March 4, 2021 • 38 mins
In this episode, Erika and Whitney use their Hollywood skills to explore the history of reparations through the lens of three Black women trailblazers in the reparations movement. Whitney channels his best Richard Attenborough, in a Jurassic Park-MrDNA mashup, and gets a colorful history lesson from a Reparations Mosquito; played by the illustrious actress Cree Summer. Erika bends space time to posthumously interview Queen Mother Moore about her life and dedication in “the struggle.” Professor Mary Frances Berry uncovers the brave work of Callie House, whose fight for a pension for ex-slaves got her thrown in jail. And finally, reparations star Alderwoman Robin Rue Simmons defies gravity to change American history in Evanston, Illinois. This inspires the duo to imagine what it would be like to live, “In A World…”
Guest voiceover appearance: Cree Summer
The Queen Mother Moore audio was Courtesy of the Tamiment Library at New York University.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
I Am America Alexander, and I'm Whitney Dow. Welcome to
Reparations The Big Payback, a production of Color Farm Media,
I Heart Radio, and The Black Effect Podcast Network. Whitney.
When we started this journey, we spoke of our own
origin stories and how remarkable it was that our very
different lives led us to arrive at the same place.
So I feel that we can't go any further until
(00:28):
we lay out the history of reparations. It's a big
world and we can't mention everything, but we can focus
on a few historic examples to give people an understanding
of how long this battle has been going on. It's
a really long and complicated story, and it has lots
of heroes and villains, but it's also a story that's
populated with people that we don't know, the people that
(00:50):
were fighting for reparations and obscurity. But right now, I
want to talk about a few people who I think
are really important to the movement. I'm thinking of Calli House,
who was born into slave ree and then mounted a
major push for pensions for the formerly enslaved in the
eighteen hundreds. Then there's Queen Mother Moore, who is a
major figure in the reparations movement in the middle of
the twentieth century. And Robin Ruth Simmons and Alderman from Evanston, Illinois.
(01:13):
He's making history today with the first tax fund reparations
program in US history. Oh it's awesome. I'm excited. But
the phrase history lesson is a snoozer. So let's make
this fun for ourselves. And here's where my film and
television background, You're welcome may be useful. Okay, how about this? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
(01:35):
Maybe we can do like an Uncle Remus sketch in
Song of the South, you know, only this time you
play Uncle Remus talking to the Blackbird explaining the history
of the reparations movement. Oh yeah, how's your Southern accent?
You want me to play the Uncle Remus of reparations?
(01:57):
Have you heard of cancel culture? Okay, all right, I
mean look, I mean, hey, I was you don't have
to play Uncle Remus. I was trying not to typecast.
You probably can't even hummaton, but look I got it.
Oh this is it. Have you ever seen Jurassic Park?
The first one I have? But now I'm really confused
(02:21):
Erica about where this thing is going. Listen. Okay, this
is awesome. Let's use this technique that they used to
teach the visiting scientists Jeff gold Bloom, Sam Neil and
Laura Dern how the Jurassic Park science team rebread those
big old dinosaurs from the DNA samples locked in amber fossils.
(02:46):
So you play the part of Richard Attenborough and he's
very charming, so you have to you know, you'll make do.
But okay, um and um, we'll get ah, I know,
creased summer to play the part of the know it
all reparations mosquito, creased summer. Okay, in that case, I'm in.
But God help me. Hello Whitney, or should I say
(03:14):
Professor Dow Hello reparations Mosquito, and please call me Whitney.
So today we're going to be learning about the history
of reparations. Indeed, I'm difficult, yet worthy conversation told within
the rich, painful tapestry of America's failure to acknowledge the
(03:36):
sin of slavery and the debt owed to its formerly
enslaved people and their descendants. Here. Wait, that was exhausting.
I quit. Oh no, you don't. Reparations Mosquito, no backing
out now. Talking about race in America can be exhausting,
But trying to get reparations, that's like shake up a
(03:57):
snow globe in Boston expecting it to bring in Cleveland. Sadly,
I'm sure they had made perfect sense to you, Whitney.
Let's get started. Everyone's a critic, I know, Okay, I'm
all yours. This is the cliff Notes version, right. Well,
we can't talk about reparations without identifying the need for
(04:19):
it in the first place, and that all comes down
to the sin of slavery. A complicated discussion that takes
more time than I got, so yes, please google that,
but suffice it to say, the profits and progress made
from the unpaid labor of slaves transformed America's economy and
(04:40):
made America the most powerful country in the world in
record time. Thank gad he didn't last. Soon came emancipation
and a bloody Civil War. Long story short, they lost,
(05:12):
we won, and a period of reconstruction began. Entered General
William to come to Sherman. Sherman meets with a group
(05:33):
of freedmen who asked Sherman to create a way they
could benefit from their own labor. Their request land In response,
General Sherman issues Special Field Order Number fifteen, four hundred
thousand acres would be given to the freedman for settlement
or to break it down for their acres and of you.
(05:55):
Hence the famous phrase was born. But that didn't last long.
President Link was assassinated and the new President, Andrew Johnson
vetoed the bill mean while the Southern Homestead Act of
eighteen sixty six was created. It gave black people six
months to buy land at low rates, but no one
(06:18):
could afford the land, so the program failed. There were
some bright spots. Callie House started the National ex Slave
Mutual Relief, Bounty and Tension Association, but the group was
investigated by the Department of Justice and Cally was introduced
(06:38):
to the newest legal form of slavery, jail. Marcus Garvey
believed all black people should return to their rightful homeland, Africa,
so he started the United Negro Improvement Association, but the
FEDS infiltrated at and he wound up in jail. Two
(07:00):
m yep. That whole lacking of black people for fighting
for injustice never fill out of vogue. See also segregation, lynching,
Jim Crow, but Whitney a lot has happened in between,
so let's fast forward to the nineteen sixties. I never
(07:24):
leave a man behind you. Good cool, Let's continue. Jim Foreman,
you know him. He made big headlines when he interrupted
the service at Riverside Church to demand five hundred millions
in reparations from predominantly white religious institutions for their role
(07:46):
in perpetuating slavery. Queen Mother Moore kept the pressure on
and petition the government for compensation for slavery, but reparations.
After this say we need and deserve federal restitution. In
(08:07):
ninety nine, Congressman John Conyers introduced a bill just to
study proposals for reparations for Black Americans, and he had
to reintroduce the bill each congressional term until he left
office in two thousand seventeen. The Bill family made a
decision two years later, thanks the Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee. Unfortunately,
(08:28):
it is still waiting for approval from the House Judiciary Committee.
So let me begin. America is a place and welcomes
the diversity of thought. We even welcome the diversity of
thought among the multicolored chocolate people that are African Americans.
Good luck, sister Sheila, who jee whiz Whitney. Reparations ain't easy. There,
(08:58):
I told you, wait a minute, I'm a guy. Reparations
has seen a huge wave of renewed interest over the years.
America Civil and racial unrest, mixed with a global pandemic
in twenty twenty made crystal clear the disparity, suffering, and
(09:19):
terrorism that continue to plague all communities of color, poor people,
and especially black people. And though George Floyd's murder was
a rallying call for action, the ugly, mostly white mob
of insurrection Is swarmed America's capital in January six, twenty one.
Oh sometime it seemed like we live in constant sorrow,
(09:44):
in a world without end. A man, Oh, I forgot
to tell you something, Okay, I think I know what's
coming here. In two thousand and ninet, four hundred years
after the first enslaved Africans arrived, something wonderful, something extraordinary
(10:09):
happened in Evanston. Against all odds, with a mostly white council,
Alderman Robin Ruth Simmons successfully passes America's first Referations's Bill,
which assesses a three percent tax on leal cannabis sales
to create a fund to make cash payments to qualified
black Evanstonians. That's amazing, right, I'll say. And I know
(10:34):
this revelation may have many black folks asking where in
the hell is Evanston. It's in Illinois, just in case
you're plotting a move. Well that's all, folks, bravo. This
(10:57):
is absolutely the best history lesson I've ever got from
a Mosquito. Thank you, You're welcome. Unfortunately, this is the
worst gig I ever had. Ain't got no sempor trailer
my makeup or that's no massus. This dude that used
to bring me what I need when I needed it,
quarantine blocking all my connects. But now you know more
(11:19):
than you did about the wonderful world of reporations. So
long Whitney hugs the Erica. Yess my girl, she's such
a cute pack. So long Creed, I mean, so long
reparations Mosquito. Wow, Erica. That didn't sting at all. Oh
(11:43):
that was freaking terrific. Oh, thank you, thank you Chris
Summer for lending her master voice to this piece. She's amazing.
Um A little jealous you two got to play, but
I think it's something cool to do later. To even
the score. Bill Whitney, you did a good job too.
I appreciate the props Erica. You know, so my first
conversation with Mosquito, but hopefully my last. But now you know,
(12:06):
I love the story of Kelly House, and I love
that we got a chance to talk to historian Mary
Francis Barry, who wrote the book on this. Amazing woman,
Mary Francis Barry. She's fantastic, she's smart, beautiful, in great shape.
She's eighty two. Okay, I want to be here. Cally
House was a black woman who had been a slave.
(12:28):
You know, her mother had been a slave, her father
had fought in the Union Army as a runaway slave.
And she was at church and she heard about some
white guy who had asked the federal government for pensions
for slaves on the brow ex slaves, he called them
on the grounds that the money would go into the
(12:49):
pockets of the white people on the plantations where they
were all still working, and that this was an indirect
way to help white Southerners after the Civil War, and
we can struction. But when she heard about it, she said, well,
I don't understand why we can't do this for ourselves.
Why can't we start some and ask the federal government
to give us some pensions that we use for ourselves,
(13:12):
After all, we were the ones who were slaves. And
so she went around organizing herself in churches, and she
would get people to if they couldn't write, somebody would
write down their name and put what plantation they were
on and so on, and they would put an x
bot and sent them off to Congress. And eventually it
grew and grew and grew, and she started traveling all
(13:35):
of the plays, collecting petitions, listening to people's stories and
all that, and the federal government got concerned. They decided
because letters were coming from white people saying, the Negroes
are meeting in churches and they come out saying and
talking about someday we're gonna get something, and we know
that I don't get anything, and we're scared of them.
So you need to do something about that woman who's
(13:57):
going around there stirn them up. And so they decided
to go after her. They said the fetes did that.
She had about three hundred thousand dudes paying members the
dues of cents a year, and she was laughed at
by middle class negroes because she was not very well educated.
(14:18):
She had only been like, you know, the sixth grade,
and the government decided that they would get after her
for using the mails to defraud. Some of you may
remember that that's what they did to market Garment later,
and they said that she was using the mails to
defraud because she was telling black people that she was
going to negros, that she was going to try to
(14:39):
get the federal government give them some money. And she
should know the federal government is never gonna give negroes
any money. That's the way they put it. So it
was fraud to be organizing people. And they ended up
prosecuting her, but all white jury in Tennessee, and they
put in prison for her trouble. After that, there were
branches who had There were black folks all the south.
(15:02):
One was in New York City. They were all out
in the black towns. And then there were people like
Queen Mother Bore who was in the New Orleans chapter,
all of whom became Garbagates. And so you can trace
the present day reparations movement within Cobra and the other
organizations all the way back to Callis House and her
(15:23):
ex lay pension movement. A remarkable woman. And I think
the people who say had their names on there at
a time when they were attacked, when they were under
attack and could be abused and everything else, their descendants
ought to get something Malcolm X talks about. If you
stick a knife in my back nine inches, pull it
(15:44):
out six inches, that's not progress. If you pull it
all the way out, that's not progress. The progress comes
from the healing the moon that the blow made. You're
talking about the loss so many hundreds of years of
human potential. How would reparations impact of progress on issues?
If we quality the reparations are the most direct way
to target money to ease the disparities and let black
(16:11):
people decide how to spend the money. But first the
country has to acknowledge the disparities, and if people refuse
to then that means that they're ignot acknowledging that slavery
was an institution that did not benefit slaves. Once you
accept what happened, then in fact, demanding reparations is easy.
(16:32):
We should go after local city councils, local mayors, local
government and organize the way Kelly House did, and better
because we have better communication now to organize and demand
that local communities pass measures to do this. The Cally
(16:56):
Howd story is really interesting because it's both inspiring and
completely depressing at the same time. You know, it's inspiring
what this woman managed to accomplish at the height of
the white terror and post reconstruction America, but it's really
depressing because she did this, build a incredible organization and
trying to get reparations for the formerly enslaved, and the
(17:16):
response of the government was to thrower in jail. Now,
I keep getting the feeling that white Americans feel that
if they just open this reparations doors just a crack,
they're not gonna be able to contain what comes flooding through.
So they keep barring the door, and the pressure just
keeps building and building. Yeah, it's funny that to me,
it's not a door, it's it already exists. They either
(17:38):
keep going and not talking about it, or they, you know,
look at it and they face it, because it's kind
of like an energy that's already out there. But whether
they realize it or not. You've been telling me about
CALLI House for a while, and I am a new fan. Look,
I'm a believer. Dr Barry, Thank you, thank you you
are river to your people. Thanks for educating us about
who in what really matters, you know. But Whitney, I
(18:01):
just realized that the pioneers were talking about today are
all black women, and they all, all of them paid
an emotional price for their work in the struggle. It's
kind of like the same thing today right Erica. There's
lots of strong black women leaders and they're taking a
lot of shots right now. Look at Stacy and Georgia. Yeah, Stacy,
Ayana ill han Omar, You've got Natasha Brown. I mean yeah,
(18:22):
I could go on and on and on. There's amazing
black women that have always been there doing their thing,
and it's time for them to get their flowers. Speaking
of which, I'm a bit competitive and I want to
do something cool like your Jurassic Park history mash up.
So I'm gonna use my black wizard skills. You didn't
know I had them to do something I know you
cannot do. I am an actor with access and so
(18:44):
you're you. But look I'm going to um, yeah, I'm
gonna do something cool. So what are we gonna get?
A song? Like a morality play? Maybe some a cappella. Nope,
I'm gonna go back in time. I'm going to talk
to a queen, a pioneer of reparations whose life story
led her to become a force of nature in the struggle.
I'm gonna talk to Queen Mother Moore. How are you
(19:06):
going to do that? I use a little bit of
magic to do it, and I believe if I listen, well,
I'll come back forever changed. So here, let's do this.
Let's adjust the volume a little bit, Mr Pop Okay,
I just know I needed to get on the right
frequency and always works in the movies. Oh gosh, you're here.
(19:31):
It worked. Oh you don't know how I but I
got to go through to kid here own. Okay, chill Erica,
you know she ain't got time for that. Welcome Queen Mother.
I'm glad that you're here. Thank you so much, and
thank you for blessing us with your story. Yes, no,
thank you, ma'am. You know where I come from, this
homeless of people to call themselves queen Charlemagne, the god Queen, Queen, Queen.
(19:54):
He calls me queen. But you know what, how did
you become the queen? Mother? Mea was restored upon me
by the African students. First of all, as a result
of my years of activities in this country. African students, well,
they gave it to me. And when I went to
(20:15):
Africa to dr and crew mass funeral, they chief heard
about me and he sent for me to come to
him and I went and he said, I'm going to
make you a fishery queen mother, queen mother of the Ashanti,
and he initiated me the queen mother. But I was
(20:36):
queen mother before I went to Africa. We know you
did amazing things in Harlem, but you're actually from the
South right. But yes, I was born in New Iberia, Louisiana,
seven ninety. I grew up in New Orleans, Louisiana. My
(20:58):
parents came from New all into Louisiana. My grandparents came
from New Iberia, Louisiana. My father worked for herself. My
mother was a housewife. I had two brothers and five sisters.
I was the sixth one in the family, Queen of
the more Where would you say that your story starts?
(21:20):
What was life like growing up for you? My mother
died when I was five years old, and after Papa died,
my brother sold the house that papa had left. And
mind your papa had told him that told me that
brother Henry would take care of us. Well. He took
(21:41):
care of us all right. The moment he came from
the funeral, he said we had to move, and I
had my little sisters. So I took a few of
Papa's moves to the auction and sold them and readed
an apartment. I left New Orleans during the war. I
left and went to Muscle Shoals m Muscial Souls well
(22:05):
Wreatha did a lot of recording there. Yes, really difficult
to listen to you tell your story, but you made
it through. Yes, So how did you get started with
your work? We talked a lot about origin stories. What
was the origin of your work? Within that cause? My
face encounter with the real struggle was with the Red Cross,
(22:28):
who discriminated against the black recruits. They gave the white
recruits coffee and doughnuts while they were mobilizing them, and
they didn't give anything to the black recruits. And I
mobilized the people around to make what we used to
call hook cakes and coffee and gave it to the
(22:48):
blacks who were congregated waiting to be shipped off. And
my sister and I we found a place where the
soldiers could come and we got an old phonic have
and a lot of scratch records. Well, it was a
place where the men could come in and play cards
or checkers or something. So we consider ourselves having to
(23:12):
face USO among black Oh wow, so you've been organizing
around the black community for a while, But how did
you get to the liberation movement like your work with
the great Marcus Garvey. Well, I was face brought in
turned Marcus Carvey movement by the fact that he I
understood that he was to come and speak to us
(23:34):
in Louisiana. And we went to the meeting and low
and behold, he didn't come, and we had the mayor
refused to allow him to come. So we were very
incensed about it and got a delegation to go see why.
Then it was guaranteed that Marcus Carvey would come. The
(23:55):
next night, the hall was packed with people. Everybody went
with ammunition, had guns. Everybody had guns, Black people with guns.
Blue Steve Smith and Western's German lugers. Really and uh,
I had two guns with me. Y'all showed up and
(24:18):
showed out, that's what's up. Amazing and ammunition, a bag
of ammunition. Everybody had what you call a suitcase today
because we was afraid the police would stop him from
coming again and we wanted to protect him. Wow, in
the night that he did come, what happened, thirty people
(24:40):
was in that hall. So when God came, reapplauded very much,
and he said, my friends, I wanted to apologize for
not speaking to you last night. But the reason I
didn't speak to you because the mayor permitted himself to
be used as a stooge by the police department to
prevent me for speaking to you. And when he said that,
(25:02):
the police jumped up and said, I'll run you in.
And when the police did that, everybody jumped up on
the benches we had benches then and took out their
guns straight up. The guns were straight up in the air.
Speak Gorvy set and Gorvy said, And as I was saying,
and he went and repeated itself, and the police filed
(25:25):
out of their like little puppy dolls. Every police been
filed out of the hall. And I can't forget that
speak Garvey speak. Oh I wish I was there. And
that was your first experience with Marcus Garvey. Amazing. Oh yes,
I'm still a life member the Garvey movements, like to
join the Garvey movement after that, How did this impact
(25:50):
your path as an activist? Well, after must have shown.
I went back to New Orleans and stayed there a
while until Marcus Garvey came on the sea in so
then we came to HALLM. Well, anyhow, HALLM was waste
than anything we had seen. They had for white only
signs and only apartment houses in Hallm for white only,
(26:12):
big signs outside, and we had to go upstairs in
the lowest theater like we did in the South. Same thing,
the white people sitting the bottom downstairs and we had
to go upstairs, and that kind of thing. So nobody
could work in HALLM. No black place. And while you
were in Harlem, you began working with Garvey's Universal Negro
(26:34):
Improvements Association and uh the African Communities League. Oh yes,
I had gone to his meetings and had was his
guest divino on the Black store line. He bought some
ships and they were very unsuccessful because they were sabotaged.
You know. What was his plan for the ships to
(26:54):
do export import from Africa, trade and so on. So
I was very impressed with that. So was Marcus Garvey
who helped push you to look towards Africa with your work. Yes, well,
it was to teach our people self esteem for one thing,
and our history and pride in our nation. And the
(27:20):
other thing was self sufficiency going into business and so on,
and to think in terms of the development of Africa,
to help free Africa from colonialism, that kind of thing. Okay,
So is that how you got into your reparations petition. Yes,
the petition called for us to go back to Africa.
(27:44):
So those who wanted to go back, and for those
who wanted to stay here, they had to be certain
indemnity given for the people who wanted to stay the
people who wanted to go. I was asking for two
hundred billion dollars for the injury that we have received
(28:05):
as a result of our enslaveman. Okay, two under billionaire.
That was a lot of money. Then in now, would
you say the petition was successful? I got very good response,
and he told me that we needed a member nation
to introduce the resolution since we were not officially remembers
(28:25):
of the You and I'm sorry, Queen mother more, I'm
having trouble here. I think we're losing our connection free
Mother More. Hello, you were talking about the members that
you needed someone to introduce the resolution. Oh, just one
that was getting good? I think, Oh I lost her.
(28:47):
M hm, that was amazing. Wow, what was it like
to talk to a legend? No, you know, I ain't
got the words. I mean, Queen Mother More. She's a
queen and you saw. I mean she suffered for her
struggle work, as she put it, but she was unstoppable.
She never quit and we have to celebrate her life.
And when I think about all the soft handed complainers
(29:09):
that we got, now me included, you know, battling racism
one well written witty post at the time. But look,
I just want to say this. I love black people.
I love you. We are unique on this planet. Why
did the universe choose of US African Americans to tell
this epic story? I mean to bear this poisonous thorny crown.
(29:30):
I'm inspired by Queen Mother Moore and I salute her,
and I will work harder and I think twice. I
will think twice before complaining about the lack of gluten
free treats at the craft service table. I'm changed, So Erica,
this history is amazing. You know, we've been talking about
Cally House now Queen Mother Moore. But it also pulls
(29:51):
up these other things for me as well, that there's
another side of the story, and that's the white side
of the story. The pressers in the story that we're
hearing the people that opposed Cally House, people and lock
are up the people that opposed Queen Mother Moore. It's
complicated when you think about your legacy and how you're
connected to these things. You know, I want to celebrate
people like Calli and Queen Mother more, but at the
(30:12):
same time, I have to figure out how do I
take ownership of the other side of the story. When
you think about history, there's history being made right now
in Ebste Illinois. Alderman Robin Ruth Simmons from the Fifth
Ward has just passed the first tax funded reparations bill
in US history. I live in a city that has
(30:34):
acknowledged our collective wrongdoing and we have acknowledged that we
want to do something radically different in passing it. So
that makes me hopeful. And the beauty of this reparation
goal is it's in line with my highest priorities in
my role as Alderman, I've known as reparation Robin and
(30:56):
rolls of parks. Now, so that's different. I feel incredibly
proud to lead in a community that allowed such radical
policy and uncomfortable conversation. People have been extremely nasty to me,
and I really, you know, feel bad for them that
(31:17):
whatever is happening in their life that is so miserable,
that they are in so much pain that they want
to share it and pass it all around. So I
feel sad for them, and I forgive them and hope
that they find some peace. So when that happens, even
you know, it's my faith that allows me to work
(31:37):
past the pain that I received and take that pain
and figure out how to turn it into some purpose.
I would love for more people to take ownership of
it and do the work. It's important. It's going to
have to happen. We have officially started our public subcommittee meetings.
You've established the timeline, and we have prioritized the initialmity
(32:01):
and we're gonna start with housing, you know, keeping our
black community. We have a declining population as serving a
very diverse community. Right of the population is black and
the rest of the community is not black, and they
don't understand as much. So at the same time as
I'm working on the policy, building relationships, finding resources, I
(32:23):
still have a huge piece of education. In the process
of this. I have been supporting the City of Chicago
and the State of Illinois on their initiatives, just being
an advocate, showing up to speak, sharing what was possible
in Evanston, and hopefully giving some inspiration to the leaders
at the state level and the city level. I'm also
(32:46):
in full support of HR forty and supporting anyone that
is looking to get that passed. The amount of support
that I have received from leaders and experts has really
given me confidence to tenue the second leg of the work.
We are likely to be the you know, not only
the first city, but also in the first state in bordering,
(33:08):
the first major city to have a local reparative policy,
a local reparation They're going to be more actions that require,
you know, a majority vote. But right now, in terms
of the direction, the thought, leadership, the intentions, I have
said it, and I will continue nurturing it, and I
(33:31):
will see it through. You Know, every time I hear
Robin I start, I think about something that's always kind
of in the back of my mind as a white person,
is that I look at this community, Evanston, Illinois, and
who's committed to give reparations to their black residents. But
the effort was really driven by this black woman who
(33:51):
put this whole program together and drove it to the
mostly white city council. And so I always wonder, if
we owe this, why aren't we take king the lead
on it more? But I think what's really interesting about Evanston,
and something that you and Iraq I've talked a lot about,
is that what does a world that has had reparations
(34:12):
pay it look like? And in Evsn, Illinois, in a
few months, we're going to start to see three black
women we never met locked together in their destinies. It's
one long epic put on like the Odyssey or the Mahabarata,
(34:35):
which I was in and did world tour the public
theater long ago. But I digress. Anyway, Whitney, let's think
about that world. But we need to give our history
lesson the rock and heroes finale it deserves because of
their work and others. One day we may finally get reparations,
and what would that be like? The narrative would get
(35:02):
flipped in a world where reparations exist in America for
the descendants of African slaves. The human potential lost in
the white capped, stormy seas, mixed with the blood and
pain of centuries, is slowly regained and reanimated in the
(35:25):
multi colored chocolate children who reclaim their destinies and God
given potential, and ironically, American democracy is saved and finally realized,
not by a caped, crusading billionaire bat or a greasy
haired alien with a red s s on his chest,
(35:46):
but by real life heroes of all colors, previously locked
into the villain roll, newly free to be the gods
and earths they were always meant to be. During Alexander
and Whitney dow as they battle for the soul of
America in the new action adventure Buckbuster Reparations, The Big
(36:13):
Payback next time on Reparations, the big payback, to paraphrase W. B.
Du Boise on the subject of the history of slavery,
of the exploitation and violence against African Americans in US history,
American people have been, as he put it, spoiled by sweets. Right,
(36:36):
so we have too often got a nice nationalist dessert
with a big old helping of American exceptionalism on top
and to a large extent, it's not true, and we're
not going to be able to face the future effectively,
I think, if we continue to insist that the history
of slavery and the history of land from Indigenous people
(37:01):
are not the central realities of the first quarter millennium
of our history. This podcast is produced by Eric Alexander,
Ben ar Noon and Whitney Dow. The executive producers are
Charlemagne the God and Dolly S. Bishop. The Supervising producer
is Nicole Childers, and the lead producer is Devin Mavock Robbins.
(37:24):
The producer writer is Sires Castle, and the Associate producer
is Kevin fan With additional research and writing support provided
by Nile Blast. Original music by d J D t
P The Queen Mothermore audio was courtesy of the Tammament
Library at New York University Reparations The Big Payback as
(37:48):
a production of Color Farm Media, I Heart Radio and
The Black Effect Podcast Network in association with Best Case Studios.
For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I
heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
I Am America Alexander, and I'm Whitney Dow. Welcome to
Reparations The Big Payback, a production of Color Farm Media,
I Heart Radio, and The Black Effect Podcast Network. Whitney.
When we started this journey, we spoke of our own
origin stories and how remarkable it was that our very
different lives led us to arrive at the same place.
So I feel that we can't go any further until
(00:28):
we lay out the history of reparations. It's a big
world and we can't mention everything, but we can focus
on a few historic examples to give people an understanding
of how long this battle has been going on. It's
a really long and complicated story, and it has lots
of heroes and villains, but it's also a story that's
populated with people that we don't know, the people that
(00:50):
were fighting for reparations and obscurity. But right now, I
want to talk about a few people who I think
are really important to the movement. I'm thinking of Calli House,
who was born into slave ree and then mounted a
major push for pensions for the formerly enslaved in the
eighteen hundreds. Then there's Queen Mother Moore, who is a
major figure in the reparations movement in the middle of
the twentieth century. And Robin Ruth Simmons and Alderman from Evanston, Illinois.
(01:13):
He's making history today with the first tax fund reparations
program in US history. Oh it's awesome. I'm excited. But
the phrase history lesson is a snoozer. So let's make
this fun for ourselves. And here's where my film and
television background, You're welcome may be useful. Okay, how about this? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
(01:35):
Maybe we can do like an Uncle Remus sketch in
Song of the South, you know, only this time you
play Uncle Remus talking to the Blackbird explaining the history
of the reparations movement. Oh yeah, how's your Southern accent?
You want me to play the Uncle Remus of reparations?
(01:57):
Have you heard of cancel culture? Okay, all right, I
mean look, I mean, hey, I was you don't have
to play Uncle Remus. I was trying not to typecast.
You probably can't even hummaton, but look I got it.
Oh this is it. Have you ever seen Jurassic Park?
The first one I have? But now I'm really confused
(02:21):
Erica about where this thing is going. Listen. Okay, this
is awesome. Let's use this technique that they used to
teach the visiting scientists Jeff gold Bloom, Sam Neil and
Laura Dern how the Jurassic Park science team rebread those
big old dinosaurs from the DNA samples locked in amber fossils.
(02:46):
So you play the part of Richard Attenborough and he's
very charming, so you have to you know, you'll make do.
But okay, um and um, we'll get ah, I know,
creased summer to play the part of the know it
all reparations mosquito, creased summer. Okay, in that case, I'm in.
But God help me. Hello Whitney, or should I say
(03:14):
Professor Dow Hello reparations Mosquito, and please call me Whitney.
So today we're going to be learning about the history
of reparations. Indeed, I'm difficult, yet worthy conversation told within
the rich, painful tapestry of America's failure to acknowledge the
(03:36):
sin of slavery and the debt owed to its formerly
enslaved people and their descendants. Here. Wait, that was exhausting.
I quit. Oh no, you don't. Reparations Mosquito, no backing
out now. Talking about race in America can be exhausting,
But trying to get reparations, that's like shake up a
(03:57):
snow globe in Boston expecting it to bring in Cleveland. Sadly,
I'm sure they had made perfect sense to you, Whitney.
Let's get started. Everyone's a critic, I know, Okay, I'm
all yours. This is the cliff Notes version, right. Well,
we can't talk about reparations without identifying the need for
(04:19):
it in the first place, and that all comes down
to the sin of slavery. A complicated discussion that takes
more time than I got, so yes, please google that,
but suffice it to say, the profits and progress made
from the unpaid labor of slaves transformed America's economy and
(04:40):
made America the most powerful country in the world in
record time. Thank gad he didn't last. Soon came emancipation
and a bloody Civil War. Long story short, they lost,
(05:12):
we won, and a period of reconstruction began. Entered General
William to come to Sherman. Sherman meets with a group
(05:33):
of freedmen who asked Sherman to create a way they
could benefit from their own labor. Their request land In response,
General Sherman issues Special Field Order Number fifteen, four hundred
thousand acres would be given to the freedman for settlement
or to break it down for their acres and of you.
(05:55):
Hence the famous phrase was born. But that didn't last long.
President Link was assassinated and the new President, Andrew Johnson
vetoed the bill mean while the Southern Homestead Act of
eighteen sixty six was created. It gave black people six
months to buy land at low rates, but no one
(06:18):
could afford the land, so the program failed. There were
some bright spots. Callie House started the National ex Slave
Mutual Relief, Bounty and Tension Association, but the group was
investigated by the Department of Justice and Cally was introduced
(06:38):
to the newest legal form of slavery, jail. Marcus Garvey
believed all black people should return to their rightful homeland, Africa,
so he started the United Negro Improvement Association, but the
FEDS infiltrated at and he wound up in jail. Two
(07:00):
m yep. That whole lacking of black people for fighting
for injustice never fill out of vogue. See also segregation, lynching,
Jim Crow, but Whitney a lot has happened in between,
so let's fast forward to the nineteen sixties. I never
(07:24):
leave a man behind you. Good cool, Let's continue. Jim Foreman,
you know him. He made big headlines when he interrupted
the service at Riverside Church to demand five hundred millions
in reparations from predominantly white religious institutions for their role
(07:46):
in perpetuating slavery. Queen Mother Moore kept the pressure on
and petition the government for compensation for slavery, but reparations.
After this say we need and deserve federal restitution. In
(08:07):
ninety nine, Congressman John Conyers introduced a bill just to
study proposals for reparations for Black Americans, and he had
to reintroduce the bill each congressional term until he left
office in two thousand seventeen. The Bill family made a
decision two years later, thanks the Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee. Unfortunately,
(08:28):
it is still waiting for approval from the House Judiciary Committee.
So let me begin. America is a place and welcomes
the diversity of thought. We even welcome the diversity of
thought among the multicolored chocolate people that are African Americans.
Good luck, sister Sheila, who jee whiz Whitney. Reparations ain't easy. There,
(08:58):
I told you, wait a minute, I'm a guy. Reparations
has seen a huge wave of renewed interest over the years.
America Civil and racial unrest, mixed with a global pandemic
in twenty twenty made crystal clear the disparity, suffering, and
(09:19):
terrorism that continue to plague all communities of color, poor people,
and especially black people. And though George Floyd's murder was
a rallying call for action, the ugly, mostly white mob
of insurrection Is swarmed America's capital in January six, twenty one.
Oh sometime it seemed like we live in constant sorrow,
(09:44):
in a world without end. A man, Oh, I forgot
to tell you something, Okay, I think I know what's
coming here. In two thousand and ninet, four hundred years
after the first enslaved Africans arrived, something wonderful, something extraordinary
(10:09):
happened in Evanston. Against all odds, with a mostly white council,
Alderman Robin Ruth Simmons successfully passes America's first Referations's Bill,
which assesses a three percent tax on leal cannabis sales
to create a fund to make cash payments to qualified
black Evanstonians. That's amazing, right, I'll say. And I know
(10:34):
this revelation may have many black folks asking where in
the hell is Evanston. It's in Illinois, just in case
you're plotting a move. Well that's all, folks, bravo. This
(10:57):
is absolutely the best history lesson I've ever got from
a Mosquito. Thank you, You're welcome. Unfortunately, this is the
worst gig I ever had. Ain't got no sempor trailer
my makeup or that's no massus. This dude that used
to bring me what I need when I needed it,
quarantine blocking all my connects. But now you know more
(11:19):
than you did about the wonderful world of reporations. So
long Whitney hugs the Erica. Yess my girl, she's such
a cute pack. So long Creed, I mean, so long
reparations Mosquito. Wow, Erica. That didn't sting at all. Oh
(11:43):
that was freaking terrific. Oh, thank you, thank you Chris
Summer for lending her master voice to this piece. She's amazing.
Um A little jealous you two got to play, but
I think it's something cool to do later. To even
the score. Bill Whitney, you did a good job too.
I appreciate the props Erica. You know, so my first
conversation with Mosquito, but hopefully my last. But now you know,
(12:06):
I love the story of Kelly House, and I love
that we got a chance to talk to historian Mary
Francis Barry, who wrote the book on this. Amazing woman,
Mary Francis Barry. She's fantastic, she's smart, beautiful, in great shape.
She's eighty two. Okay, I want to be here. Cally
House was a black woman who had been a slave.
(12:28):
You know, her mother had been a slave, her father
had fought in the Union Army as a runaway slave.
And she was at church and she heard about some
white guy who had asked the federal government for pensions
for slaves on the brow ex slaves, he called them
on the grounds that the money would go into the
(12:49):
pockets of the white people on the plantations where they
were all still working, and that this was an indirect
way to help white Southerners after the Civil War, and
we can struction. But when she heard about it, she said, well,
I don't understand why we can't do this for ourselves.
Why can't we start some and ask the federal government
to give us some pensions that we use for ourselves,
(13:12):
After all, we were the ones who were slaves. And
so she went around organizing herself in churches, and she
would get people to if they couldn't write, somebody would
write down their name and put what plantation they were
on and so on, and they would put an x
bot and sent them off to Congress. And eventually it
grew and grew and grew, and she started traveling all
(13:35):
of the plays, collecting petitions, listening to people's stories and
all that, and the federal government got concerned. They decided
because letters were coming from white people saying, the Negroes
are meeting in churches and they come out saying and
talking about someday we're gonna get something, and we know
that I don't get anything, and we're scared of them.
So you need to do something about that woman who's
(13:57):
going around there stirn them up. And so they decided
to go after her. They said the fetes did that.
She had about three hundred thousand dudes paying members the
dues of cents a year, and she was laughed at
by middle class negroes because she was not very well educated.
(14:18):
She had only been like, you know, the sixth grade,
and the government decided that they would get after her
for using the mails to defraud. Some of you may
remember that that's what they did to market Garment later,
and they said that she was using the mails to
defraud because she was telling black people that she was
going to negros, that she was going to try to
(14:39):
get the federal government give them some money. And she
should know the federal government is never gonna give negroes
any money. That's the way they put it. So it
was fraud to be organizing people. And they ended up
prosecuting her, but all white jury in Tennessee, and they
put in prison for her trouble. After that, there were
branches who had There were black folks all the south.
(15:02):
One was in New York City. They were all out
in the black towns. And then there were people like
Queen Mother Bore who was in the New Orleans chapter,
all of whom became Garbagates. And so you can trace
the present day reparations movement within Cobra and the other
organizations all the way back to Callis House and her
(15:23):
ex lay pension movement. A remarkable woman. And I think
the people who say had their names on there at
a time when they were attacked, when they were under
attack and could be abused and everything else, their descendants
ought to get something Malcolm X talks about. If you
stick a knife in my back nine inches, pull it
(15:44):
out six inches, that's not progress. If you pull it
all the way out, that's not progress. The progress comes
from the healing the moon that the blow made. You're
talking about the loss so many hundreds of years of
human potential. How would reparations impact of progress on issues?
If we quality the reparations are the most direct way
to target money to ease the disparities and let black
(16:11):
people decide how to spend the money. But first the
country has to acknowledge the disparities, and if people refuse
to then that means that they're ignot acknowledging that slavery
was an institution that did not benefit slaves. Once you
accept what happened, then in fact, demanding reparations is easy.
(16:32):
We should go after local city councils, local mayors, local
government and organize the way Kelly House did, and better
because we have better communication now to organize and demand
that local communities pass measures to do this. The Cally
(16:56):
Howd story is really interesting because it's both inspiring and
completely depressing at the same time. You know, it's inspiring
what this woman managed to accomplish at the height of
the white terror and post reconstruction America, but it's really
depressing because she did this, build a incredible organization and
trying to get reparations for the formerly enslaved, and the
(17:16):
response of the government was to thrower in jail. Now,
I keep getting the feeling that white Americans feel that
if they just open this reparations doors just a crack,
they're not gonna be able to contain what comes flooding through.
So they keep barring the door, and the pressure just
keeps building and building. Yeah, it's funny that to me,
it's not a door, it's it already exists. They either
(17:38):
keep going and not talking about it, or they, you know,
look at it and they face it, because it's kind
of like an energy that's already out there. But whether
they realize it or not. You've been telling me about
CALLI House for a while, and I am a new fan. Look,
I'm a believer. Dr Barry, Thank you, thank you you
are river to your people. Thanks for educating us about
who in what really matters, you know. But Whitney, I
(18:01):
just realized that the pioneers were talking about today are
all black women, and they all, all of them paid
an emotional price for their work in the struggle. It's
kind of like the same thing today right Erica. There's
lots of strong black women leaders and they're taking a
lot of shots right now. Look at Stacy and Georgia. Yeah, Stacy,
Ayana ill han Omar, You've got Natasha Brown. I mean yeah,
(18:22):
I could go on and on and on. There's amazing
black women that have always been there doing their thing,
and it's time for them to get their flowers. Speaking
of which, I'm a bit competitive and I want to
do something cool like your Jurassic Park history mash up.
So I'm gonna use my black wizard skills. You didn't
know I had them to do something I know you
cannot do. I am an actor with access and so
(18:44):
you're you. But look I'm going to um, yeah, I'm
gonna do something cool. So what are we gonna get?
A song? Like a morality play? Maybe some a cappella. Nope,
I'm gonna go back in time. I'm going to talk
to a queen, a pioneer of reparations whose life story
led her to become a force of nature in the struggle.
I'm gonna talk to Queen Mother Moore. How are you
(19:06):
going to do that? I use a little bit of
magic to do it, and I believe if I listen, well,
I'll come back forever changed. So here, let's do this.
Let's adjust the volume a little bit, Mr Pop Okay,
I just know I needed to get on the right
frequency and always works in the movies. Oh gosh, you're here.
(19:31):
It worked. Oh you don't know how I but I
got to go through to kid here own. Okay, chill Erica,
you know she ain't got time for that. Welcome Queen Mother.
I'm glad that you're here. Thank you so much, and
thank you for blessing us with your story. Yes, no,
thank you, ma'am. You know where I come from, this
homeless of people to call themselves queen Charlemagne, the god Queen, Queen, Queen.
(19:54):
He calls me queen. But you know what, how did
you become the queen? Mother? Mea was restored upon me
by the African students. First of all, as a result
of my years of activities in this country. African students, well,
they gave it to me. And when I went to
(20:15):
Africa to dr and crew mass funeral, they chief heard
about me and he sent for me to come to
him and I went and he said, I'm going to
make you a fishery queen mother, queen mother of the Ashanti,
and he initiated me the queen mother. But I was
(20:36):
queen mother before I went to Africa. We know you
did amazing things in Harlem, but you're actually from the
South right. But yes, I was born in New Iberia, Louisiana,
seven ninety. I grew up in New Orleans, Louisiana. My
(20:58):
parents came from New all into Louisiana. My grandparents came
from New Iberia, Louisiana. My father worked for herself. My
mother was a housewife. I had two brothers and five sisters.
I was the sixth one in the family, Queen of
the more Where would you say that your story starts?
(21:20):
What was life like growing up for you? My mother
died when I was five years old, and after Papa died,
my brother sold the house that papa had left. And
mind your papa had told him that told me that
brother Henry would take care of us. Well. He took
(21:41):
care of us all right. The moment he came from
the funeral, he said we had to move, and I
had my little sisters. So I took a few of
Papa's moves to the auction and sold them and readed
an apartment. I left New Orleans during the war. I
left and went to Muscle Shoals m Muscial Souls well
(22:05):
Wreatha did a lot of recording there. Yes, really difficult
to listen to you tell your story, but you made
it through. Yes, So how did you get started with
your work? We talked a lot about origin stories. What
was the origin of your work? Within that cause? My
face encounter with the real struggle was with the Red Cross,
(22:28):
who discriminated against the black recruits. They gave the white
recruits coffee and doughnuts while they were mobilizing them, and
they didn't give anything to the black recruits. And I
mobilized the people around to make what we used to
call hook cakes and coffee and gave it to the
(22:48):
blacks who were congregated waiting to be shipped off. And
my sister and I we found a place where the
soldiers could come and we got an old phonic have
and a lot of scratch records. Well, it was a
place where the men could come in and play cards
or checkers or something. So we consider ourselves having to
(23:12):
face USO among black Oh wow, so you've been organizing
around the black community for a while, But how did
you get to the liberation movement like your work with
the great Marcus Garvey. Well, I was face brought in
turned Marcus Carvey movement by the fact that he I
understood that he was to come and speak to us
(23:34):
in Louisiana. And we went to the meeting and low
and behold, he didn't come, and we had the mayor
refused to allow him to come. So we were very
incensed about it and got a delegation to go see why.
Then it was guaranteed that Marcus Carvey would come. The
(23:55):
next night, the hall was packed with people. Everybody went
with ammunition, had guns. Everybody had guns, Black people with guns.
Blue Steve Smith and Western's German lugers. Really and uh,
I had two guns with me. Y'all showed up and
(24:18):
showed out, that's what's up. Amazing and ammunition, a bag
of ammunition. Everybody had what you call a suitcase today
because we was afraid the police would stop him from
coming again and we wanted to protect him. Wow, in
the night that he did come, what happened, thirty people
(24:40):
was in that hall. So when God came, reapplauded very much,
and he said, my friends, I wanted to apologize for
not speaking to you last night. But the reason I
didn't speak to you because the mayor permitted himself to
be used as a stooge by the police department to
prevent me for speaking to you. And when he said that,
(25:02):
the police jumped up and said, I'll run you in.
And when the police did that, everybody jumped up on
the benches we had benches then and took out their
guns straight up. The guns were straight up in the air.
Speak Gorvy set and Gorvy said, And as I was saying,
and he went and repeated itself, and the police filed
(25:25):
out of their like little puppy dolls. Every police been
filed out of the hall. And I can't forget that
speak Garvey speak. Oh I wish I was there. And
that was your first experience with Marcus Garvey. Amazing. Oh yes,
I'm still a life member the Garvey movements, like to
join the Garvey movement after that, How did this impact
(25:50):
your path as an activist? Well, after must have shown.
I went back to New Orleans and stayed there a
while until Marcus Garvey came on the sea in so
then we came to HALLM. Well, anyhow, HALLM was waste
than anything we had seen. They had for white only
signs and only apartment houses in Hallm for white only,
(26:12):
big signs outside, and we had to go upstairs in
the lowest theater like we did in the South. Same thing,
the white people sitting the bottom downstairs and we had
to go upstairs, and that kind of thing. So nobody
could work in HALLM. No black place. And while you
were in Harlem, you began working with Garvey's Universal Negro
(26:34):
Improvements Association and uh the African Communities League. Oh yes,
I had gone to his meetings and had was his
guest divino on the Black store line. He bought some
ships and they were very unsuccessful because they were sabotaged.
You know. What was his plan for the ships to
(26:54):
do export import from Africa, trade and so on. So
I was very impressed with that. So was Marcus Garvey
who helped push you to look towards Africa with your work. Yes, well,
it was to teach our people self esteem for one thing,
and our history and pride in our nation. And the
(27:20):
other thing was self sufficiency going into business and so on,
and to think in terms of the development of Africa,
to help free Africa from colonialism, that kind of thing. Okay,
So is that how you got into your reparations petition. Yes,
the petition called for us to go back to Africa.
(27:44):
So those who wanted to go back, and for those
who wanted to stay here, they had to be certain
indemnity given for the people who wanted to stay the
people who wanted to go. I was asking for two
hundred billion dollars for the injury that we have received
(28:05):
as a result of our enslaveman. Okay, two under billionaire.
That was a lot of money. Then in now, would
you say the petition was successful? I got very good response,
and he told me that we needed a member nation
to introduce the resolution since we were not officially remembers
(28:25):
of the You and I'm sorry, Queen mother more, I'm
having trouble here. I think we're losing our connection free
Mother More. Hello, you were talking about the members that
you needed someone to introduce the resolution. Oh, just one
that was getting good? I think, Oh I lost her.
(28:47):
M hm, that was amazing. Wow, what was it like
to talk to a legend? No, you know, I ain't
got the words. I mean, Queen Mother More. She's a
queen and you saw. I mean she suffered for her
struggle work, as she put it, but she was unstoppable.
She never quit and we have to celebrate her life.
And when I think about all the soft handed complainers
(29:09):
that we got, now me included, you know, battling racism
one well written witty post at the time. But look,
I just want to say this. I love black people.
I love you. We are unique on this planet. Why
did the universe choose of US African Americans to tell
this epic story? I mean to bear this poisonous thorny crown.
(29:30):
I'm inspired by Queen Mother Moore and I salute her,
and I will work harder and I think twice. I
will think twice before complaining about the lack of gluten
free treats at the craft service table. I'm changed, So Erica,
this history is amazing. You know, we've been talking about
Cally House now Queen Mother Moore. But it also pulls
(29:51):
up these other things for me as well, that there's
another side of the story, and that's the white side
of the story. The pressers in the story that we're
hearing the people that opposed Cally House, people and lock
are up the people that opposed Queen Mother Moore. It's
complicated when you think about your legacy and how you're
connected to these things. You know, I want to celebrate
people like Calli and Queen Mother more, but at the
(30:12):
same time, I have to figure out how do I
take ownership of the other side of the story. When
you think about history, there's history being made right now
in Ebste Illinois. Alderman Robin Ruth Simmons from the Fifth
Ward has just passed the first tax funded reparations bill
in US history. I live in a city that has
(30:34):
acknowledged our collective wrongdoing and we have acknowledged that we
want to do something radically different in passing it. So
that makes me hopeful. And the beauty of this reparation
goal is it's in line with my highest priorities in
my role as Alderman, I've known as reparation Robin and
(30:56):
rolls of parks. Now, so that's different. I feel incredibly
proud to lead in a community that allowed such radical
policy and uncomfortable conversation. People have been extremely nasty to me,
and I really, you know, feel bad for them that
(31:17):
whatever is happening in their life that is so miserable,
that they are in so much pain that they want
to share it and pass it all around. So I
feel sad for them, and I forgive them and hope
that they find some peace. So when that happens, even
you know, it's my faith that allows me to work
(31:37):
past the pain that I received and take that pain
and figure out how to turn it into some purpose.
I would love for more people to take ownership of
it and do the work. It's important. It's going to
have to happen. We have officially started our public subcommittee meetings.
You've established the timeline, and we have prioritized the initialmity
(32:01):
and we're gonna start with housing, you know, keeping our
black community. We have a declining population as serving a
very diverse community. Right of the population is black and
the rest of the community is not black, and they
don't understand as much. So at the same time as
I'm working on the policy, building relationships, finding resources, I
(32:23):
still have a huge piece of education. In the process
of this. I have been supporting the City of Chicago
and the State of Illinois on their initiatives, just being
an advocate, showing up to speak, sharing what was possible
in Evanston, and hopefully giving some inspiration to the leaders
at the state level and the city level. I'm also
(32:46):
in full support of HR forty and supporting anyone that
is looking to get that passed. The amount of support
that I have received from leaders and experts has really
given me confidence to tenue the second leg of the work.
We are likely to be the you know, not only
the first city, but also in the first state in bordering,
(33:08):
the first major city to have a local reparative policy,
a local reparation They're going to be more actions that require,
you know, a majority vote. But right now, in terms
of the direction, the thought, leadership, the intentions, I have
said it, and I will continue nurturing it, and I
(33:31):
will see it through. You Know, every time I hear
Robin I start, I think about something that's always kind
of in the back of my mind as a white person,
is that I look at this community, Evanston, Illinois, and
who's committed to give reparations to their black residents. But
the effort was really driven by this black woman who
(33:51):
put this whole program together and drove it to the
mostly white city council. And so I always wonder, if
we owe this, why aren't we take king the lead
on it more? But I think what's really interesting about Evanston,
and something that you and Iraq I've talked a lot about,
is that what does a world that has had reparations
(34:12):
pay it look like? And in Evsn, Illinois, in a
few months, we're going to start to see three black
women we never met locked together in their destinies. It's
one long epic put on like the Odyssey or the Mahabarata,
(34:35):
which I was in and did world tour the public
theater long ago. But I digress. Anyway, Whitney, let's think
about that world. But we need to give our history
lesson the rock and heroes finale it deserves because of
their work and others. One day we may finally get reparations,
and what would that be like? The narrative would get
(35:02):
flipped in a world where reparations exist in America for
the descendants of African slaves. The human potential lost in
the white capped, stormy seas, mixed with the blood and
pain of centuries, is slowly regained and reanimated in the
(35:25):
multi colored chocolate children who reclaim their destinies and God
given potential, and ironically, American democracy is saved and finally realized,
not by a caped, crusading billionaire bat or a greasy
haired alien with a red s s on his chest,
(35:46):
but by real life heroes of all colors, previously locked
into the villain roll, newly free to be the gods
and earths they were always meant to be. During Alexander
and Whitney dow as they battle for the soul of
America in the new action adventure Buckbuster Reparations, The Big
(36:13):
Payback next time on Reparations, the big payback, to paraphrase W. B.
Du Boise on the subject of the history of slavery,
of the exploitation and violence against African Americans in US history,
American people have been, as he put it, spoiled by sweets. Right,
(36:36):
so we have too often got a nice nationalist dessert
with a big old helping of American exceptionalism on top
and to a large extent, it's not true, and we're
not going to be able to face the future effectively,
I think, if we continue to insist that the history
of slavery and the history of land from Indigenous people
(37:01):
are not the central realities of the first quarter millennium
of our history. This podcast is produced by Eric Alexander,
Ben ar Noon and Whitney Dow. The executive producers are
Charlemagne the God and Dolly S. Bishop. The Supervising producer
is Nicole Childers, and the lead producer is Devin Mavock Robbins.
(37:24):
The producer writer is Sires Castle, and the Associate producer
is Kevin fan With additional research and writing support provided
by Nile Blast. Original music by d J D t
P The Queen Mothermore audio was courtesy of the Tammament
Library at New York University Reparations The Big Payback as
(37:48):
a production of Color Farm Media, I Heart Radio and
The Black Effect Podcast Network in association with Best Case Studios.
For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I
heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to
your favorite shows.
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