QLS Classic: Top Shelf 1988

The masterminds behind Top Shelf 1988 join Team Supreme to discuss the most transformative year in hip-hop history.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Of Course Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This
classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Ladies
and gentlemen, what's up? This is Questlove and you're checking
out QLs Classic. So some time back, way back, I

(00:20):
think around twenty eighteen, there was a mythical unearthed with
quotations project called Top Shelf nineteen eighty eight. It featured
like a lot of the all stars of the what
I call the Latin Quarter era of hip hop, the
Latin Quarter era known as the classic hip hop era.
A lot of those songs that are now staples and

(00:43):
hip hop they basically got their debut when.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
DJ Red Alert was spinning at the Latin Quarter.

Speaker 1 (00:51):
Womonarias like Chubb Rot, also Grad Master Cast, Belly, Mal
Smooth be Of Nice, Smooth Dress, A Black Sheet, Masta,
A Grandpoopa, Jungle Brothers, Dougie Fresh, Special, Led, MC Light,
Craig G, Big Daddy, Kane, Bis Marquis, and of course
MC Search. What can I say, man, this is like

(01:12):
one of those rare summit meetings that I've always dreamed
about having a conversation with my uh, you know, my
comrades and the gods that built hip hop culture as
I knew and loved it. Ladies and gentlemen, let's go
back back in time to a classic era and Quest

(01:34):
Love Supreme history. This is the Top Shelf nineteen eighty
eight episode Let's go.

Speaker 2 (01:46):
So Luke that man.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Hatt's just let's just kick it off. Ladies and gentlemen,
do not attempt to adjust your your.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Doing your dial.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
This is probably my my, my greatest dream manifesting right
now in front of in front of my eyes, Ladies
and gentlemen, I'm surround the ride, all my idols literally
in front of This is Quest Love Supreme. Only on Pandora.
We have the world's greatest right in front of me.

(02:19):
I'm gonna introduce you one by one. Starting up, we
have sur Kane, Big Dady King, Hello, I will talk
to you. Craig g Yeah, in the house.

Speaker 2 (02:30):
I want you, sir.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
This is amazing.

Speaker 3 (02:32):
MC light is in the house. Good evening, Hello, Special
Ed is in the house. What it is like flat
buy church as stand up for me? All MC search
is in the house.

Speaker 4 (02:43):
White people stand up.

Speaker 1 (02:48):
We also have Vinji Greenberg from Roston Records, Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh.
Did you bring me a Bromani brothers, I gotta go
back and get you on about that. And brotherly, I
el I'm gonna put your name bro.

Speaker 5 (03:04):
No, no, I'm.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
Gonna say it one more time.

Speaker 5 (03:11):
I I led there.

Speaker 2 (03:16):
Get your jew right.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
I know I'm trying to one more time. Elkare Yeah,
I did it.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
I mean, Louis Vats get it right.

Speaker 6 (03:29):
Word.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
We are here to I guess, kick off or celebrate
the Top Shelf project. I can't stress enough to our
listeners how crucial the year of nineteen eighty eight was
for hip hop history. And you know to hear of
this project. First of all, this came out of nowhere,
at least for me. I never heard of this. The

(03:53):
idea of can you give us who can who can
best describe to me the history of the Top Shelf
nineteen eighty eight project, the genesis of it.

Speaker 7 (04:03):
I'll take that.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
So.

Speaker 7 (04:05):
I had moved to New York in two thousand, was
working at a record company as an assistant, and I
was working on producing and writing music at nights and
on the weekends. And so I started making beats and
I was getting better at producing, and a mutual friend
of me and Chris's introduced us, and Chris was big
into digging for records and all that, and so he

(04:26):
came over one day and we just made a track
and it ended up being the track what was the
first one we made Grand Poobas. So anyway, we made
a track and we're like, oh, this is really dope,
but it sounds like it's like nineteen eighty eight. This
is in two thousand and three. And he kept coming
over and we kept making beats, and all of a sudden,
we had this group of beats that we loved, and

(04:47):
we didn't know what to do with them, because you know,
it wasn't like fifty cent, who was popping off in
two thousand and three, was going to get on these
beats that sounded like nineteen eighty eight.

Speaker 4 (04:55):
So we came up with.

Speaker 7 (04:55):
This idea, like what if we got like our idols
from nineteen eight eight to somehow get on these records.
And we didn't I didn't know anybody, really, it was
just like a dream. And then we came up with
this whole backstory of top shelf Studios and all the
tapes were lost in the Tompkin Square Park rides and
we just sort of just we were just just dreaming

(05:18):
in my bedroom. Literally just like coming up with this
story to somehow give this project some context. And it
wasn't even a project at the time, it was just
a dream. And so a friend of mine introduced me
to five to five Freddy and I went to it.
We went to his house and we played him a
bunch of beats and he really liked it. He loved

(05:39):
the concept of it, which was basically there was the
studio from nineteen eighty eight called Top Shelf. All the
greatest artists came through there to record after shows, hanging
out whatever, and during the Tonquin Square Park rides, all
the tapes were lost.

Speaker 2 (05:54):
And now crazy by the way, thank you.

Speaker 7 (05:58):
And now now fifteen years later, in two thousand and three,
we find these records, right, But now it's fifteen years
after that. Because I didn't have I had, I was
able to. We were able to make the record, but
we like no one was interested in putting it out,
and so it wasn't until we had success with Rostroum

(06:19):
and we're able to do it properly that it's now
properly coming out now thirty years after the fictional Top
Shelf Studios was looted during the Tompkins Square Park rides.

Speaker 2 (06:34):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Well, yeah, I think it's only apropos that you do
it on an even number, which is thirty years into it,
So it seems like it's all come full circle. How
did you How did you pitch this idea to each
to the artist, yes, to each member.

Speaker 7 (06:54):
Well, I thought that by having fat five Freddy on
my side would help because if it's like two thousand
and three and it's just like, hey, my name is
Benji and I want to make this record, that's you know,
So it was a lot more effective to be like, hey,
me and fib five Freddy because he came on as
an executive producer of it.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
Back then.

Speaker 7 (07:15):
You know, we're making this record and blah blah blah,
and and people like the beats. I think that's what
it came down to, is people were feeling the energy
of the project. I mean, you'd have to ask them,
but to me, it was like, you know, to me,
it was a celebration of the music that we grew
up with and that we loved and what got me

(07:39):
into music in the first place. And so I think
people felt that energy or I hope they did, which
was just like it was a celebration and it was
just like a cool concept idea and like, let's just
all get together and make a record.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
So I have to ask, were the tracks initially made
on n SB twelve hundred.

Speaker 4 (07:57):
Or no cheated a little bit. We cheated a little bit.

Speaker 7 (08:02):
We actually made them on an MPC two thousand XL.
That's close and uh and yeah, yeah, so you know,
but yeah, no, he didn't make them on sp.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
Well, definitely the spirit of idiot is in there. Like
I've never thought i'd see the day where you know,
someone's spitting over something that's one hundred and eight bp ms,
which you.

Speaker 2 (08:27):
Know, for me, like.

Speaker 1 (08:29):
I mean, I'm I'm just a lover of of of
fast wraps. So even with chub Rock's track, I was
like whoa. Like the second I heard, I was like, Oh,
there's no way he's gonna map and then he started
like out the now. Yeah, absolutely, So I have to
ask this room. There's there's one sort of common thread

(08:52):
that's on almost every Quest Love Supreme show, which.

Speaker 2 (08:59):
I feel the.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
Common denominator of all of you, because of course the
Latin quarter, of which no one salivates more over Latin
quarter stories.

Speaker 2 (09:11):
Than I do.

Speaker 1 (09:12):
So yeah, without my corehorts here, who will make fun
of me of doing this. I have to ask questions
about the Latin Quarter. They literally, yeah, they made that
jingle just for me because they know and I ask

(09:34):
too many questions of it. But for me, I mean,
I'll be remiss to not let any stories of nineteen
eighty eight go by without without any Latin Quarter tells.
First of all, was this room at all like socially?

Speaker 2 (09:50):
Because this is.

Speaker 4 (09:53):
Oh yeah, oh tell y'all man, I'm too young to
know what.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
You Yeah, I was gonna say, I don't think you
know right.

Speaker 5 (10:00):
I don't know what you're talking about. That spot really funny.

Speaker 1 (10:06):
You two are actually Juice Crew remembers stars I was
gonna say. I was gonna say, was Juice crew members.

Speaker 5 (10:16):
To agree with ed? I was really young, but I
have Yeah, I mean when the symphony was out, I
was fifteen.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Yeah, the shouting when I was twelve twelve.

Speaker 5 (10:30):
And but here's the thing about Latin Quarters. I met
searching front of Latin Quarters when you had the Hate
Girls song. And the way I wound up in Latin
Quarters was I used to hey boy, my bad.

Speaker 2 (10:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (10:41):
I used to answer the phones at the Rap Attack
for mister Magic, and some nights I would wind up
in Latin Quarters with mister Magic underage, scared to death,
and I remember bumping into Search in front of there.
I remember seeing a couple of shows there, but I
didn't go off, but I would wind up there coming

(11:01):
from the radio station. So it was kind of weird
that New York didn't really care about your age. And
because I had to have been at least fourteen years old.

Speaker 8 (11:09):
Well they made sure that you got a wristband for alcohol.
So I was at Latin Quarters are fifteen, Yeah, and
it was okay, And I didn't even want to be
near a bar, like it was so much going on
just on a music front, you seeing all the dancers
and everything, that liquor was the last thing on my mind.

Speaker 9 (11:26):
I agree, I mean I wasn't even I think I
maybe went to the bar. I can probably count on
one hand. And it was all five times we're read
alert to have poopoo juice because he would call us
all to the bar, all the violators and have poopoo juice,
which was myers rum pineapple, and I forgot the third thing,
but yeah, so that was his drink. And I've never

(11:49):
been anywhere in the world where they know how to
make poopoo juice, access the Latin Quarter and one bartenders
in Peace Chris Lighty, Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 10 (11:58):
Well, first of all, Search is being modist because Search
was the king of Latin Quarters. It's like, you know,
when when you come in Latin Quarters, it's like just
you know, it's Red Alert Paradise Gray.

Speaker 2 (12:14):
Mc Search. You know.

Speaker 10 (12:17):
Yeah, that's how that's how it falls. I mean, it's like,
if you come in there and you don't see Search,
you gotta think something is wrong. You're for real. I mean,
it was like he was the king of Latin Quarters.
That's where I met him first, like really, like like
when he the Hey Boy song, Like I remember the
night when Search walked in and Read threw it on
and gave him love and Search ran on the floor

(12:40):
and started breaking it down dancing and everybody and everybody
was screaming it for him. I was like, Okay, you see,
that's what I need to be doing, you know.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
For real. Wait, now you mentioned something great, you said
that when you would go with Magic. But I'm under
the impression that Latin Quarter was more broad alt.

Speaker 5 (13:00):
Well, now, now the thing about it was is we're
talking before the bridge was like, we're talking when I
had like the song Transformer out. That was a couple
of years before the whole conflict started.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
So what was the official first year of the Latin
Quarter that we know is at eighty six?

Speaker 2 (13:18):
Celebrity Tuesdays? Eighty five Tuesdays and nineteen eighty five, Yeah.

Speaker 9 (13:22):
Celebrity Tuesdays with Paradise and Lamumbo Cars Awesome, too awesome,
too awesome, too right, and Paradise was working, but it
was special right, that's exactly right, special Teddy Ted had
Celebrity Tuesdays.

Speaker 2 (13:35):
That's exactly right.

Speaker 5 (13:35):
Eighty four it was before like the whole drama started.
So I would go with Magic, and the funny thing
is Magic would leave me. I'd hit Latin Quarters by myself,
just like what the hell's going on here? And I
never went to the bar because I had my little
rope chain on in the corner, and you know who
I would see. I would see Hawk and he would
make me feel safe. That was my brother, because he

(13:59):
would make me feel safe, and then I'd get a
little confidence and hang out for a minute.

Speaker 10 (14:04):
But he's talking about the guy that I'm going against
in the eight and a half step in video with
the Braids.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
Is this the Hawk that you gave a shout out
to in Rapid Game?

Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah that Hawk.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
Yes, I'm about to play out one second for half
a second before he was a black thought Trek was
Hawk Hawk Smooth and his acronym was Hype African Warrior,
keep kicking this smooth.

Speaker 2 (14:31):
I'm sorry listening. I'm sorry to.

Speaker 4 (14:34):
African Warrior keeping it smooth. I'm sorry, good night.

Speaker 5 (14:40):
But it predated the South bronx Bridge beef, so you
know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
But that was kind of Brooklyn. Yo. Did you take
the train from fall rockaway there?

Speaker 4 (14:49):
I just took the second street I would take.

Speaker 2 (14:52):
The Age was the Latin Quarter.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
The the was before the Latin Quarter was New York's
regional then, Like, was this the first Manhattan?

Speaker 2 (15:06):
Remember to me? Like I was so for me?

Speaker 9 (15:12):
Eighty three was lynn Brook Hot Skates, Empire, Roller Rink,
United States of America and Queens like the only place
to really hear hip hop was split between hip hop
and dance music and the Five.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
Boroughs Roxy and dance.

Speaker 9 (15:30):
But they were real strict about young boys going in there,
like they were real like you it was it was
tough to get.

Speaker 4 (15:37):
In there when you were young.

Speaker 1 (15:38):
And dance Tarrian.

Speaker 8 (15:40):
Yeah, you were getting your hip hop from the roller
Rins without questions, questions, skates, skate.

Speaker 2 (15:47):
My first show at USA, I got boot what yeah, I.

Speaker 9 (15:51):
Think I got my first show at Empire Roller Rink.
I got booted because I had a trash record called
Melissa that was trash. But I could dance really good,
so that would save me. But that record was trash
because you got to remember, I went to high school
with Dan to Dana slick Rick, so I thought if

(16:12):
I came out with a British accent, I would be fly.

Speaker 4 (16:15):
Oh my god, and it was terrible.

Speaker 9 (16:18):
So I performed at Celebrity Tuesday because you got some
towour playing the record, and I went there and I
got on stage and people are looking at me like
I'm alien.

Speaker 4 (16:28):
So I started dancing and they were.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
Like, oh, white boy, go white boy.

Speaker 9 (16:32):
So I was like, oh, okay, like this I'm saved.
Like I figured it out, like I could be whack,
but I could dance. And then Vanilla Ice came and
just you know, took that whole steak. But I decided
to kind of grow and have lyrics and you know,
become something better than just a dancing I.

Speaker 1 (16:50):
See wait, you said you got how so well, I'll
never forget it.

Speaker 2 (16:56):
It was again with Miss the Magic.

Speaker 5 (17:01):
Joe Sla was performing and I wasn't even supposed to perform,
and something happened technically with Magic just threw me on
the mic and no DJ knew what was going on
or nothing, and I had to kick an a cappella
and they weren't really friendly with a cappella's back then
because it was dances. So you know, about eight bars in,
I think I'm kicking some hard rhyns. This is again

(17:23):
before I heard Kine and I threw all like seven
rhyme books away.

Speaker 2 (17:26):
Yep, So my rhyme.

Speaker 5 (17:28):
Was mad basic and like I said, I mean, I
just wasn't good and I was nervous as hell. Again
I'm like fourteen years old. I don't know no better.
But it didn't deter me, you know what I mean.
But it was weird because when he mentioned USA, it
was like one of the read like in queens everybody
came through USA. But growing up in Queensbridge, the Recenter

(17:48):
was almost like a celebrity spot, so you had mad
people come through. I remember being ten watching Grand Master,
I mean Graham Wizard did or cut with handcuffs on,
and I'm like ten years old, like with my sepkin On,
just amazed at it.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
So I've seen a lot of stuff. But my brother.

Speaker 5 (18:05):
My grandmother lived across the street from Harlem World and
forced the projects and my brother would come home. The
thing about New York back then is it wasn't as
regional as you thought. There was somebody from any borough
at any show. It didn't matter how far away it was.
Brooklyn was always somewhere. So I would get first hand
copies of like the Fantastic five cro Crush Battle. So

(18:27):
I would say, like even before Latin Quarters, like Halem
World was the spot, like you had to be nice
to perform at Hall. I wanted to perform at Halem
World when I didn't even write rhymes. I just was
rhyming off the top of the head non stop, and
I was like, Halem World's the spot until I wound
up at Latin Quarters scared to death, or Union Square
because I was always by myself, magic with I'd get

(18:48):
in this car with him and then he'd break out.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Just leave it.

Speaker 5 (18:53):
Union Square was my first spot outside of Brooklyn, really,
my first hip hop spot outside of Brooklyn can matter
of fact, Yeah, yeah, Rock Kim, I used to just
go to Empire.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
I ain't going nowhere. I was a kid. I walked
the Empire and walked back home. Okay.

Speaker 5 (19:09):
Yeah, so we just was in the hood, local local spots,
little parties in the hood and stuff like that, block parties.
But yeah, Rock Kim was at Union Square. My brother
won tickets on the radio. Yeah we went, Yeah, we went,
and you know, we never stopped going.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
We was like, oh so even after youngest in charge
came out and legal don't I don't know what the
last official year of Latin Quarter was, but nineteen eighty eight, damn. Okay,
so yep, that was it.

Speaker 9 (19:39):
And it's it's really a very sad story because it's
I don't think I've ever told this story, but don't cry.
Yeah nah, So me Fat Raoul, who was the original DJ.
We came in there on a Thursday night just kind
of was me Chris Light he may rest and peace,

(19:59):
big diar.

Speaker 4 (20:01):
Read and we just strolled up in there on a
Thursday night.

Speaker 9 (20:06):
And in fact, Raoul was DJINGHM and we were going
to turn it into a hip hop night. We were
just like, Yo're like, let Red get on the turntables.

Speaker 1 (20:16):
It wasn't a hip hop nightdays.

Speaker 4 (20:21):
This particular Thursday was not a hip hop night.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
And what gay cabaret night? And was doing it?

Speaker 9 (20:28):
You just decided no, no, no, you don't understand like we
we were just we were just rolling around the City's no,
I need to verify, like be clear.

Speaker 4 (20:38):
Like I'm like like Twitter right now verified.

Speaker 5 (20:44):
You ain't had to tell this story, you know, no,
I think it's important, like we on we on, you know,
we on Quest Love Supreme.

Speaker 9 (20:52):
We need to get supreme. So so I spised out
like I was. I think, you know, I've been smoking
or whatever. And I spised and I told all the
people that wasn't bee boys to get out, and I
said something real derogatory about gay people. And I was like,
if you ain't a bee boy, you need to get out.
And Big Daryl he just got charged and he went

(21:14):
downstairs and there was this cock diesel dude with his
man and we went up to him and this dude
knocked Darryl out, laid him out flat, and Baby Chris
grabbed me put me in Mike Goldberg's office and he
said you stay here, and then things started flying, things

(21:35):
started flying. I was in there for like an hour,
like an hour, just sitting there.

Speaker 4 (21:41):
I came out.

Speaker 9 (21:42):
Place was trashed, empty, Mike Goldberg was heated, told Red.

Speaker 4 (21:49):
Never come back, told us never come back.

Speaker 9 (21:51):
And I come outside and Chris and Daryl and Ali
and Red are just sitting on Chris's Mac some more,
just sitting there and on the corner of forty seven
the Broadway, and they were like, search go home.

Speaker 4 (22:08):
I was like, Noah. They were like search go.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
Home, damn.

Speaker 4 (22:12):
And that was it, that last end of the last night.

Speaker 8 (22:15):
Wow, that's crazy to even hear, because you know, we
just knew that it was closed.

Speaker 11 (22:20):
It was like, what the hell happened?

Speaker 8 (22:22):
And what did at that point Union Square, the Sheraton Hotel.
We knew that I had kind of taken up, you know,
a lot of the slack and it was younger and
fresher and everything.

Speaker 11 (22:35):
But I didn't know that was the reason.

Speaker 4 (22:37):
Why Mike, Mike shut it down, shut it down.

Speaker 5 (22:41):
I just thought it was all the stuff that happened
when you left that closed it.

Speaker 4 (22:45):
No.

Speaker 9 (22:46):
And you know, it's funny because you talk about Hawk
and Dog Cainge like Hawk Dog a Rock the original.

Speaker 10 (22:52):
Fifty original fifty six killer Ben Hues.

Speaker 9 (22:57):
When I was in the Quarter and they were about
to do their thing. The one thing I loved about
those dudes is they would tell me.

Speaker 2 (23:07):
Search, Yeah, that's what would tell me, like always.

Speaker 4 (23:10):
Protected me, like I was a little puzzle, which leaves.

Speaker 1 (23:14):
Me to this question. You knowingly would I don't mean
risk your life, but hip hop was so potent back
then that even you're I mean, basically you're playing Russian roulette.
You don't know what's gonna pop off, because.

Speaker 9 (23:33):
What would happen? No, no, no, what would happen? I'm sorry
Paul and self. What would happen? Was the quarter got
so big, right, the rep got so big that the
tunnel kids would come from Jersey, Connecticut, Long Island. It
became a feeding market for Brooklyn and for Uptown. And
these girls from Hempstead would come in and they had

(23:54):
the big errands and these they were showing out and
it was like it was there was a shop a
paradise man like Hogg Dog Deceptor cons like they just
they went in and they would just give you the
high sign. And there were certain records when they came
on Ultramagnetic with either Ultramagnetic came on or rebeled.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
Out a pause, that was it. That was there was.

Speaker 8 (24:25):
Always something that was gonna happen. You just wanted to
get enough dance time in before it did.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
Quest So when that drum roll comes in on Stetsa.

Speaker 2 (24:36):
In the house on top billing.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Top me, tuck your stuff, it wasn't even you didn't
have time to tuck it.

Speaker 9 (24:42):
Like iou would be in the middle of the floor,
so it'd be Fatima and shake and stretch and all
of them.

Speaker 6 (24:50):
Stretch right school school, school, Lage, Reggie nice and smooth, Swift, Swift, And.

Speaker 9 (25:02):
As soon as that record came on, I owe you
was Jay's gone. And what would come in the middle
of that crowd was every hood.

Speaker 4 (25:15):
Loom that we knew.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
And we were already.

Speaker 11 (25:18):
Back and somebody and was.

Speaker 9 (25:24):
Girls were running out screaming because they were bleeding from
the ears because their bamboos got yanked yo, And I
don't know.

Speaker 2 (25:32):
Who it was.

Speaker 9 (25:32):
I'm not even gonna point no fingers because I'm not
getting thrown under the bus, but somebody from Decepticons. I
remember when they went after jam Master Jay got to.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Bring up yo rest inter j kept his kept his.

Speaker 6 (25:46):
They dragged across, they yelled his.

Speaker 9 (25:51):
Ye, he had the chain with the Adidas thing. He
saw another day and Marv and Mark may he rest
in peace. He was with him, Hollis who was with him,
and whoever tetricane to hurricane and whoever tested them. And
I mean that's one of the few times I remember
bullets flying in the quarter like you would hear them

(26:13):
like going past your ear, and you saw like and
he's holding on and Hollis Crew and he's and they're
trying to pull it off of his neck and they're
dragging him across the dance floor.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
It's gone.

Speaker 4 (26:26):
I mean, there's nobody there except for Hollis Crew and
those dudes.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
And he kept his.

Speaker 10 (26:31):
You remember when Jim Brown would run for a touchdown
and you see like four or five dudes on his back.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
That's how it looks. Jesus Christ kept his.

Speaker 5 (26:41):
Though, Yes, every week, but it's crazy Tho quest like
you you wasn't that after midnight and Philly like you
never like, let me tell you something.

Speaker 4 (26:53):
I know, Yeah, I know, listens when they shut down
New York, that's when we went.

Speaker 5 (26:59):
Cane at the anniversary show and he had Divine Sounds
on it.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
Yep, right right.

Speaker 5 (27:05):
And I'll never forget this because I posted it the
day after because I took a picture with them. I
was having a conversation and I heard the intro Fi
plus five and whoever was talking to me, I jetted
off and ran in the stage because what I remember
from that song was being at USA and they be
Fats open for them.

Speaker 2 (27:24):
And they came on and did that song.

Speaker 8 (27:26):
Wow.

Speaker 5 (27:27):
And when they said we're Define Sounds and we're back again,
somebody started shooting. And this is the crazy thing is
this is not about being gangster, none of that. I
loved hip hop so much. I wasn't mad at the gunshots.
I was mad I did not get to hear the
song finished being performed.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
That's exactly right, or yeah, like we we.

Speaker 5 (27:46):
I was in a lot of dangerous places because of
hip hop, yo like, and I was totally oblivious to
it because I just wanted to hear the music.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
That's exactly right. So that's exactly.

Speaker 9 (27:56):
I remember going to Zanzibar to see you performed. It
was a Juice Crew night, it was Shante, it was you,
it was Master Ace, it was Zanziball.

Speaker 4 (28:08):
Y'all didn't even make the stage.

Speaker 9 (28:11):
They played, they played Lean on Me, and that place
got shot up before y'all even probably even got in
the limit.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
How about sensations though a little.

Speaker 4 (28:22):
Small hallway, that one hallway.

Speaker 5 (28:24):
And all the way place symphony, Yes, the first Yes,
that all hall way. Man Like, a lot of stuff
happened from that dressing room to the stage.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
No, yeah, I remember all those places. I want to remember.
I want to know how you remember all that stuff,
man Like I don't.

Speaker 1 (28:43):
It's you can't forget it.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
Venes, I remember the names of the venues, but I can't.
I actually that one little with the glass mirrorage so
vividly remember.

Speaker 9 (29:00):
I remember you performing at Hinchcliffe Coliseum in Patterson, New
Jersey with KRS Boogie Down Productions Audio two You Rock,
sand I got thirty four seconds on stage to do
a portion of something I mean, and it was the

(29:20):
stage was on the fifty yard line and the crowd
was like a thousand miles away, and it was like
there was like two thousand people in this stadium of
maybe ten thousand people, and it was the greatest show.
I mean, I thought hip hop had reached its pinnacle,
you know what I'm saying, Because it was like eighty

(29:41):
seven or something, and there was actually like people in
the middle of an outdoor stadium coming to a show
because you know, we were doing like you know, but
we also doing the spectrum, we were doing Masison Square
Guard eighty seven was really starting, you know, to pop
off like that, you know, run DMC and A B
C Boys as they sold out the guarden, you know, right,

(30:03):
all of that. But to see like people in an
outdoor a like a stadium stadium, it was like mind blowing.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
For you.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
What were the like the most notable performances that occurred.
I've heard the the Keras One versus Melley Mello thing, whatever,
I've heard that story, But what were in your mind, like,
what was the consummate, unbeatable performance at.

Speaker 5 (30:38):
I would honestly say, to be honest with you, it
would be when I first saw a public enemy.

Speaker 8 (30:45):
Oh my god, I was getting ready to say public
at Latin Quarters.

Speaker 1 (30:48):
Yeah, that was the first time or the rebel without
a parts time though.

Speaker 4 (30:51):
Was.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
It or was it public Enemy number one? That one?

Speaker 8 (30:58):
And he said, I remember he's remember I'm saying, I
feel like I'm on I god damn shelf because.

Speaker 5 (31:04):
The stage was so shallow, it was very high and
it wasn't that and the base from that beat was
rattling the club.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
I never.

Speaker 9 (31:14):
But what you guys don't remember, but you guys two things.
One thing was the first time they ever performed there
was for their Yobum Rush to Show album. They got
booed off stage like we were throwing batteries at them.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
They were terrible.

Speaker 4 (31:28):
Yeah no, no, no, that was no no.

Speaker 9 (31:30):
And then literally a year later that's when I was raped.
But I remember, like for me, like to me. The
shows that I remember were the transformation shows. I remember
the Audio two doing I.

Speaker 4 (31:44):
Like Cherries, I like Days Better and Grapes sau.

Speaker 12 (31:50):
That they did that at Latin Court, yes, the first
time Audio two ever performed, and four Top Build a
year before, a year before they came out of the box.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
I like cherries, yes, oh no.

Speaker 11 (32:06):
Yes, I like cherries before I met them.

Speaker 9 (32:10):
Okay, and I'll and I'll accept it. I'll accept that, Sierr.
That's fine, and that's fine. But those transformations are the
things that I remember the best, because that was eighty
seven and then they went to Top villain and the
place went bonkers.

Speaker 4 (32:27):
But you know what, the box top Billain was just
and the second top.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
Villain was immediate, immediatemediate. That was because the top building
that was immediate. But let me correct myself.

Speaker 5 (32:40):
Honestly, it wasn't the Public Enemy show, and I'll keep
it a hundred the goddamn Juice Crew show at the Apollo.

Speaker 2 (32:46):
When Biz came out of those quarters.

Speaker 5 (32:50):
Quarters, it was public and I thought you met period
like it might have been the Juice Crew Show at
the Apollo.

Speaker 4 (32:55):
Okay, yeah, I mean came.

Speaker 5 (32:57):
Out of a giant nose caane came swinging down from
a damn ivory bench.

Speaker 2 (33:02):
I don't know remember when.

Speaker 5 (33:06):
This was the first time I seen a production like
and I'm down with these dudes, and I remember them
not wanting me to perform driving a giants start dropping out.

Speaker 4 (33:22):
I'll tell you.

Speaker 9 (33:22):
I'll tell you another great show that I remember. It
was winter, it was cold, it was cold, and this
was when Emerald City and Red Parrot were doing hip
hop nights and they had a really interesting way to
get to the club because the stairs and that was
really like a Juice Crew spot, like that was Magic's home.

(33:44):
That was like that was a Juice Crew house, like
they were there every week. But Roxanne and Biz did
their record. I'm shantem right. So they're at the Red
Parrot and I'm looking at the watch and I'm like,
I gotta get to the Q. I run to the
o Q, you know, having a good time, blah blah
blah blah. And then everything goes dark and we think, oh,

(34:06):
powering out or something, and then all you hear is
Vic and then Biz walked out and then Shauntey walked
out in a full length fur and.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
It was a rap. It was a rap. It was
a rap.

Speaker 9 (34:24):
I There are very few shows that I remember where
people went that crazy that was a rap.

Speaker 1 (34:31):
Were these shows in which people would just perform their
single and that was it or was it a full.

Speaker 9 (34:36):
People would just show up and perform and leave. You
would just come in and get busy max and.

Speaker 4 (34:43):
Relieve inside, and you were happy. You were so happy,
you were so happy.

Speaker 9 (34:50):
I mean, and I hate to parlay it into this
and I'm not trying to, but like, what makes eighty
eight the Golden Era is because of this. It's because
like everything kind of accumulated up, you know what I'm saying,
like eighty five and eighty six with Rock Kim and
Kine and the Canaan Rock Kim battles, you know, not

(35:11):
battles like beef, but battle who is the better MC
and g rap with I'm fly rolling up my tentsive window,
raised my antenna because I'm not only fly, but I'm
a big bread winner.

Speaker 4 (35:20):
Like oh my god, queens.

Speaker 9 (35:22):
Represent you know, And it was like all of this movement,
movement movement in eighty eight, like Thomas set it straight.
You know what I'm saying, ain't no half stepping word.
I'm ready, like when he said that, when Kate said that,
like it was it. We were ready, Like it wasn't
just him ready, we were ready.

Speaker 4 (35:38):
We were ready to be greater than the sum of
what we were in the streets of our boroughs.

Speaker 10 (35:43):
I think eighty eight was like you know, transformation, you
know period, you know, like during like the mid eighties.
What was going on was like during the time of
the show, and a lot of that it was like
really like the hip hop party era where you know,
a lot of the hip hop dancers played a major

(36:03):
part and the whole crowd participation, that interaction thing you know,
it was that that party feel that like cats like
your Busy Bee DJ, Hollywood Buck Starsky were doing it
regular parties back in the days. Now it's like on
Wax that way. But then incomes you know, on Brothers.

(36:25):
I think rock Kim was first, and then Kars and
then myself and it started turning into a lyrical thing,
you know. And I think at that point, you know
a lot of people were, you know, like really like
stepping their game up lyrically, and the MC his presence
was really really being felt, you know, because I mean,

(36:47):
if you think about it, you know, back then, any
artist that came out with his DJ the DJ name
came first, you know, Jasey, Jeffer Fresh, Prince, Eric b
and Rakim Grand that's the Flagh in the Furious Five.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
It was like the artist was making their presence felt.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
Okay, So from each of you, what song during that
period did you hear that just made you, that just
transformed your whole artistic approach, Like you hearing something like
Jay will always till this day talk about him hearing

(37:25):
who Shot You for the first time in his car
and that totally transforming his life and his whole approach
to how he was going to be as as an
MC And I mean I've heard this countless of times
with different songs. But for you guys, which is the
class of eighty eight eighty nine, because me, as a consumer,

(37:47):
I cannot think of another year in which, week after
week after week was just some life changing shit coming
out every week. Literally, Like I mean at least twenty
four to twenty five classic albums, like career defining albums

(38:08):
that year alone. So for you guys that are actually
participating in it, was it a thing of like, oh,
I'm a fan of it, or were you like did
you feel a certain way when you heard lyrics and
fury or like damn, like all right, I gotta come
with it, and like what song from a peer of
yours that made you feel a certain way?

Speaker 2 (38:29):
Like damn, Like I gotta come this damn guy right here?

Speaker 11 (38:32):
Man, Like I.

Speaker 5 (38:35):
Being having access to Mally, you hear stuff early and
I think he had that little silver cougar and I
get in the call and he puts his tape in
and I hear set it off, and I was just like, okay, man,
I gotta go home. Just put burn all my rhyme books.
The old one, two, rhyme, rhyme, step and it's ova,

(38:55):
It's done, It's done. And then I remember this dude,
I used to go out, Like I said, I used
to answer the phones at BLS and I would come
in early and listen to all the new records. I've
never heard a special Ed in my entire life. Then
and I put his album on, and the same way
he was doing it with bars, but it was like effortless,

(39:15):
like he was talking to you. I was like, holy shit, man,
see now that I can't be Kane. I can't be Ed,
but I could be myself because Ed is being itself.
He's dropping ill bars, but it sounds like he's making
a sweat exactly exactly. So there was a lot of
moments in those times, not just eighty eight, but in
those few that little corner of years eighty eight, eighty

(39:38):
nine and all like MC's went from you know, just
the basic pattern of a regular bar in the cadences,
rapping three words in one sentence. And it was like, okay, wait,
you know I started with shot, Well listen, everybody, my
name is Craigg.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
I was like, okay, well that style is done.

Speaker 1 (40:00):
I can't do that.

Speaker 2 (40:06):
When I heard said. When I heard said it off, I.

Speaker 5 (40:12):
Was like, okay, man, and not even and even before
I said it off, I can't hold it back that one.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
I was like, Yo, these dudes is rhyming like. And
the funny story I always tell this story.

Speaker 5 (40:22):
You know, I was at the studio when Rock Kim
did Eric be his president Shan mixed that song and
we were laughing at him because he was punching in
each line. And I'm not saying that's anything against him
as a rapper. Maybe he didn't know how to record
in the studio then and we were like, this is terrible,
like I didn't know. And then when I heard it

(40:43):
like a week later, mall he was turning records around
in like a week. The next week on the radio
I heard it, I was like, that is not the
goddamn same song. I was sitting in the studio listeners.

Speaker 9 (40:52):
And I'll tell you that that moment. I used to
hang out with Eric a lot in the quarter and
I used to drive him out to Wine Dance. He
had old little shorty that he had in wine dancing
because he thought I lived in the Five Towns.

Speaker 4 (41:05):
I lived near Wine Dance, Long Island.

Speaker 9 (41:07):
Which was like two hours out of my way, but
I was just, you know, I just wanted to hang
out with Eric Bright. He gave me a white label
of Eric B for President on Zakia Records, and I
listened to it.

Speaker 4 (41:22):
And when I heard.

Speaker 9 (41:27):
Sitting on the couch with my feet up, you think
I'm lazy? You must be crazy. You thought I was
a donut. You tried to glaze me. I threw every
round book I had in the trash and I'll never forget.
The next day, I went to see some homeboys that
I just graduated high school with and I said to him.
I said, to my man, g Man Holt Man, he
rests in peace. I was like, yo, you heard that

(41:48):
ERICB for President? And we both said thought I was
a donut. You tried to glaze me. It was the
craziest shit I ever heard. And then a month two
months later, this knuckle head comes out and changes the
whole game. Brannan, Now, I mean Wrath of Cain was
another point in my career where I just for a

(42:11):
minute there I was like, yeah, I can't do this.
I can't I just me personally, I can't do this.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
I see him do this. I've seen Ratha Kane change
Tarik's life. One of Lady Bee's apprentice was in high
school with me, so he used to answer phones to
Para ninety nine in Philly, so he'd off to bring
in like promotional twelve inches and all that stuff, so
we heard like stuff ahead of time.

Speaker 2 (42:39):
But man, we were in fifth period and.

Speaker 1 (42:44):
He was at the door of school and he held
up we saw the cold Chilling Them logo, and he
was like, somehow we excused ourselves from English class, went
to the rooftop and he says, you gotta hear this ship,
and he like, I'll never forget the collective jaw drop

(43:09):
of twelve of us cutting various classes or whatever. Like
lunch period was different for something like eleventh grader had
a little blue school record place.

Speaker 4 (43:17):
Yeah, we had like a little the preschool Crosbysby.

Speaker 1 (43:22):
And we were just staring at We did not know
what that ship.

Speaker 9 (43:28):
We just I'll tell lights something that you don't even
know when you did. I'm not having it with pas K.
I cut off K Love for like the rest of
my life because yeah, because when Hay Love, when I
did Hey Boy with K Love, like I wanted to
do a record like that with her, and she was
fronting like she was like, yeah, I'm not you know,
nobody's trying to hear all that.

Speaker 4 (43:50):
And then y'all came out with that and I was like, yo,
cheek guy, you, I can't fuck with you.

Speaker 1 (43:55):
I can't fuck with you.

Speaker 4 (43:56):
Like see that we could have done that, Like we
could have done that.

Speaker 2 (44:00):
That to me was the.

Speaker 9 (44:01):
Greatest duet top five that are alive. That duet is
just still to this day incredible.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
What was the B side the cram to understand you?

Speaker 11 (44:11):
What was it called a take it Light?

Speaker 9 (44:13):
No?

Speaker 5 (44:15):
I had the ill bounce beat to it. I used
to call awesome too and request it. I used to
call it awesome too. I used to call records in
the morning.

Speaker 2 (44:26):
He came on Tuesday.

Speaker 11 (44:28):
B side to cram to understand you was take it light?

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Was it take it light?

Speaker 2 (44:31):
With the ill jo I used to call.

Speaker 5 (44:35):
Yeah, I used to call and I used to call
awesome too at four thirty in the morning on a
Tuesday morning. When if your mom's caught you on the phone,
she would whoop that I would be calling and I'd
be whispering into the phone.

Speaker 2 (44:48):
Yo. Molly Mall lives in my building. Fresh by the
Fresh three mcs.

Speaker 5 (44:56):
Like hip hop, you know you're drawn to it, man,
Like with the violence, all of that was like secondary.

Speaker 2 (45:02):
I just wanted to hear hip hop.

Speaker 5 (45:05):
I wanted to hear dudes rhyming and to make me
feel like I wasn't crazy for doing it.

Speaker 9 (45:11):
Is there a record like and I always wanted to
ask you this, but is there a record that you
wrote that you even stepped back and you were like yourself,
h yo, that you were like, man, the most gave
me this.

Speaker 4 (45:22):
Right here, because this is crazy.

Speaker 11 (45:24):
No, I think he was too in it. You probably
was too in it to know right.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
Probably Mortal Kombat on my second.

Speaker 10 (45:32):
Mortal Kombat really yeah, because it was just that, just
one line that just had me like, okay, yeah, I'm
in a special place right now.

Speaker 9 (45:41):
Yeah, Like I remember being in the zone when I
wrote gas Face. I was in the zone when I
wrote black Hat as bad luck bad guys, where black
must have been a white guy that started all that.
I literally stopped for a minute and I was like, yeah,
I'm never going to write a better rhym like the I.

Speaker 10 (45:56):
Was the none of in front of because every one
of my adversaries lack your little son of obituary columns
of reach your name add out question.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Let me ask you a question, though, Yes, what is
your favorite m Sea light song?

Speaker 1 (46:12):
I'm gonna tell you something.

Speaker 11 (46:15):
I can answer that.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
No, do you know listen, I'm gonna tell you something.
See as a drummer, I've.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Never heard.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
I mean paper then's the first song with the rim
shot was used. Everything was snare drum hard snare drums
and again it was I mean for me to to
to get a what I call a War of the
World's movement, which is orson Welles's War of the World's

(46:50):
where people thought it was a real Aliens attack and
people staring at the radio like what the fuck is
going on? When I heard that song, Yo I I
that was one of the for me, even as a drummer,
I was just like, yo, I, I didn't know you
were allowed to do that.

Speaker 4 (47:06):
You can rhyme over a rim shot.

Speaker 10 (47:08):
You don't have to play drummer. You could play rim
shots this shit and it's crazy. Literally the rim was
hitting hard though, I mean yeah, the drums, and for.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
Me, the way the way that Tarik and I bonded,
like Tarik thought it was such a novelty for a
human being to like recreate it so to like get girls.
Tarik would be calling, like Tarik would call my crib
at like eleven o'clock, which is like way past high
school hours for your parents. Like my dad was like

(47:37):
Joe Jackson, drill sergeant. Don't nobody call this house after
nine pm, like that sort of thing. Tarik would call
like eleven, like yo, like on three way, have a
joiner on the On the other line, he'd be like, Yo,
run the basement real quick and play on place it he.

Speaker 2 (47:53):
Off real quick.

Speaker 4 (47:55):
But you you don't know, plase it off.

Speaker 2 (47:57):
Yeah, he can place it off, like yo, man, my
dad like might start riffing.

Speaker 1 (48:00):
Just play us off it just like literally that was
his thing, like I bet you can't play. And he
would call and be like, yo, play play play paper
thin real quick, like just call girls up like I'm
gonna get.

Speaker 2 (48:13):
A mirror to play.

Speaker 1 (48:15):
Even in school where we were he would battle MC's
uh in the cafeteria on the sixth floor and all
the instrumental majors were in the basement and we weren't
using the elevator and I had this little cassio sk
one thing. So the way that my duib as was

(48:36):
allowed to sit with the cool kids. Was I provided
the break beats and not and not the punching line.
They would they would take an order. They'd be like,
all right, run downstairs and play play funky drummer real
quick aside to run downstairs. That was I was the apprentice, Like,
that's how I earned my way into That's how Turikono
became a group. And literally like you have like one

(48:58):
point seven seconds to get a good four bar out
of it, so you would have to pay twice as fast. Okay,
it's good, run upstairs, and then he'd be like, now
I'm gonna do top billing, real quick run down set.
That was me every day at Performing Arts High school.
Like boys and men were in the bathroom harmonizing, but
me and Tarik were literally Now now.

Speaker 5 (49:20):
As as an actual drummer, did you have simsonic drums?

Speaker 1 (49:24):
Did you have those the Mattels? Yes, yes, I got that. Yeah,
I was doing playing rock on that night, day and
night night.

Speaker 2 (49:32):
And then you know what, you know? You know my
favorite song from your catalog?

Speaker 11 (49:38):
Right, no.

Speaker 2 (49:43):
Tempt said this? Oh thank you?

Speaker 6 (49:45):
And yo?

Speaker 1 (49:47):
Where is intro? Though? Who was that? Matt Robinson's inn,
who's being really okay? Can you explain the genesis of
being Pezza the president and Answeringette and how this thing started?

Speaker 5 (50:03):
Cannot answer that quickly, Duck Alert. I always accused her
of being a beat bier because when Kane did raw,
I felt like kidd and play did do this my way?

Speaker 2 (50:13):
And we used to talk about it on the radio.

Speaker 10 (50:15):
I know you did, yeah really and defense though they
picked up that record I think the same day I
picked up the Okay yeah see, but I said it
in dougle Lo, I was like herbs a beat biter.

Speaker 5 (50:31):
So we always made fun of it, and maybe that's
what you got magic saying that's where we got it.

Speaker 1 (50:37):
So you guys must really be perplexed now in twenty eighteen,
where it would be who the artist that actually mirror
a track that sounds similar to what came out before?

Speaker 2 (50:50):
I would welcome it now actually because it all sounds
like one record to me. Yeah, I mean, you know the.

Speaker 9 (50:55):
One thing that I love about this top show record
when I when I heard it, when I heard lights
record on this record listen up Everybody of Night the
MC five foot and you know I started crying like
I started literally crying because it was like, oh my gosh,
she took me to eighty eight. And like there's very
few times this year I got like emotional over records,

(51:16):
and one of them was watching nas do Ellmatic with
the Kennedy you know, Philharmonic. Like I lost my shit
when I watched Dealmatic and a three hundred piece orchestra.
But that simple little record, like her rhymeing like she
was seventeen again on a record that just came out

(51:38):
like five days ago. I was like, like the Indian
man in the garbage commercial.

Speaker 4 (51:44):
Yeah, I was.

Speaker 10 (51:46):
First of all, still to this day, you know. I
mean I mean people, can you say still sounds that
hungry on the mic?

Speaker 11 (51:54):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (51:55):
You know, but only yeah.

Speaker 9 (51:56):
But I mean, with all due respect, your record on
Yo be you went in, man, you went in, you
went in, Edwin in Dress went in. Doug's records incredible
and they were dancing and saying it and move into
I mean every record sounds like this celebration of eighty

(52:18):
eight and that, and it's why I went so hard,
you know what I mean, Like just from a marketing
and promotion.

Speaker 4 (52:25):
Perspective, it's like, yo, this it just sparked.

Speaker 9 (52:28):
Something in me and like put a battery in my
back that I'm like, Yo, there's there's a there's a
wealth of opportunity here for these brothers, for these icons
and these legends to get back out.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
Then, So what's the plan now that the album is out?
What's the the ongoing future plan for this project? Is
this just well good morning?

Speaker 9 (52:47):
I mean, you know I told like this, and I
told I didn't tell you this. Well, I told you
over the phone a little bit you heard yeah, but no, no, no.
But my concept for the performance on Good Morning America
is a small sample of what I want the tour
to be because how we listened and absorbed hip hop

(53:13):
is way different than rock guys did. Because rock guys
had radio twenty four hours a day.

Speaker 4 (53:21):
The Beatles could you could hear the Beatles.

Speaker 9 (53:22):
Six hundred times a week on fifty two stations between
New York and Philly. So the music was absorbed by
that boomer generation in a way that was very traditional.
So when they continued to kind of repitulate that music,
it was it was easy.

Speaker 4 (53:44):
It's not easy for us.

Speaker 9 (53:45):
There was nothing easy about eighty five to ninety two,
ninety three. It was three hour spurts and the only
time you really heard music was how it was blended together.
You'd go from Cain to Audio two to rob bas
and easy rock to MC light to a promo to
Da Da Da Da Da. So I feel like it's

(54:08):
time to engage that essence if I can't, like and
bring that out on on the road.

Speaker 4 (54:16):
And that's kind of the top shelf tour and how
I see it, you know, in the spring, and and
and again.

Speaker 9 (54:24):
Not to blow these two knuckleheads up there that are
right here, but but Benji like he's spending money like
it's a whiz Khalifer record. I mean, would all do respect?
And I'm not trying to dig in his pockets, I'm
really not, but like the patience and the presence of
mind to do what he's doing on the level that

(54:46):
he's doing it.

Speaker 4 (54:47):
No one's done it for these icons, no one, like never,
It's never happened.

Speaker 5 (55:00):
I got a question for Benji, and yes, being from Pittsburgh, right,
how did what was y'all y'all inspiration behind the beats?

Speaker 2 (55:10):
Like did y'all get tapes from New.

Speaker 5 (55:11):
York or like, because a lot of the beats are
in the pocket in that eighty eight sound like you
know what I mean? So, what was your inspiration behind
the beats?

Speaker 2 (55:22):
Like I was from New York and I grew up
in Jersey and Okay, so you had heavy access to it. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (55:30):
I used to watch Video Music Box every day after school,
so I mean it was part of my childhood.

Speaker 7 (55:36):
So and you know, for me from from Pittsburgh, we
didn't have a video music box, but we had sandwiches.

Speaker 9 (55:44):
Sorry, I know you had a local video show. I
forgot Homeboy's name, but you had a local video show.
The kid that was on buzz Zzy had like a
video show.

Speaker 4 (55:55):
Reggie Read the DJ that was on naz Ak, that's Cleveland.
There's a dude, Man, there's a dude in Pittsburgh. I
don't know if you remember him came.

Speaker 2 (56:06):
But he had a video show. This guy's a wealth
of knowledge. Yeah, like remember all the search write You
write it down.

Speaker 4 (56:15):
For me, like like a sky I got this ghetto.

Speaker 9 (56:18):
Pass that these black men and women allowed me to
make this music. Like if I don't remember everything, it
would be a disrespect to the people that allowed me
to go into the quarter, that allowed me to go
into Union Square. I mean, turn it like turn it
just a one eighty like Hawk could have just snuffed
me the second I walked in there, fuck out of here,

(56:39):
white boy.

Speaker 4 (56:41):
It would have been simple.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (56:42):
But you know what in the beginning of.

Speaker 5 (56:44):
Hip hop, man hip hop was for the not black
or white or Puerto Rican. It was for everybody. We
was all involved in it because it was music, It
was a rhythm. It was something that that brought together
all the people from the hood that ain't have no
wheels to go or something to have in common.

Speaker 2 (57:05):
It was a way to communicate and a way to
party together.

Speaker 5 (57:09):
Y'all had your different crews coming together, partying together without beef.

Speaker 2 (57:14):
And I respect that.

Speaker 9 (57:15):
But b I ain't seen nine white boy in any
park gym that I ever went to from nineteen eighty
to nineteen eighty six, except for Vanilla b aka Blake
Latham aka Lord Scotch aka KEYWAYK, like I saw nine
white people anywhere.

Speaker 1 (57:36):
Even in you were literally the one white person as the.

Speaker 4 (57:40):
Only white person.

Speaker 9 (57:41):
There was a joke understanding in mathematics who used to
do the big parties in Prospect Park when the five
percenters used to get together. You remember that understand that
had this Big Book of Life and he'd come on in.
I used to sneak in the Prospect Park and watch
the five percenter's break.

Speaker 2 (57:56):
Yo.

Speaker 4 (57:57):
He would say that.

Speaker 9 (57:57):
Search is the only white person except police at the
park game. Okay, I mean, yo, there were nine white people.
And that's why I got so mad, like I would.
I mean I got mad like eighty six. Like a
group came out on Select Records called B M O. C.

(58:18):
And was a guy named Shecky Green and this other dude,
and I'm.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
Like they were Capital Actually no, no, no, no they weren't.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
They weren't Select.

Speaker 10 (58:26):
Prospect or for Green Park. I'm sorry, Prospect. Yeah yeah,
I think they.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
Was on Capitol.

Speaker 4 (58:34):
No, there wasn't.

Speaker 2 (58:35):
The b C Boys were on Capital first before men
on campus.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
Yeah yeah, yeah, they were before the white boys.

Speaker 4 (58:42):
He was on the same time.

Speaker 9 (58:43):
I'm a white boys on and then the white boys.
And I'm like all this corny ship, like yo, funk
out of here, excuse my lad. But I was like,
you know what I'm saying, like, yo, it was it
was shut up. No, I know you did, but I
just you know, it's disrespectful. And my daughter me is here,
like I don't you know, but it's like, you know,
like I just don't want I was mad, like I

(59:06):
was mad, like you can't come in here, like you
don't know what I went through, Like I was battling
in Vandermere projects.

Speaker 4 (59:13):
I was van I was pink houses, like I was
tearing dudes.

Speaker 9 (59:17):
Down for money and like getting shot at, Like don't
come in here with some Connecticut nonsense and call yourself
BMOC like I'm not seeing you.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
So when did you When did you guys feel that
the spirit of hip hop, at least the transformation of it,
was slowly eroding? Like what was your first uh oh moment?
And I don't mean like when this guy rose to
prominence or whatever, but.

Speaker 11 (59:44):
When when When I heard.

Speaker 8 (59:50):
Women referred to as bitches by NWA, I was like something,
something's about to happen, Something's different because I had never
heard Caine, KRS One, Slick Rick Heavy d Fresh Prince.
I never heard any of them refer to a woman
as a bitch.

Speaker 9 (01:00:08):
Even go see the doctor was like respectful, right, The
word was skeezer, yeah, and that was really shady, Like
my mom would not let me say skeezer in the house.
You know what I'm saying like, but but I will
tell you. For me, I went to I'll never forget this.
I went to Roanoke, Virginia on tour with Kine. We

(01:00:30):
went back to back and the first year we went
it was Caine, Queen, Latifa, Digital Underground, third Base, nice
and smooth, eighty nine. Ronoke, black crowd, college crowd, felt good,
you know, it felt like any other place. We went
back a year later. Carol Lewis booked us a year

(01:00:52):
later in Ronoke. It was all white people all and
screaming for Caine and screaming for Digital under around and
screaming foret totally, totally and for me, like I was
through when we did Pop Goes the Weasel and we
went out on tour, you know, and we took Cypress

(01:01:13):
and Naughty and Tim Dog and all that, and we
would get to Pop Goes the Weasel and these drunk
frat white boys would come on our stage and try
to do stage diving, and our dances were from Long Beach.

Speaker 4 (01:01:24):
We weren't having that.

Speaker 9 (01:01:24):
We would body slam these dudes like they were rushing
the stage, like we were snuffing them, like we didn't
know what they were doing.

Speaker 4 (01:01:31):
Like I was I was done. Like for me, I
was done, Like I was like, this is just not
this is not what I expected.

Speaker 2 (01:01:38):
Shout out to eighty eight for you saying snuff.

Speaker 4 (01:01:40):
I know.

Speaker 11 (01:01:40):
Another moment, another moment that was different for me was.

Speaker 4 (01:01:45):
I could have said duff too right now, all of.

Speaker 8 (01:01:48):
Those women in the hot tub with Puffy and Biggie.
I was like, wait a second, what's happening here? It
was a lot, you know, as a woman looking at
these visuals, it was like I was really confused as
to where we were headed.

Speaker 4 (01:02:04):
But you trying to flip it on, trying to flip
it on.

Speaker 9 (01:02:09):
You try to flip the sexuality, try to take your sexuality.

Speaker 4 (01:02:13):
And you were saying what kind of guy you liked?

Speaker 11 (01:02:15):
Oh yeah, that's time. But they wouldn't.

Speaker 2 (01:02:19):
I was wasn't it a hot tubfo I'm.

Speaker 4 (01:02:22):
I'm not saying that.

Speaker 2 (01:02:23):
I don't. I don't.

Speaker 5 (01:02:24):
Just for me, it wasn't the music. It was when
they started first week sales. Huh, all of a sudden,
All of a sudden, they stopped developing artists, and all
of a sudden, it just jumped into who could say
the craziest thing and get the most like pre social

(01:02:47):
media pre going viral. It was what you could say
on record to get the most attention. And the first
week sales kind of like took away from artists me
and developed where you had to go open up for somebody,
You had to follow the tour bus in the van,
you know what I mean. It turned into something else where.
If your album then pop in like three weeks, it

(01:03:07):
was over, you know what I mean, Like not even
in hip hop. There was other genres of music where
the album been out for a year and didn't catch on,
and then it caught on.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
So to me, the first week sales kind of ruined.

Speaker 11 (01:03:21):
The chance of growth. I remember.

Speaker 9 (01:03:23):
I remember me and Pete and Clark Kemp were doing
a party at Irving Plaza when Palladium was open and
a young group got on stage in nineteen eighty six.
Nobody knew of them, a group called rob Based and
Easy Rock.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
They were on profile.

Speaker 9 (01:03:38):
My man Steve plot Nikki, who was head of retail,
said hey, can you get these guys a slot on
your on your Night? They came on, they did a
song called It Takes two. Didn't move nobody? What didn't
move nobody didn't? Clark Camp played it easy rock got
on the turntables, he was rhyming. No one could care less.

Speaker 2 (01:04:01):
A year later, was it the sound system?

Speaker 4 (01:04:03):
Nope, sound system was bumping.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
Was unfamiliar right now based on.

Speaker 4 (01:04:10):
Internationally known nobody was trying to check for them lyrics.

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
A year later it was a rap popularity.

Speaker 9 (01:04:16):
But no, no, no, But I'm talking about the timeline,
you know what I mean. Actually that record came out
now and it didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:04:23):
Pop in eight weeks. It'd be a rap, be a rap.
This record developed over a year.

Speaker 10 (01:04:29):
You know, a long time. You know when I noticed
a difference. I noticed a difference listening to radio and
seeing what was in heavy rotation, because like you know,
I remember, like when we came out n W A
easy E. They was popping and they were selling a

(01:04:50):
lot of records. Didn't get no radio play. Radio was
Scott Walker. Same thing was New York.

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
I don't know. In Philly we had uh sort of
no wrap work day. Like suddenly in ninety ninety one,
suddenly there was no rap work day. Like they took
away Lady B Street Beat for like a good two years.
It was like hard as hell. Then we had to
depend on college radio.

Speaker 10 (01:05:16):
But I'm saying. What I'm trying to say is like
that at all, I'm not I don't think so. You
didn't hear No NW on the radio. You didn't hear
Luke Skywalker on the radio. You didn't hear the Ghetto
Boys on the radio. We didn't sell, but they were
selling a lot of records and they were popping millions
of kind of hammer. But when you started hearing all

(01:05:38):
the Volga lyrics and the gangster rap being the main
thing becoming mainstream on radio, That's when I felt like, okay,
something something.

Speaker 2 (01:05:53):
That's how it's not ours gender?

Speaker 1 (01:05:56):
How easy or how hard was it to rock different
marketplaces that weren't New York based. So if saturd Off
could move you in nineteen eighty eight in New York,
when you guys would go to Phoenix or something or like.

Speaker 10 (01:06:14):
You had to understand your catalog. You had to understand
your catalog and knew what work with certain crowds. You
know certain places I knew that you know, I could
end with raw, I could end with warm it Up and.

Speaker 8 (01:06:27):
Usually the video because by then, Yo MTV raps was
rocking all over the nation, and you knew that the
song you had with your video you could do.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Yeah, it was a hot joint.

Speaker 5 (01:06:38):
I would cheat because I knew how to freestyle. Like
I remember doing a show in like Houston and they
had no clue I was, but I freestyled off of
a ghetto a ghetto boys beat and.

Speaker 2 (01:06:47):
Won them over. That's because my songs were really regional.

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
So you know what, I'm so glad you said that
shit before anything. We were living in London at the time,
so we had to go on ninth hand information. Yeah,
what happened at night of the freestyle between you and Supernat?

Speaker 5 (01:07:08):
Oh, that was just that was a situation where you know,
I was known for freestyle and you know, on the
radio and all of that, and a lot of people
knew that I could freestyle, and I was cool with
Organized Confusion, and they were working with Supernat and he
was in the studio talking about how he was the
greatest freestyler and they were like, well, yo, Craig g

(01:07:30):
could probably take you. So we were supposed to battle
on Bobido okay live on the radio, and I think
Buck While and a few other people were going to
bring their drum machines and that didn't show up. So
I'm at the New Music seminar and I'm just chilling.
I'm with like Diamond D and them, and he was
on stage and they just asked him. They were like, yo,

(01:07:51):
what's up with the battle with you and Craig g
And if you ever see the video? He kind of
looks out and it's on video. Yeah, they have like
clips of.

Speaker 2 (01:07:57):
It on video. Yeah. Is it on YouTube? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (01:08:00):
Oh god, yeah, it's like clips of it. It's probably
from the freestyle All the Rap movie. But he called
me out and I remound you out. Yeah, Craig, where
you at?

Speaker 2 (01:08:11):
What is that? That's a call out? Right yes?

Speaker 5 (01:08:13):
And then imagine him saying that and you turn around
and grand Master the Kaz is standing next to you,
who's like part of some of the most legendary battles.
I walked on stage with a forty ounce in my hand.
I wasn't prepared to battle him, but I did know,
and I knew I was the underdog, and I used
it against him. Basically, that's pretty much what happened. Like
I baited him, I said a regular rhyme. I knew

(01:08:34):
some information. Nobody told me. I researched everybody. I knew
he was some Indiana and it was perfect time. And
like I said, when you go back home to Indiana,
get Mike Tyson out the slammer and he couldn't.

Speaker 2 (01:08:45):
Recover, basically is what it was.

Speaker 12 (01:08:47):
You know.

Speaker 5 (01:08:48):
I talked to him a lot, like you know, he
lives in Calli and we might work on some music
at some point. We don't have the scheduling like that.
But you know, to me, it kind of helped me
because it took me from being this old school rapper
to being able to work my way into the underground
and have like a slightly second career from it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:09):
Yeah, the ripples that that caused.

Speaker 2 (01:09:12):
Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:09:15):
I don't know, I forget. I think Tim Westwood was
talking about like yeah, and this before the internet, so
there was such a viral moment that it just became
something on its own.

Speaker 2 (01:09:27):
But sometimes I could be an asshole.

Speaker 5 (01:09:29):
And I remember at the end of the battle, I
had a stack of cards from record labels and I
threw them all in the trash.

Speaker 2 (01:09:34):
Really, yeah, all the trash because I was like, nobody
was checking for me.

Speaker 5 (01:09:40):
So if it ain't genuine, I don't I don't want
to be the flavor of the month, right so you know,
I threw them all in the trash. I had rowdy records,
I had a stack of cards from labels. I threw
them all in the garbage.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
King, did you ever have any battles of note on?
I mean during that the period of where you're coming up,
like any MC's ever try try to challenge you.

Speaker 10 (01:10:00):
Like I mean, that's I started as a battle rapper.
That's all I did. Really, Yeah, That's all I did
until I met Biz. And that's how I met Biz.
I met Biz battling. I basked him for a battle.

Speaker 2 (01:10:11):
You never saw him with Keith Murray was rapping for him. No,
cut it out, man, I don't know what are we
talking about. Yeah that Keith?

Speaker 10 (01:10:24):
Yeah, now what Keith was fifteen man, you know he
was fifteen, just really getting started.

Speaker 2 (01:10:29):
Man, cut it out, man, nah man, you got it
to me.

Speaker 5 (01:10:32):
Man, you say rhyme in front of Cane and kine
to just say a rhyme at the top of your
rhyme by ninety five decibels of a bar and you
just you're like, okay, let me just go back home
and those other rhyme books.

Speaker 2 (01:10:44):
Keith was like.

Speaker 10 (01:10:47):
His name wasn't even Keith Murray. His rap name was
do Damage at the time. Oh, I don't know, eighty
eight maybe, But you.

Speaker 5 (01:10:56):
Know, coming up during that time, like if you lived
in a certain neighborhood and they knew you rhyme, you
couldn't leave a.

Speaker 2 (01:11:01):
House without battle with somebody. I mean, I remember Jazz
the whole Jazz Rush.

Speaker 1 (01:11:06):
Yeah, I hear of it in Philly, but I don't
what was Did you and Jazz Frush know each other
from Philly or just no?

Speaker 10 (01:11:13):
You know, I just found out, maybe like uh, two
years ago, that we had battled prior to after Midnight.
I didn't even know that, yeah, because I remember battling
someone at the rooftop that had dissed Bismarcky and I
stepped up and battled them there. I didn't know that
that was the same dude from after Midnight. Okay, I

(01:11:35):
remember the after Midnight thing, and I know it was
a time issue. I don't know whether I got there
late or what was going. I can't really remember. And
then we got we got on and I guess Dode
asked for the battle. We came up and we went
and we I don't know where we went, well, maybe
two rounds maybe, and dude didn't want to stop. Dude

(01:12:00):
didn't want to stop, and then Lady B told him, listen,
you need to stop. You need to stop, because sure
at first she said it to me like, yo, we
need to finish the show. And the dude didn't want
to stop.

Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
Just minchell.

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
He was like, I'll battle you. Yeah, this was Durman,
the show god, okay.

Speaker 10 (01:12:17):
And then the first Lady BE told me, you know,
so I was ready to go on with the show,
you know, because I knew that because I already at
the rooftop. I already gave it to him and it
was happening again. But dude, you know this dude, you know,
he didn't want to stop. And then Lady B told him, like,
you really need to stop. Like I'm like, give him

(01:12:38):
that look like you know, I'm doing you a favor.
But dude, dude was relentless with it, you know. And
then I threw I think one hundred dollars at him.
I was like, I was like, I was like, yeah,
here you go, man, he goes something for your troubles man,
something like being arrogant, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:12:56):
But yeah, I mean, I'm just finding out that it
was the same dude.

Speaker 5 (01:13:00):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:13:01):
I tried to ask Charlie Me and Charlie Mack was
talking about him performed but Ultra Magnetic Fie and Philly Yeah,
the Juice for joint we did though for Charlie Mack.

Speaker 10 (01:13:10):
Yeah, because I was telling Charlie Mack to bring up
because he said the dude still talks about I was, yo, dude,
I'm like, I'd love to see this guy.

Speaker 1 (01:13:17):
The legend of Caine versus Jash Fresh is like bigger
than what actually happened.

Speaker 2 (01:13:24):
I'm glad you told me what actually had a lot
of this monster.

Speaker 1 (01:13:27):
Yeah, yeah here. I don't know if it's on tape
or video or anything.

Speaker 10 (01:13:32):
No, Like Charlie Max said that he's like still today,
he'd be like, y'all know, I want y'all know, I
want I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
That I can attest dude.

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
That's like the garbage man. I mean, you know, you
know I ran for one hundred and fifty y'alls in
high school.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
Oh Pocai.

Speaker 10 (01:13:47):
Yeah, well, I mean, I I'll give Duke credit. He
didn't back down, you know what I'm saying, and he
wanted to keep it going. But what it was, it
was like we was in the middle of a show,
and I mean it was like you not winning, right,
there was a professional yeah you know.

Speaker 2 (01:14:01):
You know, but I mean, but you know, yeah, that's
what that was.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
Wow. Wow, ladies and gentlemen, I can go on forever.
It's about to be like zero o'clock of the morning. Yeah,
I will say. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, please please support
Top Shelf nineteen eighty eight. Can we expect any other
offspring videos?

Speaker 6 (01:14:28):
Oh?

Speaker 7 (01:14:28):
Yeah, definitely, definitely want to have some visuals in the future.
We're going to have some crazy vinyl next year and yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:35):
We would be available on hard that's yeah, that's the
most important.

Speaker 7 (01:14:38):
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, super yeah, absolutely. Can I just say
one thing, yes, absolutely so. In nineteen eighty eight, I
was ten years old in Pittsburgh. I was a paper boy,
like a real paper like I delivered newspapers and I
use that money to go to the record store.

Speaker 4 (01:14:56):
To buy tapes.

Speaker 7 (01:14:59):
And they were tapes of everyone that's in this room.
And and then I flashed forward to nineteen ninety at
the Syria Mosque when Third Base and Big Daddy Kane
Digital Underground were performing and I was there with my
brother and one of his friends.

Speaker 4 (01:15:18):
Cane.

Speaker 7 (01:15:18):
You came out in a hot tub. They pushed you
out in a hot tub.

Speaker 9 (01:15:27):
Ladies, you'll forgive me, ladies, lady, forgive me old time story.

Speaker 2 (01:15:35):
I'm sitting here like you have the bike and shorts.
Oh yeah, sexual chocolate, sexual chocolate actually work back. Oh
my goodness, it worked.

Speaker 7 (01:15:49):
But let me tell you how much of an honor
it is to just be here with you guys. It's
it's like really sort of a surreal experience for me.
So it's an honor to be here and to have
worked with you in some capacity and to you know,
bring this project to light. And you know, one of
my main things with this project is not just like, yeah,
go listen to Top Shelf nineteen eighty eight, like definitely

(01:16:09):
do because it's super dope, but also listen to everything else.
Listen to Long Leave of the Cane, listen to Lighters
of Rock, listen to all the different records that came
out then, and it's like a celebration of that time,
and it's a reminder of like, Yo, she was dope, you.

Speaker 2 (01:16:25):
Know what I mean.

Speaker 7 (01:16:26):
And that's like what I came up listening to, Like
that's like basically all I listened to and so to me,
it's important to always shine a light on it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:34):
We have to invest in our art and our artists. Yes,
you're you're right, ladies and gentlemen. I thank you very
much for coming to Normally I tell my crew to
give it up, but I'm the only person here.

Speaker 2 (01:16:46):
Give it up to.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
So on behalf of the top shelf like a crew
and the QLs crew. This is quest Love. Thank you
very much for joining us. This was a special edition
of Course Love Supreme. I'll see you on the next program.

Speaker 2 (01:17:03):
Peace Couest.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic episode
was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts
from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you listen to your favorite shows.