to her,
and then I just couldn't go through with it. I
thought maybe it's her and she thought, okay, She's like
(11:21):
what did I do wrong? I'm like I don't know. Um.
Then the second time through, I got engaged again for
a second time two a girl I met in Europe actually,
and so once again like I was staying through with it,
but then I was just like I don't feel like
my conscience wouldn't let me go through with it again.
(11:41):
And I was open with her. I was like, you know,
I'm attracted to guys and and but I was like,
but I'm still gonna make it work like girls in
our culture. It's like you here, It's like there are
people just like they do with depression, just like they
do with alcoholism. Some people deal with some metal health problems.
Other people deal one of those things that people deal
with is same sex attraction. So like people are encouraged
(12:05):
to help others work through their problems and through faith
and God, like, we can overcome this problem, this challenge
and have a happy life and happy marriage. So that's
what you know. So even I would talk to them
openly about it, but they but they were still cool
with it. But that didn't work. And then I got
engaged a third time. That was last year. So this
(12:26):
was in the spam of like the since the eight
years that I had come out to my parents. I
was like, I'm still gonna you know, through my faith,
God's going to change me, help me overcome my same
sex attraction. Um, but the last time I just felt like, Okay,
it's not any of these girls problems, They're all wonderful,
(12:48):
and this is I have to be honest with myself
and I just have to come to terms that maybe
I like because I was like, oh, I'm you know,
I'm bisexual because I still like these girls. And I
was like, you know, I'm never whether I'm like gay
or just inspect him a bisexual. I have to be
honest with myself. I like guys and I'm never. I
(13:08):
started feeling like this hatred for the girls. I was engaged.
I was supposed to be in love with them, and
I was feeling anger and hatred for them. Like it
was like like I felt like I was gonna explode.
So I was like, this isn't good. And I was
talking to one of my friends who she got married
to someone who was lg a guy who's LGBT, and
(13:32):
they got married, had five kids. He served in like
church leadership positions. She was saying, how like I was there,
I think, visiting with my ex fiance and she was
telling me the story and she's like, we had five kids,
like four of them observed missions and we were married
for twenty years, and all of a sudden, she's like,
I find some things and I tried to approach him
(13:53):
because it's like and he just exploded on her because
he thought like he was doing a good job hiding it.
He was like, you know, playing the part I had
kids was serving in his church. He started beating her
and and it's like it explodes and I was just like,
she's just like I She's like, I wasn't mad at
(14:15):
what that he was the way he was. I was
just mad that, um, you know, he had to felt
like he had to hide it and like and acted
out the way he did. And I was just like,
you know what, the council I'm getting right now is
leading me to that path, Like I don't want I
already feel that anger happening because I'm trying to be
(14:36):
something that I'm not. I'm trying to make it look
like I'm this happy, straight guy who's going to have
a happy straight life, and I know that's that's not
what I am. And this anger and bitterness that's building
up inside of me, he's gonna gonna get worse if
I keep faking this. And I was like, I don't
want to put anyone through that. I don't want to
(14:57):
be the cause of someone else's suffering just because I
tried to look straight and you know, make all the
Mormons who are watching me happy that I was following
God's path the way they thought it needed to look.
And so I told I was having these horrible anxiety attacks.
(15:19):
I had dinner with my ex fiance and I had
an anxiety attack again, and I was just like I need,
I need a break, And I said I can't see
for like, I need like three weeks because I was like,
I'm gonna take three weeks to work on praying and
fasting to see if God, if I have enough faith,
Like maybe this is just the trial of my faith.
(15:41):
And it's been sixteen years that I've been praying about
this now at this point, but maybe this is like
the ultimate goal, Like I'm so close to getting married
for a third time, and maybe it's just the devil
trying to take away my soul and prevent me from
having this marriage that I'm supposed to have that he
wants me to have. So I was praying and praying
and fasting where it's like you don't eat and you
(16:03):
don't drink so that you like humble yourself before God,
and uh, I started feeling like nothing I was like numb.
And that's when I started like going smiling down because
I didn't talk to anyone. I was so embarrassed because
I'm like, in the back of my head, I knew.
I was like, David, you like guys more than more
(16:25):
than girls, and maybe you have to come to terms
with that. And I was just like no, Like for me,
that was the devil talking to me. He was trying
to take me down, and I was like, I can't
let that happen. I can't, and so I was praying
even harder. I was like I didn't want to. I
stopped talking to my family, I stopped talking to my friends.
(16:48):
And I think that's a pretty dangerous thing to do,
because when you're feeling really sad and getting depressed and
you isolate yourself, you start thinking thoughts you shouldn't think.
You started thinking like, um, I don't know, it's just
it can be you need helps sometimes you need help
(17:08):
to go through. But I didn't know who to talk
to you. At that point. I was still going to church.
I was still like, I was like, I'm going to
do everything I need to, but it was like making
me feel even worse, and um, so I started I
was like, what do I do? I think in my heart,
I'm like I need to come to terms with this.
I need to admit this to myself. But I was like,
(17:30):
if I admit this, then I am giving my giving
myself away. And so I was like, Okay, what's worse?
Because I felt that like about to just pop out
and like explode. I couldn't hold it down anymore. And
so I was like, before that happens, what's worse for
me to become gay and end up with the guy
(17:52):
or doing something doing stuff I'm not supposed to be
doing with guys, or maybe I should just eminate things
before it to prevent it from getting there. I was
looking at as a better option to end my life
than two become gay after the fact. Like now that
(18:25):
I've come out, like I've seen that is pretty common,
Like unfortunately that is way more common than it should
be with people of faith and and specifically with people
in my church, like Latter Day scenes, oh, because because
it's just that conflict that it's causing, Like you hear
(18:47):
like homosexuality and they're they're like pauring it up like
the sin with like killing people. So like you're looking
at yourself as like if I've become a homosexual, like
I'm my evilness is equal to those of murderers, and
it's like I don't want to deal bad. I don't
want to live my life like feeling that on myself.
(19:08):
So you're thinking like, okay, but it just got to
a point where I'm like, well, I was just going
back and forth in my head. I'm like, well, maybe
even if I was gay, and maybe if I even
ended up with a guy, maybe there's some value to
my life still, like maybe I can make up for it,
Like even if I'm this horrible gay person, queer person,
(19:31):
maybe it's still I can still contribute to life so
that it's not entirely bad for me to keep being here.
So like that was like the things I was going
through with my mind. So I'm like maybe, but at
the same time, you feel so disappointed in yourself because
it's like I was supposed to be married, I was
supposed to have this wife and have these children and
(19:54):
live this dream, this dream life that you're you're taught
as growing up as a ladder. They say, so a
k A Mormon. So um, there's just a point where
it's just like I don't want to deal with this,
Like I don't feel like God's hearing me. I must
not have enough faith, Like no matter how hard I try,
I just maybe I'm a faithless person. Or maybe I'm cursed.
(20:17):
Maybe God really doesn't like me and he's just showing
me that he doesn't. Maybe he doesn't want me around.
But I'm like or like maybe I'm not good enough,
Like maybe I'm not strong enough and I'm showing my weakness.
So you start like I was. I was just like
thinking like, well, maybe if I just go off, I
can just speed up right now and I can just
drive off the curb and like it will look like
(20:40):
it wasn't on purpose, because I didn't want to have
that weight of like my family, thinking like I saw
how people who end their lives how much it affects
the family, Like I don't want to do that to
my family. I love them too much to leave them
feeling like they did something wrong. So and I didn't
want to hurt their lives. But I was like, if
(21:02):
it looks like an accident, then maybe it won't be
as bad. And that was like going back and forth
for a couple a few weeks, Like when I was
in that time where I just isolated myself and it's
I don't I don't think that's a good thing. It's
just how it was. But I finally got to the
point where I just finally felt this like opening and
(21:23):
I like came out of the numbness and I just
was like, I think that's God, this feeling that I've
always recognized as God. I've had a faith crisis this year,
so like now I'm like, I don't know what to call,
like God greater, like some something greater out there, like
higher self. But I always called the God. And that's
(21:45):
what I was feeling at that point. And I just
dropped to my knees and I was like God, like
desperately just saying, God, if you're there, and if you
really have a purpose for me, please take this away
from me. I don't. I'm so tired. I don't know
what to do with this anymore. Like no matter how
(22:06):
hard I try, it's not enough. So please please, Like
I know you can change water into wine. I know
you can allow the blind to see, like that's what
they taught me, So surely you can change me if
that's your will. And I just got this clear response
it was so clear and sure and like just assuring,
(22:31):
like peaceful, but like strong. He just said, David, you
need to stop asking me this. As you can see,
you've been asking for over half of your life now
for me to change you and change something that I
don't intend to change. It's like it's like I don't
see you the same way you see you. I don't
(22:53):
see you the same way a lot of people do
a lot of even while meeting people who are following
me see you. He's like, and I, now I need
you to take time to understand that. And I said,
I was like, I didn't. I wasn't expecting that. Like
I thought he was gonna be like, yes, David, you
finally shown your trial of faith and you passed the
(23:14):
test like like the Abraham was about to kill his son.
And Isaac like, no, wait, you don't actually have to
do that, like you've shown your proven yourself worthy and faithful.
But he was like, no, you need to stop asking
you this. I'm like, huh, And I said, I don't
want to mess up though, like I don't want to
make I just don't want to mess up. And he said, well,
(23:36):
then perhaps you need to do what you think are mistakes.
So do you realize you're allowed to make mistakes. I
give you permission to make mistakes, and then you're as
you make mistakes, you're going to realize what you thought
were mistakes aren't mistakes. And I knew what he was
talking about, a God or whatever it um. I understood
(23:57):
it as God as I had always understood at that point,
like said, but it just said, and if you make mistakes,
if you do mess up, that's why you can always
come to me and we can work through this together.
And so I don't know if that was like my
higher self, it's like that's God. I don't know, but
(24:18):
I knew that was what I needed. And I knew
what God was referring to as like, Okay, I just
need to get to know guys and date them. And
I and then like I was doing yardwork a cup
like not long after that, and I just felt like
this feeling and say, like you need to share this,
(24:38):
like just and so I posted on Instagram about it.
And that was my coming out last year of June,
and just I was all sweaty from doing yard work,
but I was just like, I don't know, I didn't
think anything of it like I didn't. I was literally
still sweaty from yeah. And if I didn't realize how
(24:59):
many people, how much it's going to mean to everybody.
So the thing David, like you, I sit here and
listen to you, like your struggle so mimics what I
went through with the Christian Church, being raised Baptist in
the South, Like I hear so many things. I'm like, yes,
that that that that that, but like realize the struggle
that you went through to get to hear just by
(25:21):
sharing your story, there's somebody, if not many, somebody's that
are not going to go through the struggle you went
through because now you've shown them, look what happens. Look
when you get to the other side of it. The
way that's lifted, the fact that you do get to
live your life authentically and you do survive, and you
not only survived, but you thrive. And I think it's
(25:43):
so beautiful that you're sharing this with everybody because the
good that you were going to do. You're going to
stop people from going through the struggle you went through
just by telling your story, and you should be really
proud of yourself for that. And you're gonna stop people
from getting hopefully by sharing that, sharing your story of struggle,
you are going to stop the people from getting to
the dark places that you got to that you were
(26:06):
able to pull out of, because so many times some
people don't pull out of those And by you sharing that,
and I'm sitting here crying because of you know, you're
trying to find your purpose and you know you're talking
about what your purposes, you know, in what you're supposed
to be doing. Just from you sharing the story of
(26:30):
how you didn't want to disappoint the people that were
listening to you, you helped heal me because I know
what it's like, just says, well, you do. I relate
to that so much of when I was in when
I did mean girls and being in the closet and
not being able to come out. I was living in this,
(26:52):
you know, very similar situation to you. And it was
like people people finding out that I was gay. I
was so afraid that I was going to disappoint all
the people that have like built me up and helped
me have a career and like ben Fans and like
followed my journey and done that. I was so afraid
that they were going to be disappointed by me. When
(27:12):
they if they found out that I was gay, and
just for you, from you sharing that about you, it
helped heal me a little bit. I could feel it
healing inside my heart because like it was just a
little like, oh, someone else has done this. I'm not
alone someone else because what we do is a weary,
weird profession, right, it's not not a lot of people
do this. And so by you sharing that, you helped
(27:34):
heal me just now on this podcast, it helped. So
thank you. Oh that's beautiful. See, this is why we
share these stories, this right here. Yeah, the reason that's
so important. It's therapeutic to get it, you know, to
get it out. And I'm I'm so glad that it's
(27:54):
that it's heal healing to hear because sometimes it's like
it's hurtful, but it's like when someone else is going
through that same pain, it's so nice to let them
know they're not alone. I know. It meant so much
to me when I like the people who who like
I was watching, Um, there's a guy who's in my church.
His name is Charlie Bird. He was this mask. He
(28:16):
was the b y U s Cosmo, the Cougar mascot
and he went viral doing his ESPN dance like dances
and um and he came out as like the mascot,
but also came out as gay. And I was kind
of like, what, like it's okay to be gay and
be a Mormon. Like I was just like what, And
(28:37):
they they a lot of people are like, no, you
shouldn't use the word gay like that. That's what they
were saying, and amongst like our like our church and
like some of the people who are higher up with this.
And He's like, but that's how I identify myself. And
they're like, no, we're not. Like some of the people like, well,
your book won't be able to come out if you
use that word. But he just like, you know what,
(28:59):
I have to use it. And he had the courage
and he was like I'm going to risk, you know,
I'm gonna still put it out and let people know
I'm gay and let them know why it's okay. Well
it's not a bad thing to be that. And one
of my friends gave me that book during COVID and
I was just kind of like, why are you giving
me this book? Because I wasn't you know, I wasn't
terms with myself yet, and she was like, no, it's
(29:21):
it's a great book. It's a great even like even
if you're not not um LGBT, it's a great like
spiritual book to read. I was like, and I hauled off.
I was like, I don't want to read that because
I was uncomfortable with it, like I was working so
hard to avoid that conversation and having to confront it.
But when I read it, I was just like, oh wow,
(29:42):
because he he had he described it. He's like, I'm gay,
Like his audience is like Mormons that he's talking to
with this, it was like on this church comp bookstore,
desert book and he's like, I'm gay, and this is
why identify as gay? Because usually with it's like, no,
you have same sex attraction. If you're following God. If
you say you're gay, then you're like following the devil.
(30:04):
And so he's like, this is why identify as gay
because he's like, yes, I'm attracted to the same sex,
but there's so many other things that that label I
identify with. He's like, I'm a dancer. It's like you
are reading this book probably because you've seen me dancing.
He's like, I love art, I love fashion. He's like,
I have an eye for design. He's like, I'm sentimental.
(30:25):
I get along really well with women and so and
so he's like, you know, if if I was, he's like,
it's not just like this attraction to the same sex.
He's like, I feel like being gay is like this,
there's so many other things to being who I am.
He's like, and if I wasn't gay, I wouldn't be
who I am anymore. And I thought that was It
(30:46):
was so comforting to see that because our church would
always just say gay people all they think about a sex.
They're just lustful and their horny and they just want
to like do like weird unnatural sexual things with with
each other with the same sex, and that's all they're thinking.
So this is like my first time seeing someone and
(31:07):
I was able to relate to him, like, so you
mean it's okay to be the way I am, Like,
it's not this evil thing. So um, and that's why
I'm like, I'm trying. Sometimes it's like, oh my gosh,
it's like a heavy thing to always talk about. But
I'm like, I want people, especially people like in churches,
you know, who grew up like we did and in
like faith cultures to know like it's actually not bad
(31:30):
to be the way you are and and help them
understand a little bit why, like it's you can be
happy and and it's like a wonderful thing. It's a
beautiful it's beautiful. It's beautiful to be queer. Yeah, I
look at like you talk about religion, like I look
at how I grew up, and I say, like, there's
a level of brainwashing that happened in the church I
(31:51):
grew up in, and it is telling you you can
only be one way. Like I was listening to you
talk about how they would phrase things so our church
would say struggle with homosexuality, like and that was their
thing they tried to put up for spence. It would
make you feel like, oh, I should feel bad for
feeling this way, and also I'm struggling, just like I
may struggle with lying or whatever else it is. And
(32:11):
they brainwash you to think that. And then I even
heard you say some of the terminology they would say,
like if I become gay, you don't become gay. You
just accept the fact that you are and you learn
to love it and celebrate it. And the minute you do,
tell me if I'm wrong here, But if they're not,
that weight that just comes off and all that fear
that you had just disappears, because all of a sudden,
(32:34):
it feels like now you're actually living a life that's
in the light. You're actually living a life completely as yourself.
And when you're not doing that lying or lying to
yourself or lying to other people, the anger goes away.
When you're not doing that lying to yourself for other people,
that fear goes away because it's all just real, it's
the truth. And like that's the thing, like I always say,
(32:56):
like I always talk about you are listening at home,
this is what you should get from this, Like get
the hope from this, get the fact that, like it
is so much better when you are just yourself. And
if you are in a place where you're still letting
religion or whatever you were taught beat you down, Like no,
that's just Oftentimes it's not people being malicious. It's just
that they don't know any better because it's all they
(33:17):
were taught, and so they try to put it on you.
And it's okay to let it go and just thrive
as who you are, Like screw that, I'm gonna have
a breade, and I think it's so important to have
(33:49):
like the conversation, like because when I came out, a
lot of like some of the conservative people who who
had an opinion, like they said the same thing I'd
heard a lot growing up. Well, why why is this?
Why do you have to say it out loud? Why
why don't you just keep this to yourself? And I'm like,
because all y'all cared about who I was dating, who
I was gonna marry, Like y'all wanted to know everything
(34:11):
else about me. And now that I'm saying why I'm not.
And also it's like I need, we need to have
this uncomfortable conversation, especially in the churches, And because they're
not used to it like that there, they haven't been
exposed to it, and they're like, oh, like, why are
you exposing this to this? We've we've also avoided this.
I'm like, you know what, I tried to avoid that.
(34:33):
I tried to avoid that all my life, until to
the point where I thought it would be better to
terminate myself to to not have to deal with it.
I'm like, they're way too many other people in the
same position who are feeling the same way. So it's like,
we need to talk about it, and then he was
one of those people, so we you are doing a
really good thing by saying it, like because again, like
the more we say it, the more people realize they're
(34:55):
not alone, and the more hope we give to people.
So I'm just is so awesome that you are using
your voice right now to do this. I just think
it's a beautiful, beautiful thing. There are people out there
listening David that are feeling exactly like James's feeling, and
they are feeling exactly like I'm feeling, which is wow.
(35:15):
I feel like someone sees me. I come from a
faith based based background where I have struggled with my
faith and might have it. You know, you have a
faith crisis where you're feeling one way, but because of
your faith in the way you were raised and the
different churches you've grown up with, you're torn in a
(35:35):
different direction. So there's people are out there listening to
this podcast right now and you're here speaking about it.
So for the people that are listening that feel like
they're being seen by listening to your story, what would
you tell them? The people that are going through the
same struggle that you are. I hope, like, if you're
(35:56):
here listening to this, I hope you can see that
us three, you know, we've come out, we've and we're
hopefully you can hear our stories and see that you're
not alone. That you know. I feel like some of
the word wording that we hear in religion can make
us feel isolated, like where the problem and like we
(36:18):
struggle misunderstood. So I hope you know by hearing us
three talk openly about our experiences that we've gone through,
what you're feeling like. I just hope you know you're
not alone. We're where You're with you, we got you,
and that it's that it's there. It's really beautiful. One,
(36:38):
it's scary to work through. I guess the inner homophobia
that we've been taught, been taught to be afraid of ourselves,
and we think that it's bad to to accept that part.
It's terrifying. But once when you have the courage to
accept yourself, you feel this love that you've never allowed
(37:03):
yourself to experience for yourself, and you find this new confidence,
this new joy, and it's just like wow, like you
it's like I can actually live my life and enjoy it.
I don't have to hide, I don't have to pretend
to be something else. And it's and it's like, you know,
I'm not I'm not an evil person. I'm I'm I'm
(37:26):
being the way I was, Like you know that prayer
that I had. It's like it's like, you know, we're designed.
We are designed differently, but we're not designed less than
we can have the same amount of joy. We can
enjoy relationships um just as equally as anyone else can,
and it's so beautiful, and we can have companionship, we
(37:50):
can have families if we want. Like that is still
it may look a little differently as all than then
what's considered like the standard look, but you can experience
the same amount of joy and happiness and you deserve it.
You deserve to have it. Listen, Dave, I think honestly,
and like maybe I've just had a lot of a
(38:10):
lot of time out as myself now to look at
it differently. I think where we live a better life.
I think it's a life of true honesty. It's a
lie because because once you get that to be honest
about who you are, you pick up the strength to
be honest everywhere and you live a much more authentic
real life because of that. So I think I think
(38:31):
before you plus, like I get to be married to
a dude that's so fun. Dude, yes, a very good
looking man, very good looking, but beyond that, it's my
best buddy. It's Mary, my best buddy, and and have
all this with him, so like it's it's a really
cool thing. So how did it's thrilled to be gay?
And I think gays have Like I'm gonna go ahead
(38:53):
and say it, like I'm not gonna say like, we're
like more funner, better, but gosh, we are more fun
and we just are because no one's ever said, oh
my boring gay best friend. Sentence has never been said
in the history of the world. They're like, oh my god,
my amazing, hilarious gay bff. No one's ever said, oh
(39:13):
my boring gay friend who is just a wallflower? Right,
Like that's ever been set. So it's that lets me
be able to say we have more fun and we
are we are more fun. So we David, I heard
David ask where we met? We met? We met? So
I used to host a TV show that Jonathan was
a guest on and and I was promoting Halloween Wars
(39:34):
because I was actually episode one of podcast. If you
ever get to go back to the first episode of
our pridecast that we did, we met, I met, I
was I was hosting Halloween Wars on Food Network. That
this always the motion you use for hosting my lef. Yeah,
this is a microphone, but it's not. It's a microphone.
I was hosting Halloween Wars on Food Network and I
(39:57):
went on his show to promote my show, and we
met and instantly fell in love. And then I left
him and I ran back and I said, I have
to meet you in the parking lot because I need
to kiss you to see if this is going to
be forever true story rush exactly as he was last thing,
David Archer let us crush from his speakers. He came
(40:17):
back to see if it was a crush and how
long ago was this funny? It was in fact real,
Oh my gosh, six years, six years. It was basic
years ago. We got married this year. Congratulations, thank you.
And this makes me so happy to see I love
because it gives like, you know, I don't have a
lot of examples of like I think they like prevented
me from seeing gay people happy to discourage me from
(40:40):
feeling like I could be happy if I accepted this.
So I just love y'all just killing it. Thank you,
And it's it's funny because as we say, David, as
we welcome. It's it's funny though because I really do
identify with you, because because we do have a certain
level of like weird job where what we do people
notice and it's a whole thing. We don't want to
let down our fans, and you just feel like like
(41:02):
I understand it. So it's like, I remember when I
came out. I came out with an Instagram post as well.
I Instagram post. I wasn't sweaty. I posted a picture
of us. Well maybe we were sweaty. I'm gonna look
up David. I posted a picture of us, uh, just
like together, like cuddling kind of, and I just was like,
(41:23):
you know what this is the I love this guy
and like I love him and like just posted that
and I remember just going viral, like or not viral,
but just everyone like, oh my god, you know John
the man, Like everyone's like going crazy about it. But
when I hit post that, you feel it physically come
off you. The stress and the weight that you've been
(41:45):
carrying for sixteen years. You feel it go like oh okay,
and it just it. It doesn't make it perfect, but
a huge chunk of it leaves and then the rest
is able to dissipate over time. So and it's still dissipating, right.
There's still a little little things on my shoulders and
stuff I have to, you know, brush off because I
feel like, oh, one of those little those little negative
(42:07):
nancies are coming up on my and it's like, no,
that's not real, that's not real, and you have to
brush them off always. But it does. So I do
I identify with that whole story of the post. I
love it. I love it. Yes, thank you to instal
is me to come out. Yes, because like there is,
there's so much joy in it too, that like we
need to talk about because, like you said, David, like
(42:28):
they do in religion, they hide it from you. They
hide the fact that there is joy, They hide the
fact that you will have this happiness. I was taught
that I will never have my happily ever after if
I choose this life, which a k A just means
except who I am. And that is so wrong to
all those pastors and preachers and even little puppets. We
had puppets. Don't even get me started on that. The
(42:50):
puppets trying to tell us how like you were wrong
because the happiness is out there to be had. Have
you gotten this one? I want to know because we
talked about this on podcast a lot. We ask people
about their first pride. Yes, have you gotten to go
to a pride yet? You know? I didn't. I don't
think I've gone to private. I've gone to what's called
the Love Loudfest that Dan Reynolds from Imagine Dragons Doud
(43:11):
in Utah. He's amazing. So that was my first like
fest of any kind of pride I went. I've gone
to it a few years ago as well, but this
is my first time that I participated in it. Out
this is a queer guy and so what was that like?
It was? It was here in Salt Lake. It was
(43:32):
really scary because I never talked to it, like face
to face with people, and to do it in Salt
Lake City was really terrifying. Actually I was. I was
having an anxiety attack before but um and on stage.
Actually I was having an anxiety attack, but at the
same time it was so liberating. Because I felt like
(43:52):
I didn't have to put this front on for everybody,
because literally, like I was used as like this example
in the church to be like this is how you
want to be, Like this is how we want our
kids to to be, like, look how faithful and true
and he is to like his beliefs. And so I
was scary because I felt like I was exposing myself
(44:13):
like just completely like just new to out there, I felt.
And but it felt like I had nothing else to
hide anymore, and it was really relieving. Ah. And this
is because this is pridecast we always ask everyone, and
this is something that you know, this year has been
(44:35):
your big year where you come out and been able
to talk about this. So you know it's gonna mean
something different to you now than it's going to mean
to you two years from now, five years from now,
two months from now, Right now, in this moment, what
does pride mean to you? Pride is like the sense
of it's acknowledging all of you, and it's accepting all
(44:59):
of you and then having confidence in that. It's like
these levels, uh of learning how to just fully love
all of you and love parts of you that you
were told you didn't have permission to that, you were
told you weren't allowed to love, and to finally take
(45:19):
that and own it back, to finally gain ownership of
what was taken from you, to feel like you needed
to reject this part of you that's always a part
of you, it's like and it's part of your essence,
and so to to gain confidence and full love in that.
I feel like totally deserves the title of pride because
(45:43):
and people be like, you know, oh, but you know,
why why do you say pride and stuff? I'm like,
because it's like I had to learn how to be
okay with that word too, for those very things. It's
like I'm gaining back ownership of a part that I
was always told old I was I needed to be
ashamed of I need. I'm gaining it back. And yeah,
(46:06):
and it's it. Does you feel a sense of pride,
like like I feel you feel stronger. You feel stronger.
I feel like you and I need to hang out
cha because like we're the same person, like we will
just sing songs and musicals. We can't do it without it,
(46:28):
um and I want to I do want to address
like because we've be talking about like religion, and stuff.
Here there are some really wonderful people of faith and
different religions that we even have in our lives. We
have wonderful Christian friends, we have wonderful Mormon friends, et cetera,
and they are out there. Um, would you did you
want to talk about how? Because I see that the
(46:48):
Mormon Church has has come out and uh what do
they say that it supports kindifying protections for same sex marriage?
And like, we have some very progressive Mormon friends I
feel that have always been very supportive of us and
progressive Christian people. Um what what do you I mean?
Is it? Are you even a placeat to have thoughts
on where do we think religion goes from here with
(47:10):
loving queer people and accepting queer people and celebrating queer people.
Because my thought is that man got ahold of all
of these scriptures way too much and tweaked it for
what they wanted down the line as interpretations and interpretations
and interpretations went on. And so do you think there's
a space where you know, the different faiths can be
(47:32):
celebratory of us wonderful, amazing queer people, the best people. Yeah,
Like I said, I've had a bit of a faith crisis.
I've had to take a step back and step away
from my faith and beliefs. But I do I agree
with you with that people just according to whatever is
the social constructure of the time. People just interpret what
(47:55):
scripture is to fit whatever they want to believe, or
whatever they're uncomfortable with, whatever they don't understand and they
are scared of, so they label it as bad and
try to change how scripture sounds to fit fit that. UM.
But I feel like there's there has to be space.
(48:16):
I feel like we're in a time. Someone who's telling
me this, someone was saying, we're in a time of
enlightenment now, like we're in this technological You can't hide
things away anymore. It's my friend's mom like you, you
can't hide things. You can't just label something and take
someone's word for it. You have too many resources to
see for yourself how things actually are, including the LGBT
(48:38):
community and individuals. UM. You can't label them as bad
because like you can see it for yourself how they
really are and what they're about. But I feel like
churches in order to not if they want to keep growing,
they have to make room for for for LGBT for everyone,
and yeah, for everybody, not yet, not just not just
(48:59):
LGBT people. UM, finding common ground for everybody to feel included.
And there's I was having conversations with one of my
church leaders, and it's like when I first spoke to him,
he didn't know what I was going to bring up.
And I was talking to him about my sexuality and
he tried to stop the conversation because he was uncomfortable.
(49:19):
He's an older gentleman where they didn't talk about this,
and he said, well, he's like, I don't know what
to tell you. I don't understand this topic. He's like,
I don't know what it's like to be gay. He said,
let me find someone else for you to talk to,
and I said, he's so. He said, let me find
someone else free to talk to to help you understand it.
And I said, I don't need someone to help me
(49:39):
understand it, like I'm already I've already gone through this,
Like all I need is for you to listen to
what I'm going through and what I have to share.
And UM, I've had to meet with him several times.
He's like one of the higher higher leaders in my church.
So it's like he's in charge of a lot of
what other people are gonna believe, and they're ideologies. He
(50:01):
has a lot of influence. And he was saying I
went to talk with him again, um, just the other week,
I think last week, and he said he said, he said,
this is the first time I've ever had an in
depth conversation with someone who's who's gay, and and well
I think about the topic and I was like, and
(50:24):
I said, well, it's I feel like this is overdue
and it is crucial. And he said this isn't going
to go away, is it? And I said, no, it's not.
He said, it's only going to keep growing. I said, yeah,
it is going to keep going because more people are
gonna just not hide. And I said, most people feel
like people are leaving the church because you don't give
(50:47):
them an option, because like there's it's kind of like
this expectation, which is why it's so complicated with Latter
day Saints, is if you get married, they may excommunicate you.
If you're in the same sex marriage, they will consider
It's like I said, I see myself marrying a man
if I get married, I see myself marrying a man.
So why am I going to stay in this church,
(51:07):
because he was like, well, why did you leave the church?
Why did you say it publicly? Because I I've told
People magazine that I was I had stepped away from
my church. And He's like, what, And I said, I
don't want to be in a place and I don't
want to act like I'm a part of this organization
that I'm I've stepped away from now, and I don't
want the reason one of the reasons, There are several reasons,
(51:30):
but I don't want to be somewhere where if I
decide I want to marry and commit myself to someone
I love through marriage, that there's gonna be hanging over
my head, this fear that they're going to remove my
baptism covenant that I made with Christ because I'm considered
someone who's rebelling against God and that I've that I'm
like denying his spirit and committing this horrible thing against God.
(51:53):
Like why would I why would I want to stay
here with with that judgment being placed on when I
know I'm good, Like I know I'm making the right
decision for me. And so he was thinking about that,
and he was saying, He's like, you know, we don't
know why we don't know why gay people are why
God like has this why gay people exist. And I'm like,
(52:17):
you're you're talking about it as if it's a problem,
I said, And instead of talking about as if it's
an issue, why don't what about considered it as if
that's how God intended it, Like we are just designed
differently than heterosexual people and still fully can find joy
in our relationships and belong and be happy. I said,
(52:40):
we need to stop looking at it that way. And
so I feel like you have to have uncomfortable conversations
with people because for them like we don't want to
talk about this. But I'm like and and I was
really happy because he said, well, I feel like to
find solutions, you have to gain understanding. And that's when
he said, I've never talked to like a person this
(53:01):
indebt before. And I said, well, I'd be happy to
talk to more people and more of the leaders because
I feel like this needs to happen. And I said,
my friend Charlie Bird, I'm like, he's trying to talk
to some of the leaders And I said, you won't
talk to him. I'm like, why not? He has a
great perspective, he's a great advocate for people like me,
(53:23):
and he's still in the church at this point at least.
I can't speak for his future. But I said, but
you won't talk to him? Why not? I said, I
can only imagine. I'm like, it was hard for me
to have a conversation with you, and I've known you've
all for like over a decade now, and I've been
like this public figure in the church. I can only
imagine how hard it's been for everyone else. So I'm
hoping that I can at least get my foot in
(53:44):
the door to help the conversation keep going for the
rest of the people, so they don't feel like, well,
maybe it's better for me to not be here anymore.
Like I want to just completely wipe that away. So
whether if you decide you want to be religious and
and queer that you can safely do that, that you're
literally changing the face of it, you're using it for good,
(54:08):
and you're literally changing the face of it, Because I mean,
who's to say that with what the Church of Jesus
Christ letter to the Saints came out that they're in
support of codifying same sex marriage right and so that
doesn't happen without people like you having those conversations with
the highest up leaders of that organization. So you're literally
(54:31):
changing the face of acceptance in this religion. I think
a lot of these religions who are going to learn
like you, either learn or get left behind. Yes, the
world is growing, the world is changing. People are learning
to love themselves and accept themselves in love and accept
each other. And so to be continued, I guess with
this with I'm certainly not a part of religion I
(54:52):
grew up in anymore. I'm definitely in a different place
than that. So to be continued. To be continued, Listen, David,
I when did you get back to your family? Because
I know you are at your family's home, but I
know you got a lot of stuff to promote. So
I'm just gonna let you shamelessly shameless. This is a
shameless plus shameless plugs. You have a Christmas tour, David.
(55:14):
Let me remind you have a Christmas tour. Tell us
about it. You have a song called I do that too. Yeah,
Christmas tour. More, the more, the merrier Christmas tour. And
uh I have I think I have like nine or
ten shows still that I'm doing, Like in Texas, Arizona, Utah,
Las Vegas, and uh up until December with those and
(55:39):
then faith in Me I released. That was the last
song I released a couple of months ago, I think.
And it was kind of like my song where I
was describing what it's like to feel finally being okay
with myself and allowed myself to like who I like?
So and and that is like the sensation. It feels
like it's exciting and it's like you just wanna yeah.
(56:02):
So it's faiths it's my song that it's really fun.
I wanted to feel like you're dancing in your room
like no one's watching. But I did that in out
in the Streets because that's what it feels like coming
out in a sense. So, and my good friend Kevin McHale.
(56:23):
He was one of my first He was on one
of my only gay friends I had when I first
came out. So I called him. He directed the video
and I called him like, so do you know Kevin, Yes,
we've met him before, Yes, Okay, he is the best.
So he and Justin Thorne directed it. But I called Kevin,
I'm like, what is this like, I'm like, I don't
(56:43):
know what it's like. To date a guy, Like, how
is it? I asked him, and he's just he was
so cool and so open with me, and he's like,
if you ever have questions, you can call me any time.
So he's awesome. Yes, And you now have your gay
uncles right here, Jonathan and you call when when you're
going through the woes and the highs and the lows
(57:04):
of your relationships, you call, you call Jonathan and James
and say, okay, gounles um from this part he just
said this, but we went on a date and now
he wants to do this and I don't know, and
we we'll we'll walk you through it, okay. But I
would just I would just tell you this. Don't don't
let that damage that un educated people put on you
(57:26):
affect you now in your quest for love. Don't take
the baggage from the uneducated people into the new relationship
because it's not real. It's not real when you get
so you get to start this fresh beginning. You are
going to feel very young. Listen, not to preach at
you right now, but you are going to feel very
young because when you are dating genuinely and authentically, it
(57:49):
feels like you're just dating for the first time as
like a teenager. So that stuff's all going to pop up.
Know that it's all accurate, it's all real, and it's
all okay, and you're you're happy. Ending has come? Is
that our new show? Thank you, David art Love. It's
us like pre screening dates Sweet Man's Life. Okay, fine, fine,
(58:11):
we'll let you do it. I know, but you call
us if you need us. All right, David, thank you
so much for joining us on podcasts. I know that
this episode is going to change people's hearts, it's going
to change their minds, and it's going to help people
feel seen. I know that for a fact because you
helped us feel seen. So thank you so much for
joining us on podcast Thank you. Thanks Jonathan James too
(58:34):
great and we need to hang, Yes, we will have to.
How do people get tickets for your tour? Oh? They
can go to David Archiletta dot com and I have
a link on my Instagram. I thinking on my TikTok
David Archie or my TikTok and Instagram handles. I mean,
it's David Archiletta. He's a legend. You'll find him on
social media. Type his name and go see his Christmas tour,
(58:57):
make sure you listen to his new song faith In,
and have a fantastic holiday. David, we will talk to
you soon. Happy to her and Bud Thanks, Happy to her.
Bye bye
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations.
The Nikki Glaser Podcast
Every week comedian and infamous roaster Nikki Glaser provides a fun, fast-paced, and brutally honest look into current pop-culture and her own personal life.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.