QLS Classic: Ray Parker Jr.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Course Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.
This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.
What's up, y'all, This is Quest Love and this is
QLs classic which we hear at Quest Love Supreme. Taken
to our archives to bring you some amazing stories from
past episodes. Uh. This was a really great episode with
Ray Parker Jr. Talking about his life as a musician,

(00:23):
working with Barry White, with Stevie Wonder, with Shaka Khan,
hanging with Prince, giving Quincy Jones stories, even and even
Huey Lewis. Uh. This is one for the music fans.
We really hope you enjoyed this Quest Love Supreme episode
with Ray Parker Jr. Sokrema so Suremo role call, soul

(00:52):
Prima suf Frema, role called Suprema Sulfmo roll call, so
a prima Frema roll call. My name is Questo. Yeah
that understood. Yeah. Let me tell you something, Yeah that
makes me feel good something sub prima roll call, subprima

(01:16):
su frema roll call. My name is Fonte. Yeah. My
favorite album is Voodoo. Yeah, because that woman needs love. Yeah,
just like you do. Su Frema roll call, subrima something
So Frema roll call. My name is Sugar. Yeah, I

(01:37):
love to ball. Yeah, you know my number? Yeah, So
who you're gonna call? Surema roll call su Prima sub
Frema roll call. I'm on pay bill. Yeah, there's something strange. Yeah,
you stole my ship. Yeah, and I've been brave Suprema

(02:02):
roll call, Suprima, Supremo roll call. Yeah, current crass. Yeah
you've been taking him. Yeah, roll call Frema call. My

(02:23):
name is like yeah, No, I'm not Jill. Yeah, but
if I would Mr Parker, Yeah, I'll go up any
Hill Road. Suprema roll call, Suprima, su Prema roll call.
My name is Ray Yeah, Torres born in May. Yeah,
I'm my love is strong. Yeah, I grab my guts.

(02:45):
I played with it. Roll call su Prima, Road called Suprema, Suprema,
roll call suprem We have an amazing show for you today.

(03:06):
Our guests is someone I really wanted to get it
on the show since we launched it. Uh. He's an
incredible talented singer, songwriter, kdars and producer. He's working with
some trude legends of soul including Mr Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye,
Berry White, so many more ladies and gentlemen. Mr Ray
Parker Jr. Is on the show today. Now, before we
bring him on, let's check in quickly with Team Supreme.

(03:30):
Um ma'am. I'm doing okay. I'm kind of tired. I
think I have decision for like, I'm tired of making
that THEMN decisions. I'm mentally exhausted. So now me and
my me and my lady are finally moving into our house.
And so now you were moving this house for the longest, dude,
It's like because it's just been a lot, man, it's
been like, well, hell, I ain't been home. I've been
running around with you all all be but but no,

(03:52):
but no, it's just that. And then it's like changing bills,
like getting stuff from your old place to your new place,
and like I'm working, my ladies working, the kids is working,
and it's just it's just a lot. Man. Wait, the
kids are working, well, I mean they're in school and
you know what I'm saying, And like, well, this is
a question from a person that's not a father. Okay, okay,
So how what's the report card system? Like? Now, do

(04:15):
they just email you the report? Man? Yo? The report cars?
Do they bring it home to you? Na? It comes
straight to your hands and no more. I can't. I can't,
Uh Ferris building my way out of there, Na bro
like this, everything is electronic. You can log on um.
You can see they skipping class. You can see like absence. Guys,

(04:36):
do you live in a police state? I think we
all live right Yeah? Serious helicopter parenting right there? All right.
I just want to play one Ray Parker Junior song
and Radio before he comes in, because we need to
relax so he's gonna have all these crazy stories to
tell us. I want to play one of my favorite
joints off of the two places at the same time.
Record It's uh Tonight Tonight by Ray Parker Jr. And

(04:59):
Radio This quest Love Supreme only door Come on, baby,
it's right. If it won't, let get down to nice
to night. Tell Thomas add a sun. We don't need

(05:24):
his LFE. That's right. Every mind dr bell not to
ring this phone not singing sing We got live bols
right here, Ray Parker Jr. This question love, lay down
nights right, come down like that was too nice to night?

(05:48):
Ray Parker Junior in Radio a conditioning here or request love? Uh? Yeah,
this is there's some story behind that song this you
should not let that just dress. I'm I'm never We
want to ask all the stories. Um, every episode is
a blessing, but this one in particular, it's like, I mean,

(06:09):
this man is the consummate musician, session player, producer, uh
songwriter personality. I mean, he's one of the coolest people alive.
You don't understand not serious cool Ladies and gentlemen, welcome
the greatest Ray Parker Jr. Thank you pretty good to

(06:31):
be here. Thank you man. This is this is a dream,
a dream. Thank you, Thank you for coming to do
our show. We are going to ask every question ever
want to ask you right now. Um to Night, the
kid is not it's a nice okay tell me. Usually

(06:52):
I start at the beginning, but what was the story
behind tonight to night? Tonight? It's an interesting song because
I don't know if you recalled, but I used to
play on all the Herbie Hancock and I wrote a
lot of songs with Hervey. So I was over his
house one day and we were kicking it. And if
you know anything about her but he never plays the
same thing twice. He just doesn't, you know. And his
chords changed like every half a beat. That's a different

(07:14):
chord and it's like going on forever. And he ran
across these three chords and I was like, whoa, that works,
but you just gotta slow it down. He's like, what
are you talking about? Said slow that down? He said,
that ain't working on my song, said I ain't talking
about your song. No, that already slow it down. And
I had to get him to play the chords in
segments where it would just hold for two bars. He says,

(07:35):
what do you mean? He says, what am I doing
for too? I says, you're not doing anything. Just hit
the sustained pell, just hold it, let it drift. And
I end up talking and I said, you know, I
could write a whole song for that. So what I
did is I took his synthesizer in his move, unplugged
it from right where we were at his house, which
is off a Doheny, put it in my car, put

(07:55):
him in the car front, drove him to my house
in my studio, right plugged it back up, and said,
now I want you to do exactly what you're doing
at your house. I just want you to do it
like him one twelfth a time. So everything last two
bars and he had one hell of a time done.
We spent a long time because he just couldn't hold
those chords. And one he says, man, this is stupid,

(08:15):
said don't worry about the stupidity of it, just do
it and let that hang. And then he played the
bass on it, then put the bass on second. He
was playing way too many notes for us, and slow
that down to just do doo doo doo do you know?
Which still is a lot for me, but he's that's
his version of slowed down. Then we took the sentersides
back to his house and finished his song. What's wrong

(08:38):
was it? I don't know. I just remember tonight. Tonight
I was soon throwing with my song. I forgot what
we were doing for him? Is that it hard for
you to do? Like I'm often frustrated because obviously jazz
cats have a bigger, wider, expansive vocabulary than the average musicians.
So to get them to just simplify, I think it's
a pride thing. Like they feel like every think has

(09:00):
tould be this elaborate, big productmatic and they don't understand
the beauty of simplicity. Do you think that's because like
they just think they're above pop music or Yeah, in
a sense, they're like in more notes is more something?
You know, I've I've learned that the less notes you play,
more money you get for the space, you know what

(09:22):
I mean. But you know, it's like, you know, most
of my friends and I started off like this too.
I used to play jazz and and and all the
stuff when I was younger. You want to play something
that the musicians sitting next to you cannot play. So
it's that kind of a thing like watch me do
this run and you can't do this run. When actually,
when you're making music, you want to play something that
the person, even if they play it bad, they want

(09:46):
to make them try to play it, so they think
I got it, I got it, you know. So it's
it's actually the opposite thing. So what you feel is
that resistance from people when they locked into jazz and
they said I got it. This is it. They're locked
into their world and they just can't see anything else,
so they're just over there. Yeah. I don't even know
if they think they're better than anybody. I don't think
it's better. I just think they think they're different and
they think that the difference is correct. I also think

(10:09):
it's easier for jazz guys to do the more difficult
composition stuff, but it's literally impossible for them to play
something simple. Yeah. Um, so I want to go back
to the beginning. You were You're from the d right,
are from Detroit, well part of what part of the

(10:30):
west side, west side, Grand Boulevard, Dexter, actually Virginia Park
and Dexter. But I was born halfway between the Grandy
Ballroom and Motown. Really yeah, right in the middle. I
could walk either way. If I walked northwest, I was
going to the Grandy Ballroom, and which I was a kid,
not old enough to go in. You could hear Jimi
Hendricks playing upstairs, you know, coming out the window. And

(10:51):
for those of y'all who don't know, the Grandy ball
Room was like a white rock club in the heart
of the ghetto. Black people everywhere, and it was almost
like um off demilitarized zone. They could go to from
their cars to the club and back without being harmed.
If they went another block either way, that was it,
you know, or half a block either way, and it

(11:12):
was like holy sacred ground. But it was right in
the middle of the ghetto and all of the rock
bands were played at Ted Nugion Emboy Dukes. That's when
he had a group called the Amboy Dukes. And all
the rock bands were famous for playing here. And then
if I went the other way, it was Northwestern High School,
which I end up graduating from. And then there was
Motown down the street, so I could walk to Motown too.
First of all, it was the guitar your first and

(11:33):
no no, I played clarin at six years old, I
assume that was school. That was elementary school. I had
a teacher named Alfred T. Kirby, and he's probably the
most important person in my life because at five years old,
I was in kindergarten and I hated kindergarten because the
gym class didn't have you dance these Russian dances with
the girls. We we gotta change, you know, partners and
all that stuff. I wasn't into those girls. You know,

(11:55):
that's another story. Took me a long time to find
girls when I found him. But you know, so I
didn't want to do this. So at the type of
person I was outgoing at you know, team time for
the first grade and I'm six years old, I said,
I ain't doing it. I'm not gonna do it. So
I want to go talk to my parents about it,
because they didn't really know I was talking about. So
I decided to find out who's running this school, and

(12:18):
so they told me the principle. I said, well, where
is the principle, and so I marched out the class,
went to the principal's office and said, look, I ain't
digging the gym thing with the dancing with the girls.
Is there something else I can do? So the principle
looked at me, I'll never forget to look. First of all,
the principle said absolutely nothing. For maybe us. It seemed
like sixty seconds like this is little kid come in
here talking it's crap, you know, So it was like

(12:40):
that more of that. Then the principle said, okay, I
got something for you and took me to the music class.
He said, if you don't want to be in this
gym class doing these dances, you can take a music class.
I said, what's the music class? Said you pick an
instrument and you're gonna play. Now, well, it's nice about
the music class that I just this is a god giving,
just a gift. Is my only had two best friends
in the world. That was Nathan and Ali, and both

(13:01):
of them were already in the music class. Brown and
Nathan won elementary score them absolutely Jesus. Yeah, so the band.
So so I go to the class. I walked into
the room. There's Nathan playing his trumpet. Nathan played the

(13:22):
trumpet all he was playing the drums, but at that
time he had a snare drum and we hung a
symbol from the ceiling, you know. And uh so the
teacher asked me what I want to play? Well, I
was a young kid. I wasn't gonna stay the tuba, right,
take tuba? So I wanted to play the flute. And
all the girls had taken the flute. So what's I said,
what's the next smallest instrument? And the next small session
was declaring that you know, and so Mr Kirby, who

(13:45):
was a genius guy, I wish I could talk to
him now. Mr Kirby. Uh he looked at me. He says,
young man, this about a weekend to it. He could
see that I was less and enthused as Ali and
Nathan were. He says, we're gonna start the band. And
this band is to be called a sting Rays, which
was named after me. I didn't figure that out for

(14:06):
twenty years. But the band was named after me, and
you know who else didn't figure it out, Ali and Nathan,
they were too stupid to figure out Radio was named
after you too later a story so and I think
he named it after me because I needed the most.
I needed more encouragement than Nathan and Olie did you know.
And so it was interesting. We did uh parent teacher

(14:28):
conference stuff, orphanages and a whole bunch of stuff. And
our hit song which was hit in the neighborhood, local
local hit. It's called Airplane Do Do Do Do Do
Do Do Do Do crash, you know, and that was
and man, we were we were popular for somebody this

(14:51):
is under ten years old. Six years old. We were
six years old, were rocking. That's the show, Ladies and Go.
I was dancing to one of your songs. And so
that's how it all began is on the clarinet. Nathan
played the trumpet, all he played the drums. Any any

(15:12):
other notable UH Session Monster musicians also go to the
school with you during this time period that when you know,
Diana Ross went to that school, not when I went.
Temptations went to that school. I think, yeah, there was
a lot. No, this was a famous Now what you
got a picture. I'm sure you've noticed that a lot
of famous people have come out of Detroit. It was
just a small area. So everybody was going to either

(15:34):
that school or the school next to it, or cast
Tech or you know. We were all in the same genre,
so to speak. Kevin Tony went to high school with me,
still plays with me. Now. The guy from the black
Birds Creep Park doing it, Yeah, he was, and we
all went to school together. That's what we're gonna get
to his story for sure, that's he's a jazz guy
and you know, so that's the whole story. But uh,

(15:55):
and just to show you the progression. Later we met
up with Sylvester Rivers, who was one of our good
friends too, who end up doing all of the piano
work in Invictus and Hot Wax and the other stuff.
And Sylvester had a band for the first time. We
hadn't we We thought we were smoking everybody. I mean,
we were jamming. So now let's fast forward. It seemed
like twenty years but eight years, oh, eight and a

(16:16):
half years old. We're gonna fast forward eight and a
half years. So the biggest thing that happened at eight
and a half years old, is we heard Sylvester's band,
And Sylvester's band had a bass guitar and he was
playing a keyboard. We never really thought about chords, right,
we didn't even have a bass drum yet. So all
of a sudden, now we we're hearing chords for the
first time, and we're hearing the bass note on the bottom. Man,

(16:38):
that stuff seemed this big compared to just the trumpet,
the claring it and the snare drum. Yeah, so Ali immediately,
you know, I guess his parents borrow some money. He
got a bass drum so he could get some bottom
on at least the drum, so you could get a
kick going, you know, foot going, and uh, I never
you gets Sylvester wanted Ali to join his band, which

(16:59):
was a more just the kid the band because their
drummer wasn't happening and all. He was on the floor crying,
you know, because he didn't want to leave his homies.
You know, he just so he try, Okay, I'll never leave,
it said, man, you need to leave. I ain't gonna
do this anyway. Something else. I still wasn't committed at
that agent and by that time, I was playing a
little bit of saxophone. But the big thing, the big
life change, was my dad bought a Magnavox tape recorder

(17:22):
about this big, with real, the real, and I had
the only tape recorder in the neighborhood that was real,
the real. So the studio I was the studio believing,
and I still like that today. But I was the studio.
I had the tape recorder and my brother had a
cheap box guitar, and I remember I had a Busher
Busher saxophone. I took my brother's guitar and I put

(17:45):
the microphone in the guitar and it amplified it. Right,
it was an acoustic guitar, but I put the mic
in the thing, passed the strings, stuck it up in there,
turned the tape recorder up, and it's like, whoa, that's
cool sounding. Plus I got more than one show. I
couldn't plain things that you hit the strings, but it
was more than one old at the time, and I
was tired of breathing and stuff anyway, so ALI left
the band. I didn't like this, and by the time,

(18:06):
you know, I was starting to get a little taller,
a little more ten years old, starting to get a
little more handsome, you know, growing a little hair. Just
ain't found the girls yet. But I'm just saying I
was just starting up, going into your own. Yeah, I'm
getting taller, you know, and the little clarinet's getting smaller.
I'm getting taller, you know. It's what happened. So Ali
quit the band and went with Sylvester and the bigger band.

(18:27):
So I just said, I'm gonna play the guitar and
you know, and we were still playing together sometimes, but
they didn't want me to play the guitar. They wanted
me to play the clarinet, you know. And I said,
if you don't let me play the guitar and or record, y'all,
that's just the way it is. So that's how that went. Okay,
So now I'm gonna let you'll take it back over.
I'll be talking, I know, campfire stories. We should tell

(18:48):
him who Ali? He keeps? Well? Now, now everything's coming
to me now. Because I was trying to Ali and
Jerry hooked up, and of course Jerry was also in radio,
so that hooked them up years later. That's way I
don't want to jump that for I don't jump that
so okay, So were you self taught or did you

(19:10):
have formal instruction? Self taught on the guitar? And this
is normal for everyone in Detroit, Like am I to
think that everyone's a wonder kind prodigy at their instrument.
You know what, Yeah, it does seem like it. But
let me tell you this. The level of musicianship was
so high that before you could even tell anybody you
played the instrument, you had to be good. Right. It's

(19:31):
just like I never get Norm Nixon told me one time,
he said all his guys he went to school with,
all six or eight them went to the NBA because
the level of practice that they all commanded from each other,
it was so much higher than when they showed up
with everybody else. The whole group was higher. And I
think that's how Detroit was. You know, when I was
a young kid, like fourteen, I'm playing in the in

(19:51):
the at the twenty Grand Well, you know, James Jamison
was sitting next to me, right, So that's just the
way you played. James Jamison was sitting here. You know,
Jack Anfred's so over there, proper white sitting here. I mean,
you gotta play well, you gotta play you know, there's
there's nowhere around it, and if you're not cutting it,
everybody's point at you. And I gotta tell the street
when the notes, when the bad notes get played, it
wasn't me because I was perfect, right, I had to

(20:13):
be perfect. I'd be out, but they'd all point to
me anyway, the youngest. I get hit with the drumstick
anyway because it's the youngest. So did you play with
the Funk Brothers or were you? I didn't play with
the Funk Brothers on the original. I don't mean that.
I mean, but did you ever play with those guys?
Every day? So the twenty Grand was just the epicenter
of musician. I was in the house band at the Grand,

(20:35):
so it was Michael Henderson would play sometime. Bo Hannon
was the band leader. He's the guy that brought me
your Hamilton handon, brought me in the band. Michael Henderson
would play when he's not on tour with Miles or
steviea somebody. But Jamison was there just about every night.
Um Eddie Willis would play sometime. Why I was there
all the time? Right Wing was from the Georgy as well. Yeah,

(20:58):
you know the guitar while the thick L five because
he pushed the phone in and get the wa wa pedal. Yeah,
that's my guitar. That ain't guitar. He still owed me
three hundred dollars patented that when I was playing jazz,
I put the phone in there because Melvin Sparks and
George Benson had done it. And I bought an L five,

(21:19):
you know, to play some jazz. I was playing jazz wa.
I was living with this white chick and she stole
all everything he had. So he came home to carveon
was gone. He took all the money. He would have
killed it, but he didn't have enough money to go
get fined her to kill. Had a thin body guitar
that he was playing all the time, and so I said, look,

(21:40):
I ain't gonna play jazz much no more. You could
buy my L five, and he didn't have much of choice.
He gave me a hundred two hundred bucks and said
he paid me the rest, which I never ever, never did.
But that's how he got the guitar. And then once
he started playing with it, the wa pedal and the
boxing tire feeding back gave him his new sound. He
was like oh, I like this chick. So he's been
playing it ever since. Now we out a deal because
he smokes a lot of cigarettes, and so I say,

(22:02):
if you croak early and when my guitar back, even
that's probably that's priord of the deal. That's probably deal.
Even though so I guess uh. Some previous episodes before um,
we learned the idea of the house band, which was
various acts will come to town. Learned the records to
whoever you know? It was how much warning did you have, like,

(22:24):
give us an example of you being in the house
band and someone coming to the town. Is this okay,
we're in the house span let's say Gladys Night and
the Pips come to town. Chuck Jackson was a big
guy to a come. No spanners will come there. In
the warning you show up there this week, they say,
the spinners showing. They put the charts up there and
it's time to you know, you rehearsed a little bit
with the charts and the four charts or actual like

(22:47):
their court charts with some notes, so the guitars going
or Dr Dawn that will be written then you go
back to chords. Was that the same you mentioned Chuck Jackson.
Was that the same Chuck Jackson the work with No, No, No,
there was there was a guy singer, Chuck Jackson had
a big horn section. Everything I know, Chuck Marvin Yancy

(23:08):
to you. Yeah, I did some of Natalie's records. Yeah,
you'ren't sophisticated, lady, right, I know. I'm on our love.
I remember that because she was pregnant at the time, right, Okay,
So okay, so you're saying that without warning, someone puts
paper in front of you and you gotta get. Yeah,
you gotta go. And I got my first gig at Motown,

(23:29):
even before Hamilton Bohanna, even before the twenty grand Is
with the Spinners, Okay, and Billy Henderson had a chart
called Fascinating Rhythm. He says, I don't care how old you.
You can read that chart. You got the gig. So
I pulled out my guitar. Read that chart. Now, I
got the gig. And so he came to my mom
and they take us out on weekends, you know, and
we go play with the Spanish. They were nobody at
the time. They had Felipe Win hadn't even gotten the

(23:50):
band yet, you know. So this is Detroit Spinish span. Yeah,
but at the twenty grand, which is interesting. Phelippe Win
got in the bandag twenty grand. They ain't had no
hits and they weren't signing the Philadelphia. But I do
remember Felipe Win turning out the audience two shows a
night with no hits. He just started doing that half
half year. He was just the most energetic guy you

(24:11):
ever seen. And when nobody knew what he was singing, right,
it was like exciting anyway, I've heard the level of
performing was unbelievable. Yeah, so Flip bay Win was off
the change, and I heard he was like the greatest,
like Ad Liver. He would just come up with stuff
off the cuff like was Tom Bill would shortened all
the songs to leave a long fade because they just

(24:32):
would let him have a fade. So if you look
at the Spinner songs, they you know, two minutes it
starts to just go to the fad. There's a formula
one Spinner songs because when you're the same with slide
in Family Stone, like I used to think that Fleet
Bay sang everything, whereas you know, I noticed that uh
one of the other singers would sing the main lyrics

(24:54):
and then it's time for the end straight. He rarely
would get a song by him, stuff like Rubber Bandman
maybe one of the time, but it's kind of like
a formula at the Grand. So could you describe what
what a typical night there was like, Like, first of all,
I was at a nightclub. Is it it was a
night theater or we need another nightclub like that? It

(25:14):
was all black nightclub in the center of the ghetto.
Capacity probably four or five people, but it would be packed.
I mean this place would be packed seats everywhere Ladist
night will have a line going outside in the wintertime
all the way around the block. So if it's in
the center of the hood, was there any concern where
once you became of a certain stature, Say, if you're

(25:34):
like Dina Ross, are you still going to the twenty
Grands and see Norman Winfields there every night? I mean
he used to pick on me as a kid, saying
what's he doing here? And I said, sha, you hold
up the drink. Shut up. It was like calling me
out routinely. You know, are you coming under age? Like yeah, yeah,
I was way under age. I mean when me and
Norman Winfield we couldn't be friends for like another four
years because he was called he was just calling me out,

(25:56):
just you know. It took a while. I used to
I don't know, he was just picking on me. And
then he talked to me like third party two. He'd
be like, why is he here? He's obviously too young.
He was just picking you know what. He's like, Yeah,
like I guess you know, he didn't know through you
he might have someone that was sort of at one
level with with Dennis or No, he didn't feel none

(26:18):
of that. He wasn't feeling. It was all about Dennis
and no one else that was kid punked out on
the stage and just what that was. It wasn't headed
that way. But the typical day is, you know, we
go in reheard the songs or like say a show time,
we do the first show almost like clockwork. Every night
in the middle between the two shows, me and Jamison
would hang out. Jameson had a black fleet with bro him.

(26:39):
We go to his car, you know, and I was
a really nice kid. Jamison would go in his glove box.
And that's wintertime, so we got the rendos rolled up.
We got a little bit of heat on cold and
and then he had a bag of weat. Then the
bag of wheat was sitting on his gun, you know,
the gun, And I'm sorry the gun was sitting on
the bag of First of all, everybody just by everybody
in the gotta get used to that. You don't go

(27:00):
nowhere without your gun and the globe box, you know.
But he had a weed undergun, so he would get
the weed put in the pipe and he starts smoking weeds.
So I told my mother on James James what I said,
you know, because it was making me feel weird. You know,
it's it's you know, contact I just wasn't happening, you know.
So you know, I had to talk with my parents
and they told me what to say because they didn't

(27:22):
want me to get all get him in trump. So
I went back and I said, you know, Mr Jamison,
Mr Jameson, how old was he at the time. I
don't know. He probably is in his late thirties, I'm guessing,
you know, and I think I was fourteen fifteen. I said,
you know, I can't sit in a car with you
no more, because you know, you're smoking these things and
I can't, you know, I feel weird. H He promised

(27:46):
me he'd never do it again, you know, he said,
you know, this is a week lad. He said, he
missed our hang out in the car, you know, because
nobody else is hanging out because he liked to drink
a little bit. People gone. So he told me he
never do it again. So I said, okay, cool. You know,
then we got back together and we go acted his car,
listened to some music and kick it. You know, I
didn't know he's gonna be famous or everything. I just
just the bass player. I was gonna say, was he

(28:07):
because I've never heard any James Jamison stories whatsoever. For
for those that know James Jamison is like the standard
for which I personally judge every basse player I've ever
played with. For those of you that are fans of
of d'angelo's Voodoo and you praise Peno Palladino, Peano Palladino's

(28:28):
basically the second coming to James Jamerson, like his his
finger game is bar nothing. I mean, he's emulating James Jamerson.
Even in the Shadows of Bowtown documentary is all Jamison, everybody.
And they talked about the twenty grand as well. So
was it a generation separation? That's what I want to know,

(28:49):
like it was sort of a generation separation, you know. Um,
but they were they were good guys, the Funk Brothers.
You know, my mouth was probably a little too big.
I remember the first song learned to play was I'm
Losing You Down, and I had I had it down.
I mean, I had my red three thirty five back
pick up dude jink in the bottom note. They had

(29:10):
the whole thing put together. And so I was showing
Robert White. You know, we were sitting in the studio
and I'm showing Robert White sort of not just playing
for him, but sort of like, look at me, watch this.
You know, I'm the man, you know, And Robert White
looked at he says, he says, he says, that's really nice,
young man. I played on the original record, you know.

(29:31):
I mean, you know, I'm like, really, you play on that?
Says he. Then he I found he played mocked on.
That's him on my girl. I mean I was like,
I got quiet, you know, I got shut up. But
those guys were teaching us. So, you know, Robert White
taught me a lot of rhythm stuff and tricks and
how to phrase it and how to use the things.
So they were real helpful, They were real good guys,

(29:52):
all of them. So am I just assuming that there
is what I think are three classes because obviously when
Norman Whitfield really started, uh kind of taken over where
Holland Dejar Holland left off. If Holland Deljar Holland really
utilized the Funk Brothers to their full ability, I feel
like Norman Whinfield took Dennis Coffee's band wait was or was,

(30:13):
but he just took Dennis Coffee in Wahwa basically. But
the even the rhythm section was was different than some
of the same guys. Sometimes. Yeah, Jamison was on some
of his stuff before they could not get alone. They
had some fights, you know. So I mean by the
time that they had made in uh their exodus to Hollywood,
what were you facing? Then? That was a godsend that

(30:36):
that Holland do johanand left Motown really because yeah, because
Jack Ashford, Dennis Coffee, Robert White, they had Motown sewed up.
I did some Marvin Gay albums when Marvin wanted to
be different. I did one thing with Smokey and the
Snake Pit, but most of the sessions were done by
the Funk brothers. So when Holland do joh Holland left,
the Funk Brothers weren't supposed to be there, so that

(30:56):
left me and my boys, Me and Sylvester step Yeah,
let us want that, didn't young man? Singling free? So
we all that, of course it is, yeah, all that
kind of stuff, Chairman of the board, lordly uh free
to pay. I mean that's us doing all that those records.
So that led us in on the thing. You know.
So you were the house band for Yeah, I'm I'm on. Yeah,

(31:20):
that's that's me. Yeah, so we're having a good time
Marvin get Cutter record. I remember the first release was
Year to Man, which I'm playing two or three guitars on.
That's me a fifteen sixteen and I'll never forget. I
made like twenty grand in a month. My father worked
at four he only made sixteen grand all year. So
this posed a real interesting problem my dad. No. I

(31:47):
had already told my dad I don't need no money.
I told him that thirteen years and I got the money.
Then I'm good. You don't have to pay nothing for
me no more. But what was interesting is now I'm
starting to make so much money. My dad thought for
sure I was selling drugs. He was a hudd percent sure,
So he hired my older cousin follow me around. Now
this may have been prompted by if you ever saw

(32:09):
the movie super Fly, the blue Cadillac with all this
stuff on, Marvin Gaye had one just like it, but
it was burgundy with a burgundy top. It was cold
blooded bug eys. I mean, you know this thing was.
So Marvin's at the studio one day and he's smoking
a joint and I'd already kind of said, you know,
I think Bohana or somebody told him, you know, ray

(32:30):
with to join him. So Marvin felt bad, but he
wasn't gonna stop smoking his joint. He just feel bad
about it. So I'll never forget what he did. Man.
I don't know if I had a driver's license or
not at the time, but he looked over at me,
he says, man, wann't you take the car for spend?
Go out for a couple of hours and half a
good time? And I'm like, really, man, I let me
tell he let me drive the Pentmobile in Detroit. I

(32:52):
was leaning so hard I think me and the mirror
were like, sent it up, sent it up. You know.
I'm driving through the neighborhood, so I know because so
I'm just trying to protect my dad. Now, you know
he saw that too, something he at least heard about it.
He said, Man, we saw your son driving a fifty
thousand capital. Now you said he made how much money?
Last money? You need to check your own home talking

(33:14):
about us. So I'm pulling up to the high school.
I'm leaning hard right. I can't get no no girls
in the car because I can't stop, because I'm scared
to stop. I'm just leaning and if the police come,
I don't care. I'll take I shot at it. But
I drove around for a couple of hours. I went
back to do your best time in my life. You know.
So your father just had no clue that you were

(33:34):
pretty much a genius at your craft at this point.
He thought that, first of all, if you weren't playing
the saxophone, why are you playing any music? He says,
nobody wants to hear anything about the saxophone. And my
father was much older than me, by the way, I
should say that he had me at forty six ft seven,
So in his mind all he knew was the jazz
musicians of the old days. They live out the suitcase.
They make five dollars and they broke all right, So

(33:55):
that's all he He didn't understand what recording was or
any of this stuff. Okay, So what would session musician
in Detroit make on a typical session. First of all,
are you your own agent? Yes? Okay, we had no agents.
They just call you on the phone. McKenley Jackson for
Invictus would call up and say, hey, we're cutting at
such and such a time. Can you make it ten

(34:15):
o'clock ninety dollars for three hour session? How long do
you have to learn the song? You don't have long.
They spend half an hour on the drum sound. You
go in there. What no amplifiers. Everybody had a little
or a tone speaker next to him, and in the
main room in Motown, everybody plugged in the same speaker
clapping it. Bass guitar, everybody plugging the same thing. Then

(34:36):
they had a drum booth for the drums. So they
you run the song, but you gotta get three songs
in three hours, or don't nobody want to see you
no more? You gotta get three songs. Whatever. So you
got a half an hour setting up the thing. You
gotta change the stream whatever, y'all gotta tune up whatever.
That's it. Now, let's play. And they come in and
change the parts and they run it down and you

(34:57):
have to get it. But what was exciting is you
could hear your song on the radio within ten days.
They get it out really quick back then, you know,
and it was a singles world. Back then. It wasn't
a lot of albums, so everything we cut was supposed
to be a hit single. All right, So during this period,
what is your proudest moment of like, ah, that's my guitar? Like,
what's what's your man? When I heard everything Good is

(35:18):
Bad and Everything Bad is Good come back? It had
four my guitars on it. That opened up and I
was up loud. How many wait? How many tracks? Tracks? Okay?
So what year is this? Now? This is seventy, I guess. Okay.
So the studio used is this town or is it no? No?
This was Holladjo Holland had their own studio and it

(35:41):
was in a burned down movie theater on Grand River
and Joy Road, which was happening to be two blocks
over from the Grandy Ballroom, which was interesting because I
always wondered why they had a burnt down movie studio
and why they put all this sand under the control
room floor. And when I first built my studio in
Hollywood and American Studios, I didn't want to burn down

(36:02):
movie theater, but I did put saying under the floor,
which made it work right. And and now that I'm older,
I traced it back to Memphis. The old Royal Studio
was in a burned down movie theater and they got
saying under the control room. And so it all really
started in Memphis. They were trying to imitate, you know,
exactly and Willie, Willie Mitchell during the Hollando John Holland

(36:24):
period and the Marvitgate period. And I was just graduating
out of high school. You know, I got out of
high school seventeen. So I'm now doing a year of
college that I say at the first in the middle
of the first year, which I hated. Now, I was
drafting car parts for Ford Motor Company. Here. I mean,
if you can imagine me with a suit in town,
you know, drawing car doors and trying to make it fit.
You know, that didn't work out for me, and Stevie
wanted to call me on the telephone, and I had

(36:46):
never missed Stevie wanted. But Music from My Mind was
my favorite album, you know, of all the time, which
they recorded in this building. By the way, they did
what affected what? What affected music on my Mind have
on you? Like I never heard those sounds just to
hear it, Like I never heard someone that was in
that era describe it. I mean, I know what it
is in hindsight as an adult. But by the way,

(37:07):
that's my favorite album that he's ever recorded. And it's
him playing all the instruments, but it's it's all these
experimental sounds, and it's a breakaway from the traditional Motown sound.
It's just him experimenting a free and experiment and just
trying something totally new. And so I had pretty much,
you know, when I first heard it, I'm not sure
I liked it that much. It was so new then

(37:28):
as I then a month later, I had thrown away
every other record. I had just had the eight track
of that in my car play along which one which
one grabbed you the most? On the album? Like the
first you know what, I can't marry wants to be
Super I can't. I can't even say I just would
play the whole a track and just let it play.
And I used to drive from Detroit to Cincinnati and
back in eight hours just so I could just nobody

(37:49):
could talk to me. I just turned up loud and
just drive and just listen to it. Was that, you know.
So what happened to me is right around my birthday
in seventy two, right before my eighteenth birthday, I got
a phone call from Stevie Wonder and this is the
true strive to before I hung up on him, you know,
because that's a common thing for every know, not believing.

(38:12):
I mean, I'm playing the song the album in my
car every day. I ain't got nothing but that, So
it's got to be one of my boys messing around
with me. Gotta but you know. And he called two
or three times. I hung up to it three times.
Four time he called back. I said some not some
nice things and then still hung good thing. He had
a sense of humor, so he called back in fifth tanks.
Just look, he says, we ain't we ain't communicate say this.

(38:33):
Steve wanted he's just listen to this, and he played
me the rhythm track he had just started with Superstition,
and I almost hung again because the rhythm tracking superstition
starts off with marching drums topped, and I was like, oh,
that's you know. Then if before I could hang up,
I heard boom. I heard that, and I went, oh,

(38:53):
my gosh, hanging up the phone. And there was still
this shoe of the college with the door parts and
learning that thing, you know, And there's a major problem
there because my dad wanted me to finish college and
get a real job and have a pension plan, and
this still wasn't a real job. Still twenty in one month,

(39:18):
I remember, I'm doing the twenty grand, making three fifty
a week at the twenty grand in cash, no taxes.
We didn't pay taxes in Detroit. Three fifty He's right,
we'll shoot ten years ago to Mary. Didn't pay taxes.
Don't go back to hip hop. So we make three fifty,

(39:41):
So three fifty week, twenty grand uh ninety dollars every
three hour session at Holland do Joholland. And then that
one month with Marvin Gaye and Jewish Barty mrss and
weddings on the weekends pay like thirty forty bucks. And
we could do three, four or five of those easy
so we're making plenty in Detroit house some of this
money like pretty much. Yeah, But instead I bought myself

(40:04):
a really nice con It's crazy. In the first house
I bought, I bought my dad's house. I did do that,
just so you know. When I made some real money
about my dad's house, Mom took care of everybody, paid
all the bills. They never paid a pennymore for the
rest of their life. And he still didn't he didn't
say you should still finish college. By that time I
was twenty two, he was done talking parents do that

(40:29):
like just side deep deep into Delf half life. My
dad was still getting that you gotta get a real
job exactly like my third record. He's still like, you
gotta get a real job. You're something I love. You
gotta come on straighten up. Yeah I got that. I
didn't get it. It didn't get real to my mom
until she saw me on the cover Double XL, Like
when she like when she saw us on Double x

(40:51):
L and then like the swords like see me in
magazines that was your second album. It was like it
was like, Okay, it's it's real. So with Stevie, did
you you finally when did you move to Los Angeles.
I moved to Los Angeles soon as I quit Stevie's band,
and I stayed in the band a good eight months.

(41:13):
I guess something like that. You know, I always wanted
to go to l A. I just I felt like,
you know, even in Detroit. It's because it was always
felt like the stork made a mistake and like dropped
me in the wrong name. It just felt like that
for some reason, you know, Like I saw the Beverly
Hills Billies on TV and I was like, wow, that's
I like that restaurant road, you know, swimming pools, movie
stars and the sunlight, and you know, I remember seeing

(41:36):
Leave It to Beaver and nobody ever stole Beaver's bike
and he wrote it to school, you know, I getting
knifed up from my jacket and everybody got guns and
we're going to pick each other up in the alley
and go to school in the group and all that
kind of stuff. Beaver didn't have to do none of
that stuff, you know, So I just I didn't know
the difference. I just would ask my parents where's that at?
And they don't stay California. I mean that everything was

(41:57):
movies were done in cafe. I just thought, well, don't
Robbie in California, so I mean it should be cool. Yeah, they'
sure do. I learned that when I got there too.
They steal your money and it takes you a year
or two to figure out that you lost, like what happened.
So when you're touring with Stevie, I mean you're with
the heavy I mean out in hindsight, I don't think

(42:19):
you saw it as I mean, these are the heavyweights,
but I mean it's like, you know, it's Williams, was
Denice Williams, And it was Raymond Pounds with you? Or
was it? Like he wouldn't know it was somebody before Alie.
I got Alie in the band. After Stevie and the
drummer think his name is Chris, they had a fight
and the drummer said, blind fai, I'm gonna how about this,

(42:41):
Stevie one is used to being blind. The drummer thought
he could put a thing around his eye and make
it even right, and so he went for blows and
Stevie every time he wait a minute, they fist. They
got into a fist exclusive. I didn't think that was
even up, but they ended up and of course, you

(43:01):
know Stevie. Every time the guy even turned his head, bamd.
Stevie was no, it was it was baby was like
bang and so we all had stepped it to the doctors.
Wait a minute. It didn't take long before we had
to stop the fight. And then this guy still got fired,

(43:23):
so he lost his game. But we did have Randy Brecker,
David Sanborn, Denise Williams, you know, so it was it
was Yeah, a lot of people in this band, Heavyway,
Scotty Edwards. You know. It was a great band. So
were you part of the infamous Rolling Stones tour? Absolutely
the first tour I've been on the big tour. But

(43:43):
why not? Just it was the reception, like the reception, yes, no, no,
I mean, how did well? This is the thing. So
we we interviewed the Revolution, uh some episodes back and
of course, and I've heard mixed side of the story
as well, and he was like, well, you know, he's
on stage in his underwear, so of course they're going
to throw stuff at him. The Revolution was basically saying

(44:04):
that you know, Rolling Stones already, audience wasn't receiving them well,
and they got booed and pelted with Jack Daniel Bottle.
I was there when when Prince got hit with the jack,
Daniel in the head with the bottle head somewhere in

(44:24):
l A. He got hit in the head with the jack.
Had to get off the stage. He got hit in
the head. They said, plays them right and roll. I
mean it was like bad, you know, I mean he
came off the gate smoking with the guitar. So was
still yeah, the theories behind that, But what was it
like with you? Was there fear like we might not?
First of all, I was too young to know anything.

(44:45):
I thought the Rolling Stones had already come on. I
thought Stevie was the headline. Okay, So it took me
a minute or two by the time of tear gas
got in the limousine and I figured out, okay, something
else has happened here. And the thing, you know, so
the whole thing, now you gotta remember this was I
have really discovered girls yet, but I was about to
discover lots of girls. So this is the first really

(45:09):
big tour like go away from home and stayed for
more than a week that I've ever been on. Was
the Rolling Stones tour in nineteen seventy two, and they
were wonderful guys. We all had a great time. No
one bowed Stevie Wonder off the stage and told him
to get off. We didn't have that same experience as
some of the other groups had, you know, maybe because
he got the respect. And then we'd always go play
a few songs with the Stones, and you know, we
got to go to Playboy Mansion, which I've never been

(45:31):
two before. You know, there's a documentary of it called
the You ever see the Cocksuckers Blues? Uh the Rolling
Stones documentary? Yeah, yeah, they show I guess you guys
playing satisfaction with the little skinny kid with a real
good time. He really skinny after it. That'd be me.
So were you ever like on their airplane? And that's

(45:53):
supposed to be the penultimate standard of just yeah, yeah,
that's supposed to be the beginning. It was pretty bad,
really well, there was a lot of going on. There
was a lot of things because if you don't like
to smell of weed like that, it was like, you know,
I didn't do that. I didn't partake in that type
of activity. Let you do it. And I do remember that,

(46:19):
you know, last I had checked cocaine was white. Their
cocaine was crystal clear, and it was clear, and he
went up in a cone like that high and people
could just go back and just get all they want.
So this was only for eight months. The ruling stones
to us for about four months, but I mean college
tour with Stevie after that. So this is also I

(46:41):
mean his morphing into something other than little Stevie want
just a big time. Yeah. Yeah, he had changed and
he became and he's an interesting guy, but he really was.
We used to hang out all the time, like we
race cars, you know, and and we crashed people like
oh if you didn't let him drive your fifty dollar fine,

(47:01):
wait what yeah, yeah, this episode is gonna fuel all
the Stevie ain't blind. Don't believe the Stevie's blind's not
gonna If you're sitting next to Steve, you know he's
blind and he's driving the car. Now he assists on

(47:22):
drive dose, he assisting when you being in the passenger.
And yet and was worse than that is he insisted
on me driving and then we'd have to race the
car next to us. He didn't care about hitting the cars.
He said, well hit him. Then I was about to
say he's been and he's been in car accidents and
he still drives. Let me tell you something, he hadn't
been in the carrs in it yet still got some

(47:46):
reservations about what happened. I'm gonna leave that alone because
that was a couple of years later. But you know
how you hear something on the radio like all that
Cardadian stuff to be like, well, what really happen? Really happened?
How does a limousine crash into a log thing? And

(48:08):
oh boy? So I mean you just you know, come on,
you getting back now that we're in the seventies, was
was very white. Next. Now, first I left, and see
I left Stevie's band because he was teaching me how
to write songs. I had Buddy Miles playing the guitar
upside down on some of my songs, and me and

(48:29):
Stevie cut a bunch of stuff with us singing. But
somehow he wasn't gonna release it. I figured it took
me a minute, but I figured out he really wasn't
gonna let me put it out. And so that sort
of broke my heart because he didn't want me to
lead a band. You know, so I wanted to lead
a band ago Bray Parker Jr. Man, you're too valuable.
At the time, I was to get his guitar player.
You know, he wasn't feeling it. You know, I was
supposed to be his boy. So he took it kind

(48:51):
of personal that I left the band. But we were
still really good friends because after that, I got Nathan
in the band, which is a story into itself. Let's
talk about it. Still old in the band, Yeah, what's interest.
Nathan is the band leader, he's been in forty three years.
But the great Nathan wants, by the way, master basse
player I had got. Uh. This is a year and
a half after I left the band. Me and Stevie

(49:12):
was still drive around l A and we party and
hang out. And I got Reggie McBride in the band
because me and Reggie used to play together twelve years old.
The time this got tom Gary used to play grand
in the other room. And so Reggie left the band
and went to Rare Earth, And then Stevie said, well,
I want somebody else from Detroit in the same neighborhood.
He wants that type of human being, that type of vibe.

(49:33):
The only person left was Nathan, who played the trumpet
right and I said, well, I got my buddy Nathan,
who played the trumpet. He wants to play the bass,
he says, I said, the game play the basse he
just started, you know, And Stevie said, we'll have him
come out there. He says he's a fast learner. I said, well,
he's a fast learner, but he ain't got the base yet, right,
so he has some kind of cheap harmony basse. And

(49:53):
I remember Stevie heard him at the auditions events. Sounds
really weird, you know. So then Nathan took my basse
and went on, is Steve on my base? And the
way the story goes, Nathan told me his eighteen other
bass players there and everybody, I'll play him ten to one.
But he still got the gig. You know what do
you think it's? So he learned how to because Stevie
just wants somebody from Detroit in the club down the

(50:14):
street from me, the whole bit. And so he basically
taught Nathan how to play bay name, not how to
play the bassis his first gig, his first gig ever
in life. So how does he because he can't see, um,
is it a lot of he cannot see? So how

(50:36):
are you guys learning? First of all, how is he
writing these songs? I've heard he writes him in his
head and he just play. He remembers every part, every everything,
and he could play all part like I was in
the studio with him the whole time when he did
Living for the City and he started with the Fender
Rose no click track when no click tracks at those times,
so he just played it like this, and it really
got weird when it dune dune and you know those

(51:00):
chords going off beach. You know. I was like, oh, homeboard,
you might be smoking. But I mean, you know, then
he would layer it and then we'll come together. He
put the drums on last. Always put the drums on last. Really, yeah,
you always put his drums on last. Usually the drums
and drums first. That's interesting. Yeah. See me, I put

(51:22):
a cup of parts down, but I need to put
the drums down. Then lock relocked the base and everything
back to whatever it is. But he just puts it down,
put the drums on last. I always wanted to know
how does he not tape ideas, especially when he can't. Well,
I'm sure that he writes, but I mean for you
guys to know what he's saying, he hears it in
his head and he'll he'll give it to you, but

(51:44):
mostly on his records. That's him playing most of the
stuff a lot of the time, and then he'll overdub
what he needs, so you're only getting the finished product.
And yeah, yeah, he played the drums and stuff. Like
when we did Maybe a Baby, the track was pretty
much done. Okay. And more trivia. It's funny the second
engineer we did that at Crystal Sound in l A.
Turns out years later second engineer with Steve Perry from

(52:04):
Journey Second. He was the second engineer on the date.
That's crazy. So you know, whole Sherry fame. There's a
lot of stuff going on at that time. You know,
it's an interesting time period in life, you know. I
mean I look back on as I hope much creder,
but at the time, just what was happening? That was it?
You know? Well, I wanted to ask about that. When

(52:26):
you did Barry White, was it just studio sessions or
was it also touring with him? Yeah? I did both. Okay,
how did y'all get paid? Because money had like seventy
people in the band, Like every show about I don't
know about the other guys, but I was getting triple
scale playing with Barry White in the studio. But it

(52:48):
was I came a little late, like I missed Dodd
because I was playing with Stevie one tour and U.
I met Barry White the next year, the following year,
and he was my first, my last, everything even before that.
But he was like a roughneck kind of guy, gangster
friend the hood and you know, and I was a
Detroit boy. I wasn't you know that clean, you know.

(53:10):
So I had my afro, had my Lincoln Condental and
gene Page famous rings. He needs to we need to
get him an award on he needs a profit. Yeah,
he's unbelievable, all the Lineal Richard. He even did the
the Righteous Brothers song. So he's he's He was a
good friend of mine from Detroit. I mean he lived
out here, but I worked with him in Detroit and

(53:30):
he brought me to the session. You know, Barry Waite
wasn't paying no attention. I wasn't on the session, and
verybody liked to play his music back loud nive console
speakers all the way up, you know, stuff whacking, orchestra jamming,
that stuff is going. And I had an idea for
a tune, and you know I did what did I
had to lose? I was off coming from the trip.
What do I care? You know? So I pushed stop
on the table recorder, you know, all the music stop.

(53:51):
You know, you got rid of yourself. I did it
and Barry session and Barry White looked over. He says,
he says, oh yeah, what igniting mom me big? First
of all, he says, what Frank, what happened? And then
he looked around there to me in the corner. I said,
excuse me, Mr White, And it was got real quiet,
and he said he looked at somebody, says who because

(54:14):
that right? And then he looked at Gene Page, like
you brought him here? And I said, excuse me, Mr White, Um,
that's a really nice song, but it's missing this guitar part.
And he looked at me and before he could punch
me or kick me out, he said, we didn't get
the funk in there and play it. Then, you know,
so I went into Joe Jackson with you ask first

(54:36):
and then gonna start an impact. Attentions rise at tensions rising, right, right?
So I go out there and uh, you know, I'm
starting to play the part, and I think, like anybody else,
you know, I hope he likes it, because I like,
I know what I gotta do. So I hit this line,
the line was doing dude, dude, that kind of a thing,

(54:57):
you know, And he loved it. And and so I said, okay,
we'll roll the tape back. He says, fuck you keep
playing it now. So the only thing that's missing on
the record. It's fun. You keep playing out, but you
hear me out for a bar and I have two bars, right,
And he said keep playing. So I just started back
up playing it and he just left it like that
because he didn't believe in fixing it. He just left it.

(55:17):
Really yeah on the record it drops out for a
bar where he told me, is this you know? So
on this uh White Goal album, then me and Barry White,
I'm not gonna say we were boys, but I thought
we were boys, right, And you know, so his thing
was he got all these rioters sound. He said, nobody
gets a song with Barry White, no way, no, how
y'all right for these guys, right, for these guys, right
for all this time. And so I was determined to

(55:39):
get a song with Barry White. So I got Jeane
Paste to write out the charts, and I had the
music demo tape cutting all this stuff, so I put
Barry White had a little Mercedes convertible by this time.
This is later in seventy four, and Barry came out
to studio, said, Barry listening to this, and I pushed
him in my car on by accident. I had the
door open, you know, push him in, but I know
he's gonna cut himself. So he damn, I'm the window

(56:00):
because he was too big to get into Mercedes. He
comes too big, you know, but he got in there.
But he didn't want to acknowledge that he was too
big to get in, so that worked in my favorite
But anyway, I got to play him the track. You know.
He said, yeah, man, that's nice. So what about it?
I said, well, you know, to cut the track. He said,
he's the man he doing. So we went back cut
hit the rest of his stuff, you know. DA and
Barry White had a specific and he says, everybody's getting

(56:22):
triple scale. I'm cutting eight songs today. I ain't paying
your pennymore. You can cut in one hour, you can
cut it in ten hours. Don't care what you do.
But once we get these songs sessions over. So this
is one of those days. We were done already, right,
we got like two or three hours left. Everybody want
to go home, but they're all my boys. David T. Walker,
you know, Lee ridden j Graden, Theme Parks and over

(56:55):
in the corner. And to show you what kind of
guy Jeane Paige was, I owe him way too much.
He had already the night before written all the charts
out for me for the whole band. Right, And so
when we got done, I said, Barry, Man, you mirror song.
Please let me cut the song. Man. He says, Ray,
we're done here, man, we're going home. I said, why
don't you do this? Why don't you go home? And

(57:16):
I cut the track. Okay. He looked at me like
little snotty knows kids. I mean, he's really pushing himself,
you know. And so he went home, and I got
Joe Sample and Wilton felt all the guys you know,
to stay back with me and cut the tracks. So
we cut the track in like twenty minutes, and I
drove it up to Barry's house and he listened to

(57:37):
what he says that's on the album. That's how I
gotta cut on the White Gold album, which did really well. Wait,
what's the title of the song always thinking of You?
All right, let's go and always thinking of You? Written
by Ray Parker Jr. For Barry White, White Gold Supreme.

(57:58):
That's a million reasons. Why why I always always who?

(58:20):
Who engineered this? Who? Frank Keshmar, Frank Keshmar? Who else
was on the sessions? Well? On the Barry White sessions
was Ed Green played the drums all right, all the time.
Wilton Felder, who was a saxophone player for the Jasper Sayers,
played the bass, and for those who don't know, he
also played on all the Jackson five hits too, and
a whole bunch of other stuff. So when you hear
a BC, that's Wilton Felder the sax player playing the bass. Yeah.

(58:43):
Joe Sample played the keyboards. Gary Filming played the vibes,
had the vibes, and on guitar would would be myself
wa wah, David T. Walker Right, Dean Parks sometimes either
j Gray or Lee written now time out Dean Parks. Yeah,

(59:04):
the great theme Parks was my boy Dean Parks. We
played together many years on whole much of stuff. Yeah,
what does Dean Parks doing in the Berry White session?
It was on all the Rayway sessions. No, I just
that's just I can't imagine Parks just you know Parks
from when you the song you mentioned, Yeah, that's that's

(59:24):
Jane Park. I'm playing on there too, but but that's
I think that's me, Dean and Lee. But we're playing
one note to piece, but they're all sunk together because
Barry wouldn't let you play the whole parts. So we
were playing one note to bed and we're sliding it
up and that's all three of them. That's overd. No,
he didn't like to overdue. So it's just normal to
have four guitarists playing five what forward don't stop it

(59:48):
for He just didn't want to overdone for monetary reasons. No,
he just didn't like it. He mixed on the need
console where all the faders are here in the monitor
section here, and he just he believed that he should
be to mix up here and if he didn't, hear
the echo on the drums, take the whole takeover. So
he wanted everything to sound like a record right here.
He says, forget all that, do it later. I want.

(01:00:09):
If I can't get it here, I ain't got no record,
so it's up to the band the engineered everybody else
to give him his record on those favors. And all
he wanted to do is play with the volumes on
his favor. But if he couldn't get the scenario, he
couldn't get it cut over. So even mixing like, there's
no like, okay, let's take a day out to mixing
stuff like, because you already mixed it. It's already open this.
You're hearing it the way he wants to hear what
happened afterwards. By this time I would have figured you

(01:00:30):
guys have figured out my ego. Of course I want more.
I want a song that Barry White sings and me
and him do together. I went through something very similar
at my apartment where I lived upstairs Barry White's when
of his manager guys lived there. So I figured out
from the management when Barry was just going to show
up right and I was gonna pull a coup real

(01:00:52):
fast and playing his new cut ahead right, talking about
I know most people said you should quit what feeling.
So here it comes. I see Barry White pulling up.
I can't wait, and I know where he's going. But
I don't want him to get out of his car
and go ring the buzz and go upstairs. I want
to catch him while he's downstairs. So I see him

(01:01:13):
come up the street because I've been waiting all this time.
So as soon as I see him come to the street,
I leave my park go downstairs, get in the car,
and I pulled to the front. But when I pulled
to the front out of the parking lot, it opens
the gate. Barry White had parked his White Mark seven
and the front of the gate illegally, but it was
too close and I had already triggered it when I
saw it was too late, so the gate was rising.

(01:01:36):
He had parked and was getting out, the gate lifted
up the front of his car. The car was too
heavy comment back on the gate. It ripped the gate
off the thing and it fell on top of his
Mark set. So I wrecked his Mark seven. But I
did get to play him the song where I needed that,

(01:02:00):
but it was his fault he parking around space. But anyway,
I did get him to listen to the song, and
he did cut the song, and so I was one
of the first people to ever get a song with that.
I wrote with Barry White maybe the only and it's
called you See the Trouble with Me, and we sold
like seven or eight million records and then a group
called Black Legend redid it in two thousand two or something.

(01:02:21):
It went number one around the world again, so it's
on all his greatest hits records. And I think he
was just very kind to me to do it. First
of all, he did it's kind enough not to beat
me up after I trash Just White Mark seven, you know.
So he's a good dude. That's crazy, so okay, So
eventually you quit while your head. But we skipped Rufus
and Shaka. How did you get tell me something good? Uh?

(01:02:44):
That's Stevie song was let's go Let's get some more
drama now because I know you guys like drawing. Okay,
So I wrote the song for Barry White and Stevie.
None of him will cut it. So the next door
to me is this girl Shaka Khan and Andre Fisher
who I'm working with, and so me on Andre Fisher
and David Foster are doing sessions for thirty five bucks

(01:03:07):
for flat Top and Cookie At I continue to turn
the studio. That's it's the starting out seventy four. We're
doing budget, you know, we're trying to make some money.
The David Foster, Yeah, but he won then, No, he was.
He was. He's older than me, he's about four. But
I don't know if you know he wrote that song
don't Cry She's a Lady, Sweeten. That's how you got

(01:03:31):
my respect. David Foster wrote that. I was like, man,
we used to play that when I was a kid
in the band. Were talking about you wrote that, David Foster, Yeah,
he wrote, ye, don't crash, She's a lad. Everybody used
to be playing their band all the rest of stuff. Yeah,
And so it was one of those things where nobody
would cut the song. So me and Andre were go
in the studio and we lay it down. I played

(01:03:51):
the guitar in the rest of that. He says his
band of Ruth is gonna cut. I'm like, unknown whatever,
cutting myself unknown band. So we cut the songs. Sha
sings on and she's ain'ts really really, I'm like, who's
that saying this is? This is gonna be something. I'm thinking,
oh man, it's gonna be hot. And then she tells
me the story. She says, you don't even remember me. Huh,
I said, what are you talking about? Remember? She says, well,

(01:04:12):
you know when you're back last year when you were
playing with Stevie Wonder, Me and my sister I gave
you the tape to listen to. You gave me an
address to your house to MAILITUO in San Francisco and
she says, and you don't even live in San Francisco
and you were trying to bang me and you you know,
so then you discover women. And I was like, guilty,

(01:04:33):
y'll T, y'll t. But you know, I said, you
really sang it. But she was pregnant with the time
the making long story short, the record was gonna be
the first single called you Got to Love. I mean,
we were jammed and her sister boom, yeah yeah yeah,
so here comes shot con. She sang the heck out
the song. I'm liking the song, but no nobody knows
who know rufus Is. They're invisible band. Nobody ever heard

(01:04:53):
of it? Now, all right, just quit Stevies band. So
you know, Stevie's gotta teach me a lesson, I mean,
because he's upset. Now I'm gonna ask you this question,
how in the world does Stevie wonder who just won
eight Graham He's fine, if he's going to cut a song,
why does he cutting on the most unknown singer on
the planet because he found out that. I'm not saying that.

(01:05:13):
I'm just saying I'm just fine. I'm just telling you that,
out all the records on the planet Earth, somehow he
ended up with a single in front of mine. Y'all
must have had this conversation. You got the love first, yes,
and then where he got the Stevie. I'm just saying,
all the records in the world, he could have his
choice of doing anybody on the planet. Somehow he migrated

(01:05:36):
all the way to to mine, which was wonderful because
tell me something good, open up. The album made and
then my single came. I blew up and did y'all
ever had a conversation you are Stevie? Well, whenever we
have those conversations, just like the Queen of England. You know,
did you see the movie? Now? Okay, well I didn't
see it either. I mean it was an amicable parting.

(01:05:57):
I assume it wasn't so bitter to the fact that
you know, we love each other. But we've had some
interesting you're not gonna speak to each other for a
long time sessions. Then he apologized that we hugged Kiscar
and then you know, then I was nominated for Oscar
with him. He wouldn't speak to me again until until
he one kissed me and we were good again. You

(01:06:19):
know what we are nominated for with Oscar because he
was woman ye and woman in red. Yeah, I just
called so I wanted the British Oscar and m the
fifty seven Oscars opened up with me performing it when
they spent like a half a minute, but they didn't
ask him to perform, and I sat they sat me
and back at him. I mean I had my hands

(01:06:40):
on him near Prince was over here, had my hands
on Stevie here, and you know, I mean he wasn't
saying anything. Yeah. I had a funny suspicion that if
I had won that Oscar, I think that would have
been the end of the relationship. I think, well, I
think we'd be done, be done by this point. Do

(01:07:00):
you have like personal aspirations of your own VV artists
or you just know, like what do you want to be?
Do you want to be the the consummate, Sideman. Do
you just want to songwriting publishing? Is that where it is,
or do you want to be the start? Well, first
I wanted to be the guitar player. Then I figured
I might not make enough money doing that, and I
really like nice things, so I thought, well, and when

(01:07:23):
I work with Stevie, I liked the song writing and
all that kind of thing, said, why you write the song,
and that works us to write the songs. But it
really wasn't until I took that Shaka con record Home
and the very white White Goal album to my mom
and dad because they thought I was failing in California.
I should move back home. You know. I lost my
linko an condemn for this little small Mercedes that didn't

(01:07:43):
have electric seats and stuff, you know, then put it.
They came out to my house, which I thought was cool.
But the day my house was on top of a
hill swim who view of the city, and my dad
looked at it and said he couldn't afford the house
on the bottom. With everybody else, they stuck the way
up in the middle of nowhere. We had to go
down this winey road and his house wasn't even made
it out of bricks. He's had some stuck over, you know,
blood build house sleeper together. So they were really they

(01:08:07):
were depressed, and they were thought I wasn't doing so well.
You know. Then I brought the record home to my mom,
and it was really my mom that gave me the
rude awakening. You know. My mom said, uh, And I said, hey, Mom,
I had this big hit on Shotka Con I mean
on the Rufus. You know. She was, what's the Rufus?
I said, that's the name of the band. I guess
she thought it was my band. I don't know what
she thought. But so I gave my mom the record

(01:08:28):
and she took the record and she looked at it,
look at the front. She saw people, and she's, I
don't see you right now. You gotta understand, I'm going
home with an ego. I like making m Hollywood out
that the site beart song on very white song. You know.
She says, I don't see you, And then she took
the very white ricks. She looked at me, I don't
see you. I said, that's because mom, I wrote the song.
Now I'm still feeling high and mighty and justified. So

(01:08:50):
she pulled out the record and on Never you get ABC.
Dunhill at the time had a black label and they
write your name and silver. As I said, see, my
mom says right there, right package, you know me. And
she looked at it. Now. My mother's in her late
sixt year time, and she was like, boy, gonna get
my magnifying glass. So she gets her magnified glass and

(01:09:14):
she she holds it back and she's doing like that
and it says our period Parker. And I'll never forget
these words. This is where I got it. You know.
Sometimes simplicity, like you said, simplicity of a song, simplic
simplicity is better. She said to me, she says, is
that you are period Parker. I said, yeah, that's me.
She said the period took one space. Couldn't they just

(01:09:34):
give you another space? And uh, you know, so when
I left home with a lot smaller head than when
I got there, you know, I figured, I said, you know,
I'm not coming back until I get a record with
I gotta get my face on the record. That's just
that my mama does not understand what it is I'm doing.

(01:09:54):
I couldn't even explain to my mom what I did,
and my mom couldn't even see me. My name was
a small I didn't like the way it felt. By
this point, you were also on the silver screen correct
a little bit and Saturday night. I want to say, yeah,
that's too brief. Well, I mean it was still like
you know your mama, Yeah that's too brief, mama blink.

(01:10:15):
You know, did you explain to your mama that the
little name on the back of the album makes a
lot of time more money than the big face on
the cover. You know what. I could have explained it,
but money wasn't the issue here. The issue is my
mom was sitting there like she didn't know what I
was doing. She's sitting there like, you know, I'm coming
home to my I got it. I want I want

(01:10:37):
to like what you know. It's like I don't see nothing,
you know. So that that struck a quarter message. I'm
gonna cut. I gotta cut something. My mama could see
me on the cover, and that's just the way it's
got to be. You know, this is question love Supreme
Wren pen Door. If you're just joining us, we're almost
through our two of our conversation with our guest Ray
Parker Jr. We learned about his work with Stevie Wonder,
Barry White con and we're digging deeper. And to his

(01:11:00):
attempts after years of working in the music business to
prove to his parents that he was a success. I
guess my question is who did you fish for to
get a record deal? Nobody? Okay, well, okay, this is
where I want to know. I want you to describe
Clive Davis. Now, we got to lead into clients. Gotta

(01:11:21):
let me leave in the client days, and I'm gonna
try and make it as brief as possible. After that,
you got to love very White, all that kind of segment.
I got a singles deal with A and M Records
to do this girl a Nita Sherman, which she sang
one song and the secretary at the studio said a

(01:11:41):
few words to me. She burst out in tears. I
had four hours of studio time left, and I had
to sing the song myself because she was crying. Who
she blew my entire record deal. And when I went
to the A and M lot, at the corner of
my eye looked like in the next building over there
was Quincy Jones standing there and I was like us, John,
Oh my god, Quincy Johns stand over there. I mean

(01:12:02):
Quincy Jones. I know what to do with myself because
we played Killer Joe in the band when I was
a kid with handing and all this stuff. So I
gotta I gotta go meet Quincy. I gotta go say
something to Quincy Jones. So I just got this record
on A and M my egos. I had plenty of
ego at the time. Maybe it did much. So I
went over to Quincy Jones and I said, Hi, you
don't know me, but I'm the guy wh's gonna teach
you how to produce hit records. I'm the guy's gonna

(01:12:31):
teach you how to produce hit records. Well, to make
a long story short, a couple of months later, the
Brothers Johnson came out and he was number one on
the pop charts and IRP charts, and they just sent
me to Bernie Grimman's, which happened to be in the
back of the nm A lot to get the box
of records, the only ones in existence besides the radio
and the Swamp radio in Florida that played my record.
And as I was being escorted off the lot, the

(01:12:54):
one thing that that was good for when I said
that it's Quincy Jones saw me like this with my
records going off to a lot. Now, by the way,
by the time I got to Bernie Gramman's thing, and
they had already told me I was fired. Okay, so
I'm doing a really good job at this. I'm trying
to get to Bernie Grammans, get the records and get
to my car, and my Adam's apples all choked up.

(01:13:17):
I mean, I'm about to cry. I met I'm holding
all this, but my Adam's hurting right here has choked
up some you know, being a little kid. But so,
I mean, you know, so I'm just trying all I
want to do to get my records and make it.
And I was almost to the gate where they let
you in and out, and I was getting ready because
my cars parked out so I can't get on a
lot no more. So I was about to leave, and
then somebody said, hey, young man, I'm waiting on my

(01:13:40):
production lessons. Hey, all I can say is I look
like Lioness with the tile, and and he felt so
bad he immediately stopped. Whoever he may have been talking
to her about before, I know, but he left. Those
guys immediately came over to me put his arms around him.

(01:14:01):
He says, now, now side, I didn't mean that. Yeah,
he said, it ain't that bad. And he says, he says,
I don't know who you are. He was just joking
with me because he had a hit and he's keep
me getting kicked all later. But he know how to
take it that bad. He says, I don't know who
you are, but you know you're obviously doing something right
or else she wouldn't be on this lot, That's what

(01:14:22):
he said. And he says, what you need to do
now is just pick yourself back up and get back
in the game, and do it fast, he said, don't
take all day. He says, get back in it and
do it quickly, you know. And then I left that lot,
went to H. B. Barnham and Wawa at the studio
where they gave me another rag and on and made
me cry again. You know. So it's a bad day
for so at the time, was was her Balbert and

(01:14:43):
Jerry Marks? Were they in name only executives and those
days they were running it. So what do you think
it was like they just didn't see I didn't have
a hit. Yeah, I was get off the lot. You
don't have the head, get out here, get fired. Hey,
and the guy A and M told me, he said,
Mr Parker, and I only sing because the girl started crying.
She messed up my record. I'm like everybody else, I'm

(01:15:05):
blaming on somebody else me. But she didn't sing the song.
She started crying when other girl was hitting on me,
you know, And I was like, oh no, don't. She
didn't even sing anything. Come on, you know, in those days,
you only had X amount of hours for studio time.
They let you the studio for six hours. Six hours,
you're done. So I had to sing the song. The
guy looked at me. Kip Comba was his name. I
never forget his name. He says, Mr park you do

(01:15:25):
a lot of things, right, guitar. We like what you
right and said he said, but you gotta let this
singing thing go. This. You ain't gonna be no star. This,
ain't you. He says, that ain't gonna happen, you know.
He says that ain't gonna happen. And famous last words.
So now we're gonna get we're leading into the client
and all that stuff. So hold on, here we go.
Does LEO happened? No, that's between it that's what leads
me to climb. So so then I'm working with Richard

(01:15:47):
period all the time, doing um a bunch of sessions.
He's paying me triple scale. He's got a studio at
the Paramount Lot with Paramount Universal Lot, and so he
had my name on the concrete, says Ray Parker Juniors,
where whenever I all up, I put on Paramount Lot
park right there in the Ray Partet Jr. Space. We
were boys, man, We're cutting Barbara Streich saying, Carly Simon,

(01:16:07):
I mean everybody. Whatever he did, I was. I was
this guy. He had Dave, the juice man come every day.
They bring him cocaine and we and they bring me
watermelon juice, you know what I mean. Eventually watermelon juice
for rear. And so in those days, we didn't have
like tape recorders and stuff like you have now with
your iPhone. So I had a song that I've written

(01:16:28):
at home with the little click drum machine. I'm beating
on the thing on my Maestro rhythm ace and I
just wanted to see what it sounds like. So I
told the Green you played this, John Barnes, you play this,
And so we all played our parts. And then Richard
comes in to lunch break and says, man, that's jamming.
What is that? I said, when that's a song. I
wrote it home, you know. But we're just on lunch break.
He says, well, can't we cut that on Leo Sayer?
And I said, well, I don't know. Yeah, he says,

(01:16:51):
but but I mean I gotta get my party song.
So he promises me my part of the song. It's
not like it's a mystery issue. I didn't know that
I when't getting my part of the song to the
record came out, you know. So the record comes out,
it's jamming, and I don't see my name on anywhere.
I stand in Tier Records for two hours trying to
find my name on a forty five. You can imagine that.
I just knew it was gonna appear, and I'm there
for two hours. And the lady there was a security

(01:17:13):
guard that comes down to me who ended up being
burned at the meeting in the ladies room. Girl, you
know Bernie and Cooper was the security guard because the
move she was a security guard. She's about to rest me.
She said, you're gonna buy this record of what I'm
telling her. I'm about to start crying again. There's a

(01:17:33):
lot of crying for a big dude. So I'm about
to start crying again. She said, you buy this record? What?
And then she finds, are you Ray Parker? What are
you doing? She knew me from being a guitar player.
She says, well, you gotta listen to my music. And
I'm not listening to anything right now. I'm trying to
figure out what happened to my song, you know. And
so I had given him two songs and given him
that one and Jack and Jail, right, And so Carol Childs,

(01:17:56):
who was his head of his publishing company, felt so
bad because she kept saying with Rickards, that's a mistake.
Richard's gonna make it right. And Richard also told me
he's gonna do a whole album on you. I like,
you know, I like that. Give feed him, feed and
feed him, just postpone, postpone, promise him the world. He says,
you're gonna be Barbara Stretch and he's gonna cut a
whole album on you, and I'll be by Richard Pere
and you'll be on Warner Brothers. And that to be

(01:18:17):
the end of that, okay. We then the contract came.
It was like everything for him, nothing for me, you know,
And I was broken heart because I'm like, how could
you do this? I thought we've been working again on records.
I've been helping you, giving more ideas than maybe I should.
And he promised me a piece of the song. Wasn't
like he had to give me all the song, just
give me my share of the song. So he didn't
do that, and Carol felt so bad. Carol Chims is

(01:18:37):
her name at the time was Carol Pinkins. She felt
so bad about it that she took the song to
Roger Burnbaum, who when I was at a and m
used to go get the hot dogs. Right now he
owns the whole planet, you know what I mean. But
at the time, Roger Burnbaum was the guy who gott
got pizzas and stuff for us when we had to
meet and Rudi, yeah, but I always drive him nice.
Now he's the vice president of Arista, so he played

(01:19:00):
off a clide. Clyde falls in love with Jack and you,
Clive calls up, I don't want to talk to you
any more. White people in the suiting time just don't
you know what I mean? So I won't even meet
with Clide. So this goes on for a month or so.
Then Clive is very clever guy. He calls back and
he says, um, you're a respectable guy in the music business.
I'm a respectable guy in the music business. Let's say
we don't talk about any of the stuff and we

(01:19:21):
just have lunch. He says, that makes sense. He says,
how could you refuse just having lunch. I was like, Okay,
he's gonna come correct. Okay, we just go go have lunch.
So Carol comes with me. We go to lunch and
one thing leads to another. Classes so what are you
planning on doing with all the sudden? Before he get
finished talk, Carrol says, rased, and make a record dot.
Then they go they started negotiate. I thought like, yeah,

(01:19:43):
like this has been prepped and I ain't. I'm part
of it. I'm out the loop again once again. And
so that's how we started talking about that stuff. And
you know, he said, I'll get you the best. Yeah.
We were talking about what to do, and to me,
I said, I don't want to have an album like
David T. Marker where they just kind of played on
the jazz stations on that US I wanna be on
Kiss FM, Top forty Radio Dot and so he told

(01:20:05):
me what had to happen if I want to be
on top for the race. He said, well, if you
make if you don't make a record like all the
with all them notes and chords and Dot, if you
cut it like Jack and Jail, I get the three chords, boom,
we got it. So we made a deal. I told
him I'll never write a song I have them on
three chords. Okay, it's gonna be intro verse court, it's
gonna be very predictable, intro verse course verse chorse bridge,
and you know. I said, I'm gonna do that. It'll

(01:20:26):
be three minutes and forty five seconds long, and it
would be some chords, and we have some great lyrics
and story and at the end that we see the
melody being will cover up the melody with a bunch
of playing and that. And he was like, okay, I said,
but can you get I want to be on Kiss FM,
and Dot Dot told so. We we had that conversation,
and then we had an interesting conversation. He said to me,
I'll get you the best producers, I'll get you the

(01:20:48):
best studio record playing. I get you the best ring,
I get you the best of everything, and I just
told him, you know, I really don't want none of that.
What I like to do is just go home and
cut it at home, because by this time I put
a little sixteen track and board and all that stuff,
and me and Reggie doserm Doser brother, we wired the
whole thing ourself. Took us two months. I mean when
I say wired, I don't mean plugged in, and I'm

(01:21:08):
talking about all the solder and Joyce wired everything, did
the whole night. But then I had to give him
my TV set to keep going. At one point I
wish I had a video pretty much like a crack deal,
you know. And for those who think I wasn't dedicated,
I recorded my brother's band at ABC in in early
seventy four, wiped out twenty seven thousand dollars, which is

(01:21:32):
a lot of money in nineteen seventy five centuries. And
then I had spent eighty seven thousand dollars on studio
equipment and putting the studio in the house, at which
everybody then was a hundred percent year. I had lost
my mind at the same time I lost the song
Little Here and getting kicked out of and just a
whole bunch of things going wrong. So at that point
everywhere I went there and say, there he is. That's

(01:21:54):
the idiot right there, spent all his money, you know,
plays the hell of a guitar, but he's listening all
his money doing other stuff, you know. And just to Cliff,
what was the song with sa you make me feel
like You made me feel like yeah. Yeah. So things
are going like really south in a fast sense. So
we wired the studio and I just told Climb, I'd
like to cut it home if you don't mind, right,

(01:22:17):
and his words to me, he thought about it and
he said, okay, he says, but if you screw it up,
you know, we'll listen to it. You screw it up,
then let's do it the other way. I thought that
was fair, that was fair, right, So give me a
good shot at and I thought I could deliver the
next thing that happened. I had done Boss gags and
a bunch of other stuff with Bill Shane, who was
the really prominent engineer. Yeah. I think he did the
Asia album for Steely Dan need one Grammys, and at

(01:22:40):
the time he was probably the most prominent engineer in
the business. All of a sudden, Bill Shane, who I've
been working with years, he shows up at my house.
Right now, I know this is the work of Cavala
Roughalo and Carol Charles and everybody else. They're like Bill
management to yeah, when I got everything Ante everything they

(01:23:03):
were with Earth want to fire and Okay. So so
they come over to my house to listen to the music,
and so they had no cheer from the city, and
so they're stand up and they're thinking, what kind of
places this? I got cables on the roof, the stuff,
the drums in the bedroom, and Mike's hanging fronts of things.
You know, we didn't have enough money from Mike stands,
you know. So things are looking pretty raw and rough,

(01:23:23):
and so they send Bill Schnay over my house to
talk me out of it, basically, and Bill listens to
the song where I cut it, and he goes back.
He says, well, besides eight of the tractor out of phase,
and it don't sound that bad, he says, not what
I would do, he said, but if it's a here,
it's a hit. You know. I'm mentioning this because the
turning point at that stage is when before then everything

(01:23:45):
I did was stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, right except
right something good songs to play the guitar. Once Bill
Schnay said that that record was gonna be okay. Nobody
ever questioned about any of my studio stuff again ever
in life. That was the end of it. I had
the big boy come over and he's put he had
put his hand on me. That was it. Right. Next

(01:24:06):
thing I know, uh after that, Prince was coming over,
right because he came over and he he was like
what is he came to? And they were trying to
sign Prince and he wasn't signing. He says, what y'all
can do for me is taking me over race house
because I hear he's got a studio. That's all he
wanted to do, right, So they called me up. They said, man,

(01:24:26):
Prince wants to come over your house. We're talking to
him about that. He said, but he he just wants
to see the studio in the house. He ain't saying
nothing else but that, right, And they said, well, you
know he's gonna come over and he ain't gonna talk much.
You know, he's gonna say much. It wasn't like that
or he when I got done, and I said, he
didn't want to talk to you guys. We weren't hang right.
I was taking for a ride in the Rose Royce

(01:24:46):
and we were cruising sun at Boulevard and you know,
and he just wanted to get the studio equipment a side,
so we we he didn't have quite as much money,
so we didn't get him a JAG twenty four like
I had the mcian staff. So we got him a
Soundcraft board. Then I got my got Soundcraft and I
got Steve flew back to Minneapolis and we put it
in there. And I remember he had a BMW six

(01:25:06):
thirty six, and so we I got a stereo system
done in the car like my stereo system was done
in the car. And we were hanging out, you know.
And so Warner Brothers wanted me to produce the next album.
I think it was Sexy danswer on all this time.
So he comes back to my house the next trip
to l A and he plays me what he got.
You know, we're supposed to be working on it. And
you know, I mean, I probably talked to myself out

(01:25:27):
of a lot of money, but I just told the truth.
I was young. I heard that am myself I don't
know see what to do with this. This sounds great
like it is, you know. So I told one of
brother y'all should leave him along. This sounds great just
like it is. And so they put it out like
it was, and the rest is history is a hit. Yeah.
In fact, I'm finishing the studio now. And what's so
sad about it is is every studio I've ever built,

(01:25:49):
Prince was one of the first guys there. He is
not coming to this one. Unfortunately. I was playing it on,
you know. When I started working on this one was
like years so going like, oh yeah, we get my
boy over here. Blessed, you know, we go back to
the right the way, the old days, the way we
used to do it, you know, and this will be
the first one he ain't making it too. That was
important to me because here's another guy that was that

(01:26:09):
had one hit record at the time. But at least
what it made me think is I wasn't a complete idiot,
because remember, everybody's making me feel like an idiot. So
now here comes Prits coming over and the only thing
he cares about is what's he doing over there? I
want to do that. Then, Larry Graham came over and
he got the same stuff I got and cut one
of them, one in a million, on the same same system,
same way, and it's like in his home. Yeah, he

(01:26:32):
put the same he said he did. Larry told me
he did exactly what I put in the bedrooms. Boom,
cut it and that was it. But what's the sound?
That radical back then? Too? So what was what was
wrong in the studio is unlike it is today. You
guys have the amplifiers. Everybody brings in their own gear
bring there. Each studio there had its own sounds sort

(01:26:53):
of and each the engineers all stayed with sort of
one studio, and so you would be with their sound.
And it's not that the sound was bad, but if
you wanted to do something different or you have something
different in your head, if you're paying two hundred an,
you can't think about it. You know, you gotta move experimentation. Yeah,
So what Prince want to do it just play with
the guitar sound. Let me play with a different sound.

(01:27:15):
Let me play with a different drum sound from me.
Let me see what that would do. And so when
you had the equipment at your house, they would allow
you to do that sucking out the system, and it
was just the beginning of it. So everybody kept saying,
you can't do it. The walls don't work, this don't work,
and it just wasn't true. Everybody said they equipment with brick,
you need tech person, and I never had a tech person.
Nothing broke, and so it was you know, it turned

(01:27:35):
into a different scene. You know, if you read Clive's book,
was nice about his book. First thing he says that, yeah,
we did this a year before Prince and a year
before anybody did. We we had experiment with that and
did it, you know, and it made me feel better
about myself. Just to see some other people that I
respected thought that I wasn't crazy because I have been
hearing you're crazy, you're crazy for so long. To hear

(01:27:56):
two other guys say you think it's that crazy, that's
all that good idea and then they go do it
and have success with it too, was really rejuvenating. Well,
I would figure, especially this is the era in which Stevie,
who's constantly reinvented himself and doing the one man thing
by himself, I would figure that all the labels would
have been salivating for like, you know, we want armor

(01:28:19):
you know, yeah, you would think so, but they didn't.
They just want somebody and and they didn't understand. They
just want somebody in their box. And you know, sent
him to the record plan. You know. Their thing was,
get this engineer, get this arrange. Sent him to the plan.
Let's see what happened. Get this producer, get you you know,
someone sort of producing. Let's go. You know, I gotta

(01:28:39):
I gotta tell a funny story about this. I don't.
I don't even think Ray knew this. When Ray sitting
with us after tonight show and we're going over this
right now. This is about like four months after like
my dad's passing. It was weird. I knew one of
these days someone's gonna trigger the floodgate of tears. But

(01:29:01):
I think it's gonna be the sound of rape Park.
You said that sometime. He said, he just broke me.
My whole goal was just like you wanted to escape
and in records without like people you break it down
and cry. I was like, all right, I gotta get
out this movie, and I gotta make it to my office.

(01:29:24):
You know, none of the roots here, so they don't
clown me. I try to get glass. I didn't know,
glasses nothing, and I'm like bawling like a muff. So
I think I just ran out of the room, like
I was dabbing like a Right. It was this song
Jack and Jail particularly, that's yeah, it's like like just

(01:29:44):
hit him, just hit him. It just it just well
because that was the first song I sang. I sang
in the second grade pageant, like at performing arts you
had to display some sort of talent or whatever, and
so I remember I sang Jack and Jill the second
and I see my parents, right, and so it was

(01:30:07):
just a memory. But I mean there's nothing like the
song like make me Sad grief though expected like that
it did put you in that place. Yeah yeah, but
it was just such an unexpected thing. And like I
was like, man, I cannot see the roots and Steve
and Ray Parker g see me crime. But don't you
think it's interesting? Because I was thinking about about your music,

(01:30:30):
and I feel like Ray Parker Jr's music, especially for
seventy late seventies eighties babies, it gives them the members
of an era, like it's kind of like a joyful
time when you were no worries and you was my
mama's first crush. That was when my aunt had money.
My aunt like she loves you. I mean she was
how I first got introduced to your music. And she
would always buy, you know, the records and stuff, and

(01:30:52):
like she had all the radio albums and everything, and um,
it was interesting to me hearing you talk about your
journey to becoming a singer. How you know that was
something that I guess maybe you were a little reluctant
to do, but I always thought you were like the
coolest motherfucker ever. Right, here's a trick I was. I
was a musician first, and I knew what it was

(01:31:13):
supposed to sound like. So when I first started singing,
it was out of tune. I mean, I didn't need
nobody to tell me. I hear myself. So I surrounded
myself with people who could sing, and then I started
working on it. It's just like lifting weights. If you
do it long enough, you get your voice and you
get to go. But it wasn't until I think the
third album, when I did A Woman's Love is the
first real commercial record I sang all the way through

(01:31:35):
by myself, you know, like Jack and Jail is me,
but it's also Jerry and it's also RNL and Jerry
sitting on the high notes by the way Woman the
Love album that's the one with you in the white
pants and the peachback the crack that was. That was

(01:31:56):
like I just can't get That's like, we gotta We're
still in recreation cocaine period, right, Why are we always
associated with just saying no, no, I know that I
didn't do it, but but you're absolutely got to think
of the worst tragedy the black people, just like this

(01:32:18):
recreational drug period. But yeah, that was the thing like
my aunt would always tell your records and the thing
that later on, I mean, I'm listening to this stuff
as a kid, but listen to it later on. The
thing that I always thought was James about what you
did is that your presentation was very like smooth and
like very sophisticated. But the lyrics like you'd be saying
about something that story yeah, like you like damn, like

(01:32:39):
the I don't want to know about yours, you don't
know about mine, don't make sense to look too hard,
but what your heart look? He made affairs sound like, yeah,
a woman needs loves made sense. It's like she yeah, yeah,
your woman should get you you'll get your heart broke
out the homie, Yeah, don't get calls. So how did

(01:33:02):
you how did you organize radio? I mean, at what
point did you bring our uh was our now Carmichael
and now he was in my brother's band, Arndell and Vincent.
What was your brothers band's name? Uh? Energy? Perry Como
had had a really good quote and they said, like,
what's the secret to your success? And he says, well,
I never reach I mean I don't try too hard.

(01:33:23):
But again it's it's that where it's where did our
love go? Theory? You you had it, especially with with
with Jerry Knight, someone that can sang s A n G.
You know, to provide that. But what gave you the
wisdom especially on your first album? Because I'll be honest
with you, I didn't learn this lesson until twenty years

(01:33:44):
into my career, Like I've yet. Now that I have
a wisdom, I'm gonna try and apply it to the
next week album. But it took seventeen records from me
figure out like, no, all this complex stuff you're doing,
like you gotta do something simple, But there's art too simplicity,
like I of like people would tend to look down
on it, But what gave you the wisdom to keep

(01:34:04):
it at a digestible level that wasn't so complex that
it wasn't alienating. I mean, but it was still appealing.
But yet here's what took me down the path. Let's say,
and I think it was a small tunnel. And this
is why I asked, because I know that he has
a very narrow tunnel. This is a hit. This is

(01:34:25):
not a hit exactly. He just you stayed with him
for the longest, so obviously you had Well, it's it's
a narrow tunnel. Especially when you think about music, you
have to think about what is your gift to music?
What are you talented at doing? What can you do?
What can you not do? I can't dance like Michael Jackson,
still can't. You can put me on Dancing with the Stars.

(01:34:46):
I'm good for the first week, but you know I
can't do the sping. I can't. I just can't do it.
I don't have my bones, don't beat with the drums
like they're gonna happen. Ain't gonna go. So I figured
out a long time ago. I don't think I'm ever
gonna sing like Luther van Dress. I'm not gonna sing
it like glad Its Night. I'm not gonna So therefore
take that away from the man. I ain't gonna get
like Mark. You take that out the puzzle. Uh. The

(01:35:08):
people who play way too many notes and way too
much jazz at which I could have done, they never
got on top for the radio. So take that out
the mix. Right, you can't do that. Now you got
the musical genius guys and Stevie Wonders, all that kind
of stuff. They can figure out complex chords, Maurice Wider
from finding somehow get back to another chord eighty chords later.
It still works on the radio. Steely Dan, I don't

(01:35:28):
know what they're doing. I don't understand that. Take that
out to mix. So now you left with my hero.
Uh that I try to patter myself off of on
the first record, Casey and Sunshine Man this. But you
are right. I don't want you all to go to sleep.
I'm trying to keep you awake. I heard Casey singing

(01:35:49):
get down Tonight, right. It was a number one record.
It was jamming the people up dancing, and I said,
he's singing two notes, do a little dance. Meg a
little love, get down tonight, even the verse honey, honey,
me and you and every now and then woo woo
woo woo. That was the big one. But everything else,

(01:36:13):
you know, and I thought about I said, well, you
know what he Ain's singing all the news notes like
everybody else, he's got it here. I could do that right.
I may not be able to do that glad it's night,
but I can do that. And so I said, you know,
there's gotta be a way. You just gotta channel it
right to get those simple chords and to get it
to move in such a way that it's comfortable for you,

(01:36:33):
which I think Mick Jagger and a whole bunch of
other people have really done, really really well. They figured
out their style, their sound, and just play those chords
at work for you and the things you learned one
I never I wouldn't have put that one together. Two notes,
but you you're making absolute sense. My career is not

(01:36:56):
ship man. I got life through it, that's right. And
the lyric thing for me, which we were talking about,
I'll never forget if a couple of companies I went
to early on they kept saying, your lyrics suck. I
got tired of hearing your lyrics suck. So I started
a period when I was like eighteen nineteen years and
they kept saying your lyrics suck, Your lyrics suck, you know,

(01:37:17):
And I said, you know what, I'm I already got
the music thing. I'm gonna work on this lyric thing listening.
So I started listening to like me and Mrs Jones
from a whole new standpoint. When I heard he was
a kid, I heard the orchid bump buh bum. But
but but I said, that sounds like Laurence. Well, what
are they doing in Philadelphia? You know? Then I never
heard we meet at the same cafe every day. I mean,

(01:37:40):
when I was just too young to get it, you know.
Then I started listening to songs like I saw a
hell of the story. Now what they like that? You know,
I really listened to Let's Get It On. I was
listening to a different way that was going, and it
seemed like all the songs had deeper meaning to me,
especially the Holland oor Jo Holland songs okay, which they
always had nursery rhymes and they tongue in cheek it.
If you could beat me rocking, you can have my

(01:38:01):
chair fee five for fun. I can smell the present
of somebody, you know, somebody else's been sleeping and exposed.
What was their secret to did they tell you our
formula is well, they ain't handled for him. And first
of all Lamant and Brian and they get in the week.
They said they just go, you know, sitting in the
house for two or three hours and write four or
five hits and be done with it. You know. That's

(01:38:23):
what I said. That's what I said. I said. There
ain't a lot of encouragement laid Brian think that they
sitting down. Brian had the classical stuff, so that's him
putting on them classical chords. Lamont will come up with
ridiculous lyrics. And Eddie did a little bit of everything,
you know, so he had stuff. But they do really
just sitting down and say when you know, Barry call
us up there, we need one on the four times
when they don't want dining ross. You know, we know
it's a big meeting with smoking everybody, and so were

(01:38:44):
just right for five up, you know, knocked that up.
We can then we go back to the rest of
what we're doing. He said. The records were coming in
so fast. They were just giving them out to their friends,
you know, said Gold Records. They would come every weekend
just get rid of them, face at the house. So
there's and again that's a different group. Now Prince was
in that group. You know, we have men and him
would have a lot of debt space on the phone

(01:39:05):
because I call him up and I'm cutting a Woman's
Love and I know I gotta smash. I'm working on
this album. I'm poloshy and I'm getting it right. And
then he'd be talking about, you know, I cut twelve song.
He's talking about he cut eighty songs. So he's sitting
on the phone and I'm like thinking myself, hell you
do that phone, Why don't you just cut ten good ones?
You know, when controversy was out, he sent me all
the nineteen ninety nine and all the Purple Rain and

(01:39:27):
all of the time, all of the girls I got
all this music. I'm like, what the heck is this right?
He says? He says, he says with a nineteen ninety
nine album is a double pack album. I said, why
are you that double pack up? Nobody's buying that from
the black folks at the type He says, an almost
seller at this regular price. He says, I just did
Warner Brothers taking them too long to put the records out.

(01:39:49):
I don't want the stuff to get old, so I
gotta just put them in the record. Yeah, yeah, I
got the second record. So he's trying to work and
he said, this is the movie. So he's trying to
do the movie when controversy just came out and ain't
nobody even heard nine. And I'm like, I like that
little red Corvette song, But but what's this you know
down here? Do do Do Do? Do? Do Do Do Do?
I'm like, what the heck is that? You know? So

(01:40:10):
he would just write that many songs, you know. Then
it became apparent to me later, you know, I think
I was Solidarity and he was Mozart or something. You know,
you get that. I watched the movie. I was like,
feels familiar, and you know one you know, there was
one time, like Holland John the same thing. There's one

(01:40:31):
time he went to Rio and he wanted the piano
at the top floor, so they took a helicopter, flew
the piano and knocked the windows out up. So he's
supposed to be there a week doing whatever. He stays
a week and then knocked they tear. It's the knock
it out, take the piano. He comes back and say,
I wrote a couple of albums. You know how about this?

(01:40:54):
It sounds crazy, But if that motivated you to write
a couple of albums, I wish I could. I knocked
the windows out if you can get me two smash albums.
You know. Even a good friend of mine who just died,
Rob Temperton, always said he don't write nothing unless he's
at his apartment on the freeway and worms Germany. This
is Love Supremor and Panduran. If you're just tuning in,
we're into hour three with our special guest Ray Parker Jr.

(01:41:15):
And we're talking about the process for finding the right
lyrics for a hit song. So where's your sweet spot? Like?
Where did these hits come from? Where do you have
to be? I started with the lyrics. I like a
good story. You could be telling me about you and
your old lady, and you can let something slip out
and I go, So your source of information from your friends.
I don't like to be singing about myself. That ain't good.

(01:41:36):
It's like it's like taking your underwear down. You know.
I like to expose, you know, especially if you put
two or three relationships together, you can see a path.
Then I take that. Oh yeah, we're going with this
because like a woman's love. I don't even know how
much of that I wrote. I mean, I have five
girls in the studio, and while I went out to
start how about this, I came back. I'm sitting at

(01:41:58):
the board and they're just gossip and yeah, honey, he
got thinks coming. If you can think that, that's the
way things used to be, you know, And you can
hear him talking about, you know, back in the day,
back in the day, you know, got I used to
tell people, don't tell anybody, don't tell nobody. Now I
don't care if you're telling not. If he could do it,
I get me something too. How you know he's getting
I'm getting it. I was like, look at this. And

(01:42:19):
then Gloria Alread was on the news at the time,
all this stuff studio, but the girls were writing the song.
They were talking about times have changed, things ain't the same.
I'm like, oh, no longer, will we'll be taking this.
I like that. Yeah, And one girl's like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
he could do that if you want to come and

(01:42:39):
leave me to stay, come home, but get his feelings here.
I said, oh, I like that. One day you come,
I just stop matching the thing together. No longer will
the women are today be accepted that all the side.
I said, this is it, said, it's the song. This
is it, you know, And I tell you the biggest
thing in the song. And this is why women are
so sensitive to the lyrics. I said, she will fool

(01:43:03):
around just like you do. Was not a hit. Didn't work.
She will fool around meant that she was she will
fool around. That's wrong. She can fool around. She has
the option to. She has the option to. Let me
tell you, when I changed this, she will that she can.
All the girls smiling in the studio. You gave us
the option. If I had said she will on the radio,

(01:43:24):
I don't even know if that would have worked. But
when I went to she can, it was a crowd pleaser, right,
All the girls like, what do you mean she will
fool around? I was like, well, I you know, I'm
trying to sit there. She can't. Can't that wull work
all the girls so that she can? And I was like, really,
just over in one word I used to go to,

(01:43:45):
she can mean you did it. He puts it back
on you. You did it. If she will, she's already
doing it. And you know what, I at that point
in my life, all my songs were so beautiful and romantic,
and the girls and everybody loved me. You know, I
wanted to be the bad boy a little bit. I
just you know, I wanted to show just a little

(01:44:06):
other side. I mean, it's like, you know, yeah, I
got it. Did you feel a little pressure that, like, okay,
it's two times are changing, Like I better come out
with some I mean, because you didn't even really feature
your your your guitar mastery, let alone your rockets, her
mastery all that much on these records, you know. But

(01:44:29):
that song, yeah, it was because I want to make
sure I wasn't a guitar record first, you mean, but
but I started saying I can play a little more guitar.
But I heard, um, I tell you what inspired that
song was. Rick Springfield had a tune called Jesse Girl,
Right Jess. I wish I had a girl like Jesse's girl,
you know, And I thought that what a punk attitude
that is, you know, I wish I had go take

(01:44:49):
the bitch. I just I ain't know, ain't the attitude
I wish And he's sitting back dreaming about wishing what
he had with his head come yet. But you kind
of had the attitude as well. On Jamie, well you

(01:45:10):
you she always minds. But he also said, like, you know,
keep it to yourself, like, like, what do you have
to bust somebody? I saw your lady the other day,
but you know the other woman. I'm just the average guy,
fool around a little on the side. Never thought it
would amount too much. I never met a girl who's

(01:45:32):
so tough now, who would have thought of one nice
stand could turn into such a hot romance. But when
she did it to me, I slept and fell in love.
I mean it was just a true statement, you know,
that's really And then you the reason I knew the
rules of the game. You hit it once, breakaway clean.
I should have never gone back, I know, but I

(01:45:55):
had to have just a little bit. My my friends.
My friends laugh, and that's all right. I may be
a food, but I know what I like. I hate
to have to cheat, but it feels better when that sneak. Okay,

(01:46:16):
Then the dender line Clide Davis. Oh, this affair is unique.
All my life, I never met such a freak. And
she keeps me going strong for so long that by
the time I get home, it's all gone. It makes
me want to grab my guitar and play with Okay,
So when you're taking us to client, he heard that,

(01:46:38):
it just went, Oh that's it. I love that he
heard that. He said, oh, that's it. He says, by
the time we got to makes me want to grab
my guts. He just play that again and want to
play with it all night long. He says, Oh, that's smashed.
But do you know what a unique position that is
because the legend of Clive Davison being so hard to
please as far as I know, and knowing instantly when

(01:46:58):
there's a hit like that's some rare air, rare shipped
too make him that enthused about anything. That he loved
Jack and Jill. It was his most enthusism, he said, smash.
He loved a woman. He's love love the other woman.
He was not so into. Can't change that. M hm.
That was what he didn't like. He he didn't liked it.

(01:47:18):
He wasn't into that. In fact, that they were canning
the whole album. He said, okay, pick one, we put
it out. If it's a hit, we put that alm out.
If not, go back and record that was. That was
that kind of year. So that that's what got that
album released. But what was interesting and and and it's
me bragging on Clive, is that he really did do
the right thing. He said, okay, you you picked one,
you think that's it, let's put it out. And he

(01:47:40):
didn't like, let's teach him and not put no money
behind all. He actually went and promoted and gave it
it's all and the song blew up and he said, okay,
was hit. That's that. Put the Albu out another one.
He didn't really like that much of the Ghostbusters. He said,
you could take that to Geff and when you go,
you know the shade. So you're saying like the rock

(01:48:01):
Gorn album at all? No, me didn't like that. He
wanted to start over. Really, yeah, what didn't you like
about it? Like? Nothing about it? He didn't hear no
hit like anything about and you know, there was everybody
was because Jack and Jewel was a novelty song. They
thought it was you know and uh, which I thought
was Here's what I thought was funny. Lamane doj And
and McKinley Jackson were teasing me about writing the nursery, right,

(01:48:24):
I said, but I learned it from you guys. You know,
y'all the guys taught me. How did they wanted? Young
man singing? Free? Mean? Y'all taught me this stuff. So
I was writing imitating them. You know, so can I
when did you dissolve radio? Like? And what was the
radios for me? Were you guys like, okay, are we
really a band? Or is it just like let's let's

(01:48:45):
talk about that because that's fun. First of all, I
love all the guys in radio and we're best of
friends today, the ones that are left. And when I
first put the band together, I was a young kid
and I just want to split everything now. Even though
it was my record deal, they were signing me. I
had the studio, I paid all the money. I wrote
a song, it didn't matter me. I was like, just
let's let's get five guy, let's split everything. That was

(01:49:05):
my thing. Good thing. God made sure that didn't happen.
The band led by Jerry. The funny thing about Jerry Knight,
he's the biggest troublemaker, but he was my best buddy,
and he would apologize for it later. He didn't hold back.
He would say, MA, don't know why I did something
that stupid. You know, he broke up with Jerry and Alive.
But so the whole thing was Jerry was the first
guy to put the pool to band again and say, look,

(01:49:26):
we don't want to be signed to that white label.
Arista has the Bay City Rollers and Barry Man. We
don't want to be saying why don't you sign? We
just want to get paid a salary. So that took
me off of to split the money thing. That was
his words, that was their words. They all collectively got together.
But what was another option for them? The option for

(01:49:49):
them was to sign the record they only take one
fifth and one piece of the band. They didn't want
to do that. They didn't want no piece of the band.
They want cash and I'm sure the big picture, the
final it was spearhead by Jared. I tried to talk
him out of it. They weren't hearing it. They all
wanted money, and they wanted money I didn't have. I
think they wanted five hundred dollars a week on tour

(01:50:09):
or something like that, and me by an instrument. So
I went and borrowed like two hundred grand from tour
support from Arisa to pay das. Yeah, as Ahead of
Time record has just came out, I had no money.
And what was interesting is when the record hit, the
single went go album and go Jack and jail album
with Gold in London. Now we're playing Hammersmith Oty in

(01:50:29):
London and I go out with the head of the
British company right, and then we go out to some
club and he's saying, yeah, man, things are gonna grasp that. Man,
life couldn't be better since it's like a dream come true.
He says, well, I don't know how to tell you this,
but your band wants a separate deal without you because
they had met some British producer I forgot who he was,
inspiring them to leave. Some of your guys. He's some

(01:50:51):
of your guys are leaving and I'm like, I'm looking,
this is the what's the president the President of England,
not client, but the President of England. British up and
he's speaking a British accent. I'm like, he thinks something something.
He thinks black people all look the same. He thinks something.
Somebody else what was he talking about? Right? And then
he names the names. Man, I was about to crash
so hard again. I had to get up and go
to bathroom. I had to get him go to the bathroom.

(01:51:15):
I'm choking. I had to go recompose myself and come
back tell me what you just said. Again. I couldn't
wait to get back to the hotel. So then we
have our blowout meeting at the hotel and I'm sitting
with the guys. I'm saying what I said, what is
this that you want to deal by yourself? What is
the what are you doing? Then it all came out, Well,
you're getting all the royalties and we get nothing. I said,
you're getting the money you asked for that I borrowed,

(01:51:36):
and I'm still paying off on the last tour all
the money that you took. And you took the keyboard,
threw it off the stage. I was three grand of
my money, you know, and I bought all the instruments
off the stage. Throw it off the stage. Who they
must have saw the movie or something, you know, So
it was interesting. And then you know, Jerry looked at him, said, no,
he's made five million on net on the tour. Five

(01:51:59):
million on the first two day. Were eating popcorn when
we were playing, you know. But he said he thought
I made five million net on the tour and another
five men on the album. I was like, really, because
I'm in the whole surface above and it wasn't. So
immediately three guys in the band quit right after the
first hour. I think it was Charles, Jerry and one Vincent.

(01:52:20):
Vincent wasn't even studio guy said please don't leave Vincent.
You don't. They can't use the student. You're not gonna
do anything. Don't worry. We're going with Jerry. Jerry is
gonna sign it too a deal. Well, Jerry got a deal,
didn't sign a none of the guys so they're not
on the Overnight Sensation, none of the none of the
they're not on none of that stuff and having none
of that, and so Jerry Jerry got in with Don Kirshenbaum. Yeah,

(01:52:44):
the producer was a brainstorm, was he I'm messing him,
I'm messing up the name. But that's the Don, not
Kirching Kirshenbaum. Yeah, David Kirshenbaum, I'm sorry. And he had
cut a rock and roll record, so you know then,
but Jerry came out here and ma, I'm sorry to this.
So I looked at Jared said, you know, Jerry, this
is nineteen seventy nine. Whatever. I said, you heard a crossover,
you know, R and B radio first for your top

(01:53:05):
for the radio, said say'll play none of this stuff? Okay?
So I talked him in the cutting Overnight Sensation because
he didn't have that on the album. I always thought
that was a radio record. Of course, it sounds like
a radio record. It was the funk. How about this,
even though he broke up the band, I'm still trying
to save us. But look the record you played me.
Ain't nobody playing that? It was all rock and roll.
I said, you need to cut. Why don't you cut

(01:53:25):
one and stick it on the back and see what
you know? And then one record was Overnight Sensation. That
saved him. Then we started Ray Parker Junior Radio. And
then when I think another guy left and Clive just said,
that's enough, all this personnel change. We're going to Ray
Parker Junior. That's it. So he switched it like that.
But in the meantime, after Jerry messed up his album,
then he got out and he didn't hire none of

(01:53:45):
the guys in the band. So they were left in
the cold man, so they didn't have my gig, and
they the leader. It was terrible. They never recovered, you know.
So the leader left them in the cold. And the
next thing was was hooking g Area up with Ali,
you know. So I got those two together and he
looked out for him again with and so him and

(01:54:06):
Ali they cut a big smash record with you know,
there's no stuff, and then Jerry would go on stage
without Ali, but Ali being in a dressing room with
Jerry's already out there performing and he would just do
crazy stuff, you know, he was. He'd come up front,
he was clean with he said, Man, I did you
know even before he died, I'm the one that got
him at the hospital a few days before he died
cancer hen and we spent most of that year together.

(01:54:27):
He probably knew he was sick, and I didn't know
he was sick, you know. And he told me some
things that I never never dreamed of because in my
mind I was always trying to help everybody because there's
plenty of money for everybody, y'all go do it. But
he always wanted me to sign him and take his
publish and he always wanted me to to do it
nice and men, I can't do that. I'll show you
how to do it. You can take the money like

(01:54:48):
he did a bunch of songs with the Jets. I
was gonna say he broke Curiosity those Jets Jet. He
wrote Curiosity and and and a two or three other
big hits for the Jets. You rush on your jab
And when he played me those songs, they sound like
Jerry Knight records, right. And then all of a sudden
he was fifty fifty writer with Aaron Jackman said, who's

(01:55:09):
Arry zick Man? The song sound the same as it
did last week that you played for me. Well, he
got the deal. He can get in places. What are
you talking about? What you're talking about? It's the same song. Yeah,
And so he ended up splitting in and giving him
all the production and what stuff. And in the end
it was an interesting conversation. Jerry looked at me, he says,

(01:55:30):
he says, you know what, I'm a genius number two guy.
And he was. Even after he left the band, we
would always talk. He'd coached me on lyrics on the
Other Woman, and he said, no, you can write a
better verse and you can. He was just a guy.
He says, I'm a genius. Number two guy, he says,
but you're the number one guy. You should have signed
my publishing. I would have been better off. And in hindsight,
you know what he's righting. I didn't see it. Maybe

(01:55:53):
he saw it. My thing was where everybody can do this,
let me just show you how to do it. But
everybody can't do everything. You know, everybody. It would have
been better off because I would have paid him a time,
represented songs. He would have been cool. But he said,
he says, I'm a number two guy. He says, he said,
leaving by myself. He says, I'll destruct everything destructive. He says,

(01:56:14):
I am. I can just see was conscious of it. People,
he said, that's what it is. He is a change,
That's it, he said. But if you had led it
and you had taken it, we would have got through this.
You know, for those just join us. We're still talking
to the Great Ray Parker Jr. Uh going down, uh,

(01:56:37):
not even going down, getting life lessons, this question of
supreme getting life lessons, and we haven't even got the ghosts.
Let's just listen. Let's let's jump in the pools. Let
us jump in the pool? Are you allowed to tell
the Ghostbusters story? What Ghostbusters story? I would tell you

(01:57:01):
everything you want to know the best of my ability. Okay.
So as as a guy who's he's done a little
bit of of scoring work and whatnot, you know, I
often have clients that will say, uh, you know, let's
let's take a song like, let's take Drake's hotline blink

(01:57:22):
like you know for my show of something like that. Yeah,
cut of something exactly. Um so tols here Hughie side
of the story. Who who's that? Who's that? All right
to hear? Hughey Lewis's version? Uh am. I to believe
that they pitched him the Ghostbusters movie. He thought it

(01:57:46):
was rather silly and didn't want to license I Want
a New Drug to them because he thought the movie
was stilly and kind of dismissed it, and you know,
just took his ball and went home. And then is
this where they come to you, like, well, first of all,
we'll give me the let me give me my my

(01:58:08):
take on it. I didn't even I never heard what
you heard that song ever? Ever thought that goes bust
to sound like I want to. I never thought it, dude,
But yeah, but just here's what I found out later,
And this was only after I heard that they were
doing a lawsuit something like that. I guess they approached
him first to write the song, to write a theme song.

(01:58:28):
I don't think they wanted his song, but I think
they wanted him to write a theme song, and then
they put his song in the temp track along with
three other songs to sound just like that song. They
also have one, four or five chords barband cords, So
so if you were if you were in the room
as a musician, you would know not to write neither

(01:58:49):
one of us a ballot because you know that the
guy was up temple barband song, so hit the hit
in that direction. I had no idea to approached him.
I had no idea about any of that kind of stuff.
I think it was unfortunate that he named me in
the lawsuit and named you know and all that stuff.
I tried to take him to dinner in Germany, but
I guess this guy said, don't talk to that Ray guy.
You know we're about to get me. Yeah, yeah, don't

(01:59:12):
talk to that Ray guy. I had no idea what
they were talking about. When I go you, I ain't
free to no go. None of that sounds like the
same song to me. But I think that maybe he
had a case because they called him first and they
put his song in the temp track. I think that's
a thing for him in the movie company to discuss
now on that on the settlement or whatever you call

(01:59:35):
a settlement or whatever they got for it. And and
I can't talk about the case. And I'll tell you
why because I have a genius lawyer named Don Passman,
and dons what book? Donald passimans lawyer. You wrote a
book called Everything you Need to Know about the Music Business?
On the Music business class I took in college. That

(01:59:56):
was our textbook. It was that in the cause Sheif book.
Those were I to tell but that was like the Bible. Well,
Donald pass Ms oldest client is me. I've been with
him since the beginning. And that's a whole another story
that goes through Bill Cosby. Back to Bill Cosby again,
because Bill Cosby was represented by this firm that's not
in the Yellow Pages or anything that, like, you know,

(02:00:20):
and the only way you get into the firm and
somebody brings up Bill Cosby brought me into the firm
and that's how I met Don Passman. It's the beginning.
It's very much like Tom Cruise. The phrase very much
like that because there was a couple of people I
told about it. Says, I can't find a phone up,
but I don't see any advertising. They don't, you know,
they don't advertise. They handled very elite group of people.

(02:00:40):
And so my lawyer came to me. He says, okay, um,
things have worked out or whatever. He said to me,
do you want to know what happened? Right? Ray Parker
answered to do you wanna know what happened? Is gout
anything to do with me? I mean we're talking, what
we're talking about it? Right? He said, nothing to do too.

(02:01:01):
I said, oh, that's interesting, and then he says, I
just prefer not to tell you. He says, because at
the end of the day, we have a gag rout
on this finding for whatever they're gonna do. He says,
it doesn't affect you. And if I don't tell your daughter,
you can't talk. Okay. So I've never broken the rule
because I don't know anything about through I haven't I

(02:01:21):
don't know what anything of it was. It has nothing
to do with me. My name's on the song I
get I don't know nothing to do with me. I
don't have that. So I never talked about it because
I don't know anything about it. But he talked about it.
Why the like, who's it protect? I don't know. I
don't know anything about it. My lawyer said, you can't
talk about it because you don't know. No lawyer, he says,

(02:01:44):
I know you ain't gonna talk about it because you
don't know nothing about it, which he is correct. So
now in two thousand three, I think it was VH
one was coming calling me several times a week, which
I thought, why I ain't that popular? Why am I
getting some phone calls? Be on TV? And come to
find out they had his version where they now and

(02:02:04):
they want to have me on where they now and
play him back to back right, So he said a
bunch of stuff in which I sued him and I won.
He broke the GA agree was on TV. And how
about this, I like Huie losing the news. I don't
have anything bad to say about him. I never met him.
You got seen each other in the last years. We've
never seen each other ever. And I think the sad

(02:02:27):
part in the irony part of the I think he
takes it more personal because of however it happened. It's
one of those things. Just the bomb built itself. But
I really had nothing to try to do that. And
I think if he had any right, maybe he should
have had it with the other guys. They did it,
but for some reason it seemed to be directed in
my direction more than I think it should have been.

(02:02:49):
Like I hear people talk about him. They say he's
a nice guy. Other people say I'm a nice guy.
Now when they're approaching you to do this, yeah, and
I okay. So the end result is I mean, it's
it's it's really a dead and it's it's a dead
heat tie between who owns the national Halloween anthem. I mean,

(02:03:14):
it's either you or Michael Jackson, neck and neck. But
I prefer to think I'm the winner. I mean, Rod
Temper then just pass. I love rode Ian, you know,
but like I took a picture, I'm just saying, around
this time, this is when you're that's when your checks
start looking real nice. Around this So you're thinking like that,
I'm starting to get concerned because I'm the only living

(02:03:35):
songwriter from Halloween left. My Bobby Boys pick I did
some shows where he's gone. Now Rod Temperton is gone.
I mean you're kind of lonely here. I mean, but
I guess if who you gonna call for Halloween? I
mean right out and still here. So I mean at
the time, were you thinking like, yo, if I write

(02:03:58):
the right song, this will be played, this will be
the happy birthday to you Halloween. No? No, no, but
you gotta admit that it's never died. Yeah, you're talking
about and is it a burden? Is it a burden that? No?
Is the winning a lot of ticket of burden? Ever?
Get too heavy to say? You know, I love you?

(02:04:21):
Because dude, my ring tone, I mean the people what
they want? My god, you know, give the people with
the people call me, they tell me, don't answer the phone.
Let it ring through, you know. And so it's just
you know that logo for those you can't see that

(02:04:43):
if you ring the phone, it plays not who you're
gonna call, but who are you trying to call? Leave
your name and number after the tone. Who you're trying
to call me? You know, like calling right now? I
was call me comic Nick, comic. You're gonna like exp
another question? Ringing toll. Who is this on my phone? Yes,

(02:05:15):
leave your name the number after the tone. He's trying
to call that available. We shouldn't make that available. But

(02:05:37):
as with all Ray Parker stories, you do want the
juice right always as you guys are looking for but
your way over there, and it starts over there. In
the very White days, there was a guy named Gary
Lemel who ran Barry White's publishing company Aaron Schroder at
the time. Okay, the other woman got a temp job

(02:05:59):
working for Mary L. Mal the Columbia Pictures who I
just happened to be. Me and her were doing whatever
we were doing, and so that hooked me back up
with Gary line Male, who wanted me to save him
by writing the song Oh my whole friend. Man. That's
how we made the connection. Okay, So he brought the
project here. Yeah, and so he figured that I could.

(02:06:21):
He says, you got the right humor, you got the
right thing. He says, I think you're right for the job.
I'll give you fifty grand. Just go write the song,
whether if we don't use it, you keep the money.
What the heck? They headed like that, you know, And
it wasn't gonna be no record wasn't gonna be in this.
It was twenty seconds of music at the library scene.
So I wrote a minute and fifteen seconds of it,

(02:06:41):
just because I don't know how to do twenty seconds
of music. You know, by the time I do one
group and go to the other group, I got a
minute and a half of men and fifteen seconds of
men and ten seconds something like that. And so I
played the guy a little snippet I had, and that's
what he loved I right, he just loved it. Right.
I went to meet and he loved it. Called me
at three in the morning, I'll sleepy getting the stuff girl.

(02:07:01):
Now there's some magic to those girls yelling. There's really
huh okay. So now I was dating little valley girl
um in in the valley. I woke her up at
five in the morning, told her to get her high
school friends together because the messengers coming at eight thirty
nine o'clock and I need to get these voices on.

(02:07:23):
And it was their first time they were being a studio,
so they were excited. They could be like six seven
and this is your recording at your house, this recording
that American. So they're screaming and yelling ghostbusters which I
think made the magic in the record. You know. That's
how the song came about. And then we took to
tape recorders and started linking the tracks together to make
the song four minute song because I only had a

(02:07:44):
minute in fifteen seconds of it. And then the breakdown
section that's just me playing some stuff over the same
groove without the guitars in the base and over dubbing
and just making sections out of it. But it's really
only a minute and ten seconds of music. You can't
but not that I think that when you tend to
overthink it or try to like concoct, like I'm gonna

(02:08:10):
make an anthem for Halloween, it never happened. You just
got to do it. But he just wasn't even overthinking it.
Was just like, to you, was this just some arbitrary
He grabbed his fifty grand and exactly, I take the money.
I told my account yang, I'll see it. I'm spending
this because my bonusbody. So at what point did you?
At what point was the oh God like the holy ship?

(02:08:33):
The is too fast. Let me tell you how the
best idea of my life came. The first thing is
I got the music really quick. I had all this
stuff I was jamming. I could not. The guy wanted
the words ghostbusters in the song I don't get my
fifty grand. Well, we friend Detroit, you don't get your
fifty grand. Just don't get it back. Don't get it back.

(02:08:55):
I'm gonna put it in there. But it was impossible
to sing ghostbusters, right, I mean, it's just it wasn't
even Ghostbusters. I created that. It was Ghostbusters. That's what
they kept saying, Ghostbusters. We want Ghostbusters in the song.
You heard it now, So it's not fair. But at
the time, they hired plenty of writers over the time
span of a year, and nobody could get that word
in the song. It was a stupid word the sing.

(02:09:15):
Can't sing ghostbusters. It just doesn't sing. So you're saying
other people were trying to dem own and yeah, the
guy said they had been doing this a year. They
don't like none of the song directed on like none
of who I don't I don't know, but some famous
people trying. But it's interesting he says that because that's
the same thing that Bobby Brown did on the second Ghostbusters.
He didn't sing it either. On our own joint. He

(02:09:38):
didn't sing it either. So he was, but he was
off the hook. They wanted Ghostbusters in the song, right
because he didn't have to say ghosts. So here's what.
So here's what we're at. And I'm sitting there. So
I got the song done, and I haven't called a
girl yet because I don't have anything myself. So it's
like nas three thirty four o'clock in the morning, my
fifty grand starting to float out the window, you know.

(02:10:00):
And then this commercial comes on TV, which I wasn't
really trying to write a commercial, but I remember the
part of the film they had the Ghostbusters with the
backpacks and they had the phone number under it. And
when I was half asleep trying to stay awake but
trying to write this lyric, I was dozing off, half asleep,
and on comes this commercial on TV with like some

(02:10:21):
insect repelling guys or the you know, the the exterminator guys,
and they got their backpacks and they look just like
the Ghostbuster guys to me, or to wash this troubles
down the drain whatever that you know, wrote a router
guy something, it's some kind of guy like that, and
so I'm looking at it. When they got the phone number,
who do you call? And I went, look, just like
the Ghostbuster guys, we're gonna make it who you gonna call? Right,

(02:10:44):
So that's Detroit. I said, I'm just gonna like not
seeing the words Ghostbusters. I'm gonna let the crowd go
go Busters, and I just go who you're gonna call?
So my song is who you're gonna call? I had
no idea what's gonna be commercials and rested. I mean
it didn't take, but that call on like wildfire. As
soon as that song that the director loved it, he says, oh, man,

(02:11:07):
that's he's I like the way you're going. And he
was a Jewish guy. So he says, I'm not afraid
of any ghosts. He said, but you're going, what are
you saying? I said, no, I'm miss like, I ain't
afraid no ghosts. Man. He says, I like how you
phrasing that. He says, I like, he's I like the phrases.
He says, I said, I had a background. He's no,
I like how you're saying it. I like, you go out,
I'm not afraid of any ghost I'm like, I'm looking

(02:11:28):
at him like I'm looking at where at and I'm
saying no, I ain't afraid no ghosts. He says, say
it again slow, I said, I ain't afraid no ghost
and I hadn't really thought about what I was saying.
I said, no, I ain't fraid no ghost just I
like that man. So we didn't re redid that, and
that's what changed the whole world because when they when

(02:11:51):
they licensed the song for commercials, it has nothing to
do with the movie because they don't license Ghostbusters. They
license who You're gonna call, and they put their own
name in the back of it. Ah, that's really okay.
My question is are you is this your song or
is this like whenever someone wants to utilize Ghostbusters, do

(02:12:12):
you have to go through a whole protocol of getting
the movie company? And it's pretty much my solf. Now
there are protocols, Okay, if the movie was released like
this film, there's a three month moratorium on each side. Dude,

(02:12:35):
I's only forgot Ghostbusters got released again this year, there's
a three month moratorium on the front. Well, they didn't
want people to do it, but I have such a
wonderful deal that if you offered me a million dollars
to do it within that three month period. They can
say no, you can't do it, but then they give
me a million dollars. Oh, so I still don't lose
the money. Oh, but I mean doing it asking. You

(02:12:57):
can't perform it anywhere or for me. And I'm just
talking about that. They want to use the commercials and
other stuff. You know. You know when you do a
film thing, they don't want you in conflict with the film, right,
so you can't do any commercials for the first three
months after it comes down. Now, but you on the
words too, like the merchandizing merch So we're coming out

(02:13:19):
with a clothing line of Ray Parkard Jr. Collections Clothing
on because I think they figured out that on the words.
So they want to put the words with the characters.
So we have a t shirt line and clothing line
coming out. Did they use the yours in the two?
I haven't seen part of the new one. This is
probably three by the way, part they used the snippet
of it. In my opinion, they should have played the

(02:13:39):
themes every time, but they put in there some parts.
But you know every time. To me, Indiana Jones that
that that's how you know. The good guys just play
the same thing someone. I think, I hope next time
they do that, you know. But they played a little
bit of mine. Then they have twenty other versions where
they mixed it up and did a different ways, you know,
and then they cut a whole album with these guys.
I mean, I got writes, probably ten songs on the album,

(02:14:02):
but nobody had a hit on the album. Movie did well,
you know, they tried it tried. Maybe next time he'll
So when you're turning in this master, at what point
do you realize I have the national anthem for Halloween

(02:14:22):
two weeks after it coming, and it will never die.
It will never know Halloween. We didn't know till later.
I didn't think about Halloween. But so you're not seeing
a grand love. The only thing I knew is that
the record came out. Well, I had already told, been
told what's gonna happen. You know, the the movie in
those days will come out almost nine months later overseas

(02:14:44):
in different places. So client had already said, okay, we
released a single in front of the film, and then
when the film comes out, we wait and release it overseas. Uh,
you know, in those days they want to stop as
MENI imports as possible, so they just let it low low,
and within the first two weeks we had sold so
many records and clients says, what do you think has

(02:15:06):
happened their export and the records? We gotta sent ship
it out overseas, he said, But the movie's not coming
out for eight nine months. We're gonna be way ahead
of the film, he says. I'm I'm torn between putting
it out, he said, but my distributors are making me
put it out because they're selling so many of them.
And I think within the first few weeks we were
so three and a half million records overseas, there were exports,

(02:15:26):
so they forced him into release in it. He says,
why do you think they're buying this? They don't understand
what you're saying in Italy or other places. I said,
if I knew that, I would have cut a bunch
of them. We are you talking about record? Put the
record out? You know? So? And by meet him when
meet Him came um that February were rapture, like I
think they gave me a record with fifteen million selling

(02:15:46):
albums or something like that was just crazy. It's one
of those songs that took off every everybody. There was
something in the song there so infectious, are so happy
that you didn't need to know what language it was,
You didn't need to understand everything. It just went number
one in fifty two comes Trees. It just just went everybody.
And it wasn't a burden on you, like, oh no,
all that money to the bank, A wear in my pocket,

(02:16:13):
down my pants. What's your family saying now? Oh? Then yeah,
he's all right, he's gonna be all right aside from
the ghostbuses. Uh, we read that like you're I think
the highest paid guitar, like the highest Oh that's nonsense.
I read that thing. Yeah, well, you know what what

(02:16:33):
I like about it is, you know you read. You
can't believe everything you read. First of all, my kids
they come up to me, so Dan, we read your
your net worth two million dollars, right, all these different things.
Two million dollars. I think, where do you get that
number from? We just spent a million dollars just on
the studio in the back yard. Okay, what about the
rest of his place or whatever to do? And then
that article comes out he's the highest pay he made,

(02:16:54):
He's worth four hndred million dollars. He just made an
eighty nine million last year. I'm like I did somewhere
in the middle. I don't even know if it's the
middle somewhere between this. It's kind of crazy the things.
I mean, who comes up with this stuff? Who writes
this stuff on the matter? And then my neighbor he's
worth like eighty million, I mean, all these different um
and Denise Willmas was worth almost a billion dollars. Yeah,

(02:17:16):
she's worth like nine hundred and fifty billion dollars on
the website. Get it. So I'm just saying, there's all
these numbers and telling my kids, I said, you can't
believe everything you read. Look at this right here. You
know what other stuff were you able to put your
money in and like investing and stuff just to stay well?

(02:17:39):
You know, I lost lots of money years ago, especially
in the stock market when I got too greedy. But
recently I had a really a good land for I
bought a bow bunch of a Tesla stock that seven dollars,
I mean a meaning for a lot enough where I
made in five months a few million dollars. I got leave.
And you know what's even better, because I'm older and

(02:18:00):
wise I actually cashed to me and I still got
a lot of it, but I cashed and it took
most eight percent off the table. I was smart enough
to finally, you know. So I look for a little
things like that. I mean, I do the safe stuff now,
really stay a little bit, bonds, you know that kind
of stuff. Stay out of trouble, pay your taxes, get
don't you want to be going to jail like the
other guys, you know, keep the country rolling, and just

(02:18:22):
just do normal stuff. If you if you, if you
pay attention. The key thing with money is just not
to buy more stuff that you've got money for. Everybody
wants to look like this. If you like this, it's okay,
look like that. Don't go up there, you know, just
don't get out of hand with it and get stupid,
you know, life lessons. Yeah, so okay, uh, I guess
doing the tornado of the success of the single, I

(02:18:46):
noticed that in eighty four you didn't put the record
out though, no Ghostbusters, and they had me all over
the place and sex and single Man that year or whatever.
Later we did put a record out, Chartbusters track and
that was Clive Davis. This thing and I never get Yeah,
the Greatest Hits, which we had already had the Greatest
Hits album the year before. I said another Greatest Hits.

(02:19:08):
Let me tell you something. We packaged the Greatest Hits.
I had a cold on one of the songs. He said,
just put the thing out there. Cut the stuff. Sold
a million plus albums. Wow. Right, So Clid was right again.
I mean, it was an unbelievable pay day for not
a lot of work. So that really happened. Great. Was
I don't think that man should sleep alone? Was that
on sex a second? The next record? Second? The end

(02:19:37):
of Barrister? Yeah, that's what. They didn't promote anything. They
just kind of let it go bye bye. But okay,
that was just one slight blemish and you wanted it
off or was it? Oh no, no, I was off
for Arista in eighty three before Ghostbusters. Oh yeah, and
it was. It was one of those things where, um,

(02:19:58):
I think it was a missing stand. I never wanted
to leave there still, but Clive wanted me to do
a Dion Wark album and he called my manager and
somehow they were arguing about the price, and he says, well,
if it's gonna cost down, I want to know what
did it take to renegotiate Ray, and we think, what
do you reading Ray for? I got four more years
left to the contract. It's somewhere in there. He wanted
me to do an album, and to me, it's just
told him misunderstanding and things got out of hand and

(02:20:19):
he had offered some really low amount of money and
everybody got nervous, and David Geffen offered like an enormous
amount of money and it was too late to turn back.
Sort of a deal. Yeah, so I ended up signing
with Did he hate losing your Yeah, but we remained friends.
I actually went back to him a little bit later.

(02:20:40):
And uh so when I cut Ghostbusters, I was really
already sort of leaving, so it could go either way.
But I gave it to Cline because I said, well,
you could put it out fast, and he didn't like it.
I said, we don't have to like it. They're gonna
pay you all the money to promote it. Just take
it and pressing, put put the fill it full of
your album, feel out, full of your artists, and go,
and which he was wonderfully happy about. You know, m hm, okay,

(02:21:03):
I'm the greatest part of theft ever. Let me tell
you something. I'm a very fortunate guy because after that,
I went to Geffen and we could that I don't
think man should sleeping on that Dark album, which did
well went gold in England. They kind of smissed the
ball here, crossing it over pop the usually way that
we do all my records. Because David Geffen was selling
the company at the time, and I remember the numbers

(02:21:26):
and I think he gave me a million dollars up
front another million to the record and he said, I'm
getting out the music business. I'm selling the whole company.
And if you go to m c A, you can
keep all the money. You have to pay it back.
I was like, I'm down for that. Just get the
money off, the pay it back, you know. So that
mean I went to m c A, but I kept
my contract, but he owed me all the money and

(02:21:47):
I'm free and clear and I'm starting to zero. Ah, bro,
so I'm starting to zero. So I said that that works.
The only problem is I got to m c A
and even though I had to it on Bobby Brown
and those guys, you know, I had another but I

(02:22:07):
had another artist, and I had an an artist, Randy
Hall signed there too. They was your artist or yeah, yeah,
he were signing me, and I signed him to the
m c A and so now I'm going to MC
after all of this. So while it's going on, and
they were like they wanted to have an A and
R meeting and listen to what I was going to
record and all that, and I just wasn't feeling that.

(02:22:27):
It's like kind of like making an actor audition. After
he's my contract said I could do whatever I want
to do, and you give me I think it was
a million bucks up front, Just give me a million
bucks when I started, so I hadn't got my money right,
and they were talking about, well you can come on there.
I said, come in, where come into? Where is my
million dollars? We're talking, you know, And I had a

(02:22:48):
bunch of more albums that they had to take, like
several more albums, and so the conversation came up as too.
And my parents were sick at the time. So I
really want to spend more time Detroit. It's hard for
me to record. And so that's why I say this
worked out perfect time they decided to to get rid
of me, right, but they was this under Jerald Busby

(02:23:11):
or no, he had just left Ernie Singleton and I
love both of those guys, but they were gonna do
it this way, which is fine. So that the idea
came Let's by real, so I believe it. I thought
my lawyers thought he was crazy. I said, they'll never
do that. You know, they'll they'll just make me cut

(02:23:31):
all the records and they're gonna sell them and do whatever. Well,
you know what, they wrote me a big fat check
for all the next several albums. They mightn't have to
do anything that is unheard of. I mean, how do
you deal with the changing times and when the event
of hip hop coming in? And like, how are you

(02:23:51):
dealing with this? I've heard various uh if you heard,
uh the infamous Michael Henderson rant, and there's a there's
a famous Michael Henderson and yeah, a Japan rant where
more write it down where he's just, you know, kind

(02:24:17):
of ranting over the changing times of music and how
it's it might be leaving him behind, Like how are
you taking it at that moment? You know what's the
interesting thing. I never really thought about getting left behind,
and I never really thought about changing. Um. I think
I do so many things in the music business. There
was a time I took a lifelong vacation, which is

(02:24:39):
probably after that. In my check I just felt like,
you know, I moved to the mountains, I bought an airplane,
and I started flying around the country. You know, so
you just wanted to take it easy. And I bought
a really nice airplane that that I can fly like,
I can fly to New York and back. You know,
some people take vacations of me. I know, it's amazing,

(02:24:59):
right all right, like the airplane. So I got a
little making so I got a little out of not
out of control, but you know, I was like water
skiing everything that I dreamed about that. I bought a
house in the mountains and lived up eight thousand feet
overlooking the lake and the fresh air, and I was
snowmobile ski eighty days a year and just had a

(02:25:20):
wonderful time of it. You know, girls couldn't e find
because they didn't know what I lived. I fly my
airplane to the girl's house, have a date, and I
split and go back home. They'd nobody find life. I
was having a great time, and I did that for
several years. And yeah, if you got a plane, had motorcycles,
dirt bikes, I mean I just was having a great time.

(02:25:41):
This went on for a while, you know, until I
met my future wife, but finally made you just had
to get married. I don't know, I met a girl
like none other did. I would rather watch TV with
and go bang a couple of them one. Yeah, it
was just just a man. It was real romance. I think,
you know and feel that way today, even I don't

(02:26:01):
want to say that. Yeah, you have a record a
song on, you know, the Mexico when you talk about that,
was that inspired by her or by your wife? No,
I was just in Mexico write some song, just fooling around.
You wait till you hear the next record. I mean,
I'm almost halfway done with it. It's funky. It's nine three.
You know what he said, he don't write about his life.

(02:26:22):
He and then what I'm doing now this is I'm
cutting me? What am I cutting? This? New record? Sounds
like me? Funky delic Rick James. I mean, it's it's
that here. You know, it's back to my ear. If
the instruments were created much after that, I ain't gonna
have it on there. I mean, and you know it's interesting.
I don't feel the least bit because I'm not really

(02:26:43):
money motivated to make the record, so I don't feel
the least bit. I gotta listen to us on the
radio try to go boobah boo, bah boo. But if
they go booboo, I just want to do it my way,
you know, and just keep it true to what it is,
you know, and people if somebody says, well, how you
gonna sell, I don't know. Maybe we're selling, maybe we'd know.
But I never really made music to to to try
to make money. I was always trying to make music

(02:27:04):
because I love the music. How do your kids feel
about your career? Like, do they know that you're the
coolest dude walking the planet? Or My kids thought nothing
until they saw me get a star on Hollywood Boulevard,
And really that got let me tell you something. I
never they don't move over anything, right. But we came
home from the star ceremony and my youngest son took
the picture of somebody down the hung his star up

(02:27:26):
that I gave you, and I was like, really, I mean, y'all,
really we got to yall. I mean we finally tapped
you just a little bit. I got a thirty year
old sixteen and eighteen. So the younger ones, you know,
the older ones, you know, they greal with all this nonsense,
they ain't getting it. But for some reason, Yeah, but
for some reason, even the older kids, the star on

(02:27:46):
Hollywood Boulevard was a life changer. That was the game changing.
Forget all the money to get all that stuff. They
know they live in the house, that the money bar.
They got that, but that's just their thing. But for
some reason, the star thing everybody got. You know, even
my wife. We were driving home. I said, I don't
know about your other boyfriends, but I bet you didn't
want to know. Holly, just start tell something. I thought

(02:28:08):
we were gonna have something going right. And she looked
at me, she says, I let you slide with that
one to put the blind you know, she let me.
She let it go. She did even let that one go.
So that was interesting thing with your kids, like how
do you because they grew up, you know, particularly old ones,
growing up growing up in that kind of goperster, how

(02:28:28):
do you teach them like the importance of work ethic
and like what are they into? Them out of the
house and cut them off like years ago, and well,
you know, they started you know the problem is the
kid they think your money is their money. Yeah, yeah,
you know. So I kicked my kids out, and you
know what, they all fell to the ground, and now

(02:28:50):
they're all making a lot of money doing well. Yeah,
and so hopefully the younger ones will do the same thing.
And it's really painful to the fine I told my
kids old stories got hurt me more, it's gonna hurt you.
But guess what I get that funk out. I came
home one day and both of them were supposed to
be looking for a job. One of graduated college. One

(02:29:12):
it dropped out, and they were the swimming pool drinking
Margarita's and it was noon. I said, with the job,
They said, we searched the all day, all day. It's
twelve o'clock. So we finally put them out. They were
like two and twenty four. Okay, that's reasonable. You gets
every It may have been because the oldest one had graduated,

(02:29:39):
so maybe it's twenty three and that's why the other
one dropped out at the time. Y'all can move together
and share my s That's that's real. Like, did you
ever have a deadline? Like when I was my dad
was like, yo, something got to happen. But I wasn't lucky.

(02:30:00):
I got my record deal like within a year and
a half. But I got super lucky. It was eighteen
for me, and I knew. Once I graduated high school,
I was just like, yeah, I can't come back. So
then I went to college and even coming back for
the summers was tough. You know what I'm saying. Had
to pay something. Yeah, oh totally. I was working everything.

(02:30:22):
So then finally my senior year, me and my buddy,
we got our own apartment and so that was then.
I also had a kid on the way. I had
my son on the way, so that come. So I was.
I was hustling. And then I graduated and then we
signed our first deal. We complete we complete the listing
like a couple of months and I graduated. So what

(02:30:43):
about you? Unpaid Bill and Steve? Your parents were like,
I get then out. It's like Rody Dangerfield, don't stay
home back to school? Are there any last I have
one last question, but I have to rewind back a

(02:31:06):
little bit on because it means so much to me.
But um, I just have to say, like you your
theme the Prior's place, you know that that was one
of my favorite shoes ever, Like, what was it like
working with Richard Pryor? And how did how did you
maan that that was wonderful? Um I got that because

(02:31:26):
I was dating the director's daughter. The other I need
one more like Campfire Story, leave the rest of that alone.
So her dad asked me to come in and write
the song, you know, and working with Richard Pryor was

(02:31:47):
wonderful and it was like a dream come true. Then
they put me in the video and I bounced a
basketball and Richard man, I'm like, oh man, this is
as cool as he can get, right, And all of
a sudden, I don't know where the ratings come out.
The thing is and great and it's as kids cartoons,
I mean kids think. So I'm thinking, wow, this is
every everything, this is it. I got it. Then Richard
probably says I don't want to do no more, like

(02:32:10):
after several episodes, and everybody's like, yeah, what happened? I
thought we said the ratings said ratings. Richard just doesn't
feel like doing anymore, you know, No, he just didn't
feel just change his mind. It was the Black Sesame Street. Yeah,
he just changed. He came on eleven thirty right before Soldier.
He just decided I'm not gonna do the more wow.

(02:32:31):
And you know, and when that happens, you know, like
what about us little guys? You know, come on, you
know it must be nice, it must be nice. Just
walk away right in the middle of it. Don't care,
you just go so okay, any any I mean your
new addition session was Okay, you're gonna like this. So

(02:32:51):
I wrote Mr. Telephone Man right alongside Jack and Jill
and some other stuff all at the same time, right,
and I thought a stupid song, Mr Tell I don't
know why did I write that? So I can it
and I don't do anything with it, and we end
up recording it on this kid on Geffen Records, Kid
Junior Tucker, and they they for some reason, they throw
his album with David Foster cut some first Jay grading

(02:33:15):
it comes something. They didn't like anything, and they gave
it to me at discounted budget, and I actually finished
the record for him, gotta done, and then they just
came the thing and he didn't do nothing with it,
but somehow the new edition heard it through this guy,
Dale Kanoshima used to work for Michael Jackson, and uh,
they loved the song. I didn't know that they had
heard it. So Gerald Buzzby called me up in Detroit

(02:33:37):
while my parents were sick, and he says, um, I
want you to fly to New York Boston to hear
these kids singing, because you know they want you to
work with him on a song. That's why he didn't
say right. He say work with him on a song.
And my parents were sick. I've been in Detroit for months,
it's freezing cold, and he wanted me to go to Boston.
It's January. Not even not feeling it right. So I

(02:33:58):
tell Gerald, thanks of man, man, I don't think something
man feeling So Gerald, being a smart guy, he was
called back a month later. A few weeks later, he says,
how about we take the jet and go to the
Bahamas and stay at the Trump thing there and go
to the restaurant and we party. I said that that works.
Do that. So we fly down to the Bahamas. We

(02:34:21):
rent motorcycles, were going the casino. We eated the same restaurant.
Donald Trump stand over there. We're sitting here and we
party so hard. We get to the kids concert. They
walk off the stage. Right, there's Mr Parker. How did
you like our song I ain't even heard of yet.
Gerald looked at me. I'm looking at him like, oh man,

(02:34:42):
we're late. We missed the whole thing, you know. And
we're like, oh yeah, that was great, yeah that. And
so I go back and I'm feeling bad now because
I'm like, man, Gerald and my parents are sick, really
not feeling this. Write the song thing and go back
to you know, just he says, oh man, you ain't
gotta write the song. He said, they were playing your song.
They just want you to re record it. You know.

(02:35:04):
I'm like, what song, Mr telephone, that's how they hear that.
He says, No, they worked out there, they know what.
They want you to cut it, just like the old stuff.
So we got went back to California and uh, the
kids say, look, just cut it just like. In fact,
we buy the old track. I said, no, that Blondes again.
You can't buy it over. But it's me playing on
the instruments, so I'll cut it again. So I put

(02:35:26):
all the instruments together. Yeah yeah, yeah, so that's me playing.
I play the drums and over the I'm I'm like Steve,
I put the drums on last, you know. So I
played the bass and all the rest. Well, that's how
the master taught me. I'm just doing it like EI
did it. So I put all the stuff on. We
get the track done, We get the singing on. Ralph
sings the versus sounds great. Nobody can sing the chorus,
and said Bobby because he's he didn't want He said,

(02:35:47):
I don't sing. I rap n I said, well, you
gotta sing because anybody else singing it. So he's yelling
and screaming up. So we get him on up. Later
he tells me, you know, I saw him a few
weeks ago. He told me, says what Ray Prone Jr. Said,
I can sing something. Quit the band so I do
my own album. I said, boy, that was a confidence.

(02:36:08):
I'm gone, you know. But it was interesting. Uh they cut,
We cut the record, turned it in and they were
a little out of tune on some parts. It was
worked to get the vocals done. So Jerald Buzzy listen
to me, says, can you cut four or five more songs?
You know? I said, man, I can't do that. I'm
doing this. He says, well, get your boys, Allie, and
wasn't naming them to do it. He says they can

(02:36:29):
ghost it for you. He says, you got my permission.
So I go to my boys and said, man, y'all
you want to cut the stuff. I got pockets full
of cash burn here, you know, do this. We don't
want to do that. We don't want to do it.
I said, yeah, but they said we don't want to
Nobody want to do it. What I just didn't want
to do it. No, I couldn't get all. I mean
people needed integrity, too much integrity or too much poor judgment,

(02:36:50):
so nobody would take the money to do it. So
that's how I ended up with just the one song.
I turned the song in and believe it not, that's
the same week when they called me for Ghostbusters. So
when Gary Lemel called me from Ghostbusters, you know, I
had been in Spargo's and I was sitting with the
lady right there, Claire. We were looking at that red
i mean black poster with it just had a circle
on it or something like that, and I said, what

(02:37:11):
is that? And I said I got a phone call
from my friend about there, and with Gary was saying
it was you know, spent a couple of days I
paid the right to sciences. Man, I'm not doing this
so I'm going back to the Troit, he says. He says,
you're not doing music. He says, what are you doing
here now? Since I'm doing a new edition, says we
don't doing music? Then what you're talking about? My money
ain't good, but there is, you know. So that's how
he talked me to doing this. I was already in

(02:37:32):
town doing a new edition, you know, so he said
stay two more days, fifty grandy. So that year I
had missed a telephone man and Ghostbusters came out the
same year. Man, same changes, get any changes, Ray Parker Jr.
Thank you, Thank you guy. Thanks one of the new edition.

(02:37:59):
Ray Parker. You almost didn't happen, just like Ghostbusters almost
didn't happen, just like Jack and Jill almost didn't happen. Man,
I don't know what lesson like, there's so many I
don't know if it's that I should start dating all
the daughters of all the mine is I'm kicking my

(02:38:20):
kids out of the house. Yeah, information like exactly what
I'm like? What was the day right A? Ghostbusters? So
um yeah myself they got to go numbered already. Oh yeah,
that's what you're taking for this ar Yeah they yeah,

(02:38:42):
they gotta get out. I mean once they're not legal yet,
they're not not and ten, but my basically saying this
seven three to seven years fifteen, gotta get out. Oh yeah,
oh yeah. I mean it was like that for me.
You know what I'm saying, I did, right, I ended
up in the room with you. Motherfucker'd. A child has

(02:39:06):
to suffer to make it in life. I don't think
you gotta suffer. I just you know what, man, it's
it's it's tough because like we talk about this is
to call him night like, you know, looking at what
was it was? You god right, saying like his kids
are like super nerds. So a lot of ways, like
hip hop and the kids of entertainers, hip hop has
afforded the kids way better lives than the fathers and mothers,

(02:39:29):
you know what I'm saying. So that's the good thing.
But then in some aspects, you kind of lose that
thing that made your dad right or whatever, a hunger drive, whatever,
So you kind of gotta walk that line. It's like, Okay,
do I want to give my kids everything that I
didn't have, or do I want to make them live
like Antoine Fisher? So I'm just kind of like I

(02:39:52):
mean not like not like I mean not, I mean
mine is still here. I'm still strong. Oh, nigga, I
don't know who your people be. So no, I mean
so that's that's my that is my conflict because I
want to give you the things. I mean, I don't

(02:40:14):
want my kids to grow up like in the crack
house and ship like I experienced. But at the same time,
I don't want them, you know, to just be soft
and yeah, goddamn job at noon. Yeah. So so that
was my lisbon kick your kids out. I'm sorry. I

(02:40:37):
just wanted to radio show to nerd out a little bit.
I didn't want this to be the moment of your
life changing. Uh so, Bill, you seem to agree about
kicking my kids out of the house. You would kick
one daughter out with you know it like tomorrow. No,
I'm playing, but you're not. I'm not. I don't. I

(02:41:02):
you know, I haven't given much thought to kicking my
kids out the house. I feel like a few years
ahead of me. So yeah, your kids, your daughters so much. So,
I mean, there are days, but those are late Jordan's
there's two kids and I'm babe Bill's life and one
might be testing his patients just a little bit more

(02:41:24):
than the other one. Everybody's patients, not just but do
you feel I mean, is it too late? She's only three, right,
she's four? Is it too late to do what? Get
her back? Yes, it's too late for that. I have
about three friends who thought. One one of them infamously said,
you know he had a son and a darty. He says, well,

(02:41:45):
you know, I'm gonna saying my bill money up for
my son, a college stuition up for her. And now
they're older, it's the complete opposite. The angel is now
a nightmare. I've heard that they switch and right, so
who knows, like the apple of your eye? Might you know?
It might be bail money time. I mean, I hope

(02:42:09):
you know about girls? To keep him off the poll,
the only thing you need to do. I've heard that,
all right, So Steve drop drops the science man, what
would you learn? Man? I thought some of the interesting
things he was talking about was the Stevie Wonder playing
drums on his stuff last Yeah, I mean that's that,
and it's just so it's just mind blowing. How does

(02:42:30):
that make it? No? Click? So he's playing to what? Well,
because Steve is one of the most adventurous uh high
hat players all time. That just makes a lot of sense.
The fluctuation of his drumming is because he does it
last and I'm never the same. I'm gonna cut a

(02:42:51):
song album every part. That's what I was thinking the
whole time. You know, I gotta try this. I love
that in two weeks. Let's let's let's let's try that's
something cool. And and also Stevie wonders a parent competitiveness
with with Ray Parker and trying to that on the

(02:43:12):
Shaka Khan thing and all that um and then uh
that fugilism skills as well, and that Barry White didn't
like over dubs and then he was he was doing
all that. No, but in general, we're choosing people here
that seemed to know everybody, who have seemed to have
done everything, and it's like it's just so much data
going and you know, we need to choose somebody who

(02:43:33):
just did like a one hit wonder. So what did
you learn besides the fact that you might possibly I
want Ray Parker Junior to be your your baby dead,
just at least the soundtrack to you know Me and
My Baby. You know what I learned, and I learned
this every week on this show. Excuse me, not jokes,
but I learned that you gotta pay attention. And it's
funny because You'll made the joke about having a one

(02:43:55):
hit Wonder on the show, and I'm like, you know
a lot of people listening might think that Ray Parker,
well the one hit one there. So it just goes
to show that you and not to plug our own show,
but you need to pay attention to the quest love
Supreme because you will find out some ship that you
never knew. And then I think at the same time,
you should have your phone open on Google and discogs
or whatever else you need to do so that you
can be, you know, more musically educated person. Bill. Yeah,

(02:44:18):
what's up? What did I learn? Um? I learned that
it's a good idea to maintain relationships because you will
never know when you will need certain people again. Any
other last words, Boss Bill? Um, Like, as far as
the relationships maintained relationships, Um, Ray Parker Jr. Still want
the coolest dudes on the planet still talks, right, Think

(02:44:43):
Drake's going to be that cool when he's there. I
just realized we forgot to ask him Ray Parker what
it was like to uh to be Land up Col'
seeing st Good night, ladies and gentlemen. There's another episode
of Question Love Supreme. Boss Bill tune in next week.

(02:45:05):
It wasn't Land, ok, it wasn't think. That wasn't him,
I was Sugar Steve. I'm Bill Prote Edit Scott Wait
what Scott Spurn? What this is a quest love? Come

(02:45:27):
next week again at one pm Eastern Standard time am
Specific Standard time, and uh we hope you still are
listening to this quest Love Supre? Thank you. What's Love

(02:45:48):
Supreme is production of My Heart Radio. This classic episode
was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts
from my Heart Radio, visit the heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite chose

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